Jared here. This week, I’m joined by UMass Dartmouth Head Coach Matt Ducharme, along with Jane McCauley and Carly Whiteside—two of UMASS Darthmouth’s transfer athletes who just helped the Corsairs capture the program’s first-ever Little East Conference championship.
You’ll hear Jane and Carly describe their journey from Division I to Division III in their own words; a pathway to leadership, growth, and a new chapter of success. This was an experience that didn't just reignite their passion for the game, but also expanded their appreciation for the relationships, sacrifice, and joy that college basketball can provide.
There’s also great insight from Coach Matt, who shares his philosophy on blending transfers with homegrown players. We discuss how he leveraged the transfer portal to strengthen a team culture built on work ethic, professionalism, and shared sacrifice. Four-year development is still clearly Coach Matt’s “why,” but his take on how the portal can elevate both culture and competitiveness is worth hearing.
If you want to understand how the transfer portal can be used as a tool for growth—when both players and coaches are intentional—this is a conversation you won’t want to miss.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
So pushing the limits of the Riverside podcasting software are Jane McCauley, CarlyWhiteside and coach Matt Duscharm.
How's everybody doing?
Good.
Great.
Excited to be here.
Very excited to be here.
Awesome.
I'm very excited to have you.
And I think this is also really exciting for me because my level of my relationships varywith the three of you.
(00:25):
So I appreciate everybody being on board for doing this.
Coach Matt, I'm going to find some way to integrate you knocking me almost out of my shoesinside of like an inflatable tube in the intro.
Yeah.
It keeps me humble to know
even at my healthiest how much weaker I was than you.
(00:47):
uh But let me start here, easy stuff.
Congratulations, you guys had an awesome year.
I feel like everybody had an awesome experience and I'm really excited to dive into it.
uh Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is with the clients I work with and withthe people I talk to, I constantly hear...
(01:10):
uh
really misinformed takes about two specific things that I think the three of you canreally help me with.
The first, D3 basketball, and the second is the transfer portal.
And I feel like the three of you together can really help address some of these things.
So are you down for a conversation like that?
I accept the mission.
(01:32):
Wow, the grit and determination.
I love it already.
Okay, coach Matt.
I want to start with you.
I always like to think of basketball in, you know, four year generations.
You get him as first years, you graduated as seniors.
Despite your immaculate head of hair, you are now well past your third generation uh ofcollege students.
(01:55):
And I have seen you firsthand, both as a peer and someone that has once competed againstyou.
I've seen you consistently develop.
players, first year to senior year.
So I certainly don't think the transfer portal is an alternative to what you do, but I amcurious as to what caused you to want to lean into the transfer portal and acquire some of
(02:17):
the athletes that you have now.
Well, the easy answer is I thought COVID when that happened, it kind of changed thelandscape of the way classes were made up the extended year.
So we ended up having some really big graduating classes because that, that people tooktheir extra years.
And with that happening, uh plus on top of just the, just include how rapid the transportportal grew and when they took away all the restrictions.
(02:44):
And uh I thought it would be silly not to.
dip my toes in the pool.
ah So I think that, I mean, I really got kind of fortunate to get the, you the talent thatI ended up getting out of the transfer portal.
Not only talent, the, you know, the character and the quality of person and people that wedid get.
(03:09):
So ah I think it can help you uh build rosters in a quicker fashion.
I still love
uh love, love, love, bringing in a high school student and really having thatrelationship, developing a relationship over those four years and recently five and six
and uh how many years it takes.
(03:29):
I think it's something that I don't want to ever lose that, I still think you need to beable to do both pretty well.
wanna confirm something because you've said something that I've heard even from a lot ofD1 coaches where the portal is going the most crazy right now.
Most of us coaches that got into coaching did it because of how much they liked those fouryear developmental relationships.
(03:51):
So confirming, hearing you say like that's never something you want to abandon, correct?
Okay, and that's really important to me because now if I flip it,
I think that a lot of times people that are transferring are seeking out a developmentalrelationship like that and maybe they don't always get it.
So I want to start with you, Carly, because, you know, in the intro I highlighted the longtime friendship that you and Jane had, which to me makes this story so interesting.
(04:20):
In this instance, you all, ah if anyone isn't watching the video, there was a dynamitefist bump that just took place.
But Carly, for you in this specific instance,
You went first.
You were the trailblazer.
What was it specifically about either Coach Matt or UMass Dartmouth as a campus?
What was it that made you, you know, ready to take that jump from D1 to D3?
(04:45):
Well, when I entered the transfer portal, really wasn't sure.
I was kind of just doing it and seeing what would happen.
um Wasn't necessarily set on continuing playing somewhere, just seeing my options.
um So then when coach reached out to me, I was like, this could be cool.
This is like really close to where I grew up on Cape Cod.
(05:06):
um And my mom would be able to come see me play.
Like I should check it out.
um So after I went on a visit, I really just felt like
the people in the community and just like really the team uh was what I was looking for injust like down to earth people who, you know, aren't, you know, aren't like superstars or
(05:30):
feel like they, I don't know, just like real people who just love basketball and want tomake relationships and stuff.
that was what sold me on the school.
uh
And it was a great decision.
And then I didn't even think I'd get two years.
So I feel very fortunate.
want to ask you a quick follow up because there's obviously so many different mindsetsthat you can have as a Division I athlete in the transfer portal, right Carly?
(06:00):
Did you, even for a moment, envision like, by the time this adventure at the D3 level isdone, I'm going to be an All-American?
Was that something that like entered your mind as you were navigating this process?
No, really actually like in summer league and stuff leading up to coming to UMassDartmouth, I was just like, I hope I play.
(06:22):
Like I really hope I get some minutes.
And then coach told me I was going to start our first scrimmage and I was like so excited.
And he was like, yeah, I know what I'm doing.
So um yeah, no, I really didn't have expectations other than I knew I was going to bearound like great people and hopefully have some fun playing basketball again.
(06:42):
uh
So, so Jane, um I have a relationship with Coach Matt as a coach going on, you know, adecade, my hairline versus his at least.
And for you, I've known you actually almost just as long.
um I recruited you to the Division III level when I was still there.
(07:04):
You were adamant at the time about wanting to go D1.
And I will tell, I will shout this kid out because I have four years.
This kid's work ethic,
stands out against any ones I've ever coached.
So I want to ask you this, Jane.
You see Carly's success and immediately you start talking to me about Division 3.
(07:25):
If I get an extra year of eligibility because of what happened with COVID and a red shirtyear, I might want to do this.
My question for you is a little bit different than Carly.
Carly doesn't know what her success is going to look like, but all of a sudden you see hercrushing it.
Does it?
Does that influence you in any way?
Like, you know what work you put in, you know how hard you work at the Division I level.
(07:48):
Is there a part of you that kind of goes, hey, this is my closest friend in basketball, Isee her doing this, maybe I can do that.
Does that influence your decision in any way?
I think it was interesting because I didn't know up until the bus ride going to our Macchampionships my fifth year that I was going to get my extra year of eligibility.
So I was watching Carly play her whole fifth year just as a fan.
(08:11):
Like I watched every game essentially like that I could that I didn't have a game and youknow, it was really fun like getting to see her success and you know her find her joy in
the game again.
And you know, when I found out that I was going to get my extra year that sort of
what I wanted, not even just the success on the court, but I just wanted to love playingbasketball again.
(08:35):
And it was so hard to turn down an opportunity to get to play together again.
um So yeah, yes, influenced my decision a little bit in the success way, but I think herjust having fun playing in just the environment that she was in um and the environment
that was created here sort of is what influenced my decision the most.
Yes, and now I mentioned briefly in the open, because even the two of your transfer portaljourneys look a little bit different.
(09:02):
If I remember correctly, you even entered the transfer portal as a do not contact.
You're like, if I do this, this is what I want to do.
Right?
So I'll tell the people on air, once Jane entered the portal, I will never forget theconversation I had with Coach Matt, where I was like, so uh I think this is like a done
deal already.
And Coach Matt even being like,
(09:27):
So my question now, go ahead, Jane.
I'm sorry.
Yeah, I kind of, think I know I should have let you finish the question, but um you know,I transferred.
once prior to getting my sixth year.
I think that after the experience that I had, I didn't really want to play an extra yearand go somewhere where I was going to know nobody.
(09:50):
I didn't really want to experience that again, only having one year left to play and oneyear left to go to school there.
So I think that.
was like, right, if I get my sixth year, like, this is what's happening.
Like, we're going to play together.
It's going to be a great experience.
And I think I already had made up my mind prior.
So um yeah, for me, there was no reason.
I didn't really want to hear from anyone else.
(10:10):
I didn't really want to contact anyone else.
um Nothing was sort of going to influence that decision.
So it may have sounded a little crazy in the moment, but I feel like I knew what I wasdoing.
don't want to put you too much on the spot, Coach Matt, but in my career, I would imagineanything like that.
Like when a recruit makes a decision like that, that's always been very humbling to me.
(10:34):
I imagine this happens.
What's your reaction?
Is it just humbling to hear somebody be like, yeah, I saw my friend having a ton of funplaying basketball.
It inspired me.
Let's go.
Look, what's that like for you?
Um, yeah, I think I was probably, I was probably speeches on the phone with you when youkind of told me that, um, yeah, it was, uh, yeah, like you said, think the word is right.
(10:55):
It's humbling.
It's, it's, it's just like for a less, um, wordy, it's just pretty cool.
Like, uh, you're happy that you've, know, that your teams and your program has been ableto develop a place that people want to go.
And I mean, obviously Carly was a huge piece of that, but she was a huge piece of.
the having fun and the culture that we built too.
(11:16):
So I think that is something that's, like you said, humbling and awesome.
you know, hope you can, know, once in your coaching career, you get something like that.
And now I hope there's a second one out there somewhere, but I really enjoyed this one.
Yeah, that's great to hear.
And I want to make sure our listeners understand this early.
We're going to be talking about oh the other members of the UMass Dartmouth squad.
(11:39):
And I almost struggle to call them the other members because you guys had an unbelievablybalanced team.
I just think this story of people that started as teammates in one place and ended asteammates and friends at another place is so unique and interesting.
So listeners, stay tuned for that because we will be diving into that.
um
Coach Matt, I want to stay with you because I also know that something you can get in thetransfer portal is bigger than stats, right?
(12:08):
It's culture.
And you already talked about character.
So I'd love to hear from you, maybe so that young people and their families can understandthe value add of a potential Division I transfer.
Would you say that there was something
specific that either Carly or Jane or Amaris brought to your culture or to your lockerroom that you may not have otherwise had and if so, you know, could you quantify that?
(12:34):
That's tough because you know you have these I've had some great players that have reallydone well.
I think that I was thinking about that as you're saying.
I think maybe professionalism might be the word I'm thinking of.
I'm just bringing a different way of approaching ah the game, the practice, the outside,the other stuff that we do that might be maybe with something we didn't always have at the
(12:57):
level we got it with.
You specifically these two and like you said, Amaris that brought it a different.
ah Just a different way of kind of doing things at times.
I think that was probably it.
And you mentioned James work ethic and college work ethic.
They did extra stuff like it was, that was just what was expected of you.
And yeah, we expected a D3, but I think it's a different expectation at a different level.
And bringing that here was very helpful for the rest of the team too.
(13:20):
So almost in a way kind of lifting the floor is kind what you're talking about, like thatlevel of industriousness.
Yes, industriousness.
There it is.
That's, by the way, that's John Wooden word.
That's not a Jared Seidman word.
I got the book like right next to me.
That's how I sound cool, Matt.
So I almost want to flip that question, Carly and Jane, for you two.
(13:40):
What was something about the Division III level and Coach Matt and his staff that you hadnot experienced elsewhere that maybe surprised you?
Um, I...
I would just say, like, the...
total support that we receive at UMass Dartmouth.
(14:01):
I think when you think about maybe at a Division I school, you're gonna have maybe moreresources or more people checking in on you, but it's like, I personally felt the opposite
and I felt like a higher level of support uh from just not only coaches, but everyone thatwe worked with, like athletic trainers and our...
(14:22):
our strength and conditioning coach and like down to all the way like to the janitors andstuff.
So I just feel like it's um just the community and the support was not surprising to me,but just really like a special piece of it that I didn't necessarily know I would have
coming in.
um
Yeah, I'd have to agree.
(14:43):
think like numbers wise at higher levels, you probably have like more people that arethere to support you.
But I think like the level of support that you do get and the individualized, you know,support that you get at this level is just like sort of unmatched.
And it might just be, you know, this place specifically, and it might just be ourexperience specifically.
(15:03):
But either way, it is really special.
Like when we get sent off to away games, like our janitor every single time has a signthat says go
UMass Dartmouth women's basketball, I just don't think that down to that level of staffand support at every school, you're getting that.
So um yeah, just really special environment here.
(15:24):
That's awesome and honestly I really look forward to picking your brains more about thatin a moment when we talk a little bit more about the recruiting nuts and bolts.
I want to fast forward to a moment.
um One of the things about doing a podcast post-season is the spoilers are readilyavailable.
We know that you guys won the Little East Conference and we know that your conferencechampionship game specifically was basically as good as it gets.
(15:51):
um
What I want to talk to you about is, you know, all three of you in some capacity oranother have learned a little bit about sports psychology.
You want to get into flow.
You want to have that game where everything you execute fires on all cylinders.
And, you know, it just seems like everything you work for is working.
In my experience, those games only happen uh one or two times a season, if that for youguys, it literally happened in your conference championship game.
(16:21):
So
I have to ask all of you, like, what did it feel like to basically play the perfect gamein what to that point was the most consequential game of your season?
What was that like?
Okay, can I start?
(16:42):
Okay.
It was a big moment for us because our last, well not our last two, but two of our regularseason games towards the end, um we lost and they were kind of games that we felt as
though we really didn't like play like ourselves.
um And so come playoff time, we had the opportunity to face both of those teams again.
(17:09):
And saw Keene State in the semi finals, took care of business there.
So that was like stop one on the revenge tour.
And then we had Southern Maine, of course, in the championship.
um So that just, I think the added like it's championship game.
Yes.
But we also knew that we were coming up like the scene is coming into our gym now andthey're on a high from when they beat us the most recent game.
(17:34):
um So I think that extra
level of just wanting to prove that we can play our game of basketball against this teamreally fueled us extra em and we're very happy with the results.
Hahaha.
That's it.
I love that you said very happy with the results.
(17:57):
That is a very...
I wouldn't disagree with you.
I would be happy with that result too.
I think in terms of just like the game flow and like, know, everything just feeling likeit was going right.
um At the beginning, you know, I think after the first quarter, like we got some nervesout and we were like, okay, this is, you know, we feel like now we're playing our
(18:19):
basketball and like now we know like we can handle this team and like we're on our homecourt.
And I think, you know, after that first quarter, everyone just started to really justembrace the moment and
enjoy it and have fun.
Like at the end of the day, we did have six or seven, seven upperclassmen who, you know,that was going to be our final game on that court.
(18:40):
So I think, um you know, just having fun and embracing the moment really, and just takingit all in just made it that much more special that that was the game that that happened
in.
But um yeah, I can't really explain that feeling.
the subject of unexplainable things.
go, please go ahead.
I'd love to hear from you coach.
(19:01):
I'm actually probably going to say what you're going to say.
mean, to talk about modesty that just came out of Jane's mouth.
ah Yeah, well, and they're also being modest.
I thought they really started the game like they wanted to win that game pretty quickly.
They started fast.
This team, special in knowing and when they're playing well, it's really fun to watch.
(19:26):
if you watch this.
I think you saw that, but Jane having the championship game, I'm sure you're going to takeit from here, but that was a being on or being in the flow.
Um, that was the zone that, you know, not many people see and at any level, including, youknow, NBA, WNBA, anywhere you don't see a 10 for 13, uh, from three experience.
I'm going let you take it from there because I can see you biting and you want it.
(19:51):
You took the words right out of my mouth.
was like, yeah, I'm, that's not a common thing.
But I also think what's really interesting is the selflessness of your team.
In that moment to have so many veteran players, you know, and we'll talk about this morein a moment, but one of the things to me that is so unique about your team this year is
(20:11):
your whole team shot better than 38 % from the floor.
Like anyone at any time could have brought it.
And the fact that in that
game the idea was Jane's hit her first few so now we're gonna really deliberately get herthe ball until she cools down and then it just turned out that she never cooled down.
(20:33):
That's, you know, I, as a coach, I want to ask you, this is a follow-up, like, does your,cause we all have plans going into games like this, like how much does the plan change as
you see the flow of the game?
You know, there's so many pen and kick looks, Carly's getting doubled, like how much doyour original plans change as you see the success unfolding?
(20:56):
With this team, it's different ah because of what you said, the way they share the ball,the way they trust each other.
They're so smart on the floor that honestly made my job a lot easier for that.
Carly knows when she's getting double, there's kick outs and there's people that can shootthe ball or pass out, pass back in.
Like that kind of stuff's going to happen.
Yeah, we talk about it in timeouts, but the game flow, they are very good as a team as awhole of reading that and kind of figuring out what best way to go out of it.
(21:23):
We play call, we do things to change things up.
But some of that stuff is just they're naturally gifted and the IQ and the awareness ofthe game and the flow it's going.
want to build off this.
um
we're talking to two transfers on your team.
You also have multiple homegrown all conference players.
(21:45):
A lot of people on this team embraced a different role than what they had in a differentyear when they went to the NCAA tournament.
You know, so I want to make sure the listeners understand this.
Like this was a very, very unique year in terms of roster construction, adjusting to newroles on a team that's been successful in the past.
(22:07):
amazing.
So I want to start with you, Matt, and I want to just talk about what I think was the mostimpressive thing objectively about your team this year was a lack of ego.
Nobody on the team plays more than 30 minutes a game.
You have all of your starters averaging double figures.
Five, you go five deep on your bench shooting above 38 % from the floor.
(22:28):
um You are consistently playing 10.
I think there's a lot of coaches out there that would be curious to know how did you pullthis off exactly?
you talked about sacrifice and one of our first team meetings, we actually, um, cause I'ma Homer and I love the Celtics.
(22:49):
Um, we took a page out of their book.
They had a meeting at the beginning of year.
You know, I had, um, like you said, we had a lot of the kids coming back from the yearbefore they'd went to the NCAA is, um, starters fifth years, uh, Jay Levine being one of
them that was a starter, um, was coming in.
I said, listen, we got six, seven, possibly that could start.
I've all played.
(23:10):
really good minutes.
said, I need you to realize that we might not all start, but we're all going to have arole and we need you to embrace it if we're going to have the success we want.
I read like this whole, um, you know, Joe Missoula thing talking about the starters andHorford and all that.
And, and just re I don't think they took it as serious as I did at the beginning.
Uh, but then realizing I, for instance, one that's sitting right here, Jane coming from Done and coming off the bench for the whole season, I really embraced in that role.
(23:38):
Um,
and shining in the role.
And obviously she got good minutes off of that role and then she would finish a lot ofgames, but it's really realizing, well, you could have been, I'm a D1 player.
You're not starting me.
That's crazy.
uh There was none of that.
And Jaylen Levine started the year before the whole season and then took a seat coming offthe bench and never complained.
(23:58):
They had to come in, start a couple of games when we had injuries and did an amazing job.
Like there was just that buy into, we want to win the LEC.
That is our goal.
And then what do we got to do to get there?
And if we start thinking about it's the me, then we're to have problems and it's the we,we're going to have victories.
building on that, because I think this is really important from a coaching perspectivebefore I get Jane and Carly's thoughts.
(24:27):
I can point to a lot of specific stats that are very cool, right?
You're a near top 10 scoring offense in the nation.
You're one of the most efficient field goal percentage teams in the country.
You are literally seventh in the country and made threes this year.
But behind the stats is kind of my hypothesis, which would be none of this happens unlesseverybody's bought in and the locker room is tight.
(24:51):
Is that sort of the summary in your eyes?
Yeah, but like you said, I've had three generations of really teams and I think I've beenblessed with some really, really special teams.
Back when I met you in Dallas, that was my first special team.
This team was probably the most special as far as how fast they came together and reallybought in um to be the team that they wanted to be.
(25:16):
Like I told you before, the goal is what they wanted so bad that they were willing to giveup some of their personal things.
And like I tell people all the time, if you give up some personal things for the end goalof the team, some of your personal stuff is going to be accomplished.
You're going to have that personal goals that meet, it's the, your, what your intentionsare.
think that make that make it more special.
(25:37):
So if you want to talk about unbelievable timing, you finished that sentence and thenCarly and Jane dropped.
So the good news is we still have that.
I'm going to pause this real quick.
So slow.
(26:01):
Bye, Jerry.
for us coach?
oh
Hey, be careful what we're gonna say right now.
Thank
we go.
Okay, now we're okay.
uh Thankfully, all I heard or that made the recording was any questions for us, But in theevent there was more, we'll figure it out later.
(26:25):
Yeah, the gag reel.
Okay.
So what Coach just said is really interesting to me because he talks about a combinationof a lot of new pieces, gelling together, sacrifice.
to achieve a common goal, especially for two people that just made the journey that youdid from D1 to D3.
(26:47):
I would love to know if the two of you have any advice to younger players based on theexperience you went through this year.
um I think sort of just, you know, not even just based on what I went through this year,but, just throughout my entire college athletic journey, sort of just staying true to
(27:09):
yourself and like, you know, your principles and like what made you get to where you arelike, um and don't settle.
I feel like my work ethic is like something I have taken a lot of pride in my whole lifeand um I didn't really let it waver throughout my college career.
And I think that
You know, if I did, I would have, you know, finished my six years of playing basketballwith a lot of regret if I, you know, didn't carry that through um throughout my playing
(27:37):
career.
So I'd sort of just say, you know, do, don't lose what you did to get to where you are, nomatter what level you're playing at and sort of don't settle.
Love that.
What about you, Carly?
Um, would say that just like thinking big picture, like it's, great to work towards a goaland, like working towards earning a scholarship is something, that is a great
(28:06):
accomplishment.
Um, but thinking about like setting goals for yourself and being okay with like your pathlooking a little different, um, is something that I've really embraced and, um,
Yeah, I think just like it's, you're going to end up where you're supposed to be andthings, things just fall into place as there's, as there should.
(28:31):
So that's what I would say.
It sounds to me at least like you guys don't have really any regrets about your journey.
Is that fair?
Yeah.
That's really, really cool.
um Let's dovetail right off that because this is after all a podcast about the recruitingprocess.
(28:53):
So this is an opportunity for a long time Division III coach and two high level DivisionIII players to talk about Division III basketball.
um I know that Coach Matt and I have been uh banging the drum for D3.
um I know, I don't want to love up on Coach Matt, but I know for a fact
(29:15):
There are D1 coaches out there at all levels that love Coach Matt.
I know that.
And I also, you know, happened to coach at the Division 1 level myself after coaching atDivision 3 for a while.
You two have a similar experience.
You were scholarship level players that had an amazing run at the Division 3 level.
I guess my question to you, the players, would be, you know, can you help me dispel thisrumor that Division 3 ball, like, is bad?
(29:41):
and not well-coached, like you just experienced it.
What would you have to say about Division III basketball?
I think, can I go?
Yeah.
I just think like people don't realize how competitive it is and just the level of talentthat exists at the division three level.
And like I said, like when I came and played summer league with the team, I said to my momafterwards, like I just, yeah, I want to be on this team, but I just hope I play.
(30:06):
I hope I can contribute something and get some minutes.
like, I think just you need to go and like watch a game and be there in person and realizethat there's like really impressive.
athletes and yeah, it's a highly competitive level.
Yeah, I'd say, you know, the difference may maybe on some teams, there's a difference inskill level.
(30:31):
But I think that a lot of teams do make up for it in just sheer athleticism.
I think that, you know, there are a lot of D three teams that have, you know, soccer andlacrosse players on their basketball team, which you can see when they're like running the
break or like running full court press.
But yeah, I don't I
I would disagree with anyone who thinks that it's not as competitive.
(30:51):
think especially in the New England area where we got to play, there's a ton of really,really, really top tier teams that definitely could beat Division II and Division I teams,
I'd say.
And some of the rivalries that go on in our region specifically, I think make it just somuch more exciting to watch and to be a part of.
(31:12):
So sticking with the two of you for a second, I was gonna say I wanna toss you ahypothetical, but the reality is this isn't a hypothetical.
I deal with this with my clients and when I talk to people.
um To the person that's like, well, maybe I'll go D3 because it's not as serious as D1 andmaybe the time investment won't be the same.
(31:38):
What do you say to that person?
I think the time investment, I think it's just as serious.
from spending time around a team or people, players that you might be on a team if you'regoing on recruiting visits and stuff, you can tell, least I can only speak for our
(32:02):
program, but um it's taken very seriously and um definitely still an equally like...
daunting time commitment.
It's college athletics still.
uh But I will say on the more positive end, it is still a large time commitment that I dofeel like there's more balance in your life outside of basketball.
(32:28):
So uh in terms of your sport, you're still spending basically the same amount of time,maybe a few hours less per week, but you still have the same daily practice, daily
you know, lift conditioning, whatever you're doing, those like outside of basketballthings, I feel like you have a little more of your life to you.
(32:51):
feels that way.
uh I mean, I'd agree.
I think like one of the only differences is I guess like at the D3 level, there's somemajors that you probably can't pursue if you were to play at a higher level that um you're
allowed to at most division three schools, but
Um, terms of time commitment, like Carly said, like we obviously still practice every day.
live twice a week in season and, you know, preseason.
(33:14):
We just enjoy playing basketball and we want to be ready for the season in terms of like,you know, chemistry wise and conditioning wise.
And, you know, we play pickup and we condition preseason voluntarily.
And I think that it's just something that, um, obviously it's, we're talking specific toour program, but I think, you know, division three, I don't think that the preseason
(33:34):
commitment is much less than.
You know what we're describing as well, but I do think I agree that obviously you do havea lot more balance just in your life in general.
And I do think like a big piece of it is also the summer session, not not having a summersession at division three level, but that really prepares you to come into school like in
the fall and like your.
(33:56):
Your teammates and like the coaches and everybody like you're more eager for like pick upand lift and things like that.
And you're like putting so much more energy towards that when you've had a summer too.
spend time with family and like recover and get yourself situated.
was the biggest thing.
Like you don't have a summer session in D3 and I think a lot of people would be like, wellthen it's definitely not as serious.
(34:19):
And my response was like, ah they're still competing and they still all want to play.
So they're going to come back and probably compete.
Is that a fair assessment of what you're saying?
Like I never thought that was as huge a thing as other people make it out to be.
Yeah, for sure.
mean, I think that, yeah, like you said, it can be a perception that like, because wedon't have a summer session, it's not as competitive, but, um you know, I think it makes
(34:49):
us, like Carly said, so much more excited to, you know, come back and play together andcompete just because we haven't really had as much competition over the summer.
So think it is a healthy amount of time off and it's just enough to, you know, geteveryone like excited and, you know, ready for the school year.
ready to play together.
And we also send em workout check-ins.
(35:10):
it's kind of like you're remotely staying motivated through your teammates by checking inwith like a selfie of yourself working out, whether it's on Snapchat or group me, but like
kind of pushing each other while we're not actually physically together was helpful forus.
I don't know.
Before we turn back to Coach Matt for a couple of nuts and bolts recruiting questions, yousaid something just now that piqued my interest.
(35:32):
oh
I would love to quantify this just so that the average parent or average listener actuallyfigured this out.
During the spring and summer when the coaches by rule in D3 could not work with you, howoften per week would you say the two of you were getting up shots or in the gym working on
something basketball related?
(35:54):
Because I want listeners to understand what the work really looks like.
What was that like for you two?
I mean, I'd say probably like five or six days a week.
Yeah, pretty much.
Maybe that we didn't work out, but I think probably five to six days a week for sure.
Okay, this is important.
(36:16):
Go ahead, Coach Matt.
You were about to add something.
This is good.
yeah, ask Jane what she did before the championship game
Jane, what'd you do before the championship game?
I shot on the shooting machine.
730.
730.
I don't know how many shots I made.
But.
Several hours.
Yeah, and this is really, really important, right?
(36:39):
Because it kills me when people dismiss D3.
People don't understand that this exists on a plane.
There are D3 teams out there, and I'm telling you this team was one of them, that couldtake it to some of the teams at Division 2, in their region.
Like, it's not like the bottom of D2 is better than the top of D3.
And it's also not like the very bottom of D1 is better than the top of D2.
(37:01):
Jane, you saw some of those scrimmages.
I'll say that.
uh
You know, this is what I really want people to understand.
We're doing a podcast with literally one of the best Division III three-point shooters inthe country and a WBCA named by the coaches, All American Honorable Mention.
(37:23):
So these are two people that are now telling you, these are two people now telling you, ohyeah, even though the coach wasn't there, we still were working at basketball.
like it was a part-time job at the Division III level.
So anybody that's questioning the passion, the dedication, and the commitment that thisreally involves, let this be a lesson to you.
(37:49):
And this is a good opportunity for me to segue to you, Coach Matt.
um I imagine as you're working the transfer portal, you might also have some people athigher levels that don't have this impression.
about what Division III actually is and what playing for UMass Dartmouth actually is.
I imagine, and I'd love to hear it from you, what is the skepticism that a potentialtransfer athlete has to work through to be a desirable recruit for you?
(38:18):
What are the potential red flags and how do you filter that?
You know, was thinking about this, I was actually on a phone call earlier today and I was,it's for me, I like to build relationships in the recruitment process.
You know, talk to the high school coach, the AU coach, the family, get to meet all that.
And sometimes with the transport, the situation it is, you don't get to build all thoserelationships and really get to learn about the whole person as much as I like to
(38:48):
sometimes.
So there is some of that like.
trepidation of, right, well, anybody can, you know, the highlight films of their life orthe highlight films of who they are, they can be that for that short amount of time.
Is that who they really are?
Is that who they're really bringing into the program?
So that is my biggest, you know, area of, like I said, trepidation of like, that's where Igot to really dig down and try to get a quick synopsis of who the person is and making
(39:14):
sure they're going to come in and be a positive to the program and not a negative to theprogram.
And kind of that's probably the biggest part.
want to now flip that because you've had this positive experience with transfers now.
mean, and we've established that it's not just with statistics.
know, Jane, Carly, Amaris all brought it and helped elevate, you know, the culturalcomponent of your program.
(39:39):
Is there now something that might have you look at a high school kid and whether it'simmaturity or lack of preparedness, like, is there a chip in your brain that goes, I might
be able to...
get this in the transfer portal and not have to worry about this.
Like how do you balance that?
So yes, on the flip side, what you know you're getting typically, because you're gonnatalk to the college coaches, someone that has played at a level that is higher than high
(40:02):
school has hopefully been successful.
You have some actual clips of them playing in college.
ah So they have the work, you probably have the work ethic.
They know what the extra workouts are all about.
They know what a college program is all about.
So yeah, that is definitely a positive.
Really, really interesting.
I would love to hear this now from the three of you and then we'll kind of close it withmy final question after this.
(40:25):
Knowing what you now know, I want to talk directly to the high school students becausethat information gap is real, right?
You don't know what you don't know and everyone has that experience when you show up on acollege campus and you're practicing for the first time.
What advice would you have to a specific high school kid
(40:47):
that's going to go play D3.
What would you say to them as they're getting ready to transition?
You guys want to study?
Well, me too.
Um, I can start.
Okay.
Um, I would say, you know, don't overlook like the level of talent that you're going toplay.
(41:07):
Like I would say like, don't walk in and think that because of the success, you know, youhad in high school or wherever you were, that it's immediately going to carry over.
I think no matter what level D1, D2, D3, you need to just come in and be a sponge learnfrom everyone around you, including the coaches.
the upperclassmen and, you know, be willing to.
(41:30):
You know, create relationships with everyone.
Um, I think that.
The 1 of the good things about division 3, like we talked about earlier is you have a lotof time to form these relationships off the court with your teammates.
So, you know, being open to that.
Um, I think it's super important as well.
Other freshmen.
(41:52):
Charlie, you wanna add to that?
I think, I mean, I like, I like what Jane said.
I think.
Any like coming into college at any level, I just feel like, really taking advantage ofyour opportunities that you get.
(42:13):
And no matter how those look and really like trying to use each experience as a growingexperience and not really viewing anything as like.
failure or, I like, you know, I can't do this, but just like more of that positive mindsetthat wherever you end up is where you're supposed to be and you're going to, um, be okay.
(42:38):
So I just think like taking advantage of the support and the help that it's offered to youand, um, going out and seeking that is a big thing.
And at the division three level, just thinking about how can I push my teammates and havethis, have relationships that
em are going to get me better, but also just improve the climate that I'm walking into andthe culture of wherever I end up.
(43:03):
I imagine it's gotta make you pretty proud to hear ah what you just heard from twoplayers.
um Is there anything that you'd like to add um to what they just shared?
Well, things I like to hear is the culture and everywhere you go, you are part of theculture.
complaining about the culture, you are an addition or subtraction to culture.
So be part of what you want to see.
(43:25):
And then go where you want it.
And I know you hear that part.
Well, I hope people hear that.
I go where you want it and go where you see yourself being successful, whatever successlooks like for you.
uh It might be, you know, being on a really successful high level team that you don't geta lot of minutes on, that's okay.
It might be going somewhere you just want to play and you don't care about wins.
Not my thing.
Um, I enjoy, you know, I, I want to, I want a team that wants to win and willing to putthe work into win and willing to put the sacrifice in and what it might mean to get to the
(43:51):
wins.
Um, and then really at the end of the year, celebrating as a team, um, having a, you know,winning something, hopefully a championship.
I think finding what's important to you and what your must haves are a way you're tryingto land.
Um, and then being true to who you are and know why you, what your why is and why am Igoing to this place is because, you know, I'm supposed to, because people think I'm really
(44:12):
good or.
my family thinks I should, or my AU coach thinks I should, or whatever it might be, findit where you're finding your best fit and where you're gonna be the happiest.
Because when you do leave the school, you wanna look back and say that added to my life,and added to who I am, and now I'm gonna have these relationships forever with these
friends, with these teammates.
I just think that's important to not lose your self-identity with looking at whateverybody else thinks you should do.
(44:35):
Go where you want it and go where you can be your best fit.
the three of you just mic dropping one after the other.
um This is really valuable to me specifically because I don't just think I know that thenext Carly Whiteside, the next Jane McCauley is out there right now, whether they're in
(44:56):
the portal or not, whether they're trying to stick out and experience when you're, Mattsays no, I love that, so I love you, Matt, I love you.
Figuratively.
The next Carly White or Jane Macaulay is out there.
And I don't mean in terms of what they bring to a culture or who they are as people.
I mean more in terms of someone who might be looking for a new experience, someone whomight be looking to make an impact differently or might be seeking out something
(45:21):
different.
I am of the opinion that over the last 45 minutes or so, you guys have really drawn a mapfor what the next Carly or Jane could do.
to put trust in themselves and what type of environment to look for.
But I always want to give you guys the floor.
If there is anything that you haven't said to that future you that you want to say, isthere anything else you guys want to add?
(45:45):
Because I think this has been so valuable.
I would just say like lean into the um uncomfortable like conversations, whether that'slike with teammates or friends or family coaches, like leaning into that.
Cause that's really where you figure out who you want to be and what, you know, like thatcan just, don't know.
(46:11):
I think making yourself uncomfortable is where we grow and how um as a player and as aperson, like that's really what.
sports about and preparing you for life after the sport, which we are now in.
So just thinking about taking advantage of every opportunity you get.
Yeah, I think like, you know, aside from all the encore and basketball experiences andjust like, you know, going through the transfer process a couple times, I think at the end
(46:43):
of the day, like really reflecting on, you know,
my career, I think it's just so much bigger than basketball.
And it's just about like, the relationships you have and the experiences like, the thingsthat you remember are not like, obviously, we're always gonna remember like, a
championship win and like, you know, the major ones, but you know, the things that youremember just like the times that you spend with your teammates and like, the
(47:05):
relationships that you form.
And, you know, I've been at three different schools and I'm still in touch like superfrequently with, you know, people that I met.
in 2019.
So it's like, you never know who you're going to cross paths with, including this one.
But you never going to know who you're going to cross paths with and, you know, who'sgoing to impact your life.
And it's just it's so much bigger than basketball at the end of the day.
(47:28):
So basketball is what brings that all together.
But it's the other stuff that's important.
So pick a place for the people and like the relationships that you feel and for like
Having like-minded people, feel like, like when I met Jane at Vermont, my mom instantlyknew that like out of everybody that she met, she's like, like you and Jane are so
(47:49):
similar.
Like I can tell that that's going to be your close friend.
And it's just like that feeling of who do you, and not that you need to pick people thatlike you're similar to, but just like that, like like-minded people who are going to have
like a similar goal and who are really going to like push you to improve basketball wiseacademically life.
Yeah.
uh
(48:11):
This has got to, you hear two players of yours say this, Coach Matt, I imagine this fillsyour cup immensely.
Cup is overflowing, Jared.
This was I Will tell you this is actually my first time I've done a podcast with coaches acoach and players at the same time and ah I'm actually honestly now that I've done it not
(48:39):
looking forward to going back to doing one or the other Because I feel like it was sointeresting to hear you guys not just talk about what your journey was like but also like
calling out one another's modesty, talking about one another's value to one another,bringing everything back to your team.
ah I imagine this was an extremely fulfilling year for everybody uh involved in thisinterview.
(49:03):
And I thank you so, so much for your time.
And I look forward to catching up with you all very soon.
Thank you so much for your time.
Thank you, Jared.
Thank you.
So pushing the limits of the Riverside podcasting software are Jane McCauley, CarlyWhiteside and coach Matt Duscharm.
How's everybody doing?
Good.
Great.
Excited to be here.
Very excited to be here.
Awesome.
I'm very excited to have you.
And I think this is also really exciting for me because my level of my relationships varywith the three of you.
(00:25):
So I appreciate everybody being on board for doing this.
Coach Matt, I'm going to find some way to integrate you knocking me almost out of my shoesinside of like an inflatable tube in the intro.
Yeah.
It keeps me humble to know
even at my healthiest how much weaker I was than you.
(00:47):
uh But let me start here, easy stuff.
Congratulations, you guys had an awesome year.
I feel like everybody had an awesome experience and I'm really excited to dive into it.
uh Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is with the clients I work with and withthe people I talk to, I constantly hear...
(01:10):
uh
really misinformed takes about two specific things that I think the three of you canreally help me with.
The first, D3 basketball, and the second is the transfer portal.
And I feel like the three of you together can really help address some of these things.
So are you down for a conversation like that?
I accept the mission.
(01:32):
Wow, the grit and determination.
I love it already.
Okay, coach Matt.
I want to start with you.
I always like to think of basketball in, you know, four year generations.
You get him as first years, you graduated as seniors.
Despite your immaculate head of hair, you are now well past your third generation uh ofcollege students.
(01:55):
And I have seen you firsthand, both as a peer and someone that has once competed againstyou.
I've seen you consistently develop.
players, first year to senior year.
So I certainly don't think the transfer portal is an alternative to what you do, but I amcurious as to what caused you to want to lean into the transfer portal and acquire some of
(02:17):
the athletes that you have now.
Well, the easy answer is I thought COVID when that happened, it kind of changed thelandscape of the way classes were made up the extended year.
So we ended up having some really big graduating classes because that, that people tooktheir extra years.
And with that happening, uh plus on top of just the, just include how rapid the transportportal grew and when they took away all the restrictions.
(02:44):
And uh I thought it would be silly not to.
dip my toes in the pool.
ah So I think that, I mean, I really got kind of fortunate to get the, you the talent thatI ended up getting out of the transfer portal.
Not only talent, the, you know, the character and the quality of person and people that wedid get.
(03:09):
So ah I think it can help you uh build rosters in a quicker fashion.
I still love
uh love, love, love, bringing in a high school student and really having thatrelationship, developing a relationship over those four years and recently five and six
and uh how many years it takes.
(03:29):
I think it's something that I don't want to ever lose that, I still think you need to beable to do both pretty well.
wanna confirm something because you've said something that I've heard even from a lot ofD1 coaches where the portal is going the most crazy right now.
Most of us coaches that got into coaching did it because of how much they liked those fouryear developmental relationships.
(03:51):
So confirming, hearing you say like that's never something you want to abandon, correct?
Okay, and that's really important to me because now if I flip it,
I think that a lot of times people that are transferring are seeking out a developmentalrelationship like that and maybe they don't always get it.
So I want to start with you, Carly, because, you know, in the intro I highlighted the longtime friendship that you and Jane had, which to me makes this story so interesting.
(04:20):
In this instance, you all, ah if anyone isn't watching the video, there was a dynamitefist bump that just took place.
But Carly, for you in this specific instance,
You went first.
You were the trailblazer.
What was it specifically about either Coach Matt or UMass Dartmouth as a campus?
What was it that made you, you know, ready to take that jump from D1 to D3?
(04:45):
Well, when I entered the transfer portal, really wasn't sure.
I was kind of just doing it and seeing what would happen.
um Wasn't necessarily set on continuing playing somewhere, just seeing my options.
um So then when coach reached out to me, I was like, this could be cool.
This is like really close to where I grew up on Cape Cod.
(05:06):
um And my mom would be able to come see me play.
Like I should check it out.
um So after I went on a visit, I really just felt like
the people in the community and just like really the team uh was what I was looking for injust like down to earth people who, you know, aren't, you know, aren't like superstars or
(05:30):
feel like they, I don't know, just like real people who just love basketball and want tomake relationships and stuff.
that was what sold me on the school.
uh
And it was a great decision.
And then I didn't even think I'd get two years.
So I feel very fortunate.
want to ask you a quick follow up because there's obviously so many different mindsetsthat you can have as a Division I athlete in the transfer portal, right Carly?
(06:00):
Did you, even for a moment, envision like, by the time this adventure at the D3 level isdone, I'm going to be an All-American?
Was that something that like entered your mind as you were navigating this process?
No, really actually like in summer league and stuff leading up to coming to UMassDartmouth, I was just like, I hope I play.
(06:22):
Like I really hope I get some minutes.
And then coach told me I was going to start our first scrimmage and I was like so excited.
And he was like, yeah, I know what I'm doing.
So um yeah, no, I really didn't have expectations other than I knew I was going to bearound like great people and hopefully have some fun playing basketball again.
(06:42):
uh
So, so Jane, um I have a relationship with Coach Matt as a coach going on, you know, adecade, my hairline versus his at least.
And for you, I've known you actually almost just as long.
um I recruited you to the Division III level when I was still there.
(07:04):
You were adamant at the time about wanting to go D1.
And I will tell, I will shout this kid out because I have four years.
This kid's work ethic,
stands out against any ones I've ever coached.
So I want to ask you this, Jane.
You see Carly's success and immediately you start talking to me about Division 3.
(07:25):
If I get an extra year of eligibility because of what happened with COVID and a red shirtyear, I might want to do this.
My question for you is a little bit different than Carly.
Carly doesn't know what her success is going to look like, but all of a sudden you see hercrushing it.
Does it?
Does that influence you in any way?
Like, you know what work you put in, you know how hard you work at the Division I level.
(07:48):
Is there a part of you that kind of goes, hey, this is my closest friend in basketball, Isee her doing this, maybe I can do that.
Does that influence your decision in any way?
I think it was interesting because I didn't know up until the bus ride going to our Macchampionships my fifth year that I was going to get my extra year of eligibility.
So I was watching Carly play her whole fifth year just as a fan.
(08:11):
Like I watched every game essentially like that I could that I didn't have a game and youknow, it was really fun like getting to see her success and you know her find her joy in
the game again.
And you know, when I found out that I was going to get my extra year that sort of
what I wanted, not even just the success on the court, but I just wanted to love playingbasketball again.
(08:35):
And it was so hard to turn down an opportunity to get to play together again.
um So yeah, yes, influenced my decision a little bit in the success way, but I think herjust having fun playing in just the environment that she was in um and the environment
that was created here sort of is what influenced my decision the most.
Yes, and now I mentioned briefly in the open, because even the two of your transfer portaljourneys look a little bit different.
(09:02):
If I remember correctly, you even entered the transfer portal as a do not contact.
You're like, if I do this, this is what I want to do.
Right?
So I'll tell the people on air, once Jane entered the portal, I will never forget theconversation I had with Coach Matt, where I was like, so uh I think this is like a done
deal already.
And Coach Matt even being like,
(09:27):
So my question now, go ahead, Jane.
I'm sorry.
Yeah, I kind of, think I know I should have let you finish the question, but um you know,I transferred.
once prior to getting my sixth year.
I think that after the experience that I had, I didn't really want to play an extra yearand go somewhere where I was going to know nobody.
(09:50):
I didn't really want to experience that again, only having one year left to play and oneyear left to go to school there.
So I think that.
was like, right, if I get my sixth year, like, this is what's happening.
Like, we're going to play together.
It's going to be a great experience.
And I think I already had made up my mind prior.
So um yeah, for me, there was no reason.
I didn't really want to hear from anyone else.
(10:10):
I didn't really want to contact anyone else.
um Nothing was sort of going to influence that decision.
So it may have sounded a little crazy in the moment, but I feel like I knew what I wasdoing.
don't want to put you too much on the spot, Coach Matt, but in my career, I would imagineanything like that.
Like when a recruit makes a decision like that, that's always been very humbling to me.
(10:34):
I imagine this happens.
What's your reaction?
Is it just humbling to hear somebody be like, yeah, I saw my friend having a ton of funplaying basketball.
It inspired me.
Let's go.
Look, what's that like for you?
Um, yeah, I think I was probably, I was probably speeches on the phone with you when youkind of told me that, um, yeah, it was, uh, yeah, like you said, think the word is right.
(10:55):
It's humbling.
It's, it's, it's just like for a less, um, wordy, it's just pretty cool.
Like, uh, you're happy that you've, know, that your teams and your program has been ableto develop a place that people want to go.
And I mean, obviously Carly was a huge piece of that, but she was a huge piece of.
the having fun and the culture that we built too.
(11:16):
So I think that is something that's, like you said, humbling and awesome.
you know, hope you can, know, once in your coaching career, you get something like that.
And now I hope there's a second one out there somewhere, but I really enjoyed this one.
Yeah, that's great to hear.
And I want to make sure our listeners understand this early.
We're going to be talking about oh the other members of the UMass Dartmouth squad.
(11:39):
And I almost struggle to call them the other members because you guys had an unbelievablybalanced team.
I just think this story of people that started as teammates in one place and ended asteammates and friends at another place is so unique and interesting.
So listeners, stay tuned for that because we will be diving into that.
um
Coach Matt, I want to stay with you because I also know that something you can get in thetransfer portal is bigger than stats, right?
(12:08):
It's culture.
And you already talked about character.
So I'd love to hear from you, maybe so that young people and their families can understandthe value add of a potential Division I transfer.
Would you say that there was something
specific that either Carly or Jane or Amaris brought to your culture or to your lockerroom that you may not have otherwise had and if so, you know, could you quantify that?
(12:34):
That's tough because you know you have these I've had some great players that have reallydone well.
I think that I was thinking about that as you're saying.
I think maybe professionalism might be the word I'm thinking of.
I'm just bringing a different way of approaching ah the game, the practice, the outside,the other stuff that we do that might be maybe with something we didn't always have at the
(12:57):
level we got it with.
You specifically these two and like you said, Amaris that brought it a different.
ah Just a different way of kind of doing things at times.
I think that was probably it.
And you mentioned James work ethic and college work ethic.
They did extra stuff like it was, that was just what was expected of you.
And yeah, we expected a D3, but I think it's a different expectation at a different level.
And bringing that here was very helpful for the rest of the team too.
(13:20):
So almost in a way kind of lifting the floor is kind what you're talking about, like thatlevel of industriousness.
Yes, industriousness.
There it is.
That's, by the way, that's John Wooden word.
That's not a Jared Seidman word.
I got the book like right next to me.
That's how I sound cool, Matt.
So I almost want to flip that question, Carly and Jane, for you two.
(13:40):
What was something about the Division III level and Coach Matt and his staff that you hadnot experienced elsewhere that maybe surprised you?
Um, I...
I would just say, like, the...
total support that we receive at UMass Dartmouth.
(14:01):
I think when you think about maybe at a Division I school, you're gonna have maybe moreresources or more people checking in on you, but it's like, I personally felt the opposite
and I felt like a higher level of support uh from just not only coaches, but everyone thatwe worked with, like athletic trainers and our...
(14:22):
our strength and conditioning coach and like down to all the way like to the janitors andstuff.
So I just feel like it's um just the community and the support was not surprising to me,but just really like a special piece of it that I didn't necessarily know I would have
coming in.
um
Yeah, I'd have to agree.
(14:43):
think like numbers wise at higher levels, you probably have like more people that arethere to support you.
But I think like the level of support that you do get and the individualized, you know,support that you get at this level is just like sort of unmatched.
And it might just be, you know, this place specifically, and it might just be ourexperience specifically.
(15:03):
But either way, it is really special.
Like when we get sent off to away games, like our janitor every single time has a signthat says go
UMass Dartmouth women's basketball, I just don't think that down to that level of staffand support at every school, you're getting that.
So um yeah, just really special environment here.
(15:24):
That's awesome and honestly I really look forward to picking your brains more about thatin a moment when we talk a little bit more about the recruiting nuts and bolts.
I want to fast forward to a moment.
um One of the things about doing a podcast post-season is the spoilers are readilyavailable.
We know that you guys won the Little East Conference and we know that your conferencechampionship game specifically was basically as good as it gets.
(15:51):
um
What I want to talk to you about is, you know, all three of you in some capacity oranother have learned a little bit about sports psychology.
You want to get into flow.
You want to have that game where everything you execute fires on all cylinders.
And, you know, it just seems like everything you work for is working.
In my experience, those games only happen uh one or two times a season, if that for youguys, it literally happened in your conference championship game.
(16:21):
So
I have to ask all of you, like, what did it feel like to basically play the perfect gamein what to that point was the most consequential game of your season?
What was that like?
Okay, can I start?
(16:42):
Okay.
It was a big moment for us because our last, well not our last two, but two of our regularseason games towards the end, um we lost and they were kind of games that we felt as
though we really didn't like play like ourselves.
um And so come playoff time, we had the opportunity to face both of those teams again.
(17:09):
And saw Keene State in the semi finals, took care of business there.
So that was like stop one on the revenge tour.
And then we had Southern Maine, of course, in the championship.
um So that just, I think the added like it's championship game.
Yes.
But we also knew that we were coming up like the scene is coming into our gym now andthey're on a high from when they beat us the most recent game.
(17:34):
um So I think that extra
level of just wanting to prove that we can play our game of basketball against this teamreally fueled us extra em and we're very happy with the results.
Hahaha.
That's it.
I love that you said very happy with the results.
(17:57):
That is a very...
I wouldn't disagree with you.
I would be happy with that result too.
I think in terms of just like the game flow and like, know, everything just feeling likeit was going right.
um At the beginning, you know, I think after the first quarter, like we got some nervesout and we were like, okay, this is, you know, we feel like now we're playing our
(18:19):
basketball and like now we know like we can handle this team and like we're on our homecourt.
And I think, you know, after that first quarter, everyone just started to really justembrace the moment and
enjoy it and have fun.
Like at the end of the day, we did have six or seven, seven upperclassmen who, you know,that was going to be our final game on that court.
(18:40):
So I think, um you know, just having fun and embracing the moment really, and just takingit all in just made it that much more special that that was the game that that happened
in.
But um yeah, I can't really explain that feeling.
the subject of unexplainable things.
go, please go ahead.
I'd love to hear from you coach.
(19:01):
I'm actually probably going to say what you're going to say.
mean, to talk about modesty that just came out of Jane's mouth.
ah Yeah, well, and they're also being modest.
I thought they really started the game like they wanted to win that game pretty quickly.
They started fast.
This team, special in knowing and when they're playing well, it's really fun to watch.
(19:26):
if you watch this.
I think you saw that, but Jane having the championship game, I'm sure you're going to takeit from here, but that was a being on or being in the flow.
Um, that was the zone that, you know, not many people see and at any level, including, youknow, NBA, WNBA, anywhere you don't see a 10 for 13, uh, from three experience.
I'm going let you take it from there because I can see you biting and you want it.
(19:51):
You took the words right out of my mouth.
was like, yeah, I'm, that's not a common thing.
But I also think what's really interesting is the selflessness of your team.
In that moment to have so many veteran players, you know, and we'll talk about this morein a moment, but one of the things to me that is so unique about your team this year is
(20:11):
your whole team shot better than 38 % from the floor.
Like anyone at any time could have brought it.
And the fact that in that
game the idea was Jane's hit her first few so now we're gonna really deliberately get herthe ball until she cools down and then it just turned out that she never cooled down.
(20:33):
That's, you know, I, as a coach, I want to ask you, this is a follow-up, like, does your,cause we all have plans going into games like this, like how much does the plan change as
you see the flow of the game?
You know, there's so many pen and kick looks, Carly's getting doubled, like how much doyour original plans change as you see the success unfolding?
(20:56):
With this team, it's different ah because of what you said, the way they share the ball,the way they trust each other.
They're so smart on the floor that honestly made my job a lot easier for that.
Carly knows when she's getting double, there's kick outs and there's people that can shootthe ball or pass out, pass back in.
Like that kind of stuff's going to happen.
Yeah, we talk about it in timeouts, but the game flow, they are very good as a team as awhole of reading that and kind of figuring out what best way to go out of it.
(21:23):
We play call, we do things to change things up.
But some of that stuff is just they're naturally gifted and the IQ and the awareness ofthe game and the flow it's going.
want to build off this.
um
we're talking to two transfers on your team.
You also have multiple homegrown all conference players.
(21:45):
A lot of people on this team embraced a different role than what they had in a differentyear when they went to the NCAA tournament.
You know, so I want to make sure the listeners understand this.
Like this was a very, very unique year in terms of roster construction, adjusting to newroles on a team that's been successful in the past.
(22:07):
amazing.
So I want to start with you, Matt, and I want to just talk about what I think was the mostimpressive thing objectively about your team this year was a lack of ego.
Nobody on the team plays more than 30 minutes a game.
You have all of your starters averaging double figures.
Five, you go five deep on your bench shooting above 38 % from the floor.
(22:28):
um You are consistently playing 10.
I think there's a lot of coaches out there that would be curious to know how did you pullthis off exactly?
you talked about sacrifice and one of our first team meetings, we actually, um, cause I'ma Homer and I love the Celtics.
(22:49):
Um, we took a page out of their book.
They had a meeting at the beginning of year.
You know, I had, um, like you said, we had a lot of the kids coming back from the yearbefore they'd went to the NCAA is, um, starters fifth years, uh, Jay Levine being one of
them that was a starter, um, was coming in.
I said, listen, we got six, seven, possibly that could start.
I've all played.
(23:10):
really good minutes.
said, I need you to realize that we might not all start, but we're all going to have arole and we need you to embrace it if we're going to have the success we want.
I read like this whole, um, you know, Joe Missoula thing talking about the starters andHorford and all that.
And, and just re I don't think they took it as serious as I did at the beginning.
Uh, but then realizing I, for instance, one that's sitting right here, Jane coming from Done and coming off the bench for the whole season, I really embraced in that role.
(23:38):
Um,
and shining in the role.
And obviously she got good minutes off of that role and then she would finish a lot ofgames, but it's really realizing, well, you could have been, I'm a D1 player.
You're not starting me.
That's crazy.
uh There was none of that.
And Jaylen Levine started the year before the whole season and then took a seat coming offthe bench and never complained.
(23:58):
They had to come in, start a couple of games when we had injuries and did an amazing job.
Like there was just that buy into, we want to win the LEC.
That is our goal.
And then what do we got to do to get there?
And if we start thinking about it's the me, then we're to have problems and it's the we,we're going to have victories.
building on that, because I think this is really important from a coaching perspectivebefore I get Jane and Carly's thoughts.
(24:27):
I can point to a lot of specific stats that are very cool, right?
You're a near top 10 scoring offense in the nation.
You're one of the most efficient field goal percentage teams in the country.
You are literally seventh in the country and made threes this year.
But behind the stats is kind of my hypothesis, which would be none of this happens unlesseverybody's bought in and the locker room is tight.
(24:51):
Is that sort of the summary in your eyes?
Yeah, but like you said, I've had three generations of really teams and I think I've beenblessed with some really, really special teams.
Back when I met you in Dallas, that was my first special team.
This team was probably the most special as far as how fast they came together and reallybought in um to be the team that they wanted to be.
(25:16):
Like I told you before, the goal is what they wanted so bad that they were willing to giveup some of their personal things.
And like I tell people all the time, if you give up some personal things for the end goalof the team, some of your personal stuff is going to be accomplished.
You're going to have that personal goals that meet, it's the, your, what your intentionsare.
think that make that make it more special.
(25:37):
So if you want to talk about unbelievable timing, you finished that sentence and thenCarly and Jane dropped.
So the good news is we still have that.
I'm going to pause this real quick.
So slow.
(26:01):
Bye, Jerry.
for us coach?
oh
Hey, be careful what we're gonna say right now.
Thank
we go.
Okay, now we're okay.
uh Thankfully, all I heard or that made the recording was any questions for us, But in theevent there was more, we'll figure it out later.
(26:25):
Yeah, the gag reel.
Okay.
So what Coach just said is really interesting to me because he talks about a combinationof a lot of new pieces, gelling together, sacrifice.
to achieve a common goal, especially for two people that just made the journey that youdid from D1 to D3.
(26:47):
I would love to know if the two of you have any advice to younger players based on theexperience you went through this year.
um I think sort of just, you know, not even just based on what I went through this year,but, just throughout my entire college athletic journey, sort of just staying true to
(27:09):
yourself and like, you know, your principles and like what made you get to where you arelike, um and don't settle.
I feel like my work ethic is like something I have taken a lot of pride in my whole lifeand um I didn't really let it waver throughout my college career.
And I think that
You know, if I did, I would have, you know, finished my six years of playing basketballwith a lot of regret if I, you know, didn't carry that through um throughout my playing
(27:37):
career.
So I'd sort of just say, you know, do, don't lose what you did to get to where you are, nomatter what level you're playing at and sort of don't settle.
Love that.
What about you, Carly?
Um, would say that just like thinking big picture, like it's, great to work towards a goaland, like working towards earning a scholarship is something, that is a great
(28:06):
accomplishment.
Um, but thinking about like setting goals for yourself and being okay with like your pathlooking a little different, um, is something that I've really embraced and, um,
Yeah, I think just like it's, you're going to end up where you're supposed to be andthings, things just fall into place as there's, as there should.
(28:31):
So that's what I would say.
It sounds to me at least like you guys don't have really any regrets about your journey.
Is that fair?
Yeah.
That's really, really cool.
um Let's dovetail right off that because this is after all a podcast about the recruitingprocess.
(28:53):
So this is an opportunity for a long time Division III coach and two high level DivisionIII players to talk about Division III basketball.
um I know that Coach Matt and I have been uh banging the drum for D3.
um I know, I don't want to love up on Coach Matt, but I know for a fact
(29:15):
There are D1 coaches out there at all levels that love Coach Matt.
I know that.
And I also, you know, happened to coach at the Division 1 level myself after coaching atDivision 3 for a while.
You two have a similar experience.
You were scholarship level players that had an amazing run at the Division 3 level.
I guess my question to you, the players, would be, you know, can you help me dispel thisrumor that Division 3 ball, like, is bad?
(29:41):
and not well-coached, like you just experienced it.
What would you have to say about Division III basketball?
I think, can I go?
Yeah.
I just think like people don't realize how competitive it is and just the level of talentthat exists at the division three level.
And like I said, like when I came and played summer league with the team, I said to my momafterwards, like I just, yeah, I want to be on this team, but I just hope I play.
(30:06):
I hope I can contribute something and get some minutes.
like, I think just you need to go and like watch a game and be there in person and realizethat there's like really impressive.
athletes and yeah, it's a highly competitive level.
Yeah, I'd say, you know, the difference may maybe on some teams, there's a difference inskill level.
(30:31):
But I think that a lot of teams do make up for it in just sheer athleticism.
I think that, you know, there are a lot of D three teams that have, you know, soccer andlacrosse players on their basketball team, which you can see when they're like running the
break or like running full court press.
But yeah, I don't I
I would disagree with anyone who thinks that it's not as competitive.
(30:51):
think especially in the New England area where we got to play, there's a ton of really,really, really top tier teams that definitely could beat Division II and Division I teams,
I'd say.
And some of the rivalries that go on in our region specifically, I think make it just somuch more exciting to watch and to be a part of.
(31:12):
So sticking with the two of you for a second, I was gonna say I wanna toss you ahypothetical, but the reality is this isn't a hypothetical.
I deal with this with my clients and when I talk to people.
um To the person that's like, well, maybe I'll go D3 because it's not as serious as D1 andmaybe the time investment won't be the same.
(31:38):
What do you say to that person?
I think the time investment, I think it's just as serious.
from spending time around a team or people, players that you might be on a team if you'regoing on recruiting visits and stuff, you can tell, least I can only speak for our
(32:02):
program, but um it's taken very seriously and um definitely still an equally like...
daunting time commitment.
It's college athletics still.
uh But I will say on the more positive end, it is still a large time commitment that I dofeel like there's more balance in your life outside of basketball.
(32:28):
So uh in terms of your sport, you're still spending basically the same amount of time,maybe a few hours less per week, but you still have the same daily practice, daily
you know, lift conditioning, whatever you're doing, those like outside of basketballthings, I feel like you have a little more of your life to you.
(32:51):
feels that way.
uh I mean, I'd agree.
I think like one of the only differences is I guess like at the D3 level, there's somemajors that you probably can't pursue if you were to play at a higher level that um you're
allowed to at most division three schools, but
Um, terms of time commitment, like Carly said, like we obviously still practice every day.
live twice a week in season and, you know, preseason.
(33:14):
We just enjoy playing basketball and we want to be ready for the season in terms of like,you know, chemistry wise and conditioning wise.
And, you know, we play pickup and we condition preseason voluntarily.
And I think that it's just something that, um, obviously it's, we're talking specific toour program, but I think, you know, division three, I don't think that the preseason
(33:34):
commitment is much less than.
You know what we're describing as well, but I do think I agree that obviously you do havea lot more balance just in your life in general.
And I do think like a big piece of it is also the summer session, not not having a summersession at division three level, but that really prepares you to come into school like in
the fall and like your.
(33:56):
Your teammates and like the coaches and everybody like you're more eager for like pick upand lift and things like that.
And you're like putting so much more energy towards that when you've had a summer too.
spend time with family and like recover and get yourself situated.
was the biggest thing.
Like you don't have a summer session in D3 and I think a lot of people would be like, wellthen it's definitely not as serious.
(34:19):
And my response was like, ah they're still competing and they still all want to play.
So they're going to come back and probably compete.
Is that a fair assessment of what you're saying?
Like I never thought that was as huge a thing as other people make it out to be.
Yeah, for sure.
mean, I think that, yeah, like you said, it can be a perception that like, because wedon't have a summer session, it's not as competitive, but, um you know, I think it makes
(34:49):
us, like Carly said, so much more excited to, you know, come back and play together andcompete just because we haven't really had as much competition over the summer.
So think it is a healthy amount of time off and it's just enough to, you know, geteveryone like excited and, you know, ready for the school year.
ready to play together.
And we also send em workout check-ins.
(35:10):
it's kind of like you're remotely staying motivated through your teammates by checking inwith like a selfie of yourself working out, whether it's on Snapchat or group me, but like
kind of pushing each other while we're not actually physically together was helpful forus.
I don't know.
Before we turn back to Coach Matt for a couple of nuts and bolts recruiting questions, yousaid something just now that piqued my interest.
(35:32):
oh
I would love to quantify this just so that the average parent or average listener actuallyfigured this out.
During the spring and summer when the coaches by rule in D3 could not work with you, howoften per week would you say the two of you were getting up shots or in the gym working on
something basketball related?
(35:54):
Because I want listeners to understand what the work really looks like.
What was that like for you two?
I mean, I'd say probably like five or six days a week.
Yeah, pretty much.
Maybe that we didn't work out, but I think probably five to six days a week for sure.
Okay, this is important.
(36:16):
Go ahead, Coach Matt.
You were about to add something.
This is good.
yeah, ask Jane what she did before the championship game
Jane, what'd you do before the championship game?
I shot on the shooting machine.
730.
730.
I don't know how many shots I made.
But.
Several hours.
Yeah, and this is really, really important, right?
(36:39):
Because it kills me when people dismiss D3.
People don't understand that this exists on a plane.
There are D3 teams out there, and I'm telling you this team was one of them, that couldtake it to some of the teams at Division 2, in their region.
Like, it's not like the bottom of D2 is better than the top of D3.
And it's also not like the very bottom of D1 is better than the top of D2.
(37:01):
Jane, you saw some of those scrimmages.
I'll say that.
uh
You know, this is what I really want people to understand.
We're doing a podcast with literally one of the best Division III three-point shooters inthe country and a WBCA named by the coaches, All American Honorable Mention.
(37:23):
So these are two people that are now telling you, these are two people now telling you, ohyeah, even though the coach wasn't there, we still were working at basketball.
like it was a part-time job at the Division III level.
So anybody that's questioning the passion, the dedication, and the commitment that thisreally involves, let this be a lesson to you.
(37:49):
And this is a good opportunity for me to segue to you, Coach Matt.
um I imagine as you're working the transfer portal, you might also have some people athigher levels that don't have this impression.
about what Division III actually is and what playing for UMass Dartmouth actually is.
I imagine, and I'd love to hear it from you, what is the skepticism that a potentialtransfer athlete has to work through to be a desirable recruit for you?
(38:18):
What are the potential red flags and how do you filter that?
You know, was thinking about this, I was actually on a phone call earlier today and I was,it's for me, I like to build relationships in the recruitment process.
You know, talk to the high school coach, the AU coach, the family, get to meet all that.
And sometimes with the transport, the situation it is, you don't get to build all thoserelationships and really get to learn about the whole person as much as I like to
(38:48):
sometimes.
So there is some of that like.
trepidation of, right, well, anybody can, you know, the highlight films of their life orthe highlight films of who they are, they can be that for that short amount of time.
Is that who they really are?
Is that who they're really bringing into the program?
So that is my biggest, you know, area of, like I said, trepidation of like, that's where Igot to really dig down and try to get a quick synopsis of who the person is and making
(39:14):
sure they're going to come in and be a positive to the program and not a negative to theprogram.
And kind of that's probably the biggest part.
want to now flip that because you've had this positive experience with transfers now.
mean, and we've established that it's not just with statistics.
know, Jane, Carly, Amaris all brought it and helped elevate, you know, the culturalcomponent of your program.
(39:39):
Is there now something that might have you look at a high school kid and whether it'simmaturity or lack of preparedness, like, is there a chip in your brain that goes, I might
be able to...
get this in the transfer portal and not have to worry about this.
Like how do you balance that?
So yes, on the flip side, what you know you're getting typically, because you're gonnatalk to the college coaches, someone that has played at a level that is higher than high
(40:02):
school has hopefully been successful.
You have some actual clips of them playing in college.
ah So they have the work, you probably have the work ethic.
They know what the extra workouts are all about.
They know what a college program is all about.
So yeah, that is definitely a positive.
Really, really interesting.
I would love to hear this now from the three of you and then we'll kind of close it withmy final question after this.
(40:25):
Knowing what you now know, I want to talk directly to the high school students becausethat information gap is real, right?
You don't know what you don't know and everyone has that experience when you show up on acollege campus and you're practicing for the first time.
What advice would you have to a specific high school kid
(40:47):
that's going to go play D3.
What would you say to them as they're getting ready to transition?
You guys want to study?
Well, me too.
Um, I can start.
Okay.
Um, I would say, you know, don't overlook like the level of talent that you're going toplay.
(41:07):
Like I would say like, don't walk in and think that because of the success, you know, youhad in high school or wherever you were, that it's immediately going to carry over.
I think no matter what level D1, D2, D3, you need to just come in and be a sponge learnfrom everyone around you, including the coaches.
the upperclassmen and, you know, be willing to.
(41:30):
You know, create relationships with everyone.
Um, I think that.
The 1 of the good things about division 3, like we talked about earlier is you have a lotof time to form these relationships off the court with your teammates.
So, you know, being open to that.
Um, I think it's super important as well.
Other freshmen.
(41:52):
Charlie, you wanna add to that?
I think, I mean, I like, I like what Jane said.
I think.
Any like coming into college at any level, I just feel like, really taking advantage ofyour opportunities that you get.
(42:13):
And no matter how those look and really like trying to use each experience as a growingexperience and not really viewing anything as like.
failure or, I like, you know, I can't do this, but just like more of that positive mindsetthat wherever you end up is where you're supposed to be and you're going to, um, be okay.
(42:38):
So I just think like taking advantage of the support and the help that it's offered to youand, um, going out and seeking that is a big thing.
And at the division three level, just thinking about how can I push my teammates and havethis, have relationships that
em are going to get me better, but also just improve the climate that I'm walking into andthe culture of wherever I end up.
(43:03):
I imagine it's gotta make you pretty proud to hear ah what you just heard from twoplayers.
um Is there anything that you'd like to add um to what they just shared?
Well, things I like to hear is the culture and everywhere you go, you are part of theculture.
complaining about the culture, you are an addition or subtraction to culture.
So be part of what you want to see.
(43:25):
And then go where you want it.
And I know you hear that part.
Well, I hope people hear that.
I go where you want it and go where you see yourself being successful, whatever successlooks like for you.
uh It might be, you know, being on a really successful high level team that you don't geta lot of minutes on, that's okay.
It might be going somewhere you just want to play and you don't care about wins.
Not my thing.
Um, I enjoy, you know, I, I want to, I want a team that wants to win and willing to putthe work into win and willing to put the sacrifice in and what it might mean to get to the
(43:51):
wins.
Um, and then really at the end of the year, celebrating as a team, um, having a, you know,winning something, hopefully a championship.
I think finding what's important to you and what your must haves are a way you're tryingto land.
Um, and then being true to who you are and know why you, what your why is and why am Igoing to this place is because, you know, I'm supposed to, because people think I'm really
(44:12):
good or.
my family thinks I should, or my AU coach thinks I should, or whatever it might be, findit where you're finding your best fit and where you're gonna be the happiest.
Because when you do leave the school, you wanna look back and say that added to my life,and added to who I am, and now I'm gonna have these relationships forever with these
friends, with these teammates.
I just think that's important to not lose your self-identity with looking at whateverybody else thinks you should do.
(44:35):
Go where you want it and go where you can be your best fit.
the three of you just mic dropping one after the other.
um This is really valuable to me specifically because I don't just think I know that thenext Carly Whiteside, the next Jane McCauley is out there right now, whether they're in
(44:56):
the portal or not, whether they're trying to stick out and experience when you're, Mattsays no, I love that, so I love you, Matt, I love you.
Figuratively.
The next Carly White or Jane Macaulay is out there.
And I don't mean in terms of what they bring to a culture or who they are as people.
I mean more in terms of someone who might be looking for a new experience, someone whomight be looking to make an impact differently or might be seeking out something
(45:21):
different.
I am of the opinion that over the last 45 minutes or so, you guys have really drawn a mapfor what the next Carly or Jane could do.
to put trust in themselves and what type of environment to look for.
But I always want to give you guys the floor.
If there is anything that you haven't said to that future you that you want to say, isthere anything else you guys want to add?
(45:45):
Because I think this has been so valuable.
I would just say like lean into the um uncomfortable like conversations, whether that'slike with teammates or friends or family coaches, like leaning into that.
Cause that's really where you figure out who you want to be and what, you know, like thatcan just, don't know.
(46:11):
I think making yourself uncomfortable is where we grow and how um as a player and as aperson, like that's really what.
sports about and preparing you for life after the sport, which we are now in.
So just thinking about taking advantage of every opportunity you get.
Yeah, I think like, you know, aside from all the encore and basketball experiences andjust like, you know, going through the transfer process a couple times, I think at the end
(46:43):
of the day, like really reflecting on, you know,
my career, I think it's just so much bigger than basketball.
And it's just about like, the relationships you have and the experiences like, the thingsthat you remember are not like, obviously, we're always gonna remember like, a
championship win and like, you know, the major ones, but you know, the things that youremember just like the times that you spend with your teammates and like, the
(47:05):
relationships that you form.
And, you know, I've been at three different schools and I'm still in touch like superfrequently with, you know, people that I met.
in 2019.
So it's like, you never know who you're going to cross paths with, including this one.
But you never going to know who you're going to cross paths with and, you know, who'sgoing to impact your life.
And it's just it's so much bigger than basketball at the end of the day.
(47:28):
So basketball is what brings that all together.
But it's the other stuff that's important.
So pick a place for the people and like the relationships that you feel and for like
Having like-minded people, feel like, like when I met Jane at Vermont, my mom instantlyknew that like out of everybody that she met, she's like, like you and Jane are so
(47:49):
similar.
Like I can tell that that's going to be your close friend.
And it's just like that feeling of who do you, and not that you need to pick people thatlike you're similar to, but just like that, like like-minded people who are going to have
like a similar goal and who are really going to like push you to improve basketball wiseacademically life.
Yeah.
uh
(48:11):
This has got to, you hear two players of yours say this, Coach Matt, I imagine this fillsyour cup immensely.
Cup is overflowing, Jared.
This was I Will tell you this is actually my first time I've done a podcast with coaches acoach and players at the same time and ah I'm actually honestly now that I've done it not
(48:39):
looking forward to going back to doing one or the other Because I feel like it was sointeresting to hear you guys not just talk about what your journey was like but also like
calling out one another's modesty, talking about one another's value to one another,bringing everything back to your team.
ah I imagine this was an extremely fulfilling year for everybody uh involved in thisinterview.
(49:03):
And I thank you so, so much for your time.
And I look forward to catching up with you all very soon.
Thank you so much for your time.
Thank you, Jared.
Thank you.
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