My husband, Timothée Chalamet

Heather and Zoe dive into the controversy surrounding Kratom wellness drinks, reflect on sobriety as a growing cultural shift, and plot their night out at a non-alcoholic bar. Giggle breaks, dream husbands, and hot takes included.

This episode is available on Youtube with timetamps here. 

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Episode Transcript

Heather (00:00):
This podcast covers sensitive topics that may be
difficult for some listeners.
Please take care while listening.
I went to the lake andum, she went into the

Zoe (00:11):
water

Heather (00:12):
for 20 seconds, for 20 seconds.
I'm scared.
I'm scared.

Zoe (00:16):
Yeah, but a fish is not gonna swim up your vagina.
I don't You don't know that?
I like, yeah, don't swim in Lake Ontario.
Never swim in Lake Ontario.
You can be afraid of that water.
Yeah.
There's certain water thatYes you can be afraid of.

Heather (00:28):
It's not the water, it's what's could be in there.
Like what kind of underground monster.
Like it's just so big and vast.
I'm like, there is some sort ofsomething under here that's gonna leak.
No, but trust me, there

Zoe (00:37):
isn't,

Heather (00:39):
you know, and take me down.
You're the only monster in the lake.
That's true.

Music (00:45):
Yeah.

Heather (01:00):
Drunk.
Welcome back to Girl and Drunk.
Hey guys, I'm Heather.
I'm Zoe.
How are you?
Are you drunk today?
Is everybody okay today?
Is everyone feeling everybody okay?
I actually do feel likemy nervous system is calm.
I did you do like there it's acalm energy and I think it must

Zoe (01:19):
be because you just had therapy.

Heather (01:20):
Well she, we did do a grounding technique 'cause
she was like, how are you?
And I said, I don't reallyfeel like I'm connected.
So we were like breathing and feelingthe chair and feeling my feet.
Nice.
So I think we're gonna do that every time.
Nice.
Because I just.
Crazy, but you know,there's a lot going on.
Yeah.
It's a very busy, A lot of thingsare happening for the podcast too.
I know.
I'm so excited.
We're going.

(01:41):
Out tonight.
We're going out.
Hey, we're going to 0, 0, 0bar, zero bar in the village.
Mm-hmm.
We're going get get some Mocktails.
Mocktails with the Withthe gaze Gay mocktails.
So good.
I'm so excited.
That's my old neighborhood.
Yeah.
So I'll point to thehouse I used to live in.
Should we

Zoe (01:57):
go to Cruise and Tangos after?

Heather (01:58):
Is that still open?
Oh yeah, I think so.
I think so.
Oh my God.
Is anyone performingtonight on a Thursday?
Yeah, Thursday is the new Friday, babe.
Thursday is the New Friday.
Monday is my Sunday.
Monday is my Sunday.
Monday is also your Sunday.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Um, how is your mental health?

(02:19):
How are you,

Zoe (02:19):
how am I, I mean, I'm good.
Mm-hmm.
Literally nothing toreally complain about.
I, um, I am really excited abouteverything that's going good for the pod.
Me too.
I feel just like proud of us, I guess.
Yeah.
And I'm just really excited to hang outwith you all weekend at the lake house.
Oh my God.
I'm

Heather (02:37):
so excited.
But I'm feeling really good.
I'm feeling good too.
I'm excited.
I'm excited.
This is the first time you'reactually gonna meet Anne in person.
Yeah.
That's so crazy.
That's crazy.
I'm so excited.
All of our boys are gonna be together.
Yeah.
Our boyfriends will kiss this weekend.
Oh, they're gonna kiss.
You're gonna kiss by the bonfire.
Oh yeah.
Crazy.
Oh my God.
I have to buy two Muskoka chairs.
That's okay.

(02:58):
Whatever.
Um, my mental health is fine.
I am stressed out, butI think that's okay.
That does not mean that I'm depressed.
Mm-hmm.
I'm just.
There's a lot going onand it's good things.
Yeah.
But my brain doesn't reallyseparate like good stress and bad
stress, so it's all just like, ah.
Yeah.
But I think I'm okay.
My nervous system feels fine.

(03:19):
And I had a nice like littleromantic, little getaway.
Yeah.
And I feel good and safe and calm.
Yeah.

Zoe (03:25):
No, I feel like.
It's going really goodbetween you guys to be honest.
Like I feel like you guys got through somehurdles and it really tested you guys.
Mm-hmm.
But now you obviously cantalk about things better.
Yeah.
And like talk about like struggles andhow to like, get over it instead of just
like be mad at each other, you know?

Heather (03:42):
Yeah.
There's like something that happenswhen my nervous system gets triggered
and I'm not able to like be calm.
Mm-hmm.
I'm like.
Ugh.
Why am I sober?
Yeah.
Like I just get so like wild up real fast.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And I don't like that.
And I was saying thatto my therapist today.
I'm like, I gotta.
I gotta rein it in.
Yeah.
I feel very buzzy all the

Zoe (04:02):
time.
Yeah.
Well, I was talking to someone atthe meeting last night and I was just
like, I don't know, like I'm good.
Everything's just really busy,but like all these things that are
happening in my life are good things.
Mm-hmm.
So I don't have anythingto complain about, like

Music (04:14):
Yeah.
Yeah.

Zoe (04:15):
It's a good type of busy and honestly, busy is good for people
like us because That's true.
There's no time to like sit andwonder about drinking, you know?
Yeah, that's true.
And also

Heather (04:27):
I think busy.
There's a fine line betweenbusy and like overwhelming.
Yeah.
You know, you have to like manage that.
Yeah.
I think it's good.
It's like growth.

Zoe (04:35):
I booked tickets to Portugal and Italy.

Heather (04:38):
Oh.
Have you been to either of those places?

Zoe (04:39):
I've been to Italy when I was like maybe grade eight with my family.
Okay.
All I remember about that trip is thatI ate three gelatos every single day.
Oh my God.
For a week and a half.
Yeah.

Heather (04:52):
Okay.
That's a gelato.
That was like a goal of

Zoe (04:54):
mine to eat ice cream three times a day.
Hey, you're an ice cream girl.
I'm an, I'm an ice cream girl.
Yeah, through and through.

Heather (04:58):
My sister likes a gelato too, and I, it doesn't call to me.
Oh, it calls to me.

Zoe (05:04):
My boyfriend, he got mad this weekend 'cause I, well, we got ice cream on let's
say Saturday or Sunday night and then.
I wanted it again the next night.
And he was like, yeah,but we had it last night.
And I said, so what?
Give me my motherfucking ice cream.
You're like

Heather (05:18):
so observant.
Great memory.
Okay, so this has nothing to do withsobriety, but mm. It affects me.
So I'm just gonna say thatit affects my sobriety.
Justin Trudeau and Katy Perryhave been seen out and about.
So do you think it's a publicity stunt?
Well, you know how I feel about Ka Perry?

(05:39):
Yeah.
I don't know what's going onwith her, but she's literally,
something happened to her.
Yeah.
She's trying to get into a bunker.
She's,

Zoe (05:44):
she's like so different now.
Like weird.
She a cy.
It's weird.
Is it KA Perry or is it a cloneof Ka Perry at this point?
And where did Ka Perry go?
Because I want teenage dream

Heather (05:56):
back.
Well, I also thought that it was alwaysweird that she was with Orlando Bloom.
I'm like, this doesn't make sense.
Something's wrong here.
And then also, where's Orlando Bloom?
Yeah.
Well they were together at Tiff last year.
I saw them walk the red carpet.
Yeah.
Oh, right outside your house with um.
With your bicycle?

Zoe (06:12):
Yes.
Right outside my house.

Heather (06:13):
Oh my God.
Does it go outside your house?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Oh my God, dude.

Zoe (06:17):
Hello.
Yeah.
Hi.
I am trying to get into my condo.
Bye guys.
Yeah, everybody scoot.
Scoot.
Well, I go outside of my condo andit's the red carpet, and I'm like,
oh yeah, of course for me, I do.
Yeah, I do.

Heather (06:28):
Mm. Like, okay.
God.
Well now, now you can belike, thank you so much.
It's a podcast.
I, yeah, exactly.

Zoe (06:33):
Hand out our stickers.
Yeah,

Heather (06:36):
bring your own camera.
Yeah.
Oh God.
Yeah.
You can be there taking photos.
Oh my God.
I'll be there.
Okay.
I'll be there.
You do a TikTok of that.
I feel.
Katie Perry is tryingto get into some bunker.
She's trying to get with all the rich.

Music (06:49):
Yeah,

Heather (06:50):
and it's weird.

Zoe (06:50):
It's fucking weird.
Like the cr.
Watching her shit on TikTok, like herconcerts on TikTok is cringe as fuck.
What has happened?
Well,

Heather (07:00):
it's just like, it's, it's like it's, it's catering to like children
and the like, elder, millennial.
Well now Katie just wantsto be in the politics.
Maybe she'll run.

Zoe (07:12):
What is Orlando Bloom doing?

Heather (07:13):
I don't know.
But he was so

Zoe (07:15):
hot.
He was so, he was likePirates of the Caribbean.
I

Heather (07:19):
really wanted to hold

Zoe (07:20):
his hand.
I really wanted to suck his stick.

Heather (07:23):
Yeah.
I wasn't there yet, but Ireally was like Orlando Bloom.
Where, but like, I wouldlove for him to act again.
Yeah.
Same.
Come on the pod.

Music (07:33):
Orlando.
Orlando

Heather (07:34):
Bloom friend of the pod.
Um, that's all I have to sayabout them, but we uh, we saw this
article about this, um, this well,oh yeah, this wellness drink.
Yeah.
That it's being promotedas a wellness drink.
It's called.
Feel free wellness drink.
Have you heard of it before?
No.
No.
I hadn't heard

Zoe (07:54):
of it either, but I guess it's like not Health Canada approved yet.
Yeah.
Which like Health Canada isvery strict about stuff coming
into Canada, which is good.
Mm-hmm.
Our FDA is very different.
Yeah.
America lets everything fucking in.

Heather (08:08):
Yeah, and that's where you guys are eating an old shoe.
Yeah, we are eating a shoelace, ashoe lace, but yeah, mean shoelace.
We don't have this stuff,especially around drugs and alcohol.
Yeah.
We are like pretty conservative on that.
Even

Zoe (08:20):
for skincare, like working at the clinic, like there's some
products that take forever toget approved because why is that?

Heather (08:27):
Be,

Zoe (08:28):
I don't Canada.
Canada is just strict.
Yeah.
Canada is safer.

Heather (08:30):
This wellness drink called Feel Free is marketed as a natural energy
and mood boosting alcohol alternative.
I mean, it sounds great.
It sounds great.
It sounds great.
Is it promoted as likea caffeinated drink?
It's not promo promoted as that at all.
Okay.
It's literally just promotedas a natural energy booster.

(08:52):
Okay.
Alcohol alternative.
Okay.
And

Zoe (08:55):
so usually like, so I would assume that it would be an energy
drink if I just like heard aboutthat, I would buy it because I
think it's an energy drink, I guess.
Yeah,

Heather (09:02):
I would too.
Or like, um, you know, those likesupplements with like the mushrooms or
like the ashwagandha, stuff like that.
Now the thing is, yeah.
People are getting addicted toit when they looked into it.
This what it is, is a,it's a thing called Krato.
Kratom, okay.
K-R-A-T-O-M.
I'm probably butchering how to spell that.

(09:23):
Yeah, I've been outtathe game for a while.
But Kratom Kratom, it is, whatit does is it interacts with your
opiate receptors in your brain.
So it, so it's a drug.
Yeah, it's a drug.
Yeah, it, it basically actssimilarly to an opiate.
So in small doses it's a stimulant.
Mm-hmm.
So in small doses, yeah, it couldfeel like an energy drink, but in

(09:43):
larger doses it's like a sedative.
Mm-hmm.
Like an opiate.
Mm-hmm.

Zoe (09:48):
I wonder, does it have like a label on it?
Like drink only one inevery 24 hours or anything?
Possibly.
Possibly.
I would hope so.

Heather (09:56):
But the way they get around these things Yeah.
Is because it's not regulated.
Yeah.
Like they don't have to be asregulated, especially when it's
like health foods and stuff.
It seems to be sometimes with theselike health food drinks, they don't.
They can be out on shelves beforethey're fully FDA approved.
Interesting.
And that's, that's, this oneis, it's not fully FDA approved?

(10:16):
No.

Zoe (10:16):
Okay.
And yet, for some reason, reason,so now it's getting pulled off the
shelves because it's, well, not yet.
This is just like early stages.
Yeah.
Okay.
So imagine if someone bought this Yeah.
As like a healthy drink.
Yeah.
Right.
And then they love it.
Mm-hmm.
And then they realize it'sbasically opium or opioids, right?
Yeah.
Yeah.
And then.
If they can't find it anymorebecause they take it off the shelves.

(10:38):
Yeah.
And then they go and buy drugs.
Yeah.

Heather (10:41):
I think these things like, oh.
That made me feel really good.
This was like a natural energy.
Yeah.
I'm gonna take it again and again.
Uh, even if you don't realize, likeknow that it's an addictive substance
you're taking, your body is getting Yeah.
Addicted.
Yeah.
So people are going through withdrawaland some people are reporting that
their withdrawal from this Yeah.
Is worse than an alcohol withdrawal.

(11:02):
Yeah.
Which alcohol withdrawal is soscary and dangerous and horrible.
If I took it, yeah.
If I drank it.
My body would immediately belike, oh, we know what this is.
Yeah.
And then it would want more.
Yeah.
Like it would be such afucking loophole for me.
Yeah.
It's very dangerous tomarket something like that.

(11:23):
I that, that's what I findwith all of this stuff.
Who are the,

Zoe (11:26):
who

Heather (11:26):
fucking owns this company?
Like, let's see.
Okay.
The brand was created by JWRoss, who developed, feel free.
As a so-called alcohol alternativewhile recovering from alcohol addiction?
No.
He first formulated it after studyingplant-based medicines in South Pacific.
He found himself a loophole.
He found himself a fucking loopholeand he made money off of it.

(11:47):
Wow.
Crazy.
And of course it is a man.
Well, yeah, of course it's a man.

Zoe (11:52):
Yeah.

Heather (11:52):
That's so crazy.
It's like, oh, I can't drink alcohol.
Yeah, I'll just do something else.
I'll

Zoe (11:57):
just do this very minor drug.
Yeah.
That like still makes mefeel like the effects and I
still like the effects of it.
Well, but I don't have to drink alcohol

Heather (12:05):
and I don't know how, how big of a problem this is.
Yeah.
Because it's not FDA.
A regulated, yeah, the dosesare different in every batch.
'cause you can't be super consistentif you're not like going through
through with the FDA is very dangerous.
It's so dangerous.
Like, I don't know what's in likethose like mushroom, like remember
my ex used to drink, put those liketinctures of like mushroom stuff

(12:25):
and he's like, it's for focus.
And I'm like, you guysdunno what you're taking.
Yeah.
And that's probably fine.
Yeah.
But I'm like, anything like that, I'mlike, you're not, this isn't better.
And, and like.
I guess the word alternative.
Yeah.
That's what I, we need tohone in on 'cause it's alcohol

Zoe (12:42):
alternative.
Yeah.
Yeah.

Heather (12:44):
Because that to me, for some reason, immediately I'm like, oh, it's
a thing to drink when you're sober.

Zoe (12:49):
Yeah.

Heather (12:50):
It's like a wellness drink, alcohol alternative.
Okay.
Maybe it gives me a little buzz.
'cause there are some things,like sometimes I have a pop
and I'm like, oh, she buzzy.
Yeah.

Zoe (12:57):
I love, I love a pop, I love a red bull.
Like, yeah,

Heather (13:00):
sometimes extra caffeine, like sometimes that makes you buzzy.
So I just figured that's what it was.
But.
Alcohol alternative.
Hold on.
Why are you doing that?
Yeah.
Why?
Why do you have to be, why do you haveto do an what happened with alcohol
that you can't drink it anymore?
That you're looking for analternative like this is, this
is not even harm reduction.
This is transfer addiction.

Zoe (13:21):
Yeah.

Heather (13:21):
Right.
Like you're just addicted to, orfor me anyway, addicted to the
feeling of like being out of my body.
Yeah.

Zoe (13:29):
You're still feeling the effects of a drug.
Yeah.
Giving you dopamine.
Yeah.
You know, like this.
You're not clearly, it says it's a drug.
You're not sober.
Yeah.

Heather (13:40):
This is how I feel too about like weed and shrooms.
The microdosing like that.
The

Zoe (13:45):
microdosing.
You're doing drugs.

Heather (13:48):
Yeah.
Yeah.
You are doing drugs.
Yeah.
And I know people use it andthey're like, oh, it's good.
It's for focus.
And people are microdosing all day.
No, if you're microdosingmushrooms, you're taking drugs.
You're taking drugs.
And for me, I like the married guy, he.
My prosing mushroom.
Oh really?
Yeah.
I didn't know that.
And he was like, I just like love.
It's so cool that I can be around you.
And Zoe, our married man Yeah.
Was taking the mushrooms.

(14:08):
Our married man.
I thought you were talkingabout your married man.
Oh no.
No, never.
And I was, well, maybe he would.
I know.
But he was like, it's so cool to bearound you and Zoe and like just be sober.
And I'm like, you smoked a joint on theway to the restaurant and you've been
popping pills the whole time, babe.
Yeah.
Like you are not sober, which is fine,but you said Yeah, but you're not sober.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But I do think like.

(14:29):
If I were to my grid, those mushrooms,I haven't, but like, are you fucking,
I'm gonna go off the deep end with them.
Yeah.
I'm gonna take too much.
I'm gonna take them every day.
Your tolerance is gonna go up.
Mm-hmm.
It's the whole same thing.
Same with weed.
Yeah.
Like, I think I've said this before, butlike you can totally be addicted to weed.
Totally.
Absolutely.
A hundred percent.
Yeah.
If I took anything that justallowed me to sit in my bed and do

(14:51):
fuck all, all day, I would do it.
Well, it's

Zoe (14:54):
because like also like if you're weaning off weed, like you.
There's side effects.
Yeah.
The side effects shows it is an addiction.
Yeah.
You know, like if you're doingit every single day mm-hmm.
You're gonna have side effects when youstop and that means you are addicted.

Heather (15:06):
Yeah.
This says with this drink, itkept using like the alcohol
alternative alcohol alternative.
And I was like, why are wecalling something an alcohol
alternative when it's just a drug?

Zoe (15:20):
Well, it's like a loophole, right?
Yeah.
Like he found

Heather (15:22):
himself a loophole.
You think also like.
What do you think about this?
Like alcohol being separate from drugs?
Like to me, they'rethe same fucking thing.

Zoe (15:31):
They are different.
They give you the same side.
Like they give you thesame effect, though.

Heather (15:35):
They can both ruin your life.
Yeah.

Zoe (15:37):
Like I feel like they both give you the same like euphoria effects, whatever.
Yeah.
It is just drinking or taking a drug.

Heather (15:46):
Yeah.
And I guess that's true.
Like you can take this andyour life might not be ruined.
Yeah.
So I think there's two things.
I think sometimes you can likebe an alcoholic, ruin your
whole life, and then get sober.
You could be an alcoholic, ruin yourwhole life and then be like, I'm sober.
I need a little somethingto take the edge off.

(16:06):
Yeah.
But then you're not sober,but then you're not sober.
Yeah.
And I, and I, and I don't, then you're notactually ever getting to the root of it.
Yeah.
It's like, okay, you've calmeda symptom, which is alcohol.
Yeah.
Because maybe you're super aggressive,maybe you don't get work done.
But now we're like microdosing, shroomsand we're never fully in our body.
Yeah.
So we never fully heal whatever it isthat's making us need to take a substance.

Zoe (16:28):
Yeah.
I think, um,

Heather (16:30):
and shrooms is so fucking trendy.

Zoe (16:32):
Shrooms is so trendy.
Mm-hmm.
I never like got the appealof shrooms, to be honest.
But yeah.
If you're microdosing, shrooms, yeah.
You're still, it's like microdosing.
Shrooms is like equivalentto having one drink a night.

Heather (16:47):
Yeah.

Zoe (16:47):
Of like, that's the drug.
Yeah.
But you're doing it during the day.

Heather (16:51):
Like that's the other thing.
It's like an acceptable drug tojust do casually all day long.
That's true.
And it's, I just, I don't know.
It's an interesting one.
I did not.
No.
No.
Well, I would probably drink, honestly.
Yeah.
If I just started doing drugs, I'dbe like, what's the difference?
Exactly.

Zoe (17:07):
Well, and that's why like we can't smoke weed and we can't

Heather (17:11):
Yeah.

Zoe (17:11):
Do shrooms casually.
Like we can't do anything casually.
We'll do it to the extent.

Heather (17:15):
No, no.
As, because even if you're like,oh, you can't get addicted to
shrooms, which yes, you fucking can.
Yeah.
I'm addicted to gettingthe fuck outta my body.
Yeah.
I love that.
Mm-hmm.
It's like, even if yousay that, I'll be like.
Try me.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I can, like, you can get addicted andit will lead you to do something else.

(17:38):
I don't know.
It just feels, it feels like we're,we're, we're creating a whole
new trend and it's just, no one'ssuper educated about it, you know?
It feels weird.

Zoe (17:47):
Yeah.

Heather (17:48):
I can't believe

Zoe (17:49):
that fucking drink.
I know.
That is really crazy.
Let's stay on top ofthat and see if it gets.
Like, but it can't be promoted as afucking health and wellness drink.
No, that's the thing.
Yeah.
Like this fucking mom Yeah.
Of four kids goes to Whole Foods Yeah.
And gets this health and wellness drink.
Yeah.
And get tries it and gets addicted to it.
Yeah.

(18:09):
Then looks into it andfinds out it's a drug.

Heather (18:12):
Yeah.
Not to mention as an addict and as asober person, I'll touch anything that
says like healthy health wellness.
Good for you.
Yeah.
Good gut.
Yeah.
I won't read the fucking label.
If it's a cute bottle and it says likeit's from Whole Foods and it says like,
healthy, I'm gonna fucking drink it.
Same.
So I'm not going to.
I'm, I'm gonna assume it's fine.
Yeah.
If it doesn't say there's alcohol

Zoe (18:33):
in it.
Well, and that's why we do need to be morecareful about looking at the labels and
like watching bartenders make our drinks.
Yeah.
You know, like, yeah, it isdangerous because that could happen.
Yeah.
Did I tell you when I was at Swan,like a couple weeks ago for my friend's
birthday, this girl ordered a mocktail.
She like sipped on it for a coupleminutes and she was like, wait,

(18:55):
this kind of tastes like booze.
And then asked the server.
And the server was like, yeah, sorry.
Oops.
I did get you the cocktailversion by accident.
And then she had to justtake it off the bill.
But I'm like, fucking,thank God that wasn't me.
Did she drink it?
She drank like a couple sips of it.
Is she an alcoholic?
She's not an alcoholic.

(19:15):
Okay.
I think she just wasn't drinking.
That's so scary.
That's so scary.
And also it's like.
Okay.
That server, yeah, was probably like,oh yeah, just a dumb mistake I made.
Oops.
But like, no, you need to be So on that.
Yeah.
For the alcoholics, like, yeah, we can'tjust have like, oh, a dumb mistake.
That's also on us to like look and asklike, Hey, this is non-alcoholic, right?

(19:38):
Yeah.
Like there's so many things thatwe have to do as sober people to
ensure our sobriety every single day.
Like it's a lot of work.
Yeah.
It would be easier if people justactually cared about us and listened
to a sober person instead of justbeing like, oh, fuck you, you're sober.
Ha ha.

Heather (19:54):
Yeah.
It's like it's no different than beinglike, I literally can't eat gluten.
Yeah, I can, but like if you'receliac, you can't have that.
Yeah.
So.
Take it seriously.
It's very important.
I know sometimes I see, like, I'llgo to dinner and they'll, they'll
have like a whole tray of drinks.
Yeah.
And I'm like, how the fuck do you know?
Literally.
But I always ask, they put it infront of me and I go, this one's
the non-A alcoholism, right?
Yeah.
And they always have said, oh yeah, yeah.

(20:16):
Like, but I. It feels sometimes alittle annoying for me to like ask.

Zoe (20:21):
But that's the thing, like it's kind of annoying too, like
at, at this point, like I've beenasking for almost three years.
Yeah.
Like at what point do I just trust them?
But that's where it gets iffy.
Like we can't ever really trust anybody.
No.
We need to just keep makingsure that it's a sober one.
And

Heather (20:36):
Yeah.
I don't think that you canever trust anyone but yourself.
Yeah.
Like you can't just trust, you know.
A male,

Zoe (20:43):
a male bartender, a male we can never trust.
A male can't trust a male bartender.

Heather (20:51):
And you know what?
They're everywhere.
No, you can't.
Yeah.
And I always like, sometimeslike I sit there and I'm like,
this is the non-alcoholic andit's from the non-alcoholic
menu, and it's not even Yeah.
And I

Zoe (21:01):
just wanna make sure, like, and that's why when they like come
over with a can, like, or if you'rebuying cans, like it's, it's nice.
Yeah.
Because then, you know, or iflike I'm getting a diet Coke,
at least I know, hey, that.
Doesn't have any booze in it.
And maybe that's why I like, yeah,sodas and red, red bulls more
because the mocktail, it couldhave booze in it if, I'm not sure.

Heather (21:21):
And I don't know if this is like part of it with aa, but they, they promote
like not doing non-alcoholic or dea.
And maybe it's also toprevent accidents like that.
Yeah.
You know?
Honestly, that could be it too.
Yeah.
'cause I've heard a lotof stories about that.
Like someone goes to Mexico,they get a zero zero.
Mm-hmm.
It's a real one and they'relike, oh shit, I'm already in it.
Let's keep going babe.
Exactly.

(21:42):
It's just not good.
I, um, I was gonna say, so, oh, I'mexcited to go to this bar tonight.
Yeah.
I don't really know what it is,but the non, like the o the first
non-alcoholic bar in Canada Yeah.
Are the only non-alcoholicbar in Canada for sure.
It's the first, the first, I don't know.
It might be the only, it's very exciting.
It's in the village.
Yeah.
I'm excited to see what it is, butI was thinking about that today.

(22:03):
I'm like, it's so good too.
Have a place, especially in the village.
Yeah.
That like people can go, Iwanna talk to them about that.
I'm like, why?
In the village?
Yeah.
And the village is likethe L-G-B-T-Q Village.
Yeah.
And so there's a lot of like partyingand stuff that goes on there.
That's where I used to live and I'mlike, this is an interesting demo.
Mm-hmm.
You know, it's good though.

(22:24):
It's so good.
It's like it gives people a place togo, not just like someone's apartment.
It's like if you don't wannadrink, you can go there.
Well,

Zoe (22:30):
my friend Brandon, he's obviously gay and friend of the pod.
He's sober.
He, I didn't know this, but there'smeetings that he goes to that are only
for lgbtq plus like, oh, meetings for themthat are like safe and like inclusive.

Heather (22:45):
That makes sense.
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.
I also feel like the experience isa little different for everybody.
Like every community.
Yeah.
Women.
And I feel like it's

Zoe (22:53):
good to like have a space for them to like have their own meetings.
Like talk about their Totally.
I'm sure their experiences are so like.
W like similar to each other.
Yeah.
And I'm sure they gain a lot.

Heather (23:04):
Yeah.
That's why I think those, likehaving all women's groups, all men's
groups, I think those are reallygood to just relate to the people.
Yeah.
Yeah.
To the people.
To that pa, to the syllabus.
I'm excited.
I'm excited to go down to thatarea though, 'cause I haven't
been there since I moved here.
And is there any good food on there?
Should we get some

Zoe (23:21):
dinner after we go?

Heather (23:22):
There's so much.
Oh God, I've done so much drinking over

Zoe (23:25):
there.
I know, but have you doneany eating over there?
Probably not.
Yeah, I've done a lotof eating over there.

Heather (23:30):
Okay.
But there's a lot.
Yeah, there's a lot.
But there's, there's some peoplethat I, that like live amongst,
like that live on the street and Iwanna know if they're still there.
I wanna know, because some ofthem, I think, I think about some
of them all the time and it's,well, let's go check it out.
Let's go see if they'rearound Scary sometimes.
'cause like sometimes it'll belike, they, they do not look good.
Do not look good.
And then, and then someone's takenthem in and given them a haircut.

(23:51):
Then

Zoe (23:53):
they're gone for six months and they're gone for six months and then they

Heather (23:55):
come back and you said, where were you?
Yeah.
What have you seen?
What do you know?
Yeah.

Zoe (23:59):
And then they say, yeah, someone took me out like in the butt fuck nowhere.
Yeah.
It took me forever to get back, say, Hey,

Heather (24:06):
don't get in someone else's

Zoe (24:06):
car.
Don't move.
Don't move our friends.
Don't our street friends.
Well,

Heather (24:10):
the village was also where Bruce MacArthur was picking up
all the gay men and killing them.
Remember that?
The serial killer.
I heard about that.
Yes.
Yeah.
What a psycho I, that onepsycho, that documentary was so
interesting 'cause it was like in myneighborhood and I'm like, oh my God.
That's where I walk my dog.
Oh my god.
That's my house.

(24:30):
Yeah.
Um, lot of murder in Toronto.
I dunno why you're so funny todaythere's a, I don't know what it is,
there's a house near my sister that inthe nineties this woman was murdered
and my mom, when they walked by it, shealways is like, murder house murder.

(24:51):
And then she like says,what happened there?
Yeah.
Oh, it's crazy.
He was stalking her and then he cameand he was there and then I can't wait
to like actually meet your mother.
I feel like everything willlike, make way more sense.
We had a good giggletoday about something.
I don't remember what.
Okay.
Um, well, Arian brought up a good point.
Okay.
And I guess like it's, it's talkingabout like methadone and Dilaudid.

(25:12):
Yeah.
Methadone and Dilaudid are a harm,they're a harm reduction drug.

Zoe (25:16):
Well, sub Suboxone as well is one of those suboxone sub Yes,
because my, my rehab boyfriend, yes.
Took Suboxone to get offhis opioid addiction.
Okay.

Heather (25:28):
What was he on?
Oxy.
I can't, I, I can't remember.
Gosh, you can't

Zoe (25:32):
remember.

Heather (25:33):
You know,

Zoe (25:33):
he

Heather (25:33):
is just doing the whole

Zoe (25:34):
gamut of things.
He'd just look at pills.
He just did everything.
Hope it was the right ones, but.
Yeah, from what he told me, a lot ofpeople tell, told him to get on Suboxone
because it really helps you quit.
And he as a man was like,no, I can quit by myself.
No, I can quit by myself.
I don't need some other drug to help me.

Music (25:55):
Mm-hmm.

Zoe (25:56):
And then he finally did it and it was work.
Way more helpful to clean him off of it.
There's different ways to take it.
You can take the pill every single day.
I was gonna ask, what is it?
Or you can take a shot once a month.
Okay.
Um, I think, and do you know why it does?
I think it just slowly leansyour body off of your addiction.

(26:17):
Okay.
Like, there's cer you go down everymonth, so each month you're slowly like.
Take Getting your body off of it.
Yeah.
Under like supervision from a doctor.
Exactly.
Yeah.
So it is way easier than just coldturkeying it and going through the
withdrawals is crazy from opiates,like it's really fucking hard.
Yeah.
My sponsor did it thoughwithout Suboxone, which is cool.

(26:40):
My sponsors.
10 years, holy shit is in November.
Oh, that just gave me, I know.
Whoa.

Heather (26:47):
I, I have never done it.
I've never done the harm reduction model.
I've never been able todo anything like that.
But I

Zoe (26:51):
think in that case, like it is suggested, 'cause my ex had been trying
to get sober like three plus timesbefore, like he's been in and outta rehab.
So they're like, Hey, you haveto fucking do something else.
Clearly these other ways of tryingto get sober aren't working.

Heather (27:06):
Yeah.

Zoe (27:06):
Let's try.
Putting you on Suboxone, you know?

Heather (27:08):
Totally.
I'd imagine It's hard to, becausethere's multiple ways of harm reduction.
Got it.
This like there's harm reductionto the point where you wanna stop.
Yeah.
And then there's harmreduction to like maintain.
Got it.
But I think opiates orlike Dilaudid in methadone.
Yeah.
Methadone is for heroin.
Okay.
Dilaudid is fentanyl.

(27:28):
Okay.
It's like opioids and then, andthen suboxone is another opiate.

Zoe (27:33):
Yeah.
Or

Heather (27:33):
maybe

Zoe (27:34):
they're just the same

Heather (27:35):
thing.
Just different brands.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.
Because I know there is a drink.
Yeah.
And I know there's someone who Iknow who was a heroin addict, and
they were, they had the, the drink.
Yeah.
I think it's Dilaudid andyou keep it in the fridge.
And if you, if anything happens,if you fuck up your dose, if you

(27:57):
drop one, if you smash it, ifyou, you know, or whatever it is.
If you make one mistake, you are nolonger allowed to take it home with you.
So you have to like go to the doctor or goto the clinic and have them either inject
it or give it to you, administer it, andthen like that takes away your autonomy.
Yeah.
So like that's hard.
You're asking an addict to do.

(28:19):
Be like, okay, take this.
We're gonna help you wean yourself off.
You cannot make a single

Zoe (28:25):
fucking mistake, and you're bound to make mistakes in early
addiction, like it's fucking bound.
And also these things cost money.
They're not like, these are addicts we'retalking about that have no money, and
then they have to go and get Suboxone.
What do you mean it's not,it's not covered in Canada,
of course it's not covered.
Oh, no.
So that's another reason thatthese addicts like can't get
help on the street and like just

Heather (28:46):
Yeah,

Zoe (28:46):
they can't, they don't have access.
They don't have $50 to have like a

Heather (28:50):
month's

Zoe (28:51):
supply of Suboxone.
That's true.
And so when

Heather (28:53):
we talk about harm reduction, yeah, you're right.
It has taken on two different thingswhere it's like, yeah, there's an ability
to stop if you have the resources.
Yeah.
And maybe a house and a family.
And then there's like.
I don't have those resources.
I could never afford that andI don't have anything to lean
on, so let's do it this way.
Yeah.
I just hope my drugs are clean.
Yeah, it's really interesting.

(29:15):
But again, like you can alsoget addicted to these things.
Like you, you have to wean yourself off ofmethadone and that's really hard, right?
Like, I mean, I think if you're

Zoe (29:24):
a heroin addict mm-hmm.
You're not gonna get addicted tosomething that's a lower high than heroin.
It's v it's, I think that wouldbe unlikely, to be honest.
Yeah.

Heather (29:35):
But you, I wonder if like, giving yourself, I

Zoe (29:39):
don't know.
I would love to like talk to someonewho's used it 'cause For sure.
But like, I'd never, like when thepeople at rehab and my ex were talk,
or my rehab boyfriend was talkingabout it, it never seemed like a
thing that people got addicted to.
No.
Okay.
It never seemed like.
No one was like, no, don't do thatbecause you're gonna get addicted.

(29:59):
Everyone was like, no, like thisis like a good way to get sober.
Yeah.
Like it every, it was very positive.
That's good.
It was just like no one wantedto admit that they couldn't do
it on their own and like have tohave that help from another drug.

Heather (30:12):
Maybe that's what it is too.
It's like the ego of being like, I needhelp, so I'm gonna take this drug so
that I don't have to take this drug.
Exactly.
God, I just, fuck you.
I'll just take the drugs.
Like, it just seems like so exhausting.
That's what addiction is.
That's what addiction is.
Yeah, man.
Oh man.
Okay, so one of the questions we got lastweek was, is sobriety and sober curiosity.

(30:36):
Sober living is that.
Trendy.
Trendy?
Or is this a thing that wethink is going to stick?
Yeah.
Is this like a cultural shift?

Zoe (30:44):
Obviously it is trendy because it was in Happy Gilmore too.
Oh my God.
Yeah.
I didn't see it.
You saw it?
I saw it, yeah.
Did you see Happy

Heather (30:50):
Gilmore?
Yeah, and

Zoe (30:51):
it's, my dad was obsessed with that movie.
Like he played it probably likeevery few months when I was a kid.
And it's about golfing.
Have you never seen it?
No, I didn't.
I, oh my God.
No.
You would actually kindof fucking love it.
Yeah.
It's so stupid.
Funny.
You would cry.
Happy Gilmore.
He wanted to like, hegrew up playing hockey.

(31:11):
He fucking didn't knowhow to skate though.
Awful skater.
Great.
His name happy.
His name is happy.
Okay.
His dad like really wantedhim to be in hockey.
He really liked hockey.
Horrible skater.
Great fighter sounds like an addictwaiting to happen, but like never
could like get the hockey thing.
One day he hit a golf ball and itwent right through a window, like

(31:35):
streets down and everyone was like,oh my God, you should play golf.
You're so fucking good.
And then he started playing golf.
Yeah.
Then he started winning all this moneyand he needed to win money because
his grandma was gonna lose his house.
His grandma took care of him as a child.
He loves his grandma so much.
We love that we're fighting for him towin all this money at the golf tournament.
What's

Heather (31:54):
wrong with her?
Why?
She lost all her money.
Is she bad with money?
I don't fucking remember.
Okay.

Zoe (31:59):
But then he wins the money.
It's a generational issue.
He wins the money and grandmagets to save his house.
Thank you.
That's the end of Happy Gilmore One.
Okay, now we go on.
Happy Gilmore Two.

Heather (32:09):
Okay.
Riveting.
Let's go again.
I'm assuming grandma's no longer with us.
Grandma's no longer with us.
Yeah.
Okay.
Happy Gilmore has four kids, maybe fiveare his real daughters in the movie.
Yes.
I like their, I like, Ilove, I think they, I love.
They're just a cool, they're so

Zoe (32:25):
fucking cool.

Heather (32:26):
Yeah, I like that.
I love them.
I like that whole thing.
I love, I love them.
My sister sees him.
Would you fuck him?
No.
No.
I have zero interest in that kindof real choice of zero style.
And my sister sees him all the time.
Love in your film?
I, I

Zoe (32:42):
think he's, he's not stylish, but he is stylish.
Like he started a trend, ideally

Heather (32:48):
like it.
Yeah.
No, I don't wanna havesex with Adam Sandler.

Zoe (32:51):
I mean,

Heather (32:51):
would I

Zoe (32:52):
like Adam?
Probably not now.
Has like a whole like that'sthe Adam Sandler style.
Yeah.
You know, like he has

Heather (32:59):
Yeah.

Zoe (32:59):
Evolved like into

Heather (33:01):
Yeah.

Zoe (33:01):
It's crazy.
The style.
Just being

Heather (33:02):
a lazy asshole can turn into fashion for sure.

Zoe (33:05):
Yeah.
But uh, the second one.
He hits a golf ball.
Yeah.
And it hits his wife inthe head and he, she died.
No, she doesn't die.
It starts like that and I'm like, ugh.
Here, here again.
The, the mother of of his children again?
Yeah, the mother of his, his children.
Oh, dead.
That's how the movie starts.
Oh my God.
It's like up that movie up.

(33:27):
Dead right in the beginning.
Dead right in the beginning.
And then.
He's like drinking.
Sure.
Way too much.
Because he's sad and he's, he can'tbelieve that he killed his wife doing
the thing he loves and he's miserable.
He said He's drinking, he'sdrinking, he's drinking.
He drink.
Never

Heather (33:42):
golf again.

Zoe (33:43):
No.
He thought he was never gonna golf again.
But then he drank all his money away.
Oh.
And they have to moveout of grandma's house.
Lost everything.
Lost everything.
Are his kids still withhim or are they adults?
They are now in college.
One of them is living withhim, the real one, the girl.
And um, now he needs to play golf againto get some money, more money back.

(34:05):
Oh, okay.
This is just a moneymaking thing.
And now he goes to meetingsto like try to get sober.
And one of the girls that he talks toat the meetings is his other daughter.
Yeah, but, and they likehave a bond, but it's not

Heather (34:18):
his long lost daughter in the real movie.
No.

Zoe (34:20):
Oh, okay.
It's just, it doesn't matterwhat it's about, but they do
bring to, into sobriety, into it.
Yeah.
That's good.
Which is

Heather (34:27):
interesting.

Zoe (34:28):
Which is interesting.
Which is on theme of like,yeah, sobriety is trendy.
Like I, if it wasn't really trendy,they, Adam Sandler wouldn't put
this random storyline of himgetting sober into it in a comedy.
Happy Gilmore won.
He would like what?
20, 30 years ago?
He would never get sober.
Yeah.
That would never be a story arc.

(34:49):
No.
In a movie.
But now 2025, it is a storyarc because it's trendy to be

Heather (34:53):
sober.
That's actually a really interesting pointbecause yeah, a lot of the like recovery
movies I watch are like, yeah, they'relike in AA or they're in rehab and it's
like so devastating and it's all thesethings and it's like this is just like.
This is a guy, he's very funny.
He's a guy's guy.
Everyone loves him.
Everyone's dad nuts for him.
Yeah.
And like this guy is just going onhis normal life, but he's also in aa.

(35:17):
Yeah.
I feel like the demographic that AdamSandler caters to is interesting.
Yeah.
Because I think a lot of men of thatgeneration probably drink a lot.
Yeah.
And don't, yeah.
AKA my dad a yeah.
AKA.
Most of our dads, yeah.
Like most of our parents are.
They just like weren't taughthow to drink, nor were we.
Yeah.
But yeah, I think that's a, Ithink that's actually pretty cool.

(35:40):
Mm-hmm.
To be like, this is a guy that theyall love and respect so much and don't
expect kind of like emotions from him.
And then it's like, oh,a really real thing.
Yeah.
I don't think Adam Sandleris so in real, in real life.
Is he?
I don't think so.
I don't think so, but Ithink that's pretty cool.
I like it.
It was a cool story.
Arc was with the meetings thathe, oh no, they were co-ed
the meetings that he went to.
Yeah.

Zoe (36:00):
Yeah.
And the meetings that hewent to, like the per.
It wasn't like how realmeetings are at all.
Mm-hmm.
Like the movies never get it right.
Yeah.
Some weird guy was like runningit and I guess he got arrested
at the end by Kid Cudi.
Like there was so many fucking cameos.
It crazy.
Kid cu, I fucking love Kid Cudi.
And that's the thing, I thought myhusband was maybe gonna make a cameo.

(36:22):
Timothee Chalamet . Yes,because Kid Cudi made a cameo.
My husband plays basketballwith Adam Sandler.
My husband loves Kid Cudi.
There everyone.
Oh, like I really washoping that you're like all

Heather (36:36):
signs lead to T She, exactly.
You're did like, if Steve Carrellcomes out right now, I'm gonna freak
out and like, my man, oh my God.
This is, this is, I love so much.
Don't, I don't think that I realized that.
Are you crying right now?
Now Zoom in on her.
This is.

(36:57):
What's going on?
Wait, now I feel like I'm.

Zoe (37:09):
I loved Timothee Chalamet and I loved him first.
Okay, anyways,

Heather (37:16):
holy shit.
What would you even do if you met him?
I don't know.
Like, this is crazy.
This is really out of control.
One day we're gonna have areal conversation about how
dangerous the nineties were.
Yes.
Let, and early two thousands, twos,um, speaking of nineties, early

(37:37):
two thousands, we're talking aboutmillennials talking about, yeah.

Zoe (37:40):
Millennials.
I did have an interaction with one.
Mm-hmm.
Recently.
And with, with one of you,with one of you people.
Mm-hmm.
Because I'm a Gen Z guys.
Mm-hmm.
Barely.
But I was talking to this new girland I was like, yeah, I'm almost
three years sober, blah, blah, blah.
And she was like, oh yeah,you Gen Z kids, you are.
So health and wellness.

(38:00):
When we were drink too much, we justkept drinking until we figured it out.
Yeah.
And I was like, okay.
That seems, that seems likean inappropriate statement.

Music (38:10):
Mm-hmm.

Zoe (38:11):
You know,

Heather (38:12):
I've heard that from multiple people.
Yeah, I've heard that.
And maybe not necessarily aboutdrinking, but I have heard like.
We just kind of picked our bootstrapsup and went to work or like we just
kind of got over it or like I was doingthis and then we just kind of strap.

Zoe (38:26):
Yes, but then, then you're not an alcoholic.
If you can like get through it andlike keep living your life, then
yeah, you're not an alcoholic and youdon't necessarily need to stop then.
But like if I'm telling you thatI'm sober and that I stopped, you
should, you should clock that.
It was probably for areason, like I probably.
I don't wanna tell this random girl.
Yeah, but I didn't wanna be like,yeah, I ended up at the hospital 15

(38:48):
plus times and was gonna kill myself.

Heather (38:50):
Yeah.

Zoe (38:51):
Thank God I did get sober.
I didn't wanna say that toher, but it's just like you.
Some people need to be a little bitmore cautious of what they're saying.
Yeah, I think is what it is.

Heather (39:01):
I wonder what that is though.
'cause she's like, oh, you GenZs are so health and wellness.
Like as if that's thereason to not drink it.
Which it is, but it'salso not the only reason.
And I wonder why that's the firstthing to come out of your mouth.
Like I wonder is she.

Zoe (39:19):
Is she drinking too much?
Yeah.
I mean, she was drinkingwhen I told her that.
So maybe she can'tconfront her own drinking.
Yeah.
And can't look in inward.
So that's just what she says whenpeople tell her that they're sober.
Yeah.

Heather (39:32):
You know, and, and maybe to be like, oh, you guys are so healthy.
It, it's easier to say that thanlike, oh, you probably had a problem
and you had to look inward andyou had to do this and all the,

Zoe (39:40):
you know what I mean?
That's, yeah.
But it's just like, whycan't people just go there?
Like, why can't people just ask?
In a normal way, instead of justassume all these things like, yeah, I
know, I, yeah, I don't wanna be sober.
I have to be sober.
It's not because I'm ahealth and wellness freak.
Yeah.
Our first episode was called, thisis not a Health and Wellness podcast,

(40:01):
honestly, like, did you listen

Heather (40:02):
to the podcast matter?
She clearly didn't.
You obviously didn't.
The millennial idea arounddrinking I find very interesting.
Like I. We had an, we read an articlethat said like that the headline was
like, millennials are the most drunkwhatever generation in human history.
Yeah.
And so obviously we looked into that.

(40:23):
'cause I'm like, what's all this?
Then to me, I read that and Iwas like, yeah, that makes sense.
Not

Zoe (40:28):
really, and the

Heather (40:29):
grand scheme of

Zoe (40:30):
things, but maybe because there's so many millennials.
Maybe that's like where it comes in.
Yeah.
But I do think that there's been

Heather (40:36):
an interesting lifespan of millennial drinking.
Oh.
Like.
Millennials started drinkingbefore there were phones.
Yeah.
So like people have gone through,I don't know, there's people who
have gone through like a cultural

Zoe (40:49):
shift.
Well, and the drinking withoutphones, like not as many consequences.
Right?
Yeah.
'cause like you didn't text your fuckingex-boyfriend a billion times, you know?
Yeah.
If

Heather (40:58):
you, you had to like actually go to his house, which I'm sure you did.
I'm sure you did.
Mm-hmm.
I'm sure I would've, it was sad.
I mean, I

Zoe (41:04):
did, even though I had a phone.
Had a phone.
Yeah.
And

Heather (41:06):
still showing up places so.
Then we start to go to clubs.
And that's just like I, I feel likewhen I started drinking, you just
like had to just drink fucking hard.
Yeah.
And I think like vodka and tequila andwhatever was like cheapest and accessible.
Like I feel like something aboutthe millennial generation of

(41:27):
drinking is just so fucking sloppy.
Yeah.
And I don't know if that's likepressure and social pressure and then
all of a sudden we like have to get.

Zoe (41:36):
Jobs.

Heather (41:37):
I don't really know.
Yeah.
It just seems

Zoe (41:38):
like, yeah, you're expected to go crazy in college and then all of a
sudden clean up your act and get a job.
Yeah.
Like how does one go fromdrinking every single day Hardcore
to like having a life after.
Yeah.
How are you supposed to do both because I

Heather (41:55):
couldn't.
What you just said about like, you'resupposed to go crazy in college.
I think that's an interestingdichotomy with the, the purity culture.
'cause I think also what happenedwith millennials is they went through
the Christian purity of it all Right.
And like, but

Zoe (42:09):
I remember like being young and my parents being like, yeah, like
you're gonna drink like throughoutcollege, like you're gonna be crazy.
Like even before I started drinking, likethey had expected me to really, to like.
Drink a lot throughout myhigh school college years.
Mm-hmm.
And they just like thought that wasnormal, what everybody does and like
it is so normal, I just couldn't do it.

(42:29):
Yeah.

Heather (42:31):
Yeah.
I think, I think just thinking thatdrinking like that is normal or drinking
at all, it's like it is a risky thing.
Yeah.
Like we send our kids out to godrinking in college and it's like.
Giving them weapons.
Yeah.
Like you're giving themlike psychological warfare.
Yeah.
Like this could be so dangerous.
And it is so dangerous.
So dangerous.
I don't know.

(42:51):
The, the drinking behaviors are a lot.
And then I think paired with like.
The truth that is wellness culture.
Yeah.
I think there's like 50% of thepopulation is like wellness.
Wellness of millennials, andthen the other 50 is like,
fuck you we're drinking know.

Zoe (43:05):
Well, I think it's like the older generation, right?
Is more, fuck you we're drinking.
Yeah, we've been drinking.
We're never gonna stop drinking.
This is our thing.

Heather (43:13):
Yeah.

Zoe (43:14):
And then the younger generation of millennials is like, no, like what's.
What are these Gen Zs saying?
Yeah, let's be into ourhealth and wellness guys.
Like, let's,

Heather (43:22):
yeah,

Zoe (43:23):
let's not drink poison maybe every single

Heather (43:24):
night.
You know?
I do think, like generationally it doesmatter because I even think like I'm
the first of my family to go to therapy.

Zoe (43:32):
Yeah.

Heather (43:33):
Like, and now

Zoe (43:34):
everyone in your family goes to

Heather (43:35):
therapy.
Except for your mom.
Except for my mom.
But like, they weren't, theydidn't know what that was.
Yeah.
And people that are a little bit olderthan me are now trapped in this area.
They're like in their fortiesand they're like, okay.
So we were not taught.
To go to therapy and now we'relike of this age where like mm-hmm.

(43:55):
Now we'd have to go startunpacking all of this stuff.
Yeah.
Like I just feel like it's never toolate to go to therapy though, too.
But I think

Zoe (44:02):
that might be what some of those people are thinking.
Like, they're like, oh,like I'm 40, I'm 50.
It's too late.
Yeah.
What am I gonna, I have toomuch to talk about in therapy.
You know?
Like, no, it's never toolate to start therapy.
It's never too late to work on yourself.

Heather (44:15):
Yeah.
I think that's like a real big jobwith the millennials too, is to
be like, okay, all of our parents.
Either were in Vietnam or like hadparents who were in the war and it's
like there's so much trauma and thenthere's like now the millennials and
Gen Zs are like, let's unpack whyeveryone is so fucked up all the time.

Zoe (44:34):
Yeah.
For our next generation of kids.
Like let's not make our nextgeneration so fucked up.
Like Yeah.
It'll be interesting tosee like the next, yeah.
Yeah.
Because I'm very interested.
Yeah.
I hope I

Heather (44:45):
live long to see it.
Did you ever remember when theJonas Brothers had purity rings?

Zoe (44:49):
Yeah.
Did you ever, I wasn't

Heather (44:51):
into the Jonas Bros. Did you ever think like, I'm gonna wait until marriage

Zoe (44:54):
to

Heather (44:54):
have sex?

Zoe (44:56):
I mean, I did tell my dad that I was gonna never drink alcohol.
So like maybe I thought I was nevergonna have sex, but I don't know.
I remember being like young andlike listening to these sexualized
music lyrics, like Brianna, likeBeyonce, like, and to how they talked
about grinding on guys in clubs.

(45:16):
I was like, fuck, I can't wait to do that.

Heather (45:18):
Yeah.
So I

Zoe (45:19):
don't think, I don't, I was probably not thinking I was
gonna save myself for marriage.
And going back to the Omega thing, Idefinitely showed my pussy on there.
You did?
Yeah.
At what age?
Young.
Like what?

Heather (45:30):
I don't know.
Like a minor?
Yeah.
Holy fuck.
Yeah.
You're so punk.
Rock Zoe.
I can't put that in.
You're not scared of literally.
No, you have said we can't put thatin price, so there's gotta be one.
It's pretty incredible though.
Like I just didn't have the gumption.
I was afraid of literally everything Iwas Do you think that's crazy to put in?

(45:51):
No.
Okay, fine.
I think think a lot of fucking dumb kids.

Zoe (45:55):
Yeah.
I was a dumb kid.
I was a dumb horny kid too.
That was like,

Heather (45:58):
oh, this feels good.
But it's actually not even your.
Fault because you can be asdumb and horny as you want.
You're a kid.
Yeah.
I shouldn't have had access to that.
That's exactly right.
It's like, but it's not your

Zoe (46:08):
responsibility to be like, Ooh.
But also like if I was a kid rightnow, I would be on porn for sure.
I just didn't know what porn was.
Oh.
Boy, I looked for it though, didn't I?

Heather (46:18):
Yeah.
And that's how I stumbled upon ome.
Oh my God.
I used to type humping intoGoogle search, like Google images.
Yeah.
So embarrassing.

Zoe (46:28):
No, it's so embarrassing.

Heather (46:29):
But I do think, I don't know, like God, purity culture is so
weird, but I was kind of like leaninginto it in a way, and I was like,
well, if I'm not gonna have sex,I might as well just do this, but.
I don't think I ever

Zoe (46:41):
thought that I would save myself.

Heather (46:42):
No.
But it is.
I just, I do.
I was a little whore.
I do think it's like interesting to gothrough watch, watch shiny happy people
season two, because it's interesting.
It's like all of these people whojust like went to college and were
taken by like these culty Christians.
Mm. And it's like pure, andwe don't do this, and we
don't do anything to our body.
And then it's like even nowthe cult leader is like.

(47:04):
Raping everybody.
So what the fuck is this?
And then you start thinking, well, that's

Zoe (47:08):
like all cults, right?
Like yeah, that's literally all cults.
Which is Except for aa.
Except for aa.
And AA is not a cult, isn't it?

Heather (47:16):
Eh.

Zoe (47:17):
I guess so.
A little bit.

Heather (47:18):
Yeah.
But it's like fine.
It's like SoulCycle.
Exactly.
Yeah,

Zoe (47:20):
exactly.

Heather (47:22):
I, I don't know.
I just like that article thatwas like, millennials are the
drunkest generation in history.
And I'm like, okay.
Yeah.
I do think that there's been a lotof trauma done to the millennials.
Yeah.
I do think there's a lot of work thatthe millennials have to do and they

Zoe (47:34):
just like won't do it.
And I think it is, like, I thinkthat woman said that to me because
it, she is scared to look inward.
Yeah.
And she wants to just blame iton this other thing that doesn't
have anything to do with it.
Like health and wellness doesn't.
Makes sense to why I'm sober.
Like that's doesn't coincide babe.
Mm-hmm.
Like I told you, I'm sober.

(47:56):
Yeah.
That doesn't mean I'minto health and wellness.
Yeah.
I usually just go and maybe it's justlike people need to be more educated
of like what sobriety is and like whatpeople can and can't say to sober people.
Yeah.
Going into the store I havewith the convenience store guy.
Yeah.
So weird.
That pisses me off.
It's just the one convenience store.

(48:17):
It's always the same man that works there.
And I always get a pack of cigarettesand he always asks me if I want
a beer or wine for the road.
Like a traveler.
Yeah.
And I always say no, andI wanna go off at him.
Yeah.
Like I wanna go back there and say no.
Like you can't fucking ask people.
Yeah.
If they want a traveler justbecause they're buying cigarettes.

(48:38):
Yeah.
Just because I smoke doesn'tmean I drink alcohol.
Yeah.
A lot of people who smokecigarettes are sober.
Yeah.
You can't ask peoplethat You can't upsell.

Heather (48:47):
Yeah.
Alcohol.
Yeah.
And, and as addicts, like weare responsible for our own Yes.
Addiction.
However, however, there's

Zoe (48:56):
like, you don't need to do

Heather (48:57):
that.
No.
There's certain

Zoe (48:58):
things that people don't need to say.
You don't need to say that.
Why are you saying it?

Heather (49:02):
Yeah.

Zoe (49:02):
If someone buys candy, are you gonna ask them for a traveler, is it
just because I'm buying cigarettes?
Yeah.
I don't know.
Yeah.
I guess it's also just like so normal.
But like that's another thing.
Like it shouldn't you?
Yeah.
It shouldn't be normalized like no, there.
There are a lot of sober peoplenow coming in like, like we said.
Yeah.
Like it's the new, it is the new thing.

(49:24):
And everyone's at a differentpoint in their sobriety too.
If someone asked me that when I,if I was a couple days sober, oh,
I would've taken it up the sign.
I would've taken it, ofcourse I would've taken it.
Fuck that.
Can we just be a little bit morelike thoughtful of what we say?

Heather (49:37):
Yeah.

Zoe (49:37):
To anybody like.

Heather (49:39):
Yeah.
I, I, in any way, I think that's hardbecause alcohol is so normal and we're
the ones that are like, oh, sorry.
Like we're, we'll work around youand your alcohol culture, and it's
actually like, wait, your alcoholculture is so fucking detrimental.
Yeah.
That the guy on the corner isliterally asking me as a, as a
pass by comment if I wanna drink.
Exactly.
It's crazy.
Like, you just don't thinkabout that with alcohol.

(50:03):
People struggling with addiction,you just like, don't think about it.
Like, do you wanna drink?
The amount of times that peopleare like, oh, you wanna drink?
I mean, are you fucking kidding me?
The bar, that one bar that literally youcan trade in your chips for beer, right?
You

Zoe (50:14):
trade in your, my, the meetings I go to are by the Madison and.
It might just be a rumor, but people havetold me that I guess if you give like a
ca chip to the Madison or if you go toaa, if you bring any sort of like chip
in, they will give you a free picture of

Heather (50:33):
booze.
It's crazy.
That one is like very weaponizing.
That one I don't, I really hope that's

Zoe (50:39):
just

Heather (50:40):
a rumor that

Zoe (50:40):
people have

Heather (50:41):
said, yeah, true.

Zoe (50:42):
But I heard about it before.
That's true.
If you've heard about ittoo, then it's probably true.
And like, fuck you, the Madison, what?
Do what?
I know what's the, what'sthe thinking there?
Well see.
'cause that, what is the thinking?
You're just a horrible person.

Heather (50:55):
The thinking there, like I'm assuming they're like, oh,
I mean they're obviously clearlyassholes, but they're like,

Zoe (50:59):
well, they're clearly alcoholics that don't.
Wanna get sober and don't believe in it.
And so they're like using that as a

Heather (51:05):
Yeah.
Yeah.
I feel like the thinking is like, listen,we are not forcing anyone to drink.
They come in here, they bringtheir chips, they wanna thing true.
Like we didn't say, Hey, like we'regonna force this down your throat.
Fucking bullshit.
Yeah.
It's like.
You're like actively putting asystem in place to fuck with people.
Yeah.
And like their vulnerability.
It's like, that's thecraziest shit I've ever heard.

(51:25):
Yeah.
Yeah.
Ugh.
But yeah, I think, I think maybe with likethe new generation of like sobriety, there
will be more of a understanding of like

Zoe (51:36):
what, like what's acceptable to say or to like sober people.
Yeah.
Like, I don't know.
Or like.
Don't be shoving alcoholdown people's throats.
Yeah.
You know, and like I was at a eventmaybe last summer and the bar had sh.
Water guns filled with booze.
Whoa.

(51:56):
And they were spraying it everywhere.
Oh my God.
You're like, and I had a drink in myhands, so like, I would have to cover
it to like make sure that there was noalcohol being sprayed into my Coca-Cola.
That's so crazy.
So it was so hard tostay sober at that bar.
Oh my God.
Like, why did I put myselfinto that situation?
Even like, I felt safe there, butthen I was like, oh, like I never

(52:17):
had to physically cover my drink.
That's.
Really wild.
That's just like, yeah,we're all drinking.
We're all drinking.
I guess like I think withinthe next 10 years it, it will
be the convenience store.
A guy won't be upselling me alcoholjust 'cause I buy cigarettes.
Yeah.

Heather (52:34):
Well.
'cause they don't, I don't say,they never say like, oh, well you
want a pack of cigarettes, like ifyou're getting milk or something.
They're never like, do youwant, well, that's the thing.
Yeah.
If I was just getting a pack of

Zoe (52:42):
candy, they're not gonna offer me a pack of cigarettes because
cigarettes, and if I'm getting acandy, I'm not getting offered alcohol.
Yeah.
Am I?
And just because I smokecigarettes doesn't mean I drink.
A lot of sober people smoke cigarettes.
Yeah.
Only.
Yeah.
Like me.
Yeah.
And that's my chance for addiction.
Well, not really because I'vealways smoked cigarettes.

(53:04):
Yeah, you gotta do what you gotta do.
It's the whole lore of it, and Heatherlikes it when I smoke cigarettes.
She says, I look cool.
You

Heather (53:10):
do look cool.
And

Zoe (53:11):
I like the way that my house smells after you smoke outside.
My boyfriend hates the way that I smell.
Oh, everyone hates it.
You're the only one that likes it,and I think that's why you're the
only one that actually loves me.
Well, and that's exactly right.
Does he ever say anything about kissing?
Like does kissing bother him?
I mean, it's not his favorite thingafter I smoke a cigarette and kiss him.
Yeah.
He's not.
He's not thrilled.
Yeah.
But he still does it.

(53:32):
Well then maybe you'll stop.
Maybe he'll stop and kiss you.
No, maybe you'll stop.
Oh, I thought he said maybehe'll stop kissing me.
Wow.
And kiss you.

Heather (53:41):
And instead maybe he'll break up with you and Yeah.
And then me and will get togetherand ride off into the sunset.
Yeah.
No, I'm just kidding.
Um, okay.
Do you wanna go get a mocktail?
Yeah.
Are we done with that?

Zoe (53:52):
I feel good about it.
Okay, good.
Okay.
Okay.
Let's get a mocktail at zero bar.
Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh.
Dance with the gaze.

Heather (53:59):
Dance with the gaze, the sober gaze.
Uhuh, I'm proud of you.
Oh, I'm proud of you.
Goodbye.
Proud of you guys.
Proud of you.
Thanks for listening to Girl Un Drunk.
You can follow us on Instagram and TikTokat Girl Un Drunk podcast and or send

(54:20):
me an email at [e-mail].
I just hit my knee and,oh, I did it again.
I haven't,

Zoe (54:27):
oh, didn't they used to do that?
The doctors?
Yeah, I have like a memory re reflexes.
Yeah.
I wonder if that was reported.
I don't have good reflexes then.
Oh God, I'm scared.
What's wrong with you?
Because it's, you now do it.

Heather (54:45):
I do it to myself and I
knocking on your.
That's weird.
Zoey, maybe you're, you know what it isthat you're probably just so prepared.
You're like, no, nothing can,nothing can make me twine.
Nothing.
A sober girl, nothing can wreck me.

Music (55:03):
Oh my

Zoe (55:03):
God.