March 10, 2025 • 32 mins
Welcome to Making Maverick Moves, the podcast where we dive into bold, unconventional actions that break the mold and redefine success. Today, we are tackling a game-changing question: Who are you... When you are big. My guess today is the incredible Kimberly Roush of All-Star Executive Coaching. She's an executive coach, speaker, and author of Who Are You... When You Were Big. Kymberlee has coached top executives, entrepreneurs, and high achievers to break through limitations, step into their potential, and lead with confidence. But, here’s the twist... her big philosophy isn’t just about success; it’s about becoming the boldest, most fearless version of yourself. So, if you’ve ever felt like you’re playing small, holding back, or waiting for permission to take that big, maverick leap, this episode is for you. Kymberlee is here to help you break through that barrier, make bold intentions, and grow into the person who makes waves, takes risks, and owns their maverick move. Are you ready? Let’s dive in!
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(00:05):
Welcome to Making Maverick Moves,the podcast where we dive into
bold, unconventional actions thatbreak the mold and redefine success.
Today, we are tackling a game changingquestion, who are you when you are big?
My guest today is the incredible KimberlyRoush, executive coach, speaker, and
(00:30):
author of Who Are You When You Are Big?
Kimberly has coached top executives,entrepreneurs, and high achievers to
break through limitations, step into theirfull potential, and lead with confidence.
But, here's the twist.
Her big philosophy isn'tjust about success.
(00:51):
It's about becoming the boldest,most fearless version of yourself.
So, if you've ever felt likeyou're playing small, holding
back, or waiting for permissionto take that big Maverick leap.
This episode is for you.
Kimberly is here to help you break throughself doubt, set bold intentions and grow
(01:14):
into the person who makes waves, takesrisks and owns their Maverick move.
So are you ready?
Let's dive in.
Welcome to the show, Kimberly.
Thank you.
So excited to be here.
Can you tell us how you cameto this place of helping others
discover their big selves?
(01:36):
I can.
So I was, uh, in publicaccounting for 22 years.
I was a national partner at KPMG.
I got promoted into a national role,which was, um, having the IT auditors
and the financial statement auditorsplay nice within the firm, , and
I was dealing with the top two andthree people in the whole firm.
I felt so out of my league.
I didn't feel like aleader among the leaders.
(01:57):
And so I asked if I could have anexecutive coach and my boss was
like, sure, that's a great idea.
And it was amazing, you know, threemonths into the role, the chairman of
our firm was diagnosed with brain cancer.
And three months later, he passed away.
And my, you know, I wasworking on leadership to feel
like a leader and whatnot.
And.
And then all of this happened and my coachsaid, well, what's going on with you?
(02:20):
And I said, Oh, I'm safe.
I'll be in this role for another year.
When I'm done with this, they'll giveme some other great position, more
title, more money they always have.
They always will.
And he just said, wow, you know, whydon't you look at the aspects of your job
that gets you out of bed in the morning,the things that have you energized and
engaged, the things that have you, youknow, can't wait to get into work in the
(02:41):
morning or staying there late at night,losing track of time and, and then figure
out the position that would allow youto do that stuff the most within KPMG.
And.
I thought, wow, had I just said theywill give me some great position,
they always have, they always will.
Because if you had asked me, I wouldabsolutely would have told you that I take
(03:02):
an initiative for every step of my career.
And yet this very passive statement justcame out of my mouth and I was like, wow.
And so
I ended up going down this path oftrying to explore that, and maybe I was
a slow learner, but it took me probablysix months to answer that question.
(03:24):
And when I realized what really hadme excited and engaged and empowered
and, you know, all of that, it waswhen I was, really big challenge
in front of people within the firmand then inspiring them to go after
it and then coaching and developingand mentoring them along the way.
And that was the fun part of my job.
(03:44):
It was the stuff I got to do.
It wasn't the stuff that was the hardonerous work that my ego was so tied
to and, you know, I thought made me soimportant and, and all of those things.
It was just this fun part.
And.
You know, I looked at roles within thefirm that would allow me to do that.
And ultimately just came to the conclusionthat, wow, what if I did what he did?
(04:06):
You know, what if I What if Itook that great big partner hat
off my head and set it aside?
I mean, nobody does that, butwhat if I did and, you know, and
could actually get off the hamsterwheel and get on the Ferris wheel.
Right.
And.
So I made that bold move to step out.
And I'd love to talk about bold moves.
(04:26):
Cause you're taught, you,you use that language.
So I stepped out and I went frombeing, you know, Kimberly Roush,
this national partner and global firmwith resources at my fingertips to
becoming Kimberly Roush entrepreneur.
One woman show, you know, like I wasfeeling really small, even though it
was a very deliberate, intentional,well planned out, it was daunting and
(04:50):
it was a little scary and thank GodI had a coach to continue to help me
through it, but I got out and I wasfeeling small and so naturally I had
a coaching session on it and I said,you know, who am I to coach executives?
You know, I've never beenan executive and he's like.
You don't think a nationalpartner in a big four public
accounting firm is an executive?
(05:10):
And I'm like, well, wenever called ourselves that.
You know?
And he's like, well, whoare you when you're big?
And he asked me that question.
And he had me write something out.
And that was the source of the question.
And big is all about being in anempowered state of mind, knowing your
strengths, your values, your gifts.
(05:32):
And stepping into it and, and doingit in a deliberate and intentional
way, not a brash way, not ready, fire,aim, not, I'm tired of this and I'm
going to run to something else, but Idon't know what I'm running to, but,
but rather what do I really want?
And I think when you really know what youwant, it doesn't even feel all that bold
or scary or, cause you've planned it out.
(05:54):
You've thought about it.
You've put time and effort into it.
So where do you get to that placewhere you know exactly what you want?
Because I think that's that place thatpeople may never get to that because they
feel that they have to be absolutely sure.
So can you kind of talk us through howyou get to that point where you're willing
(06:15):
to jump off that cliff and hope thatthe parachute helps you land safely?
Sure.
You know, I think I was just hearingsomething yesterday on risk tolerance
and how different people view risks.
And I talk about this a lot with clients.
I'm not a risk taker.
I'm not a risk taker.
And it's like, Hmm, Ithink you take risks.
You just, you know, are take very measuredrisk and you manage risk and you calculate
(06:38):
it before you do it so that it does ordoesn't feel like a risk at the time.
But I think that's a good place to kindof talk about Alan Milam is my coach
and he's my co author on the book too,but he wrote this book Bold Moves and
he talks about barely move makers.
You know, those are kind ofthe couch potatoes in life.
They, they sit on the couch,they let life happen to them.
(06:58):
They just show up to work every day,but they're not taking that initiative.
They're, they're sort of maybe feelinga victim to their circumstances.
They're really operating from fearand insecurity and, and doubt.
And then there's brash move makers.
And brash movemakers, you know, are kindof ready fire aim, but they can get a lot
of followers because people like actionand people see action as leadership.
(07:23):
And so, but they're not necessarilygoing in the right direction.
And what's kind of interesting, what Ifind about brash movemakers is sometimes
they're just willing to take a big riskand they'll just course correct along
the way and they're okay with that.
And so that might be a littledifferent risk tolerance, but I
still think that oftentimes thosemoves are not driven by Intention.
(07:44):
They're driven by runningaway from fear and security.
Still, the difference between a brashmovemaker and a bold movemaker is that
bold moves are deliberate and intentional.
They're coming from hope and possibility.
They're not running away from anything.
They're running towards something.
I never doubted whetherI'd made the right move.
(08:06):
It was just going to take longerthan I thought it was going to, but
I never doubted whether it had beenthe right move because I planned it
out so well going in, I didn't need acontingency plan, which was pretty cool.
Right.
And so again, I think it's all aboutthe, it's about the right level
of discovery, the right level ofplanning, the right level of intention,
(08:27):
knowing yourself well enough.
To know what you're alignedto, to know your strengths and
your values and your gifts.
And when you see something that's sucha natural fit, it doesn't feel risky.
It doesn't feel so scary.
This is a good time to talk about whatit means to be big and feeling big.
(08:47):
I read your book when yougave it to me a while back.
I re read it and I get that feeling.
feeling in my stomach of invincibilitywhen I hear you describe what
it is to be your biggest self.
Can you talk about that a little bit andinspire us about what it's like to be big?
(09:08):
Sure.
And let me tell you how it feels.
So Alan had asked me this question,who are you when you're big?
And he had me write something outfor our next coaching session.
He's like, think back totimes when you were thriving.
Think back to times when youwere, you know, on your game,
energized, engaged, et cetera.
And, you know, I immediately went tokind of being in front of my team and
leading them in a celebratory event afterI had given them a great big challenge.
(09:32):
You know, I was.
I had my team of 50 peopleachieve work life balance in my
22 years in public accounting.
Nobody ever felt like theyhad work life balance.
And we just kept waiting forsomeone to give it to us and.
When we realized that, wow, what ifI define what it would be every week?
If I could do just two things thisweek to make me feel like I had work
life balance, what would they be?
(09:52):
And I gave them permission to do that.
I gave them permission to go after it.
They started working togetherto allow each other to achieve
their work life balance goals.
And we never missed a single deadlineand my team, they were working incredibly
hard, but they felt like they hadwork life balance and it was a mind.
set.
And so when I thought aboutwhere am I when I'm big, right?
(10:13):
I, I, the first thing I thoughtof was standing in front of my
team as we were doing sort ofa celebratory event for that.
And I could feel it in my stomach, right?
Like I could, I could justfeel how I felt in the moment.
And I think part of the problem withme answering the question initially
for Allen on where is it the timesin my career when I was thriving, I
kept trying to think my way into it.
(10:34):
And unfortunately, my egowas too tied to it, right?
I was, I kept going for what I was knownfor being good at or the prestigious
positions I had or the prestigiousthings that I got to do within the firm.
But it wasn't where I felt the mostalive, you know, in my soul, in my heart.
So I thought about that.
And my first version of my bigstatement says I'm smiling, singing,
(10:54):
doing, I got the going on dance.
Like I had that feeling.
And once I had thatfeeling, it was like, Oh.
Like big is simply a state of mind andevery moment of every day I have a choice
to make and I can choose to feel smallor I can literally just step into being
big and I used to think about literallywalking out from behind my desk and
(11:15):
stepping into the sort of the circle onthe floor and saying, okay, I'm going to,
I'm going to make myself feel that way.
I'm going to imagine it in my.
In my whole being, in my body.
And when I get there, like it was easyto come up with additional times when
I felt that way and, and to describewhat it was when I was feeling that way.
I realized that number one,big is a state of mind.
(11:37):
It's simply a state of mind.
And we can, everything in lifeis the story we make up about it.
So we can make up really defeating, youknow, stories that bring us down, or we
can kind of reframe the situation and putit into something that is more empowering.
I was working with a lot of peoplein transition and, you know, some of
them are like, Oh my God, I'm a loser.
(11:58):
I've already had to pick up my career.
It's all downhill from here.
I don't know if my marriageis going to survive.
Those sound drastic, but thoseare things, actual things that
go through people's minds.
And I've worked with over 5, 000people in transition or you can say.
Oh, my gosh.
That job wasn't right for me anymore.
Anyway, you know, this is a coffee break.
Look, I get to spend time with mykids and reconnect with my spouse
(12:18):
and look at all these great people.
I'm meeting networking to find my job.
And, you know, what if I getto choose what I go to next and
define it better for myself?
And, you know, this isjust a mid career reset.
Who do you think is going to land faster?
Right?
Somebody who is.
Doom and gloom or somebody who's liketaking advantage of this invariably
(12:40):
the people who were enjoying this thisbreak and this journey Landed faster
your state of mind is number one.
So what I hear you saying, you've gotto change that mindset Can you give
us some tips as to how we make thatconnection and maintain that connection?
Because I think it's easy for us todo it for a little while but then
life shows up How do we become big?
(13:02):
There's kind of a process that Itend to take people through and
it's, it's really an expandedversion of what Alan had asked me.
What are the times when you were, youknow, on your game energized engaged?
And I call it thriving moments.
It's like what were the times in yourcareer or in your life even where you
were just On fire, you know, like youwere clicking on all cylinders, you
(13:23):
were in that state of flow and thenthink back to those times, oftentimes
when I'm helping people with interviewsor even in their branding, it's like,
okay, get it down to sort of a story.
What was the situation?
What was the action?
What was the result?
But what I think isdesperately missing is.
Why was it so meaningful to you?
What was it about itthat had you thriving?
(13:44):
And when I realized that in every timewhen I was thriving, I could stand back
and I could see I had put some greatbig challenge out in front of people.
I'd inspired them to get there.
One was organizing a team for the multiplesclerosis bike ride and recruiting
people that didn't even have bikes toride a hundred miles on a bike over the
course of a weekend and seeing their.
(14:04):
Aces in Mission Bay Park onSunday afternoon after they'd
ridden a hundred miles on a bike.
I'm like, I just knew I'd given themsomething that was good for their life,
like something that, where else dothey put barriers up where they think
they can't do something or, and theynever even bothered to challenge it.
What I call that is, is, youknow, being able to witness
people's magnificence emerging.
(14:25):
And I truly feel that's what I get to do.
I know it sounds a littlecorny or whatever, but.
You know, I want to help them tap intothose times and then amplify that and find
every opportunity to do that because thosestories tell you about what's meaningful
and what you're passionate about and allof that, but they also reveal all of your
strengths and your values and your giftsand big is an inside out proposition.
(14:51):
It's not I'm big when someexternal condition occurs.
It's when I'm big.
Who am I being?
How am I showing up?
What does it look like?
What do other peoplesee when I'm being big?
What am I doing when I'm being big?
Not that I'm big when I get to do that,but when I'm big I do that just that makes
it's not conditional It's an inside out.
(15:13):
So many people are looking forall this External validation
and extrinsic motivators.
Oh, I want the bonus.
I want the raise.
I want the achievement But whatreally drives us are intrinsic?
Motivators and trying to identifyand articulate those and really
explore what lights your fire Youknow, that's a way to identify
(15:34):
who you are when you're being big.
The other clue is when you Are being big.
Everything's easy and effortlessbecause you're in that state of flow.
And so it's not hard.
Like, oftentimes I would have people tellstories of their greatest achievement.
And, you know, they tell this story andthey want to tell it in the interview.
And you could just tellthat they were dog tired.
(15:55):
They were not feeling appreciated.
They were being the martyr.
But.
It's a story they think peoplewanna hear, and they would not
get a job if they told that story.
. Mm-hmm . You know, or they wouldnot impress their boss in a, in a
current job if they were tellingthat story to demonstrate their band.
Because it was just about really kindof ego and an external accomplishment.
It wasn't about what had them thriving.
(16:17):
Um, but a clue is where haveyou felt in that sense of flow?
Where have people around you, thisis the fourth thing, you know,
when you're big, you're givingopportunity for others to be big too.
And there's ripple effect and it's gamechanging and it's not just you and your
teams, it's your peers, your bosses,your boards, it's your family, it's your
(16:38):
community, it's It's the person in line inthe grocery store in front of you, right?
That if you have this energyof being big, it's contagious.
I believe, you know, emotions arecontagious and I can feel we've all been
around sourpusses and become sour, right?
You know, and we've all been aroundthese, these people that just seem to
have it going on and are really selfassured and confident and happy with
(17:00):
themselves and, and that spreads too.
So those are all clues, right?
Like understanding where youthrived, identifying your strengths,
your values, your gifts, thinkingabout where you've been in flow.
Think about how you're showing up.
What I have people do is actuallywrite a big statement, you know,
and when I'm big, blah, blah, blah.
Right.
(17:22):
When we come back, we'll talk more aboutthis energy flow and how we can keep
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(18:07):
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You talk about flow, and that reallyresonates with me, because when we
allow fear to come to us, whetherit's fear about money, fear about
(18:29):
relationships, every time you feel that,I think that kind of breaks the flow.
I mean, can you talk a little bitabout how, how do we keep that flow
going without the self sabotage, thenegative self talk, anything that's
going to slow us down, the self doubt?
I believe we actually all have thesetwo voices inside our heads, right?
We have a good voice and we havewhat I call the gremlin, right?
(18:50):
The gremlin just screams things at us.
We wouldn't say to our worst enemy, right?
And yet we say it toourselves all the time.
And most of the time we'renot even aware of it.
We're it's subconscious.
And so what I do with clients isI do a full all day onboarding
session with new clients.
And we spend a whole day together.
And part of that day is weamplify this positive voice.
I want to know.
(19:11):
What it would say to them in theircurrent situation, you know, Is it the
voice of a coach or a boss or a parentor a grandparent or a mentor or you know?
Best friend and you know, what wouldthey tell them in this situation or
or in general about about themselves?
Yeah, I want to be able to amplify thatduring the coaching relationship I want
to be able to call upon that during thecoaching relationship but then we all
(19:33):
have this negative voice and the negativevoice says You know things we wouldn't
say to our worst enemy like I saidbefore the things I was saying when I was
talking about The story of a you know, weeverything in life is a story we make up.
I'm a loser I already atthe peak of my career.
It's all downhill from hereYou know, I'm never gonna get
a job as good as the last one.
I might lose my marriage Youknow, my kids think I'm a loser.
(19:55):
Those are all limiting beliefs That'sall that negative voice and not well
have you stucker than stuck Unless youlearn how to manage it, we all have it.
So there's a great book by Rick Carsoncalled Taming Your Gremlin, and he
has three principles in that book.
The first one is simply notice.
Like, I have people write down everythingthey're saying to themselves, and
sometimes they just look at that listand say, no wonder I feel like crap.
(20:19):
Right?
And it's like, wow, okay.
And then sometimes we need a littlemore than just acknowledging it.
And the second step of his Kindof methodology, if you will, is
choose and play with options.
So I get people to name their gremlins.
I get people to, um, think aboutwhat time of day it shows up.
(20:39):
And the, the biggest thing is thatI get people to banter with it.
And so we turn limiting beliefs, all thenegative things that your gremlin wants
to say to you into powerful assumptions.
Now, these aren't just.
Positive assumptions.
They're not just a logic shift or ashift from a thinking state, if you will.
What I'm trying to do is create a newneural pathway in our brain, and we can't
(21:01):
do that with some sort of energetic.
Connection to it.
So when we banter or get sarcastic or, youknow, or a little snarky with it, we're
going to have way more power to do that.
And so I take every limiting beliefthat somebody has written down prior
to our all day onboarding session,and we take every one of those and
we flip it to a powerful assumption.
(21:23):
Like when I went into my nationalrole, I did this with my coach and
I was telling myself, myself, thingslike, I don't think like them.
And, and I'm not in their leaguelooking to the leaders of the firm
I was dealing with day to day.
And I don't think like them became,of course you don't think like them.
That's why they called you to the table.
That's why they created this positionfor you, which is absolutely true.
(21:45):
And I'm not in their league became,yeah, and at this stage of their career,
they weren't in that league either.
Look who you get to hang with.
What can you learn from these people?
So picture me walking into a conferenceroom with those thoughts going
through my head versus the first two.
I'm going to show up completely different.
And so managing this negativevoice is, is critically important.
I'll give you one other funny example.
(22:08):
I used to do a program forexecutives in transition.
It was a free month longgroup coaching program.
Got me, you know, infront of a lot of people.
I helped people within a time of need.
And you know, it's reallyfueled my business in terms of
referrals over time and whatnot.
But we do this exercisein that in that session.
And what I'm trying to do isis teach everybody this skill.
(22:29):
And so we have a write down for a week,everything that Kind of pops into their
head and then they come to the sessionready to share just one of the things
that they've written down and then wego around the room and we say, okay,
everybody, let's help this person flip itand we don't want to do it through logic.
We want to be snarky and youknow, we're kind of teaching
because people will go to logic.
They'll go to problem solving andthat's it's just not going to do it.
(22:52):
Right.
And so this one guy who'sprobably the most successful
in the room by all accounts.
And the thing that he'd been tellinghimself his whole life, he said,
my, I just, my whole life, I'vetold myself that I'm in trouble
or I'm going to get in trouble.
And everybody was like, this guy sayingthat, you know, it was like, really?
(23:12):
And so, you know, it took us a littlewhile to turn it around, but that's okay.
Cause cause we just keepgoing until we get it.
And what's funny is when we get it, wewill see a shift in their physiology.
Right.
They will laugh or they will sit backor their shoulders will go down or you
know Like you can see it physically intheir in their body and their energy
When we find the right thing and we justkeep going till we find it and we were
(23:35):
having a little trouble this day Gettingto it and and so I kind of sat back and
I said, okay What happened when I gotin trouble and I just started cracking
up and and I just said Spank me, baby.
Never going to say that to himself againwithout just breaking into a laugh.
(23:55):
Right?
Like we've, we've createda new neural pathway.
It is gone.
He'll say it to himself again.
Right.
Because, because we do that.
The key is, is do I havean ability to manage it?
Do I recognize when it's taking me over?
Do I slow down and simply noticethe things I'm saying to myself?
And do I choose and play with optionslike in Rick's book, Rick Carson's book?
(24:17):
I also get people to name it.
I had a guy whose name wasTom and this was honorable Tom
and this was doubting Thomas.
Which soon became known as DFT.
One day he, uh, he hada, a box he sent me.
It was a records box and he had thisbig chain around it with a padlock.
And he sent me a picture andit said DT on the front of it.
And he was so proud of himselfbecause he had locked the gremlin
(24:39):
away for, you know, two weeks.
So he thought he had mastered this.
And I'm like, it's notabout stuffing it away.
It's about when it shows up almostinviting it out to dance and then
pulling the rug out from underneath it.
And that gets to the other part of Rick'sbook, which is be in process with it.
Understand this isn't a one and done.
(24:59):
It's going to come and go.
Anytime you try and make a bold moveor a maverick move, anytime you try
and challenge the status quo, yourgremlin's going to get really loud.
Because it doesn't, it feels risky andso much of what we perceive as risk is
simply our gremlin trying to hold us back.
And so when we can actuallychallenge all of that, we can
(25:24):
move forward with confidence.
When you're right there gettingready to make your Maverick move,
there's one thing that's stopping you.
So is it fear?
Is it doubt?
The consequences thatcould possibly happen?
So what is your advice topeople who really want to make
this move, but they're stuck?
(25:46):
One of my coach's questions that usuallyjust like drives me a little crazy.
You know, I'll be stuck on something.
And I'll say, Oh, my gremlin's got me.
And he'll say, how do youknow it's not your whisperer?
I'm like, what, whatare you talking about?
Because this is the way I feel.
I feel like crap.
It can't be my whisperer, you know?
And it's like, Oh, well, what ifthere's something there for me to
(26:06):
pay attention to, what if there'ssomething I haven't considered?
What if there's somethingI need to consider?
What if there's, you know.
Something that I can plan for, or I canmitigate, or I can challenge, right?
Maybe it's just getting my gremlin to hushup, but maybe there's something that I
(26:27):
can look at that I haven't yet considered.
And I think that that'sactually a good thing.
I want that.
You almost want that to happenbecause when you overcome it and
move forward with confidence,you're going to feel even better.
And so look at it, you know, liketalk to it and, you know, go down a
path with somebody and find out, is itjust my gremlin showing up or is there
(26:50):
something for me to look at there?
Is there something that, youknow, that can make me more
self assured moving forward?
Whether you're running away fromsomething or running towards something.
Um, so whether you're making a brashmove or a bold move, I've got people
in jobs and they're not happy and theyjust want to get out or they just want
to, you know, and they're looking atsomething, man, I want to go be an
entrepreneur, I'm tired of the, youknow, the corporate boss and all that.
(27:12):
And it's like, are you, you know,like if they're focused on that, I'm
not convinced they want to go there.
No, my family was an entrepreneur.
I just have this dream.
I, you know, I, I just knowthis is what I want to do for
the second half of my career.
And there's resilience in that.
And I think it's really, really important.
(27:34):
I have a, I heard.
We couldn't put it in the bookbecause we couldn't verify it,
but I had heard this story and Ijust thought it was fascinating.
So, so just know it may not be true, butwhat I had heard was that Barbara Walters
was interviewing Oprah and as they werekind of, you know, getting sat down
and, you know, just chatting a littlebit and whatnot, Oprah thought Barbara
(27:58):
Walters had said, why do you work out?
And that's not what she actually said.
And they were like,Oh, no, no, no, no, no.
Why do you work?
And she said, if you picture a graphand I'm going to try and drop backwards.
So she said, um, Oh,it's my life's purpose.
You know, I just, it's, it's,you know, it's my calling.
I can't imagine not doing it.
And dah, dah, Right.
(28:19):
And it was kind of this Northstar of, of progress up, right.
And, you know, yeah, sure.
There's been ups and downs, but,but you know, she's achieved it.
And there's this resilience that sortof goes on when you, when you know
what you're going for and, and you've,you're, you're intentional about it.
Right.
And so then they kind of laughedand said, well, why do you work out?
(28:41):
And she said to not have a fat butt.
Okay.
This is according to the story.
Again, we, we looked for it to try and putit in the book and we couldn't find it.
So it may not be true.
And so just.
Bear with that.
Um, and you know, the, the weight ison the bottom, you know, access, right?
(29:02):
And it can, fear can be a great motivator.
And this is why I think rashmaker people come in, right?
Fear can be this greatmotivator for action.
And so we create this action.
And as soon as the distance between, youknow, what I'm afraid of and where I am
goes away, we tend to fall back down.
And so that's why Perhaps herhealth journey has gone up and down
(29:26):
as opposed, cause she's runningaway from being unhealthy, right?
As opposed to runningtowards being healthy.
And so Fascinating.
And, you know, whether the story'strue or not, I think the, the, the
point is made in, when we're runningtowards something, I think we just
have this incredible resilience.
You hear so much talk about resilience.
(29:47):
So it sounds like there is some workthat needs to be put in to this.
I know that some people want toavoid that type of internal work.
Do you think you can ever getto that place of being big
if you don't do that work?
I don't.
However, I like to think of it as notbeing work, but having it be play, right?
Like, how do you do it in such a waythat you enjoy the journey, that it's
(30:10):
fun, that it's, it's intriguing to you?
You know, I'm an extrovert, right?
I had a coach that helped me through it.
I had a coach that Italked it through with.
Because that's how I process.
That's how I think.
I have to think out loud.
And while I might've done work onmy own in between sessions, my real
journey in exploration occurred whenI was talking it out with somebody,
(30:32):
whether it was him or somebody else.
And it's kind of funny.
He has a question and another questionfor me that, you know, always gets me.
I'll be sitting here laboringover something stuck.
My gremlins going away.
Right.
And he would be like, well,what would make it easy?
In other words, wherecould I create that flow?
Right.
And I was like, huh.
And I'd be like, you know, I mightthrow things out, you know, I'll
find a magic wand or if I likemarketing is not my gig, right?
(30:54):
Uh, maybe if I had a marketing degreeor maybe if I had, you know, and I'll
mention all these things and thenit'll be like, well, maybe if I had
someone I could bop down the halland throw my ideas around, right?
Well, I'm a solo entrepreneur.
I don't have.
Somebody, you know, right nextdoor to, to go, but he'll be like,
gee, do you know anybody like that?
And I'm like, of course I do.
Any one of those 5, 000 people thatwent through my bootcamp program, right.
(31:17):
Would be honored to haveme ask for their help.
Let me bounce my ideas aroundor think something through with
them and call on their expertise.
And if that's how it makes iteasy for me, then find a way
that's going to make it easy.
This is a magical book.
Who are you when youare big, Kimberly Roush?
Thank you so much for being on the show.
My pleasure.
(31:38):
Super fun.
It's so great to see you again.
And I think that your big statement'sa fun testament to all of this.
And, um, you've certainly sortof been through this process.
So I think, you know,the power of it for sure.
Making Maverick Moves with Gina L. Osborneis produced and edited by Lisa Osborne.
(31:58):
Theme music, Maverick Heart, is byretired IRS criminal investigative
attaché Clarissa Balmesita.
Connect with us on socialmedia through GinaLOsborne.
com slash Making Maverick Moves.
And don't miss an episode.
Subscribe to Making Maverick Moveswherever you get your podcasts.
Welcome to Making Maverick Moves,the podcast where we dive into
bold, unconventional actions thatbreak the mold and redefine success.
Today, we are tackling a game changingquestion, who are you when you are big?
My guest today is the incredible KimberlyRoush, executive coach, speaker, and
(00:30):
author of Who Are You When You Are Big?
Kimberly has coached top executives,entrepreneurs, and high achievers to
break through limitations, step into theirfull potential, and lead with confidence.
But, here's the twist.
Her big philosophy isn'tjust about success.
(00:51):
It's about becoming the boldest,most fearless version of yourself.
So, if you've ever felt likeyou're playing small, holding
back, or waiting for permissionto take that big Maverick leap.
This episode is for you.
Kimberly is here to help you break throughself doubt, set bold intentions and grow
(01:14):
into the person who makes waves, takesrisks and owns their Maverick move.
So are you ready?
Let's dive in.
Welcome to the show, Kimberly.
Thank you.
So excited to be here.
Can you tell us how you cameto this place of helping others
discover their big selves?
(01:36):
I can.
So I was, uh, in publicaccounting for 22 years.
I was a national partner at KPMG.
I got promoted into a national role,which was, um, having the IT auditors
and the financial statement auditorsplay nice within the firm, , and
I was dealing with the top two andthree people in the whole firm.
I felt so out of my league.
I didn't feel like aleader among the leaders.
(01:57):
And so I asked if I could have anexecutive coach and my boss was
like, sure, that's a great idea.
And it was amazing, you know, threemonths into the role, the chairman of
our firm was diagnosed with brain cancer.
And three months later, he passed away.
And my, you know, I wasworking on leadership to feel
like a leader and whatnot.
And.
And then all of this happened and my coachsaid, well, what's going on with you?
(02:20):
And I said, Oh, I'm safe.
I'll be in this role for another year.
When I'm done with this, they'll giveme some other great position, more
title, more money they always have.
They always will.
And he just said, wow, you know, whydon't you look at the aspects of your job
that gets you out of bed in the morning,the things that have you energized and
engaged, the things that have you, youknow, can't wait to get into work in the
(02:41):
morning or staying there late at night,losing track of time and, and then figure
out the position that would allow youto do that stuff the most within KPMG.
And.
I thought, wow, had I just said theywill give me some great position,
they always have, they always will.
Because if you had asked me, I wouldabsolutely would have told you that I take
(03:02):
an initiative for every step of my career.
And yet this very passive statement justcame out of my mouth and I was like, wow.
And so
I ended up going down this path oftrying to explore that, and maybe I was
a slow learner, but it took me probablysix months to answer that question.
(03:24):
And when I realized what really hadme excited and engaged and empowered
and, you know, all of that, it waswhen I was, really big challenge
in front of people within the firmand then inspiring them to go after
it and then coaching and developingand mentoring them along the way.
And that was the fun part of my job.
(03:44):
It was the stuff I got to do.
It wasn't the stuff that was the hardonerous work that my ego was so tied
to and, you know, I thought made me soimportant and, and all of those things.
It was just this fun part.
And.
You know, I looked at roles within thefirm that would allow me to do that.
And ultimately just came to the conclusionthat, wow, what if I did what he did?
(04:06):
You know, what if I What if Itook that great big partner hat
off my head and set it aside?
I mean, nobody does that, butwhat if I did and, you know, and
could actually get off the hamsterwheel and get on the Ferris wheel.
Right.
And.
So I made that bold move to step out.
And I'd love to talk about bold moves.
(04:26):
Cause you're taught, you,you use that language.
So I stepped out and I went frombeing, you know, Kimberly Roush,
this national partner and global firmwith resources at my fingertips to
becoming Kimberly Roush entrepreneur.
One woman show, you know, like I wasfeeling really small, even though it
was a very deliberate, intentional,well planned out, it was daunting and
(04:50):
it was a little scary and thank GodI had a coach to continue to help me
through it, but I got out and I wasfeeling small and so naturally I had
a coaching session on it and I said,you know, who am I to coach executives?
You know, I've never beenan executive and he's like.
You don't think a nationalpartner in a big four public
accounting firm is an executive?
(05:10):
And I'm like, well, wenever called ourselves that.
You know?
And he's like, well, whoare you when you're big?
And he asked me that question.
And he had me write something out.
And that was the source of the question.
And big is all about being in anempowered state of mind, knowing your
strengths, your values, your gifts.
(05:32):
And stepping into it and, and doingit in a deliberate and intentional
way, not a brash way, not ready, fire,aim, not, I'm tired of this and I'm
going to run to something else, but Idon't know what I'm running to, but,
but rather what do I really want?
And I think when you really know what youwant, it doesn't even feel all that bold
or scary or, cause you've planned it out.
(05:54):
You've thought about it.
You've put time and effort into it.
So where do you get to that placewhere you know exactly what you want?
Because I think that's that place thatpeople may never get to that because they
feel that they have to be absolutely sure.
So can you kind of talk us through howyou get to that point where you're willing
(06:15):
to jump off that cliff and hope thatthe parachute helps you land safely?
Sure.
You know, I think I was just hearingsomething yesterday on risk tolerance
and how different people view risks.
And I talk about this a lot with clients.
I'm not a risk taker.
I'm not a risk taker.
And it's like, Hmm, Ithink you take risks.
You just, you know, are take very measuredrisk and you manage risk and you calculate
(06:38):
it before you do it so that it does ordoesn't feel like a risk at the time.
But I think that's a good place to kindof talk about Alan Milam is my coach
and he's my co author on the book too,but he wrote this book Bold Moves and
he talks about barely move makers.
You know, those are kind ofthe couch potatoes in life.
They, they sit on the couch,they let life happen to them.
(06:58):
They just show up to work every day,but they're not taking that initiative.
They're, they're sort of maybe feelinga victim to their circumstances.
They're really operating from fearand insecurity and, and doubt.
And then there's brash move makers.
And brash movemakers, you know, are kindof ready fire aim, but they can get a lot
of followers because people like actionand people see action as leadership.
(07:23):
And so, but they're not necessarilygoing in the right direction.
And what's kind of interesting, what Ifind about brash movemakers is sometimes
they're just willing to take a big riskand they'll just course correct along
the way and they're okay with that.
And so that might be a littledifferent risk tolerance, but I
still think that oftentimes thosemoves are not driven by Intention.
(07:44):
They're driven by runningaway from fear and security.
Still, the difference between a brashmovemaker and a bold movemaker is that
bold moves are deliberate and intentional.
They're coming from hope and possibility.
They're not running away from anything.
They're running towards something.
I never doubted whetherI'd made the right move.
(08:06):
It was just going to take longerthan I thought it was going to, but
I never doubted whether it had beenthe right move because I planned it
out so well going in, I didn't need acontingency plan, which was pretty cool.
Right.
And so again, I think it's all aboutthe, it's about the right level
of discovery, the right level ofplanning, the right level of intention,
(08:27):
knowing yourself well enough.
To know what you're alignedto, to know your strengths and
your values and your gifts.
And when you see something that's sucha natural fit, it doesn't feel risky.
It doesn't feel so scary.
This is a good time to talk about whatit means to be big and feeling big.
(08:47):
I read your book when yougave it to me a while back.
I re read it and I get that feeling.
feeling in my stomach of invincibilitywhen I hear you describe what
it is to be your biggest self.
Can you talk about that a little bit andinspire us about what it's like to be big?
(09:08):
Sure.
And let me tell you how it feels.
So Alan had asked me this question,who are you when you're big?
And he had me write something outfor our next coaching session.
He's like, think back totimes when you were thriving.
Think back to times when youwere, you know, on your game,
energized, engaged, et cetera.
And, you know, I immediately went tokind of being in front of my team and
leading them in a celebratory event afterI had given them a great big challenge.
(09:32):
You know, I was.
I had my team of 50 peopleachieve work life balance in my
22 years in public accounting.
Nobody ever felt like theyhad work life balance.
And we just kept waiting forsomeone to give it to us and.
When we realized that, wow, what ifI define what it would be every week?
If I could do just two things thisweek to make me feel like I had work
life balance, what would they be?
(09:52):
And I gave them permission to do that.
I gave them permission to go after it.
They started working togetherto allow each other to achieve
their work life balance goals.
And we never missed a single deadlineand my team, they were working incredibly
hard, but they felt like they hadwork life balance and it was a mind.
set.
And so when I thought aboutwhere am I when I'm big, right?
(10:13):
I, I, the first thing I thoughtof was standing in front of my
team as we were doing sort ofa celebratory event for that.
And I could feel it in my stomach, right?
Like I could, I could justfeel how I felt in the moment.
And I think part of the problem withme answering the question initially
for Allen on where is it the timesin my career when I was thriving, I
kept trying to think my way into it.
(10:34):
And unfortunately, my egowas too tied to it, right?
I was, I kept going for what I was knownfor being good at or the prestigious
positions I had or the prestigiousthings that I got to do within the firm.
But it wasn't where I felt the mostalive, you know, in my soul, in my heart.
So I thought about that.
And my first version of my bigstatement says I'm smiling, singing,
(10:54):
doing, I got the going on dance.
Like I had that feeling.
And once I had thatfeeling, it was like, Oh.
Like big is simply a state of mind andevery moment of every day I have a choice
to make and I can choose to feel smallor I can literally just step into being
big and I used to think about literallywalking out from behind my desk and
(11:15):
stepping into the sort of the circle onthe floor and saying, okay, I'm going to,
I'm going to make myself feel that way.
I'm going to imagine it in my.
In my whole being, in my body.
And when I get there, like it was easyto come up with additional times when
I felt that way and, and to describewhat it was when I was feeling that way.
I realized that number one,big is a state of mind.
(11:37):
It's simply a state of mind.
And we can, everything in lifeis the story we make up about it.
So we can make up really defeating, youknow, stories that bring us down, or we
can kind of reframe the situation and putit into something that is more empowering.
I was working with a lot of peoplein transition and, you know, some of
them are like, Oh my God, I'm a loser.
(11:58):
I've already had to pick up my career.
It's all downhill from here.
I don't know if my marriageis going to survive.
Those sound drastic, but thoseare things, actual things that
go through people's minds.
And I've worked with over 5, 000people in transition or you can say.
Oh, my gosh.
That job wasn't right for me anymore.
Anyway, you know, this is a coffee break.
Look, I get to spend time with mykids and reconnect with my spouse
(12:18):
and look at all these great people.
I'm meeting networking to find my job.
And, you know, what if I getto choose what I go to next and
define it better for myself?
And, you know, this isjust a mid career reset.
Who do you think is going to land faster?
Right?
Somebody who is.
Doom and gloom or somebody who's liketaking advantage of this invariably
(12:40):
the people who were enjoying this thisbreak and this journey Landed faster
your state of mind is number one.
So what I hear you saying, you've gotto change that mindset Can you give
us some tips as to how we make thatconnection and maintain that connection?
Because I think it's easy for us todo it for a little while but then
life shows up How do we become big?
(13:02):
There's kind of a process that Itend to take people through and
it's, it's really an expandedversion of what Alan had asked me.
What are the times when you were, youknow, on your game energized engaged?
And I call it thriving moments.
It's like what were the times in yourcareer or in your life even where you
were just On fire, you know, like youwere clicking on all cylinders, you
(13:23):
were in that state of flow and thenthink back to those times, oftentimes
when I'm helping people with interviewsor even in their branding, it's like,
okay, get it down to sort of a story.
What was the situation?
What was the action?
What was the result?
But what I think isdesperately missing is.
Why was it so meaningful to you?
What was it about itthat had you thriving?
(13:44):
And when I realized that in every timewhen I was thriving, I could stand back
and I could see I had put some greatbig challenge out in front of people.
I'd inspired them to get there.
One was organizing a team for the multiplesclerosis bike ride and recruiting
people that didn't even have bikes toride a hundred miles on a bike over the
course of a weekend and seeing their.
(14:04):
Aces in Mission Bay Park onSunday afternoon after they'd
ridden a hundred miles on a bike.
I'm like, I just knew I'd given themsomething that was good for their life,
like something that, where else dothey put barriers up where they think
they can't do something or, and theynever even bothered to challenge it.
What I call that is, is, youknow, being able to witness
people's magnificence emerging.
(14:25):
And I truly feel that's what I get to do.
I know it sounds a littlecorny or whatever, but.
You know, I want to help them tap intothose times and then amplify that and find
every opportunity to do that because thosestories tell you about what's meaningful
and what you're passionate about and allof that, but they also reveal all of your
strengths and your values and your giftsand big is an inside out proposition.
(14:51):
It's not I'm big when someexternal condition occurs.
It's when I'm big.
Who am I being?
How am I showing up?
What does it look like?
What do other peoplesee when I'm being big?
What am I doing when I'm being big?
Not that I'm big when I get to do that,but when I'm big I do that just that makes
it's not conditional It's an inside out.
(15:13):
So many people are looking forall this External validation
and extrinsic motivators.
Oh, I want the bonus.
I want the raise.
I want the achievement But whatreally drives us are intrinsic?
Motivators and trying to identifyand articulate those and really
explore what lights your fire Youknow, that's a way to identify
(15:34):
who you are when you're being big.
The other clue is when you Are being big.
Everything's easy and effortlessbecause you're in that state of flow.
And so it's not hard.
Like, oftentimes I would have people tellstories of their greatest achievement.
And, you know, they tell this story andthey want to tell it in the interview.
And you could just tellthat they were dog tired.
(15:55):
They were not feeling appreciated.
They were being the martyr.
But.
It's a story they think peoplewanna hear, and they would not
get a job if they told that story.
. Mm-hmm . You know, or they wouldnot impress their boss in a, in a
current job if they were tellingthat story to demonstrate their band.
Because it was just about really kindof ego and an external accomplishment.
It wasn't about what had them thriving.
(16:17):
Um, but a clue is where haveyou felt in that sense of flow?
Where have people around you, thisis the fourth thing, you know,
when you're big, you're givingopportunity for others to be big too.
And there's ripple effect and it's gamechanging and it's not just you and your
teams, it's your peers, your bosses,your boards, it's your family, it's your
(16:38):
community, it's It's the person in line inthe grocery store in front of you, right?
That if you have this energyof being big, it's contagious.
I believe, you know, emotions arecontagious and I can feel we've all been
around sourpusses and become sour, right?
You know, and we've all been aroundthese, these people that just seem to
have it going on and are really selfassured and confident and happy with
(17:00):
themselves and, and that spreads too.
So those are all clues, right?
Like understanding where youthrived, identifying your strengths,
your values, your gifts, thinkingabout where you've been in flow.
Think about how you're showing up.
What I have people do is actuallywrite a big statement, you know,
and when I'm big, blah, blah, blah.
Right.
(17:22):
When we come back, we'll talk more aboutthis energy flow and how we can keep
self sabotage from preventing us frombecoming big, looking for a keynote
speaker who redefines leadership.
Meet Gina L. Osborne.
As a U. S. Army Cold War spy catcherand FBI Special Agent Executive,
(17:44):
she knows what it takes to leadthrough chaos, crisis, and change.
Her secret?
Making Maverick Moves.
Bold, fearless strategies thatbreak barriers and shatter limits.
If you want your audience tothink bigger, lead stronger, and
own every room, Gina delivers.
(18:07):
Book Gina L. Osborne today and unleashthe Maverick mindset at your next event.
Visit GinaLOsborne.
com slash Making Maverick Moves.
You talk about flow, and that reallyresonates with me, because when we
allow fear to come to us, whetherit's fear about money, fear about
(18:29):
relationships, every time you feel that,I think that kind of breaks the flow.
I mean, can you talk a little bitabout how, how do we keep that flow
going without the self sabotage, thenegative self talk, anything that's
going to slow us down, the self doubt?
I believe we actually all have thesetwo voices inside our heads, right?
We have a good voice and we havewhat I call the gremlin, right?
(18:50):
The gremlin just screams things at us.
We wouldn't say to our worst enemy, right?
And yet we say it toourselves all the time.
And most of the time we'renot even aware of it.
We're it's subconscious.
And so what I do with clients isI do a full all day onboarding
session with new clients.
And we spend a whole day together.
And part of that day is weamplify this positive voice.
I want to know.
(19:11):
What it would say to them in theircurrent situation, you know, Is it the
voice of a coach or a boss or a parentor a grandparent or a mentor or you know?
Best friend and you know, what wouldthey tell them in this situation or
or in general about about themselves?
Yeah, I want to be able to amplify thatduring the coaching relationship I want
to be able to call upon that during thecoaching relationship but then we all
(19:33):
have this negative voice and the negativevoice says You know things we wouldn't
say to our worst enemy like I saidbefore the things I was saying when I was
talking about The story of a you know, weeverything in life is a story we make up.
I'm a loser I already atthe peak of my career.
It's all downhill from hereYou know, I'm never gonna get
a job as good as the last one.
I might lose my marriage Youknow, my kids think I'm a loser.
(19:55):
Those are all limiting beliefs That'sall that negative voice and not well
have you stucker than stuck Unless youlearn how to manage it, we all have it.
So there's a great book by Rick Carsoncalled Taming Your Gremlin, and he
has three principles in that book.
The first one is simply notice.
Like, I have people write down everythingthey're saying to themselves, and
sometimes they just look at that listand say, no wonder I feel like crap.
(20:19):
Right?
And it's like, wow, okay.
And then sometimes we need a littlemore than just acknowledging it.
And the second step of his Kindof methodology, if you will, is
choose and play with options.
So I get people to name their gremlins.
I get people to, um, think aboutwhat time of day it shows up.
(20:39):
And the, the biggest thing is thatI get people to banter with it.
And so we turn limiting beliefs, all thenegative things that your gremlin wants
to say to you into powerful assumptions.
Now, these aren't just.
Positive assumptions.
They're not just a logic shift or ashift from a thinking state, if you will.
What I'm trying to do is create a newneural pathway in our brain, and we can't
(21:01):
do that with some sort of energetic.
Connection to it.
So when we banter or get sarcastic or, youknow, or a little snarky with it, we're
going to have way more power to do that.
And so I take every limiting beliefthat somebody has written down prior
to our all day onboarding session,and we take every one of those and
we flip it to a powerful assumption.
(21:23):
Like when I went into my nationalrole, I did this with my coach and
I was telling myself, myself, thingslike, I don't think like them.
And, and I'm not in their leaguelooking to the leaders of the firm
I was dealing with day to day.
And I don't think like them became,of course you don't think like them.
That's why they called you to the table.
That's why they created this positionfor you, which is absolutely true.
(21:45):
And I'm not in their league became,yeah, and at this stage of their career,
they weren't in that league either.
Look who you get to hang with.
What can you learn from these people?
So picture me walking into a conferenceroom with those thoughts going
through my head versus the first two.
I'm going to show up completely different.
And so managing this negativevoice is, is critically important.
I'll give you one other funny example.
(22:08):
I used to do a program forexecutives in transition.
It was a free month longgroup coaching program.
Got me, you know, infront of a lot of people.
I helped people within a time of need.
And you know, it's reallyfueled my business in terms of
referrals over time and whatnot.
But we do this exercisein that in that session.
And what I'm trying to do isis teach everybody this skill.
(22:29):
And so we have a write down for a week,everything that Kind of pops into their
head and then they come to the sessionready to share just one of the things
that they've written down and then wego around the room and we say, okay,
everybody, let's help this person flip itand we don't want to do it through logic.
We want to be snarky and youknow, we're kind of teaching
because people will go to logic.
They'll go to problem solving andthat's it's just not going to do it.
(22:52):
Right.
And so this one guy who'sprobably the most successful
in the room by all accounts.
And the thing that he'd been tellinghimself his whole life, he said,
my, I just, my whole life, I'vetold myself that I'm in trouble
or I'm going to get in trouble.
And everybody was like, this guy sayingthat, you know, it was like, really?
(23:12):
And so, you know, it took us a littlewhile to turn it around, but that's okay.
Cause cause we just keepgoing until we get it.
And what's funny is when we get it, wewill see a shift in their physiology.
Right.
They will laugh or they will sit backor their shoulders will go down or you
know Like you can see it physically intheir in their body and their energy
When we find the right thing and we justkeep going till we find it and we were
(23:35):
having a little trouble this day Gettingto it and and so I kind of sat back and
I said, okay What happened when I gotin trouble and I just started cracking
up and and I just said Spank me, baby.
Never going to say that to himself againwithout just breaking into a laugh.
(23:55):
Right?
Like we've, we've createda new neural pathway.
It is gone.
He'll say it to himself again.
Right.
Because, because we do that.
The key is, is do I havean ability to manage it?
Do I recognize when it's taking me over?
Do I slow down and simply noticethe things I'm saying to myself?
And do I choose and play with optionslike in Rick's book, Rick Carson's book?
(24:17):
I also get people to name it.
I had a guy whose name wasTom and this was honorable Tom
and this was doubting Thomas.
Which soon became known as DFT.
One day he, uh, he hada, a box he sent me.
It was a records box and he had thisbig chain around it with a padlock.
And he sent me a picture andit said DT on the front of it.
And he was so proud of himselfbecause he had locked the gremlin
(24:39):
away for, you know, two weeks.
So he thought he had mastered this.
And I'm like, it's notabout stuffing it away.
It's about when it shows up almostinviting it out to dance and then
pulling the rug out from underneath it.
And that gets to the other part of Rick'sbook, which is be in process with it.
Understand this isn't a one and done.
(24:59):
It's going to come and go.
Anytime you try and make a bold moveor a maverick move, anytime you try
and challenge the status quo, yourgremlin's going to get really loud.
Because it doesn't, it feels risky andso much of what we perceive as risk is
simply our gremlin trying to hold us back.
And so when we can actuallychallenge all of that, we can
(25:24):
move forward with confidence.
When you're right there gettingready to make your Maverick move,
there's one thing that's stopping you.
So is it fear?
Is it doubt?
The consequences thatcould possibly happen?
So what is your advice topeople who really want to make
this move, but they're stuck?
(25:46):
One of my coach's questions that usuallyjust like drives me a little crazy.
You know, I'll be stuck on something.
And I'll say, Oh, my gremlin's got me.
And he'll say, how do youknow it's not your whisperer?
I'm like, what, whatare you talking about?
Because this is the way I feel.
I feel like crap.
It can't be my whisperer, you know?
And it's like, Oh, well, what ifthere's something there for me to
(26:06):
pay attention to, what if there'ssomething I haven't considered?
What if there's somethingI need to consider?
What if there's, you know.
Something that I can plan for, or I canmitigate, or I can challenge, right?
Maybe it's just getting my gremlin to hushup, but maybe there's something that I
(26:27):
can look at that I haven't yet considered.
And I think that that'sactually a good thing.
I want that.
You almost want that to happenbecause when you overcome it and
move forward with confidence,you're going to feel even better.
And so look at it, you know, liketalk to it and, you know, go down a
path with somebody and find out, is itjust my gremlin showing up or is there
(26:50):
something for me to look at there?
Is there something that, youknow, that can make me more
self assured moving forward?
Whether you're running away fromsomething or running towards something.
Um, so whether you're making a brashmove or a bold move, I've got people
in jobs and they're not happy and theyjust want to get out or they just want
to, you know, and they're looking atsomething, man, I want to go be an
entrepreneur, I'm tired of the, youknow, the corporate boss and all that.
(27:12):
And it's like, are you, you know,like if they're focused on that, I'm
not convinced they want to go there.
No, my family was an entrepreneur.
I just have this dream.
I, you know, I, I just knowthis is what I want to do for
the second half of my career.
And there's resilience in that.
And I think it's really, really important.
(27:34):
I have a, I heard.
We couldn't put it in the bookbecause we couldn't verify it,
but I had heard this story and Ijust thought it was fascinating.
So, so just know it may not be true, butwhat I had heard was that Barbara Walters
was interviewing Oprah and as they werekind of, you know, getting sat down
and, you know, just chatting a littlebit and whatnot, Oprah thought Barbara
(27:58):
Walters had said, why do you work out?
And that's not what she actually said.
And they were like,Oh, no, no, no, no, no.
Why do you work?
And she said, if you picture a graphand I'm going to try and drop backwards.
So she said, um, Oh,it's my life's purpose.
You know, I just, it's, it's,you know, it's my calling.
I can't imagine not doing it.
And dah, dah, Right.
(28:19):
And it was kind of this Northstar of, of progress up, right.
And, you know, yeah, sure.
There's been ups and downs, but,but you know, she's achieved it.
And there's this resilience that sortof goes on when you, when you know
what you're going for and, and you've,you're, you're intentional about it.
Right.
And so then they kind of laughedand said, well, why do you work out?
(28:41):
And she said to not have a fat butt.
Okay.
This is according to the story.
Again, we, we looked for it to try and putit in the book and we couldn't find it.
So it may not be true.
And so just.
Bear with that.
Um, and you know, the, the weight ison the bottom, you know, access, right?
(29:02):
And it can, fear can be a great motivator.
And this is why I think rashmaker people come in, right?
Fear can be this greatmotivator for action.
And so we create this action.
And as soon as the distance between, youknow, what I'm afraid of and where I am
goes away, we tend to fall back down.
And so that's why Perhaps herhealth journey has gone up and down
(29:26):
as opposed, cause she's runningaway from being unhealthy, right?
As opposed to runningtowards being healthy.
And so Fascinating.
And, you know, whether the story'strue or not, I think the, the, the
point is made in, when we're runningtowards something, I think we just
have this incredible resilience.
You hear so much talk about resilience.
(29:47):
So it sounds like there is some workthat needs to be put in to this.
I know that some people want toavoid that type of internal work.
Do you think you can ever getto that place of being big
if you don't do that work?
I don't.
However, I like to think of it as notbeing work, but having it be play, right?
Like, how do you do it in such a waythat you enjoy the journey, that it's
(30:10):
fun, that it's, it's intriguing to you?
You know, I'm an extrovert, right?
I had a coach that helped me through it.
I had a coach that Italked it through with.
Because that's how I process.
That's how I think.
I have to think out loud.
And while I might've done work onmy own in between sessions, my real
journey in exploration occurred whenI was talking it out with somebody,
(30:32):
whether it was him or somebody else.
And it's kind of funny.
He has a question and another questionfor me that, you know, always gets me.
I'll be sitting here laboringover something stuck.
My gremlins going away.
Right.
And he would be like, well,what would make it easy?
In other words, wherecould I create that flow?
Right.
And I was like, huh.
And I'd be like, you know, I mightthrow things out, you know, I'll
find a magic wand or if I likemarketing is not my gig, right?
(30:54):
Uh, maybe if I had a marketing degreeor maybe if I had, you know, and I'll
mention all these things and thenit'll be like, well, maybe if I had
someone I could bop down the halland throw my ideas around, right?
Well, I'm a solo entrepreneur.
I don't have.
Somebody, you know, right nextdoor to, to go, but he'll be like,
gee, do you know anybody like that?
And I'm like, of course I do.
Any one of those 5, 000 people thatwent through my bootcamp program, right.
(31:17):
Would be honored to haveme ask for their help.
Let me bounce my ideas aroundor think something through with
them and call on their expertise.
And if that's how it makes iteasy for me, then find a way
that's going to make it easy.
This is a magical book.
Who are you when youare big, Kimberly Roush?
Thank you so much for being on the show.
My pleasure.
(31:38):
Super fun.
It's so great to see you again.
And I think that your big statement'sa fun testament to all of this.
And, um, you've certainly sortof been through this process.
So I think, you know,the power of it for sure.
Making Maverick Moves with Gina L. Osborneis produced and edited by Lisa Osborne.
(31:58):
Theme music, Maverick Heart, is byretired IRS criminal investigative
attaché Clarissa Balmesita.
Connect with us on socialmedia through GinaLOsborne.
com slash Making Maverick Moves.
And don't miss an episode.
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