What does it take to break the cycle of social discrimination in India?
In this inspiring episode, host Nicole Jansen is joined by the visionary philanthropist and social entrepreneur, Dr. Abraham George. As the founder of the Shanti Bhavan School in India, Dr. George has dedicated his life to empowering children of the most marginalized communities by providing opportunities through education. Over the past 27 years, the school has changed the lives of over 15,000 children. 98% of its students are college graduates, with many making it to Ivy League institutes like Stanford, Dartmouth, and Princeton.
Discover how Dr. George’s life journey, from the Indian military to a successful business career in the U.S., led him to his true calling: breaking down the systemic barriers of the caste system in India through a holistic educational approach. This bottom-up strategy not only focuses on academics but also nurtures the mindset and self-worth of each student, propelling them to previously unimaginable heights.
Dr. Abraham has authored multiple books on social justice, including India Untouched, and is writing another one about Shanti Bhavan that is due for a release soon.
What We Discuss in this Episode
- What inspired Dr. George to dedicate his life to breaking cycles of poverty?
- How does the caste system in India perpetuate economic inequality?
- The role of nurturing belief in students from marginalized communities.
- What are the greatest challenges faced when establishing a school like Shanti Bhavan?
- How can global citizens contribute to alleviating poverty around the world?
- The importance of economic justice as a path to social justice.
- Overcoming obstacles: Dr. George's journey from Wall Street to social impact.
- The significance of action and how it transforms compassion into tangible change.
- How can we motivate others to participate in acts of service and philanthropy?
- The long-lasting impact of transforming young lives and its ripple effect on society.
Podcast Highlights
0:21 - Breaking the generational cycle of poverty with education
2:17 - Dr. George's journey from the Indian military to U.S. entrepreneurship
5:51 - Understanding India's caste system and its impact
10:17 - Transforming mindsets: nurturing belief in marginalized kids
15:06 - Challenges faced in establishing Shanti Bhavan School
20:41 - Empowering global citizens to contribute positively
25:22 - The link between economic and social justice
31:03 - The joy of giving and making a lasting impact
34:54 - Action as a catalyst for true transformation.
Favorite Quotes
Economic Justice: “The path to social justice is through economic justice.”
Transformative Action: “Compassion without action is of no use. It doesn't benefit the other person; it only makes you feel good.”
Episode Show Notes: https://leadersoftransformation.com/podcast/education/532-from-invisible-to-unstoppable-shap
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome to the leaders of transformation podcast. The number one
show for business leaders and entrepreneurs passionate about uplifting
others and making a greater impact in the world. Now here's your
host, transformational coach, speaker, and business
advisor, Nicole Jansen.
(00:21):
What does it take to break the generational cycle of poverty? Our
guest today is doctor Abraham George. He is a renowned
philanthropist, social entrepreneur, and the visionary founder of
the Shanti Bhavan School in India that is breaking
cycles of poverty and empowering the next generation of leaders.
His school has actually started out with only 48 children over
(00:44):
the last twenty seven years, changed the lives of 15,000 people.
I really love this statistic. 98% of their students are
college graduates and many of them making into
Ivy League schools, Stanford, Dartmouth, Princeton. And
there is also a documentary about their school that were highlighted
in 2017 called daughters of destiny, and it centers
(01:08):
around their initiatives to educate and empower girls. So we're
really excited to have Abraham here. And today, we're gonna talk about
the root causes of generational poverty and their bottom up
approach to transformation. So, Abraham, welcome. We're glad to have you here
today. Very nice of you. Thank you, Nicole. I just want to
add the Daughters of Destiny is on Netflix. Just a
(01:30):
little. Yes. Thank you. Sorry. I meant to mention that. Yes. And we'll make
sure there's a link in the show notes to that so people can make sure
that they get that. Also, a shout out to Oscar Hamilton and
their team for the wonderful introduction. I always like to acknowledge
those that support this show, and we have amazing
booking agents who send us guests all the time. And so
(01:51):
Marie Kay at Oscar Hamilton introduced us. So thank you
for this introduction. So let's talk about, Abraham,
what inspired you to literally dedicate your life
to I know you had a career before and then just, you know, you
decided to leave that and dedicate your life to
serving this community in India and these kids within this school. So
(02:14):
talk a little bit about what led to that. My business
career is in The was in The United States for twenty five
years. But before that, I had a small carrier.
I was a graduate of the Indian military academy, and
I went on to serve in the Indian artillery.
My, if I may just carry that story because it's relevant to
(02:36):
what motivated me to start embark on what I am doing
today. I was posted as an officer in the
Himalayas, very close to the Chinese border. This was soon after
the Chinese invasion of India in the nineteen sixties.
And I was sent up to an altitude of 14,000
feet, the highest battleground at that time, anywhere in
(02:58):
the world, that where artery guns were taken up there and I
was sent with some soldiers. And we were blasting the rocks
and, I used to joke that we are moving the Himalayas. Right?
Anyway, at the end of, ten months or so, I
had major accident that I was blown up by a
dynamite blast and sent home. And
(03:20):
then I was sent to the Pakistan border. But coming back
to the Chinese story, now while I was there, it's very
cold below freezing temperatures, shortage of
oxygen and everything else and I was the only officer there. I used
to climb another small mountain out there and I used to sit
there and wait because the blasting is going on down there.
(03:43):
And I used to think what am I doing? I'm trained well
to kill others. This is a profession I want or
I want something else. When the accident took place,
I came to the realization there must be some reason why I was
saved. If I was a fraction of a second late, I would
have been totally blown up and I turned around to
(04:05):
jump. So I committed myself to
doing something for social good. I didn't know exactly what I will be
doing, but I decided that I need to
leave the army and make some money. And I had the
opportunity to come to The United States. I was barely
21 at that time. And then I did my graduate studies
(04:27):
in New York University and all of that. And after a couple
of years working for JPMorgan, I started my own
company, which lasted for another twenty five years. But as
time passed, I realized that my original mission, which
is to do social work or social service, was
getting delayed and I decided to sell my company
(04:51):
and the return to India after almost twenty
plus years of absence to embark on what I am
doing today. So I got started with the school
called Shanti Bhavan, which is a residential school for children
from the bottom most segment of the society. They are
also the so called untouchables of India. The you
(05:13):
know, we have, like, India as a caste system, so
they don't have the same opportunity as others. And I was driven
by the social justice element of it apart from poverty.
And I felt that the way to solve the problem is
to empower them, rather than waiting for somebody to do something
good for them. So that's why I am doing what I'm doing.
(05:36):
I embarked on many other projects, which I'll be happy to talk to you,
But the main trust was the school, residential
school for children from very deprived socially and
economically deprived communities.
Yeah. Talk about that caste system. Not everybody's familiar with
that and how that works. And I think it's also relevant
(05:58):
for even, like, in The US. Sometimes people say they don't have opportunity,
but literally there, if you don't have a chance, unless somebody
actually offers it to you. Yeah. It's just different perspective. Well,
America has a class system, not as so much of a caste
system, and it's based on color mainly. Yeah.
In India, color is somebody can be dark, somebody can be lighter
(06:20):
skinned. So it's not based on color, it's based on where and how
you were born. And this goes back to
fifteen hundred years when the society
was broken up based on who is going to do what
And the upper so called rich people who owned
land and so on, decided that some people ought
(06:42):
to be the ones to clean their, you know, latrines
and do all kinds of menial labor. And
after a few hundred years they were classified as untouchable.
They were not allowed to enter the homes. They didn't have any
property. Their children sometimes have to work as bonded
laborers. Bonded laborers means that you give your service for
(07:04):
free and for which they give you some food. So
this system still continues. But when
India became independent from the British in
1947, Mahatma Gandhi wanted to give
rights to people who belong to the so called untouchable castes.
They were called untouchables at that time. And the constitution
(07:26):
said that if you discriminate on the base
of castes, you'll be punished, punishable
by law. But they never removed the caste system.
So in excess even today, the people refer to certain
group of people belonging to the lowest caste. In fact,
the government asks you, you know, when you apply for a job, asks you what
(07:48):
your caste is. Wow. So so this still
exists, but sort of not spoken of
much, but everyone knows who belongs to what
caste. So you're saying that when somebody goes for a job,
they ask them what caste they're part of, how does that affect their
ability to get a job? It works both ways. For
(08:09):
government jobs, they have set aside a quota
like 10 to 20%, depends on what it is,
where they have to recruit from the lowest class.
College admission same way 10 to 20%,
you have to be given admission whether you are qualified on merit or
not. So in that sense it helps. But even
(08:32):
in America, people in the Silicon Valley
discriminate people, in their own company.
In major companies, you're talking about fortune 100 companies,
they discriminate because they know certain employees
belong to the lower caste. So how do they know that? One of the
ways they know is the name. The the name
(08:54):
sort of designates, sort of give you an idea there. And
then Now you're talking about American citizens, not just hiring in
India. You're talking about here American citizens. They have
certain names that commonly used by people who belong to that.
Secondly, they have the education background is poor, so their accent is
poor. Their knowledge about many things is
(09:16):
less than those who went to very good schools.
So then they talk, where do you come from and this and that, and they
find out. I never really thought about it, like, in this way.
But I remember in being in Canada, and I chose not to go to
university because I had a business and my parents had businesses,
and they're very blue collar. At least my dad was and his family
(09:39):
growing up and where he came from. My mother, certainly more affluent. But so
I'm in my 20s and I'm working on my business and
I'm going out there and I'm presenting. And a lot of people asked me
at that time, where did you go to university? And it was kind of like
a qualifier, right? Not like, oh, I'm curious, where did you go to university?
It was more like a qualifier to say, what is your level of education?
(10:01):
And it's very interesting. And then after a while, people stopped
asking me that question. In fact, I remember working with lawyers at one
time with some of the top lawyers in Canada and we were moving to
a bigger firm. And I said, well, you know, because they needed
my resume just for a formality because I was going with them. I said, you
realize that on my resume, it doesn't say that I have a
(10:23):
university education college or anything like that. And he said,
I don't care. We've already negotiated the deal. You're coming with us because
of the project that I was working on. And he said, just tell him you
went to the school life experience. And I said, oh, I like that. And it's
still on my LinkedIn today. I went to the school of life experience.
What a great education that is. But how often does that limit
(10:44):
us? And so talk about your school coming back to what you do
is you bring them out of that situation, even in
kind of like overcoming that. Maybe they have the same, you know, that last
name that they had. I don't know how you deal with that. Because it's not
just education, it's a mindset, it's psychological, it's all of those
things that you got to work on to be able to have 98% of
(11:06):
your students to be graduates and many going on to those Ivy League
schools and getting in to those Ivy League schools, which then allow them
to get those positions at American companies and abroad, I'm
sure. Right. You know, one of the greatest things about America
is that a lot of people want to help the underdog.
That is not necessarily so in many other
(11:29):
countries including India. Now back to your question,
we search for children who are economically very deprived. That
is, we used to take children whose family income is less
than $2 per day. Now with inflation and everything, we
are raised up to $5 a day. But $5 is what a
Starbucks coffee costs. Right? So that's it for a family of four.
(11:51):
So that's our criteria. And what we find when we base
it on income, we don't like to ask what your caste is. So
we are based on income. If we find that over 90%
of those people are from the so called untouchable cast.
By definition, they just sort of fall within that. So but we
don't ask that question. Now, how do we
(12:14):
transform them? That's a different issue. They don't have role
models. Hardly anyone from their families have gone to a high
school or a college for that matter. So one of the
challenges we have is not just to
inspire and motivate the kid to do well. The parents
don't have any expectations of their kid. The parents think they are no
(12:36):
good, they will be some media labor or
something in the local level. When we talk about our
kids going to college then you talk about Ivy League
and so on, they don't even understand. They don't even understand what America
is for that matter. They know it's a prosperous country and that's
about it. So we have a lot of challenges to overcome
(12:59):
and that is first, making the children aspire for
something great, making the parents understand that their
children have the same potential as anyone else. All that
they need is the nurture that we need to give.
They you know, there was this debate about nature versus nurture.
And one of my great ambitions was to
(13:22):
prove to the world or to prove to the society that,
listen, if you take children from any segment of the society and you do
the very best, bring them up well and educate them well
and motivate them, they have a good chance. They will do just
as well as children from upper segment of the society. So
that is what we do to make this thing happen. So that's
(13:45):
yeah, you bring up a really good point, because I think that is across the
board in all countries. This isn't just India, and the
situation that you're dealing with, but the generational patterns,
and the, like you said, the low expectation, I think
about people that I've interviewed even have had
aspirations to go to college and their parents are like, why would
(14:06):
you ever do that? One of my recent guests, Jane Boulware, finished out
her career at Microsoft, you know, as a VP in
Microsoft. She'd been at Kimberly Clark all over the world and
doing these amazing things. She talks about in her autobiography,
she talks about the fact that when she was growing up, she grew up in
the cornfields of Iowa, that when she wanted to go to college,
(14:28):
her parents were like, you know, especially her dad was like, why? Why would you
ever wanna do that? Yeah. And so I'm glad you addressed that
because as parents to believe in your kids, and we like to think
that everyone believes in their children and that they can be anything that they wanna
be. But that starts with, of course, how we see ourselves. If I don't see
myself as capable of more than I'm gonna project that
(14:50):
onto my children. If I have them, I'm gonna project them onto
others. And so it's literally, you can change the world in one
generation by changing the way they see themselves. And then they
see that possibility of, wow, if Johnny can do it, then
maybe the next one can do it. You made a good point here. That is
now things are beginning to change. They're seeing that many
(15:13):
of our early batches Yeah. Are succeeding. They are going to
college. They got excellent job in Microsoft and five other great
companies. Now the new parents are realizing that, hey, so and
so is doing well, maybe my kid can also do well. Now they're getting
that they're going to America. So the the whole thing is completely
different for the children. It is amazing seeing
(15:35):
that earlier batches, the last four years since we
started sending them to The United States are going
to America to study in colleges. The practically the whole
school wants to go to America. I am exporting them. But, of
course, only three or four get in each year. You know, they have the
95 percentile in SAT and all the
(15:57):
other other things they have to achieve. So three or four in a
batch is good good enough number, and others go
elsewhere. Well, and and you're changing their mindset. So even if they
don't get into an Ivy League school or American school, but now their
mindset is expanded and you're
expanding the mindset of the parents and of everyone who sees it.
(16:18):
It's that's true transformation is lasting transformation because it's
based on identity. It's based on who I am and who I'm capable of
being. I love it. Yeah. So do you ever have kids that
are resistant to that, that are, like, it's
harder to get through? Or is there do you do you notice that some
kids it's easier to get through to and other kids it's hard to get through
(16:40):
to? What do you notice about that? Are they all really receptive because they're All
the kids aspire for something good to happen,
but some kids think that I am not good enough. No matter
what you say, maybe they have some learning difficulties
and they have been scoring well. So that problem is there,
and we try to remedy it. But in a class of 20
(17:03):
or 25, you may get four or five kids
who will finally succeed in getting into an
American good American university. The others, they go
to Indian universities and they're all top universities. They're not
bad at all. And then after they finish their bachelor's degree,
they end up, with top companies. Mostly
(17:25):
American companies again who are in Bangalore. The nearest
city is Bangalore. It's called the Silicon Valley Of India,
and there, you have practically every American company
there. So because of their background and upbringing,
our children have much easier time getting through good interviews
and so on and they get admission. So like you said, ninety eight
(17:47):
percent graduate from college and actually
this almost same ninety eight percent get into good
companies too. One of the challenges we face
is actually something else, and that is we spent
fourteen years from the age of four to complete high school. You
know? Yeah. We we take a nursery, the k g,
(18:10):
and all the way twelve years, so fourteen years with us. Then we
have to tell the parents, hey, you gotta wait another four years for the
job. Listen, we can't wait eighteen years. We'll be dead by
then. So how long this will go on? And if they ever
want to do masters, God forbid, you know, these people don't.
So what they're waiting for them to come back and help the family earn
(18:32):
income, is that what it is? It's not fair to ask them to
leave and come and help family, they can help from America, Part of their
income, they can send. They can visit once a year. They have great
aspiration. They want to do well in America or anywhere
for that matter. Some are in Canada and UK. So we tell
them that you pursue the best opportunity that
(18:54):
you have. You can help in many different ways. You don't have to
come back to your village when there's no opportunity at all. So
But is that what their parents are impatient for? Or what is it that is
their hesitation? Money. Money. Money. Yeah. So I mean, like, the support.
So they don't pay for it, obviously. How do you fund this? Oh, we
don't fund at all. The entire cost of education and boarding is paid
(19:17):
by the university. That's a challenge. Otherwise, we would get more
children to come. No. I mean, up until the point from from four
to 18. How do you pay for it? I know originally you were paying be,
you know, I as I said, I had made some money in business.
And so initial fifteen years, I did it by myself.
And then I had some difficulty during the two thousand eight crisis.
(19:40):
And then my son Ajit joined me to raise
money. And so today, most of the money
comes from donations. At the care, I want to point out
something, Nicole, and that is a good 60 to
70% of that donations come from America,
not from India. And people who have not seen seen the
(20:01):
school, they read about it. They They believe. They believe. Yeah. And they
say, by God, this is what we want to help. And sometimes they make
a trip and come and look. But in that sense, America
has been very generous. That is awesome. Well, I love to hear that. I
love to hear that. You mentioned about some of the challenges that you face with
kids. What challenges did you face even just starting off the school? Like, I
(20:23):
think about some of the people that are listening, aspiring leaders of
transformation. They're aspiring to make a difference in the world. Maybe they're thinking about
launching something or they're, early stage, and maybe they
don't have the funds and the resources. They didn't make all the
money first to but they're just like, I feel called to it. What could you
share from your story in terms of your staying power
(20:45):
to get through those challenges? Because there's always gonna be challenges,
always gonna be obstacles that you have you have to face when you're doing something
new. Of challenges. The first one I didn't think was a challenge
because I thought I had made enough money in America. So it
was easy for me. I had, you know, sold my business and all of
that. So first fifteen years, I did all the construction and everything
(21:06):
else until the market crashed and I got into
difficulties. And then because we had succeeded, you
know, demonstrating to people that we had done a good job, we are able
to attract money. So financial is a very major consideration
if you're going to do something of your own. The other choice is
to join another NGO, a non government organization
(21:28):
and, work there and hopefully you can make a good
contribution. Third choice is, find some
person who is rich enough, join forces with him and
tell him I will be your agent for getting the job done, you give me
your money and I'll show you, you'll be the board and everything
else so different ways you can persuade another person
(21:50):
but in my case my ability to demonstrate
to others that I mean business and I've done
well and that has helped me even today. Did you have any
resistance from the government agencies and as you
were trying to set this up, I mean, you're starting a new school. You don't
just set up a school and say, okay. I'm gonna I mean, maybe you do
(22:11):
in India. Here, I know there's a lot of resistance. You wanna set up a
charter school. It's a whole process. I've had clients that have done it. So
was there any resistance on that side? Because I'm sure there's
some of the government that wants to help the underserved
population, but then there's the other side of it, which doesn't. You asked a
very intuitive question. There were two problems. First is
(22:33):
the community. You take a few children from the
poorest in a village and then you see the landlords that
say, hey, this kid is going to one of the great schools, good
schools, and my kid can't go there. And then another
bunch of fellows will say, if you educate all of them and they
go somewhere else, who is going to work in my field? Okay. So
(22:54):
Exactly. That is one. And they even said they're going to burn down the
school. So I we went through that phase. Okay. The other
is something I was aware of, which is corruption.
And this is thirty years ago. Thirty years ago when I came and
even today, corruption is rampant. So I made a
decision that I will not ask for government to give me any
(23:16):
money. If I took government money, they will come and
sit on top of me, ask me for this, ask me for that, and they
come and inspect, and they'll take more bribes. So to this day,
I have not taken government money. I have reached out to
private individuals. And by the way, most of the
donations that come from The United States are from individuals,
(23:38):
not from corporations. In India, it is slightly
different because in India, individuals don't donate much
for whatever reason. And government enacted a
law whereby 2% of the profits of a
company has to be given to charity. So they distribute that
money to many charitable organizations, and we get a small share of
(24:00):
it. We have to go and somehow convince them that they should give
us. And we have been reasonably successful. But as
I said, most of the money comes from The United States and that too from
individuals because American foundations
normally fund American charitable projects. And I don't
blame anyone, but individuals, you know, especially those of
(24:21):
Indian origin, that means they were born in America, but their
parents came from, they have some affinity to India. And so they are
willing to help and then others who are not of Indian origin,
they also reach out and help us. Yeah, that's the tendency, right?
We have a tendency to just focus in on helping those in our own
country and yet not realizing that we're global citizens, and
(24:43):
it's helping humanity. So how did you find
these? Because I'm thinking about some of the questions, right, that people are going
here. Like, how do you find these individuals that would
support you? Now you had some connections probably through your business and
all of that, but at some point, you go beyond that. I made a
big mistake. And that was when I left my business in
(25:05):
America. And for fifteen years, I was on my own. And I said, I got
to focus on my work, and I don't want any business things to come in
the road. And after a few years, they're all retired and they're gone. So I
didn't have any business Oh, okay. Connection. Yeah. My son
took over. He's young. And he used social
media quite a lot. And he made talk
(25:28):
and TED talk. And I write blogs. I wrote
a couple of books. And then came Netflix film,
Daughters of Destiny, which made a huge difference because
it was awarded an Emmy award for television with
a conscience and spread all over the world and that
really helped. Our credibility was established because
(25:51):
of that film. Now I've written another book and
hopefully it will come out, not it is coming out here.
Yeah. And that is another way to get your story out.
Talk about that. Your book that's coming out. Okay. I can
disclose the name of the book unless the publisher changes
it. It's called Mountains to Cross. It's nothing to do with mountains but
(26:13):
obstacles to cross. And it is about
how you can find purpose to your life. That's what
I found. I, for twenty five years, I was successful
as a businessman, Wall Street. And what did I discover
in my work? I found that there is so much joy in
giving and so much joy in making things happen, especially for
(26:36):
children. And so, I decided that my
book ought to be not just about my accomplishments,
but how did I do it? What inspired me to do it? And if you
have made money especially and you want to find
some sort of satisfaction, like Jane Udall
talks about in her book, I believe it's called Joy or something.
(26:59):
And also a couple other books I've read where you need
to find satisfaction in making a difference
to other people's lives. And I found that not
only it is difficult to make a difference to other people's lives,
it's, you know, you can touch one person, two person, but if you're going to
do in a larger scale, there are so many other obstacles come away.
(27:21):
But if you cross those mountains and you make
them successful like these stories I have told you, just to see their
faces, just to see their families, how it is transformed,
their own siblings, their parents, they are they are moved out of the hut
into a nicer home. And the joy that comes from seeing
the transformation in one generation, that is a
(27:44):
very, very rewarding thing. I feel I am fortunate
enough to have that satisfaction in my life. Yeah. I
don't think there's anything greater, more satisfying than that from
a impact standpoint, legacy standpoint. It's more
than what you receive from it. If you look at it, I
think there's a lot of people nowadays that I love the fact that there's so
(28:06):
many people that wanna help others and are out there and, you know, the random
acts of kindness, but they're, like, happen to have it recorded. I had the video
camera and the whole crew there just happened to be but anyway, the
virtue signaling is popular. But when you get the
beneath all of that to how it feels to be able to
use what you have in service of others, that's what you're talking about.
(28:28):
Yes. You know, in some ways, you need to do this
silently, quietly. Yeah. And, you know, yesterday, I got
a email from one of the girls who is currently with
ExxonMobil, and she wrote to me, I am gonna have
my baby this month, and I want to bring her
up the way I was brought up. You know, this very, very moving
(28:50):
Yeah. To to hear something like that. You know? And you
won't even know all the stories. You won't even know and your kids won't
even know all the stories. You don't know the ripple effect that has gone out
Correct. From the decision that you made years ago
in the impact that it's you can't calculate it. So, yeah.
Nicole, I want to say one other thing. And that
(29:13):
is when I was in graduate school at NYU, I had
decided that I'll go into this, but I was thinking, what is the
best way to do something? At least in a small way. How
do I break the cycle of social discrimination?
And it became very clear to me that no amount of
preaching, whether you do it in the church or a temple, people are not going
(29:36):
to come out and suddenly become Yeah. It's talking. All the talking. Yeah.
Yeah. That's about it. And I came to a simple
conclusion that the path to social justice
is through economic justice. Amen. Yes. And that's
why I'm trying to make these children extremely
successful economically. The change has to come from
(29:58):
bottom up. Don't wait for somebody to give them justice. Yeah. Thank
you for saying that. My dad used to have this saying, he said that you
can't be truly free unless you're economically
financially free. It has such an effect on our lives and
what we're able to do. Yeah. It's the systemic. So you're talking
about the systemic transformation of how do you change. We
(30:20):
talk about generations, and I love the fact that you're doing it from bottom up
as opposed to and it's kind of alluding to in the beginning. There's a lot
of people that are waiting for it in America, waiting for it from top
down. They're not doing this. They're not doing that and
whatever. And it's like, you make it, and I forget who it
was, famous actor. I think it was Morgan Freeman. And he was
(30:41):
interviewed, and he's like, man, it's a long way from Memphis or wherever it
was. You know, it's a long ride from there to here, but
everybody can make that ride if they make the choice. And so we
get to choose. But sometimes you don't have the you don't even know that that's
even possible. And the kids that you were working with initially, maybe now
they see that possibility. But if you don't even know that that's possible
(31:03):
There is no escaping, the reality that someone has to reach
out for them. Somebody has to reach out. So it's twofold, but there's the
partnership in that, if you will. Yeah. So That's the
challenge. How do you motivate enough people, especially people with
financial means? Yes. That a, they will find
joy, b, they have an oblique moral obligation to
(31:26):
improve life for these people. And third, make sure
that they realize that their money is not wasted. A lot of
people are very skeptical about these types of project. They
think that somebody is gonna walk away with the money they give. But then you
demonstrate on the ground that this has really had a big impact,
then people are willing to come forward. You know, that's a great place to end
(31:48):
this too is that grassroots, less talking,
more action, action speaks volumes. There's a saying,
right, faith without works is dead. If faith doesn't whatever
your faith is, if if it doesn't translate or your
desire to help people or your desire to make a difference in the world
doesn't translate into good works, then what is it? So that's
(32:11):
why I often will say, you know, I say leaders of transformation take action, take
action on something that you learned here, and I encourage our listeners to do that.
And I have a podcast. We have a 530 episodes,
but you can listen to podcasts all day. You can
read books, you can study and learn. But
until you put that into action, nothing's gonna happen.
(32:32):
Nothing's gonna change in the physical. Very
important word. In my book, I talk about it. Compassion is
wonderful. You know, you have sympathy, you have empathy, you have
compassion. That's great. But compassion without action
is also use. It doesn't benefit the other person. It only makes you feel
good. Yes. Thank you for being here, Abraham. I
(32:54):
really appreciate it. And we're gonna make sure that the links to your
website are in the show notes. Everybody can go and get that.
Shantibavanchildren.org. Will make sure
that that is there with the correct spelling and everything and also on the screen
here for those watching in the video. And for our listeners, I
just encourage them, take action. Leaders of transformation,
(33:16):
leaders who create transformation in the world, take
action on something that you learned here today. There's so much
inspiration in this, but there's also practical action.
And an example of what you can do, I just encourage you to take action
on something. If there's something that we can do to support you in that
in taking that step, you're not sure what the steps are, how to do it,
(33:38):
you don't have the connections yet, then reach out to us. We'd love
to support you. But one of the things is I've had personally a lot of
people that have reached out and said, hey. I'm trying to do this. You know,
I'm looking to do this and so forth. You gotta be willing to take the
action. Nobody's gonna do it for you. Right? You
gotta take the action for yourself and step out in faith. Take
that step and then invite other people, enroll other people to
(34:01):
participate with you. But you got to take that action and be doing something
can't be overthinking it so long. At some point, you got to pull the trigger.
Let's go. Right? You got to jump out of the boat. Right? You got to
go swimming. It's, you know, like all these analogies, but it's life. Right? And so
we encourage you to do that. And if you need some support along that journey,
we'd love to support you and you can reach out to us
leaders@transformation.com. Ask us any questions, what you need. We
(34:25):
can, you know, support you however we can. And I encourage you
that if you've been encouraged by Abraham's story and what they're
doing there at the school, go support what they're doing. Maybe making
monthly pledge or whatever it is, support what they're doing, get involved,
maybe even getting involved if you're not ready to start your own thing.
So participate in something else. Learn, get involved, and do
(34:47):
something. Everybody doing a little bit adds up to a lot. So
we encourage you to do that. Again, Abraham, thank you so much for being here.
Much. You made a very, very powerful point, Nicole, at the
end, powerful point that people have to act on it. No amount
of talking. And enjoy the documentary, Daughters of Destiny.
Yes. Yes. And we look forward to your book coming out. So when your
(35:09):
book comes out, give us a link. We'll make sure that also gets included in
the notes afterwards as well. So Okay. Anyway, thank you so
much. It's a pleasure. Thank you everyone for being here. We look forward to seeing
you next week on another episode of the Leaders of Transformation. Thank you,
Nicole. Thank you. My pleasure. Thank you for listening to
the Leaders of Transformation podcast with Nicole Jansen. If
(35:31):
you're enjoying this show, please click the follow or subscribe button and
leave a rating and review wherever you listen to your podcasts.
And remember to join us on social and get connected. Together,
we can make this world a better place for everyone. We'll
see you next time.
Welcome to the leaders of transformation podcast. The number one
show for business leaders and entrepreneurs passionate about uplifting
others and making a greater impact in the world. Now here's your
host, transformational coach, speaker, and business
advisor, Nicole Jansen.
(00:21):
What does it take to break the generational cycle of poverty? Our
guest today is doctor Abraham George. He is a renowned
philanthropist, social entrepreneur, and the visionary founder of
the Shanti Bhavan School in India that is breaking
cycles of poverty and empowering the next generation of leaders.
His school has actually started out with only 48 children over
(00:44):
the last twenty seven years, changed the lives of 15,000 people.
I really love this statistic. 98% of their students are
college graduates and many of them making into
Ivy League schools, Stanford, Dartmouth, Princeton. And
there is also a documentary about their school that were highlighted
in 2017 called daughters of destiny, and it centers
(01:08):
around their initiatives to educate and empower girls. So we're
really excited to have Abraham here. And today, we're gonna talk about
the root causes of generational poverty and their bottom up
approach to transformation. So, Abraham, welcome. We're glad to have you here
today. Very nice of you. Thank you, Nicole. I just want to
add the Daughters of Destiny is on Netflix. Just a
(01:30):
little. Yes. Thank you. Sorry. I meant to mention that. Yes. And we'll make
sure there's a link in the show notes to that so people can make sure
that they get that. Also, a shout out to Oscar Hamilton and
their team for the wonderful introduction. I always like to acknowledge
those that support this show, and we have amazing
booking agents who send us guests all the time. And so
(01:51):
Marie Kay at Oscar Hamilton introduced us. So thank you
for this introduction. So let's talk about, Abraham,
what inspired you to literally dedicate your life
to I know you had a career before and then just, you know, you
decided to leave that and dedicate your life to
serving this community in India and these kids within this school. So
(02:14):
talk a little bit about what led to that. My business
career is in The was in The United States for twenty five
years. But before that, I had a small carrier.
I was a graduate of the Indian military academy, and
I went on to serve in the Indian artillery.
My, if I may just carry that story because it's relevant to
(02:36):
what motivated me to start embark on what I am doing
today. I was posted as an officer in the
Himalayas, very close to the Chinese border. This was soon after
the Chinese invasion of India in the nineteen sixties.
And I was sent up to an altitude of 14,000
feet, the highest battleground at that time, anywhere in
(02:58):
the world, that where artery guns were taken up there and I
was sent with some soldiers. And we were blasting the rocks
and, I used to joke that we are moving the Himalayas. Right?
Anyway, at the end of, ten months or so, I
had major accident that I was blown up by a
dynamite blast and sent home. And
(03:20):
then I was sent to the Pakistan border. But coming back
to the Chinese story, now while I was there, it's very
cold below freezing temperatures, shortage of
oxygen and everything else and I was the only officer there. I used
to climb another small mountain out there and I used to sit
there and wait because the blasting is going on down there.
(03:43):
And I used to think what am I doing? I'm trained well
to kill others. This is a profession I want or
I want something else. When the accident took place,
I came to the realization there must be some reason why I was
saved. If I was a fraction of a second late, I would
have been totally blown up and I turned around to
(04:05):
jump. So I committed myself to
doing something for social good. I didn't know exactly what I will be
doing, but I decided that I need to
leave the army and make some money. And I had the
opportunity to come to The United States. I was barely
21 at that time. And then I did my graduate studies
(04:27):
in New York University and all of that. And after a couple
of years working for JPMorgan, I started my own
company, which lasted for another twenty five years. But as
time passed, I realized that my original mission, which
is to do social work or social service, was
getting delayed and I decided to sell my company
(04:51):
and the return to India after almost twenty
plus years of absence to embark on what I am
doing today. So I got started with the school
called Shanti Bhavan, which is a residential school for children
from the bottom most segment of the society. They are
also the so called untouchables of India. The you
(05:13):
know, we have, like, India as a caste system, so
they don't have the same opportunity as others. And I was driven
by the social justice element of it apart from poverty.
And I felt that the way to solve the problem is
to empower them, rather than waiting for somebody to do something
good for them. So that's why I am doing what I'm doing.
(05:36):
I embarked on many other projects, which I'll be happy to talk to you,
But the main trust was the school, residential
school for children from very deprived socially and
economically deprived communities.
Yeah. Talk about that caste system. Not everybody's familiar with
that and how that works. And I think it's also relevant
(05:58):
for even, like, in The US. Sometimes people say they don't have opportunity,
but literally there, if you don't have a chance, unless somebody
actually offers it to you. Yeah. It's just different perspective. Well,
America has a class system, not as so much of a caste
system, and it's based on color mainly. Yeah.
In India, color is somebody can be dark, somebody can be lighter
(06:20):
skinned. So it's not based on color, it's based on where and how
you were born. And this goes back to
fifteen hundred years when the society
was broken up based on who is going to do what
And the upper so called rich people who owned
land and so on, decided that some people ought
(06:42):
to be the ones to clean their, you know, latrines
and do all kinds of menial labor. And
after a few hundred years they were classified as untouchable.
They were not allowed to enter the homes. They didn't have any
property. Their children sometimes have to work as bonded
laborers. Bonded laborers means that you give your service for
(07:04):
free and for which they give you some food. So
this system still continues. But when
India became independent from the British in
1947, Mahatma Gandhi wanted to give
rights to people who belong to the so called untouchable castes.
They were called untouchables at that time. And the constitution
(07:26):
said that if you discriminate on the base
of castes, you'll be punished, punishable
by law. But they never removed the caste system.
So in excess even today, the people refer to certain
group of people belonging to the lowest caste. In fact,
the government asks you, you know, when you apply for a job, asks you what
(07:48):
your caste is. Wow. So so this still
exists, but sort of not spoken of
much, but everyone knows who belongs to what
caste. So you're saying that when somebody goes for a job,
they ask them what caste they're part of, how does that affect their
ability to get a job? It works both ways. For
(08:09):
government jobs, they have set aside a quota
like 10 to 20%, depends on what it is,
where they have to recruit from the lowest class.
College admission same way 10 to 20%,
you have to be given admission whether you are qualified on merit or
not. So in that sense it helps. But even
(08:32):
in America, people in the Silicon Valley
discriminate people, in their own company.
In major companies, you're talking about fortune 100 companies,
they discriminate because they know certain employees
belong to the lower caste. So how do they know that? One of the
ways they know is the name. The the name
(08:54):
sort of designates, sort of give you an idea there. And
then Now you're talking about American citizens, not just hiring in
India. You're talking about here American citizens. They have
certain names that commonly used by people who belong to that.
Secondly, they have the education background is poor, so their accent is
poor. Their knowledge about many things is
(09:16):
less than those who went to very good schools.
So then they talk, where do you come from and this and that, and they
find out. I never really thought about it, like, in this way.
But I remember in being in Canada, and I chose not to go to
university because I had a business and my parents had businesses,
and they're very blue collar. At least my dad was and his family
(09:39):
growing up and where he came from. My mother, certainly more affluent. But so
I'm in my 20s and I'm working on my business and
I'm going out there and I'm presenting. And a lot of people asked me
at that time, where did you go to university? And it was kind of like
a qualifier, right? Not like, oh, I'm curious, where did you go to university?
It was more like a qualifier to say, what is your level of education?
(10:01):
And it's very interesting. And then after a while, people stopped
asking me that question. In fact, I remember working with lawyers at one
time with some of the top lawyers in Canada and we were moving to
a bigger firm. And I said, well, you know, because they needed
my resume just for a formality because I was going with them. I said, you
realize that on my resume, it doesn't say that I have a
(10:23):
university education college or anything like that. And he said,
I don't care. We've already negotiated the deal. You're coming with us because
of the project that I was working on. And he said, just tell him you
went to the school life experience. And I said, oh, I like that. And it's
still on my LinkedIn today. I went to the school of life experience.
What a great education that is. But how often does that limit
(10:44):
us? And so talk about your school coming back to what you do
is you bring them out of that situation, even in
kind of like overcoming that. Maybe they have the same, you know, that last
name that they had. I don't know how you deal with that. Because it's not
just education, it's a mindset, it's psychological, it's all of those
things that you got to work on to be able to have 98% of
(11:06):
your students to be graduates and many going on to those Ivy League
schools and getting in to those Ivy League schools, which then allow them
to get those positions at American companies and abroad, I'm
sure. Right. You know, one of the greatest things about America
is that a lot of people want to help the underdog.
That is not necessarily so in many other
(11:29):
countries including India. Now back to your question,
we search for children who are economically very deprived. That
is, we used to take children whose family income is less
than $2 per day. Now with inflation and everything, we
are raised up to $5 a day. But $5 is what a
Starbucks coffee costs. Right? So that's it for a family of four.
(11:51):
So that's our criteria. And what we find when we base
it on income, we don't like to ask what your caste is. So
we are based on income. If we find that over 90%
of those people are from the so called untouchable cast.
By definition, they just sort of fall within that. So but we
don't ask that question. Now, how do we
(12:14):
transform them? That's a different issue. They don't have role
models. Hardly anyone from their families have gone to a high
school or a college for that matter. So one of the
challenges we have is not just to
inspire and motivate the kid to do well. The parents
don't have any expectations of their kid. The parents think they are no
(12:36):
good, they will be some media labor or
something in the local level. When we talk about our
kids going to college then you talk about Ivy League
and so on, they don't even understand. They don't even understand what America
is for that matter. They know it's a prosperous country and that's
about it. So we have a lot of challenges to overcome
(12:59):
and that is first, making the children aspire for
something great, making the parents understand that their
children have the same potential as anyone else. All that
they need is the nurture that we need to give.
They you know, there was this debate about nature versus nurture.
And one of my great ambitions was to
(13:22):
prove to the world or to prove to the society that,
listen, if you take children from any segment of the society and you do
the very best, bring them up well and educate them well
and motivate them, they have a good chance. They will do just
as well as children from upper segment of the society. So
that is what we do to make this thing happen. So that's
(13:45):
yeah, you bring up a really good point, because I think that is across the
board in all countries. This isn't just India, and the
situation that you're dealing with, but the generational patterns,
and the, like you said, the low expectation, I think
about people that I've interviewed even have had
aspirations to go to college and their parents are like, why would
(14:06):
you ever do that? One of my recent guests, Jane Boulware, finished out
her career at Microsoft, you know, as a VP in
Microsoft. She'd been at Kimberly Clark all over the world and
doing these amazing things. She talks about in her autobiography,
she talks about the fact that when she was growing up, she grew up in
the cornfields of Iowa, that when she wanted to go to college,
(14:28):
her parents were like, you know, especially her dad was like, why? Why would you
ever wanna do that? Yeah. And so I'm glad you addressed that
because as parents to believe in your kids, and we like to think
that everyone believes in their children and that they can be anything that they wanna
be. But that starts with, of course, how we see ourselves. If I don't see
myself as capable of more than I'm gonna project that
(14:50):
onto my children. If I have them, I'm gonna project them onto
others. And so it's literally, you can change the world in one
generation by changing the way they see themselves. And then they
see that possibility of, wow, if Johnny can do it, then
maybe the next one can do it. You made a good point here. That is
now things are beginning to change. They're seeing that many
(15:13):
of our early batches Yeah. Are succeeding. They are going to
college. They got excellent job in Microsoft and five other great
companies. Now the new parents are realizing that, hey, so and
so is doing well, maybe my kid can also do well. Now they're getting
that they're going to America. So the the whole thing is completely
different for the children. It is amazing seeing
(15:35):
that earlier batches, the last four years since we
started sending them to The United States are going
to America to study in colleges. The practically the whole
school wants to go to America. I am exporting them. But, of
course, only three or four get in each year. You know, they have the
95 percentile in SAT and all the
(15:57):
other other things they have to achieve. So three or four in a
batch is good good enough number, and others go
elsewhere. Well, and and you're changing their mindset. So even if they
don't get into an Ivy League school or American school, but now their
mindset is expanded and you're
expanding the mindset of the parents and of everyone who sees it.
(16:18):
It's that's true transformation is lasting transformation because it's
based on identity. It's based on who I am and who I'm capable of
being. I love it. Yeah. So do you ever have kids that
are resistant to that, that are, like, it's
harder to get through? Or is there do you do you notice that some
kids it's easier to get through to and other kids it's hard to get through
(16:40):
to? What do you notice about that? Are they all really receptive because they're All
the kids aspire for something good to happen,
but some kids think that I am not good enough. No matter
what you say, maybe they have some learning difficulties
and they have been scoring well. So that problem is there,
and we try to remedy it. But in a class of 20
(17:03):
or 25, you may get four or five kids
who will finally succeed in getting into an
American good American university. The others, they go
to Indian universities and they're all top universities. They're not
bad at all. And then after they finish their bachelor's degree,
they end up, with top companies. Mostly
(17:25):
American companies again who are in Bangalore. The nearest
city is Bangalore. It's called the Silicon Valley Of India,
and there, you have practically every American company
there. So because of their background and upbringing,
our children have much easier time getting through good interviews
and so on and they get admission. So like you said, ninety eight
(17:47):
percent graduate from college and actually
this almost same ninety eight percent get into good
companies too. One of the challenges we face
is actually something else, and that is we spent
fourteen years from the age of four to complete high school. You
know? Yeah. We we take a nursery, the k g,
(18:10):
and all the way twelve years, so fourteen years with us. Then we
have to tell the parents, hey, you gotta wait another four years for the
job. Listen, we can't wait eighteen years. We'll be dead by
then. So how long this will go on? And if they ever
want to do masters, God forbid, you know, these people don't.
So what they're waiting for them to come back and help the family earn
(18:32):
income, is that what it is? It's not fair to ask them to
leave and come and help family, they can help from America, Part of their
income, they can send. They can visit once a year. They have great
aspiration. They want to do well in America or anywhere
for that matter. Some are in Canada and UK. So we tell
them that you pursue the best opportunity that
(18:54):
you have. You can help in many different ways. You don't have to
come back to your village when there's no opportunity at all. So
But is that what their parents are impatient for? Or what is it that is
their hesitation? Money. Money. Money. Yeah. So I mean, like, the support.
So they don't pay for it, obviously. How do you fund this? Oh, we
don't fund at all. The entire cost of education and boarding is paid
(19:17):
by the university. That's a challenge. Otherwise, we would get more
children to come. No. I mean, up until the point from from four
to 18. How do you pay for it? I know originally you were paying be,
you know, I as I said, I had made some money in business.
And so initial fifteen years, I did it by myself.
And then I had some difficulty during the two thousand eight crisis.
(19:40):
And then my son Ajit joined me to raise
money. And so today, most of the money
comes from donations. At the care, I want to point out
something, Nicole, and that is a good 60 to
70% of that donations come from America,
not from India. And people who have not seen seen the
(20:01):
school, they read about it. They They believe. They believe. Yeah. And they
say, by God, this is what we want to help. And sometimes they make
a trip and come and look. But in that sense, America
has been very generous. That is awesome. Well, I love to hear that. I
love to hear that. You mentioned about some of the challenges that you face with
kids. What challenges did you face even just starting off the school? Like, I
(20:23):
think about some of the people that are listening, aspiring leaders of
transformation. They're aspiring to make a difference in the world. Maybe they're thinking about
launching something or they're, early stage, and maybe they
don't have the funds and the resources. They didn't make all the
money first to but they're just like, I feel called to it. What could you
share from your story in terms of your staying power
(20:45):
to get through those challenges? Because there's always gonna be challenges,
always gonna be obstacles that you have you have to face when you're doing something
new. Of challenges. The first one I didn't think was a challenge
because I thought I had made enough money in America. So it
was easy for me. I had, you know, sold my business and all of
that. So first fifteen years, I did all the construction and everything
(21:06):
else until the market crashed and I got into
difficulties. And then because we had succeeded, you
know, demonstrating to people that we had done a good job, we are able
to attract money. So financial is a very major consideration
if you're going to do something of your own. The other choice is
to join another NGO, a non government organization
(21:28):
and, work there and hopefully you can make a good
contribution. Third choice is, find some
person who is rich enough, join forces with him and
tell him I will be your agent for getting the job done, you give me
your money and I'll show you, you'll be the board and everything
else so different ways you can persuade another person
(21:50):
but in my case my ability to demonstrate
to others that I mean business and I've done
well and that has helped me even today. Did you have any
resistance from the government agencies and as you
were trying to set this up, I mean, you're starting a new school. You don't
just set up a school and say, okay. I'm gonna I mean, maybe you do
(22:11):
in India. Here, I know there's a lot of resistance. You wanna set up a
charter school. It's a whole process. I've had clients that have done it. So
was there any resistance on that side? Because I'm sure there's
some of the government that wants to help the underserved
population, but then there's the other side of it, which doesn't. You asked a
very intuitive question. There were two problems. First is
(22:33):
the community. You take a few children from the
poorest in a village and then you see the landlords that
say, hey, this kid is going to one of the great schools, good
schools, and my kid can't go there. And then another
bunch of fellows will say, if you educate all of them and they
go somewhere else, who is going to work in my field? Okay. So
(22:54):
Exactly. That is one. And they even said they're going to burn down the
school. So I we went through that phase. Okay. The other
is something I was aware of, which is corruption.
And this is thirty years ago. Thirty years ago when I came and
even today, corruption is rampant. So I made a
decision that I will not ask for government to give me any
(23:16):
money. If I took government money, they will come and
sit on top of me, ask me for this, ask me for that, and they
come and inspect, and they'll take more bribes. So to this day,
I have not taken government money. I have reached out to
private individuals. And by the way, most of the
donations that come from The United States are from individuals,
(23:38):
not from corporations. In India, it is slightly
different because in India, individuals don't donate much
for whatever reason. And government enacted a
law whereby 2% of the profits of a
company has to be given to charity. So they distribute that
money to many charitable organizations, and we get a small share of
(24:00):
it. We have to go and somehow convince them that they should give
us. And we have been reasonably successful. But as
I said, most of the money comes from The United States and that too from
individuals because American foundations
normally fund American charitable projects. And I don't
blame anyone, but individuals, you know, especially those of
(24:21):
Indian origin, that means they were born in America, but their
parents came from, they have some affinity to India. And so they are
willing to help and then others who are not of Indian origin,
they also reach out and help us. Yeah, that's the tendency, right?
We have a tendency to just focus in on helping those in our own
country and yet not realizing that we're global citizens, and
(24:43):
it's helping humanity. So how did you find
these? Because I'm thinking about some of the questions, right, that people are going
here. Like, how do you find these individuals that would
support you? Now you had some connections probably through your business and
all of that, but at some point, you go beyond that. I made a
big mistake. And that was when I left my business in
(25:05):
America. And for fifteen years, I was on my own. And I said, I got
to focus on my work, and I don't want any business things to come in
the road. And after a few years, they're all retired and they're gone. So I
didn't have any business Oh, okay. Connection. Yeah. My son
took over. He's young. And he used social
media quite a lot. And he made talk
(25:28):
and TED talk. And I write blogs. I wrote
a couple of books. And then came Netflix film,
Daughters of Destiny, which made a huge difference because
it was awarded an Emmy award for television with
a conscience and spread all over the world and that
really helped. Our credibility was established because
(25:51):
of that film. Now I've written another book and
hopefully it will come out, not it is coming out here.
Yeah. And that is another way to get your story out.
Talk about that. Your book that's coming out. Okay. I can
disclose the name of the book unless the publisher changes
it. It's called Mountains to Cross. It's nothing to do with mountains but
(26:13):
obstacles to cross. And it is about
how you can find purpose to your life. That's what
I found. I, for twenty five years, I was successful
as a businessman, Wall Street. And what did I discover
in my work? I found that there is so much joy in
giving and so much joy in making things happen, especially for
(26:36):
children. And so, I decided that my
book ought to be not just about my accomplishments,
but how did I do it? What inspired me to do it? And if you
have made money especially and you want to find
some sort of satisfaction, like Jane Udall
talks about in her book, I believe it's called Joy or something.
(26:59):
And also a couple other books I've read where you need
to find satisfaction in making a difference
to other people's lives. And I found that not
only it is difficult to make a difference to other people's lives,
it's, you know, you can touch one person, two person, but if you're going to
do in a larger scale, there are so many other obstacles come away.
(27:21):
But if you cross those mountains and you make
them successful like these stories I have told you, just to see their
faces, just to see their families, how it is transformed,
their own siblings, their parents, they are they are moved out of the hut
into a nicer home. And the joy that comes from seeing
the transformation in one generation, that is a
(27:44):
very, very rewarding thing. I feel I am fortunate
enough to have that satisfaction in my life. Yeah. I
don't think there's anything greater, more satisfying than that from
a impact standpoint, legacy standpoint. It's more
than what you receive from it. If you look at it, I
think there's a lot of people nowadays that I love the fact that there's so
(28:06):
many people that wanna help others and are out there and, you know, the random
acts of kindness, but they're, like, happen to have it recorded. I had the video
camera and the whole crew there just happened to be but anyway, the
virtue signaling is popular. But when you get the
beneath all of that to how it feels to be able to
use what you have in service of others, that's what you're talking about.
(28:28):
Yes. You know, in some ways, you need to do this
silently, quietly. Yeah. And, you know, yesterday, I got
a email from one of the girls who is currently with
ExxonMobil, and she wrote to me, I am gonna have
my baby this month, and I want to bring her
up the way I was brought up. You know, this very, very moving
(28:50):
Yeah. To to hear something like that. You know? And you
won't even know all the stories. You won't even know and your kids won't
even know all the stories. You don't know the ripple effect that has gone out
Correct. From the decision that you made years ago
in the impact that it's you can't calculate it. So, yeah.
Nicole, I want to say one other thing. And that
(29:13):
is when I was in graduate school at NYU, I had
decided that I'll go into this, but I was thinking, what is the
best way to do something? At least in a small way. How
do I break the cycle of social discrimination?
And it became very clear to me that no amount of
preaching, whether you do it in the church or a temple, people are not going
(29:36):
to come out and suddenly become Yeah. It's talking. All the talking. Yeah.
Yeah. That's about it. And I came to a simple
conclusion that the path to social justice
is through economic justice. Amen. Yes. And that's
why I'm trying to make these children extremely
successful economically. The change has to come from
(29:58):
bottom up. Don't wait for somebody to give them justice. Yeah. Thank
you for saying that. My dad used to have this saying, he said that you
can't be truly free unless you're economically
financially free. It has such an effect on our lives and
what we're able to do. Yeah. It's the systemic. So you're talking
about the systemic transformation of how do you change. We
(30:20):
talk about generations, and I love the fact that you're doing it from bottom up
as opposed to and it's kind of alluding to in the beginning. There's a lot
of people that are waiting for it in America, waiting for it from top
down. They're not doing this. They're not doing that and
whatever. And it's like, you make it, and I forget who it
was, famous actor. I think it was Morgan Freeman. And he was
(30:41):
interviewed, and he's like, man, it's a long way from Memphis or wherever it
was. You know, it's a long ride from there to here, but
everybody can make that ride if they make the choice. And so we
get to choose. But sometimes you don't have the you don't even know that that's
even possible. And the kids that you were working with initially, maybe now
they see that possibility. But if you don't even know that that's possible
(31:03):
There is no escaping, the reality that someone has to reach
out for them. Somebody has to reach out. So it's twofold, but there's the
partnership in that, if you will. Yeah. So That's the
challenge. How do you motivate enough people, especially people with
financial means? Yes. That a, they will find
joy, b, they have an oblique moral obligation to
(31:26):
improve life for these people. And third, make sure
that they realize that their money is not wasted. A lot of
people are very skeptical about these types of project. They
think that somebody is gonna walk away with the money they give. But then you
demonstrate on the ground that this has really had a big impact,
then people are willing to come forward. You know, that's a great place to end
(31:48):
this too is that grassroots, less talking,
more action, action speaks volumes. There's a saying,
right, faith without works is dead. If faith doesn't whatever
your faith is, if if it doesn't translate or your
desire to help people or your desire to make a difference in the world
doesn't translate into good works, then what is it? So that's
(32:11):
why I often will say, you know, I say leaders of transformation take action, take
action on something that you learned here, and I encourage our listeners to do that.
And I have a podcast. We have a 530 episodes,
but you can listen to podcasts all day. You can
read books, you can study and learn. But
until you put that into action, nothing's gonna happen.
(32:32):
Nothing's gonna change in the physical. Very
important word. In my book, I talk about it. Compassion is
wonderful. You know, you have sympathy, you have empathy, you have
compassion. That's great. But compassion without action
is also use. It doesn't benefit the other person. It only makes you feel
good. Yes. Thank you for being here, Abraham. I
(32:54):
really appreciate it. And we're gonna make sure that the links to your
website are in the show notes. Everybody can go and get that.
Shantibavanchildren.org. Will make sure
that that is there with the correct spelling and everything and also on the screen
here for those watching in the video. And for our listeners, I
just encourage them, take action. Leaders of transformation,
(33:16):
leaders who create transformation in the world, take
action on something that you learned here today. There's so much
inspiration in this, but there's also practical action.
And an example of what you can do, I just encourage you to take action
on something. If there's something that we can do to support you in that
in taking that step, you're not sure what the steps are, how to do it,
(33:38):
you don't have the connections yet, then reach out to us. We'd love
to support you. But one of the things is I've had personally a lot of
people that have reached out and said, hey. I'm trying to do this. You know,
I'm looking to do this and so forth. You gotta be willing to take the
action. Nobody's gonna do it for you. Right? You
gotta take the action for yourself and step out in faith. Take
that step and then invite other people, enroll other people to
(34:01):
participate with you. But you got to take that action and be doing something
can't be overthinking it so long. At some point, you got to pull the trigger.
Let's go. Right? You got to jump out of the boat. Right? You got to
go swimming. It's, you know, like all these analogies, but it's life. Right? And so
we encourage you to do that. And if you need some support along that journey,
we'd love to support you and you can reach out to us
leaders@transformation.com. Ask us any questions, what you need. We
(34:25):
can, you know, support you however we can. And I encourage you
that if you've been encouraged by Abraham's story and what they're
doing there at the school, go support what they're doing. Maybe making
monthly pledge or whatever it is, support what they're doing, get involved,
maybe even getting involved if you're not ready to start your own thing.
So participate in something else. Learn, get involved, and do
(34:47):
something. Everybody doing a little bit adds up to a lot. So
we encourage you to do that. Again, Abraham, thank you so much for being here.
Much. You made a very, very powerful point, Nicole, at the
end, powerful point that people have to act on it. No amount
of talking. And enjoy the documentary, Daughters of Destiny.
Yes. Yes. And we look forward to your book coming out. So when your
(35:09):
book comes out, give us a link. We'll make sure that also gets included in
the notes afterwards as well. So Okay. Anyway, thank you so
much. It's a pleasure. Thank you everyone for being here. We look forward to seeing
you next week on another episode of the Leaders of Transformation. Thank you,
Nicole. Thank you. My pleasure. Thank you for listening to
the Leaders of Transformation podcast with Nicole Jansen. If
(35:31):
you're enjoying this show, please click the follow or subscribe button and
leave a rating and review wherever you listen to your podcasts.
And remember to join us on social and get connected. Together,
we can make this world a better place for everyone. We'll
see you next time.
Popular Podcasts
United States of Kennedy
United States of Kennedy is a podcast about our cultural fascination with the Kennedy dynasty. Every week, hosts Lyra Smith and George Civeris go into one aspect of the Kennedy story.
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com