October 1, 2024 • 30 mins
Navigating the high-voltage industry is just like exploring a complex maze, where each twist and turn represents new technologies, regulatory hurdles, unpredictable market dynamics, outdated infrastructure, and more. It can feel overwhelming! How do you choose the right path?
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Episode Transcript
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(00:01):
High voltage takes center stagein this season of Hitachi
Energy's Power Pulse podcast.
We promise to bring you great contentfrom the brightest minds in the business.
We'll discuss challenges, opportunities,and all the hot topics
any high voltage enthusiast
or anyone interested in sustainabilityfor that matter, is sure to enjoy.
In this episode of the podcast,we will focus on the main issues
(00:21):
affecting the high voltageindustry in general,
and we will also tell you howwe're addressing them at Hitachi Energy.
They are carbonfootprint, availability, reliability.
We invited Dr.
Arthouros Iordanidis to come inand tell you all about it.
He holds a PhD in Industrial Processesand Products, and
is the current Head of Circuit Breakerand Grid Components at Hitachi Energy.
(00:41):
His background encompassesR&D and portfolio management.
Originally from Greece, he'snow based in Zurich.
Welcome back to Power Pulse.
I'm your host, Sam Dash, and todayI'm speaking with Arthouros Iordanidis,
head of GPG Circuit Breakerand Grid Components at High Voltage.
Arthouros, hello. Hi, Sam.
Arthouros, let's get right into it.
Can you share a bit of your backgroundand tell us what inspired you
(01:04):
to pursue a career in the high voltageenergy industry?
Well, as always, it happens,there is a mix of logic
and some things that happen by chance.
I wanted to do rocket science.
That's the reason I'm in Hitachi Energyin High Voltage.
Of course, you might ask, thatsounds like a failure.
It's not rockets that we are building inHitachi Energy.
(01:27):
Well, actually, sort of the contrary.
I sort of imaginedthere must be some sort of connection.
Now, I'm thinking Hitachi Energymight be working on rockets.
It is working on technologies
which are resembling a lot rocketsand have a lot in common.
So rocket science or airspacewas something that I studied,
I studied the phenomenon, the physics, how
(01:48):
the air flows around the wing of a planeand lifts it up;
or how the rocket comes back to the Earthafter launching to the space;
Or how reactive flowsgo through a reactor.
For example, to generate hydrogenfrom methanol or from biogas.
This is what I studied.
And once I have seenan ad coming from here,
from Switzerland, from corporate research.
(02:09):
They were askingfor Compositional scientists, for fluid
dynamics, continuum mechanics in highvoltage equipment, circuit breakers.
I thought the name sounds interesting.
Let's look what is inside.
It was very interestingthat when I looked inside,
what happens in the circuit breaker,the phenomena are pretty much the same;
to very good extent, the same as aroundthe wing of the airplane.
Right?
So there is a flow of the gas,supersonic flow as in the jet.
(02:33):
And one has to understand how this flows,in order
to be able to develop reliable equipment.
Later I realized that it's actuallyit's much more complex than the flow
around the wing.
And the reason is that for the equipment,for our high voltage equipment,
to be able to function, to interruptthe current, it always ignites an arc.
So that's kind of a small lightningin the device.
(02:55):
And it creates a very hot medium plasmawith a temperature of 20,000 Kelvin or so.
That is,the surface of the sun is 5,000 Kelvin.
This one is 20,000.
So it's much hotter than the sun. Right.
And this phenomena,
this flow, supersonic flow happensat the same time when this arc is burning.
And understanding this and modeling that
(03:17):
and designing based on the understandingis really rocket science.
So that is the reason why I ended upin high voltage R&D at that time.
Well, that actually leads menicely to my next question,
which is what do you enjoy most aboutbeing involved in high voltage energy?
So I think I'm lucky that there wereseveral stages of things that I have been
(03:38):
enjoying otherwise would have been boringfor last almost 20 years that I’m in.
Yeah, right in the beginning
was what I told you – understandingof those thing that was motivating me
to wake up and go to my officeand make the next step.
That's what got you in every day,was that connection to the rocket science
that you had studied.The challenge is still there. Yeah.
And the benefitthat the understanding would bring.
(04:00):
So I was really a scientist,and that was driving me.
Over time, it has changed, of course,.
When I look now, as of today, I do a bitless of those rocket science now.
And luckilythere are many people that continue that
and do it better than what I would dotoday.
What I enjoy today is the purposeof the things that we are doing.
I enjoy defining and implementinga strategy
(04:21):
in our company in High Voltage,which luckily happens to be also world
leader in the technologyand in the market in this industry.
So by defining our strategiesand implementing them at the same time,
we are definingwhat happens in the industry in the world
because this companyhas been in the middle of it
historically,and we are also in that position now.
(04:42):
And when I see the people, the teamwith whom I work, with these great people,
with all this energy that enables the workthat I mentioned; strategy
and then implementation.
That gives me
the energy, the most satisfaction nowand the most positive emotions now.
The energy of the teamand also the capability to implement that.
Yeah. Terrific.
It sounds like you workwith some great people.
(05:03):
So Arthouros, it might be fair to saythat many of us worldwide
are used to a grid that instantly provideselectricity.
That is right, because the electricityor the speed of propagation is like
speed of light. There's almost instant.That is. Right? Right.
We demand more and morefrom that phenomenon
where we boil a kettleor charge our phone, watch TV,
and we expect our phonesto charge in an instant.
(05:24):
When they used to take maybe 24 hours.
And so this grid, as we've talked about inother episodes, has been around
for a long time and relies not exclusivelyon many chemical agents or machinery
that reduce the longevityand health of our planet.
So we'll look into those agentsin more detail in separate episodes.
But in the meantime,
I wonder if you can explainwhat the current carbon footprint
(05:45):
of the existing grid equatesto in sort of real terms and simple terms
for our audience.
Indeed, we do use in our equipment,
certain materialswhich are having certain carbon footprint.
To give you a reference on somethingthat we have developed also very recently
and installed in the United States- there’s the first EconiQ.
So SF6-free, this the materialthat we're talking about is SF6,
(06:08):
which is commonly used in highvoltage equipment.
And we as you know, hopefully,we recently installed
and energized in the US, an equipmentwithout that gas.
So without the gasthat has very high greenhouse effect.
This is a perfect gas, has many otherproperties which are exceptionally good.
Right.
So it can allow very small sizeof the equipment.
(06:31):
It's not toxic, not flammable.
So it's very safe to use.
But it has one drawback that when it'sreleased to the atmosphere, it stays there
for thousands of years and it absorbsthe infrared that leaves our Earth.
So this is what we callgreenhouse effect. Right.
And that has very stronggreenhouse effect.
So some 24,000 times higherthan a kilogram of CO2 in the equivalent.
(06:53):
So we have installed deviceswithout that gas.
We manage that.
An installation of a single breakerin the US that has been done.
This is saving of a carbon footprint,similar
to a couple of flightsthat fly from here, Europe to the US.
So if you think that every yearthere are thousands of such devices
installed on the earth, the industry,
you can imagine that the effectis quite significant.
(07:16):
And when you say that it's the equivalentof a few transatlantic flights,
is that what you said?
Exactly, it's a jumbo jet 747that flies from London to New York.
So the equipment that you mentionedhas now been installed in the US;
that is SF6-free. Right.
That is saving the equivalentof the damage that those airplanes cause.
(07:37):
Exactly How often, if you imaginethat this equipment is running daily,
does it save that amountper day or per month or per year?
What's the breakdown of that?
Well, we would have been in a prettybad position if we would save it per day
because that is a quitea significant amount.
And we install one breaker,it is there installed for 30-40 years.
(07:58):
And this is also the existingone with SF6, it's sealed
and it's regulated thatthere should be very minimal emissions.
But even with that minimal emissions,because of the properties of this
gas - over 30 years,40 years, it collects.
So it emits this SF6 molecules outside.
They leak and this is the amountthat equals to a couple of jumbo jets
(08:18):
flying from Europe to the U.S.
over the lifetime of one circuit breaker,it gives you that kind of emissions.
So over the period of about 30or 40 years, you're saving the emissions
of about a few different jumbo jetscrossing the Atlantic a few times.
Terrific.
So from these numbers, I think you willsee that this is significant number.
But you also see thatthat is not decisive.
(08:40):
So we have other sourcesalso of emissions.
I think we can discuss them also, likefire, power plants and many other things.
Of course,
they contribute much more than the leakageis coming from this equipment.
Therefore, when we look into the footprintof, of our equipment,
we should look a bit more holistically,because the big impact of our work
(09:00):
on the CO2is enabling the clean technologies.
It's not only the products themselvesthat are more sustainable, but they enable
technologies, sources and consumption,which is much more environmental friendly.
So let me actually ask you about that.
With the sourcesthat are more environmental,
if we're to change the carbon footprintthat the grid leaves behind,
(09:21):
can that grid continue providing uswith the same quality and quantity
of electricity 24/7and still be eco-friendly and sustainable?
That's our mission...Yeah. ...to make it possible.
And so you've seen evidenceso far that that is possible.
That is already part of reality.
And I give you a couple of numbersshowing that if you look Europe; 44%
(09:41):
of the energy produced last year,electrical energy was produced
from renewable sources; 44% out of it,almost 30% coming from wind and solar.
So it's not a theory anymore
that this could be one wayof getting the energy to the households.
It's already reality.
And I'm sure you didn't have big problemslast year
with the shortages of electricityor with the interruptions, blackouts, etc.
(10:05):
so the business was like normal.
The life was pretty normal.
While the transition from clean energy isalready happening and this will increase.
And I was saying about motivation,what motivates me to come and work,
this is one of thosebecause the availability of the equipment
that our R&D people are developing,our factories are producing,
that enables that this shift from worstto better is happening without notice.
(10:31):
So do you ever find thatyou get frustrated with the speed
of production in connectionwith speed of thought, essentially,
so your team is able to figure outthese ways of creating something
that is more sustainable or eco-friendly,but production falls behind in some way?
Well, first of all, we should be sure withthe technologies that we're introducing.
You mentioned reliabilityin the beginning. That is the key.
(10:54):
If we save somewhere,for example, the CO2 footprint
but then someone causes the blackoutfor a few hours,
I think we damagemaybe even more than what we create.
So everything in this industrywhere we are, everything that we introduce
must be reliable.
It must be fully understood, fully testedand then introduced.
And this takes time.
My wish would have been of course,
(11:15):
to have these things every day faster,and we are reasonably fast actually.
But it's also needs time to ensurethat the reliability is not compromised.
This we cannot afford.
No, I think that's important to hit upon,because I think so often we're anxious
that things aren't moving fast enoughto account for the changes
in our environment that we feel arebeing caused by global warming in general.
(11:38):
You know, that
phrase is thrown around quite generally,and we want solutions immediately.
But I think what you're sayingis important for our audience to hear,
which is that they're very importantsafety protocol and checks
that need to be in placeto make sure that things
don't sort of rush into production tooquickly. Is that right?
Absolutely. Yeah.
So renewables are a big part of the wayforward, I think it's safe to say.
(11:58):
How is the industry in general adapting
to those increasing demandsfor renewable energy sources?
I think as an industry,we are living very exceptional times.
I think the scale of changeis not happening very often.
And there are three pillars of this changethat we live today.
One is what I mentioned, renewablesand changing of the sources
(12:19):
of the energy, of the generationof the electrical energy.
You can imagine that in the pastor also now to a good extent,
we had a much simpler network,which means that there was one big plant
producing the electricity - could benuclear, could be coal-fired.
And then this electricity was distributeddown to these bulbs that we have here.
Right.
Today, we have very many sources.
(12:40):
We have wind, we have solar.
Every house or every second
house is producing electricitythat is capable to feed into the network.
And this system needs to be managed,and our equipment
gets more complex to be able to managethis reliability of sources.
On the other hand side,also the consumption changes.
Before everything was also simple.
(13:00):
It's 50Hz,somehow electricity was generated
in a plant and then it was turningthe motors, pumps, the bulbs,
they were heated up by this 50Hz currentand then giving light.
Today we have to charge our mobile phones;we have to charge our cars.
Our houses are full of electronics.
Those don't require,don't work with a 50Hz nice AC current
(13:23):
and we need to convert this into directcurrent etc.
which createslots of variability in the network.
So the power quality needsto be controlled
much more tight in a tight waybecause the sources changes,
the consumption changesand this nice 50Hz shape is not there.
So one of the purposes of our highvoltage is to provide equipment
(13:43):
that is able to monitor
the quality of the power that we havein our grid and correct it,
because if we don't correct it,then it causes problems.
So to give you an example of,how all this network complexity can have
a specific impact on the equipmentthat are connected to the network.
I have a friendwho lives on a small island in Greece,
and he often tells me that his fridgeis out of order because it was damaged,
(14:08):
and there was some flicker that he hasseen more or less in the same evening.
Well, what happensis that the power quality,
this 50Hz is not 50Hz anymoreand there are some spikes that are
getting in the network.
There's sort of a surge of energy
at one point, and that sort of, overwhelmsthe system of the fridge.
Is that right? Exactly.
That hits the fridge and the fridgeis not designed for such a spike.
(14:30):
And then it gets damaged.
So I tell him, please buyour power quality equipment, for once
instead of buying a new fridgeevery three years.
Of course, this a joke because we don'tmake such equipment for household.
But you can imagine that when such a thinghappened on the scale of a city
where we use our equipment, orfor a factory or for industrial factories,
such, quality of the electricitycan damage lots of equipment.
(14:52):
And one of the purpose of usis to install monitoring of the quality
or the frequency of the phase shiftor harmonic content.
So there are lots of technical
terms behind that and correct itwhenever it gets wrong and not acceptable.
Or rather strict lawsthat exist in every country and region
how this power quality should be.
(15:14):
So let me ask you a bit about that.
On a larger scale, how does the aginginfrastructure and equipment in cities
or countries impact the reliabilityand performance of high voltage grids?
You can imagine, an aluminum smelter, forexample, which is fed from a transformer.
And in between there is our switchgear,which is controlling
(15:35):
the electricitythat is supplied to this aluminum smelter.
And of course, they live long time, 30years, but they need certain maintenance.
They need also at some point replacementbecause nothing is forever.
This is the switchgear that livesfor 30 to 40 years, is that right?
Exactly, and smelterhopefully lives for even longer.
So to stop this production for one dayor you can imagine
(15:57):
also a gas platform – to stopsuch a production for one day, it's
a huge impact on society because of theavailability of the production,
but also a huge financial impacton the customer that is operating it
and understanding
when we should stop the equipmentor when it's still okay to run it.
It can save or bring very big benefitto the customers and to society.
(16:19):
Right.
I think what you're saying, correct me
if I'm wrong, is there's a lot of thoughtthat goes into the negotiation of when
to interrupt a systemto enhance it or improve it,
so that you're not causingtoo much upset to society or to business.
Is that right?
That's right.
Well, I won’t say that it's
not only the effectof replacing our piece of equipment,
(16:40):
but the impact of the shutdownthat you have to take
is much higher costs on the societyand on the industry, on business
even than the equipmentitself. Right, right.
Therefore, we have to be extremely carefuland we have to know our equipment
very well, the condition of it to be ableto say, okay, now we have to stop.
And up to this point it's okay to run itbecause it's in a good condition.
(17:00):
And so on that note,when you are faced with that decision of
interrupting the system or the machinery,how are regulatory changes
impacting the developmentand operation of high voltage products?
Regulation,
in particular the
way that it goes last year, it'sdefinitely an opportunity
(17:20):
for us, for our industry,but also for our society.
I think many movements, including
also the offers or spread or introductionto the markets of SF6-free technology
that I mentioned earlier are,
in a good sense, also possiblebecause our legislators,
our governments and the society realizethat we have to do something.
(17:43):
So we have to introducecertain limitations on emission,
so on the energy sources,fossil fuel, etc..
So do you think it presents more obstaclesor open opportunities for utilities?
We as a technology leader in the field,we are in a very good position to innovate
and the regulations,they help both society to get better,
(18:05):
cleaner, to protect the earthbut they also motivate the innovation.
Because some technologies have existedalso some ten years ago, 20 years ago,
not as advanced as now, but at that timehave also seen that it was considered
as a nice to have because we thought,okay, climate change is not real maybe.
Some people at least thought at that time.
(18:25):
And the governments,they are not saying that, look,
everyone has to bebetter, has to be cleaner.
So that was in my view,
that was a bit breaking the innovation,which is the opposite now.
And we see that when the technologiesare available, they get more mature.
That is also impacting legislationbecause we should be careful
making legislation which is not backed upby reality, by the technology.
(18:49):
As of today, we have a very nicecombination of available technologies
and let's say ambitious legislation
that motivates innovation and innovation
is the place where our companyand our high voltage units are good.
So it is definitely an opportunityboth for us as industry,
but also a company and for the societythat makes our work meaningful.
(19:11):
Yeah, yeah.
That's fantastic.So let me follow up on that.
It seems that phasing out
SF6 is proving to be the priorityfor the industry worldwide,
not just for Hitachi Energy dueto the environmental and health concerns.
Do you think that the industry is readyto adopt SF6-free technology now?
Do you feel likewe're sort of halfway there?
(19:32):
Where are we in that timeline?
We are in the beginning,but the direction is already given
that the technologies are adopted,they are already commercial.
First of all, they’re available,they are proven and they are commercial.
We are expanding our portfolioand we see customers asking for it.
So with the change, with the swap from SF6to SF6-free, it will still take time.
(19:57):
I mentioned you, the lifetime ofthe equipment is 30/40 years.
Whatever has been installed last yearwill still be there for a long time.
This infrastructure,we cannot simply just replace
because it's a very, it's a big, it’sa big thing.
Do you feel that businesses or governments
are on board to replace those, say,
circuit breakers or whateverthe equipment is that relies on SF6?
(20:20):
Are they willing to replace itbefore its time is up?
Like you said, thatthose pieces of equipment
might last 30 or 40 yearsand were installed last year.
Do they want to ride that lifetime out,or are they willing to take the sort
of financial hit of replacing itnext year, or in five years.
If you would try to replace this hugeinfrastructure that has been built over
(20:41):
decades, in my eyes,that would be a mistake
because we would win on the equipmentthat we are replacing,
and it might be also good for a companyproducing that equipment like we,
but it would make more damagebecause we would break down the shift
to the sustainable energygeneration and distribution.
There are lots of sources of energygeneration that are being introduced.
(21:03):
If we keep ourselves busy with replacingthe old ones, we’ll not make progress
in replacing the fossil fuel basedgeneration sources like the wind
by the sources like the wind,it would be counter-productive to focus
on replacing the existing one.
Rather, we would anywaybe busy, the governments and the industry
like we by making new installationsbased on SF6-free.
(21:26):
And this is alsohow the governments are thinking.
Well, the legislation that we are seeing,they are addressing new installation.
While they always saythat we can run everything
that exists until the life endand there's also one aspect of it,
our equipment, our heavy duty equipment,there's lots of energy that they transmit.
And if we replace so much metaland insulator
(21:46):
and everything,we might even harm the nature more by
just scrapping the working equipmentthen helping with the SF6 reduction.
Right.
It takes a certain amount of energyand causes
a certain amount of harm to the planetto get rid of things
and to dispose of equipmentand various materials.
Is that right? Definitely.
(22:07):
Most environmental friendly wayis for our industry, but also for
our private life, is to use the thingsthat we are having as long as possible.
I think our cars for example;to replace a car every two years,
even if it's very ecological one, it'snot good for the ecology.
The same for the switchgear.
I think replacing workingthings will not help us with the resources
(22:28):
that are needed to produce them,
and also with the CO2 footprintthat we create by creating these
heavy parts, they are not small bitsand pieces that we are producing.
Yeah, I think that's actuallya great example to give to our listeners,
which is if you have a very fuelinefficient vehicle that you're driving
and you want to replace it
with maybe an electric vehicle,it could be that getting rid of your gas
(22:50):
guzzling 4x4 or truck could be worsefor the environment or something
you have to negotiate
in improving your emissionsfrom your vehicle that you're driving.
Is that right?
It's definitely worth to understandwhat is the pro
and what is the con, how much will damageand how much will help.
Of course, if one would have very heavy4 x 4, which, four-liter consumption
(23:12):
probably still, good optionto go to more environmental friendly.
But, there is certain balancewith the many normal cars.
I think replacing one vehiclejust to get the more
electric one, for example,might not be the best option
if you would look the full life cycleor the CO2 footprint
that the whole chain of creating the carand using it makes.
(23:35):
Right?
And also, I'm sure you're aware there'salso the trend and social responsibility
that people want to embraceand be seen as embracing, which is
I want to be seen driving an electric carbecause I like the image of that,
and I want to exude that personalitythat I'm responsible to nature.
But like you said,
we have to really look more closelyat what that give and take is
(23:57):
and what we're actually doingwith those choices.
Is that right? Exactly. Right.
So let me pivot a bit here.
Does grid modernizationand digitalization play
a role in addressing the challengesthat we've been talking about?
Or rather, how does it play a role?
Well, digitalization does
have a special role in our industry,and it's special for the following reason.
(24:19):
You imagine that the electricity turnslots of motors.
I mentioned the aluminum smelter.
It generates lots of heat
to be able to melt down the materialand get out of it aluminum.
So it's, lots of real energy. Right.
This will never be digital, right.That's the physics.
So our equipment will work with real power
and they will be also heavy duty thingsbecause that is the nature.
(24:43):
We cannot replace it by digital means.
That is like thatand that will stay like that.
However adding digital to this maincore function of our equipment
can have a difference.
And I mentioned you like stoppingthe factory and replacing the equipment.
Right.
Digital means what we have
now we are developingand we have them already in the fields.
(25:03):
Allow us to put a sensor, a small sensor
into our equipmentand to monitor condition of it.
Yeah.
So without stopping the factory,the plant, without opening the device,
without looking into it, we're ableto get the information that we need.
We create digital modelsthat are taking the continuously measured
data and definewhat is the lifetime of this equipment.
(25:25):
And this digital information can be alsoshown to the customer when it works out.
And saying that, look,you have 5000 operations still this
circuit breaker can do andcan be in the field another three years.
By doing this, we have a very big impacton the customer, positive impact
because of all the consequencesof stoppage that I mentioned.
(25:47):
So digital in our industryis more enabling additional value,
but it is not replacing the core functionof our devices.
Right.
So I feel like what I'm hearing
and correct me if I'm wrong, is onevery important part of a digital device
like you mentioned,could be that you are able
to keep the equipment running,but also monitor it at the same time
(26:07):
without interrupting its functionnecessarily,
which you may have to dowithout that digital component.
And so you're able to keep things runningand keep track of it at the same time,
so that you can study it and improve it
while it's running, and have a moreseamless replacement of some component.
Is that right?That's a very good description.
Actually,it's a seamless monitoring of the devices.
(26:28):
And then using digital means to understand
from the lots of datathat we measure to understand
what is the actual condition of the deviceand what we should do with that.
So before intervening with some heavymechanical steps– Yeah, right.
We can use digitalto extend the lifetime of the device
and thus to have the businessof our customers,
(26:49):
runningas long without interruption as possible.
And possibly in extendingthe life of that product, have less
of a detrimental impactto sort of ecology of the planet.
Is that right?
Absolutely. Yeah.
Because of the thing that we just said,I think, replacing the equipment,
hundreds of kilograms of materialand scrapping that
and replacing it,transporting it, producing it.
(27:11):
So it has a long chain of thingsthat impact the nature.
So they have sustainability mark on it.
Therefore, when we extend it from, say,30 years to 40 years,
we already saved one thirdmore of the CO2 impact.
Right.
So there's a complex cost benefit analysisthere.
Right. Yeah.
Just to add to this, one insight is thisand the other one is
(27:34):
of course the reliability.
When we monitor the deviceand we know how is its condition
then we also ensure that it's workingreliably.
Whenever we see that, look now it'scoming to the edge of the lifetime.
Maybe it's not 30 years, it's worked15 years, but in very hard conditions.
Then we also come to a customerwith a proposal
that, look,now we want your network to be reliable.
(27:56):
And we think that next yearyou should plan in organized way
a replacementor maintenance of the device.
And you help with that, like yousaid, organized way of replacement.
Is that right? Exactly. Yeah.
The worst thing that can happenwhen this thing comes as a surprise.
Yeah. Of course.
You imagine a big city as a surprisethat does not have electricity.
So that's not something what we want.
(28:16):
If the utility knows that in one year
I have to do something,then he can plan it.
He can redirect the flow of electricitybecause it's a network,
there is always a way.
You can do it and then no one will see it.
We as consumers will not seeany difference because it's planned.
So that's the ideal that there's somethingseamless about that transition, right?
(28:37):
Yeah.
So actually that's a great segueinto the other question
I was going to ask you,which is time is a luxury
that this industrycan't really afford anymore.
And you've broughtinto our understanding of that.
A reliable grid is non-negotiablefor most countries at this point.
What would be your key advicefor the industry to keep the grids
working seamlessly without those deadpatches of things
(28:58):
not working to make the grid more reliableand available and sustainable?
Well,we have to invest in the technologies.
We have to invest to our peopleto have these bright brains,
so that then they are ableto come with new technologies
and they're able to provethat these technologies are working.
Environment helps usbecause there is good regulation
(29:18):
that also forces the industryto be reliable.
Actually, it's not now industry.
It's not easy to come out with a productwhich is not well tested,
and we have to follow these thingsvery strictly,
and we have to be able to copewith the time pressure.
We need the great people that are ableto generate ideas, but that's not enough.
(29:41):
They need to also prove the ideas.
And then we as an industry, as a company,we have to implement
that in the productionand make it available to our customers.
At the endthe people factor is a big game changer
in the innovation, and particularlyat the time of changes that are happening
in the electrical networks and the powersupply that we are experiencing now.
(30:03):
Lovely.
Thank you.
Thanks so much.
I really appreciate you joining us todayArthouros.
Thank you very much Sam.
You’ve really deepened our understandingof energy, reliability
and availability and the reductionof our carbon footprint in general.
Thanks for tuning in to this episode ofPower Pulse.
Until next time.
And that's it for today.
We'll be back soonwith some more great content.
(30:23):
But before you go,remember to give us a follow
so you don't miss an episode.
Thanks for tuning in. See you soon!
This episode was brought to you by HitachiEnergy.
Createdand introduced by Bárbara Freitas-Daniels.
Content and scriptwriting by Cassandra Inay.
Guest speaker Dr. Arthouros Iordanidis.
Hosted by Sam Dash.
Produced and edited by Creative Chimps.
High voltage takes center stagein this season of Hitachi
Energy's Power Pulse podcast.
We promise to bring you great contentfrom the brightest minds in the business.
We'll discuss challenges, opportunities,and all the hot topics
any high voltage enthusiast
or anyone interested in sustainabilityfor that matter, is sure to enjoy.
In this episode of the podcast,we will focus on the main issues
(00:21):
affecting the high voltageindustry in general,
and we will also tell you howwe're addressing them at Hitachi Energy.
They are carbonfootprint, availability, reliability.
We invited Dr.
Arthouros Iordanidis to come inand tell you all about it.
He holds a PhD in Industrial Processesand Products, and
is the current Head of Circuit Breakerand Grid Components at Hitachi Energy.
(00:41):
His background encompassesR&D and portfolio management.
Originally from Greece, he'snow based in Zurich.
Welcome back to Power Pulse.
I'm your host, Sam Dash, and todayI'm speaking with Arthouros Iordanidis,
head of GPG Circuit Breakerand Grid Components at High Voltage.
Arthouros, hello. Hi, Sam.
Arthouros, let's get right into it.
Can you share a bit of your backgroundand tell us what inspired you
(01:04):
to pursue a career in the high voltageenergy industry?
Well, as always, it happens,there is a mix of logic
and some things that happen by chance.
I wanted to do rocket science.
That's the reason I'm in Hitachi Energyin High Voltage.
Of course, you might ask, thatsounds like a failure.
It's not rockets that we are building inHitachi Energy.
(01:27):
Well, actually, sort of the contrary.
I sort of imaginedthere must be some sort of connection.
Now, I'm thinking Hitachi Energymight be working on rockets.
It is working on technologies
which are resembling a lot rocketsand have a lot in common.
So rocket science or airspacewas something that I studied,
I studied the phenomenon, the physics, how
(01:48):
the air flows around the wing of a planeand lifts it up;
or how the rocket comes back to the Earthafter launching to the space;
Or how reactive flowsgo through a reactor.
For example, to generate hydrogenfrom methanol or from biogas.
This is what I studied.
And once I have seenan ad coming from here,
from Switzerland, from corporate research.
(02:09):
They were askingfor Compositional scientists, for fluid
dynamics, continuum mechanics in highvoltage equipment, circuit breakers.
I thought the name sounds interesting.
Let's look what is inside.
It was very interestingthat when I looked inside,
what happens in the circuit breaker,the phenomena are pretty much the same;
to very good extent, the same as aroundthe wing of the airplane.
Right?
So there is a flow of the gas,supersonic flow as in the jet.
(02:33):
And one has to understand how this flows,in order
to be able to develop reliable equipment.
Later I realized that it's actuallyit's much more complex than the flow
around the wing.
And the reason is that for the equipment,for our high voltage equipment,
to be able to function, to interruptthe current, it always ignites an arc.
So that's kind of a small lightningin the device.
(02:55):
And it creates a very hot medium plasmawith a temperature of 20,000 Kelvin or so.
That is,the surface of the sun is 5,000 Kelvin.
This one is 20,000.
So it's much hotter than the sun. Right.
And this phenomena,
this flow, supersonic flow happensat the same time when this arc is burning.
And understanding this and modeling that
(03:17):
and designing based on the understandingis really rocket science.
So that is the reason why I ended upin high voltage R&D at that time.
Well, that actually leads menicely to my next question,
which is what do you enjoy most aboutbeing involved in high voltage energy?
So I think I'm lucky that there wereseveral stages of things that I have been
(03:38):
enjoying otherwise would have been boringfor last almost 20 years that I’m in.
Yeah, right in the beginning
was what I told you – understandingof those thing that was motivating me
to wake up and go to my officeand make the next step.
That's what got you in every day,was that connection to the rocket science
that you had studied.The challenge is still there. Yeah.
And the benefitthat the understanding would bring.
(04:00):
So I was really a scientist,and that was driving me.
Over time, it has changed, of course,.
When I look now, as of today, I do a bitless of those rocket science now.
And luckilythere are many people that continue that
and do it better than what I would dotoday.
What I enjoy today is the purposeof the things that we are doing.
I enjoy defining and implementinga strategy
(04:21):
in our company in High Voltage,which luckily happens to be also world
leader in the technologyand in the market in this industry.
So by defining our strategiesand implementing them at the same time,
we are definingwhat happens in the industry in the world
because this companyhas been in the middle of it
historically,and we are also in that position now.
(04:42):
And when I see the people, the teamwith whom I work, with these great people,
with all this energy that enables the workthat I mentioned; strategy
and then implementation.
That gives me
the energy, the most satisfaction nowand the most positive emotions now.
The energy of the teamand also the capability to implement that.
Yeah. Terrific.
It sounds like you workwith some great people.
(05:03):
So Arthouros, it might be fair to saythat many of us worldwide
are used to a grid that instantly provideselectricity.
That is right, because the electricityor the speed of propagation is like
speed of light. There's almost instant.That is. Right? Right.
We demand more and morefrom that phenomenon
where we boil a kettleor charge our phone, watch TV,
and we expect our phonesto charge in an instant.
(05:24):
When they used to take maybe 24 hours.
And so this grid, as we've talked about inother episodes, has been around
for a long time and relies not exclusivelyon many chemical agents or machinery
that reduce the longevityand health of our planet.
So we'll look into those agentsin more detail in separate episodes.
But in the meantime,
I wonder if you can explainwhat the current carbon footprint
(05:45):
of the existing grid equatesto in sort of real terms and simple terms
for our audience.
Indeed, we do use in our equipment,
certain materialswhich are having certain carbon footprint.
To give you a reference on somethingthat we have developed also very recently
and installed in the United States- there’s the first EconiQ.
So SF6-free, this the materialthat we're talking about is SF6,
(06:08):
which is commonly used in highvoltage equipment.
And we as you know, hopefully,we recently installed
and energized in the US, an equipmentwithout that gas.
So without the gasthat has very high greenhouse effect.
This is a perfect gas, has many otherproperties which are exceptionally good.
Right.
So it can allow very small sizeof the equipment.
(06:31):
It's not toxic, not flammable.
So it's very safe to use.
But it has one drawback that when it'sreleased to the atmosphere, it stays there
for thousands of years and it absorbsthe infrared that leaves our Earth.
So this is what we callgreenhouse effect. Right.
And that has very stronggreenhouse effect.
So some 24,000 times higherthan a kilogram of CO2 in the equivalent.
(06:53):
So we have installed deviceswithout that gas.
We manage that.
An installation of a single breakerin the US that has been done.
This is saving of a carbon footprint,similar
to a couple of flightsthat fly from here, Europe to the US.
So if you think that every yearthere are thousands of such devices
installed on the earth, the industry,
you can imagine that the effectis quite significant.
(07:16):
And when you say that it's the equivalentof a few transatlantic flights,
is that what you said?
Exactly, it's a jumbo jet 747that flies from London to New York.
So the equipment that you mentionedhas now been installed in the US;
that is SF6-free. Right.
That is saving the equivalentof the damage that those airplanes cause.
(07:37):
Exactly How often, if you imaginethat this equipment is running daily,
does it save that amountper day or per month or per year?
What's the breakdown of that?
Well, we would have been in a prettybad position if we would save it per day
because that is a quitea significant amount.
And we install one breaker,it is there installed for 30-40 years.
(07:58):
And this is also the existingone with SF6, it's sealed
and it's regulated thatthere should be very minimal emissions.
But even with that minimal emissions,because of the properties of this
gas - over 30 years,40 years, it collects.
So it emits this SF6 molecules outside.
They leak and this is the amountthat equals to a couple of jumbo jets
(08:18):
flying from Europe to the U.S.
over the lifetime of one circuit breaker,it gives you that kind of emissions.
So over the period of about 30or 40 years, you're saving the emissions
of about a few different jumbo jetscrossing the Atlantic a few times.
Terrific.
So from these numbers, I think you willsee that this is significant number.
But you also see thatthat is not decisive.
(08:40):
So we have other sourcesalso of emissions.
I think we can discuss them also, likefire, power plants and many other things.
Of course,
they contribute much more than the leakageis coming from this equipment.
Therefore, when we look into the footprintof, of our equipment,
we should look a bit more holistically,because the big impact of our work
(09:00):
on the CO2is enabling the clean technologies.
It's not only the products themselvesthat are more sustainable, but they enable
technologies, sources and consumption,which is much more environmental friendly.
So let me actually ask you about that.
With the sourcesthat are more environmental,
if we're to change the carbon footprintthat the grid leaves behind,
(09:21):
can that grid continue providing uswith the same quality and quantity
of electricity 24/7and still be eco-friendly and sustainable?
That's our mission...Yeah. ...to make it possible.
And so you've seen evidenceso far that that is possible.
That is already part of reality.
And I give you a couple of numbersshowing that if you look Europe; 44%
(09:41):
of the energy produced last year,electrical energy was produced
from renewable sources; 44% out of it,almost 30% coming from wind and solar.
So it's not a theory anymore
that this could be one wayof getting the energy to the households.
It's already reality.
And I'm sure you didn't have big problemslast year
with the shortages of electricityor with the interruptions, blackouts, etc.
(10:05):
so the business was like normal.
The life was pretty normal.
While the transition from clean energy isalready happening and this will increase.
And I was saying about motivation,what motivates me to come and work,
this is one of thosebecause the availability of the equipment
that our R&D people are developing,our factories are producing,
that enables that this shift from worstto better is happening without notice.
(10:31):
So do you ever find thatyou get frustrated with the speed
of production in connectionwith speed of thought, essentially,
so your team is able to figure outthese ways of creating something
that is more sustainable or eco-friendly,but production falls behind in some way?
Well, first of all, we should be sure withthe technologies that we're introducing.
You mentioned reliabilityin the beginning. That is the key.
(10:54):
If we save somewhere,for example, the CO2 footprint
but then someone causes the blackoutfor a few hours,
I think we damagemaybe even more than what we create.
So everything in this industrywhere we are, everything that we introduce
must be reliable.
It must be fully understood, fully testedand then introduced.
And this takes time.
My wish would have been of course,
(11:15):
to have these things every day faster,and we are reasonably fast actually.
But it's also needs time to ensurethat the reliability is not compromised.
This we cannot afford.
No, I think that's important to hit upon,because I think so often we're anxious
that things aren't moving fast enoughto account for the changes
in our environment that we feel arebeing caused by global warming in general.
(11:38):
You know, that
phrase is thrown around quite generally,and we want solutions immediately.
But I think what you're sayingis important for our audience to hear,
which is that they're very importantsafety protocol and checks
that need to be in placeto make sure that things
don't sort of rush into production tooquickly. Is that right?
Absolutely. Yeah.
So renewables are a big part of the wayforward, I think it's safe to say.
(11:58):
How is the industry in general adapting
to those increasing demandsfor renewable energy sources?
I think as an industry,we are living very exceptional times.
I think the scale of changeis not happening very often.
And there are three pillars of this changethat we live today.
One is what I mentioned, renewablesand changing of the sources
(12:19):
of the energy, of the generationof the electrical energy.
You can imagine that in the pastor also now to a good extent,
we had a much simpler network,which means that there was one big plant
producing the electricity - could benuclear, could be coal-fired.
And then this electricity was distributeddown to these bulbs that we have here.
Right.
Today, we have very many sources.
(12:40):
We have wind, we have solar.
Every house or every second
house is producing electricitythat is capable to feed into the network.
And this system needs to be managed,and our equipment
gets more complex to be able to managethis reliability of sources.
On the other hand side,also the consumption changes.
Before everything was also simple.
(13:00):
It's 50Hz,somehow electricity was generated
in a plant and then it was turningthe motors, pumps, the bulbs,
they were heated up by this 50Hz currentand then giving light.
Today we have to charge our mobile phones;we have to charge our cars.
Our houses are full of electronics.
Those don't require,don't work with a 50Hz nice AC current
(13:23):
and we need to convert this into directcurrent etc.
which createslots of variability in the network.
So the power quality needsto be controlled
much more tight in a tight waybecause the sources changes,
the consumption changesand this nice 50Hz shape is not there.
So one of the purposes of our highvoltage is to provide equipment
(13:43):
that is able to monitor
the quality of the power that we havein our grid and correct it,
because if we don't correct it,then it causes problems.
So to give you an example of,how all this network complexity can have
a specific impact on the equipmentthat are connected to the network.
I have a friendwho lives on a small island in Greece,
and he often tells me that his fridgeis out of order because it was damaged,
(14:08):
and there was some flicker that he hasseen more or less in the same evening.
Well, what happensis that the power quality,
this 50Hz is not 50Hz anymoreand there are some spikes that are
getting in the network.
There's sort of a surge of energy
at one point, and that sort of, overwhelmsthe system of the fridge.
Is that right? Exactly.
That hits the fridge and the fridgeis not designed for such a spike.
(14:30):
And then it gets damaged.
So I tell him, please buyour power quality equipment, for once
instead of buying a new fridgeevery three years.
Of course, this a joke because we don'tmake such equipment for household.
But you can imagine that when such a thinghappened on the scale of a city
where we use our equipment, orfor a factory or for industrial factories,
such, quality of the electricitycan damage lots of equipment.
(14:52):
And one of the purpose of usis to install monitoring of the quality
or the frequency of the phase shiftor harmonic content.
So there are lots of technical
terms behind that and correct itwhenever it gets wrong and not acceptable.
Or rather strict lawsthat exist in every country and region
how this power quality should be.
(15:14):
So let me ask you a bit about that.
On a larger scale, how does the aginginfrastructure and equipment in cities
or countries impact the reliabilityand performance of high voltage grids?
You can imagine, an aluminum smelter, forexample, which is fed from a transformer.
And in between there is our switchgear,which is controlling
(15:35):
the electricitythat is supplied to this aluminum smelter.
And of course, they live long time, 30years, but they need certain maintenance.
They need also at some point replacementbecause nothing is forever.
This is the switchgear that livesfor 30 to 40 years, is that right?
Exactly, and smelterhopefully lives for even longer.
So to stop this production for one dayor you can imagine
(15:57):
also a gas platform – to stopsuch a production for one day, it's
a huge impact on society because of theavailability of the production,
but also a huge financial impacton the customer that is operating it
and understanding
when we should stop the equipmentor when it's still okay to run it.
It can save or bring very big benefitto the customers and to society.
(16:19):
Right.
I think what you're saying, correct me
if I'm wrong, is there's a lot of thoughtthat goes into the negotiation of when
to interrupt a systemto enhance it or improve it,
so that you're not causingtoo much upset to society or to business.
Is that right?
That's right.
Well, I won’t say that it's
not only the effectof replacing our piece of equipment,
(16:40):
but the impact of the shutdownthat you have to take
is much higher costs on the societyand on the industry, on business
even than the equipmentitself. Right, right.
Therefore, we have to be extremely carefuland we have to know our equipment
very well, the condition of it to be ableto say, okay, now we have to stop.
And up to this point it's okay to run itbecause it's in a good condition.
(17:00):
And so on that note,when you are faced with that decision of
interrupting the system or the machinery,how are regulatory changes
impacting the developmentand operation of high voltage products?
Regulation,
in particular the
way that it goes last year, it'sdefinitely an opportunity
(17:20):
for us, for our industry,but also for our society.
I think many movements, including
also the offers or spread or introductionto the markets of SF6-free technology
that I mentioned earlier are,
in a good sense, also possiblebecause our legislators,
our governments and the society realizethat we have to do something.
(17:43):
So we have to introducecertain limitations on emission,
so on the energy sources,fossil fuel, etc..
So do you think it presents more obstaclesor open opportunities for utilities?
We as a technology leader in the field,we are in a very good position to innovate
and the regulations,they help both society to get better,
(18:05):
cleaner, to protect the earthbut they also motivate the innovation.
Because some technologies have existedalso some ten years ago, 20 years ago,
not as advanced as now, but at that timehave also seen that it was considered
as a nice to have because we thought,okay, climate change is not real maybe.
Some people at least thought at that time.
(18:25):
And the governments,they are not saying that, look,
everyone has to bebetter, has to be cleaner.
So that was in my view,
that was a bit breaking the innovation,which is the opposite now.
And we see that when the technologiesare available, they get more mature.
That is also impacting legislationbecause we should be careful
making legislation which is not backed upby reality, by the technology.
(18:49):
As of today, we have a very nicecombination of available technologies
and let's say ambitious legislation
that motivates innovation and innovation
is the place where our companyand our high voltage units are good.
So it is definitely an opportunityboth for us as industry,
but also a company and for the societythat makes our work meaningful.
(19:11):
Yeah, yeah.
That's fantastic.So let me follow up on that.
It seems that phasing out
SF6 is proving to be the priorityfor the industry worldwide,
not just for Hitachi Energy dueto the environmental and health concerns.
Do you think that the industry is readyto adopt SF6-free technology now?
Do you feel likewe're sort of halfway there?
(19:32):
Where are we in that timeline?
We are in the beginning,but the direction is already given
that the technologies are adopted,they are already commercial.
First of all, they’re available,they are proven and they are commercial.
We are expanding our portfolioand we see customers asking for it.
So with the change, with the swap from SF6to SF6-free, it will still take time.
(19:57):
I mentioned you, the lifetime ofthe equipment is 30/40 years.
Whatever has been installed last yearwill still be there for a long time.
This infrastructure,we cannot simply just replace
because it's a very, it's a big, it’sa big thing.
Do you feel that businesses or governments
are on board to replace those, say,
circuit breakers or whateverthe equipment is that relies on SF6?
(20:20):
Are they willing to replace itbefore its time is up?
Like you said, thatthose pieces of equipment
might last 30 or 40 yearsand were installed last year.
Do they want to ride that lifetime out,or are they willing to take the sort
of financial hit of replacing itnext year, or in five years.
If you would try to replace this hugeinfrastructure that has been built over
(20:41):
decades, in my eyes,that would be a mistake
because we would win on the equipmentthat we are replacing,
and it might be also good for a companyproducing that equipment like we,
but it would make more damagebecause we would break down the shift
to the sustainable energygeneration and distribution.
There are lots of sources of energygeneration that are being introduced.
(21:03):
If we keep ourselves busy with replacingthe old ones, we’ll not make progress
in replacing the fossil fuel basedgeneration sources like the wind
by the sources like the wind,it would be counter-productive to focus
on replacing the existing one.
Rather, we would anywaybe busy, the governments and the industry
like we by making new installationsbased on SF6-free.
(21:26):
And this is alsohow the governments are thinking.
Well, the legislation that we are seeing,they are addressing new installation.
While they always saythat we can run everything
that exists until the life endand there's also one aspect of it,
our equipment, our heavy duty equipment,there's lots of energy that they transmit.
And if we replace so much metaland insulator
(21:46):
and everything,we might even harm the nature more by
just scrapping the working equipmentthen helping with the SF6 reduction.
Right.
It takes a certain amount of energyand causes
a certain amount of harm to the planetto get rid of things
and to dispose of equipmentand various materials.
Is that right? Definitely.
(22:07):
Most environmental friendly wayis for our industry, but also for
our private life, is to use the thingsthat we are having as long as possible.
I think our cars for example;to replace a car every two years,
even if it's very ecological one, it'snot good for the ecology.
The same for the switchgear.
I think replacing workingthings will not help us with the resources
(22:28):
that are needed to produce them,
and also with the CO2 footprintthat we create by creating these
heavy parts, they are not small bitsand pieces that we are producing.
Yeah, I think that's actuallya great example to give to our listeners,
which is if you have a very fuelinefficient vehicle that you're driving
and you want to replace it
with maybe an electric vehicle,it could be that getting rid of your gas
(22:50):
guzzling 4x4 or truck could be worsefor the environment or something
you have to negotiate
in improving your emissionsfrom your vehicle that you're driving.
Is that right?
It's definitely worth to understandwhat is the pro
and what is the con, how much will damageand how much will help.
Of course, if one would have very heavy4 x 4, which, four-liter consumption
(23:12):
probably still, good optionto go to more environmental friendly.
But, there is certain balancewith the many normal cars.
I think replacing one vehiclejust to get the more
electric one, for example,might not be the best option
if you would look the full life cycleor the CO2 footprint
that the whole chain of creating the carand using it makes.
(23:35):
Right?
And also, I'm sure you're aware there'salso the trend and social responsibility
that people want to embraceand be seen as embracing, which is
I want to be seen driving an electric carbecause I like the image of that,
and I want to exude that personalitythat I'm responsible to nature.
But like you said,
we have to really look more closelyat what that give and take is
(23:57):
and what we're actually doingwith those choices.
Is that right? Exactly. Right.
So let me pivot a bit here.
Does grid modernizationand digitalization play
a role in addressing the challengesthat we've been talking about?
Or rather, how does it play a role?
Well, digitalization does
have a special role in our industry,and it's special for the following reason.
(24:19):
You imagine that the electricity turnslots of motors.
I mentioned the aluminum smelter.
It generates lots of heat
to be able to melt down the materialand get out of it aluminum.
So it's, lots of real energy. Right.
This will never be digital, right.That's the physics.
So our equipment will work with real power
and they will be also heavy duty thingsbecause that is the nature.
(24:43):
We cannot replace it by digital means.
That is like thatand that will stay like that.
However adding digital to this maincore function of our equipment
can have a difference.
And I mentioned you like stoppingthe factory and replacing the equipment.
Right.
Digital means what we have
now we are developingand we have them already in the fields.
(25:03):
Allow us to put a sensor, a small sensor
into our equipmentand to monitor condition of it.
Yeah.
So without stopping the factory,the plant, without opening the device,
without looking into it, we're ableto get the information that we need.
We create digital modelsthat are taking the continuously measured
data and definewhat is the lifetime of this equipment.
(25:25):
And this digital information can be alsoshown to the customer when it works out.
And saying that, look,you have 5000 operations still this
circuit breaker can do andcan be in the field another three years.
By doing this, we have a very big impacton the customer, positive impact
because of all the consequencesof stoppage that I mentioned.
(25:47):
So digital in our industryis more enabling additional value,
but it is not replacing the core functionof our devices.
Right.
So I feel like what I'm hearing
and correct me if I'm wrong, is onevery important part of a digital device
like you mentioned,could be that you are able
to keep the equipment running,but also monitor it at the same time
(26:07):
without interrupting its functionnecessarily,
which you may have to dowithout that digital component.
And so you're able to keep things runningand keep track of it at the same time,
so that you can study it and improve it
while it's running, and have a moreseamless replacement of some component.
Is that right?That's a very good description.
Actually,it's a seamless monitoring of the devices.
(26:28):
And then using digital means to understand
from the lots of datathat we measure to understand
what is the actual condition of the deviceand what we should do with that.
So before intervening with some heavymechanical steps– Yeah, right.
We can use digitalto extend the lifetime of the device
and thus to have the businessof our customers,
(26:49):
runningas long without interruption as possible.
And possibly in extendingthe life of that product, have less
of a detrimental impactto sort of ecology of the planet.
Is that right?
Absolutely. Yeah.
Because of the thing that we just said,I think, replacing the equipment,
hundreds of kilograms of materialand scrapping that
and replacing it,transporting it, producing it.
(27:11):
So it has a long chain of thingsthat impact the nature.
So they have sustainability mark on it.
Therefore, when we extend it from, say,30 years to 40 years,
we already saved one thirdmore of the CO2 impact.
Right.
So there's a complex cost benefit analysisthere.
Right. Yeah.
Just to add to this, one insight is thisand the other one is
(27:34):
of course the reliability.
When we monitor the deviceand we know how is its condition
then we also ensure that it's workingreliably.
Whenever we see that, look now it'scoming to the edge of the lifetime.
Maybe it's not 30 years, it's worked15 years, but in very hard conditions.
Then we also come to a customerwith a proposal
that, look,now we want your network to be reliable.
(27:56):
And we think that next yearyou should plan in organized way
a replacementor maintenance of the device.
And you help with that, like yousaid, organized way of replacement.
Is that right? Exactly. Yeah.
The worst thing that can happenwhen this thing comes as a surprise.
Yeah. Of course.
You imagine a big city as a surprisethat does not have electricity.
So that's not something what we want.
(28:16):
If the utility knows that in one year
I have to do something,then he can plan it.
He can redirect the flow of electricitybecause it's a network,
there is always a way.
You can do it and then no one will see it.
We as consumers will not seeany difference because it's planned.
So that's the ideal that there's somethingseamless about that transition, right?
(28:37):
Yeah.
So actually that's a great segueinto the other question
I was going to ask you,which is time is a luxury
that this industrycan't really afford anymore.
And you've broughtinto our understanding of that.
A reliable grid is non-negotiablefor most countries at this point.
What would be your key advicefor the industry to keep the grids
working seamlessly without those deadpatches of things
(28:58):
not working to make the grid more reliableand available and sustainable?
Well,we have to invest in the technologies.
We have to invest to our peopleto have these bright brains,
so that then they are ableto come with new technologies
and they're able to provethat these technologies are working.
Environment helps usbecause there is good regulation
(29:18):
that also forces the industryto be reliable.
Actually, it's not now industry.
It's not easy to come out with a productwhich is not well tested,
and we have to follow these thingsvery strictly,
and we have to be able to copewith the time pressure.
We need the great people that are ableto generate ideas, but that's not enough.
(29:41):
They need to also prove the ideas.
And then we as an industry, as a company,we have to implement
that in the productionand make it available to our customers.
At the endthe people factor is a big game changer
in the innovation, and particularlyat the time of changes that are happening
in the electrical networks and the powersupply that we are experiencing now.
(30:03):
Lovely.
Thank you.
Thanks so much.
I really appreciate you joining us todayArthouros.
Thank you very much Sam.
You’ve really deepened our understandingof energy, reliability
and availability and the reductionof our carbon footprint in general.
Thanks for tuning in to this episode ofPower Pulse.
Until next time.
And that's it for today.
We'll be back soonwith some more great content.
(30:23):
But before you go,remember to give us a follow
so you don't miss an episode.
Thanks for tuning in. See you soon!
This episode was brought to you by HitachiEnergy.
Createdand introduced by Bárbara Freitas-Daniels.
Content and scriptwriting by Cassandra Inay.
Guest speaker Dr. Arthouros Iordanidis.
Hosted by Sam Dash.
Produced and edited by Creative Chimps.
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