July 21, 2025 • 34 mins
Traci DeForge is here to her knowledge about podcasting for your business without feeling like a total salesy weirdo. She’s busting the myth that you need 10,000 downloads to make a buck—seriously, you can start monetizing with just 1,500 listeners. We talk about how to weave your podcast into your business strategy without sounding like a used car salesman. If you’ve ever felt awkward about asking for sales, Traci’s got the lowdown on how to do it without the cringe. So, grab your earbuds and get ready to learn how to turn your podcast into a money-making machine while keeping it real and relatable!
Takeaways:
- Most podcasters wrongly believe they need to drop $10k to start monetizing.
- Traci DeForge busted the myth that you need 10,000 listeners; 1,500 can do it too!
- Podcasting is all about strategy; it’s not just talking into a mic, folks!
- You've got to view your podcast as part of your whole business model, not just a side gig.
- Feeling salesy? Get over it! Your mindset can really change how you sell.
- If you don't ask for what you're worth, you might be leaving money on the table!
Links referenced in this episode:
- schoolofpodcasting.com
- produceyourpodcast.com
- podpage.com
- Secrets of Closing the Sale - Zig Ziglar (Audible)
Traci DeForge
Helping business owners & brands turn their expertise into strategic podcasts that build authority, attract qualified leads & drive revenue. Full-service, 360° podcast solutions from strategy to sponsorship.
As Founder & CEO of Produce Your Podcast, I help business owners, brands, and thought leaders transform their expertise into strategic media platforms that build authority, attract qualified leads, and generate revenue. From early-stage startups to my work with Fortune 500 companies, including Google, Hilton, Weight Watchers International, Microsoft, and British Airways, I am internationally recognized for identifying successful business development opportunities for innovative growth.
Recognized as a Top 10 Podcasting Services Provider by Media & Entertainment Business Review (2024), we’ve launched and managed over 160 B2B and B2C podcasts, supporting startups and global brands across the technology, legal, finance, and healthcare sectors.
With 30+ years of experience in award-winning media production, broadcast radio, and business development, I developed a full-service podcasting model delivering broadcast-quality production, strategic brand positioning, and measurable business outcomes. From concept to launch, audience growth to monetization, our proprietary workflow equips clients with a turnkey system for success, aligned with their marketing, sales, and content creation goals. READ MORE
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(00:00):
Most podcasters think thatthey need $10,000 to make money.
But what if I told you that'sa myth and you could start monetizing
with just 1500 listeners?Well, that's what Tracy DeForge is
here to explain. Hit it,ladies. The school of Podcasting
with Dave Jackson. Podcastingsince 2005. I'm your award winning
(00:25):
hall of fame podcast coach,Dave Jackson, thanking you so much
for tuning in. If you're newto the show, this is where I help
you plan, launch and grow yourpodcast. If you want to monetize,
I can help with that too, andso can Tracy. That's what we were
talking about. My website isschoolofpodcasting.com use the coupon
(00:46):
code listener when you sign upfor either a monthly, quarterly or
yearly subscription. And ofcourse that comes with a 30, 30 day
money back guarantee. TracyDeforge has been in media really
for 30 years, going back toher days on being on the radio out
in LA. She's probably bestknown for producerpodcast.com but
(01:08):
she's worked with Fortune 500companies, she's worked with major
media outlets, and she is aperson that I with love and respect
refer to as a big shot smartypants. And, and so when I brought
her on, I really wanted to tapinto her knowledge of using a podcast
with a business. I've beengetting a lot of questions about
(01:30):
that and so I asked her aboutthat and asked, where do you start?
Well, I am definitely going tostart with the strategy and I am
going to look at everythingthrough the lens of business development
because I don't know that I'ma big shot, but I am a smarty pants
when it comes to businessdevelopment strategy. And what I
find that a lot of people getexcited about the idea of starting
(01:50):
a podcast, but they, theydon't really necessarily look at
the whole picture, 360 degreesof how it integrates into their business
model, their business, andalso even their time, energy and
bandwidth. Right. Becausethere's so many people out there
saying you should do this andyou should release this many times
and you should do this manythings. And the reality is is you've
(02:11):
got to do what's right for youto make it sustainable. And you have
to create a podcast that'sengaging, that's edu, that provides
education and that is set upfoundational to convert people to
continue that conversationwith you once they have consumed
your content. So there's somuch more to it than just what kind
(02:32):
of mic do I get or or where amI going to record? Or how many times
am I going to release? Youreally want to start with why? Why
the podcast? And then what doyou want the podcast to do? To serve?
How are you going to leveragethat podcast for business growth?
Those are the first two thingsI would talk about. No doubt.
I love that. And the fact thatbefore you even start monetizing,
(02:56):
I always say, you don'tmonetize a podcast, you monetize
an audience. So for the newperson that may not have enough of
an audience to monetize, whatare your strategies for that?
One of the things that I wouldtalk about first is I would look
at how is your podcast fittinginto the rest of your business model.
Again, a conversation peopledon't have frequently enough. You
(03:16):
can't silo off your podcastand expect it to grow and thrive.
And you'd be surprised at thethings that I see. I, I, we were
working with a client and theykept saying, I just, my, my audience
isn't growing, my audienceisn't growing. But my webinars, man,
they're on fire. And I'm like,okay, so they have a webinar marketing
(03:37):
strategy that has, you know, afunnel with opt ins and they're having
like, each email is triggeringanother email. It's triggering, you
know, the whole system thateverybody does for webinars. Not
once in any of this visibilityare they telling this other audience
that they're cultivating,creating and growing that, oh, by
the way, we have a podcast.They weren't thinking of it outside
(04:00):
of just, I release it, Iposted on social media, I record
it, I release it, I posted onsocial media. It's like, no, it's
just not enough anymore. Like,you have to think about every area
that you touch a potentialclient, even down to we were talking
with a, one of our clients,Crazy wealthy podcast. Again, very
niche focused podcast, veryhigh assets under management. Like
(04:24):
really using their podcast ina very specific way to educate clients.
They take qr, you know, cardsto golf tournaments, or they'll host
a golf tournament for theirclients and they'll put the, the
podcast QR code on whateverthat they end up putting out there.
If you're speaking at anevent, make sure it's, you know,
(04:45):
ask people in the audience,okay, I have a podcast. If you've
had fun with me on stagetoday, get out your, get out your
smartphone right now. Go tothe platform where you listen or
watch your podcast and find mypodcast. Like you, you just have
to think about it ineverything that you do. And you have
to literally eat, breathe andsleep it. Not literally, but it's
(05:08):
just so easy to think of it asa wash once, repeat. And it's just
not. It's just not at all.
Absolutely. When I travel, Ialways wear a school of podcasting
T shirt. And when I'm onstage, depending on the situation,
I'm often wearing a podpage Tshirt. Because you always want to
be promoting and a lot of ushave problems with that. We kind
(05:31):
of have a. We feel salesy andmakes us feel weird. So how do you
handle that?
How you feel about sales is amindset issue that you really need
to overcome even before youget behind the mic, because that
is something that you cancustomize and personalize in your
own way. And what feels salesyto you might not feel salesy to someone
(05:51):
else, but you've got to becomfortable and confident about it.
I think that's one of thethings that people don't talk about
enough. Like, I can give you avery. And we can outline some really
strategic ways to drop incalls to action, but it really starts
first with your comfort leveland communicating that call to action.
So when I'm working withclients and strategy, what I like
(06:12):
to say is, you know, you'reresponsible for the energy that you
bring to the mic, what excitesyou to talk about and then taking
that into a warm invitation.Because I think if you get your mind
around the fact that youhaving a conversation about your
business, you showcasingclients, if that's appropriate for
your business model, if you'retalking about your products and services,
like what fires you up aboutit? What do you know you do well?
(06:35):
What do you know that yourproduct or your service, how does
it transform people? What'sthe journey around that? And if you
can tell it and bestorytelling about it or get excited
about it, then that's. Thatenergy is contagious.
All right, I'm going to jumpin here. If you didn't notice, Tracy
just did one. She didn't say,come hire me, but she did say, when
I'm working with clients,that's a very polite way of just
(06:56):
letting the audience know I doconsulting. How about calls to action?
Think of it as if you werehaving a one on one conversation.
Because most people arelistening to their podcast. If they're
listening, they're listeningwith it, with earbuds. It's a very
intimate relationship thatyou're building. So just think about,
I'm asking one person to doone thing and I think that lowers
(07:17):
the. The Stress around feelingsalesy. But nobody wants an infomercial.
So you need to have strategyaround your content, you need to
have strategy around yourpodcast. But you've got to start
with how you feel about it.
And I realize that, you know,for the person that wants to make
money with their podcast, yougot to learn how to sell, because
you're either selling yourstuff or you're selling somebody
(07:37):
else's stuff. And a greatbook. It's an old classic, but man,
it's good. Secrets of Closingthe Sale by Zig Ziglar will help
you get your mind around.You're not selling, you're helping.
And one of the things, foryears everybody was into the whole
you have to tell your story.So I want to ask Tracy about that.
If you're an accountant, whois going to tell your story about
(08:00):
how you got into the financebusiness, is that going to be super
transformative to somebody whowants to then hire you to do their
books or do their taxes? Imean, maybe they want to get to know
you, but they probably want toknow more about what kind of innovative
new way or how do you take theload off of them or what's in it
for them, basically. And Ithink that no matter Whether it's
your first episode or your100th episode or your 1000th episode,
(08:24):
you have to enter into everypiece of content that you create
with what's in it for youraudience and not what's in it for
you. Because your story mightbe interesting, it might be a game
changing story story. But ifit's not something that is going
to ultimately benefit or bringvalue to your customer or your client,
(08:44):
is it necessary? You know, Idon't know.
Oh, I do. I think it's reallyunnecessary. Think about it again,
My criteria. Does it make itlaugh? Does it make you laugh, cry,
think grown, educate orentertain? And in most cases it doesn't.
And for the love of God, don'tread your LinkedIn bio. That's as
dry as yesterday's toast. Butyou can work in calls to action.
(09:06):
It doesn't have to be at the end.
So it's just being mindful andstarting to place that deliberately
into conversations throughoutthe episode. I think a lot of times
it's a myth that you have towait till the end to have the call
to action. But a call toaction can be dropped in if you're
transitioning into a specialsegment, if you're opening the show
(09:27):
talking about the school ofpodcasting, if you're, you know,
all of these are differentways that you can connect with your
audience so that theyunderstand what it is that you do.
So you'll notice that lastweek I said, I'm no longer interrupting
interviews to put in a call toaction. That's something I just chose.
I find it's a little toodisruptive, which I realize is kind
(09:47):
of good from a marketingstandpoint, but not so great from
an experience standpoint. Butin the end, you have to let them
know what it is you do. When Iwas in Chicago last week, they said,
you are a brand, you're not apodcast, and you want to be known
for whatever it is you do.You'll notice that I occasionally
throw in, my name is DaveJackson. I help podcasters. It's
(10:10):
what I do. So when somebodygoes, I need help with my podcast,
you'll go, oh, I know a guynamed Dave Jackson. You have to let
people know what you do.
This is the perfect time foran honest, like, true story about
a client we had who does sevenfigure business consulting. She'd
been podcasting for over threeyears, consistently showing up like,
you know, recording herpodcast. She came to work with us
(10:34):
because her show wasn'tgrowing, her business wasn't growing
quite as well as she washoping that it would. We tweaked
the way she did her intro sothat she was explaining that this
was her podcast and theresult, the reason she was doing
this podcast is because sheoffered these services to people
who wanted to be seven figureentrepreneurs. The first episode
(10:54):
after she tweaked her intro,she closed a five figure client on
coaching services. But themost important part of the story
is that the person who sheclosed said to her, I've been listening
to your podcast for years andI didn't know how you could help
(11:14):
me. That is, for years, thisperson, I didn't know how you could
help me. Now, there's nothingsalesy about that person genuinely
wanted to understand becauseshe liked the host, she liked the
content, she liked the show.Clearly she kept showing up and was
finding some value from it,but she couldn't connect the dots.
(11:38):
The host wasn't building thebridge between the podcast conversations
and how she could help aclient. And when she did that one
time, five figures in revenue.So it's really just not my opinion.
It's really truly very important.
But I know you may bethinking, but I don't believe. I
(11:58):
mean, I've been doing this fora couple years. I'm not sure if I
have enough downloads. If myaudience, if my reach is big, Enough
to look for sponsorships and partnerships.
I think there's just this hugemyth that you can't monetize your
show unless you have 10,000downloads per episode or more. You
and I both know most cases areeven 1500 or less or 1000 or less.
(12:22):
And so is that still possiblefor monetization? Absolutely. Absolutely
it is. What you have to thinkabout are a couple of things. One
is what are you doing in yourbusiness in addition to your podcast?
So it might seem like a nobrainer, but a lot of times that
gets overlooked. So have youbeen blogging for years before you
(12:42):
started your podcast? Do youhave a robust social media on at
least one channel? Do you havea consistent newsletter that you've
been sending out monthly orweekly? Do you show up at community
events? Are you a speaker?Have you published a book? Like the
first, first thing that youwant to think about is what are the
multiple ways that a brand, ifthey were to align with you and work
(13:04):
with you, what are the multiomnichannel fancy pants sprays? But
what are the multiple reasonsand touch points that you can reach
an audience that that brandcan be connected with? That's your
first thing that you want tolook at and figure out. And then
the second thing is, is likestart looking at your own products
and services as your firstsponsor. I like to tell people your
(13:29):
podcast is oceanfront realestate. So start using it first to
even let people know that youwant sponsorships. One of the things
that we talk a lot about atProducer Podcast is bringing in what's
called the Powered by sponsor.And the Powered by sponsor is a really
great way. It's how you openyour show. You know, it is the growth
(13:50):
accelerator podcast, Poweredby Producer Podcasts. I mean, I'm
using that example becausethat's ours. But it could be powered
by shure mics, it could bepowered by, you know, mailchimp,
it could be powered byanybody. Right? But the, the way
that you can do that is that'snot taking inventory. It's not a
60 or 90 second long liveread. It's just a way to announce
(14:12):
to your audience and have yourbrand affiliated with you and your
show out of the gate. Andthat's something that people could
charge $250 for $25,000 for,depending on how many people that
they're reaching off of it.But it's an, it's for somebody who
isn't in like eating,breathing and sleeping the sponsorship
and brand advertising world.It's a really easy thing to, to get
(14:35):
your brain around. And thesecond thing is create a signature
piece of content that you canput a sponsor adjacent to inside
your podcast. So that could betips, that could be takeaways, that
could be, I mean, we have afunny podcast, the fans first, it's
a sports podcast. They have aspecial segment called get off my
Lawn and it has a funny, youknow, curmudgeony character, you
(14:58):
know, get my lawn. And thenit's a fan rant. And so that's such
an easily sponsored featureand it's a fun production element
for your audience and you candrop a sponsor adjacent to that.
So you just have to thinkabout like, what are the easiest
low hanging fruit from theproduction perspective that I could
deliver consistently. Then youhave to look at your inner network
(15:21):
first. This is the piece thatpeople underestimate all of the time.
They, they really overestimatethe number of people that know what
it is that they do. But mostof the time people will underestimate
the number of people theyknow. So you have to think about
church, your ball field, youknow, who you, who's, you know, your
(15:42):
wife or your husband's friendsthat own businesses and who, who
are people that would want tobe aligned with my types of content
or the vendors that you'vebeen doing business with for years.
We had a interior designpodcast. They had been in business
for over a decade when theystarted their show. They had a 10
(16:02):
year history of buyingwallpaper and paint and faucets from
Kohler. And you know, theseare long term relationships. They
already know the quality ofthis, these women, the quality of
their work. So when theystarted a podcast, it was a natural
conversation to go back to abrand like Kohler and say, hey, we
(16:23):
started a podcast and we'vealready been blogging, we've already
had really great websitetraffic. We've already been, you
know, really consistent withour social. Do you want to be involved
in our podcast? It was notjust a yes, it was a hell yes. And
so they monetized reallyquickly out of the gate. And I think
it's just people not realizingthat they can ask first. Like, I
(16:44):
think if anybody takesanything away from this episode today,
hopefully they'll take awaythe. You don't get it if you don't
ask, but it, but when you ask,they may say no, but you're going
to get data. And so then youcan take that data into the next
conversation. And it's justabout having a conversation. It's
so intimidating sometimesbecause I don't sell ads. I don't
know anything about sellingads, but you know how to talk about
(17:06):
your business and you know howto talk about how you're transforming
your audience by themlistening and consuming your content
and who doesn't want to be apart of that.
Right, Exactly. And one of thehardest things is, well, what do
I charge has to.
Be valued based on what arethe things that you can do for them.
So are you going to add linksand logos in your show notes again?
(17:27):
Coming back to being able tolook at the podcast is the hub of
the content strategy wherethey will get visibility. But if
you're going to get intobigger numbers, you're going to be
able to look at the podcastplus and plus the other visibility
and touch points. You alsohave to think about like what kind
(17:47):
of numbers like with any kindof budget or business profitability
or any kind of forecasting youwould do like anything else, you
want to do that for yourpodcast too. So a lot of times people
will say I would be glad if Ijust got with my production costs
covered. So I have no ideawhat anyone's production cost. You
only know what your productioncosts. Unless you're working with
us, then I do know what yourproduction costs are. But if that's
(18:10):
where your barometer is likeis that your baseline? So okay, well
I want to build packages thatare going to cover my cost of my
production plus my time andmaybe 10%. And so you figure out
for I like easy math. So let'ssay that's $5,000. And then you want
to back into it from there andsay okay, so I could do a powered
(18:30):
by, I could do a specialsponsor, I could have a founder or
CEO on my podcast, which isnot pay to play. It's just building
that visibility piece intoyour package. Maybe you release that
episode on separate day, notin your regular cadence. And so you
start to layer up what thesepackages look like. But you have
to have a number that you wantto meet a goal, an objective like
(18:51):
I want to cover my costs. Thisis what my costs are. So I need this
plus and then you just startbuilding the packages. And it's not
that it's a willy nilly typeof thing, but you it's really depending
on the value you're going tobring to them and the type of business
it is too. Because a highticket coach with 350 highly like
(19:13):
really engaged people and youwant to talk about project management
systems or you want to talkabout bookkeeping services or you
want to talk like that is aYou don't need a lot of people to
convert somebody to a projectmanagement system or to convert,
you know, you just, you don'tneed that many people. So you have
to talk about it that way too.
And you got to remember whenshe says you don't have to have that
(19:34):
many people, those are peoplethat are engaged. So we're talking
the difference between having500 people that were hanging on every
word versus 50,000 people thattuned in and out every now and then.
And when you have an engagedaudience, you can do stuff like this.
So we are seeing people getanywhere from $250 for a special
(19:58):
segment for these are the muchsmaller audiences. When I say much
smaller audiences, I'm talkingabout 1500 downloads or less. Okay,
so these are real deals. Theseare not things that we are pie in
the sky. These are. So if you,because most branded niche business
development focused podcastsare smaller audiences by design,
they're never going to be the10 million or even the 10,000 downloads
(20:22):
for that matter. So anywherefrom 250, 500, 1000, $1500 an episode,
those are okay numbers to askif you are going to be getting in
front, putting them in frontof a very well targeted audience,
if you're going to be puttingthem in other areas of your marketing
(20:43):
strategy. So I think it's fairto say, like, is it 5,000, I don't
know how, how many socialmedia followers do you have? How,
what's your SEO like? All ofthose kind of things. But in, but
just starting out, you canjust start asking for 500, 1500 dollars
per episode. And if yourelease four times a month, that
starts to add up. We alsorecommend that you don't have to
(21:06):
sell, don't go keep asking forone episode at a time. Do a three
month, do 13 episodes. Do youknow, take the pressure off yourself.
Like, try to get thosepackages to be like, if you're only
going to get $250 an episodefor a special segment, make that
a 13 or a 26 week agreement sothat you can start to, to build that
(21:26):
revenue base up for yourself.
Produce your podcast.com iswhere you can find all things Tracy.
And again, she doeseverything. Check it out again. Produce
your podcast.com, traciDeforge, thanks so much for coming
on the show.
Thank you, Dave. I'm so happyto be here and it was such a fun
conversation and I lookforward to continuing this conversation
(21:47):
with you at a conference inthe near future, I'm sure.
Absolutely. Thank you so much,Tracy. And speaking of conferences.
(24:41):
The school of podcasting.Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Tracy really is fun to bearound. That's the other thing I
like about Tracy. We alwayshave a good time and a good laugh.
The one thing I thought Iwould chime in on, and I heard this
tip, and I was like, that's.That's a good one. That is when it.
Cause we don't know what tocharge. So here's the thing. If you
(25:01):
haven't heard no yet, you'renot charging enough. That's a simple
rule. If you've. Every timeyou've thrown a number out and they
go, oh, yeah, great, okay,there's probably money on the table.
I remember when I interviewedJoe Salsihai from Stacking Benjamin's.
That was one of his things, ishe kept raising the price until he
finally heard no, that was wayback on episode 562. Back in the
(25:26):
day, me and Joe Salsey High.So that's something to keep in mind.
But I wanted to talk aboutthis salesy thing because, look,
right now, as we speak thisFriday, I'm launching an actual campaign
in my newsletter. Then this iswhy having a coach is a good thing,
because he's like, what werethe numbers on your last campaign?
(25:47):
I'm like, what do you mean,campaign? I'm like, I send emails
and stuff. He goes, no. Whereyou actually try to sell something.
And I'm like, oh, and boy. SoI'm actually trying to sell something
in my newsletter starting thisFriday, and I feel very salesy. And
so I thought, let's talk aboutthat. And like I said, probably one
of the best books is from ZigZiglar. It's called Secrets of Closing
(26:12):
the Sale. And Zig Ziglar is agreat example of how the power of
storytelling is just hugebecause he. He has all this great
information, but he's fromAlabama and me, and he calls his
wife the old redhead, and, youknow, water pumping and doing that.
He just. Everything's a story,and you can see it. He triggers the
(26:33):
theater of the mind. And atthe end, you're like, I can do that.
So he said the. He emphasizesthat you're selling is not about
pushing your own gain. Like, Ineed to make my commission, but it's
about helping others solvetheir problems and, you know, fulfill
their needs, whatever it isthey're trying to do. So this is
(26:55):
where I mentioned last week,Justin Moore's book sponsor, Magnet.
And by the way, Justin'scoming on the show, so if you have
a question for him, feel freeto send it on over, just go to schoolofpodcasting.com
contact and he said, really?Zig Ziglar, again, is the focus is
on serving the customer andproviding real value. He says when
(27:20):
you do that, that salesyfeeling disappears. And so this is
where you have to really knowwho your audience is. And when you
know you're solving theirproblem, then you know you're not
selling them, you're servingthem. You know, so shift your focus
to the benefit that you'redelivering to the customer. And if
(27:42):
you're like, well, I'm notreally sure. Well, then go make sure,
find some people to take yourcourse or to buy your product or
whatever you're doing and thensay, did that work for you? And if
they go, oh, are you kiddingme? That was amazing. Well, then,
you know, you're helping them,you know, and by that, that means
you're gonna have toexperiment a little bit. So when
(28:05):
you first start out, you'relike, hey, try this. And they might
go, ew, right? So seeeverything, not so much as a do or
die. So many people, if Idon't do this, then I'm gonna kill
my podcast. Well, wait, holdon. That's feedback. When you try
something and it doesn't work,that's feedback. And you go, oh,
I probably shouldn't do that.And then you tweak it. And then again,
(28:26):
as always, maintain aconsistent schedule. Be consistent
in your effort as well as thevalue of your content. But he really
talks about the bottom line.For Zig, it's all about serving others
and really believing yourproduct or service is the best of
(28:49):
the, you know, bunch, for lackof a better phrase. And then he does
it. One of his key things iswhen you're talking to someone, ask
questions instead of justtelling them about your product.
Because the more youunderstand their problem, the more
you will see how your productor service or your podcast or whatever
(29:10):
is going to solve that. And ifyou can see it solving it, then you're
not selling them, you'rehelping them. So keep that in mind.
Because the one thing thatTracy said that is so true, if you
don't ask, you don't get. Andthe more you ask, you know, yes,
at first, again, some peoplemay say no, realize no, often is,
(29:34):
not now. But you gotta ask andyou kind of get used to it. I have
had people ask me, why do Isay, you know, hall of fame podcast
award winning guy at thebeginning. And that was from a coach
that said, hey, how manypeople can say that? And I go, I
don't know, probably when Igot inducted, 10 or so, 15 maybe.
(29:57):
I don't know. He's like, youneed to say that at the beginning
of every show. And I was kindof like, eh, you know, Keel's like,
ooh, look. He's like, no, no,that's credibility. You know, it's
something you can say. Noteverybody can say it. You need to
say it. So if you ever wonderwhy I always start off with award
winning hall of fame podcastcoach, and he goes, by the way, is
that a fact? And I go, yeah, Igot the statue sitting behind me.
(30:20):
If you ever see me on video.He goes, well, then you're not lying.
He goes, you're just, youknow, pointing out that that's the
truth. And I'm like, oh, yeah,I guess so. So whether it's imposter
syndrome or just feelingawkward, anytime you do anything
new, you're gonna feelawkward. Remember that as well. But
(30:40):
you can overcome this, youknow, kind of. I don't want to be
salesy. There are ways to sellwithout being this Sunday. Sunday,
Sunday. Right. So it doesn'thave to be that either. But you can
do it if you want to. Again,as always, since we're talking about
making money today, I alwayshave to remind people you don't have
to make money with yourpodcast to be a valid podcast. You
(31:02):
could do it just for fun. Butfor those of you who are, and I saw
a lot of questions this week,so I was like, ah, it's time to bust
out the Tracy interview. Well,you got some good tips. Quick Housekeeping.
Back on episode 991, I wastalking about how to podcast and
stay married. And I totallyforgot to mention school of podcasting
(31:26):
members Greg and Linda Smith.They do a Show married in lovett.com.
those two been married foreverand they're sharing their tips on
how to stay married and loveit. I'll have a link to that out
in the show notes. Next weekon the show, I'll be interviewing
David Hooper. He is the authorof the book Big Podcast. He's the
(31:48):
host of the show Build a BigPodcast. He's also part of music
business radio. And Dave isnow on satellite radio. And so we
talk about what skills that hehad as a podcast and as a broadcaster.
How did that get him intosatellite radio along with stuff
like this? Success is a greatdeodorant in that if you've got some
(32:11):
stuff on the outside thatlooks great, maybe you don't have
to look at the inside and Irealized that I wasn't living life,
not really. You know, I waskind of paving over some stuff. And
of course you can follow theshow by going to schoolofpodcasting.com
follow and never miss anepisode. And if you need help with
your podcast, I'm DaveJackson. I help podcasters. It's
(32:33):
what I do and I would love tosee what we can do together. Go over
to schoolofpodcasting.com joinand use the coupon code listener.
That's L I S S T E N E R whenyou sign up for either a monthly,
quarterly or yearlysubscription. And that does come
with a 30 day money backguarantee along with step by step
(32:55):
courses, unlimited coachingand one of the best podcast communities
on the Internet. This in awhile. Currently using a rode podmic
USB into a rodecaster duo intoHindenburg journalists. My primary
plugin is the chef's Omnichannel. I love that thing and I
(33:20):
am hosted. This show is hostedon Captivate. If you need a website
check out PodPage. And ourhost is Dave Jackson. Our producer
is Dave Jackson. Our editor isDave Jackson. Our music music consultant
is Dave Jackson. The graphicdesigner is Dave Jackson. What else?
(33:41):
Assistant to the cousin of thebrother of storyboarding is Dave
Jackson. Thanks for tuning in.Until next week. Take care. God bless.
Class is dismissed.
Most podcasters think thatthey need $10,000 to make money.
But what if I told you that'sa myth and you could start monetizing
with just 1500 listeners?Well, that's what Tracy DeForge is
here to explain. Hit it,ladies. The school of Podcasting
with Dave Jackson. Podcastingsince 2005. I'm your award winning
(00:25):
hall of fame podcast coach,Dave Jackson, thanking you so much
for tuning in. If you're newto the show, this is where I help
you plan, launch and grow yourpodcast. If you want to monetize,
I can help with that too, andso can Tracy. That's what we were
talking about. My website isschoolofpodcasting.com use the coupon
(00:46):
code listener when you sign upfor either a monthly, quarterly or
yearly subscription. And ofcourse that comes with a 30, 30 day
money back guarantee. TracyDeforge has been in media really
for 30 years, going back toher days on being on the radio out
in LA. She's probably bestknown for producerpodcast.com but
(01:08):
she's worked with Fortune 500companies, she's worked with major
media outlets, and she is aperson that I with love and respect
refer to as a big shot smartypants. And, and so when I brought
her on, I really wanted to tapinto her knowledge of using a podcast
with a business. I've beengetting a lot of questions about
(01:30):
that and so I asked her aboutthat and asked, where do you start?
Well, I am definitely going tostart with the strategy and I am
going to look at everythingthrough the lens of business development
because I don't know that I'ma big shot, but I am a smarty pants
when it comes to businessdevelopment strategy. And what I
find that a lot of people getexcited about the idea of starting
(01:50):
a podcast, but they, theydon't really necessarily look at
the whole picture, 360 degreesof how it integrates into their business
model, their business, andalso even their time, energy and
bandwidth. Right. Becausethere's so many people out there
saying you should do this andyou should release this many times
and you should do this manythings. And the reality is is you've
(02:11):
got to do what's right for youto make it sustainable. And you have
to create a podcast that'sengaging, that's edu, that provides
education and that is set upfoundational to convert people to
continue that conversationwith you once they have consumed
your content. So there's somuch more to it than just what kind
(02:32):
of mic do I get or or where amI going to record? Or how many times
am I going to release? Youreally want to start with why? Why
the podcast? And then what doyou want the podcast to do? To serve?
How are you going to leveragethat podcast for business growth?
Those are the first two thingsI would talk about. No doubt.
I love that. And the fact thatbefore you even start monetizing,
(02:56):
I always say, you don'tmonetize a podcast, you monetize
an audience. So for the newperson that may not have enough of
an audience to monetize, whatare your strategies for that?
One of the things that I wouldtalk about first is I would look
at how is your podcast fittinginto the rest of your business model.
Again, a conversation peopledon't have frequently enough. You
(03:16):
can't silo off your podcastand expect it to grow and thrive.
And you'd be surprised at thethings that I see. I, I, we were
working with a client and theykept saying, I just, my, my audience
isn't growing, my audienceisn't growing. But my webinars, man,
they're on fire. And I'm like,okay, so they have a webinar marketing
(03:37):
strategy that has, you know, afunnel with opt ins and they're having
like, each email is triggeringanother email. It's triggering, you
know, the whole system thateverybody does for webinars. Not
once in any of this visibilityare they telling this other audience
that they're cultivating,creating and growing that, oh, by
the way, we have a podcast.They weren't thinking of it outside
(04:00):
of just, I release it, Iposted on social media, I record
it, I release it, I posted onsocial media. It's like, no, it's
just not enough anymore. Like,you have to think about every area
that you touch a potentialclient, even down to we were talking
with a, one of our clients,Crazy wealthy podcast. Again, very
niche focused podcast, veryhigh assets under management. Like
(04:24):
really using their podcast ina very specific way to educate clients.
They take qr, you know, cardsto golf tournaments, or they'll host
a golf tournament for theirclients and they'll put the, the
podcast QR code on whateverthat they end up putting out there.
If you're speaking at anevent, make sure it's, you know,
(04:45):
ask people in the audience,okay, I have a podcast. If you've
had fun with me on stagetoday, get out your, get out your
smartphone right now. Go tothe platform where you listen or
watch your podcast and find mypodcast. Like you, you just have
to think about it ineverything that you do. And you have
to literally eat, breathe andsleep it. Not literally, but it's
(05:08):
just so easy to think of it asa wash once, repeat. And it's just
not. It's just not at all.
Absolutely. When I travel, Ialways wear a school of podcasting
T shirt. And when I'm onstage, depending on the situation,
I'm often wearing a podpage Tshirt. Because you always want to
be promoting and a lot of ushave problems with that. We kind
(05:31):
of have a. We feel salesy andmakes us feel weird. So how do you
handle that?
How you feel about sales is amindset issue that you really need
to overcome even before youget behind the mic, because that
is something that you cancustomize and personalize in your
own way. And what feels salesyto you might not feel salesy to someone
(05:51):
else, but you've got to becomfortable and confident about it.
I think that's one of thethings that people don't talk about
enough. Like, I can give you avery. And we can outline some really
strategic ways to drop incalls to action, but it really starts
first with your comfort leveland communicating that call to action.
So when I'm working withclients and strategy, what I like
(06:12):
to say is, you know, you'reresponsible for the energy that you
bring to the mic, what excitesyou to talk about and then taking
that into a warm invitation.Because I think if you get your mind
around the fact that youhaving a conversation about your
business, you showcasingclients, if that's appropriate for
your business model, if you'retalking about your products and services,
like what fires you up aboutit? What do you know you do well?
(06:35):
What do you know that yourproduct or your service, how does
it transform people? What'sthe journey around that? And if you
can tell it and bestorytelling about it or get excited
about it, then that's. Thatenergy is contagious.
All right, I'm going to jumpin here. If you didn't notice, Tracy
just did one. She didn't say,come hire me, but she did say, when
I'm working with clients,that's a very polite way of just
(06:56):
letting the audience know I doconsulting. How about calls to action?
Think of it as if you werehaving a one on one conversation.
Because most people arelistening to their podcast. If they're
listening, they're listeningwith it, with earbuds. It's a very
intimate relationship thatyou're building. So just think about,
I'm asking one person to doone thing and I think that lowers
(07:17):
the. The Stress around feelingsalesy. But nobody wants an infomercial.
So you need to have strategyaround your content, you need to
have strategy around yourpodcast. But you've got to start
with how you feel about it.
And I realize that, you know,for the person that wants to make
money with their podcast, yougot to learn how to sell, because
you're either selling yourstuff or you're selling somebody
(07:37):
else's stuff. And a greatbook. It's an old classic, but man,
it's good. Secrets of Closingthe Sale by Zig Ziglar will help
you get your mind around.You're not selling, you're helping.
And one of the things, foryears everybody was into the whole
you have to tell your story.So I want to ask Tracy about that.
If you're an accountant, whois going to tell your story about
(08:00):
how you got into the financebusiness, is that going to be super
transformative to somebody whowants to then hire you to do their
books or do their taxes? Imean, maybe they want to get to know
you, but they probably want toknow more about what kind of innovative
new way or how do you take theload off of them or what's in it
for them, basically. And Ithink that no matter Whether it's
your first episode or your100th episode or your 1000th episode,
(08:24):
you have to enter into everypiece of content that you create
with what's in it for youraudience and not what's in it for
you. Because your story mightbe interesting, it might be a game
changing story story. But ifit's not something that is going
to ultimately benefit or bringvalue to your customer or your client,
(08:44):
is it necessary? You know, Idon't know.
Oh, I do. I think it's reallyunnecessary. Think about it again,
My criteria. Does it make itlaugh? Does it make you laugh, cry,
think grown, educate orentertain? And in most cases it doesn't.
And for the love of God, don'tread your LinkedIn bio. That's as
dry as yesterday's toast. Butyou can work in calls to action.
(09:06):
It doesn't have to be at the end.
So it's just being mindful andstarting to place that deliberately
into conversations throughoutthe episode. I think a lot of times
it's a myth that you have towait till the end to have the call
to action. But a call toaction can be dropped in if you're
transitioning into a specialsegment, if you're opening the show
(09:27):
talking about the school ofpodcasting, if you're, you know,
all of these are differentways that you can connect with your
audience so that theyunderstand what it is that you do.
So you'll notice that lastweek I said, I'm no longer interrupting
interviews to put in a call toaction. That's something I just chose.
I find it's a little toodisruptive, which I realize is kind
(09:47):
of good from a marketingstandpoint, but not so great from
an experience standpoint. Butin the end, you have to let them
know what it is you do. When Iwas in Chicago last week, they said,
you are a brand, you're not apodcast, and you want to be known
for whatever it is you do.You'll notice that I occasionally
throw in, my name is DaveJackson. I help podcasters. It's
(10:10):
what I do. So when somebodygoes, I need help with my podcast,
you'll go, oh, I know a guynamed Dave Jackson. You have to let
people know what you do.
This is the perfect time foran honest, like, true story about
a client we had who does sevenfigure business consulting. She'd
been podcasting for over threeyears, consistently showing up like,
you know, recording herpodcast. She came to work with us
(10:34):
because her show wasn'tgrowing, her business wasn't growing
quite as well as she washoping that it would. We tweaked
the way she did her intro sothat she was explaining that this
was her podcast and theresult, the reason she was doing
this podcast is because sheoffered these services to people
who wanted to be seven figureentrepreneurs. The first episode
(10:54):
after she tweaked her intro,she closed a five figure client on
coaching services. But themost important part of the story
is that the person who sheclosed said to her, I've been listening
to your podcast for years andI didn't know how you could help
(11:14):
me. That is, for years, thisperson, I didn't know how you could
help me. Now, there's nothingsalesy about that person genuinely
wanted to understand becauseshe liked the host, she liked the
content, she liked the show.Clearly she kept showing up and was
finding some value from it,but she couldn't connect the dots.
(11:38):
The host wasn't building thebridge between the podcast conversations
and how she could help aclient. And when she did that one
time, five figures in revenue.So it's really just not my opinion.
It's really truly very important.
But I know you may bethinking, but I don't believe. I
(11:58):
mean, I've been doing this fora couple years. I'm not sure if I
have enough downloads. If myaudience, if my reach is big, Enough
to look for sponsorships and partnerships.
I think there's just this hugemyth that you can't monetize your
show unless you have 10,000downloads per episode or more. You
and I both know most cases areeven 1500 or less or 1000 or less.
(12:22):
And so is that still possiblefor monetization? Absolutely. Absolutely
it is. What you have to thinkabout are a couple of things. One
is what are you doing in yourbusiness in addition to your podcast?
So it might seem like a nobrainer, but a lot of times that
gets overlooked. So have youbeen blogging for years before you
(12:42):
started your podcast? Do youhave a robust social media on at
least one channel? Do you havea consistent newsletter that you've
been sending out monthly orweekly? Do you show up at community
events? Are you a speaker?Have you published a book? Like the
first, first thing that youwant to think about is what are the
multiple ways that a brand, ifthey were to align with you and work
(13:04):
with you, what are the multiomnichannel fancy pants sprays? But
what are the multiple reasonsand touch points that you can reach
an audience that that brandcan be connected with? That's your
first thing that you want tolook at and figure out. And then
the second thing is, is likestart looking at your own products
and services as your firstsponsor. I like to tell people your
(13:29):
podcast is oceanfront realestate. So start using it first to
even let people know that youwant sponsorships. One of the things
that we talk a lot about atProducer Podcast is bringing in what's
called the Powered by sponsor.And the Powered by sponsor is a really
great way. It's how you openyour show. You know, it is the growth
(13:50):
accelerator podcast, Poweredby Producer Podcasts. I mean, I'm
using that example becausethat's ours. But it could be powered
by shure mics, it could bepowered by, you know, mailchimp,
it could be powered byanybody. Right? But the, the way
that you can do that is that'snot taking inventory. It's not a
60 or 90 second long liveread. It's just a way to announce
(14:12):
to your audience and have yourbrand affiliated with you and your
show out of the gate. Andthat's something that people could
charge $250 for $25,000 for,depending on how many people that
they're reaching off of it.But it's an, it's for somebody who
isn't in like eating,breathing and sleeping the sponsorship
and brand advertising world.It's a really easy thing to, to get
(14:35):
your brain around. And thesecond thing is create a signature
piece of content that you canput a sponsor adjacent to inside
your podcast. So that could betips, that could be takeaways, that
could be, I mean, we have afunny podcast, the fans first, it's
a sports podcast. They have aspecial segment called get off my
Lawn and it has a funny, youknow, curmudgeony character, you
(14:58):
know, get my lawn. And thenit's a fan rant. And so that's such
an easily sponsored featureand it's a fun production element
for your audience and you candrop a sponsor adjacent to that.
So you just have to thinkabout like, what are the easiest
low hanging fruit from theproduction perspective that I could
deliver consistently. Then youhave to look at your inner network
(15:21):
first. This is the piece thatpeople underestimate all of the time.
They, they really overestimatethe number of people that know what
it is that they do. But mostof the time people will underestimate
the number of people theyknow. So you have to think about
church, your ball field, youknow, who you, who's, you know, your
(15:42):
wife or your husband's friendsthat own businesses and who, who
are people that would want tobe aligned with my types of content
or the vendors that you'vebeen doing business with for years.
We had a interior designpodcast. They had been in business
for over a decade when theystarted their show. They had a 10
(16:02):
year history of buyingwallpaper and paint and faucets from
Kohler. And you know, theseare long term relationships. They
already know the quality ofthis, these women, the quality of
their work. So when theystarted a podcast, it was a natural
conversation to go back to abrand like Kohler and say, hey, we
(16:23):
started a podcast and we'vealready been blogging, we've already
had really great websitetraffic. We've already been, you
know, really consistent withour social. Do you want to be involved
in our podcast? It was notjust a yes, it was a hell yes. And
so they monetized reallyquickly out of the gate. And I think
it's just people not realizingthat they can ask first. Like, I
(16:44):
think if anybody takesanything away from this episode today,
hopefully they'll take awaythe. You don't get it if you don't
ask, but it, but when you ask,they may say no, but you're going
to get data. And so then youcan take that data into the next
conversation. And it's justabout having a conversation. It's
so intimidating sometimesbecause I don't sell ads. I don't
know anything about sellingads, but you know how to talk about
(17:06):
your business and you know howto talk about how you're transforming
your audience by themlistening and consuming your content
and who doesn't want to be apart of that.
Right, Exactly. And one of thehardest things is, well, what do
I charge has to.
Be valued based on what arethe things that you can do for them.
So are you going to add linksand logos in your show notes again?
(17:27):
Coming back to being able tolook at the podcast is the hub of
the content strategy wherethey will get visibility. But if
you're going to get intobigger numbers, you're going to be
able to look at the podcastplus and plus the other visibility
and touch points. You alsohave to think about like what kind
(17:47):
of numbers like with any kindof budget or business profitability
or any kind of forecasting youwould do like anything else, you
want to do that for yourpodcast too. So a lot of times people
will say I would be glad if Ijust got with my production costs
covered. So I have no ideawhat anyone's production cost. You
only know what your productioncosts. Unless you're working with
us, then I do know what yourproduction costs are. But if that's
(18:10):
where your barometer is likeis that your baseline? So okay, well
I want to build packages thatare going to cover my cost of my
production plus my time andmaybe 10%. And so you figure out
for I like easy math. So let'ssay that's $5,000. And then you want
to back into it from there andsay okay, so I could do a powered
(18:30):
by, I could do a specialsponsor, I could have a founder or
CEO on my podcast, which isnot pay to play. It's just building
that visibility piece intoyour package. Maybe you release that
episode on separate day, notin your regular cadence. And so you
start to layer up what thesepackages look like. But you have
to have a number that you wantto meet a goal, an objective like
(18:51):
I want to cover my costs. Thisis what my costs are. So I need this
plus and then you just startbuilding the packages. And it's not
that it's a willy nilly typeof thing, but you it's really depending
on the value you're going tobring to them and the type of business
it is too. Because a highticket coach with 350 highly like
(19:13):
really engaged people and youwant to talk about project management
systems or you want to talkabout bookkeeping services or you
want to talk like that is aYou don't need a lot of people to
convert somebody to a projectmanagement system or to convert,
you know, you just, you don'tneed that many people. So you have
to talk about it that way too.
And you got to remember whenshe says you don't have to have that
(19:34):
many people, those are peoplethat are engaged. So we're talking
the difference between having500 people that were hanging on every
word versus 50,000 people thattuned in and out every now and then.
And when you have an engagedaudience, you can do stuff like this.
So we are seeing people getanywhere from $250 for a special
(19:58):
segment for these are the muchsmaller audiences. When I say much
smaller audiences, I'm talkingabout 1500 downloads or less. Okay,
so these are real deals. Theseare not things that we are pie in
the sky. These are. So if you,because most branded niche business
development focused podcastsare smaller audiences by design,
they're never going to be the10 million or even the 10,000 downloads
(20:22):
for that matter. So anywherefrom 250, 500, 1000, $1500 an episode,
those are okay numbers to askif you are going to be getting in
front, putting them in frontof a very well targeted audience,
if you're going to be puttingthem in other areas of your marketing
(20:43):
strategy. So I think it's fairto say, like, is it 5,000, I don't
know how, how many socialmedia followers do you have? How,
what's your SEO like? All ofthose kind of things. But in, but
just starting out, you canjust start asking for 500, 1500 dollars
per episode. And if yourelease four times a month, that
starts to add up. We alsorecommend that you don't have to
(21:06):
sell, don't go keep asking forone episode at a time. Do a three
month, do 13 episodes. Do youknow, take the pressure off yourself.
Like, try to get thosepackages to be like, if you're only
going to get $250 an episodefor a special segment, make that
a 13 or a 26 week agreement sothat you can start to, to build that
(21:26):
revenue base up for yourself.
Produce your podcast.com iswhere you can find all things Tracy.
And again, she doeseverything. Check it out again. Produce
your podcast.com, traciDeforge, thanks so much for coming
on the show.
Thank you, Dave. I'm so happyto be here and it was such a fun
conversation and I lookforward to continuing this conversation
(21:47):
with you at a conference inthe near future, I'm sure.
Absolutely. Thank you so much,Tracy. And speaking of conferences.
(24:41):
The school of podcasting.Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Tracy really is fun to bearound. That's the other thing I
like about Tracy. We alwayshave a good time and a good laugh.
The one thing I thought Iwould chime in on, and I heard this
tip, and I was like, that's.That's a good one. That is when it.
Cause we don't know what tocharge. So here's the thing. If you
(25:01):
haven't heard no yet, you'renot charging enough. That's a simple
rule. If you've. Every timeyou've thrown a number out and they
go, oh, yeah, great, okay,there's probably money on the table.
I remember when I interviewedJoe Salsihai from Stacking Benjamin's.
That was one of his things, ishe kept raising the price until he
finally heard no, that was wayback on episode 562. Back in the
(25:26):
day, me and Joe Salsey High.So that's something to keep in mind.
But I wanted to talk aboutthis salesy thing because, look,
right now, as we speak thisFriday, I'm launching an actual campaign
in my newsletter. Then this iswhy having a coach is a good thing,
because he's like, what werethe numbers on your last campaign?
(25:47):
I'm like, what do you mean,campaign? I'm like, I send emails
and stuff. He goes, no. Whereyou actually try to sell something.
And I'm like, oh, and boy. SoI'm actually trying to sell something
in my newsletter starting thisFriday, and I feel very salesy. And
so I thought, let's talk aboutthat. And like I said, probably one
of the best books is from ZigZiglar. It's called Secrets of Closing
(26:12):
the Sale. And Zig Ziglar is agreat example of how the power of
storytelling is just hugebecause he. He has all this great
information, but he's fromAlabama and me, and he calls his
wife the old redhead, and, youknow, water pumping and doing that.
He just. Everything's a story,and you can see it. He triggers the
(26:33):
theater of the mind. And atthe end, you're like, I can do that.
So he said the. He emphasizesthat you're selling is not about
pushing your own gain. Like, Ineed to make my commission, but it's
about helping others solvetheir problems and, you know, fulfill
their needs, whatever it isthey're trying to do. So this is
(26:55):
where I mentioned last week,Justin Moore's book sponsor, Magnet.
And by the way, Justin'scoming on the show, so if you have
a question for him, feel freeto send it on over, just go to schoolofpodcasting.com
contact and he said, really?Zig Ziglar, again, is the focus is
on serving the customer andproviding real value. He says when
(27:20):
you do that, that salesyfeeling disappears. And so this is
where you have to really knowwho your audience is. And when you
know you're solving theirproblem, then you know you're not
selling them, you're servingthem. You know, so shift your focus
to the benefit that you'redelivering to the customer. And if
(27:42):
you're like, well, I'm notreally sure. Well, then go make sure,
find some people to take yourcourse or to buy your product or
whatever you're doing and thensay, did that work for you? And if
they go, oh, are you kiddingme? That was amazing. Well, then,
you know, you're helping them,you know, and by that, that means
you're gonna have toexperiment a little bit. So when
(28:05):
you first start out, you'relike, hey, try this. And they might
go, ew, right? So seeeverything, not so much as a do or
die. So many people, if Idon't do this, then I'm gonna kill
my podcast. Well, wait, holdon. That's feedback. When you try
something and it doesn't work,that's feedback. And you go, oh,
I probably shouldn't do that.And then you tweak it. And then again,
(28:26):
as always, maintain aconsistent schedule. Be consistent
in your effort as well as thevalue of your content. But he really
talks about the bottom line.For Zig, it's all about serving others
and really believing yourproduct or service is the best of
(28:49):
the, you know, bunch, for lackof a better phrase. And then he does
it. One of his key things iswhen you're talking to someone, ask
questions instead of justtelling them about your product.
Because the more youunderstand their problem, the more
you will see how your productor service or your podcast or whatever
(29:10):
is going to solve that. And ifyou can see it solving it, then you're
not selling them, you'rehelping them. So keep that in mind.
Because the one thing thatTracy said that is so true, if you
don't ask, you don't get. Andthe more you ask, you know, yes,
at first, again, some peoplemay say no, realize no, often is,
(29:34):
not now. But you gotta ask andyou kind of get used to it. I have
had people ask me, why do Isay, you know, hall of fame podcast
award winning guy at thebeginning. And that was from a coach
that said, hey, how manypeople can say that? And I go, I
don't know, probably when Igot inducted, 10 or so, 15 maybe.
(29:57):
I don't know. He's like, youneed to say that at the beginning
of every show. And I was kindof like, eh, you know, Keel's like,
ooh, look. He's like, no, no,that's credibility. You know, it's
something you can say. Noteverybody can say it. You need to
say it. So if you ever wonderwhy I always start off with award
winning hall of fame podcastcoach, and he goes, by the way, is
that a fact? And I go, yeah, Igot the statue sitting behind me.
(30:20):
If you ever see me on video.He goes, well, then you're not lying.
He goes, you're just, youknow, pointing out that that's the
truth. And I'm like, oh, yeah,I guess so. So whether it's imposter
syndrome or just feelingawkward, anytime you do anything
new, you're gonna feelawkward. Remember that as well. But
(30:40):
you can overcome this, youknow, kind of. I don't want to be
salesy. There are ways to sellwithout being this Sunday. Sunday,
Sunday. Right. So it doesn'thave to be that either. But you can
do it if you want to. Again,as always, since we're talking about
making money today, I alwayshave to remind people you don't have
to make money with yourpodcast to be a valid podcast. You
(31:02):
could do it just for fun. Butfor those of you who are, and I saw
a lot of questions this week,so I was like, ah, it's time to bust
out the Tracy interview. Well,you got some good tips. Quick Housekeeping.
Back on episode 991, I wastalking about how to podcast and
stay married. And I totallyforgot to mention school of podcasting
(31:26):
members Greg and Linda Smith.They do a Show married in lovett.com.
those two been married foreverand they're sharing their tips on
how to stay married and loveit. I'll have a link to that out
in the show notes. Next weekon the show, I'll be interviewing
David Hooper. He is the authorof the book Big Podcast. He's the
(31:48):
host of the show Build a BigPodcast. He's also part of music
business radio. And Dave isnow on satellite radio. And so we
talk about what skills that hehad as a podcast and as a broadcaster.
How did that get him intosatellite radio along with stuff
like this? Success is a greatdeodorant in that if you've got some
(32:11):
stuff on the outside thatlooks great, maybe you don't have
to look at the inside and Irealized that I wasn't living life,
not really. You know, I waskind of paving over some stuff. And
of course you can follow theshow by going to schoolofpodcasting.com
follow and never miss anepisode. And if you need help with
your podcast, I'm DaveJackson. I help podcasters. It's
(32:33):
what I do and I would love tosee what we can do together. Go over
to schoolofpodcasting.com joinand use the coupon code listener.
That's L I S S T E N E R whenyou sign up for either a monthly,
quarterly or yearlysubscription. And that does come
with a 30 day money backguarantee along with step by step
(32:55):
courses, unlimited coachingand one of the best podcast communities
on the Internet. This in awhile. Currently using a rode podmic
USB into a rodecaster duo intoHindenburg journalists. My primary
plugin is the chef's Omnichannel. I love that thing and I
(33:20):
am hosted. This show is hostedon Captivate. If you need a website
check out PodPage. And ourhost is Dave Jackson. Our producer
is Dave Jackson. Our editor isDave Jackson. Our music music consultant
is Dave Jackson. The graphicdesigner is Dave Jackson. What else?
(33:41):
Assistant to the cousin of thebrother of storyboarding is Dave
Jackson. Thanks for tuning in.Until next week. Take care. God bless.
Class is dismissed.
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