October 29, 2023 • 32 mins
Strap yourself in for an incredible journey as we sit down with Sam White, founder of Stella Insurance, a trailblazing financial services venture that champions women. This episode is sure to leave you inspired as Sam takes us through her journey, filled with bumps, twists, and turns, yet undeniably worth the ride, reminding us that the success story is not without its share of setbacks.
Hear firsthand from Sam as she recounts her thrilling move to Australia and the birth of Stella Insurance. Dive deep into Sam's leadership growth and her fearless approach to taking risk. This is not just another success story - it's a testament to resilience, growth, and the sheer determination required to achieve greatness. Expect to be moved, empowered, and inspired to step out of your comfort zone and dare to dream. Then this episode is a must-listen!
Listen to Learn:
🎙️How to embrace your mistakes as opportunities
🎙️How to nurture resilience through challenging times
🎙️The power of having a united team
🎙️How to unlock the potential of women in entrepreneurship
Listen here: https://www.buzzsprout.com/1981646
#NPWPodcast #ListenNow #Podcast #WeArePower
Find out more about We Are PoWEr here. 💫
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:19):
The Northern Power Women podcast For your career
and your life, no matter whatbusiness you're in.
Hello, hello and welcome to theNorthern Power Women podcast,
where every week, I get thechance to speak with absolutely
amazing individuals, as wespotlight the work that they do
and those individuals usingtheir power for good in the aim
of reaching a more equal,diverse and inclusive world.
(00:42):
And this week I get to speak tothe wonderful Sam White.
Sam White is the founder ofStellar Insurance, which is a
female centric financialservices business that is I love
this unapologetically led bywomen and designed for women.
Sam is a serial entrepreneur.
She is passionate aboutequality innovation.
(01:02):
She is a trailblazer, she iskickass, she's a fabulous friend
of mine and I'm delighted tochat with Sam today.
Welcome to the pod.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Hey, lovely.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
I've missed you.
I have missed you.
Do you remember our chats overlockdown?
We just jumped on her on a Zoomcall and record it and put it
out to the world, couldn't we?
Because we were just sort ofkeeping ourselves sane, weren't
we?
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Or insane, I'm not quite sure I was going to say
it's probably a straight sayingwith us to keeping ourselves
sane.
No, they were a real lifeline,I think, for both of us and you
know I say this all the time,particularly for female founders
we need each other, likethere's not enough of us and it
can be very lonely and you know,you're often dealing with
(01:46):
things that you've never dealtwith before and just having each
other to have conversationswith to go oh, yeah, yeah, yeah,
it's going to be okay, I'mgoing to make, you're going to
make it through that and it'sall going to work out.
I think it's super special.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
I know we check in, don't we?
On WhatsApp at varying times ofthe early morning or the night
or whatever, and I think I knowduring that period we talked a
lot about checking in on thecheckers and it was interesting.
I got a lovely WhatsApp thismorning off the phenomenal
Sharon Davis, who is the chiefexecutive young enterprise,
which is an amazing organizationwhich is all about empowering
(02:23):
our future talent to be aware ofentrepreneurship, to be aware
of financial sort of literacy,if you like.
And I bumped into her at one ofthe party conferences recently.
As you run around the fringescatching up with people you can
only see sort of in a limitedtime, and I was having a moment
that just been a lot going on,and she messaged she did a check
(02:44):
in on me this morning and it'sright, isn't it?
You appreciate that, I think.
So anyone out there you knownever think that you're ever on
your own.
It's just just keep checking in.
It's important, isn't it it?
Speaker 2 (02:55):
is.
I think it's nice as well.
I had a call with a femalefounder friend of mine that's a
little bit earlier on herjourney and she was having one
of those existential crisismoments where it just all felt
really overwhelming and actuallyselfishly.
It was lovely for me to be ableto talk her through that and
(03:17):
she you know we had we were onthe phone for about an hour and,
you know, probably four weekslater she was like I did it, I
made it, I got through the otherside and it was just a really
nice experience and we all needthose those times because it
kind of ebbs and flows.
You go through those momentswhere you feel like a superhero
(03:37):
and everything's going reallywell and everything you touch
turns to gold.
And then you have those momentswhere you know you feel like an
absolute disaster andeverything you touch turns to
shit, and I was the same for allof us and you just got over it.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
And sometimes it is.
Your cape feels a bitdishevelled, doesn't it?
On occasion you're like it'sout, it's out for dry cleaning,
it's out on the line.
I kind of need not to wear itat the moment.
And I think sometimes, whenpeople see people like
successful, like you, you knowand and and and you know some of
the fellow sort ofentrepreneurs out there people
(04:10):
think we're all over it and it'sbeen an easy path.
But your path hasn't beensimple, hasn't it?
You started your first businessat 24, didn't you?
But it wasn't.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
It wasn't mission easy, no, and look, as the older
I get, the more I realise thatthis is true for everybody.
There is not a singlesuccessful person that has had a
smooth path From.
What I'm starting to realise isnot a single successful person
that hasn't nearly losteverything, at least you know,
(04:39):
once or twice on the journey,and so it's just good to remind
yourself of that.
I love, I love the WinstonChurchill saying success is the
ability to go from failure tofailure without losing one ounce
of enthusiasm.
And I feel that, you know, I'vehad numerous occasions with the
(05:00):
businesses where challengeshave come in and I, you know,
when they first hit you like,wow, I'm never gonna be able to
get through this, I'm not gonnabe able to make it work.
I, I sort of grew my businessesorganically from 1999 and
actually for the first few yearsit wasn't.
It was hard, but it was.
(05:20):
It was smooth in the sense thatevery year we'd make more money
or we'd grow more, or you know.
So you're on that kind ofjourney where first year you
couple of hundred thousand andnext you know, five, six and
then onto a million, and it'skind of like the snowball that
gets bigger and bigger, and bythe time I was.
You know, mid-thirties, 2010.
(05:44):
The business was turning over18 million, making three, four
million pound profit.
I thought I was that superhero.
I had a real spring in my step.
I'm driving Lamborghinis.
I'm like this is the life.
Move to Beverly Hills, this isbest life.
And then you know the thebusiness that I had went through
(06:08):
massive regulatory changes andI lost 60% of my income line in
the four-week period.
So you, you, you, you have thiskind of absolute drop.
You know in terms of everythingthat you believe to be true.
And in that moment, in thatfirst moment, when you stare
(06:28):
down, you look at numbers andyou're like this is like
existential, this could youcompletely destroy.
You.
You have to dig into somethingthat I think is the thing that
separates entrepreneurs fromnon-entrepreneurs.
You have to be able to have thevision to say I can see how
(06:50):
this can be different and how Ican dig myself out of this
scenario and answer a deeperfuture.
So yeah, it's.
I have definitely had all ofthose experiences and whilst, at
the time, you would rather beanywhere other than sat dealing
(07:13):
with them, I genuinely wouldn'tchange it now because it gives
you such a resilience andgrounding and sense the self.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
I think that's important, isn't it?
Sometimes, I, you know, youlook in the mirror, you hold the
mirror up and I think, gosh,I'm not good at this or I, you
know, I could have done that orI could have had a different
path.
But you know, I think I don't.
I would ever change anything,because I think it is the bits
that you learn on the way, andif it is a bit bumpy or if it is
a bit sort of zigzaggy, it's,it's what you learn about
(07:45):
yourself on the way.
And you know you talk aboutthat resilience of you know
you're air in the States, inyour Beverly Hills.
You know the, the freshprincess of Bella, did you?
You know, did it feel likestarting again or does it just
feel like a diversion?
Speaker 2 (08:02):
oh, that's a great question, it did feel in a lot
of ways like starting again,because it was, and you have to
be able to do that in order tosurvive difficult times.
You have to be able to cutloose any preconceptions that
you have.
So tying your identity to whatyou believe the business says
(08:28):
about you is disastrous.
So if I bought into the ideathat I was Sam White, princess
of Bella, lamborghini driverperson that could go and shop
wherever they wanted and earnthat money and and that that was
who I was, then being able tomake the hard decisions to
(08:50):
restructure the business in theway that I had to would have
been impossible because Iwouldn't been able to let go of
that, that person and and thosedreams and those aspirations for
a moment to be able to rebuildand and come back up, which of
course we did.
But you, you, I think.
(09:10):
For me it sounds like a strangething for somebody who is a
capitalist in a lot of ways andon to know but the money is not.
I don't care that much aboutmoney I got.
I like it for the freedom itgives me and I'm competitive
enough to know that I kind ofsee it as a way of keeping score
, but but actually in of itselfit doesn't really do much for me
(09:35):
, and if you look at business asthe same as everything else in
life, something that gives youthe ability to grow, then you
can accept some of this stuff, Ithink, with a lot less
resistance than you do if you'vegot your ego and your identity
(09:56):
and everything else attached toit.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
So you're on this new journey, and at what point did
you think I'm gonna go toAustralia to set up a new
business, Stella?
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Look Australia in all honesty and I'm probably too
honest for my own goods onoccasion but Australia was a
whim initially.
I'd been over there a few timeswhen I was younger, on holidays
and traveling, and I knew Iliked the country.
But when I first went over Iwas going through a messy
(10:30):
divorce.
My best mate at the time hadfallen in love with a guy who
lived in Sydney, who wasactually Scottish, and he'd been
over in the UK and she'd spentsome time with him and there was
a real connection there.
I then met somebody and I'mentrepreneurial right and so I'm
(10:52):
always looking foropportunities.
I'm always open.
I'm always curious Could we dothat?
What does that look like?
Does it fit with what we've gotgoing on at the moment?
And this guy came in and hesaid Sam, you really need to
look at Australia as a market.
There's loads of similaritiesto the UK.
There's some interesting stuffgoing on and I just thought why
not?
Like?
(11:13):
I spoke to my mate and said,because she was sort of
prevaricating about whethershe'd pursue this thing with a
guy, I was like I'm also anincurable romantic.
So for me it was actually whydon't we both jump on a plane?
I can see what's gonna happenfrom a business viewpoint.
She can see if this works withthis guy.
(11:33):
We've got like I've got a wingwoman.
She's got some moral support.
We can justify it with abusiness trait.
Let's see where we go.
And as soon as I got there andthis is where I probably do get
a little bit more spiritual andtouchy-feely I think that you
(11:54):
need to listen to the nudgesthat you get in the universe and
you need to really connect withyourself if you're gonna live a
full life and a big life.
And Australia from the minute Igot there, good things happened
.
Every meeting that I had therewas an opportunity that came out
(12:15):
of it.
It was like really good energyand it just felt very, very
right.
And so I did a number ofdifferent businesses over there.
They all went well andeventually one of the guys that
I'd set up a business with wasthe CEO of a huge insurer over
(12:36):
there and he said would you setup an insurance business?
I said I'm not doing that again.
I've got loads of insurancebusinesses in the UK.
It's not what sets my soul onfire.
And he said well, what does setyour soul on fire?
And I said supporting women inbusiness, female
entrepreneurship.
The world is not built forwomen, and the business world
(13:01):
even more so, is not built forwomen, and I'd love to change
that.
And he said, well, then, changeit.
I, you know what can we do.
And so this idea of building afinancial services brand that
was designed around women forwomen, by women for women just
(13:23):
really captured my imagination.
It captured lots of otherpeople's imagination.
So we got, you know, we gotinvestment from a local media
company and, like all this,things just kind of took off and
so, yeah, stella was formed andit's been an incredible journey
(13:43):
and I've been able to do thingsthat I've never been able to do
in the past in terms of brandbuilding and product development
and all that sort of stuff, andI'm just super excited about it
for the future.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
And we're delighted to have Stella as a partner and
that is, you know, that comeswith the loyalty and influence
from yourself and we've driventhat and we now work with your
team, who we absolutely love,and amplifying that voice and
that message around women andwomen in business and, like you
say, being unapologetically, youknow, focused on women.
It's been amazing and I feellike I've seen a real advent of
(14:22):
Sam.
Sam you were someone who wasnot really out there.
You'd speak at things, you'd beabsolutely say yes to things.
When you were an entrepreneur ofthe year of us back in gosh,
when was that?
That was something about sixyears ago, I think, or five
years ago, when you were anentrepreneur.
You were in Australia at thetime, I remember, and you know
(14:43):
you would always do this.
But then, all of a sudden, I'veseen this real rise and present
and ownership you really own inyourself as that
entrepreneurial model.
How easy for that for you wasto go into that.
Um, I suppose that thatenvironment of leaning in to go
right, I'm gonna go on thisstage, I'm gonna go and, you
(15:05):
know, have my voice heard,probably one of the hardest
things I've ever done.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
Um, so, like, I'm no different to anybody else and we
know that women suffermassively with imposter syndrome
.
So it's interesting to me now.
Um, people will often say to meoh, you know God, you're like
you're.
Everybody always says to me nowyou take up all my LinkedIn
(15:29):
feed and I'm like I only postonce a week.
I'm like I'm not, but you knowthat there's there's a kind of
um, slightly jokey teasy.
You're out there all the timeand people will say couldn't do
what you do.
You know, going, puttingyourself out there and and you
know what it is really um, itmakes you very vulnerable.
(15:53):
I think like and I've alwaysadmired that about you, simone
that you have always been.
When I won that award, it's thesame thing and still I see you
everywhere.
You're on the TV, you're doingstuff, you say yes to everything
and I always used to thinkthere's no way I could put
(16:13):
myself through that.
I had panic attacks in my 20sthat were really bad and you
know, I refused to publiclyspeak at all until I was faulty
and I put myself um on a on acourse to kind of get it, get it
out of me, kind of thing topush myself forward.
(16:33):
But at the first time I spokein public I threw up for a week
like the thought of it was sohorrific to me.
It felt so exposing and youknow I was worried I was going
to get on stage and have amassive panic attack and it was
all all be a disaster.
And I think one of the thingsthat I've really learned over
(16:55):
the last few years is just likegoing to the gym.
You know you go to the gym tobreak the muscle so that it
heals back stronger.
And with putting yourself outthere publicly there is no
substitute for just doing it.
You have to do it and the moreyou do it the easier it gets.
(17:16):
And I thought about thatyesterday I was on a panel
somewhere and I was literallyrushing from one meeting to go
on this panel and I arrived late, did not really particularly
planned, kind of just rocked up,sat down, said my truth and
there wasn't really any momentof oh my God, like I don't want
(17:40):
to be here or whatever.
I just felt really kind ofgrounded in that moment.
But there's still experiencesthat you have that are
overwhelming again and that'spushing your comfort a little
bit further.
I did live breakfast TV a fewweeks ago and that was like I
(18:00):
was like, oh, it'd be fine, likeI'm used to this.
Now right, it is completelydifferent.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
You're like lights, camera action, right, and the
heat, the heat of the camera andthe earpiece the earpiece, kind
of talking in your ear likedistracting you.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
I was like, oh wow, this is a lot, but I did it,
hopefully not too badly.
You know, they said they'd likeme to come on again, and so you
kind of go, okay, like I can dothis, I can work through it, I
can get to the other side.
But I think it's so importantto be honest about those
(18:38):
feelings Because I think there'sparticularly with women, I
think there's so many women thatdon't do it because they think
their reaction, their naturalreaction to something that is,
frankly, absolutely bloodyterrifying, makes them there's
something wrong with them andmeans that they can't do this
stuff, when we both know, ofcourse you can, if we can do it.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
And that's why you know we can see you on BBC's
Wake Up to Money, on the EatingKing Sky News, on BBC Radio 4.
And Houghton, your own podcast.
Sam has her own amazing podcastthat I've been on, called the
Human Business, which isabsolutely it is just like a
hanging out with your mate forhalf an hour or so.
It's brilliant.
But I think that there is that.
I think that first time youstep into that, it is stepping
(19:20):
out of that comfort zone, isn'tit?
It's stepping out and going.
You know what I can do this andI know one of your mantras in
business and life is why don'twe?
That's something you live by.
Do you ever regret making thosedecisions based on that mantra?
Speaker 2 (19:34):
No, definitely not.
I mean and that is includingthe fact that things go wrong,
like you know, with alarmingregularity.
But it's you know, for me, lifeis about things going wrong.
Life is about havingexperiences, learning, making
mistakes.
It's not supposed to be perfect.
(19:57):
I don't know at what pointpeople thought that life somehow
had to be this absolutelyperfect journey, because it
ain't Like.
I'll save you the drama.
It's just, you know, things aregoing to go wrong.
You are going to feelvulnerable, you're going to feel
embarrassed, you're going to dostuff in a way that other
(20:19):
people might not agree with.
All of those things are true.
But what's the alternative?
You know, you sit in a room byyourself, feeling safe and not
engaging with anything or doinganything Like that's the other
alternative to this.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
I won't talk about leadership, because I think one
of the posts I saw that you putout there or you openly spoke
about was when you step backfrom being Chief Exec.
Do you think that was one ofyour biggest leadership
decisions to sort of take thatstep?
Speaker 2 (20:50):
Look, I am constantly learning as a leader, like it
is, and for me as a founder of abusiness, as an entrepreneur,
the biggest investment that Ican make and should make is into
my capabilities as a leader.
It's easy when things aren'tgoing well to look at your team
(21:16):
and say what are they doingwrong?
Why aren't they supporting me?
Why are they exhibiting thisbehavior?
And the reality is, as witheverything in life, the only
thing you can change is yourself.
So I have been on a realjourney over the last couple of
years of digging deep into whatmy leadership style is, where my
(21:41):
blind spots are, where are thethings that I can improve.
And it's been fabulous and whenyou see it come to life in a
team dynamic.
We've had a couple of challengesrecently and in the past I
(22:03):
would have felt like that wasall on me and Sam to the rescue,
on the white horse, findingsolutions.
And for the first time,properly, I felt that I
absolutely could lean into theteam and that the team would
(22:24):
have this.
And I was on a call.
And I was driving and tappedinto this call because, as usual
, I was darting from place toplace and the team were all
putting in various differentsolutions to this challenge and,
honestly, it was magic.
It was lovely to hear them haveeach other's backs, challenge
(22:45):
each other, support each otherwith solutions, and it was like
this this is it.
This is the shit when it comesto actually really believing
that you're on the right pathfrom a leadership viewpoint.
But I think if you start tothink I've nailed it, I'm a
great leader, I've goteverything, yeah, it's all over.
(23:08):
We're all on a journey withthat and I'm no different than
the next person.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
And I saw and I don't know the situation you were
talking about I saw a post youput out a few weeks ago which
talks about talking about yourteam and the fact that I think
hadn't won a deal.
But then the team had sort ofacknowledged that actually they
needed to sort of redo orrethink something, so went back
and tried to re-win whatever thedeal was.
And it was that the way yousort of talked about.
(23:37):
You know, I don't think it wasnecessarily the victorious end,
but it was the fact that youreally recognised the process
that your team went through andit was like you stepping back
and I'm really proud of howyou've dealt with that team.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
Yeah, they lost a deal.
They did, and it was animportant deal to us.
But it kind of doesn't matter,because the reality is you are
going to lose deals, Things aregoing to go wrong and you can
win deals the wrong way.
So you can have success, that'sthe wrong success and you can
(24:12):
have failure that's the rightfailure.
And this was a great example ofthis.
They had made mistakes early onin the relationship with this
partner and they had done a fullanalysis of what had happened.
Now I had spoken to the partnerand, as far as I was concerned,
(24:35):
the deal was dead.
And they came to me and said wewant to fight for this.
Like, can we fight for this?
Because we know exactly whatwent wrong and how it went wrong
and we want to do this.
And I said, yeah, if you wantto do that, if you want to put
that work in caveat, I don'twant you to get your hopes up.
(24:56):
And they absolutely.
You know they didn't just workout what had gone wrong.
They put together a whole planof how they'd make it up to this
individual so that they wouldbe back in a much better
position than they had beenbefore.
(25:16):
They were humble, they wereaccountable, they were all the
things that you would want themto be, and when ultimately it
didn't come off, there was nobitterness, there was no
recriminations.
You know, they just theyabsolutely gave it their all and
(25:37):
they accepted the loss withdignity and grace.
Speaker 1 (25:42):
And when I read that, that's what I saw, I thought
that's leadership, that isleadership in action to actually
acknowledge that, acknowledgethat whole journey.
And so I know Sam the humanistpassionate is now say yes and
leaning in.
I know one of the things Ialways is so in awe of is the
fact that, through your business, the donations that you make to
domestic abuse charities outthere, but which is phenomenal,
(26:05):
and that's, you know, thesethings that drive you and enable
you to make this happen.
But the Sam, sam the human yourecently did the ice bath and
breathing challenge, wim Hof,has got into your life, hasn't
it?
A year ago you gave up thebooze, didn't you?
You've given up the booze andnow you've, you've, now you've
kind of looked and really I sawthe post around you in the ice
(26:27):
bath.
I literally shivered as Ilooked at it.
You've talked about that beinglife changing.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
Yeah, it was, and look, I realized I'm becoming
one of those really annoyingpeople that I would have hated
10 years ago.
So, like my wife is always,like you know, don't get too
much on the soapbox that peoplewill not invite us around for
dinner anymore.
But I did.
Look, I'm getting older now I'm48, every bit of energy that I
(26:58):
can master I want to take.
But I also wanna enjoy lifefully, like that is really
important to me, and so alcoholfor me is a nummer.
It numbs you.
I don't wanna be numb.
Like I love life, I wanna feeleverything I can feel.
So got rid of that.
(27:19):
But the Wim Hof was Jenny wasgoing away with her sister to
Italy to drink wine and eatpasta, which lots of people
listening to this would sayshe's the smart one.
And I had a free weekend,didn't have the kids, was gonna
go to this health retreat thatI've been to a few times and
(27:39):
when I phoned to book in theysaid actually it's a Wim Hof
weekend.
I'd read the stuff you know,the ice bath and the breath work
and stuff.
And I hate cold water, likehate it.
I won't even go in the pool onholiday unless it's like bath
water warm.
So this was my idea of hell,like there's no way.
But then I stepped back and Iwas like, didn't you feel like
(28:02):
that about public speaking?
Isn't it exactly the same asall the things that you think?
And I'd read so many incrediblethings for the health benefits
and what have you.
I just thought, yeah, I'm gonnago.
And it was transformational Forloads of different reasons.
The breath work in and ofitself is really quite magical
(28:26):
and I've done it every day sinceit was probably six weeks ago
that I went.
I'm now over two minutes ableto hold my breath as part of
this process that you do, but itdoes something to your nervous
system.
It hits your I think it's yourparasympathetic nervous system,
but it basically it's likemeditation on steroids and then
(28:52):
the ice bath is just about doingsomething that you would
believe you would be incapableof doing and conquering that
fear of the thing that you thinkis impossible, and it was
definitely that for me.
I had a real emotionalbreakthrough.
(29:14):
I lost my dad in March thisyear and the grieving process
has been challenging becauseI've been so busy and it's been
a real process.
Speaker 1 (29:33):
And I think that's part of that you being you,
isn't it?
Like Jenny you're wonderful,jenny going off to eat pasta and
wine.
It's like you have to do you,to conquer whatever those
challenges around you, whetherit's grief, bereavement,
business challenges.
It's you've got to do, you,haven't you?
And so, as we get you know, sam, it is always a joy to talk
(29:54):
with you and to hear what you,where you are and what you're up
to in the world.
And I know this is an extraspecial long edition, this one.
What's next for Sun White?
Sun White, the movie, the book,the series.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
Come on.
Well, I've got a few things I'mworking on that I'm hopeful to
get into production in the nextfew months, but some
entrepreneurial show stuff.
I'm doing my Toast series onRadio 4 again, which I'm
(30:29):
starting recording in November,which I absolutely love.
Stella, we're launching we'vealready launched in the UK motor
insurance, but we're launchinghome insurance.
We've just launched travel inAustralia.
We're looking at businessinsurance for female
entrepreneurs.
So just more of the samebuilding growing.
(30:53):
I just kind of fighting my waythrough all of this stuff, but I
really also want to get outthere more and just really
encourage more women to get intobusiness and more female
entrepreneurship.
That's everything for me.
Speaker 1 (31:12):
And we will put details about Stella and all of
the opportunities in the showYou're not fighting through.
You are blazing a trail and thething about you, sam, is you
don't forget the people thathave helped you or supported you
on the way.
You are an ultimate champion.
So thank you so much for beingsuch an amazing human, amazing
business woman, amazing rolemodel and a friend.
(31:35):
Thank you so much for joiningme.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
Right back at you.
Thank you for everything,Simone.
You're an absolute wonderfulhuman being and I really
genuinely value everything thatyou've ever done.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
I'm off to Google Wim Hof now, but I'm not so sure.
Thank you so much for joiningus and thank you to all of us,
all of you for listening in.
Please do stay connected, andall of our socials at North
Power Women on X or Twitter, andNorthern Powering and all the
other ones.
We love hearing these stories.
We love hearing from you, soplease drop us a line.
(32:08):
Podcast atnorthernpowerwomencom.
Please do listen to next week'sepisode.
We'll have another fantastichuman.
My name is Simone.
Thank you for listening.
This is the Northern PowerWomen Podcast and we're live at
what Goes On Media Productions.
The Northern Power Women podcast For your career
and your life, no matter whatbusiness you're in.
Hello, hello and welcome to theNorthern Power Women podcast,
where every week, I get thechance to speak with absolutely
amazing individuals, as wespotlight the work that they do
and those individuals usingtheir power for good in the aim
of reaching a more equal,diverse and inclusive world.
(00:42):
And this week I get to speak tothe wonderful Sam White.
Sam White is the founder ofStellar Insurance, which is a
female centric financialservices business that is I love
this unapologetically led bywomen and designed for women.
Sam is a serial entrepreneur.
She is passionate aboutequality innovation.
(01:02):
She is a trailblazer, she iskickass, she's a fabulous friend
of mine and I'm delighted tochat with Sam today.
Welcome to the pod.
Speaker 2 (01:10):
Hey, lovely.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
I've missed you.
I have missed you.
Do you remember our chats overlockdown?
We just jumped on her on a Zoomcall and record it and put it
out to the world, couldn't we?
Because we were just sort ofkeeping ourselves sane, weren't
we?
Speaker 2 (01:23):
Or insane, I'm not quite sure I was going to say
it's probably a straight sayingwith us to keeping ourselves
sane.
No, they were a real lifeline,I think, for both of us and you
know I say this all the time,particularly for female founders
we need each other, likethere's not enough of us and it
can be very lonely and you know,you're often dealing with
(01:46):
things that you've never dealtwith before and just having each
other to have conversationswith to go oh, yeah, yeah, yeah,
it's going to be okay, I'mgoing to make, you're going to
make it through that and it'sall going to work out.
I think it's super special.
Speaker 1 (02:01):
I know we check in, don't we?
On WhatsApp at varying times ofthe early morning or the night
or whatever, and I think I knowduring that period we talked a
lot about checking in on thecheckers and it was interesting.
I got a lovely WhatsApp thismorning off the phenomenal
Sharon Davis, who is the chiefexecutive young enterprise,
which is an amazing organizationwhich is all about empowering
(02:23):
our future talent to be aware ofentrepreneurship, to be aware
of financial sort of literacy,if you like.
And I bumped into her at one ofthe party conferences recently.
As you run around the fringescatching up with people you can
only see sort of in a limitedtime, and I was having a moment
that just been a lot going on,and she messaged she did a check
(02:44):
in on me this morning and it'sright, isn't it?
You appreciate that, I think.
So anyone out there you knownever think that you're ever on
your own.
It's just just keep checking in.
It's important, isn't it it?
Speaker 2 (02:55):
is.
I think it's nice as well.
I had a call with a femalefounder friend of mine that's a
little bit earlier on herjourney and she was having one
of those existential crisismoments where it just all felt
really overwhelming and actuallyselfishly.
It was lovely for me to be ableto talk her through that and
(03:17):
she you know we had we were onthe phone for about an hour and,
you know, probably four weekslater she was like I did it, I
made it, I got through the otherside and it was just a really
nice experience and we all needthose those times because it
kind of ebbs and flows.
You go through those momentswhere you feel like a superhero
(03:37):
and everything's going reallywell and everything you touch
turns to gold.
And then you have those momentswhere you know you feel like an
absolute disaster andeverything you touch turns to
shit, and I was the same for allof us and you just got over it.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
And sometimes it is.
Your cape feels a bitdishevelled, doesn't it?
On occasion you're like it'sout, it's out for dry cleaning,
it's out on the line.
I kind of need not to wear itat the moment.
And I think sometimes, whenpeople see people like
successful, like you, you knowand and and and you know some of
the fellow sort ofentrepreneurs out there people
(04:10):
think we're all over it and it'sbeen an easy path.
But your path hasn't beensimple, hasn't it?
You started your first businessat 24, didn't you?
But it wasn't.
Speaker 2 (04:18):
It wasn't mission easy, no, and look, as the older
I get, the more I realise thatthis is true for everybody.
There is not a singlesuccessful person that has had a
smooth path From.
What I'm starting to realise isnot a single successful person
that hasn't nearly losteverything, at least you know,
(04:39):
once or twice on the journey,and so it's just good to remind
yourself of that.
I love, I love the WinstonChurchill saying success is the
ability to go from failure tofailure without losing one ounce
of enthusiasm.
And I feel that, you know, I'vehad numerous occasions with the
(05:00):
businesses where challengeshave come in and I, you know,
when they first hit you like,wow, I'm never gonna be able to
get through this, I'm not gonnabe able to make it work.
I, I sort of grew my businessesorganically from 1999 and
actually for the first few yearsit wasn't.
It was hard, but it was.
(05:20):
It was smooth in the sense thatevery year we'd make more money
or we'd grow more, or you know.
So you're on that kind ofjourney where first year you
couple of hundred thousand andnext you know, five, six and
then onto a million, and it'skind of like the snowball that
gets bigger and bigger, and bythe time I was.
You know, mid-thirties, 2010.
(05:44):
The business was turning over18 million, making three, four
million pound profit.
I thought I was that superhero.
I had a real spring in my step.
I'm driving Lamborghinis.
I'm like this is the life.
Move to Beverly Hills, this isbest life.
And then you know the thebusiness that I had went through
(06:08):
massive regulatory changes andI lost 60% of my income line in
the four-week period.
So you, you, you, you have thiskind of absolute drop.
You know in terms of everythingthat you believe to be true.
And in that moment, in thatfirst moment, when you stare
(06:28):
down, you look at numbers andyou're like this is like
existential, this could youcompletely destroy.
You.
You have to dig into somethingthat I think is the thing that
separates entrepreneurs fromnon-entrepreneurs.
You have to be able to have thevision to say I can see how
(06:50):
this can be different and how Ican dig myself out of this
scenario and answer a deeperfuture.
So yeah, it's.
I have definitely had all ofthose experiences and whilst, at
the time, you would rather beanywhere other than sat dealing
(07:13):
with them, I genuinely wouldn'tchange it now because it gives
you such a resilience andgrounding and sense the self.
Speaker 1 (07:23):
I think that's important, isn't it?
Sometimes, I, you know, youlook in the mirror, you hold the
mirror up and I think, gosh,I'm not good at this or I, you
know, I could have done that orI could have had a different
path.
But you know, I think I don't.
I would ever change anything,because I think it is the bits
that you learn on the way, andif it is a bit bumpy or if it is
a bit sort of zigzaggy, it's,it's what you learn about
(07:45):
yourself on the way.
And you know you talk aboutthat resilience of you know
you're air in the States, inyour Beverly Hills.
You know the, the freshprincess of Bella, did you?
You know, did it feel likestarting again or does it just
feel like a diversion?
Speaker 2 (08:02):
oh, that's a great question, it did feel in a lot
of ways like starting again,because it was, and you have to
be able to do that in order tosurvive difficult times.
You have to be able to cutloose any preconceptions that
you have.
So tying your identity to whatyou believe the business says
(08:28):
about you is disastrous.
So if I bought into the ideathat I was Sam White, princess
of Bella, lamborghini driverperson that could go and shop
wherever they wanted and earnthat money and and that that was
who I was, then being able tomake the hard decisions to
(08:50):
restructure the business in theway that I had to would have
been impossible because Iwouldn't been able to let go of
that, that person and and thosedreams and those aspirations for
a moment to be able to rebuildand and come back up, which of
course we did.
But you, you, I think.
(09:10):
For me it sounds like a strangething for somebody who is a
capitalist in a lot of ways andon to know but the money is not.
I don't care that much aboutmoney I got.
I like it for the freedom itgives me and I'm competitive
enough to know that I kind ofsee it as a way of keeping score
, but but actually in of itselfit doesn't really do much for me
(09:35):
, and if you look at business asthe same as everything else in
life, something that gives youthe ability to grow, then you
can accept some of this stuff, Ithink, with a lot less
resistance than you do if you'vegot your ego and your identity
(09:56):
and everything else attached toit.
Speaker 1 (09:58):
So you're on this new journey, and at what point did
you think I'm gonna go toAustralia to set up a new
business, Stella?
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Look Australia in all honesty and I'm probably too
honest for my own goods onoccasion but Australia was a
whim initially.
I'd been over there a few timeswhen I was younger, on holidays
and traveling, and I knew Iliked the country.
But when I first went over Iwas going through a messy
(10:30):
divorce.
My best mate at the time hadfallen in love with a guy who
lived in Sydney, who wasactually Scottish, and he'd been
over in the UK and she'd spentsome time with him and there was
a real connection there.
I then met somebody and I'mentrepreneurial right and so I'm
(10:52):
always looking foropportunities.
I'm always open.
I'm always curious Could we dothat?
What does that look like?
Does it fit with what we've gotgoing on at the moment?
And this guy came in and hesaid Sam, you really need to
look at Australia as a market.
There's loads of similaritiesto the UK.
There's some interesting stuffgoing on and I just thought why
not?
Like?
(11:13):
I spoke to my mate and said,because she was sort of
prevaricating about whethershe'd pursue this thing with a
guy, I was like I'm also anincurable romantic.
So for me it was actually whydon't we both jump on a plane?
I can see what's gonna happenfrom a business viewpoint.
She can see if this works withthis guy.
(11:33):
We've got like I've got a wingwoman.
She's got some moral support.
We can justify it with abusiness trait.
Let's see where we go.
And as soon as I got there andthis is where I probably do get
a little bit more spiritual andtouchy-feely I think that you
(11:54):
need to listen to the nudgesthat you get in the universe and
you need to really connect withyourself if you're gonna live a
full life and a big life.
And Australia from the minute Igot there, good things happened
.
Every meeting that I had therewas an opportunity that came out
(12:15):
of it.
It was like really good energyand it just felt very, very
right.
And so I did a number ofdifferent businesses over there.
They all went well andeventually one of the guys that
I'd set up a business with wasthe CEO of a huge insurer over
(12:36):
there and he said would you setup an insurance business?
I said I'm not doing that again.
I've got loads of insurancebusinesses in the UK.
It's not what sets my soul onfire.
And he said well, what does setyour soul on fire?
And I said supporting women inbusiness, female
entrepreneurship.
The world is not built forwomen, and the business world
(13:01):
even more so, is not built forwomen, and I'd love to change
that.
And he said, well, then, changeit.
I, you know what can we do.
And so this idea of building afinancial services brand that
was designed around women forwomen, by women for women just
(13:23):
really captured my imagination.
It captured lots of otherpeople's imagination.
So we got, you know, we gotinvestment from a local media
company and, like all this,things just kind of took off and
so, yeah, stella was formed andit's been an incredible journey
(13:43):
and I've been able to do thingsthat I've never been able to do
in the past in terms of brandbuilding and product development
and all that sort of stuff, andI'm just super excited about it
for the future.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
And we're delighted to have Stella as a partner and
that is, you know, that comeswith the loyalty and influence
from yourself and we've driventhat and we now work with your
team, who we absolutely love,and amplifying that voice and
that message around women andwomen in business and, like you
say, being unapologetically, youknow, focused on women.
It's been amazing and I feellike I've seen a real advent of
(14:22):
Sam.
Sam you were someone who wasnot really out there.
You'd speak at things, you'd beabsolutely say yes to things.
When you were an entrepreneur ofthe year of us back in gosh,
when was that?
That was something about sixyears ago, I think, or five
years ago, when you were anentrepreneur.
You were in Australia at thetime, I remember, and you know
(14:43):
you would always do this.
But then, all of a sudden, I'veseen this real rise and present
and ownership you really own inyourself as that
entrepreneurial model.
How easy for that for you wasto go into that.
Um, I suppose that thatenvironment of leaning in to go
right, I'm gonna go on thisstage, I'm gonna go and, you
(15:05):
know, have my voice heard,probably one of the hardest
things I've ever done.
Speaker 2 (15:08):
Um, so, like, I'm no different to anybody else and we
know that women suffermassively with imposter syndrome
.
So it's interesting to me now.
Um, people will often say to meoh, you know God, you're like
you're.
Everybody always says to me nowyou take up all my LinkedIn
(15:29):
feed and I'm like I only postonce a week.
I'm like I'm not, but you knowthat there's there's a kind of
um, slightly jokey teasy.
You're out there all the timeand people will say couldn't do
what you do.
You know, going, puttingyourself out there and and you
know what it is really um, itmakes you very vulnerable.
(15:53):
I think like and I've alwaysadmired that about you, simone
that you have always been.
When I won that award, it's thesame thing and still I see you
everywhere.
You're on the TV, you're doingstuff, you say yes to everything
and I always used to thinkthere's no way I could put
(16:13):
myself through that.
I had panic attacks in my 20sthat were really bad and you
know, I refused to publiclyspeak at all until I was faulty
and I put myself um on a on acourse to kind of get it, get it
out of me, kind of thing topush myself forward.
(16:33):
But at the first time I spokein public I threw up for a week
like the thought of it was sohorrific to me.
It felt so exposing and youknow I was worried I was going
to get on stage and have amassive panic attack and it was
all all be a disaster.
And I think one of the thingsthat I've really learned over
(16:55):
the last few years is just likegoing to the gym.
You know you go to the gym tobreak the muscle so that it
heals back stronger.
And with putting yourself outthere publicly there is no
substitute for just doing it.
You have to do it and the moreyou do it the easier it gets.
(17:16):
And I thought about thatyesterday I was on a panel
somewhere and I was literallyrushing from one meeting to go
on this panel and I arrived late, did not really particularly
planned, kind of just rocked up,sat down, said my truth and
there wasn't really any momentof oh my God, like I don't want
(17:40):
to be here or whatever.
I just felt really kind ofgrounded in that moment.
But there's still experiencesthat you have that are
overwhelming again and that'spushing your comfort a little
bit further.
I did live breakfast TV a fewweeks ago and that was like I
(18:00):
was like, oh, it'd be fine, likeI'm used to this.
Now right, it is completelydifferent.
Speaker 1 (18:07):
You're like lights, camera action, right, and the
heat, the heat of the camera andthe earpiece the earpiece, kind
of talking in your ear likedistracting you.
Speaker 2 (18:18):
I was like, oh wow, this is a lot, but I did it,
hopefully not too badly.
You know, they said they'd likeme to come on again, and so you
kind of go, okay, like I can dothis, I can work through it, I
can get to the other side.
But I think it's so importantto be honest about those
(18:38):
feelings Because I think there'sparticularly with women, I
think there's so many women thatdon't do it because they think
their reaction, their naturalreaction to something that is,
frankly, absolutely bloodyterrifying, makes them there's
something wrong with them andmeans that they can't do this
stuff, when we both know, ofcourse you can, if we can do it.
Speaker 1 (18:58):
And that's why you know we can see you on BBC's
Wake Up to Money, on the EatingKing Sky News, on BBC Radio 4.
And Houghton, your own podcast.
Sam has her own amazing podcastthat I've been on, called the
Human Business, which isabsolutely it is just like a
hanging out with your mate forhalf an hour or so.
It's brilliant.
But I think that there is that.
I think that first time youstep into that, it is stepping
(19:20):
out of that comfort zone, isn'tit?
It's stepping out and going.
You know what I can do this andI know one of your mantras in
business and life is why don'twe?
That's something you live by.
Do you ever regret making thosedecisions based on that mantra?
Speaker 2 (19:34):
No, definitely not.
I mean and that is includingthe fact that things go wrong,
like you know, with alarmingregularity.
But it's you know, for me, lifeis about things going wrong.
Life is about havingexperiences, learning, making
mistakes.
It's not supposed to be perfect.
(19:57):
I don't know at what pointpeople thought that life somehow
had to be this absolutelyperfect journey, because it
ain't Like.
I'll save you the drama.
It's just, you know, things aregoing to go wrong.
You are going to feelvulnerable, you're going to feel
embarrassed, you're going to dostuff in a way that other
(20:19):
people might not agree with.
All of those things are true.
But what's the alternative?
You know, you sit in a room byyourself, feeling safe and not
engaging with anything or doinganything Like that's the other
alternative to this.
Speaker 1 (20:35):
I won't talk about leadership, because I think one
of the posts I saw that you putout there or you openly spoke
about was when you step backfrom being Chief Exec.
Do you think that was one ofyour biggest leadership
decisions to sort of take thatstep?
Speaker 2 (20:50):
Look, I am constantly learning as a leader, like it
is, and for me as a founder of abusiness, as an entrepreneur,
the biggest investment that Ican make and should make is into
my capabilities as a leader.
It's easy when things aren'tgoing well to look at your team
(21:16):
and say what are they doingwrong?
Why aren't they supporting me?
Why are they exhibiting thisbehavior?
And the reality is, as witheverything in life, the only
thing you can change is yourself.
So I have been on a realjourney over the last couple of
years of digging deep into whatmy leadership style is, where my
(21:41):
blind spots are, where are thethings that I can improve.
And it's been fabulous and whenyou see it come to life in a
team dynamic.
We've had a couple of challengesrecently and in the past I
(22:03):
would have felt like that wasall on me and Sam to the rescue,
on the white horse, findingsolutions.
And for the first time,properly, I felt that I
absolutely could lean into theteam and that the team would
(22:24):
have this.
And I was on a call.
And I was driving and tappedinto this call because, as usual
, I was darting from place toplace and the team were all
putting in various differentsolutions to this challenge and,
honestly, it was magic.
It was lovely to hear them haveeach other's backs, challenge
(22:45):
each other, support each otherwith solutions, and it was like
this this is it.
This is the shit when it comesto actually really believing
that you're on the right pathfrom a leadership viewpoint.
But I think if you start tothink I've nailed it, I'm a
great leader, I've goteverything, yeah, it's all over.
(23:08):
We're all on a journey withthat and I'm no different than
the next person.
Speaker 1 (23:15):
And I saw and I don't know the situation you were
talking about I saw a post youput out a few weeks ago which
talks about talking about yourteam and the fact that I think
hadn't won a deal.
But then the team had sort ofacknowledged that actually they
needed to sort of redo orrethink something, so went back
and tried to re-win whatever thedeal was.
And it was that the way yousort of talked about.
(23:37):
You know, I don't think it wasnecessarily the victorious end,
but it was the fact that youreally recognised the process
that your team went through andit was like you stepping back
and I'm really proud of howyou've dealt with that team.
Speaker 2 (23:49):
Yeah, they lost a deal.
They did, and it was animportant deal to us.
But it kind of doesn't matter,because the reality is you are
going to lose deals, Things aregoing to go wrong and you can
win deals the wrong way.
So you can have success, that'sthe wrong success and you can
(24:12):
have failure that's the rightfailure.
And this was a great example ofthis.
They had made mistakes early onin the relationship with this
partner and they had done a fullanalysis of what had happened.
Now I had spoken to the partnerand, as far as I was concerned,
(24:35):
the deal was dead.
And they came to me and said wewant to fight for this.
Like, can we fight for this?
Because we know exactly whatwent wrong and how it went wrong
and we want to do this.
And I said, yeah, if you wantto do that, if you want to put
that work in caveat, I don'twant you to get your hopes up.
(24:56):
And they absolutely.
You know they didn't just workout what had gone wrong.
They put together a whole planof how they'd make it up to this
individual so that they wouldbe back in a much better
position than they had beenbefore.
(25:16):
They were humble, they wereaccountable, they were all the
things that you would want themto be, and when ultimately it
didn't come off, there was nobitterness, there was no
recriminations.
You know, they just theyabsolutely gave it their all and
(25:37):
they accepted the loss withdignity and grace.
Speaker 1 (25:42):
And when I read that, that's what I saw, I thought
that's leadership, that isleadership in action to actually
acknowledge that, acknowledgethat whole journey.
And so I know Sam the humanistpassionate is now say yes and
leaning in.
I know one of the things Ialways is so in awe of is the
fact that, through your business, the donations that you make to
domestic abuse charities outthere, but which is phenomenal,
(26:05):
and that's, you know, thesethings that drive you and enable
you to make this happen.
But the Sam, sam the human yourecently did the ice bath and
breathing challenge, wim Hof,has got into your life, hasn't
it?
A year ago you gave up thebooze, didn't you?
You've given up the booze andnow you've, you've, now you've
kind of looked and really I sawthe post around you in the ice
(26:27):
bath.
I literally shivered as Ilooked at it.
You've talked about that beinglife changing.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
Yeah, it was, and look, I realized I'm becoming
one of those really annoyingpeople that I would have hated
10 years ago.
So, like my wife is always,like you know, don't get too
much on the soapbox that peoplewill not invite us around for
dinner anymore.
But I did.
Look, I'm getting older now I'm48, every bit of energy that I
(26:58):
can master I want to take.
But I also wanna enjoy lifefully, like that is really
important to me, and so alcoholfor me is a nummer.
It numbs you.
I don't wanna be numb.
Like I love life, I wanna feeleverything I can feel.
So got rid of that.
(27:19):
But the Wim Hof was Jenny wasgoing away with her sister to
Italy to drink wine and eatpasta, which lots of people
listening to this would sayshe's the smart one.
And I had a free weekend,didn't have the kids, was gonna
go to this health retreat thatI've been to a few times and
(27:39):
when I phoned to book in theysaid actually it's a Wim Hof
weekend.
I'd read the stuff you know,the ice bath and the breath work
and stuff.
And I hate cold water, likehate it.
I won't even go in the pool onholiday unless it's like bath
water warm.
So this was my idea of hell,like there's no way.
But then I stepped back and Iwas like, didn't you feel like
(28:02):
that about public speaking?
Isn't it exactly the same asall the things that you think?
And I'd read so many incrediblethings for the health benefits
and what have you.
I just thought, yeah, I'm gonnago.
And it was transformational Forloads of different reasons.
The breath work in and ofitself is really quite magical
(28:26):
and I've done it every day sinceit was probably six weeks ago
that I went.
I'm now over two minutes ableto hold my breath as part of
this process that you do, but itdoes something to your nervous
system.
It hits your I think it's yourparasympathetic nervous system,
but it basically it's likemeditation on steroids and then
(28:52):
the ice bath is just about doingsomething that you would
believe you would be incapableof doing and conquering that
fear of the thing that you thinkis impossible, and it was
definitely that for me.
I had a real emotionalbreakthrough.
(29:14):
I lost my dad in March thisyear and the grieving process
has been challenging becauseI've been so busy and it's been
a real process.
Speaker 1 (29:33):
And I think that's part of that you being you,
isn't it?
Like Jenny you're wonderful,jenny going off to eat pasta and
wine.
It's like you have to do you,to conquer whatever those
challenges around you, whetherit's grief, bereavement,
business challenges.
It's you've got to do, you,haven't you?
And so, as we get you know, sam, it is always a joy to talk
(29:54):
with you and to hear what you,where you are and what you're up
to in the world.
And I know this is an extraspecial long edition, this one.
What's next for Sun White?
Sun White, the movie, the book,the series.
Speaker 2 (30:08):
Come on.
Well, I've got a few things I'mworking on that I'm hopeful to
get into production in the nextfew months, but some
entrepreneurial show stuff.
I'm doing my Toast series onRadio 4 again, which I'm
(30:29):
starting recording in November,which I absolutely love.
Stella, we're launching we'vealready launched in the UK motor
insurance, but we're launchinghome insurance.
We've just launched travel inAustralia.
We're looking at businessinsurance for female
entrepreneurs.
So just more of the samebuilding growing.
(30:53):
I just kind of fighting my waythrough all of this stuff, but I
really also want to get outthere more and just really
encourage more women to get intobusiness and more female
entrepreneurship.
That's everything for me.
Speaker 1 (31:12):
And we will put details about Stella and all of
the opportunities in the showYou're not fighting through.
You are blazing a trail and thething about you, sam, is you
don't forget the people thathave helped you or supported you
on the way.
You are an ultimate champion.
So thank you so much for beingsuch an amazing human, amazing
business woman, amazing rolemodel and a friend.
(31:35):
Thank you so much for joiningme.
Speaker 2 (31:38):
Right back at you.
Thank you for everything,Simone.
You're an absolute wonderfulhuman being and I really
genuinely value everything thatyou've ever done.
Speaker 1 (31:48):
I'm off to Google Wim Hof now, but I'm not so sure.
Thank you so much for joiningus and thank you to all of us,
all of you for listening in.
Please do stay connected, andall of our socials at North
Power Women on X or Twitter, andNorthern Powering and all the
other ones.
We love hearing these stories.
We love hearing from you, soplease drop us a line.
(32:08):
Podcast atnorthernpowerwomencom.
Please do listen to next week'sepisode.
We'll have another fantastichuman.
My name is Simone.
Thank you for listening.
This is the Northern PowerWomen Podcast and we're live at
what Goes On Media Productions.
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