July 18, 2025 • 53 mins
Texas Flood 2025 revealed just how urgently we need smarter tools in disaster response. In this episode, Dave Jones, founder of StormCenter Communications, explains how his team used satellite imagery and real-time mapping to support emergency responders during the catastrophic floods. Their data helped identify stranded residents, blocked roads, and the areas most in need—turning science into life-saving action.
Satellite technology for disaster response is revolutionizing real-time crisis management. Dave shares how open-access Earth observation data, localized GIS tools, and close coordination with emergency services are building more resilient communities as climate change amplifies flood risks.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
A few places in the US have
undergone extreme flooding.
Kerr County, Texas, and New Mexico,
Reduso from July 4th to July
8th, have had flash flooding.
Many people have died,
people are still missing.
And conversations are
happening, what happened?
Were people alerted?
How did those alerts go out?
How were they received
(00:21):
if they were received?
And how are people building
infrastructure around rivers
where there's been flooding in the past?
I wanted to make sure
that you as the audience
for the How to Protect the Ocean podcast
understood some of the
conversations that are going on.
There's a lot going on in the news.
A lot of people are
making it very political
(00:41):
because of the cuts that happened
over the last couple
months in the US federally.
And I wanted to kind of
sift through all that, right?
Really sift through the BS to
say, what actually happened?
Did the cuts get,
affect the messaging system?
Did the cuts affect the ability
for the message to get out there?
Or was it just a fact that this was a
very bad circumstance caused by more
(01:04):
moisture in the air?
And a confluence of storms and clouds
with moisture and just bad circumstances?
Or is it all of the above?
To the bottom of that, I
wanted to get some answers.
And Dave Jones, the CEO of Storm Center
has come on the podcast
before to talk about storms
and alert systems and weather.
And he's a meteorologist
(01:25):
for a very, very long time.
He's a good friend of the podcast.
And he graciously accepted to come on the
podcast and talk about how
the messaging system went out,
how it could be better done in the future
and what needs to be done so that we can
alert more people
faster and they can get out.
And they can have all the information for
them, plus the feedback systems that
happen and what needs
(01:45):
to happen in the future.
Before we go on with the podcast, you
know, I want to be sensitive to the fact
that people have had
their lives just, you know,
it's been awful for people.
It's been a huge tragedy.
I want to acknowledge that.
The reason why I'm putting this podcast
out now is because as the Central Texas
(02:05):
and Kerr County floods were
happening in the river there,
another flood happened in New Mexico.
So these floods are happening.
We're at a time of year where there's a
lot of moisture in the air because of
humidity and it's the summer.
So I want to make sure that people, if
they can have the
ability to get the right,
know whether radios or whatever they
need, they will have it and that they'll
(02:26):
be on alert and they understand the
impacts of these dangerous situations.
So hence why I'm putting it out now is to
be cognizant of that and to
help people in the near future.
So here's the episode.
Let's start the show.
Everybody, welcome back to another
episode of the How to
Protect the Ocean podcast.
I am your host, Andrew Lewin.
(02:46):
This is the podcast where you find out
what's happening with the ocean, how you
can speak up for the ocean,
what you can do to live for a better
ocean by taking action.
On today's episode, it's
a bit of a somber note.
We are talking about the flash floods
that happened in Kerr County in Texas, as
well as in New Mexico.
People have lost their lives.
People are still missing.
The rescue efforts are ongoing.
(03:07):
I want to have Dave Jones on to talk
about what went on during the storm.
How are people alerted in these areas
that are more vulnerable to flash floods
and what can we do
about it in the future?
And for those communities that are in a
similar situation that haven't had floods
yet, but might have them in the future,
what they can do and how they can better
(03:28):
prepare themselves in the future so that
this doesn't happen in
their county, in their town.
So I want to have Dave
Jones on to discuss this.
He's been on the podcast before.
He's been a
meteorologist for a long, long time.
He's the CEO of Storm Center right now,
which provides extra coverage of the
weather to his clients, but also
(03:49):
as a YouTube channel, which I'll link in
the show notes where you can get updated
live updates a lot of the times on
hurricanes, on storms and so forth.
And you can better protect
yourself and better be alerted.
So he helps amplify the messages.
He doesn't put up the messages, but he
helps amplify the messages coming up from
the National Weather Service and NOAA.
He does a damn good job at it.
(04:09):
So he was gracious enough to take time
away from the work that he's doing to
help educate myself, as well as everybody
here that's listening to this podcast and
watching this podcast.
In order to better protect
themselves wherever you live.
You know, I live here in Canada, watching
this from Canada is awful.
We've seen this happen in our country,
but to watch it anywhere around the world
and see people in pain and have to
(04:31):
undergo this tragedy, a
tragedy is just awful.
And, you know, our hearts go out to
everybody and the families
who are going through this.
But I wanted to make sure that we had the
education here so that we can protect
ourselves in the future.
So without further ado, here is Dave
Jones talking about the flash floods that
happened in Texas and New Mexico, how we
can better prepare ourselves and how the
(04:52):
system works and how it can work even
better in the future.
Enjoy and I'll talk to you after.
Hey, Dave, welcome back to the How to
Protect the Ocean podcast.
Are you ready to talk about some flooding
that's happening in the US right now?
Unfortunately, I'm ready.
Yeah, it's it's you know, when I when I
want to when I contacted you to come on
the podcast, I was
like, he's going to be busy.
(05:13):
He's going to be tired, you know, just
not only mentally and
physically, but emotionally.
And I mean, there are some big tragedies
happening in Texas, in New Mexico.
There are over 120 people that have
confirmed that have died in
these flash floods in Texas.
There's there's about four individuals
that are missing, three people killed,
including two children in New Mexico.
(05:35):
Horrendous, horrendous
flooding, horrendous tragedy.
And of course, people are still missing.
And this is and this is
what we wanted to avoid.
We always want to avoid
this type of stuff we talk.
And in this as as everything is
developing and as still people are trying
to be found and rescuers are doing their
best and and and braving the elements to
(05:57):
get out there in very difficult
situations or very dangerous situations
to rescue and find some
of these missing people.
You know, there's some blame and a lot of
stuff being thrown back and forth.
And unfortunately, a lot of it's
political, you know, a lot of doge cuts
that we talked about on the last podcast,
you know, from NOAA, the National Weather
(06:17):
Service, what we were afraid of.
But it seems like a lot of political
stuff is like, let's blame one side,
let's blame the other side.
I want to strip away that Dave today.
And I want to kind of just talk about the
process of what is supposed to happen.
And if that happened during this, like
the early warning systems, making sure
people were safe or they knew about these
(06:38):
types of storms and these types of
floods, how these floods occurred.
And maybe we'll start
off with that, Dave.
Can you just talk, because, you know,
you've got you've got the knowledge on
this way more than I do.
Can you just let the audience know, like,
what happened in the first place?
How did these floods happen?
Well, I mean, you know,
it's a great question.
And we always look back.
Of course, we can see things developing
(07:00):
in the future, but we can't tell, you
know, days and days and days ahead of
time, how much rain is going to fall in a
certain watershed or over a certain town.
That is really an elusive
thing as far as forecasting goes.
But we can see the conditions coming
together that will
(07:20):
result in flooding somewhere.
And that's what happened, Andrew, over
the last, you know, several days, even
before July 4th and the
terrible flood happened.
We had a lot of
moisture that was in the air.
And typically there's, you know, there's
a give and take for
moisture and dry air over Texas.
(07:43):
And we had a landfalling tropical storm
in Mexico several days before that.
That was kind of, you
know, rained out in Mexico.
But that circulation stayed there and it
brought with it when it moved
over Texas, even more moisture.
And so, you know, you and I might notice
(08:04):
it as boy, it's really humid out today.
Yeah, got a lot more
humid than yesterday.
It doesn't mean that that remnants of
that system was bringing any rain itself
or bringing any thunderstorms, but it was
bringing the moisture.
And at the same time, there was a
circulation around a high pressure system
(08:24):
that was off the southeast coast of the
United States that was bringing in more
moisture from the Gulf.
And that happens very
frequently in Texas.
So you have those two
things that are coming together.
And then you had a little disturbance in
the atmosphere that was leading to the
(08:45):
development of
thunderstorms in South Central Texas.
And when you don't have a lot of steering
currents, but you have a lot of moisture
and you get thunderstorms to develop, you
get thunderstorms that
develop and don't move very quickly.
There is no real push to
get them out of the way.
(09:05):
And so when those thunderstorms develop,
they tap into that very
thick layer of tropical moisture.
It's continuing to be fed by moisture
coming in off of the Gulf around the
circulation around a
high pressure system.
And those thunderstorms
just kind of sit there.
(09:25):
And that's what happened over Kerr County
in Texas and just north of Kerr County.
These thunderstorms formed
and they just kept reforming.
We call it training when all move over
the same place at the same time.
And that is the
recipe for flash flooding.
(09:46):
So when you think about that, you think
about that moisture and the storms going
and all that stuff, you
think, well, what about absorption?
Can't the land absorb
that rain coming down?
And the hill country of South Central
Texas is very much thin
soil and a lot of rock.
(10:10):
And it's it's very hard there.
And so they had been in a drought for a
long period of time.
So you have very hard soil.
You have not very thick soil for
absorbing any kind of rain and, you know,
nothing's going to absorb 12 to 15 to
(10:31):
perhaps 20 inches of rain
over a several hour period.
That rain has to go somewhere and it
drains right down into the watershed and
into the local river.
In this case, the Guadalupe River, which
surged more than 30 feet as unreal.
(10:51):
All that rain fell.
Now, you know, we we talk about storms
that happen like this and you know, you
mentioned how this just seemed to be this
time as coincidence in a way where all
these systems are kind of
converging in one place.
You have over an area where you have, you
know, a lot of rock.
(11:11):
And so the absorption of the soil and
thin soil, not a lot of
absorption is going to happen.
This seems to be just a case of bad luck.
But we know we talk about when we do.
I've done this in the past
when I did private consulting.
We talk about 100 year storms, which are
really bad storms, 50 year storms, 10
year storms and all these
different types of storms.
And, you know, engineers and planners,
(11:33):
they build and they plan for these types
of storms to happen every so often.
So these hundred year storms, these 10
year storms for a storm like this, I know
it might be early to
say, do we know what?
What kind of category these storms have?
Like, has this happened before in these
areas where similar
consequences or similar results?
(11:54):
They have. And in Kerr County and along
the Guadalupe River, they've had several
major floods over the
course of the last hundred years.
And, you know, I hear in the media, I
hear other people saying, oh, my gosh,
this was a one in a thousand year event.
Well, I've always been an advocate to
(12:16):
say, let's throw that out the window.
Right. Let's stop talking about one in a
thousand year event.
Let's talk a lot, not talk about one in a
hundred year event because we are living
in a different paradigm as far as the
atmosphere is concerned.
It is basically
turbocharged with heat and moisture.
(12:40):
And so we can't look at past events and
say, oh, this is not
going to happen again.
Anybody that says that this flood that
just happened isn't going to happen for
another two to five
hundred years is not accurate.
And we're going to see more of these kind
of floods happening not just in the
(13:01):
United States, but in many countries
around the world because we have that
much more moisture in the atmosphere.
And so, yes, they've had floods there.
Many of the structures that were washed
away were in flood zones.
Some areas, including the Mystic Cabin
(13:22):
retreat area was in
an extreme flood zone.
Who knows how they
were able to build there.
And they also apparently had an emergency
plan and had an inspection two days
before this happened and
(13:43):
passed that inspection.
So I don't know what the
inspection was for. Right.
But it's certainly opening up a lot of
questions to what the people do,
especially if they're taking money and
taking and housing people and having
activities in a dangerous
(14:04):
area when it could flood.
What are the plans that were in place?
I'd love to see those emergency plans and
I'd love to see what is the history.
I'm starting to get information from
several colleagues around what is the
(14:24):
information in the past as to why they
didn't have warning
systems in place in that area.
Yeah. You know, it's interesting.
When we look at the coastal areas all
around the world, they're
always updating tsunami warnings.
They're also updating coastal warnings,
coastal hazards, sea surges and so forth.
(14:47):
And you'd expect the same thing to
happen, especially when you when you just
what you just mentioned is they had an
inspection and stuff.
And I feel as though, as you mentioned
earlier, how it's a different game than
it was even 30 years ago, even 10 years
ago, the atmosphere has changed.
And so I think that's a good thing.
Using the thousand year storms, hundred
year storms, 10 year storms may not be
(15:09):
appropriate at this point
because there's going to there.
We know they're going to be more frequent
and the atmosphere in itself, as you as
you described a lot in this podcast
episode is it's it's
thick and it's ready.
So and we're seeing a lot different and I
I said this a couple of years ago when
here in Ontario, we had flash flooding
(15:29):
and I said climate change is going to
expose the vulnerabilities of cities that
haven't done the
necessary adaptations and plans.
And this is not to because I don't want
to blame anybody, you know, especially
what's going on now is
people are still being rescued.
No, no, that's not what'sgoing on right now.
But this is going to change. You know, there's a lot of people that are really cognizant of that.
(15:50):
But unfortunately, when looking at people
like cities and towns and villages that
are dry right now, you know, that are
watching this, this is the lesson that
they have to take and being like we do
inspections, we do routes
and I think are these routes.
(16:13):
We look at the floodplains,
you know, we look at our people.
Should people be in there?
If they're in this area and they're
allowed to be in this area, do they have
the necessary equipment
and ability to get out?
You know, there's a lot of stuff that can
go on in an emergency, as you know.
And how many hours did it rise from five
or seven feet to 37 feet?
(16:35):
Yeah, estimates are
between one and two hours.
That's not a lot of time to get to get
out of the dodge,
especially to recognize.
Like I've seen some of the videos, Dave,
and you know, you worry
that what's true, what's not.
But, you know, it's not what you think in
terms of the rise, you know, you would
almost think that somebody's looking at
(16:55):
it and it's just rising
up, rising up, rising up.
It didn't really happen that way, right?
It was a gosh, like coming around the
corner, you just see this, this wave in a
river, which you're just
like, how does this happen?
And it's coming and rushing at you.
It's not just rising this way.
It's coming for you, you know, in that in
that kind of manner, which is devastating
(17:17):
and scary altogether.
And so it's, you know, when you think
about it and that rise, you think just
straight up, but it's coming at you and
up and that and it's coming out of big at
a pretty fast speed.
Yeah. And when you, you know, Andrew,
when you think about that water coming
down, let's just say it's moving at seven
(17:39):
miles per hour, which
is which is pretty fast.
Yeah. For water.
It exerts the same pressure on a person
as a category five hurricane. And then
when you make it 10, 20, 30 feet high,
it's off the charts.
(18:01):
Nothing can withstand the power of that
much water coming down. And when you
think about a thunderstorm, think about a
hilly area, the topography, all this rain
coming down along the river.
And when you think about it, you know,
all that water is running down along in
those hills. All that water is running
down towards the lowest spot.
And where it meets is where these rivers
(18:23):
are. That's why rivers are there. And
when they all come together, all that
water rushing over all those
hills down all those hills.
And when you think about it, you know,
how it's going to rise in that level.
Unreal. Now. So we now we know what
(18:45):
happened in terms of the
storm and and what it did.
Let's talk warning systems. Let's talk
how normally how are people warned about
these types of storms and and what is the
process that happens from what you see
because you kind of see a
little bit behind the scenes.
(19:06):
And so you know, you have a lot of people
in the environment at this point. You
know, you you have your own. You have you
have storms that are communications.
That's your CEO. That is
what you that's what you do.
You provide information to people online,
like through YouTube. And you also have
your own clients where you provide that
and provide more analysis and so forth.
But for people who are in a situation
like in, you know, Central Texas and Kerr
(19:29):
County, how were they getting their
updates and how is it
normally supposed to go?
And I have a question and one that's
going to be analyzed for a while. And
hopefully quick solutions will come up.
Most areas like Kerr County or in rural
areas around the country have a couple of
ways of getting warnings from the
(19:50):
National Weather Service. And the
National Weather Service, first of all,
is the official and authoritative voice
for issuing watches and warnings.
So I can't stand up as the CEO of Storm
Center Communications and say I'm issuing
a flash flood warning for this town.
(20:13):
Right. Right. I can't do that. Right.
What we do is we immediately pass on
those warnings and watches and advisories
from the National Weather Service.
And so there are there are two main ways
that they can get that information. One
is through the wireless emergency alert
system. It's called we are here in the
(20:34):
United States where the National Weather
Service issues a warning.
And you your phone will go on. You get
that emergency message that pops up when
(20:54):
you'll get that emergency message that
pops up if you haven't turned it off on
your phone. And if you have a signal and
you have you have connectivity.
Yeah. The other way which you can get
those warnings is through NOAA Weather
(21:16):
Radio. NOAA Weather Radio is a standalone
radio that has AMF and bands. As a matter
of fact, I actually
have one. It's right here.
This is the one I think you were showing
the other day on your social media. I saw
this. Yeah. So so this is what it looks
(21:37):
like. I don't know if you can see it.
Yeah. If you just move it over just a
little bit to your right, I believe.
There you go. Yeah. Perfect. Thank you. I
just unplug it. I don't have batteries in
this one, but I'll put the antenna down.
This is the NOAA Weather Radio. And you
can program it for the area in which you
live. You know, you go through a menu and
then you find out what what section
(21:58):
you're in, what state, what county and
then what sub region you're in.
And this radio is constantly monitoring
through radio signals when the Weather
Service issues an alert, whether it's a
watch or a warning. And there are lights
here right here. It says warning over
(22:19):
here. It says watch and those lights stay
lit while that's that is in effect.
And then all you have to do when you get
an alert is you hit this button and then
the National Weather Service computerized
voice comes across and says National
Weather Service has issued a flash flood
warning for Kerr County in Texas for the
(22:41):
Guadalupe River. It's rising rapidly and
then they give
instructions. Interesting. Okay.
So what we know is that in some areas
along the Guadalupe River, the cell
signal is terrible. So they don't have
great connectivity. But the other thing
(23:03):
that I do know is that NOAA Weather Radio
completely covers Kerr County.
So if everyone along the river had a no
weather radio, they would have had the
radios go off and alert them. Now that's
one part of the equation getting the
(23:25):
alert. The second part of the equation is
understanding the alert. So what was
communicated through no weather radio is
another thing to look at.
And we know because it's the same
information that's sent through the
Internet to all of our systems. You know,
I was seeing those warnings coming in and
(23:47):
you know, I could read them and it's
exactly what no weather radio was saying.
But then the other challenges was anybody monitoring a no weather radio when they had if they had a no weather radio and did they know what to do when they heard about that flash flood warning because I can certainly tell you that the flood warnings issued do not specifically identify all the camps and RV camp
(24:20):
that are on the ground along the river.
Right. Right. So maybe people are
listening to Oh, the mystic camp. They
didn't mention that. I don't know. Yeah,
because they didn't mention the specific
argument could be so many. There could be
so many. Yeah, you have to have
situational awareness for what a warning
means and how it applies to where you are
(24:44):
and where you're going to be spending
time. Right. And and so the the the other thing that I think that's really important is that the
other way in which you can get warnings
is you know, through other Internet
connected devices. Right. I mean, for
example, we developed a technology called
geo collaborate, which allows you to
(25:06):
collaborate across different platforms.
If there was a warning issued, then that
area would light up, you know, and then
you click on it and then you see what the
warning is. That's not the most proactive
way to get a warning.
And the provision to lipid scheme and theeffect and the awareness that
everybody has on Earth. And word ofPath
(25:40):
and to get you to check the warning out the other day, take alternative control. And that theasse messages that they cables may tell you that they have. If
it's like, we're going to make the messages on dimensional security room chorus spiritual or organizations and email.
These are the kind of
questions that we need to ask.
And, and you know, I mean, some people
have said to me, you know,
why are you looking at what, what needs
to happen now and all that stuff?
They're still looking for victims. And I
said, you know what? I,
(26:01):
from a meteorologist, from a
meteorologist perspective
that who does not live in
Texas, we're all grieving, right?
We're all grieving.
Even up here in Canada.
And, and that's right. People
around the world are grieving.
And we're all looking at
what can we do to help?
(26:22):
And we can't get down there and dig under
trees and try to move cars.
And there are a lot of people down there
doing that right now.
So the way in which we can do that is to
think about not
letting this happen again.
And what can we do?
What? How can we contribute to warning
(26:43):
systems, understanding
more, creating better
products, you know, and it really does in
many cases come down to
people believing the warning.
Right. I mean, we even saw this. We even
saw this with Hurricane Katrina where
(27:03):
people stayed even, you know,
when they were told to evacuate, you
know, they're always going to be people
who ignore the warnings,
ignore the evacuations.
They don't heed the dangers. Right.
Right. Right. And, and if you hear that
warning and you just turn it off because
you get a lot of warnings that never mean
(27:25):
anything, that's something that we have
to look at as meteorologists as the
National Weather Service.
What is it that they can do differently
to make this one seem above and beyond?
Yes. And make it a
little bit more urgent.
Yeah, a little bit more urgent. And
(27:45):
that's why the Weather Service came up
with flash flood emergency.
Right. Okay. Flash flood warnings, flash
flood warning for here,
flash flood warning for there.
But when there's a flash flood emergency,
their hope is that people will hear the
(28:05):
word emergency and listen closer to where
that impacts and then take action.
And that's exactly what a flash flood
emergency means. Yeah. And indeed, a
flash flood emergency was issued. Gotcha.
Now, when we know one thing to those two
is to remark, you know, as we discuss
(28:26):
what can be done in the future.
I also want to kind of like we're talking
we're focusing right now on Texas, but,
you know, not long after maybe like three
or four days after on July 8, we saw a
flash flood in New Mexico.
And, you know, you know, people,
unfortunately, people perished. Some
(28:47):
individuals are still missing. So this is
why like it could happen. We're in this.
We're in a situation right now. We're in
a time of year where in certain areas
where we're more vulnerable than others.
So even people who are understanding
what's happening over in Texas, over in
New Mexico, they're in somewhere else.
They may be like, maybe we should go get
a NOA radio, you know, or figure out how
(29:09):
to get that. Maybe we should start
looking more on our town or village or
our city's website and find out where the
evacuation routes are.
Or even talk to our council person or
government representative of like, what
do we do in this emergency? What is
actually an emergency that we should be
really looking out for? And I think it's
(29:29):
important to that. And that's why I want
to cover it in this episode because you
just never know when it's going to hit,
especially in a summer where we're
getting humidity all across North
America, where the rains
are going to start to come.
We've been having drought conditions. And
when those rains come, they come hard and
it could be it could be very dangerous.
(29:51):
And the situation with these with these
radios is the first time I've heard of
these radios that were still available.
Is this given out by by the local
governments or or like the government
initiatives or are these just purchased
at like your radio shack or Circuit City
or Best Buy or whatever.
Yeah. Yeah. You could. That's a great
question. And you can purchase these. You
(30:13):
can get on, you know, any online retailer
that sells this kind of stuff and order
them. OK. In many cases, state or county
governments will buy a
whole big lot of them. OK.
OK. Especially in areas that you really
need them. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I
(30:33):
remember speaking with a friend of mine
and colleague who is the spokesperson for
Midland Radio, which is a manufacturer of
no weather radios, said that in some
cases, areas or counties or towns who
decided. And I want to talk
(30:54):
about sirens as well. Right.
Who decided not to install sirens or to
take down their sirens and use that
budget to buy no weather radios and give
them to their OK. OK. Their citizens. So
it wasn't just the fact that they're just
taking it down because they don't want to
(31:15):
use them anymore. They're taking them
down, but replacing them with something
probably a little bit more with more
information like these no radios.
More information and a radio signal
reaches a lot further than a siren. True.
And, you know, many studies have happened
where, you know, sirens have been put in
places and unfortunately they're not made
to penetrate your house. Right.
(31:37):
So you may not hear a siren. You may be
watching TV. You may be having your
headphones on. You may be sleeping and
you don't hear the sirens. Now, people
who live close to the sirens are going to
hear them. But there have been instances
around the country where towns have
invested in these sirens. And, you know,
you're talking anywhere between 100 and
(31:59):
$500,000 a year. You know, you have to
pay for maintenance and,
you know, keeping the sirens.
You know, keeping them up, installing
them, you know, all that kind of stuff.
What else can you do with that money that
might give everybody an alert in their
own home and know whether radio is
certainly an option? Yeah.
(32:22):
What's interesting, too, is that you
think about radios. You know, when I grew
up, radio was a was a still pretty big
thing. You listen to it in your car. You
could listen to them at home.
You know, there was no iPhones or MP3s or
Internet even when I, you know, in the
80s when I was a kid. And so radios were
a pretty big thing. When my parents were
(32:44):
growing up, that's what they listened to.
That was their entertainment. So
everything was listened over the radio.
We have a lot of different technologies
nowadays in our homes, phones, wireless
internet, you know, TVs and so forth.
And those can go down. Power outages can
really go. The radio frequencies from
(33:05):
these radios really are powerful. Do you
think that even though it's so powerful,
people don't think they're as advanced
because they're, you know, from a
futuristic standpoint, they look like
they're old technology and some people
may not rely on them as much.
Do you think is it do you think there's
has has that ever come across your
(33:27):
conversations with the maybe lack of
uptake from from some communities? Yeah,
I really haven't heard that. You know,
the fact that it's a radio people might
not be interested in using it. They'd
rather, you know, have some AI bot
blanket their phone or
something, you know, right.
(33:47):
And the problem is that in many areas,
particularly very rural areas, there may
not be cellular signals. And if you don't
have a cellular signal, then you're
basically carrying a brick around in your
pocket. That's not going to tell you
anything. And the no weather radio does
(34:10):
penetrate much more of the
geography and people can get it.
Now, I do think that it's really an
awareness thing where people don't know
about no weather radio. It's been around
for more than 50 years. The it's being
(34:31):
threatened by cuts budget cuts. You know,
if the National Weather Service continues
to take budget cuts, they've been
protecting no weather radio for now.
But pretty soon, you know, if they keep
getting cut, that's going to be something
that they can't afford to maintain. So
then this so this and then when you mean
(34:52):
by that, sorry to interrupt when you when
you mean by that, it's not the people who
manufacture the actual radios.
It's a signal that goes out to the radios
to maintain that awareness. That's right.
Because because they used to have like
when no weather radio first started, they
installed all these antennas,
transmission antennas, yeah, around the
country for to broadcast the signals.
(35:16):
And then that got really expensive to
maintain. So they started leasing space
off of existing radio towers and towers
that that exist out there.
Well, I mean, that's like rent.
It keeps going up. And so they're
struggling with increased costs to
(35:36):
maintain the transmitter and to keep it
on the tower that they they have it on
now. Because when they issue from each
forecast office, when they issue the
warning and they that automatically
activates the signal that sets the no
weather radios off. Right.
So the weather service doesn't make the
(35:57):
no weather radios, but they provide the
content that's going to save your life.
Right. Which is if the most important,
right, is you've got the device, they
want to get you the information to go to
that device and get it.
I want to kind of just talk a little bit
about some of the stuff that's been said
over the last week or so in terms of what
(36:18):
may have happened, what may not have
happened. It sounds just from our
conversation that alerts went out.
But there could have been a lot of ways
that people didn't get alerts, lack of
cell service, lack of the technology like
the radio that would have it power
outages. So, you know, again, lack of
ability to get that that data to them or
those alerts to people.
(36:40):
We talk about cuts. We talk about the
cuts that were coming, the cuts that have
happened to the National Weather Service
to NOAA over the last couple of months
has been very quick. And I know things,
you know, things move slowly in
government. A lot of the times we know
National Weather
Service budget's been cut.
(37:06):
And I think that's a great question of
alerts not going out due to whatever
reason, whether they were cuts, whether
it was like a mistake, whether or is that
an investigation that that's got to
happen after where we
can get full answers?
Yeah, no, I mean, and that's that's a
that's a popular question, too. Yeah. Did
did the cuts impact the issuance of the
warning? Right now, there doesn't seem to
(37:27):
be a direct correlation between cuts and
the warning went out late.
Right. The National Weather Service
Office in New Braunfels in San Antonio,
they had extra meteorologists on staff
than they normally would. Okay. Because
(37:47):
of the possibility or the likelihood of
flooding happening. But where I do think
it could have made a difference. And, you
know, it can't be proven right now.
And that is that their warning
coordination meteorologist every office
(38:08):
has what they call a WCM a warning
coordination meteorologist and their job.
One of their jobs is to be the liaison
between the emergency managers and the
National Weather Service towns and the
National Weather Service and any other
organizations that, you know, have an
(38:30):
interest in getting warning information.
And so these warning coordination
meteorologists are just like every other
employee. They were offered the early
buyouts to retire as a as a point of
force reduction mandated, you know,
across the government.
(38:52):
And the warning coordination
meteorologist took an early retirement
about eight months ago and they have not
been replaced. And so, you know, my as a
meteorologist, I'm thinking, well, that
warning coordination meteorologist
(39:13):
between eight months ago and now could
have been visiting all those places
telling them about the
importance of the flood warnings.
Telling them the importance of, hey, we
can flood really quickly. Be ready. We're
going to issue these alerts. Would he
have done that? I don't know. But the job
of the WCM is to be that liaison and to
(39:36):
make sure the emergency management
community understands
how the process works.
The other thing I don't know is the
people that this warning coordination
meteorologist was had such great
relationships with. Did any of them
change in the last eight months? And if
any of those changed in the last eight
(39:57):
months, were they getting any instruction
for what those warnings mean and how
should they act? Should they hear it?
What kind of connectivity back to the
weather service?
Because there is a channel.
There's a feedback channel. It's called
NWS Chat. Right. Where the emergency
managers and media can be in a direct
(40:20):
chat with meteorologists at the weather
service. Right. You know, what kind of
activity was going on there?
That's more to issue even more warnings
to the public to even like help boost the
information getting out. Is that it?
Well, I think more up to date warnings
were about not issuing more warnings. But
what do you do when you receive this
(40:42):
warning? Ah, OK. Gotcha. So so more
helpful tips and stuff. Yeah, there's a
there's a flood flash flood emergency.
We're issuing that should have made every
emergency manager and every police
officer get up and go down to that riverbank to try to get out.
Right. Yeah. Yeah. They know that, you
(41:02):
know, so there's an education behind that
as well. And I just wanted to mention,
too, that and I haven't been able to
confirm it, but I've seen it in some
media reports. And I know that those
specific media get multiple. They have to
get multiple confirmations before they
report it. And that is, is that Kerr
County had the option or an opportunity
(41:23):
to install a siren system
along the Guadalupe River.
Where this flood happened back in 2016 or
2017 and they refused to do it. Why? I
don't know. I didn't see the study that
was done to say it's not worth it or
(41:45):
whatever. I have heard officials say that
installing an alert system is expensive.
And so that just leads you to answer that question.
Well, what's expensive and at what price?
Yeah, well, it was a priority here.
(42:05):
Something is more expensive. And what did
you buy with that money that could have
been that could have put in an alerting
system. So I'm sure I will guarantee it
1000% that there's going to be a lot of
pressure to get some sort of alerting system.
I personally think throughout the country
(42:29):
that this flood will lead to some sort of
major change in the way that flood
warnings are issued and consumed. And the
question is going to be how long will
that take? And, you know, I mean, Andrew,
we're talking about this flood.
It happened less than a week ago or a
(42:55):
week ago actually today. And six months
down the road, will anybody
be thinking of flash flooding?
Well, and you're right. And I think it's
important. This is, we had this, like I
mentioned, we had flash flooding, not as
bad obviously, but it was pretty bad. But
(43:16):
nobody followed up. I had it in my neighborhood in Pittsburgh.
I had it in my neighborhood and certain
parts of my neighborhood. And I followed
up with the people happened twice in in
in a year, less than a year. And then
because there weren't any fatalities,
thank God, and knock on
whether it doesn't happen.
People's places, properties got damaged
and and it happened twice. So they had to
put in two insurance claims now that
(43:37):
people are concerned that over time, like
those insurance is going to go up or not
covered. And and no, but nobody followed
up with the region,
with the city government.
They were just worried about their own,
you know, insurance costs. And just to
your to your point of in six months from
now, is this going to be kind of washed
(43:58):
aside and no pun intended, of course. And
people aren't just are
just going to forget about it.
Assuming that it's going to be dealt
with, you know, that the people that they
voted into power to say, Hey, you know
what, we need to we need to deal with
this, we need to put in this iron system,
because obviously, it would have helped.
We didn't do it the first time. This is
our chance to do it. But people, I feel
(44:19):
that they need to follow up.
They need to continue, especially if
you're in an area that's vulnerable and
you may or may not be able to move out of
that area or you want to continue to stay
in that area. I feel like you almost have
to have like put committees together,
citizen committees to make
sure that that that's followed up.
It's so important to do that. And I
think, you know, in Kerr County, Texas, I
(44:40):
don't think they'll ever forget when you
get outside of Texas and around the
country, there are probably.
you know, Kerr County, Texas tomorrow.
And will people see this as a reason to
(45:06):
make them move faster in getting alert
systems or understanding what's
available, putting things in place,
getting meteorologists in to talk to them about what's going on in the world.
And I think that's something that we're going to have to do tomake sure that we have the right resources to be able to
take the risk and what their risk
tolerance is, because communities could
come together and say, you know what?
(45:26):
We want to. And this is something they
don't do today, but could be in the
future where communities work together to
say, okay, this is our risk tolerance.
Instead of the government coming in
saying we're going to issue a warning
(45:48):
because we think this is what it should
be. Yeah. If you get more community
involvement and buy in from people as to
what you're trying to do, I think you'll
get more longevity in people thinking
about it and feeling more comfortable
with the risk that
that they're undertaking.
(46:09):
I agree. I agree completely. That
feedback mechanism is so important
because that's what makes a community.
That's not just don't just let government
make all the decisions, but be involved
in the government and be involved with
what happens around your town city.
Obviously, you know, not not trying to
blame on anybody in this situation. This
is devastating. You know, our hearts go
(46:32):
out to all the people affected who have
lost their loved ones and are still
looking for those. It
must be a horrible situation.
We don't want to see this situation
happen again ever, you know, and to
protect that we know the ways I think
this also speaks to a couple of things.
(46:52):
One that we need to invest in these
monetarily as well
funding wise into these systems.
They're not cheap for a lot of times, but
they are effective when they're in. They
can save a lot of people's lives. So I
think that's that's important. I think
also the fact that, you know, we we
pretty much went through this this
episode without really talking about
(47:12):
climate change too much.
And we didn't have to because flooding is
enough. Like we know the risks of
flooding. We know it's being it's made
worse by climate change, but people see
this and this is a danger and like an
extreme danger to people immediately. And
this needs to be fixed.
And so there's a lot of things that we
can do in the short term and in the long
(47:33):
term to ensure that we can predict these
things a little bit faster just from a
you know, where it doesn't just sneak up
on us and also making sure that we have
connectivity so that people can get
alerts and all the
different ways of getting alerts.
You know, as far as I'm concerned, like
if you're in one of those areas,
everybody should be given a radio, you
(47:54):
know, like that should come to the house
or apartment or anything, right?
I agree. And you know, another important
thing is is because we're in a new
paradigm and you're right. We don't have
to talk about climate change. All we have
to talk about is there's more moisture in
the atmosphere. And yes, the atmosphere
is warmer. So you're adding more
ingredients to create
(48:15):
floods in many more locations.
And we also want to make sure that people
understand we are in that new paradigm.
So forecasts of flash flooding are going
to be more numerous. We're going to talk
(48:35):
about that a little bit more and that
that we need the research, right?
We need research in science to understand
how the atmosphere is transforming and
how fast it's transforming because that
(48:55):
one in one thousand year flood that
everybody's talking about may become a
one in 10 year flood at that magnitude.
But then 10 years from now, it may become
a one in two year flood. Yeah. And so if
that happens, that has to change
(49:16):
everyone's planning for community
development, urbanization,
planning, storm drain size.
What kind of what kind of modifications
are cities and towns going to need to to
manage that kind of rainfall? Absolutely.
(49:39):
You said it perfectly. I think it's
funding needs to go in that and that can
be costly, but it's necessary.
And I think a lot of times it gets passed
up and it's deemed unnecessary for
whatever reason, whether it's political,
whether it's it's budgetary. But you're
right. We do need to understand our
system more. We are in an ever changing
(50:00):
world more than ever.
And we need to we need to have a better
understanding of how we can adapt to it
and change it. So that hopefully that's
why research needs to be funded.
Absolutely. Absolutely.
David, I want to thank you so much for
spending some time with me today. I know
you're busy. I appreciate all the work
you do and all the work your colleagues
(50:20):
do and appreciate you coming here and
giving information to our audience, you
know, sifting through all the stuff on
the news and being able to provide us
with ways people get alerts as well as
ways they can get alerts and how they can
get in the future if they need it.
So if everybody can go out and get your
NOAA watch radio, go out and get it
because it's very important to do so.
(50:43):
I'll put it if I can find some links.
I'll put a link if you can if you can
purchase it online or something. So
again, Dave, thank you so
much. We really do appreciate it.
Great. Thank you, Andrew. Thanks for
having me. No problem.
Thank you, Dave, for joining us on
today's episode of the How to Protect the
Ocean podcast and providing us all that
information. A lot of the stuff I didn't
know about and I thought it was really
(51:03):
interesting to find out, you know, after
all this gets sorted investigations
happen, people get to mourn their loss,
people get to understand what happened
and what they can do in the future.
I hope that there are critical and
constructive conversations from a
government level and community levels
with their governments in order to better
(51:25):
protect themselves. Forget the political
side of everything. Forget the two sides
to every political aisle. Forget the
climate change political aspect. Let's
protect people. Let's make sure that we can be safe in our own communities, you know, whether in the US, whether you're in Canada, whether you're in Europe, whether you're in the US, whether you're in Canada, whether you're in Europe.
It doesn't matter. We want to make sure
(51:45):
that we're protected and governments and
communities need to come together to be
able to ensure that these are protected.
This has nothing to do with political
affiliations. This has to do with
protecting people, with protecting
children. You know, 27 children were
killed because they were at a camp that
were on the Guadalupe River and that is unacceptable. That cannot happen again. And we need to protect the people.
And that is unacceptable. That cannot
(52:06):
happen again. And we need to better
prepare for these types of storms, not
only from just a receiving and providing
alerts, but also the infrastructure of
where things can be built, where things
can go in the future. And I think that's
really important discussions to have in
the future, even in my community up here
in Canada, in Burlington, Ontario.
So I want to thank you everybody for
(52:28):
joining us today. I'd love to hear your
feedback and leave a comment on the
YouTube channel if you're watching this
on YouTube, or if you're listening to
this on your favorite podcast app, you
can hit me up on my website,
speakupforblue.com forward slash contact,
leave me an email. If you have any
questions for myself or
Dave, I'll pass it on to him.
It goes right to my personal email, or
you can hit me up on Instagram at how to
(52:49):
protect the ocean. It's at how to protect
the ocean. Just DM me. I want to thank
you so much for joining us on today's
episode of the how to protect the ocean
podcast. I'm your host, Andrew Lewin from
the true North strong and free. Have a
good day. We'll talk to you
next time and happy conservation.
A few places in the US have
undergone extreme flooding.
Kerr County, Texas, and New Mexico,
Reduso from July 4th to July
8th, have had flash flooding.
Many people have died,
people are still missing.
And conversations are
happening, what happened?
Were people alerted?
How did those alerts go out?
How were they received
(00:21):
if they were received?
And how are people building
infrastructure around rivers
where there's been flooding in the past?
I wanted to make sure
that you as the audience
for the How to Protect the Ocean podcast
understood some of the
conversations that are going on.
There's a lot going on in the news.
A lot of people are
making it very political
(00:41):
because of the cuts that happened
over the last couple
months in the US federally.
And I wanted to kind of
sift through all that, right?
Really sift through the BS to
say, what actually happened?
Did the cuts get,
affect the messaging system?
Did the cuts affect the ability
for the message to get out there?
Or was it just a fact that this was a
very bad circumstance caused by more
(01:04):
moisture in the air?
And a confluence of storms and clouds
with moisture and just bad circumstances?
Or is it all of the above?
To the bottom of that, I
wanted to get some answers.
And Dave Jones, the CEO of Storm Center
has come on the podcast
before to talk about storms
and alert systems and weather.
And he's a meteorologist
(01:25):
for a very, very long time.
He's a good friend of the podcast.
And he graciously accepted to come on the
podcast and talk about how
the messaging system went out,
how it could be better done in the future
and what needs to be done so that we can
alert more people
faster and they can get out.
And they can have all the information for
them, plus the feedback systems that
happen and what needs
(01:45):
to happen in the future.
Before we go on with the podcast, you
know, I want to be sensitive to the fact
that people have had
their lives just, you know,
it's been awful for people.
It's been a huge tragedy.
I want to acknowledge that.
The reason why I'm putting this podcast
out now is because as the Central Texas
(02:05):
and Kerr County floods were
happening in the river there,
another flood happened in New Mexico.
So these floods are happening.
We're at a time of year where there's a
lot of moisture in the air because of
humidity and it's the summer.
So I want to make sure that people, if
they can have the
ability to get the right,
know whether radios or whatever they
need, they will have it and that they'll
(02:26):
be on alert and they understand the
impacts of these dangerous situations.
So hence why I'm putting it out now is to
be cognizant of that and to
help people in the near future.
So here's the episode.
Let's start the show.
Everybody, welcome back to another
episode of the How to
Protect the Ocean podcast.
I am your host, Andrew Lewin.
(02:46):
This is the podcast where you find out
what's happening with the ocean, how you
can speak up for the ocean,
what you can do to live for a better
ocean by taking action.
On today's episode, it's
a bit of a somber note.
We are talking about the flash floods
that happened in Kerr County in Texas, as
well as in New Mexico.
People have lost their lives.
People are still missing.
The rescue efforts are ongoing.
(03:07):
I want to have Dave Jones on to talk
about what went on during the storm.
How are people alerted in these areas
that are more vulnerable to flash floods
and what can we do
about it in the future?
And for those communities that are in a
similar situation that haven't had floods
yet, but might have them in the future,
what they can do and how they can better
(03:28):
prepare themselves in the future so that
this doesn't happen in
their county, in their town.
So I want to have Dave
Jones on to discuss this.
He's been on the podcast before.
He's been a
meteorologist for a long, long time.
He's the CEO of Storm Center right now,
which provides extra coverage of the
weather to his clients, but also
(03:49):
as a YouTube channel, which I'll link in
the show notes where you can get updated
live updates a lot of the times on
hurricanes, on storms and so forth.
And you can better protect
yourself and better be alerted.
So he helps amplify the messages.
He doesn't put up the messages, but he
helps amplify the messages coming up from
the National Weather Service and NOAA.
He does a damn good job at it.
(04:09):
So he was gracious enough to take time
away from the work that he's doing to
help educate myself, as well as everybody
here that's listening to this podcast and
watching this podcast.
In order to better protect
themselves wherever you live.
You know, I live here in Canada, watching
this from Canada is awful.
We've seen this happen in our country,
but to watch it anywhere around the world
and see people in pain and have to
(04:31):
undergo this tragedy, a
tragedy is just awful.
And, you know, our hearts go out to
everybody and the families
who are going through this.
But I wanted to make sure that we had the
education here so that we can protect
ourselves in the future.
So without further ado, here is Dave
Jones talking about the flash floods that
happened in Texas and New Mexico, how we
can better prepare ourselves and how the
(04:52):
system works and how it can work even
better in the future.
Enjoy and I'll talk to you after.
Hey, Dave, welcome back to the How to
Protect the Ocean podcast.
Are you ready to talk about some flooding
that's happening in the US right now?
Unfortunately, I'm ready.
Yeah, it's it's you know, when I when I
want to when I contacted you to come on
the podcast, I was
like, he's going to be busy.
(05:13):
He's going to be tired, you know, just
not only mentally and
physically, but emotionally.
And I mean, there are some big tragedies
happening in Texas, in New Mexico.
There are over 120 people that have
confirmed that have died in
these flash floods in Texas.
There's there's about four individuals
that are missing, three people killed,
including two children in New Mexico.
(05:35):
Horrendous, horrendous
flooding, horrendous tragedy.
And of course, people are still missing.
And this is and this is
what we wanted to avoid.
We always want to avoid
this type of stuff we talk.
And in this as as everything is
developing and as still people are trying
to be found and rescuers are doing their
best and and and braving the elements to
(05:57):
get out there in very difficult
situations or very dangerous situations
to rescue and find some
of these missing people.
You know, there's some blame and a lot of
stuff being thrown back and forth.
And unfortunately, a lot of it's
political, you know, a lot of doge cuts
that we talked about on the last podcast,
you know, from NOAA, the National Weather
(06:17):
Service, what we were afraid of.
But it seems like a lot of political
stuff is like, let's blame one side,
let's blame the other side.
I want to strip away that Dave today.
And I want to kind of just talk about the
process of what is supposed to happen.
And if that happened during this, like
the early warning systems, making sure
people were safe or they knew about these
(06:38):
types of storms and these types of
floods, how these floods occurred.
And maybe we'll start
off with that, Dave.
Can you just talk, because, you know,
you've got you've got the knowledge on
this way more than I do.
Can you just let the audience know, like,
what happened in the first place?
How did these floods happen?
Well, I mean, you know,
it's a great question.
And we always look back.
Of course, we can see things developing
(07:00):
in the future, but we can't tell, you
know, days and days and days ahead of
time, how much rain is going to fall in a
certain watershed or over a certain town.
That is really an elusive
thing as far as forecasting goes.
But we can see the conditions coming
together that will
(07:20):
result in flooding somewhere.
And that's what happened, Andrew, over
the last, you know, several days, even
before July 4th and the
terrible flood happened.
We had a lot of
moisture that was in the air.
And typically there's, you know, there's
a give and take for
moisture and dry air over Texas.
(07:43):
And we had a landfalling tropical storm
in Mexico several days before that.
That was kind of, you
know, rained out in Mexico.
But that circulation stayed there and it
brought with it when it moved
over Texas, even more moisture.
And so, you know, you and I might notice
(08:04):
it as boy, it's really humid out today.
Yeah, got a lot more
humid than yesterday.
It doesn't mean that that remnants of
that system was bringing any rain itself
or bringing any thunderstorms, but it was
bringing the moisture.
And at the same time, there was a
circulation around a high pressure system
(08:24):
that was off the southeast coast of the
United States that was bringing in more
moisture from the Gulf.
And that happens very
frequently in Texas.
So you have those two
things that are coming together.
And then you had a little disturbance in
the atmosphere that was leading to the
(08:45):
development of
thunderstorms in South Central Texas.
And when you don't have a lot of steering
currents, but you have a lot of moisture
and you get thunderstorms to develop, you
get thunderstorms that
develop and don't move very quickly.
There is no real push to
get them out of the way.
(09:05):
And so when those thunderstorms develop,
they tap into that very
thick layer of tropical moisture.
It's continuing to be fed by moisture
coming in off of the Gulf around the
circulation around a
high pressure system.
And those thunderstorms
just kind of sit there.
(09:25):
And that's what happened over Kerr County
in Texas and just north of Kerr County.
These thunderstorms formed
and they just kept reforming.
We call it training when all move over
the same place at the same time.
And that is the
recipe for flash flooding.
(09:46):
So when you think about that, you think
about that moisture and the storms going
and all that stuff, you
think, well, what about absorption?
Can't the land absorb
that rain coming down?
And the hill country of South Central
Texas is very much thin
soil and a lot of rock.
(10:10):
And it's it's very hard there.
And so they had been in a drought for a
long period of time.
So you have very hard soil.
You have not very thick soil for
absorbing any kind of rain and, you know,
nothing's going to absorb 12 to 15 to
(10:31):
perhaps 20 inches of rain
over a several hour period.
That rain has to go somewhere and it
drains right down into the watershed and
into the local river.
In this case, the Guadalupe River, which
surged more than 30 feet as unreal.
(10:51):
All that rain fell.
Now, you know, we we talk about storms
that happen like this and you know, you
mentioned how this just seemed to be this
time as coincidence in a way where all
these systems are kind of
converging in one place.
You have over an area where you have, you
know, a lot of rock.
(11:11):
And so the absorption of the soil and
thin soil, not a lot of
absorption is going to happen.
This seems to be just a case of bad luck.
But we know we talk about when we do.
I've done this in the past
when I did private consulting.
We talk about 100 year storms, which are
really bad storms, 50 year storms, 10
year storms and all these
different types of storms.
And, you know, engineers and planners,
(11:33):
they build and they plan for these types
of storms to happen every so often.
So these hundred year storms, these 10
year storms for a storm like this, I know
it might be early to
say, do we know what?
What kind of category these storms have?
Like, has this happened before in these
areas where similar
consequences or similar results?
(11:54):
They have. And in Kerr County and along
the Guadalupe River, they've had several
major floods over the
course of the last hundred years.
And, you know, I hear in the media, I
hear other people saying, oh, my gosh,
this was a one in a thousand year event.
Well, I've always been an advocate to
(12:16):
say, let's throw that out the window.
Right. Let's stop talking about one in a
thousand year event.
Let's talk a lot, not talk about one in a
hundred year event because we are living
in a different paradigm as far as the
atmosphere is concerned.
It is basically
turbocharged with heat and moisture.
(12:40):
And so we can't look at past events and
say, oh, this is not
going to happen again.
Anybody that says that this flood that
just happened isn't going to happen for
another two to five
hundred years is not accurate.
And we're going to see more of these kind
of floods happening not just in the
(13:01):
United States, but in many countries
around the world because we have that
much more moisture in the atmosphere.
And so, yes, they've had floods there.
Many of the structures that were washed
away were in flood zones.
Some areas, including the Mystic Cabin
(13:22):
retreat area was in
an extreme flood zone.
Who knows how they
were able to build there.
And they also apparently had an emergency
plan and had an inspection two days
before this happened and
(13:43):
passed that inspection.
So I don't know what the
inspection was for. Right.
But it's certainly opening up a lot of
questions to what the people do,
especially if they're taking money and
taking and housing people and having
activities in a dangerous
(14:04):
area when it could flood.
What are the plans that were in place?
I'd love to see those emergency plans and
I'd love to see what is the history.
I'm starting to get information from
several colleagues around what is the
(14:24):
information in the past as to why they
didn't have warning
systems in place in that area.
Yeah. You know, it's interesting.
When we look at the coastal areas all
around the world, they're
always updating tsunami warnings.
They're also updating coastal warnings,
coastal hazards, sea surges and so forth.
(14:47):
And you'd expect the same thing to
happen, especially when you when you just
what you just mentioned is they had an
inspection and stuff.
And I feel as though, as you mentioned
earlier, how it's a different game than
it was even 30 years ago, even 10 years
ago, the atmosphere has changed.
And so I think that's a good thing.
Using the thousand year storms, hundred
year storms, 10 year storms may not be
(15:09):
appropriate at this point
because there's going to there.
We know they're going to be more frequent
and the atmosphere in itself, as you as
you described a lot in this podcast
episode is it's it's
thick and it's ready.
So and we're seeing a lot different and I
I said this a couple of years ago when
here in Ontario, we had flash flooding
(15:29):
and I said climate change is going to
expose the vulnerabilities of cities that
haven't done the
necessary adaptations and plans.
And this is not to because I don't want
to blame anybody, you know, especially
what's going on now is
people are still being rescued.
No, no, that's not what'sgoing on right now.
But this is going to change. You know, there's a lot of people that are really cognizant of that.
(15:50):
But unfortunately, when looking at people
like cities and towns and villages that
are dry right now, you know, that are
watching this, this is the lesson that
they have to take and being like we do
inspections, we do routes
and I think are these routes.
(16:13):
We look at the floodplains,
you know, we look at our people.
Should people be in there?
If they're in this area and they're
allowed to be in this area, do they have
the necessary equipment
and ability to get out?
You know, there's a lot of stuff that can
go on in an emergency, as you know.
And how many hours did it rise from five
or seven feet to 37 feet?
(16:35):
Yeah, estimates are
between one and two hours.
That's not a lot of time to get to get
out of the dodge,
especially to recognize.
Like I've seen some of the videos, Dave,
and you know, you worry
that what's true, what's not.
But, you know, it's not what you think in
terms of the rise, you know, you would
almost think that somebody's looking at
(16:55):
it and it's just rising
up, rising up, rising up.
It didn't really happen that way, right?
It was a gosh, like coming around the
corner, you just see this, this wave in a
river, which you're just
like, how does this happen?
And it's coming and rushing at you.
It's not just rising this way.
It's coming for you, you know, in that in
that kind of manner, which is devastating
(17:17):
and scary altogether.
And so it's, you know, when you think
about it and that rise, you think just
straight up, but it's coming at you and
up and that and it's coming out of big at
a pretty fast speed.
Yeah. And when you, you know, Andrew,
when you think about that water coming
down, let's just say it's moving at seven
(17:39):
miles per hour, which
is which is pretty fast.
Yeah. For water.
It exerts the same pressure on a person
as a category five hurricane. And then
when you make it 10, 20, 30 feet high,
it's off the charts.
(18:01):
Nothing can withstand the power of that
much water coming down. And when you
think about a thunderstorm, think about a
hilly area, the topography, all this rain
coming down along the river.
And when you think about it, you know,
all that water is running down along in
those hills. All that water is running
down towards the lowest spot.
And where it meets is where these rivers
(18:23):
are. That's why rivers are there. And
when they all come together, all that
water rushing over all those
hills down all those hills.
And when you think about it, you know,
how it's going to rise in that level.
Unreal. Now. So we now we know what
(18:45):
happened in terms of the
storm and and what it did.
Let's talk warning systems. Let's talk
how normally how are people warned about
these types of storms and and what is the
process that happens from what you see
because you kind of see a
little bit behind the scenes.
(19:06):
And so you know, you have a lot of people
in the environment at this point. You
know, you you have your own. You have you
have storms that are communications.
That's your CEO. That is
what you that's what you do.
You provide information to people online,
like through YouTube. And you also have
your own clients where you provide that
and provide more analysis and so forth.
But for people who are in a situation
like in, you know, Central Texas and Kerr
(19:29):
County, how were they getting their
updates and how is it
normally supposed to go?
And I have a question and one that's
going to be analyzed for a while. And
hopefully quick solutions will come up.
Most areas like Kerr County or in rural
areas around the country have a couple of
ways of getting warnings from the
(19:50):
National Weather Service. And the
National Weather Service, first of all,
is the official and authoritative voice
for issuing watches and warnings.
So I can't stand up as the CEO of Storm
Center Communications and say I'm issuing
a flash flood warning for this town.
(20:13):
Right. Right. I can't do that. Right.
What we do is we immediately pass on
those warnings and watches and advisories
from the National Weather Service.
And so there are there are two main ways
that they can get that information. One
is through the wireless emergency alert
system. It's called we are here in the
(20:34):
United States where the National Weather
Service issues a warning.
And you your phone will go on. You get
that emergency message that pops up when
(20:54):
you'll get that emergency message that
pops up if you haven't turned it off on
your phone. And if you have a signal and
you have you have connectivity.
Yeah. The other way which you can get
those warnings is through NOAA Weather
(21:16):
Radio. NOAA Weather Radio is a standalone
radio that has AMF and bands. As a matter
of fact, I actually
have one. It's right here.
This is the one I think you were showing
the other day on your social media. I saw
this. Yeah. So so this is what it looks
(21:37):
like. I don't know if you can see it.
Yeah. If you just move it over just a
little bit to your right, I believe.
There you go. Yeah. Perfect. Thank you. I
just unplug it. I don't have batteries in
this one, but I'll put the antenna down.
This is the NOAA Weather Radio. And you
can program it for the area in which you
live. You know, you go through a menu and
then you find out what what section
(21:58):
you're in, what state, what county and
then what sub region you're in.
And this radio is constantly monitoring
through radio signals when the Weather
Service issues an alert, whether it's a
watch or a warning. And there are lights
here right here. It says warning over
(22:19):
here. It says watch and those lights stay
lit while that's that is in effect.
And then all you have to do when you get
an alert is you hit this button and then
the National Weather Service computerized
voice comes across and says National
Weather Service has issued a flash flood
warning for Kerr County in Texas for the
(22:41):
Guadalupe River. It's rising rapidly and
then they give
instructions. Interesting. Okay.
So what we know is that in some areas
along the Guadalupe River, the cell
signal is terrible. So they don't have
great connectivity. But the other thing
(23:03):
that I do know is that NOAA Weather Radio
completely covers Kerr County.
So if everyone along the river had a no
weather radio, they would have had the
radios go off and alert them. Now that's
one part of the equation getting the
(23:25):
alert. The second part of the equation is
understanding the alert. So what was
communicated through no weather radio is
another thing to look at.
And we know because it's the same
information that's sent through the
Internet to all of our systems. You know,
I was seeing those warnings coming in and
(23:47):
you know, I could read them and it's
exactly what no weather radio was saying.
But then the other challenges was anybody monitoring a no weather radio when they had if they had a no weather radio and did they know what to do when they heard about that flash flood warning because I can certainly tell you that the flood warnings issued do not specifically identify all the camps and RV camp
(24:20):
that are on the ground along the river.
Right. Right. So maybe people are
listening to Oh, the mystic camp. They
didn't mention that. I don't know. Yeah,
because they didn't mention the specific
argument could be so many. There could be
so many. Yeah, you have to have
situational awareness for what a warning
means and how it applies to where you are
(24:44):
and where you're going to be spending
time. Right. And and so the the the other thing that I think that's really important is that the
other way in which you can get warnings
is you know, through other Internet
connected devices. Right. I mean, for
example, we developed a technology called
geo collaborate, which allows you to
(25:06):
collaborate across different platforms.
If there was a warning issued, then that
area would light up, you know, and then
you click on it and then you see what the
warning is. That's not the most proactive
way to get a warning.
And the provision to lipid scheme and theeffect and the awareness that
everybody has on Earth. And word ofPath
(25:40):
and to get you to check the warning out the other day, take alternative control. And that theasse messages that they cables may tell you that they have. If
it's like, we're going to make the messages on dimensional security room chorus spiritual or organizations and email.
These are the kind of
questions that we need to ask.
And, and you know, I mean, some people
have said to me, you know,
why are you looking at what, what needs
to happen now and all that stuff?
They're still looking for victims. And I
said, you know what? I,
(26:01):
from a meteorologist, from a
meteorologist perspective
that who does not live in
Texas, we're all grieving, right?
We're all grieving.
Even up here in Canada.
And, and that's right. People
around the world are grieving.
And we're all looking at
what can we do to help?
(26:22):
And we can't get down there and dig under
trees and try to move cars.
And there are a lot of people down there
doing that right now.
So the way in which we can do that is to
think about not
letting this happen again.
And what can we do?
What? How can we contribute to warning
(26:43):
systems, understanding
more, creating better
products, you know, and it really does in
many cases come down to
people believing the warning.
Right. I mean, we even saw this. We even
saw this with Hurricane Katrina where
(27:03):
people stayed even, you know,
when they were told to evacuate, you
know, they're always going to be people
who ignore the warnings,
ignore the evacuations.
They don't heed the dangers. Right.
Right. Right. And, and if you hear that
warning and you just turn it off because
you get a lot of warnings that never mean
(27:25):
anything, that's something that we have
to look at as meteorologists as the
National Weather Service.
What is it that they can do differently
to make this one seem above and beyond?
Yes. And make it a
little bit more urgent.
Yeah, a little bit more urgent. And
(27:45):
that's why the Weather Service came up
with flash flood emergency.
Right. Okay. Flash flood warnings, flash
flood warning for here,
flash flood warning for there.
But when there's a flash flood emergency,
their hope is that people will hear the
(28:05):
word emergency and listen closer to where
that impacts and then take action.
And that's exactly what a flash flood
emergency means. Yeah. And indeed, a
flash flood emergency was issued. Gotcha.
Now, when we know one thing to those two
is to remark, you know, as we discuss
(28:26):
what can be done in the future.
I also want to kind of like we're talking
we're focusing right now on Texas, but,
you know, not long after maybe like three
or four days after on July 8, we saw a
flash flood in New Mexico.
And, you know, you know, people,
unfortunately, people perished. Some
(28:47):
individuals are still missing. So this is
why like it could happen. We're in this.
We're in a situation right now. We're in
a time of year where in certain areas
where we're more vulnerable than others.
So even people who are understanding
what's happening over in Texas, over in
New Mexico, they're in somewhere else.
They may be like, maybe we should go get
a NOA radio, you know, or figure out how
(29:09):
to get that. Maybe we should start
looking more on our town or village or
our city's website and find out where the
evacuation routes are.
Or even talk to our council person or
government representative of like, what
do we do in this emergency? What is
actually an emergency that we should be
really looking out for? And I think it's
(29:29):
important to that. And that's why I want
to cover it in this episode because you
just never know when it's going to hit,
especially in a summer where we're
getting humidity all across North
America, where the rains
are going to start to come.
We've been having drought conditions. And
when those rains come, they come hard and
it could be it could be very dangerous.
(29:51):
And the situation with these with these
radios is the first time I've heard of
these radios that were still available.
Is this given out by by the local
governments or or like the government
initiatives or are these just purchased
at like your radio shack or Circuit City
or Best Buy or whatever.
Yeah. Yeah. You could. That's a great
question. And you can purchase these. You
(30:13):
can get on, you know, any online retailer
that sells this kind of stuff and order
them. OK. In many cases, state or county
governments will buy a
whole big lot of them. OK.
OK. Especially in areas that you really
need them. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I
(30:33):
remember speaking with a friend of mine
and colleague who is the spokesperson for
Midland Radio, which is a manufacturer of
no weather radios, said that in some
cases, areas or counties or towns who
decided. And I want to talk
(30:54):
about sirens as well. Right.
Who decided not to install sirens or to
take down their sirens and use that
budget to buy no weather radios and give
them to their OK. OK. Their citizens. So
it wasn't just the fact that they're just
taking it down because they don't want to
(31:15):
use them anymore. They're taking them
down, but replacing them with something
probably a little bit more with more
information like these no radios.
More information and a radio signal
reaches a lot further than a siren. True.
And, you know, many studies have happened
where, you know, sirens have been put in
places and unfortunately they're not made
to penetrate your house. Right.
(31:37):
So you may not hear a siren. You may be
watching TV. You may be having your
headphones on. You may be sleeping and
you don't hear the sirens. Now, people
who live close to the sirens are going to
hear them. But there have been instances
around the country where towns have
invested in these sirens. And, you know,
you're talking anywhere between 100 and
(31:59):
$500,000 a year. You know, you have to
pay for maintenance and,
you know, keeping the sirens.
You know, keeping them up, installing
them, you know, all that kind of stuff.
What else can you do with that money that
might give everybody an alert in their
own home and know whether radio is
certainly an option? Yeah.
(32:22):
What's interesting, too, is that you
think about radios. You know, when I grew
up, radio was a was a still pretty big
thing. You listen to it in your car. You
could listen to them at home.
You know, there was no iPhones or MP3s or
Internet even when I, you know, in the
80s when I was a kid. And so radios were
a pretty big thing. When my parents were
(32:44):
growing up, that's what they listened to.
That was their entertainment. So
everything was listened over the radio.
We have a lot of different technologies
nowadays in our homes, phones, wireless
internet, you know, TVs and so forth.
And those can go down. Power outages can
really go. The radio frequencies from
(33:05):
these radios really are powerful. Do you
think that even though it's so powerful,
people don't think they're as advanced
because they're, you know, from a
futuristic standpoint, they look like
they're old technology and some people
may not rely on them as much.
Do you think is it do you think there's
has has that ever come across your
(33:27):
conversations with the maybe lack of
uptake from from some communities? Yeah,
I really haven't heard that. You know,
the fact that it's a radio people might
not be interested in using it. They'd
rather, you know, have some AI bot
blanket their phone or
something, you know, right.
(33:47):
And the problem is that in many areas,
particularly very rural areas, there may
not be cellular signals. And if you don't
have a cellular signal, then you're
basically carrying a brick around in your
pocket. That's not going to tell you
anything. And the no weather radio does
(34:10):
penetrate much more of the
geography and people can get it.
Now, I do think that it's really an
awareness thing where people don't know
about no weather radio. It's been around
for more than 50 years. The it's being
(34:31):
threatened by cuts budget cuts. You know,
if the National Weather Service continues
to take budget cuts, they've been
protecting no weather radio for now.
But pretty soon, you know, if they keep
getting cut, that's going to be something
that they can't afford to maintain. So
then this so this and then when you mean
(34:52):
by that, sorry to interrupt when you when
you mean by that, it's not the people who
manufacture the actual radios.
It's a signal that goes out to the radios
to maintain that awareness. That's right.
Because because they used to have like
when no weather radio first started, they
installed all these antennas,
transmission antennas, yeah, around the
country for to broadcast the signals.
(35:16):
And then that got really expensive to
maintain. So they started leasing space
off of existing radio towers and towers
that that exist out there.
Well, I mean, that's like rent.
It keeps going up. And so they're
struggling with increased costs to
(35:36):
maintain the transmitter and to keep it
on the tower that they they have it on
now. Because when they issue from each
forecast office, when they issue the
warning and they that automatically
activates the signal that sets the no
weather radios off. Right.
So the weather service doesn't make the
(35:57):
no weather radios, but they provide the
content that's going to save your life.
Right. Which is if the most important,
right, is you've got the device, they
want to get you the information to go to
that device and get it.
I want to kind of just talk a little bit
about some of the stuff that's been said
over the last week or so in terms of what
(36:18):
may have happened, what may not have
happened. It sounds just from our
conversation that alerts went out.
But there could have been a lot of ways
that people didn't get alerts, lack of
cell service, lack of the technology like
the radio that would have it power
outages. So, you know, again, lack of
ability to get that that data to them or
those alerts to people.
(36:40):
We talk about cuts. We talk about the
cuts that were coming, the cuts that have
happened to the National Weather Service
to NOAA over the last couple of months
has been very quick. And I know things,
you know, things move slowly in
government. A lot of the times we know
National Weather
Service budget's been cut.
(37:06):
And I think that's a great question of
alerts not going out due to whatever
reason, whether they were cuts, whether
it was like a mistake, whether or is that
an investigation that that's got to
happen after where we
can get full answers?
Yeah, no, I mean, and that's that's a
that's a popular question, too. Yeah. Did
did the cuts impact the issuance of the
warning? Right now, there doesn't seem to
(37:27):
be a direct correlation between cuts and
the warning went out late.
Right. The National Weather Service
Office in New Braunfels in San Antonio,
they had extra meteorologists on staff
than they normally would. Okay. Because
(37:47):
of the possibility or the likelihood of
flooding happening. But where I do think
it could have made a difference. And, you
know, it can't be proven right now.
And that is that their warning
coordination meteorologist every office
(38:08):
has what they call a WCM a warning
coordination meteorologist and their job.
One of their jobs is to be the liaison
between the emergency managers and the
National Weather Service towns and the
National Weather Service and any other
organizations that, you know, have an
(38:30):
interest in getting warning information.
And so these warning coordination
meteorologists are just like every other
employee. They were offered the early
buyouts to retire as a as a point of
force reduction mandated, you know,
across the government.
(38:52):
And the warning coordination
meteorologist took an early retirement
about eight months ago and they have not
been replaced. And so, you know, my as a
meteorologist, I'm thinking, well, that
warning coordination meteorologist
(39:13):
between eight months ago and now could
have been visiting all those places
telling them about the
importance of the flood warnings.
Telling them the importance of, hey, we
can flood really quickly. Be ready. We're
going to issue these alerts. Would he
have done that? I don't know. But the job
of the WCM is to be that liaison and to
(39:36):
make sure the emergency management
community understands
how the process works.
The other thing I don't know is the
people that this warning coordination
meteorologist was had such great
relationships with. Did any of them
change in the last eight months? And if
any of those changed in the last eight
(39:57):
months, were they getting any instruction
for what those warnings mean and how
should they act? Should they hear it?
What kind of connectivity back to the
weather service?
Because there is a channel.
There's a feedback channel. It's called
NWS Chat. Right. Where the emergency
managers and media can be in a direct
(40:20):
chat with meteorologists at the weather
service. Right. You know, what kind of
activity was going on there?
That's more to issue even more warnings
to the public to even like help boost the
information getting out. Is that it?
Well, I think more up to date warnings
were about not issuing more warnings. But
what do you do when you receive this
(40:42):
warning? Ah, OK. Gotcha. So so more
helpful tips and stuff. Yeah, there's a
there's a flood flash flood emergency.
We're issuing that should have made every
emergency manager and every police
officer get up and go down to that riverbank to try to get out.
Right. Yeah. Yeah. They know that, you
(41:02):
know, so there's an education behind that
as well. And I just wanted to mention,
too, that and I haven't been able to
confirm it, but I've seen it in some
media reports. And I know that those
specific media get multiple. They have to
get multiple confirmations before they
report it. And that is, is that Kerr
County had the option or an opportunity
(41:23):
to install a siren system
along the Guadalupe River.
Where this flood happened back in 2016 or
2017 and they refused to do it. Why? I
don't know. I didn't see the study that
was done to say it's not worth it or
(41:45):
whatever. I have heard officials say that
installing an alert system is expensive.
And so that just leads you to answer that question.
Well, what's expensive and at what price?
Yeah, well, it was a priority here.
(42:05):
Something is more expensive. And what did
you buy with that money that could have
been that could have put in an alerting
system. So I'm sure I will guarantee it
1000% that there's going to be a lot of
pressure to get some sort of alerting system.
I personally think throughout the country
(42:29):
that this flood will lead to some sort of
major change in the way that flood
warnings are issued and consumed. And the
question is going to be how long will
that take? And, you know, I mean, Andrew,
we're talking about this flood.
It happened less than a week ago or a
(42:55):
week ago actually today. And six months
down the road, will anybody
be thinking of flash flooding?
Well, and you're right. And I think it's
important. This is, we had this, like I
mentioned, we had flash flooding, not as
bad obviously, but it was pretty bad. But
(43:16):
nobody followed up. I had it in my neighborhood in Pittsburgh.
I had it in my neighborhood and certain
parts of my neighborhood. And I followed
up with the people happened twice in in
in a year, less than a year. And then
because there weren't any fatalities,
thank God, and knock on
whether it doesn't happen.
People's places, properties got damaged
and and it happened twice. So they had to
put in two insurance claims now that
(43:37):
people are concerned that over time, like
those insurance is going to go up or not
covered. And and no, but nobody followed
up with the region,
with the city government.
They were just worried about their own,
you know, insurance costs. And just to
your to your point of in six months from
now, is this going to be kind of washed
(43:58):
aside and no pun intended, of course. And
people aren't just are
just going to forget about it.
Assuming that it's going to be dealt
with, you know, that the people that they
voted into power to say, Hey, you know
what, we need to we need to deal with
this, we need to put in this iron system,
because obviously, it would have helped.
We didn't do it the first time. This is
our chance to do it. But people, I feel
(44:19):
that they need to follow up.
They need to continue, especially if
you're in an area that's vulnerable and
you may or may not be able to move out of
that area or you want to continue to stay
in that area. I feel like you almost have
to have like put committees together,
citizen committees to make
sure that that that's followed up.
It's so important to do that. And I
think, you know, in Kerr County, Texas, I
(44:40):
don't think they'll ever forget when you
get outside of Texas and around the
country, there are probably.
you know, Kerr County, Texas tomorrow.
And will people see this as a reason to
(45:06):
make them move faster in getting alert
systems or understanding what's
available, putting things in place,
getting meteorologists in to talk to them about what's going on in the world.
And I think that's something that we're going to have to do tomake sure that we have the right resources to be able to
take the risk and what their risk
tolerance is, because communities could
come together and say, you know what?
(45:26):
We want to. And this is something they
don't do today, but could be in the
future where communities work together to
say, okay, this is our risk tolerance.
Instead of the government coming in
saying we're going to issue a warning
(45:48):
because we think this is what it should
be. Yeah. If you get more community
involvement and buy in from people as to
what you're trying to do, I think you'll
get more longevity in people thinking
about it and feeling more comfortable
with the risk that
that they're undertaking.
(46:09):
I agree. I agree completely. That
feedback mechanism is so important
because that's what makes a community.
That's not just don't just let government
make all the decisions, but be involved
in the government and be involved with
what happens around your town city.
Obviously, you know, not not trying to
blame on anybody in this situation. This
is devastating. You know, our hearts go
(46:32):
out to all the people affected who have
lost their loved ones and are still
looking for those. It
must be a horrible situation.
We don't want to see this situation
happen again ever, you know, and to
protect that we know the ways I think
this also speaks to a couple of things.
(46:52):
One that we need to invest in these
monetarily as well
funding wise into these systems.
They're not cheap for a lot of times, but
they are effective when they're in. They
can save a lot of people's lives. So I
think that's that's important. I think
also the fact that, you know, we we
pretty much went through this this
episode without really talking about
(47:12):
climate change too much.
And we didn't have to because flooding is
enough. Like we know the risks of
flooding. We know it's being it's made
worse by climate change, but people see
this and this is a danger and like an
extreme danger to people immediately. And
this needs to be fixed.
And so there's a lot of things that we
can do in the short term and in the long
(47:33):
term to ensure that we can predict these
things a little bit faster just from a
you know, where it doesn't just sneak up
on us and also making sure that we have
connectivity so that people can get
alerts and all the
different ways of getting alerts.
You know, as far as I'm concerned, like
if you're in one of those areas,
everybody should be given a radio, you
(47:54):
know, like that should come to the house
or apartment or anything, right?
I agree. And you know, another important
thing is is because we're in a new
paradigm and you're right. We don't have
to talk about climate change. All we have
to talk about is there's more moisture in
the atmosphere. And yes, the atmosphere
is warmer. So you're adding more
ingredients to create
(48:15):
floods in many more locations.
And we also want to make sure that people
understand we are in that new paradigm.
So forecasts of flash flooding are going
to be more numerous. We're going to talk
(48:35):
about that a little bit more and that
that we need the research, right?
We need research in science to understand
how the atmosphere is transforming and
how fast it's transforming because that
(48:55):
one in one thousand year flood that
everybody's talking about may become a
one in 10 year flood at that magnitude.
But then 10 years from now, it may become
a one in two year flood. Yeah. And so if
that happens, that has to change
(49:16):
everyone's planning for community
development, urbanization,
planning, storm drain size.
What kind of what kind of modifications
are cities and towns going to need to to
manage that kind of rainfall? Absolutely.
(49:39):
You said it perfectly. I think it's
funding needs to go in that and that can
be costly, but it's necessary.
And I think a lot of times it gets passed
up and it's deemed unnecessary for
whatever reason, whether it's political,
whether it's it's budgetary. But you're
right. We do need to understand our
system more. We are in an ever changing
(50:00):
world more than ever.
And we need to we need to have a better
understanding of how we can adapt to it
and change it. So that hopefully that's
why research needs to be funded.
Absolutely. Absolutely.
David, I want to thank you so much for
spending some time with me today. I know
you're busy. I appreciate all the work
you do and all the work your colleagues
(50:20):
do and appreciate you coming here and
giving information to our audience, you
know, sifting through all the stuff on
the news and being able to provide us
with ways people get alerts as well as
ways they can get alerts and how they can
get in the future if they need it.
So if everybody can go out and get your
NOAA watch radio, go out and get it
because it's very important to do so.
(50:43):
I'll put it if I can find some links.
I'll put a link if you can if you can
purchase it online or something. So
again, Dave, thank you so
much. We really do appreciate it.
Great. Thank you, Andrew. Thanks for
having me. No problem.
Thank you, Dave, for joining us on
today's episode of the How to Protect the
Ocean podcast and providing us all that
information. A lot of the stuff I didn't
know about and I thought it was really
(51:03):
interesting to find out, you know, after
all this gets sorted investigations
happen, people get to mourn their loss,
people get to understand what happened
and what they can do in the future.
I hope that there are critical and
constructive conversations from a
government level and community levels
with their governments in order to better
(51:25):
protect themselves. Forget the political
side of everything. Forget the two sides
to every political aisle. Forget the
climate change political aspect. Let's
protect people. Let's make sure that we can be safe in our own communities, you know, whether in the US, whether you're in Canada, whether you're in Europe, whether you're in the US, whether you're in Canada, whether you're in Europe.
It doesn't matter. We want to make sure
(51:45):
that we're protected and governments and
communities need to come together to be
able to ensure that these are protected.
This has nothing to do with political
affiliations. This has to do with
protecting people, with protecting
children. You know, 27 children were
killed because they were at a camp that
were on the Guadalupe River and that is unacceptable. That cannot happen again. And we need to protect the people.
And that is unacceptable. That cannot
(52:06):
happen again. And we need to better
prepare for these types of storms, not
only from just a receiving and providing
alerts, but also the infrastructure of
where things can be built, where things
can go in the future. And I think that's
really important discussions to have in
the future, even in my community up here
in Canada, in Burlington, Ontario.
So I want to thank you everybody for
(52:28):
joining us today. I'd love to hear your
feedback and leave a comment on the
YouTube channel if you're watching this
on YouTube, or if you're listening to
this on your favorite podcast app, you
can hit me up on my website,
speakupforblue.com forward slash contact,
leave me an email. If you have any
questions for myself or
Dave, I'll pass it on to him.
It goes right to my personal email, or
you can hit me up on Instagram at how to
(52:49):
protect the ocean. It's at how to protect
the ocean. Just DM me. I want to thank
you so much for joining us on today's
episode of the how to protect the ocean
podcast. I'm your host, Andrew Lewin from
the true North strong and free. Have a
good day. We'll talk to you
next time and happy conservation.
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