Using Art to Process Climate Anxiety and Loss with Katherine Steichen Rosing

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Hey, friends. Welcome. Andwelcome back to noseyAF conversations
about art, activism and socialchange. I am your host and friend,
Stephanie, and today onnoseyAF, I am talking with Katherine
Steichen Rosen, a Madisonbased artist whose immersive installations
and abstract paintings explorethe deep connections between forests

(00:23):
and watersheds. Katherine'swork dives into the natural systems
that sustains us, like carbonand water cycles. And honestly, it
is such a pleasure to have herhere because Katherine is one of
those people I'll always maketime to talk shop with about what's
going on in our work. She'swarm and generous and really just

(00:45):
a fresh breath of air, whichfeels perfect since, you know, Katherine's
all about water and trees.Anyway, we are going to start the
theme music so that you canmeet my friend, Katherine. Welcome
to noseyAF. Gotta get up, getup tell the whole world you a winner,
winner Vision of a star with amission in the cause what you doing,

(01:08):
how you doing, what you doingand who you are Flex yourself and
press yourself Check yourselfdon't wreck yourself if you know
me then you know that I beknowing what's up hey, Stephanie.
Graham is Nosy as. All right.Katherine, welcome to no tf.
Hi. Thanks for having me.
Yeah. I'm so happy that youcan be here because I feel anytime

(01:33):
I walk through the forestpreserve on my neighborhood walk,
I think of you.
Oh, that makes me feel so goodwith your work.
You mentioned that you have,like, a deep relationship with northern
ecosystems, and I'm curiouswhat that means to you.
It kind of goes back and it'sreally multilayered. When I was a

(01:55):
kid, we didn't have any money,and my big family, we would spend
three weeks camping in thewoods around Lake Superior, swimming,
catching fish. And then my momwould cook them, my dad would clean
them and stuff like that. Andswimming, kayaking, canoeing. Or
not kayaking, but canoeingback then. And that started the kind

(02:16):
of groundwork for me, thislove and comfort of being in the
forests, in the water. Thatevolved as I grew up and I became
an adult. I learned tobackpack. So then I was out west,
which is a very differentlandscape, very dry and arid in many
places. And when you'rebackpacking, every resource is valuable.

(02:37):
You carry your food, yourtent, your. You know, and you try
to minimize any excess. Soyou're often carrying water or looking
for the next water source. AndI remember backpacking in Canyonlands,
that's out near Arches. And wehad carried our water for the first
day or day and a Half. And thesecond night, we thought that we

(02:58):
would be passing some kind ofa water source. And I remember we.
We walked past this shallow,murky looking place and we're like,
no, we don't want to drinkthat. So we passed it thinking, oh,
there'll be something more.But there wasn't. And so my husband,
who's, I think we were marriedat the time, went back a couple miles
to get water from that. But wehad filters and like, we probably

(03:21):
boiled it, used iodinetablets. And then it came back and
it's just like, I remember howthat felt to be alone, like, there's
nobody there. And then, like,being from Wisconsin, where we have
so much water and it's pureand clean and plentiful, I never
appreciated how valuable itwas as a resource. And as I've gotten

(03:41):
older, like, we took our kidscamping. I spend as much time as
I can, not enough hiking inthe woods and in the forest because
it's a way that I've learnedabout the cycles of life, life, death,
that are difficult for ashumans, at least really hard for
me, especially death. But whenI look in the forest, I see that

(04:05):
the old decaying logs or the,you know, the trunks of the trees,
they're fostering new life andnurturing new growth. They're decaying
and becoming part of the soil.And it's just this beautiful life
cycle. And so, like, Irecently lost my mom.
I'm so sorry.
Thank you. I mean, she had agood, long life, but still, like,

(04:26):
I'm miss her and it waseasier. I told her I'm gonna. When
she was still alive. I'm gonnathink of you as one of the grandmother
trees in the forest. And therewas all the support and nurturing
through the roots. So it'sreally. The forests have taught me
a lot.
That's really sweet and reallylovely, especially because it seems
like she taught you this, likeyour family, right? Like, would go

(04:50):
out camping and be a part ofnature. And so, you know, it makes
sense that you would referenceher in that way. Do you still hike?
I do as much as possible. Yeah.
Okay.
I was just hiking in Acadianational park in Maine for the first
time. Oh, wow. It wasgorgeous. Yeah.
Yeah, beautiful. Did you go,like, by yourself or do you, like,

(05:13):
go to these things with groups?
I went with my husband and myson. So most of our vacations, whenever
we can help it, they'recentered around hiking or kayaking
or both, so.
Well, that sounds so lovely.
Yeah.
So, like. Okay, so let me tryto describe for the listener. Some
of your work, A particularbody of your work. When I think of

(05:33):
Katherine's work, I think ofthese beautiful yellowy green. Think
of, like, fun leaves, butyellow, green, blue leaves that would.
If you were walking throughthe forest, they would be, like,
falling on you. Or if you wereto look up, you might see them falling.

(05:53):
And, yeah, they're sort of,like, mystical, while also being
pretty realistic about theforest in a way. What do you think
about that?
It's hard to say for sure,depending upon which painting you're
talking about. But I do use alot of oval shapes. So if you're
thinking of that, like, theoval shapes originally come from.

(06:19):
They're sort of symbolizingthe water shield plant, which is
a little. Kind of like a waterlily, but it's more nondescript.
They grow on little lakes. Andthat came from an artist's residency
where I was focusing on theinterconnection between forests and
small bodies of water. And soI met with a scientist, and she was

(06:41):
talking. She had researchedthese. And so I was, like, became
fascinated by these floatingoval leaves. And then I paired that
with these vertical lines thatare suggesting the tree trunks.
Yes.
Yeah, that's what I thoughtyou were thinking of. And so they're.
And then those ovals appear.Like, sometimes I have a horizon
line or a suggestion of ahorizon line. And so in the air,

(07:04):
you see those ovals also. AndI haven't really decided on a specific
meaning for those. To me, it'sa symbol, kind of the life that's
in the air, whether it'sleaves, birds, insects. And it's
a visual way to have somecontinuity with the ovals that are
in the lower part. That is, inmy mind, the lake surface.

(07:27):
I see. Yes. Okay. So the piecethat. For me to be specific, that
came to mind, it's called theSpace between Heaven and Earth.
I love that one. Yeah.
Yeah. And so that's why I waslike. It reminds me of. If you walk
through the forest preserve,the painting is very blue. And so
at the local forest preserve,where I go, it might not be that

(07:48):
blue, but the leaves can bethat color.
Yeah. And I should say Iabsolutely love color. I love color
and surface in painting. And Iuse color more expressively and kind
of experimentally. So I don'tnecessarily follow anything that's
real. Right.
So. Right, right.

(08:10):
The leaves can be orange orblue or blue, green, or whatever
works in that composition.
Yeah. How did you choosepainting as your medium? Cause I
know sometimes you've jumpedaround to. You Know, installation
and even some video work. Butpainting seems to be, like, the foundation
for you.
Yeah, painting is myfoundation, and installation is my

(08:31):
second love.
Okay.
A newer love. Yeah. I've beena painter my whole life, and I began
as a realist painter. Like, Ithink a lot of this, we love to look
at the world. Like, I justremember always studying what things
looked like. And I did veryrepresentational watercolors. They

(08:51):
were landscape for the mostpart, although I did some portraits
when I was in high school, butlater it was more a landscape or
abstract. And then throughgrad school, my work became pretty
abstract, and I was alwaysjust. That's been sustained is the
love of color and surface. So,like, texture and things like that.
As the paintings grew larger,I kind of went back to a little bit

(09:14):
of my roots. When I was inChicago, I was a member of ARC Gallery,
where we had five galleryspaces. It was a huge space in a
warehouse. They're stillaround, but they are much, much smaller
now. And we had one gallerydedicated to installation. It was
like, I think, the first placein the country that did that. And
I would go every month andlook at installations from artists

(09:37):
around the country and just bein awe of what they were doing with
simple materials and justtransforming the space. And I always
wanted to do that, but itdidn't feel right for my work. And
then when my paintings gotbigger, I wanted to, like, immerse
people in the painting as Ifeel when I'm immersed in a forest,
where. When I'm in a forest,everything is. My sensations are

(09:59):
heightened. Color and textureare all very vivid for me, and so
that colors come in through inthe paintings. But I started to have
this desire to actually,literally immerse people. And I was
also growing more and moreinterested and aware of environmental
issues and climate change andwanted to focus on those specifically

(10:22):
in the installation.
That is so cool. I loveinstallation work, too. I love seeing
it. You know, I alwaysthought, you know, yeah, you can
like, make a room of, like,what you want people to see and experience
and get as close to it aspossible in your own interpretation.
It doesn't have to be real,but, like, see it how you see it.

(10:43):
Yeah. My first installationwas all white, sheer trees that I
called spirit trees because Iwas thinking about the logging in
the northern Wisconsin, like,you know, and when I hike, I'm always
looking for the oldest,largest trees. And in the north here,
it takes a really long timefor them to grow. And so. And I know

(11:07):
that from reading that theEuropeans came in to the Great Lakes.
And they just harvested allthese massive pines that were there
to build the sailing ships andall of that that would keep, you
know, kept the trade andeverything going to North America.
And so I just imagine whatwould it have looked like before
they got here? And can it everlook like that again? Like, I would

(11:30):
wish. So that firstinstallation with all white trees,
I think of white as a sort ofa funeral color, like the absence
of life and the draining ofcolor. And so I was able to kind
of try to give this sort ofghostly feeling as people walk through
those translucent trees.
Yeah. Uh, for the listener.Can you. Do you. Do you know the

(11:51):
name of that installation? Doyou remember the name of it?
Yeah, that was called Vigil.
Okay. Vigil. All right. Yeah.That's beautiful. Yeah, I remember
seeing. When you were postingabout that one on Instagram.
Yeah.
And whatnot. You know, theysay, I heard that, like, trees have
feelings.
They do, kind of. Yeah.There's a researcher that I. I love

(12:13):
to read about. Susan's Simondor Symard. I forget. I think it's
Simon. She's out in the upperwest coast and she's done a lot of
studies about how treesinterconnect. Like, they can actually
communicate with each otherthrough the root systems. It's pretty
widely known now, but she'sthe one that discovers that. And

(12:33):
so they send chemical systemsand things. So if they feel some
kind of a danger or a threat,they can send signals to other trees
in the forest and they canactually send nutrients. So they
can feed other trees. Theycan. They can even recognize their
young, which is mind bogglingto me. Whoa. So they can't. I know.

(12:53):
It's like, isn't that cool?Like, they. They can recognize their
babies and say, I'm going togive you a little bit more food.
Can they. When people go andhug trees, can trees feel that?
I don't know. I'm not sure. Idon't know if they can feel like
that.
Maybe I just wonder when youwere speaking about the whole, like,
harvesting the trees for theships, if they were like, oh my gosh,

(13:14):
guys, this is terrible. Like,and if there was like a screaming
amongst them, you know, and I know.
I wonder.
It's awful. That's awful. Didthat happen?
Yeah.
Oh, my goodness. Well, youknow, how could city folks get into
trees and being a part offorest and, you know, I live.
In a city and I grew up in acity and the trees are everywhere

(13:36):
and there's such a thingcalled an urban forest. So those
trees are really important. SoI think just when you go on a daily
walk, or if you do or whenjust you're going running about,
just pay attention to them.Each tree has sort of its own kind
of bark. Their leaves,obviously are different. Notice if
they're healthy or are they indecline. Are there branches bare

(13:58):
of leaves? You know, thingslike that. I think just appreciate
them. And if you have a treeon property that you can take care
of. I remember I talked to ascientist, and she said, I wish people
would take care of trees likethey take care of their pets. Wow.
Yeah. But you know what? Now,this is going to be some tree prejudice,

(14:19):
but the little tree that Ihave in front of my house, for some
reason, I don't hold it in thesame regard as, like, a forest tree,
because maybe because it wasbrought in there or, you know, like,
you see the city, you know,like, when I go visit my parents,
you know, they're. Their localcity was out planting trees, and

(14:39):
it just seems like moredecorative. But maybe I shouldn't
think that way.
Yeah, I would think about,like, what they're doing is they're.
When they get big, they'regoing to give you free air conditioning,
and they're going to bebeautiful. They are taking carbon
out of the atmosphere, sothey're cleaning up the air that

(15:01):
you're breathing. So they'redoing a lot of great thing. Like
when. When I was a kid, the.We had. We lived in a pretty modest
neighborhood, and the mostbeautiful thing was the trees. We
had all these elm trees thatwere gorgeous, and, like, there was
like a cathedral over thestreet. And then Dutch elm disease

(15:22):
came through and wiped out allthe trees, and they. So when I. I
don't know how old I was, butthey came through and they cut them
all down. And so now therewere no trees, and we didn't have
air conditioning, so, like, itwas hot and it wasn't as pretty,
you know? So I think we shouldbe grateful for those trees that
we have. Okay.
Sri, I love you out here.

(15:43):
Very good.
Yes, I will. I'll hold. I'lltreat. I'll treat all trees the same.
Just like humans, right? Justlike humans and our pets.
Yeah.
I will hold it into high regard.
There we go.
My gosh. Okay. Well, thank youfor that lesson. Yeah. You know,
back to your color. Back toyour pretty color, you know, and,
you know, you just sort oftook me through, like, a little bit

(16:04):
of ecological lesson, and I'mcurious, you know, like, what does.
What role does beauty play? Inaddressing, you know, complex ecological
issues. Because your work isso important, because it is of the
environment, about theenvironment, but it is also beautiful.
And I know that art is. Iguess my question is. Yeah, what

(16:25):
role does that do you think about?
I don't think about creatingbeautiful paintings intentionally.
I work with color and surfaceand composition until I get it to
look the way I want. That itfeels balanced and has interest.
But I think that makingsomething that's interesting for
people to look at. Like, I'mhoping when people see the work in

(16:46):
person, that they see all thelines and the marks and the textures
that I take so long to create.
Yeah.
And that it makes the peoplecurious. So I think. And in the installations,
I'm hoping that by creatingsomething that has some visual appeal
that is enticing people totake a closer look. Maybe, like,

(17:06):
if it's in an exhibition or onmy website or Instagram or wherever,
I usually write about some ofthe ideas in the work. And so that's
a way of, like, I don't expectpeople to necessarily understand
from looking at it what it'sabout. Cause it's about a lot of
different things and differentthings to different people. But it's
a way of using the visual todraw people into some deeper concepts.

(17:30):
When you go on your walks andtake in this. Are you taking pictures?
Do you paint from memory?
I do both. I take a lot ofphotographs. Like, if you back. It's
been quite a while now, but Iwas working a lot with tree bark.
And I would walk with mysister once a week. And I would stop
and go. I would be gaspinglike, oh, my gosh, look at that.

(17:51):
Look at that. And my sister'snot an artist. And she's like, what?
She's very efficient. Wants tokeep on walk, walk, walk as fast.
And I would. So I'd bephotographing. And my husband, when
we. We hike together a lot.And I walk faster than him. So I
stop and take photographs whenI, like, see certain compositions
or, like, certain. I'm reallyinterested in the generational relationships

(18:14):
in forests. And that visually,that is like the wide vertical bands
and the narrow bands. Peoplesometimes comment. And it took me
a while to realize I'm notpainting ever branches. They're always
the tree trunks. I would love.That's true. Like, it would be fun
to paint all those wonderful,gnarly branches. I would love that.

(18:36):
But what means so much to meis those trees as, like, bodies.
The compositional and therhythm, like music. The spaces between
the vertical lines of the Treetrunks. And the other thing is, when
I'm in the north, those areoften pine trees, and they're denser
forests. And so the lowerbranches are either chewed off by

(18:57):
the deer or they're broken offbecause they're not getting enough
sunlight from the dense canopyabove. And so I just don't see branches.
Like, I just see thosevertical lines. And so, yeah, I do
photograph. But then when I'min my studio, sometimes I will look
at the photographs to justkind of bring me back to the forest,
maybe get a pattern of thevertical lines and the spacing. And

(19:20):
then I pretty much put it away.
Yeah, you get like, areference point and then just go,
take off.
Just to start.
Yeah. You know, as the kidssay. Then you start cooking. Yeah.
Then you start cook. Messingwith the paint and getting dirty.
Yes. Oh, my gosh. Do you paintevery day?
No, I can't. I wish I could. Itry to, but there's, you know, all
the other advent andapplications and stuff you have to

(19:43):
do.
Yeah. I just. I hate that.
I do, too.
It's like a necessary evil,obviously, because you have to. You
know, you work so hard to makethis work, and then you want to show
it, but it's just, you know,sometimes I have to trick myself
into. Especially this summer,as we're recording this, I've been
really into popsicles. I mean,who doesn't? Who doesn't? Not like

(20:06):
a popsicle, But I've always.I've, like, been rewarding myself
with a popsicle. Like, afteryou finish this app. You got a popsicle?
There you go.
I just go to the freezer. But.Oh, they're so good. You, like, build
any sort of, like, treat infor yourself as you finish, like,
admin work. Hmm.
I get to read.
Ooh, that's good.
Yeah. Cause usually I'mworking until pretty late.

(20:28):
Yeah.
And I find. I try to. I keepthinking, like, I get up, I eat my
breakfast in front of thecomputer, as if I could magically
get rid of all the stuff thathas to get done by the time I get
done with breakfast so I cango to my studio. But then that never
happens. So I sit in front ofthe computer with my. My pajamas
and my espresso and then mywater bottle, and then it's like

(20:49):
three hours later, and Ihaven't showered.
Yeah.
So that's kind of sometimeshow the days go. But I paint often
at night because if I haven'tpainted during the day and I have
to get away from the computerso I can go to sleep later, then
I can go. My studio's in mybasement. So I go down and it's like,
wow, I'm here.
Yeah. That's one of the thingsthat's really nice about having a

(21:12):
home studio. Cause I feel likeeven when I've had, you know, my
work at the residency, I feellike there's always been, like, a
certain time where I'm like,oh, it's getting pretty late. I better
wrap up.
Right.
You know, and when you're athome, you don't have to say, you
better wrap up.
No, I mean, at some point,yeah. But it's not like you have
to get in the car or walksomewhere or you just go upstairs.

(21:32):
When you do paint, are youpainting in. Do you work, like, in
a series? Or do you do, like,one painting and say, okay, that's
done, and then move to thenext one? Or. How do you think about
your work in that way?
I think about it in seriesbecause of the ideas and the themes
and often the visuals. I don'tfinish always before I move on. It
kind of depends on what thestate of that painting is like. Some

(21:55):
I struggle with so much, and Ijust can't. I don't know what to
do. So I put it aside, startsomething else, and then I get a
fresh look at it. So. But theimagery, like, my work is evolving
right now, and I'm not quitesure. You never know where it's going
to take you.
Yeah.
And I don't know if this ispart of the previous series or if

(22:19):
it's kind of its own new.
Yeah. What's that like to.
Move?
Like to keep working and notknowing where you're going?
It's scary. It's terrifying.It's like, I feel like sometimes
I look and think I don't knowwhat I'm doing, but the painting
is telling me, this is whatyou need to do. And so I have to

(22:41):
follow it. I figure easier tojust. I don't know if it's easier,
but I just move forward, andthen I can always not show it, you
know, and I'll move on to the next.
Yeah. See, even as soon as Iasked you that question, I got, like,
little, like, tingles in mystomach. I know, because I think
with, like, filmmaking, youknow, you know where it's going.

(23:03):
You have your script and youknow what the story is. So there
isn't really going to be aplace where, you know, if it's a
story of a girl walking downthe street, where. But now she's
walking into an office. Youknow, it's like, no, we all know
that this was the plan. Imean, I guess you could, but, you
know, for the most part, thereis a beginning, middle, end, versus
with your work.

(23:23):
Let's say somebody was walkinginto that building, and then an eagle
swooped, like, in front ofher. Wouldn't she want to, like,
find a way to get that, towork it into the story?
Yeah, that's true. Yeah,that's right. I'd be like, oh, my
gosh. Okay. Yeah, now we haveto figure out, one, how to get that
little girl back, and thentwo, how to figure out how to make
it work in the story. Yeah,that's true. Yeah, it's like. Yeah,

(23:45):
it's just interesting. Like,just sort of working into an unknown,
I guess. I feel like I. I'mtrying to be more like that, but
it doesn't seem to. I feellike a tension in my stomach, you
know, from.
Well, I definitely feel thattoo, sometimes. Like, there's a painting.
I think it's finished now.It's part of this new body of work

(24:06):
that's emerging. And I startedit with this sort of wanting to make
this background kind of likethe painting you referenced before.
Was it between Heaven andEarth? A space between Heaven and
Earth? Because I loved thatpainting. And it started to get more
specific, and this cloud formemerged. Cause I'm working with these.

(24:29):
I've been fascinated byatmospheric rivers for the last few
years. And the ideas of theiratmospheric rivers are these huge
clouds. Usually they. Theyused to talk about them as forming
over the Pacific Ocean. And ifyou look on the weather map, they're
these long, serpentine, like,snaky, kind of winding, beautiful
cloud patterns. And they. Theydrop massive amounts of rain in one

(24:54):
spot, causing a lot offlooding, and then depriving other
areas of water. And so thenthey're causing drought. And I. I
became more and moreinterested in it because I've been
interested in the water andthe carbon cycle for a long time.
I like systems and how thosebig systems and the little systems
work. And here where I live,we had gone through about five years

(25:16):
of drought, where the farmersin the outer areas around here were
struggling with their crops.In my backyard, my trees were not
looking very good. You know,the plants. I'm not going to waste
water on grass. So the grassis all looking dead. And, you know,
it was pretty rough. And thenwe had. After about four or five
years, we had this massivedownpour, like flooding, a little

(25:38):
bit of flooding. And thentrees are toppling I think. I don't
know if this is true, but Iimagine that over the drought, roots
were shrinking and dying andthen. And also the water could not
be absorbed in the soil. Sothese trees were falling, there was
power out. We were out withpower, like, four days right before

(25:59):
a solo show. That was notcool. Oh, my gosh. You know, kind
of just made me reallyinterested in what's happening with
climate and how theprecipitation patterns are changing.
And so these atmosphericrivers, they can hold as much water
or more as the Amazon river upin the sky.
Wow.

(26:20):
Like, that's amazing. Yeah,it's just hard to comprehend. Like,
that's heavy water. Right. Andso it's going to fall at some point.
So my paintings, I'm startingto. About a year and a half ago,
I started to have these sortof curvilinear, somewhat abstracted
cloud like forms that werebecoming part of the paintings. And

(26:42):
so that's what I had startedthat in the painting I was mentioning.
Before. Meaning? Well, I meantit to be much more soft, but it became
more specific in this kind ofspiral that's kind of moving through
the painting. And it wasmaking me so nervous, and I finally
decided to leave it and giveit what else it needed. And I think

(27:03):
it's done now, and I think I'mokay with it, but. Okay, we'll see
what happens next.
We'll see.
Yeah.
My gosh. So is Atmosphericriver something that. Like a new
body of work that you're alsogonna be working on?
Yeah, it's finding in thepaintings right now. I feel like
I'm splitting my attentionbetween the water shields and damselflies,
which what I call the body ofwork that the space between heaven

(27:27):
and Earth is part of, with allthe ovals and the trees and sometimes
a horiz and these new sort ofwhat I think of as climate spirits.
Like, I think about thoseatmospheric rivers and those cloud
formations, kind of likeclimate spirits that are a little
malicious and capricious.Like, maybe I'm going to give you

(27:48):
water here, but I'm not goingto give you guys water over there
because you've been messing upthe planet. So here you go. So that's
happening in my paintings, butalso I been incorporating ideas in
the installations where Iincorporate, like, flasks of water
gathered from local sourcesthat I've exhibited with those suspended

(28:10):
trees that people know me for.But now I'm working on for the solo
show at Ripon College that'scoming up in a couple months. I'm
working with Cyanotype whichis a photo, you probably know it,
photographic process. And Idon't have much or like any experience
with cyanotype and, and I'mworking on a huge scale which was
terrifying, exhausting butpretty exciting too. So I'm making

(28:34):
like 36 inch wide by about15ft long cyanotypes on a lightweight
cotton, was it cheesecloth?And using a variety of images to
create these sort of flowinglike this fabric that I can then
use in a flowing cloud likestructure that will be a suspended

(28:56):
in this exhibition.
My friend Krista just had hada bunch of friends over for like
craft day and we were puttingleaves on cyanotype paper.
Oh yeah, right.
Yeah. Is that sort of like thesame kind of process that you're
doing then?
Yeah, similar.
And like leaving it out in thesun and stuff.
Yeah. But you know, as, youknow as you're a photographer, when

(29:17):
you work with light sensitivematerial, the exposure time at around
noon or 1 o' clock is 10minutes. And so to try to arrange
things on 15ft at 36 incheswide into.
It'S like ah, by yourself.
Well, I had help, I had help.I had like, yeah, I had help with

(29:39):
it, but I had a kind of a planand I had all this stuff laid along
on the driveway and I startedkind of putting things on and yeah,
I had a system. Okay. It wastricky, man.
You know, speaking of systems,when you paint, do you work on like
one painting at a time or doyou work on like four at a time?
I've seen like some artistshave like in their studio, like one

(30:00):
painting here, one paintingthere. How do you work?
I work, I focus on one at atime, but I often have several going
at the same time. But it'smore like the one I'm focused on
is what I, I, I, I'm dedicatedto. Cause the palettes are often
different. Like I'm not goodat keeping the same palette. I don't

(30:21):
want, I get, I'm notinterested in keeping the same palette
constantly. And there's littlemixtures. Like I have lots and lots
of mixtures that I make. Andso I need to keep those until I finish
a paint. In case I like, Imess up one area, I've got to go
back and kind of work into itagain. So I've got some of the same
color.
Yeah. Is it hard to, is itwhen you mix colors, is it just by

(30:45):
experimentation or do you havelike a color that you see in your
mind of what you wantsomething to be and then you just
go after it.
I often have a color in mind,but color is very elusive. Like,
I used to teach color theoryand I know all the theory, but wow,
you know, you mix it on thepalette against the white background
or whatever other colors areon the palette. And then I go to

(31:08):
the painting and still I'mlike, that's not what I wanted. That's
not what it looked like overthere. And so, you know, just keep
fine tuning until it works.
You've completed someresidencies, and I know artists,
you know, love a goodresidency. Can you talk about how
I know you, the residenciesthat you've done at Trout Lake and
St. Croix watershed. Can youtalk about how that's influenced

(31:31):
your art and thinking andmaybe why an artist might want to
consider a residency?
I'm really happy to talk aboutthose two residencies. They were
my first residencies and theywere science based and I was alone.
So I'm the only artist there.And at St. Croix, I went there first.
And I went there wanting tobring together two separate themes

(31:57):
in my work that I've beenworking with for decades. And one
is water and the water cyclethat I've used in a lot of different
ways, symbolically andabstractly. And the other is forest.
And there's such a connectionbetween the two. Very close. And
I just wanted to think abouthow to bring them together in my
work. And I wanted to learnmore about them and also their connection

(32:19):
to climate. So the people atthe residency at St. Croix connected
me with a professor atUniversity of Minnesota who's a forester.
So I talked to him and Italked to like some of the water
scientists there. And I thinkthe seeds were planted there for
what I later did about. Ithink it was the next year at Trout
Lake Research Station. So thatwas during COVID And so I had limited

(32:44):
time with the scientistsbecause we had to be outdoor, which
was unfortunate, but we wouldgo for walks. And that's where I
mentioned earlier, the waterShield plant. That's where I met
the scientists who had studiedthem and knew so much about them.
And I had never paidattention. I didn't know. I probably
looked at them and thought,oh, you know, there's some floating

(33:05):
plants. And so now I becameobsessed with them. Cause they also.
It was fall when I was there.I was out kayaking and I was looking
for them. And I came acrosssome where the leaves were changing
colors, like from this sort ofwine, red wine color to still to
some greens floating on thelake that's reflecting the sky. And

(33:25):
then I'M thinking about theconnections that, like, they're making,
their roots are making withthe soil at the bottom of the lake
and then the shelter that theyprovide for the fish and things like
that. So I learned a lot aboutthat. And the little oval forms,
like I said before, I becameobsessed with those kind of like
Larry Poon's painting, likethese dot paintings where the colors

(33:46):
sort of vibrate against thesolid background. That's visually,
was a big influence. So then Italked to another scientist, Gretchen
Gerrish, who's the director ofthe station, and her research had
been focused on the damselfly,which I really didn't know what it
was.
Yeah. What is that?

(34:06):
It's. It's like a. It's like acousin, a smaller cousin of the dragonfly.
They're more delicate, bodyiridescent. Like, around here, there's
a lot of little delicate,like, iridescent turquoise bodies.
And then their wings are kindof transparent. And so she talked
about how, like. Like I said,I like systems, and that includes.

(34:28):
I'm curious about how doinsects lay their eggs like, there.
It's kind of based on waterand, like, small, quiet lakes that
I love to kayak on. So what istheir life cycle? And so she. We're
walking along, and there'sthis teeny little stream. And she
said, well, let me see if Ican find a larvae. And she like,

(34:49):
what? So she just croucheddown, picked up some, like, debris,
like, that looked like sometwigs and roots and stuff. And then
out of that, she plucks thislittle squirming little thing and
put it in her hand. And I'mlooking at, like, that looks like
a scorpion, like, but it, youknow, it's tiny.
Yeah.

(35:10):
And so she put it in my hand.I'm like, okay, okay. And that was
this arching kind of littlething. So I, you know, I learned
from her that the dragonfliesdeposit their eggs into the water,
they dip their tails in thewater, and the eggs sink into the
muck. And they can stay therefor like a year or two. And then
the larvae start to grow, andthen they come out of the water,

(35:33):
probably through littlestreams and at the edge and things,
and then they turn into these beautiful.
Wow.
Damselflies. So, you know, itjust inspired new imagery in my work
and a deeper understanding ofhow nature works, because that's
important for me. It also,those residencies gave me a lot of

(35:55):
time to be by myself withoutoutside distractions. I don't have
to worry about anybody else'sschedule and just to work and focus
on my work and then hike alot, kayak, take a lot of photographs
and things like that.
So you're not afraid of bugs?
It depends on what they are.Like, oh, okay. I'm wasps and bees.

(36:17):
Oh, yeah.
You know, I'm a littlesqueamish, but I am fascinated. Like,
I have a couple paintings thatI incorporated mosquitoes, eggs and
larvae in, and I looked up howdid mosquitoes lay their eggs? And
it was like, it was very cool.I do not like mosquitoes. I mean,

(36:40):
like, I hate them. But whatI've been learning is, like, every
little part of the ecosystemfor the ecosystem to thrive, because
the fish need to eat the.Those mosquitoes and the larvae,
and they. They eat thedamselfly larvae. Like, it's the
cycle, whether we like it ornot. If they aren't there, you know,

(37:02):
we're in trouble.
Yeah, that's true. You'regiving me a little bit of appreciation
for them because I don't likewhen I'm riding my bike and those
big dragonflies are out. Icannot stand that.
Oh, wow.
They. They get in your face.
Oh, yeah. That wouldn't like.
And they like to. They liketo. They, like, know what they're
doing. They're like, oh, letme bother Stephanie on her bike.
She probably thinks she'ssweet. Let's go see.

(37:25):
But the damselflies, I mightnot mind them as much because they
don't seem to be as huge. Imean, they just make such an impact,
those dragonflies.
Yeah, dragonflies are big andtheir bodies are big and thick. The
damselflies, I've had themland on my kayak and, like, they're
just so beautiful.
So what are you working onnow? What are you up to now? You

(37:46):
know?
Well, I'm getting ready forthat show, and so I'm kind of nervously
working on that installationthat I was talking about with the
cyanotypes. I have to do acouple more waiting for the temperatures
to drop a little bit, so Ihave to make a few more of those.
And then I'm working on howthat's going to look in that space
and then trying to get somemore paintings finished for that

(38:08):
show. Because I'm going to aresidency. This will be very different
than my other one. So I'mgoing to Pooch Cove in Newfoundland.
So I'm super excited. That'llbe in September. Yeah, there.
I went there. I went there.
Yeah, I know you did. Yeah.Yeah. And I listened to your podcast.
You talked to. Actually, youdid an interview with James, right?

(38:29):
Yes.
And then Gerry Rush. Yeah.Yeah. So I'm so excited to go there.
And that'll be great becauseI'll be with six other artists, and
so it'll be this. We'll beable to do studio visits and kind
of check in with each otherand just, like, be together. So that'll
be cool.
That is. You're going toreally, really enjoy it, I think.

(38:50):
I think you're really going toenjoy it, and I love that you're
going and, you know, you'vedone so much, so many different projects
and stuff. I'm asking thisquestion for a specific listener,
but can you talk about aproject if you're comfortable that
might not have gone as plannedand, like, you know, how. How they
might have shaped yourpractice, you know, just because

(39:11):
I. I don't know. The work isso pretty, you know, it's nice to
know that. Not nice to know,like, ha, ha, look at what happened
to you. But, you know, justlike, no, we always see the finished
product, you know.
Exactly. We see the finishedproduct, and you have no idea of
the struggles that went intoit. Yeah. I have a specific project
in mind that I'll talk about,but I wanted to start by saying,

(39:35):
so many paintings I strugglewith, and I don't know what they're
gonna look like. And I havehad paintings that I just think look
absolutely horrible. I don'tknow what to do, but I've been persistent,
and I stick with it untilmaybe I put it aside and come back.
And sometimes those are thedeepest and the strongest works.

(39:58):
And so I think it takes youinto surprising places. But I had
a situation where I hadapplied for an insulation that was
gonna incorporate these leafdrawings that I've made. I've made
them before, but I wanted tomake a new set for this show along
with this central tree thatwould be suspended. And my proposal

(40:19):
was accepted, but given thetime that I learned that it was accepted
and then when the show wasgonna be that I couldn't make that
work because I needed, like,real live leaves and that they were
like. It just wasn't gonnawork out. So then, like, oh, God,
like, what am I gonna do forthe. With the walls? And what. What

(40:40):
else am I doing with thatspace? And that's when I think I
had planned to do the videoalready. That's my first and, so
far only video production ofone wall. I thought, well, okay,
I can't do the leaves. Whatelse can I do that relates to trees?
And I thought, well, I'll makethese linen panels that will be in
the same format, like, scrolldrawings that are about, like, 40

(41:00):
inches wide by 10ft tall. So Istarted working with linen gauze
and then India ink. Indiaink's to symbolize carbon because
it is literally carbon made ofbirth particles. And so I made those,
and they just didn't workflat. They just kind of hung there.
So I thought, well, all right.And I. And I was like, what I. What

(41:21):
I'm not saying is I wasagonizing for months, like, what
am I going to do? And tryingthings and experimenting with a lot
of different materials andideas. And I finally decided, I'll
take these linen pieces andsew them into cylinders. And before
I do that, I'm going to burnholes into them. So in addition to
the carbon from the India ink,there's going to be holes, because
these are. The whole show wasabout climate change and, you know,

(41:45):
and, you know, talk about theeffect of drought on trees. They're
more susceptible to fire andjust dying when they're dry. So I
was burning holes in and sewedthem together and then showed them
as a group. And I was soexcited about that. Like, it ended
up being much more meaningful,more deep and. And surprising to

(42:07):
me. And so now I feel likefire is part of my repertoire.
Yeah. I like it, like, when itflips, when it comes out unexpected,
like.
Yeah. And I think that theanswer to this or the lesson, I guess,
is to not give up. Like,there's gonna be painful struggle
that can make you feel sostupid or incompetent or whatever

(42:29):
words we throw at ourselves.But it's like, you. Sometimes you
just have to keep pluggingaway at it. Don't give up on the
idea, but let it evolve andtry. And at some point, like, I think
I had the deadline, I had theshow, so I had to make a commitment,
so I had to stop playing. Ihad to make a decision and go with
it. And I had played enoughthat it did work, but it was really

(42:55):
a difficult time.
You know, Katherine, whenyou're working, do you have, like,
anyone look at your work inprogress and give you feedback, or
are you just stepping back andmaking all the shots or making all
the decisions about that onyour own?
Oh, that's such a goodquestion. I have a couple friends
around that I do ask, andtheir opinions are really valuable.

(43:18):
My husband, almost every day,like, when I'm working in my studio,
especially painting, I makehim come and look at it.
Is he an artist?
No, he's not. He's anengineer. He's a. But he's been around
art with me for many decades.But I'll ask my sister who's not
an artist. I'll ask anybodywho's coming into the house. When
I need feedback, I've learnedis that they may identify something

(43:43):
that bothers them or doesn'tfeel right. Doesn't mean that that's
the part that needs changing.It doesn't mean anything needs changing.
But it often gets me to lookat it in a different way. Then I
find my own solution. But Ihave to be careful. Cause sometimes
I've had artists come over toand get feedback, and then I've sort

(44:04):
of thought, oh, that soundslike a great idea. I'll do it. And
then it doesn't work. And Ithink partly because maybe I was
looking for an easy answer andI didn't think about it, or maybe
it just wasn't. They look atwork in a different way than what
I'm. You know, we have to beour own final voice because we know
what feels right.

(44:25):
Yeah. I think that that makesa lot of sense. Like about trusting
your gut.
Yeah.
Does that just come with time,you think or experience?
It comes with time. It comessometimes at certain days that it
comes, you know, like, howwell did you sleep? What were your
interactions with the rest ofthe world like? Are you in kind of

(44:45):
feeling vulnerable that day?There's a lot of. I mean, I think
being an artist is so hard.
I agree.
You know, people think, like,if I introduce myself and they say,
what do you do? And I say, I'man artist. Like, how nice. And, you
know, and all of us artistsare like, well, it is, but.
Right. Yeah.

(45:06):
You don't see the agony behindthe image.
Right. Yeah. I was thinking,as I had asked you, that I'm like,
yeah, I do think that also, itfeels like you have to be extreme
experimental too. Right.Because when you do trust that, when
you do trust yourself and youput it out there and you might get,
like a reverse response, youknow, you still have to think like,
okay, well, am I okay withwhat they just said? Or like, okay,

(45:29):
well, let me try again. Like,you. You still have to. You still
continue to ask yourself these questions.
Right.
And you just have to make yetanother decision and just keep going.
Right? Yeah, exactly. And Ithink you used the word decision,
and that's something I thinkpeople don't think about with art.
I think they sort of thinkit's like, go with your. Whatever
it feels like. Right. But it'sa constant sequence of decisions.

(45:54):
What color Is it gonna be. Howbig is it gonna be? Do I. Does it
need another layer? Does itneed whatever, more contrast? Does
it need another something overthere? Does it, like, you know, whatever
you're making, it's. There's alot of decision making, and sometimes
it's intuitive and you justkind of go with. I mean, at least
for me, sometimes I'm just. Ijust go with it. But then as I'm

(46:16):
finalizing, it's. There's.It's. There's a lot of decisions.
Even what materials I do, Iwork with. Right.
Oh, my gosh. Yeah. And I feellike, even, like, on top of being
an artist, being a human,because after you make all those
decisions, then you might haveto make a decision about, like, what's
for dinner. Yeah.
No, exactly.
I mean, seriously, it's like,now you have to, like, maybe run

(46:38):
to the grocery store, Right.Run up to Walgreens and, like, pick
up something. It's like, oh,my gosh.
Yeah. That decision on dinneris the one that's. Because I'm the
cook in our house and myhusband's the dishwasher, which is
great, but I'm like, everyday, like, four o', clock, do I have
food in the house? What am Igoing to do with it? And how long

(47:00):
is it going to take? And can Ikeep painting for another hour?
Right, right. Oh, my gosh. Ifeel like you might have to have
your husband on another time.For, like. For, like, if my spouse
is an artist, this is what todo. Oh, my gosh.
I don't know. I think he'sstill learning. He's been. He's a
great help, though.
Yeah. Is there a specificnatural phenomenon that you've been

(47:22):
obsessing over recently?You've told us, like, about the damselflies,
like, the different floatingplants, like the atmospheric rivers.
Anything new that, like, hascome to your attention?
Well, I would say it's theatmospheric rivers.
Okay.
A pretty new obsession. Yeah.It's like. And that along with drought,

(47:42):
and I call it drought anddeluge. But, like, really mean, like,
drought and flooding and theinterconnection with trees and forests
and water and just, you know,what's happening in our world. Yeah.
What? Do you have any thoughtsfor just, like, how we're treating
the world, like, in oureveryday, like, things that we could

(48:03):
be doing better.
I'm a fan of nature. I don'tuse the word activist.
Yeah.
But maybe a spokesperson maybewould be better. I'd be more comfortable
with that.
Ambassador.
Yeah, Ambassador. I love that.I Feel like an activist. I really
respect that they're out maybecleaning things up, going and sending

(48:26):
leaflets or making phone callsor, you know, planting trees. I mean,
I plant trees in my yard, butit's now. But it's more of an ambassador.
I think we need to think abouthow much waste we have. And I'm guilty.
Like, everyone is. Every timeI buy something, I'm like, oh, do
I really need that? But tryingto reuse. Like, I do my best to avoid

(48:50):
buying water bottles or evento, like, if I go to an event. I
try not drink water. I mean,sometimes I do. But I hate, like,
the disposaling everything.Like, water bottles, coffee cups.
Like, we can all make our owncoffee or tea at home in a reusable.
Like, they make stainlesssteel things that'll last pretty
much forever or almost, youknow, and stuff like that. So choosing.

(49:13):
Like, I was somewhere tastingvinegar, and they had this little
plastic spoon, and she wasgonna give me two different ones
to taste. I'm like, could justuse the same spoon. And then I asked,
like, can you recycle that?Oh, no, we can't. So, like, they're
a business where they'rethrowing away probably thousands
of things a day or hundreds aday. You know, like, we just have
to think about, like, do Ineed to make that car trip? Could

(49:37):
I. Like, I try to route myroute in an efficient way. So I think
we just have to. And I thinkthe thing that I'm passionate about,
the idea that every singleindividual can make a difference.
I think Greta Thunberg saysthe same thing, believes the same
thing. People sometimes willsay, oh, we have to wait. The corporations

(50:00):
and the government has to doit. Well, our government is not going
to do it right now, and it'surgent. And so if we all make different
buying decisions and actdifferently, all those actions add
up. And then if we changebuying habits, then the companies
will follow us because theywant to make money. Right? So aware

(50:22):
of what you're using and howyou're using it.
And there she is, folks.Katherine Mother Earth. Lovin Steichen
Rosen. You know, one thingthat really stuck with me from this
conversation is how Katherinesaid, we have to be our own final
voice. Like, how true is that?I am going to lean into that more

(50:45):
because I feel like evensometimes when I'm questioning some
type of decision, whether itbe creative or not, I start thinking,
oh, should I get feedback? Butthen I stop and ask myself, like,
is that even really necessary?Do I really need the feedback? Because
honestly, not all the time. DoI need someone to co sign me? You
know, I'm about to co signmyself. You know, co sign yourself.

(51:09):
Anyway, when we talked,Katherine was on her way to Canada
for her residency at PoochCove. But she's back now and has
a few shows coming up. So I'mgoing to tell you about two of them,
but make sure you head to herwebsite and join her newsletter so
you don't miss anything. Sothe first one I'm gonna tell you
about is a solo exhibition. Idon't know if we have a title for

(51:31):
it yet, but it's gonna be atthe K. Stecker Gallery, which is
in Ripon College in Ripon,Wisconsin. And that is October 17th.
And she's even gonna have aartist talk October 17th. So mark
your calendar and make sureyou head there and then this show
is a little bit further out.But I'm gonna tell you anyway while

(51:52):
I have your ear as that,Katherine has a solo Exhib Kim Storage
Gallery, which is inMilwaukee, Wisconsin, and that is
opening up April 17th of 2026.And that'll be on view from April
17th through May 23rd with anartist talk on April 18th. Okay.

(52:15):
This is all things KatherineSteichen Rosing episode and I really
hope you enjoyed it. That's itfor today's episode of Nosiaga. Thank
you. Thank you so much forlistening. And until next time, you
know, stay nosy, stay curious,and keep making the work you only
can make. And I will talk toyou later. Bye. This has been another
episode of noseyAF. I'm yourhost, Stephanie Graham. What did

(52:40):
you think about today'sconversation? I would love to hear
your thoughts. Head over tothe noseyAF website for all the show
notes related to this episode.You can also find me on Instagram,
Instagram at Stephanie Graham,what would you know? Or online@missgraham.com
where you can sign up for mynewsletter where I share exclusive
updates about my studiopractice as well as this podcast.

(53:01):
Until next time, y' all staycurious and take care. Bye.

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Using Art to Process Climate Anxiety and Loss with Katherine Steichen Rosing