November 2, 2024 • 23 mins
Agatha All Along’s executive producer Mary Livanos joins BD and Aaron for a spoiler-filled discussion about the MCU’s magical new series. This chat dives into all things Agatha but also discusses some of Livanos’ other recent projects, such as WandaVision and The Marvels. Take a trip down, down, down the road for all of the Agatha insights and more on Phase Hero!
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Episode Transcript
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(00:13):
Phase Hero is back for anotherexciting episode, everybody.
Thank you so much for joining us today.
I am Brandon Davis.
I love doing this with you guysand we're talking Agatha all along.
We have a special guest, but first Igotta introduce my co host for today.
Aaron Perrine is here.
What's going on, everybody?
What's going on Aaron howyou feeling this morning?
Great, ready to travel backdown the witch's road again,
(00:36):
I love it.
I love it.
I love that this, listen, first,first time you came on FaZe Hero We
had the, we did the silent entrance.
I thought, hey, that couldbe the shtick going forward.
No, I'm glad we're doing this.
Thank you so much everybody foran epic Response to our first
episode on Wednesday of phase hero.
That was incredible.
We had a thousand people watching live.
(00:57):
That was insane.
Because you guys have been sosupportive because you guys have had
fun with us with all the things we'regoing to talk about on phase hero.
Marvel, DC, Star Wars, Gladiator,Invincible, anything you guys want to
talk about, we will yap about it with you.
And today, we are, as Aaron said,going back down the witch's road.
We have a live guest on Phase Zero today.
She has worked on such Marvel Studiostitles as Guardians of the Galaxy Volumes
(01:18):
2 and 3, Captain Marvel, WandaVision,The Marvels, and now She's the executive
producer on Agatha all along with avery exciting next project already
lined up, I believe in vision quest.
Maybe maybe we'll hearsomething about that today.
Please welcome to phasezero in the comment section.
Thank you for being here.
Mary Lovato's.
Hey, everybody.
(01:39):
Hey, Brandon.
Hey, Aaron.
Hey, Mary.
Thank you so much for hanging out with us.
I'm so stoked to
be here.
First of all I want to getto know you a little bit.
I want our audience to getto know you a little bit.
I'm a Gamecock, South Carolina.
You went to what I wouldcall . You see where it's going?
I know.
Where you going?
The other USC.
(01:59):
The other USC.
Yeah.
So it's, I just think it's really coolthat you went to Southern Cal film,
you're working at Marvel Studios now.
I would just love tohear about that journey.
Like how did you find yourself landing?
Yeah, for sure.
I'm a California girl.
I grew up going to comic book shops.
I knew I wanted to get into TVand film somehow, but my parents
(02:20):
were in the aerospace industry.
I really had no idea how to do that.
So I went to USC.
And I did their incrediblebusiness and film joint program.
But mostly I just interned the entiretime I was there and starting my
sophomore year of college, I I woulddrive in Manhattan beach and I would
drive by the old Marvel offices atthe time and see the big Marvel brick.
And I'm like, how do I get in there?
So I, at the time, this wasprobably like 2010 or 11.
(02:43):
I went to the website and I likecalled the number at the bottom
of the website and just weaseledmy way into getting an interview.
And then I interned there andI did research and development.
As well as cleaning the kitchenand delivering the mail for
the better part of a year.
And I worked at Comic Con and putout, research binders for Guardians
of the Galaxy 1 and got to read comicsand break them down and do the thing.
(03:06):
And it was always my hope that Icould land back at Marvel full time.
And after more work experience,the opportunity came up and it
was where I always wanted to be.
So I'm just a fan getting away with it.
That's unbelievable.
That's so cool.
That is so cool.
Yeah, it's escalated quite a bit.
Solidarity started out in thekitchen, in the mail room.
That's where all of the journey,the rest of the journey started.
(03:29):
But now you're actually a movie star.
You're featured as one of the starsof Toy Story alongside Simon Williams.
How does it feel to be a real lifemovie producer and an MCU movie star?
So honored.
It was really fun to work onGuardians of the Galaxy 2.
James Gunn is just so creativeand so wonderful and just
loves to celebrate the crew.
And so I appear on that poster withSimon Hatt, the associate producer
(03:51):
and James is a co exec producer who'smy buddy and it's a fond memory.
So it feels good.
All right.
Let's talk a little aboutAgatha all along here.
Which congratulations because everythingI see, people are loving this show,
like it's gotta be at this pointhonestly, we talked a bit about this
right before we started, but it hasto be a little bit relieving because
I imagine the nerves before yourelease a project like this, that,
(04:13):
there's gonna be so many eyeballs on.
are just something I'llnever even experience.
I don't even know if I could handle it.
So now that it's out there inthe world and people are loving
it, are you feeling good?
Are you feeling the love?
We are feeling the love.
It's really exciting.
It was a tall order tofollow up WandaVision.
And like WandaVision, the developmentand creation of these stories, it
just felt like a passion project.
(04:34):
That we were luckyenough to get to work on.
And, what's fun about these shows, it'slike for a while, they're like, just
completely unpitchable because they're soharebrained and there's so many layers.
So we were just so passionateabout these characters.
being created.
And we were so excited forthe representation that we
got to put up on screen.
And just really revealed really relievedthat we had some reveals left for
(04:56):
the finale that fans couldn't quitefigure out until the episodes aired.
So that was a win.
And it's just really heartening tosee such a wonderful, warm embrace.
From the fans, there was alot of heart we put into it.
So it's nice to have thatripple out into the world.
I you can really see the hearttoo, because like yesterday the
(05:17):
Marvel studios accounts put out.
The moments where the cast actuallyfirst got to see the witch's road and
like Jack literally leads them down thewitch's road, things out how, and it's
all practical and it's all wild that youguys built a forest inside somewhere.
And I was like, my goodness, thisthing is way bigger than any of
us could have possibly imagined.
How did you guys decide todo The Witch's Road here?
(05:40):
Yeah we had wonderfulpartners in production.
At first the stage that we had forThe Witch's Road was quite small and
they sprung and got us the biggest oneavailable in the Atlanta area, which
was incredible, so that's all in camera.
The backdrops were incredible,there were like beautiful like
mushrooms that lit up on set thatwe could change the lighting for.
It was fireflies embedded throughout.
It was really fully immersive andjust so wonderful for the cast to be
(06:05):
able to experience that in real time.
But how we ended up landing on theidea, in development, we knew we wanted
to embark on the witch's road, but wefound ourselves like, bummed out at
the thought of having to be surroundedby blue screen the entire time and
walking on like a painted foam floor,it's just not what we wanted to do.
And of course, in development.
(06:25):
We were talking about, how wewanted this to feel like Goonies
Jack wanted it to feel like legend.
We wanted it to feel tactile and real.
And so watching back the Wizardof Oz, the idea arose, why not?
Why not do backdrops?
Why not do miniatures?
Why not try to get this in camera?
There's something so timeless about it.
(06:45):
The golden age of fantasy and horrorwhere you can go back and watch
those movies and they don't feellike they've aged at all because of
the craftsmanship that went into it.
And it felt so right with this showto celebrate the craft of filmmaking
like we did with WandaVision.
It felt a wonderful similarspiritual way to approach the work.
(07:05):
I want to talk about episode seven,which I think is an absolute master.
And I know I'm not alone in that.
The time travel rulesare great as a lost fan.
I a was lost involved in the developmentof time travel rules, but also, just
that episode alone I just love tohear about the process developing it.
And did you know you had a banger on yourhands before, before you even saw the
We, we've loved the episode for so long.
(07:28):
It was a hard, it was avery hard one to crack.
Jack loves memento, Gia King, whowas a writer's assistant who became
a staff writer and co wrote thisepisode with Cameron Squires, who
is one of our WandaVision alums.
They did such a incredible jobfiguring out how to sequence this.
episode in a way that wouldmake sense and in a way that
(07:49):
would be rewarding to the fans.
It was incredibly ambitious andtook a lot of time to make sure
that the logic all checked out.
And then of course, filming itwas its own entire challenge.
Jack jumped in and directed thatepisode had, had to prep very quickly.
And Ishii Metcar, our associateproducer, like helped build like
a whole map for how the swordswould fall because it's confusing.
(08:10):
Like where in the sequence arewe, but what swords have fallen?
What?
What hasn't and getting that all oncamera was a huge task and our SFX
department just absolutely crushed it.
There was like a realsense of danger on the set.
And then when the cast came in, thiswas towards the end of our schedule.
And, we finished that last scenewhere Patty ushers all the witches
(08:30):
through the through the torture device.
And she was leaving set after thattape, we were going and everyone.
honest to God, we were all neartears and just trying to hold
it back, including the cast.
But I think you can feel like the rushof emotion all culminate in that episode.
And Patty's performanceis just so incredible.
(08:51):
We were so lucky to work with her.
And the
music and everything.
It's just so good.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It really is.
And with Miss Lone, which I could notbelieve, when we heard that she was
killed, I was like, oh my God, I can'tbelieve she's gonna, are you think
we're gonna get an Emmy push for her?
I, the woman deservesevery award under the sun.
Give it all to give it all to Patty.
(09:12):
She deserves it.
. That's true.
So to switch gears a little bitto right after Episode 7, Billy
gets his costume in Episode 8.
It's this massive moment.
There's some delightful stuff on socialfrom Daniel Salon about designing his look
and like, How it draws from his parents.
Was there ever like anydoubt about creating a comics
(09:34):
accurate suit for Wiccan?
I know you had to talk to RyanMinuting as well to craft the
looks of all the characters.
So could you talk about making this suit?
Yeah, for sure.
No, there was never any doubt.
We had to do it.
If anyone gets to establish theWiccan look, it's going to be us.
No.
Oh gosh.
Daniel is just so wonderful to work with.
He is so tuned into thecharacters and just.
(09:58):
understands their spirit.
It was so cool to see the themetamorphosis from Billy's road
look, which on his sweater,they're all the incredible, symbols
embedded throughout his sweatertranslated onto the Wiccan look.
There were so many incredible referencesfrom the comics that we were sure to
take note of and reference there'slike a beautiful, like galaxy like
(10:19):
lining the The patterning of allthe blue is this like Damascus steel
pattern that Daniel picked out.
It's just really beautiful workand we were stoked to establish it.
What are we going to get tothe Billy and Agatha Hot Toys
figures and the Fortnite skins?
Come on.
Everyone should immediately gomessage Hot Toys and ask them.
(10:45):
You referenced comics references.
We got Ghost Agatha too.
That's a pretty big deal.
We killed Agatha.
That's insane.
Was that always theplan from the beginning?
Was that Agatha's fateall along, if you will?
I love this questionso much because it was.
Wow.
When we first learned that we would getto, to work on this project and Jack
(11:06):
and I found out that we'd get to worktogether again, I was like, we shared
ideas and like the one thing that we botheach on our own gravitated towards were
like, ah, it'd be cool if she just diesat the end of this and becomes a ghost.
So how we got there Again, it's sofitting for the story, but it was
just this like incredible collectiveconscious, like wishlist item that
(11:29):
we definitely had to do by the end.
Like she's a villain.
She's going to die.
Show was deadly.
Y'all killed my aunt Sharon.
Okay.
Oh, all p
all right.
This is hard.
Okay, wait, but speaking ofAgatha's death, Jamie Jurek is
one of our staple co hosts here.
She couldn't join today because I
have, I brought my Agatha shegave me during the junket.
(11:51):
She's the best.
Okay.
So she really wanted to be here today, butthere's construction at her apartment and
it was just going to be so noisy that shewas like, it's best if I sit this one out.
But for Jamie, I'm asking this questionbecause I know Jamie wants to know,
and I know there are people who wantto know for Agatha's death scene,
how many times did you have to filmthe kiss between Agatha and death?
(12:11):
As these things go we have a productionschedule that we have to adhere to.
A few times I like definitely turneddown the volume on my, Like headphones.
I was like but yeah, they did the takeseveral times and no, we, as these things
always are, like, we were like rushingthrough the work, we had to get it done.
So they were just on point and the whole.
(12:32):
crew was just so supportive andwanted to create like a quiet,
respectful, emotional space for Aubreyand Catherine to do their thing.
This is the culmination of the show.
It's the kiss of death.
It's what the entire relationshiphas been leading to and everything
they've been holding back fromtheir entire, relationship.
(12:53):
And it was just, it was awesome.
It was, they did.
An incredible job andthere's such emotion in that.
The emotional payoff of thewhole series is right there.
And then with Billy there'sso much happening all at once.
It was, yeah good work.
Good stuff, guys.
Real quick some real quickEaster egg questions for you.
These are some of the deeper cuts stuff.
Let me see what we have here.
Oh, okay.
You guys name dropped Mephisto.
(13:13):
All right.
And I, that's awesome.
That made the internet go wild.
I saw Eric Voss startlevitating out of his seat.
So I would love to hear about how didthe Mephisto reference come to be?
Do you guys see that aslike an integral thing?
Is it a fun way to honor like thefans who have been with you guys since
WandaVision and is it all Eric Voss fault?
(13:33):
It was really fun to honor the fans.
The.
The fan interaction during WandaVisionwas just something at a level that
we could have never anticipated.
And the engagement is just somethingthat warmed everyone's hearts so much.
And they're really at the crux of it.
Agatha is a story.
Agatha is a character who hasstories constantly fabricated
(13:55):
about her and rumors galore.
And what is real and what isn'treal is incredibly unclear.
So it was fun to tease out a name dropMephisto as a way to enhance the sort of
like legend and lore of Agatha Harkness.
That was one of those Leo moments whereeverybody's pointing at the screen.
Yeah, absolutely.
(14:17):
And also, I know with the Eastereggs, the fandom started paying
attention to those tarot cards.
Hardcore.
Like even before we got started andthen at about episode four episode
five it really became okay We're gonnastart pouring through the details
of these tarot cards to figure outwhat is going on here Each one seems
different and relevant to the showDid you guys talk to a tarot expert or
(14:38):
how does all these details work with?
Lilia's like journey through life
Yeah, so we had a few tarotcard readers in the room.
Jia King, I mentioned, who co wrotethe episode, knows how to read tarot.
I actually, I learned how toread tarot back during my Marvel
internship many moons ago.
Had some knowledge but wedid consult with a witch.
I don't know that she talked about.
(14:59):
Tarot at the time.
We just had the general knowledge.
But no, a lot of detail went intothe making of those and took a
long time to land on the design.
We were so lucky.
Jack's director's assistant BrittanyHorn is also a fabulous artist.
We were struggling toreally nail the design.
She just Was, quietly sittingin the back and painting over
(15:19):
classic design of tarot deck.
And then we saw the concepts werelike, Brit, you just got to do it.
And so she did.
And it's a really beautiful work.
She's actually designing a full customtarot deck that will be released, next
July, all having to do with Agatha.
So that's cool.
Okay.
So we've got to let you go.
So I just wanted to ask onelast question real quick.
(15:41):
I thought maybe that wasWanda's body at the beginning.
I thought maybe we'd see Wanda in Agatha.
Was there ever consideration tohave Elizabeth Olsen come back
as Wanda in Agatha all along?
No, not quite.
This was Agatha's story and we wantedit to honor Agatha and we, teasing out
the, The reunification of the Max Mafamily was, something that we wanted
(16:03):
to do over the course of this show.
And we very much did thatwith Billy and, the end of the
show with Let's Go Find Tommy.
Hope that's where it all leads.
And there are other Marvelprojects that are doing their
thing right now in development andwho knows what they have planned.
But it was really wonderful andrewarding to get to take an incredible
step one with Agatha all along.
(16:25):
Is Vision Quest going to be amazing?
Everything needs to be amazing.
That's the job.
Mary, everything you'vedone has been great.
Congratulations on just anepic run with Marvel so far.
And I can't wait to see where it's going.
We'll be following you to VisionQuest and whatever you have next.
Thank you so much for hangingout with us on FaZe Hero.
(16:46):
It is awesome to get to hearthese insights from you.
And congratulations on another epic title.
Thank you, Brandon.
Thank you, Aaron.
It was great to be with you guys again,and thanks for watching and covering.
Thank you, Mary.
All right, guys.
Mary, you can close your browser.
It'll disconnect you automatically.
Aaron and I are goingto hang for a moment.
That was awesome.
Oh, that was so cool.
So cool.
(17:07):
Oh I want there was there was other Iwas going to ask more future questions,
but it was just very cool to those arethe questions that don't get answered.
They're the questions that make headlines.
But guess what?
We're a podcast that isn't superconcerned about making headlines.
We want to get inside theshow and hear how it was made.
And that was freaking awesome.
And I just appreciate that Marywas just such a good sport with
so many of those fun questions.
(17:29):
What do you have anytakeaways from that, Aaron?
I felt like there's so much craftin it, and I guess it comes through
that this was the work of peoplewho really love certain, properties.
Name dropping these oldermovies when you're designing
the road really comes through.
These are two people making thesethings, which I think was why it
(17:49):
connected with the audience theway that it did, I totally agree.
Oh.
That's crazy.
I also can't believe that like adirector's assistant was just sitting
there doing the entire tarot deck.
And no one realized and they'relike, okay, here you go.
That's crazy too.
I find it
interesting that Wandawas never considered.
I think it makes sense, but I love,I, I'm a geek for those connectivity,
other character type questions.
(18:10):
And it's, I just love gettingthe answers like that.
And I think that was really interesting.
I want to shout out a couple of peoplein the comments real quick before we
wrap up the the comment section thing.
I typically would, Always be readingcomments in our stream yard thing
but they're not loading for somereason in stream yard so I opened the
youtube show to See what's going on.
There's so many people commenting.
Thank you guys, but I gotta shout outmonty especially and fear and beer
(18:33):
halloween nights for the super chats.
Thank you guys for that.
And everybody else there'sso many comments here.
Thank you for joining us today.
We're going to wrap this up.
We'll be back onWednesday for Venom three.
The podcast is available now on Spotify.
It is going to be available on Applepodcasts and all other major podcast
platforms, as soon as we can get it.
There's just processing.
(18:54):
It takes a second.
This phase hero.
Show came together really quickly.
We're getting that all figured out.
Aaron, any last words for today's episode?
It's absolutely Lake Corner on Twitter.
You can catch us all social media.
We really appreciate the support withthe podcasts, with the live show.
Come on back for Brandon, talkingabout the Penguin after Sunday.
I'm sure we'll have thoughts'cause we do all of it.
(19:16):
We do all of it over here on Face Hero.
Oh yeah.
And yeah.
I'm just excited to, hear fromMary, hear from everybody.
I'm so happy.
Everybody loved this show so much.
Jamie's going to flip when she hearsabout this bracelet still being a thing.
Who's going to flip abouthearing the comment about
turning the the headphones down.
Oh my God.
(19:38):
Oh, that's going to be funny.
There will be on this very channel,the YouTube channel where the
face hero episodes are living,and there is a podcast playlist.
So you can listen to it as apodcast on YouTube as well.
Now there will be, I will havemy penguin Recap breakdown with
exclusive insights from the caston Sunday night on the channel.
And then we will have aPenguin Live review the Monday
(19:58):
after the Penguin finale.
So that's a week from thisMonday, depending on when
you're listening to this.
Hopefully it's before it's Monday.
But yeah, so please continue to subscribe.
Thank you so much forcontinuing to support.
Follow at Faze Hero on Twitter,at Faze Hero Pod on Instagram.
We're figuring out what to do withit, but we're just having fun.
It's going to be updates.
It's going to be clips.
It's going to be stuff like that.
And We're going to keep it rolling.
Play our show for yourdad, play it for your cat.
(20:20):
We'll see you in thenext episode, everybody.
Phase Hero is back for anotherexciting episode, everybody.
Thank you so much for joining us today.
I am Brandon Davis.
I love doing this with you guysand we're talking Agatha all along.
We have a special guest, but first Igotta introduce my co host for today.
Aaron Perrine is here.
What's going on, everybody?
What's going on Aaron howyou feeling this morning?
Great, ready to travel backdown the witch's road again,
(00:36):
I love it.
I love it.
I love that this, listen, first,first time you came on FaZe Hero We
had the, we did the silent entrance.
I thought, hey, that couldbe the shtick going forward.
No, I'm glad we're doing this.
Thank you so much everybody foran epic Response to our first
episode on Wednesday of phase hero.
That was incredible.
We had a thousand people watching live.
(00:57):
That was insane.
Because you guys have been sosupportive because you guys have had
fun with us with all the things we'regoing to talk about on phase hero.
Marvel, DC, Star Wars, Gladiator,Invincible, anything you guys want to
talk about, we will yap about it with you.
And today, we are, as Aaron said,going back down the witch's road.
We have a live guest on Phase Zero today.
She has worked on such Marvel Studiostitles as Guardians of the Galaxy Volumes
(01:18):
2 and 3, Captain Marvel, WandaVision,The Marvels, and now She's the executive
producer on Agatha all along with avery exciting next project already
lined up, I believe in vision quest.
Maybe maybe we'll hearsomething about that today.
Please welcome to phasezero in the comment section.
Thank you for being here.
Mary Lovato's.
Hey, everybody.
(01:39):
Hey, Brandon.
Hey, Aaron.
Hey, Mary.
Thank you so much for hanging out with us.
I'm so stoked to
be here.
First of all I want to getto know you a little bit.
I want our audience to getto know you a little bit.
I'm a Gamecock, South Carolina.
You went to what I wouldcall . You see where it's going?
I know.
Where you going?
The other USC.
(01:59):
The other USC.
Yeah.
So it's, I just think it's really coolthat you went to Southern Cal film,
you're working at Marvel Studios now.
I would just love tohear about that journey.
Like how did you find yourself landing?
Yeah, for sure.
I'm a California girl.
I grew up going to comic book shops.
I knew I wanted to get into TVand film somehow, but my parents
(02:20):
were in the aerospace industry.
I really had no idea how to do that.
So I went to USC.
And I did their incrediblebusiness and film joint program.
But mostly I just interned the entiretime I was there and starting my
sophomore year of college, I I woulddrive in Manhattan beach and I would
drive by the old Marvel offices atthe time and see the big Marvel brick.
And I'm like, how do I get in there?
So I, at the time, this wasprobably like 2010 or 11.
(02:43):
I went to the website and I likecalled the number at the bottom
of the website and just weaseledmy way into getting an interview.
And then I interned there andI did research and development.
As well as cleaning the kitchenand delivering the mail for
the better part of a year.
And I worked at Comic Con and putout, research binders for Guardians
of the Galaxy 1 and got to read comicsand break them down and do the thing.
(03:06):
And it was always my hope that Icould land back at Marvel full time.
And after more work experience,the opportunity came up and it
was where I always wanted to be.
So I'm just a fan getting away with it.
That's unbelievable.
That's so cool.
That is so cool.
Yeah, it's escalated quite a bit.
Solidarity started out in thekitchen, in the mail room.
That's where all of the journey,the rest of the journey started.
(03:29):
But now you're actually a movie star.
You're featured as one of the starsof Toy Story alongside Simon Williams.
How does it feel to be a real lifemovie producer and an MCU movie star?
So honored.
It was really fun to work onGuardians of the Galaxy 2.
James Gunn is just so creativeand so wonderful and just
loves to celebrate the crew.
And so I appear on that poster withSimon Hatt, the associate producer
(03:51):
and James is a co exec producer who'smy buddy and it's a fond memory.
So it feels good.
All right.
Let's talk a little aboutAgatha all along here.
Which congratulations because everythingI see, people are loving this show,
like it's gotta be at this pointhonestly, we talked a bit about this
right before we started, but it hasto be a little bit relieving because
I imagine the nerves before yourelease a project like this, that,
(04:13):
there's gonna be so many eyeballs on.
are just something I'llnever even experience.
I don't even know if I could handle it.
So now that it's out there inthe world and people are loving
it, are you feeling good?
Are you feeling the love?
We are feeling the love.
It's really exciting.
It was a tall order tofollow up WandaVision.
And like WandaVision, the developmentand creation of these stories, it
just felt like a passion project.
(04:34):
That we were luckyenough to get to work on.
And, what's fun about these shows, it'slike for a while, they're like, just
completely unpitchable because they're soharebrained and there's so many layers.
So we were just so passionateabout these characters.
being created.
And we were so excited forthe representation that we
got to put up on screen.
And just really revealed really relievedthat we had some reveals left for
(04:56):
the finale that fans couldn't quitefigure out until the episodes aired.
So that was a win.
And it's just really heartening tosee such a wonderful, warm embrace.
From the fans, there was alot of heart we put into it.
So it's nice to have thatripple out into the world.
I you can really see the hearttoo, because like yesterday the
(05:17):
Marvel studios accounts put out.
The moments where the cast actuallyfirst got to see the witch's road and
like Jack literally leads them down thewitch's road, things out how, and it's
all practical and it's all wild that youguys built a forest inside somewhere.
And I was like, my goodness, thisthing is way bigger than any of
us could have possibly imagined.
How did you guys decide todo The Witch's Road here?
(05:40):
Yeah we had wonderfulpartners in production.
At first the stage that we had forThe Witch's Road was quite small and
they sprung and got us the biggest oneavailable in the Atlanta area, which
was incredible, so that's all in camera.
The backdrops were incredible,there were like beautiful like
mushrooms that lit up on set thatwe could change the lighting for.
It was fireflies embedded throughout.
It was really fully immersive andjust so wonderful for the cast to be
(06:05):
able to experience that in real time.
But how we ended up landing on theidea, in development, we knew we wanted
to embark on the witch's road, but wefound ourselves like, bummed out at
the thought of having to be surroundedby blue screen the entire time and
walking on like a painted foam floor,it's just not what we wanted to do.
And of course, in development.
(06:25):
We were talking about, how wewanted this to feel like Goonies
Jack wanted it to feel like legend.
We wanted it to feel tactile and real.
And so watching back the Wizardof Oz, the idea arose, why not?
Why not do backdrops?
Why not do miniatures?
Why not try to get this in camera?
There's something so timeless about it.
(06:45):
The golden age of fantasy and horrorwhere you can go back and watch
those movies and they don't feellike they've aged at all because of
the craftsmanship that went into it.
And it felt so right with this showto celebrate the craft of filmmaking
like we did with WandaVision.
It felt a wonderful similarspiritual way to approach the work.
(07:05):
I want to talk about episode seven,which I think is an absolute master.
And I know I'm not alone in that.
The time travel rulesare great as a lost fan.
I a was lost involved in the developmentof time travel rules, but also, just
that episode alone I just love tohear about the process developing it.
And did you know you had a banger on yourhands before, before you even saw the
We, we've loved the episode for so long.
(07:28):
It was a hard, it was avery hard one to crack.
Jack loves memento, Gia King, whowas a writer's assistant who became
a staff writer and co wrote thisepisode with Cameron Squires, who
is one of our WandaVision alums.
They did such a incredible jobfiguring out how to sequence this.
episode in a way that wouldmake sense and in a way that
(07:49):
would be rewarding to the fans.
It was incredibly ambitious andtook a lot of time to make sure
that the logic all checked out.
And then of course, filming itwas its own entire challenge.
Jack jumped in and directed thatepisode had, had to prep very quickly.
And Ishii Metcar, our associateproducer, like helped build like
a whole map for how the swordswould fall because it's confusing.
(08:10):
Like where in the sequence arewe, but what swords have fallen?
What?
What hasn't and getting that all oncamera was a huge task and our SFX
department just absolutely crushed it.
There was like a realsense of danger on the set.
And then when the cast came in, thiswas towards the end of our schedule.
And, we finished that last scenewhere Patty ushers all the witches
(08:30):
through the through the torture device.
And she was leaving set after thattape, we were going and everyone.
honest to God, we were all neartears and just trying to hold
it back, including the cast.
But I think you can feel like the rushof emotion all culminate in that episode.
And Patty's performanceis just so incredible.
(08:51):
We were so lucky to work with her.
And the
music and everything.
It's just so good.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It really is.
And with Miss Lone, which I could notbelieve, when we heard that she was
killed, I was like, oh my God, I can'tbelieve she's gonna, are you think
we're gonna get an Emmy push for her?
I, the woman deservesevery award under the sun.
Give it all to give it all to Patty.
(09:12):
She deserves it.
. That's true.
So to switch gears a little bitto right after Episode 7, Billy
gets his costume in Episode 8.
It's this massive moment.
There's some delightful stuff on socialfrom Daniel Salon about designing his look
and like, How it draws from his parents.
Was there ever like anydoubt about creating a comics
(09:34):
accurate suit for Wiccan?
I know you had to talk to RyanMinuting as well to craft the
looks of all the characters.
So could you talk about making this suit?
Yeah, for sure.
No, there was never any doubt.
We had to do it.
If anyone gets to establish theWiccan look, it's going to be us.
No.
Oh gosh.
Daniel is just so wonderful to work with.
He is so tuned into thecharacters and just.
(09:58):
understands their spirit.
It was so cool to see the themetamorphosis from Billy's road
look, which on his sweater,they're all the incredible, symbols
embedded throughout his sweatertranslated onto the Wiccan look.
There were so many incredible referencesfrom the comics that we were sure to
take note of and reference there'slike a beautiful, like galaxy like
(10:19):
lining the The patterning of allthe blue is this like Damascus steel
pattern that Daniel picked out.
It's just really beautiful workand we were stoked to establish it.
What are we going to get tothe Billy and Agatha Hot Toys
figures and the Fortnite skins?
Come on.
Everyone should immediately gomessage Hot Toys and ask them.
(10:45):
You referenced comics references.
We got Ghost Agatha too.
That's a pretty big deal.
We killed Agatha.
That's insane.
Was that always theplan from the beginning?
Was that Agatha's fateall along, if you will?
I love this questionso much because it was.
Wow.
When we first learned that we would getto, to work on this project and Jack
(11:06):
and I found out that we'd get to worktogether again, I was like, we shared
ideas and like the one thing that we botheach on our own gravitated towards were
like, ah, it'd be cool if she just diesat the end of this and becomes a ghost.
So how we got there Again, it's sofitting for the story, but it was
just this like incredible collectiveconscious, like wishlist item that
(11:29):
we definitely had to do by the end.
Like she's a villain.
She's going to die.
Show was deadly.
Y'all killed my aunt Sharon.
Okay.
Oh, all p
all right.
This is hard.
Okay, wait, but speaking ofAgatha's death, Jamie Jurek is
one of our staple co hosts here.
She couldn't join today because I
have, I brought my Agatha shegave me during the junket.
(11:51):
She's the best.
Okay.
So she really wanted to be here today, butthere's construction at her apartment and
it was just going to be so noisy that shewas like, it's best if I sit this one out.
But for Jamie, I'm asking this questionbecause I know Jamie wants to know,
and I know there are people who wantto know for Agatha's death scene,
how many times did you have to filmthe kiss between Agatha and death?
(12:11):
As these things go we have a productionschedule that we have to adhere to.
A few times I like definitely turneddown the volume on my, Like headphones.
I was like but yeah, they did the takeseveral times and no, we, as these things
always are, like, we were like rushingthrough the work, we had to get it done.
So they were just on point and the whole.
(12:32):
crew was just so supportive andwanted to create like a quiet,
respectful, emotional space for Aubreyand Catherine to do their thing.
This is the culmination of the show.
It's the kiss of death.
It's what the entire relationshiphas been leading to and everything
they've been holding back fromtheir entire, relationship.
(12:53):
And it was just, it was awesome.
It was, they did.
An incredible job andthere's such emotion in that.
The emotional payoff of thewhole series is right there.
And then with Billy there'sso much happening all at once.
It was, yeah good work.
Good stuff, guys.
Real quick some real quickEaster egg questions for you.
These are some of the deeper cuts stuff.
Let me see what we have here.
Oh, okay.
You guys name dropped Mephisto.
(13:13):
All right.
And I, that's awesome.
That made the internet go wild.
I saw Eric Voss startlevitating out of his seat.
So I would love to hear about how didthe Mephisto reference come to be?
Do you guys see that aslike an integral thing?
Is it a fun way to honor like thefans who have been with you guys since
WandaVision and is it all Eric Voss fault?
(13:33):
It was really fun to honor the fans.
The.
The fan interaction during WandaVisionwas just something at a level that
we could have never anticipated.
And the engagement is just somethingthat warmed everyone's hearts so much.
And they're really at the crux of it.
Agatha is a story.
Agatha is a character who hasstories constantly fabricated
(13:55):
about her and rumors galore.
And what is real and what isn'treal is incredibly unclear.
So it was fun to tease out a name dropMephisto as a way to enhance the sort of
like legend and lore of Agatha Harkness.
That was one of those Leo moments whereeverybody's pointing at the screen.
Yeah, absolutely.
(14:17):
And also, I know with the Eastereggs, the fandom started paying
attention to those tarot cards.
Hardcore.
Like even before we got started andthen at about episode four episode
five it really became okay We're gonnastart pouring through the details
of these tarot cards to figure outwhat is going on here Each one seems
different and relevant to the showDid you guys talk to a tarot expert or
(14:38):
how does all these details work with?
Lilia's like journey through life
Yeah, so we had a few tarotcard readers in the room.
Jia King, I mentioned, who co wrotethe episode, knows how to read tarot.
I actually, I learned how toread tarot back during my Marvel
internship many moons ago.
Had some knowledge but wedid consult with a witch.
I don't know that she talked about.
(14:59):
Tarot at the time.
We just had the general knowledge.
But no, a lot of detail went intothe making of those and took a
long time to land on the design.
We were so lucky.
Jack's director's assistant BrittanyHorn is also a fabulous artist.
We were struggling toreally nail the design.
She just Was, quietly sittingin the back and painting over
(15:19):
classic design of tarot deck.
And then we saw the concepts werelike, Brit, you just got to do it.
And so she did.
And it's a really beautiful work.
She's actually designing a full customtarot deck that will be released, next
July, all having to do with Agatha.
So that's cool.
Okay.
So we've got to let you go.
So I just wanted to ask onelast question real quick.
(15:41):
I thought maybe that wasWanda's body at the beginning.
I thought maybe we'd see Wanda in Agatha.
Was there ever consideration tohave Elizabeth Olsen come back
as Wanda in Agatha all along?
No, not quite.
This was Agatha's story and we wantedit to honor Agatha and we, teasing out
the, The reunification of the Max Mafamily was, something that we wanted
(16:03):
to do over the course of this show.
And we very much did thatwith Billy and, the end of the
show with Let's Go Find Tommy.
Hope that's where it all leads.
And there are other Marvelprojects that are doing their
thing right now in development andwho knows what they have planned.
But it was really wonderful andrewarding to get to take an incredible
step one with Agatha all along.
(16:25):
Is Vision Quest going to be amazing?
Everything needs to be amazing.
That's the job.
Mary, everything you'vedone has been great.
Congratulations on just anepic run with Marvel so far.
And I can't wait to see where it's going.
We'll be following you to VisionQuest and whatever you have next.
Thank you so much for hangingout with us on FaZe Hero.
(16:46):
It is awesome to get to hearthese insights from you.
And congratulations on another epic title.
Thank you, Brandon.
Thank you, Aaron.
It was great to be with you guys again,and thanks for watching and covering.
Thank you, Mary.
All right, guys.
Mary, you can close your browser.
It'll disconnect you automatically.
Aaron and I are goingto hang for a moment.
That was awesome.
Oh, that was so cool.
So cool.
(17:07):
Oh I want there was there was other Iwas going to ask more future questions,
but it was just very cool to those arethe questions that don't get answered.
They're the questions that make headlines.
But guess what?
We're a podcast that isn't superconcerned about making headlines.
We want to get inside theshow and hear how it was made.
And that was freaking awesome.
And I just appreciate that Marywas just such a good sport with
so many of those fun questions.
(17:29):
What do you have anytakeaways from that, Aaron?
I felt like there's so much craftin it, and I guess it comes through
that this was the work of peoplewho really love certain, properties.
Name dropping these oldermovies when you're designing
the road really comes through.
These are two people making thesethings, which I think was why it
(17:49):
connected with the audience theway that it did, I totally agree.
Oh.
That's crazy.
I also can't believe that like adirector's assistant was just sitting
there doing the entire tarot deck.
And no one realized and they'relike, okay, here you go.
That's crazy too.
I find it
interesting that Wandawas never considered.
I think it makes sense, but I love,I, I'm a geek for those connectivity,
other character type questions.
(18:10):
And it's, I just love gettingthe answers like that.
And I think that was really interesting.
I want to shout out a couple of peoplein the comments real quick before we
wrap up the the comment section thing.
I typically would, Always be readingcomments in our stream yard thing
but they're not loading for somereason in stream yard so I opened the
youtube show to See what's going on.
There's so many people commenting.
Thank you guys, but I gotta shout outmonty especially and fear and beer
(18:33):
halloween nights for the super chats.
Thank you guys for that.
And everybody else there'sso many comments here.
Thank you for joining us today.
We're going to wrap this up.
We'll be back onWednesday for Venom three.
The podcast is available now on Spotify.
It is going to be available on Applepodcasts and all other major podcast
platforms, as soon as we can get it.
There's just processing.
(18:54):
It takes a second.
This phase hero.
Show came together really quickly.
We're getting that all figured out.
Aaron, any last words for today's episode?
It's absolutely Lake Corner on Twitter.
You can catch us all social media.
We really appreciate the support withthe podcasts, with the live show.
Come on back for Brandon, talkingabout the Penguin after Sunday.
I'm sure we'll have thoughts'cause we do all of it.
(19:16):
We do all of it over here on Face Hero.
Oh yeah.
And yeah.
I'm just excited to, hear fromMary, hear from everybody.
I'm so happy.
Everybody loved this show so much.
Jamie's going to flip when she hearsabout this bracelet still being a thing.
Who's going to flip abouthearing the comment about
turning the the headphones down.
Oh my God.
(19:38):
Oh, that's going to be funny.
There will be on this very channel,the YouTube channel where the
face hero episodes are living,and there is a podcast playlist.
So you can listen to it as apodcast on YouTube as well.
Now there will be, I will havemy penguin Recap breakdown with
exclusive insights from the caston Sunday night on the channel.
And then we will have aPenguin Live review the Monday
(19:58):
after the Penguin finale.
So that's a week from thisMonday, depending on when
you're listening to this.
Hopefully it's before it's Monday.
But yeah, so please continue to subscribe.
Thank you so much forcontinuing to support.
Follow at Faze Hero on Twitter,at Faze Hero Pod on Instagram.
We're figuring out what to do withit, but we're just having fun.
It's going to be updates.
It's going to be clips.
It's going to be stuff like that.
And We're going to keep it rolling.
Play our show for yourdad, play it for your cat.
(20:20):
We'll see you in thenext episode, everybody.
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