146 Breaking Barriers: Women in Hunting and Conservation with Renée Thornton

MAC Outdoors with Mia Anstine brings an inspiring episode featuring Renee Thornton, the dedicated founder of the Women Hunt program of the Wild Sheep Foundation. This episode is a must-listen for anyone passionate or intrigued about hunting, wildlife conservation, or empowering women in the outdoors.

Today, we discuss the dynamic expansion of the Women Hunt program, which offers new and experienced female hunters unparalleled opportunities to engage, learn, and thrive within the hunting community. The program stands out for its inclusive approach, providing mentorship, skills training, and community building, all while emphasizing the importance of wildlife conservation.

This episode offers a blend of personal stories, expert advice, and an empowering message to women passionate about hunting and the outdoors. Discover how the Women Hunt program shapes the future of hunting and conservation, providing a platform for women to connect, learn, and inspire.

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IMPORTANT LINKS:
Kootenai Anglers, Dave Blackburn https://goflyfishmontana.com/
Episode 95 Wild Horses https://miaanstine.com/2023/03/15/mac-outdoors-podcast-94-2/
Beyond Bonds https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjh2X2vXfjo
Women Hunt https://wlidsheepfoundtion.org/womenhunt

Episode Transcript

(00:01):
She's an award winning writer, a hunting guide, archery and rifle instructor,
keynote speaker, and all around outdoors woman who encourages
you to get outside, hunt, fish, shoot and savor all that life has to
offer. And now, here's your host, Mia Anstein.
Well, hey. Hi. Hello. I'm so happy to be visiting with you again

(00:21):
today. I'm super excited to be sharing another guest with
you that I wanted to learn from, and I figured you could learn while I
was learning. So hopefully I will get all of your questions answered.
And if you learned something that you think someone else should know
about, I hope you'll share the episode with them and
also share information for women, Hunt

(00:43):
and the Wild Sheep foundation. As always, I will include
important links in the show notes and if you're interested, you can tune in
and watch the episode on YouTube or just listen on
whatever your favorite podcast player is. If it's your first
time here, thank you for stopping by and I hope that you'll subscribe before you
go, I wanted to talk to you a little bit before we

(01:05):
get going about mentoring and
also owning your greatness. Because this is something that we talk about today in an
episode. And if you're having a
struggle or a hard time knowing how great you
are, this is something that you can go to different
organizations, different groups, you can attend these community

(01:27):
events and learn from others. But while you're learning
from them, you're also mentoring and empowering them as well.
So share your greatness with others. That is something that I think
whether you're a man, woman, youngster, no matter how old you
are, share your greatness with others. You are super special
and you need to find a way to own and embrace

(01:49):
the qualities that you have within. I hope you enjoy
today's show. If you have questions or comments, please reach out
on social media. You can find us on Facebook,
Instagram and most social media outlets. Or you can email.
The email address is contact.
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(02:57):
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Anstine for 10% off your order. Okay,
you all, today, I'm super excited to have a guest
that we've been playing tag. We've been juggling around with appointments
and then colds and different stuff going on, but we finally

(03:19):
connected and we're so excited to share a new
organization and we'll find out just how new. But
Renee, would you please introduce yourself to my audience and
let them know who you are and what you do? Yeah. Thanks so much, Mia,
and I'm so glad we finally able to connect and I'm excited to talk to
you today. I love your podcast. So, yes, my name is Renee

(03:40):
Thornton. I live in the beautiful state of Montana, and I'm
the founder of a program of the Wild Sheep foundation. It's called
Women Hunt. And we also have an initiative called Women in
Hunting. And I was, I
am a Canadian. I'm also now an Americana. I hold dual citizenship.
And when I was living in Canada before I moved here in

(04:02):
2019, I was a middle aged,
mid forties women who decided to
learn to hunt. And I had to do that on my own. I didn't know
anybody who did it, and I had to pathfind my way. And
it's, you know, that's a whole other story. But
it's the reason why this program got started to begin with.

(04:23):
And I really love engaging
women who have curiosity or interest in learning to hunt, hunt, and
also, of course, with experienced female hunters, too. But that was
the genesis of the creation of this program. And we just
love engaging, educating,
empowering, and inspiring women, like so many other great women out there

(04:45):
who do things for empowering women.
Yeah. And so, as I said, I had so many questions,
but with the wild Sheep foundation,
how did it come about? Like, did you and a group of other
ladies, you saw a need or how did this come to be?
Yeah. So let's see. I have to try

(05:08):
to synthesize a really long story. So I was working in
downtown Calgary in southern Alberta, and I like to fly
fish as well. I love fly fishing. And so in the summertime, I
have a great fly fishing guide up in Libby, Montana, on the
Kootenay river. I'll give him a plug. I just love him. Dave
Blackburn with kootenay anglers. But anyway, I would every summer book a fly

(05:30):
fishing trip with him and drive the 4 hours from Calgary to Libby and
fly fish. And I was on this whole new journey of trying to figure out
how to hunt and how to prepare myself for that and train. And
I started in the city of Calgary, joining local
hunting clubs to try to make some friends and some connections. And
that's how I started. I just joined these hunting clubs. I'd show

(05:53):
up, didn't ask for a thing for over a year, ever asked for
anything. I said, hi, I'm new to hunting. I'd like to make friends and connections.
How can I help you? And one of the organizations
I joined in the province of Alberta was the Alberta chapter of
the Wild Sheep foundation. So, you know, I know that in
Colorado where you live, you know what wild sheep are, but a lot of

(06:15):
people don't. You know, a lot of people in different parts of the United States
and eastern Canada haven't seen a wild sheep, don't really know what it is.
So, you know, for people's benefits, we're talking about Rocky
Mountain bighorn sheep, desert bighorn sheep in our
thin horn ranges up in Alaska and the Yukon
NWT in British Columbia. We're talking about stone sheep and dull

(06:36):
sheep. Right? But we have them in Alberta. I grew up around them.
I love them. They're my favorite wildlife species. So it was natural for me to
join that chapter. And in any case,
the world headquarters of the Wild Sheep foundation
is in Bozeman, Montana. And I was fly fishing the summer of
2018 in Libby. And I looked on the Wild

(06:58):
Sheep foundation foundation website, and I saw that they were having this open house. So
I came down, I volunteered at the open house, and I got to meet all
the staff and over 400 members who were there for this open house
and outfitters and guides. And. And I met, most
importantly, the past chairman of the board of the Wild Sheep Foundation, a
man named Brett Jefferson from Nevada. And he had come up for it, and

(07:21):
we had a chance at that open house to sit down for quite a while.
He was really interested about how I went about
in my mid forties on my own, figuring out how to hunt.
And through that conversation, he then approached the president and
CEO of the Wild Sheep Foundation, Gray Thornton. And he
said, did you get a chance to meet Renee Halloon from Calgary?

(07:42):
And she's a new, newer member? And he said, yeah, we were introduced. And he
said, well, I want you to sit down with her and listen to her story,
because it's remarkable how
she's figured this out on her own. And I think it's time for the Wallchief
foundation to do something to help more women. So that's kind of
how it happened. It just was really organically, through my own. Pursuing my

(08:03):
own passions, showing up to volunteer at this
open house, having the good luck, the timing is everything
sometimes, as we know, meeting that chairman, he was
interested, and the foundation was ready to do something. So
they then approached me about a week or two later, formally, and
asked me if I would create a program. So that's

(08:25):
how it started. It was just really
organic. Yeah, it sounds organic.
And I just think it's wonderful that you took it upon
yourself to just go after this, basically
becoming involved and wanting to learn. And also, I think it's
very fortunate that somebody saw

(08:47):
that in you, and they saw that you could be somebody who could
motivate other people or inspire them and stuff like that. I think
those, I don't think are accidental. I think it's something I'm sure that was
meant to be, at least in my mind. I'm like, it has to be something
that's meant to be. But when we're thinking
about going after others, as I said, there's always so many things

(09:09):
that come to mind, but. So you have
always loved sheep. And I kind of cling on to that because
everyone always asks, like, what is a dream hunt for you? And Bighorn
sheep have always been, they're just an iconic animal,
and I'm not a member of the Wild sheep foundation or
anything like that, but. But it's something that, it's just an iconic

(09:31):
animal, and they're like, what's your dream hunt? And it's Marco Polo. I would love
to go, and I'm not, like, working toward that,
but it's always like, if there was one hunt that somebody could take you on,
that would be the one. And do you hunt
bighorn sheep, or are you just really concerned about their populations
and the management of them? Well, yeah, the conservation of wild

(09:53):
sheep is, you know, primary for me, and that's the purpose of the wild Sheep
foundation, you know, and I just. Just for your
listeners, I don't work for the foundation. I'm a volunteer,
and my committee is all volunteer based, you know, so there is more
educated people who can talk about the foundation and what they do. But, you know,
in Cole's notes, what they do is their purpose is to put and keep

(10:14):
wild sheep on the mountain. So certainly the conservation of wild sheep is
foremost in my mind. Have I actually hunted wild sheep
yet? No, I haven't, but I'm aspiring
sheep hunter, and I will start to hunt them. You know, I kind of
lost out on this window because, you know, in Alberta, we're
really lucky. We can, as a resident of Alberta, you can buy an over

(10:37):
the counter tag to hunt Rocky Mountain bighorn.
You can also do that in the province of BC. And the only
state you can do it in Alaska and the only state south of the
parallel that you can do over the counter is in the state of Montana. But
it's a restricted, unlimited area everywhere else, you have to put in for
draws. And as anybody who has experience doing that, it's really

(11:00):
tough to get drawn. Right, so.
But I wasn't ready to hunt wild sheep when I lived in Alberta. I was
a really new hunter. I didn't have a lot of experience. I suppose I
could have done it, but I didn't feel comfortable embarking on that kind of
hunt. You know, it's really challenging, mentally, physically. So I
just wasn't ready. And then, you know, through that, this

(11:22):
path of starting women hunt, I ended up
marrying Gray, the CEO of Wild Sheep foundation.
And then I relocated to the United States in late 2019,
and I lost this opportunity to hunt over the counter
sheep in Alberta. But that's okay. I'll get there. And
I'm saving my pennies to buy a hunt. You know, there's lots of ways to

(11:44):
do it, as we know. But, yeah, my dream
hunt is actually stone sheep. They're my favorite wild
sheep in North America. I love them. They're beautiful. And
that's the one I'm working towards. Yeah. What do you think it is
about the sheep that are so magnificent?
What draws you to that? You know, I think that

(12:06):
people, you know, just are in awe of a
species that can live in such harsh environments,
at such tremendous elevations,
survive such brutal conditions.
And, you know, there's something about the rams with their
beautiful curling horns and, you know, when they're in the rut

(12:29):
and they smash their heads together in that demonstration
of power to dominate each other
and breed the preferred breeding ram
for the ewes, you know, I mean, it is something, if you've never seen it
or heard that sound, it's something to just be in awe of.
And I think there's a lot of aspects of that that really

(12:50):
are powerful and moving for people. Yeah.
And I specifically asked you that because people have asked
me that in the past. When I say like that, it's iconic. I mean, I
grew up in Colorado and in southern California, and
it's something that I don't know exactly. I can't pinpoint
exactly where the fascination with the bighorn sheep came

(13:13):
from. I mean, it is the state animal for Colorado, so maybe that
is it for me. But it is like, just like what you
said, the smashing of their heads, their skulls
together when they're fighting for the
women. We were elk hunting one time, and you could just hear this
smashing, and it was echoing through the valley.

(13:35):
And, you know, at first we were like, what is that sound? Is it boulders
falling? What's going on? And then we realized they were on a bench up above
where we were hunting. And it is incredible.
It's just amazing. So I know a lot of people are like, we want to
hear the wolves howl in the wild and stuff like that. And it's like, I
don't know about the wolf howling, but the ramsden is really

(13:56):
cool.
So thank you for giving me your perspective and outlook on
why you think they're amazing. I also think they're amazing
because of their stature, their muscular build.
I was very impressed the first time I was up close one. I've never hunted
one. My husband got to hunt some, but the way

(14:17):
they're built is. It's amazing. It's phenomenal.
They're just. Their whole structure. And, you know, I think,
too, like, to some degree, although this might not be the case for everybody, like,
there's something about the conservation of wild sheep. It's so
different than other north american species. You know, we all are. Most of
us are familiar with the fact that through a whole bunch of reasons,

(14:40):
most wildlife in North America was really perilously close
to being extirpated and great giants,
both male and female, at the turn of the century, by creating the north
american model, or what we call the north american model today, we're really
instrumental in bringing in conservation practices that
brought back populations of wildlife species from white tailed deer to elk

(15:02):
to turkey to, you name it. And the one species that's
really struggled in recovery is the wild sheep. And there's lots of reasons
for that, and primarily it's disease. They're really vulnerable to
disease issues. The second one is habitat encroachment. There's
also predation. Right. And so
the wild sheep foundation has been at the forefront of conservation organizations and

(15:25):
the recovery of the species since the sixties and seventies when they were at the
lowest they'd ever been. Now, you know, I'm talking about less than
20,000 sheep across the continent. Now, through their efforts,
we're looking at wild sheep populations that are back at around 80,000,
which is a great recovery in a fairly short period of time, but they
really have,

(15:50):
they're less able to recover more quickly than these other species
have. And so I think for me, too, that's part of the attraction
to wild sheep is that they're not actually that abundant. You know, they're
abundant enough that we can hunt them because we have wildlife management
professionals who manage those populations and numbers. But that's why they're so
challenging to draw. You know, it's because they're being properly managed. And

(16:12):
I think that that's part of the appeal, is that there, there's not many of
them on the landscape. So when you see them, it's special. Right. That is
something special. Thinking of that, in past episodes,
I have talked about conservation quite a bit. It. But
thinking of an animal that is recovering the way the sheep
are, how do you. What are your thoughts about,

(16:34):
especially being a newer hunter? I mean, I grew up in a hunting family
for generations of hunting. What are your thoughts about
this animal? How does hunting of them fit in with the
conservation of them? Oh, gosh. Wow. That's a great question.
You know, we're really proud at the Wild Sheep foundation to
be the premier organization to raffle off or auction off,

(16:56):
rather, governor and minister tags at our
annual sheep show in Reno in January. And, you know, if there's one thing
your listeners need to know, is that wild sheep hunters are wild
sheep, cuckoo nuts. Like, they are the most enthusiastic,
passionate group of people you've ever met. And
the, you know, I know that there's a lot of controversy around the topic

(17:18):
of selling permits, right? But the simple fact of the
matter, I am pro, I'm in the pro column here for
conservation permits being sold at auction because the
men and the women who have the means to pay
$600,000 for the opportunity, let's
remember, it's just an opportunity to hunt. It's not a guarantee. You know,

(17:40):
those people who have those means, they. The percentage
of that amount that that represents, let's say whether it's
400,000, 506,000, whatever that amount is,
it is significantly higher than the percentages
that the regular, the rest of us contribute on an
individual basis. So that single tag,

(18:02):
the income from that sale goes back
to that state, provincial or territorial agency for the management of
wild sheep. And so their contributions alone,
right there, are doing tremendous work to make sure that those agencies are
still funded, they can still hire people to manage their resource.
And so how does hunting play into a species that's

(18:25):
maybe not recovering as quickly as others, or is recovering but
more slowly, you know, it's critical. And for every one
of us, the rest of us who aren't in those positions to buy those tags,
we're still buying the opportunity every year when we put in further draws, we're supporting,
even though it's, you know, a slim chance.
And, you know, that's, well, we can talk about hours about the

(18:47):
contributions that hunters make to wildlife conservation and how grossly
misunderstood that is in the general population. Right. But
the, you know, that's a, like a little bit of my answer there. I could
just talk for hours, though. Mia. Yeah. And I didn't mean to ask that question
to put you on the spot. It's just something that I know
some people don't fully understand how

(19:09):
that goes together. And especially like in
Colorado this year, we have a ballot initiative to eliminate mountain lion
hunting potentially, and bobcats. And
I told you, I lived in California, I lived in San Diego. I went to
college over there. And while I was there, they had eliminated
mountain lion hunting. And it's like now they don't have that revenue from the hunters

(19:31):
buying those hunting licenses. So there's a whole
lot, as you said, we could talk all four days about that.
I wasn't trying to put you on the spot. Not at all. No,
for the listeners, it's very well managed, but there's also a
whole process of things that go together with this.
And also, I will put a link in the show notes. We

(19:54):
talked to a gentleman from Nevada
that works for the agency there in an episode about
wild horses because at the National assembly of Sportsmen's
caucuses that the congressional sportsman's foundation puts on, Gray
spoke there about the need
for the science and the management to

(20:17):
help prevent disease with the sheep herds. But we
also talked about the wild horses because they're impacting the sheep in
Nevada really bad. So you mentioned the habitat, but I'll put a
link to that episode for you all to listen to if you want to go
back and check that out and learn about how everything
impacts one another. But thank you for giving us a background on

(20:39):
that. And so can you tell us more? I really
wanted to learn about women hunt and what you're doing and
what the goals are and all that. Can you give us some overview of it?
You bet. So, you know, like I said, this all came about from
my personal experience. So our initial focus has been really on
the newer, newer hunter. Right. And getting those women

(21:01):
involved. And we've been super successful.
And we really launched formally in 2021, even though this
all went back to 2018. It took some time to get traction, understand, from
our community what they wanted. We got interrupted with COVID You know, there were a
lot of things going on there. So when I talk about launching,
I say that we launched in 2021. And so that's been our primary

(21:24):
focus so far. So we, we really specialize in training
newer, newer hunters. We partner with an excellent facility
in the hill country of Texas. We select women
through what I call a competitive
application based process. It's fully funded by our
very generous donors and sponsors, the women who get chosen through this

(21:46):
application process. It's super competitive, as you can imagine.
So it's international. We get applications
outside of the US. And
as a matter of fact, we're in the middle of assessment right now for this
class this year. And we have our first applicant from outside of North
America, from Australia. So we'll see how she does in her assessment. But

(22:07):
anyway, we picked these women through this blind assessment. We
don't know their names. We don't know their ages. We don't know their race or
if they identify a disability or if they identify their religion, all
of that gets removed if they identify it, and then we do a blind
assessment. So we've been really blessed over the last three years to get this great
diversity in our women. And I know you, you've talked

(22:29):
about that on some of your podcasts in the back, but I love seeing women
in all ages. You know, we've had women into their sixties who are getting into
hunting. We have had women with disabilities,
women of different races and ethnicities. You know, so it's been
really, really validating to
me when I think about why women want to start hunting. And, you know, and

(22:51):
even since I started get going in late 2016, 2017,
it's not that long ago or 2024, but even in that
timeframe, I can't believe the growth in women and hunting. And
it's really validating to me when I see this cross section in
demographics. This is really evidence that this is
just, we're programmed for this. It's in our nature,

(23:14):
and I really believe that. So our primary focus has
been to engage, educate, empower and inspire these
women. And our program right now has three prongs. We send them on
skills training. When they come out of it, we work with our chapter and
affiliate network to find a mentor for them so they have somebody to support
them. Really critical, as you know. You know, you can take all the training you

(23:35):
want if you don't have somebody to take you out hunting or shooting, sometimes that
can be pretty demoralizing. So we set them up with a hunter or a mentor,
and then the third prong is all about giving back. And this is where things
get really exciting from my perspective. Yeah. And
so these women, like I said, they get this unbelievable five day training.
They learn it doesn't even matter if they've ever touched a firearm before.

(23:57):
Does not matter. This facility is, is operated by some
of the world's best instructors, retired us special
forces. They're expert hunters as well. And the women get
taught everything from firearms basics
to cleaning their firearm to
shooting, not just accurately, but consistently to

(24:19):
300 yards, positional
shooting, blood trailing,
game identification, shock placement. They go out and hunt four times.
During the course of the hunt, they got taught field dressing,
butchering. We bring in a chef from San Antonio who specializes
in wild game preparation, Joshua Schwanke with gastronomy

(24:41):
outdoors. So he teaches them how to prepare wild game, which
often can be intimidating for somebody who's never done it, you know,
so they get that all through the generosity of our sponsors and donors.
So a condition, and they have to acknowledge this
when they apply, is that they are expected to give back. So we're really excited
about what we're giving back in the three classes we've, we've put through

(25:03):
so far. What these women are doing in their home states, provinces and territories
is amazing. Like, they are now touching hundreds, if not thousands of
lives. And they all have different personalities and strengths and interests. So they're
all doing different things. Some of them are doing legislative things, some of them are
doing skills training. Some of them are passionate about the model and
talk about that. Others, you know, are engaging youth, other

(25:25):
women, men, you know, it's really tremendous.
So the impact and that,
you know, that social capital that gets built through the
voices of women is the most exciting aspect, in my
opinion, about our approach to engaging new female hunters. You
know, but we also are now

(25:48):
starting to really build and get traction. We've got lots of people stepping up saying
we want to help, you know, and so we're now going to be expanding
our programming base for more opportunities for women who
don't fit that newer, newer hunter narrative
and who are more experienced. So we're building a really strong
community behind women in hunting, and we're also

(26:10):
building other skills and hunting opportunities, shooting
opportunities. We have a whole
part of our program dedicated to the memory of one
of our members who died tragically last year. A young mother,
the wife of one of our prominent members in Alaska. She was like the
light of the Wild Sheep foundation. She would come to our sheep show. Everybody loved,

(26:33):
loved Ruby. Her name was Ruby. Ruby Mayflower Blake and
her husband Derek, their daughter was three months
old when Ruby passed in a tragic
accident. And Derek, you know, he
approached Gray as the CEO and me as the chair of
women hunt.

(26:55):
I mean, within about six months after Ruby passed. And he said,
I really would like to work with you guys to form
something within the women hunt program for
Ruby's memory. And he said, I'd like to build
something, a legacy fund that will allow us to give
hunting and outdoor opportunities to women who survived

(27:17):
domestic violence or other traumas and abuses. Ruby
had that background from a previous marriage, and so he was really
familiar with the difficulty in her recovery
from that. Right. And how the outdoors really helped her in her healing journey,
which so many of us can relate to. When we get outside, it feels good,
it fills our souls, and it can really help people on healing journeys

(27:38):
of all kinds. Right. So we're so proud. We just
launched the Ruby Mayflower Blake Legacy Fund. Derek
has built a committee. We've got some real heavy hitters on there. Jana
Waller, Chris. Not Christy Titus. I apologize. Christy Titus
is a great supporter of women hunt, but, sorry,
Julie McQueen, Brittany Boddington,

(28:01):
and myself and Derek. And so we're going to launch this fall,
and we're just finishing up the application process for that. But
it's going to be a dedicated. It is a dedicated fund under women
hunt in Ribby's memory. And we're really
excited about that. So, you know, we're really going to start
expanding and growing in different ways to hit different parts of our

(28:23):
women hunt community and our women in hunting community, and
we're really excited for what's going to come. Yeah, it
sounds like you guys are doing amazing things and you're
covering so many aspects of the
outreach that, I mean, there's. I've interviewed a lot of different people on this
show, and some people are focused on this one thing and this one

(28:45):
thing. But I love how you have such a well rounded program
and from start to finish, but then to go beyond
and to provide them
requirement to mentor or share with others
when they. When they finished. And I think that is a key
to the whole picture of conservation,

(29:06):
because just like we're talking about people not understanding, why would
you want to hunt a sheep? You know, when we're
talking about that, we have. With what I'm involved with several
organizations, but with one of them that we do in January
before shot show, we did a women's waterfowl hunt. And the biggest
thing for me with that and wherever I like the idea that you have

(29:28):
some hunters maybe that have a little experience is
we had this waterfowl hunt was for newer, newer hunters. But
some of them that at least were in my group that I took
out, they had more experience than me
and they knew what they were doing. They just hadn't gotten to do it
on their own. And so basically, like, through the program, the second

(29:51):
day, I was like, okay, you ladies call the shots and
you do this and kind of just give them the grace
to know that, to empower them to
just like, seize their strength. And they did. And it's just
amazing to watch that, to see them get their wings and fly
and hopefully through that, they're going to be giving back, like, what

(30:13):
you're saying. And so I love that you're
going to maybe have some newer ones that maybe they don't really
realize how great they are either. It's like, you know, own your greatness.
Yes. That's a great point. Yeah, I love that.
Yeah. And going to some of those that go to the
legislative stuff, that is a big one.

(30:35):
And it's something I work a lot on. And this year, I
haven't had a lot of time to do that, but it's nice to see that
maybe there are some other people that are going to take those reins and start
helping be a voice for not just hunting, but for women
and hunting. Right. And that's what you guys are
creating. And I just love it. One question that I had when you were

(30:57):
talking about Janna Waller and Julie McQueen and Brittany
Boddington, as soon as you said that you're working with
a group in Texas, are you working with the same group that Brittany
works with for her? She hunts. Even so, we know
it's the. I'm sorry, I guess I forgot to say the name. Sorry.
It's the. The FTW ranch. Okay.

(31:19):
Yeah. And they specialize. They've been around for over
20 years. Tim Fallon, the Fallon family built that facility.
It's about 14,000 acres, and they have multiple
different ranges, and they also have whitetail and exotic
species for hunting opportunities. And as I mentioned,
Tim and the Fallon family employ retired special

(31:42):
forces instructors and
they do civilian training like this, but they also
do a lot of military training. They have military contracts with not just
the us government, but foreign governments as well for sniper training.
And they're just exceptional. But no, Britney's she hunts program is

(32:02):
awesome. And she does great things. And I love
that. Mia, I love. How many of us are out there trying to do
more for more women, to get more women involved? And you
talked about the legislative aspect and if I could just for a minute, you know,
this is, this is so important. I
mean, sometimes I get asked the question, why

(32:24):
are you focusing on women? You should be focusing on youth. Youth are the future.
And to me, there's no separation. They're, they're synonymous.
They, they're melt together. And this is what I think about, you know, this is
how I typically respond is, you know, they are not mutually
exclusive. Women bring the family, the
whole family. What women do, they bring the whole family.

(32:46):
That's everybody. And so
there's space for both communities, space for
providing opportunities for both. And that's another thing
we're going to be working on. We've been hearing from moms and dads, hey,
Renee, can you do more for the young hunters? So we're also going to be
working on those opportunities. There's always challenges with that,

(33:08):
with making sure that they have a guardian with them. We don't want to get
into being responsible and liable for
the safety of a minor. So we're looking at how do
we do that? By providing an opportunity that involves their
parent or their guardian. But anyway, I'm segwaying here a little bit,
but what I'm trying to get at is that the more women we bring

(33:30):
in, the more families we'll bring in. So there's advantages
for engaging more women just as far as increasing
numbers for future hunters. But more
importantly, I mean, when we're talking about real and present
dangers that we're facing right now from a very vocal, well
funded opposition to our hunting heritage and our rights to

(33:51):
hunt, when I think about that and I think about the powerful voices
of women, and I look at past elections, not just in the US, but
elsewhere, where government
either engages with women or alienates
women, that is felt at the ballot box,
women will get involved and they'll go out and vote.

(34:14):
And it's the same principle. The more women we encourage to get involved
on that grassroots level and vote on ballot initiatives such as what you're
facing in the state of Colorado, you know, and howl for
hunters and CRWM are doing great things to bring awareness to
anybody, to raise their voice in opposition to some of the attempts that are underway
right now. The more women we get out to the ballot box,

(34:36):
they're going to teach those behaviors about the importance of voting to their
families, and that's going to trickle down as well. So I just wanted to
say that, you know, like, I think often too many within our
community underestimate the impact of getting out and voting. It's
really important. It's really, you know, I know it's not very sexy.
It sometimes can get a little bit depressing, too, you know, but become

(34:58):
informed, start tying into these great organizations that are bringing awareness
to real pressures that are underway and get out vote.
Yeah. Thank you for saying that. It's something that I
speak about quite a bit in the platforms where
on the podcast, it's been a while since I've shared a lot about legislation
because it gets pretty heavy sometimes. So I

(35:21):
appreciate you saying. I appreciate you bringing
it up. We have had Charlie, Charles
Whitwom from Howell on the podcast as well. Well, and so
we do talk about legislative stuff sometimes, but
it is something, I think some people, they
don't want to hear about it, they don't want to deal with it, but it

(35:43):
is so important. And
the repercussions from not voting
or sometimes it's very detrimental to our
wildlife populations. And I don't think people even understand, you know, and so
there's a lot of different stuff to pay attention to. It's hard to pay attention
to all of it. But organizations like the Wild Sheep Foundation, I know

(36:05):
you, that foundation has supported a lot of stuff to
help help hunting, but also without the
wildlife, we don't get to hunt. So I think that's something that some
people who don't hunt don't understand, that hunters care about wildlife quite a bit.
If we don't have wildlife, we don't, we do not get to hunt. So. Yeah.
Yeah. Thank you for bringing up legislative. Yeah, you bet. Yeah.

(36:28):
The mom, the moms bring the family. And that's
a really key issue is without our parents, we don't
learn to hunt and we don't learn attitudes. So we got to teach
the moms. I will tell you, and the listeners may have heard this
story before, but so I'm a regional rep for Sci for the state
of Colorado, and one of the chapters, they do

(36:51):
an event, it's called the legacy Hunt.
And it takes a youngster from a family
that doesn't hunt but that wants to learn how to hunt. Okay. And
when they started this project, it's evolved over the years. But
you take this youngster, they go through hunter ed. We do arrange
day. It's smaller than the FTW, but kind of

(37:14):
similar. Learn about the gun, learn to sight it in,
learn how to cycle, learn how to follow up shoot, learn how
to, we don't do moving targets with the youngsters because we try to teach them.
We want it broadside, standing still, you know, we optimal shots and stuff
like that. But they go on a hunt with an outfitter. They
learn how to field dress, process, and cook the deer. And

(37:36):
so we have this. But it was something that one of the parents
was like, I'm too busy. And we're like, okay, we'll pick the kid up. You
know, it's okay, we'll make it work. Well, we need the parents
involved because without the parent, it's just like you said with the women and okay,
you just taught them, but, like, they go home and where's their mentor? And so
with the youngster, they need the mentor. So that's something that they added in

(37:57):
was the parent or a guardian has to be involved so that the parent is
also learning in the background. And one
thing that happened through one of these hunts that I'm just always, I'm so proud
of this mom because she had no interest in hunting. She was like, sure, my
son can learn. But then a year later, she
sent this picture, and she's a single mom. She really works

(38:19):
hard. She has ups and downs just like all of us do. But
she was crying. She was so excited because her
son had hunted the year before. And the next year she went
with him, and she got her hunter ad in her license, and she didn't shoot
an animal, but she was so excited because she went hunting. So two years after
his hunt, she sends a picture of her with a buck. And

(38:41):
so he, through this whole process, they brought
everybody together, and now the whole family, even though the
dad's not with the family, like, they have this real tight core
unit because of the time they spend out in the woods. So
it's super cool, and it's amazing the things that
the outdoors can do for us. And especially when you have a purpose

(39:03):
when you're out there, besides maybe looking for birds or tracks
or. Which. I enjoy that too,
but, yeah. So I'm hoping that maybe some of
the women you guys are sending through your groups, I'm
sure that you might have some experiences like that. And

(39:23):
if so, I would love for you to come back in the future and share
some of your attendees stories because I know you can share
them. Absolutely. And, yeah, that
would be great. And, you know, that's just a great, great program you just
described, and really clever to
recognize that, okay, no parents or guardians have to be involved

(39:45):
because we need to get them interested, too. What a great story about
that. Single mom that. Yeah, yeah. Every time you see her,
I'm probably more excited now than she is. I'm just like, oh, my gosh,
this is so wonderful. But I think because she
shares probably more than she needs to on social media.
I don't suggest you share your whole life on social media, but she does. And

(40:09):
so you see when she's struggling and you see when she is excited,
and, you know, so to see this big, huge
win, not just for her, but for her whole family.
Like, we've had some really exceptional women come through our program, and I
don't want to, you know, I don't want to risk offending any of them
by mentioning a few naturally excludes others. But I, you know, so

(40:32):
I'm not. But I hesitate to say this, but I just want to share, like,
we, you know, we've had. We had a woman
from Mississippi. She is
hearing compromised and, like, severely hearing
compromised. And she, in her application,
talked about how she had her personal reasons for wanting to learn to hunt. But

(40:54):
then, more broadly than that, at the time, she was the principal of the
Mississippi school for the deaf, and she wanted to then
as a way of giving back, she wanted to break down the
perceptions that the deaf community have that they cannot get
involved in outdoor experiences, particularly shooting and
hunting. You know, she did a whole day for her entire

(41:16):
school last year. They're doing it again this year. She's transitioned into a different
administrative position now that touches both the Mississippi schools for the deaf and the
blind, and they are doing this. Last year, they launched
this wildlife day. She ordered from our youth
educator for our youth program at the Wild Sheep Foundation. Doctor Ryan Brock
has a kit that he can ship to any educator,

(41:38):
and she ordered that kit from him. And she introduced
aspects of the kit. She focused on the guzzler builds that we do for
wild sheep that end up benefiting other wildlife as well. And
she introduced wild sheep to her students, and she basically
revealed that, look, I became a hunter this year. And they were all just
in shock. Like, you know, principal Paula is a

(42:01):
hunter, and I can do that, too, you know, and I love Paula's story. And
then, you know, we had a woman last year out in Nebraska who
is a self described large woman, and
she's very active, but she gets judged by a lot of people. You
must not be an active person. And she, you know, is
really committed to showing to her

(42:23):
community of larger women that
you can be active and you can be out there and you can shoot and
you can hunt. You know, we have as well, like, I'm sure
you've seen multiple times, women from minority groups
who are really excited about being able to
show to a non traditional audience that they can become involved in hunting,

(42:45):
too, as a woman, you know? And so there's lots of great stories
out of our program, just like any program, I'm sure. But, yeah, we should talk
about maybe who you might want to have voices heard on
your podcast. Sure. If there's somebody that you think should.
Should be heard or would like to send them my way. I love to
hear those stories. And I, as I said, I figure if I want

(43:08):
to know, then somebody listening would like to know as well. So I'm always
up to sharing, and good or bad, we all can
learn from some of that stuff, so. Yeah,
absolutely. I have another question for you. When you
had first mentioned that you got into hunting, you also said you had
already been fly fishing. And you mentioned Bozeman, which I think of Simdein,

(43:30):
and, you know, I think of all the stuff up in Bozeman. Can you tell
us a little bit, how did you get into fly fishing?
So remember how I told you when I was starting to figure out how to
learn to hunt, I joined all these hunting clubs, right?
And so I also wanted to learn to fly fish. Right around the same
time, there was kind of this whole thing that was going on with me. And
so I went to a wild game banquet for these

(43:55):
Calgary fish and Game association, which is not like an industry. It's a
hunting club. It's not a provincial thing. Anyway,
I went to their wild game banquet, and they had one of those raffles, you
know, the one I'm talking about, where you give $20, they have a deck of
cards. They rip a card in half, right? So you've got a one in 52
chance of winning the prize. And it was for this fly fishing
package. It was a day of instruction with a local fly shop.

(44:18):
Cabela's had donated a fly fishing vest, a rod, and a
reel, and some flies, and I won
this card draw, and that was my entry
into fly fishing. I took the course, and then, you know, I lived right in
Calgary on the Bull river, which is a great trout fishery and on the
footsteps of the Rocky mountains and where

(44:39):
there's great high altitude fly fishing. And so
after I took the training, I went out and tried to fish on my own.
And, you know, I did okay. But as a new fly caster,
it was pretty disastrous for the most part. And then that's
when I decided, you know, like, we all have to make decisions about what our
priorities are. Right? And so I made the decision that I would

(45:01):
invest in a guided fly, fly fishing experience so that I could learn from
a really experienced fly fishing guide and up my
game. Right. So I decided to make a holiday of it. I could have booked
with a local guide in the Calgary area, but I was like, man, this is
home. So I booked in Libby and that's how I got started in fly
fishing. And my Dave Blackburn, that guy that I talked about, you

(45:23):
know, when I called all these different companies, you know, we know that not
all fly fishing guides want to ensure that's okay. That's their business
model. No judgment, right? But it took me some time to finally
find somebody who was saying, you know, yeah, if you need some instruction, no
problem. And, you know, he said, as long as you're okay with losing
half a day of fishing so that I can do some dry,

(45:45):
dry land training with you. And I said, no problem. I said, I want to
learn well, right? And so, you know, I think that's
a good lesson for any woman listening to this. Whether it's fly fishing or
hunting or shooting or whatever, think about what
you're willing to give up to get where you want to be. Because sometimes, whether
you like it or not, you're going to have to pay for that, right? And

(46:07):
so, you know, that's another example. In order to afford my
first precision rifle training course, which I did at FTW,
in order to afford buying my first firearm and my
first ballistic turret scope, I had to sell my rv.
I had to make a choice. It's okay. I went back to tenting. I didn't
think I'd ever do that, but I did. So, you know, that was years

(46:29):
ago. But, you know, and I just think that's an important thing to keep in
mind, that sometimes if you really want to advance your journey and whatever it
is you're doing, you have to make those investments and those sacrifices.
Absolutely. And I do have a link on the website
for a guide on how to book a guided hunt.
And it's for hunting, but it could apply to fishing as well. Because what I

(46:50):
liked and what you just said is you talked to a few
different guides, or I don't know how many many, but you talked to them.
And because when you talk to them, you can first of all get a feel
to whether you have a vibe that's going to work or not like that.
That's a key, especially when you're learning something because you don't want to be
frustrated with the person. When you're going to be frustrated with your line getting

(47:12):
tangled, you're going to be frustrated with a fly getting stuck in the willows or,
you know, there's other things. So you hopefully want a guide that you
guys are going to get along and, you know, have a good demeanor
together when you're out there. So if you want to go, I'll put a link
to that guide in the show notes for the listeners. If you want to go
and check it out, it's questions to ask when booking a guided hunt.

(47:33):
And since you did do this as a vacation also, I mean,
when you're doing that, you're going to figure out, do I need a hotel? Do
I need what? Accommodations and food and how many
days, you know, all that kind of stuff. That's something. Also, if you're
booking, you know, if you're going to go with women hunt, that's
something. When you apply, you probably want to know what state which we already talked

(47:55):
about, how long which we talked about and what are the
accommodations going to be like at FTW, what's the food going to be
like, what do we have there? You bet. So at FTW, they
take care of everything. And, you know, you know, I can't
say enough. You know, you get your own cabin. The food is
exceptional. You do not go there to lose weight. Don't, don't think it's

(48:17):
going to be a calorie restricted diet at FTW. But
yeah, calories don't count, right? But
yeah, you're absolutely right. You know, preparation is key on everything.
And, you know, I can
remember back in early 2017 when I was really ramping up my
efforts to figure out how I could learn how to hunt. You

(48:39):
know, I would google and I never really knew again.
Even just back then in 2017. There weren't the
resources there are today, honestly, and what research there
were. As somebody who was completely unconnected from the whole
community, I didn't know what was reputable, what wasn't,
what I could trust. And, you know, and so the more of

(49:01):
us out there that are doing these programs for women,
the better it is for us to be able to vet things,
vouch for them, endorse them and take that
uncertainty away from people. And, you know, the resources and the packing
guides and the list guides and all that stuff, you know, are so important.
So, you know, that show link you're going to provide for that gentleman with the

(49:23):
instructional on how to book a hunt, you know, that's great. You know,
and we're also going to be building on our website. We're revamping
our website right now. It's very rudimentary. It's going to be very different here in
a few months. But pointing people to good resources is
one of the things we're going to do on our website. You know, we're not.
Our program isn't about creating things. We partner with people who already

(49:44):
deliver great things. That's how we like to do it. So.
Yeah, and that's great because it's nice to have that community
of. It's not like us against them in
different organizations. Like, we're all one and we should all kind of work together.
I think that's super important, and that's something that's lost among
some groups. Or maybe just people might just be people's egos in certain

(50:08):
aspects, but. So I think that's great that you'll be kind
of reaching out to different people and stuff like that.
Something else for the listeners, and I'm sure,
Renee, that you could probably attest to that, is when you go to these types
of events where it's more than one person there, more like it's a group,
you also, I just said a community of outdoor organizations or

(50:30):
conservation organizations or whatever, you build a community
of people there. When you're all going through this event
together, and especially if it's a new hunter group, you know, you're there.
And so you have this new friend group that is out there, and they
can be support from afar, especially with technology nowadays. You
can share all of that together. You bet. You know, the women

(50:52):
who've come through our program to date are now some, you know, some of their
best friends came through those groups, you know, and it's wonderful for
me, as the founder to step back and just watch how they interact with each
other and support each other. They have reunions, you know,
they do hunts together, all sorts of different things. It's really wonderful. And,
you know, our chef, Joshua Schwenke, I mentioned, he's our executive

(51:14):
chef now, and he's the executive chef of the Wild Sheep foundation as well. And
at our sheep show every January in Reno, we now have
sponsored culinary sections, the camp chef culinary corner.
And chef does three days of wild game instruction there. But for the
women who come through our program, they get special access to him, that
we have a private group chat, and they can go on there anytime and ask

(51:36):
him culinary questions, you know, so that, you know, that whole thing
of community can look so many different ways, and you can tap
into things at different times for different needs. And what
I really love is that. I don't know if this is your experience. I suspect
it is. But one of the things I love about the hunting community
is we're so tightly knit, you know? And

(51:58):
when you go out on a hunt with somebody or an outdoor experience, fishing,
it is, you know, there's a bond that gets created. And what I love
so much is that it really is this family, you know?
And I find, anyway, when you really connect with
a good group, there's no judgment, you know? So if you fall off the wagon
for a little while and you come back to the group and you say, hey,

(52:19):
sorry, I was Mia for six months, but I'm back and I want to do
something with somebody, people are not judging that. They're just like, right on, let's
go. And, you know, I love that, but that
community is key. And
I wanted to talk a little bit about, if you don't
mind, Mia, about sometimes what's important

(52:42):
about our community is helping women,
regardless of experience level. But particularly, I think for some of the newer
ones, understanding that
the barriers that they put in place are
often perceived. Some of them are very real. No doubt about it. There
are challenges for women entering predominantly male

(53:04):
dominated industry on any, wherever that happens to be in the
boardroom or in a hunting camp. Right. So I don't discount
that at all. There are real challenges, but a lot of them are psychological and
in our minds, they're perceived barriers. And one other great thing
about community is that we can help break those down. And, you know,
one of the things, things that, when I talked about the giving back component

(53:26):
of woman hunt, one of our participants in British
Columbia. So our affiliate in British Columbia is called the Wild
Sheep Society of BC. She's a member of that affiliate.
She's a passionate conservationist, she's a holistic
practitioner, a yoga instructor. Really connected
to wellness and well being. Anyway, her name is Rebecca

(53:48):
Peters and she was in our first class of 2021.
And through her giving back journey,
knowing how much I love. So my, my very first hunt
was spring, black bear spot and stalk in northern
Alberta. Not your typical first hunt, but that's a whole
other story. A great story, but it's a long one. But anyway, you know,

(54:10):
I'm passionate about predator hunting. You know, again, a controversial topic.
We could talk about it for hours, but there is a purpose for it. It
is a good purpose. It has real benefits. Plus, bear meat is
delicious. And so
Rebecca also loves bear hunting. So she and her husband
had this idea of a way for her to kind of

(54:32):
complete her circle of giving
to women hunt, and a really interesting
exploration of the reversal of mentor to mentee.
She and her husband approached me, said,
how would you like to come to BC and do a spring black bear hunt
with us in an area that we frequently hunt that we're

(54:54):
familiar with? And, you know, Gray
would come and Colin would be there, Rebecca's husband. But, you know, Rebecca would
basically be guy hosting me, hosting me.
She was not a guide. Be really clear there,
hosting me on this hunt in an area she's hunted
and been familiar in. I've never hunted, hunted in BC before. It was a

(55:16):
really different type of bear hunt because it was in the mountains. So was it
at altitude different to all the other bear hunts I'd done in the past.
And while I was an experienced bear hunter, there were still a lot of things
for me to learn about hunting in a different environment, different
bear behavior. You know, unfortunately, a few years
ago, emotions won over science in BC, and

(55:37):
the government of the day outlawed grizzly bear hunting. There are
real impacts now on these areas. There's
too many grizzly bears. Bears. That's just the hard truth about
this, the consequence of that decision. In four days
of hunting, we saw 27 bears, and 20 of
them were unique grizzly bears. Wow.

(56:00):
And that, to me, like, my mouth just drops when you say that,
because to see a bear in the
wild, I mean, you do see them, but
definitely not in that number. That is
incredible amount and way too
many grizzlies. You know, I mean, grizzly bears are really

(56:21):
territorial, right, and very aggressive
species. And as I mentioned, the Peters
have hunted that area for years. They're intimately familiar with it.
And Colin said flat out that they. You never used to see
that abundance of grizzlies in that area before. But
what I wanted to just share here with everybody is that,

(56:44):
you know, we ended up, that concept sort of
grew. And then the Wild Sheep foundation and the Wild Sheep Society of
BC and Women Hunt and Women Shaping
Conservation, which is a movement that Rebecca's building in
her affiliate. Our four groups came together and we
fundraised and we did a little short film

(57:06):
about this bear hunt. And it's about 20 minutes long, and it really
explores a lot of topics, like those concepts of mentor to mentee
and that role reversal. You know, it's a
great film for illustrating women working together on a
hunt. Yes, our husbands were there and they provided support when we
asked for it, you know, when we needed it. But really it was about women

(57:28):
hunting together. We brought another women hunt alumna from the class of
21 from Alberta, brandy love. So there was three of us. We had
a great woman there who stayed back at camp for the most part.
Tiffin, she. She's a wild game
chef and in BC, and she's a forager. And
so she. She was part of our camp, you know, journey.

(57:50):
And anyway, this film explores, you know,
the challenges we face on hunts, those ups and downs, the joys, making
mistakes, overcoming them, terrain issues,
like all sorts of things. And then, of course, way too many
grizzlies, risky situations, you know, but I just wanted to
share with people that even when you're thinking about barriers

(58:13):
and you're thinking about maybe you're taking those first steps and you're thinking
about what might my first hunt look like? And it's not, again, it's not a
judgment thing. But, you know, if you're, if you're comfortable,
if where you're at in your journey is, I'm only comfortable with bird hunting.
That's okay, you know, and if you decide you really want to start with a
white tail doe, well, that's okay, too. But if you are

(58:35):
expecting or more of a risk taker, I'm not sure the right way
to put it, Mia. But, you know, you can do a bear hunt for your
first hunt. I did. It means a different mindset. You have
to have a great mentor. There's lots of things at play, but it's
totally achievable. It's actually a great first hunt. I'm a big
proponent of it now, since going through it, you get to

(58:57):
watch lots of bear behavior. But anyway, I just wanted to share
that as a kind of a little bit of a push to people's thinking
about stepping outside of their comfort zones. And, you know, I really
encourage anybody to watch this film. It's lovely exploration of lots
of topics. And even if you might be thinking,
what does a black bear hunt in the mountains of BC with a couple of

(59:18):
women have to do with me? You might be surprised at
what comes through in this film. And at the very least, it might be
something you decide to share with somebody who could benefit from the
messaging. So it's called beyond bonds, a woman
hunts story. It's up on our YouTube channel, on the Wild Sheep Foundation's
YouTube channel. I'll find it and put a

(59:40):
link in the show notes. So I want to watch it, obviously.
And one thing that I also wanted to share, just thinking of you and the
group that you had with you, you mentioned, I think it was Tiffany was back
at camp, and that is something also, if you're
interested in hunting, you can go along on the hunt
and not be the one hunting, and you can just tag along and learn that

(01:00:01):
way. I mean, me, I said, I grew up in a hunting family. That's how
I learned to hunt, was as a small child, I was tagging along with dad.
I was not the hunter, and I was just learning. And so that's something
you can go and learn and obviously find a mentor
who's willing to teach, as you said, with your fishing guide, find somebody who's willing
to teach you and that wants to do that. But don't be afraid to ask,

(01:00:22):
because I know many people that are like, yeah, come on, you know,
join us in camp. And if you want to, if you're willing to hike, if
you're willing to go. We took a lady this year, and we went on a
hike with our shotguns to look for turkeys. Didn't see any,
but she learned, you know, she learned some things while we were out there. So
you bet. That is your. That's an excellent point. It's always great to say,

(01:00:44):
hey, I'd like to learn how to hunt. Can I come and carry your pack?
Can I come and help with whatever? It's a. It's a really great way
to get out a hunt. Yeah, yeah. Definitely is.
So, I mean, I'll get the link to that because I
want to see that. It sounds great to me. It sounds like a wonderful video

(01:01:05):
that you guys have done. Where else can we find
women hunt or women in hunting? Yeah, you bet. So we
have a presence on Instagram and Facebook.
We have a website. So because we're a program of the Wild Sheep
foundation, you can find us on the Wild Sheep Foundation's website.
So that's wild sheepfoundation.org

(01:01:26):
backslash womenhunt. Or to make it more simple, just
go to wildsheetfoundation.org. on the top menu bar,
there's an item called hunt. And you just click on that. And women Hunt will
be under that heading of Hunt. That's another way to get to
us. And then we do have a YouTube channel. It is in its
infancy. There's just a handful of videos on there right now. But

(01:01:50):
so primarily Instagram, Facebook, our website, our
email, if people wanna email me or a member of our committee,
is womenhunt. So that's plural. It's w
o m e n. Hunt.
[e-mail].
dot. That's our email address. Excellent.

(01:02:11):
I'm super excited to see where you're gonna go with this. And, I mean, you
guys are already doing great things, so I think it can only get better from
here. And what a wonderful thing to be
touching. I mean, maybe you're touching several women, but it's
spreading. And I think that is just awesome. It's so great. As I said,
when I saw it on social media, I was like, wait a second. This sounds

(01:02:31):
pretty cool. Thank you so much. I
appreciate that. Okay, well, if you
have other news in the future, please reach out. I am following
on Instagram. I know, but I'll make sure I'm following on Facebook as well
and subscribe for newsletters and so forth. And maybe I need to go
and become a member of the Wild Sheep foundation as well. I'm just a member

(01:02:54):
of, like, every other thing in the world.
When I saw that, when I was reading through your answers
for the listeners, I send surveys so I can kind of see what
these organizations or their directors, what they're focusing
on, and so that we're focusing on what's going on now
instead of what was going on five years ago. And so when I saw

(01:03:17):
that, I was like, why am I not a member of that one? Yeah. Please
join and all your listeners. Yeah, it's a great community, just
like every other hunting community, but we do great things for the conservation of wild
sheep, for sure. Yeah, absolutely. Well, I appreciate
you taking the time, and I'm glad we finally got to meet up, but
thank you for taking the time to join me on the podcast and to share

(01:03:40):
the story with my listeners. Thank you very much. I appreciate it.
Hey, this is Lloyd Bailey, the armed lutheran host of the armed lutheran
radio podcast, reminding you that the podcast you're
listening to is a proud member of the Self Defense Radio Network.
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