August 22, 2024 • 17 mins
Hitachi Energy will unveil two iconic world-firsts at CIGRE Session 2024 in Paris:
- EconiQ 550 kV circuit breaker
- EconiQ 420 kV Live Tank Circuit Breaker LTA
These remarkable SF6-free solutions underscore the reliability and scalability of our technology, and we can’t wait to tell you more about it!
This electrifying episode features Markus Heimbach, Managing Director of the High Voltage Products business unit at Hitachi Energy, and Christian Ohler, Head of Global Product Group Switchgear. These experts share captivating details about these new EconiQ technologies and how they are paving the way to move beyond SF6 with the lowest carbon footprint.
---
Dr. Markus Heimbach is the vibrant force behind Hitachi Energy’s High Voltage Products business unit.
He holds an M.Sc. and a PhD in electrical engineering from RWTH Aachen University and an MBA from the University of Hagen. Before joining Hitachi Energy, Markus was a scientist and chief engineer in Aachen University.
When he’s not leading innovative and game-changing projects, you can find him conquering cycling races with the same drive he brings to his career.
He is energetic, engaging, and always up for a challenge!
Dr. Christian Ohler is a renowned physicist and leader in high-voltage.
He holds a PhD in physics from RWTH Aachen University and is currently the Head of the Global Product Group Switchgear in Hitachi Energy.
When asked about his work, he believes it is a service to society where we give an essential infrastructure to modern society – the power grid.
After hours, his artistic side shines. Christian is passionate about photography and loves capturing life’s special moments.
A keen photographer with a curious mind, he firmly believes that it is how people collaborate within the company that makes the difference.
---
Make sure to follow us and click the notification button to get updates on new episodes.
Visit www.hitachienergy.com/powerpulse for more information.
The Power Pulse podcast is produced and edited by Creative Chimps for Hitachi Energy.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
High voltage takes center stagein this brand
new season of HitachiEnergy's Power Pulse podcast.
We promise to bring you great contentfrom the brightest minds in the business.
We'll discuss challenges, opportunities,and all the hot topics
any high voltage enthusiasts
or anyone interested in sustainabilityfor that matter, is sure to enjoy.
Welcome back to the second special episodeof the Power Pulse podcast.
(00:22):
I'm your host, Bárbara Freitas-Daniels,and joining me today are Dr.
Markus Heimbach and Dr. Christian Ohler.
They are here to let you inon some exciting news.
We told youour economic roadmap was on track.
Well, today is the dayyou learn exactly what we meant.
Hello!
Welcome to another episode of the PowerPulse podcast.
We have a very special episodein store for you today.
(00:44):
Joining me today I've got MarkusHeimbach and Christian Ohler.
Thank you so much for joining me againtoday.
It's the second timeyou're on the podcast,
so thank you for making the time.
And if you'll allow me, Markus,I have a question for you.
When you were last here, you told usyou were about to take on Amstel Gold.
How did that go?I finished it successfully.
Oh. Good job. Well done.
It was a very nice experienceand I liked it very much.
(01:04):
It was tough, but in the end of the day,I finished and that is all what we wanted.
Going back next year? Sure. Oh, good.
Christian, how about you?
Are you a cyclist?Do you enjoy cycling at all?
Not really.
No. Cycling is probably the one sportI really hate.
I never told to Markus.
I do know the one thing you do have incommon is your interest in switchgear.
(01:25):
So if you don't mind, let's jumpright into it.
We are here on occasion of CIGRE.
Christian, would you mind telling usa little bit about CIGRE?
What is it about?
I mean, CIGRE,first of all, is an organization.
So it's really the expert organizationwhere the professionals
that work inside high voltagedomain gather and deal with their matters.
But it's probably more importantif people talk about the CIGRE,
(01:46):
they are talking about the eventthat happens every two years in Paris.
Nice to go to Paris,
which is a combinationof an expert conference
and exhibition by vendors and like a fairand the special thing
about the conference,it's really about interaction.
So on a normal conference,you write your paper,
then you present your paperand people ask questions.
(02:07):
But at CIGRE, you write a paperand you don't present the paper.
But actually people present questionsto the papers
that have been submitted before.
And then people ask questionsabout the questions.
So it has a deeply interactive character.
And for me,I like it a lot because it shows
the spirit of this industryto jointly solve problems.
Whatever organizationyou come from, utility or a vendor.
(02:31):
But there’s kind of the spiritthat we jointly try to solve the problems
that are existing in the power system.
All right. So it's all about innovation.
It's about innovation.
And this is the second in this exhibition.
You typically really see the new thingsthat are coming out.
And there's a lotof very interesting things to see Okay.
So if it's all about innovation,
is there anything you'd like to sharewith us, Markus? Yes.
(02:52):
After we launched two years agoat the CIGRE event first SF6-free
dead tank breaker, or gasinsulated switchgear at the 420 kV level.
We are now happy that we, and proud, thatwe can present one step more.
We are announcing at the CIGRE,the launch of the first fully tested
SF6-free 550 kV GIS (gas insulatedswitchgear) and dead tank breaker.
(03:16):
Okay, wow.This is a milestone in the industry.
It shows that our concept is scalable.
We can reach the highest voltage levelsand on the other hand,
we can keep the same footprint.
In addition,we are as well launching the first
SF6-freelive tank breaker in the world for 420 kV.
And we will show both of the breakers
at the CIGRE eventand also at the exhibition.
(03:38):
Oh wow. You heard it here first.
Another world first for Hitachi Energy.
And I can tell you, you're
both very proud of this achievementas you should be, as we all should be.
Christian, would you mind telling usa little bit more about these breakers,
what they're about, what they do?Sure, sure.
The live tank breaker is probablythe most common types in our network.
So this is when you have airinsulated substations.
So you have a lot of space and you putthe individual components in this space.
(04:02):
And the breakeris the most powerful of these components.
So for the first time you will have reallyfor the top voltage level
that exist in transmission grid420 kilovolt in most countries,
we will have SF6-freelive tank breakers to interrupt
short circuit currentsin air insulated switchgears.
Then the metal enclosed versions,so the dead tank breaker, mainly targeted
(04:25):
at United States and the gas insulatedswitchgear (GIS) 550 kilovolt,
these are really the highest ever voltagesanybody has done free of SF6.
So if you look globallywhere most of the SF6 is stored
and where we can achieve thisSF6-free breakers,
the biggest effect in removing SF6from the power system.
(04:46):
Okay,so you've just touched on it a little bit,
but Markuscan you tell us a little bit more
about where we can usethese breakers in terms of geography?
So North America might have differentneeds to China let's say.
So we're targeting different marketsglobally, is that right?
Correct.
When you look into the 420 kV levelwhere we had two years ago,
the gas insulated switchgear,and today we have the live tank breaker.
(05:08):
This is the dominant transmissionnetwork in Europe.
So the main power on the AC network
is transported through the 420 kV network.
This corresponds a little bit for examplein US with this 362 kV network,
which is quite similar, with the similarrequirements to the equipment.
While the 550 kV networkis strong in the US,
(05:32):
especially on the East Coastand the West Coast, it is all over China
and this as well, for example, in Brazilas big markets.
Okay.
420 kV or 380 kVs as well, are very strongin the Middle East or in Saudi Arabia.
They're quite a broad offering. Good.
Christian, are these two breakersbased on the same technology?
Yes and no.
Okay. And more yes than no.
Go on, you’ll have to explain.
(05:53):
But first for the yes,I mean both are gas circuit breakers.
So they use the same type of technologywe are used to from SF6.
And which gives – I would say– this very gentle interruption behavior
we are used to from gas circuit breakers.
So when you interrupt the current, it'skind of done
in a way that will not put any riskon neighboring equipment.
(06:14):
So a smooth wayto interrupt those currents.
So yes, in that regard.
So both are based on carbon dioxide-oxygenmixtures as the base mixture.
But then there is the one difference whichis that in the metal enclosed breaker
we actually add a few percentof C4-fluoronitrile.
So kind of a high performance special gasto the carbon dioxide and the oxygen.
(06:37):
Because only by adding thiswe keep the size of the SF6 equipment.
So it's a very tiny spicy spice added,but has a very important function
to be able to keep the sizeof the equipment as it is currently.
Right.
So, Markus, could you tell us in moredetail why we need different gas mixtures?
Yes, in the air insulated switchgear,which, as Christian explains,
(07:00):
you have a lot of space.
You have as well metersto insulate the voltage while in the gas
insulated switchgear, spaceis usually the constraints you have.
You need to insulate the voltagewithin centimeters and in order to be able
and capable to insulate this voltagewithin centimeters,
you need to have a higher pressureand a better gas.
All gases which are existing innature are in principle bad insulators.
(07:24):
So in order to keep the performance of SF6with the same reliability margins,
or even better reliability marginsand stay in
within the same space of footprint,we are adding 3.5% C4 nitriles.
Right.
And in order to do that,we are then basically as he’s saying,
we are doping itor we are putting spice into it.
(07:45):
And this is then helping to keep reallythe, the dimensions of the switchgear.
Okay.
So this seems like a really high-techpiece, this C4FN.
Christian, do you want to tell us a littlebit more about this eco-efficient gas?
Sure, sure.
C4-fluoronitrile is a synthetic gas.
So it's a manmade gas,something that doesn't exist in nature.
But for such a gas, it's as goodfor nature as it can be.
(08:08):
Or let's say, it's in harmonywith nature in many aspects.
Because when I hear F-gas,I think, oh, not good, right?
But are all F-gasses the same? No.
No, they are not the same.
I think we really have to considerthe life cycle of these gases.
Of course, firstthis gas is enclosed in a switchgear.
So most of the timenobody comes close to it
and it's not going in any way to nature.
(08:30):
But if that happens or in the casethere is a small leakage or there is some,
some mishapand it would actually leave the equipment,
it has a lot of very beautiful properties.
So for example, it cannot mix with water,cannot accumulate in
any grass or lake or anythingbecause it will simply evaporate.
It's always a gas.
(08:50):
And if it's not a gas,it is very quickly evaporating
and then it will distributein the atmosphere.
And after a long time, 20, 30 years,there will be reaction
in the upper layer of the atmospherewhere the sun is extremely intensive
and there are certain radical particles,and they will create the decay of this
molecule, and it will end up in a saltthat already exists in nature.
(09:13):
So even though it's a manmadesynthetic molecule,
its final state of life, is somethingthat already exists in nature.
So this is why I tend to say it'sactually very much
in harmony with nature,even though it's manmade.
Okay, so you decided to investin this specific technology.
If I may ask, I'm just very curiousas to why you didn't decide to go
(09:35):
for vacuum technology, for example?
When we started the whole plan,
how to build the portfolio,because also in the beginning
you need to knowwhat is the whole portfolio?
What is your vision about the portfolio?
How are you able to cover 100 kilovoltsup to 1000 kilovolts?
So we wanted to have a scalable portfolioand a scalable technology.
And when you have gas insulation,you can somehow
(09:56):
linearly increase with the distance,the withstand voltage.
So if you have 1000 kV, you need to buildprinciple ten times larger than 100 kV.
It's a little bit different,but this is the basic principle behind.
Vacuumthough, and I have quite some experience –
professional experience in my paston the medium voltage side
with a vacuumwhere it is a perfect interruption.
Vacuum, so has the disadvantage
(10:18):
that it's saturating with the voltageand the distance.
So you cannot just increase the distanceand then you have a better withstand
voltage behavior.
And on top of it, the behavior of vacuum
is much more statisticalthan the gas behavior.
And when youthen come to the limits of the insulation
level, the limitswhere you then can withstand the voltage,
(10:40):
this statistical behaviorwill end up in unreliability.
There as well, other conceptson top of the vacuum, or together
with the vacuum, which are using technicalair as then the main insulation.
But here you have as well the disadvantagewhat we explained
before,when you go into gas insulated switchgear.
When you want to have a gas
insulated switchgear,usually the space is your main constraint.
(11:03):
And in order to keep the same space,
the same dimensions,the same footprint as we have with SF6.
You have to increase the pressureas we do with our EconiQ
but you have as well to have a better gas.
You are not able to copewith a deficiency of technical error
in insulation within the same dimensionsand within the same footprint.
(11:24):
And in the end of the dayis then the question
if you usethen technical air for insulating,
why don't you go directly for an airinsulated switchgear. Right.
So that's the reason why we areembarking on the C4 concept, I’m
meaning on the F-gas concept for the gasinsulated for the metal enclosed breakers.
While in the live tank breakersyou have enough dimensions.
We can stay with the carbon dioxide.
(11:44):
And because this is determinedby the air outside.
So more or less we cannot compromise.
We cannot compromise on reliability.
So we don't cut awayany margin of safety or anything.
We cannot compromiseon the size of the equipment
because it's the essence of this equipmentto be small, because people want it
to be small,to use the minimum amount of space.
(12:07):
And also, as Markus explained, the vacuumcircuit breaker
has definitely a lot of meritsin the medium voltage space.
Maybe up to 72 kV.
It can push a little bit,
but it simply doesn't have the scalingproperty that allow us to cover
all the portfolio and remove the SF6,where there is most of it in the high end.
Right.
So regulators have been paying
(12:27):
a lot of attention to this F-gasthat we've just been discussing.
I know I've read myself, so recently,
I know the EU passed a regulation on thisspecifically in relation to high voltage.
I've read it a few times.
It's not an easy read, I do remember,
I think you'll agree, right, it'snot an easy read is it?
There are some exemptions in there.
Would you like to comment onhow this eco-efficient portfolio matches
what the EU has approved as the safeway to go, as the right way to go
(12:50):
for a sustainable world?
I agree it's not an easy read,so it's a complex legislation.
But for those who have followed it,it's definition
from the very beginning, it'snow very clear.
And actually we welcome this regulationbecause it sets a clear
hierarchy of principles.
And the first principle is that technicalspecification comes first.
So customers specifythe technical needs for their equipment.
(13:15):
And the safe operation of powergrid is really the first principle.
And then the second principle
is to use as little or createas little global warming as possible.
So to reducethe usage of fluorinated gases,
because they contributewhen they escape to the global warming.
And this is the clear secondto this technical principle.
And then it creates different classes.
(13:35):
So those class that has no fluorinated gasat all, where for example
a live tank breaker would fall
because, as Markus explained,we don't need fluorinated gases
in the live tank breaker.
But then there's also in the legislation,
the second category,global warming potential up to 1000.
And in our case, EconiQsolution is around 400.
So it's in the second classwhere due to the technical needs,
(13:58):
our solution fits perfectly.
Because if you just put the same technicalspecification that you have in SF6,
we can fulfill it free of SF6.
So this is perfectly foreseen,this situation in the legislation.
And then there is a second exemption,as some people call it,
which is the legislation clearly says.
In the end, we need to consider the totallife cycle assessment.
(14:21):
So the gas is only one componentout of many.
And what matters in the end is the carbonfootprint of the complete product.
And again, the EconiQ products that we doare made to have the lowest possible
carbon footprint
if you take them as a complete product,because they keep the size
of the equipment,
so they don't push the carbon footprintof the gas into use of more materials.
(14:43):
They staywith the same amount of materials
and have a small remaining carbonfootprint of the gas,
but still they reduce itby a factor of 100.
So for all practical purposesthey take out the carbon footprint
of the SF6.
Okay, so it seems likeit's a pretty future-proof portfolio.
It is. Yes.
Absolutely. Yes.
Oh good. Sohow are your customers adopting this?
(15:06):
Have they shown interest?
What's the external world telling you?
Yeah,we started a couple of years back already
with sub transmission, as we call it.
So the 145 kV, 123 kV live tankbreaker, EconiQ live tank breaker
SF6-free and we have basically referenceall over the world.
It has taken a bit of timein the beginning, but now it's speeding up
and taking the lion's share of our ordersreceived in that voltage level.
(15:28):
When we come to the dead tank breaker,so we'll start
selling the dead tank breakers12 months back in the United States.
It's a main applicationof this kind of breaker,
and we have already bookedmore than 200 breakers within one year.
And we see really the accelerationin the adoption
of the principles from the customersall over the United States.
(15:49):
Because also in the United States,
we will have more and more pressureand from the regulation to phase out SF6.
And then when it comes to the gasinsulated switchgear,
we have seen that in the beginningthe adoption was a bit slow.
We have then started this pilot,but what I can say,
and that is really amazing,is that in 2024 we will book more orders
in our main gasinsulated switchgear here in Switzerland,
(16:11):
with EconiQ, meaning SF6-freethan with our traditional portfolio SF6.
This is very exciting for usand this is as well giving a lot of hope
because also the SF6 and we are doing itall because it’s contributing
quite significantly to global warming.
And this is then helping reallyto support the energy transition.
Right. That was very beautifully put.
(16:32):
Thank you very much, Markus and Christianfor coming in today and chatting with me
about the eco-efficient portfolioand the innovation
that you're bringing to the industryand to the world.
It's been wonderfullearning more about it.
And I guess all that's left to say is,see you in Paris.
And that's it for today.
We'll be back soonwith some more great content.
But before you go,remember to give us a follow
so you don't miss an episode.
(16:52):
Thanks for tuning in. See you soon!
This episode was brought to you by HitachiEnergy,
created, written,and hosted by Bárbara Freitas-Daniels.
Content and scriptwriting by Domenico Menduni.
Guest speakers Dr.
Markus Heimbach and Dr. Christian Ohler.
Produced and edited by Creative Chimps.
High voltage takes center stagein this brand
new season of HitachiEnergy's Power Pulse podcast.
We promise to bring you great contentfrom the brightest minds in the business.
We'll discuss challenges, opportunities,and all the hot topics
any high voltage enthusiasts
or anyone interested in sustainabilityfor that matter, is sure to enjoy.
Welcome back to the second special episodeof the Power Pulse podcast.
(00:22):
I'm your host, Bárbara Freitas-Daniels,and joining me today are Dr.
Markus Heimbach and Dr. Christian Ohler.
They are here to let you inon some exciting news.
We told youour economic roadmap was on track.
Well, today is the dayyou learn exactly what we meant.
Hello!
Welcome to another episode of the PowerPulse podcast.
We have a very special episodein store for you today.
(00:44):
Joining me today I've got MarkusHeimbach and Christian Ohler.
Thank you so much for joining me againtoday.
It's the second timeyou're on the podcast,
so thank you for making the time.
And if you'll allow me, Markus,I have a question for you.
When you were last here, you told usyou were about to take on Amstel Gold.
How did that go?I finished it successfully.
Oh. Good job. Well done.
It was a very nice experienceand I liked it very much.
(01:04):
It was tough, but in the end of the day,I finished and that is all what we wanted.
Going back next year? Sure. Oh, good.
Christian, how about you?
Are you a cyclist?Do you enjoy cycling at all?
Not really.
No. Cycling is probably the one sportI really hate.
I never told to Markus.
I do know the one thing you do have incommon is your interest in switchgear.
(01:25):
So if you don't mind, let's jumpright into it.
We are here on occasion of CIGRE.
Christian, would you mind telling usa little bit about CIGRE?
What is it about?
I mean, CIGRE,first of all, is an organization.
So it's really the expert organizationwhere the professionals
that work inside high voltagedomain gather and deal with their matters.
But it's probably more importantif people talk about the CIGRE,
(01:46):
they are talking about the eventthat happens every two years in Paris.
Nice to go to Paris,
which is a combinationof an expert conference
and exhibition by vendors and like a fairand the special thing
about the conference,it's really about interaction.
So on a normal conference,you write your paper,
then you present your paperand people ask questions.
(02:07):
But at CIGRE, you write a paperand you don't present the paper.
But actually people present questionsto the papers
that have been submitted before.
And then people ask questionsabout the questions.
So it has a deeply interactive character.
And for me,I like it a lot because it shows
the spirit of this industryto jointly solve problems.
Whatever organizationyou come from, utility or a vendor.
(02:31):
But there’s kind of the spiritthat we jointly try to solve the problems
that are existing in the power system.
All right. So it's all about innovation.
It's about innovation.
And this is the second in this exhibition.
You typically really see the new thingsthat are coming out.
And there's a lotof very interesting things to see Okay.
So if it's all about innovation,
is there anything you'd like to sharewith us, Markus? Yes.
(02:52):
After we launched two years agoat the CIGRE event first SF6-free
dead tank breaker, or gasinsulated switchgear at the 420 kV level.
We are now happy that we, and proud, thatwe can present one step more.
We are announcing at the CIGRE,the launch of the first fully tested
SF6-free 550 kV GIS (gas insulatedswitchgear) and dead tank breaker.
(03:16):
Okay, wow.This is a milestone in the industry.
It shows that our concept is scalable.
We can reach the highest voltage levelsand on the other hand,
we can keep the same footprint.
In addition,we are as well launching the first
SF6-freelive tank breaker in the world for 420 kV.
And we will show both of the breakers
at the CIGRE eventand also at the exhibition.
(03:38):
Oh wow. You heard it here first.
Another world first for Hitachi Energy.
And I can tell you, you're
both very proud of this achievementas you should be, as we all should be.
Christian, would you mind telling usa little bit more about these breakers,
what they're about, what they do?Sure, sure.
The live tank breaker is probablythe most common types in our network.
So this is when you have airinsulated substations.
So you have a lot of space and you putthe individual components in this space.
(04:02):
And the breakeris the most powerful of these components.
So for the first time you will have reallyfor the top voltage level
that exist in transmission grid420 kilovolt in most countries,
we will have SF6-freelive tank breakers to interrupt
short circuit currentsin air insulated switchgears.
Then the metal enclosed versions,so the dead tank breaker, mainly targeted
(04:25):
at United States and the gas insulatedswitchgear (GIS) 550 kilovolt,
these are really the highest ever voltagesanybody has done free of SF6.
So if you look globallywhere most of the SF6 is stored
and where we can achieve thisSF6-free breakers,
the biggest effect in removing SF6from the power system.
(04:46):
Okay,so you've just touched on it a little bit,
but Markuscan you tell us a little bit more
about where we can usethese breakers in terms of geography?
So North America might have differentneeds to China let's say.
So we're targeting different marketsglobally, is that right?
Correct.
When you look into the 420 kV levelwhere we had two years ago,
the gas insulated switchgear,and today we have the live tank breaker.
(05:08):
This is the dominant transmissionnetwork in Europe.
So the main power on the AC network
is transported through the 420 kV network.
This corresponds a little bit for examplein US with this 362 kV network,
which is quite similar, with the similarrequirements to the equipment.
While the 550 kV networkis strong in the US,
(05:32):
especially on the East Coastand the West Coast, it is all over China
and this as well, for example, in Brazilas big markets.
Okay.
420 kV or 380 kVs as well, are very strongin the Middle East or in Saudi Arabia.
They're quite a broad offering. Good.
Christian, are these two breakersbased on the same technology?
Yes and no.
Okay. And more yes than no.
Go on, you’ll have to explain.
(05:53):
But first for the yes,I mean both are gas circuit breakers.
So they use the same type of technologywe are used to from SF6.
And which gives – I would say– this very gentle interruption behavior
we are used to from gas circuit breakers.
So when you interrupt the current, it'skind of done
in a way that will not put any riskon neighboring equipment.
(06:14):
So a smooth wayto interrupt those currents.
So yes, in that regard.
So both are based on carbon dioxide-oxygenmixtures as the base mixture.
But then there is the one difference whichis that in the metal enclosed breaker
we actually add a few percentof C4-fluoronitrile.
So kind of a high performance special gasto the carbon dioxide and the oxygen.
(06:37):
Because only by adding thiswe keep the size of the SF6 equipment.
So it's a very tiny spicy spice added,but has a very important function
to be able to keep the sizeof the equipment as it is currently.
Right.
So, Markus, could you tell us in moredetail why we need different gas mixtures?
Yes, in the air insulated switchgear,which, as Christian explains,
(07:00):
you have a lot of space.
You have as well metersto insulate the voltage while in the gas
insulated switchgear, spaceis usually the constraints you have.
You need to insulate the voltagewithin centimeters and in order to be able
and capable to insulate this voltagewithin centimeters,
you need to have a higher pressureand a better gas.
All gases which are existing innature are in principle bad insulators.
(07:24):
So in order to keep the performance of SF6with the same reliability margins,
or even better reliability marginsand stay in
within the same space of footprint,we are adding 3.5% C4 nitriles.
Right.
And in order to do that,we are then basically as he’s saying,
we are doping itor we are putting spice into it.
(07:45):
And this is then helping to keep reallythe, the dimensions of the switchgear.
Okay.
So this seems like a really high-techpiece, this C4FN.
Christian, do you want to tell us a littlebit more about this eco-efficient gas?
Sure, sure.
C4-fluoronitrile is a synthetic gas.
So it's a manmade gas,something that doesn't exist in nature.
But for such a gas, it's as goodfor nature as it can be.
(08:08):
Or let's say, it's in harmonywith nature in many aspects.
Because when I hear F-gas,I think, oh, not good, right?
But are all F-gasses the same? No.
No, they are not the same.
I think we really have to considerthe life cycle of these gases.
Of course, firstthis gas is enclosed in a switchgear.
So most of the timenobody comes close to it
and it's not going in any way to nature.
(08:30):
But if that happens or in the casethere is a small leakage or there is some,
some mishapand it would actually leave the equipment,
it has a lot of very beautiful properties.
So for example, it cannot mix with water,cannot accumulate in
any grass or lake or anythingbecause it will simply evaporate.
It's always a gas.
(08:50):
And if it's not a gas,it is very quickly evaporating
and then it will distributein the atmosphere.
And after a long time, 20, 30 years,there will be reaction
in the upper layer of the atmospherewhere the sun is extremely intensive
and there are certain radical particles,and they will create the decay of this
molecule, and it will end up in a saltthat already exists in nature.
(09:13):
So even though it's a manmadesynthetic molecule,
its final state of life, is somethingthat already exists in nature.
So this is why I tend to say it'sactually very much
in harmony with nature,even though it's manmade.
Okay, so you decided to investin this specific technology.
If I may ask, I'm just very curiousas to why you didn't decide to go
(09:35):
for vacuum technology, for example?
When we started the whole plan,
how to build the portfolio,because also in the beginning
you need to knowwhat is the whole portfolio?
What is your vision about the portfolio?
How are you able to cover 100 kilovoltsup to 1000 kilovolts?
So we wanted to have a scalable portfolioand a scalable technology.
And when you have gas insulation,you can somehow
(09:56):
linearly increase with the distance,the withstand voltage.
So if you have 1000 kV, you need to buildprinciple ten times larger than 100 kV.
It's a little bit different,but this is the basic principle behind.
Vacuumthough, and I have quite some experience –
professional experience in my paston the medium voltage side
with a vacuumwhere it is a perfect interruption.
Vacuum, so has the disadvantage
(10:18):
that it's saturating with the voltageand the distance.
So you cannot just increase the distanceand then you have a better withstand
voltage behavior.
And on top of it, the behavior of vacuum
is much more statisticalthan the gas behavior.
And when youthen come to the limits of the insulation
level, the limitswhere you then can withstand the voltage,
(10:40):
this statistical behaviorwill end up in unreliability.
There as well, other conceptson top of the vacuum, or together
with the vacuum, which are using technicalair as then the main insulation.
But here you have as well the disadvantagewhat we explained
before,when you go into gas insulated switchgear.
When you want to have a gas
insulated switchgear,usually the space is your main constraint.
(11:03):
And in order to keep the same space,
the same dimensions,the same footprint as we have with SF6.
You have to increase the pressureas we do with our EconiQ
but you have as well to have a better gas.
You are not able to copewith a deficiency of technical error
in insulation within the same dimensionsand within the same footprint.
(11:24):
And in the end of the dayis then the question
if you usethen technical air for insulating,
why don't you go directly for an airinsulated switchgear. Right.
So that's the reason why we areembarking on the C4 concept, I’m
meaning on the F-gas concept for the gasinsulated for the metal enclosed breakers.
While in the live tank breakersyou have enough dimensions.
We can stay with the carbon dioxide.
(11:44):
And because this is determinedby the air outside.
So more or less we cannot compromise.
We cannot compromise on reliability.
So we don't cut awayany margin of safety or anything.
We cannot compromiseon the size of the equipment
because it's the essence of this equipmentto be small, because people want it
to be small,to use the minimum amount of space.
(12:07):
And also, as Markus explained, the vacuumcircuit breaker
has definitely a lot of meritsin the medium voltage space.
Maybe up to 72 kV.
It can push a little bit,
but it simply doesn't have the scalingproperty that allow us to cover
all the portfolio and remove the SF6,where there is most of it in the high end.
Right.
So regulators have been paying
(12:27):
a lot of attention to this F-gasthat we've just been discussing.
I know I've read myself, so recently,
I know the EU passed a regulation on thisspecifically in relation to high voltage.
I've read it a few times.
It's not an easy read, I do remember,
I think you'll agree, right, it'snot an easy read is it?
There are some exemptions in there.
Would you like to comment onhow this eco-efficient portfolio matches
what the EU has approved as the safeway to go, as the right way to go
(12:50):
for a sustainable world?
I agree it's not an easy read,so it's a complex legislation.
But for those who have followed it,it's definition
from the very beginning, it'snow very clear.
And actually we welcome this regulationbecause it sets a clear
hierarchy of principles.
And the first principle is that technicalspecification comes first.
So customers specifythe technical needs for their equipment.
(13:15):
And the safe operation of powergrid is really the first principle.
And then the second principle
is to use as little or createas little global warming as possible.
So to reducethe usage of fluorinated gases,
because they contributewhen they escape to the global warming.
And this is the clear secondto this technical principle.
And then it creates different classes.
(13:35):
So those class that has no fluorinated gasat all, where for example
a live tank breaker would fall
because, as Markus explained,we don't need fluorinated gases
in the live tank breaker.
But then there's also in the legislation,
the second category,global warming potential up to 1000.
And in our case, EconiQsolution is around 400.
So it's in the second classwhere due to the technical needs,
(13:58):
our solution fits perfectly.
Because if you just put the same technicalspecification that you have in SF6,
we can fulfill it free of SF6.
So this is perfectly foreseen,this situation in the legislation.
And then there is a second exemption,as some people call it,
which is the legislation clearly says.
In the end, we need to consider the totallife cycle assessment.
(14:21):
So the gas is only one componentout of many.
And what matters in the end is the carbonfootprint of the complete product.
And again, the EconiQ products that we doare made to have the lowest possible
carbon footprint
if you take them as a complete product,because they keep the size
of the equipment,
so they don't push the carbon footprintof the gas into use of more materials.
(14:43):
They staywith the same amount of materials
and have a small remaining carbonfootprint of the gas,
but still they reduce itby a factor of 100.
So for all practical purposesthey take out the carbon footprint
of the SF6.
Okay, so it seems likeit's a pretty future-proof portfolio.
It is. Yes.
Absolutely. Yes.
Oh good. Sohow are your customers adopting this?
(15:06):
Have they shown interest?
What's the external world telling you?
Yeah,we started a couple of years back already
with sub transmission, as we call it.
So the 145 kV, 123 kV live tankbreaker, EconiQ live tank breaker
SF6-free and we have basically referenceall over the world.
It has taken a bit of timein the beginning, but now it's speeding up
and taking the lion's share of our ordersreceived in that voltage level.
(15:28):
When we come to the dead tank breaker,so we'll start
selling the dead tank breakers12 months back in the United States.
It's a main applicationof this kind of breaker,
and we have already bookedmore than 200 breakers within one year.
And we see really the accelerationin the adoption
of the principles from the customersall over the United States.
(15:49):
Because also in the United States,
we will have more and more pressureand from the regulation to phase out SF6.
And then when it comes to the gasinsulated switchgear,
we have seen that in the beginningthe adoption was a bit slow.
We have then started this pilot,but what I can say,
and that is really amazing,is that in 2024 we will book more orders
in our main gasinsulated switchgear here in Switzerland,
(16:11):
with EconiQ, meaning SF6-freethan with our traditional portfolio SF6.
This is very exciting for usand this is as well giving a lot of hope
because also the SF6 and we are doing itall because it’s contributing
quite significantly to global warming.
And this is then helping reallyto support the energy transition.
Right. That was very beautifully put.
(16:32):
Thank you very much, Markus and Christianfor coming in today and chatting with me
about the eco-efficient portfolioand the innovation
that you're bringing to the industryand to the world.
It's been wonderfullearning more about it.
And I guess all that's left to say is,see you in Paris.
And that's it for today.
We'll be back soonwith some more great content.
But before you go,remember to give us a follow
so you don't miss an episode.
(16:52):
Thanks for tuning in. See you soon!
This episode was brought to you by HitachiEnergy,
created, written,and hosted by Bárbara Freitas-Daniels.
Content and scriptwriting by Domenico Menduni.
Guest speakers Dr.
Markus Heimbach and Dr. Christian Ohler.
Produced and edited by Creative Chimps.
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