Episode 33 | Protest or Parade? - Hey White Women

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Right now, in France, there was a farm tax that they didn't like, so they just took manureand dumped it all over until they got what they want, right?

(00:10):
And I'm like, what if, you know, this has really gotten me started thinking, right?
So I'm like, first of all, when people are saying, why isn't the military doing something,right?
I don't think they know what they're talking about.
Like, what you're talking about is the military intervening and democracy removing thepresident, and that's crazy.
But I'm starting to be like, I think maybe what actually needs to happen is like fivemillion veterans need to just get together and march into the literal White House, grab

(00:46):
him out of the chair, dump him on Pennsylvania Avenue and say, pick again America,
Got to tell Rebecca about how I got white woman whisperer on TikTok.
what happened?
Bernie Bros.
Bernie Bros happened.

(01:08):
Mmm.
Mmm.
Yeah.
first thing our producer Haley said, because it was literally the day we didn't recordlast week.
And she was like, oh my gosh, Rebecca is going to just laugh or have thoughts.
So I, you know, what happened was if any of y'all have listened to our number three ofthis podcast, episode three, that's the word I was looking for.

(01:34):
We talk about this time, I had to testify against my ex-husband who the army found out wasa white supremacist and they were kicking him out of the army.
And in his like own description, right, of his own radicalization is I used to be a prettymoderate guy.
I was choosing between Bernie and Trump.
Right?

(01:54):
And that immediately made sense to me.
Like I had never gotten into Bernie.
It was kind of giving cult, but also
just like I was busy sporting Elizabeth Warren and writing a book, right?
But I said, I made a video where I said it is relevant that the extremist himself, right?

(02:18):
And now of course I've written in Cult of America about this.
I'm like the kind of mediocre angry white man.
who would walk up to his wife after she gave the college valedictorian speech afterescaping a cult with no education and tell her the other guy was funnier, right?
That kind of angry white bro that is mad that America's moving on and not centering youanymore, both Bernie and Trump appeal to them, right?

(02:48):
And I've told this story in the past, but I just made this video saying that's becausesomeone was like, do you still think Bernie is an extremist?
And I said,
didn't say Bernie was an extremist, right?
The extremist said that Bernie's tactics appealed to him, right?
And two hours later, I was was demonetized, you know, in alive 24 violations in 10minutes.

(03:14):
And I was just like, and I actually kind of remember being like, this is so weird.
What am I feeling?
Am I go?
I've, like, this is what happens to black women on the internet.
All the time.
You know, and I've seen other creators and you talking about this where it's like you'reknown to your audience as a consummate expert and very good, you always know your stuff,

(03:42):
you show up every day and then you say one thing they don't like and all of a sudden theyforget.
that you're an expert that does your research that knows what you're talking about, youknow, like maybe I've written a whole book on this topic.
It's listen to black women until a black woman is saying something, know, theory is fine.
You know, they understand conceptually all this stuff, but in reality, there's still anexceptionalism to each of these people, right, that have an indoctrinated, that will end

(04:15):
up in some kind of group setting where it's the group, there's a the in something.
And if there's a the in it,
you are going down a road.
I realized like, similarly with the, sorry, you know, the marches protests, okay.

(04:38):
I had the nerve to have a feeling about them that wasn't thank goodness, I guess.
And it's just the nice guys reacting out of you.
What do you mean?
We are the good ones.
And it doesn't matter what side.
If you reject what they have deemed to be the correct answer to their thing, their socialscript, you are the problem.

(05:02):
So that's, of course, what started happening, right?
And then even people who are my followers, who've loved me for years were like, this one,now you lost me, right?
Like now, you know?
So first of all, my first thing was to come back and say, every cult scholar and everyscholar of extremism says the same thing, and y'all don't listen.
You pretend to listen, but you don't listen, which is like, it's not the content of yourcharacter that matters, right?

(05:28):
It's not the belief.
of the cult that makes it a cult, right?
That's why we're here to talk about tactics.
That's why we're here to, and you know, it was interesting because it gave me anopportunity to show that first of all, was like, nobody likes it when the cult eye is
turned on them, right?
But like, I felt like my followers, they were coming to me in the live and almost beinglike, but now, it was like they needed me to give them permission to still love me.

(05:58):
And it's like, y'all like,
First of all, Daniella the individual gets to have political opinions, right?
And like Daniella the individual sometimes acts culty, you know?
I was glad when Kamala took over because she was better at doing the leader of themovement thing than like blank sheet of paper Joe Biden.

(06:18):
And then I had to call myself out on that, you know?
And like I was calling the other side maggots for a couple of days and I thought it wasclever.
And then I was like, no, that's...
dehumanizing language, right?
And I can call myself out on that.
But it was this, it was just such an interesting moment for me to be like, so, and by theway, the extremist we're talking about here is my ex-husband, right?

(06:43):
So if I can separate my feelings, and I can separate my feelings about that man and thehorrible things he did to me enough to realize that it's...
important to listen to the extremist describing his extremism process, but you can'tseparate your feelings enough about a political candidate you have never met and you think

(07:08):
that like you're the, you know better in this conversation or like you're the expert hereor something all of a sudden.
It's gaslighting.
It's because, cause look at the context of what you're doing, why you're doing it, whatyou're saying.
And it's like, all they hear, I've been just, there's been so much with this, you know,all they hear is the story and the storyline and that's, and they focus on the main

(07:33):
characters of the story.
They are not looking at the storytellers.
Why are they telling you this?
White woman whisperer got on the internet and said, Hey,
I don't know.
How is this different from the, the pussy hats and the black squares and the bluebracelets and the, how is it different?
And they said, I can't believe you, you know, would do this.
I'm so disappointed.

(07:54):
We're getting fired up, which I don't think you understand how much you are hurting yourown cause and trying to let me know when you tell me this is getting you started.
This has gotten you off your seat.
Nothing has happened to you actually.
It's the threat something may and all you did was rally against the Republicans.

(08:16):
Okay, now what?
You could have gone and done something.
Y'all are showing telling that you're scared.
What are you scared of?
I'm going to say that again.
You know, what are you scared of?
Being treated like me?
And I think that's a moment people don't wanna have, right?
And I am learning that like, what, like white America doesn't know how to respond, right?

(08:41):
Like they literally do not, we literally do not know what to do because we haven't had,because we haven't had to fight for our existence.
in our homeland for a very long time.
Other people have, non-white America has, but white America has not.

(09:04):
People have asked me, well, something, okay, but what happened?
Cause I said, you know, like what change are we talking about?
No one even knows.
They're just like mad at me for asking.
Okay.
But BLM, what about BLM?
Which I also think I don't know if you can see the three letter words and all that stuff.
Black lives matter.
Saying those three words bothered a lot of people saying the words, you know why?

(09:26):
Because we are lives.
And I remember going through and realizing,
They don't think black lives is a thing you should say.
Because you're like, what do mean?
Just lives, it's just people.
And that's the problem.
Black people go to the street because you're gonna see us.
Look at us, look at how many of us there are.
White people taking to the street with police assistance, we already know.

(09:48):
You're on the news, you're everywhere.
You're in the Congress, you're doing everything.
We already know it's bad and you're pissed.
You set up a day to say like, we're gonna say it out loud in your face.
Okay, we heard you.
We have you heard us for 400 years?
No.
Instead, when I say, hey, you did it on a Saturday, that's not very disruptive.
Not even, I just don't even think protests are a white people thing because of thevisibility and like black lives matter caused disruption just in existing.

(10:15):
You already exist as people.
What are you going to do about it?
You could have walked into buildings like you and I have had these conversations, likehave a plan, be strategic.
And they said, we're going to do what black people have done and stand in the street.
But look,
And then they're like, we're so peaceful.
Yeah.
because it was white America.
When we congregate, they're afraid.

(10:36):
When you congregate, they're like, aw, so do something with that.
I don't know, don't get mad at me for saying, I don't think this is doing what you thinkit's doing.
Or I don't know what you think it's doing.
And if this is your action, and you couldn't even go to vote or whatever, then, I don'tknow what friend is asking, then like, I don't know what you.

(10:58):
I'm at least going to say this is what I feel about it.
I don't know.
I hear a lot of you congratulating yourselves, but then telling me you're fired up now orsince 2020, 2016.
I just don't think people understand what it sounds like.
like white women have been so used to being spoken to and for and with, but never about ornever heard themselves being spoken about.

(11:25):
Black people talk about child talk, but like,
you're hearing it and you're like, Whoa, why could, why would you think something likethat of us?
Cause you, cause you're yelling at me now and I wasn't even talking to you.
You know, I, I posted on my Patreons specifically cause I was like, gosh, if I critiquethis thing, they're going to be so mad at me.

(11:47):
And like to pay it to comment things to me, like I can't believe I'm sad that you wouldeven criticize you don't call black women didn't black women.
If you had listened to black women 400 years ago, let's say 40 years ago, let's say fouryears ago, like we wouldn't be here.
we are here for the purpose of criticizing.

(12:09):
Like, what do they think they're following you for?
Like, because that was, I mean, obviously not the same, right?
But like, that's why this thing to me was so frustrating.
Like I had to go, literally, I'm going to other platforms and like people are finding meto yell at me.
And I'm like, if you're coming,

(12:29):
to another platform to yell at me that your guy's not a cult leader, like I have some newsfor you, you know, and just that reaction.
Now, I mean, I also think this is why people can't get me, right?
Because I'm such a white lady, why am I not freaking out?

(12:49):
And it's because I'm like, so first of all,
it
all rushing to try to educate me that this is scary.
And I'm like, I've been yelling about this since 2015 at the top of my lungs and writingbooks and building platforms.
Second of all, like I've lived through existential threats before for a large portion ofmy life, especially in other countries.

(13:16):
And then like,
And then I just, at the end, I just add on now for fun.
And I'm like, third of all, knitting-coat lady knows how to run away to Brazil.
Like what?
You know?
weird because I saw that I saw on my FYP.
Can we talk about a knitting cult lady being a Psy up?
And I got to tell you, I also think it has, of course I'm going to take a little creditbecause I'm self centered just like everybody else.

(13:38):
But like you talk to me almost every week, right?
And even if you were to be on the freaking outside, look at what black people are doingright now.
It's not that we're sitting out.
Okay.
I just also want to say this.
Black lives matter.
That as a phrase.
stoked a lot of conversations in itself.
We took to the streets because you couldn't do anything else.

(13:59):
We gotta go where we are.
Hands off protest, not really sure what, I mean, be more clear, right?
Hands off, and I think that's supposed to be like hands off our bodies.
Is that what that's supposed to be?
I think.
was supposed to be hands off America.
See, it's not clear, but you're making the point, right?

(14:22):
Hands up.
Okay.
That's unclear.
You know, I want to go back to, and I've been thinking like my language or the language Ilike to use is more primitive.
I want to bring back the word primitive as something, know, like you understand rightaway.
Very clear.
Human to human, not complex and civilized and five forks and each fork means somethingspecial.

(14:45):
Now.
You know what to do with this.
this I'm combining a couple of things, but there's a lot of talk on, you know, the blackside of tech talk about, BBLs and stuff.
And this woman said, she had this issue with her BBL went viral, but she said, sit downair was smelling really bad.
My sit down air stunk really bad.
And for some reason that stuck in my head.
I really liked hearing the phrase.

(15:07):
Everyone knows exactly what she means.
Right.
She's talking about, but without.
making it as a grown woman and you know it's a conversation beyond that but the way I likelanguage and understanding is is it usable?
Do you understand what you're here to do?
What's the point of this protest to get together to know to talk about change and listenbut people are just talking to each other?

(15:30):
That's not just being showing up.
People showed up.
that's giving like all presses good press.
I don't, they showed up and did what?
Then they yelled at me at home.
They yelled at me about it.
And, you know, so I've been listening to this book by Philippa Gregory called NormalWomen.
And Philippa Gregory usually writes like sensational Tudor England novels, right?

(15:53):
She wrote The Other Bowling Girl, okay?
But she went and she wrote a book that was like, you know, it's fiction that women weren'talways in the narrative, right?
Women were always part of the narrative.
for all of history.
So I'm gonna write a book about normal English women.
And it's so funny, because I was trying to listen to this and do crafts to tune out, butit's just so relevant.

(16:16):
And it's just like, English women, they know how to revolt.
They know they have been existentially, maybe not today, but in the past.
These English peasant women, they knew what to do.
Right now, in France, there was a farm tax that they didn't like, so they just took manureand dumped it all over until they got what they want, right?

(16:44):
And I'm like, what if, you know, this has really gotten me started thinking, right?
So I'm like, first of all, when people are saying, why isn't the military doing something,right?
I don't think they know what they're talking about.
Like, what you're talking about is the military intervening and democracy removing thepresident, and that's crazy.
But I'm starting to be like, I think maybe what actually needs to happen is like fivemillion veterans need to just get together and march into the literal White House, grab

(17:20):
him out of the chair, dump him on Pennsylvania Avenue and say, pick again America,
right?
Like we swore to protect and defend against enemies, foreign and domestic, you know?
And like.
I'm trying so hard to figure out, like, what can I do as an individual?
And like, it's so weird and frustrating on this side to be like writing about this,studying this.

(17:45):
Like, I would do anything to have him out of there.
But like, what's that tipping point?
And I just...
And what put him there?
See, I don't feel like white people go far enough because they're so consumed with theircurrent fear that they, their short-sighted fear that this is the, this is the threat

(18:05):
that, that Trump and this administration is the problem.
So then are you saying there wasn't a problem when black women were saying, Hey, you knowwhat could come down the line?
There was a problem then we didn't fix that one.
You know what started that problem?
Remember that one?
We didn't fix that one.
So it's why I always go back to white women need to make it about your race.

(18:27):
Your race.
When I say make it about race, I don't mean talk about racism.
I mean, talk about your race because your race is the reason this is happening.
Your white womanhood, not just woman, because women have been, some women have been doingfrom day one, all of the work.
And it hasn't been white women as a whole.
You want to talk?
Wolf in sheep's clothing.

(18:49):
I, as I brought up black and white thinking, someone brought up black sheep and I've beenthinking about that a lot.
just the generalizations of black sheep and like, that doesn't have to be bad, butwhiteness took it, made it bad.
Wolf in sheep's clothing.
Y'all are like, we don't talk about looks.
Yeah, it looks like a wolf, but we don't talk about looks.
He's giving us money not to talk about looks.
So we're not going to talk about him while he gets closer and closer to the black sheepand eats the black sheep because we have a deal with the wolf anyway.

(19:11):
But like the MLM cult whiteness is the problem.
Not how you view black people.
Not that it's that you don't deal with conflict.
You don't listen to criticism because you're in a cult and you don't see yourself as partof it.
So when you hear things about it, you're like those people, those people, not, you know,liberal white women that are a problem, not like me.

(19:36):
And it's always like you.
It's the people yelling at me about how they're on the right side of history.
And they will write in my comment.
I've always been on the right side of history.
Shut up to me.
And on my platform where it's free for them to listen, they don't even have to do it.
Right.
But I'm making them, I'm making them defensive.
I'm making them angry.
making them think differently.

(19:57):
And that is what gets attacked is me.
And to me, that's it.
Right.
It's the MLM of it all.
It's when Trump said, however, many years ago, I could shoot somebody on fifth Avenue andnothing would happen or whatever.
That wasn't like everybody loves me.
No.
That's no one does anything here when bad things happen.

(20:19):
Nothing will happen to me.
He was right.
He put up, like I said, a full page ad about basically murdering some black boys thatdidn't do anything wrong and we made him president.
I think that's the problem.
Not now that he's president, let's address the things he's doing as president.
No, how did we get?
Where you thought that was okay in the first place, that this random man who has neverdone a good thing in his life in terms of things that you can list is still

(20:44):
should be the one leading your army because you're so fearful of outside, of scary.
That it's the fearful of others, because he's just the war captain.
What if we don't have war?
I mean, he's crashing the world right now.
He's precipitating his own apocalypse.
know, like this is, I keep saying like it's cult leader in end stage, but yeah, I mean,the cult leader only exists because the people want the cult leader to lead them, right?

(21:19):
they believe that they can make it, they know MLMs are 99 % failure.
Like I've been kind of obsessing over the MLM thing now because I'm like, it's white onwhite crime.
This is where you guys really could be getting together and understanding how you'remanipulated.
The nice, performative, polite consent.
Like the compromising of your consent is right there in capitalism and commercial cults,all cults.

(21:43):
if black people aren't there,
Not because we don't have much, because we have honest conversations with each other andgo, why would that man ask you to go to that thing early on?
I made a video about that too.
Like our families almost get got.
so by the way, I have to say, Eliza Schlesinger, a white comedian, went and did her lastspecial in Salt Lake City, Utah, and she went into MLMs, and she went into like white

(22:09):
woman-ness.
It was good, it was good.
But there was a guy, a black guy who was trying, NXIVM was trying to recruit, right?
So after it blew up, someone asked him like why,
Why didn't you fall for it?
And he was just like, just, think that, you know, paraphrasing, right?

(22:30):
But like black people know when somebody is trying to like own them and coerce them,right?
Like it's just in, and like you said, you all talk about it, right?
We don't talk about it.
We don't talk about anything white America, you know, like.

(22:51):
why we haven't changed.
It's not because things just don't change.
Like if you talked about it, you would change.
That's why TikTok changed so much because people were talking and sharing their ownpersonal experiences.
And we're like, we're not special.
You're not special.
You're just a person, but that special that you're holding onto that you want validated.

(23:12):
And MLM is like, we got this.
You can be the top 1 % of this company.
Maybe not this company.
Next company.
You can be the top percent of this company.
USA.
Another three letter word like MLM, USA, ROI, GDP.
Calm down.
me realize another level of why college is such a good recruiting ground for cults.

(23:36):
Because college is like the first time for so many kids, I think that you don't feelspecial, right?
Think about it, like you're out of your home, right?
Your parents are not, like in some way, like if you have good parents, right?
They're making you feel special.
That's part of what childhood should be.

(23:56):
Well, yeah, that's funny because my mom was so intentional and she always said it.
She was like, when it was just you, I put you in preschool, not just because I neededtime, but I needed you to know you're the center of my world, but not the center of the
world.
You know.
like having those discussions, right?
But does white America have those discussions?
know, but, and then, know, intelligence wise too, right?

(24:22):
You get to college and like, so you've been told that, right?
If you get to college, like you've been on top of the intelligence pyramid for at least awhile.
And now all of a sudden you get there and there's like everybody here was it, you know,smart and not every, right?
But like,
yeah, it's not with you.
of a sudden you're just one in a crowd and that can feel like really, really hard anderasing.

(24:47):
And then Upshows, Upshows occult, right?
Like here we are.
Yup.
You want to feel even more in control of your life because maybe you don't feel in controlas much as you did before in like, in your specialness.
And, and when they say, don't tell your, your people, don't tell your parents, that'ssomething you guys are already practicing and primed for.

(25:07):
The isolation and the self shaming and the like, seen and not heard, right?
I talk about in my Patreon video, like my brother, it wasn't a big moment to me, but itwas just like my brother almost was in an MLM, but I didn't know at the time, it was years
ago.
I just asked the questions that came to my head naturally when he was telling me thesethings.
It didn't make sense.

(25:28):
And so I asked him and it popped the bubble, I guess he was feeling special.
Then here I come big sister, like, you're not that, I love you.
But that doesn't make sense that some random guy in a park thinks you're just like, yougot something.
I don't like that.
just that, and for years after that, if a friend was getting into something similar, wedidn't have a name for it.

(25:48):
I didn't know what these things were, but I had been to one kinda where I was like, yeah,but if they're saying they're retired, they're still in this room with me.
I'm thinking about the storyteller, not the story.
That guy who retired and never has to work again is still in this room talking about thisthing.
Does that mean if I do that, this is what I'll be doing?
That sounds terrible.

(26:10):
I don't want to do that.
is why I tell people, I'm like, if there was a way to get people out of cults that we knewabout, I would be super rich and I wouldn't be here talking to you, right?
Because I would have just, everyone wants help with that.
So anyone like.
and I feel like it's right there, but white people don't have the conflict tools.
I'm, because I'm reading also the magical age of overthinking.

(26:32):
And I realized I have to just consider it a white people book, like corporate cults,because she's saying stuff and I like Amanda Montel, but she's saying stuff.
And I'm like, not everybody, you know, and if you, she's just made it about her race, itwould be much better.
I don't know.
that, you know, it's just a white.
this is good because I'm about to go through Culting of America for the second time.

(26:53):
And so I can be like looking for this and like pulling this in to more places and like.
And it's just like, whenever there's a generalization, just include race into thatgeneralization.
Because when white women talk about all women this, you don't know me.
Sorry.
I'm a woman.
And when you make a generalization as a white woman that all women, or, you know, thisstudy says that our brains naturally make us judge people by the way they look.

(27:21):
Who is in the study?
Who was in the study?
Because I'm going to tell you right now, it wasn't black women for the most part, becausethat's never part of the diversity, you know, of the, of the sample is are there black
women and, know, between black women and I said the million man march and stuff, I'm goingto make a video about it, but yeah, Angela Davis and bell hooks had things to say about

(27:43):
the million man march, but do we know what they were?
Cause they weren't let's please do this.
What did black women think about that March?
that was filled with millions of men.
yeah, people, women were there too, I'm sure.
You know, like, in it, the patriarchy is in that thing.
Louis Farrakhan, the preacher, and his, anyway, you know, but.

(28:06):
by the way, last week when I got burned, right, and I was like, well, I don't totallyunderstand it.
I bet black women do.
And I went and I listened and like I literally took Mediocre, the Dangerous Legacy ofWhite Male America by Ijeoma Oluo open and it fell open to that.
Right.
Like I clearly knew that was there, have come back to it many times.

(28:32):
And it's like, yeah, they've been saying it since the beginning.
And now, by the way, anytime anyone tries to get into content with Bernie with me, I'mjust like, why hasn't he told his followers to stop being toxic to black women on the
internet in the last 10 years?
Why didn't he have a black woman running me?
point, it makes me think that it's because you like the angry white man voter out theredoing your dirty work for you, right?

(28:55):
it's all strategy and business still politics and ex and in corporations.
I don't see much of a difference.
They're just little divisions.
get divisions of the corporation.
You company towns.
We're a corporation nation and we just title it different stuff.
If the MLM is not business is not that much different than a real business.

(29:17):
Cause I do see, hear people say that in the anti MLM.
They're like, imagine going into a real business and saying just like this stuff.
They do.
They do.
That's just the male version.
That's the overt.
That's the like ESP thing.
And this is MLM.
They're all the same.
If you can't say how you feel, you're probably in something dangerous and you turned yourmarch into an MLM.

(29:42):
And I think that's really weird.
Someone said in response to me, they said, get, uh, you get out of it, what you put intoit or something like that.
It is what you make it.
I was like, ew.
A protest?
no, they're playing protester and I don't think people know what a protest is about.

(30:02):
calling it a parade, but like it was a parade.
was a parade.
It was.
It was like, like, does anyone know what to what to do next?
Like
up and felt good about themselves.
And like that wasn't.
It's like, I say the same thing in corporate America, right?
Like you're offsite.

(30:25):
Like that is your little mini cult session, right?
Like that is for you to get motivation, to get people inspired, to get whatever.
None of that's gonna matter unless you have your actual like operational meetings, youknow?
Cause like that is not, that doesn't do anything, right?

(30:45):
everyday day to day.
This was the weekend.
This was like, you get, we're going to allow you to air your grievances, have your littlegripe session today, and then we'll go back to business as usual.
Literally, because it was on a Saturday and fine.
Fine.
Do it, but don't be surprised when we go.
Okay.
One, we didn't, you know, like I said, black people didn't not go cause we think you gotthis.

(31:08):
We just think you don't got this.
You clearly don't.
You wanted this.
Yeah.
Okay, so I need your advice about like, white women taking care of each other, right?
So like, I mean, I'm selling this book that's like for white women to focus on theproblems of whiteness and handle our own business, but also I'm kind of getting into that

(31:32):
myself.
And it's like, there's critiques, but
I also feel like there's a point where we shouldn't be bothering black women to teach usanymore and we should be taking care of our own business.

(31:53):
so I'm conscious of that.
I've definitely read more books about anti-racism and anti-blackness by black women than Ihave read books about whiteness by white women.
Yeah.
But I just, I just want to know your thoughts in this general arena.
Yeah.
Because that's what usually comes up when I say, you know, make it about race.

(32:14):
And I mean, I have to always say your race because people think that means make it aboutthe harms of racism.
And okay, you can make it about the harms of racism to yourself.
think it's like figuring out how it has limited your own life, how it has put you in acult, like the anti MLM type things and being specific and realizing as you're specific.

(32:37):
you end up pointing to black women, right?
And there are black women who have been always doing the work, have done the work, thebooks are out, even if it's not based on anti-racism.
Octavia Butler, reading the parable of the Sower and parable of the talents, white womendon't like to do it because they feel like it's too relevant.
And I can't even explain to you how ridiculous that sounds to me, right?

(33:00):
Because that's the answer.
If it's relevant, that means she's talking about what you need to hear.
And the, it's relevant because we have been saying this for decades.
had to be a decades for her to even write a whole novel about it and create a world inwhich she's saying, this is what is happening.
And people won't listen to it.

(33:21):
It's listening so much better and, and active listening differently because apparently alot of listening is talking and for you, it is different.
But I think it will come up often that it's like, you are calm because we have theseconversations.
And it's not just a side thing.
It's because you have black women in the background of your mind.

(33:45):
A lot of people do not.
A lot of people piss me off.
like part of how I survive this, survive, right?
Nothing has changed, right?
But just like to me, the mental triggering and the anger or whatever is I go to the bar inmy front yard and I just watch black women and they're just inspiring fashion and they're
calm and I listen and learn.

(34:08):
And I, your answer has really helped me because I've been telling people kind of like thedifference between a
guru and an expert is an expert can tell you exactly where their expertise came from.
And like, I can be working on anti whiteness, but I can tell you exactly how black womenhave educated my practice on this, because it's not like I am some special white woman

(34:32):
that has a different perspective.
Like I've gotten it from the people who have different perspective.
And you're constantly working on it.
You're not saying you're done.
It's demonstrating it, just like the way I am.
I come to this app and I say, I'm listening to black women and then I'm checking in withmy own feelings and then I share my feelings about that, that whole thing.

(34:57):
And sometimes they're not, it's not always this big, it's not proportional to the problem.
Sometimes it's just saying, am I not allowed to ask questions?
as a black woman and having white women come back me up, I think would do so much more forwhite women community if they could see their power as security for black women, as

(35:18):
protectors of black women.
And say you wanna talk about women, women, women, if you protect black women, you areprotecting yourself because those black women are already protecting you.
So you'll have more, it like feeds into...
Itself, it's not an external.
You don't have to go out and find a book.
Black women are constantly talking about this all the time.
I have a Patreon, right?

(35:39):
Where I'm just figuring out all these different things and you'd be surprised how whitewomen don't want to pay for my Patreon.
I'm gonna tell you that, right?
And they'll come up with all the reasons and tell me them, which I didn't need, but it'sweird that you're telling me.
And, and there's just so much used to this like,
the earning and the discomfort.

(36:02):
They're just not willing to get into this uncomfortable, nuanced phase of, I'm white, I'mgonna talk about my whiteness, but I'm learning about my whiteness from black women.
Black women are telling you, how do you expect men to learn?
When I say men, the men of women, it's like, what would you want a man to do?
Yes, leave you alone in life, especially in the dark, especially in these places, but tobe talking to their friends.

(36:26):
And, and I pointing these things out when they're just chilling, not when, you know,waiting for their moment to go punch a guy in the face.
No, it's checking on your girls when you don't need to.
I'm gonna tell you.
So I went home to visit with a friend and we're just sitting and there's a bar, a bunch ofblack people.
It was at this wine bar and this, the pair of people sitting across from us got some food.

(36:50):
We didn't order any food, right?
We just ordered drinks.
They ordered food and drinks after us.
They had food and they were sitting and the woman looks up and she looks across from us.
goes, did you guys order?
You didn't get your food.
And immediately she was concerned that we didn't eat yet or we hadn't gotten, they hadgotten there after us.
And she was like, no, I just saw you guys from outside.
just want to make sure everything is good.
And it was just such a natural thing that she did.

(37:11):
Black woman just saw two other black women, make sure you get, there wasn't a lot ofthought and it was such a nice moment, but that's how we walk around is just a common
humanity.
But if you are.
thinking one, that this is for other people.
Like your anti-racist journey should not be for to help other people.

(37:32):
I think that's really important.
This is for you.
I'm doing this because, yes, it's for me, but it's for you too.
Because this is the truth.
We are talking about white women all the time.
I am reading salvation, or I already read salvation by bell hooks, but I brought it backout because I remember she talked about the million man march in it.
And we talk about homophobia in the black community and why that got in the way of someblack women.

(37:55):
Like intersectionality, reading books by black women, do all the work.
And it's not just like, black women, black women.
It's like, no, she talks about homophobia in the black community during the million manmarch and how conversations happened after the march.
And when Angela Davis says something and they said, well, she says she's, she's gay.
So, you know, she don't know.

(38:17):
just, can, okay.
We can talk about anything white people want to talk about.
We are already talking about it.
There are people doing that.
Like I said, it's tapped and not like bad, but like we've been waiting for you.
You can't start conversations though with us when you haven't, you know, you're, you'reasking how can we help?

(38:40):
How can we help you?
You haven't been listening for 400 years.
Start with that.
And you're like, yeah, but you don't know that we've been trying.
my God.
We've been on the right side.
Rebecca, I coded Katniss Everdeen into the blonde lieutenant showing up to save the day.
Exactly.
Like we're not living in a movie you guys and it doesn't have to be, I'm not sayingviolence is required, but there was this lady who was a pro lifer who was antagonizing

(39:08):
pro-choice ladies in the Bronx and she got punched in the face and everyone was like,well.
You went to the Bronx and decided to say, you think maybe should die.
Consequences, behavior.
But a scheduled protest two weeks later would not have done much of a thing to change thatwoman's position moving forward.
Fran has been very upset about how people are reacting to my critiques.

(39:32):
Yeah.
She's like, no, is someone harassing Rebecca again?
Yeah, she gets real work
People notice that pattern with my dog when I get worked up, but I'm on these high stools,so he's not in my lap.
He's like barking and crying more.
Yeah, she, I don't know.
She just needs a lot of attention lately, especially if I'm ever on TikTok, which is, youknow, emotional support animals, not always the way you decide.

(39:57):
Sometimes it's the way they decide.
said, she's brunching too, right?
She's she's resting and recovering.
I don't know if you saw back in the day there was a Twitter thread that was, does my dogknow he's black or she's black?
And by the way, I learned so much about black culture just from that.

(40:19):
It was so funny.
It was so wholesome.
was so, now I'm doing a, my dog's a Republican thing, you know?
uses to teach several different things, but I very much know it's tied to the Twitterthread of doesmydogknowysplash.
Well, there's a whole yeah.
Black people name their dogs.

(40:39):
They have middle names.
This is Francis Marie.
a way to critique white people.
I was like, yeah, Francis what?
baby.
Frances Murray.
When she's in trouble, she's Frances Murray.
we don't let them in the kitchen.
I'm a little half white, so she goes in my kitchen.
you know, no licking in the face.
I met my mom's dog that I hadn't met yet and I had to teach him we are black.

(41:04):
We do not lick in the face.
And like, that's what it can be to make it all about your race.
It doesn't mean the white supremacy thing of
You are better or you are worse or you are bad or you are good.
It's just you're white and you've got some stuff.
I would say, I don't know all of it because I'm not white, right?

(41:24):
But I know you got a culture because you're saying the same things and you're very, butthere's over representation.
And I think it's harmed a lot of white women where they're just, they're, they're used tobeing, like I said, spoken to and with and for, but never about.
And join the club.
Black women are the only ones we're only spoken about and never with or to.

(41:45):
And usually after we're dead, then then we're spoken about or like conceptually what youdon't want to be.
but I did have, was the B's and H's of women, right?
So it's like there's bitches and hoes.
That's us.
Right.
But like we own those.
Those are us.
We are them.
We are bitches and hoes.
Like, but then white people have babes and huns.

(42:06):
Y'all got to own those.
You don't, you know, people think that they're just different, you know, the babes, theMLM babes and the huns and all that stuff.
Yeah.
All the boss babes, business bitch, all that stuff.
that's y'all people.
Like you should want to go save them, you know, go get them, but not like go get them bad,like go get them from the cult, you know, but if you don't know how to have conversations

(42:31):
like that.
kind of conversation I'm trying to have, you know.
And again, I very much inspired by black women calling themselves the 92%.
And now I see black men calling themselves the 80%.
And I'm like, white ladies, we are the 48%.
Right?
We are the 48 % that did a tiny bit understand the assignment.
And now like, it's our job to get the other ones, you know, like once you get out of acall, you have that crack in your brainwashing.

(42:57):
now it's your job because you're the one that understands how they think.
Right.
Versus jumping out and going, we're with the black people now.
Cause you're not.
Cause you're not.
Nope.
Never going to be.
And that's okay.
We, we don't mind white people.
We just mind when you're intrusive and decide, no, I'm on your side now.

(43:19):
Because I also want to ask, not ask, it's not like a real question, but you know, theright side of history.
Do you mean the black side of history?
You
You know, cause what you mean is white side, there's the white side of history.
Cause where are black people in that?
We don't ever talk about right side of history.
Cause are we a part of that?
You know, are we in the history or are we the history?

(43:42):
It's, you know, it's just, what about just being, you know, it's again about the story andthe storyline and not the storyteller.
Who's telling this story where you are on the right side, black people?
Cause.
We're not telling your stories.
You should just live your story and then that will do something.
That will have its impact.
But living your life for the storyline doesn't make any sense.

(44:05):
But that's what they want.
That's what the MLM will sell you, a good story.
The right side of history, protests.
don't be, I have to say, don't be afraid to tell your story because black women are gonnacritique it either, they should.
I saw a critique that my book was a little white feministy and I have been trying to learnabout that ever since.

(44:29):
And I was a 33 year old white woman when I wrote that book that had only done so muchwork.
You know, it's funny, because then I wrote Un-American after finding out that my ex was awhite supremacist.
And what I wrote was kind of like the plan for the journey that I have to go on.
And I was pretty proud of myself to pull it out two years later and be like, oh, I've donethat.

(44:52):
Like, I've gone on this journey, you know?
Like, it's not done by any means, but like, OK, you know, like deconstruction isdeconstruction, right?
And there's nothing really
This is something I'm learning how to say to people in cults.
Like there's nothing mysterious to cults about me or to deconstruction.
Like it's just formulaic, right?

(45:13):
It's the same every time.
And like, they're not actually magical.
They don't actually have any superpowers.
And when you grow up with them, you just understand it.
and let me tell you another one, right?
You know how the concept,
you're gonna know who said this, but that like the oppressed understand the oppressors thebest?

(45:35):
Was that Audre Lorde?
No?
okay.
So I was talking about how I never really used the bite model, right?
Because he, you know, like, I don't have an opinion on it.
I'm like, if it works, it works, but I always use these women's models.
And then I was like,

(45:57):
Ted Patrick, a black man said, I've never seen a cult where women weren't a servant class,which of course he was able to recognize because he was a black man, right?
So I was like, so by definition, right, these women who were cult survivors, likeunderstand cults, not better, maybe better, right?

(46:18):
Better, differently, more.
more, it's more, it's more ingrained in them.
You know, it's like, it's more interwoven into your fabric of understanding when thingsare right, wrong.
It's not a, it's not a book learning.
And then I immediately was like, huh, which makes sense that why I feel as a cult babyexpert, right, who's done the work to develop my expertise, that I understand cults better

(46:46):
because children are the most oppressed in a cult.
And anyway, just like this concept, right, of like, of course, and of course,
If I go talk to black children, I'm probably going to learn even more, you know, and like,actually, we're reading a book by so it's called The Community by J.

(47:09):
Amelia Chisholm, this month for book club.
And it's about growing up in the Nubian nation, which is a black Muslim cult.
And I have never read a better description of my childhood, including my own book.
Mm!
And I could say it's because she stays there longer, it's because she was whatever, butit's like, you know, who knows?

(47:31):
storytellers as black people.
No one tells our story but us.
So you think about how good we have to be as storytelling just innately for you to careenough to listen where it can't be rehearsed because you don't believe, you know, not you,
white people.
and it doesn't need proof and credibility and all that stuff.

(47:54):
It's this who and why is this story coming to me?
Who is telling me this story?
Why are they telling me this story?
We have to take all this stuff in.
We zoom out, zoom in.
There's reasons.
It's not just for attention, but in MLM, in the whiteness, we just need your attention.
We just need you here.
We need you here all the time.
We need you focused.
We need you scared.

(48:14):
need you.
Paranoia is profitable, right?
All of that.
And you having a book that was kind of white feministy when you were a white feminist,that makes sense to me.
I just think,
what I would do with that information, one is like, accept it like you did and thenunderstand going forward, all right, as long as you say white, it is no longer like white

(48:36):
feminist problem.
It's feminist and it's inclusive, it's specific.
I kind of, make it, well, I feel like white people feel like it's calling pantsuitspantsuits when they're on men, right?
Like they're, why would you say pantsuit?
It's a...
It matters because you made it matter, right?
It's a pantsuit.

(48:57):
Why does it bother you if I say pantsuit?
Because it doesn't apply to you?
you're a man?
That's how white women feel when I call them white women.
you're saying it in a derogatory way and you need to deal with that.
Right.
That's you're saying when you say black people, you find derogatory.
When I say white people, I'm finding specifics.
Right.
I'm just saying white people do this.

(49:19):
And when white people have historically done that, it is too denigrate.
And I'd like to understand the beginning of denigrate.
Niggas in there.
You know, right there.
you know, but just cause I do it doesn't make it reverse racism.
It's no, you're the one who wasn't talked about.
Everything that whiteness cares about is unsaid and that's on purpose.

(49:43):
Looks, money, power, religion, all that stuff that makes you dangerous to other people.
We don't talk about that.
We don't talk about looks.
Like I said, it's interesting when there's a wolf wearing sheep's clothing and we don'ttalk about looks, the wolf gets to do whatever they want.
Cause you're like, well, it'd be rude to point out that he's a wolf.
You know, we can see that he's a wolf, but that's.

(50:05):
We don't talk about that.
Yeah.
You know, that doesn't make any sense.
The black sheep is black.
That's fine, but not bad.
Yeah, you're breaking my mind with the like, the things left unsaid, right?
And even as I think about my books, I'm like, no, in my first book, I don't call the armya cult.
I very specifically was too afraid of that, even though I wrote a whole book showing it.

(50:29):
In my next book, I call it a cult, I call it an empire, you know, like, you have to getinto the stuff.
Yeah.
Yeah, and that's like even me saying, I don't feel like, I could just not critique theprotest and keep it moving, but that feels wrong to me concerning what I do and what I can
do.
And I know I have thoughts, but if I share them.

(50:53):
to have this conversation because I went to the protest, I called it a parade the wholetime and I left going, but did this change anything?
Right?
think that's reasonable and I knew you went.
So I was like, okay, and I made the video about it and I said, I'll talk to Danielle aboutit tomorrow.
See, I still have my feelings about it, but I'd be curious to see what you think,especially since we talk regularly and all of this.

(51:16):
And I'm not surprised by any of that.
It's just information, you know?
I'm not condemning people who won't.
Because what else are you gonna do?
I'm just saying, that can't be it.
I so I believe that part of it is just if if all the white people get out of their homesand be jackasses, then it's showing that we're harder to control.

(51:38):
You know, so think there's a little element where it's like, you know, wearing wearingbright color is part of resistance.
Yes.
And I don't think it's like.
it's well thought out or I don't know how to like express what I'm feeling about this, butit's like, because we have the numbers, because we are the ones in the history books,

(51:59):
right?
Because we are the ones allowed to come out in big numbers.
We're trying to show like, hey, if you don't stop it, we're gonna be bigger jackasses thanyou think.
But we're still trying to do it in the, like I kept.
that happen?
When do we...
At what point?
manure what if we just dumped manure all over Washington DC right like

(52:20):
Yeah, because what was Jackassery about this?
I didn't see any Jackassery.
Except for we're going to all meet up.
Yeah, no, I mean, yeah.
we don't hang out.
We don't make a sign and be really like, you know, it was, and, and I just, feel like Iwish why people understood more.
Like it's not about, or not focusing on the, on the harms, on the harms and the hurts.

(52:45):
And instead focusing on the healing, not the hurting, harming, but the healing.
And because you're so focused on the next hurt and the next harm.
And how am going to hurt them, hurt their feelings, lock them up?
tell them to keep their hands off or whatever, whoever's hands.
Like it's not about them.
It's supposed to be about all that has been done, how we got here and just like, until youdo that, they're not gonna be uncomfortable enough to do something that's uncomfortable.

(53:17):
that's just not, look how many MLMs, right?
And I mean, people out of MLMs, hundreds of thousands, I'm sure.
But like, they still think this is better than, there needs to be more like certainty andpossibility and something.
Instead, it's just kind of like.
Save us, who are you talking to?
Who are you protesting to?

(53:39):
Where are you going?
And we all agreed on this day in the future.
just think about Black Lives Matter was like a visceral reaction.
This is a, this is a, this is something.
this is what I keep saying, you know?
And I keep trying to remind people, like, first of all, like, we didn't even get intoWorld War II until 3,000 soldiers were killed, billions of dollars of military equipment

(54:05):
was destroyed, and we were embarrassed in front of the world, right?
And, but like, like, I'm like right now with the crashing the economy right after youbroke the Department of Education, like,
white kids in Kentucky are gonna be starving soon, right?

(54:26):
And unfortunately, unfortunately, I think that it's gonna take actual existential threatsto white American children.
And there are, but we're not having that conversation, right?

(54:47):
And that's like,
right.
That's what I would wish like.
to me.
Someone was like, it's a planned protest.
And I was like, yeah, but.
Was that not enough for you?
Is that your existential threat?
The kids getting guns in school, but that's not enough for you.
You know?
And so at some point it's like.
we, I think when we didn't riot after Sandy Hook, like that.

(55:10):
Yuvaldi, you watched a woman get arrested after saving her own kids.
At Yuvaldi, I watched this Hispanic woman get past all these, what do you think cops, likethat's what cops do.
What are you doing?
That's what a mother did.
She got through all those people, got to her kids, got them out, and then they stillwanted to arrest her.
Why aren't the moms, all the moms, white moms, like, this was the other thing I was goingto say, that.

(55:35):
the focus, the hyper focus on hypothetical harms when instead of focusing on what'salready been done, I think people will be more motivated if you like saw how little you
know about your own reasoning.
I think that would make people more worked up than don't you know if your daughter getsraped in an alley and then they're going to force her to have a baby.
I hate that.

(55:56):
I hate that so fucking much.
And I can't, I don't have the words to explain why because has
Slavery wasn't enough.
Like, what do you think is happening to black girls right now?
And for the last 50, 500 years, and it's like, well, no, it's bad now because I don'tthink you understand these random white men and bibs think that it's okay for in the

(56:17):
future, if something terrible, terrible happens to our kid, then we should care becausethis, your kid right now isn't learning about their own consent.
Like they don't,
They are not expected to know anything about their own bodies, to ever be able to talkabout their own bodies.
That's a problem.
But this is the problem.
Because if we're going to talk about how white women can do, right?

(56:40):
Like, yes, individual white women can go put their bodies in front of school shooters.
But we have to talk about how to get white women to stop raising school shooters.
Right?
Like, that's the conversation.
Right?
And this is the I, what I notice is I get the resistance as soon as I get to like, areyou?

(57:03):
I
cussed Mr.
Knitting Cult Lady out the other day for men not doing more and why aren't you havingthese conversations with your friends?
And you have to do that.
And you have to be comfortable that either they're gonna take the challenge or they'regonna leave and then you'll respond to that.
like, yeah, you're gonna have to make it uncomfortable for your husband to be a sexist andfor those values to get Bastown down to your child and you're gonna have to learn.

(57:34):
how you're passing it on down to your child.
How do you save your child from your indoctrination?
What are you making your child afraid to do and say?
For fear of looking bad?
Looking bad?
I'm sorry, if that is the fear, I don't care.

(57:56):
I look bad all the time.
But that's not my point, right?
Like I get past that because to me it's existential.
And I'm not even like, this is what I'm doing.
I'm not getting in the street and making a sign, but I'm speaking directly to white womenwho want to do something.
I would say for white women to do that, to find others who are clearly on the same pageand be like, how can we do more of just like having those conversations?

(58:21):
And I mean, lift it, it's hard because it's like, you want to amplify black voices and youshould, but it's like figuring out how to do that before it's.
racist, like before you're defending something.
And I don't know, it has to be like self application first, like being one of thesepeople.

(58:43):
Isn't anything really.
You're one in a crowd.
I think okay.
But you guys deserve that without dehumanization and like white people want community.
That's what I'm hearing.
That's how MLMs are having, it's how cults are happening.
That's how these protests are happening.
They're like, I want to find people who are like me.
Do that.
Absolutely do that.
But don't do that and expect a pat on the back from black people.

(59:06):
And do like, this is the thing that's going to save us.
centering the vulnerable would do that.
You're not doing that because the people who are vulnerable can't go to these protests.
I had a white woman say, my husband, the only way he would go is because it was on aSaturday because he just didn't get it.
And then I got him to go because he didn't have work.
And now he's fired up.

(59:27):
You type that out to me on my page.
And I'm not even mad, but it's disheartening and it's concerning.
And I'm like, whoa.
Cause like I said in my post, I was moved by the pink hat parade.
That first protest we had where my mom made pink hats.
We were like, was like white women out here.

(59:48):
They want to do something better than this.
They're mad that Trump is in.
That was 2016 Trump.
What, how was this?
I was moved by that.
I cried.
I was like, it's everywhere.
Everyone believes.
And I don't take that away from me, but I'm not someone who is gonna see the same thingand be like.
We had this fight already.
I thought we already did this and they're like, well, we're getting started.

(01:00:09):
We're getting fired up.
Seven years later or whatever, eight years later.
I don't know, man.
It's really, it's, it's, I don't know, but it's literally the, I think we're like lookingat the problem, which I think is better than, right, right, right.
You see where I'm going.
You understand what I'm saying.
even looking directly at it, right?

(01:00:29):
Like you are, like white women still have their like sun shades on, you know, because it'stoo bright to look at.
I like.
I think I have my sun shades off, but I'm still confused about why it's hurting me.
Mm-hmm.
I mean, you're not supposed to be here, right?
Like, your people are supposed to be in Europe.
It's very sunny here.
Like, we're not supposed to be here either, right?

(01:00:50):
But like, none of us...
So it's complicated and we have to accommodate, like, we adapt.
It's not always good for us, the adaption.
Yeah, adapting, but...
Mm-mm.
I think the journey doesn't have to be, you know, as hard as people make it sometimes oflike going back and finding this stuff and like, you know what?

(01:01:10):
I made these earrings, someone called it cultural appropriation today and I was like, youknow what?
Like I am pretty comfortable in the fact that I grew up in Brazil, which is full ofAfrican influences and Mexico, which is full of indigenous influences and I'm an artist
who gets inspired by color.
I'm going to come back from Asia.
this summer, hopefully with Asian influences.
And I was born in the Philippines and grew up in Japan.

(01:01:31):
And like, these are conversations we should be having, but it still ties back to me, whichis like, I know where my influences come from.
I know why I'm putting them in my life and what it's doing to like speak to my soul.
And just like part of my answer is like, don't, if you don't want to build a cult, right,don't coerce and manipulate people and exploit their labor.

(01:01:54):
And like, if you don't want to,
culturally appropriate, don't steal some things from other people's cultures that youdon't have a right to and then use those to hurt those people.
And I don't, you know, I was like, I'm not doing any of that and we can have theseconversations.
They just want you to be fearful.
It's like this weird, it's an MLM of like, be fearful.

(01:02:17):
what it is.
Anyway, I'm gonna be a Psyop for Halloween.
It's basically gonna be Carmen Sandiego, but knitted.
And then I'm gonna have a blinking hat that says definitely not a Psyop or like just saysnot a Psyop.
That to me, I don't know, that like sat with me so weird for so long.
And I'm like, what they want is to be able to give up.

(01:02:40):
Right?
We talked about this with the Kamala thing.
They want to be able to sit down and you've been sitting for so long.
They want to, when Kamala was nominated, they want to be able to give up and now Kamalagoing to take care of it.
Then she didn't.
was like, and I called it then I said, y'all feel too relieved for me.
And then she didn't.
And I was like, this is unfair.
And now it's like, well, now he's terrible.

(01:03:01):
So we got to give up.
You know, don't expect anything from us.
We have a Trump.
are like, he's gonna be president for the rest of his life.
like, like what, you know, this goes back, I think we talked about this before, but likethe apocalyptic psychology that I think is very in whiteness and very in white America and

(01:03:24):
just this like, it is that, right?
Like it's gonna be so bad.
It's what we were talking about earlier, like my anxiety that my
husband and child will be killed in a car crash and then like I'll never be expected to behappy again.
I'll never be responsible for my own happiness.
Right?
Like it's that, but on a national scale.
And like, I really think that rapture psychology is just like religious suicidal ideology.

(01:03:51):
And by the way, suicides is what we see in cults, right?
And the cult of whiteness is so...
Like about getting you to suppress, right?
And I like, my God.
quiet, silence.
Yep.
I want to write an essay about cultural appropriation one day, right?

(01:04:13):
Because it's like, I'm not white.
What is that?
I'm Slovakian and Hungarian.
That's why I'm translucent like a vampire.
And I'm also allergic to the sun because of unmitigated sun exposure in Latin America whenI'm flavored Hungarian.
so that's why I have to look at all of these African and Indian and beach cultures thathave cover-ups but that are really warm.

(01:04:39):
You know, and it's like, there's stories there, there's stuff, there's not glossing overstuff, right?
And it's just like, but it's not easy.
They just want like...
want like very, I'm not going to say black and white thinking, but they want it to bewhite or wrong.

(01:05:01):
And like, that's not how life works.
That's not how people speak to each other, but in whiteness it is like there you can'tmistakes.
don't know her and like, you know, that's not how everybody talks to each other.
And they don't know that that's not how everybody talks to each other.
You think.
It's really hard to get people out of cults.

(01:05:21):
And I actually don't think it's that hard if you have relationships first, but you didn'tbuild those.
So then they went and found something that felt like a real relationship.
But if you have one outside, if you have an actual community, if someone's treatingsomeone horribly, it's like, what do you say to them?
If you just treat them really well, they might start to realize how horribly they're beingtreated.

(01:05:46):
Or you just ask them because you're concerned.
So when do you eat?
When do you, okay, so how many hours are you sleeping?
Let them, like, we do so much thinking and feeling for the other person and then to decidewhat we're gonna say, that's all manipulation.
That's MLM activities.
This is how you do it.

(01:06:06):
You get someone out like this.
Do you know that person?
Like, this idea that just, all cult members are the same and this is how you would getthem out?
And this is what That's what everybody wants right like they want an easy answer, you knowand like I've been noticing this in white America forever You know, like when I was a fast

(01:06:31):
runner in the army, right?
all these women they would be like, are you always a fast runner?
And Rebecca took me like a year to realize they wanted me to say yes
They wanted me to be like, I've always been gifted, paid for college running track, blah,blah, blah.
What they did not want me to say is, no, six months ago I couldn't run a mile.
And so I quit chain smoking, I started training, and if you wanna work really, really,really hard, I guarantee you I can help you improve your runtime.

(01:06:58):
Right?
Like that's not what they wanted.
And right now, some influencer made something about April 20th.
that suddenly there's gonna be martial law.
like, people want me.
On Easter Sunday, on Zombie Jesus Day, I was like, you literally go outside your house andscream, he is risen, or scream in terror, right?

(01:07:23):
Either one works, but like, and they want me to say yes.
They want me to be, like, and this one guy.
He's like, but Texas, like you could do martial law in te- in motherfucking Texas?
You think you can control?
Like, the government couldn't even control one compound in Texas, please, like-

(01:07:47):
Who do they think that like this, that's so dehumanizing to even when you say like themilitary to come save us, like those aren't just made up of your neighbors.
Like those aren't just people.
This is what I'm saying.
but drones, but drones.
And I'm like, every single piece of warfare still has a human being involved, right?

(01:08:07):
And they, nobody wants to think about individuals in the military.
They think of, wanna think of little toy soldiers in the Civil War, and they wanna thinkof a robot army.
And that's why we can't do anything, right?
And it's like, no, stop.
Stop.
Like, if Donald Trump can keep you in your house on Easter Sunday, that's a you problem, Ithink.

(01:08:31):
Right, like he is just a guy.
So as much as like Bernie Sanders isn't an extremist, whatever, man, he's an old white guywith money.
Well, barely.
He's a four fraudsters descendant or whatever, you know?
been bankrupt six times, just lost the economy $66 trillion.

(01:08:52):
Like, why are we acting surprised?
Yeah.
he's America.
And we're gonna be like, guys, he's the problem.
millions of actual individuals said this is a better choice.
And not because they're big, stupid idiots, or, you know, for other dehumanizing things.
There's reasons.
It's not for black people to figure out because we clearly aren't them.

(01:09:12):
92%, okay?
Every time, we are very clear.
You guys are the ones unclear.
So I need you guys to figure out what's going on there.
And it's because you don't talk, because you don't experience conflict, open conflict, youexperience conflict, but not open.
You have a fear of open conflict.
think because we only listen to stories to otherize them.

(01:09:34):
I feel like you just explained my whole life to me.
People were happy to be like, Daniella, you grew up in a bad cult.
We wanna hear about that.
We wanna understand that.
We wanna say, what can we do?
We do not want Daniella to hold up a mirror.
I've just started now and any of the big groups ask me.

(01:09:55):
Like, what do you say makes AA a cult, Jehovah's Witness, whatever.
I'm just like, what makes children of God a cult?
What makes Scientology a cult?
Like, mirror, it's America.
It's white America, that's the problem.
That, you know, asking them back their question, but not always like, you like, you'rejust asking them back their question.

(01:10:17):
think people in real life ask real questions, do something different, not like, so youthink that's white people stuff.
you, so, bring it down a notch and be like, how many hours do you sleep?
I'm concerned about that.
Like something.
very regular.
When I said black and white thinking and I challenged the idea, look how much peoplefreaked out.

(01:10:38):
It's because I'm getting, that's what I want to talk about.
And that kind of brings all this other stuff to the surface.
I'm not going to go in and talking about how black women were deemed unrapable becausethat's true.
And that's, there's reasons for that, but that's not the thing I need to attack.
It's why, what allowed this to be a
where all these white women are talking to me about how men are so scary and how much theyrape.

(01:11:02):
Like I could have no fucking idea about that.
Like that's what I want people to challenge.
like, can't just, if I just say that one, that's putting my own trauma first and like, itshouldn't be about me.
Cause not about me.
It's about white women.
But then they are like, no, it's not.
Like just like yell at me that it's not.

(01:11:25):
And then.
That's it for them, I guess.
You should know better.
We go, try and you're moving the goalpost, blah, blah, blah, blah, Okay.
I think it's just as easy as saying white, but okay.
Protest.
Go ahead.
something else that I'm like seeing the pattern of, right?
Where I'm like, when you say someone in a cult is in a cult, they get mad.

(01:11:46):
When you say someone who's not in a cult is in a cult, they're like, okay, whatever,right?
And it's like, when you talk about like whiteness is a problem, like if it wasn't aproblem, like I keep saying in response to the Psyop thing, I'm like, I don't have.
to tell you all that I'm not a dragon, right?

(01:12:08):
Like I didn't think we needed to have that conversation.
But like, I don't, I'm a person, right?
Like that whole thing was part of the crazy, but I'm like, I'm not addressing it.
I don't care how big it is.
They can't affect me.
Like what?
No, this is silly.
indicative though, because that would never be said about me.

(01:12:31):
I don't know what that is yet, but I'm going to think about it.
Like no one would ever say I'm a Psyop.
Well, you know what?
Let me not say that.
Let me not speak for white people.
I just like that, but cause like.
I think it comes into it, right?
And I think a lot of this stuff comes into it.
Like when I say to people that are challenging my expertise and I'm like, sit down, right?

(01:12:53):
And I notice what that is.
It's like, I'm speaking to civilians with my captain voice, right?
Like this is the version of me being like, get to the position of attention, right?
And like, when I do that, I'm still calm.
I'm still blah, blah, blah.
I'm the mean lady.
But like, that wouldn't be how people responded to you.
if you yelled at people on the internet.

(01:13:13):
Like I regularly yell at my fan base and tell them that they're problematic.
Yeah, and there's like an element of authority for you, no matter what, because yes, youhave like expertise authority, but there's nothing.
And being black is not enough of an authority for some people.
like, have you read this book?
Have you read this book?
Have you read this book?
I need people to understand that like black people don't need to read books about beingblack.

(01:13:36):
I read them because I like to understand more about what came before me so that I'm betterinformed when I speak, like leading by example type thing.
It's not so that I can flex that I've read.
It's weird.
don't like when white people ask me about more than like one or two books.
Like once you start asking me about the third book, I'm like, what do think this is?
When people ask me if I've seen a cult documentary, I'm like, the only reason I'm gonnawatch it is to give me opportunity to explain to y'all another thing, right?

(01:14:02):
But I don't need to see an umpteenth cult story.
We've been telling y'all it's the same every time and you don't believe.
And that's like.
that black people could not have, because they don't see blackness as something to evenconnect to intellectually.

(01:14:23):
They're like, it's an extra.
It's like saying pant on suit, right?
Like, if I know suits, I know suits.
What do mean, pantsuit?
Nope.
It's like you can maybe know fire, but I'm saying it's a grease fire and you're justsaying it's a fire, it's a fire, it's a fire.
And I'm like, yeah, but it's a grease fire.
And you're like, shut up, know fires.
and I'm trying to help you and maybe it sounds like I'm yelling at you, it's because I am,but because it's a grease fire and you keep going for the water.

(01:14:46):
Sorry?
I don't know.
And then people like to critique how I'm saying it.
It's all about how you tell the story and what ideas, right?
Like you said, who's telling the story, right?
So I was a nanny in college, right?
And one time this little boy goes running up to his mommy, he's like, Miss Danny hit me.

(01:15:07):
And the mother turned like this, right?
Wasn't gonna physically do anything, but was gonna very much explode.
And I literally just looked at her and I said, he was sitting on the sink with his feet ina bathtub about to bite down on the cord of a dryer.
Yeah, I whacked him.
Boom, knocked the thing out of his, right?

(01:15:29):
And she's like, my gosh, thank you.
Right, it's like, who's telling the story?
What perspective do you have here?
Objective facts are not always objective.
Just because you feel strongly, like emotional response does not mean that is the truth.
That that's the whole truth.
And that's all you need to know is just how strongly you feel.

(01:15:51):
I'm sorry, because there's other stuff going on here.
and alarms should disturb you.
Like there's this thing where I feel like I have to justify the fact that what I'm sayingwill disturb white women.
And it's like, well, you didn't have to say it in this way that would.
aggravate that like something where I feel like I'm starting to have to explain to myselflike well no I said it cuz I mean I knew maybe they'd be mad like I

(01:16:17):
I'm saying something that I wanted to move you, right?
Like, do you have to be uncomfortable enough to be moved, not just touched by theinformation?
We've talked about that before.
Toni Morrison said that people are touched, but not moved.
And I'm trying to move you.
I'm not going to move you by going, excuse me.
Hey, hey, I know.
I know you love that protest.

(01:16:37):
You know, but even when I do that, by the way, even when I say that I try to be the nicestabout it in my head, like I say, no, you don't have to stop saying it.
Just consider.
when you say black and white thinking, da da, and then they come in and white's blame tome with all that means, what they really, what they think when they use it.
And so y'all go to protest and you tell each other what you think about it.

(01:16:58):
And then you go home.
And I think, do you think about, not you, but you know, do you think about how peopleafter the Black Lives Matter protest?
Cause I don't think that's what they're calling it.
They just went outside.
They could not stay inside.
They went outside.
Do you think when they got home, they were feeling?
What do you think they were feeling when they got home?
Was it like energized?

(01:17:19):
I don't feel like that's the words we were feeling after watching someone be murdered inbroad daylight and be watched and filmed and then shown on the news for us in the middle
of the day.
You wouldn't see it happen to a rabbit, but we watched it like it was regular.
Do you think after we went out into the street and said, our lives matter, that we wenthome and go, yeah.

(01:17:40):
Like we're not having the same experiences.
And then to go tell black people?
No, you don't understand, it was great.
Yeah, it was great.
You feel great.
You're really motivated.
Okay, you're motivated to tell me about it.
Yow!
And I feel like it's just going to be like a black square outside in the spring.

(01:18:08):
It's fine if it, if it led to more stuff, right?
Like it would have been fine if people were excited about Kamala.
If I felt like after she was elected, then something, something,
I was literally thinking this.
was like, yeah, it's a protest, but it's the week after peak blossom in DC.

(01:18:29):
Like half these people were coming here anyway.
They didn't they needed something to do and they wanted to feel better
cherry blossom race that morning and people were like, I'll go protest, you know?
What are they protesting?
Do they know what they're protesting?

(01:18:50):
accidentally calling it a parade all day.
I think that's great.
I think that's accurate.
I think that's what most people are calling it in my comment section.
The parade of rally.
I think rally sounds accurate to me because I just associated with Trump and it's like theanti-Trump rally or something.
I don't know.
It's why people being like, guys.

(01:19:11):
And the leaving the country bit, don't like it.
How dare you?
One, it's what you yell at people who are like upset and they're like, if you want it, youcould just leave.
And then you're like, I guess I'm gonna just leave.
No, I'm definitely not going to leave.
I'm just saying that's people out of frustration.
like, it's also like wrong.
You're not going to do that.
You can't even be bothered to do more than protest on a Saturday for these people.

(01:19:36):
They're not going to actually move.
But like, I get it.
I just think I don't, you don't hear black people saying that.
Never got to never had a chance.
Where are we going to go?
and we still stay and we're trying and you're like, wow, white people really fucked thisplace up.
Let's go.
Where are you going?
They don't want you.
And you know, you gonna fuck their shit up?

(01:19:58):
Because you're gonna go and be like, I was a victim of where I lived.
You...
Okay.
Okay.
All right, you know, and have your feelings.
I just want to make that clear.
Your feelings are valid.
Everyone's feelings are valid.
it is exactly what you said, right?
mean, like, I was trying to say that to be ironically funny because I'm trying to explainthat I have a different perspective, but that's not in good taste.

(01:20:23):
And like, I'm still upset.
Like the professor of fascism, Timothy Snyder, writes these books, like, Fled to Canada,and I'm like,
Everyone has to do their own thing, but the last thing of his 20 lessons is be as brave asyou can.
And now I'm just like.

(01:20:44):
It's one thing to leave, right?
It's one thing to leave.
It's another to write.
a book about how brave you are to leave and talk about it from afar.
And then tell people and you know.
To critique something, you have to care for it.
You know that, but I just think that that has to be said because like, why would I makethese videos if I didn't think white women wanted to do the right thing, wanted to be
here, wanted change?

(01:21:05):
I just also am seeing you not do those things you wanna do.
It's like watching a girlfriend go back and back to these weird guys and you're like, whydon't you just be single for a little bit so we can figure this out?
And then like, but I gotta go on a, that's my biological clock.
Do you even want kids?
Like you haven't figured that out yet, but you're just.
Yeah, and I think that there's like white people have so much you have so much here towork with in terms of like

(01:21:29):
evidence and material between MLM stuff and like white on white crimes all over the place.
Just look at this protest.
This is a bit of a...
There's a lot to be said about this and that's all white people stuff.
Black people have no business really talking about it because they're on purpose.
But white people can talk about it.
It just won't be like...
But we don't do that either.

(01:21:50):
We don't give ourselves praise for just existing.
We say, okay, why are we doing this?
What's the Million Man March about?
You guys just don't hear it because your narrative is the mainstream societal narrative ofI had a dream, blah, blah, contents of character, playing on the playground.
Everything's great.
That was all men.
It was capitalistic, think she said, and capitalistic, imperialistic, and patriarchal thatmillion man march.

(01:22:15):
I know white people felt really good about it.
That should have been my first time.
Even my mom was like, I think I went to that march.
I was like, mm.
But see, George Floyd just happened in 2020.
So, and it's not just George Floyd.
It's that we saw it, that we watched it, that we debated it, that it was on TV.
Like I had to see that man's face, lose life.

(01:22:36):
And it was news.
Like, and I can't, just the whole fact that you would never see that with a bunny, with arabbit, with a squirrel.
You wouldn't watch someone kneel on it.
They would never air that.
That's what I would like to interrogate.
Like, why are we so comfortable with certain things and so uncomfortable with a critique,but very comfortable with, you know, watching bodies be treated like products and stuff.

(01:23:00):
like, that's
But white people could like go to a building and be like, shut off.
like, y'all could just like be really cute and like walk into PSCNG or these electriccompanies and be like, everyone gets it for free.
I don't know.
These utility places, someone said, um, Lynchburg, Virginia, or like being intentionalabout them, well are going to go to this building.
last person out of the Department of Education, please delete all student loans, you know,like.

(01:23:25):
Someone's in charge of these buttons.
That's how I talk about Scientology.
Having tax exempt status was from them finding the guy who said, okay, and they justattacked him relentlessly until he was like, if you'll stop, I'll give you tax exempt
status.
And undoing that is really hard because white people don't like to undo other people'swork, which is another thing.
Judges, if people saw judges as people, you'd realize, you know how many judges will notoverturn something just because another judge made a bad choice?

(01:23:51):
like, well, that's not good.
That's not good professionalism amongst the judges.
If you stop this, but I'm just a good, I do good at my job, maybe we would have betterresults.
But instead we're making these big systemic requests instead of asking people to go inmaliciously comply, do their job terribly, go in, get in the system.

(01:24:12):
Everyone who's got less than this, erase it.
Make the cops budget down.
I don't know.
You guys have so much, so many people.
You do all the jobs.
but you wait till you're not on the job to then talk about how the jobs are killing us.
You know.
Like get into those insurance companies and just mess them all up.
broken, no more insurance.

(01:24:33):
I don't know.
I'm here for the insurance business.
Like we don't need it.
It's a scam.
It's a Ponzi scheme.
We could work on that, you know?
could have healthcare for everyone.
Model idea.
Yeah.
that.
And that would be good for us.
could heal, know, focusing on healing the harms already caused would be something likethat.
You know, we are already in so much debt.

(01:24:56):
We have so much.
How are we in some, you know, I just think being like, this is what democracy looks like.
A bunch of white people, chanting with signs.
Ooh.
Now I'm like seeing it in my head and I'm like, well, that doesn't look that muchdifferent from the other one.
It's just we know.
I do like the idea of the 48%.
I would like for that, you know, like we are white women and we believe we are on thistype of white womanness, not like women, cause you're doing yourself a disservice.

(01:25:27):
because we don't have an all women experience.
Yeah, we have because we haven't built that because we've specifically unbuilt that rightand that is yeah.
And it would be more accurate.
It's more accurate.
It's more effective to be intentional and say white.
It's not exclusionary.
I mean, I guess it is, but please exclude us because I'm not having the experience thatyou're talking about.

(01:25:51):
And you can't know that.
And even if you said white women and it does happen to all women, then that's just moreinformation than I could be like, yeah, same.
I'm not going to be offended that I wasn't included in experience that you have.
That's interesting.
White women do that.
Yeah.
If I say, black women, blah, blah, blah, blah, people touch my hair.
They'll say, that happened to me too once.

(01:26:12):
Like correct yourself.
This isn't just a black people thing.
This is an every woman thing.
But because I said it within my blackness, that doesn't mean it's not about my blacknessbecause you also experience it.
Like it could be different context.
Who's telling this story?
Why, when, where are we?
Was I in a professional setting where that would never happen to you?
But it did happen to me.

(01:26:33):
You know.
Also, did you feel scared?
Did you feel the ability to push back?
Did you?
I wore my crazy fringe expert coat to the mall to the to the parade and people wereliterally just coming up and petting me and I really didn't like it.
And I didn't say anything because I'm being a public person and whiteness and niceness andall of that.
But I could have right.

(01:26:53):
I could have just been like, excuse me.
Don't don't touch me.
Don't do that.
imagine they just didn't do it, right?
Because that's a white people thing to do is to just reach out and touch.
And it's based in racism, whether you are black or not, that comes from the residuals of Ihave access to things I like.
If I like it, I appreciate it.
That's all that matters.
I am complimenting this person like men, I'm trying to compliment you.

(01:27:16):
And it doesn't matter.
I just want to talk.
I don't want to talk to you, but they still feel entitled.
Whether it's overtly aware or not, black people don't.
for the most part, just reach out and touch a stranger.
Because we know they're a stranger and they're a person.
And my liking that thing isn't enough for me to feel like you now have to be involved inthat.

(01:27:37):
Let me let you know that I like it.
I could do that, but by touching it and where'd you get it?
I want to have it.
Those are different.
You know, when I wear one of my sweaters, I need that pattern right now.
I need this.
I don't know, I feel like you want to eat me.
And white people have done that.
White people have eaten black people.

(01:27:58):
And I need people to be aware of that.
When I talk about consuming us, it's happened.
Nat Turner was made into grease.
And no one talks about that.
Because it's gross and it's terrible.
But you have to realize this is how much white people epigenetically have been impacted.
Where you go from watching people swing on rope

(01:28:19):
to that's in order to change your brain, not to do something to them.
That's to change the white people's brain to say, that's not a human because we wouldnever, we would never see that happen to a bunny.
So obviously this is deserved on this person because we're good people.
My dad's a good person and he's cheering for this.
This must be good.
You know, our little brains, they're kids.
They brought kids to those things.

(01:28:41):
That's how we get to two o'clock on the news, seeing this and going, that's just news.
When you would never like,
That is because of slavery.
That is because of the need to keep white people from seeing black people as people.
Why?
When we go in the streets, it disturbs white people.
Cause we're like, why are they congregating?

(01:29:01):
They're so angry, they're so loud.
This is scary.
They're alluding, they're scary to see them like this.
That's how we got here.
It's cause you're so scared of black existence.
If you weren't that scared, you would allow us to lead stuff and think we're not going toretaliate or try to eat you back.
We don't want to.
You don't wash.
We don't want to eat you.
We got enough food, you know, but like there's this belief that retaliation is going tocome some kind of they're focused on us.

(01:29:27):
They want to hurt us back.
No, we're not focused on the hurt or the harm.
We're focused on healing and we can only heal if you leave us alone.
Tulsa.
We built a whole city and they came and destroyed it.
That's what we want.
so they preach segregation.
It's like, that's why we make jokes about it.
It was like, cool.
Leave us alone.
Yes, I know people died.

(01:29:48):
You know, it's the violent enforcement that becomes the problem, not the being apart.
Dividing is neutral.
Dividing by force and violence is not neutral.
That's where whiteness came in and was like, enforce law and order, the obedience to thisthing.
When people say I'm trying to divide white people or divide women?
Maybe.

(01:30:08):
And this is why I keep thinking like I need to stop saying I'm a scholar of bad groups andI'm just a scholar of groups and maybe that's the prop, right?
It's like, because that just still to me sounds like the different of groups andcommunity.
And it's like, and I tried with my best intention to make open-minded, diverse, inclusivegroups and I failed.

(01:30:29):
They were all just whiteness.
And then I just engaged in the community.
Yep.
Yeah.
like the enforcement, the like, I'm starting to see more and more, like as soon as youmake a group, right?
All a group is, is members with a shared mission, right?
You can just stop at members, right?

(01:30:52):
Because as soon as you define an us, you define a them, right?
And we wouldn't have this problem.
And we also wouldn't have...
you wanting your own cities if we hadn't defined an us first, right?
Like if there hadn't been that.
And right now, I just feel like.
it's like whiteness is just cracking, right?

(01:31:15):
And everyone's afraid because we're gonna spill out of all these groups and just likespill out into the melting pot or whatever, you know?
And like, how am I gonna stand out?
How am I gonna be special?
And it's like, you're not, you're going to be part of the stew and you're not gonna belonely anymore.
Mm-hmm.

(01:31:35):
It reminds me of the egg shell thing where I feel like whiteness is the egg shell, not theegg.
And they're just so holding on to keeping it all together with the shell.
We need the shell.
then, you know, when you crack the shell, it's all pointy and scary.
if you get little pieces in it, it's really going to mess up that thing you're eating ifyou don't get all the shells out of there.
But it's OK to be an egg.
You need to go through some stuff.

(01:31:56):
Maybe get hard boiled, like you said.
Be resilient.
The shell isn't what makes you.
but it protects, you know, then everything very fragile, very, cause all we're going tospill out.
That's okay.
You know, all of these phrases, nice guy finishes last.
That's okay.
was just thinking, I like scrambled eggs better than raw eggs anyway, you know?
it's almost like you get more out of the cooked egg than the just egg-having.

(01:32:20):
Just having an egg, letting it rot.
Yeah.
you see the thing where they're like, they're talking, I'm sure it's not scientists, butnow they're saying like, what if we could come up with some protective coating for eggs
that made them last longer and like, eggs come like that.
Eggs, but also eggs come like that.
Like if you just spent time with the egg and the chicken and knew more about it, like.

(01:32:45):
Every developing nation knows like the eggs aren't refrigerated.
You just don't wash them and then they last for three weeks like
the fridge and then we ruin it because then it has to stay in the fridge.
You can't let it un, that's America.
That's America.
Is adding a layer on the egg, my God.
And what she talks about in magical overthinking, which is like, I had the problem withthe book because I was like, this is feeling like a white lady wrote this, but she's not

(01:33:11):
acknowledging it.
She was saying like, there's this additive bias, you know, need to, there's a problem, wegotta add something to it.
Now we gotta do,
And it's like, that's what everybody thinks.
Don't speak for us.
because that's not what I do.
You know, I started realizing, Ooh, I got too much going on.
Less is more.
Just go to Patreon and I have TikTok a little and Patreon and my life got easier, better,more focused.

(01:33:35):
What you appreciate appreciates.
And I reduce things downsizing, but see whiteness says downsizing bad, breaking up badfailure, all that failure.
I just read about how hoarding is tied to white supremacy.
Yeah, power hoarding, power hoarding is a tenet.
Yep.
And it's like the fear of scarcity, the loss, loss aversion, sunk cost fallacy.

(01:33:58):
You're, you're dying to your stuff.
That's whiteness.
That's not humanness.
That's not a natural human, like evolutionary.
Like Americans need to chill.
White Americans need to chill with it.
This is how people are.
In your cult.
Yeah.
Yes.
But be specific in our cult, in the Ameri-cult.
This is how people are.

(01:34:20):
I would be fine with that.
I can read the book with that asterisk in there, but if you just like people, what are wegoing to do?
It's like the white frangility thing.
Lord of the Flies thing, right?
Like acting like this is how people react.
No, this is how white boys in British boarding schools are taught to be, you know.
do, like all that stuff.
And then everyone's like, well, the author is satire.

(01:34:41):
Ha ha ha.
Why are we reading it?
Why are we reading Greek mythology and the Lord of the Flies when we could read all aboutlove by bell hooks and understand compassion.
We could be reading books by black women in schools.
Can you imagine?
Octavia Butler in schools way better than Greek mythology and would help.
And it's people we have heard, like we know those names.

(01:35:02):
I don't know who Odysseus and the Oedipus.
What are we doing?
But I tie that all with like,
romance and the Romans and Rome and the Roman Empire for these white men of like, this ispeak, peaking.
They don't care what it is.
It's it's the point.

(01:35:24):
They wore toe-its.
They wore, they were shiny.
Just be gay.
It's fine.
Be gay.
But that's whiteness, right?
It's like, no, no, no, no, no.
We like it cause history.
whiteness.
Yeah.
Well, thank you, Rebecca, for thank you for letting loose and thank you for educating usand for calling me out and I

(01:35:52):
undefensivly and being here for this because I knew I had this and that made me feelbetter.
Cause I was like, people are commenting.
I'm I'm just going, I'm just going, I'm just going, I'm just go, I'm just go talk to Dinaabout it.
I just know, and you don't, that's so much of it though.
I just need white women to understand like this is huge because I get to do this and havethis black women get to listen to me talk my shit.

(01:36:15):
Cause I feel more clear and they tell me things like,
this is so validating that you keep having this clear, like clarity.
And it wouldn't happen if I was just answering questions all the time, you know, andtrying to defend myself.
If I felt like there wasn't someone who was just going to be like, yeah, I was there.
And yeah, it makes sense to me or, or nothing.

(01:36:35):
You don't have to even say that it makes sense.
Right.
And that's so validating for me.
I just need you guys, like, it's not always the big answer.
It's sometimes it's just literally listening without.
doing the defensiveness is all of the beginning.
That's like the first 10 steps.
And like, I'm walking away from this very clearly understanding that like, we have tounderstand why he's president.

(01:37:01):
Like, that's much more important than stopping him from being president, right?
It's like, we have to understand why he is our president, white America.
And that is understanding the assignment.
So, you know, we've got some time.
We've got at least a couple years.

(01:37:21):
There's 112 more weeks of this, no.
Sorry, it's homeschooled.
I said we're in week 12, somebody did the math for me for how many weeks left there is,but I don't remember it anymore.
there's a cat.
All right, well we.
yeah, it's week 12, like, you know, imagine being a black woman.
Yeah.

(01:37:43):
For real, imagine it, right?
Imagine it, talk about the differences, talk about whiteness.
Obviously I couldn't do, I think, any of this without talking to you every week, Rebecca,and I appreciate it.
And I really missed you last week.
I know I missed you guys too.
And I'm like, this is nice.
It's nice that I have this.
Be this person for a black woman in your life.

(01:38:04):
If you are, if you have one, if you see one, if you're online and scrolling throughTikTok, just tell a black woman, thank you for always being clear and here.
And I appreciate it because it does way more than whatever the protest is supposed to do.
Got it.
Understood.
Hua!
Thanks.

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Episode 33 | Protest or Parade?

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Episode 33 | Protest or Parade?