March 6, 2025 • 31 mins
Ever wondered why you don’t crave sex the way you used to? Or why your partner always seems to want it more (or less) than you? You’re not broken—but the way we’ve been taught to think about desire is.
In this episode, I sit down with Susan Morgan Taylor, a renowned somatic sex therapist, to uncover the real reasons behind low sex drive, desire discrepancies, and why women are often blamed for “not wanting it enough.”
If you’ve ever felt disconnected, pressured, or “not in the mood” more than you’d like, this episode will change everything you thought you knew about desire.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
It's one of the biggest problems that couplesface.
(00:03):
I promise you, you're gonna have more passionin your relationship.
If you're feeling stuck and stagnant, juststart telling the truth.
(00:27):
The studies have shown on average, it's twentyone or more minutes of, we could say foreplay,
stimulation of some sort before we'll beconsistently orgasmic during penetrative sex.
But most men ejaculate in the first two toseven minutes of penetrative sex.
And so you can see here the disconnect.
Right?
Like a woman needs twenty one or more minutesof even a foreplay before penetration even
(00:50):
happens, much less who knows, you know, oncewe're in there, penetration is part of your
sexual repertoire in and it's all over in twominutes, let's see.
That is not enough time for her to really dropinto what's possible for her.
So we have different arousal styles.
So when couples don't understand how they arewired and how their partner is wired, this
(01:10):
leads to all kinds of problems and nobody'sbroken, nobody needs to be fixed.
But when we know that piece, it really canclarify what's happening.
So that can lead to just a disinterest and ashutdown in sex over time where it just becomes
about, man, let me just give it to him becauseit's what he wants.
There's really nothing in it for her at thatpoint.
So how do you begin to bring the thespirituality into sexuality?
(01:32):
And what does that really look like for you?
The answer to that is actually very simple, andit's not gonna sound spiritual at all.
Nothing more spiritual than the right nowmoment.
So where do you begin?
There's three things happening, and one of them
Hey, everybody.
Welcome back to another episode on The Lounge.
I am so thrilled to introduce you to my nextguest here, a new friend of mine, Susan Susan
(01:57):
Morgan Taylor.
Susan is an amazing holistic sex therapist whohas found a way to bridge sexuality and
focusing on sexuality for both women andcouples with the art of spirituality.
So she really helps women and couples restoretheir relationships, get back to love, get back
to that passion, and normalizes theconversation around sexuality so that we can
(02:22):
talk about this and grow deeper into love anddeeper into our connection with each other,
ourselves, our partners, and so much more.
She's, like I said, a holistic sex therapistand intuitive coach and really specializes in
women's sexuality.
So, Susan, I'm absolutely thrilled.
We're gonna talk about desire discrepancy.
We're gonna talk about being in the art of thepresence and somatic work and what that means,
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and we're gonna break down some myths aboutdesire and discover some truths.
So we're gonna have a great time.
So welcome to the lounge.
Thank you so much, Diane.
I'm so excited to be here in the lounge andcan't wait to have this first issue in either
way.
What are you guys gonna be looking for?
It's gonna be so good.
And let's let's jump right jump right in.
So in talking about desire, right, so one ofthe things that that I know you talk about is,
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like, what is the truth about desire?
And I feel like what I see is because of thingsthat I know so many of us talk about offline,
like porn and media and everything that we seein the world around desire, there's so many
myths, and I think people are living and tryingto live up to this expectation of, like, what
(03:31):
desire, quote, unquote, should be like andshould feel like.
So what truly is the truth here?
How do we break this down?
Yeah.
Well, yeah, I mean, one of the biggestchallenges that I see in my work, I work you
know, I'm a specialist in women's sexuality,but I primarily work with couples like you,
Diane.
And we have this issue.
What you hear out there, like, the common termis, like, mismatched libido or high sex drive,
(03:55):
low sex drive, but clinical term is desirediscrepancy is what we would call that, like,
clinically.
And, really, what this comes down to is, youknow, there there's just it's one of the
biggest problems that couples face.
And it also, the challenge that I see isusually what you have happen is there's the,
quote, unquote, higher desire partner trying tofind a way to get the lower desire partner to
(04:16):
rise to meet their sexual libido desire, andthe lower desire partner is probably feeling
broken, like, they need to be fixed.
And and this really is not the right approachto take in my opinion.
And so part of what I'm here to do and what I'dlove to get across to your listeners today is,
like, let's get rid of this idea of highlibido, low libido.
Because what the truth really is is that we'rewell, there's a few things going on here.
(04:39):
There's really, like, three main keys thathappen here.
It's one of the things I teach in my monthlymaster class.
There's three things happening, and one of themone of them is we have different arousal maps.
So we're wired differently.
We have different ways that we come online andbecome interested in sex.
And a lot of times what's happening is we'regoing the more explicitly sexual route.
(04:59):
We're going straight for, say, genital touchand explicitly, quote, unquote, we think of as
sex, which that does not work for everybody.
Some people need a little bit more of a slowerpace or they need less, more sensual type of
touch or they need more teasing before they'regoing to become interested in sex.
So we have different arousal styles.
So when couples don't understand how they arewired and how their partner is wired, this
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leads to all kinds of problems of, like, notbeing on the same page and feeling like, oh,
someone's broken.
Someone needs to raise their libido or needs tobe fixed.
And we just need to change that conversation.
Nobody's broken.
Nobody needs to be fixed.
But when we know that piece, it really canclarify what's happening.
So that's that's one of the causes of thatdesire discrepancy.
So when somebody has this desire discrepancyand we say we say, okay.
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There's nothing wrong with anybody.
Right?
So where do people begin, though, to go andsolve it?
And I see sometimes people try, like, well,let's meet in the middle.
I wanna have sex every day.
You wanna have sex twice a month.
So maybe we, like, meet in the middle and tryto have sex once every ten days.
Yeah.
And, usually, that leads to, like, nobodyreally being happy in in my experience.
(06:08):
So where do people in your you know, with yourwork and what you've seen,
where
do people really begin to break this down andfind a way of solving this that is not this,
like, meet in the middle kind
of Exactly.
That I love that question.
And so in the process I've created called thepleasure keys process, it's what I use.
My couple's retreats, I use this a lot in mywork.
It's the three there's three n what I call thethree n's.
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Notice, name, negotiate.
The very first place we start to answer yourquestion to keep this simple, we start with the
ability to notice, which takes us back to ourcapacity to access what's called direct
pleasure.
So we have two ways of experiencing pleasure,two primary ways that we experience pleasure or
in we'll call it enjoyment.
One is the indirect route.
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The other is the direct route.
So the indirect route is when we're, say,watching porn or creating a a fantasy in our
mind or seeing our partner have a really goodtime and get turn you know, excited by
something we're doing to them.
It's coming through the visual, through theeyes, stimulating visual cortex, and we become
aroused or, you know, receive pleasure in thatway.
It's a very valid pathway, but the otherpathway is direct pleasure, and that is the
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pathway that's direct to the nerve endings inthe skin directly to the brain.
And what I see happen when couples arestruggling with this issue of not being on the
same page and high libido, low libido, one orboth of them.
Most of the time, it's both of them.
They might not realize it.
There's a a limitation to their capacity toaccess this direct route.
And when we don't have access to that directroute, we don't have access to our own to our
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own arousal and what turns us on and what wewant, what we don't want, what we like, what we
don't like, what we're willing to do or notwilling to do.
And that's why that conversation on, like,let's meet in the middle never really works
because a lot of times what's happening issomeone's probably pushing past some limit.
They're not really truly coming at it from,like, a desire or a willingness, and that's
never gonna lead to more pleasure, moreenjoyment, or more arousal.
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So the very first step is to open that directpathway in the body, that direct route of
pleasure in the body.
So the curiosity I have around that, and then Iwanna get into your, you know, kind of your
other ends here as well, is one of the thingsI've said in my work a lot is the pathway to
pleasure is directly will related to thepathway to presence.
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The capacity experience pleasure is directlyrelated to the the capacity to experience
presence.
And I imagine not, you know, knowing exactlythe specifics of your somatic work, but I
imagine that there is an l a huge element, Iwould suspect, of presence.
So when you're talking about this directpathway, does that involve anything, like, with
the ability to actually be present in the bodyto Absolutely.
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Experience?
Yeah.
Absolutely.
And that actually is really the fir like, beingpresent in the body is how we start to, access
or or move the debris out of that pathway.
And it's very simple.
So because that's what I hear a lot too.
Like, well, I'm stuck in my head or I haveperformance anxiety.
Right?
You're not you're not present or I can't bepresent.
(09:08):
Yeah.
Everybody can be present.
It's like exercising a muscle.
Right?
And so the very first step to opening thatdirect pathway for pleasure through the body,
through the nerve endings on the skin, it'sactually extremely simple.
And how we do it is by noticing physicalsensation, and all of us have the capacity to
do that.
Now, you know, it might be it's exercising amuscle.
It might take a minute before you can reallystay with physical sensation, but we start by
(09:31):
just noticing what sensation is available to mehere right now.
And we do it in very simple ways, by the way.
Like, we're we don't even really have to startgenitally or, you know, quote unquote sexually.
We start by waking this pathway up even justthrough the hands, by learning how to notice
what sensations are available right now in myhands.
And then we can expand that to what do I noticeright now in my in my body, the weight of the
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chair against my back, the feeling of the theair against my skin.
So that immediately is the quickest pathway tothe present moment is to come into physical
sensation.
It's just a shift of our awareness.
That's all we're doing.
So we're not trying to, like, clear ourthoughts or not think of anything or stare at a
blank wall for an hour.
All we're doing is just shifting our awarenessfrom being up in the head in the past, future,
(10:17):
wherever, doing the grocery list to what what'shappening right now?
What's what am I able to notice right now inthis moment in my body as a physical sensation
that brings us into the present?
Yeah.
It's it's one of these things when I've, donelive classes in front of audiences and I ask,
especially women, like, how many of you guyshave ever been thinking about the grocery list
in the middle of doing sex?
(10:38):
How many of you ever, like, had that knowingthe list?
And it's amazing when when people are honestand you see one hand come up in the room and
all of a sudden, like, multiple hands.
And and it's really common.
Right?
Because I think without this training, like,what you do with your clients around that
direct presence and practicing throughout theday, it's like, if we're not practicing that
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throughout the day and that's not becoming partof our life around directly present to the
sensations Right.
When we get to the bedroom, that same thingthat's happening all day to keep our mind
wandering all over the places, it's gonnahappen in the bedroom naturally because
Absolutely.
Like you said, we haven't practiced that thatmuscle.
So then what about the other ways of reallyhelping with this, you know, this discrepancy
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and these three ends?
Can you talk more about those?
Yeah.
So the very first piece is that getting thatdirect pathway open through being in the body.
And, one thing I wanna say too is we tend tothink of sex as a doing.
Like, we're trying to get to this activity orget to the doing of the thing, the kissing, the
touching, the penetration, whatever.
And what we what really helps is just gettingout of this idea that's doing.
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It's not about getting to some particularthing.
If we can slow down and do the noticing partreally well first, that's where pleasure and
arousal start to open up and expand.
So pleasure expands from where we already findit in the body, not from where we try to tell
it to go.
So to answer your question, next piece, once weget that noticing and we get good at that skill
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is to name.
So this is about learning to name, not justnaming what I notice, but also when I'm able to
notice, I can start to identify what do I want,what do I need, what do I not want, What am I
willing to do or not do?
So we start to have this finer level ofdiscernment from that connection to our own,
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direct pathway of pleasure in the body.
And then we can start to name it.
And when we get that, then we're we're nowclear.
So I can either, you know, I can either name itwithin myself what I would need right now.
Oh, I'm noticing that I need to slow down or Ineed to breathe more deeply, or I might need to
hear certain words from my partner.
Like, I can then advocate for that need or thatdesire.
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So there's that piece internally, but we canalso go relationally.
Maybe there's something that I need my partneror want my partner to do or something I would
like to do to my partner.
So we can start to bring that into therelational space.
That's the second n, which leads, you know,sort of organically to what's the third n.
Right?
The third n is that negotiate part.
So negotiate is where either, negotiating formyself, advocating for a desire or need that I
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can either give to myself, or relationally,working out that with my partner.
And there's so many ways to do this.
We can do it very directly, verbally.
There's also ways to do negotiation where we'renot using words at all.
Usually, when I'm working with a couple, we'reor or an individual client, we're working with
using words because I think that we can'treally give that piece up until we have gotten
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really good at it.
But there's lots of ways to do that negotiatingdance where it might not even involve the use
of explicit direct words.
But learning how to do that directly in a waythat your partner can hear it and you can hear
it and there's no, like, terrible reactionsthat happen, that's where the clarity is
created.
And when there's clarity, there is connectionand there is confidence.
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So how do you in, like, that then negotiatestandpoint?
Because I feel like that's such a criticalpart, right, in the couples and the
interrelational.
How do you coach people to begin to have thoseconversations when like, one of the things that
I've seen in studies around these kind ofconversations is, like, anytime we have
conflict conversation and really and research,there's three threats, the threat to the self,
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the threat to the partner, the threat to therelationship.
And then in sex, it's interesting in inconversations around sex.
Out of those three threats, the one that is,like, the biggest threat in studies is the
threat to oneself.
So, like, okay.
I'm gonna say to my partner, hey.
I'm gonna negotiate and make this requestaround my need.
Then the threat to the individual is actuallythe biggest thing from the standpoint of, like,
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the ego and all these things.
Right?
Because we all wanna provide pleasure to ourpartner, but, you know, like, innately.
So where do you begin, like, in your work to tokind of unpack that negotiating, helping people
have success with it?
Absolutely.
And I I would say that that's where a lot ofcouples get stuck.
We're trying to leap to this negotiating partwhen we haven't developed the first two ends.
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We haven't gotten this direct pathway open inour body, and we're not good at noticing.
And so we're directly trying to create a thingthat maybe we maybe we do want it, but we're
not good at the other part of it.
So that part has to happen first before thenegotiating is gonna be good.
And then the other piece is and this is anotherproblem with desire discrepancy and why we have
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it is there's couples don't have a proven roadmap.
They don't have a framework.
They don't have mute they don't have a mutualunderstanding or a common language or an actual
lens to be able to see the problem through.
And so that's what I do when I do my couplesretreats.
It's what I'm teaching my couples.
They're learning how to have that foundation sothey have a common language, and they learn how
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to see through it's almost just like it's like,once it it gels, it's like, oh my gosh.
Like, I can see it now.
I see why we were having this challenge.
And so a lot of what you're speaking to, thosethreats are drastically reduced because they're
sort of there's a clarity there now, andthere's a mutual understanding of what's
actually going on because my no is not arejection of somebody else.
(16:08):
Right?
And that tends to be how we hear, like, oh mygod.
I've been rejected.
And that's why, you know, why don't we ask forwhat we want?
Well, fear of rejection, fear of being judged,some fear of some sort, usually.
Right?
Fear of being selfish, fear of hurting mypartner's feelings if I speak up for what I
want.
But when we have a common understanding andclarity in terms of what role am I playing,
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what role are you playing, whose desire are wefollowing, when that clarity is there and
language is common, the road map is clear, sowe reduce a lot of those perceived threats.
They become less of an issue, and it becomessomething that, ideally, we get really good at
at beginning to manage and have a differentrelationship with.
So that that that's not the stance we're comingfrom.
It's from the threat, the one of those threethreats.
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And I love what you said there that the no isnot a rejection.
Right?
And I think even just, like, that simple that'swhy I wanna repeat that because I think that
even that that simple understanding is sopivotal for being like, well, if I don't feel
rejected, this no doesn't mean a rejection,then it allows us to be much more present in
the conversation, I think, curious in theconversation to hear all the other things that
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are really at the truth and and put the coupleback together on that same team.
Right?
Yeah.
Absolutely.
And that's the key is sort of that curiosityand that willingness to the a no doesn't have
to be the end of the whole negotiation or thewhole conversation, and that that's what
happens a lot too.
Right?
It's like, oh, that didn't go well.
He didn't want it.
She doesn't want it.
So we're just gonna call the whole thing off,and it doesn't have to be that.
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It can be, okay.
You're a no to that request.
So so what else could we come up with thatwould be within your limits right now that you
would be willing to provide or you would bewilling to receive?
Right?
So we work at that level of that's thenegotiating part.
It doesn't have to be the end of theconversation just because someone's a no to
that particular offer at that time.
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And I think it's so critical.
Right?
Because we're not taught how to have theseconversations.
So it's just that that framework of how to dothis is is amazing.
And and what about then for women inparticular?
Because I know you specialize both in couplesand women.
And I think one of the problems that women findis, oh my gosh.
Like, I don't even have the desire.
I can't even bring this conversation and get tothe name because I don't even want it.
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I was talking to a a friend of mine thisweekend.
I saw her, like, three weeks ago, and she hadjust started she's in perimenopause.
It just started hormones, and she was soexcited.
And she was like, my libido's back on.
Hormones are so fun.
And so that was three weeks ago.
Now this past weekend, I see her again, andshe's like, oh, even with the hormones, her
libido went up, and then it's, like, flatlined.
(18:41):
Right?
So it's stuff that I know we both talk about inour work around, like, hormones are not
everything.
They're important.
We gotta keep balance, but Right.
They're not everything.
So Yeah.
From a standpoint of this desire.
Right?
Like, from a standpoint of what is even gettingsomebody to the conversation to even talk about
the discrepancies or talk about their needs,wants, preferences, all these things.
(19:02):
What do you find for women?
Because we are, you know, very complicatedcreatures in many ways.
What are the what are the root causes of thatlow desire that you find as commonly?
I mean, you know, in in lot of cases, a lot ofwomen are context oriented contextually, so
we're you know, there's something calledcontextual desire, contextual arousal, where
it's really about what's happening in ourenvironment, how are we feeling about our body
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that day, how do we feel about ourrelationship, did something happen at work
yesterday that didn't go well.
So it's we're very plugged into our contextgenerally.
So that can absolutely have an impact on awoman's libido and interest in sex.
But there's also other factors that come intoplay here, and first of all, I really think
it's a myth there's this myth out there that,like, women don't want sex as much as men, and
women are always the lower desire partners.
(19:44):
It's not always true.
Like, that was true very much in my story.
I totally understand that place, which is why,you know, really love the whole conversation on
women's sexuality.
But it doesn't have to be because what'shappening is though there's several things.
One of the things that happens a lot of timesis as women, we don't know our bodies, and we
and our partners probably don't either.
(20:05):
But our bodies have the same amount of erectiletissue as a man's body.
It's just spread out over a larger area.
We tend to need, on average, what the studieshave shown on average, it's twenty one or more
minutes of, we could say, foreplay stimulationof some sort before we'll be consistently
orgasmic during penetrative sex.
So there's that.
So if we're not giving our bodies time toactually warm up and really be, like, really
(20:30):
ready, get us out of our head, get thosetissues engorged, get us in a place where
we're, you know, not doing the grocery listanymore.
That takes time because we are plugged into ourprefrontal cortex.
It's the wrong part of the brain for sexualarousal.
We wanna be in the parasympathetic nervoussystem where the the prefrontal cortex is
quieted, the brain waves slow down to alpha ortheta waves, not the beta, which is the doing
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mind.
So there's that piece that's happening thatthat over time, if we continue to not
understand that or not honor the difference inour body, it will lead to a a loss of interest
in sex over time.
The next piece that tends to happen is that itdepends on what study you consult, but most men
ejaculate in the first two to seven minutes ofpenetrative sex.
(21:10):
And so you can see here the disconnect.
Right?
Like, a woman needs 21 of even just foreplaybefore penetration even happens, much less who
knows, you know, once we're in there, ifpenetration is part of your sexual repertoire,
and and it's all over in two minutes, let'ssay, that is not enough time for her to really
drop into what's possible for her.
(21:32):
So that can lead to just a disinterest and ashutdown in sex over time where it just becomes
about the man.
Let me just give it to him because it's what hewants.
There's really nothing in it for her at thatpoint.
The last piece here is emotional connection.
If that piece is offline, we're not feelingconnected to our partner or, you know, again,
the contextual piece, something happened atwork or, you know, bad you know, just kinda not
(21:56):
feeling great about my body that day or how Ilook, how I smell.
Like, those things all impact our ability toreally relax and show up and feel good where
we're getting something from the sexualencounter versus it just being for the man.
Yeah.
I so well say.
I think one of the things that that females andmen just from a standpoint of, like, the brain
(22:16):
function of this such a hard time understandingthe other is, like, the ability of the man to,
like, just focus so much.
And so it's so easy to compartmentalize, right,of, like, okay.
I had a bad day, but I'm putting that overhere.
And right now, I have my sex brain on.
And, like and I think for women, it's like,well, what do you mean?
Like, it's all, like, because of women'sability to have this diffuse awareness and take
(22:37):
in so much information at once.
Yeah.
Either these
are good or bad.
They're just different, you know, skill setsand strains.
Right?
And I think it's one of those things where it'slike, because of that, because there's so much
information coming in for the female brain allthe time Yeah.
It does take time for it to reroute and to dropinto that.
And without knowing it, it can be as simple as,like, well, I asked my partner to take out the
(23:01):
trash this morning, and he didn't.
And now I feel like I'm doing everything.
We make up stories, and then we go down this,Yeah.
This rabbit hole.
So I think it's really, you know, reallyimportant to, you know, look at all those
things you're talking about and getting out ofthat you know, the head there and into into the
body.
And so totally.
(23:21):
Then tell us a little bit too because I'mreally curious from a standpoint since one of
your focuses is is really in this bridgebetween spirituality and sexuality.
So how do you begin to bring the thespirituality into sexuality, and what does that
really look like for you?
Yeah.
And, you know, the answer to that is actuallyvery simple, and it's not gonna sound spiritual
(23:42):
at all.
But I mean, when we're in the when we're in thepresent moment here now, which some of that is
a somatic piece.
Right?
It's like, am I here in my body right nowfeeling what there is to feel in this moment?
That's an aspect of it.
The other piece is just the coming into theright now moment brings us into true.
Truth is one of the things that brings us intothe right now moment.
And that piece is like, can I really be honestand truthful with myself right now?
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What am I actually feeling in my body?
How am I feeling right now about this moment orwhat happened between me and my partner?
What is it that I really need right now?
What's actually happening in this moment?
Giving myself complete and total permission tofeel that thing even if it's ugly.
Right?
A lot of times, it's ugly.
It's like, no.
Like, I don't wanna admit that I'm reallypissed off or I'm really angry or I'm feeling
(24:24):
really jealous.
You know, like, we're tagging one of the we didnot want we'll admit the other things.
Oh, I'm hurt or I'm angry, but, you know, wedon't wanna admit the ugly stuff.
So it's a matter of can I be honest andtruthful of that in myself, and then am I
willing to bring that into the relational spaceand to be witnessed in that, to bring that in
relationally as the truth of I feel this rightnow?
(24:45):
When that happened, I experienced it like this.
Like, really bringing the truth in brings usinto the present moment, and there's nothing
more spiritual than the right now moment.
So that's really what the spirituality piece isabout, which is very, you know, it's not woo
woo.
That's not very new age.
That's just, like, right here, right now,what's happening.
You bring truth in.
I promise you, you're gonna have more passionin your relationship.
(25:07):
You're definitely gonna start to feel more.
More stuff is good.
If you're feeling stuck and stagnant, juststart telling the truth.
That's gonna shift things up real quick.
And I think you're so right about those kindaugly things.
Right?
I think even as, like, children, we're notreally taught sometimes to be like,
disappointment's a normal human emotion.
Like, embarrassment's a normal human emotion.
(25:27):
Even things like jealousy are normal humanemotions.
Right?
These come up for for humans, and it's notpersonal.
And I think the just like you and I are workingto make the conversation around sex less less
taboo and just more of like, hey.
How do we talk about this in a really healthyway?
Same thing for these types of emotions.
Like so I really appreciate that and, like,just naming around.
(25:48):
Like, I'm a little embarrassed about this or Ifeel this and being able to be in the present
with those emotions because the more I thinkwe're dropping into the present and practicing
that in our life, the more, I think it like Isaid, it it just it just goes into the the
practice of sexuality in the bedroom as well.
Yeah.
And it's really
you know, the spiritual practice of love is apractice of I like to use the word embrace.
(26:13):
So it's not about, let me deny this bad feelingand move on to the next thing or get to the
good feeling.
That's denial.
That's always gonna take us further away fromconnection, from love, and also from pleasure
and from orgasmic experiences, at least what'sreally available to us, which is much more than
just, you know, the climax most of us arefamiliar with.
It's a lot more available.
So the practice of embrace is a spiritualpractice of love where we're saying yes to
(26:34):
everything that arises in the moment,everything including the shame, the jealousy,
the anger, the hatred, the rage, and the love,the pleasure, the joy, the bliss, the
silliness, all of it.
We're able to embrace and say yes.
Oh, that is one of the most profound andsimplest spiritual practices available that,
you know, it truly can move the needle if we'rewilling to be that courageous and take that on
(26:57):
as a practice.
And I think with that, I think one of thethings and I wanna, save the answer to this for
our part two and tell our listeners how to getto part two as well.
Because I think one of the things that peoplestruggle with in what you're talking about is
almost as both and approach.
Right?
How can I experience in life?
How can I maybe experience something likejealousy or embarrassment or whatever it is,
(27:22):
but also experience connection and love at thesame time?
And it's like Yeah.
You know, we get stuck in this either or whenwe're way more dynamic of of humans than that.
And so I I'd like to get into, like, how wereally deal with, like, the the paradox around
the emotion and how that applies to sex andsexuality.
Yeah.
And I know we're also gonna talk in part two,like, the number one question that every couple
(27:46):
should know the answer for.
So as I'm really so I'm really curious aboutyour number one question and what people should
know the answer for.
So for everybody that's listening, part two isgoing to be accessible by joining our libido
club.
So if you go into the show notes, you'll seehow to join the libido club and where we're
featuring other guests like Susan and yourmonthly ability to get your sex education
(28:10):
techniques, so much more.
And so look in the show notes for that.
But I also wanna make sure before we wrap upthis part one that people know how to get ahold
of you.
I know you have your Pleasure Keys ebook onyour website.
We're gonna put that in the show notes as wellas your connection code monthly class and
information about that.
So all of the links of working with Susan willbe in the show notes.
(28:33):
But tell us a little bit more about your yourfree ebook as well as I wanna make sure
everybody knows about these retreats you'redoing because you guys I've looked at Susan's
website and the retreats, and these are just,like, I feel like genius ways that she's
bringing couples together for ways of very andvery classy ways of helping couples go through
(28:53):
these kind of conversations that we're havingtoday and getting the support they need in real
time.
Because, of course, we're talking about thishere, but if we don't practice it, you know,
nothing really works.
We gotta put this stuff into practice, andthat's some of what Susan's doing in her
retreat.
So tell us a little bit more about yourretreats of your word as well as your free
ebook giveaway.
Yeah.
Absolutely.
So ebook is available at pleasurekeys.com.
(29:15):
And what's really cool about the ebook is thatyou were talking about this piece of presence
and how do we do that.
That ebook is gonna tell you how to do that.
So it's the three keys to deepening pleasure,increasing your orgasmic potential, and
creating mutual sexual fulfillment, And that'sat pleasurekeys.com.
So I hope everyone will grab a copy of that,and it'll give you a little bit more of, like,
the how to of some of what we talked abouttoday, Diane.
(29:36):
And then, yes, the retreats are fabulous.
The Pleasure Keys retreats, and all theinformation for those retreats are on my main
website at pathwaytopleasure.com.
Our next one is coming up here in '20 well, Ido them several times a year.
We do have one coming up here in a couple ofmonths, but they happen several times a year.
And it's a beautiful way to get away from thecraziness of your life and to really dive deep
(30:00):
into the experiential learning that needs tohappen if we're really gonna move the needle
with, coming back into deeper connection andsolving this issue of mismatched sexual desire.
And I wanna say, you know, at the retreats,they are there's no it's all nonsexual,
actually.
It'll improve your sex life in everyrelationship you have.
We're not you know, there's no getting naked.
(30:20):
There's no sexual touching really that happensat the retreats.
But what you're learning is the the commonlanguage, the skill set, and this proven road
map that you're gonna be able to use movingforward for the rest of your life, the rest of
your relationship, future relationships,etcetera.
It's it's the most effective way I found toreally help couples move the needle, getting
that immersive format.
(30:41):
And then I also do a monthly master class, afree master class called the connection code on
the five keys to deepen the connection andresolve the mismatched libido for good.
And that information, again, is just on my mainwebsite at pathwaytopleasure.com.
Perfect.
Thank you for all of those offerings.
And you guys, again, we'll have all of that inthe show notes.
I hope you will get download these, you know,these free gifts.
(31:02):
Go check out the retreat.
Please go check out the retreat.
And make sure you look for the libido club aswell below so that you can get part two because
we gotta know this question that every coupleshould know the answer to, and we're gonna talk
about that paradox, pleasure, somaticexperience, and more in our libido club
meeting.
So thank you so much for being here with metoday.
(31:22):
It's been a true pleasure, and thank youeverybody for being on another episode of the
lounge.
Thank you for listening to the libido lounge.
Please don't keep me a secret.
Please share this with your friends.
You can find me on YouTube, on Instagram, aswell as how to work with me at mylibidodoc.com.
It's one of the biggest problems that couplesface.
(00:03):
I promise you, you're gonna have more passionin your relationship.
If you're feeling stuck and stagnant, juststart telling the truth.
(00:27):
The studies have shown on average, it's twentyone or more minutes of, we could say foreplay,
stimulation of some sort before we'll beconsistently orgasmic during penetrative sex.
But most men ejaculate in the first two toseven minutes of penetrative sex.
And so you can see here the disconnect.
Right?
Like a woman needs twenty one or more minutesof even a foreplay before penetration even
(00:50):
happens, much less who knows, you know, oncewe're in there, penetration is part of your
sexual repertoire in and it's all over in twominutes, let's see.
That is not enough time for her to really dropinto what's possible for her.
So we have different arousal styles.
So when couples don't understand how they arewired and how their partner is wired, this
(01:10):
leads to all kinds of problems and nobody'sbroken, nobody needs to be fixed.
But when we know that piece, it really canclarify what's happening.
So that can lead to just a disinterest and ashutdown in sex over time where it just becomes
about, man, let me just give it to him becauseit's what he wants.
There's really nothing in it for her at thatpoint.
So how do you begin to bring the thespirituality into sexuality?
(01:32):
And what does that really look like for you?
The answer to that is actually very simple, andit's not gonna sound spiritual at all.
Nothing more spiritual than the right nowmoment.
So where do you begin?
There's three things happening, and one of them
Hey, everybody.
Welcome back to another episode on The Lounge.
I am so thrilled to introduce you to my nextguest here, a new friend of mine, Susan Susan
(01:57):
Morgan Taylor.
Susan is an amazing holistic sex therapist whohas found a way to bridge sexuality and
focusing on sexuality for both women andcouples with the art of spirituality.
So she really helps women and couples restoretheir relationships, get back to love, get back
to that passion, and normalizes theconversation around sexuality so that we can
(02:22):
talk about this and grow deeper into love anddeeper into our connection with each other,
ourselves, our partners, and so much more.
She's, like I said, a holistic sex therapistand intuitive coach and really specializes in
women's sexuality.
So, Susan, I'm absolutely thrilled.
We're gonna talk about desire discrepancy.
We're gonna talk about being in the art of thepresence and somatic work and what that means,
(02:46):
and we're gonna break down some myths aboutdesire and discover some truths.
So we're gonna have a great time.
So welcome to the lounge.
Thank you so much, Diane.
I'm so excited to be here in the lounge andcan't wait to have this first issue in either
way.
What are you guys gonna be looking for?
It's gonna be so good.
And let's let's jump right jump right in.
So in talking about desire, right, so one ofthe things that that I know you talk about is,
(03:10):
like, what is the truth about desire?
And I feel like what I see is because of thingsthat I know so many of us talk about offline,
like porn and media and everything that we seein the world around desire, there's so many
myths, and I think people are living and tryingto live up to this expectation of, like, what
(03:31):
desire, quote, unquote, should be like andshould feel like.
So what truly is the truth here?
How do we break this down?
Yeah.
Well, yeah, I mean, one of the biggestchallenges that I see in my work, I work you
know, I'm a specialist in women's sexuality,but I primarily work with couples like you,
Diane.
And we have this issue.
What you hear out there, like, the common termis, like, mismatched libido or high sex drive,
(03:55):
low sex drive, but clinical term is desirediscrepancy is what we would call that, like,
clinically.
And, really, what this comes down to is, youknow, there there's just it's one of the
biggest problems that couples face.
And it also, the challenge that I see isusually what you have happen is there's the,
quote, unquote, higher desire partner trying tofind a way to get the lower desire partner to
(04:16):
rise to meet their sexual libido desire, andthe lower desire partner is probably feeling
broken, like, they need to be fixed.
And and this really is not the right approachto take in my opinion.
And so part of what I'm here to do and what I'dlove to get across to your listeners today is,
like, let's get rid of this idea of highlibido, low libido.
Because what the truth really is is that we'rewell, there's a few things going on here.
(04:39):
There's really, like, three main keys thathappen here.
It's one of the things I teach in my monthlymaster class.
There's three things happening, and one of themone of them is we have different arousal maps.
So we're wired differently.
We have different ways that we come online andbecome interested in sex.
And a lot of times what's happening is we'regoing the more explicitly sexual route.
(04:59):
We're going straight for, say, genital touchand explicitly, quote, unquote, we think of as
sex, which that does not work for everybody.
Some people need a little bit more of a slowerpace or they need less, more sensual type of
touch or they need more teasing before they'regoing to become interested in sex.
So we have different arousal styles.
So when couples don't understand how they arewired and how their partner is wired, this
(05:23):
leads to all kinds of problems of, like, notbeing on the same page and feeling like, oh,
someone's broken.
Someone needs to raise their libido or needs tobe fixed.
And we just need to change that conversation.
Nobody's broken.
Nobody needs to be fixed.
But when we know that piece, it really canclarify what's happening.
So that's that's one of the causes of thatdesire discrepancy.
So when somebody has this desire discrepancyand we say we say, okay.
(05:46):
There's nothing wrong with anybody.
Right?
So where do people begin, though, to go andsolve it?
And I see sometimes people try, like, well,let's meet in the middle.
I wanna have sex every day.
You wanna have sex twice a month.
So maybe we, like, meet in the middle and tryto have sex once every ten days.
Yeah.
And, usually, that leads to, like, nobodyreally being happy in in my experience.
(06:08):
So where do people in your you know, with yourwork and what you've seen,
where
do people really begin to break this down andfind a way of solving this that is not this,
like, meet in the middle kind
of Exactly.
That I love that question.
And so in the process I've created called thepleasure keys process, it's what I use.
My couple's retreats, I use this a lot in mywork.
It's the three there's three n what I call thethree n's.
(06:32):
Notice, name, negotiate.
The very first place we start to answer yourquestion to keep this simple, we start with the
ability to notice, which takes us back to ourcapacity to access what's called direct
pleasure.
So we have two ways of experiencing pleasure,two primary ways that we experience pleasure or
in we'll call it enjoyment.
One is the indirect route.
(06:52):
The other is the direct route.
So the indirect route is when we're, say,watching porn or creating a a fantasy in our
mind or seeing our partner have a really goodtime and get turn you know, excited by
something we're doing to them.
It's coming through the visual, through theeyes, stimulating visual cortex, and we become
aroused or, you know, receive pleasure in thatway.
It's a very valid pathway, but the otherpathway is direct pleasure, and that is the
(07:15):
pathway that's direct to the nerve endings inthe skin directly to the brain.
And what I see happen when couples arestruggling with this issue of not being on the
same page and high libido, low libido, one orboth of them.
Most of the time, it's both of them.
They might not realize it.
There's a a limitation to their capacity toaccess this direct route.
And when we don't have access to that directroute, we don't have access to our own to our
(07:41):
own arousal and what turns us on and what wewant, what we don't want, what we like, what we
don't like, what we're willing to do or notwilling to do.
And that's why that conversation on, like,let's meet in the middle never really works
because a lot of times what's happening issomeone's probably pushing past some limit.
They're not really truly coming at it from,like, a desire or a willingness, and that's
never gonna lead to more pleasure, moreenjoyment, or more arousal.
(08:03):
So the very first step is to open that directpathway in the body, that direct route of
pleasure in the body.
So the curiosity I have around that, and then Iwanna get into your, you know, kind of your
other ends here as well, is one of the thingsI've said in my work a lot is the pathway to
pleasure is directly will related to thepathway to presence.
(08:24):
The capacity experience pleasure is directlyrelated to the the capacity to experience
presence.
And I imagine not, you know, knowing exactlythe specifics of your somatic work, but I
imagine that there is an l a huge element, Iwould suspect, of presence.
So when you're talking about this directpathway, does that involve anything, like, with
the ability to actually be present in the bodyto Absolutely.
(08:46):
Experience?
Yeah.
Absolutely.
And that actually is really the fir like, beingpresent in the body is how we start to, access
or or move the debris out of that pathway.
And it's very simple.
So because that's what I hear a lot too.
Like, well, I'm stuck in my head or I haveperformance anxiety.
Right?
You're not you're not present or I can't bepresent.
(09:08):
Yeah.
Everybody can be present.
It's like exercising a muscle.
Right?
And so the very first step to opening thatdirect pathway for pleasure through the body,
through the nerve endings on the skin, it'sactually extremely simple.
And how we do it is by noticing physicalsensation, and all of us have the capacity to
do that.
Now, you know, it might be it's exercising amuscle.
It might take a minute before you can reallystay with physical sensation, but we start by
(09:31):
just noticing what sensation is available to mehere right now.
And we do it in very simple ways, by the way.
Like, we're we don't even really have to startgenitally or, you know, quote unquote sexually.
We start by waking this pathway up even justthrough the hands, by learning how to notice
what sensations are available right now in myhands.
And then we can expand that to what do I noticeright now in my in my body, the weight of the
(09:53):
chair against my back, the feeling of the theair against my skin.
So that immediately is the quickest pathway tothe present moment is to come into physical
sensation.
It's just a shift of our awareness.
That's all we're doing.
So we're not trying to, like, clear ourthoughts or not think of anything or stare at a
blank wall for an hour.
All we're doing is just shifting our awarenessfrom being up in the head in the past, future,
(10:17):
wherever, doing the grocery list to what what'shappening right now?
What's what am I able to notice right now inthis moment in my body as a physical sensation
that brings us into the present?
Yeah.
It's it's one of these things when I've, donelive classes in front of audiences and I ask,
especially women, like, how many of you guyshave ever been thinking about the grocery list
in the middle of doing sex?
(10:38):
How many of you ever, like, had that knowingthe list?
And it's amazing when when people are honestand you see one hand come up in the room and
all of a sudden, like, multiple hands.
And and it's really common.
Right?
Because I think without this training, like,what you do with your clients around that
direct presence and practicing throughout theday, it's like, if we're not practicing that
(10:59):
throughout the day and that's not becoming partof our life around directly present to the
sensations Right.
When we get to the bedroom, that same thingthat's happening all day to keep our mind
wandering all over the places, it's gonnahappen in the bedroom naturally because
Absolutely.
Like you said, we haven't practiced that thatmuscle.
So then what about the other ways of reallyhelping with this, you know, this discrepancy
(11:22):
and these three ends?
Can you talk more about those?
Yeah.
So the very first piece is that getting thatdirect pathway open through being in the body.
And, one thing I wanna say too is we tend tothink of sex as a doing.
Like, we're trying to get to this activity orget to the doing of the thing, the kissing, the
touching, the penetration, whatever.
And what we what really helps is just gettingout of this idea that's doing.
(11:43):
It's not about getting to some particularthing.
If we can slow down and do the noticing partreally well first, that's where pleasure and
arousal start to open up and expand.
So pleasure expands from where we already findit in the body, not from where we try to tell
it to go.
So to answer your question, next piece, once weget that noticing and we get good at that skill
(12:04):
is to name.
So this is about learning to name, not justnaming what I notice, but also when I'm able to
notice, I can start to identify what do I want,what do I need, what do I not want, What am I
willing to do or not do?
So we start to have this finer level ofdiscernment from that connection to our own,
(12:28):
direct pathway of pleasure in the body.
And then we can start to name it.
And when we get that, then we're we're nowclear.
So I can either, you know, I can either name itwithin myself what I would need right now.
Oh, I'm noticing that I need to slow down or Ineed to breathe more deeply, or I might need to
hear certain words from my partner.
Like, I can then advocate for that need or thatdesire.
(12:48):
So there's that piece internally, but we canalso go relationally.
Maybe there's something that I need my partneror want my partner to do or something I would
like to do to my partner.
So we can start to bring that into therelational space.
That's the second n, which leads, you know,sort of organically to what's the third n.
Right?
The third n is that negotiate part.
So negotiate is where either, negotiating formyself, advocating for a desire or need that I
(13:11):
can either give to myself, or relationally,working out that with my partner.
And there's so many ways to do this.
We can do it very directly, verbally.
There's also ways to do negotiation where we'renot using words at all.
Usually, when I'm working with a couple, we'reor or an individual client, we're working with
using words because I think that we can'treally give that piece up until we have gotten
(13:34):
really good at it.
But there's lots of ways to do that negotiatingdance where it might not even involve the use
of explicit direct words.
But learning how to do that directly in a waythat your partner can hear it and you can hear
it and there's no, like, terrible reactionsthat happen, that's where the clarity is
created.
And when there's clarity, there is connectionand there is confidence.
(13:55):
So how do you in, like, that then negotiatestandpoint?
Because I feel like that's such a criticalpart, right, in the couples and the
interrelational.
How do you coach people to begin to have thoseconversations when like, one of the things that
I've seen in studies around these kind ofconversations is, like, anytime we have
conflict conversation and really and research,there's three threats, the threat to the self,
(14:17):
the threat to the partner, the threat to therelationship.
And then in sex, it's interesting in inconversations around sex.
Out of those three threats, the one that is,like, the biggest threat in studies is the
threat to oneself.
So, like, okay.
I'm gonna say to my partner, hey.
I'm gonna negotiate and make this requestaround my need.
Then the threat to the individual is actuallythe biggest thing from the standpoint of, like,
(14:42):
the ego and all these things.
Right?
Because we all wanna provide pleasure to ourpartner, but, you know, like, innately.
So where do you begin, like, in your work to tokind of unpack that negotiating, helping people
have success with it?
Absolutely.
And I I would say that that's where a lot ofcouples get stuck.
We're trying to leap to this negotiating partwhen we haven't developed the first two ends.
(15:04):
We haven't gotten this direct pathway open inour body, and we're not good at noticing.
And so we're directly trying to create a thingthat maybe we maybe we do want it, but we're
not good at the other part of it.
So that part has to happen first before thenegotiating is gonna be good.
And then the other piece is and this is anotherproblem with desire discrepancy and why we have
(15:24):
it is there's couples don't have a proven roadmap.
They don't have a framework.
They don't have mute they don't have a mutualunderstanding or a common language or an actual
lens to be able to see the problem through.
And so that's what I do when I do my couplesretreats.
It's what I'm teaching my couples.
They're learning how to have that foundation sothey have a common language, and they learn how
(15:45):
to see through it's almost just like it's like,once it it gels, it's like, oh my gosh.
Like, I can see it now.
I see why we were having this challenge.
And so a lot of what you're speaking to, thosethreats are drastically reduced because they're
sort of there's a clarity there now, andthere's a mutual understanding of what's
actually going on because my no is not arejection of somebody else.
(16:08):
Right?
And that tends to be how we hear, like, oh mygod.
I've been rejected.
And that's why, you know, why don't we ask forwhat we want?
Well, fear of rejection, fear of being judged,some fear of some sort, usually.
Right?
Fear of being selfish, fear of hurting mypartner's feelings if I speak up for what I
want.
But when we have a common understanding andclarity in terms of what role am I playing,
(16:29):
what role are you playing, whose desire are wefollowing, when that clarity is there and
language is common, the road map is clear, sowe reduce a lot of those perceived threats.
They become less of an issue, and it becomessomething that, ideally, we get really good at
at beginning to manage and have a differentrelationship with.
So that that that's not the stance we're comingfrom.
It's from the threat, the one of those threethreats.
(16:50):
And I love what you said there that the no isnot a rejection.
Right?
And I think even just, like, that simple that'swhy I wanna repeat that because I think that
even that that simple understanding is sopivotal for being like, well, if I don't feel
rejected, this no doesn't mean a rejection,then it allows us to be much more present in
the conversation, I think, curious in theconversation to hear all the other things that
(17:13):
are really at the truth and and put the coupleback together on that same team.
Right?
Yeah.
Absolutely.
And that's the key is sort of that curiosityand that willingness to the a no doesn't have
to be the end of the whole negotiation or thewhole conversation, and that that's what
happens a lot too.
Right?
It's like, oh, that didn't go well.
He didn't want it.
She doesn't want it.
So we're just gonna call the whole thing off,and it doesn't have to be that.
(17:34):
It can be, okay.
You're a no to that request.
So so what else could we come up with thatwould be within your limits right now that you
would be willing to provide or you would bewilling to receive?
Right?
So we work at that level of that's thenegotiating part.
It doesn't have to be the end of theconversation just because someone's a no to
that particular offer at that time.
(17:54):
And I think it's so critical.
Right?
Because we're not taught how to have theseconversations.
So it's just that that framework of how to dothis is is amazing.
And and what about then for women inparticular?
Because I know you specialize both in couplesand women.
And I think one of the problems that women findis, oh my gosh.
Like, I don't even have the desire.
I can't even bring this conversation and get tothe name because I don't even want it.
(18:19):
I was talking to a a friend of mine thisweekend.
I saw her, like, three weeks ago, and she hadjust started she's in perimenopause.
It just started hormones, and she was soexcited.
And she was like, my libido's back on.
Hormones are so fun.
And so that was three weeks ago.
Now this past weekend, I see her again, andshe's like, oh, even with the hormones, her
libido went up, and then it's, like, flatlined.
(18:41):
Right?
So it's stuff that I know we both talk about inour work around, like, hormones are not
everything.
They're important.
We gotta keep balance, but Right.
They're not everything.
So Yeah.
From a standpoint of this desire.
Right?
Like, from a standpoint of what is even gettingsomebody to the conversation to even talk about
the discrepancies or talk about their needs,wants, preferences, all these things.
(19:02):
What do you find for women?
Because we are, you know, very complicatedcreatures in many ways.
What are the what are the root causes of thatlow desire that you find as commonly?
I mean, you know, in in lot of cases, a lot ofwomen are context oriented contextually, so
we're you know, there's something calledcontextual desire, contextual arousal, where
it's really about what's happening in ourenvironment, how are we feeling about our body
(19:23):
that day, how do we feel about ourrelationship, did something happen at work
yesterday that didn't go well.
So it's we're very plugged into our contextgenerally.
So that can absolutely have an impact on awoman's libido and interest in sex.
But there's also other factors that come intoplay here, and first of all, I really think
it's a myth there's this myth out there that,like, women don't want sex as much as men, and
women are always the lower desire partners.
(19:44):
It's not always true.
Like, that was true very much in my story.
I totally understand that place, which is why,you know, really love the whole conversation on
women's sexuality.
But it doesn't have to be because what'shappening is though there's several things.
One of the things that happens a lot of timesis as women, we don't know our bodies, and we
and our partners probably don't either.
(20:05):
But our bodies have the same amount of erectiletissue as a man's body.
It's just spread out over a larger area.
We tend to need, on average, what the studieshave shown on average, it's twenty one or more
minutes of, we could say, foreplay stimulationof some sort before we'll be consistently
orgasmic during penetrative sex.
So there's that.
So if we're not giving our bodies time toactually warm up and really be, like, really
(20:30):
ready, get us out of our head, get thosetissues engorged, get us in a place where
we're, you know, not doing the grocery listanymore.
That takes time because we are plugged into ourprefrontal cortex.
It's the wrong part of the brain for sexualarousal.
We wanna be in the parasympathetic nervoussystem where the the prefrontal cortex is
quieted, the brain waves slow down to alpha ortheta waves, not the beta, which is the doing
(20:50):
mind.
So there's that piece that's happening thatthat over time, if we continue to not
understand that or not honor the difference inour body, it will lead to a a loss of interest
in sex over time.
The next piece that tends to happen is that itdepends on what study you consult, but most men
ejaculate in the first two to seven minutes ofpenetrative sex.
(21:10):
And so you can see here the disconnect.
Right?
Like, a woman needs 21 of even just foreplaybefore penetration even happens, much less who
knows, you know, once we're in there, ifpenetration is part of your sexual repertoire,
and and it's all over in two minutes, let'ssay, that is not enough time for her to really
drop into what's possible for her.
(21:32):
So that can lead to just a disinterest and ashutdown in sex over time where it just becomes
about the man.
Let me just give it to him because it's what hewants.
There's really nothing in it for her at thatpoint.
The last piece here is emotional connection.
If that piece is offline, we're not feelingconnected to our partner or, you know, again,
the contextual piece, something happened atwork or, you know, bad you know, just kinda not
(21:56):
feeling great about my body that day or how Ilook, how I smell.
Like, those things all impact our ability toreally relax and show up and feel good where
we're getting something from the sexualencounter versus it just being for the man.
Yeah.
I so well say.
I think one of the things that that females andmen just from a standpoint of, like, the brain
(22:16):
function of this such a hard time understandingthe other is, like, the ability of the man to,
like, just focus so much.
And so it's so easy to compartmentalize, right,of, like, okay.
I had a bad day, but I'm putting that overhere.
And right now, I have my sex brain on.
And, like and I think for women, it's like,well, what do you mean?
Like, it's all, like, because of women'sability to have this diffuse awareness and take
(22:37):
in so much information at once.
Yeah.
Either these
are good or bad.
They're just different, you know, skill setsand strains.
Right?
And I think it's one of those things where it'slike, because of that, because there's so much
information coming in for the female brain allthe time Yeah.
It does take time for it to reroute and to dropinto that.
And without knowing it, it can be as simple as,like, well, I asked my partner to take out the
(23:01):
trash this morning, and he didn't.
And now I feel like I'm doing everything.
We make up stories, and then we go down this,Yeah.
This rabbit hole.
So I think it's really, you know, reallyimportant to, you know, look at all those
things you're talking about and getting out ofthat you know, the head there and into into the
body.
And so totally.
(23:21):
Then tell us a little bit too because I'mreally curious from a standpoint since one of
your focuses is is really in this bridgebetween spirituality and sexuality.
So how do you begin to bring the thespirituality into sexuality, and what does that
really look like for you?
Yeah.
And, you know, the answer to that is actuallyvery simple, and it's not gonna sound spiritual
(23:42):
at all.
But I mean, when we're in the when we're in thepresent moment here now, which some of that is
a somatic piece.
Right?
It's like, am I here in my body right nowfeeling what there is to feel in this moment?
That's an aspect of it.
The other piece is just the coming into theright now moment brings us into true.
Truth is one of the things that brings us intothe right now moment.
And that piece is like, can I really be honestand truthful with myself right now?
(24:03):
What am I actually feeling in my body?
How am I feeling right now about this moment orwhat happened between me and my partner?
What is it that I really need right now?
What's actually happening in this moment?
Giving myself complete and total permission tofeel that thing even if it's ugly.
Right?
A lot of times, it's ugly.
It's like, no.
Like, I don't wanna admit that I'm reallypissed off or I'm really angry or I'm feeling
(24:24):
really jealous.
You know, like, we're tagging one of the we didnot want we'll admit the other things.
Oh, I'm hurt or I'm angry, but, you know, wedon't wanna admit the ugly stuff.
So it's a matter of can I be honest andtruthful of that in myself, and then am I
willing to bring that into the relational spaceand to be witnessed in that, to bring that in
relationally as the truth of I feel this rightnow?
(24:45):
When that happened, I experienced it like this.
Like, really bringing the truth in brings usinto the present moment, and there's nothing
more spiritual than the right now moment.
So that's really what the spirituality piece isabout, which is very, you know, it's not woo
woo.
That's not very new age.
That's just, like, right here, right now,what's happening.
You bring truth in.
I promise you, you're gonna have more passionin your relationship.
(25:07):
You're definitely gonna start to feel more.
More stuff is good.
If you're feeling stuck and stagnant, juststart telling the truth.
That's gonna shift things up real quick.
And I think you're so right about those kindaugly things.
Right?
I think even as, like, children, we're notreally taught sometimes to be like,
disappointment's a normal human emotion.
Like, embarrassment's a normal human emotion.
(25:27):
Even things like jealousy are normal humanemotions.
Right?
These come up for for humans, and it's notpersonal.
And I think the just like you and I are workingto make the conversation around sex less less
taboo and just more of like, hey.
How do we talk about this in a really healthyway?
Same thing for these types of emotions.
Like so I really appreciate that and, like,just naming around.
(25:48):
Like, I'm a little embarrassed about this or Ifeel this and being able to be in the present
with those emotions because the more I thinkwe're dropping into the present and practicing
that in our life, the more, I think it like Isaid, it it just it just goes into the the
practice of sexuality in the bedroom as well.
Yeah.
And it's really
you know, the spiritual practice of love is apractice of I like to use the word embrace.
(26:13):
So it's not about, let me deny this bad feelingand move on to the next thing or get to the
good feeling.
That's denial.
That's always gonna take us further away fromconnection, from love, and also from pleasure
and from orgasmic experiences, at least what'sreally available to us, which is much more than
just, you know, the climax most of us arefamiliar with.
It's a lot more available.
So the practice of embrace is a spiritualpractice of love where we're saying yes to
(26:34):
everything that arises in the moment,everything including the shame, the jealousy,
the anger, the hatred, the rage, and the love,the pleasure, the joy, the bliss, the
silliness, all of it.
We're able to embrace and say yes.
Oh, that is one of the most profound andsimplest spiritual practices available that,
you know, it truly can move the needle if we'rewilling to be that courageous and take that on
(26:57):
as a practice.
And I think with that, I think one of thethings and I wanna, save the answer to this for
our part two and tell our listeners how to getto part two as well.
Because I think one of the things that peoplestruggle with in what you're talking about is
almost as both and approach.
Right?
How can I experience in life?
How can I maybe experience something likejealousy or embarrassment or whatever it is,
(27:22):
but also experience connection and love at thesame time?
And it's like Yeah.
You know, we get stuck in this either or whenwe're way more dynamic of of humans than that.
And so I I'd like to get into, like, how wereally deal with, like, the the paradox around
the emotion and how that applies to sex andsexuality.
Yeah.
And I know we're also gonna talk in part two,like, the number one question that every couple
(27:46):
should know the answer for.
So as I'm really so I'm really curious aboutyour number one question and what people should
know the answer for.
So for everybody that's listening, part two isgoing to be accessible by joining our libido
club.
So if you go into the show notes, you'll seehow to join the libido club and where we're
featuring other guests like Susan and yourmonthly ability to get your sex education
(28:10):
techniques, so much more.
And so look in the show notes for that.
But I also wanna make sure before we wrap upthis part one that people know how to get ahold
of you.
I know you have your Pleasure Keys ebook onyour website.
We're gonna put that in the show notes as wellas your connection code monthly class and
information about that.
So all of the links of working with Susan willbe in the show notes.
(28:33):
But tell us a little bit more about your yourfree ebook as well as I wanna make sure
everybody knows about these retreats you'redoing because you guys I've looked at Susan's
website and the retreats, and these are just,like, I feel like genius ways that she's
bringing couples together for ways of very andvery classy ways of helping couples go through
(28:53):
these kind of conversations that we're havingtoday and getting the support they need in real
time.
Because, of course, we're talking about thishere, but if we don't practice it, you know,
nothing really works.
We gotta put this stuff into practice, andthat's some of what Susan's doing in her
retreat.
So tell us a little bit more about yourretreats of your word as well as your free
ebook giveaway.
Yeah.
Absolutely.
So ebook is available at pleasurekeys.com.
(29:15):
And what's really cool about the ebook is thatyou were talking about this piece of presence
and how do we do that.
That ebook is gonna tell you how to do that.
So it's the three keys to deepening pleasure,increasing your orgasmic potential, and
creating mutual sexual fulfillment, And that'sat pleasurekeys.com.
So I hope everyone will grab a copy of that,and it'll give you a little bit more of, like,
the how to of some of what we talked abouttoday, Diane.
(29:36):
And then, yes, the retreats are fabulous.
The Pleasure Keys retreats, and all theinformation for those retreats are on my main
website at pathwaytopleasure.com.
Our next one is coming up here in '20 well, Ido them several times a year.
We do have one coming up here in a couple ofmonths, but they happen several times a year.
And it's a beautiful way to get away from thecraziness of your life and to really dive deep
(30:00):
into the experiential learning that needs tohappen if we're really gonna move the needle
with, coming back into deeper connection andsolving this issue of mismatched sexual desire.
And I wanna say, you know, at the retreats,they are there's no it's all nonsexual,
actually.
It'll improve your sex life in everyrelationship you have.
We're not you know, there's no getting naked.
(30:20):
There's no sexual touching really that happensat the retreats.
But what you're learning is the the commonlanguage, the skill set, and this proven road
map that you're gonna be able to use movingforward for the rest of your life, the rest of
your relationship, future relationships,etcetera.
It's it's the most effective way I found toreally help couples move the needle, getting
that immersive format.
(30:41):
And then I also do a monthly master class, afree master class called the connection code on
the five keys to deepen the connection andresolve the mismatched libido for good.
And that information, again, is just on my mainwebsite at pathwaytopleasure.com.
Perfect.
Thank you for all of those offerings.
And you guys, again, we'll have all of that inthe show notes.
I hope you will get download these, you know,these free gifts.
(31:02):
Go check out the retreat.
Please go check out the retreat.
And make sure you look for the libido club aswell below so that you can get part two because
we gotta know this question that every coupleshould know the answer to, and we're gonna talk
about that paradox, pleasure, somaticexperience, and more in our libido club
meeting.
So thank you so much for being here with metoday.
(31:22):
It's been a true pleasure, and thank youeverybody for being on another episode of the
lounge.
Thank you for listening to the libido lounge.
Please don't keep me a secret.
Please share this with your friends.
You can find me on YouTube, on Instagram, aswell as how to work with me at mylibidodoc.com.
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