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September 23, 2025 35 mins

Haven’t seen it? – We’ll help you decide to press play or skip with a quick spoiler-free movie breakdown.

Seen it? – We’ll make you want to watch it again by uncovering things you may have missed, even after multiple viewings. Plus movie trivia you never noticed!

This week on Movies In A Nutshell we take on The Bourne Identity, chosen by listener Ady Willan! The 2002 spy thriller starring Matt Damon as Jason Bourne.

🎬 The Bourne Identity (2002) – In A Nutshell

PART 1 – The Nutshell – If you haven't seen it

A clear, spoiler-free basic plot/style breakdown, plus movies it can be compared with and all to help you decide if it’s your kind of movie.

PART 2 – Unboxing – If you've seen it

  • What Did You Miss? → Hidden layers, details, surprises and things you may have missed even after multiple viewings!
  • Paul’s Facts of the Day → Trivia, production stories, and film facts.
  • Hate It or Rate It? → Marc, Darren & Paul give their brief opinions, scores and see where it lands in the Legend League!

PART 3 – Listener Lounge

Listener questions, shout-outs, and movie requests.

📌 Movies In A Nutshell is a movie podcast with spoiler-free breakdowns, film reviews, and trivia in every episode.

See where The Bourne Identity lands on our Listener League Table!

📊https://linkly.link/2Bi9l

📊 View the Legend League table:

https://www.moviesinanutshell.com/legend-league

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🎙️ Hosts

Marc Farquhar

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Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/themarcfarquhar

Darren Horne

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thedarrenhorne

Paul Day

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/pauldaylive23


Recorded at:

🎙️ Sunbeams Studios – https://www.thestudioatsunbeams.co.uk

🎵 Part of Annie Mawson's Sunbeams Music Trust – https://sunbeamsmusic.org


Music:

🎵 Main Theme: BreakzStudios – https://pixabay.com/users/breakzstudios-38548419

🎵 Music Bed: ProtoFunk – Kevin MacLeod – https://incompetech.com

(All music licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 License)

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Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:12):
Hello and welcome to Movies ina Nutshell with me, Marc Farquhar,
myself, Darren.
Horn and I, Paul Day.
We help you spend less timebrowsing and more time watching.
If you've seen the movie,we'll reveal what you might have
missed. If you haven't, we'llgive you a quick spoiler free breakdown.
We've got behind the scenestrivia including Paul's facts of
the day, host ratings.
And a legend league table,plus your. Chance to choose a movie.

(00:33):
So grab some popcorn and let'sjump into this week's movie. Okay,
here we go. The BourneIdentity, which was a listener Choice
chosen by A.D. willen.
Thanks, A.D. thanks for your choice.
I had not seen it before, soit was the first time for me. I knew
it was one of those films thatI should have seen and everyone else
has seen it. So we are in partone, which is the nutshell where
we will break the movie downspoiler free to help you decide if

(00:56):
it's a movie for you. How dowe break this down? What's this movie
about? It has identity in thetitle, so.
That gives it away.
It's a journey of discovery.
A journey of discovery of hisidentity. His.
Who is he? Is he a. Is he agood guy? Is he a bad guy?
Who knows?
Is he a loser?
Who knows?
Is he a hero?
Is he Matt Damon? Well, weknow he's Matt Damon. Yeah. Much
like he was being born again.Oh, there's the nutshell. End of

(01:21):
episode. Boom. Nailed it.
What's this movie about? Them?
That's about paranoia.Loneliness to a certain extent. And
a deep distrust of thesecurity organizations that our governments
employ.
And like I said, like manymovies in many different ways. Identity.
Yeah.
Or lack thereof. And ajourney, some kind of journey to

(01:43):
discovery.
And it's a spy thriller.
Yeah. It's about survival. Dowhat you have to do to survive. It's
about instinct, reactingnaturally to extreme. In extreme
circumstances.
Yeah. It's also about. It'snot self efficacy. What's that word
or phrase where you can just.You can take care of yourself, where
you're Reliance. Selfalliance. Yeah. So that's self reliance.
And yeah, standing on your owntwo feet and just taking care of

(02:06):
business.
But like I said, the instinctskick in. Like you work to situations
because you've got no memory.You're like, oh, I've just reacted
to that. Like, it's like your.So your, your past is coming forward
but you don't remember it.It's quite a. It's also. This is
a game of Cat and mouse isquite good. It's a journey for the
most part. You don't know ifit's hero's journey or a villain's
journey. Literally, you're.You're on the journey with him.
Yeah. We find out about the.The guy as he finds out about the

(02:30):
guy. I suppose that's whatmakes it quite unique. It's also
about us growing old becauseMatt Damon is prepubescent in this
movie. Well, this was 2002. Heis a mere baby. Yeah.
I was 21 when this movie cameout. Okay, so the basics of it. Part
A. A man is pulled from thesea with no memory, but with instincts
and skills suggest some kindof past.

(02:51):
Yeah.
There may be a dangerous.
Multiple languages. Take careof himself.
Yeah. As he searches foranswers across Europe, he discovered
his name, what he thinks ishis name, and shadowy forces in.
The background, shadowygovernmental forces are trying to
track him down at the same time.
So he's kind of caught betweenwho he. Who he thinks he is and who
he wants to be. He mustsurvive long enough to choose his
own identity in the end, Iguess his destiny.

(03:13):
And in the meantime, he runsinto Run Lola Run. Yes, he does.
Yes. Lola. Yeah. Yeah. Marie.
Did you recognize Marie?
I did. Straight away. Boom.Anything movies this can be compared
to. I do not have a movie. Twomovies. This one.
I've written down a few. Seeif you agree. Darren, you'll probably
think more. So I went with.Obviously there's the Bond comparisons,

(03:34):
but like modern Bond, DanielCraig Bond. So they're less cartoony
Bonds. So what happened was.And again, kind of getting into the
deep cultural impact of this,but it's probably worth saying. So
in 2002, Bond had just doneDie Another Day with PS Brosnan,
which obviously had a few. Ithad an invisible car wind surfing
on a thing. There was a fewCGIs. I still enjoyed Dying. What

(03:57):
was Halle Berry's name in it?Jinx, I want to say. Oh, that's actually
fairly tame for James Bond. Ithink it's jinx galore. Yeah, but.
But that had come out and it'sreally good. But then Born Identity
came out and had this sort ofstyle. And I think the Bond producers
then said, no, this is. Anddon't forget Twin Towers was only
in 2001. So the world'sperception of comedy and all this

(04:20):
sort of stuff had changed. Sothey then modeled Daniel Craig Bond
very much on Born Identity. Soif you like the Daniel Craig Bond
films, you're probably gonnalike the style of Bond identity because
that's where I think they gotit from. That's. I'm sure what they
said.
Was this a book? Initially itwas, yeah.
But it's also a remake. Yeah.So there's a miniseries with Richard
Chamberlain. Yeah. Which I'venever seen, but my old keyboard player

(04:43):
back in the day used to raveabout that.
Yeah. When I mentioned justlike, a couple of my friends were
like, which one? I was like,the Matt Damon one.
See, I didn't realize it was aminiseries until I was doing the
Facts of the Day.
Oh, so it's not a previous movie.
It sounds like it's aminiseries, but then they put it
on video, like, as a bit of amovie, and apparently that was more
like the book. Whereas thisfilm's very light, likely like the

(05:03):
book. Okay, so. So there's theBond films, Mission Impossible films,
Enemy of the State. I know youlike that one.
Definitely.
Possibly. Jack Reacher, JackJack Ryan, that kind of stuff. Jack
Ryan, for sure. Yeah. Yeah. Iput the new Italian Job, bit of that
in there. The Matt Wahlbergone, the Saint, the Val Kilmer one
I've seen. Maybe that kind ofstyle where it was sort of 90s spy

(05:24):
espionage cities, that kind ofvibe. I also put Leon in Heat, potentially,
and any of you Marvel people.I also put down Captain America,
Winter Soldier, and BlackWidow, potentially, just because
of the kind of spy elements Iknow you haven't seen in the Marvel
ones. But Munich. Yeah, that'sa good call.
Good references there. So thatshould help people get a feel for
where this fits in.

(05:45):
It feels like an old 1970skind of cold War spy movie. Yeah.
Well, I was thinking evenGoldenEye, to a certain extent, like
the. The first PS Brosnan one.
Okay, let's move on to parttwo, which is the unboxing, which
is located right in the middleof Spoiler Territor.
Yeah. I was gonna say this isalso just a love story about a guy

(06:07):
who's trying to get it on withthe lass, and his job keeps getting
in the way. Yeah, there isthat, because I've just ended that.
I'm gonna have to edit thatback in. But that was good. Did you
not hear me finish the segment?
Yeah, but I thought that thatwas a spoiler because the love story.
Yeah, that's true.
Okay, that's good. Okay, so inpart two, we have. What did you miss?

(06:28):
Where we will uncover thingsyou may have missed, even if you've
seen the movie many times.Then we have Paul's Facts of the
Day where he will amaze uswith his Hours of research and he
will pick the best ones.
Hours studying.
And then we've finalized Parttwo with Hate it or Rate it, where
we each give our opinion onthe movie plus a score of 10 and
we see where it lands on theLegend League. Darren, let's go over
to you for. What did you miss?
I don't know. Like, I didwonder if the color red was doing

(06:51):
something that color red waslike a safe thing for him. Because
I'm sure. Did she have red inher hair or was it just like. I'm
looking at her like Lola loadof on. I don't think she did. I feel
like she had. Because I look,I did a double take and I was. I'm
sure there's some red strandsor some reddishness or it's brownie
red or something like that,you know. But then she has a red
car and 98.

(07:12):
Yeah, I think 99. And this is2002, so it's not long after.
See, that's weird, isn't it?Because in my head, I feel like this
isn't a different time zone.
They're very differentstylistically. Yeah, you wouldn't.
But. But in the facts of theday, I think there's bits around
the director wanted her forthis role. So originally it might
have been something else, butit's like, no, no, I want Run Lola
Run in this film. I won't tryand say her name so you don't have
to edit it out. Thanks. Otherthan that, I really didn't spot that

(07:37):
much else. I mean, it isabout. I mean, Paul was right. I
was so proud of you, but youkind of shouted everything. I was
going to say that it's not. Itwasn't made like after 9 11. It would
have been written before 9 11.It would have been in production
probably around that time.
It probably had to stop and goback to it.
Yeah. And apparently I read alittle bit that the production was
a bit of a shit show. And thenline 11 happened and then it got

(07:58):
kind of pushed through. So itwas a luck thing. It's not about
9 11, but I think it was a hitbecause we. There was a lot of dialogue
around security agencies andwhat isn't. Isn't appropriate. There
was definitely an awarenessthat these massive kind of spy agencies
and like undercover agentswere out there working for us. And

(08:18):
also an element of whichquickly became distrust in the agencies
as a conspiracy. The theoriesaround 911 started to spring up.
And then you got this moviewhere it's like, oh, they are up
to Shady stuff. And they'realso incompetent and also not trustworthy.
Well, governments areincompetent. Right. And I think that
it became like a sense ofcontempt because basically, I mean,

(08:40):
what is these, you know, thissecurity organization? Was it the
program school? Isn't it?Yeah, it's a bunch of old white guys
dictating what should andshouldn't be done. And he said, come
on, these guys are idiots. Ithink Agent Langley or whatever comes
in the second one, the ladyStats. Oh, yeah. Thinking she's all
part of treadstones off. Butyeah, in this one it is very much

(09:00):
Brian Cox and just. Yes,Cooper. Yeah. And he's like, what
are we gonna do? Like, so gobring him in. Like, ask him what
happened. Like, tranquilizehim or something. No, no, activate
every one of the other agentsbecause nothing's going to go wrong,
even though this agent wentrogue. So let's get all the other
agents who are going to beperfectly stable and aren't having

(09:21):
headaches and aren't going tofreaking become mental because of
what you've done to them. Andwe'll send those out into the field.
What? Course. And it's alsothis weird American thing as well.
It's like, yeah, we're goingto have. Which agent were you? Which
country we in? So wait, you'vegot agents in every other country,
I'm guessing they don't knowyou're there. So you're just the
police for the world, aren'tyou? America. Fuck, yeah. Spreading
democracy and libertyeverywhere you go. You couldn't.

(09:43):
You couldn't tell because Iwas in character. I'm an actor. Yeah,
amazing. But. But there's.It's. It's a weird film because he
then has a conscience, right?Like, he is. He can't kill this person
because they've got kids andhe's like, I can't do this.
Well, I feel that's. We findout that's why he failed his original
mission, because he has aconscience and a heart.
Yeah. And it takes a while forus to find that out if. Remember,

(10:05):
isn't it, before we get thatflashback of till the end. Which
is good because, like you say,it kept us guessing all the way through.
Is he good guy? Is he bad guy?What. What's his moral compass? Yeah,
and you're right. I mean, itdid kind of change the action movies
to a certain extent. And,like, if you go back further in time
to, I know, the adventures ofwomanhood, like, if you had a sword

(10:25):
fight in that era. SoAdventures of Womanhood. Jesus went.
Is that four years before?Yeah, I think it's always the actors
would have to learn swordfighting because it's going to be
a long take.
Authentic.
It's going to be a long take.It's going to be long shots and mid
shots. Like it's going to becertainly two shots and these guys
are going to have to swordfight. Same with Princess Bride to
a certain extent, which is80s, I think. Whereas in this we

(10:49):
start to get that quickkinetic action. Whereas we like Kung
Fu move, say like Chucky,Jackie Chan or whatever. You have
long takes. These actors arereally doing it and they're showing
off that they can really dothis. And so, so then it starts to
come down and I think theaverage cut across the film is four
seconds in this movie. So it's1, 2, 3, 4, cut. So in the fight
scenes it's probably quicker.Like 1, 2, cut, 1, 2, cup. And that

(11:10):
got. That got reduced as itwent on. So by the sequel it was
2.4 seconds and the third oneit was 2 seconds. So average cut
of every 2 seconds. Wow. Ialways felt the second one was more
cut. Even the third onethough. Absolutely. Other than the
third one, I remember. Seeingthe second one being quite tired,
trying to stay awake with theextra cuts. And I was struggling
because it was so fast. And Idon't know if it's a good or bad

(11:32):
thing. And the good thing isyou can get people like. Who's Count
Dooku in Star Wars?Christopher Lee. Yes, Christopher
lee, who's probably 97 orsomething crazy in that movie. And
you can get him doing swordfights because. Or like, you know,
lightsaber fights becauseyou're going to cut around it. But
is it because we're like, oh,I'd rather see these guys really
do it. But yeah, this reallykind of changed the cinema, the,
the landscape of actionmovies. And you're right, like James

(11:54):
Bond went from being a cartoonto really gritty black and white
opening guy being killed in atoilet, you know. Yeah. Well, I remember
watching the behind the scenesstuff of Dying of the Day and it
was a shame really in thesense that, see, I really like Pierce
Brodner's James Bond. Ithought it was a good Bond. And when
you watch the behind thescenes of Die Another Way, it's clear

(12:14):
they were trying to lean intowhatever the, the trends were at
that time, which was there wasmore cgi. So they were actually trying
to push the envelope with allthe scenes that we now look at go,
oh, invisible Car andwindsurfing and all that, that was
actually them trying to dogood, to be up to date, to push Bond
into the new century. And itkind of backfired.
They always do it too much,don't they?
Yeah.
I remember when there was 3D,was everything. Yeah, it was movies

(12:37):
that had no need to be in 3D,were in 3D. Everything was. Everyone
was doing it was just ridiculous.
So what Bonded and I watchedthe behind the scenes thing of this
one on the Blu Ray. You'd beproud of me. Yeah. But Frank Marshall
and Matt Damon everyone'stalking about. Yeah. We wanted to
make something different towhat all the other action movies
were at the time. So Bond, ina way, was trying its best to do
something good. And itbackfired because everyone's like,

(12:58):
oh, that's too. And especiallywith 9 11, everyone had been a bit
more serious, probably. Sothey're thinking, oh, invisible cars,
what load of crap. So PierceBrosnan was probably thinking he
was going to do a fifth oneand I kind of wanted him to do a
fifth one. But then whenBourne came out, it changed the landscape
and they're like, no, we needto just scratch this.
We need someone like you said.
All of a sudden it was blackand white. Daniel Craig, very serious,

(13:20):
completely differentlandscape. And you can see that impact
of that Bourne film straightaway. Also, Pierce Brosnan wasted
the opportunity to say theline, I'm sure I left my car around
here somewhere. Right. Ifyou're listening, if you're listening,
you should have thrown thatin. Yeah, it's good, it's good. Yeah.
But there's a lot of otherthings that I quite liked it because
a lot of times spy movies areseamless. Like, everything goes their

(13:42):
way. Like, so James BondiEverything goes your way. And a lot
of stuff goes wrong for thisguy. And there's bits like, you know,
where he's trying to get away,but he drops the bag and it's our
dude and he's got to go adifferent way. But I also like the
bit where he's this. They'rebuilding up to some elaborate heist,
really, to get into the hotelto get the bill I think they were
after. And he's like, okay, Ineed you to like, count how many

(14:03):
feet it is and I'm going toguide you. And then we're going to
do this and do this. And she'slike, oh, I just asked the guy. Yeah.
And he gave it to me and hesaid, ask the guy. She says, yeah.
I said, who's personal assistant.
And he's like, oh, that's good.
Okay.
It's like, it's like when youlike a super one of those movies,
a superhero with flaws kind of thing.
Yeah. It's like when Deadpoolforgets the bag of guns.
Yeah.

(14:24):
But it makes it more real. Andagain in the behind the scenes when
they're talking about it, it'slike they really wanted it to be
character driven action ratherthan. Because what we in 2002. So
at that time it was actionfraction's sake. Yeah. And they were
like, no, we wanted to becharacter based action. So yeah,
there's gonna be them actionscenes. But we wanted it very based
around this story of him findhimself and then like you say it
then changed. So all theaction films that sort of then preceded

(14:47):
that would have this.
Well, we'd have.
Trying to Be Bold.
Also had Mission Impossible 2in 2000.
Yeah.
Not long before that.
And that's another goodexample of, you know that out of
the Mission Impossible filmsis probably the most extreme of.
It was a John Woo thing. Soit's slow Motion Motorbike 1 on the.
On the rocks in the middle ofnowhere, hanging off which Tom Cruise
obviously he said nut job fordoing all that stuff by himself.

(15:07):
Legendary nut job. But thenWhen Mission Impossible 3 rolled
around, I can't remember whatyear that was, they kind of pulled
it back a bit from MissionImpossible 2's craziness. And then
by the time Mission Impossible4 and 5 and some of the others, they'd
sort of been a bit more bornidentity as well. So as you get through
them, they actually becomemore serious again. All right. There's
still the crazy stunts.

(15:27):
So it has an impact basically.Definitely big impacts.
Yeah. Especially on the actionfilm genre. There's also a little,
a little element in, you know,the fact he doesn't kill the kids
is that you can't just use.I'm just following orders. And. And
he was like, no, look, I'm.You know, he clearly makes a decision.
I'm not going to do that. Andwhat's going on in the world right
now is interesting becausethere's an awful lot of people in

(15:48):
both this country and inAmerica certainly who are following
orders and doing someseriously shady stuff. You know,
I've seen the police in ourcountry like arresting 91 year old
women for wearing a T shirt.It's. There's some weird stuff going
on for sure. So yeah, that wascool. And I also like the fact that
I now know that dyeing awoman's hair and washing her hair

(16:11):
and cutting her hair is one ofthe horniest things you can experience
on the planet. Far hornierthan making a clay pot. I wonder
if he'd go there. And you did.It's horny, right?
Have you done both?
No. The ghost scene, I waslike, what is that?
Oh, it's just so cheesy that Inever bought into that.
Yeah. No one. I've never met awoman who is willing to make that

(16:34):
much mess for sex. If you'relistening, listeners, have you ever
done this?
I noticed Marie quickly getslost in Jason's journey.
Every.
She asked so many questions.Who was that? Where are you going?
What just happened? Where arewe going? What are you doing? Those.
Every. She was just complete.Every. Every scenes are asking a
question about it. She hasn'tgot a clue. She can't keep up with

(16:54):
him.
Yeah, but I feel like that'sus going, who's that?
Yeah, she represents us, the listener.
But also, how quickly does shefall for him? I know this is just
a mysterious stranger. Theylike that kind of thing. Actually,
I'm kind of in love with him.Yeah. So that happened fast. See,
if Matt Damon had come at myseminars, he could have been friend
zone and got on with his job.Right, right. Friend zone in a day.

(17:16):
Oh, yeah. With poor day. Right.
Friend Zone all day by Paul Day.
Let's. Let's get that. Let'sget that spin off podcast in the
works.
I see the first book coming.The first book.
Okay. Yeah. Volume one. She isadorable. Like when she's kind of
putting the whole hair behindher ear and she's like, well, can
I come? Do you want me tocome? Oh, no, I'll see you. Whatever
you say. We can come upstairs,say, oh, my God, it's like they've

(17:38):
been on a date. Very interesting.
The world's weirdest date.
Right? But yeah, she fallsfrom. I mean, he's good looking,
so things.
I picked up on identity versusconditioning. Like, Bourne's muscle
memory clashes with his. Like,his emerging conscience. Like, he
knows he can do things, butlike, oh, I don't want to do that.
Which is kind of what happenedin the first place.
I think. Also he's aware thatthis skill base is starting to make

(18:00):
him seem like a bad guy. Hesaid, what possible reason could
I have to know this or do thisor whatever. I wrote down one of
the lines which links intowhat you were saying, that she's
always asking questions whereshe said, he went out the window.
Why would someone do that?Yeah. That was cool. It's like, why
would you do that? It's almostlike a Seinfeld thing. Like.
Yeah, she's. She's kind ofnot. She's not just a tag along.
She's almost. She almosthumanizes his. Or she steers his

(18:24):
choices by just being herself.
Jason, who's out there, It'sClive Owen.
She asks questions, but alsomakes him think, which influences
his choices because he's. Heis a bit lost. Yeah, he's kind of
fumbling his way through this.So anyway, she's kind of.
I love her horror as well whenshe's like, I'm on this picture.
What, the fight. Who are you?And she tries to attack the guy.
He's like, no, I do this. Youstay over there. But I like the fight

(18:47):
scenes. They were. They weresolid. They were.
Yeah.
Quick and kinetic, but theywere vicious. It reminds me of Grosse
Pointe. Blanket places. Oh,yeah, because he uses the pen.
I like the location. Zurichand Paris.
Yeah.
It seemed like the gritty realism.
Yeah. Like a lack of kind ofMarvel CGI type of stuff. It was
like, okay, I believe you'rein this city. I believe you're hurtling
around everywhere. That's cool.

(19:07):
Did anyone else pick up onsome of the shots? So earlier on
there was a lot of handheldkind of almost claustrophobic shots.
But then later on, much morewider shots as he gained sort of
more control. Everything seemsto be zoomed out.
Yeah, that's good call. And.And the director did a lot of it.
He's very hands on directorDoug Lyman, from what we hear. Yeah.
And he did a lot of themhandheld shots himself, probably.

(19:30):
It worked.
I felt it worked, I think so.The only other thing I was going
to say was around Treadstoneand the government side of it is
sort of the counter narrativegoing on throughout it, which is
very 24 in a way as well,where you've got like the two things
going on.
It's funny, the operativesthat come to like tackle him and
like sort of his compatriots,aren't they like same training but
just different choices.Because he hasn't. Because he's lost

(19:50):
his memory. He's not thinkinglike them, but they mirror each other
in quite a lot of ways. Butobviously he's. He's thinking just
survival, whereas they've got.Obviously got a mission.
Because this is quite a bigbreakout role, I think, for Clive
Owen. Because at that point.
Oh, yeah, I really like him.
Yeah. He was in the runningfor Bond. I think around that time
he was One of the frontrunners with Daniel.
Craig, and I really liked himin Henry Cavill and Some of the Inside
Man.

(20:11):
I haven't seen that one. Ihaven't seen it either. I watched
one called oh, Recognize.
I could maybe recommend that.Let's move on to Paul's Facts of
the Day.
Facts of the day. Okay.
You'll have some for this.
Surely there's lots of factsfor this, right? Let's do some facts
of the day. Matt Damon climbeddown the last 30ft of the building
himself without a stuntdouble. He called. The most grueling
thing I had to do. He alsotrained for about. I wrote this down.

(20:35):
I think they said it in thedocumentary. I think it was about
three months before. Yeah,three months training before the
actual film started filming.And part of that was all. He went
through hundreds of hours ofgun training so he'd look comfortable
holding a weapon, which heobviously does in the film. He also
trained in the Filipinomartial art Kali. For the movie,
Kali involves using theaggressor's energy against him and
conserving your own energy. Sothere's a lot of thought going into

(20:57):
the fight scenes. This goes towhat you said about the camera stuff.
So Doug Liman, the director,wanted the camera operator to be
late moving the camera, addingan edge to the photography. So he
didn't let.
It's like you're struggling tokeep up with what's going on. Yeah,
yeah.
So he didn't used to watch.Let them rehearse. Watch them rehearse.
So then he didn't know all the cues.
Yeah, yeah.
So that's probably why it'sgot that edge.

(21:18):
You don't really see that veryoften. It's not. It's not a widely
used technique that. But it works.
But maybe it was around thattime period. As of 2014, this is
the only film in the Bourneseries with any resemblance to the
plot of the book, which it'spurportedly based on. And it's still
a very loose adaptation. Sothe book, if you've read the books,
you're probably thinkingthey're not loosely.
Based on the book, and thenthey just sort of gone in their own

(21:39):
direction.
I know a lot of the Bond bookspotentially like this. I haven't
read them, but, like, Iimagine Moonraker isn't quite what
ended up in the Rochamo filmand some of the others, so. But all
the other movies in the seriesand the original screenplays, they
use only the title of thenovels by Robert Ludham and Erich
Van Lustbader. Oh, the authorof the novel of that the film was

(21:59):
based on, Robert Ludham. Heactually died while the film was
in post production on 12thMarch 2001. So I wonder if he actually
saw any of it. But Matt Damonwas surprised when he was offered
the role because in the book,Bourne is much older, a much older
man. But Lyman told me hedidn't want to. To do James Bond.
He saw it more as a EuropeanNikita. That's a good call. I never

(22:20):
thought of that one as a composition.
Also having a younger maledoing it, this differentiates it
more from James Bond becauseJames Bond's always been. Always
been an older, older sort ofdistinguished gentleman, whereas
he's a young, younger guy. SoI think that works.
Yeah. And again, maybe that'swhat sort of gave it that fresh look,
I suppose, I think. So it'sheaded that Brad Pitt was actually
offered the role of JasonBourne, but he turned it down to
do Spy Game.
I couldn't see Brad Pitt doingthat, I don't think. Has Bradford

(22:42):
done anything like that?
Well, maybe Spy Game, but Ihaven't seen it. I don't know what
that sounds like. Stop atHarrison Ford.
I've never seen him as like anaction hero.
Leading man Doug Lyman wantedMatt Damon to walk like a boxer.
Damon explained there was kindof directness in it and an efficiency
about the way he moved.
Boxers are always walking fora fight.
So like myself, of course.Yeah, yeah, got that swagger.

(23:03):
Right. That'll be in your bookas well.
That's Chapter two. Theproduction used the same stunt driving
team that worked on the famousParis car chase in the scene in Ronan,
which was in 1990. And thenone more. There's lots of stories,
like you said, Darren, aboutthere's a bit of chaos with Doug
Lyman and the way he workedwith the producers. So there's a

(23:24):
bit of a clash going onbecause I put into ChatGPT at one
point to say, why didn't hereturn to do the other films? Because
obviously he was a big part ofwhy they wanted him for the first
one. And it was around himwanting to film in Paris and the
producers being like, well,can't we just do it over here? And
he's like, no, no, I want tobe in Paris. So I think he caused
a few headaches, but maybethat's why it worked and it felt

(23:45):
so great.
That's why he had a vision.
That's why they probablybrought in Paul Greengrass for the.
I think chatgpt said he was aBit more used to working with producers
and probably doing what theysaid. So, final one. Against the
advice of his sound mixers,Doug Lyman chose to take out the
classic Universal music overthe opening logo and instead includes

(24:05):
ambient sounds from the film.And the mixers told Lyman the music
over the logo was generally acue to the audience to shut up. But
Lyman went against their inputand as he notes, they were right.
Evidently, the audiences Lymansaw the film with for the first time
talked over the beginning ofthe film.
Well, you expect that movie,the usual move. But if it's not that
you get. You see what youexpect but you're not hearing it,

(24:26):
it kind of makes you go,something's happening here.
I feel like maybe over this2001. 2002. So maybe over the years,
because now they changed thelogo a bit.
There's always. There'svariations of them as well.
But it used to be maybe verytraditional of it. I think this is
also this probably the startof Matt Damon making mega bucks.
Yes, it will have been.
I know Matt Damon well.
Certainly not. Certainly after this.

(24:48):
Leading up to this, he hadn'thad some massive hits. Particularly
like, I know he was annoyedthat he wasn't in Ben Affleck's the
Town because he thought he'dhave the Hawkeye role. And I've seen
him say it. And Ben Affleck islike, what, are you kidding me? Like,
your fee would have been thebudget to the film. And Dame was
like, yeah, then it would havebeen. And obviously turned down Avatar,

(25:08):
didn't he? He did. And hewould have got 10. Yeah. Oh, he still
talks about that. He's like,yeah, shouldn't have talked. I shouldn't
have turned out Avatar. Yeah,he'd have been billions up on that.
Apparently James Cameron said,look, I don't need you for this film.
The star is the effects, but Iwant you. I think you'd be good in
it. And I'll give you 10 ofthe profit. Like it would have just
been. Yes, rolling. It wouldhave been like the highest paid actor.

(25:30):
It's just insane.
Cool. Thanks for your facts, Paul.
Yep.
Let's move on to hate it orrate it. Let's go to Darren first
on this one.
Yeah, it was a bit meh for me.I. I was checking my phone a lot.
I actually fast forward someparts. I. For me, it couldn't hold
my attention for the full. Isit two hours? Yeah, I got a bit bored.

(25:51):
I didn't really have a greatsense of jeopardy with it. I never
really thought he was in danger.
Are you really familiar withthis film? You've seen it a lot of
times?
Not a lot. I would have seenit maybe two, three times, maybe
before. And I think that it'sone of those films that's a real
good product of its time.Like, it hit the zeitgeist of the
early 2000s. I can see why itspawned sequels, but I think now

(26:11):
it just seems a little bittired. It's kind of lacking in charm.
There's nothing reallyinnovative about it. It's almost
a little bit cartoonish now.Like, the security service are old
white guys who are mean andthey're a bit incompetent. Yeah,
okay, whatever. Do somethingnew. I think when you've had movies
like, say, Socaro, which havejust got a little bit more. I suppose
they built on the grittinessof this. This kind of started the

(26:35):
realism, but then they builton it to go grittier. I didn't hugely
enjoy it, and so I'll probablygive it a four. You know, I think
it is a good film and it didchange the landscape of action movies.
But I don't think I would everwatch it again.
Oh, wow, Paul.
No, I liked it. I can seewhere Darren's coming from. And you
feel like it is now very muchproduct of its time. But I still
found it gripping. Some greatsequences. I still like the car chase

(26:59):
bear, and I do like therelationship between them and the
way you discover it as hediscovers it. And the surround sound
on the initial storm waspretty damn cool. Yeah, there's better
ones, but I appreciate, Ithink, the impact it had with its
slickness and things. But Icame away still enjoying it, and
I do really want to watch thesequels again now.
We actually haven't done anysequels yet on this show, but year

(27:21):
two. All sequels.
All the sequels. All thesecond film. But no, I still think
in. In that genre. Hot Shotspartway. Yeah, in that genre. And
obviously I kind of hate it alittle bit because of the way it
took a bit of the humor outBond. Because I kind of like my Bond
with a bit of that. I know itkind of has a bit of it still, but

(27:45):
they tried to make it intoBond. I'm like, no, you're your own
thing, man. You could havepulled back some of the sillier elements
and still had a. Did AustinPowers come out after this? No, before,
so. Because it feels likeAustin Powers would be a response
to Casino Royale, so. It'sweird. Yeah. No Austin Powell.
I never thought about that.
No Austin Powers, like, 97. Iwant to say something like that.

(28:05):
The first one.
Yeah.
Second one was about 99because it. Feels like they're like
you're doing James Bond wrong.It should be this.
There's a movie I need towatch again.
Yeah. So I'm still saying it'sa very solid action thriller. I'm
gonna give it a solid seven.How about you? You've never seen
it before, so.
Yeah, I really enjoyed it.Obviously I've not seen it before
but like this is one of thoseI've not seen. I've not seen many

(28:26):
Mission Impossibles.
No.
So this is a genre where I, Iwant to see more. And as. As being
able to see it for the firsttime, I felt like quite lucky.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
I wasn't, I didn't have toomuch to compare it to. I enjoy his
journey of his self discovery.I wasn't like. I was gripped and
I like the relationship, thechemistry between them too. Is it.
Is he going to stick with him?Is she going to ditch him? Is he

(28:47):
going to get rid of her?
Yeah.
And then obviously him tryingto be thwarted and caught up by his
employers. Yeah.
It's like you said, Darren,you just try to go on a day, get
back to work. Yeah.
No, I enjoyed all that. Itwas, it was quite simplistic but
I, I was, I was, I was up forthat and I really enjoyed it all
the way through. I didn't, Ididn't get bored and I actually managed
to watch it. I was on my ownat night, sitting. I sat with a pizza

(29:10):
and a beer.
Nice. That's the way.
Just. Yeah. From beginning toend. I really enjoyed it. I'm gonna
give it a solid seven, same asyou. Yeah, it was really good. So
I'll put that in thecalcimator 18. I'll put that in the
league and see where it lands.25th out of 36.
Isn't that just coming realclose to Crazy Stupid Love?
Yeah, It's. That was 17.5.This is 18.

(29:32):
Wow.
So it's just below Snatch andjust above Crazy Stupid Love and
Cra. Leave the World behindand Crazy Stupid Love are tied on
17.5. Let's move on to partthree, which is the Listen A lounge.
Okay. Welcome to the ListenLounge. So in the Listen Lounge we
have the lobby where we willanswer your questions, we will read

(29:53):
out your comments, we willhave a recap from the previous week,
then we move on to thequestion of the week. We round it
off with next week's movie.Okay, so we'll start with the lobby.
So Sam Bradford has emailedus. I think this may have been a
movie with choice from theprevious listener choice. So. But
he has put something quiteinteresting. So he. I think his choice
was Equilibrium.

(30:14):
Equilibrium.
You love that movie. I've notseen it.
I've seen it.
So he put. He put a bit of a.The premise. He's put. Christian
Bale finds himself questioninghis place and allegiance in a futuristic
dystopia of a post World War 3art, creativity and emotions are
all now taboo and a newdictatorship. Question, did the Matrix
eclipse this film? Should thishave been a bigger film when it was
released?

(30:34):
Absolutely. Should have been abigger film when it was released.
It was. I think it'sphenomenal. It's lower budget. It's
always seems low budgetanyway. But I think it's really interesting
and it does talk about thepower of art and art is magic. I've
probably talked about thisbefore. Like anyone who creates art
is a wizard, a witch,illusionist, you know, a magician.

(30:56):
Because art makes you feel.And the fact that you can take a
musician, can take music andnotes and their voice and make someone
cry, that's witchcraft to me.Or the fact that Jaws will spring
to mind whenever I'm in theocean and my feet suddenly can't
touch the bottom and I thinkI'm gonna get attacked by a shark.
Or even now if I'm in a showerwith a shower curtain, particularly

(31:17):
if it then touches my bum andsticks to me, I'm just like. The
fact that movies can do that,or song can alleviate grief, or poem
can give you. Make you believein love. Like it's insane to me how
powerful art is. And we see ittime and time again where real governments
and totalitarian governmentsand governments in movies come after
the artists and shut down theart and burn books and burn paintings

(31:40):
to stop.
Us from feeling suppression.
Yeah, absolutely. And I thinkEquilibrium was a warning about that.
And I think it's a reallysolid film. And the action scenes
are phenomenal. It's got a bitof a cult status now, by the sounds
of it.
Seems like we should cover itone week then. I tell you what, Sam.
I will add it to the nextlistener choice. Yeah, it's already
in there.
See if it's a wheelchair.

(32:00):
But it's not available on astreaming service as the list of
films that we could choose butwe can't because you have to pay
for them is outrageous. Yes, Iknow what you're gonna say.
Only Blockbuster is stillopen, right? Yeah. Also we're in
a state now where we're movingin. Well, America certainly is moving
into a sedated country and weare the same. Like an awful lot of
people on antidepressants oranti anxiety. Everyone's. It's a

(32:22):
lot of people on meds to numbthemselves or we're doing it to ourselves
by being dopamine addicts andwe're numbing ourselves by doom scrolling
or playing games for extendedhours or drinking or whatever it
is.
Thanks, Sam. Thanks for your question.
Yeah, good question.
Okay, so we're not going torecap on last week's question. We'll
do that probably in the next one.
Cool.
About awkward date experiences.
Oh yeah.

(32:43):
There will be some, some coolanswers come for that, I'm sure.
Question of the week. Thistime, if you woke up with no memory
like Jason Bourne, what wouldbe the first thing you would hope
people would tell you about yourself?
Oh, nice. That was also. Itwas a kind of based on a true story.
There was a guy, I thinkcalled Bourne who woke up and no.

(33:04):
Suddenly just lost his memory.I forgot who he was. And then he
moved to a different countryand set up a store in like Pennsylvania.
And then three months laterhis memory came back and he totally
forgot who he was inPennsylvania and was like, why am
I here? And then went back tohis old life.
I've heard stories of peoplelike banging their head or being
in some car. Car accident.When they wake up, they can speak
a different language or playthe piano.

(33:24):
Really?
Yeah.
Wow. I don't know what to sayto the answer to your question though.
What would you certainly wantsomething bad.
Like, oh, God, not you.
You won the lottery two yearsago. Excellent. But you gambled it
all away.
Did you know you have thebiggest podcast of all time with
Mark and Darren? Do I? Yeah.It's award winning, award winning.

(33:46):
You just had surgery. You justhad penis reduction surgery because
you couldn't walk. And I'mseeing a theme here.
I feel like we're gonna getsome ridiculous answers, but I cannot
wait. Listeners, don't let usdown. Come on. Yeah. So if you woke
up with no memory like JasonBourne, what's the first thing you
would hope people would tellyou about yourself? So next week's
movie. We went to the cinemawith some of our listeners.

(34:10):
You know, he wants to die tosay it. Did none of our fans turn
up? Yes.
And they were listening.They're listeners to the podcast.
Yeah. So we went to see theLong Walk. We did Stephen King.
We were local cinema.
Yes. I'M not gonna tell youwhat we thought. You'll have to tune
in next week for that. Yeah,so we met some, we met some of our
listeners, we watched the filmand then we went for a drink and

(34:31):
a chat afterwards. So thosewho were there got a sneak insight
into our opinions on the movieand we had a good chat. So there
you go. So that's next week'smovie. I look forward to that. So
this episode is officiallyover. But before we say goodbye,
you can get in touch with us,you can email us. Hello, Movies in
a Nutshell dot com. Ourwebsite is Movies in a Nutshell Dot
com. The links to our socialsare in the show notes. So if you

(34:53):
want to get in touch with us,you can message us. We will read
some of your comments out onthe show. We love to hear from you
guys and the best thing youcan do to help us is to share the
show. Yes, send people a link,tell them about it. If you can think
of even you can think of justone person who would like this episode
or this podcast, tell themabout it, give us a rating and review
whatever apps you listen. Thatall also helps. Anything you guys
want to add, just please do that.
Well, he says we like doing this.

(35:14):
We want to do it for a longtime, but for it to be sustainable,
we need help.
We love you long time.
Yeah, what he said. Okay, sothis episode is officially over.
This is Mark saying goodbye,Darren saying goodbye for now.
You drive, I'll pay. It's that simple.
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