October 12, 2024 • 55 mins
In this episode of the Next Level Human podcast, Dr. Jade interviews Dr. Dana Cohen, an expert in integrative functional medicine. They discuss her new book and the importance of simplifying nutrition, the role of hydration, and how blending can be a powerful tool for improving health. Dr. Cohen shares insights from her new book, 'Fueled Up,' emphasizing the need to incorporate more whole foods into our diets while reducing ultra-processed foods. The conversation also touches on the psychological aspects of eating, the significance of moderation, and practical tips for using a blender to enhance nutrition.
integrative medicine, functional medicine, nutrition, hydration, blending, health tips, wellness, diet, recipes, health education
Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Integrative Functional Medicine
02:49 The Importance of Nutrition Basics
06:04 Hydration and Its Role in Health
11:59 Understanding the Fourth Phase of Water
17:47 The Role of Blending in Nutrition
23:52 Practical Tips for Using a Blender
30:00 The Psychology of Eating and Moderation
45:01 Final Thoughts and Resources
Connect with Dr Cohen:
https://www.drdanacohen.com/
https://www.drdanacohen.com/fuel-up-book
https://www.instagram.com/drdanacohen/
Looking for a Next Level Human Coach? Get on the waitlist and get access to the brand-new science of quantum metabolism and identity restructuring with Dr Jade and the team.
http://nextlevelhuman.com/human-coaching
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Connect with Next Level Human
Website: www.nextlevelhuman.com
support@nextlevelhuman.com
Connect with Dr. Jade Teta
Website: www.jadeteta.com
Instagram: @jadeteta
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to the show, everybody.
This is the Next Level Humanpodcast.
I'm your host, dr Jay Tita, andI'm here with a new friend of
mine, dr Dana Cohen MD.
She is an internist who's beendoing integrative functional
medicine since the late 90s and,as she and I have been talking,
just before we jumped on, wewere talking how we had both
(00:20):
been around for a while andreally had not run into each
other much until what was last.
I guess it was.
May maybe Dana like May,something like that March, april
, may in Chicago at the IF1, atthe, I guess, jeffrey Bland's
conference, yeah.
And so the reason I wanted tohave Dr Dana on for all of you
(00:44):
is because she has a brand newbook out called Fueled Up or
Fuel Up, right, fuel Up.
And this book is right inalignment with a lot of what we
talk about on this podcast, andthis is this idea that in the
health space, we can getinundated with information and
(01:05):
get very, very confused aboutwhat to eat.
It all becomes very complicated, and this is the kind of book I
love, because it really bringsyou back to basics and gives you
a very simple way to begin toapproach a nutrition.
Now I'm just going to frame upreal quick, dana, then I'm going
to let you take this away.
(01:25):
I just want to let everyoneknow, remind everyone on this
show, that, from my perspective,if you're going to be
successful, yes, cooking andprepping food and all these
kinds of things is veryimportant and probably what most
people are going to need to doat least some of that.
However, you're also going toneed to be at least some of that
.
However, you're also going toneed to be able to manage eating
(01:46):
out, eating processed foodsfrom time to time, reading
labels, figuring out what arethe things that you can do that
are going to be good for you.
So one of the ways I usuallyframe this up is I talk about
the s diet and it goes like thissoups, salads, scrambles,
shakes, smoothies, stir fries,skillet meals, sours.
(02:09):
These would be things likefermented foods and things like
that, spices, and then, ofcourse, some of your favorite
food.
Now in this list we have shakesand smoothies.
So these are things that comeout of a blender, which is a
very convenient way to approachnutrition.
(02:29):
I remember way back when I firstdiscovered Bruce Lee and my
love for Bruce Lee in terms ofhis philosophy and his teachings
.
He's one of the first people Ibelieve, at least some people,
give him credit for this idea ofblending up food.
He used to take chicken breast,broccoli and stick it in a
blender with some water andblend it up and carry it around
(02:51):
with him in the thermos and eatit for his meals, and so I
remember reading about this andthinking this guy probably
created the first, you know,protein shake smoothie.
But, dana, you're doingsomething incredibly interesting
and I always like to saypractitioners like you, who
probably seen a lot, a lot ofpeople.
You come up with thesesolutions because you know that
(03:15):
most people are way too busy toeat and prep wild caught salmon
and kale every single day.
They need simple solutions, andso I want you to just tell us a
little bit about your story,how you came up with this
concept, a little bit about thebook, and let's get into this
discussion.
I'm really excited to have youhere.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Thank you.
Thank you so much.
I have another S for you, which, by the way, I love that Sours
and shrubs.
Shrubs are vinegar-based drinksthat are becoming very popular
now.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Shrubs.
That's the first time I'veheard that that's called a shrub
.
Very cool.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Yes.
So there you go.
So, yes, the book.
How did I come up with thisbook?
So my first book was onhydration Quench.
It was written about water,it's movement.
We really are the first peoplethat put together hydration and
(04:29):
fascia you know, so, and we talkabout Dr Pollack's work Fourth
Phase of Water in that book.
So that was my first book andthrough that book my co-author,
Colin Sapphire, who invented theNutribullet and then sold that
company, now has a gorgeous newblender called the Beast.
(04:50):
Check it out, it's incredible.
And he was really the personwho sort of and the Nutribullet
was really where the personalblender came in, meaning you can
take it off the thing and drinkit right from the cup and be on
the go with it.
That's really what theNutribullet did.
So now the Beast is thisbeautiful, much more powerful,
(05:12):
gorgeous personal blender.
So he had gotten in touch withme and for like a long time we
were figuring out how can wework together.
You know he has a hydrationelement of his Beast.
You know he has a hydrationelement of his beast and in our
talking I realized he's got aton of what I call colonisms.
You know he's a lay person,he's not a scientist, but he's
(05:33):
got great.
You know he struggled his wholelife.
He was a marathon runner buthated vegetables, didn't eat
well and it wasn't serving himand figured out.
Well, when he invented theNutribullet he figured out this
is how I need to do it I'm goingto sneak in these vegetables
somehow and it changed his life.
So, and he had all these littleterms that I loved I was like
(05:55):
Colin, we need to let's.
Why don't we write the book?
Why don't we, you know, come upwith the next book?
And basically, this is like thenext step of it, just all fits
in with quench and then, andthen where we're going from here
.
So, so that's what we did andthis is what we came up with.
And you know, the idea is how tocheat your way to good health
(06:16):
using a blender.
You know, it's that simple.
Um, the blender.
Something like 96 to 98% ofhouseholds have a blender, and
it's fun, it's easy, it's quickand it's really.
You know, I said to you earlier, you can't mess up.
Nobody puts cake or, you know,junk into their blender.
(06:40):
You're getting real whole food.
So the big message, the overallmessage, is how to get rid of
ultra, or how to limit ultraprocessed foods, how to get more
real whole food into your diet,and then whatever science we
can find to back that up we talkabout.
You know, 30 different plants aweek can really help your
microbiome.
How to do that, how to make iteasier, but, but you know, every
(07:03):
step of the way.
Number one do not beat yourselfup.
There is no diet, there is nodeprivation in this.
Just up level your health everystep of the way.
So it's not just smoothies andshakes, there's cocktails and
mocktails, there's, you know,dressings and sauces and soups
(07:26):
and desserts, and then weirdways that you can use your
blender breads and flatbreadsand stuff like that.
We even do have a chicken saladrecipe in there.
You know, I think it's pushingit a little bit, but you pulse
it and it's fine.
Yeah, so, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
Well, you talked about it as a cheat, and to me
it really is.
I've always said there's thecheat code for health and
fitness really is the blender,and so when I saw this I saw you
post on social, I think and Iwas like we really should cover
(08:01):
this on the podcast, because,from my perspective, it's like
what are the big movers?
You know, most people to me, I,you know, we have this idea of
one to five big things you cando.
Well, if you know how to useyour blender, it's going to
change the game for you in termsof your health and your fitness
.
Now, if you don't mind, I wantto as we get into this.
I want to because I'm just, youknow, just kind of selfish.
(08:24):
I want to learn a little bitfrom you about let's go back
Before we cover a little bitmore of the new book.
Let's go back to Quench alittle bit and talk about this
idea of hydration, and so thiswould be your first book, I
guess back in 2021, which is theprecursor to this, and so you
had mentioned that.
(08:44):
I want to kind of start thereand then go into the new book,
but walk us through just alittle bit about this idea
because I assume well, I'll justtell you my premise here Right,
one of the things that you hearabout is you hear a lot about
this fourth phase of water, thisso-called exclusion zone water
or, you know quote, structuredwater, and this idea that we can
(09:06):
just drink this out of a beaker, and my thought has always been
or out of a water bottle.
My thought has always been thatreally, where this water is, is
it's in biological substances.
So I've always thought, likeyou know, when I go down to
Costa Rica, I eat, all I do iseat fruit all day long and feel
fantastic and I wonder.
I've always wondered it'sreally just about?
(09:28):
Is it really just about megetting hydrated through this
food?
And so this is sort ofsomething I've been wondering
about.
I'm wondering can you educateus a little bit on this idea of
hydration hydration through food, perhaps?
And you know this idea of, youknow, exclusion zone water or
structured water, becauseobviously, university of
(09:49):
Washington and you know, andjust to also be clear it's a
(10:09):
hypothesis, it's not a proventhing, but it makes complete
sense to me.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
And you know, some scientists water researchers are
not on board, but most waterresearchers do believe that
there are other phases of water.
And now it's even coming outthat there's probably many other
phases of water, not just fourphases.
That was the whole impetus forme writing that book.
By the way, that's mind blowingto me.
We've always known that waterexists as three phases water,
(10:39):
ice and vapor, you know, andliquid ice and vapor.
And when, you know, when Istarted to hear about this, I
was like what are you talkingabout?
And so that was mind blowing tome.
And then, when you start tolook at it, and basically the
idea is how H2O, the simplestmolecule in the world, yet the
most complex, when I got intowriting this book, I was like,
(11:03):
oh my God, what did I get myselfinto?
I'm not a researcher.
This is way beyond, but we do agood job of simplifying it.
And it's the idea of how theseH2O molecules layer upon each
other or structure, right, andit's in that layering that they
start to share electrons andthen, and then the charges
change a little bit, right?
(11:24):
And so it's believed that it'sin that form of water, this
fourth phase of water, and DrPollack believes it's H3O2.
So it's not really H3O2.
It's just in that layering thatthey start to share electrons,
that it changes a little bit,and it's in that phase that's
believed to exist withinourselves and that it exists in
(11:46):
nature, right?
So the byline to our book iseight glasses a day is not the
way, yeah, right.
So first of all, how can youknow a five foot sedentary
person who never sweats haveeight glasses and a six foot two
athlete who's sweating?
You know, it doesn't make anysense, and I'm here to say that
(12:08):
it's different for every person.
What you know, what theiroptimal hydration level is.
We don't have a perfect way ofmeasuring it.
I do have something that I willgive to your people listening
the best way to know if you arewell hydrated is to look at your
urine output, right?
So we are meant to be urinatingevery two or three hours while
(12:31):
we're awake, and I have peopledo hashtags.
You know, I've been known.
I'll sit at my desk for eighthours straight, not get up once
to pee and I'm like what am Idoing?
I know better than that, youknow.
And the truth is it is the onething that I'm a real stickler
on.
Day in, day out, hour by hour,we need to stay on top of our
hydration.
Okay so, because hydration isthe single most important thing
(12:55):
you can do to treat and preventchronic disease, hands down,
before you start any supplementregimen, diet regimen, whatever
it may be, always start withhydration.
Learn how to hydrate first, andthat means drinking some water.
That means eating your water, Ibelieve a smoothie is.
You know, one green smoothie isequivalent to two or three
(13:19):
glasses of the same amount ofbulk water.
You know in the way that ithydrates your cells because
we're holding on to it better.
There's fiber in there, there'sminerals in there, there's
electrolytes in there.
These all these things thathelp maybe structure the water
or just hold on to the water orget into the cell better.
We don't know for sure, but Ido know, know that in my 30
(13:41):
years of doing this, 28 years ofdoing this, that when even my
athletes, when they come in andsay I can't quench my thirst, no
matter what I do, they change afew things add a smoothie a day
, add some electrolytes, getsome sunshine, start to ground.
These are all things that arehydrating.
(14:03):
Move differently, and when Isay move, it's not necessarily
exercise.
I'm not an exercise specialist,although I was an exercise
physiology major, but I lost allthat information.
But movement we talk aboutmicro movements in the book.
It's a lot of information in afew minutes, sorry.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Yeah, no, it's perfect.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
Good.
So movement is a hydrating actand it's my belief that you know
why sitting is the new smokingbecause we're squelching
delivery of hydration to ourperiphery Right.
So we talk about this thingcalled micro movements, and
basically we made them up.
It's you know.
(14:45):
This is a micro movement,meaning, you know, shrugging
your shoulders, turning yourhead, moving all your joints.
You know, from ananthropological view, we have
something like we're born withI'm going to mess up the numbers
Three hundred differentmovements when we're, when we're
infants, and as we get older,we only use 30 or 40 of them.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Yeah, isn't that crazy.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
Yeah, so we need to, like you know, move everything
that you can think of Start inthe morning, start from your
toes and twist and turn and doall this stuff and then,
throughout the day, do somemovements, and I think I touched
everything.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
Yeah, and actually I'm sure you're familiar with
Herman Ponser's work.
He's kind of who I regard asprobably the premier expert in
metabolism in the world rightnow.
He's out of Duke University.
He did a study on thehunter-gatherers and looking at
the different movement patternsthat they use.
This is not for Dana, but it'sfor all you listeners.
I'm sure you know this, dana,but one of the things he found
(15:46):
that was really interesting,that the major difference was
these hunter-gatherers walkabout as much as us, a little
bit more, but they're not likedoing tens of thousands of steps
more than we are per day.
The major place where they aredifferent than us is in the way
they rest.
They have active restingpositions where they're kneeling
(16:08):
, they're standing in particularways.
They don't have chairs andthese micro movements that
you're calling them are going onall the time.
Anyone who's ever gone into aprimitive man deep squat and had
to support their body know thattheir body's sort of moving
like this constantly.
And this is what they foundwere one of the major
differences between us and ourhunter-gatherer ancestors as it
(16:32):
pertains to movement.
They don't necessarily do a tonmore movement than us.
They do do more, but it's notlike a ton a ton, but the way
they rest with these sort ofmicro contractions in the
muscles is very different thanus, and so it just reminded me
of that when you were sort ofbringing that up, and I love the
(16:53):
way you're talking about it andI want to sort of get your take
on this too, because isn't itinteresting?
And maybe as an internistyou're a little different than
me, so maybe you're going tocorrect me on this.
But one of the things that Ihave always found bizarre in the
field of medicine is that wedon't have great ways to even
measure hydration, even still inindividuals In terms of lab
(17:17):
values, in terms of other things.
There is no great way to measurehow hydrated someone is in
general.
And number two, basically on anindividual level, and I find
this absolutely mind blowingthat that is still the case when
it is probably arguably and youseem to agree with me, or I
(17:38):
agree with you probably one ofthe most important things we can
do as humans.
Yet medicine has no real way ofevaluating hydration on an
individual level in terms ofcellular hydration, sort of real
hydration, and so, other thansigns and symptoms and blood
volume, right, it's like, whatelse do we look at?
(17:59):
There are a few measures kidney, you know, anion gap, chloride,
sodium, all these things thatyou can infer but there's not a
really good way in my mind tomeasure this and I'm wondering.
You're nodding your head, so itseems like you're in agreement
with this, but I was wonderingmaybe you have a secret that I
don't know about, given your,but isn't that crazy that that's
(18:20):
the case?
Speaker 2 (18:21):
Yeah, yeah, no, we definitely don't, and we talk a
lot about that.
That's why I said the firstthing.
I said the best way is tomeasure.
Look at your urine output andmake sure that you're peeing.
Even the color of your urine isnot, is not perfect.
It's not a great test.
I mean, you know, if you takethe B vitamin, then all uh, yeah
(18:48):
, it's not a great test, it'sokay.
Um, you know and I want to justsay something on that note too,
when we look at our urine, we'vea lot of people have been told
like we want crystal clear urineat the end of the day, then you
know you're hydrated enough.
Um, I'm not sure I I agree withthat.
I think there's, um, I see,almost on a weekly basis I
(19:09):
definitely on a weekly basis, ifnot more than a few times a
week where patients areoverhydrating and their sodium
is low and their chloride is lowNot enough to be detrimental,
but enough to give them.
Like when I asked them are yougetting cramps?
Are you getting?
Are you fatigued?
Yeah, because some of the samesymptoms of overhydration is
(19:31):
with underhydration.
I also want to differentiatebetween low-grade, subclinical
dehydration versus overtdehydration.
We know what overt dehydrationis.
That's easily measured.
You need to go to the emergencyroom.
Your eyes are rolling back inyour head because you've been
vomiting or whatever, diarrheaall day long Different.
(19:53):
It's this low grade, subclinicaldehydration that affects all of
us that we need to stay on topof every single day, because
that's the stuff that that leadsto chronic disease, diabetes,
alzheimer's, certain cancers.
You know that is a risk factorfor those things.
Speaker 1 (20:13):
Yeah, and just so everyone understands I think
most people know this, but maybeyou want to say something about
this as well your sense ofthirst is not a good indication
of how much water you drink.
So what we're hearing from youis that okay?
Yeah, maybe urine volume, youknow, peeing every two to three
hours, maybe some degree oflooking at urine color, but you
(20:37):
certainly don't want that tooclear, you know, because you're
losing minerals and all thatkind of stuff.
You know there's other testsyou can do, like the pinch test
of the hand and how fast theskin bounces back and stuff like
that.
And, of course, acutelyspeaking, we know what overt
dehydration looks like.
That's a medical emergency, butthere's no real way to
adequately look at our hydrationfrom an optimal standpoint in
(21:02):
the current way we look at it,and so it's really interesting
to hear you also say that,having written a book on this,
and so let me ask you about this, dana.
So you mentioned, and is thereanything else you want to say
about this idea of what happenswhen we are getting our
hydration through food?
(21:23):
We can go back to some of thestuff like with Gatorade which I
know that's like a sin to evenmention Gatorade for us
functional medicinepractitioners, because of you
know some of the stuff that youknow the brominated, you know
vegetable oils and all thethings that some of these things
can have.
However, that original researchdoes indeed show that when you
(21:43):
have glucose along withelectrolytes, along with water,
you are going to get betterhydration, and I'm wondering if
you have any other informationon this in terms of getting your
hydration through foods andthrough fruits and these kinds
of things and through vegetables.
I mean, when you think aboutfruits and vegetables, one of
(22:05):
the interesting things aboutthese things, we tend to think
of them as very nutrient-densefoods and we tend to think of
them as sort of low-carbohydrate, and we tend to think of them
as very nutrient-dense foods andwe tend to think of them as
sort of low-carbohydrate and wetend to think of their calories.
What we don't often think of isthat they're loaded with water.
This is why they crunch when webite into them.
These things are loaded withwater.
So one of the things I'vealways often thought is this
(22:26):
idea of dry foods versus sort ofthese wet vegetables and fruits
.
And of course, this discussionwill bring us into your new book
, because now it seems to me,and I don't know if I'm jumping
the gun here, but it seems to mewe can engineer this water
based food delivery system whenwe are using a blender when we
(22:50):
are using a blender.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
Yes, so, first of all , cauliflower is dry, but it's
something like 90, I may bemessing up the number 96% water.
So vegetables naturally containa lot of water and hydration.
They also contain fiber andminerals.
So those things alone.
Minerals are electrolytes.
The fiber is going to hold onto that water like a sponge help
(23:15):
you hold on to it better.
The electrolytes help you pushit into the cell.
Going back to the, you know, theGatorades and those kind of
things, yeah, there is, I'm onthe board of an electrolyte
company, c know, but there is.
You know, there is goodresearch that we, you know, some
of those electrolyte drinks.
(23:37):
Not everybody needs them, um,and certainly we don't need to
purchase them.
We could maybe even do somereal salt is a great way to get
some of those electrolytes insome of our water.
But I think we talked aboutthis earlier, maybe before we
were talking.
Even some of my you know myreally super healthy yogis,
(23:59):
let's say.
You know they do hot yoga allthe time and they're the ones
who say I can't quench my thirst, right?
I know this is the time wheneverybody starts to drink or
everybody starts to move, andthat can quench my thirst.
Well, you know, you add one kindof either electrolytes or a
little bit of salt to some oftheir waters.
You don't need to do everysingle one, and it changes.
(24:22):
You know they're holding ontothat water better.
Or do a green smoothie a day,so it changes how you know how
they're holding, I believe, howthey're holding onto that water,
and you're not just drinkingbulk water and peeing out your
electrolytes.
Um, so I think that's thedifference.
That's my belief in why itworks better.
Um, and yeah, so, and the thingabout the Gatorade yeah,
(24:46):
there's just all these otheradditives that we don't need.
I wrote myself a note.
I'm going to make sure I sendyou a copy of quench, so thank
you, great yeah.
Everything you said we talkabout.
Yeah, you're going to.
You're going to enjoy it.
Speaker 1 (24:58):
Yeah, yeah, I use.
I use electrolytes all the timeand I've used many different
forms element from, but I don'tthink I've tried quench yet, so
yeah, I'm excited.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
No cure, oh cure.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
Okay, quench is the book.
Quench is the book.
Yeah, cured is the electrolyte.
Okay, so let's get into thisidea then.
So this is making a lot ofsense in terms of what we need
to do, and now let's kind oftalk about this new thing that
you've done.
We kind of got a little bit ofthe background, so walk us
(25:31):
through sort of the general ideahere for the person who's like.
You know, dr Dane, I've neverthought of using a blender in
this way, and so what's the waythat?
Are we doing this?
Like every meal?
Are we blending our meals?
Is this, like you know, onemorning smoothie?
Is this, you know, just theidea of like, including it
(25:52):
several times a week?
Walk us through what yourecommend.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
So you know, the big gist of the book is how to eat
more food, as mother natureintended.
That's it, you know.
So trying to get rid of ultraprocessed foods, trying to tip
the scales in more favor of realfoods versus UPFs.
Right now it's anywhere from 50to 65 percent of our diets
(26:19):
include ultra processed foodsand every single day there's
some new research that's comingout that's showing that's the
real cause of chronic disease.
Right, yeah, and so we need tostart.
You know we talk about cookingfor ourselves.
I think that's super important.
We do give even some recipes.
There's a lot of recipes.
There's 100 different recipesin the book, some recipes even
(26:42):
how to, how to roast a chicken.
We've lost the art of cooking.
You know how to, how to poach afish, how to roast a chicken,
how to grill a cauliflower steak.
You know and you know.
So, blending, and it's no, youdo not want to blend every
single meal.
We need to chew, we need to sitdown to a table, we need
(27:02):
community, we need to savor ourfood, smell our food.
This is not that.
However, you know, think aboutmaybe not your audience, but
maybe your audience's familymembers, who they're trying to
change their eating habits alittle bit.
What are they eating forbreakfast and how can that be
better?
(27:22):
You know?
So a smoothie for breakfast isa perfect, great way for to
start your day.
Nutrient density, like the, theamount of vegetables that you're
getting in there, um, and andreal food, and then and protein.
You can, you can either we wetry to always try to eat real
food, so we give ideas ondifferent ways of getting
(27:44):
protein in that shake hemp seeds, chia seeds, whatever that may
be, or or protein powder, whichis a good cheat, and then we
also give tons of recipes onsauces, and the whole impetus
for me writing the book is thisthere is a steak sauce that I
love.
There is this specific brand ofsteak sauce that I love, and
(28:07):
the reason I love it is becauseit has horseradish in it.
I love, love, I crave.
It has horseradish in it.
I love, love, I crave, lovehorseradish and, um, and for
some reason, I never wants it.
I never looked at the label,and one day I looked at the
label and I was like, oh my God,what am I doing?
You know, the only reason Ilove this is horseradish.
It's got four.
the first four ingredients arefour different kinds of sugar,
(28:28):
including high fructose cornsyrup, and I was like I can do
better than this and you know, Istarted with an organic ketchup
and horseradish and I was likeall right, this is better, it's
not bad, it was actually reallygood.
And then I had a friend who's achef helped me create this much
(28:54):
better steak sauce and it's inthe book and it's easy and it's
done in a blender.
So I was like that's, you know,and so you want to up level
your nutrition every step of theway, right?
So instead of store-bought evenlike you know the junky yogurts
and stuff, like you want to getreal yogurts and then you can,
you can, you can enhance them.
We have enhanced waters, youknow.
Enhanced um sauces, condimentsare a big one, right.
So there's tons of recipes andit just gives you ideas on if I
(29:16):
can get people to start thinkingabout reading the labels even
me, you know and this is why Isaid to you early on, I was like
, oh God, what kind of audienceam I talking to?
Are they going to all berolling their eyes at me?
Speaker 1 (29:27):
No, you're talking to an audience that's very
receptive.
They love this stuff.
Speaker 2 (29:31):
But we need to all hear it and we need to
constantly be reminded of it.
So how to up-level every stepof the way?
How to look at labels?
Look at them more often.
You know the usual suspectsshop the perimeter.
Get more real foods.
You can't cheat in a blender,because nobody's putting junk in
a blender.
(29:51):
It doesn't.
It's just it's weird.
You know, nobody does that.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
Yeah, I love this.
So this book really is.
It's not just where it mightlook like, it's just about
blending things up.
It's actually a complete itsounds like it's a complete
education on the basics thatwhat we need, with a very
powerful tool to make thishappen and it sounds like you're
saying level one would be juststart, because you know, when we
think about morning time, right, it's like this is probably the
(30:23):
time where most people aremessing up.
Right, I would say most peopleare messing up first thing in
the morning or last thing atnight, and I'll tell you
something that I've done evenbefore seeing your book.
It's always been a cheat for mewhen I'm at my best, and that is
, first thing in the morning, asmoothie with a little bit of
protein, and then last thing atnight, either before dinner or
(30:47):
after dinner.
Sometimes I do it both times toshut off my tending to overeat
habit at night.
I'm one of these people who canliterally I'll eat dinner and I
want an extra taste ofsomething, and what I have found
is that, as long as I getenough protein and fiber in that
meal, I am much better, and sowhat I will do I have found is
(31:10):
that I will usually do apre-protein shake smoothie
before dinner and thenoftentimes, if I can't shut the
hunger down, I'll do another one.
And so but it sounds likeyou're saying level one is, hey,
just get your nutrients in, youknow, in the morning.
This is a very quick way to doit.
(31:31):
And then I'm bringing up thisidea that you know in the
research those of you who arewondering this is the concept of
preloads and postloads.
So a preload would be, you know, something that you take right
before you eat, that takes theedge off and hopefully ideally
has less calories than what youwould eat to a meal and then
(31:51):
decreases the amount of caloriesthat you would eat at the next
meal to a degree to offset it oreven perhaps have much less of
it.
And so I love this idea.
From my perspective, I'vealways used these things as
convenience-oriented things andpreloads and postloads.
But it sounds like level onefor you is like hey, jay, just
start with a good, high quality,nutrient, dense, quick, blended
(32:16):
breakfast.
And what might that look like?
I'm imagining in my mind.
I'm imagining something green,something purple, like
blueberries or something likethat, maybe a little bit of
yogurt, maybe some proteinpowder.
I mean, I'm sure if you want toget Rocky Balboa style, you
could crack an egg in there.
I don't know, but it soundslike listening to you.
It's this idea of let's getsome fiber in there, let's get
(32:38):
some phytonutrients in there,let's get some electrolytes and
nutrient-dense stuff in there.
So I'm thinking about this ideaof essentially blueberries a
little bit.
You know things like that.
And what are we mixing thiswith?
Are we mixing it with water?
Is it almond milk?
Is it skim milk?
Like you know, some people theytend to think of oh, if I'm
going to make a smoothie, it'sgot to be milk, you know.
(32:58):
So walk us through what theideal shake might be in the
morning.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Yeah, so exactly what you said.
So blended greens is alwaysyour, your start.
Throw in whatever greens youhave there.
So greens and I typically dowater, but you can do any kind
of nut milk you can do.
You know, I'm trying to thinkwhat other milks you would want.
I don't particularly love milk,milk because I do think that as
(33:26):
we get older we we lose theenzymes to metabolize milk and
in my, in my career, I havefound more people are sensitive
to milk.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
You know dairy, but and adding water and a handful
of almonds is into this.
Thing is like your own almondmilk anyway, in a sense.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
Exactly, Exactly.
Or you can, you know, make yourown milk.
You know, nut milk M Y L K, oryou can make your own milk, nut
milk, M-Y-L-K, and then, yes, afruit for flavor.
Protein, either natural proteinCottage cheese is even a better
(34:05):
source of protein, but thedairy stuff is there or protein
powder, and there's.
I mean, you go online, there'sthousands of recipes.
We have hundreds of recipes inthe book, 100 recipes in the
book, but easy, you know, easyenough to do your breakfast.
I'm trying to think aboutforgetting anything.
Speaker 1 (34:20):
And let me actually ask you this, dana, because you
know, for me I hate to admitthis you know, being a health
care practitioner, but I do notlike vegetables, right, and I
imagine a lot of people don't.
And I think a lot of peoplewould think, oh my gosh, I'm
putting this green stuff in.
What is this going to tastelike?
But I'm sure you have ways ofhiding this, and there's plenty
(34:43):
of greens that you don'tnecessarily taste at all, trust
me, you all I know because I'vepracticed with this but what are
your favorite greens?
For those of us who are alittle bit averse to that swampy
green sort of flavor, sospinach has no flavor, you put
it in a smoothie.
Speaker 2 (35:02):
You're not going to taste it, I will tell you.
My co-author, colin Sapphire,said earlier he he hates
vegetables.
He doesn't eat salads.
He hates it.
He still hates it.
But every morning he has whathe calls green slime and he
holds his nose and slugs, sucksit down.
Um, and I have to tell you, Ican't even.
(35:22):
You know, and I like vegetablesand I was like oh I can't even
do that, but he's found whatworks for him, I promise people.
Like you know, we talk aboutmaking changing habits, changing
tastes.
Um, over time you will changetastes, but in the beginning you
can.
You know, we actually havethree levels of smoothies a
little more fruit forward in thebeginning to green slime at the
(35:44):
end, you know, and thenhopefully, over time, you can
work your way into some of that.
Um, things I mean think about.
I like to use this examplebecause it really spoke to me
too.
Think about when we were, youknow, you and I.
I grew up in the seventies andI think about when I was growing
up, we drank tab.
You know diet sodas, like allthese things you know and but.
(36:08):
But I remember as a kid makingthat switch from or or you know
from regular soda to tab you'relike this is disgusting, how
does anybody do that?
And now, if I were to drink aregular Coke, like that's
disgusting to me and syrupy andtoo sweet, you know, over time
are taken up.
Not that I think anybody shouldbe drinking soda, by the way,
(36:30):
you know.
I will say I will go to arestaurant every so often, have
a Diet Coke.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
You know, we all, we all pick our poisons when we
need them and myself too, by theway, every once in a while.
You know that can be nice andto your point, right.
Remember the first time most ofus had coffee or a beer or
something like that.
These weren't necessarilythings that we necessarily love
the first time we do develop ataste for this stuff.
(36:54):
So I like that.
You're essentially saying that.
And the healthier you eat, themore potent these taste buds get
and you pick up subtle flavorsthat you may not have known that
you liked.
And of course, I do think partof it too is that we don't let
ourselves oftentimes get hungryenough.
I can remember the first timeand I used to hate turkey
(37:15):
sandwiches, for example.
And I remember when I was young, my mom had me out chopping
wood all day and I hadn't eaten.
I came in and she had a turkeysandwich and I was like, and I
tasted it, I was like, oh my God, it's the best tasting thing
ever.
Right?
And now, from this day, I loveturkey sandwiches, but it's it's
this idea that our taste budsdefinitely do change.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
Yeah, I like that you mentioned we lost the feeling
of hunger.
We don't allow ourselves to behungry anymore.
We don't.
We're constantly feeding.
So I do think that that isimportant to overnight fast, no
eating in the middle of thenight.
I have very few rules, though Ido want to say in this book.
You know, we meet people wherethey are.
(37:55):
And I think you know number onewe have to stop beating
ourselves up first.
You know, stop judging others,but stop judging ourselves, most
importantly, and and and meetwhere you are.
Like you know, I do ask thatyou be a little adventurous and
try new things.
I think that that is superimportant.
(38:16):
So that's the one thing we doask in the book, like just be
adventurous.
If you don't like it, toss it.
You know, I've made you know.
This is why a blender is somuch fun.
You feel like a chef.
You're putting all these thingsin there.
Spices like, oh, I'm going totry this.
And often it's like whoa, whatdid I do?
Sometimes I do have to hold mynose and suck it down because I
(38:37):
don't want to waste it, but it'sfun and it's exciting and you
feel it's creative.
Speaker 1 (38:47):
It's also really creative and when you find that
formula, that recipe that works,it's like any other recipe that
works.
It becomes a staple in yourdiet and makes all of the
difference in your health.
So I love that you're sayingthat.
I also love you know, you and Iare in a lot of alignment on a
lot of things, but I'm the sameway as you where to me, I think,
(39:07):
sometimes I think one of themore toxic things we are doing
that no one talks about is whatwe are doing to ourselves in our
heads, this idea of constantlystressing out.
Sometimes I wonder what's moretoxic the things we're putting
in our mouth or the chronicstress about the things that
we're putting in our mouth?
(39:28):
It is turned into a huge sort ofthing here when you deal with
people and they're just at theirwits end, and that's why I'm so
grateful for work like this.
It comes from practitioners whoyou can tell, have seen
thousands and thousands ofpatients and know they need
solutions that work for everyone.
(39:49):
So I love this idea and I justdon't want you, the listener, to
miss what Dr Dana is saying.
She's essentially saying do notbeat yourself up.
There's not a whole lot ofrules in this book for that
reason that you're supposed totry to find and do what works
for you and to be just beexperimental and open, and this
(40:09):
tool can set you free in termsof what you are doing with your
nutrition.
Speaker 2 (40:16):
Yeah, up level wherever you can.
Try to get those you know.
Add those vegetables in atevery step.
Make those condiments have yourmorning smoothie.
Up level your nutritionwherever you can.
Don't beat yourself up.
(40:37):
You know, and I you know, havingworked for Dr Atkins early on
in my 28 years, I know thatdiets don't work and I can say
this.
My husband's given mepermission to say this.
He is somebody who the Atkinsdiet or the keto diet is the
only thing that's ever reallyworked for him, and when he goes
on it, he is so good on it.
He's so good, but his wholelife it's this.
And when he goes off.
He is off the rails because hedoesn't know how to eat.
He doesn't understand theMediterranean diet.
(41:00):
He doesn't think that fruitsare good for him because he's so
used to thinking any kind ofcarbs are bad for him, you know.
And he doesn't know how to eatin moderation because you know.
So it's um, diets don't work.
We have to learn how to eatreal food, um, and how to enjoy
our foods and not beat ourselvesup.
And, yes, stop putting toxicthings into our brains.
(41:20):
Um and and you know and live inthis world.
Yes, there are.
There are toxins, there aretoxic foods.
I'm there, is no way I'm nevergoing to have another piece of
birthday cake again from youknow and you know I, it's just
not going to happen, but ithappens less and less and and I
(41:43):
enjoy it less and less.
So maybe it will one, you know,honestly, it's not a great
example because I really don'tthink I enjoy it.
Speaker 1 (41:50):
Yeah, yeah, you know actually, I want to say
something about what I wouldcall.
You know, there's a.
You know I'm an entrepreneur,and in the tech world they have
this thing whenever you hiresomeone to do computer work for
you.
There's this thing called scopecreep that basically you do the
thing and then you keep addingthings on and it turns into a
bad habit.
I think we get you mentionedsomething I just want the
listener to pay attention towith your husband, and I think
(42:13):
there's scope creep.
That happens with a lot ofthese diets.
So, let's say, you go on anAtkins diet and all of a sudden,
you read all this stuff aboutor keto diet, or carnivore diet
or whatever it is, and you readall this stuff that you're not
supposed to have.
Let's say, and all of a sudden,in the case of the keto diet,
you're eating tons and tons offat, and so you get this sort of
(42:36):
halo effect around fat beinggood and everything else being
bad.
Now, of course, rarely can youstay on this diet, but what ends
up happening when you go backto your traditional diet?
There's some scope creep there.
So now, all of a sudden, you'reeating more fat than you
normally would otherwise, andthere is a strong argument to be
made that the major detrimentalfactor in the Western diet in
(42:59):
research on diets, especially onrats, they call this the
cafeteria diet, which is a dietthat is simultaneously rich in
fats, sugars, starch, salt andalcohol, and that this
combination of foods perhaps isthe big no-no.
And this goes right back to theultra processed foods, the UPS
(43:20):
that we talked about and that.
So what happens is this scopecreep of more fat when you go on
an all fat diet or more carbswhen you go on a vegan diet can
lead to this, and I actuallythink the better approach almost
always is a moderate approach.
However, moderation issomething that you have to learn
through experience, and that'sone of the things that we don't
(43:44):
talk enough about, so we don'thave to delve into that.
But maybe that's the next bookyou or I write.
These two authors right thatthis idea of what you know, the
new moderation diet, you knowthat really teaches people about
these combinations.
Speaker 2 (43:58):
But I'm going to just say I want to add one quick
thing about that, because we do,and we didn't even talk about
this beforehand.
We mentioned an area ofpsychology called harm reduction
psychotherapy, and the reasonbeing is it helped me 20
something years ago quit smoking.
So I just want to, just I wantto talk about that because and
(44:22):
this may or may not and please,if anybody has an alcohol or
drug addiction problem, get theright help, but we know that the
recidivism rate of completeabstinence is hugely high.
So there are instances wheremoderation in that field is
appropriate, and the same in thehealth field.
(44:45):
So we sort of relate it to foodand nutrition.
This harm reduction approachwhere, once again, you meet
people where they are completelove and compassion for yourself
, judging it, for thepractitioner to judge that
person too at moderation is a is, it is a huge.
(45:08):
You know it sounds so simpleand it's such a simple message
and and thing, but it really iswhere we need to go.
Um, so I'm so happy that youmentioned that because I think,
uh, yeah, we are unbelievablyaligned yeah, we are, we are
it's scary it's fun.
Speaker 1 (45:26):
It's fun when we get to.
You know, you don't know apractitioner.
You get together and you know,sometimes it's also fun to have
some, some differences where youcan really learn.
But yeah, it was so nice toconnect with you.
Why don't we uh let the uh anyfinal thoughts that you have to
wrap up and then let's make surethat everyone knows where to
get the book and where to findyou online no, I mean, I think I
(45:49):
think we covered everything.
Speaker 2 (45:51):
Hydration food is always the quickest way to to to
good health.
Always start there before yougo on any you know medications
or whatever.
Learn how to eat first, learnhow to, how to hydrate first and
simple.
Speaker 1 (46:06):
Yeah, and and the book.
Everybody is fueled up.
The and simple yeah, and thebook everybody is Fuel Up.
It's Harness the Power of yourBlender and Cheat your Way to
Good Health.
It comes out, I think, october8th.
It's going to be ready for you,so make sure you go and get
that book.
The book Quench came out in2021.
That's Dana's first book andyou can find Dana online.
(46:28):
Actually, me and her talk oninstagram a lot, so I know
you're there, dana, you're what.
What's your, your handle oninstagram for everybody?
it's dr dana cohencom dr danacohen yeah, dr dana cohen at dr
dana cohen um on instagram, andI just want to thank you so much
, thank you so much, uh, foryour work.
(46:49):
Do me a favor, hang on the line, just so I can make sure all
this gets uploaded.
But for all of you, thanks forhanging out on the show and we
will see you at the next episode.
Welcome to the show, everybody.
This is the Next Level Humanpodcast.
I'm your host, dr Jay Tita, andI'm here with a new friend of
mine, dr Dana Cohen MD.
She is an internist who's beendoing integrative functional
medicine since the late 90s and,as she and I have been talking,
just before we jumped on, wewere talking how we had both
(00:20):
been around for a while andreally had not run into each
other much until what was last.
I guess it was.
May maybe Dana like May,something like that March, april
, may in Chicago at the IF1, atthe, I guess, jeffrey Bland's
conference, yeah.
And so the reason I wanted tohave Dr Dana on for all of you
(00:44):
is because she has a brand newbook out called Fueled Up or
Fuel Up, right, fuel Up.
And this book is right inalignment with a lot of what we
talk about on this podcast, andthis is this idea that in the
health space, we can getinundated with information and
(01:05):
get very, very confused aboutwhat to eat.
It all becomes very complicated, and this is the kind of book I
love, because it really bringsyou back to basics and gives you
a very simple way to begin toapproach a nutrition.
Now I'm just going to frame upreal quick, dana, then I'm going
to let you take this away.
(01:25):
I just want to let everyoneknow, remind everyone on this
show, that, from my perspective,if you're going to be
successful, yes, cooking andprepping food and all these
kinds of things is veryimportant and probably what most
people are going to need to doat least some of that.
However, you're also going toneed to be at least some of that
.
However, you're also going toneed to be able to manage eating
(01:46):
out, eating processed foodsfrom time to time, reading
labels, figuring out what arethe things that you can do that
are going to be good for you.
So one of the ways I usuallyframe this up is I talk about
the s diet and it goes like thissoups, salads, scrambles,
shakes, smoothies, stir fries,skillet meals, sours.
(02:09):
These would be things likefermented foods and things like
that, spices, and then, ofcourse, some of your favorite
food.
Now in this list we have shakesand smoothies.
So these are things that comeout of a blender, which is a
very convenient way to approachnutrition.
(02:29):
I remember way back when I firstdiscovered Bruce Lee and my
love for Bruce Lee in terms ofhis philosophy and his teachings
.
He's one of the first people Ibelieve, at least some people,
give him credit for this idea ofblending up food.
He used to take chicken breast,broccoli and stick it in a
blender with some water andblend it up and carry it around
(02:51):
with him in the thermos and eatit for his meals, and so I
remember reading about this andthinking this guy probably
created the first, you know,protein shake smoothie.
But, dana, you're doingsomething incredibly interesting
and I always like to saypractitioners like you, who
probably seen a lot, a lot ofpeople.
You come up with thesesolutions because you know that
(03:15):
most people are way too busy toeat and prep wild caught salmon
and kale every single day.
They need simple solutions, andso I want you to just tell us a
little bit about your story,how you came up with this
concept, a little bit about thebook, and let's get into this
discussion.
I'm really excited to have youhere.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Thank you.
Thank you so much.
I have another S for you, which, by the way, I love that Sours
and shrubs.
Shrubs are vinegar-based drinksthat are becoming very popular
now.
Speaker 1 (03:49):
Shrubs.
That's the first time I'veheard that that's called a shrub
.
Very cool.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Yes.
So there you go.
So, yes, the book.
How did I come up with thisbook?
So my first book was onhydration Quench.
It was written about water,it's movement.
We really are the first peoplethat put together hydration and
(04:29):
fascia you know, so, and we talkabout Dr Pollack's work Fourth
Phase of Water in that book.
So that was my first book andthrough that book my co-author,
Colin Sapphire, who invented theNutribullet and then sold that
company, now has a gorgeous newblender called the Beast.
(04:50):
Check it out, it's incredible.
And he was really the personwho sort of and the Nutribullet
was really where the personalblender came in, meaning you can
take it off the thing and drinkit right from the cup and be on
the go with it.
That's really what theNutribullet did.
So now the Beast is thisbeautiful, much more powerful,
(05:12):
gorgeous personal blender.
So he had gotten in touch withme and for like a long time we
were figuring out how can wework together.
You know he has a hydrationelement of his Beast.
You know he has a hydrationelement of his beast and in our
talking I realized he's got aton of what I call colonisms.
You know he's a lay person,he's not a scientist, but he's
(05:33):
got great.
You know he struggled his wholelife.
He was a marathon runner buthated vegetables, didn't eat
well and it wasn't serving himand figured out.
Well, when he invented theNutribullet he figured out this
is how I need to do it I'm goingto sneak in these vegetables
somehow and it changed his life.
So, and he had all these littleterms that I loved I was like
(05:55):
Colin, we need to let's.
Why don't we write the book?
Why don't we, you know, come upwith the next book?
And basically, this is like thenext step of it, just all fits
in with quench and then, andthen where we're going from here
.
So, so that's what we did andthis is what we came up with.
And you know, the idea is how tocheat your way to good health
(06:16):
using a blender.
You know, it's that simple.
Um, the blender.
Something like 96 to 98% ofhouseholds have a blender, and
it's fun, it's easy, it's quickand it's really.
You know, I said to you earlier, you can't mess up.
Nobody puts cake or, you know,junk into their blender.
(06:40):
You're getting real whole food.
So the big message, the overallmessage, is how to get rid of
ultra, or how to limit ultraprocessed foods, how to get more
real whole food into your diet,and then whatever science we
can find to back that up we talkabout.
You know, 30 different plants aweek can really help your
microbiome.
How to do that, how to make iteasier, but, but you know, every
(07:03):
step of the way.
Number one do not beat yourselfup.
There is no diet, there is nodeprivation in this.
Just up level your health everystep of the way.
So it's not just smoothies andshakes, there's cocktails and
mocktails, there's, you know,dressings and sauces and soups
(07:26):
and desserts, and then weirdways that you can use your
blender breads and flatbreadsand stuff like that.
We even do have a chicken saladrecipe in there.
You know, I think it's pushingit a little bit, but you pulse
it and it's fine.
Yeah, so, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
Well, you talked about it as a cheat, and to me
it really is.
I've always said there's thecheat code for health and
fitness really is the blender,and so when I saw this I saw you
post on social, I think and Iwas like we really should cover
(08:01):
this on the podcast, because,from my perspective, it's like
what are the big movers?
You know, most people to me, I,you know, we have this idea of
one to five big things you cando.
Well, if you know how to useyour blender, it's going to
change the game for you in termsof your health and your fitness
.
Now, if you don't mind, I wantto as we get into this.
I want to because I'm just, youknow, just kind of selfish.
(08:24):
I want to learn a little bitfrom you about let's go back
Before we cover a little bitmore of the new book.
Let's go back to Quench alittle bit and talk about this
idea of hydration, and so thiswould be your first book, I
guess back in 2021, which is theprecursor to this, and so you
had mentioned that.
(08:44):
I want to kind of start thereand then go into the new book,
but walk us through just alittle bit about this idea
because I assume well, I'll justtell you my premise here Right,
one of the things that you hearabout is you hear a lot about
this fourth phase of water, thisso-called exclusion zone water
or, you know quote, structuredwater, and this idea that we can
(09:06):
just drink this out of a beaker, and my thought has always been
or out of a water bottle.
My thought has always been thatreally, where this water is, is
it's in biological substances.
So I've always thought, likeyou know, when I go down to
Costa Rica, I eat, all I do iseat fruit all day long and feel
fantastic and I wonder.
I've always wondered it'sreally just about?
(09:28):
Is it really just about megetting hydrated through this
food?
And so this is sort ofsomething I've been wondering
about.
I'm wondering can you educateus a little bit on this idea of
hydration hydration through food, perhaps?
And you know this idea of, youknow, exclusion zone water or
structured water, becauseobviously, university of
(09:49):
Washington and you know, andjust to also be clear it's a
(10:09):
hypothesis, it's not a proventhing, but it makes complete
sense to me.
Speaker 2 (10:16):
And you know, some scientists water researchers are
not on board, but most waterresearchers do believe that
there are other phases of water.
And now it's even coming outthat there's probably many other
phases of water, not just fourphases.
That was the whole impetus forme writing that book.
By the way, that's mind blowingto me.
We've always known that waterexists as three phases water,
(10:39):
ice and vapor, you know, andliquid ice and vapor.
And when, you know, when Istarted to hear about this, I
was like what are you talkingabout?
And so that was mind blowing tome.
And then, when you start tolook at it, and basically the
idea is how H2O, the simplestmolecule in the world, yet the
most complex, when I got intowriting this book, I was like,
(11:03):
oh my God, what did I get myselfinto?
I'm not a researcher.
This is way beyond, but we do agood job of simplifying it.
And it's the idea of how theseH2O molecules layer upon each
other or structure, right, andit's in that layering that they
start to share electrons andthen, and then the charges
change a little bit, right?
(11:24):
And so it's believed that it'sin that form of water, this
fourth phase of water, and DrPollack believes it's H3O2.
So it's not really H3O2.
It's just in that layering thatthey start to share electrons,
that it changes a little bit,and it's in that phase that's
believed to exist withinourselves and that it exists in
(11:46):
nature, right?
So the byline to our book iseight glasses a day is not the
way, yeah, right.
So first of all, how can youknow a five foot sedentary
person who never sweats haveeight glasses and a six foot two
athlete who's sweating?
You know, it doesn't make anysense, and I'm here to say that
(12:08):
it's different for every person.
What you know, what theiroptimal hydration level is.
We don't have a perfect way ofmeasuring it.
I do have something that I willgive to your people listening
the best way to know if you arewell hydrated is to look at your
urine output, right?
So we are meant to be urinatingevery two or three hours while
(12:31):
we're awake, and I have peopledo hashtags.
You know, I've been known.
I'll sit at my desk for eighthours straight, not get up once
to pee and I'm like what am Idoing?
I know better than that, youknow.
And the truth is it is the onething that I'm a real stickler
on.
Day in, day out, hour by hour,we need to stay on top of our
hydration.
Okay so, because hydration isthe single most important thing
(12:55):
you can do to treat and preventchronic disease, hands down,
before you start any supplementregimen, diet regimen, whatever
it may be, always start withhydration.
Learn how to hydrate first, andthat means drinking some water.
That means eating your water, Ibelieve a smoothie is.
You know, one green smoothie isequivalent to two or three
(13:19):
glasses of the same amount ofbulk water.
You know in the way that ithydrates your cells because
we're holding on to it better.
There's fiber in there, there'sminerals in there, there's
electrolytes in there.
These all these things thathelp maybe structure the water
or just hold on to the water orget into the cell better.
We don't know for sure, but Ido know, know that in my 30
(13:41):
years of doing this, 28 years ofdoing this, that when even my
athletes, when they come in andsay I can't quench my thirst, no
matter what I do, they change afew things add a smoothie a day
, add some electrolytes, getsome sunshine, start to ground.
These are all things that arehydrating.
(14:03):
Move differently, and when Isay move, it's not necessarily
exercise.
I'm not an exercise specialist,although I was an exercise
physiology major, but I lost allthat information.
But movement we talk aboutmicro movements in the book.
It's a lot of information in afew minutes, sorry.
Speaker 1 (14:22):
Yeah, no, it's perfect.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
Good.
So movement is a hydrating actand it's my belief that you know
why sitting is the new smokingbecause we're squelching
delivery of hydration to ourperiphery Right.
So we talk about this thingcalled micro movements, and
basically we made them up.
It's you know.
(14:45):
This is a micro movement,meaning, you know, shrugging
your shoulders, turning yourhead, moving all your joints.
You know, from ananthropological view, we have
something like we're born withI'm going to mess up the numbers
Three hundred differentmovements when we're, when we're
infants, and as we get older,we only use 30 or 40 of them.
Speaker 1 (15:07):
Yeah, isn't that crazy.
Speaker 2 (15:09):
Yeah, so we need to, like you know, move everything
that you can think of Start inthe morning, start from your
toes and twist and turn and doall this stuff and then,
throughout the day, do somemovements, and I think I touched
everything.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
Yeah, and actually I'm sure you're familiar with
Herman Ponser's work.
He's kind of who I regard asprobably the premier expert in
metabolism in the world rightnow.
He's out of Duke University.
He did a study on thehunter-gatherers and looking at
the different movement patternsthat they use.
This is not for Dana, but it'sfor all you listeners.
I'm sure you know this, dana,but one of the things he found
(15:46):
that was really interesting,that the major difference was
these hunter-gatherers walkabout as much as us, a little
bit more, but they're not likedoing tens of thousands of steps
more than we are per day.
The major place where they aredifferent than us is in the way
they rest.
They have active restingpositions where they're kneeling
(16:08):
, they're standing in particularways.
They don't have chairs andthese micro movements that
you're calling them are going onall the time.
Anyone who's ever gone into aprimitive man deep squat and had
to support their body know thattheir body's sort of moving
like this constantly.
And this is what they foundwere one of the major
differences between us and ourhunter-gatherer ancestors as it
(16:32):
pertains to movement.
They don't necessarily do a tonmore movement than us.
They do do more, but it's notlike a ton a ton, but the way
they rest with these sort ofmicro contractions in the
muscles is very different thanus, and so it just reminded me
of that when you were sort ofbringing that up, and I love the
(16:53):
way you're talking about it andI want to sort of get your take
on this too, because isn't itinteresting?
And maybe as an internistyou're a little different than
me, so maybe you're going tocorrect me on this.
But one of the things that Ihave always found bizarre in the
field of medicine is that wedon't have great ways to even
measure hydration, even still inindividuals In terms of lab
(17:17):
values, in terms of other things.
There is no great way to measurehow hydrated someone is in
general.
And number two, basically on anindividual level, and I find
this absolutely mind blowingthat that is still the case when
it is probably arguably and youseem to agree with me, or I
(17:38):
agree with you probably one ofthe most important things we can
do as humans.
Yet medicine has no real way ofevaluating hydration on an
individual level in terms ofcellular hydration, sort of real
hydration, and so, other thansigns and symptoms and blood
volume, right, it's like, whatelse do we look at?
(17:59):
There are a few measures kidney, you know, anion gap, chloride,
sodium, all these things thatyou can infer but there's not a
really good way in my mind tomeasure this and I'm wondering.
You're nodding your head, so itseems like you're in agreement
with this, but I was wonderingmaybe you have a secret that I
don't know about, given your,but isn't that crazy that that's
(18:20):
the case?
Speaker 2 (18:21):
Yeah, yeah, no, we definitely don't, and we talk a
lot about that.
That's why I said the firstthing.
I said the best way is tomeasure.
Look at your urine output andmake sure that you're peeing.
Even the color of your urine isnot, is not perfect.
It's not a great test.
I mean, you know, if you takethe B vitamin, then all uh, yeah
(18:48):
, it's not a great test, it'sokay.
Um, you know and I want to justsay something on that note too,
when we look at our urine, we'vea lot of people have been told
like we want crystal clear urineat the end of the day, then you
know you're hydrated enough.
Um, I'm not sure I I agree withthat.
I think there's, um, I see,almost on a weekly basis I
(19:09):
definitely on a weekly basis, ifnot more than a few times a
week where patients areoverhydrating and their sodium
is low and their chloride is lowNot enough to be detrimental,
but enough to give them.
Like when I asked them are yougetting cramps?
Are you getting?
Are you fatigued?
Yeah, because some of the samesymptoms of overhydration is
(19:31):
with underhydration.
I also want to differentiatebetween low-grade, subclinical
dehydration versus overtdehydration.
We know what overt dehydrationis.
That's easily measured.
You need to go to the emergencyroom.
Your eyes are rolling back inyour head because you've been
vomiting or whatever, diarrheaall day long Different.
(19:53):
It's this low grade, subclinicaldehydration that affects all of
us that we need to stay on topof every single day, because
that's the stuff that that leadsto chronic disease, diabetes,
alzheimer's, certain cancers.
You know that is a risk factorfor those things.
Speaker 1 (20:13):
Yeah, and just so everyone understands I think
most people know this, but maybeyou want to say something about
this as well your sense ofthirst is not a good indication
of how much water you drink.
So what we're hearing from youis that okay?
Yeah, maybe urine volume, youknow, peeing every two to three
hours, maybe some degree oflooking at urine color, but you
(20:37):
certainly don't want that tooclear, you know, because you're
losing minerals and all thatkind of stuff.
You know there's other testsyou can do, like the pinch test
of the hand and how fast theskin bounces back and stuff like
that.
And, of course, acutelyspeaking, we know what overt
dehydration looks like.
That's a medical emergency, butthere's no real way to
adequately look at our hydrationfrom an optimal standpoint in
(21:02):
the current way we look at it,and so it's really interesting
to hear you also say that,having written a book on this,
and so let me ask you about this, dana.
So you mentioned, and is thereanything else you want to say
about this idea of what happenswhen we are getting our
hydration through food?
(21:23):
We can go back to some of thestuff like with Gatorade which I
know that's like a sin to evenmention Gatorade for us
functional medicinepractitioners, because of you
know some of the stuff that youknow the brominated, you know
vegetable oils and all thethings that some of these things
can have.
However, that original researchdoes indeed show that when you
(21:43):
have glucose along withelectrolytes, along with water,
you are going to get betterhydration, and I'm wondering if
you have any other informationon this in terms of getting your
hydration through foods andthrough fruits and these kinds
of things and through vegetables.
I mean, when you think aboutfruits and vegetables, one of
(22:05):
the interesting things aboutthese things, we tend to think
of them as very nutrient-densefoods and we tend to think of
them as sort of low-carbohydrate, and we tend to think of them
as very nutrient-dense foods andwe tend to think of them as
sort of low-carbohydrate and wetend to think of their calories.
What we don't often think of isthat they're loaded with water.
This is why they crunch when webite into them.
These things are loaded withwater.
So one of the things I'vealways often thought is this
(22:26):
idea of dry foods versus sort ofthese wet vegetables and fruits
.
And of course, this discussionwill bring us into your new book
, because now it seems to me,and I don't know if I'm jumping
the gun here, but it seems to mewe can engineer this water
based food delivery system whenwe are using a blender when we
(22:50):
are using a blender.
Speaker 2 (22:52):
Yes, so, first of all , cauliflower is dry, but it's
something like 90, I may bemessing up the number 96% water.
So vegetables naturally containa lot of water and hydration.
They also contain fiber andminerals.
So those things alone.
Minerals are electrolytes.
The fiber is going to hold onto that water like a sponge help
(23:15):
you hold on to it better.
The electrolytes help you pushit into the cell.
Going back to the, you know, theGatorades and those kind of
things, yeah, there is, I'm onthe board of an electrolyte
company, c know, but there is.
You know, there is goodresearch that we, you know, some
of those electrolyte drinks.
(23:37):
Not everybody needs them, um,and certainly we don't need to
purchase them.
We could maybe even do somereal salt is a great way to get
some of those electrolytes insome of our water.
But I think we talked aboutthis earlier, maybe before we
were talking.
Even some of my you know myreally super healthy yogis,
(23:59):
let's say.
You know they do hot yoga allthe time and they're the ones
who say I can't quench my thirst, right?
I know this is the time wheneverybody starts to drink or
everybody starts to move, andthat can quench my thirst.
Well, you know, you add one kindof either electrolytes or a
little bit of salt to some oftheir waters.
You don't need to do everysingle one, and it changes.
(24:22):
You know they're holding ontothat water better.
Or do a green smoothie a day,so it changes how you know how
they're holding, I believe, howthey're holding onto that water,
and you're not just drinkingbulk water and peeing out your
electrolytes.
Um, so I think that's thedifference.
That's my belief in why itworks better.
Um, and yeah, so, and the thingabout the Gatorade yeah,
(24:46):
there's just all these otheradditives that we don't need.
I wrote myself a note.
I'm going to make sure I sendyou a copy of quench, so thank
you, great yeah.
Everything you said we talkabout.
Yeah, you're going to.
You're going to enjoy it.
Speaker 1 (24:58):
Yeah, yeah, I use.
I use electrolytes all the timeand I've used many different
forms element from, but I don'tthink I've tried quench yet, so
yeah, I'm excited.
Speaker 2 (25:09):
No cure, oh cure.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
Okay, quench is the book.
Quench is the book.
Yeah, cured is the electrolyte.
Okay, so let's get into thisidea then.
So this is making a lot ofsense in terms of what we need
to do, and now let's kind oftalk about this new thing that
you've done.
We kind of got a little bit ofthe background, so walk us
(25:31):
through sort of the general ideahere for the person who's like.
You know, dr Dane, I've neverthought of using a blender in
this way, and so what's the waythat?
Are we doing this?
Like every meal?
Are we blending our meals?
Is this, like you know, onemorning smoothie?
Is this, you know, just theidea of like, including it
(25:52):
several times a week?
Walk us through what yourecommend.
Speaker 2 (25:57):
So you know, the big gist of the book is how to eat
more food, as mother natureintended.
That's it, you know.
So trying to get rid of ultraprocessed foods, trying to tip
the scales in more favor of realfoods versus UPFs.
Right now it's anywhere from 50to 65 percent of our diets
(26:19):
include ultra processed foodsand every single day there's
some new research that's comingout that's showing that's the
real cause of chronic disease.
Right, yeah, and so we need tostart.
You know we talk about cookingfor ourselves.
I think that's super important.
We do give even some recipes.
There's a lot of recipes.
There's 100 different recipesin the book, some recipes even
(26:42):
how to, how to roast a chicken.
We've lost the art of cooking.
You know how to, how to poach afish, how to roast a chicken,
how to grill a cauliflower steak.
You know and you know.
So, blending, and it's no, youdo not want to blend every
single meal.
We need to chew, we need to sitdown to a table, we need
(27:02):
community, we need to savor ourfood, smell our food.
This is not that.
However, you know, think aboutmaybe not your audience, but
maybe your audience's familymembers, who they're trying to
change their eating habits alittle bit.
What are they eating forbreakfast and how can that be
better?
(27:22):
You know?
So a smoothie for breakfast isa perfect, great way for to
start your day.
Nutrient density, like the, theamount of vegetables that you're
getting in there, um, and andreal food, and then and protein.
You can, you can either we wetry to always try to eat real
food, so we give ideas ondifferent ways of getting
(27:44):
protein in that shake hemp seeds, chia seeds, whatever that may
be, or or protein powder, whichis a good cheat, and then we
also give tons of recipes onsauces, and the whole impetus
for me writing the book is thisthere is a steak sauce that I
love.
There is this specific brand ofsteak sauce that I love, and
(28:07):
the reason I love it is becauseit has horseradish in it.
I love, love, I crave.
It has horseradish in it.
I love, love, I crave, lovehorseradish and, um, and for
some reason, I never wants it.
I never looked at the label,and one day I looked at the
label and I was like, oh my God,what am I doing?
You know, the only reason Ilove this is horseradish.
It's got four.
the first four ingredients arefour different kinds of sugar,
(28:28):
including high fructose cornsyrup, and I was like I can do
better than this and you know, Istarted with an organic ketchup
and horseradish and I was likeall right, this is better, it's
not bad, it was actually reallygood.
And then I had a friend who's achef helped me create this much
(28:54):
better steak sauce and it's inthe book and it's easy and it's
done in a blender.
So I was like that's, you know,and so you want to up level
your nutrition every step of theway, right?
So instead of store-bought evenlike you know the junky yogurts
and stuff, like you want to getreal yogurts and then you can,
you can, you can enhance them.
We have enhanced waters, youknow.
Enhanced um sauces, condimentsare a big one, right.
So there's tons of recipes andit just gives you ideas on if I
(29:16):
can get people to start thinkingabout reading the labels even
me, you know and this is why Isaid to you early on, I was like
, oh God, what kind of audienceam I talking to?
Are they going to all berolling their eyes at me?
Speaker 1 (29:27):
No, you're talking to an audience that's very
receptive.
They love this stuff.
Speaker 2 (29:31):
But we need to all hear it and we need to
constantly be reminded of it.
So how to up-level every stepof the way?
How to look at labels?
Look at them more often.
You know the usual suspectsshop the perimeter.
Get more real foods.
You can't cheat in a blender,because nobody's putting junk in
a blender.
(29:51):
It doesn't.
It's just it's weird.
You know, nobody does that.
Speaker 1 (30:02):
Yeah, I love this.
So this book really is.
It's not just where it mightlook like, it's just about
blending things up.
It's actually a complete itsounds like it's a complete
education on the basics thatwhat we need, with a very
powerful tool to make thishappen and it sounds like you're
saying level one would be juststart, because you know, when we
think about morning time, right, it's like this is probably the
(30:23):
time where most people aremessing up.
Right, I would say most peopleare messing up first thing in
the morning or last thing atnight, and I'll tell you
something that I've done evenbefore seeing your book.
It's always been a cheat for mewhen I'm at my best, and that is
, first thing in the morning, asmoothie with a little bit of
protein, and then last thing atnight, either before dinner or
(30:47):
after dinner.
Sometimes I do it both times toshut off my tending to overeat
habit at night.
I'm one of these people who canliterally I'll eat dinner and I
want an extra taste ofsomething, and what I have found
is that, as long as I getenough protein and fiber in that
meal, I am much better, and sowhat I will do I have found is
(31:10):
that I will usually do apre-protein shake smoothie
before dinner and thenoftentimes, if I can't shut the
hunger down, I'll do another one.
And so but it sounds likeyou're saying level one is, hey,
just get your nutrients in, youknow, in the morning.
This is a very quick way to doit.
(31:31):
And then I'm bringing up thisidea that you know in the
research those of you who arewondering this is the concept of
preloads and postloads.
So a preload would be, you know, something that you take right
before you eat, that takes theedge off and hopefully ideally
has less calories than what youwould eat to a meal and then
(31:51):
decreases the amount of caloriesthat you would eat at the next
meal to a degree to offset it oreven perhaps have much less of
it.
And so I love this idea.
From my perspective, I'vealways used these things as
convenience-oriented things andpreloads and postloads.
But it sounds like level onefor you is like hey, jay, just
start with a good, high quality,nutrient, dense, quick, blended
(32:16):
breakfast.
And what might that look like?
I'm imagining in my mind.
I'm imagining something green,something purple, like
blueberries or something likethat, maybe a little bit of
yogurt, maybe some proteinpowder.
I mean, I'm sure if you want toget Rocky Balboa style, you
could crack an egg in there.
I don't know, but it soundslike listening to you.
It's this idea of let's getsome fiber in there, let's get
(32:38):
some phytonutrients in there,let's get some electrolytes and
nutrient-dense stuff in there.
So I'm thinking about this ideaof essentially blueberries a
little bit.
You know things like that.
And what are we mixing thiswith?
Are we mixing it with water?
Is it almond milk?
Is it skim milk?
Like you know, some people theytend to think of oh, if I'm
going to make a smoothie, it'sgot to be milk, you know.
(32:58):
So walk us through what theideal shake might be in the
morning.
Speaker 2 (33:03):
Yeah, so exactly what you said.
So blended greens is alwaysyour, your start.
Throw in whatever greens youhave there.
So greens and I typically dowater, but you can do any kind
of nut milk you can do.
You know, I'm trying to thinkwhat other milks you would want.
I don't particularly love milk,milk because I do think that as
(33:26):
we get older we we lose theenzymes to metabolize milk and
in my, in my career, I havefound more people are sensitive
to milk.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
You know dairy, but and adding water and a handful
of almonds is into this.
Thing is like your own almondmilk anyway, in a sense.
Speaker 2 (33:43):
Exactly, Exactly.
Or you can, you know, make yourown milk.
You know, nut milk M Y L K, oryou can make your own milk, nut
milk, M-Y-L-K, and then, yes, afruit for flavor.
Protein, either natural proteinCottage cheese is even a better
(34:05):
source of protein, but thedairy stuff is there or protein
powder, and there's.
I mean, you go online, there'sthousands of recipes.
We have hundreds of recipes inthe book, 100 recipes in the
book, but easy, you know, easyenough to do your breakfast.
I'm trying to think aboutforgetting anything.
Speaker 1 (34:20):
And let me actually ask you this, dana, because you
know, for me I hate to admitthis you know, being a health
care practitioner, but I do notlike vegetables, right, and I
imagine a lot of people don't.
And I think a lot of peoplewould think, oh my gosh, I'm
putting this green stuff in.
What is this going to tastelike?
But I'm sure you have ways ofhiding this, and there's plenty
(34:43):
of greens that you don'tnecessarily taste at all, trust
me, you all I know because I'vepracticed with this but what are
your favorite greens?
For those of us who are alittle bit averse to that swampy
green sort of flavor, sospinach has no flavor, you put
it in a smoothie.
Speaker 2 (35:02):
You're not going to taste it, I will tell you.
My co-author, colin Sapphire,said earlier he he hates
vegetables.
He doesn't eat salads.
He hates it.
He still hates it.
But every morning he has whathe calls green slime and he
holds his nose and slugs, sucksit down.
Um, and I have to tell you, Ican't even.
(35:22):
You know, and I like vegetablesand I was like oh I can't even
do that, but he's found whatworks for him, I promise people.
Like you know, we talk aboutmaking changing habits, changing
tastes.
Um, over time you will changetastes, but in the beginning you
can.
You know, we actually havethree levels of smoothies a
little more fruit forward in thebeginning to green slime at the
(35:44):
end, you know, and thenhopefully, over time, you can
work your way into some of that.
Um, things I mean think about.
I like to use this examplebecause it really spoke to me
too.
Think about when we were, youknow, you and I.
I grew up in the seventies andI think about when I was growing
up, we drank tab.
You know diet sodas, like allthese things you know and but.
(36:08):
But I remember as a kid makingthat switch from or or you know
from regular soda to tab you'relike this is disgusting, how
does anybody do that?
And now, if I were to drink aregular Coke, like that's
disgusting to me and syrupy andtoo sweet, you know, over time
are taken up.
Not that I think anybody shouldbe drinking soda, by the way,
(36:30):
you know.
I will say I will go to arestaurant every so often, have
a Diet Coke.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
You know, we all, we all pick our poisons when we
need them and myself too, by theway, every once in a while.
You know that can be nice andto your point, right.
Remember the first time most ofus had coffee or a beer or
something like that.
These weren't necessarilythings that we necessarily love
the first time we do develop ataste for this stuff.
(36:54):
So I like that.
You're essentially saying that.
And the healthier you eat, themore potent these taste buds get
and you pick up subtle flavorsthat you may not have known that
you liked.
And of course, I do think partof it too is that we don't let
ourselves oftentimes get hungryenough.
I can remember the first timeand I used to hate turkey
(37:15):
sandwiches, for example.
And I remember when I was young, my mom had me out chopping
wood all day and I hadn't eaten.
I came in and she had a turkeysandwich and I was like, and I
tasted it, I was like, oh my God, it's the best tasting thing
ever.
Right?
And now, from this day, I loveturkey sandwiches, but it's it's
this idea that our taste budsdefinitely do change.
Speaker 2 (37:34):
Yeah, I like that you mentioned we lost the feeling
of hunger.
We don't allow ourselves to behungry anymore.
We don't.
We're constantly feeding.
So I do think that that isimportant to overnight fast, no
eating in the middle of thenight.
I have very few rules, though Ido want to say in this book.
You know, we meet people wherethey are.
(37:55):
And I think you know number onewe have to stop beating
ourselves up first.
You know, stop judging others,but stop judging ourselves, most
importantly, and and and meetwhere you are.
Like you know, I do ask thatyou be a little adventurous and
try new things.
I think that that is superimportant.
(38:16):
So that's the one thing we doask in the book, like just be
adventurous.
If you don't like it, toss it.
You know, I've made you know.
This is why a blender is somuch fun.
You feel like a chef.
You're putting all these thingsin there.
Spices like, oh, I'm going totry this.
And often it's like whoa, whatdid I do?
Sometimes I do have to hold mynose and suck it down because I
(38:37):
don't want to waste it, but it'sfun and it's exciting and you
feel it's creative.
Speaker 1 (38:47):
It's also really creative and when you find that
formula, that recipe that works,it's like any other recipe that
works.
It becomes a staple in yourdiet and makes all of the
difference in your health.
So I love that you're sayingthat.
I also love you know, you and Iare in a lot of alignment on a
lot of things, but I'm the sameway as you where to me, I think,
(39:07):
sometimes I think one of themore toxic things we are doing
that no one talks about is whatwe are doing to ourselves in our
heads, this idea of constantlystressing out.
Sometimes I wonder what's moretoxic the things we're putting
in our mouth or the chronicstress about the things that
we're putting in our mouth?
(39:28):
It is turned into a huge sort ofthing here when you deal with
people and they're just at theirwits end, and that's why I'm so
grateful for work like this.
It comes from practitioners whoyou can tell, have seen
thousands and thousands ofpatients and know they need
solutions that work for everyone.
(39:49):
So I love this idea and I justdon't want you, the listener, to
miss what Dr Dana is saying.
She's essentially saying do notbeat yourself up.
There's not a whole lot ofrules in this book for that
reason that you're supposed totry to find and do what works
for you and to be just beexperimental and open, and this
(40:09):
tool can set you free in termsof what you are doing with your
nutrition.
Speaker 2 (40:16):
Yeah, up level wherever you can.
Try to get those you know.
Add those vegetables in atevery step.
Make those condiments have yourmorning smoothie.
Up level your nutritionwherever you can.
Don't beat yourself up.
(40:37):
You know, and I you know, havingworked for Dr Atkins early on
in my 28 years, I know thatdiets don't work and I can say
this.
My husband's given mepermission to say this.
He is somebody who the Atkinsdiet or the keto diet is the
only thing that's ever reallyworked for him, and when he goes
on it, he is so good on it.
He's so good, but his wholelife it's this.
And when he goes off.
He is off the rails because hedoesn't know how to eat.
He doesn't understand theMediterranean diet.
(41:00):
He doesn't think that fruitsare good for him because he's so
used to thinking any kind ofcarbs are bad for him, you know.
And he doesn't know how to eatin moderation because you know.
So it's um, diets don't work.
We have to learn how to eatreal food, um, and how to enjoy
our foods and not beat ourselvesup.
And, yes, stop putting toxicthings into our brains.
(41:20):
Um and and you know and live inthis world.
Yes, there are.
There are toxins, there aretoxic foods.
I'm there, is no way I'm nevergoing to have another piece of
birthday cake again from youknow and you know I, it's just
not going to happen, but ithappens less and less and and I
(41:43):
enjoy it less and less.
So maybe it will one, you know,honestly, it's not a great
example because I really don'tthink I enjoy it.
Speaker 1 (41:50):
Yeah, yeah, you know actually, I want to say
something about what I wouldcall.
You know, there's a.
You know I'm an entrepreneur,and in the tech world they have
this thing whenever you hiresomeone to do computer work for
you.
There's this thing called scopecreep that basically you do the
thing and then you keep addingthings on and it turns into a
bad habit.
I think we get you mentionedsomething I just want the
listener to pay attention towith your husband, and I think
(42:13):
there's scope creep.
That happens with a lot ofthese diets.
So, let's say, you go on anAtkins diet and all of a sudden,
you read all this stuff aboutor keto diet, or carnivore diet
or whatever it is, and you readall this stuff that you're not
supposed to have.
Let's say, and all of a sudden,in the case of the keto diet,
you're eating tons and tons offat, and so you get this sort of
(42:36):
halo effect around fat beinggood and everything else being
bad.
Now, of course, rarely can youstay on this diet, but what ends
up happening when you go backto your traditional diet?
There's some scope creep there.
So now, all of a sudden, you'reeating more fat than you
normally would otherwise, andthere is a strong argument to be
made that the major detrimentalfactor in the Western diet in
(42:59):
research on diets, especially onrats, they call this the
cafeteria diet, which is a dietthat is simultaneously rich in
fats, sugars, starch, salt andalcohol, and that this
combination of foods perhaps isthe big no-no.
And this goes right back to theultra processed foods, the UPS
(43:20):
that we talked about and that.
So what happens is this scopecreep of more fat when you go on
an all fat diet or more carbswhen you go on a vegan diet can
lead to this, and I actuallythink the better approach almost
always is a moderate approach.
However, moderation issomething that you have to learn
through experience, and that'sone of the things that we don't
(43:44):
talk enough about, so we don'thave to delve into that.
But maybe that's the next bookyou or I write.
These two authors right thatthis idea of what you know, the
new moderation diet, you knowthat really teaches people about
these combinations.
Speaker 2 (43:58):
But I'm going to just say I want to add one quick
thing about that, because we do,and we didn't even talk about
this beforehand.
We mentioned an area ofpsychology called harm reduction
psychotherapy, and the reasonbeing is it helped me 20
something years ago quit smoking.
So I just want to, just I wantto talk about that because and
(44:22):
this may or may not and please,if anybody has an alcohol or
drug addiction problem, get theright help, but we know that the
recidivism rate of completeabstinence is hugely high.
So there are instances wheremoderation in that field is
appropriate, and the same in thehealth field.
(44:45):
So we sort of relate it to foodand nutrition.
This harm reduction approachwhere, once again, you meet
people where they are completelove and compassion for yourself
, judging it, for thepractitioner to judge that
person too at moderation is a is, it is a huge.
(45:08):
You know it sounds so simpleand it's such a simple message
and and thing, but it really iswhere we need to go.
Um, so I'm so happy that youmentioned that because I think,
uh, yeah, we are unbelievablyaligned yeah, we are, we are
it's scary it's fun.
Speaker 1 (45:26):
It's fun when we get to.
You know, you don't know apractitioner.
You get together and you know,sometimes it's also fun to have
some, some differences where youcan really learn.
But yeah, it was so nice toconnect with you.
Why don't we uh let the uh anyfinal thoughts that you have to
wrap up and then let's make surethat everyone knows where to
get the book and where to findyou online no, I mean, I think I
(45:49):
think we covered everything.
Speaker 2 (45:51):
Hydration food is always the quickest way to to to
good health.
Always start there before yougo on any you know medications
or whatever.
Learn how to eat first, learnhow to, how to hydrate first and
simple.
Speaker 1 (46:06):
Yeah, and and the book.
Everybody is fueled up.
The and simple yeah, and thebook everybody is Fuel Up.
It's Harness the Power of yourBlender and Cheat your Way to
Good Health.
It comes out, I think, october8th.
It's going to be ready for you,so make sure you go and get
that book.
The book Quench came out in2021.
That's Dana's first book andyou can find Dana online.
(46:28):
Actually, me and her talk oninstagram a lot, so I know
you're there, dana, you're what.
What's your, your handle oninstagram for everybody?
it's dr dana cohencom dr danacohen yeah, dr dana cohen at dr
dana cohen um on instagram, andI just want to thank you so much
, thank you so much, uh, foryour work.
(46:49):
Do me a favor, hang on the line, just so I can make sure all
this gets uploaded.
But for all of you, thanks forhanging out on the show and we
will see you at the next episode.
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