May 7, 2025 • 72 mins
In this episode of Scene N Nerd, Sarah and Will discuss the fourth episode of "The Last of Us" Season 2, "Day One." They break down the gripping cold open from 2018 Seattle. The hosts dive into the complicated relationships between Ellie, Dina, and the factions they meet, like the Seraphites and WLF, while tackling the tough moral choices in a post-apocalyptic world.
As they discuss key moments, like the shocking mass hanging scene and the stakes of Ellie’s immunity, Sarah and Will highlight how the show mixes action with deeper themes of trauma and survival. They also touch on how the characters' struggles reflect real-world issues of identity and belonging.
In the second half, they switch gears to the new "Thunderbolts" movie. The hosts share their thoughts on how the movie addresses mental health, character dynamics, and the humor that runs through the story. They talk about the great chemistry among the cast, the significance of the group hug moment, and how the film balances darker themes with lightheartedness, drawing comparisons to other superhero tales.
With fun insights and lively chats, this episode encourages listeners to think about the complexities of the characters and their journeys.
0:00 Intro
1:50 "The Last of Us" Season 2 Episode 4 "Day One"
35:30 Thunderbolts* aka *The New Avengers review and discussion
Connect with us! Follow us on X, formerly Twitter, @SceneNNerd, Bluesky @SceneNNerd.bsky.social, Facebook, Instagram, and Threads @scene_n_nerd. Check out our website at www.scenennerdpodcast.com. If you enjoyed the episode, please leave us a rating and a comment on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcast fix!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
>> Will (00:00):
Foreign.
>> Sarah (00:12):
Nerds. This is Scene N nerd. I'm your host, Sarah Belmont, and with
me, as always, is our Mr. Producer, Will Polk How are you doing
tonight, Will?
>> Will (00:19):
Doing very well, Sarah. Happy Star Wars Day to
Revenge of the fifth.
>> Sarah (00:27):
So what's tomorrow?
>> Will (00:30):
Revenge, of the sixth. So some people like, you know, of course we
had Star Wars Day yesterday. May the fourth be with. With you.
Belatedly, of course, Revenge of the fifth. But some people
also, also celebrate revenge of the
6th. So I guess the Sith, you
know, depending on like, you know how
you. You want to celebrate your Sith Lord, you can do it
today or you can do it tomorrow.
>> Sarah (00:52):
Weird, weird, weird.
>> Will (00:54):
Yeah, yeah. There's no hard and fast rules.
I think anyone, anybody who can make an Internet holiday, they will do
so.
>> Sarah (01:00):
Yeah. Well, regardless of the
holidays, based on the days of the
week, it is Monday and we are recording a very
special episode because we had three
big properties to talk about this week. So we
decided to start the week off with
Andor. And tomorrow night we will be discussing the
Last of Us as well as, Thunderbolts.
(01:24):
And So we have three
episodes, all of which I consumed
on May 4th. So I was
celebrating in a way.
>> Will (01:35):
Yeah, you were.
>> Sarah (01:37):
I, I was. so Will, what. What
do you. What are your thoughts about these three
episodes?
>> Will (01:44):
Yeah. Yeah. So I really,
really enjoyed these three
episodes. I think the series, you. Each
arc has a way of
basically telling. Telling different types of
stories, whether it's a very you
mix of adventure or if it's
But this one really thought that it
(02:06):
really. The three f. The themes that really just stuck
out to me with this, with this arc was really
the rebellion and
resistance, the themes of trust
and the themes of sacrifice and
loss. And I think each one of the.
This whole arc really
explored that it slowed down. I thought we really
(02:28):
got more into the. The more.
A bit more character driven arc. And
with. With this one especially, like I was thinking about our
conversations we had last week with about like the editing,
for example, at the end of the third
episode in the first arc and how they were jumping back and
forth between my motha's wedding party with
(02:48):
her for her daughter and the. The things
that were going on on the Harvest,
world. But here I thought
it was much more. A slower pace,
more getting into the lives of the. Of our
characters and we'll, you know, we'll get into
some of those points as far as like, you know, for example,
Cassian and big shopping and, and things
(03:11):
like that, so, so I really felt it was
a more character driven arc. Not that the other ones haven't been, but
I think, we. Some of the things that have
happened up to this point in the series,
we really got to spend some, some
real time with them and some of the impacts of, of things that happen
to some of our characters.
>> Sarah (03:32):
Yeah. So I think Cassie and
Vix is a good place to start. I mean
we, we literally start with them. They're
held up. It's a year later after the events of the
first three episodes and they're are in
Coruscant in a safe hot house that was set up
by Lutheran. Bix is still dealing
with, PTSD from her
(03:55):
experience with Dr. Gross. And
Cassian is, continues
to be trying to protect her and trying to
understand with what's going on and, and
fix it. but you can
tell that them being on
missions has also worn down where, where
(04:15):
there was an incident off screen,
involving a soldier who
Cassian kills because he
sees Bix's face. So we deal with
that in the second episode. Lutheran
visits Bix, because Bix is
also taking some quote unquote
medicine.
>> Will (04:36):
Yep.
>> Sarah (04:37):
He's doing some drugs. and then by the
end of, by the third episode,
Vix and Cass or Bix gets her revenge
on Dr. Gross.
yeah,
I'm like back and forth about,
about Vix and Cassian. I will be honest.
(04:58):
The whole time I'm watching this,
like. And, and if anybody remembers last
week, the big stuff I found to be the most
interesting, I think why
I, it didn't work for me as much in these
three episodes is because it wasn't
Bix alone dealing with,
(05:18):
was Bix and Cassian and,
and someone, brought up to
me that Rogue One recently.
>> Will (05:28):
I wonder who. I wonder who.
>> Sarah (05:30):
Yeah, I wonder who. So the whole time I'm watching these three
episodes I'm just like, well,
I don't know how much I can invest in Bix
because I don't know if she's gonna
die. But I do know that these two are not gonna be together. Or
else, like in his final moments, he, he cheated
on her. And I don't know how to feel about that. So, so
(05:50):
like, what are we doing here?
And, and it was weird. I don't, I don't know if
anybody else felt this way. I'm sure I'm in the
minority most of the time. I am with Star
wars, but a lot of the time the
scenes between them
there was like this, oh my God, I'm so in love with
you. And then immediately it flipped to we're
(06:13):
arguing. Like it was just,
it was whiplash. And it was
so. And it took. And all of
the things took place within like the span of five minutes.
And I'm just like. You were just like making out,
getting ready to knock some boots, and,
and now all of a sudden you're, you're arguing, about
(06:34):
the same thing. And I get it, but
I also, I also am like,
okay, okay, this is kind of a repetitive
argument. Hopefully we don't get that argument in the
future. I, I think we will.
But, So, so that, that was
kind of my stuff where it, it piqued my
interest. But as the episodes went on
(06:56):
and the, the more scenes between them, I just
became too much of a, Like, so are we, are
we rooting for you too? Are we not? Like, like
what is going on?
>> Will (07:07):
Yeah, I mean, I, I see what you're saying about the
dynamics in their relationship, because you're right. I mean
they're, it's. It's
one of those things where I guess Cassian
was very concerned, you know, clearly concerned about her
because of all the things that have happened. And you're right. I
mean, every, each one of the episodes
(07:27):
there was a flashpoint of
whenever Cassian and, and Bix were together.
the first episode there's
so, you know, they were having discussions about the safe house and whether or
not they should decorate it and you know, make it more of their
own. And you know, and then when they went out to the
market to, to do. To try to have a normal
(07:50):
life. I guess this is. To me, I get it
was both of them.
The, the, the, the, the rebellion and the
acts that they are, are doing are impacting them in different
ways. And, and
for, for Bix. Yes, you're right.
You know, we do see at the end she does self
(08:10):
medicate because of the trauma
that she is feeling, the guilt that she
is feeling like, you know,
you know, losing her in some respects, I think she's like losing
herself because, you know, whenever
she does question Cassian about
why did you kill him? And, and was it necessary? You
(08:30):
know, is. She's really wrestling with the. I guess
internally she's wrestling like what separates
me from this guy that we just killed.
So. And I think, you know, and Cassian,
on the other hand, is very clearly
protective. Very.
When, When Lutheran wants him to do the mission to go to
(08:51):
Gorham, he, he. He's very
concerned about, you know, what's going to happen with Bix, because,
and, and, and, and, and then whenever, you know,
Lutheran shows up and has that conversation with,
With Bix and, And then Cassian finds
out the third episode, you know, he just gets all possessive and
weird and like, lose it. Loses.
(09:11):
Lose this control to the point where he just, like, goes to
the. Goes to Lutheran shop. And Lutheran's like,
dude, get it. You know, get a, Get a hold of yourself. Get it.
Get a grip on things. Because
you're, you're jeopardizing, you're,
you're running a risk of jeopardizing our whole operation
because, because you're letting your attachments, like,
run rampant here. So it's, you know, so,
(09:34):
so it's, you know, it's a lot of themes that we, We've seen before in Star
wars about attachment and, and
mission and not letting attachments
getting. Drive your. Drive your motivations
or drive your. Drive your passions. Because,
you know, we obviously see
when it's not, like, checked well, it's because.
>> Sarah (09:55):
It'S a time of war. I mean, I, I do
think I like the first episode out of these
three the best because it's the most quotable episode
for me. And one of the quotes that I did
notate was by Bixby, and
it's the first of many versions of this
argument. And she says, but if it's war, it's
not up to us what we save and what we lose.
(10:19):
I don't, I don't think she,
she's debating, well, what separates me
from that soldier. It's more about the value of life.
Like, yeah, he saw my face.
But, and, and automatically you decided
that his life. His life was,
like, worth less than. Or, worth.
(10:39):
Yeah, less than mine. And she, she didn't know
how to reconcile that. And, And I
also think that,
like, like, you're right to an
extent that, like, she's being forced into
this soldier mentality that she was not
prepared for and doesn't know how to deal with that. Plus
the. Just the PTSD from everything with
(11:02):
gross. I mean, that, that got layered
on and
Cassian, like,
there's an echo. And maybe that's also why I like
the first episode. The first. And, and that's where
I was all right with these two,
which slowly faded. It's because I,
I think that, that it's true. Like,
(11:23):
we've seen these themes before. They've been played out.
I think they got very, like, we've
seen this before. Why are we still having the same
argument. And it's an echo of what
was captured, I think much more
interestingly and much more
like in a unique way with Mon
Mothma in the previous episode
(11:46):
because she's having to sell, sell.
She's having to sacrifice her dear
old friend. Like, and it
was just. And it wasn't even like he fully
turned. Like, like they didn't know.
But, but Lutheran is like, no, you gotta go.
Can't take the risk. And, and, and the way
(12:08):
they played out her whole
grief during that dance sequence I thought
was brilliant. So, so
then to have that theme get carried
over into Cassie and Bix and it just to
feel like very similar
conversations and also to an
extent, I'm not really
(12:30):
sure. I don't really feel like either one of them
had like strong arguments because I felt like they were
both flip flopping like, like Cassie's
like, like, oh yeah, we gotta be normal. Like the
city is here. And then Bix is like, like we
can't go to the walk. Like neither one of
them were, were
like understood anything
(12:52):
about how to make this right for
each other. so. Or make this
situation feel like the home
that they wanted it to be. Or. I don't, I
don't even know. But there was
a lot, there was too much. not unders.
I don't know. It just. It felt messy.
>> Will (13:12):
Yeah, that's a, that's a great way to describe it.
It's very, it's very messy. It really is.
And you know, I think to your point, like we're trying to make
it home and you're right. Whatever.
Cassian was like, it's Coruscant. I mean we can just make
ourselves, you know, it's a big, you know, it's a big planet. We
could just really, you know, escape
into and just be
(13:35):
having normal life. But then even, but even whenever he was trying,
they were trying to do that, you know, he couldn't even go to the grocery
shop and not feel like the, the, you know,
the shopkeeper.
>> Sarah (13:45):
Was like interrogated paranoia.
Like and rightfully so based off
of the events from the previous season. I mean, the kid
got sent to jail.
>> Will (13:55):
Yeah. Yeah. So. Yeah. So it's like the only
time he, you know, whenever it's. Even
though like you said, the point of he's
so protective, of Brit Bix and everything.
But but it wasn't until
he did get the mission to go to, to Gorham where he was
actually able to, to relax and, and
(14:16):
just do the job and it's Almost like
maybe that's. Maybe. Maybe that's the therapy for
him is to. To be able to. To fall
into. Into the work
and. And that.
That. That's just how he. How he. How he copes with
things.
>> Sarah (14:34):
Yeah, maybe. I don't know. I.
I, think I was more using the word messy
in terms of the.
What exactly the writers are trying to
do throughout these three episodes with these two
characters. I mean, yes, to an extent, the whole
attachment in the Time of War and all of that,
(14:54):
but I think the themes
just got messy and the perspectives got
messy and. And why I really feel
strongly about that is because
for some reason, like, I think the
best arc in these three episodes have to
do with Cyril.
>> Will (15:13):
Oh, yes. Oh, yes.
>> Sarah (15:14):
And because, like, take it for
the Empire to have like, a
very clean and clear,
like, trajectory in their arc
and. But also
simultaneously, the way they
wrote. They. The way they wrote Cyril,
I, like, Gorman was also
(15:36):
kind of like, wait, why is he.
Why is he acting like this? And like,
the. I just was
so impressed by. By the. The
chess moves between not only Cyril,
but Deirdre. I mean, by the end of
it, Major, I'm just gonna call him Major
(15:57):
P. Because no way in hell I'm gonna pronounce that correctly.
Oh, part of Gas Partagas.
Like, told her. Told her, like, Cyril can never
know about what's. What we're really doing.
And I was just like, oh, damn. Like, it's a,
triple. And yet we know from
previous episode that
(16:17):
she clearly cares about him.
Like, I don't know, there was just something
very much more subtle
while. While being very clear and
concise about everything they did with
the Major, Deirdre and Cyril through these
three episodes.
>> Will (16:35):
I, completely agree. Yeah. I mean, I think that that, to me, that
was the strongest arc of.
Of the series as well, because we, you know, we do get a
more confident.
The spycraft. And that's one of the things I was
also thought that was woven
really, really well in the. In these episodes,
(16:56):
the spycraft on both sides, whether it's, whether
it's the rebellion or the isb.
But Cyril bit to play that role
and, and also being able to, you know,
whenever we. Whenever we get him in this,
you know, this first episode, he's. He
knows he's being monitored, he knows he's being followed. And
(17:17):
the confidence when he's talking to his mother, like,
because he was all, you know, it was.
It was convincing. Oh, I. You know, it
was. And I guess, you know, and it was I could see
how. Especially, you know, one of the things
that, I thought, you know what that the Major
told, the one Imperial later in the episode, as far
(17:37):
as, you know, calibrate your enthusiasm.
It was like. It was like a. It was a M to me. It was
like a good reference to like several M people
that. That could apply to in this episode.
M serial, Cereal being one of them.
But, especially, Especially like whenever he had that
moment, whenever he was, you know, in
(17:58):
the. In the hall there and they, You know, they.
They, you know, the Major congratulates him
for getting him the information. And you know, he was
like, this is the. The proudest day of my life.
>> Sarah (18:10):
Well, no, he said, if I say this is the
proudest day of my life, will I have ruined
everything? And then they
cut. Cut scene. I. I
agree. But to go back to Edie,
like. And I think it was her.
Her, dialogue too, that just really sold
this. But we also know, like, it wasn't like
(18:32):
planned. This is just Edie. But I
love this one line she says to him during that
phone conversation. When we find out that
in the second episode that. That
Cyril is now, the head of the Bureau
of Standards on in Gorman.
And he. And she says,
(18:53):
Because in response to. In Response to
Cyril saying this place is hardly a threat to the
Empire, Edie says, don't become
too much of an individual, Cyril.
>> Will (19:04):
Yep.
>> Sarah (19:06):
I just like. It's one word
in that sentence, the use of individual.
I'm just like there. There's
subtlety, nuance, and that's impactful
because that's. That's exactly
like the whole point about this. I mean
the. The dictatorship of.
(19:26):
That the Empire represents
and that ideology.
It. It's so against freedom and
individuality. I was just like, that is so
good.
>> Will (19:39):
It was. That was just so many
levels and it was a. So, you know, so convincing
to. As far as like when the people. The
Gorman Front were listening in and.
And especially. I love that.
>> Sarah (19:52):
Yeah, yeah. Rylands is even
like his mother is horrible.
They're so funny. And. And
then to go into the
sequence of like.
Because. Yes, yes. they make it clear
that Cyril knows he's being watched.
(20:13):
But the way they play it all out
is much later that until you. You
get shown and it's proven. Proven that he is sending
this d. This information to
Deirdre. And. And
so before that you see him go to a meeting
of the Gorman Front and
(20:34):
the way they did the
lighting, the cinematography of that whole
sequence as well as the performances.
The fact that Gorman spoke in a different
language. Oh, it was. Was.
Holocaust gave me. Holocaust feels for sure
like it gave me. People
(20:54):
are feeling like they are having to go in
hiding. Like the propag. It just.
It worked on so many levels,
that whole sequence.
>> Will (21:07):
Yeah, it did. I mean. Yeah, the gor. Yeah, the
language, you know, you know, I thought, you know, the, I
did watch the Declassified.
they've had some after shows with Andor this
season and they were talking about the. You know, you brought up
the language and I just wanted to bring this up real quick.
They based it off of French. and.
(21:28):
And yeah, and you could probably hear a little bit
into a little bit if you go back and watch, you know, when we
see it in subsequent episodes. But but
also just the vibe and
you know, and also
we, you know, we learned in the first episode,
but the Ministry of Enlightenment was going to, you know, was
going to push this
(21:49):
rebellion, push, you know,
this front forward to like,
help drive the imperial narrative about this
place. And of course you brought up beautifully, like Edie's
comments as far as, like, you know, what she, you know, what she
was, you know, saw in the news. And they're tying those things back to, you
know, tying that together, showing. That's one other thing I really like
(22:11):
about this series too is, you know, they put something. They
do follow up on things that they. They put
out there. So it was. It was. So we saw the
payoff a year later of him being placed
there.
>> Sarah (22:23):
well, I think. I think him being placed
there had more to do with Deirdre because, like,
there were two different schemes during that
meeting. There was the Enlightenment, the
propaganda and the stuff. And. And you
can hear that not only from
Edie, but. And. And I think that's more important
like. Like that propaganda
(22:45):
is being fed to everyone outside of
Gorman. Right. And then on
Gorman you have this other
Deirdre plan, which she told Krennic, like,
you. You. What you actually want
is for the rebellion to
To win a little. And then
that way when they lose, everyone can be
(23:08):
on your side still, like thinking
like. And. And the way they played that and
executed that, out.
It was done so well because
you remember it, but
simultaneously, the way
they. They fleshed that out, it.
It was. It. It felt like they were playing their
(23:29):
cards at the. At just the right times to really
spell out what was actually happening.
>> Will (23:34):
Yeah, yeah. And also. Yeah. And also just.
And also using the.
That The. The enthusiasm
to. To really drive. To drive
Events and especially, you know, I think back
to,
like I said, the
(23:55):
conversations that Krennic and Dedra had earlier on
and, And. And also, whenever she
was, You know, whenever
Tartagas was like, look, Gorman's a gift.
You know, whenever she was still, you know, she was.
Yeah, yeah, part, you know,
it was like people were like, you know, this is like a, you know, is this. Is
(24:16):
this a demotion? And even like, Edie was like, you
know. You know, you know,
to their point about their conversation too. You know, Cyril's like, very proud
of this thing and she's just like, you know, this is
like. It's, not. It's not a backwater on the Outer
Rim, but, you know, she's still trying to poo poo
the fact that he was on that planet, for. For her own
ends, but because, she just always tried to keep him. Try
(24:39):
to keep him in his place. To your point about the, you know, the individual
comment. But, yeah, I mean, it's just so. It was a
such, you know, again, as
I raised before, as far as, you know, calibrate
enthusiasm. I mean, Cyril was like, so super, super
enthusiastic about, you know, playing this
role, you know, being, you know, and he's also,
(24:59):
because of what Deadre told his mom, like, you know, back
off. But now, you know,
Cyril has now replaced
Edie with Dedra as far as just always trying to seek
that approval.
and, and. And so, you know, he, you know, so
whenever he's like, reporting back to her what's going on on the planet,
(25:19):
it's. It's really, you know, he's. He's trying to get her approval.
And then also the other thing too is just,
you know, carrying things forward. Like whenever
he, Whenever he set up the. The
communications bug in his, you know, he. He let the
ISB find the bug, you know, in
his office and, and just to help carry.
Carry the mission
(25:42):
forward. So again, I think all those other elements of spycraft are
just really, I think, you know, from the. From the Empire's
perspective or. And. And propaganda was right.
I just really, really liked how they just made
it this very.
Yeah. So was there not. No. Clearly wasn't
as much action, except until we get to the third episode.
(26:04):
But all these other. All these other levels
were just, to me, were just what really got me
engaged and. And kept me like, really on the edge of my
seat as I was watching. Watching Cyril's, journey in
the. In this. In this arc.
>> Sarah (26:17):
I don't think he was Overly
enthusiastic, I think he was. So
he. It was. It's interesting
because, like,
he. He would have these moments.
And Deirdre, which. Which I don't. I
don't know if it's him seeking her approval
so much as Deirdre has this
(26:39):
ability to. To
once she. I. There's. There's
a line that she said that I can't find right now,
but she's like, never seen him as
happy. And I forget in what context she said
that, but. But he.
Like, she's able to reel him back
in and. And it's the exact
(27:01):
same thing that they parallel with what's going
on with Ryland's leading this
Gorman front where they sent
Lutheran, sends Cassian in.
Cassian should have been Deirdre.
And he, He tried. He was. He was
pointing things out. He was. But he
was being a bit of an,
(27:23):
He. He was also just like, you guys.
You guys don't got your. Together. I can't help you. I got.
I got other problems at home. And that's really why
Lutheran was upset, is because, like, no,
Cassie. And you actually can help them. You're just choosing not
to, so. And
unfortunately, that's what
leads them to playing right into Deirdre's
(27:45):
hands. Like, there's no one
on their side who is coming
in like a Deirdre and saying,
you guys are missing the end, game here.
Like, you're thinking short term.
You're. You're. You're. You're. You're
letting your anxiety
(28:05):
about the timing wear too much on you
to where you are going to trip up. And that's exactly
how this all plays out. And man, if I
hear any complaints about not enough action.
Do you know how many episodes of TV I watch where I
complain that there's 20 minutes of
action and maybe. Maybe 10 minutes of
(28:26):
dialogue? Like, good Lord, action
is only worth it. Like, you can't
have the spectacle without the substance. Like, you have
to earn the spectacle with substance.
So, yeah, I just, like,
good Lord, go watch Rogue One.
>> Will (28:43):
Yeah.
>> Sarah (28:44):
There's an entire third act of action.
Okay.
>> Will (28:47):
Yeah, yeah. But. Yeah, but to your point, let's, you
know, since we're on the Gorman story and you know, we do
get, you know, you talk
about Cassian and his role on the planet. You know, we do
do get a little bit more history, you know,
with, when Cassie is talking to the, To the
bellhop, about, the Tarkin
Massacre, which, was a very,
(29:10):
they pulled. They pulled in the Legends because you know,
because That was a story that
when people. The first Gorman massacre was actually
the Tarkin Massacre, in the Legends series,
the Star wars. but they you know,
retconned it twice. Once in Star Wars Rebels. I meant to say
at the beginning of this, I'm going to be. There may be some moments
(29:30):
where I will get into spoiler talk with things
that happens in Star Wars Rebels that is
running concurrent, in the timeline with with. With
Andor. So just that meant to give that warning at the
top. But you know,
to your point about the
events and Cassie being a jerk and talking to
(29:50):
the Gorman folks, we
do get that historical note
about the Tarin event. And
then, And. And to
your point about how
the Rebels on this planet are playing into the
hands and because they didn't have
their Deidra and Dedra and you know, Cassian
(30:12):
was. Wasn't mentally there to do it. So by the time that
Senta and Val come to the planet to
like do the job,
the, The. It was too late.
because you know, they make it very, very clear to,
To. To the front.
Yes. You know, we'll, We'll. We'll take off. We'll take on
this this, this convoy. We're going to get these,
(30:34):
These items. But you know, they made it very clear here
are the rules. But because of
their undisciplined nature, they
fall right into the Empire's hands. As far as, you know, it
was just in. You know, again, going back to Cyril's story. I
mean seeing Cyril like observe this whole thing
just play out and he just the, The.
The. The. The glee on his face like it's
(30:57):
happening and this. The. The plan
that was hatched is coming to
fruition I thought was really, really.
You know, again, I just. Really enjoyed just
seeing that. And again it just really reinforces some of the.
The overall themes that this, that. That That's. This
arc was really trying to present, with.
With both sides.
(31:20):
You know. Yeah, having a different name,
you know, having the similar. Similar goals. But you
know, but the, the outcomes,
you know, don't go. The outcome goes one
way for one side and the other side not so much.
>> Sarah (31:36):
Yeah. I mean, and. And why.
Why they they both
They both win. But the win is
tarnished because someone did not listen
to Vel clearly state,
don't. Or Dylan did not listen to Vel clearly
state, Nobody else but Vel and Cintra
(31:56):
Cinta can have, blasters, and
he has a blaster on him. He gets into a
fight with one of the townsmen who we happened
to see in a previous episode during
the. The underground meeting.
and. And he pulls out the blaster
and accidentally they.
They get in tussle, fire off a shot. It
(32:18):
hits Citra, who. Who kind of
knew like Citra or Vel were gonna die just
because it felt like there was a pause
after she said no one but us can have joy.
These blasters. And they
both shared like a meaningful moment
in. In the leading up to this, like
where they were reunited, they were getting their
(32:41):
happily ever after. But we all know how
Rogue One ends. Do we think that
there's going to be much difference here? Like, come
on. So, so it just. It.
And it plays into the. Some. The things
that we were already talking about with.
With Bix and. And Cassian and. And maybe
that's also what took away from the Bix and
(33:03):
Cassian arguments was like.
But here we clearly see it play out, which
sometimes I don't want them to tell
me what's happening. Like, the visual
representation of, can
be a lot more nuanced and everything.
I also just hats off to the actress who plays
Belle because she really did a good
(33:26):
job in her. In her scene with
Dylan of.
Of holding in grief,
being mad, but also
not overdoing it.
Yeah, it was. She. It was
just the right mixture of everything.
Like. And. And She allowed her
(33:48):
words to mean more cutting than
anything. So.
So like, I. I thought that that was a really good,
scene and performance there as well.
>> Will (33:59):
yeah, I agree. I mean, I think, And I think
to my point about earlier character
driven and character growth, I think the vow of a
year or so ago or even season one probably would
have taken out a blaster and like just taking that guy out.
But. But at the you.
But to your point, I mean just her
(34:21):
maturity. I think as far as. Just as we
see the rebellion grow and people
understanding, you know, now she gets it as far
as like what Lutheran and even Sento were trying to tell her about the
overall. Overall, you
know, aim of what we're trying to do
here, she. She gets it now. And so even though
she is feeling that. That just the. The searing pain of
(34:43):
losing someone, especially after they have, you know,
finally. Finally did get back together and look
like they were going to get their. Their happy moment,
that's. That's been ended. and another thing too, I know.
Just want to just touch on this real briefly. I think,
you know, of course, there has been some discourse
in the fandom as far as, like, okay, are we doing the barrier
(35:03):
G gay trope? because
this, we do have this cup gay
couple who seems like they can't even have,
have any happiness and stuff. But I, I see, I,
I see, see that concern. I respect that concern.
But I think in the overall story that they were
telling here, whether it was, whether it was, everybody's going
to get it at some point. I mean, there's no, like,
(35:27):
to come to, you know, come to a, an end.
So did it feel forced?
or unearned maybe? I mean, you know, I
felt, to me, I felt in the whole context of the
story, it was a lot like Brasso's death, that in
that, you know, there's not, sometimes there's not going to
be. You go out in heroic blaze of glory.
(35:48):
Sometimes it is going to be just an empty,
hollow, you know, meaningless
death. Because this is a messy business.
so, so, so I get that
concern.
>> Sarah (35:59):
But yeah, I, I, I just
want to say I'm not part of that community. If you're offended
by what they did with that, then,
then that's your right. If you, you're not, like, I
didn't think of anything of it because, yeah,
maybe that has to do with. Because I'm heterosexual,
but I, I just, I
get like, like what you're saying. I get it. But
(36:21):
to me, I, I
don't, I don't know.
>> Will (36:26):
Like, yeah, to me, it's like the similar arguments that
happened. I mean, I think the last two, you know, with
these two arcs have been like, big flash points as far as
the social commentary. People have, like, latched on to one.
Last week was the attempted rape. This week
it's just to bury your Gates trope.
>> Sarah (36:42):
But I think what was the
political, like, what was the bad thing
about, like, I'm not saying that I don't know how
to have this conversation, but what, what was the
discussion last week about the potential.
>> Will (36:55):
Oh, oh, just should it be a Star wars or
not?
>> Sarah (37:00):
Okay, like, like, yeah,
wow.
>> Will (37:03):
Wow.
>> Sarah (37:04):
And, and, and, Will is telling this to
me. Who, who is so critical of
Star Wars? Like, oh,
my God, I thought I was mean and
bad, but wow.
Like, like, okay, should
that be in Star Wars? They didn't actually do it. And also,
(37:24):
if you had a problem with that, you best be having a problem with what
gross did her in the first season. Because that was
mental rape. Do. Jesus Christ. And also,
isn't this supposed to be, like, everyone is Always like,
oh my God, andor's best show ever because it's
grounded Star wars because it feels more
real and then. But you can't put rape in it.
(37:44):
And dear Lord, if you have two
lesbian characters who
are in a war who are clearly fighting for
the rebellion and one of them dies during
battle, like obviously just using that
as a stereotype and a trope. Fairing the gays
like, like, yeah, yeah,
>> Will (38:04):
Yeah.
>> Sarah (38:04):
I don't know. But like I said, I also feel
uncomfortable talking about the, especially the barrier
gays because I'm not part of that community. So.
>> Will (38:12):
Yeah, yeah, I'm not a part of that community either. I just, I
just, I just wanted to, I just, I like to
have a full on discussion
about all the things both story
lines and also if there's any, any
notable items that are that, that are being
discussed on the, in the interwebs or in
the discourse, I just wanted to acknowledge it.
(38:34):
So, but you know, we can move on from it. But I just, like I
said, I, I don't, I'm not a member of that community.
I see where people were concerned about that. But I mean I could, as an
African American, I could be like, oh yeah, they killed the blacks.
So yeah, the black girl
gets killed early. I mean it's just like, I guess, I
guess it's just, you know, a lot of times it's.
(38:54):
If you want. Again, I think in the
context of the story that's being told, these things happen
and people are going to die. And it has
nothing to do with anything larger than that. Than just the fact
that this is a very messy, messy business
and people die.
>> Sarah (39:11):
Yeah, yeah.
>> Will (39:12):
But anyway.
>> Sarah (39:13):
Okay, well, we got, we gotta speed up because you told me this is
gonna be 20 minutes. We're on 40 minutes and we got like three more
things to talk about. So. So like
moving on from that point, my least favorite
story arc of this entire
show. I don't like Saw.
I don't like Saw. I don't.
He just slowed everything so down for
(39:35):
me. And then I was like, Horace Whitaker, I love you,
but no, no, no, no. Because he also.
I haven't liked. I haven't like Saw in Rogue
One. I don't remember liking
him. And in season one,
like, I just cannot connect his
character. And so every, like
last week we were talking about Krennic and
(39:58):
we were talking about Ben Mendelson and his
performance. And like I love Forest
Whitaker, but there's something about the way he plays
Saad that I'M just like, you're too
much. You can't get into it.
And it's just. You're annoying. Yeah,
I do. I kind of get what you're trying to do,
but it just drives me crazy. It's like nails on a
(40:21):
chalkboard. And I'm like, we don't need this.
>> Will (40:25):
Yeah, Saul's crazy. I mean,
it basically like reinforces the. The
point again that the. The wild cards of the
Rebellion, you know, the,
If no solid backstory, of course, you know, his
sister, was killed in Clone Wars.
he. From that point forward, he just loses it. And, and
(40:47):
again, think watching Star Wars Rebels, they. They
also explore this, This, this wild
cardness and this, this, this, How, He's just.
He's one that is just
what. What you see in these episodes is
the same in the animated universe and shows as well.
So, you know, he's a very consistent character as far
(41:08):
as driving. You know, of course that the
gas was.
We see why he looks like he does when we finally do meet him
at. We. We do first, you know, meet him. We meet him in Rogue One.
But, you know, the whole story with Wilman,
I was just one. We were. I was wondering
like what. What. What ended up happening to.
To him. and we see that he's, you know, clearly
(41:30):
he's still putting his mechanical skills to use,
for. For Saul's team
and Been the only. I mean only. And we can move on from salt Only.
Other cool thing I thought was that, That whenever I was like. That
base looks awful familiar. And you know, we definitely. It
was used during this time period and
of course later in the sequel, trilogy.
It was also the same base, that we saw in the. For the Force
(41:52):
Awakens. But Yeah, but you know,
Saul is Solas Saul. And we'll just.
We'll probably get more of him as we, As we move
forward.
>> Sarah (42:07):
so then the la. That leaves us with,
Mon Mothma
and. And that is all I got.
>> Will (42:18):
Yeah. M. I. I like Mon's story
in this one, especially with
the, you know, we see her whipping votes
for, you know, trying to,
You know, she's like, for example, talking to the Gorman
senator as far as, you know, and others
with the, Trying to get the
poured, the The Public
(42:40):
ordinance, Resistance Directive
repealed. you know, because again, there was the
whole. Did a whole discussion as far as, What did she
say as far as, Are we. Are we finding criminals? Are we making
Them.
>> Sarah (42:52):
Yeah. So at the end with Krennic
because they're going through an ideology
exchange that's kind of mirrored to everything
that's going on with Gorman, and,
and the Luthien,
Gyla stealing back the listening
device.
>> Will (43:11):
Yeah, yeah, she uses her. Yeah used her approach to try to get that back
because they of course they were, you know, Scudder
was I guess worried about the
artifacts and stuff. So. Yeah, so they. Yeah, so they had to get the
artifact out. So there was a lot of things going on there.
the other cool thing too is just, you know, if I
notice other points that was made of. With
(43:32):
the. We do get the. The recast
of Benjamin Brett as Bill
Organa taken over for. For Jimmy Smith due to
scheduling reasons and you know, sense why they.
They just had the little quick scene with
Mon and, and. And Scene N
Organa. Just so that Just given
clearly the key role that the Scene N plays
(43:55):
and that Belarna plays in the Star wars
mythos, better just to get it now, rip
the band aid off, have the store, you know. Yep. We
recast them and listen, when we see him
in the next two arcs, we don't have to go
spend time on
oh, where's Jimmy Smith?
So. But that was that, you know, so, so, you know, so I
(44:17):
think there was that. I really did enjoy like the,
the back and forth argument between you know,
Krennic and, And Mon and just the philosophical
debates. And again just again we see
that her pushing, pushing, pushing,
pushing more towards just being
out, in the, in the Rebellion. And then
also, and then also just you know, again the political
(44:40):
machinations of the Senate just basically
is just there in. In name only
at this point the Emperor just continues to like,
make it more just a, A Just a rubber
stamping body to the point that of course by the time we
get to A New Hope, you know, Tarkin, you know, shares with everyone
on the Death Star that the. The Senate's been dissolved. So you
(45:01):
know, so we do. We see. We do see that
evolution of that, as. As the story goes and you
know all the senators just are there to have. Have
grand parties and get sworn in, but that's about it.
>> Sarah (45:12):
Yeah, I mean the, The Chronic and Mon Mothma
stuff was great mainly because it's just dialogue and
those two are just such great actors
and in these, in these roles
that I mean there's so many quotable lines,
especially from Krennic. I mean criminals love to lie.
After all, who wants to Die for lawless
ineptitude. And then Krennic also says,
(45:34):
mainly it's critic. And. And I think
that's kind of why, like, I liked
Mon Mothma, but I didn't. I didn't think she
had a whole lot going on. She was just really
showing how. How the
propaganda. I mean, this entire three
episodes is really kind of showing how
(45:54):
this is how the Empire remains in
control, remains power,
because, like, they're planting
these other seeds and they're these other
plans that are coming through. So. So it.
It very much felt like Mon Mothma, coming
right after the wedding was like, not coming home to
anything great either.
(46:17):
You sacrifice your dear old friend. Friend,
only to come home and realize, like, you don't
got control in the Senate anymore. People are leaving
your allies, like, they're being convinced their
loyalties with the Empire, and.
And then you get into a sparring match with Krennic, and.
I'm sorry, Krennic, actually, I think he might have
(46:38):
won that too, because. Because he. He
says, I, like this line as well. My rebel is your
terror terrorist or. Or something like that. And
that, like. Like,
it's so good. It is
just clear, concise, and, yeah,
on the nose. But I think
(46:59):
that you. You have. You have
the subtletiness with the moves and the
spy and the,
And the covert operations with Deirdre and
Cyril that you can have Krennic
actually point things out. So.
Cartoon villain on the nose, but
it's coming from Ben Mendelsohn, so it's like, okay,
(47:22):
this is a dramatic acting,
and. And so. And, like, it's just
so good. And. And we got all of the messy, weird
dialogue with the, About. About the
PTSD of being soldiers with Big
Vixen and, Cassian. So,
I mean, my. My final thing that I just want to
(47:42):
say about these three episodes, and arguably the first
three episodes, is I just don't know
why Cassian remains to
be in. Like. Like,
continues to be like the character I'm drawn
to the least.
I just. And I love him in
Rogue One, but I'm just like. And.
(48:04):
And I. I. Yes, to an extent,
this plays into. I. I have a tendency never to
really like the main characters.
It's like that. That, That Seinfeld effect
where everyone else around them is so
crazy and interesting, and they get it. Like,
he has to be the straight man. And
(48:25):
so you're just like, okay, you're a bit
boring. So. So that's the.
That's the one thing. I just Want to
leave on. Will you got any final thoughts and
then we can wrap it up for tonight?
>> Will (48:38):
Yeah, we could. Yeah, we could wrap it up. Yeah. I mean I, I
think just to piggyback off of your thought,
I think that's by. I think that's by design. I mean
they've just built such a, just a rich world,
you know, with these, these characters. I mean we've, you know, we know
where Cassian's journey ends.
So I think for me it's, it's like the
destination to, to get to
(49:01):
that to. To the end of the journey.
It's just paid was just such rich characters
like as you mentioned, Krennic and Dedra and all these other people
that we've been. And Cyril that yeah,
there are. You know, I'm enjoying learning about
all these, all these people and, and so that
by the time we get to the Cassiana Rogue one, yeah, you
(49:21):
know, we get some good moments with him. But
these other supporting characters just really
contextual. It helps contextualize
why we, you know, why we have a character that we, that we
see there you know,
in that movie. So I'm, I'm really enjoying this
series and looking glad we. Glad we had we
(49:41):
you know, set aside time just to, to talk
about these these three episode arc. This three episode
arc because it was really. It does feel like a, you know, mini movie
in and of itself.
>> Sarah (49:53):
and people who,
people who have listened to us Talk Andor
Season 1, please let me know if Will told me that
when we were discussing season one because it
felt very deja vu.
M Will, why don't you tell our listeners where they can find
you?
>> Will (50:11):
Yes, you can find me on all the socials at ah, Will and
Polk. W, I L L M P O.
>> Sarah (50:17):
L K. And you can find me there too at SJ Belmont,
sjblmo and T. Please follow our crew on
X, formerly known as Twitter at Scene and Nerd on Blue
sky and friend us on Facebook, follow us on
Instagram and threads at Scene, underscore n, underscore
nerd and visit our website
www.scenanerdpodcast.com. but most
importantly, rate following, comment on Apple podcast sponsors,
(50:38):
Spotify, YouTube or wherever you get your podcast. Good night. Geek out. You're
welcome.
Foreign.
>> Sarah (00:12):
Nerds. This is Scene N nerd. I'm your host, Sarah Belmont, and with
me, as always, is our Mr. Producer, Will Polk How are you doing
tonight, Will?
>> Will (00:19):
Doing very well, Sarah. Happy Star Wars Day to
Revenge of the fifth.
>> Sarah (00:27):
So what's tomorrow?
>> Will (00:30):
Revenge, of the sixth. So some people like, you know, of course we
had Star Wars Day yesterday. May the fourth be with. With you.
Belatedly, of course, Revenge of the fifth. But some people
also, also celebrate revenge of the
6th. So I guess the Sith, you
know, depending on like, you know how
you. You want to celebrate your Sith Lord, you can do it
today or you can do it tomorrow.
>> Sarah (00:52):
Weird, weird, weird.
>> Will (00:54):
Yeah, yeah. There's no hard and fast rules.
I think anyone, anybody who can make an Internet holiday, they will do
so.
>> Sarah (01:00):
Yeah. Well, regardless of the
holidays, based on the days of the
week, it is Monday and we are recording a very
special episode because we had three
big properties to talk about this week. So we
decided to start the week off with
Andor. And tomorrow night we will be discussing the
Last of Us as well as, Thunderbolts.
(01:24):
And So we have three
episodes, all of which I consumed
on May 4th. So I was
celebrating in a way.
>> Will (01:35):
Yeah, you were.
>> Sarah (01:37):
I, I was. so Will, what. What
do you. What are your thoughts about these three
episodes?
>> Will (01:44):
Yeah. Yeah. So I really,
really enjoyed these three
episodes. I think the series, you. Each
arc has a way of
basically telling. Telling different types of
stories, whether it's a very you
mix of adventure or if it's
But this one really thought that it
(02:06):
really. The three f. The themes that really just stuck
out to me with this, with this arc was really
the rebellion and
resistance, the themes of trust
and the themes of sacrifice and
loss. And I think each one of the.
This whole arc really
explored that it slowed down. I thought we really
(02:28):
got more into the. The more.
A bit more character driven arc. And
with. With this one especially, like I was thinking about our
conversations we had last week with about like the editing,
for example, at the end of the third
episode in the first arc and how they were jumping back and
forth between my motha's wedding party with
(02:48):
her for her daughter and the. The things
that were going on on the Harvest,
world. But here I thought
it was much more. A slower pace,
more getting into the lives of the. Of our
characters and we'll, you know, we'll get into
some of those points as far as like, you know, for example,
Cassian and big shopping and, and things
(03:11):
like that, so, so I really felt it was
a more character driven arc. Not that the other ones haven't been, but
I think, we. Some of the things that have
happened up to this point in the series,
we really got to spend some, some
real time with them and some of the impacts of, of things that happen
to some of our characters.
>> Sarah (03:32):
Yeah. So I think Cassie and
Vix is a good place to start. I mean
we, we literally start with them. They're
held up. It's a year later after the events of the
first three episodes and they're are in
Coruscant in a safe hot house that was set up
by Lutheran. Bix is still dealing
with, PTSD from her
(03:55):
experience with Dr. Gross. And
Cassian is, continues
to be trying to protect her and trying to
understand with what's going on and, and
fix it. but you can
tell that them being on
missions has also worn down where, where
(04:15):
there was an incident off screen,
involving a soldier who
Cassian kills because he
sees Bix's face. So we deal with
that in the second episode. Lutheran
visits Bix, because Bix is
also taking some quote unquote
medicine.
>> Will (04:36):
Yep.
>> Sarah (04:37):
He's doing some drugs. and then by the
end of, by the third episode,
Vix and Cass or Bix gets her revenge
on Dr. Gross.
yeah,
I'm like back and forth about,
about Vix and Cassian. I will be honest.
(04:58):
The whole time I'm watching this,
like. And, and if anybody remembers last
week, the big stuff I found to be the most
interesting, I think why
I, it didn't work for me as much in these
three episodes is because it wasn't
Bix alone dealing with,
(05:18):
was Bix and Cassian and,
and someone, brought up to
me that Rogue One recently.
>> Will (05:28):
I wonder who. I wonder who.
>> Sarah (05:30):
Yeah, I wonder who. So the whole time I'm watching these three
episodes I'm just like, well,
I don't know how much I can invest in Bix
because I don't know if she's gonna
die. But I do know that these two are not gonna be together. Or
else, like in his final moments, he, he cheated
on her. And I don't know how to feel about that. So, so
(05:50):
like, what are we doing here?
And, and it was weird. I don't, I don't know if
anybody else felt this way. I'm sure I'm in the
minority most of the time. I am with Star
wars, but a lot of the time the
scenes between them
there was like this, oh my God, I'm so in love with
you. And then immediately it flipped to we're
(06:13):
arguing. Like it was just,
it was whiplash. And it was
so. And it took. And all of
the things took place within like the span of five minutes.
And I'm just like. You were just like making out,
getting ready to knock some boots, and,
and now all of a sudden you're, you're arguing, about
(06:34):
the same thing. And I get it, but
I also, I also am like,
okay, okay, this is kind of a repetitive
argument. Hopefully we don't get that argument in the
future. I, I think we will.
But, So, so that, that was
kind of my stuff where it, it piqued my
interest. But as the episodes went on
(06:56):
and the, the more scenes between them, I just
became too much of a, Like, so are we, are
we rooting for you too? Are we not? Like, like
what is going on?
>> Will (07:07):
Yeah, I mean, I, I see what you're saying about the
dynamics in their relationship, because you're right. I mean
they're, it's. It's
one of those things where I guess Cassian
was very concerned, you know, clearly concerned about her
because of all the things that have happened. And you're right. I
mean, every, each one of the episodes
(07:27):
there was a flashpoint of
whenever Cassian and, and Bix were together.
the first episode there's
so, you know, they were having discussions about the safe house and whether or
not they should decorate it and you know, make it more of their
own. And you know, and then when they went out to the
market to, to do. To try to have a normal
(07:50):
life. I guess this is. To me, I get it
was both of them.
The, the, the, the, the rebellion and the
acts that they are, are doing are impacting them in different
ways. And, and
for, for Bix. Yes, you're right.
You know, we do see at the end she does self
(08:10):
medicate because of the trauma
that she is feeling, the guilt that she
is feeling like, you know,
you know, losing her in some respects, I think she's like losing
herself because, you know, whenever
she does question Cassian about
why did you kill him? And, and was it necessary? You
(08:30):
know, is. She's really wrestling with the. I guess
internally she's wrestling like what separates
me from this guy that we just killed.
So. And I think, you know, and Cassian,
on the other hand, is very clearly
protective. Very.
When, When Lutheran wants him to do the mission to go to
(08:51):
Gorham, he, he. He's very
concerned about, you know, what's going to happen with Bix, because,
and, and, and, and, and then whenever, you know,
Lutheran shows up and has that conversation with,
With Bix and, And then Cassian finds
out the third episode, you know, he just gets all possessive and
weird and like, lose it. Loses.
(09:11):
Lose this control to the point where he just, like, goes to
the. Goes to Lutheran shop. And Lutheran's like,
dude, get it. You know, get a, Get a hold of yourself. Get it.
Get a grip on things. Because
you're, you're jeopardizing, you're,
you're running a risk of jeopardizing our whole operation
because, because you're letting your attachments, like,
run rampant here. So it's, you know, so,
(09:34):
so it's, you know, it's a lot of themes that we, We've seen before in Star
wars about attachment and, and
mission and not letting attachments
getting. Drive your. Drive your motivations
or drive your. Drive your passions. Because,
you know, we obviously see
when it's not, like, checked well, it's because.
>> Sarah (09:55):
It'S a time of war. I mean, I, I do
think I like the first episode out of these
three the best because it's the most quotable episode
for me. And one of the quotes that I did
notate was by Bixby, and
it's the first of many versions of this
argument. And she says, but if it's war, it's
not up to us what we save and what we lose.
(10:19):
I don't, I don't think she,
she's debating, well, what separates me
from that soldier. It's more about the value of life.
Like, yeah, he saw my face.
But, and, and automatically you decided
that his life. His life was,
like, worth less than. Or, worth.
(10:39):
Yeah, less than mine. And she, she didn't know
how to reconcile that. And, And I
also think that,
like, like, you're right to an
extent that, like, she's being forced into
this soldier mentality that she was not
prepared for and doesn't know how to deal with that. Plus
the. Just the PTSD from everything with
(11:02):
gross. I mean, that, that got layered
on and
Cassian, like,
there's an echo. And maybe that's also why I like
the first episode. The first. And, and that's where
I was all right with these two,
which slowly faded. It's because I,
I think that, that it's true. Like,
(11:23):
we've seen these themes before. They've been played out.
I think they got very, like, we've
seen this before. Why are we still having the same
argument. And it's an echo of what
was captured, I think much more
interestingly and much more
like in a unique way with Mon
Mothma in the previous episode
(11:46):
because she's having to sell, sell.
She's having to sacrifice her dear
old friend. Like, and it
was just. And it wasn't even like he fully
turned. Like, like they didn't know.
But, but Lutheran is like, no, you gotta go.
Can't take the risk. And, and, and the way
(12:08):
they played out her whole
grief during that dance sequence I thought
was brilliant. So, so
then to have that theme get carried
over into Cassie and Bix and it just to
feel like very similar
conversations and also to an
extent, I'm not really
(12:30):
sure. I don't really feel like either one of them
had like strong arguments because I felt like they were
both flip flopping like, like Cassie's
like, like, oh yeah, we gotta be normal. Like the
city is here. And then Bix is like, like we
can't go to the walk. Like neither one of
them were, were
like understood anything
(12:52):
about how to make this right for
each other. so. Or make this
situation feel like the home
that they wanted it to be. Or. I don't, I
don't even know. But there was
a lot, there was too much. not unders.
I don't know. It just. It felt messy.
>> Will (13:12):
Yeah, that's a, that's a great way to describe it.
It's very, it's very messy. It really is.
And you know, I think to your point, like we're trying to make
it home and you're right. Whatever.
Cassian was like, it's Coruscant. I mean we can just make
ourselves, you know, it's a big, you know, it's a big planet. We
could just really, you know, escape
into and just be
(13:35):
having normal life. But then even, but even whenever he was trying,
they were trying to do that, you know, he couldn't even go to the grocery
shop and not feel like the, the, you know,
the shopkeeper.
>> Sarah (13:45):
Was like interrogated paranoia.
Like and rightfully so based off
of the events from the previous season. I mean, the kid
got sent to jail.
>> Will (13:55):
Yeah. Yeah. So. Yeah. So it's like the only
time he, you know, whenever it's. Even
though like you said, the point of he's
so protective, of Brit Bix and everything.
But but it wasn't until
he did get the mission to go to, to Gorham where he was
actually able to, to relax and, and
(14:16):
just do the job and it's Almost like
maybe that's. Maybe. Maybe that's the therapy for
him is to. To be able to. To fall
into. Into the work
and. And that.
That. That's just how he. How he. How he copes with
things.
>> Sarah (14:34):
Yeah, maybe. I don't know. I.
I, think I was more using the word messy
in terms of the.
What exactly the writers are trying to
do throughout these three episodes with these two
characters. I mean, yes, to an extent, the whole
attachment in the Time of War and all of that,
(14:54):
but I think the themes
just got messy and the perspectives got
messy and. And why I really feel
strongly about that is because
for some reason, like, I think the
best arc in these three episodes have to
do with Cyril.
>> Will (15:13):
Oh, yes. Oh, yes.
>> Sarah (15:14):
And because, like, take it for
the Empire to have like, a
very clean and clear,
like, trajectory in their arc
and. But also
simultaneously, the way they
wrote. They. The way they wrote Cyril,
I, like, Gorman was also
(15:36):
kind of like, wait, why is he.
Why is he acting like this? And like,
the. I just was
so impressed by. By the. The
chess moves between not only Cyril,
but Deirdre. I mean, by the end of
it, Major, I'm just gonna call him Major
(15:57):
P. Because no way in hell I'm gonna pronounce that correctly.
Oh, part of Gas Partagas.
Like, told her. Told her, like, Cyril can never
know about what's. What we're really doing.
And I was just like, oh, damn. Like, it's a,
triple. And yet we know from
previous episode that
(16:17):
she clearly cares about him.
Like, I don't know, there was just something
very much more subtle
while. While being very clear and
concise about everything they did with
the Major, Deirdre and Cyril through these
three episodes.
>> Will (16:35):
I, completely agree. Yeah. I mean, I think that that, to me, that
was the strongest arc of.
Of the series as well, because we, you know, we do get a
more confident.
The spycraft. And that's one of the things I was
also thought that was woven
really, really well in the. In these episodes,
(16:56):
the spycraft on both sides, whether it's, whether
it's the rebellion or the isb.
But Cyril bit to play that role
and, and also being able to, you know,
whenever we. Whenever we get him in this,
you know, this first episode, he's. He
knows he's being monitored, he knows he's being followed. And
(17:17):
the confidence when he's talking to his mother, like,
because he was all, you know, it was.
It was convincing. Oh, I. You know, it
was. And I guess, you know, and it was I could see
how. Especially, you know, one of the things
that, I thought, you know what that the Major
told, the one Imperial later in the episode, as far
(17:37):
as, you know, calibrate your enthusiasm.
It was like. It was like a. It was a M to me. It was
like a good reference to like several M people
that. That could apply to in this episode.
M serial, Cereal being one of them.
But, especially, Especially like whenever he had that
moment, whenever he was, you know, in
(17:58):
the. In the hall there and they, You know, they.
They, you know, the Major congratulates him
for getting him the information. And you know, he was
like, this is the. The proudest day of my life.
>> Sarah (18:10):
Well, no, he said, if I say this is the
proudest day of my life, will I have ruined
everything? And then they
cut. Cut scene. I. I
agree. But to go back to Edie,
like. And I think it was her.
Her, dialogue too, that just really sold
this. But we also know, like, it wasn't like
(18:32):
planned. This is just Edie. But I
love this one line she says to him during that
phone conversation. When we find out that
in the second episode that. That
Cyril is now, the head of the Bureau
of Standards on in Gorman.
And he. And she says,
(18:53):
Because in response to. In Response to
Cyril saying this place is hardly a threat to the
Empire, Edie says, don't become
too much of an individual, Cyril.
>> Will (19:04):
Yep.
>> Sarah (19:06):
I just like. It's one word
in that sentence, the use of individual.
I'm just like there. There's
subtlety, nuance, and that's impactful
because that's. That's exactly
like the whole point about this. I mean
the. The dictatorship of.
(19:26):
That the Empire represents
and that ideology.
It. It's so against freedom and
individuality. I was just like, that is so
good.
>> Will (19:39):
It was. That was just so many
levels and it was a. So, you know, so convincing
to. As far as like when the people. The
Gorman Front were listening in and.
And especially. I love that.
>> Sarah (19:52):
Yeah, yeah. Rylands is even
like his mother is horrible.
They're so funny. And. And
then to go into the
sequence of like.
Because. Yes, yes. they make it clear
that Cyril knows he's being watched.
(20:13):
But the way they play it all out
is much later that until you. You
get shown and it's proven. Proven that he is sending
this d. This information to
Deirdre. And. And
so before that you see him go to a meeting
of the Gorman Front and
(20:34):
the way they did the
lighting, the cinematography of that whole
sequence as well as the performances.
The fact that Gorman spoke in a different
language. Oh, it was. Was.
Holocaust gave me. Holocaust feels for sure
like it gave me. People
(20:54):
are feeling like they are having to go in
hiding. Like the propag. It just.
It worked on so many levels,
that whole sequence.
>> Will (21:07):
Yeah, it did. I mean. Yeah, the gor. Yeah, the
language, you know, you know, I thought, you know, the, I
did watch the Declassified.
they've had some after shows with Andor this
season and they were talking about the. You know, you brought up
the language and I just wanted to bring this up real quick.
They based it off of French. and.
(21:28):
And yeah, and you could probably hear a little bit
into a little bit if you go back and watch, you know, when we
see it in subsequent episodes. But but
also just the vibe and
you know, and also
we, you know, we learned in the first episode,
but the Ministry of Enlightenment was going to, you know, was
going to push this
(21:49):
rebellion, push, you know,
this front forward to like,
help drive the imperial narrative about this
place. And of course you brought up beautifully, like Edie's
comments as far as, like, you know, what she, you know, what she
was, you know, saw in the news. And they're tying those things back to, you
know, tying that together, showing. That's one other thing I really like
(22:11):
about this series too is, you know, they put something. They
do follow up on things that they. They put
out there. So it was. It was. So we saw the
payoff a year later of him being placed
there.
>> Sarah (22:23):
well, I think. I think him being placed
there had more to do with Deirdre because, like,
there were two different schemes during that
meeting. There was the Enlightenment, the
propaganda and the stuff. And. And you
can hear that not only from
Edie, but. And. And I think that's more important
like. Like that propaganda
(22:45):
is being fed to everyone outside of
Gorman. Right. And then on
Gorman you have this other
Deirdre plan, which she told Krennic, like,
you. You. What you actually want
is for the rebellion to
To win a little. And then
that way when they lose, everyone can be
(23:08):
on your side still, like thinking
like. And. And the way they played that and
executed that, out.
It was done so well because
you remember it, but
simultaneously, the way
they. They fleshed that out, it.
It was. It. It felt like they were playing their
(23:29):
cards at the. At just the right times to really
spell out what was actually happening.
>> Will (23:34):
Yeah, yeah. And also. Yeah. And also just.
And also using the.
That The. The enthusiasm
to. To really drive. To drive
Events and especially, you know, I think back
to,
like I said, the
(23:55):
conversations that Krennic and Dedra had earlier on
and, And. And also, whenever she
was, You know, whenever
Tartagas was like, look, Gorman's a gift.
You know, whenever she was still, you know, she was.
Yeah, yeah, part, you know,
it was like people were like, you know, this is like a, you know, is this. Is
(24:16):
this a demotion? And even like, Edie was like, you
know. You know, you know,
to their point about their conversation too. You know, Cyril's like, very proud
of this thing and she's just like, you know, this is
like. It's, not. It's not a backwater on the Outer
Rim, but, you know, she's still trying to poo poo
the fact that he was on that planet, for. For her own
ends, but because, she just always tried to keep him. Try
(24:39):
to keep him in his place. To your point about the, you know, the individual
comment. But, yeah, I mean, it's just so. It was a
such, you know, again, as
I raised before, as far as, you know, calibrate
enthusiasm. I mean, Cyril was like, so super, super
enthusiastic about, you know, playing this
role, you know, being, you know, and he's also,
(24:59):
because of what Deadre told his mom, like, you know, back
off. But now, you know,
Cyril has now replaced
Edie with Dedra as far as just always trying to seek
that approval.
and, and. And so, you know, he, you know, so
whenever he's like, reporting back to her what's going on on the planet,
(25:19):
it's. It's really, you know, he's. He's trying to get her approval.
And then also the other thing too is just,
you know, carrying things forward. Like whenever
he, Whenever he set up the. The
communications bug in his, you know, he. He let the
ISB find the bug, you know, in
his office and, and just to help carry.
Carry the mission
(25:42):
forward. So again, I think all those other elements of spycraft are
just really, I think, you know, from the. From the Empire's
perspective or. And. And propaganda was right.
I just really, really liked how they just made
it this very.
Yeah. So was there not. No. Clearly wasn't
as much action, except until we get to the third episode.
(26:04):
But all these other. All these other levels
were just, to me, were just what really got me
engaged and. And kept me like, really on the edge of my
seat as I was watching. Watching Cyril's, journey in
the. In this. In this arc.
>> Sarah (26:17):
I don't think he was Overly
enthusiastic, I think he was. So
he. It was. It's interesting
because, like,
he. He would have these moments.
And Deirdre, which. Which I don't. I
don't know if it's him seeking her approval
so much as Deirdre has this
(26:39):
ability to. To
once she. I. There's. There's
a line that she said that I can't find right now,
but she's like, never seen him as
happy. And I forget in what context she said
that, but. But he.
Like, she's able to reel him back
in and. And it's the exact
(27:01):
same thing that they parallel with what's going
on with Ryland's leading this
Gorman front where they sent
Lutheran, sends Cassian in.
Cassian should have been Deirdre.
And he, He tried. He was. He was
pointing things out. He was. But he
was being a bit of an,
(27:23):
He. He was also just like, you guys.
You guys don't got your. Together. I can't help you. I got.
I got other problems at home. And that's really why
Lutheran was upset, is because, like, no,
Cassie. And you actually can help them. You're just choosing not
to, so. And
unfortunately, that's what
leads them to playing right into Deirdre's
(27:45):
hands. Like, there's no one
on their side who is coming
in like a Deirdre and saying,
you guys are missing the end, game here.
Like, you're thinking short term.
You're. You're. You're. You're. You're
letting your anxiety
(28:05):
about the timing wear too much on you
to where you are going to trip up. And that's exactly
how this all plays out. And man, if I
hear any complaints about not enough action.
Do you know how many episodes of TV I watch where I
complain that there's 20 minutes of
action and maybe. Maybe 10 minutes of
(28:26):
dialogue? Like, good Lord, action
is only worth it. Like, you can't
have the spectacle without the substance. Like, you have
to earn the spectacle with substance.
So, yeah, I just, like,
good Lord, go watch Rogue One.
>> Will (28:43):
Yeah.
>> Sarah (28:44):
There's an entire third act of action.
Okay.
>> Will (28:47):
Yeah, yeah. But. Yeah, but to your point, let's, you
know, since we're on the Gorman story and you know, we do
get, you know, you talk
about Cassian and his role on the planet. You know, we do
do get a little bit more history, you know,
with, when Cassie is talking to the, To the
bellhop, about, the Tarkin
Massacre, which, was a very,
(29:10):
they pulled. They pulled in the Legends because you know,
because That was a story that
when people. The first Gorman massacre was actually
the Tarkin Massacre, in the Legends series,
the Star wars. but they you know,
retconned it twice. Once in Star Wars Rebels. I meant to say
at the beginning of this, I'm going to be. There may be some moments
(29:30):
where I will get into spoiler talk with things
that happens in Star Wars Rebels that is
running concurrent, in the timeline with with. With
Andor. So just that meant to give that warning at the
top. But you know,
to your point about the
events and Cassie being a jerk and talking to
(29:50):
the Gorman folks, we
do get that historical note
about the Tarin event. And
then, And. And to
your point about how
the Rebels on this planet are playing into the
hands and because they didn't have
their Deidra and Dedra and you know, Cassian
(30:12):
was. Wasn't mentally there to do it. So by the time that
Senta and Val come to the planet to
like do the job,
the, The. It was too late.
because you know, they make it very, very clear to,
To. To the front.
Yes. You know, we'll, We'll. We'll take off. We'll take on
this this, this convoy. We're going to get these,
(30:34):
These items. But you know, they made it very clear here
are the rules. But because of
their undisciplined nature, they
fall right into the Empire's hands. As far as, you know, it
was just in. You know, again, going back to Cyril's story. I
mean seeing Cyril like observe this whole thing
just play out and he just the, The.
The. The. The glee on his face like it's
(30:57):
happening and this. The. The plan
that was hatched is coming to
fruition I thought was really, really.
You know, again, I just. Really enjoyed just
seeing that. And again it just really reinforces some of the.
The overall themes that this, that. That That's. This
arc was really trying to present, with.
With both sides.
(31:20):
You know. Yeah, having a different name,
you know, having the similar. Similar goals. But you
know, but the, the outcomes,
you know, don't go. The outcome goes one
way for one side and the other side not so much.
>> Sarah (31:36):
Yeah. I mean, and. And why.
Why they they both
They both win. But the win is
tarnished because someone did not listen
to Vel clearly state,
don't. Or Dylan did not listen to Vel clearly
state, Nobody else but Vel and Cintra
(31:56):
Cinta can have, blasters, and
he has a blaster on him. He gets into a
fight with one of the townsmen who we happened
to see in a previous episode during
the. The underground meeting.
and. And he pulls out the blaster
and accidentally they.
They get in tussle, fire off a shot. It
(32:18):
hits Citra, who. Who kind of
knew like Citra or Vel were gonna die just
because it felt like there was a pause
after she said no one but us can have joy.
These blasters. And they
both shared like a meaningful moment
in. In the leading up to this, like
where they were reunited, they were getting their
(32:41):
happily ever after. But we all know how
Rogue One ends. Do we think that
there's going to be much difference here? Like, come
on. So, so it just. It.
And it plays into the. Some. The things
that we were already talking about with.
With Bix and. And Cassian and. And maybe
that's also what took away from the Bix and
(33:03):
Cassian arguments was like.
But here we clearly see it play out, which
sometimes I don't want them to tell
me what's happening. Like, the visual
representation of, can
be a lot more nuanced and everything.
I also just hats off to the actress who plays
Belle because she really did a good
(33:26):
job in her. In her scene with
Dylan of.
Of holding in grief,
being mad, but also
not overdoing it.
Yeah, it was. She. It was
just the right mixture of everything.
Like. And. And She allowed her
(33:48):
words to mean more cutting than
anything. So.
So like, I. I thought that that was a really good,
scene and performance there as well.
>> Will (33:59):
yeah, I agree. I mean, I think, And I think
to my point about earlier character
driven and character growth, I think the vow of a
year or so ago or even season one probably would
have taken out a blaster and like just taking that guy out.
But. But at the you.
But to your point, I mean just her
(34:21):
maturity. I think as far as. Just as we
see the rebellion grow and people
understanding, you know, now she gets it as far
as like what Lutheran and even Sento were trying to tell her about the
overall. Overall, you
know, aim of what we're trying to do
here, she. She gets it now. And so even though
she is feeling that. That just the. The searing pain of
(34:43):
losing someone, especially after they have, you know,
finally. Finally did get back together and look
like they were going to get their. Their happy moment,
that's. That's been ended. and another thing too, I know.
Just want to just touch on this real briefly. I think,
you know, of course, there has been some discourse
in the fandom as far as, like, okay, are we doing the barrier
(35:03):
G gay trope? because
this, we do have this cup gay
couple who seems like they can't even have,
have any happiness and stuff. But I, I see, I,
I see, see that concern. I respect that concern.
But I think in the overall story that they were
telling here, whether it was, whether it was, everybody's going
to get it at some point. I mean, there's no, like,
(35:27):
to come to, you know, come to a, an end.
So did it feel forced?
or unearned maybe? I mean, you know, I
felt, to me, I felt in the whole context of the
story, it was a lot like Brasso's death, that in
that, you know, there's not, sometimes there's not going to
be. You go out in heroic blaze of glory.
(35:48):
Sometimes it is going to be just an empty,
hollow, you know, meaningless
death. Because this is a messy business.
so, so, so I get that
concern.
>> Sarah (35:59):
But yeah, I, I, I just
want to say I'm not part of that community. If you're offended
by what they did with that, then,
then that's your right. If you, you're not, like, I
didn't think of anything of it because, yeah,
maybe that has to do with. Because I'm heterosexual,
but I, I just, I
get like, like what you're saying. I get it. But
(36:21):
to me, I, I
don't, I don't know.
>> Will (36:26):
Like, yeah, to me, it's like the similar arguments that
happened. I mean, I think the last two, you know, with
these two arcs have been like, big flash points as far as
the social commentary. People have, like, latched on to one.
Last week was the attempted rape. This week
it's just to bury your Gates trope.
>> Sarah (36:42):
But I think what was the
political, like, what was the bad thing
about, like, I'm not saying that I don't know how
to have this conversation, but what, what was the
discussion last week about the potential.
>> Will (36:55):
Oh, oh, just should it be a Star wars or
not?
>> Sarah (37:00):
Okay, like, like, yeah,
wow.
>> Will (37:03):
Wow.
>> Sarah (37:04):
And, and, and, Will is telling this to
me. Who, who is so critical of
Star Wars? Like, oh,
my God, I thought I was mean and
bad, but wow.
Like, like, okay, should
that be in Star Wars? They didn't actually do it. And also,
(37:24):
if you had a problem with that, you best be having a problem with what
gross did her in the first season. Because that was
mental rape. Do. Jesus Christ. And also,
isn't this supposed to be, like, everyone is Always like,
oh my God, andor's best show ever because it's
grounded Star wars because it feels more
real and then. But you can't put rape in it.
(37:44):
And dear Lord, if you have two
lesbian characters who
are in a war who are clearly fighting for
the rebellion and one of them dies during
battle, like obviously just using that
as a stereotype and a trope. Fairing the gays
like, like, yeah, yeah,
>> Will (38:04):
Yeah.
>> Sarah (38:04):
I don't know. But like I said, I also feel
uncomfortable talking about the, especially the barrier
gays because I'm not part of that community. So.
>> Will (38:12):
Yeah, yeah, I'm not a part of that community either. I just, I
just, I just wanted to, I just, I like to
have a full on discussion
about all the things both story
lines and also if there's any, any
notable items that are that, that are being
discussed on the, in the interwebs or in
the discourse, I just wanted to acknowledge it.
(38:34):
So, but you know, we can move on from it. But I just, like I
said, I, I don't, I'm not a member of that community.
I see where people were concerned about that. But I mean I could, as an
African American, I could be like, oh yeah, they killed the blacks.
So yeah, the black girl
gets killed early. I mean it's just like, I guess, I
guess it's just, you know, a lot of times it's.
(38:54):
If you want. Again, I think in the
context of the story that's being told, these things happen
and people are going to die. And it has
nothing to do with anything larger than that. Than just the fact
that this is a very messy, messy business
and people die.
>> Sarah (39:11):
Yeah, yeah.
>> Will (39:12):
But anyway.
>> Sarah (39:13):
Okay, well, we got, we gotta speed up because you told me this is
gonna be 20 minutes. We're on 40 minutes and we got like three more
things to talk about. So. So like
moving on from that point, my least favorite
story arc of this entire
show. I don't like Saw.
I don't like Saw. I don't.
He just slowed everything so down for
(39:35):
me. And then I was like, Horace Whitaker, I love you,
but no, no, no, no. Because he also.
I haven't liked. I haven't like Saw in Rogue
One. I don't remember liking
him. And in season one,
like, I just cannot connect his
character. And so every, like
last week we were talking about Krennic and
(39:58):
we were talking about Ben Mendelson and his
performance. And like I love Forest
Whitaker, but there's something about the way he plays
Saad that I'M just like, you're too
much. You can't get into it.
And it's just. You're annoying. Yeah,
I do. I kind of get what you're trying to do,
but it just drives me crazy. It's like nails on a
(40:21):
chalkboard. And I'm like, we don't need this.
>> Will (40:25):
Yeah, Saul's crazy. I mean,
it basically like reinforces the. The
point again that the. The wild cards of the
Rebellion, you know, the,
If no solid backstory, of course, you know, his
sister, was killed in Clone Wars.
he. From that point forward, he just loses it. And, and
(40:47):
again, think watching Star Wars Rebels, they. They
also explore this, This, this wild
cardness and this, this, this, How, He's just.
He's one that is just
what. What you see in these episodes is
the same in the animated universe and shows as well.
So, you know, he's a very consistent character as far
(41:08):
as driving. You know, of course that the
gas was.
We see why he looks like he does when we finally do meet him
at. We. We do first, you know, meet him. We meet him in Rogue One.
But, you know, the whole story with Wilman,
I was just one. We were. I was wondering
like what. What. What ended up happening to.
To him. and we see that he's, you know, clearly
(41:30):
he's still putting his mechanical skills to use,
for. For Saul's team
and Been the only. I mean only. And we can move on from salt Only.
Other cool thing I thought was that, That whenever I was like. That
base looks awful familiar. And you know, we definitely. It
was used during this time period and
of course later in the sequel, trilogy.
It was also the same base, that we saw in the. For the Force
(41:52):
Awakens. But Yeah, but you know,
Saul is Solas Saul. And we'll just.
We'll probably get more of him as we, As we move
forward.
>> Sarah (42:07):
so then the la. That leaves us with,
Mon Mothma
and. And that is all I got.
>> Will (42:18):
Yeah. M. I. I like Mon's story
in this one, especially with
the, you know, we see her whipping votes
for, you know, trying to,
You know, she's like, for example, talking to the Gorman
senator as far as, you know, and others
with the, Trying to get the
poured, the The Public
(42:40):
ordinance, Resistance Directive
repealed. you know, because again, there was the
whole. Did a whole discussion as far as, What did she
say as far as, Are we. Are we finding criminals? Are we making
Them.
>> Sarah (42:52):
Yeah. So at the end with Krennic
because they're going through an ideology
exchange that's kind of mirrored to everything
that's going on with Gorman, and,
and the Luthien,
Gyla stealing back the listening
device.
>> Will (43:11):
Yeah, yeah, she uses her. Yeah used her approach to try to get that back
because they of course they were, you know, Scudder
was I guess worried about the
artifacts and stuff. So. Yeah, so they. Yeah, so they had to get the
artifact out. So there was a lot of things going on there.
the other cool thing too is just, you know, if I
notice other points that was made of. With
(43:32):
the. We do get the. The recast
of Benjamin Brett as Bill
Organa taken over for. For Jimmy Smith due to
scheduling reasons and you know, sense why they.
They just had the little quick scene with
Mon and, and. And Scene N
Organa. Just so that Just given
clearly the key role that the Scene N plays
(43:55):
and that Belarna plays in the Star wars
mythos, better just to get it now, rip
the band aid off, have the store, you know. Yep. We
recast them and listen, when we see him
in the next two arcs, we don't have to go
spend time on
oh, where's Jimmy Smith?
So. But that was that, you know, so, so, you know, so I
(44:17):
think there was that. I really did enjoy like the,
the back and forth argument between you know,
Krennic and, And Mon and just the philosophical
debates. And again just again we see
that her pushing, pushing, pushing,
pushing more towards just being
out, in the, in the Rebellion. And then
also, and then also just you know, again the political
(44:40):
machinations of the Senate just basically
is just there in. In name only
at this point the Emperor just continues to like,
make it more just a, A Just a rubber
stamping body to the point that of course by the time we
get to A New Hope, you know, Tarkin, you know, shares with everyone
on the Death Star that the. The Senate's been dissolved. So you
(45:01):
know, so we do. We see. We do see that
evolution of that, as. As the story goes and you
know all the senators just are there to have. Have
grand parties and get sworn in, but that's about it.
>> Sarah (45:12):
Yeah, I mean the, The Chronic and Mon Mothma
stuff was great mainly because it's just dialogue and
those two are just such great actors
and in these, in these roles
that I mean there's so many quotable lines,
especially from Krennic. I mean criminals love to lie.
After all, who wants to Die for lawless
ineptitude. And then Krennic also says,
(45:34):
mainly it's critic. And. And I think
that's kind of why, like, I liked
Mon Mothma, but I didn't. I didn't think she
had a whole lot going on. She was just really
showing how. How the
propaganda. I mean, this entire three
episodes is really kind of showing how
(45:54):
this is how the Empire remains in
control, remains power,
because, like, they're planting
these other seeds and they're these other
plans that are coming through. So. So it.
It very much felt like Mon Mothma, coming
right after the wedding was like, not coming home to
anything great either.
(46:17):
You sacrifice your dear old friend. Friend,
only to come home and realize, like, you don't
got control in the Senate anymore. People are leaving
your allies, like, they're being convinced their
loyalties with the Empire, and.
And then you get into a sparring match with Krennic, and.
I'm sorry, Krennic, actually, I think he might have
(46:38):
won that too, because. Because he. He
says, I, like this line as well. My rebel is your
terror terrorist or. Or something like that. And
that, like. Like,
it's so good. It is
just clear, concise, and, yeah,
on the nose. But I think
(46:59):
that you. You have. You have
the subtletiness with the moves and the
spy and the,
And the covert operations with Deirdre and
Cyril that you can have Krennic
actually point things out. So.
Cartoon villain on the nose, but
it's coming from Ben Mendelsohn, so it's like, okay,
(47:22):
this is a dramatic acting,
and. And so. And, like, it's just
so good. And. And we got all of the messy, weird
dialogue with the, About. About the
PTSD of being soldiers with Big
Vixen and, Cassian. So,
I mean, my. My final thing that I just want to
(47:42):
say about these three episodes, and arguably the first
three episodes, is I just don't know
why Cassian remains to
be in. Like. Like,
continues to be like the character I'm drawn
to the least.
I just. And I love him in
Rogue One, but I'm just like. And.
(48:04):
And I. I. Yes, to an extent,
this plays into. I. I have a tendency never to
really like the main characters.
It's like that. That, That Seinfeld effect
where everyone else around them is so
crazy and interesting, and they get it. Like,
he has to be the straight man. And
(48:25):
so you're just like, okay, you're a bit
boring. So. So that's the.
That's the one thing. I just Want to
leave on. Will you got any final thoughts and
then we can wrap it up for tonight?
>> Will (48:38):
Yeah, we could. Yeah, we could wrap it up. Yeah. I mean I, I
think just to piggyback off of your thought,
I think that's by. I think that's by design. I mean
they've just built such a, just a rich world,
you know, with these, these characters. I mean we've, you know, we know
where Cassian's journey ends.
So I think for me it's, it's like the
destination to, to get to
(49:01):
that to. To the end of the journey.
It's just paid was just such rich characters
like as you mentioned, Krennic and Dedra and all these other people
that we've been. And Cyril that yeah,
there are. You know, I'm enjoying learning about
all these, all these people and, and so that
by the time we get to the Cassiana Rogue one, yeah, you
(49:21):
know, we get some good moments with him. But
these other supporting characters just really
contextual. It helps contextualize
why we, you know, why we have a character that we, that we
see there you know,
in that movie. So I'm, I'm really enjoying this
series and looking glad we. Glad we had we
(49:41):
you know, set aside time just to, to talk
about these these three episode arc. This three episode
arc because it was really. It does feel like a, you know, mini movie
in and of itself.
>> Sarah (49:53):
and people who,
people who have listened to us Talk Andor
Season 1, please let me know if Will told me that
when we were discussing season one because it
felt very deja vu.
M Will, why don't you tell our listeners where they can find
you?
>> Will (50:11):
Yes, you can find me on all the socials at ah, Will and
Polk. W, I L L M P O.
>> Sarah (50:17):
L K. And you can find me there too at SJ Belmont,
sjblmo and T. Please follow our crew on
X, formerly known as Twitter at Scene and Nerd on Blue
sky and friend us on Facebook, follow us on
Instagram and threads at Scene, underscore n, underscore
nerd and visit our website
www.scenanerdpodcast.com. but most
importantly, rate following, comment on Apple podcast sponsors,
(50:38):
Spotify, YouTube or wherever you get your podcast. Good night. Geek out. You're
welcome.
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