April 28, 2025 • 12 mins
Just noodling on the complex relationship we (I) have with parents. I hope you enjoy it.
Shantaram novel Amazon.com: Shantaram: A Novel: 9780312330538: Roberts, Gregory David: Books
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Thank you for joining anotherepisode of Pacific Northwest.
Told I am your host, Todd Pryor.
Most episodes will include a guestlearning about them and perhaps
delving into a specific topic with aprofessional or two on the subject.
As of now, that is my plan format.
However, today will be a littlebit different of an episode.
(00:22):
I did promise myself I'd look atvarious formats and this may or may
not have some use in the future.
And today I wanna talk about somethingpersonal as well as universal parents.
Yes, I understand.
Some people are adopted, theyhave estranged relationships.
Some have lost their parents,or maybe in turmoil with 'em.
(00:42):
Parents come in many forms, butwho I'm defining in this podcast as
parents are the primary individualswho bought you up as a child.
No, I'm not going to get intoany grievances or speak like I
understand everything I. I'm not atherapist, nor do I pretend to be.
I'm not doing anything by mulling overthe complicated relationships most
(01:06):
of us have with these individuals.
I could promise you that wading intothis subject made me uncomfortable and
delving in did not provide much answers,but brought up a lot of questions for me.
The reason I'm doing this episodeis I had an opportunity to bring
my daughters and my wife to see myparents in Tennessee this past week.
(01:28):
It was the first time my parents metmy youngest daughter face to face.
She's four.
They also had a chance to meetmy oldest daughter in person
for the first time since she wasroughly a year and a half old.
It was well over to do to see them.
Not to going to point fingerson who should have flown out
or any lapse in decisions.
I'm not going to blame anyonebut myself for not making it
(01:50):
a priority as I should have.
I can only control my actions and I didnot get my kids on a plane and bring
them front and center to spend timewith their grandparents, and I will, for
the rest of my life, have some level ofregret that I did not do this sooner.
Parents, in my opinion, are going tohold the most complex relationship
for you compared to any otherindividual you will meet in your life.
(02:14):
There's this great book,it's called Shanter.
It's written by Gregory David Roberts.
I'll have the link in the podcast.
It reminds me of books like TheAlchemist or the Catcher in Naiah
books that you should read atcertain ages or stages in your life.
There are multiple of quotes in this book,but one has always struck, stuck with me.
(02:36):
It goes fake, gives all of us, threeteachers, three friends, three enemies,
and three great loves in our lives.
But these 12 are always disguisedand we can never know which
one is which until we've lovedthem, left them, or fought them.
That's how we keep this crazyplace together with a heart.
(02:57):
We are all, every one of us, every Adam.
Every galaxy and every particle of matterin the universe moving towards God.
I genuinely believe that only individualsin our lives who could be two of these
12 could be one or both of your parents.
It took me some time to digesta quote and it transformed in my
(03:19):
mind of who those 12 could be.
Perhaps as I've grown the books thatI've grown with me one can dream, right?
You don't get to pick your parents.
You get to choose how you relate tothem, but you don't have the choice
on who you define as your parents.
When I think of the complexities of theserelationships, the situation heightens
(03:40):
when you include additional familymembers, your spouse and your children,
you are now in that middle of a push andpull that is your family and your parents,
and sometimes that makes it far harder.
Luckily, I've been lucky enough tohave a partner who has been nothing but
helpful in that matter and supportiveof how I situ myself with them.
But the relationship you carry withthese folks and the new company
(04:03):
kept can and should have friction.
How on earth could it not?
I don't know anyone who has adesire to raise their children
or disperse responsibilitiesexactly the same as their parents.
You just cannot help but wince.
When you hear feedback for the people wholet you run feral on a day-to-day basis,
you'll always be there, little kid.
(04:23):
And is that a good thing?
I was raised in a small town inupstate New York and I was called
toddy by everyone in my hometown.
Now that I think of it, I smile a bitas that is the only place on the planet.
I could be assured I'd be called that.
I really don't want to be called bythat name most of the time, but the
familiarity was and still is comforting.
(04:44):
The reason I'm called thatis I was, reason I'm called
that is I was a kid there.
Little toddy is playing the French horn.
How cute.
I'm stuck there in a time warp, and I, andthey have changed, but the memory of me
is all that has left in that small town.
If I go back, they know nothing of my pastdecades and I know nothing about theirs.
(05:06):
So of course they would go back to theold standby as it's the easiest option.
I recently saw a man whoI've not seen in ages.
I can still see the man I knew as a boy.
The funny thing he said whenwe parted ways was, I'll
see you in another 40 years.
Good to know that sentiment was mutual.
(05:27):
When I'm not, when I'm in frontof my parents, the same occurs.
They've been such a small part of myadult years as I've taken off into
the great wide open that they know alittle more of me except the ghost of
who I was when they really knew me.
I don't have a grasp of what it islike to be with my parents for my adult
life, and perhaps them being closerand more attached would grow with me.
(05:48):
I don't know what it, I don't know,but it does seem like this gap in
time can only be seen as a view ofwho I was and who they wanted me as.
It was this great play, actually.
It wasn't a great play.
It was a play.
There was a play, it was in years agoabout dead soldiers, and the role I had
was a young man disfigured during mypassing, and the mother of my soldier
(06:11):
wanted to see his face once more time.
It ended poorly as you'd expect,but is it better for the mother to
remember her little boy lost, orthe young man who is truly lost?
I don't know the answer.
I don't even know the answer.
As a father myself, knowing who theyare now versus who they were when they
(06:31):
were with you will always be fragmented.
How do you change the narrative ofwhat was in, what is, does it matter?
Does convincing others thatyou are a different figure
now than you were years ago?
Matter in brief moments, you standtogether now that you're an adult.
Does a single moment arguing overunfulfilled expectations or of
(06:54):
how you wanna be treated matteras much as simply sitting quietly
near them when you have a chance.
Yes, of course, if you expectto be treated like an adult and
others treat you like you're 12,there should be a conversation.
But if a maternal figure wantsto fix you a meal every now
and then, what's the harm?
Is standing your ground nearly asimportant as allowing them a brief moment
(07:15):
to remember their fondest memories of you.
I don't have answers for overbearingfamily members, but I do understand that
a hug lasting a little bit longer than youwant, maybe the hug that's needed by them.
I can take a few extra momentsand I wish I took some more.
How do you reconcile the truth that youcan see yourself in them and you are not
(07:36):
assigned a duty to follow their path?
One example is I have my father's hands.
They're thinner, a bit different,but the similarities are remarkable.
As I don't spend a lot of timesearching my own face, the hands I see
constantly remind me of where I comefrom and in some ways a warning of
both who I can be and who I want to be.
(07:58):
I don't need to get in my childhoodhere, just know that I've seen
those hands attached to be do someamazing things and some awful things.
I'm not responsible for those actions.
I am, however aware of theghost haunting my own body.
I think being afraid of who youcould become and desirous of what
you could take from those lessonsis an ongoing process for anyone.
(08:19):
And I honor your journey.
Your parents are people, and howlong did it take you to realize that?
My wife and I were bothdivorced prior to our marriage.
Our girls do not know this yet.
They will in time, and I'm okay with that.
We have both had wild times beforeand after we met each other and
(08:40):
continue to have hopes and dreamsand fears, and sure we are people.
Not just parents.
I think it took me a long time toadjust to that simple knowledge.
Yes, that sounds simple, but framingyour viewpoint to the reality that
your parents are individuals who haveleft a lot of desires, dreams, and
aspirations on the table, allowed youto have the correct level of empathy.
(09:02):
In no way am I saying that because ofwhat they chose allows you to minimize
your experience, but allowing themthe grace you'd hope others allow you.
As most of us are fartoo critical ourselves.
It's fair to say that the storyof what was versus what really
was are two different things, andacknowledging that is critical.
(09:25):
Did you create stories in your mindto improve or negate your childhood?
I know I did.
I can't tell you what is real andmade up anymore, but I do know we
build stories in our minds thatmake the real world less real.
I mean, it's going to happen inall cases with every interaction.
So why not parents?
I know that my relationship with friendsand loved ones are filled with half truths
(09:47):
and there is only one side of the story.
And as time passes, someof the facts flow away.
Perhaps letting go of the past, thestories, the tales, all the remorse
means we can acknowledge the truths.
I have a family, it is flawed, andthey did their best they could.
They failed sometimes, and sometimesthey knocked it outta the park.
These experiences made me who Iam today, and for better or for
(10:09):
worse, I'm still here standing.
Your parents may slowly phase into beingyour peers, but will they ever truly be?
I mean, how is it possible?
Yes, of course your relationshipwill change through the years.
Of course, you'll have differentviewpoints and different
expectations as you grow, butdoes that mean you will be a peer.
(10:32):
I just don't think it makessense, nor is it feasible.
If you could look at your parentsas peers, then it's fantastic.
I just think there will alwaysbe a barrier to make it possible.
I think your relationshipcan and should evolve.
Subjects should change and the realitiesone face with your parents should
evolve, but peer-to-peer is not the samething, and I think that's all right.
(10:54):
There's no need to press a relationshipbased on the change in roles and age.
As you get older, your expectationsshould change, as should your roles.
What do you want from your parents nowthat your relationship has changed?
They may or may not be hereanymore, but what do you want?
(11:16):
Death is the end of saying something totheir face, but healing and saying what
you need to say can occur at any time.
Healing and love are the same thing.
Absolving yourself of the weight andallowing these individuals who grew
up in different times by parents whowere imperfect themselves to be simply
people who tried their best to beabsolved of any expectation no one
(11:40):
can live up to is all part of growth.
Defining these gifts you have receivedfrom them while accepting the flaws is all
part of a complex story we tell ourselves.
We are imperfect monkeyswalking on two feet.
We are stardust and dreams and hopes.
We are and we're their hopes.
I hope you can live up to your own dreamsand perhaps bring light to the stardust.
(12:05):
This is Todd Pryor with Pacific Northwest.
Told for another episode.
Thanks for listening.
Thank you for joining anotherepisode of Pacific Northwest.
Told I am your host, Todd Pryor.
Most episodes will include a guestlearning about them and perhaps
delving into a specific topic with aprofessional or two on the subject.
As of now, that is my plan format.
However, today will be a littlebit different of an episode.
(00:22):
I did promise myself I'd look atvarious formats and this may or may
not have some use in the future.
And today I wanna talk about somethingpersonal as well as universal parents.
Yes, I understand.
Some people are adopted, theyhave estranged relationships.
Some have lost their parents,or maybe in turmoil with 'em.
(00:42):
Parents come in many forms, butwho I'm defining in this podcast as
parents are the primary individualswho bought you up as a child.
No, I'm not going to get intoany grievances or speak like I
understand everything I. I'm not atherapist, nor do I pretend to be.
I'm not doing anything by mulling overthe complicated relationships most
(01:06):
of us have with these individuals.
I could promise you that wading intothis subject made me uncomfortable and
delving in did not provide much answers,but brought up a lot of questions for me.
The reason I'm doing this episodeis I had an opportunity to bring
my daughters and my wife to see myparents in Tennessee this past week.
(01:28):
It was the first time my parents metmy youngest daughter face to face.
She's four.
They also had a chance to meetmy oldest daughter in person
for the first time since she wasroughly a year and a half old.
It was well over to do to see them.
Not to going to point fingerson who should have flown out
or any lapse in decisions.
I'm not going to blame anyonebut myself for not making it
(01:50):
a priority as I should have.
I can only control my actions and I didnot get my kids on a plane and bring
them front and center to spend timewith their grandparents, and I will, for
the rest of my life, have some level ofregret that I did not do this sooner.
Parents, in my opinion, are going tohold the most complex relationship
for you compared to any otherindividual you will meet in your life.
(02:14):
There's this great book,it's called Shanter.
It's written by Gregory David Roberts.
I'll have the link in the podcast.
It reminds me of books like TheAlchemist or the Catcher in Naiah
books that you should read atcertain ages or stages in your life.
There are multiple of quotes in this book,but one has always struck, stuck with me.
(02:36):
It goes fake, gives all of us, threeteachers, three friends, three enemies,
and three great loves in our lives.
But these 12 are always disguisedand we can never know which
one is which until we've lovedthem, left them, or fought them.
That's how we keep this crazyplace together with a heart.
(02:57):
We are all, every one of us, every Adam.
Every galaxy and every particle of matterin the universe moving towards God.
I genuinely believe that only individualsin our lives who could be two of these
12 could be one or both of your parents.
It took me some time to digesta quote and it transformed in my
(03:19):
mind of who those 12 could be.
Perhaps as I've grown the books thatI've grown with me one can dream, right?
You don't get to pick your parents.
You get to choose how you relate tothem, but you don't have the choice
on who you define as your parents.
When I think of the complexities of theserelationships, the situation heightens
(03:40):
when you include additional familymembers, your spouse and your children,
you are now in that middle of a push andpull that is your family and your parents,
and sometimes that makes it far harder.
Luckily, I've been lucky enough tohave a partner who has been nothing but
helpful in that matter and supportiveof how I situ myself with them.
But the relationship you carry withthese folks and the new company
(04:03):
kept can and should have friction.
How on earth could it not?
I don't know anyone who has adesire to raise their children
or disperse responsibilitiesexactly the same as their parents.
You just cannot help but wince.
When you hear feedback for the people wholet you run feral on a day-to-day basis,
you'll always be there, little kid.
(04:23):
And is that a good thing?
I was raised in a small town inupstate New York and I was called
toddy by everyone in my hometown.
Now that I think of it, I smile a bitas that is the only place on the planet.
I could be assured I'd be called that.
I really don't want to be called bythat name most of the time, but the
familiarity was and still is comforting.
(04:44):
The reason I'm called thatis I was, reason I'm called
that is I was a kid there.
Little toddy is playing the French horn.
How cute.
I'm stuck there in a time warp, and I, andthey have changed, but the memory of me
is all that has left in that small town.
If I go back, they know nothing of my pastdecades and I know nothing about theirs.
(05:06):
So of course they would go back to theold standby as it's the easiest option.
I recently saw a man whoI've not seen in ages.
I can still see the man I knew as a boy.
The funny thing he said whenwe parted ways was, I'll
see you in another 40 years.
Good to know that sentiment was mutual.
(05:27):
When I'm not, when I'm in frontof my parents, the same occurs.
They've been such a small part of myadult years as I've taken off into
the great wide open that they know alittle more of me except the ghost of
who I was when they really knew me.
I don't have a grasp of what it islike to be with my parents for my adult
life, and perhaps them being closerand more attached would grow with me.
(05:48):
I don't know what it, I don't know,but it does seem like this gap in
time can only be seen as a view ofwho I was and who they wanted me as.
It was this great play, actually.
It wasn't a great play.
It was a play.
There was a play, it was in years agoabout dead soldiers, and the role I had
was a young man disfigured during mypassing, and the mother of my soldier
(06:11):
wanted to see his face once more time.
It ended poorly as you'd expect,but is it better for the mother to
remember her little boy lost, orthe young man who is truly lost?
I don't know the answer.
I don't even know the answer.
As a father myself, knowing who theyare now versus who they were when they
(06:31):
were with you will always be fragmented.
How do you change the narrative ofwhat was in, what is, does it matter?
Does convincing others thatyou are a different figure
now than you were years ago?
Matter in brief moments, you standtogether now that you're an adult.
Does a single moment arguing overunfulfilled expectations or of
(06:54):
how you wanna be treated matteras much as simply sitting quietly
near them when you have a chance.
Yes, of course, if you expectto be treated like an adult and
others treat you like you're 12,there should be a conversation.
But if a maternal figure wantsto fix you a meal every now
and then, what's the harm?
Is standing your ground nearly asimportant as allowing them a brief moment
(07:15):
to remember their fondest memories of you.
I don't have answers for overbearingfamily members, but I do understand that
a hug lasting a little bit longer than youwant, maybe the hug that's needed by them.
I can take a few extra momentsand I wish I took some more.
How do you reconcile the truth that youcan see yourself in them and you are not
(07:36):
assigned a duty to follow their path?
One example is I have my father's hands.
They're thinner, a bit different,but the similarities are remarkable.
As I don't spend a lot of timesearching my own face, the hands I see
constantly remind me of where I comefrom and in some ways a warning of
both who I can be and who I want to be.
(07:58):
I don't need to get in my childhoodhere, just know that I've seen
those hands attached to be do someamazing things and some awful things.
I'm not responsible for those actions.
I am, however aware of theghost haunting my own body.
I think being afraid of who youcould become and desirous of what
you could take from those lessonsis an ongoing process for anyone.
(08:19):
And I honor your journey.
Your parents are people, and howlong did it take you to realize that?
My wife and I were bothdivorced prior to our marriage.
Our girls do not know this yet.
They will in time, and I'm okay with that.
We have both had wild times beforeand after we met each other and
(08:40):
continue to have hopes and dreamsand fears, and sure we are people.
Not just parents.
I think it took me a long time toadjust to that simple knowledge.
Yes, that sounds simple, but framingyour viewpoint to the reality that
your parents are individuals who haveleft a lot of desires, dreams, and
aspirations on the table, allowed youto have the correct level of empathy.
(09:02):
In no way am I saying that because ofwhat they chose allows you to minimize
your experience, but allowing themthe grace you'd hope others allow you.
As most of us are fartoo critical ourselves.
It's fair to say that the storyof what was versus what really
was are two different things, andacknowledging that is critical.
(09:25):
Did you create stories in your mindto improve or negate your childhood?
I know I did.
I can't tell you what is real andmade up anymore, but I do know we
build stories in our minds thatmake the real world less real.
I mean, it's going to happen inall cases with every interaction.
So why not parents?
I know that my relationship with friendsand loved ones are filled with half truths
(09:47):
and there is only one side of the story.
And as time passes, someof the facts flow away.
Perhaps letting go of the past, thestories, the tales, all the remorse
means we can acknowledge the truths.
I have a family, it is flawed, andthey did their best they could.
They failed sometimes, and sometimesthey knocked it outta the park.
These experiences made me who Iam today, and for better or for
(10:09):
worse, I'm still here standing.
Your parents may slowly phase into beingyour peers, but will they ever truly be?
I mean, how is it possible?
Yes, of course your relationshipwill change through the years.
Of course, you'll have differentviewpoints and different
expectations as you grow, butdoes that mean you will be a peer.
(10:32):
I just don't think it makessense, nor is it feasible.
If you could look at your parentsas peers, then it's fantastic.
I just think there will alwaysbe a barrier to make it possible.
I think your relationshipcan and should evolve.
Subjects should change and the realitiesone face with your parents should
evolve, but peer-to-peer is not the samething, and I think that's all right.
(10:54):
There's no need to press a relationshipbased on the change in roles and age.
As you get older, your expectationsshould change, as should your roles.
What do you want from your parents nowthat your relationship has changed?
They may or may not be hereanymore, but what do you want?
(11:16):
Death is the end of saying something totheir face, but healing and saying what
you need to say can occur at any time.
Healing and love are the same thing.
Absolving yourself of the weight andallowing these individuals who grew
up in different times by parents whowere imperfect themselves to be simply
people who tried their best to beabsolved of any expectation no one
(11:40):
can live up to is all part of growth.
Defining these gifts you have receivedfrom them while accepting the flaws is all
part of a complex story we tell ourselves.
We are imperfect monkeyswalking on two feet.
We are stardust and dreams and hopes.
We are and we're their hopes.
I hope you can live up to your own dreamsand perhaps bring light to the stardust.
(12:05):
This is Todd Pryor with Pacific Northwest.
Told for another episode.
Thanks for listening.
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