WSOP Paradise and WPT World Championship

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:10):
Hello, everyone, Welcome back to a new episode of the
Poker Go Podcast. My name is Donny Peters. His name
is Tim Duckworth. It is Tuesday, December sixteenth, right in
the thick of it for all the heavy hitting poker
that is going on, not only in Las Vegas but

(00:31):
around the world. Tim and I are of course in
Las Vegas and it's it's jam freaking packed here. But
we're gonna lead off with ap Paradise because as far
as I'm concerned, that's the leading story with everything that's
going on right now. There's a lot of dobysipy news
that dropped this week today. You know, we got dobasip

(00:52):
Paradise hitting their guarantee prize pulls in. They're on to
day three in the supermin event. All that sort of
stuff we got was b Europe news that came out.
We have WSIP Player of the Year news that came out.
So we're gonna hit on all of that stuff and
then we're gonna get into the WPT World Championship. We
got to talk some community cards, which I actually have

(01:15):
no idea what we're talking in regards to community cards,
but you know what Tim said, We're talking community cards,
and then we got a family pop because why not, right,
why freaking not. If you're listening, of course, please favorite
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(01:37):
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(02:00):
as comment, like, subscribe, whatever the heck it is you
guys know the drill. Just some quick other news that
I might as well mention right now off the top,
But High Stakes Poker is back or it's coming back,
depending on when you listen to this. But season fifteen
December twenty third, the full season is dropping on poker Go,

(02:23):
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(02:44):
the funny guy, actor, all that sort of stuff. He's
making his high stakes poker debut. He is stepping into
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be alongside Andrew Roebol, Sam Keekey's in the lineups, Jennifer
till There, Nick Airball, Antonio s fondi Ari is back.
So this is going to be a season that you

(03:06):
don't want to miss. As always with high Stakes Poker,
the minimum game that you will see is two hundred
four hundred with a minimum one hundred k buy in,
but stakes throughout this season climb up to five hundred
one thousand, so the money will be absolutely flying. You
can binge the entire full season. On Tuesday, December twenty third,

(03:27):
the whole thing is going to drop. Tim has been
hard at work, the whole damn thing out there. The
whole thing's going to drop that day. It is only
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(04:11):
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only thing. You can't save them, but everything else is

(04:32):
good to go. High six Poker Season fifteen. Watch it
starting Tuesday, December twenty third. Again that is exclusively on
poker Go. All right, first news item of the day,
we got the super Duper super Duper super Duper main
event down in the Bahamas. Tim is just shaking his

(04:54):
head because he thinks I'm an idiot, which I am. Yes,
the w SIP Paradise, this super main event. It is
a PGT qualifying event. It attracted two thousand, eight hundred
and ninety one entries twenty six thousand dollars buying, so
twenty five thousand plus one thousand. It had a sixty

(05:16):
million dollar guarantee. There was a lot of talk going
in on whether they would hit the guarantee. A lot
of people for them, it wasn't the question of whether
or not they would hit the guarantee. It was more
question of how short would they come, because sixty million
dollars is a lot of goddamn money. But they hit it,

(05:38):
and they hit it pretty comfortably. More than seventy two
million dollars in the prize pool. This is the biggest
prize pool in poker history outside of the WSP Main Event.
Of course, the WSP Main Event tops all the charts.
And then I think I saw I want to say,
friend of the podcast, Jeff Platt, I think I saw

(05:59):
a video with him saying that this is the eighth
largest event ever in terms of price pool, in the
history of the game. So really big stuff coming out
of the Bahamas. I guess the first question or discussion
here is I'll throw it to you with this is
Are we surprised? Are you surprised that it it hits

(06:20):
I guess both the guarantee and then also this big
of a price bowl ending up over seventy million.

Speaker 2 (06:26):
Yeah, I mean there's obviously a lot of chatter about
it overlaying. I was never really worried about it overlaying.
I always thought they would sneak in make it just
kind of like they did last year with the fifty
million guarantee. But for it to just hit it and
keep going and hit seventy two million is pretty pretty astronomical,

(06:48):
very surprising that they would get that many. And you know,
you're following the action, you know, from you know, from
your computer, from your phone, and you know the way
that action was playing out on social media with the
you know, Daniel mcgrond obviously calling it out the most
on in the's vlogs with people in for ten bull,
it's twelve bull, it's fourteen bull, It's all these kind

(07:09):
of crazy numbers. You just saw that. Yeah, look, this
is going to get pretty messy, pretty crazy for these people.
And yeah, they once they broke through, they just couldn't stop.

Speaker 1 (07:20):
Yeah, it is very very polarizing around the poker community.
You know, you pointed out some of the stuff on
social media, you know, just talking with a lot of
people at the various tables that I've been playing at
this month, it's the same sort of chatter where you know,
some people think it's good and awesome, other people think

(07:41):
it's just way too wild and crazy and unsustainable, you know.
I mean, we've heard numbers of people being in ten, twelve,
fifteen bullets, as you said, and it's quite insane to
think of it that way. I don't think I'm surprise
that they hit the guarantee. I think I aligned with

(08:03):
you in the fact that you know, this probably would
have come in if I were to guess, I would
have said between sixty and sixty five that would have
been audience. But you know, given the fact that I
thought the day one a number was really really good.
I think there was like twelve hundred or something entries
in there. And also honestly, with the way that they
kind of finagled this this schedule, which is a very

(08:27):
interesting case study. You know, this is the first time
that I've seen a tournament do in opening flight structure
like this. And for those that don't know what they
did in the Bahamas is they had four starting flights,
but they played the first two, then they played. Then
everyone that survived those first two flights played their Day two,

(08:51):
which made it into the money. So and then there
was two more starting flights, and then those two starting
flights had their own Day two, and then everyone later
on combined for Day three. So if you bagged Day
one A and then you got a day off and
then you played Day one or Day two A, you
bag that, then you would have two days or three
days off then you would come back. So it's kind
of like a nice break in there. It could also

(09:12):
allowed you to cash the event twice, which is an
interesting little twist and a little bit weird. You know,
like you could cash day you know, two A because
they made the money on the day twos. Then if
you busted after you made the money, you could obviously
then fire multiple bullets afterwards. So there was that, But
it's also like, you know, let's say you put a

(09:33):
bunch of bullets in or whatever. Even if you put
one bullet in, you get to day two, you kind
of think, oh, in a normal schedule that we commonly
see is that, well, okay, I made it past registration.
I made it to day two, like I'm I'm going
forward like this is it? But not in this tournament.
You know, you could play that day too, you could
bust and then you could hop back in you know,

(09:54):
later on. So obviously the structure is more shallow in
the day two stage. So the whole thing kind of
generated a lot of re entries overall.

Speaker 2 (10:06):
You also have to mention the you know, like you said,
you cash on day two one hundred In total the
people in the money on day two A was two
hundred and thirty three. One hundred and twenty five of
those cashed and were eliminated. Obviously, the men cash is
two x the buy and it's fifty thousand dollars. You
also have the promotions where if you had cash in

(10:27):
the main event, you would get an extra twenty five k.
So this technically probably a decent amount of people that
cash and were eliminated that you know, essentially won three buyants, right,
they get the fifty k, plus they get the twenty
five So you know, we would have to find those
numbers somehow, but I would say a good chunk at
the one twenty five probably jumped in, you know, one

(10:49):
c or one D or even on day two B
and that's what helps push that number up with that
sixty million. Obviously, this concept is very new to poker
in gen Or obviously wasn't part of Lasius supermin So
that obviously gives them, you know, a bit more wiggle
room to up that guarantee to the sixty and then,

(11:09):
you know, knowing this concept, we might as well say,
now we probably see the guarantee even move up next
year slightly.

Speaker 1 (11:18):
Yeah. I mean, it's also something where I'm curious if
we see one this schedule concept start to take place
in other WSP events, most specifically during the summer. Not
that they would ever do this, I don't think for
the WSP main event, because that would entail making the
WSP main events a re entry, which I don't think

(11:39):
that they'll ever do. But do you start to see
it for you know, I don't know the Colossus or
the Milli Maker or the Monsters, you know, anything like that, right,
I think.

Speaker 2 (11:48):
We already see it in those events in a way,
like the Mystery Millions and the Colossus, he played to
the money you cash. Then they play a little deeper,
so like in the Colossus where there's four flights, you
can cash four times. You know, it's not the same
version of this where you know, we know what the
classics is. It's a little bit of a crap shoot.
It's quick, it's fast, it's for you know, the U

(12:09):
and me's of the world. While this obviously a twenty
five K, you can't really play to the money on
day one in a twenty five K, So I think
this concept is very.

Speaker 1 (12:18):
Have you seen this structure is pretty fast? Yeah? Sure,
but I mean they could have honestly played to the
money in the tournament. Why not?

Speaker 2 (12:26):
I think this is perfect for this event, and this
event only twenty five K Superman, you know, hey, why
not out of day two C as well? Why you're
at it? You know, like or you know what, maybe
a better option is three day ones than the two
A than three day ones, you know, then the two

(12:46):
than the two B, and you could actually run that
one D right on day two A.

Speaker 1 (12:53):
I got a crazy idea, what if you did the
first three starting flights in Vegas during the summer. Yeah,
you could do that, said, hey guys, yeah, you all backchips,
we'll see in the Bahamas.

Speaker 2 (13:07):
Yeah, you could do that, you know, essentially you could
do that. Probably what the day off of the main
final table and then the two final table days, that's
probably a good time to do it, you know that.

Speaker 1 (13:20):
Right, everyone's looking for everyone's trying to play some stuff,
right like I mean, it's in a way as a
satellite to that tournament. You know, they do plenty of
the stuff where you know, you play that, you play
the day ones or whatever online, right, or you play
the qualifiers online, same sort of thing.

Speaker 2 (13:36):
The only problem is you would have to there's two things. Well,
the best thing is that, let's say they did a
seventy five million dollar guarantee, you could probably knock off
twenty million in Vegas, So that's probably pretty good. They'll
give them a little bit of ease. The second thing, though,
this is where it gets tricky, I think, and you know,
maybe you disagree with me here. You would probably have
to play to the money, but then also pull some

(14:00):
money out of the prize pool for travel like or
pre pay something like pre pay travel expenses. The difference
with Bahamas is you're already there. You've already either won
a package or you paid your accommodation. Like you think
of all the packages that people won or gave out.
The value was thirty thousand, right, five thousand for accommodation
and travel. So now if you're going to win your

(14:20):
seat live, you know, in Vegas, just like you have
to think of as a normal satellite Like when I
won my WSP Main Events seat in Australia. You know,
I won the seat plus travel and accommodation. So I
think you would have to get a little finicky with
the payouts or like get creative with how you can
ensure people go and play. You know, you could also

(14:43):
make it very simple. You've made the money. I'm not
paying you out unless you put your ass in the
seat in paradise, which is fair enough. Right do you
cash for fifty k? You know? All right, fine, I'll
spend three thousand dollars on flights and accommodation, get myself
down there so I can make sit down ask cash
out fifty k.

Speaker 1 (15:01):
So I mean, what were they didn't they do I
don't think I don't think they did it this year.
But last year they had some day one flights online
they Yeah, and then you got into like day three
or something like that.

Speaker 2 (15:12):
Yeah, you were expedited to day three, so.

Speaker 1 (15:16):
You do something like that. It's just only in the
live setting.

Speaker 2 (15:20):
Look, WSP, it's a new animal this year, next year,
GG poker can do whatever they want. They can get
very creative here. Like you said, they can do stuff
like this where you fast chuck the live players straight
into to day three. You can you know, they have
gg poker, but they also have WSP dot com. Why
not do the same thing with WWSP dot dot com.

(15:42):
Maybe it's not twenty five k pius point, maybe it's
a much smaller price point, but it gets you to
the day two. You can do lots of things, you know,
like there's a there is a strategic plan right where
we could see this being one hundred million dollar guarantee.
Now it's not going to happen. Well, it could happen
next year, but you have to put the things in

(16:05):
motion and really kind of coordinate everything. When I say everything,
i'm talking you know, we're we're going to touch on
a bit later. But WSP Europe in April. Then you
got to coordinate WSP Vegas, You've got to coordinate GG
poker online, WSP dot com online, and then obviously Paradise
being the biggest one. But you can definitely push this

(16:25):
to being one hundred million dollar guarantee super main event
in the Bahamas with planning and not just giving out,
you know, fifty million dollars in seats. I think they
can get there organically in a way.

Speaker 1 (16:41):
I'm curious if because I know, you know, when the
WPT partnered with when they came out with their big guarantee,
they obviously update a ton to forty million the next year,
and a lot of the discussion and I think we
probably even talked about it on this podcast, and I
know we talked about it even off the podcast for sure.

(17:02):
But you know, the question is does it ever over
overtake the ws AP main event in Las Vegas? Now
that's obviously too well this let me set it up
a little bit more. Is that you know that event,
the WPD World Championship, that's competitor verse competitor, Like they're
going head to head here. I mean, it's it's internal, right,
So is that the plan here? You know? Are what

(17:25):
are they what are they trying to do? Ws A.
It's just it's very interesting to be both an industry
insider and also a fan and kind of just watching
this all unfold because I mean, it seems like it
seems to me that there was a lot more promotional

(17:49):
effort put into the ws AP Paradise Super Main Event
than there was the WASP Main Event in Las Vegas. Now,
of course you kind of have to do that because
one of them has a big ass guarantee you got
to hit, and the other one, the other one doesn't
and really has a really solid, solid, excuse me, solid
foundation that you kind of just like, you know, at

(18:12):
this point, you know, barring any like insane outcomes or
you know, happenings in the world that the WASP man
event is Las Vegas is probably nine thousand players at
its floor, like stone floor, you know. So so it's interesting, right,
you know, because to your point, if they if they
start to grow this thing, let's say, seventy five million

(18:33):
next year, one hundred million the year after that, and
they really start, you know, ramping it up, it starts
to kind of overtake the WSP Main Event in Las Vegas.
And there's a little bit more flexibility with with doing
things in the Bahamas, you know. You know, GG poker
has done a lot to uh make some innovations here

(18:54):
in the US, but the US Gaming industry also has
a lot of regulations that you have to abide by.
You know, you can't just like come in here and
start firing Crypto in his buyings like stuff like that,
whereas like in the Bahamas, it's like you can kind
of do whatever you want. So it's a little bit freer. Now,
there's obviously positives and there's negatives to every sort of thing.
I'm just I'm just already starting like the wheels in

(19:16):
my head are starting to turn, like what does this
thing look like? Because it's clearly now become this behemoth
that is, you know, legitimately here, and it looks like
it's here to stay. And you know, now it's like
how big does it grow? And is it going to
overtake the SPMN event in Las Vegas? And that is
that the plan internally? I mean, I don't think we're

(19:37):
ever gonna know the actual plan, but is that just
kind of that natural progression here, you know. So I'm
just I guess I'm kind of curious just to see
how it all plays out.

Speaker 2 (19:46):
They could do whatever they want for this event four
hundred million dollars guaranteed never ever be better than the
WSP main event here in Las Vegas. You can see that,
I'm sorry, there's some purity to that event. Really that

(20:06):
every man, right, the Tim Duckworth of the world, that
can jump in on the buzzer on day two D
with their ten thousand dollars.

Speaker 1 (20:15):
Okay, but you also do realize that if it were
to come to that, they could literally can't they own
them one in Vegas? They could say, like.

Speaker 2 (20:23):
They don't change it. I'm saying, let's pretends it stays
as it is. There is the purity of the freeze
out aspect, there's the history, the lineage of fifty odd
years of w Suputer edition. It's the one, you know.
Let's also talk about just the ease of getting to Vegas.
I can jump on a Southwest flight, I can drive

(20:44):
from California, can catch a damn bullet train in a
couple of years probably right, put up my ten thousand
dollars play. If I'm buss, I go home. If I
make it through, I continue. There's it's really hard to
kind of defeat that. And now let's let's pretend it
stays at Atlantis. You know, if we remove all the

(21:05):
poker stuff from Atlantis, there's still a lot of negativity
with that. Now there's the it's the food, the service,
you know, the slowness of the service too. Now if
they decide to move to Baha Mah, does Atlantis, Mate does?
Does Gigi Poker? Just buy Atlantis and say look, let's
make this better. Sure that's possibility too.

Speaker 1 (21:26):
Now that's je Poker Island.

Speaker 2 (21:28):
Yeah, that could happen. Now, I think that could change
things a lot and a more positive site. I just
don't think this event as it is, twenty five k
buying a gazillion re entries really appeals to the greater
player pool that is poker. And that's okay. Because they
have the Las Vegas main event, they have other opportunities.
This appeals to, you know, let's let's be real high

(21:51):
stakes poker players and that's okay. It has its place
on the poker schedule, on the poker calendar, and it
appeals to enough players and they're all there. Now, if
you're the everyday person that only has that one buy in,
I'll see you. I'll see you in July and Vegas.
You know, if you're you know, more of a value.

(22:11):
You know, you look at all the people here playing
the WPT event that we thought, Hey, they may be
over at Bahamas, but are not that appeals to them.
I think there's enough difference between what's going on on
the schedule, whether it's you know, the WSP versus WPT
debate or just the WSP Paradise versus WSP Vegas debate.

(22:32):
So I don't think you know, it will ever ever
take over the Las Vegas main event, unless you know,
they decide to just click cancel on it, or they,
you know, like I said, by Atlantis and hire a
million people to run the restaurants and speed things up

(22:53):
or make it. You know, I think you said it
the other day. Isn't it like seven hundred five hundred
dollars a night? That's pretty expensive for the for the
the rex out there, and you know, just it just
to me, nothing will have a have a bait the
WSP main event.

Speaker 1 (23:10):
Yeah, I mean, listen, I'm gonna walk back kind of
my stance a little bit. I'm not saying I think
it's going to be. I do agree with you, I would.
I also wouldn't go as far as you you're saying
never ever. I'll say it's always there's always a non
zero chance, right, It is always a non zero chance.
So I mean, I do think that kind of something
you touched on a little bit, there is where I

(23:31):
kind of end up going with it in that you know,
I don't know, I feel like I'm a decent test
case for this sort of stuff. To me, playing in
the w SP Super Main Event and feeling like I
have a shot seems unattainable, which I think is probably

(23:51):
the biggest hurdle to overcome if you are trying to
grow this event in terms of mass appeal, because I
just think like like this year, like I'm looking at
it and I'm like, well, you know, One, there's the
hurdle of like if it's hard to travel for poker
these days, especially to a place where it's going to

(24:12):
cost you, you know, five hundred dollars plus a night
or whatever it might be. You know, you know, food's
expensive there, et cetera. Like that's that's hard. So there's
that aspect to overcome. Second, I mean, twenty five K
is a lot of freaking money to buy into a
poker tournament. Like I will take one or two shots
in a ten K year, you know, sell some action
and get in there. But twenty five K is hard

(24:34):
and then on top of that, it's not only like
your random twenty five K or like a good feel
the twenty five K. I mean this is I've been
watching the coverage. I've been following all. I mean, it's
killers after killers after killers, and even guys you don't know,
you just know that they're killers from online. You're watching
the hands that they're playing. You're like, what in the
hell is going on here? And they have unlimited buy ins.

(24:56):
So it's like the unattainability for for somebody like me
or somebody that's more on the fence. I think it's
it's hard, right, It's so it's I think if you're
the w s AP, the hardest thing to again make
this event more mass appeal is being able to like
sell that dream. I don't I agree with you that,
you know, I think this event has a place. Like

(25:17):
you said, they have the WSP main event that's like
the every every pokerman's dream to go play that tournament,
and then here it's this is kind of like the
high rollers dream, you know. I just I think it's
hard to sell this to the everyman.

Speaker 3 (25:30):
Now.

Speaker 1 (25:31):
I think if you were to sell it to the everyman,
you would have to make some changes. I think making
it a freeze out is probably the number one change,
you know, But then you go into the fact that, like, well,
if it's a freeze out, how are we going to
hit sixty million dollars or even fifty million dollars in
a price play? How are you going to do that?
And how you're gonna scalop that way? I mean, you're
probably gonna just have to try and get five thousand

(25:53):
unique players down to the Bahamas. And that's in and
of itself in issue like it can can Atlantis even
how is five thousand players? You know, Like at that
point you start getting into all the logistical aspects of things.
So it's just it's very interesting to see it all
play out. I'm genuinely fascinated by it all, you know,

(26:15):
So I'm curious to see where it goes in the
next two three years. In kind of the immediate surface,
it's definitely not going anywhere, you know. Some of this
news that we'll get into next is why it's not
going anywhere. I Mean, they announced the dates for next
year already. They have We'll get to the WSP Player

(26:36):
of the Year stuff, but that's going to be awarding
packages to the twenty twenty seven version of this, Like,
so this thing is here to stay, right, and as
I said, it's an absolute freaking behemoth. So I don't know. Also, like, yeah,
you're gonna get the guys, the you know, the Chidwick's,
the negran Who's you know, all these guys that are
going down there. Jesse Loanis et cetera firing eight nine

(26:59):
ten fabian gums fired ten bullets, like you know, all
these guys are firing double digit bullets, you know, five
plus bullets at a minimum, all that sort of stuff.
I think Jeremy Osmus fired what four bullets? Yeah, you know,
and he was like he feels good that he only
had to fire four bullets type of thing. So, but
do you lose the people that are that are turned
off by that? So the people that went down there

(27:21):
with a shot, right, you know, the people that might
have been chasing like some of those bonuses that you mentioned,
the Paradise Parlay cash the main event in Vegas. Go
down there, you cash, you get another twenty five k
like stuff like that. Are you gonna are you gonna
lose those fringe people? And that's gonna be interesting to see.

Speaker 2 (27:36):
You know, you can still go there planning to fire
one bullet like.

Speaker 1 (27:40):
Yeah, but what But that's what I'm saying is that
the people that might think that do, they just end
up not going because if they say, like, hey, I
can spend twenty five K or twenty six k, right
plus travel. Let's say I'm thirty k all in, because
that's the thing I'm getting at here. I can go
thirty k on. I can go fire my one bullet

(28:00):
down there, cool right, or and this is where again
it goes back to the clashing events. I can go
to Vegas and WPT win, which is three flights freeze
out per flight ten k, and I'm basically in that
thing with a possible three chances if I need it
for the same exact amount of money buy and wise. Now,
of course you can win a lot more in the

(28:21):
super main event because of the guarantee, the prize pool,
all that sort of stuff, But then you also have
to factor in that, you know, the the WPT World
Championship is. I mean, I'm pretty confident to say that
it's a much softer field and easier for you know,
lesser players. Not that I'm knocking everyone that's playing that
event just lesser than like, you know, like the super

(28:43):
Wizards that are going to go down to play in Paradise.
So it's it's interesting in that regard, you know, so
so are the people that are the people that kind
of you saw some stuff on social media that might
have you know, complained or mentioned the multi entry and
the number that these guys are firing. Are those the
people that you're turning off and then you lose I

(29:03):
don't know, let's say four hundred unique players, three hundred
unique players, whatever it is, I don't know, because then
you know, if you're somebody like a top pro and
you know that those one bullet people that you might
view as like the spots in the field, the soft spots,
if they're not coming, does that make it less advantageous

(29:23):
for you to then go. So it's just again, I'm
just really fascinated on how it all plays out. Ten
million dollars first place prize. The prize pool was officially
announced today that they did say that you know, they
got up over seventy two million. I think it was
seventy million, two hundred and seventy five thousand in the
prize pool in total, they released the prize pool breakdown today,

(29:45):
ten million dollars for first it's very very similar at
the final table too, the DUBS main event in Las Vegas.
The first I think four spots are the exact same
ten million, six million, four million, three million, and then
fifth place here is two point three five I think
in Vegas it was two point four. Then you got

(30:05):
sixth place one point eight, you got seventh place one
point four, eighth place one point one, ninth place eight
hundred and fifty k, and I believe in Vegas ninth
place was a million. That was the big thing.

Speaker 2 (30:14):
It was exact same.

Speaker 1 (30:16):
I mean, sure, why not? I mean, you know, I
would bet that some of that had to do with
because it was very it was very kind of weird
with the payouts for this because like because of the
way they did the schedule, like you got to cash
on day two a right, but they have no idea
what the total prize pool is because there's still two

(30:37):
full flights plus that second day two and there's there's
entries in all of that. Yeah, so like you have
no idea. But then on the other side of things,
you guaranteed I think they guaranteed or at least they
might have said it. But a mint cash is worth
fifty k.

Speaker 2 (30:51):
Yeah, which is well all WSP events now the men
cash is two x.

Speaker 1 (30:55):
But what they did, but it's interesting to do that
without knowing like the full pay out in such a
big buy an event.

Speaker 2 (31:02):
They also did two pay jumps on day one a
sorry under day twos, which I don't think they needed
to do. I think they could have just kept it
a fifty k. I mean, you're not saving a lot
of money.

Speaker 1 (31:11):
You get a page on if you make day three.

Speaker 2 (31:13):
And then and then yeah, you just made like paid.
So now the men cash on day three, which was
seventy thousand, could have just been sixty thousand. So you're
probably finding an extra half a million dollars, you know,
if you just change those payouts that you could have
put up to top up the top to get that
ninth place million dollars, bumped the other ones up a
little bit and kind of copy paste what we did

(31:34):
in Vegas.

Speaker 1 (31:38):
Yeah, I mean, the tournament's just wild. I don't know
what else to say. It's Tuesday, December sixteenth. Day three
is running down in the Bahamas. They started the day
with I believe two hundred and two players. They are
very much deep into that now. There was a flurry
of eliminations to start right away. They're under one hundred

(31:59):
players now in the field. Coming into the day, it
was Martin Cabrell who had the chip lead. Yes, the
loud guy, the obnoxious guy. Right now it is Faraz
Jaka who came into the day in the top ten.
He looks to be leading the way. Chad Eaves Sledge
also came into the day in the top ten. He's
up there crushing as well. Andy Wilson, a very good

(32:23):
British player, is up there in the top ten. It
looks like Daniel Rozai who won a w SIP Eagle
bracelet in one of the events down in Paradise. He
won the fifty k nolanvan hold Him high Roller Turbo,
a PGT qualifying event. He's crushing. Poker media member Terrence
Reid is freaking crushing. He looks like he's in like
eleventh place, top fifteen. Jesse Lonis is in there, Jamil Wakiel,

(32:46):
Alexander Theologists, Martin Cabrell is still in Yes, David Coleman
is in there. So I mean Natasha Mercier is in there.
I mean, this this event is just freaking wild. So
still still kind of a long way to go with
all of this. You had Alex Foxen busting today, Joe
Katta busted today, Jean Abert Balan busted today, Chris Moneymaker

(33:08):
busted today. Nick Bartangelo also busted it today, so you know,
very interesting to follow along, very exciting to see it
all happen. They are streaming this on the WSP YouTube channel,
so you guys can check that out if you want.
And then I did want to get to one other
person who is still in because this is another kind
of point of contention around the around the industry. But

(33:31):
Ren Lynn. Ren Lynn showed up to play, which I
don't know if you guys remember, but he was recently
suspended indefinitely from World Series of Poker events and then
next thing you know, he's in the Bahamas playing. So
of course that generated a lot of buzz, a lot
of news and for those that missed it, you know Rehn.

(33:55):
The story is that he basically answered a call from
a friend that he was that was playing in a tournament.
Basically the friend was like asking him questions and showing
him spots in a tournament but it was actually like
the live tournament that the guy was playing, Wren was
helping him, and it was ruled you know, real time assistants,

(34:16):
and then you know, Wren came out afterwards, he issued
this long apology. He tried to make people right financially,
sending out all this different money to the various people
that were possibly affected at the final table and all
that sort of stuff. Obviously, GG Poker and w SP
come out, you know, in the aftermath they say he's
suspended indefinitely. You know, then at the time the suspension,

(34:38):
you know, there was a lot of people that was like, listen,
it wasn't that bad. You know, if if what Wren
really did or what he said he did, you know,
if that's actually how it went down, then you know,
it's not that bad. He tried to correct it immediately,
he tried to you know, issue the apology. Obviously, he
tried to issue the financial money or you know, the
finances to everyone to kind of make them on the situation.

(35:01):
So maybe the penalty that of the indifferent suspension was
a little bit more hard than it should have been.
But now it's interesting because everyone's like, well, I thought
you suspended this guy indefinitely and now just the next
series he's just back in the mix.

Speaker 2 (35:16):
That's here.

Speaker 1 (35:17):
You're you're a commissioner of a basically a poker league, Like,
how would you handle this thing?

Speaker 2 (35:22):
I don't know. It's a tough one. But the big
difference between Ran and other people that are been you know,
suspended or banned or whatever have you know, he did
come out immediately, tried to make things right, So that's
a big difference, if we're being honest. I think a
lot of people have predicted that he would be back
at least by next World series, if not Paradise. So,

(35:46):
I mean, they banned him and then they unbanned him.
I don't really have a problem with it, to be honest,
I don't.

Speaker 1 (35:51):
Well, I think the problem for many people is that
you're trying to hit this huge guarantee and you unban
a guy that can possibly put ten bullets in this tournament,
Like that's that's the that's the that's the dots that
people are connecting.

Speaker 2 (36:03):
You know what. I never thought of it that way.
The kudos are the people who thought that was the
reason they I'm banning Well, I mean that's just kind
of a yeah, but like one person isn't going to
make it.

Speaker 1 (36:15):
Yeah, of course one person is not going to go.
But still, I mean, if you're if you're trying to
pull players from everywhere to hit a huge guarantee, I mean,
you know, like, yeah, I mean, I guess optically, I
think it does look a little bit bad. You know,
in indefinite suspension is there's obviously no timetable on it.
They can lift the suspension whenever they want. I do

(36:36):
think that, you know, Wren handled the situation after it
happened as best he could, you know, immediately coming out
saying like, yeah, I screwed up. I'm sorry, here's the
money back to these people. But I also think that,
you know, maybe w SP and GG should have been like, listen,
here's the deal. You're suspended for WSP Paradise. You can't

(36:56):
do anything there, and you know, we'll revisit it next
year and then maybe they they allow him to play
WISP Europe or the Douvasip in Las Vegas, right, you know,
But I think I think lifting a suspension before you
actually had any other events is kind of a weird.
Look like, at least suspend him for like something, and

(37:17):
it just so happens that that's something for them would
have been dobsip Paradise, so you know, probably would have
just suspended him for WSP Paris has been like listen, buddy,
you just got to sit out, man. I'm sorry. You
know you're you're on a six month ban or whatever
the heck it is. You know, you did some good
things in terms of trying to right the wrongs after
the fact, but you still did wrong. So you know,
we got to kind of set a little bit of
an example here, and that's what we're gonna do. But

(37:40):
I do agree with you that, you know, it's not
as bad as some of the others in the past,
and I don't think he should be suspended for life
or anything like that, but I think he kind of
do have to set some sort of like you know,
precedence here. But anyway, Redland's backpoint and he's still on
with under Hunter Proyers left, so let's see how that goes.
I mentioned that this is is a PGT qualifying event.

(38:03):
You had Michael the Grinder, Miss Rocky and John wo Wasnock,
the top two finishers from this year's WSB Man event
in Las Vegas. They both needed to find a second
cash in order to get that third qualifying cash or sorry,
a third cash. They both needed to find a third cash.
They had two my fault in order to be eligible
for the PGT Million Dollar Championship at the end of

(38:25):
the season. They both got it in this event. I
don't know if miss Rocky knows. I know for sure
Big wah Was knows because he immediately sent a DM
to the poker Twitter account or the PGT account was like,
I got my third cash. I'll see you in January
in Vegas. So Was knows. He's ready to go. He's
been he's been grinding. He was at Venetian, he played

(38:48):
maybe a couple nept events. He played for sure in
Texas like he was, He's playing stuff like he's trying
to get this third cash. He finally got it in
this damn event. So congrats to you, mister Wasnack, and
we will see you in Las Vegas. Now, Michael m
is Rocky have no idea he knows like he could know,
he could not know. I know we talked with him

(39:08):
during the National Heads Up Poker Championship and he was like, yeah,
I'm gonna get my third but I have no idea
what grinder knows or doesn't know. I mean, for all
we know, he might think the event already happened.

Speaker 2 (39:19):
Yeah, we'll send someone a message to alert him. But
uh yeah, him and him and was got that third cash?
That good on them. The guys that also needed a
second I mean a second or a third cash don't
appear to be there playing.

Speaker 1 (39:36):
So the one that sticks out to me is Leo Margetts.
She's not there. She's at the wind.

Speaker 2 (39:40):
She's at the wind.

Speaker 1 (39:42):
She would he would need two cashes though.

Speaker 2 (39:44):
Kenny Hallett, he's over in Prague, which does make sense.
Jared mc guiney he is here in Vegas too, But yeah,
so we'll probably see those. Fellow w SP Main Event
final table is not participate in the upcoming free role.
But I think the biggest kind of changes on the leaderboard.

(40:06):
And look, we still have several events left. There's sixteen
hundred points up top in the Super Main, so things
are going to keep moving. But you know the biggest
change is Stephen Chidwick. He jumped up into the top ten.
We had Michael Manchek pick up some much need to
points when he finished runner up to Charlie hook, he's

(40:26):
up into the top twenty. And then you've got a
lot of people in this in this middle group. I'm
going to throw out some names at you right now.
Obviously you got Jesse Lonas who's seventh, but you know,
you have Victor Blum, you had Chadiveslays, you have Latara Guerrera.
So Gio Ittor just busted. But those guys in those

(40:46):
mid twenties with sixteen hundred points, they could take the
lead over Alex Foxon who did cash in the main event.
But yeah, we could see, you know, some dramatic changes
on the whole entire lead aboard once you know, WSP
Paradise kind of wraps up, obviously a couple more events
left too, and then we're gonna lead obviously into our

(41:08):
PGT Last Chance. That will really kind of shape everything
heading into that you know, million dollar Championship.

Speaker 1 (41:18):
Yeah, I mean, there's gonna be a lot of movement,
as you said, coming out of this whole thing. I mean,
we'll have to have to watch every single day and
see how this thing unfolds, and then you know, we'll
we'll go from there. So it would be it would
be pretty wild to see someone, you know, kind of
come out of like outside the top forty and like

(41:38):
you know, make a huge leap, get into the top forty,
ultimately be able to possibly challenge for Player of the
Year honors. Like you know, it's just there's a lot
to be there.

Speaker 2 (41:47):
One name for that is Daniel Roseai. Yeah, he obviously
won the fifty k high roll of the seven hundred
and fifty points. That was his second cash of the season.
He's still in the main event, so let's just pretend
he wins that. That's sixteen hundred. So now he's up
to twenty three hundred and he's sitting third on the Leadabard.

Speaker 1 (42:06):
I mean, that's just wild.

Speaker 2 (42:07):
Yeah. Wild. You know, there's a lot of kind of
crazy stuff like that that could happen, and yeah, we
we just get through broad eyes. The other thing, which
is tricky, which is, you know, I don't think we
really took into account when we gave WSB the Green
Lion was the double cashing. You know, like how does
that affect you know, like you know, Nacho Barbero is

(42:29):
a good one. He's cashed twice. You know, how does
that affect how many points does he get for that?
Because he's on he's at eight hundred and two points,
so he's about, you know, one hundred points out of
the top forty. He's cash twice. How are we gonna Uh?

Speaker 1 (42:46):
I mean, I think you have to honor it. But
I personally, I like, I was aware of how they
were doing this structure at the beginning of the tournament.
I thought, I don't know why. My mind just thought, Okay,
they're going to make the money on day three. What
I thought, like that just made sense to me. I
was like, why would you have people double cashing in
this tournament? But I'm also like, okay, I get it

(43:07):
from their aside, because you want people double cashing because
only fire multiple boards and that helps through guarantee.

Speaker 2 (43:12):
For the way I'm I've kind of already approached it
heading into this was they get the highest of the points,
they get both payouts in their stats, and but they
only get one cash because it's one event still, so
you know, like forward best points forward, that's the most

(43:32):
points forward, best cash forward. But we'll give them credit
for the for the the amount of money they won,
mainly because it's going to mess up on my data
if I don't do that that way. But that kind
of makes sense to me the most. You know, Nicha
Burbera is a good one. He could have picked up
ninety points, but he's only going to pick up fifty six.
I think that's, you know, fairly fair to me. And

(43:53):
obviously there's a few more, but I have to wait
till everyone kind of busts, because you know, going through
WSP plus today, you're still seeing a lot of like
code names, you know, super Yang A twenty three, et cetera,
and trying to figure out who these guys actually are
and you know where if they cash twice and I

(44:14):
have to, you know, get fancy with my spreadsheet.

Speaker 1 (44:17):
I'll tell you what. Though, in that WSP plus app,
they did fix the font size that I was complaining
about all summer long, and the font sizes.

Speaker 2 (44:24):
It seems to get better every day, like it seems
to be.

Speaker 1 (44:27):
My only issue is I don't have to restart an
app more than I restart every day. I have to
restart this app. I mean, I know that they're obviously
doing updates every single day and it's it's constantly improving,
but which is a good thing. But I'm also like,
do I have to always restart this app?

Speaker 2 (44:43):
The one thing. I just I'm assuming there's probably a solution.
You know, we obviously dealt a lot with the WSB
plus app, you know, during the summer with but the
feature table player, you know, name blanked out, chips removed,
and they have a YouTube logo. Like it needs to
be a better way to do this, Like, you know,
I just I need to see who that person is.

(45:05):
If you don't want to update the chips, that's fine,
but like we need especially like think about it tomorrow
when they play, the.

Speaker 1 (45:12):
Name should be there, but like where the chips are
should maybe just be like a lock symbol, like the
chips are locked, that's right, you know, or like too
or maybe that maybe the chip symbol is like it
says it puts the chips there, but then it says
like next to it sixty minutes ago or something, because
it's it's you know, based off whatever. Like I don't
know something, but I do agree with you that it's
a little bit weird because you're you're trying to sweat

(45:33):
the updates and then you're like, well, who the heck
are these eighty nine people? Where'd they go?

Speaker 2 (45:37):
You know, tomorrow everyone will be a feature table player.

Speaker 1 (45:40):
Well, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 2 (45:41):
That's the kind of issue. And if they really look,
do they really care about do they really want people
watching or they want on people on the app? You know,
I I think it's I.

Speaker 1 (45:50):
Mean, I think they ultimately want both.

Speaker 2 (45:51):
I don't know what that means possible, you know, I'm
I'm a firm believer. If you want to watch the stream,
you'll watch the stream. If you want to look at
the updates, you look at the updates. I think they
can both be essentially live without really jeopardizing anything. So
that's my theory on it.

Speaker 1 (46:10):
All right, Well, you know what, we'll obviously be keeping
tabs on this thing as it goes. That is the
WSP Paradise Super Main Event. Ten million dollars to first place,
more than seventy two million dollars in the prize pool,
and they are down to fewer than one hundred players.

Speaker 2 (46:25):
Gabriella Gabrielle Andrade is still in by the way, I
just know, oh my god, he's running on the pot.
I remember. I think if you guys remember, from like
what maybe two podcasts ago, I told a story about
how he was buried chasing the TCH Main Event sixteen
hundred dollars a pop brick. The entire series were putting
like twelve bullets, came over to the Champions, played the

(46:47):
final like hypertobo flight got in made a running that
main event. He's you know, obviously plays both games, but
I always thought Pilo was his like main game, cashing that,
you know, but like grinding the old thirty three hundred
of the Champions and the sixteen hundred at TCH and
then now he's just winning truck or finishing whatever is second.

Speaker 1 (47:07):
Yeah, because he finished second in the two hundred and
fifty k Invitational tournament and Paradise.

Speaker 2 (47:14):
So raking and running the super main. Where is he
sitting wild? It's twenty fifth right now of niney odd
so you go kind of crazy.

Speaker 1 (47:25):
All right, sticking with the World Series of Poker, but
kind of shifting gears a little bit here w SP Europe.
So they announced, uh, I don't know, a couple of
months ago, Tim and I brought it up on the podcast,
but they announced how two big changes to that series.
One is they were going to be leaving Rosmudov and
going to Prague. I believe it's the Hilton Prague, which is,

(47:48):
if I'm correct, the same venue as ept prog I believe,
So they're moving to Prague, and then they're also shifting timeframe,
so they're not going to do the October ish window.
They're going to shift it to the front half of
the year, and they're doing it what end of March
into April, right at the end of March into April,
March thirty first through April twelfth, and then today or

(48:11):
yesterday they announced the schedule and this also comes with
some changes. Fifteen gold bracelet events, which I think is
what they normally do there, but the main event is
the big talking point here. So the WSP Europe Main
Event has always been ten thousand euro buying or ten
thousand pounds when they were doing it in London, they

(48:34):
dropped it to five k and they added an enormous
ten million euro guarantee. Now I know that's not the
sixty seventy million that they're getting down at the WSP
Paradise Superman event, but ten million, and according to the
news store NWSP dot com, this figure surpasses any guarantee
for a poker tournament held in Europe in twenty twenty five.

(48:57):
I mean, I'm not sure that because there's been a
guarantee bigger. I mean maybe that whatever that ISPT thing,
the International Stadium's Poker Tour thing. I don't even remember
what the hell they were.

Speaker 2 (49:07):
Trying to the Trenton event there, But did they have
a guarantee? They may have? Who won that Andy?

Speaker 1 (49:14):
Which one?

Speaker 2 (49:15):
The one random one they did.

Speaker 1 (49:17):
The Triton one?

Speaker 2 (49:20):
No, that's not that's called I don't know whatever. I'll
go digg him. I thought they anyway.

Speaker 1 (49:26):
But anyway, in twenty twenty five, ten million dollars for
a five K that's two thousand entries. That's freaking Why
so the WSB Europe Main event, which had six hundred
and fifty entries, what.

Speaker 2 (49:38):
The one jop? They did a one drop there?

Speaker 1 (49:41):
Yeah, but did they have a guarantee?

Speaker 2 (49:43):
But you said biggest prize pool in Europe.

Speaker 1 (49:45):
No, no, it's the biggest guarantee for a poker tournament
held in Europe.

Speaker 2 (49:49):
We'll have to get d Maybe I misspoke.

Speaker 1 (49:51):
Again, and I have no idea what I'm saying, but
in my mind I said guarantee, So that's what I said.
So yeah, so they had six hundred and fifty ish players.
I think that number has been kind of around the
same maybe it has been declining a little bit. I
don't know exactly, but now they're going to go to
two thousand right now. Obviously half the buy in, but

(50:12):
if you were just to take last year's field multiply
it by two, that gets you up to thirteen hundred
and fifty. And this they're guaranteeing two thousand entries. I mean,
obviously they can miss the guarantee and it can be
less entries, but I mean with the way that GG
Poker's going, you know now owning the wsp brand, I
feel like they're going to get twelve to fourteen million
in this price will easy and that's just out of

(50:33):
freaking control for a for this tournament. I mean, the
EBT progue just wrapped up like what a week or
two ago Mountain Kerkow shout out to him, long time
member of the industry, member of the poker community, won
the events. I believe that had around twelve hundred entries.
So I mean that gives you an idea of what

(50:54):
WSPU Europe is trying to scale to here and they
come out with this enormous freaking guarantee which is just nuts.
It does have three starting flights I'm assuming it's gonna
be you know, multiple re entry, all that sort of stuff.
They also have a fifteen hundred dollars no limit hold
them European Circuit Championship that comes with a one point

(51:16):
five million dollar guarantee. So in that one, you're looking
at a thousand entries based on the guarantee. They got
you know, a bunch of different price points on here.
They got a one K opener, a three KPLO mixed
h five hundred dollars five hundred euro I should say colossus.
They got a two K twenty five hundred. They got

(51:36):
a ten K high roller, you know, a twenty five
k GG million's high roller. So you know, this is
this is a series that you know, much different than
than w S would be Paradise, where you know, it
was like there was one buy in sub five k
for like actual bracelet event, then everything else was just astronomical.
I mean, this is very much geared towards like kind

(51:58):
of your more average tournament player, traveling player, WSP player,
that sort of stuff. So I feel like with this schedule,
this series is now fully back. It's going to be wild.
I think it's going to be enormous. So yeah, is it.

Speaker 2 (52:17):
Going to be enormous? Why the reason I say that
I criticized the dates they chose, Okay, because well.

Speaker 1 (52:25):
They said, f your dates, tim ten million euros guaranteed.
That's what they said.

Speaker 2 (52:31):
I got it, I got it. They want to go
to war.

Speaker 1 (52:33):
Money can solve a lot of problems, including scheduling.

Speaker 2 (52:36):
Look, they went to wall with WPT win Las Vegas.
Now they're going to war with the Irish poke.

Speaker 3 (52:42):
Up in and I think they're winning the WPT versus
moved it a week later and completely being offset but
now with their main event at the front end of
the series, right because.

Speaker 2 (52:55):
Irish poke up in the one of the yah y
a series in the world that ends April sixth. WSP
Europe starts March thirty first, ends April twelfth. Now, if i'm.

Speaker 1 (53:08):
And the main event dates specifically April third, April fourth,
and April fifth for the starting.

Speaker 2 (53:14):
Place, and they overlap the Irish Poker Open main event
that has a two point five million dollar guarantee, But
why wouldn't WSP Europe just offset that by a few days.
You know, we talk about you know, we talk about
giving players the most opportunity to play everything. They just
moved that to the second week of WSP Europe. They

(53:35):
completely fade the Irish Pokeer Open main event and all
the other events they have there. But as we know,
WSP don't give a shit about anybody else, so they
did this. So I am not as bullish on of
being a super popular event because I think a lot
of people, you know, are still going to choose the
Irish Prokeer Open that obviously has some history. We saw

(53:56):
a lot of I notice a lot of people on
so sure not base there traveling to go play the
Irish Prokerap And we had a couple of our players
play the Irish proke Op and skip our events. And
this is going to be another kind of forced decision
by the two operators. And you know, not really the

(54:18):
Irish poke up in the every days have been out forever,
but really four WSP forcing players to choose between you know,
the Irish Prokeer Open WSP Europe. Buyings are different, but
the biggest issue is that conflicting main event. And look,
you're going to look at it and say, okay, I
can play a five K ten mil or I can

(54:38):
play an eleven hundred two and a half mil. You
know there is an overlapping players there. Whether you know
how many, I don't know, but still I just don't.
I just don't like that they had the whole April's
calendar open. They just could have moved it a week
later and completely dominated the entire playa pol. You could

(54:59):
have got all all of Europe playing just by moving
in a week later.

Speaker 1 (55:03):
That's I mean, listen, I I don't disagree with you
that I would love for everyone to play nice. You know,
I don't think the WSB really has to here. Ws
B is the NFL. They can do whatever the hell
they want. I'm sorry, but they're the biggest brand and
they can do whatever that. They can drop the hammer
if they want to.

Speaker 2 (55:19):
What they're not gonna win, then they'll think about it.
Around now with Bahamas, think about how many people are trying.

Speaker 1 (55:24):
What do you mean with right now? With Bahamas? They
just got seventy two plus million dollars the price, But
how can you say they're not gonna win. They're gonna win.
Maybe they're gonna win.

Speaker 2 (55:31):
Think of all the players that are here.

Speaker 1 (55:32):
You know who hurts the WPT hurts. Sure, they're main
event dropped more than five hundred entries this year. The
Irish poke Gropen is likely gonna be the one that
hurts here, not the ws B Europe.

Speaker 4 (55:41):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (55:42):
Yeah, But I'm trying to say is that if if
they did their event a different time, they would get
potentially ninety five percent of the play a pool instead
of sixty percent.

Speaker 1 (55:53):
Yeah, listen, I don't disagree with you. It would be lovely, Listen.
It would have been lovely if like, for example, if
I was thinking about going to play these events, I
could go to Europe, I could go to Ireland, I
could fire that. I could hop on over to Prague.
I could fire that, and then I could head home,
make a little swing out of the whole thing. Right now, Unfortunately,
that's not how it's gonna be personally. If I was

(56:14):
the rspoke Rope and I would move my event, okay,
just like as I sent a text message and had
a little conversation with a friend of the podcast, Matt Savage,
I would have moved the WPT World Championship dates. I
would have shifted it one day further and I would
have tried to get everyone coming back from the Bahamas
to fire that final flight, Like that's what I would
have done, And yes, it's not ideal, and you do

(56:35):
have to kind of, you know, back off, and you
know in a way like you kind of have to
be the bigger person here, Like you can't just be like,
well I'm not moving because you're not moving, and then
it's just this game of chicken and no one's gonna
win there. So like, listen, the WSP's gonna do what
the WSPEED does. They are the NFL of the industry,
you know, whether we like it or not. They are
the biggest and the best brand and that's where a

(56:56):
lot of the value is and the biggest tournaments and
that's what everyone knows and blah blah blah blah. That's
we all have to just understand that. So you just
have to kind of shift and you have to be
willing to shift. I mean you know that more importantly
than anyone because you're constantly like, well, if this changes,
I'm going to change it whatever, like we could. I'm
constantly trying to tell you times to like stand your
ground and you're not, and you're always moving shit around.

(57:17):
So you know, like if if if you were in
charge of the Irish Poker Open here, you would probably
say like, well, we got to move like we like,
I'm Irish is too big for it to just get
up Listen, I'm not. First of all, we can say
this here on this podcast. We have no idea if
like you know, the Irish Poker Open or any venue

(57:38):
and operator whatever has convention space locked in, you know,
events space, all that. It's It's understandably it can be
a logistical nightmare if you have to move stuff, and
sometimes it's not even possible, right, you know, Like we
talk at times like well why don't they do the
WPT World Championship earlier or whatever, But it's like you
can't because there's that big Amazon conference or whatever in
Las Vegas. It takes up basically the entire city. So like,
you know, we get it. That said, I would still

(58:01):
try try. I would I would exhaust all avenues to
make it happen because I think at the end of
the day, with with what we're seeing now, and we're
going to get to some of this, you know in
a second. But you know, with what we're seeing now
is GG Poker owns the Dobis Ape, the biggest Brandon
poker and they are just swinging left, right and center,

(58:26):
so like you know, you can it's like just you
got to start bobbing and weaving like that. Everyone else
just has to start bobbing and weaving. That's that's just
how it has to be. Okay, because these guys are
in town every which place in the world and they're
just they're dropping the hammer. So we we you know,
including the PGT, we got to kind of just work
around it, right, especially if they're going to be continuing

(58:46):
to throw these huge guarantees at things sixty million dollars
in the Bahamas, you got ten million here, like they're
swinging for the fences.

Speaker 2 (58:55):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (58:56):
So, I mean you even see things like, you know,
for one person, David Baker was like, WUROP schedule looks great. Awesome,
I'm a fan, Like it sounds like he's like gonna go.
I didn't see David Baker saying that about the Irish
proke open. Yeah, so it's like it's I mean, and
I know that's obviously super small. Samul Sizes is one
person that I happened to see say something on social
media like but yeah.

Speaker 2 (59:17):
This is really up time. I just randomly searched like
flights to Dublin from Vegas surprisingly cheap, because I was like,
that'd always be pretty cool to go to Isle.

Speaker 1 (59:27):
I've always wanted to go to the Irish Proke for sure.
Well that's not better at all.

Speaker 2 (59:32):
Do you think they would, uh, you know, maybe want
daily podcasts from the Icehbrooke group.

Speaker 1 (59:37):
I mean, I think you should email them and they
can sponsor this podcast if they pay for some of
our stuff. I'm in, We're totally in. Let's go send
out to a bunch of two dumb Americans over there
and we'll make it happen. Yeah, but you're basically American now, sure, yeah,
but yeah, let's say yes. I just I think that
you just have to again, I think you have with

(59:57):
what the ws AP is doing, you know, I think
you just have to be willing to move things around,
like you just have to be flexible and listen, it sucks.
It sucks to move. I get it. We've had to
move stuff on the PGT.

Speaker 4 (01:00:09):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:00:09):
You and I were just talking about with some of
our events the other day, like, you know, it's just
it's frustrating to constantly move and blah blah blah. But
I mean, unless now, the other option is like you
just have to basically fight fire with fire, and like,
I mean the best example is as WPT tried to
do it when they went to forty million on their guarantee.
They missed. Now that event doesn't have a guarantee. So

(01:00:29):
it's like, if you're willing to go toe to toe
with the World Series of Poker right and like constantly
put your neck on the line, your financial neck on
the line because you know that's going to be large
guarantees and whatnot, then Okay, I guess if that's what
you want to do, then go right ahead. But other
than that, you know, I think we just got to
kind of work around you know, I say we because

(01:00:50):
we obviously do the PGT stuff, so you know, we
got to kind of work around what seems like a
new era for the WACIPI and it's here to stay.
So yeah, looking listen, I'm also not saying like like
Irish poke rope and should not like move to like October,
Like you know, it's just like we kind of if
they can again, if they can, I know, some things
might be locked in and it's just impossible, but you know,

(01:01:12):
shifted a day or two here.

Speaker 2 (01:01:14):
When did you say, the main event in Europe starts
the third, yes, so day two of the Irish pok
Group and is April fourth, so you can probably you know,
cash the Irish poke up and knowing Europe, I haven't
spent much time there, but it's probably I don't know,

(01:01:34):
probably get on a flight and be in Prague in
an hour, so you could essentially still play both and
just play like one of the later flights for WSP
Europe and like looking at their schedule. The only thing
after that that has a big guarantee is this two
hundred See this is right, apparently the Minish the Mini

(01:01:56):
Irish Open is a two hundred and fifty dollars million
dollar like guarantee.

Speaker 1 (01:02:00):
I was like, does this thing have like is this
thing being played online? Like what the hell is this
turn they have?

Speaker 2 (01:02:05):
Look, they have online satellites, you know.

Speaker 1 (01:02:07):
Because their partnered with poker Stars for the Irish.

Speaker 2 (01:02:09):
You know what, these guys will be fine, they'll make
they guarantee, just won't be as big as next year
as as this year. Sorry, uh so they'll be fine.
I will that, you know for dogs and young pops.
I don't know what that is, but I.

Speaker 1 (01:02:24):
I will also say that. You know, in this shout
up producer Rich Ryan, he's always kind of hammering this
this point home. But you know, the Irish Poker Open,
while it does have a bit of international fame and
buzz to it, I mean it really is a regional
slash local poker t yeah.

Speaker 2 (01:02:42):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:02:43):
And and the w SP, well WSP Europe specifically, but
the w SP brand, I mean that is like pretty
much only an international like global brand, right, So you know,
I think they kind of attract different player pools in
a so you know, I think that I think that
both will be okay. You know, it's not fun having

(01:03:05):
this dropped on you if you are the Irish Proke Rope,
and of course, like it's not fun, you're you're probably
a little bit more uneasy about having to hit your guarantee.
But I still think that they'll hit it. But I
think the overall point, like what you're trying to make
is you would love people to go they run deep
in the Irish Proke Grope main event, maybe they cash
for thirty K, they hop on over, they fire five

(01:03:26):
bolts in the WSP Europe. Male Like, that's just kind
of what we all want to see, right, and what
we want to experience. So but but you know, we'll see.
I mean, there's a crap ton of poker. It's there's
poker everywhere, you know. You and I aren't going to
talk about EPT Prog, but that thing's been running and
doing some big numbers over there. So yeah, there's a
lot to be had, and it's it's very interesting now

(01:03:47):
to see how this landscape unfolds again with it's been
a little over a year now since GG Poker acquired
the WSP brand, and the swings that they are taking
are highly evident, like they are high. They're headlining moves,
and we are all seeing in that latest one today
or one of the latest ones today because we're aout
to talking about. The other one is that they dropped

(01:04:09):
this WSP Europe schedule and it has this five five
k euro ten million dollar guaranteed main event, which is
freaking crazy. So as far as I'm concerned, WSP Euver
is freaking back, okay, and I'm happy to see it
because I love doubs B Europe. It was the prestigious
brother of the WSP. All Right. The other piece of

(01:04:32):
the news out of the WSP, WSP player of the year,
everyone's been yelling, screaming, doing everything to be like, can
we do prizes for the WSP Player of the Year,
What the heck are we doing? Well, WSP today came
out and said there will be a one million dollar
total prize pool for the twenty twenty six WSP Player
of the Year race. The race does include WSP Europe,

(01:04:57):
which we just talked about, It includes the flagship WSOP
Summer in Las Vegas, and it also includes WSP Paradise.
So going back to that three series approach back when
they had Europe, the Summer in Vegas, and then they
had b Asia Pacific RIPWSP Asia Pacific. So now they're

(01:05:18):
doing all three of these. Per the press release, the
eventual Player of the Year winner will claim and enhanced
one hundred KWSP Paradise package with a variety of other
WSP packages and or tickets awarded to the top one
hundred players on the leaderboard at the conclusion of the season.
So if you head on over to WSP dot com,

(01:05:41):
they have a whole landing page dedicated to well, they
have a whole landing page dedicated to one WSP Europ
which Tim and I just talked about. They also have
a landing page dedicated to the new Player of the
Year stuff. They have all the prizes listed on there,
the details, They have past POY winners listed there. They
have a calculator for the new WSP Player of the
Year points calculator, so they have that all there. It
does say that first place is going to get the

(01:06:02):
hundre K Paradise package plus the POI title, but then
it also says second and third are also going to
get a hundre K Paradise package, which is interesting. That's
the same. Then four through fifteenth are listed to get
a thirty K Super Main Event package to WSIP Paradise.
Sixteenth through fiftieth are going to get a five K
Circuit Championship package which takes place at WISP Paradise, and

(01:06:25):
then one of those players in that group will be
randomly drawn to win a thirty K Super Main Event
package upgrade, and then fifty first through one hundredth get
two and a half K Circuit Championship ticket, and then
randomly six players will be drawn from that group to
get a five K package instead. So all of the

(01:06:46):
million dollars that are being given outs are awarded via
do WSP Paradise packages, which you know, kind of again
going back to my original thought exercise of like what's
the goal here, what's the plan here? To me, this
is another piece of evidence that they could just be
pushing everything to Dobspy Paradise. Yeah, so again, it's just

(01:07:11):
it's just very interesting to see how it's all going.

Speaker 2 (01:07:13):
Now.

Speaker 1 (01:07:13):
I would assume I couldn't find it in there. But
because the player of the erace includes WSB Paradise, all
these packages should apply for twenty twenty seven, would be
my guess. So there's no prize money next year because
how can you award a package? Good point, right, it
has the following year.

Speaker 2 (01:07:34):
Yeah, you're right.

Speaker 1 (01:07:36):
I'm not sure how this changes things. Like let's I mean,
we already talked about David Baker, like he's someone who
if you guys listen to his podcast with Adam Schwartz
Gamble Up the Gamble Up Pod, highly encourage you guys
to go check that out. But you know, he talked
about how he kind of hates what they're doing with
the Dovaspy Paradise stuff, right, but now he said today
seeing the WSP Europe schedule that he likes that, and

(01:07:57):
he seems like he's likely going to make the trips.
So let's say hypothetically Baker goes to Europe has a
great run. Does his normal thing in the summer has
a good run? Is he now going to chase Player
of the Year and go to Paradise which he originally
didn't really want to do?

Speaker 2 (01:08:14):
Like?

Speaker 1 (01:08:14):
So does that switch that whole pathway up and kind
of drive more people down to Paradise? Who knows? I mean,
I guess we'll see how it all unfolds, but it
could be interesting to see how that goes. What do
you got thoughts here on Player of the Year.

Speaker 2 (01:08:30):
I should ask producer Rich to dig up some old
audio files. But I'm said something very similar to this,
you know, for Player of the Year, where they could
I didn't say a million dollars, I said something a
lot smaller. Bet you could basically change the Vegas Player
of the Year that maybe it's a half a million
dollar prize bowl that awards seats or tickets or packages

(01:08:53):
into Paradise if Paradise is still going to be a thing.
So obviously they listen to me made a little better. No,
But I do like it because you know, like we've
kind of touched on. All their eggs are in the
paradise basket right now. I think we can both assume
that they're going to try and go bigger and better
every year down there. So for twenty twenty seven, maybe

(01:09:14):
we do see you know, seventy five eighty million guaranteed
and getting as many people down there in some capacity
is definitely a plus four, you know, ensuring they can
hit that big guarantee. So you know, people are going
to say, we saw a tweet I think from Eric
Baldwin saying, you know this, this is not very interesting.

(01:09:37):
We saw something from Michael Munchek, who's a big, you know,
Player of the Year chaser, that you know, this is tough.
This makes it a lot tougher when you add Europe.
You know, this really does only suit five, six, seven,
eight players now.

Speaker 1 (01:09:53):
Five I think it suits one. His name is Sean Deep.

Speaker 2 (01:09:58):
No overt SHONDI Gran.

Speaker 1 (01:10:01):
I think the thing is the thing is with Daniel.
The thing is with Daniel is that it's it's just
dependent on if he goes to Europe. I mean, I
don't I don't know if he's gonna go.

Speaker 2 (01:10:12):
Look the way he's been unattending our events. I think
he's going to be basically only.

Speaker 1 (01:10:18):
Okay, but if you go back to the the another
another r I P here, but the the w SP
docu series but r I P. But you know, he
talked in that about trying to have a kid and
start a family and do all that sort of stuff.
So like you know, when you're when you're moving to
that stage of your life. I mean you and I

(01:10:40):
know you can't just go gallivanting around Europe for a
fucking week and a half, Like it's just hard. So
you know, I think that you know where Sean Deep.
You know, Shan Deep already has his kids like that,
you know they're old, not not like super old, but
you know they're older, and and the DOUBSIP is his thing,
and he doesn't travel to other stuff or really play
other stuff outside of DOUBISP events. You know, he's always

(01:11:02):
gone to Europe. So now, you know, I think that
this really just does benefit Sean Deep. And these tournaments
for WSP Europe that we talked about. You know, maybe
the stuff in the Bahamas is a little bit pricey
for Sean Deep just because you know, not that he
can't compete in those fields. I certainly think he can.
I've just kind of wondered why he hasn't played all
the super big buy and stuff, you know, but he's

(01:11:22):
going to kind of value hunt, I guess. And you
know he skipped some of the bigger stuff in the
in the ws AP uh you know, areas you know
in recent years, but the WAP Europe stuff, I mean,
this is shandeb b all over it, right, So I
think it certainly favors him.

Speaker 2 (01:11:40):
He's obviously the the the number one favorite. You know,
you do have to still throw in, you still have
to mention the grand You have to mention Benny Glaza.
You know, you could mention Phil Sternheimer. You could throw
in you know, Steven Shouldwick possibly you know Seth Davies,
those kind of names. So yeah, it does shrink the list,

(01:12:03):
you know, quite significantly when it comes to Player of
the Year. And look, maybe they should have just kept
it serious specific or add a few more. Remember that year,
that one of the last years at the Rio where
they did like the Velo no limit hold the Player
of the Year, they did like the Midsteaks. You can
still do a lot of that stuff, I think, adding

(01:12:23):
you know, we see it on the PGT People love leaderboards,
people love chasing trophies that aren't directly tied to winning
a tournament. So you could add a bunch of this
and really gamify, you know, everything with the World Series.
You could have the leader boards at different different buying levels,
different games, different stops. You could do a lot of
different things to really you know, and still spend the

(01:12:45):
same amount of money, just you know, split the prizes up.
You know, maybe you're reserving those two extra big one
hundred k ones for and you split them up and
do them for the no limit leader boards and the
midstakes and stuff. But either way that they've given out
a million dollars to play, as you kind of really
complain about free money.

Speaker 1 (01:13:06):
And then also in the news release, we did see
it was down towards the bottom, but it's in there.
The fifty seventh annual WSOP, so that's next year's WSOP.
The dates were announced May twenty sixth through July fifteenth,
and then WSP Paradise dates for twenty twenty six were
also announced December first through eighteen. So for anyone out
there listening who likes to plan well in advance, obviously

(01:13:30):
you two, mister PGT Commissioner, those dates are out.

Speaker 2 (01:13:33):
So if I have been funny that everyone was like
so ecstatic about WSP Vegas dates. They're the same every year, yeah,
but everyone you know how people they just.

Speaker 1 (01:13:43):
Want to see it in paper. They want to see
it announced, like you know, like that's just it's the
same with the schedule. Like the schedule is if you're
coming out to Vegas, if you're like a professional player,
somebody's going to put in a high volume. I mean,
the schedule is going to be largely the same. Maybe
there's like maybe the Monster Stack is like shifted a

(01:14:03):
week or two like here or there. But if again,
if you're somebody who's coming out for the full six
to seven weeks, what do you care what the actual
schedule is. But like people just want to see it
in print, Like just save up your three hundred k
or whatever the hell you need in buy ins, book
your airbnb, and then let's go. Cause it's like the
schedule is going to be there, you know, like that
that's just how it is. You know, early July is

(01:14:24):
gonna be theasp ma an event, Like you know that
that's just how it is. So again, you might get
some shifts here there and some stuff. You know, sometimes
they might shift like one of those events that happened
at the beginning of the series last year, they kind
of put it towards the end, and then they put
some at the end towards the beginning. Like maybe they
do a little bit of that, but for the for
the most part, the schedule is largely the same every
single year. So so yeah, I just always think it's funny,

(01:14:48):
like you as people kind of like, oh my gosh,
it's out, it's out. It's out. Yeah, well it's out.
And then I did just want to touch on uh
cause again it's been a little bit over a year
now since GG poker acquired the WSP and just some
of the highlights that we've seen under GG Poker's ownership.
You know, right now we've got the WSP plus app

(01:15:10):
is in Las Vegas. It was used here last year.
I personally thought that it was awesome other than the
fact that the font size was astronomical, but other than that,
it was good. And I think that's a decent win
because you know, we know how hard it is to
get anything kind of approved in a gaming space here
in Nevada and here in the US it tends to

(01:15:33):
be a nightmare, but gg poker in the WSP, we're
able to get that done. So that's a big win.
The WASP plus app. Now another thing you know that
we didn't talk about, but it did come out. The
twenty twenty six WSP circuit schedule is out. It's available
on WASP dot com. But included in that news is
that the WSP plus app is going to be fully

(01:15:53):
utilized at WSP circuit stops in twenty twenty six. So
that's pretty cool and another big step in the right direction.
There you've got the super main event is, as I said,
that thing is now a behemoth. It is a real force.
It looks like it is here to stay. And if
they keep putting resources behind it like they seem like

(01:16:14):
they are, I mean, this thing could just continue to
go up, up and up. So they got that also
a change, and you know a lot of people were complaining.
You know a lot of the more international players, traveling
players are like, I don't want to go to Rosbodov
for WSP Europe. I don't like it there, all that
sort of stuff. Well, WSB is moving WSP Europe out
of Rosbudov, they put it in Prague, and they moved

(01:16:37):
it to a different part of the year, and the
schedule as of today looks pretty freaking awesome. And then
also today announced they got a million dollars in prizes
for the WSP Player of the ear Race. So you know,
all those things have happened in about a year's time,
just over a year's time now, you know, with Gigi's

(01:16:58):
ownership of the w SP. So it's a brand that
I think many would would agree was pretty stale and
stagnant for quite some time. But it definitely looks like
GG Poker is putting its fingerprints all over this thing
and trying to improve it as much as possible and

(01:17:20):
really just set it apart from everything else, as if
it wasn't already set apart from everything else. I mean,
I've always believed that, I've always said the WSB is
the NFL of poker, and now with w or sorry,
with GG Poker excuse me, you know, owning it and
doing what they want to do with it, it just
seems like there is no end in sight. So all

(01:17:41):
that stuff has happened in a year, and who the
heck knows where it's going to go from here, you
know who else. Who knows what else they have, you know,
coming down the pipeline. I would imagine many things. One
of the things that I'm selfishly most interested in is
like what they can do with the ws AP dot
com online platform here in the stage, which I don't
think that they've really touched it all.

Speaker 2 (01:18:00):
I can yeah, right, yeah, we.

Speaker 1 (01:18:02):
Don't know, like what's the contract with you know, I
think it's eight eight poker that's currently operating at eating
It's like, what's the deal there? But you know, eventually
like that would be great to see. So we'll see
if if stuff happens there. But that's obviously you know, TBD.
But overall, I would say that I would have to
give them an a on the on the first year

(01:18:23):
under ownership. I don't see how you can.

Speaker 2 (01:18:26):
Agreed.

Speaker 1 (01:18:27):
Agreed, Wow, I get an agreed from Tim. There you go, man,
in many words over there, all right, WPT World Championship
that is happening right now here in Las Vegas. I
guess a couple quick highlights you had. Eric Baldwin opened
the series with a win in the eight hundred dollars
buying million dollars guaranteed opening event or early event, or

(01:18:52):
whatever the heck you want to call it. Baldwin taking
home almost two one hundred and fifty thousand dollars for
the win. There almost three thousand entries in that thing
you had the WPT Prime Championship. It increased its field
size by more than two hundred players. This tournament, to
me and Tim and I are going to talk about
it a little bit more in a second, but this

(01:19:14):
tournament to me is for me personally, is the second
best tournament in the world. That's what I'm gonna say.
That's my tim. It had eight hundred and seventy six entries.
Last year had nine, six hundred and seventy. There are
six players remaining for the final table. They got to
the final six. They're going to delay them for a

(01:19:35):
little bit. They will play that final table on December twentieth.
That will be live streamed, I believe, so you guys
can watch it when that happens. Steven Song, who won
this event once before, he finished eighteenth. Jeremy Becker, friend
of the pod, shout out Jeremy, he got nineteenth. Both
of them took fifty three thousand dollars. I didn't see

(01:19:55):
how song busted, but I sure as hell saw how
Jeremy busted. And it was not fun. Guy jammed the button,
I believe. With Queen eight, Jeremy called big blind with
Ace King and the guy flo up in eight and
that was that. The WPT World Championship ten K main event.
The numbers are in in terms of the field size.

(01:20:16):
You had what was it, eighteen hundred and sixty five
entries in this one, three starting flights in this tournament
freeze out per flight, so you can be in for
a max of three bullets. It's ten thousand, four hundred
dollars on the buy in, something that I absolutely freaking
hate with with WPT and wind do can you just
make it ten k? Like can we just do that?
Like what are we doing? Or it should be ten

(01:20:38):
thousand plus six hundred, not this six, not this ninety
or ten thy four hundred, and then only like ninety
six or ninety one hundred goes into the prize bowl.
It's just making it difficult for us. But that field
size eighteen hundred and sixty five entries is down from
last year five hundred and twenty six, which is a
pretty big draw. I mean, obviously it dropped last year

(01:21:02):
because they didn't have the guarantee, right, I mean this
year it definitely seems like I mean, if I'm gonna say,
there's the two biggest factors, one no guarantee and two
ws be paradise, those have to be the two biggest factors.
Like if you're like there's probably other factors, yes, but
in terms of like a pie chart, I mean, what

(01:21:23):
do you think.

Speaker 2 (01:21:24):
Yeah, you could also throw in the the seats they
were giving out last yea in the club WBT free roll.

Speaker 1 (01:21:31):
Oh true, true. I mean the lot of satellites were awesome,
Like they gave out a ton of those, but but
they had what one hundred or.

Speaker 2 (01:21:37):
Well there's one hundred. Yeah, there's a hundred seats given
out in the in the frei roll.

Speaker 1 (01:21:43):
Knowing that, weren't they doing some stuff with the Mystery
quest for the second chance.

Speaker 2 (01:21:47):
Drawing not to the same level. So if you're playing that,
or you're on the fringe of playing the main event,
hearing there's one hundred fish maybeing one of them winning
a seat to get in, it does kind of swing,
you know, swing you to potentially jumping in. So obviously
you remove the hundred seats, maybe you remove another fifty
players that were on the fence because of that. You know,

(01:22:09):
it's it's a factor. It's a small one, but it's
still a factor.

Speaker 1 (01:22:13):
Yeah about that mystery question. You know, I tried to
fire a couple of flights.

Speaker 2 (01:22:17):
Yeah, I did.

Speaker 1 (01:22:18):
I mean, maybe I'm just too much of an old
man now who doesn't know what he's doing. But I
got on to Club to PT Gold, I couldn't figure
it out within five seconds and I gave up. So
I was all for it.

Speaker 2 (01:22:27):
I was just I fired to the first two flights,
and then I realized that not only did I have
to survive the first the five percent of that flight,
I then had to make the five percent of the
next flight. When every field combines. It seemed very tough,
so I gave up. I saw people in for eighteen bullets.

(01:22:47):
It was like wt's version of the Superman I guess people.

Speaker 1 (01:22:52):
In the bargain basement version of the Superman events.

Speaker 2 (01:22:55):
So I could have easily gone down that road, and
I pulled out very early. I didn't want to have
anything to do with that.

Speaker 1 (01:23:01):
Yeah, I'm also kind of curious about what's gonna happen
for like that piece of the WPT World Championship. You know,
last year it was the big free role. This year
it was Mystery Quest. So is it gonna be a
third thing next year? Are they going to run back
Mystery Quest?

Speaker 2 (01:23:19):
Like?

Speaker 1 (01:23:20):
How does that all factor out? You know something I'm
also just kind of interested in. But anyway, back to
the WPT World Championship, that ten k main event field
that did dip by five hundred and twenty six players,
but still more than two point five million dollars up
top for the winner. The top two hundred and thirty
three places are going to make the money. There were
seven hundred and thirty three players returning for today's Day two.

(01:23:45):
Sam Laskuitz PGT regular bag the chip lead. No idea
how he's doing right now, but the best vanilla poker
tournament player in the world, I'm sure he's doing simply incredible.
Hopefully he's not out there starting he fights with anyone,
of course, you know, you never know, you never know
who's going to start just throwing down more than eighteen

(01:24:06):
point two million dollars in the prize pool for this one.
I guess I'm just gonna ask you the question sir,
are you starting to worry about this event declining? Yeah,
I mean this is a big drop. This wasn't like
fifty players.

Speaker 2 (01:24:23):
Yeah, and you know we keep hopping on WSB Paradise
going bigger and better. Here it feels like WPT is
going in a way the other way obviously when not falling.

Speaker 1 (01:24:35):
Let me just jump in and say that the other
way for this ten came in because everything else is great,
highlighted by the prime.

Speaker 2 (01:24:44):
They removed the guarantee, so that's one thing. But then
the Club wt stuff's also gone down. You know, we
have the ten million dollar free row obviously, so a
lot of money given out this year with Club WBT,
but just much five Yeah, just much harder to get.
I think that has the factor that they're going down.
So you know, it's an interesting time. Do they want

(01:25:07):
to make any changes to this main event? I think
a lot of people on Socialism saying no, it's great.
You know, the one entry per flive is perfect, don't
change it. Like you touched on a little earlier, maybe
be the bigger man or the bigger tour. And you know,
i'veset your dates just slightly just so you can capitalize
on people traveling back, We've seen a lot of big

(01:25:28):
names already on their way back. You know. We saw
josh Ario tweet out something that he was landing in
time for Day one Sea and his wife was going
to basically hadn't seen him in two weeks, but was
going to pick him up, drive him straight over to
the wind so he could jump in on one Sea.
He probably got to have a lot of other players
like that coming back today, even after cashing. So if

(01:25:49):
you had run the event over, say this upcoming weekend.
You know, it's the very end of the series, I
get it, but you do have that chance to capitalize
on people coming from Bahamas. And look, Bahama's dates are
out now you touch on December first, eighteenth. You know,
that seems where they could potentially start planning around the

(01:26:10):
main event. They're not going to know the main event
days Paradise for a while, but they can kind of
probably predict it and say, hey, look, you know, we're
gonna assume it's going to be here, so let's push
outs a little later so we can try and get
more people and actually bring this back up you know,
onto the you know, back to where it kind of
was a couple of years ago.

Speaker 1 (01:26:32):
Yeah, and there's been a lot of talk about the
value of this WPT World Championship event. I've talked with
a lot of people about it. I'm starting to agree
a bit more that this is right up there with
the WSP main events. I did have a couple of

(01:26:53):
people tell me that this was even better than the
Spain event in terms of value, and if they could
play one ten K in the world for the rest
of their lives, they would play this one versus the
w SPE main event. I don't think they're idiots. I
don't think I can get there just yet, but I
understand their point and some of their points are And
this is again shout out producer rich Ryan. I know

(01:27:14):
he's been on this take forever, but the w SPE
main event structure in Las Vegas is almost too good
in the sense that it's too hard for like a
more recreational player to thrive. Not that you're not going
to get the breakouts here and there, but on the whole,
you know, once you're playing two hour levels for ten

(01:27:36):
days straight, I mean, it's the like the cream is
going to rise. That's just how it is. And the
WPT World Championship structor is still a very very good structure.
It's sixty minutes on day one, it goes to ninety
minutes on day two, so that's still a very slow structure.
But you know, you start a little bit shallower with
two hundred big blinds. It's a little bit faster to
start all that sort of stuff. So when a structure

(01:27:56):
is a little bit faster and there's more variance involved,
it's just going to allow lesser players to be able
to kind of get lucky and win more, you know,
so you have that aspect of things. Somebody else made
the point to me that, you know, the WSP main
event in Las Vegas is that one tournament where strictly
cash game professionals will go out of their way to

(01:28:18):
play where they won't play other ten ks. They won't
They just don't bother with them. They they'd rather, you know,
spend their week playing a cash game because you know,
in order to like, you might play three four days
in a tournament and like double your buying, So it's
just not worth it to them. But the WSPE a
event with the structure that's so good, it's much more
like a cash game in terms of a format because

(01:28:38):
it's just so long and extended, and the fact that
you know you can win ten million dollars up top,
you know you're going to get a lot of really
good players that come out. Where I break from it
is like again going back to what we talked about,
like way back at the beginning of the pod, and
I know we're running super long with this, but whatever.
At least I didn't promise that it was going to
be a short one. But uh, like, if somebody's going

(01:29:03):
to play a ten k, if you're gonna save up
and play a ten k, you're saving up to play
the WSP main event and trying to like trying to
get past that is very hard. So you're gonna have
I don't know, two three thousand like dreamers and shot
takers whatever the number is in that event, and I
feel like that makes up for the fact that the
WPT World Championship is a bit smaller. So so yeah,

(01:29:27):
I mean it's it's I still think the WPT World Championship,
this edition of it is elite. It's awesome. I would
love for them to find some sort of way to
bring back a guarantee, you know. I think that's I
think that's the natural next step for this event, you know,
because I just I don't know, I just fear that
it's gonna kind of keep going the other way if

(01:29:49):
what WSP is doing down in the Bahamas can continues
to go their way, because it there are no signs
that they're slowing down none whatsoever. So you know, you
got to kind of fight with that if you're the WPT.
So you know, part of it is what you said,
adjusting the schedule so it works better in that sense,
bringing back the guarantee, and I mean Tim and I

(01:30:10):
thought it was crazy to begin with when they went
to forty million, Like that was nuts, Like they didn't
need to do that. You know, maybe just have twenty
you know, maybe push to twenty five whatever, and that's
kind of the guarantee, and that's it.

Speaker 2 (01:30:19):
You know.

Speaker 1 (01:30:21):
I also think that, you know, part of it is
maybe they just really start to lean more into this Prime.
I mean, this Prime is like the greatest fucking tournament.
I mean it's so good and like it's now had
a couple of years where it's run eleven hundred dollars
buying five million dollars guarantee. I mean I would I
would honestly, try and push that thing to ten million. Like,

(01:30:44):
I think that's like if if WSP Paradise is going
to go one way with these insane high rollers and
endless bullets and all this sort of stuff, like, then
go the other way, focus on prime and just try
and attack like you know, the mid major types of play.

Speaker 2 (01:31:01):
Why not? Okay, going on that point, why don't we
change the main event to a five K ten mil?
We think the five k is a good price point here.
We've talked about this a lot.

Speaker 1 (01:31:15):
My problem is, yeah, but like my problem with that,
and I don't even know if it's my problem, but
I would say that the problem that the WPT might
have is that the WPT World Championship like that event.
First of all, the fact that they're even at ten k,
when that event used to came out yeah and made
its name as a twenty five k, like, so yeah,

(01:31:40):
I I just don't know if you diminish the WPD
World Championship event brand by going to a five.

Speaker 2 (01:31:48):
K something, you could argue that it's already been, that's
already happened when they jumped it to ten and when they.

Speaker 1 (01:31:54):
Remained Listen, I think, honestly it's pretty perfect the way
it is right now. I app love it. You know,
there's two things I don't like about it, Okay, three things.
One the fact that it's ten point four. The two
things that I'm about to say are kind of jokes.
The fact that it's ten point four I think is ridiculous,
but that's kind of a joking. Take two, I think

(01:32:16):
the chips are outrageously bad. Okay, other than that the
event is late. Now. The one thing that I actually
think like really hurts them and that I don't like
about it, it just doesn't have a guarantee, Like I
think it has to have a guarantee, but I think
the three starting flights freeze out per flight. The structure
of it, you know, start I could honestly even argue

(01:32:37):
maybe you go like forty sixty ninety with the structure,
like you know, or like forty sixty seventy five like nineties,
like I mean that's a lot, but anyway, or like
sixty seventy five ninety something like that. But I think
it's really really an elite event. It's also at an
amazing venue right in my backyard, so I'm going to
be partial to that. But the win is also an

(01:32:57):
incredible venue they have in the ballroom space. It's just
freaking amazing. The only problem with having in the ballin
space is these people that want to order drinks. It's
seventeen dollars for a glass of Chardenay. I heard that
the other day when this lady ordered at my table,
I was like, what in the world is going on?
But anyway, I mean, the only thing that I think
they need to do is like try and just find

(01:33:18):
more satellite winners, So whether that's leveraging WPT Global Club,
WPT Gold or the live ones that run in Las
Vegas at the wind but then also bring in a guarantee,
like reintroduce the guarantee and listen, honestly, maybe you just
come in with fifteen million to start. Maybe you just
kind of try and reset the whole damn thing. Fifteen

(01:33:39):
million next year, you know, fifteen million plus we're guaranteeing
five hundred satellite winners something like that, right, which I
think you can get to. I mean, they probably have
two hundred satellite winners just from the live satellites themselves,
So going to five hundred when you have the two
big online platforms, I don't think is too crazy, you know,

(01:34:00):
And then and then maybe the next year, if it
goes well, you bump that guarantee to twenty million, you know,
and then you maybe maybe you go up to twenty five,
et cetera, and you kind of grow it that way.
But you know, other than that, I mean, I think
that event is great. I just fear my fear because
I love that event so much.

Speaker 2 (01:34:18):
Is that.

Speaker 1 (01:34:20):
Without the guarantee and again, with the direction that WSP
Paradise is going, maybe we just start to see this
trend that we don't want to see in this event
just continues to lose one, two, three, four, five hundred
players every single year. And that's just a bummer, right
prime Is that that tournament is freaking awesome?

Speaker 2 (01:34:38):
Yeah, I mean.

Speaker 1 (01:34:40):
And I guess you and I can talk about that
now we both cashed in it. Shout out to us.
I absolutely positively f and blew it at the end.
I just I just I tried to be a hero
and I didn't need to be and I butchered it.
And yeah, I screwed up big time. I would say

(01:35:01):
that I was I played a plus in every single
hand I played until my bust out hand and then
my bust out hand was a fucking f minus. Okay,
that like, it was just it was just stupid. And
there's the biggest moment and I blew it and I'm
mad at myself for it. But it is what it is.
That's just I need to I don't know, I need

(01:35:21):
to learn to get past it and I need to
be able to fix my mistakes in the moment. But
you know, that's that.

Speaker 2 (01:35:28):
But yeah, I didn't blow anything. I was short, so
my decision were pretty easy.

Speaker 1 (01:35:31):
Well, I mean you you listen, you send me some
hand histories, you blow it.

Speaker 2 (01:35:35):
A lot, okay, like wait, which event was that? Anything?

Speaker 4 (01:35:38):
No?

Speaker 2 (01:35:38):
That was the six hundred.

Speaker 1 (01:35:39):
But you send me but you like, can you just
play to win? For the love of God? Like, holy hell?
Do you ever bluff? Like I mean, I say, I
say that Buffand which bluff suited?

Speaker 2 (01:35:58):
Oh, I've never done anything. So four of the five suited.

Speaker 4 (01:36:04):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:36:05):
It wasn't it like button versus big blind like this
a small blind whatever?

Speaker 2 (01:36:09):
Yeah? No, I mean we were both in for two bullets.
I made one page jump, he made several.

Speaker 4 (01:36:16):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:36:16):
I cast two hundred and fourteenth place out of nine thousand,
eight hundred and seventy six.

Speaker 2 (01:36:22):
Eight, twenty seventh or something.

Speaker 1 (01:36:24):
I think I hadn't. I had a really really good
day one I fired two bullets. As you said, I
also like the setup with this. It's a it's an
eleven hundred dollars buying But again I also hate the
fact that it's like nine to sixty goes on the price.
What are we doing here? But anyway, it's eleven hundred
dollars buy in, it's four starting flights, and it's maximum

(01:36:44):
two entries per flight, which I think is incredible. Like, yeah,
I mean, eighty eight hundred dollars all in, if you
fire all bullets is still you know, a good chunk
of money. But that's not like unattainable, Like that's like,
you know, if you're if you're if you're a if
you're kind of you know and around between five hundred
and one case, and that's kind of your your average
buy in like to be able to to sell a

(01:37:06):
little bit of action or whatever and get in, get
in there if you have to fire max. Just because
this tournament is so good, I think it's just so
worth it. I love the structure of the thing. I
think it's great. I really do so you know.

Speaker 2 (01:37:19):
My my only gripe I think is you know a
lot of these win events, this this series starting at
eleven am. These are going very late one thirty am.
Obviously the restart on date.

Speaker 1 (01:37:32):
You know, if you beat mine didn't go late.

Speaker 2 (01:37:34):
He was, yeah, he was.

Speaker 1 (01:37:35):
I was the earliest one.

Speaker 2 (01:37:37):
Was the early one. Everyone else was late. I played.

Speaker 1 (01:37:40):
We didn't even have to play hand for hand. They
started announcing it and then everyone's you guys.

Speaker 2 (01:37:44):
I was one day we finished at say one thirty
I think in the morning, and then we had to
be back by you know, eleven, I think there's you know,
we're playing down at twelve and a half percent. I'm wondering,
you know, if they that's a long day. I wonder
if we can feel like we can shrink. Obviously there's
a dinner break.

Speaker 1 (01:38:02):
Okay, First of all, the same week dinner breaks start
the fucking hashtag print the T shirts. I don't feel like,
can we stop with this nonsense with the goddamn dinner breaks.

Speaker 2 (01:38:10):
It's outrageous.

Speaker 1 (01:38:12):
It's outrageous. The second thing that I would probably entertain
doing with this event, I might pay fifteen percent, yeah,
and just figure it out, because.

Speaker 2 (01:38:24):
Nine they're not going to get that big number, even
that two and a half percent, you boss, you know
they're going to jump in say you might not get nine,
you might only get nine thousand instead of ninety eight hundred.

Speaker 1 (01:38:34):
Well, could you could you steal the piece of the
WSP playbook and cash fifteen twelve and a half percent
make the next day so you can multi Yeah? Just
I mean, I'm just throwing ideas out there, you know, like.

Speaker 2 (01:38:48):
I would even know if anything I would prefer.

Speaker 1 (01:38:50):
A part of the part of the day went. Part
of the issue that leads to longer day ones is
that when an event like WPT Prime has success and
becomes such an important, prominent tournament for people, they want
to cash it, they want to do well in it,
which then slows things down as you get to the bubble,

(01:39:12):
right like like it's kind of this weird thing where
like the event is doing so well that it becomes
so important for people to want to get into the
money to be like, yeah, I cashed Prime. I cashed Prime.

Speaker 2 (01:39:22):
I like that.

Speaker 1 (01:39:23):
A lot of the conversation, a lot of the conversation
at the tables is like, oh, how'd you do in Prime?
How'd you do in Prime, like it's the WPT ten
K World Championship main event, and then it's Prime like
and it's like, how do you do prime? How do
you do Prime? Like that's what the conversation is. Like
the event has gotten so good in terms of like
brand power that people want to cash this thing, which

(01:39:43):
then you get to the bubble and it's like everyone's
just locking down because they want to cash this one
K where it's like, you know, at the end of
the day, it's like it is just a one K,
you know, but it's it's gotten to be this this
insanely big, prestigious one K that everyone wants to do
well in it. So like, yeah, it slows things down.
And also the fact that I think that like I

(01:40:04):
mean it is eight bullets, yes, but it's still limited,
like it's cap it's not just unlimited, so like people
know like okay, like maybe I only brought four bullets,
like I'm on my third, like I want to make
it happen, So they just they just kind of tend
to slow things down. Yeah, but you know, overall, I
think again, I think this event is just absolutely great.

Speaker 2 (01:40:23):
I think it's you know, definitely an event like it's
an event you have to put on your schedule that
you can't miss, you know, whether it's your you're doing
one bullet, you know. I went in planning just to
play one bullet. You were like, no, you have to
play two. So I put in a second.

Speaker 1 (01:40:41):
You have to play fucking eight. Okay, Like the event
is too goes dude, how many times? How many tournaments
in the world can you put in one K and
win more than a million dollars? Yes, but I, I mean, honestly,
do not have.

Speaker 2 (01:40:52):
Eight bullets to my name when it comes to pocast.

Speaker 1 (01:40:55):
Sell some action, but yeah, it's as bad as you
play still, buy ten whatever, and you will text me
all the hands and I will tell you you're a
fucking idiot, and he's unbelievable.

Speaker 2 (01:41:07):
Yeah, yeah, you kind of missed this event at all.
And then we both cashed the six hundred.

Speaker 1 (01:41:14):
And then we both cast the six hundred as well.
You said the bar I decided to blow you out
of the water once again.

Speaker 2 (01:41:19):
Yeah, yep.

Speaker 1 (01:41:21):
And then I tried to win the tournament early on
day two, and I did not win the tournament early
on day two.

Speaker 2 (01:41:26):
I think we probably I didn't know how much you
cashed for we might have cashed for the same amount though, even.

Speaker 1 (01:41:30):
Though thirteen seventeen.

Speaker 2 (01:41:32):
Oh I no, I made the next jump thirteen.

Speaker 1 (01:41:34):
Welly, lucky you, lucky you for.

Speaker 2 (01:41:36):
Thirty five dollars. I feel rich.

Speaker 1 (01:41:39):
I mean I I I played a huge I tried.
I played at one point one million ship pot. I
mean it's like, you know, I might have been up
there with the chip leaders. I for sure would have
been up there with the chip I don't know if
I would have been the chip leader if I won
the hand, but yeah, it was that was a sick
one to lose. And even though the guy called in
the turn called my jam, I mean I had seventeen out,
so it was like whatever. But yeah, you know, one

(01:42:02):
day i' hit a seventeen outer and then actually like
run deep in a tournament.

Speaker 2 (01:42:06):
But that that was also in a pretty incredible event too.

Speaker 1 (01:42:09):
Size Yeah what you you played Day one A. It
had two starting flights, So this was a six hundred
dollars buy in two hundred and fifty K guarantee with
two starting flights. Yeah, Tim's flight had five hundred and
like fifty or five hundred and sixty entries. Mine had
like eight seventy. Yeah, I mean they blew this two
hundred fifty dollars guarantee out of the water and fifty
K guarantee out of the water.

Speaker 2 (01:42:31):
One hundred and fifteen k for first. The guy that
won was the guy that knocked me out, and we
both commented on the level of playing this six hundred
was I'm interesting watching.

Speaker 1 (01:42:45):
It's interesting watching. I mean I told you how I
got all my chips.

Speaker 2 (01:42:48):
I mean it was I know, it was just it
was wild and wild.

Speaker 1 (01:42:51):
I mean I didn't like, I didn't have to do
too much, but it was. It was definitely it was
a lot of crazy. I mean there's a lot of
craziness happening in this entire series, even the prime. The
prime is just like, I don't even know what people
are doing. But yeah, anyway, good stuff. There's still a
lot more poker to go. There's you know, there's an

(01:43:12):
eleven dollars two million dollar guarantee that started today at
the win. You know, they got a three I think
it's a three K three million dollar guarantee. I mean
it's just like it's just NonStop. Venetian's got a whole
ton of stuff going on. So yeah, It's just the
whole thing is just uh wild. It really is just

(01:43:33):
just a wild. Do you want to do card rankings
or you want to do community cards?

Speaker 2 (01:43:37):
Do community cause? Is that ties in with what we
just discussed?

Speaker 1 (01:43:39):
I think, all right, cool, so let's do community cards.
You got a jingle, right, yeah, holiday season, we got
to play the jingle, So let's go play the jingle.

Speaker 2 (01:43:47):
And let's go.

Speaker 4 (01:43:47):
Attention, attention, good morning, good afternoon, and good evenings of
the Poker radio audience near and far. It is now
time for a brand spanking, spiffy and new shout out
to some of our most loyal listeners. Likely got a
bit too lucky on the way to the spotlight. You're
listening to the number one poker show in the land,
and it's time for a new edition of the Poker

(01:44:09):
Gold podcast Community Cards.

Speaker 1 (01:44:12):
All right, what do you got for me? Don't even
know what this is?

Speaker 2 (01:44:16):
Yeah, you do. Day one day at Prime, I'm sitting
over in the corner the ballroom. I see for Go podcasts.
I'm like, oh, look, poker Focus. His table breaks, My
table breaks. I end up drawing his table, you know,
over in the other side of the ballroom, and you know,
normally I have a mustache and I have long hair.
You know, I don't have the mustache right now, so

(01:44:36):
I look a little differently, and I had glasses on
when I was playing. I sat next to him. He
looked at me. I said, nice heart, and he says,
thank you. I don't think you realized who I was.
And then a little bit later he says, you know,
kind of strikes up a conversation with me. So we're chatting.
He's wearing the podcast hat. He's got like six big
but he's grinding six big blinds. We're like sixty from

(01:44:56):
the money in the prime. On day one day, he
ends up. You know, we talked about the hat. He's
you know, he had all the hats. You know, I'm saying, yeah,
we've got some new stuff hopefully coming out next year,
blah blah, Like I said, six big bines. He takes
the hat off. I noticed this, I'm saying. He takes
the hat off, puts in his bag, He gets a
shove through, gets another shove through, gets a double up.

(01:45:19):
He ends up bagging more than me. And you know
I was telling you how I was playing with him.
I saw him the next day and when we were
both kind of waiting for day two. He wasn't wearing
the hat and we walked past, and I'm kind to
make a comment, Hey, you know this is the pucket.
He goes, yeah, he took off his hat and he
started winning every hand and he goes, oh, I was
hoping he didn't notice that, and he goes, oh, I

(01:45:40):
noticed that. But yeah, shout out spin. I think it's
Spen Peterson. He ended up finishing four hundredth in prime
for like three and a half k outlasted last you.

Speaker 1 (01:45:53):
That's all that matters. I'll yeah, yeah, he'll last me.
But good on spin, How last did you? Because he
actually played hands.

Speaker 2 (01:46:02):
And then I saw him in the six hundred on
one A. He did not bag chips that day, but yeah,
shout out to him for wearing the podcast. How saying hi?
I had another person sayalo as well, Yeah, keep wearing
the keep repping the puck podcast has not anything for me,
but it seems to do some stuff for other people

(01:46:23):
out there.

Speaker 1 (01:46:24):
Okay, okay, shout out Spen. All right, next up, let's
do let's do card rankings. Okay, so the reason why
I wanted to do this one. You love your fucking
rankings things. Two. I've been having a lot of conversations
about these cards that the win uses during the WBT

(01:46:46):
World Championship Series. They are the Faded Spade f SX cards.
I believe it is what they are, and I personally
think they are the best playing cards in poker.

Speaker 2 (01:47:01):
Great.

Speaker 1 (01:47:02):
I don't think it's really close. I love them. I
feel like I've had at least a dozen dealers comment
about how they hate the cards. I don't really know
what other players are saying, but I think they are
so good, so so good. What do you think? Sorry,
I had to get over. I had to reach over

(01:47:22):
because I actually had to grab a pack.

Speaker 2 (01:47:25):
How do you have a pack?

Speaker 1 (01:47:26):
Unbelievable because I'm pretty sure. I went to the website
fucking Fadedspade dot com, which everyone can do that too,
you know, no free ads, but free ad shout out
Tom Wheaton, and I bought them. Look Queen four, just
like Phil Helmy Queen four.

Speaker 2 (01:47:39):
The reason I like these cards They feel really nice
on the hands, that's great, but I like the way
the crispness of the letters and the numbers when you
when you squeeze them.

Speaker 1 (01:47:50):
So the index on the cards look, I got a
couple of kings right here. The index on the card
is is it's slightly larger then than you normally see
with like the copags or the bicycles or whatever that
like are commonly played with, but it's also not so
large that it's jumbo index if I have to look
at another damn jumbo index card. When I sat down

(01:48:12):
at the napt Las Vegas in my first tournament and
I fucking looked at my first hand and I was
did not remember that they use jumbo cards at resorts,
I wanted to flip the table over.

Speaker 4 (01:48:22):
It is.

Speaker 1 (01:48:23):
It is outrageous to use jumbo cards in a poker
tournament that is not a three hundred dollars buying seven
cards stud event. I'm sorry, like that that's just how
it has to be.

Speaker 4 (01:48:33):
So.

Speaker 1 (01:48:34):
But these are slightly larger, which I think that they're great.
They're actually kind of like I don't know if like
I don't know if this will come through on the video,
but like they're kind of like they're narrow, so they
squeeze nicely. The card itself is nice and freaking firm,
like they don't really bend at all. Like I just
love them Now, I will say that I'm not a dealer.

(01:48:55):
I'm not in the box pitching these all day and
having to shuffle them and whatever. They are pretty slippery,
which is probably some of the issues that the dealers
have with them. But I think these cards are the
freaking best. So these are my number one. But I
also don't think. I don't think Win uses these all year.
I think they only use them for the WPT World Championship.

(01:49:16):
I think as a partnership with Fated Space.

Speaker 2 (01:49:18):
Yeah, I don't play enough at the wind too.

Speaker 1 (01:49:21):
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that they don't. They don't because yeah,
so what's is this your number one?

Speaker 3 (01:49:25):
Two?

Speaker 4 (01:49:27):
Uh?

Speaker 2 (01:49:27):
Hands down? Uh? It's I mean we need.

Speaker 1 (01:49:30):
I'm fucking texting Tom Wheaton after this, the owner and
founder of Face. But I'm like you, we need a
promo code because we are talking the world out of
your freaking cards.

Speaker 2 (01:49:39):
Man. You know you talk about the nap T cards
with the bigger faces. They don't bother me as much
for two reasons. One I used as you play like
an old man. No, I understand them, like I used
to play a lot of makes, so I've seen the
bigger cause they have above me. But back home in Australia.
That's why we use at Crown. So I grew up
with you know, if you get your probably remember from

(01:50:00):
when you were there. I grew up with those bigger cads,
so I liked them when I came to When I
came to America in two thousand and seven and played
you know, at Harris but the Mirage, and I saw
these little CODs, I thought I was gonna blind. So
I don't. They don't bother me as much as they
bother you shout out second on the rankings, I feel

(01:50:21):
either the CODs of the Venetian, I'm not sure what
they are exactly, but I'm a.

Speaker 1 (01:50:27):
I don't know what those cards are. I should actually
ask Tommy l Rosa. I have them as my number three.

Speaker 2 (01:50:34):
Oh god, what could be number two?

Speaker 1 (01:50:37):
Number two?

Speaker 2 (01:50:37):
Is gonna say?

Speaker 1 (01:50:38):
Number number one is obvious. Number two to me is obvious.

Speaker 2 (01:50:42):
Okay, what's the number two?

Speaker 1 (01:50:43):
Then the w SP copad cards, yeah, okay, those are elite.
They are elite.

Speaker 2 (01:50:50):
I just don't use them that much.

Speaker 1 (01:50:52):
So I mean they're like they're also like they're perfect sizing.
They're not too small, they're certainly not too big, like
I like the way that the indexes look like.

Speaker 2 (01:51:00):
You know. Look, the only downside with those is sometimes
you find you know, this year we were playing with
WSB twenty twenty four decks.

Speaker 1 (01:51:08):
Who cares.

Speaker 2 (01:51:10):
I'm just we're gonna have a con. That's the con.

Speaker 1 (01:51:14):
I mean, yeah, I love the WSB Cope cards, so
those are my my number two. And then the Venetian cards,
which I don't I thought it was faded Spade, but
I don't know if it's faded spade, like they might
use faded spade, they might use faded spade ones in
the streaming room. And when I've done commentary, I've noticed
that the faded spade. But yeah, I gotta figure out
what cards Venetian uses. We should we should?

Speaker 2 (01:51:35):
Uh, I'm trying to look if I have a picture
of the cards. I do, but yeah, it doesn't really
say anything on it. But yeah, those cards in uster.

Speaker 1 (01:51:48):
And then I'm not sure there is another like everything
then it's everything else is like what I have, like
literally everything else.

Speaker 2 (01:51:56):
You know, you know what's on the A very low card.
I have to put it very low on the list,
the south Point card. I haven't played there in a
long time.

Speaker 1 (01:52:04):
Haven't played there in a while either, so I don't
even know.

Speaker 2 (01:52:06):
It's much hot a to squeeze. So they lose, they
lose a few points for their thickness.

Speaker 1 (01:52:12):
I mean, anything that uses jumbo is just immediately like
you're at the bottom of the list. Does I've never
played like cash at Resorts World? Do they use those
cards like all the time? They're just the worst?

Speaker 2 (01:52:23):
Yeah, I don't know. I don't think they do. Maybe
it's just the pokusars event.

Speaker 1 (01:52:30):
Yeah, I don't know, but those you just can't can't
use those cards. So yeah, those are our card rankings.
I love the Faded Spade f SX cards. I love
the Kopak wsp cards.

Speaker 2 (01:52:43):
You know what the next rankings we have to do?

Speaker 1 (01:52:46):
You're I was gonna say, I was going to say
the same sort of thing. So I'm wondering if you're
going to say the same thing that I am.

Speaker 2 (01:52:51):
Should be Vegas chipset.

Speaker 1 (01:52:53):
Ranked boom, so exactly what I was going to say.

Speaker 2 (01:52:56):
Because you know, ve Nation has multiple chip stacks, Wind
has multiple ship sets yea.

Speaker 1 (01:53:00):
And the World Championship at the bottom. That's I think
the bottom of it.

Speaker 2 (01:53:05):
I don't think they can't.

Speaker 1 (01:53:06):
I think you have to use, like, no, those chips
are just they're so there's there's.

Speaker 2 (01:53:12):
Well, then we have to include all the w s
Pation standard chip sets because the set were used in
the six hundred for WS for the the Win. I
don't like those because the the five hundreds of thousands
or whatever it is of the same color.

Speaker 1 (01:53:27):
I used to set in the eleven hundred dollars Mega satellite,
Milestone satellite, whatever the hell it is at the wind
the other day that I've never used before ever, I've
never even seen. And those are pretty good. They are
worlds better than whatever they use in the Prime and
the WPT World Championship. My biggest issue with the ones
that are used in the Prime and the WT World

(01:53:48):
Championship is like the brand person, the marketing person in
me is the printing on them. It's blurry yea like?
How like if I were to have purchased them and
got those, I would have immediately sent them back and
been like, no, redo these chips, What the hell is this?
I want crisp lettering, Like, come on them.

Speaker 2 (01:54:11):
They don't have to pay for the full thing, so
that does help.

Speaker 1 (01:54:13):
Well, I don't care. Come on, what is the win
is elite.

Speaker 2 (01:54:17):
Yeah, the wind normal set is elate.

Speaker 1 (01:54:20):
Yeah, the wind normal set is elite.

Speaker 2 (01:54:22):
The Venetian colors the Venetian the colors of the chips
very good.

Speaker 1 (01:54:26):
Well, the colors of the Venetian cash game chips.

Speaker 2 (01:54:29):
Are no, we're not.

Speaker 1 (01:54:32):
Yeah, so well we should give some thoughts to that
and then we'll talk about that ranking on the We.

Speaker 2 (01:54:37):
Need accompanying pitches though, figure that out. Yeah, I mean
we probably have enough pitches on our phone. Yeah, we
can find it on social He's got a lot of
good chip sets too. Well, that should be a separate
it's separate ranking that should be ranked. We took photos
of all of them this year and there was like

(01:54:59):
thirty eight differ and chips, so like that's its arm rank.

Speaker 1 (01:55:01):
I will say that the ones in Paradise have They've
been growing on me. I don't like, I don't know
how they feel. I don't know how they look up close,
but I'm starting to really dig them looking at the
streams and sad and I also think they fit the vibe,
you know, they look they look like you're supposed to
be in the Bahamas. So yeah, that's good. We also
want to hit on a family pot because of course,

(01:55:24):
why not. It's holiday season. Sure, so let's play the
music for that one, and then we'll come on back
and we'll give a family pot.

Speaker 2 (01:55:31):
It's time for.

Speaker 1 (01:55:36):
Family, all right. So I had my whole Bravo con
situation that I talked about, you know, the whole twenty
five hundred dollars. I don't know if you can see this,
but here my lover Boy hat. This is a twenty
five hundred Bravo Con hat. This is my my uh my,

(01:55:57):
you pay twenty well no, but my my wife went
to the event and you know, obviously paid twenty five
hundred dollars, but she brought me this hat. So I
feel like I won.

Speaker 2 (01:56:07):
Boy.

Speaker 1 (01:56:09):
Kyle from Summerhouse has.

Speaker 2 (01:56:11):
A brand, like I'm supposed to know that name.

Speaker 1 (01:56:13):
No, I'm just talking to the people. Kyle from Summerhouse
has a brand. It's like a I don't even know,
Like I don't even know what to call them. Lover boy,
it's like an alcoholic drink.

Speaker 2 (01:56:23):
It's like a truly got it.

Speaker 1 (01:56:27):
But yeah, so I'm repping the band brand right here,
lover boy. It's amazing. When I was in line the
other day to register for an event at the wind.
The woman was like, love your hat. I said, oh
you're you're a fan. She's like, oh yeah, I know
exactly what that is. I was like, perfect, I'm in there,
let's go. Basically, this cost me twenty five hundred dollars.

(01:56:48):
All right, So my family pot involves a little family
trip out to Enchant, which is at the Las Vegas Ballpark.
Here in Vegas. We try and go, I think every
single year. My wife just texted me because she's upstairs working,
and she said, it's a seltzer. That's the word that
I couldn't think of lovably. So anyway, I've never had one. Though,

(01:57:11):
I have no idea if they're good or not, but
I'm gonna take everyone's word for it and say that
they're decent. So anyway, we go to in Chant the
other night my parents are in town and make a
whole thing out of it. Bring the kids, blah blah
blah whatever. They turned the whole Las Vegas Ballpark into
basically a giant Christmas village. They got trees, lights, The
sole center part of the ballpark is it's a it's

(01:57:32):
a maze, you know, holiday vibes are going. They got
shops all around they got food games, you know, the
whole thing. This year they had a new giant slide thing,
a tube slide, which was yeah, multiple stories. You know,
you get on a tube, you go down, it's like

(01:57:52):
snow and ice mostly ice whatever. Cool. Fine, my daughter
really wanted to go on it. She locks in working
to go great. I'm like, I'll take her, fine, whatever.
So I'm also just gonna say that I already know
what people are gonna say about this story, about this
version of family pot but I'm just gonna say upfront

(01:58:14):
that it's completely on me for ignoring my parental instincts. Okay,
that is that. You know, I listened to a four
and a half year old. I should not have done
that as a forty one year old man. But here
I am. So that said, I will not continue. We
do the whole ticket thing, We get in line, the
line's like, you know, winding around the whole thing whatever.

(01:58:36):
It's like looking like, okay, we're gonna be here ten fifteen,
maybe twenty minutes whatever. Five minutes in she starts like
doing the wiggle. We all know, the freaking wiggle. I
know she has to go.

Speaker 2 (01:58:46):
To the bathroom.

Speaker 1 (01:58:47):
I'm like, okay, you have to go to the bathroom.
She says yes. I'm like, okay, we have to get
out of line, obviously, go to the bathroom. She doesn't
want to get on a line because she wants to
go on the slide. I'm like, well, why don't we
just go to the bathroom, we'll come back, we'll wait again, whatever.
She doesn't want to get out. She's adamant that she'll
be fine, and again she's four and a half. This
is where I screwed up because I just said, no,
we're just going to the bathroom. We don't go to

(01:59:08):
the bathroom. I can't believe it, but I actually trusted
her judgment in this situation, and my kind of my
thought process was like, well, maybe i'll just wait like
a couple of minutes and see if she gets better.
Two three minutes later, whatever the heck, she's like wiggling again.
I'm like, okay, we got to go to the bathroom.
So now I'm just now I'm like, okay, we're going
to the bathroom, like end of story. But she doesn't

(01:59:29):
want to go. She starts kind of throwing a little fit.
She doesn't want to go. She's like, no, I'll be fine,
I'll be fine. I'll be fine, and she stops the wiggling.
She's just standing there. I'm like, okay, maybe I'll give
her another three to five minutes and whatever. And of
course I'm in my head, I'm like, well, we're wasting
ten minutes in the line. We're gonna have to get
out go to the bathroom eventually, and then we're gonna
have to come back and wait back in the line.
So it's just kind of the whole thing's just annoying
to me already anyway. Whatever, So I'm like, all right, well,

(01:59:51):
let's just see how things play out. We go through
the whole line. She's good the rest of the way,
no more wiggling. She doesn't bring up a to go
to the bathroom. She can tell. She's like getting excited
to go on the slides. Cool, you get a wristband,
you get three slides with the ticket. So she doesn't
know you get three slides with the ticket. I do.

(02:00:12):
And I'm like, okay, we'll go once and then I'll
go to the bathroom and maybe she'll be done with
the slides. Maybe she won't, but we'll see how the
first one goes. Worst case, we have to like go
to the bathroom and then come back and finish our
two more. If we don't, then you know, I only
went once, I paid for three times. Who cares, I'll
burn twenty bucks. It's not the end of the world. Again,

(02:00:33):
I'm feeling good. I just made some money back with
this twenty five hundred oars hat so gravy in my life. Also,
like this tube slide thing is like everyone goes by themselves,
like all the kids go by themselves. So she's got
to go by herself. So there's a chance she might
just like freak out, get completely scared, and then never
want to go on it again. So whatever. We get

(02:00:53):
up to the top, you got to climb up like
three flights of stairs. You get to the top platform,
I put her in her tube, I push her down,
I go down, boom, everything's cool. She's like she was
both at the bottom like I'm scared. I was scared,
but I liked it. She wanted to go again, like okay, fine,
no incidence with the bathroom. I'm like, okay, I think
we're in the clear. Fine, back up the stairs we go.

(02:01:14):
We got our tubes. We're at the very top. Now
I'm like setting up the two tubes. You just put
them down at the top and then you sit in them.
As I'm setting the tubes down, she starts yelling, Daddy, daddy,
I'm pean. I turn around. It is like a waterfall
coming out of the bottom of her coat, bottom of
her dress, all over like her pants. It's just like

(02:01:36):
streaming down her legs. I'm just like, oh my god,
like what is happening. I'm kind of like looking around
to see if well, first, I'm like looking around to
see if anyone's noticing. No one's noticing. Everyone's like putting
their stuff in their tubes. There's one like employee on
the platform. He's like on the other side. He could
give two craps about what is actually happening on the platform.

(02:01:56):
Like I could have like ripped my clothes off and
like went down naked and he would have not cared anyway.
So she's freaking out. So I'm like, okay, whatever. So
I'm just like I'm basically like, okay, well, I'll just
let her pee, Okay, So I just let her pee,
and then what am I gonna do? Like all these
people are like coming up this like narrow staircase and
everyone's got tubes, and the tubes are big, you can't
really go down. So I'm like, well, okay, our only

(02:02:19):
way down is gotta get in the tubes, right, okay. Whatever.
So I put her in the in the thing in
the in the tube, and I just push her down
and then I go down right behind and I get
down to the bottom, and I'm like, okay, like we

(02:02:41):
made it, like whatever. But she's like she's not getting
out of the tube, and so like she's in front
of me, and I'm just like, oh my god, she's
probably peeing again. Probably the fact that now she's scared
and she's freaking out, she's whatever. So I like have
to like lift her up. Then I realize that these
tubes aren't like your normal tubes. They have like this
kind of cover on them where the bottom is all
also rubber, so the whole thing is basically like a

(02:03:03):
pool of p Now, so I'm just like, holy shit, what,
Like I am such an idiot of a parent, Like
what am I doing? She's covered in pe, she's she's
walking like she's a cowboy who's been on a horse
for twelve hours. Like she's like she can't move, you know,
like she's got wooden legs, and like the whole I'm
trying to find someone. No one's around, Like it's just
this whole thing. So then I like I'm trying to

(02:03:24):
walk off, and like where this thing is in the ballpark.
There's like this big walkway like up top, and like
everyone's like watching everyone go down these things, watching their friends,
their family members, whatever, And I'm just there, like literally
dumping out a tube full of p and everyone's probably
looking at me like, who the f is this a hole?
And what the hell is going on? The whole thing

(02:03:44):
was just just it was It was incredible. But again
it's it's largely my fault because I should have just
took her to the bathroom. I trusted her not to
go and that was my era there. But holy hell.
So that's it. Welcome to enchant. I find a guy
on the I find a guy. What's that?

Speaker 2 (02:04:05):
Welcome to parent Yeah exactly.

Speaker 1 (02:04:07):
I find a guy on the end at the end,
and I'm like, listen, this is what happened. Whatever I mean,
he could be he could not have been any less
interested in what the hell was going on. He's like,
just go put it behind the shed over there, I'm like, okay,
so I like, go put the two behind the shed.
Then I have to bring my daughter out. We have
to obviously get her changed. My wife goes into the

(02:04:29):
bathroom to take her or change. She comes out. She's
wearing my wife's shirt as like a dress now because
like all her clothes and everything were coming. It was
just the whole thing was a disaster. But but she
loved the slide. She had a good time. So I guess,
so I guess you know, it was just a little
bit of pee whatever, no big deal. Yeah, oh yeah, yeah,

(02:04:51):
you got a family. Potter was the only one I
do not. Okay, Well, you know, bravo kan last time,
uh you know, peeing at the top of the tube
slide it enchant this time. Lord only knows what the
hell's gonna happen next time, but you know, we'll figure
it out as we go.

Speaker 2 (02:05:08):
I had something similar once for a ferris wheel, and
we got up to the top or near the top,
and then we just went We just left went to
pay and then came back in line. But it wasn't
like in Chant with the line. There's probably hundreds of
people date. This was, you know, one spin in the
fairest wheel. So sometimes he's gonna make that gut decision right,

(02:05:29):
and you just sometimes doubt yourself on should you just
wait or should you, you know, stay stay in line.

Speaker 1 (02:05:35):
I think that's gonna do it for us. What do
you think? You don't even know how long we've been?
Two hours? Oh my god, Rich is gonna kill me.
I can't wait? Sorry, Rich, Ryan, Well, it was a
great show though.

Speaker 2 (02:05:46):
At least he doesn't have to edit the video, just audio. No,
I don't know.

Speaker 1 (02:05:50):
Maybe we'll send them in the video too.

Speaker 2 (02:05:51):
No, we from home sitting in the dock office.

Speaker 1 (02:05:55):
Who cares. He'll frame it all nice. It'll be a whole.

Speaker 2 (02:05:57):
Thing, not video. Rich.

Speaker 1 (02:06:01):
Well, whatever, all right, that's gonna do it for us.
His name is Tim Duckworth, my name is Donnie Peters,
and we will talk to you guys next time.

Speaker 2 (02:06:07):
So Yo, rednight, ja Express

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