September 29, 2025 • 44 mins
Explore the ocean floor is more than a scientific ambition, it is a global necessity. In this episode of How to Protect the Ocean, Andrew Lewin speaks with Tim Kearns, Executive Director of Map the Gaps, about the upcoming Ocean Floor Explorer conference in Victoria, BC. They discuss why mapping the seabed is vital for science, conservation, and society, while uncovering how challenges like funding and technology can be turned into opportunities for global collaboration.
Mapping initiatives are not only about science but also about storytelling, communication, and inspiring action. Andrew and Tim highlight how diverse communities can play a role, from students and researchers to policymakers and entrepreneurs. The conversation explores how events like this conference bring people together to tackle some of the biggest challenges in deep-sea exploration while building networks that fuel long-term solutions.
Find out more about the conference: https://www.oceanfloorexplore.org/
Register for the conference: https://www.oceanfloorexplore.org/register
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Have you ever wondered why it's sodifficult to explore the ocean floor?
It's a lot.
It's the deep sea.
There's a lot of pressure down there.
It's, you know, 3000 meters deep atsome points and even more at others.
It's a very difficult environment towork in, but there are people around
the world who are trying to map theocean floor, who are trying to find
(00:21):
ways to know more about the ocean floor,and I am very delighted to have on.
Tim Kerns, executive director of MAPthe Gaps, who is putting on a conference
that is called Ocean Floor Explorer.
It's happening at the end ofOctober from the 26th to the 29th
in Victoria, bc. It's gonna be openand it is open to international.
(00:42):
People who are interested in exploring theocean floor and mapping the gaps, we're
gonna talk about some of the major topicslike funding, technology and storytelling,
and getting people interested around theworld of how they can get involved in
finding out what's part of the ocean.
All on this episode of the Howto Protect the Ocean Podcast.
(01:02):
Let's start the show.
Hey everybody.
Welcome back to another exciting episodeof the How to Protect the Ocean Podcast.
I'm your host, Andrew Lewin, andthis is the podcast where you find
out what's happening with the ocean,how you could speak up for the
ocean, and what you can do to livefor a better ocean by taking action.
You know, it's really interesting whenthings come full circle in 2003, 2004,
back when I was a young lad and justgetting into, you know, the ocean and
(01:27):
ocean conservation and ocean science.
I did an advanced diploma doing aGIS analyst, and I did this diploma.
It was an eight month diploma onthe other side of Nova Scotia.
I was doing my master's in and aroundthe same time at Kid University on the
Bay of Fundee side, and I can't happenedto come across this advanced diploma.
My supervisor's like,Andrew, you gotta take this.
You should take this.
I was like, it's a long drive.
(01:48):
Compared to where I was living in Halifaxwas an hour and a half there and back,
and I had to go every day of the week.
It was a big investment, but it wasprobably the best investment that I
made in my life because not only did Iget an advanced diploma, that's helped
me stay employed for a long time.
But also I met some great people, and oneof those people was a teacher that taught
me remote sensing, and that's Tim Kerns.
(02:09):
Over the years, Tim and I kindof, you know, we parted ways
after he taught me for a year.
He went down to California, hestayed on the West coast and he did
a number of different things, whichwe interviewed him on last time.
He was on the podcastearlier in the summer.
And I'll link to that interviewdown below in the show notes.
But you know, we kind of reconnectedthrough this project and it was through
the podcast that I was able to learnabout, map the gaps through a couple
(02:33):
of friends and the networking thatI've done through the podcasting.
Then we got to reconnect and knowingthat, hey, I know Tim Kerns, he's the
executive director of Map to Gas, but heis also used to be my teacher when I was
doing an advanced diploma in GIS analysis.
And so I was like, this is really cool.
This is gonna be such an easy interview'cause we've known each other for so
long and just haven't talked in a while.
So, you know, we spent a numberof hours on the phone and
(02:55):
over Zoom and over Riverside.
Not only recording podcast episodes,but just discussing the importance of
mapping the ocean floor and what that isgoing to look like and how to fund it.
And now we're talking about a conferencethat he's helped put on for a number of
different years, and it's a symposiumand now a conference, and it's in
BC and it's bringing people from allover the world together to discuss.
(03:16):
How we're gonna map the ocean.
We're getting closerand closer to doing it.
We need to move fasterand faster to do it.
So this is getting even more importanteach and every year to start understanding
how we could map the gaps, lookingat different models from marketing to
storytelling, to investing to funding.
To actual use of technologyand then mapping the gaps and
then what to do with the data.
After that, it comes on the heels ofthe High Seas Treaty being ratified
(03:40):
by 60 countries, which just happeneda couple of days ago, or over the
weekend, or just before the weekend.
As of recording this podcast, September22nd, and it is awesome just to see how
everything is coming together full circle.
And I love this, and I love the factthat I've been doing this podcast for
so long, for 10 years and being able to.
Reconnect with people that have been inmy life that are doing new things and
(04:02):
being able to bring their story and storyof the stuff that they're working on, the
projects that they're working on to you,to the audience who've been listening
to me for whether it be 10 years, oneyear, less than a year, a couple of
weeks, you be able to understand what'shappening in the ocean and how we're
trying to not only map the ocean, butjust understand it and just in general.
And I think it's such a bigthing that we have to do.
(04:23):
It's something that I'm lookingforward to being able to bring you
and the information to bring you.
So with all that said, thisis gonna be a great interview,
learning about the conference.
If you want to go to the conference,please, you can register below.
I would love to see you there.
I'm gonna try and get to there as well.
So if you want to dothat, just register below.
But here's the interview with Tim Kerns.
(04:43):
Enjoy and I'll talk to you after.
Hey Tim, welcome back to the Howto Protect the Ocean Podcast.
Are you ready to talk aboutmapping the ocean floor?
I am always ready to talk about mappingthe ocean floor, especially when it
involves undiscovered discoveries.
Oh, I love it.
I love it, man.
Being prepared.
This is awesome.
Uh, Tim, this is greatto have you back on.
(05:03):
We talked last time, uh, aboutMap the Gaps, the organization
that is here, uh, that we're gonnabe talking, focusing on today.
But actually we're gonna be focusingon the conference that map the
guests puts on, uh, and it's, itis Explore the Ocean Floor and it's
happening at the end of October.
In Victoria, bc Beautiful ofVictoria, bc. Uh, and we're gonna
talk about what's gonna happenthere, why we think people should go.
(05:27):
Uh, and I think this is a, a perfectopportunity for the audience that we
have here to go to a conference, to, uh.
Kind of network with a number of differentpeople across different sectors of marine
science, conservation, ex exploration,and so in technology, um, plus investors
and funders and all these different typesof people who are going to be there.
(05:49):
Um, it's gonna be great.
So we're gonna be talking aboutthat, but Tim, before we get into
that, can you just remind peopleof who you are and what you do?
All right.
Well, thanks Andrew.
It's great to be onyour, uh, podcast again.
Yes.
Uh, and I feel like we've knowneach other a really long time now.
A really long time.
I've gotten to know you, uh, very wellin the last couple months, which has
been a real pleasure and a treat for me.
(06:09):
Uh, so yeah, my name's Tim Kerns.
I'm the Executivedirector of MAP the Gaps.
I've been involved with OceanFloor Exploration my whole career,
going back to the late nineties.
And uh, it's something thatI'm very passionate about.
And one of the reasons that I am is peoplesometimes ask, why do people like you?
Do what you do?
And part of it is that, uh, innatesense of discovery and exploration
(06:30):
that almost all humans have, right?
Yes.
Of being able to see and visualizesomething at the bottom of the ocean.
That I know no other humanhas ever seen before.
It's absolutely wild.
And then the other part of why we doit, of course, is for the discoveries.
Uh, either anthropogenic orcultural, or scientific mm-hmm.
That can be, um, uncovered.
(06:50):
Right.
Really, I, I would say unearthed, but Ithink it's un oceaned and, uh, un oceaned.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Rex plane wrecks, canyons,hydrothermal vents, volcanoes,
you know, interesting features.
Sand dunes, uh, super wild marinelife that may live down there.
So yeah, we haven't even discoveredbefore, like there's so many things.
(07:12):
We often say 75% of the oceans areunexplored, but really thinking
of it of another way, 50% ofEarth hasn't been explored.
Like that's, yeah.
Imagine buying a house and then af beingin it for a while and realizing, yeah.
I've never been in half this house before.
Yeah, that's wild.
Yeah.
And uh, so that's howI like to look at it.
I, and I love that now, you know,why do you like, you, you, we know
(07:35):
why you love the ocean bottom.
Like, we know why you want todiscover and explore and you want
other people to do it as well.
What's your biggest pitch whensomebody's like, why should I
care about the ocean bottom?
Like, what's the, how'sit gonna benefit us?
You know, in the long run?
Well, there's, there's twobig drivers for that I think.
(07:55):
And, uh, and sometimes we would callthat the value proposition, right?
Mm-hmm.
What's the mm-hmm.
Economic return on investment forme to invest in mapping the oceans?
And it sort of depends on who you talk to.
There's definite, um, uh, blue economy.
Mm-hmm.
That's what we refer to technology andinnovation, uh, and the economic, uh,
benefits from around this type of effort.
(08:18):
Uh, there's just been a recentstudy published by the United
Kingdom Hydrographic Office in June.
I invite people to check it out.
Um, I'll give you the link and we canput it in the, in the comments below.
Absolutely.
Um, and that describes howmuch of a return on investment
there is, which is substantial.
So from an economic standpoint, whetherthat's around better understanding, uh,
(08:38):
the ocean for the resources that may be.
Uh, realized from it, understandingtidal energy and tidal currents, um,
how the ocean moves benthic habitats.
Mm-hmm.
Um, of critters that livein the ocean, of course.
Um, but then there's also that otherside of it, which is the discovery side,
and I think that provides a lot of.
(08:59):
Maybe.
Maybe it's not a direct economic value.
Mm-hmm.
But there's a real human value tothat, which is knowing that we're
exploring what's in our own backyardand knowing that the data that
goes from that, particularly if itends up in the public domain and
is used for conservation purpose.
Then we can better protectwhat we don't yet understand.
(09:20):
And that, I would say that's the numberone driver for most humans to get
involved in this effort, which is howcan we possibly protect the oceans if
we don't understand the characterizationof what they look like on the bottom?
Yeah.
And it affects so many things fromclimate change to, uh, sea level
rise to conservation and marinelife to better protecting, uh,
(09:44):
potential mining sites, right?
Uh, which is making a lot ofnews headlines these days.
Yeah, it's amazing.
You know, when we, when we look atthe, the ability that we have to do so
to actually map the ocean bottom, theeffort it takes that we think it'll
take to do so, the challenges thatwe have to face or that we will face.
To map the ocean bottom.
(10:05):
It's big, it's vast, it's expensive.
There's a lot of challenges withdepth and pressure and so forth.
Um, there's a lot of stuff going on.
I no doubt know that there is technologyand people there who want to do this
together to be able to map the oceanbottom for our collective wellbeing as,
you know, humans who live on this planet.
(10:26):
Um, but when we talk aboutsuch a a, a, a large.
Thing to do, uh, knowing, like lasttime when we spoke, we talked about
doing it in, in like small sectionsand then continue to make it larger
and larger and build upon that, uh, andlook at funding models and everything.
But when we, when we discussan idea like this, it's not
just one person has this idea.
(10:46):
There are many other people around theworld, pieces around the world who are
just like, we want to do the same thing.
This is how we're gonna go about it.
This is how we're gonna go about it.
And the best way to bring those peopletogether to discuss and to for everybody
to like share those ideas is a conferencelike, you know, ocean Floor explore.
Like this is, you know, a conferencewhere that'll help bring people
together so that they can actuallydiscuss all the different aspects of
(11:11):
what it will take to map these gaps.
Right?
What it was gonna take toexplore that, that ocean floor.
And so.
To do this.
Like, I, now we know why we're doing this.
We know why you like, map the gapsis hosting this conference, uh,
in, in collaboration with, withother organizations, but really
it's map the gaps driving this.
I like, how are youbringing all these together?
(11:33):
How are you?
Like, is this, you know, 20 years of you?
Decades of you like being in thebusiness and, and meeting people,
uh, and saying, okay, these arethe people would be good for this.
Or I know this organization outhere is working on this, or this
investor is interested in this.
How do you start bringing peopletogether like this and, and
how do you get the word out?
Uh, that's a great question.
(11:54):
Well, uh.
I am sure you've heard theterm, the network effect, right?
Yes, absolutely.
And uh, and I'm fortunate that I'veworked in a number of different
organizations over the course ofmy career and I'm a reasonably
social and outgoing human being.
Yes, you are.
And I've met a lot of peopleand I have good relationship
with lots of people as well.
I've also been running a Mapthe Gap symposium since 2016.
(12:17):
And I've been fortunate to have attracteda bit of a following, not me personally,
but Map the Gaps has attracted afollowing, has a lot of relationships
with companies and organizationswho are familiar with the symposium
series and have had interest in thepast or have attended in the past.
Uh, I also in the peoplewho attend the conferences.
(12:40):
Uh, often it was 70, 80% wasthe first time they'd been
to a mouth to cap symposium.
Mm-hmm.
Although this event has remainedrelatively small in terms of
numbers being a hundred, 150 people,it's small enough that it still
becomes more of an intimate affair.
Where the networking opportunityis really, really good.
Mm-hmm.
Which ultimately ends up amplifyingthe message of what we're trying to do.
(13:03):
And I've also been fortunate throughthe math the Gap series to partner
with different host organizationseach year and have the benefits
of sponsorship that come with.
Uh, different companies and organizationsthat wanna support the event.
So ranging from National OceanNational Oceanography Center in
Southampton a couple years ago.
(13:24):
International HydrographicOrganization in Monaco in 2023.
Um, uh, in the Chilean Navyin 2016 was the first one, uh,
that I was involved with doing.
And then other organizationssponsoring, like Geosciences
Australia, uh, geosciencesAustralia, noaa, uh, seabed 2030.
(13:44):
Mm-hmm.
Key Carta Gro Schmidt Ocean Institute,Kongsberg, you know, there's all these
ocean mapping related tech, and that'sjust a few of them who, who have
come and supported these events now.
I'm limited in my spherebecause I'm not connected with.
Wealthy individuals or investment firmsor hedge fund managers and stuff, right.
(14:06):
So I'm part of what we're doingthrough Ocean Floor Explorer, and
that's what makes this conferencedifferent from the other map.
The GAP symposium is really tryingto develop this message of how can we
expand the funding footprint and themechanisms for ocean floor exploration.
But it's not just the money, it'salso how would we go about doing it?
(14:28):
And the how then brings in thetechnology, but also the people.
Because sometimes people say, can you map?
Can't you map the ocean from space?
Or why can't you map the ocean from space?
And the simple answer is, well, youcan map some of the ocean from space.
We need to rely on something calledsatellite derived bathymetry.
Companies like Te Carta who will be here,are speaking at the conference, right?
(14:51):
They have amazing algorithms andtechnologies for being able to produce.
High resolution maps of theocean floor from space, right?
However, that technology is limited toa certain water depth and water clarity,
so well then we have to rely on othertechnologies that can transmit sound
from vessels to the bottom of the ocean.
(15:11):
But even that is limiting becausenot all sonar equipment can go all
the way to the bottom of the ocean.
So then you need bigger sonarequipment with bigger vessels
that need to go further offshore.
And so I like to think of this and mygood friend Vicki Farini at uh, Lamont
Dougherty Earth Observation wouldsay it's a puzzle and we all need to
(15:34):
contribute our own puzzle pieces to,uh, to this, whether it's funding,
participation, technology, approvals.
Right.
Even ideas.
Mm-hmm.
This is where the startupcommunities come in.
We've got index tech from,uh, the UK is coming.
A very, very young startupcompany, but amazing ideas.
(15:54):
Uh, I think they're still inuniversity, in fact, but that's the
startup, that's the younger generationperspective with new ideas, new
perspectives that we need to embrace.
Yeah, because if we keep relying on thesame people and the same organizations
doing it, it's never gonna happen.
So that's part of the purpose of theconference, is to bring all these
people together and let's have theconversation about what do we need to do.
(16:17):
I love it.
It, it's, it's, uh, it's oneof those things where there's
so many different aspects.
Me as like a, as a marine scientist,right, and loving technology and stuff,
I see the benefits from a researchstandpoint, from a conservation standpoint
to know as much information as possible.
But I find sometimes when I'm in thatI might, I get this tunnel vision
where I'm just looking at, okay,what's good for marine research?
(16:39):
What's good for thebenefit of conservation?
You, you have come from a very differentbackground than I have in terms of,
you've coming from, uh, you know, you, youtaught remote sensing and GIS and coming
and, and you've, you've had a very, uh,interesting and diverse background, you
know, going forward, like after that, uh,when we met in, in, in 2003, 2004, uh,
(17:00):
working for ESRI and then, and then havinga couple of your own, uh, co co-founding
and founding companies of your own,what was the most surprising aspect of.
Uh, this of of exploring theocean and trying to get people,
more people to map the gaps.
What was the, the, the most surprisingpart that is a big part of, you
(17:22):
know, the, the symposium now?
Well, one surprise I have, andmay, may sound a bit negative, is
it's actually hard to get peopleexcited and I think that speaks to.
The lack of awareness ofa, how big the oceans are.
And, and I don't mean that, uh,you know, critically of people.
(17:44):
I think people, of course, it's hard toappreciate just how big the oceans are.
Uh, I think some people don't appreciatehow unexplored they really are.
Mm. And that's because other mappingplatforms like Google Earth, right, where
you, you can see base maps of the ocean.
Some of them are derived byinterpreted measurements over.
(18:06):
Um, dozens of kilometers, which isfine to give us a general picture.
Yeah.
But go to any Google Earth andzoom into a few spots of the ocean
and you'll see how degraded andpixelated, uh, quickly it gets.
Mm-hmm.
But many people don't realize that,that it's already been mapped.
In the 1960s, national Geographicproduced an artist rendition.
It's very famous, ofcourse, was on the cover.
(18:27):
Uh, and many people thought back then,well, the oceans have been mapped because
of this, this beautiful illustration.
And it was really, that'sexactly what it was.
It was an illustration ofwhat the depths looked like.
Yeah.
In part, based on, uh, uh, inpart, based on measurements.
Um, but nonetheless it was still,uh, largely an illustration
(18:47):
and an artist rendition.
So that's a couple of big challenges.
And then I think a third challenge,of course, is getting people to get
excited enough about getting involved.
Mm. And that's, that takes maybe somecommitment or passion or investment.
And that's part of what OceanFloor explore is about, which
is how do we ex excite people?
(19:09):
Yeah.
Whether they be people with moneyor people with ideas, or people
with technology or people withapproval and regulatory processes.
How do we get them exexcited and involved?
So to me those are kind of thechallenging parts of this conference.
I would love it if this conferencewas 500 people or a thousand people.
Right.
Um, and maybe the nexttime we do it, it will be.
Mm-hmm.
But for now, we're, uh, I feel likewe're at the beginning of a conversation
(19:34):
for how do we get serious aboutexploring the ocean floor and how
do we take the power of what Seabed2030 has been doing for the last, uh,
eight or nine years, and convert that.
Uh, energy into actionable exploration.
And, uh, that's the, to me, the reallyexciting part about the next decade
I think, of what we're moving into.
(19:55):
And I think there's like a, a, a push andpull or an advantage and disadvantage of,
of getting more and more people involved.
You know, when you get more peopleinvolved, it's great 'cause you get more
eyes on it, more years on it, more ideas.
And it's, and it's great to, to put thoseideas forward and evaluate those ideas.
But then you get some, like, again, the,the conservation side coming out and you
get people who want to, you know, exploit.
(20:17):
The ocean for a lot of different things.
Like, like we've exploited land inthe, in the past, and that could
have consequences, uh, in that.
So I, there's, there's advantagesand d disadvantages, of course.
Um, but right now the advantage ofjust is, is, I, I agree with you.
I, I feel like sometimes the deepsea, just like sometimes in space.
It's so out of context for us.
It's like a lot of us don't, probablywon't go to space in our lifetime, um,
(20:41):
some more than others, but it is cost alot of money a apparently to go, to go
to space if you want to go to space now.
Uh, and that's for like two minutes,but it even like the depth of, of the
sea, it's very difficult to get there.
It's expensive to get there and soit's very difficult to tie that.
To people's and understanding of like,Hey, this is why this is important.
(21:02):
Um, and I feel like storytellingcomes in to that aspect too, of,
you know, having great stories to.
Discuss the importance of the deep sea,uh, discuss the mystery of the deep sea
and, and what we don't know yet about,you know, the bottom of the ocean that
could help us in the future, or just theknowledge of that could help us in the
future, even protecting it in the future.
(21:24):
Do you find that, like, I know you,you have been, you, you and I have
a, a common, uh, a common friend andcolleague, uh, Natalie Gilson, who's
been, you know, is, is a big part.
Of the storytelling context of alot of, of Canadian organizations,
uh, working for Pisces.
And do you find that's like puttingin it in that context, do you think
(21:45):
that's like a gap that people have?
Not only just in in ocean in general, butespecially in like exploring the deep sea
and trying to bring that out, that emotionout for people to say, Hey, you know
what, like this is why this is important.
Yeah, a hundred percent.
That's a great question.
Uh, we have a whole session called,uh, communication strategies, uh,
(22:08):
uh, at Ocean Floor Explorer, uh,moderated by Sophie Silks from coast.
And then, as you mentioned, NatalieGilson from Pisces is on it, as
well as Joy Ani from Schmidt Oceanand Heather Manix from Compass.
Um, that's precisely the purposeof that session is to talk about
communication methods and strategies.
How do we reach people?
How, how do we get people excited?
(22:31):
Because not everyone gets excited byscience, uh, or science for the sake of
science, especially if it's not in contextto something that they're familiar with.
Mm-hmm.
And whether those stories are.
Here's an example.
Just, uh, Dr. Don Wright from Esri.
She's the chief scientist and,uh, uh, first woman of color to go
(22:52):
to the deepest part of the ocean.
Yeah.
With Victor Vivo. Uh, a few years ago,she just recently did an interview with
NPR, and as part of that, one of theNPR illustrators made a, a comic strip,
uh, describing her journey, but alsothe importance of deep sea mapping.
Yeah.
And it was a great way toillustrate and communicate.
(23:14):
Uh, something that's soimportant to so many people.
And, but it was also a uniqueperspective because you don't see a
lot of comic strips or comic style,uh, you know, presentation pieces or
media assets on, on this, on this topic.
And that's just one.
I think another one is, and maybe wewill learn at ocean floor explorers,
can we do something with mass media?
(23:36):
Mm-hmm.
Can we leverage social media more?
To make people aware, get peopleexcited, and get people interested
and, and, uh, invested in this eitherfinancially or, or, or otherwise.
And, uh, so I, I think that's a huge part.
That's probably one of the biggestchallenges is, is identifying
that's, that's another gap map.
The gaps isn't just about thephysical mapping, it's also about
(23:58):
bridging those gaps of who'sdoing what and who's involved.
Yeah.
Uh, that's why the tagline for thecompany is Connected Oceans and Connected
People, because really this is a people,this is, this is a human mission.
This is not a science mission.
No.
Absolutely, and I, I think somethingthat always gets me, you talk about
storytelling and getting peopleinterested in deep sea, there's, uh, I,
(24:19):
I, I doom scroll quite a bit on online.
I try and keep it to oceansand football that's in hockey.
That's my, that's whatI try and keep it to.
But every once in awhile, I come across this.
This, this video, and it'sthese deep sea biologists.
They're in a ROV and they're like, theyfind these animals and they're like,
oh, look, it's such and such animal.
Or it's like a new octopusspecies, or this is, we haven't
(24:40):
seen this one in a while.
And, and there's really cute littleanimals and like really interesting
shapes and sizes and colors andbioluminescence and everything like that.
And they're, you hear like the, thegeekiness in the science of like
the nerdiness in the scientistsbeing like, oh, look what we have
here and it's all this kind of fun.
And I feel like that helps.
I feel like when people can see that thereare actual animals that are living at
(25:00):
the bottom, when there's actually thingsand, and there's characteristics that are
similar to what we see on land or even inthe oceans, like in the shallow oceans.
People really get involved in that.
And I feel like there'sa component there for.
Uh, you know, for, for just mapping theocean bottom in almost like a, a, a double
benefit or as they're mapping the bottom,people can take these types of pictures
(25:23):
and take these type types of videos andbe like, look what we found in this area.
And nobody would've known thisif we didn't, if we weren't
down here, and stuff like that.
And really just generate the curiosityand, and really, uh, inspire the curiosity
of more people to get, to get to thedeep sea, uh, and be able to like.
Hear from the people who are exploringit from yourself and others who will
be at this conference who are like,no, we're gonna go to the bottom,
(25:44):
or we're gonna see the bottom.
We're gonna send ROVs at the bottomand we're gonna be talking about them.
And I think that's like.
One of the big, big storytelling grabsthat we can take and take advantage of
when, when people are gonna the bottomto get people interested in funding
more projects or just like, Hey, Iwanna see this area in the Indian
Ocean or this area in the, in theMid-Atlantic bite, or something like
(26:05):
that to see what's there, you know?
Um, right.
I think that would be, I think thatwould be a really, a really cool
thing, um, to have in, in that aspect.
Right.
Well, let me speak to that.
So, uh, one of the, the keynote forMonday, October the 27th is Moron
Harris, uh, also known as, uh,the imaginative scientist, right?
And she's got hundreds of days atsea, a very accomplished human being
(26:29):
as an oceanographer and a researcher.
And she'll be speaking specificallyat the conference about those.
Perspectives of discoveries on theocean floor and, and maybe she'll talk
about how some of them could even beused for advancing medical science.
Mm. So imagine if we can makediscoveries on the sea floor that
would ultimately end up benefitinghumans from a medical perspective,
(26:52):
either through treatments for diseasesor medicines or whatever it may be.
And that's a whole unique perspective,but it makes it extremely relatable.
To humans, of course, of the importanceof doing this on the second day.
Then we've got Victor Visco, of course,another phenomenal and accomplished
adventurer and human being will be talkingabout technology that he's developing,
(27:13):
which would help aid this effort.
And, uh, so once again,two very different mm-hmm.
Keynote speakers, but helping, uh, addperspective in that human dimension.
Um, to this, we've got a number ofother companies who will be showcasing
their technologies at Ocean Tech Live.
The demo Day, which is hosted by Coast,uh, the Center for Ocean, uh, applied
(27:36):
Sustainable Technologies here in Victoria.
And that's, uh, just across thestreet from the Victoria Conference
Center, and there'll be a dozen anda half at least companies there.
Presenting technologies.
Not all of them related to ocean floorexploration, but, and that's okay.
I mean, right.
A lot of the technologies that are beingdeveloped in the blue economy space,
um, ha, have in some part be, are ableto survive because of the bathymetry
(28:01):
that's been mapped in these areas.
We've got seaweed, uh,technology companies.
We've got technologies makingsemi-autonomous and autonomous vehicles.
We've got telecommunication companies.
Um, companies that are makingreally important sensors that need
to go on vehicles that go underthe bottom of the ocean, you know?
Yeah.
So all of this relates to oceanexploration and ocean discovery,
(28:23):
and, uh, they're a part of this eventbecause of what we're trying to do.
So I think there's, once again,that networking effect of amplifying
the message, getting more peopleinterested and excited about
ocean, and ocean technology andocean floor exploration is real.
The real key here.
It is such a key.
And, and again, there's so many differenttypes of people coming, like with a lot
(28:43):
of different backgrounds, internationalbackgrounds, uh, not just Canadians,
where, where this is taking place, uh,which is, which is really impactful things
because people are gonna bring their ownstories, their own, uh, style of, of,
uh, doing professional projects and, andgetting together and speaking together.
How big is it for, for theconference and for the symposium?
(29:04):
Um, to get people from differentbackgrounds, like from all over
the world to come together.
I think we mentioned before, beforewe record, there's gonna be people
from like the Middle East, from, fromAsian countries, from South America,
from all over the place, uh, to cometogether and, and be able to exchange
ideas and then at the conference.
How is that gonna befacilitated other than just.
(29:25):
You know, having dinners togetherand lunches together and so forth,
and just being in the same room.
But are there any, uh, parts of the, uh,of, of the conference that are gonna be
dedicated towards just exchanging ideas?
Uh, yeah, so that's a great idea.
There's.
Pardon me.
A great question.
Uh, it's fantastic havinginternational representation.
Uh, it really speaks to thediversity of who's involved mm-hmm.
(29:49):
In this activity, this global activity.
It's not a, not a North American or right.
Western Nation initiative.
This is a global initiative.
Uh, really being led by CBE 2030.
I mean, and they've got over 200 companiesthat are from all over the world who are
part of this, in addition to nationalgovernments and academic institutions
that are part of CBE 2030 as well.
(30:10):
So, CED 2030 has done a great job andthey of course, will be representing
the, um, their organization.
And their efforts, they're bringingthe Bathie sphere, which is this inter
interactive physical globe display.
So members of the public couldpotentially come, or maybe people
who are attending the conferencecould interact and learn about that
and visually see what's happening.
International representation also bringsdifferent perspectives and different
(30:34):
ideas, and there is a, in additionto the networking and the questions
after the sessions, uh, there's awhole workshop on Tuesday afternoon.
That's October the 28th.
Called aspirational fundingmechanisms for mm-hmm.
Floor exploration.
And that's co-hosted with, uh, JebCo, which is the general bath metric
chart of the oceans and map the gaps.
(30:56):
Bring together thoughtleaders to spark conversation.
No presentations, no long monologues here.
This is about asking a few hard questions.
Getting some unique perspectivesand then getting people in
the room to talk about it.
Mm. To talk about their experiences, theircrazy ideas or new ideas or perspectives,
(31:17):
and, and then hopefully convert thatinto an action plan that we can then
carry forward beyond this conference.
Uh, it's, it's no good justto talk about this stuff.
You have to capture the ideas.
Yeah.
And then you have to put,you know, an action plan.
Uh, so I'm very much looking forwardto that Aspirational, uh, funding
models, uh, workshop with, uh, Jeb bco.
I think it's gonna be a reallyinteresting perspective.
(31:38):
There's two lenses to that.
One is inside national jurisdictionsand another is outside because
mapping in inside territorial waters.
Carries, uh, a differentprice tag for one.
Yeah, a different level of complexitywhen there's, uh, national governments
involved, there could be levelsof national security permitting,
bureaucracy, who knows, right?
(32:00):
There's lots of different reasonsfor why it's challenging to
map inside national waters.
Conversely, there's also lots of reasonswhy it's challenging to map outside of.
National waters.
Uh, just because it's the highseas doesn't mean it's easy.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, and so we'll be talkingabout, uh, strategies for
how to explore that as well.
(32:20):
Well, and, and just tomention, uh, the, the.
The Highs Seas Treaty just got ratified.
They just hit the 60, 60 countrymark, so that could be more of a
conversation than ever because they,there might be some rules, uh, in that
treaty around mapping the ocean floor.
So hopefully there could be some benefitsto discussing that in this conversation
when it just, just got ratified thispast weekend as of recording this.
(32:44):
So, uh, in, in September.
So this is, this is good news and it'sgood to be able to have an international
audience that are probably interested.
I mean, we're obviously,we're interested in mapping.
All of the oceans.
So it's not just the ones withinthe exclusive economic zones,
but uh, but even in the High Sea.
So it's good to have some rules and,and regulations around that and getting
countries to, uh, put that into place.
(33:04):
So that'll be, uh, that'll be really nice.
So, right.
Yeah.
So that'll be good.
Um, okay, so, so just to, to moveon a little bit too, is getting more
into the funding because I feel likethat's a real, obviously a really
important part that a lot of the times.
Uh, may considered not as sexy in termsof like, it's better to like watch a video
of someone going down to the bottom ofthe ocean and being able to see what's
(33:26):
on the bottom and map the bathymetryand, and all that kind of stuff.
Um, but funding is, is essentialin that, uh, we're not talking
about funding just from.
Foundations and grants and so forth.
We're looking at like private companies,investors, venture capitalists that
will be attending these, this conferenceand having these discussions and, and
(33:50):
you know, trying to understand thedynamics of what could come out of this.
What's the, like, we, we talked alittle bit about the funding mechanisms
and, and things like that, but.
What do you hope to, at the endof this conference to have, uh,
an idea of or better understandingof when it comes down to funding?
(34:10):
Uh, that's a great question, ed.
At the end of the conference, what Iwould really like to have an understanding
is inside national jurisdictions or.
What are the top five pathways to funding?
Is that through highnet worth individuals?
Is that corporate donations?
Mm-hmm.
Is that, uh, people like my momwho want to give a hundred dollars?
(34:33):
Right.
Ocean floor discovery.
Is it school groups that want to beable to, uh, identify or adopt a little
piece of the ocean floor as their own?
In exchange for a great map thatthey get to hang on their wall.
Mm-hmm.
Uh, is it a high net worth individualthat wants to make a name, a lasting
legacy for themself by, uh, sponsoring1% of the Indian Ocean or something?
(34:58):
Yeah.
Um, is it, is it a, is it an approach tonational governments to share the, uh,
share the investment and everyone chip in.
Um, across the board.
And so we can have sort of aninternational collaboration maybe at the
UN level, and we have representativesof the UN who will be at the meeting
(35:19):
to talk about internationally, howcan national government support this.
Mm-hmm.
Maybe people chip in, maybe, sothere's, that's another strategy.
And all of these may take.
Many years to execute, but at leastit would be more clear than what we
have today, which I think is not acoordinated or consolidated list of the
different vehicles that are availablefor funding this type of initiative.
(35:41):
Uh, so that would be my.
Probably single largest, uh, takeawayfrom that is the identification of
realistic funding mechanisms thatcould be then further explored.
Yeah, at subsequent conference, subsubsequent workshop, or maybe more
targeted events that say, all right,well if we're gonna do something
(36:02):
with national governance, allright, then how do we work within.
The, um, uh, intergovernmentalOceanographic Commission and the
International Hydrographic Organizationto work together with these national
governments to up their contributions.
I, I don't know the answer.
Mm-hmm.
Of course.
Mm-hmm.
That's hopefully whatwe're gonna get out of.
Or maybe the answer is, well look,every day people would be interested
(36:23):
in this, so how do we reach them?
Maybe we need to develop acampaign, a marketing campaign.
Yeah.
To get them excited about this andgive them an opportunity and a pathway.
To get involved, to get excited to make aninvestment or a, or a donation, I'm sure.
And Tim, I see a perfect opportunityto talk about corporate donors as well.
I see a perfect opportunityfor the NHL team, the Seattle
(36:43):
Kraken, they're deep sea species.
They're trying to represent.
This is a perfect opportunityfor them to maybe get some right
off the coast, you know, off thecoast where they are in Seattle.
Like, let's, we'll just send thisclip out to them and see if they're,
they're interested in, in investinginto the deep sea and protecting
their crack and their deep sea, uh,their deep sea squids, because I
mean, that's, that's just perfect.
It's right there.
(37:03):
It's, it's right there.
They can come to the conference, sendtheir mascot, whatever they want to do.
Just an idea.
Just an idea.
Wow.
That's perfect.
And, and to add that the Kraken probablydon't realize that Map the Gaps is
actually registered in the state ofWashington, uh, as a nonprofit company.
So there you go.
It's perfectly appropriate.
Absolutely a hundred percent agree.
Uh, and, and you know, speaking oflike what we want, like what you want
(37:25):
to get out of this or what you wantthe conference to get out of this,
um, you know, when we talk aboutfunding, obviously we can probably
go into each and every category.
Um, but what do you want, likewhen, when the people come, you
know, we're looking at about 150people, maybe a little bit more.
Um, if we can get 200, great.
Uh, what do you.
(37:46):
Want them to get out of this conference?
Like the people who attend,what do you, what's the goal
when they go to this conference?
What, what thought process should theybe in and, and what mindset should they
be in to say, Hey, I'm gonna get asmuch as I can out of this conference?
Uh, well, uh, as long as I've been doingthese conferences, Andrew, 2016, I've
(38:06):
had a little, uh, catchphrase or whatyou call it, um, for what the purpose is.
And the purpose is to listen and to learn.
And engage.
So ultimately that's what I'mhoping attendees will get out of
the event, is to be a part of it.
Yeah.
And not feel like they're justattending and, and being an observer.
Mm-hmm.
But actually engaging and being able totake that either back to their homeowner
(38:31):
home organization or back to their schoolor back to their community, whether it's
technology or investor or whatever it is.
Um, and be able to noodle on thatand then eventually translate
that into some sort of action.
Yeah, maybe there's their own,uh, individual contribution.
Maybe it's an organizational contribution,maybe it's influence that they have
(38:52):
over some politician or group toaffecting policy or investment.
Um, and then I think the other thingthat I always try to do at these
conferences is really instill a senseof community, uh, the professional
and personal networking that you get.
These are the types of events.
Like I said, it's small enough that youcan meet everybody, you can approach
(39:12):
anybody, uh, and hopefully walk awaywith a new colleague or a friend.
Mm-hmm.
Um, that's part of the purposeof these events as well.
And we provide lots of networking time,lots of coffee breaks, lunch breaks,
social events and receptions in theevening, and those are 100% dedicated to
people using that opportunity to network.
Meet new people, uh, learnfrom others, listen to them,
(39:35):
and, uh, and ultimately engage.
No.
Amazing.
And I, I think it's interesting too,like one of the things that I always
tell people is, is especially in a,in a conference like this where you're
getting so many different types ofsessions and topics, is to go into
the sessions you're not familiar with.
And learn from them.
Learn what's happening in thefunding areas, learn what's
(39:55):
happening in the tech areas.
Learn, learn what's happening duringthe pitch fest and, and the investor,
and see how people are tr are,are, you know, pitching themselves
and, and what discussions arehappening in each of these sessions.
That they can get the most andget a whole, a comprehensive
understanding of what's happening.
Don't just sit in your niche, in yourtopic area and just do that, you know,
(40:16):
do that, but also explore others.
Um, if there's time and you'reable to go to those sessions, it
looks like there's plenty of timefrom the schedule which is up.
I'll put the link in in theshow notes, but it's uh, ocean
floor explore.org/schedule.
And you can see what you can test outat the beginning and be like, okay, I'm
gonna go to the funding model becauseI don't know a lot about funding and I
wanna be a part of this conversation.
(40:38):
Like you said, you know, youknow, it is just, you're there.
You, you soak it up and then you engage.
And I think it's really important forpeople to do that and have the confidence
to do that and, uh, 'cause the peoplewill be open to any kind of ideas.
And I think that's really,uh, really important.
But Tim, this has been such a great.
Uh, privilege to have you on and to beable to share, uh, ocean floor explore,
(41:00):
uh, with, with the people of thisaudience, which I, which I love to death.
And so I want to thank you so muchfor, for coming on and would love to
have you back on, of course, to talk.
Uh, about the conference and, uh,what happened at the conference.
So we'll do like a follow up one.
I think it'll be a lot of fun.
Um, but if people want to go, theyhaven't, they haven't, uh, thought about
doing it yet as of now to, to register.
(41:21):
But if they wanna register, um, is therea, a specific link that they can go to?
Um, I'm looking on the website here.
It looks like it's oceanfloor explorer.org/register.
Is that the, that's the right link.
That's correct.
And there's still room, there'sstill time to register up until,
uh, around, uh, October the 15thif you haven't registered yet.
(41:41):
Okay.
I do know that the hotel room blocks arepretty much sold out, almost sold out.
So if, uh, people are interested inbooking that at the Grand Pacific Hotel,
then they need to get on that quickly.
Uh, that's ocean floor.org/slash travel,uh, to find out the details on that.
There's also a discountwith Alaska Airlines and FRS
Clipper coming up from Seattle.
Okay.
So there's, there's still opportunitiesand for people to get involved.
(42:04):
Um, and it's a single track conference,uh, meaning that all the sessions,
you don't need to choose thatthey'll, they're all sequential.
Perfect.
And, uh, I look forward tohaving hopefully lots of
people, uh, sign up and attend.
Yeah, I think it'll be,it'll be really great.
So we'll put the link there.
Sign up, uh, let them know when yousigned up that you heard it from
How to Protect the Ocean Podcast.
(42:25):
This is all done for free.
Folks.
I'm not getting any money outta this.
I, this is something that's justsuper interesting to me and I
want people to attend and, uh,and, and get the most out of it.
So go sign up@oceanfloorexplore.orgslash register.
And Tim, thank you so much for comingon the podcast and sharing this.
And I look, I look forward to attendingand, and being a part of the conversation.
Great.
(42:45):
Thanks Andrew.
Always a pleasure and I lookforward to the next one.
Alright, see ya.
Thank you, Tim, for joining us again onthe How to Protect the Ocean Podcast.
It was great to have you on.
Great to learn more about the conference.
Now that the schedule's out, I thinkit's gonna be interesting for everybody
to go and learn about what's happening.
As Tim said, it's a one track type ofconference where everything, you know,
you're not gonna miss out on anything.
(43:06):
A lot of times conferences put on so muchthat the sessions are at the same time
and you have to like, oh, how do I get tothis one and this one at the same time?
I can't do it.
This is one track.
You just learn everythingright off the bat.
You have that ability to joineach and every session and
take part and participate.
I think it's gonna be reallyinteresting to do that.
So I want you guys to head out there,go to Ocean Floor explore.org/register
(43:30):
to register for the conference.
It's not an expensive conferenceif you're on the West Coast
already, it's right there.
If you're international,there's ways to get there.
I'd hope to see you there.
And if you do get there andpeople say, Hey, how did you
learn about this conference?
Say is from how to protect the ocean.
I love to just get that name out thereand be like, oh, I don't know what,
how to protect the ocean is, it's apodcast that you need to listen to and
get more and more people listening tothe podcast as I try and get more and
(43:52):
more people to go to these conferences.
So I think that's gonna be somethingthat's extremely important and I
would love to see you guys get thereand be able to be there and be able
to take part and be able to have.
A say in mapping the ocean in the future.
So that's it for today's episode.
If you have any questions or concernsor comments, please let me know.
You can put your comments in the commentsbelow if you're watching this on YouTube,
(44:13):
or you can go ahead and get ahold of meon Instagram at how to Protect the Ocean.
Just DM me.
At How to Protect the Ocean.
And if you really want to get access tome, go to speak out for blue.com/contact
and you'll be able to fill out the form.
It goes right to my personal email.
I'd love to get back toyou as soon as possible.
I wanna thank you so much forjoining me on today's episode of the
How to Protect the Ocean Podcast.
(44:33):
I'm your host, Andrew Lewinfrom the True Norstrom and Free.
Have a great day.
We'll talk to you nexttime in Happy Conservation.
Have you ever wondered why it's sodifficult to explore the ocean floor?
It's a lot.
It's the deep sea.
There's a lot of pressure down there.
It's, you know, 3000 meters deep atsome points and even more at others.
It's a very difficult environment towork in, but there are people around
the world who are trying to map theocean floor, who are trying to find
(00:21):
ways to know more about the ocean floor,and I am very delighted to have on.
Tim Kerns, executive director of MAPthe Gaps, who is putting on a conference
that is called Ocean Floor Explorer.
It's happening at the end ofOctober from the 26th to the 29th
in Victoria, bc. It's gonna be openand it is open to international.
(00:42):
People who are interested in exploring theocean floor and mapping the gaps, we're
gonna talk about some of the major topicslike funding, technology and storytelling,
and getting people interested around theworld of how they can get involved in
finding out what's part of the ocean.
All on this episode of the Howto Protect the Ocean Podcast.
(01:02):
Let's start the show.
Hey everybody.
Welcome back to another exciting episodeof the How to Protect the Ocean Podcast.
I'm your host, Andrew Lewin, andthis is the podcast where you find
out what's happening with the ocean,how you could speak up for the
ocean, and what you can do to livefor a better ocean by taking action.
You know, it's really interesting whenthings come full circle in 2003, 2004,
back when I was a young lad and justgetting into, you know, the ocean and
(01:27):
ocean conservation and ocean science.
I did an advanced diploma doing aGIS analyst, and I did this diploma.
It was an eight month diploma onthe other side of Nova Scotia.
I was doing my master's in and aroundthe same time at Kid University on the
Bay of Fundee side, and I can't happenedto come across this advanced diploma.
My supervisor's like,Andrew, you gotta take this.
You should take this.
I was like, it's a long drive.
(01:48):
Compared to where I was living in Halifaxwas an hour and a half there and back,
and I had to go every day of the week.
It was a big investment, but it wasprobably the best investment that I
made in my life because not only did Iget an advanced diploma, that's helped
me stay employed for a long time.
But also I met some great people, and oneof those people was a teacher that taught
me remote sensing, and that's Tim Kerns.
(02:09):
Over the years, Tim and I kindof, you know, we parted ways
after he taught me for a year.
He went down to California, hestayed on the West coast and he did
a number of different things, whichwe interviewed him on last time.
He was on the podcastearlier in the summer.
And I'll link to that interviewdown below in the show notes.
But you know, we kind of reconnectedthrough this project and it was through
the podcast that I was able to learnabout, map the gaps through a couple
(02:33):
of friends and the networking thatI've done through the podcasting.
Then we got to reconnect and knowingthat, hey, I know Tim Kerns, he's the
executive director of Map to Gas, but heis also used to be my teacher when I was
doing an advanced diploma in GIS analysis.
And so I was like, this is really cool.
This is gonna be such an easy interview'cause we've known each other for so
long and just haven't talked in a while.
So, you know, we spent a numberof hours on the phone and
(02:55):
over Zoom and over Riverside.
Not only recording podcast episodes,but just discussing the importance of
mapping the ocean floor and what that isgoing to look like and how to fund it.
And now we're talking about a conferencethat he's helped put on for a number of
different years, and it's a symposiumand now a conference, and it's in
BC and it's bringing people from allover the world together to discuss.
(03:16):
How we're gonna map the ocean.
We're getting closerand closer to doing it.
We need to move fasterand faster to do it.
So this is getting even more importanteach and every year to start understanding
how we could map the gaps, lookingat different models from marketing to
storytelling, to investing to funding.
To actual use of technologyand then mapping the gaps and
then what to do with the data.
After that, it comes on the heels ofthe High Seas Treaty being ratified
(03:40):
by 60 countries, which just happeneda couple of days ago, or over the
weekend, or just before the weekend.
As of recording this podcast, September22nd, and it is awesome just to see how
everything is coming together full circle.
And I love this, and I love the factthat I've been doing this podcast for
so long, for 10 years and being able to.
Reconnect with people that have been inmy life that are doing new things and
(04:02):
being able to bring their story and storyof the stuff that they're working on, the
projects that they're working on to you,to the audience who've been listening
to me for whether it be 10 years, oneyear, less than a year, a couple of
weeks, you be able to understand what'shappening in the ocean and how we're
trying to not only map the ocean, butjust understand it and just in general.
And I think it's such a bigthing that we have to do.
(04:23):
It's something that I'm lookingforward to being able to bring you
and the information to bring you.
So with all that said, thisis gonna be a great interview,
learning about the conference.
If you want to go to the conference,please, you can register below.
I would love to see you there.
I'm gonna try and get to there as well.
So if you want to dothat, just register below.
But here's the interview with Tim Kerns.
(04:43):
Enjoy and I'll talk to you after.
Hey Tim, welcome back to the Howto Protect the Ocean Podcast.
Are you ready to talk aboutmapping the ocean floor?
I am always ready to talk about mappingthe ocean floor, especially when it
involves undiscovered discoveries.
Oh, I love it.
I love it, man.
Being prepared.
This is awesome.
Uh, Tim, this is greatto have you back on.
(05:03):
We talked last time, uh, aboutMap the Gaps, the organization
that is here, uh, that we're gonnabe talking, focusing on today.
But actually we're gonna be focusingon the conference that map the
guests puts on, uh, and it's, itis Explore the Ocean Floor and it's
happening at the end of October.
In Victoria, bc Beautiful ofVictoria, bc. Uh, and we're gonna
talk about what's gonna happenthere, why we think people should go.
(05:27):
Uh, and I think this is a, a perfectopportunity for the audience that we
have here to go to a conference, to, uh.
Kind of network with a number of differentpeople across different sectors of marine
science, conservation, ex exploration,and so in technology, um, plus investors
and funders and all these different typesof people who are going to be there.
(05:49):
Um, it's gonna be great.
So we're gonna be talking aboutthat, but Tim, before we get into
that, can you just remind peopleof who you are and what you do?
All right.
Well, thanks Andrew.
It's great to be onyour, uh, podcast again.
Yes.
Uh, and I feel like we've knowneach other a really long time now.
A really long time.
I've gotten to know you, uh, very wellin the last couple months, which has
been a real pleasure and a treat for me.
(06:09):
Uh, so yeah, my name's Tim Kerns.
I'm the Executivedirector of MAP the Gaps.
I've been involved with OceanFloor Exploration my whole career,
going back to the late nineties.
And uh, it's something thatI'm very passionate about.
And one of the reasons that I am is peoplesometimes ask, why do people like you?
Do what you do?
And part of it is that, uh, innatesense of discovery and exploration
(06:30):
that almost all humans have, right?
Yes.
Of being able to see and visualizesomething at the bottom of the ocean.
That I know no other humanhas ever seen before.
It's absolutely wild.
And then the other part of why we doit, of course, is for the discoveries.
Uh, either anthropogenic orcultural, or scientific mm-hmm.
That can be, um, uncovered.
(06:50):
Right.
Really, I, I would say unearthed, but Ithink it's un oceaned and, uh, un oceaned.
Absolutely.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Rex plane wrecks, canyons,hydrothermal vents, volcanoes,
you know, interesting features.
Sand dunes, uh, super wild marinelife that may live down there.
So yeah, we haven't even discoveredbefore, like there's so many things.
(07:12):
We often say 75% of the oceans areunexplored, but really thinking
of it of another way, 50% ofEarth hasn't been explored.
Like that's, yeah.
Imagine buying a house and then af beingin it for a while and realizing, yeah.
I've never been in half this house before.
Yeah, that's wild.
Yeah.
And uh, so that's howI like to look at it.
I, and I love that now, you know,why do you like, you, you, we know
(07:35):
why you love the ocean bottom.
Like, we know why you want todiscover and explore and you want
other people to do it as well.
What's your biggest pitch whensomebody's like, why should I
care about the ocean bottom?
Like, what's the, how'sit gonna benefit us?
You know, in the long run?
Well, there's, there's twobig drivers for that I think.
(07:55):
And, uh, and sometimes we would callthat the value proposition, right?
Mm-hmm.
What's the mm-hmm.
Economic return on investment forme to invest in mapping the oceans?
And it sort of depends on who you talk to.
There's definite, um, uh, blue economy.
Mm-hmm.
That's what we refer to technology andinnovation, uh, and the economic, uh,
benefits from around this type of effort.
(08:18):
Uh, there's just been a recentstudy published by the United
Kingdom Hydrographic Office in June.
I invite people to check it out.
Um, I'll give you the link and we canput it in the, in the comments below.
Absolutely.
Um, and that describes howmuch of a return on investment
there is, which is substantial.
So from an economic standpoint, whetherthat's around better understanding, uh,
(08:38):
the ocean for the resources that may be.
Uh, realized from it, understandingtidal energy and tidal currents, um,
how the ocean moves benthic habitats.
Mm-hmm.
Um, of critters that livein the ocean, of course.
Um, but then there's also that otherside of it, which is the discovery side,
and I think that provides a lot of.
(08:59):
Maybe.
Maybe it's not a direct economic value.
Mm-hmm.
But there's a real human value tothat, which is knowing that we're
exploring what's in our own backyardand knowing that the data that
goes from that, particularly if itends up in the public domain and
is used for conservation purpose.
Then we can better protectwhat we don't yet understand.
(09:20):
And that, I would say that's the numberone driver for most humans to get
involved in this effort, which is howcan we possibly protect the oceans if
we don't understand the characterizationof what they look like on the bottom?
Yeah.
And it affects so many things fromclimate change to, uh, sea level
rise to conservation and marinelife to better protecting, uh,
(09:44):
potential mining sites, right?
Uh, which is making a lot ofnews headlines these days.
Yeah, it's amazing.
You know, when we, when we look atthe, the ability that we have to do so
to actually map the ocean bottom, theeffort it takes that we think it'll
take to do so, the challenges thatwe have to face or that we will face.
To map the ocean bottom.
(10:05):
It's big, it's vast, it's expensive.
There's a lot of challenges withdepth and pressure and so forth.
Um, there's a lot of stuff going on.
I no doubt know that there is technologyand people there who want to do this
together to be able to map the oceanbottom for our collective wellbeing as,
you know, humans who live on this planet.
(10:26):
Um, but when we talk aboutsuch a a, a, a large.
Thing to do, uh, knowing, like lasttime when we spoke, we talked about
doing it in, in like small sectionsand then continue to make it larger
and larger and build upon that, uh, andlook at funding models and everything.
But when we, when we discussan idea like this, it's not
just one person has this idea.
(10:46):
There are many other people around theworld, pieces around the world who are
just like, we want to do the same thing.
This is how we're gonna go about it.
This is how we're gonna go about it.
And the best way to bring those peopletogether to discuss and to for everybody
to like share those ideas is a conferencelike, you know, ocean Floor explore.
Like this is, you know, a conferencewhere that'll help bring people
together so that they can actuallydiscuss all the different aspects of
(11:11):
what it will take to map these gaps.
Right?
What it was gonna take toexplore that, that ocean floor.
And so.
To do this.
Like, I, now we know why we're doing this.
We know why you like, map the gapsis hosting this conference, uh,
in, in collaboration with, withother organizations, but really
it's map the gaps driving this.
I like, how are youbringing all these together?
(11:33):
How are you?
Like, is this, you know, 20 years of you?
Decades of you like being in thebusiness and, and meeting people,
uh, and saying, okay, these arethe people would be good for this.
Or I know this organization outhere is working on this, or this
investor is interested in this.
How do you start bringing peopletogether like this and, and
how do you get the word out?
Uh, that's a great question.
(11:54):
Well, uh.
I am sure you've heard theterm, the network effect, right?
Yes, absolutely.
And uh, and I'm fortunate that I'veworked in a number of different
organizations over the course ofmy career and I'm a reasonably
social and outgoing human being.
Yes, you are.
And I've met a lot of peopleand I have good relationship
with lots of people as well.
I've also been running a Mapthe Gap symposium since 2016.
(12:17):
And I've been fortunate to have attracteda bit of a following, not me personally,
but Map the Gaps has attracted afollowing, has a lot of relationships
with companies and organizationswho are familiar with the symposium
series and have had interest in thepast or have attended in the past.
Uh, I also in the peoplewho attend the conferences.
(12:40):
Uh, often it was 70, 80% wasthe first time they'd been
to a mouth to cap symposium.
Mm-hmm.
Although this event has remainedrelatively small in terms of
numbers being a hundred, 150 people,it's small enough that it still
becomes more of an intimate affair.
Where the networking opportunityis really, really good.
Mm-hmm.
Which ultimately ends up amplifyingthe message of what we're trying to do.
(13:03):
And I've also been fortunate throughthe math the Gap series to partner
with different host organizationseach year and have the benefits
of sponsorship that come with.
Uh, different companies and organizationsthat wanna support the event.
So ranging from National OceanNational Oceanography Center in
Southampton a couple years ago.
(13:24):
International HydrographicOrganization in Monaco in 2023.
Um, uh, in the Chilean Navyin 2016 was the first one, uh,
that I was involved with doing.
And then other organizationssponsoring, like Geosciences
Australia, uh, geosciencesAustralia, noaa, uh, seabed 2030.
(13:44):
Mm-hmm.
Key Carta Gro Schmidt Ocean Institute,Kongsberg, you know, there's all these
ocean mapping related tech, and that'sjust a few of them who, who have
come and supported these events now.
I'm limited in my spherebecause I'm not connected with.
Wealthy individuals or investment firmsor hedge fund managers and stuff, right.
(14:06):
So I'm part of what we're doingthrough Ocean Floor Explorer, and
that's what makes this conferencedifferent from the other map.
The GAP symposium is really tryingto develop this message of how can we
expand the funding footprint and themechanisms for ocean floor exploration.
But it's not just the money, it'salso how would we go about doing it?
(14:28):
And the how then brings in thetechnology, but also the people.
Because sometimes people say, can you map?
Can't you map the ocean from space?
Or why can't you map the ocean from space?
And the simple answer is, well, youcan map some of the ocean from space.
We need to rely on something calledsatellite derived bathymetry.
Companies like Te Carta who will be here,are speaking at the conference, right?
(14:51):
They have amazing algorithms andtechnologies for being able to produce.
High resolution maps of theocean floor from space, right?
However, that technology is limited toa certain water depth and water clarity,
so well then we have to rely on othertechnologies that can transmit sound
from vessels to the bottom of the ocean.
(15:11):
But even that is limiting becausenot all sonar equipment can go all
the way to the bottom of the ocean.
So then you need bigger sonarequipment with bigger vessels
that need to go further offshore.
And so I like to think of this and mygood friend Vicki Farini at uh, Lamont
Dougherty Earth Observation wouldsay it's a puzzle and we all need to
(15:34):
contribute our own puzzle pieces to,uh, to this, whether it's funding,
participation, technology, approvals.
Right.
Even ideas.
Mm-hmm.
This is where the startupcommunities come in.
We've got index tech from,uh, the UK is coming.
A very, very young startupcompany, but amazing ideas.
(15:54):
Uh, I think they're still inuniversity, in fact, but that's the
startup, that's the younger generationperspective with new ideas, new
perspectives that we need to embrace.
Yeah, because if we keep relying on thesame people and the same organizations
doing it, it's never gonna happen.
So that's part of the purpose of theconference, is to bring all these
people together and let's have theconversation about what do we need to do.
(16:17):
I love it.
It, it's, it's, uh, it's oneof those things where there's
so many different aspects.
Me as like a, as a marine scientist,right, and loving technology and stuff,
I see the benefits from a researchstandpoint, from a conservation standpoint
to know as much information as possible.
But I find sometimes when I'm in thatI might, I get this tunnel vision
where I'm just looking at, okay,what's good for marine research?
(16:39):
What's good for thebenefit of conservation?
You, you have come from a very differentbackground than I have in terms of,
you've coming from, uh, you know, you, youtaught remote sensing and GIS and coming
and, and you've, you've had a very, uh,interesting and diverse background, you
know, going forward, like after that, uh,when we met in, in, in 2003, 2004, uh,
(17:00):
working for ESRI and then, and then havinga couple of your own, uh, co co-founding
and founding companies of your own,what was the most surprising aspect of.
Uh, this of of exploring theocean and trying to get people,
more people to map the gaps.
What was the, the, the most surprisingpart that is a big part of, you
(17:22):
know, the, the symposium now?
Well, one surprise I have, andmay, may sound a bit negative, is
it's actually hard to get peopleexcited and I think that speaks to.
The lack of awareness ofa, how big the oceans are.
And, and I don't mean that, uh,you know, critically of people.
(17:44):
I think people, of course, it's hard toappreciate just how big the oceans are.
Uh, I think some people don't appreciatehow unexplored they really are.
Mm. And that's because other mappingplatforms like Google Earth, right, where
you, you can see base maps of the ocean.
Some of them are derived byinterpreted measurements over.
(18:06):
Um, dozens of kilometers, which isfine to give us a general picture.
Yeah.
But go to any Google Earth andzoom into a few spots of the ocean
and you'll see how degraded andpixelated, uh, quickly it gets.
Mm-hmm.
But many people don't realize that,that it's already been mapped.
In the 1960s, national Geographicproduced an artist rendition.
It's very famous, ofcourse, was on the cover.
(18:27):
Uh, and many people thought back then,well, the oceans have been mapped because
of this, this beautiful illustration.
And it was really, that'sexactly what it was.
It was an illustration ofwhat the depths looked like.
Yeah.
In part, based on, uh, uh, inpart, based on measurements.
Um, but nonetheless it was still,uh, largely an illustration
(18:47):
and an artist rendition.
So that's a couple of big challenges.
And then I think a third challenge,of course, is getting people to get
excited enough about getting involved.
Mm. And that's, that takes maybe somecommitment or passion or investment.
And that's part of what OceanFloor explore is about, which
is how do we ex excite people?
(19:09):
Yeah.
Whether they be people with moneyor people with ideas, or people
with technology or people withapproval and regulatory processes.
How do we get them exexcited and involved?
So to me those are kind of thechallenging parts of this conference.
I would love it if this conferencewas 500 people or a thousand people.
Right.
Um, and maybe the nexttime we do it, it will be.
Mm-hmm.
But for now, we're, uh, I feel likewe're at the beginning of a conversation
(19:34):
for how do we get serious aboutexploring the ocean floor and how
do we take the power of what Seabed2030 has been doing for the last, uh,
eight or nine years, and convert that.
Uh, energy into actionable exploration.
And, uh, that's the, to me, the reallyexciting part about the next decade
I think, of what we're moving into.
(19:55):
And I think there's like a, a, a push andpull or an advantage and disadvantage of,
of getting more and more people involved.
You know, when you get more peopleinvolved, it's great 'cause you get more
eyes on it, more years on it, more ideas.
And it's, and it's great to, to put thoseideas forward and evaluate those ideas.
But then you get some, like, again, the,the conservation side coming out and you
get people who want to, you know, exploit.
(20:17):
The ocean for a lot of different things.
Like, like we've exploited land inthe, in the past, and that could
have consequences, uh, in that.
So I, there's, there's advantagesand d disadvantages, of course.
Um, but right now the advantage ofjust is, is, I, I agree with you.
I, I feel like sometimes the deepsea, just like sometimes in space.
It's so out of context for us.
It's like a lot of us don't, probablywon't go to space in our lifetime, um,
(20:41):
some more than others, but it is cost alot of money a apparently to go, to go
to space if you want to go to space now.
Uh, and that's for like two minutes,but it even like the depth of, of the
sea, it's very difficult to get there.
It's expensive to get there and soit's very difficult to tie that.
To people's and understanding of like,Hey, this is why this is important.
(21:02):
Um, and I feel like storytellingcomes in to that aspect too, of,
you know, having great stories to.
Discuss the importance of the deep sea,uh, discuss the mystery of the deep sea
and, and what we don't know yet about,you know, the bottom of the ocean that
could help us in the future, or just theknowledge of that could help us in the
future, even protecting it in the future.
(21:24):
Do you find that, like, I know you,you have been, you, you and I have
a, a common, uh, a common friend andcolleague, uh, Natalie Gilson, who's
been, you know, is, is a big part.
Of the storytelling context of alot of, of Canadian organizations,
uh, working for Pisces.
And do you find that's like puttingin it in that context, do you think
(21:45):
that's like a gap that people have?
Not only just in in ocean in general, butespecially in like exploring the deep sea
and trying to bring that out, that emotionout for people to say, Hey, you know
what, like this is why this is important.
Yeah, a hundred percent.
That's a great question.
Uh, we have a whole session called,uh, communication strategies, uh,
(22:08):
uh, at Ocean Floor Explorer, uh,moderated by Sophie Silks from coast.
And then, as you mentioned, NatalieGilson from Pisces is on it, as
well as Joy Ani from Schmidt Oceanand Heather Manix from Compass.
Um, that's precisely the purposeof that session is to talk about
communication methods and strategies.
How do we reach people?
How, how do we get people excited?
(22:31):
Because not everyone gets excited byscience, uh, or science for the sake of
science, especially if it's not in contextto something that they're familiar with.
Mm-hmm.
And whether those stories are.
Here's an example.
Just, uh, Dr. Don Wright from Esri.
She's the chief scientist and,uh, uh, first woman of color to go
(22:52):
to the deepest part of the ocean.
Yeah.
With Victor Vivo. Uh, a few years ago,she just recently did an interview with
NPR, and as part of that, one of theNPR illustrators made a, a comic strip,
uh, describing her journey, but alsothe importance of deep sea mapping.
Yeah.
And it was a great way toillustrate and communicate.
(23:14):
Uh, something that's soimportant to so many people.
And, but it was also a uniqueperspective because you don't see a
lot of comic strips or comic style,uh, you know, presentation pieces or
media assets on, on this, on this topic.
And that's just one.
I think another one is, and maybe wewill learn at ocean floor explorers,
can we do something with mass media?
(23:36):
Mm-hmm.
Can we leverage social media more?
To make people aware, get peopleexcited, and get people interested
and, and, uh, invested in this eitherfinancially or, or, or otherwise.
And, uh, so I, I think that's a huge part.
That's probably one of the biggestchallenges is, is identifying
that's, that's another gap map.
The gaps isn't just about thephysical mapping, it's also about
(23:58):
bridging those gaps of who'sdoing what and who's involved.
Yeah.
Uh, that's why the tagline for thecompany is Connected Oceans and Connected
People, because really this is a people,this is, this is a human mission.
This is not a science mission.
No.
Absolutely, and I, I think somethingthat always gets me, you talk about
storytelling and getting peopleinterested in deep sea, there's, uh, I,
(24:19):
I, I doom scroll quite a bit on online.
I try and keep it to oceansand football that's in hockey.
That's my, that's whatI try and keep it to.
But every once in awhile, I come across this.
This, this video, and it'sthese deep sea biologists.
They're in a ROV and they're like, theyfind these animals and they're like,
oh, look, it's such and such animal.
Or it's like a new octopusspecies, or this is, we haven't
(24:40):
seen this one in a while.
And, and there's really cute littleanimals and like really interesting
shapes and sizes and colors andbioluminescence and everything like that.
And they're, you hear like the, thegeekiness in the science of like
the nerdiness in the scientistsbeing like, oh, look what we have
here and it's all this kind of fun.
And I feel like that helps.
I feel like when people can see that thereare actual animals that are living at
(25:00):
the bottom, when there's actually thingsand, and there's characteristics that are
similar to what we see on land or even inthe oceans, like in the shallow oceans.
People really get involved in that.
And I feel like there'sa component there for.
Uh, you know, for, for just mapping theocean bottom in almost like a, a, a double
benefit or as they're mapping the bottom,people can take these types of pictures
(25:23):
and take these type types of videos andbe like, look what we found in this area.
And nobody would've known thisif we didn't, if we weren't
down here, and stuff like that.
And really just generate the curiosityand, and really, uh, inspire the curiosity
of more people to get, to get to thedeep sea, uh, and be able to like.
Hear from the people who are exploringit from yourself and others who will
be at this conference who are like,no, we're gonna go to the bottom,
(25:44):
or we're gonna see the bottom.
We're gonna send ROVs at the bottomand we're gonna be talking about them.
And I think that's like.
One of the big, big storytelling grabsthat we can take and take advantage of
when, when people are gonna the bottomto get people interested in funding
more projects or just like, Hey, Iwanna see this area in the Indian
Ocean or this area in the, in theMid-Atlantic bite, or something like
(26:05):
that to see what's there, you know?
Um, right.
I think that would be, I think thatwould be a really, a really cool
thing, um, to have in, in that aspect.
Right.
Well, let me speak to that.
So, uh, one of the, the keynote forMonday, October the 27th is Moron
Harris, uh, also known as, uh,the imaginative scientist, right?
And she's got hundreds of days atsea, a very accomplished human being
(26:29):
as an oceanographer and a researcher.
And she'll be speaking specificallyat the conference about those.
Perspectives of discoveries on theocean floor and, and maybe she'll talk
about how some of them could even beused for advancing medical science.
Mm. So imagine if we can makediscoveries on the sea floor that
would ultimately end up benefitinghumans from a medical perspective,
(26:52):
either through treatments for diseasesor medicines or whatever it may be.
And that's a whole unique perspective,but it makes it extremely relatable.
To humans, of course, of the importanceof doing this on the second day.
Then we've got Victor Visco, of course,another phenomenal and accomplished
adventurer and human being will be talkingabout technology that he's developing,
(27:13):
which would help aid this effort.
And, uh, so once again,two very different mm-hmm.
Keynote speakers, but helping, uh, addperspective in that human dimension.
Um, to this, we've got a number ofother companies who will be showcasing
their technologies at Ocean Tech Live.
The demo Day, which is hosted by Coast,uh, the Center for Ocean, uh, applied
(27:36):
Sustainable Technologies here in Victoria.
And that's, uh, just across thestreet from the Victoria Conference
Center, and there'll be a dozen anda half at least companies there.
Presenting technologies.
Not all of them related to ocean floorexploration, but, and that's okay.
I mean, right.
A lot of the technologies that are beingdeveloped in the blue economy space,
um, ha, have in some part be, are ableto survive because of the bathymetry
(28:01):
that's been mapped in these areas.
We've got seaweed, uh,technology companies.
We've got technologies makingsemi-autonomous and autonomous vehicles.
We've got telecommunication companies.
Um, companies that are makingreally important sensors that need
to go on vehicles that go underthe bottom of the ocean, you know?
Yeah.
So all of this relates to oceanexploration and ocean discovery,
(28:23):
and, uh, they're a part of this eventbecause of what we're trying to do.
So I think there's, once again,that networking effect of amplifying
the message, getting more peopleinterested and excited about
ocean, and ocean technology andocean floor exploration is real.
The real key here.
It is such a key.
And, and again, there's so many differenttypes of people coming, like with a lot
(28:43):
of different backgrounds, internationalbackgrounds, uh, not just Canadians,
where, where this is taking place, uh,which is, which is really impactful things
because people are gonna bring their ownstories, their own, uh, style of, of,
uh, doing professional projects and, andgetting together and speaking together.
How big is it for, for theconference and for the symposium?
(29:04):
Um, to get people from differentbackgrounds, like from all over
the world to come together.
I think we mentioned before, beforewe record, there's gonna be people
from like the Middle East, from, fromAsian countries, from South America,
from all over the place, uh, to cometogether and, and be able to exchange
ideas and then at the conference.
How is that gonna befacilitated other than just.
(29:25):
You know, having dinners togetherand lunches together and so forth,
and just being in the same room.
But are there any, uh, parts of the, uh,of, of the conference that are gonna be
dedicated towards just exchanging ideas?
Uh, yeah, so that's a great idea.
There's.
Pardon me.
A great question.
Uh, it's fantastic havinginternational representation.
Uh, it really speaks to thediversity of who's involved mm-hmm.
(29:49):
In this activity, this global activity.
It's not a, not a North American or right.
Western Nation initiative.
This is a global initiative.
Uh, really being led by CBE 2030.
I mean, and they've got over 200 companiesthat are from all over the world who are
part of this, in addition to nationalgovernments and academic institutions
that are part of CBE 2030 as well.
(30:10):
So, CED 2030 has done a great job andthey of course, will be representing
the, um, their organization.
And their efforts, they're bringingthe Bathie sphere, which is this inter
interactive physical globe display.
So members of the public couldpotentially come, or maybe people
who are attending the conferencecould interact and learn about that
and visually see what's happening.
International representation also bringsdifferent perspectives and different
(30:34):
ideas, and there is a, in additionto the networking and the questions
after the sessions, uh, there's awhole workshop on Tuesday afternoon.
That's October the 28th.
Called aspirational fundingmechanisms for mm-hmm.
Floor exploration.
And that's co-hosted with, uh, JebCo, which is the general bath metric
chart of the oceans and map the gaps.
(30:56):
Bring together thoughtleaders to spark conversation.
No presentations, no long monologues here.
This is about asking a few hard questions.
Getting some unique perspectivesand then getting people in
the room to talk about it.
Mm. To talk about their experiences, theircrazy ideas or new ideas or perspectives,
(31:17):
and, and then hopefully convert thatinto an action plan that we can then
carry forward beyond this conference.
Uh, it's, it's no good justto talk about this stuff.
You have to capture the ideas.
Yeah.
And then you have to put,you know, an action plan.
Uh, so I'm very much looking forwardto that Aspirational, uh, funding
models, uh, workshop with, uh, Jeb bco.
I think it's gonna be a reallyinteresting perspective.
(31:38):
There's two lenses to that.
One is inside national jurisdictionsand another is outside because
mapping in inside territorial waters.
Carries, uh, a differentprice tag for one.
Yeah, a different level of complexitywhen there's, uh, national governments
involved, there could be levelsof national security permitting,
bureaucracy, who knows, right?
(32:00):
There's lots of different reasonsfor why it's challenging to
map inside national waters.
Conversely, there's also lots of reasonswhy it's challenging to map outside of.
National waters.
Uh, just because it's the highseas doesn't mean it's easy.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, and so we'll be talkingabout, uh, strategies for
how to explore that as well.
(32:20):
Well, and, and just tomention, uh, the, the.
The Highs Seas Treaty just got ratified.
They just hit the 60, 60 countrymark, so that could be more of a
conversation than ever because they,there might be some rules, uh, in that
treaty around mapping the ocean floor.
So hopefully there could be some benefitsto discussing that in this conversation
when it just, just got ratified thispast weekend as of recording this.
(32:44):
So, uh, in, in September.
So this is, this is good news and it'sgood to be able to have an international
audience that are probably interested.
I mean, we're obviously,we're interested in mapping.
All of the oceans.
So it's not just the ones withinthe exclusive economic zones,
but uh, but even in the High Sea.
So it's good to have some rules and,and regulations around that and getting
countries to, uh, put that into place.
(33:04):
So that'll be, uh, that'll be really nice.
So, right.
Yeah.
So that'll be good.
Um, okay, so, so just to, to moveon a little bit too, is getting more
into the funding because I feel likethat's a real, obviously a really
important part that a lot of the times.
Uh, may considered not as sexy in termsof like, it's better to like watch a video
of someone going down to the bottom ofthe ocean and being able to see what's
(33:26):
on the bottom and map the bathymetryand, and all that kind of stuff.
Um, but funding is, is essentialin that, uh, we're not talking
about funding just from.
Foundations and grants and so forth.
We're looking at like private companies,investors, venture capitalists that
will be attending these, this conferenceand having these discussions and, and
(33:50):
you know, trying to understand thedynamics of what could come out of this.
What's the, like, we, we talked alittle bit about the funding mechanisms
and, and things like that, but.
What do you hope to, at the endof this conference to have, uh,
an idea of or better understandingof when it comes down to funding?
(34:10):
Uh, that's a great question, ed.
At the end of the conference, what Iwould really like to have an understanding
is inside national jurisdictions or.
What are the top five pathways to funding?
Is that through highnet worth individuals?
Is that corporate donations?
Mm-hmm.
Is that, uh, people like my momwho want to give a hundred dollars?
(34:33):
Right.
Ocean floor discovery.
Is it school groups that want to beable to, uh, identify or adopt a little
piece of the ocean floor as their own?
In exchange for a great map thatthey get to hang on their wall.
Mm-hmm.
Uh, is it a high net worth individualthat wants to make a name, a lasting
legacy for themself by, uh, sponsoring1% of the Indian Ocean or something?
(34:58):
Yeah.
Um, is it, is it a, is it an approach tonational governments to share the, uh,
share the investment and everyone chip in.
Um, across the board.
And so we can have sort of aninternational collaboration maybe at the
UN level, and we have representativesof the UN who will be at the meeting
(35:19):
to talk about internationally, howcan national government support this.
Mm-hmm.
Maybe people chip in, maybe, sothere's, that's another strategy.
And all of these may take.
Many years to execute, but at leastit would be more clear than what we
have today, which I think is not acoordinated or consolidated list of the
different vehicles that are availablefor funding this type of initiative.
(35:41):
Uh, so that would be my.
Probably single largest, uh, takeawayfrom that is the identification of
realistic funding mechanisms thatcould be then further explored.
Yeah, at subsequent conference, subsubsequent workshop, or maybe more
targeted events that say, all right,well if we're gonna do something
(36:02):
with national governance, allright, then how do we work within.
The, um, uh, intergovernmentalOceanographic Commission and the
International Hydrographic Organizationto work together with these national
governments to up their contributions.
I, I don't know the answer.
Mm-hmm.
Of course.
Mm-hmm.
That's hopefully whatwe're gonna get out of.
Or maybe the answer is, well look,every day people would be interested
(36:23):
in this, so how do we reach them?
Maybe we need to develop acampaign, a marketing campaign.
Yeah.
To get them excited about this andgive them an opportunity and a pathway.
To get involved, to get excited to make aninvestment or a, or a donation, I'm sure.
And Tim, I see a perfect opportunityto talk about corporate donors as well.
I see a perfect opportunityfor the NHL team, the Seattle
(36:43):
Kraken, they're deep sea species.
They're trying to represent.
This is a perfect opportunityfor them to maybe get some right
off the coast, you know, off thecoast where they are in Seattle.
Like, let's, we'll just send thisclip out to them and see if they're,
they're interested in, in investinginto the deep sea and protecting
their crack and their deep sea, uh,their deep sea squids, because I
mean, that's, that's just perfect.
It's right there.
(37:03):
It's, it's right there.
They can come to the conference, sendtheir mascot, whatever they want to do.
Just an idea.
Just an idea.
Wow.
That's perfect.
And, and to add that the Kraken probablydon't realize that Map the Gaps is
actually registered in the state ofWashington, uh, as a nonprofit company.
So there you go.
It's perfectly appropriate.
Absolutely a hundred percent agree.
Uh, and, and you know, speaking oflike what we want, like what you want
(37:25):
to get out of this or what you wantthe conference to get out of this,
um, you know, when we talk aboutfunding, obviously we can probably
go into each and every category.
Um, but what do you want, likewhen, when the people come, you
know, we're looking at about 150people, maybe a little bit more.
Um, if we can get 200, great.
Uh, what do you.
(37:46):
Want them to get out of this conference?
Like the people who attend,what do you, what's the goal
when they go to this conference?
What, what thought process should theybe in and, and what mindset should they
be in to say, Hey, I'm gonna get asmuch as I can out of this conference?
Uh, well, uh, as long as I've been doingthese conferences, Andrew, 2016, I've
(38:06):
had a little, uh, catchphrase or whatyou call it, um, for what the purpose is.
And the purpose is to listen and to learn.
And engage.
So ultimately that's what I'mhoping attendees will get out of
the event, is to be a part of it.
Yeah.
And not feel like they're justattending and, and being an observer.
Mm-hmm.
But actually engaging and being able totake that either back to their homeowner
(38:31):
home organization or back to their schoolor back to their community, whether it's
technology or investor or whatever it is.
Um, and be able to noodle on thatand then eventually translate
that into some sort of action.
Yeah, maybe there's their own,uh, individual contribution.
Maybe it's an organizational contribution,maybe it's influence that they have
(38:52):
over some politician or group toaffecting policy or investment.
Um, and then I think the other thingthat I always try to do at these
conferences is really instill a senseof community, uh, the professional
and personal networking that you get.
These are the types of events.
Like I said, it's small enough that youcan meet everybody, you can approach
(39:12):
anybody, uh, and hopefully walk awaywith a new colleague or a friend.
Mm-hmm.
Um, that's part of the purposeof these events as well.
And we provide lots of networking time,lots of coffee breaks, lunch breaks,
social events and receptions in theevening, and those are 100% dedicated to
people using that opportunity to network.
Meet new people, uh, learnfrom others, listen to them,
(39:35):
and, uh, and ultimately engage.
No.
Amazing.
And I, I think it's interesting too,like one of the things that I always
tell people is, is especially in a,in a conference like this where you're
getting so many different types ofsessions and topics, is to go into
the sessions you're not familiar with.
And learn from them.
Learn what's happening in thefunding areas, learn what's
(39:55):
happening in the tech areas.
Learn, learn what's happening duringthe pitch fest and, and the investor,
and see how people are tr are,are, you know, pitching themselves
and, and what discussions arehappening in each of these sessions.
That they can get the most andget a whole, a comprehensive
understanding of what's happening.
Don't just sit in your niche, in yourtopic area and just do that, you know,
(40:16):
do that, but also explore others.
Um, if there's time and you'reable to go to those sessions, it
looks like there's plenty of timefrom the schedule which is up.
I'll put the link in in theshow notes, but it's uh, ocean
floor explore.org/schedule.
And you can see what you can test outat the beginning and be like, okay, I'm
gonna go to the funding model becauseI don't know a lot about funding and I
wanna be a part of this conversation.
(40:38):
Like you said, you know, youknow, it is just, you're there.
You, you soak it up and then you engage.
And I think it's really important forpeople to do that and have the confidence
to do that and, uh, 'cause the peoplewill be open to any kind of ideas.
And I think that's really,uh, really important.
But Tim, this has been such a great.
Uh, privilege to have you on and to beable to share, uh, ocean floor explore,
(41:00):
uh, with, with the people of thisaudience, which I, which I love to death.
And so I want to thank you so muchfor, for coming on and would love to
have you back on, of course, to talk.
Uh, about the conference and, uh,what happened at the conference.
So we'll do like a follow up one.
I think it'll be a lot of fun.
Um, but if people want to go, theyhaven't, they haven't, uh, thought about
doing it yet as of now to, to register.
(41:21):
But if they wanna register, um, is therea, a specific link that they can go to?
Um, I'm looking on the website here.
It looks like it's oceanfloor explorer.org/register.
Is that the, that's the right link.
That's correct.
And there's still room, there'sstill time to register up until,
uh, around, uh, October the 15thif you haven't registered yet.
(41:41):
Okay.
I do know that the hotel room blocks arepretty much sold out, almost sold out.
So if, uh, people are interested inbooking that at the Grand Pacific Hotel,
then they need to get on that quickly.
Uh, that's ocean floor.org/slash travel,uh, to find out the details on that.
There's also a discountwith Alaska Airlines and FRS
Clipper coming up from Seattle.
Okay.
So there's, there's still opportunitiesand for people to get involved.
(42:04):
Um, and it's a single track conference,uh, meaning that all the sessions,
you don't need to choose thatthey'll, they're all sequential.
Perfect.
And, uh, I look forward tohaving hopefully lots of
people, uh, sign up and attend.
Yeah, I think it'll be,it'll be really great.
So we'll put the link there.
Sign up, uh, let them know when yousigned up that you heard it from
How to Protect the Ocean Podcast.
(42:25):
This is all done for free.
Folks.
I'm not getting any money outta this.
I, this is something that's justsuper interesting to me and I
want people to attend and, uh,and, and get the most out of it.
So go sign up@oceanfloorexplore.orgslash register.
And Tim, thank you so much for comingon the podcast and sharing this.
And I look, I look forward to attendingand, and being a part of the conversation.
Great.
(42:45):
Thanks Andrew.
Always a pleasure and I lookforward to the next one.
Alright, see ya.
Thank you, Tim, for joining us again onthe How to Protect the Ocean Podcast.
It was great to have you on.
Great to learn more about the conference.
Now that the schedule's out, I thinkit's gonna be interesting for everybody
to go and learn about what's happening.
As Tim said, it's a one track type ofconference where everything, you know,
you're not gonna miss out on anything.
(43:06):
A lot of times conferences put on so muchthat the sessions are at the same time
and you have to like, oh, how do I get tothis one and this one at the same time?
I can't do it.
This is one track.
You just learn everythingright off the bat.
You have that ability to joineach and every session and
take part and participate.
I think it's gonna be reallyinteresting to do that.
So I want you guys to head out there,go to Ocean Floor explore.org/register
(43:30):
to register for the conference.
It's not an expensive conferenceif you're on the West Coast
already, it's right there.
If you're international,there's ways to get there.
I'd hope to see you there.
And if you do get there andpeople say, Hey, how did you
learn about this conference?
Say is from how to protect the ocean.
I love to just get that name out thereand be like, oh, I don't know what,
how to protect the ocean is, it's apodcast that you need to listen to and
get more and more people listening tothe podcast as I try and get more and
(43:52):
more people to go to these conferences.
So I think that's gonna be somethingthat's extremely important and I
would love to see you guys get thereand be able to be there and be able
to take part and be able to have.
A say in mapping the ocean in the future.
So that's it for today's episode.
If you have any questions or concernsor comments, please let me know.
You can put your comments in the commentsbelow if you're watching this on YouTube,
(44:13):
or you can go ahead and get ahold of meon Instagram at how to Protect the Ocean.
Just DM me.
At How to Protect the Ocean.
And if you really want to get access tome, go to speak out for blue.com/contact
and you'll be able to fill out the form.
It goes right to my personal email.
I'd love to get back toyou as soon as possible.
I wanna thank you so much forjoining me on today's episode of the
How to Protect the Ocean Podcast.
(44:33):
I'm your host, Andrew Lewinfrom the True Norstrom and Free.
Have a great day.
We'll talk to you nexttime in Happy Conservation.
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