June 9, 2025 • 29 mins
Best Books? – Chris Boyd opens this episode with a story from his most recent trip to the
dentist where the hygienist was asking for financial planning book recommendations and
advice as to how she should go about finding a financial planner who is willing to work
with someone who has a modest income and assets. Chris and co-host Jeff Perry suggest
a wide variety of books for people at various stages of their financial journey. The
dialogue shifts to the challenges of finding a financial planner. Jeff shares the three
questions that everyone should ask to anyone in the financial services industry who they
are considering working with.
For more information or to reach TEAM AMR, click the following link:
https://www.wealthenhancement.com/s/advisor-teams/amr
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome to Something More with Chris Boyd.
Chris Boyd is a Certified Financial Planner Practitioner
and Senior Vice President and Financial Advisor at
Wealth Enhancement Group, one of the nation's largest
registered investment advisors.
We call it Something More because we'd like
to talk not only about those important dollar
and cents issues, but also the quality of
life issues that make the money matters matter.
(00:22):
Here he is, your fulfillment facilitator, your partner
in prosperity, advising clients on Cape Cod and
across the country.
Here's your host, Jay Christopher Boyd.
Thanks for being with us for another episode
of Something More with Chris Boyd.
I'm Chris Boyd.
I'm here with Jeff Perry.
We are both of the AMR team at
Wealth Enhancement and glad to have you joining
(00:43):
us.
So Jeff, I went for a dental cleaning
this week and yesterday and felt badly afterwards
as I was getting a coffee.
Yeah, all the good stuff.
Had my teeth cleaned.
Ruined it with a coffee.
(01:04):
Red wine, coffee, sugar, all those things that
are the joys of life in some ways.
Your dental planning.
Yeah.
But anyway, as I was there, it was
a very nice dental hygienist who was Laureen,
who asked me, oh, what do you do?
So she said, I went to go to
(01:29):
a financial planner about a year ago and
then he ghosted me and I never heard
back from him.
So she's like, so we'll come back to
that.
But in the process, she said, what's your
favorite personal finance book?
What do you recommend?
(01:49):
I'm reading Rich Dad, Poor Dad.
I was like, oh, that's a good choice.
So I thought that circumstance would be the
premise of our show today.
Let's start with the books.
What are some great book ideas?
And I, in the process, I asked Co
(02:11):
-Pilot, our AI, for some thoughts on best
personal finance books in the process I thought
might be interesting.
So it started off with this year's and
I was like, no, I want all time
best.
Right.
All right.
So these are pretty good.
I think some of these you'll know.
(02:31):
Some of them I don't know.
Oh, but before we do.
Yes.
Do you want to weigh in on, you're
a student of personal finance.
You are, I think, someone who's done a
lot of reading.
I probably read literally a hundred different personal
finance books over the decades.
Wow.
(02:52):
So you must have a few that stand
out.
I do.
I do.
I have definitely some favorites.
Oh, you want my favorites?
Yeah.
So what are your favorites?
So it depends on the subject.
So back in the day when I was
just wanting to devour as much information as
I could get, I was reading books from
(03:13):
like Susie Orman, Bob Brinker, a radio show
host, had a book, a book list.
There were the Dolans who were radio people,
but they were also writing books.
And those were all like, um, kind of
broad based.
Like, you know, you need, do you need
life insurance?
How much should you say?
(03:33):
Just like really the basics.
Right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And then it's like most people, I'm no
different than most people when they're studying something,
they go from the, the general to the,
like, okay, I got the basics.
I need more.
Yeah.
So I think my favorite or my early
favorite, most memorable investing book was one up
in wall street by Peter Lynch, where he
(03:55):
talked about his investing style and how stocks,
bonds, mutual funds, how they work, you know,
the inner, not just the basics of what
they are, but how they work and why
they're important to your portfolio.
And then there was a period where I
started listening to Dave Ramsey, the Ramsey show,
(04:16):
and he and his team have had dozens
of books published.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, and I, when I was starting to
think about retire, there was a book by
Chris Hogan, um, retire inspired.
So not just the dollars and cents, as
you might say.
(04:36):
Um, but like the, you know, this should
be something, this should be something more than
a math formula.
Exactly.
Yup.
Yup.
Love that.
And, um, when we were updating our financial
plan, I read, uh, the, the legacy journey.
So there's so many on so many subjects
that I've read over the years.
(04:57):
Um, but you know, something's happened to me
and I think it's happening to most people
is we're reading less books, consuming information in
other ways.
Right.
I mean, podcasts here we are.
Right.
Yeah.
So when you find someone that you feel
that is giving you good information and it's
helpful, you tend to listen to them more
(05:21):
than read.
At least that's what's happened to me.
I still read, I have a book over
here.
Uh, it's right on the top there.
It is how to retire by how to
retire by Christine Benz.
Oh yeah.
She's great.
She's got plenty of books too.
Yeah.
Morningstar has tons of publications also.
Yeah.
(05:42):
It's on my pile because I'm going to
give it to a friend who's not a
client, but he's asked me, he said he's
thinking about retiring and I talked to him
and I'm going to follow up and have
him read that book because it's, it's a
little bit about a lot of things.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So there's, well, I think you make a
great point that, um, you know, if you,
(06:02):
if you were to talk about personal finance
and overview, that's one kind of category.
An investing book is a different category.
And even within that, you could get into,
you know, various types of investing approaches, you
know, that you could, uh, pursue.
I, um, yeah, I was thinking, well, it
(06:24):
was my favorite book and I was coming
across a, I couldn't remember the name of
this book.
It's, it was almost more of a textbook
in some respects.
Cause a lot of the books that like
I've done coursework for my professional development or
whatever, you know?
Um, and so those aren't really kind of
tech more technical, you know, but this particular
(06:46):
one was, was kind of a blend of,
it was just a ton of the, the
foundational basics, but it was done in a,
in an interesting way.
And it had some of the specifics, but
it also was more conversational in tone.
Right.
So I'm sorry, I don't remember the name
(07:06):
of it, but it, uh, I'll tell you
the background.
I, I used to do these seminars in
the nineties and the company that produced them
was called, uh, successful money management seminars.
Okay.
And then they created, um, financial security, no
(07:28):
financial strategies for secure retirement.
And then I did for re that was
geared toward pre-retirees.
And I did the one that was geared
toward retirees, lifelong strategies, um, LFS lifelong financial
strategies.
So, um, the author of these seminars had
(07:50):
this book that I was thinking about, but
they've retired, they sold the whole thing.
I went looking, I can't find it, but
anyway.
Um, but there's so many good options.
Let me, let me go through some of
the names.
You're going to recognize a lot of this
and, um, you've already given a few good
ideas already.
So here's a few, um, the millionaire next
(08:13):
door.
Oh, great.
I've read that.
Dr. Uh, Thomas Stanley.
Um, and there's, there's a, um, uh, a
followup for the revision.
Yeah.
I read the revision to a few years
ago and his daughter came out with another,
like an updated kind of version of this.
(08:33):
The, the insight of that one that I
always stuck with me was the distinction between
affluence and wealth.
Yep.
And that really was, uh, a significant eye
-opener.
Don't you think in terms of, there's, there's
people who have lots of money, lots of
income, and they may spend a lot of
(08:53):
that with a nice house and a big
car and fancy car or whatever.
And, and the, and the trips or Yep.
But are they creating wealth?
And so affluence may be about lifestyle, but
wealth is the accumulation of assets.
And, um, ultimately we, and the millionaire next
(09:15):
door is just the idea that it may
not be the people that look the most
successful who are the most wealthy.
That is so true.
And the people with all the, the shiny
stuff are most likely in debt.
Yeah, exactly.
You could have a huge income, lots of
great lifestyle, but you could be really underwater.
Right.
Yeah.
(09:35):
So yeah, that was a really, uh, insightful
and just a good book.
Um, you'll like the next one.
I bet the Bogle head's guide to investing.
Um, this was, uh, referencing Jack Bogle.
Yeah, that was a while ago.
Yeah.
Uh, he has the next book, the little
book of common sense investing, uh, by him,
(09:58):
uh, Jack Bogle, uh, your money or your
life, uh, by, uh, Vicki Robin and, uh,
Joe Dominguez.
I don't know that one.
I do not know that one either.
I will teach you to be rich.
Um, the next one we just talked about
earlier, rich dad, poor dad, right?
That's the one.
(10:19):
So she's made a good choice.
Yes.
Uh, the next one is really more of
an investing book of the intelligent investor, which
you were referencing on a podcast just a
few weeks ago.
We were talking about Warren Buffett and he,
uh, attributes much of his success to the
author of that book, Benjamin Graham, his mentor.
(10:39):
Now that's an old book now, but, uh,
anyway, some of these principles still apply.
Um, Dave Ramsey's is the next one.
There you go.
Um, total money makeover.
Yeah.
Great place for someone who might have debt
that they're struggling with.
And, you know, at the beginning of their
journey, it's a great foundational book.
(11:00):
The next one is a classic Napoleon Hills
think and grow rich.
Yep.
And, uh, I read this one.
I don't know if you read this one,
uh, Tony Robbins, um, this money master of
the game.
Yep.
I have read that.
It's, um, it's funny.
I didn't enjoy it that much, uh, because
I think maybe because of I'm being a
(11:21):
professional, you know what I mean?
It's a bit raw, right?
Yeah.
But at the same time, um, I bet
for someone starting out, that would be, that
would be a great, um, a lot, there's
a lot of great content in there.
I liked what he had to say.
I love motivational parts of these books, especially
when you're like unsure and the motivational tone
(11:45):
can really get you excited about starting.
Cause starting is the toughest part for a
lot of people, like getting organized and starting.
Cause it seems just so, I mean, you
can do the math and say, Oh yeah,
that's what I can end up with a
million dollars or, you know, whatever it is.
But to start with your first hundred dollars
is where do I begin?
It's like someone who's really overweight and that
(12:07):
those first steps on the walk and the
first saying no to that treat is the
toughest, right?
Getting started is the toughest.
So the motivational books have a place, especially
at the beginning of your financial journey.
Good point.
The, uh, the, uh, I'll, I'll, we'll come
back and talk about the, um, the challenges
(12:28):
that, uh, Laureen ran into, but let me,
uh, just hit on, I'll just run through
some of these books that were, um, uh,
I said, well, what about best investment investing
books of all time?
Here's what the list came out with the
intelligent investor.
Next one, Ben Graham and David Dodd, Graham
(12:52):
and Dodd.
You've heard of the value investor, sure.
You know, classic value investors.
Um, security analysis is that book, um, a
random walk down wall street street, um, um,
common stocks and uncommon profits.
The essays of Warren Buffett.
(13:14):
I didn't know that was a book.
Yeah.
Um, the little book of common sense investing
we talked about on the last list.
Uh, you mentioned Peter Lynch one up on
wall street.
Yeah.
I think a lot of people like Peter
Lynch cause that that's really accessible to say,
invest what you know, and pursue the things
(13:37):
that you observe, you know, the, where you
see still makes sense today.
Yeah.
You know, it's, it's like, there's a, there's
a accessibility of that.
Oh, I like that.
Yeah.
Anyway.
Um, the most important thing by Howard Marks,
uh, reminiscences of stock operator of a stock
operator.
And then the last one, uh, market wizards.
(14:00):
Anyway, I'll know some of those, but, uh,
okay.
Just threw it out there.
Some books for people to, if they're looking
for that list, let's talk about the other
aspect of this circumstance.
I'm curious if there's more to the story
with your hygienist.
Yeah.
So she, she said she had, um, tried
(14:22):
to meet with someone and, um, and had
a conversation then never heard back from them.
And I said, Oh, was, was he a
fiduciary?
She said, yes.
Are you a fiduciary?
You know, I immediately asked me.
I like that.
She's asking.
Yeah.
Which was good.
Yeah.
(14:42):
Um, and she's thinking about like, I liked
that.
She was talking about like, Oh, I want
to create, you know, multiple income streams, you
know, that kind of mindset.
So she's got, got the right idea.
Um, that idea of creating wealth and generating
cashflow from it.
Diversification.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But in any case, um, so, uh, you
(15:05):
know, I mean, while I'm like getting my
teeth prodded, so I couldn't, it wasn't a
lengthy conversation, you know what I mean?
But, uh, but in any case, um, uh,
it sounded like, you know, I was thinking
it's, it's challenging for people who are starting
out because our industry is really geared toward
(15:27):
working with people who have assets to manage
our, our compensation structure generally for advisors is,
uh, designed around assets under management.
Um, and so there's less incentive for advisors
to work with people who are starting out.
(15:49):
Now there are some compensation models that are
geared toward this, this population, but even those
require a wealth or, you know, income because,
you know, you're going to be charged for
time or, you know, some commitment of time.
Uh, it's common for some advisors, not, uh,
(16:10):
not everyone, but some advisors say, well, we'll
charge a subscription fee.
I'm going to charge you $250 a month
or whatever it is.
Right.
And we'll do your financial planning.
We'll help you prioritize.
We'll, you know, get you on the right
path.
But that's a commitment of a substantial sum
of money.
Right.
That's not going toward your savings investing or
(16:33):
debt reduction or whatever the priorities might be.
So, um, that's challenging, you know?
Uh, similarly, uh, if you work with an
advisor who doesn't charge you for time in
some fashion hourly or of the sort, you're
probably working with someone who's compensated to sell
(16:54):
you products.
Right.
And that can create challenges.
May it, if, if the advisor to use
that word loosely, maybe they have one product
that they sell or three products that they
sell.
Yeah.
Oh, you're a good fit for an annuity
life insurance or whatever.
Right.
(17:14):
That's their, you know, like that's their wheelhouse,
uh, where maybe that's not what's desirable for
you with what you're trying to do.
Right.
Um, so trying to find that, um, counsel
is, is definitely challenging as someone who's starting
out.
I know this is an area that you're
passionate about.
(17:35):
So I thought it would be an interesting
topic to just to discuss a little bit.
And by the way, I did give her
your name and email address saying, Hey, you
know, if you want to talk to Jeff,
um, you know, our firm, you know, uh,
can be a resource, but Jeff particularly loves
working with people who are motivated and getting
(17:55):
started.
Yeah.
I certainly won't give his name, but you
know, this is kind of timely.
Last week I did a review of a
young man who came with very little assets.
He was out of college getting his first
job and he wanted to start off on
the right course.
Yeah.
And, uh, a year later, or maybe it's
(18:16):
a year and a half now, but he's
made significant progress.
He's putting away money in his 401k.
That's, you know, he sees building, he started
a Roth IRA, he's full, fully funding it
every year.
And he just says, because he lives, he
has no debt.
He didn't create debt.
Um, since he's living below his means, he
(18:39):
has a good salary after, after college, but
he's sucking away money in a brokerage account
that he'll, you know, he doesn't have it
earmarked.
I can, we talked about what he thinks
it might be used for.
It might be used to buy his first
home.
Sure.
That makes sense.
But whatever it's used for.
Um, so he's got two retirements building.
He's in his mid twenties.
(19:00):
He's aggressively saving for this big goal, which
say it's a house.
Um, he's building wealth.
He's managing no debt because he's being responsible.
And I mean, so it's, you know, financially
as far as fees or anything, it's not
as productive as having a $10 million client
(19:22):
come in.
But I, you know, I have to, I
have to admit, I get more joy, I
guess, out of these little things that you
can inspire people.
To do when they're young and they're motivated
to do it.
Yeah.
Absolutely change their trajectory and foundational.
Yeah.
These habits that he's building and other, you
(19:44):
know, he's just the example from last week,
but these habits that young people can build
or helping people who have bad habits, you
know, make corrective courses and make changes in
their lives.
I mean, that's, that's, that's a great choice
of being motivated though.
Right.
You know, have to be, uh, you know,
(20:06):
serious about making these decisions and what's involved
in that, you know?
Yeah.
And if they are, they can make changes
that will forever, you know, improve their financial
stability and their financial success.
But, you know, sometimes you get people who
present as motivated, but they're really, they're coming
(20:27):
out of desperation and they're not ready to,
I mean, with anything that you're doing is
something you're giving up, right?
So if you're not staying within your means
or you're not ready to make those commitments
to your, your own future, then it's tough
to change that for somebody.
Yeah.
Um, I, I think, um, just to go
(20:48):
back to the notion of, um, the industry,
I think, I just, I don't think there's
an easy answer.
There's not a, there's not an ideal solution.
There may be, um, you know, multiple avenues
to pursue.
There may be some resources that are, you
know, relatively low costs.
(21:09):
There may be, there may be possibilities, but
I think at some level it, it requires,
if you're going to get professional help, there's
going to be a cost.
Sure.
Well, trying to find maybe that, how do
you get started?
Um, there are, you know, resources, podcasts, like
(21:33):
we were just talking about, people consume information
through podcasts like ours and others.
Um, you mentioned, uh, some, some of the
greats over the time, you know, the radio
listening that you've done with, you know, but
Dave Ramsey to this day has got a
lot of great resources for people as they
get started.
(21:53):
As they get started.
And, you know, Dave Ramsey has, um, always
suggested that people work with a financial advisor,
right.
You know, when they, when they have that
need, when they get through there, he has
baby steps when he gets through there, like
get your emergency fund, pay down your debt,
contribute to your 401k.
And then yeah, covered.
(22:15):
Okay.
We got the groundwork laid.
That's right.
Then you get to a more complex, right.
That's right.
Um, I think that's, that's good counsel.
Um, so in any case, um, I don't
know what else I just, this was on
my mind and I was like, having just
gone through that, I thought, Oh, this is
a, this is a topic that's challenging, but
(22:36):
worthy of discussion.
You know, it's absolutely challenging to a lot
of people.
I think the, the individuals have the, you
know, my example of the gentleman, um, that
young man we're helping, um, is a bit
unique.
Most people, when they get that first kind
of real job and they have that paperwork
in front of them and, you know, Oh,
(22:57):
we have a 401k.
Okay.
What is that?
You know?
So that's, that's a good time to seek
counsel.
Like, yeah, that's a good point.
Right.
Because a lot of times people just fill
out the and move on.
Right.
And may miss out on opportunity.
That's right.
Uh, may be because they're unfamiliar with markets
and risk.
(23:18):
Oh, the terms themselves.
They may be sitting in a, like a,
a fixed interest account when in reality they've
got maybe 40 years before they plan on
accessing these four resources and they'd be better
served with a more invested, uh, approach to
(23:39):
the, those funds or even worse.
They say, um, I don't know what that
is.
I'll deal with it later.
Do I have to do it now?
No, you don't.
You know, so yeah.
Missed opportunity may be giving up on, uh,
voluntary, uh, compensation.
Uh, if they don't do a match, if
they don't actually contribute, they may be giving
up on the match, which is, you know,
(24:02):
volunteering for a lower pay.
Yeah.
Free money, as they say.
Right.
Yeah.
But it all comes down to, um, seek
counsel and educate yourself.
You know, we're, we're, we're all responsible to
educate ourselves of the basics.
And I, I absolutely love what your hygienist
was asking you about.
Are you fiduciary?
(24:22):
Because you've heard my three things.
Um, and she, she got the first one,
like whoever you're working with, I don't in
the financial sector world, um, ask if they're
fiduciary and that means, uh, to, are they,
do they have your best interest at heart?
Are they, are they morally, ethically, legally responsible
to give you advice that is in your
(24:42):
best interest and not their own?
So that's a yes.
You want to hear yes.
The second one, um, is how are they
compensated?
You know, you've touched on different ways, but
if someone you're about to work with and
you're about to pay, however, that either pay
by your assets or pay, you know, hourly
or whatever the model is, if they can't
(25:04):
explain to you how they're compensated within a
minute, you know, maybe, maybe it's not a
straightforward way of compensation.
Maybe there, that should raise your, uh, your
concerns just for a moment or two to
step back.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Just step up and say, I don't, I'm
not sure.
Are you fiduciary?
Yes.
How are you compensated?
Reasonably quick answer.
(25:25):
And the third is where is, where are
my assets?
Where will my money be held?
We want it held at a third party
custodian.
The person giving you the advice, it's just
prudent and wise for them not to be
actually handling your actual dollars.
Yeah.
You want, um, sort of, it's like the
checks and balances we talk about in government,
(25:46):
right?
Right.
Same idea with your money.
Yeah.
You want, so for our example, if you
work with us, we're a fiduciary, we're typically
paid on assets under management, not always, uh,
special circumstances, and you'll be getting your statements
from us, but also from Schwab or Fidelity
(26:06):
or whoever we're using on behalf.
So brokerage platform, um, who actually holds the
assets and you can log into separately anytime,
day or night and see what's going on,
what's there.
Now we might have, uh, access to make
changes when we have discretion to manage the
(26:26):
portfolio, but, uh, it's, it's not something that's
in our back pocket.
It's something that's, uh, you know, it's not,
it's not just on a ledger.
It's it's, you can see the third party
is reporting to your assets.
And, uh, another way and I'm still self
-promotion here, but of learning is listening to
(26:47):
podcasts like this one, because we cover, we
cover a variety of these topics.
So I hope that you gave the hygienist
or will, no, I don't think I did,
but I'm going to send her this, I
think.
Yeah, absolutely.
She'll get a kick out of it.
But it's a good way.
You know, I think things have changed.
I read less books, but I listened to
more podcasts and when I find somebody credible
(27:08):
and a little entertaining, you know, we want
to be entertained too.
Yup.
That talks about issues that I care about.
Um, I subscribe.
It's your interest.
And, uh, if you're a listener, we hope
you subscribe and we hope you find this
interesting and entertaining and, and we hope you'll
share it.
Uh, hope you'll rate and, um, you know,
give a review of our podcast because it
(27:31):
does help others find our show.
There's lots of great ones out there.
Hopefully we're among the ones that you enjoy
the most.
Jeff, uh, thanks.
Good, good discussion.
Good topic.
Hopefully people got a couple of ideas for
their, uh, bedside reading if they want a
little financial, uh, uh, reading list.
I'm looking forward to hearing from your hygienist.
(27:55):
With that, everybody, thanks for being with us.
Um, until next time, keep striving for something
more.
Thank you for listening to something more with
Chris Boyd, call us for help, whether it's
for financial planning or portfolio management, insurance concerns,
or those quality of life issues that make
the money matters matter.
(28:16):
Whatever's on your mind, visit us at something
more with chrisboyd.com or call us toll
free at 866-771-8901, or send us
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You're listening to something more with Chris Boyd,
financial talk show wealth enhancement, advisory services, and
(28:36):
Jay Christopher Boyd provide investment advice on an
individual basis to clients.
Only proper advice depends on a complete analysis
of all facts and circumstances.
The information given on this program is general
financial comments and cannot be relied upon as
pertaining to your specific situation.
Wealth enhancement group cannot guarantee that using the
information from this show will generate profits or
ensure freedom from loss.
Listeners should consult their own financial advisors or
(28:57):
conduct their own due diligence before making any
financial decisions.
Welcome to Something More with Chris Boyd.
Chris Boyd is a Certified Financial Planner Practitioner
and Senior Vice President and Financial Advisor at
Wealth Enhancement Group, one of the nation's largest
registered investment advisors.
We call it Something More because we'd like
to talk not only about those important dollar
and cents issues, but also the quality of
life issues that make the money matters matter.
(00:22):
Here he is, your fulfillment facilitator, your partner
in prosperity, advising clients on Cape Cod and
across the country.
Here's your host, Jay Christopher Boyd.
Thanks for being with us for another episode
of Something More with Chris Boyd.
I'm Chris Boyd.
I'm here with Jeff Perry.
We are both of the AMR team at
Wealth Enhancement and glad to have you joining
(00:43):
us.
So Jeff, I went for a dental cleaning
this week and yesterday and felt badly afterwards
as I was getting a coffee.
Yeah, all the good stuff.
Had my teeth cleaned.
Ruined it with a coffee.
(01:04):
Red wine, coffee, sugar, all those things that
are the joys of life in some ways.
Your dental planning.
Yeah.
But anyway, as I was there, it was
a very nice dental hygienist who was Laureen,
who asked me, oh, what do you do?
So she said, I went to go to
(01:29):
a financial planner about a year ago and
then he ghosted me and I never heard
back from him.
So she's like, so we'll come back to
that.
But in the process, she said, what's your
favorite personal finance book?
What do you recommend?
(01:49):
I'm reading Rich Dad, Poor Dad.
I was like, oh, that's a good choice.
So I thought that circumstance would be the
premise of our show today.
Let's start with the books.
What are some great book ideas?
And I, in the process, I asked Co
(02:11):
-Pilot, our AI, for some thoughts on best
personal finance books in the process I thought
might be interesting.
So it started off with this year's and
I was like, no, I want all time
best.
Right.
All right.
So these are pretty good.
I think some of these you'll know.
(02:31):
Some of them I don't know.
Oh, but before we do.
Yes.
Do you want to weigh in on, you're
a student of personal finance.
You are, I think, someone who's done a
lot of reading.
I probably read literally a hundred different personal
finance books over the decades.
Wow.
(02:52):
So you must have a few that stand
out.
I do.
I do.
I have definitely some favorites.
Oh, you want my favorites?
Yeah.
So what are your favorites?
So it depends on the subject.
So back in the day when I was
just wanting to devour as much information as
I could get, I was reading books from
(03:13):
like Susie Orman, Bob Brinker, a radio show
host, had a book, a book list.
There were the Dolans who were radio people,
but they were also writing books.
And those were all like, um, kind of
broad based.
Like, you know, you need, do you need
life insurance?
How much should you say?
(03:33):
Just like really the basics.
Right.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And then it's like most people, I'm no
different than most people when they're studying something,
they go from the, the general to the,
like, okay, I got the basics.
I need more.
Yeah.
So I think my favorite or my early
favorite, most memorable investing book was one up
in wall street by Peter Lynch, where he
(03:55):
talked about his investing style and how stocks,
bonds, mutual funds, how they work, you know,
the inner, not just the basics of what
they are, but how they work and why
they're important to your portfolio.
And then there was a period where I
started listening to Dave Ramsey, the Ramsey show,
(04:16):
and he and his team have had dozens
of books published.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Um, and I, when I was starting to
think about retire, there was a book by
Chris Hogan, um, retire inspired.
So not just the dollars and cents, as
you might say.
(04:36):
Um, but like the, you know, this should
be something, this should be something more than
a math formula.
Exactly.
Yup.
Yup.
Love that.
And, um, when we were updating our financial
plan, I read, uh, the, the legacy journey.
So there's so many on so many subjects
that I've read over the years.
(04:57):
Um, but you know, something's happened to me
and I think it's happening to most people
is we're reading less books, consuming information in
other ways.
Right.
I mean, podcasts here we are.
Right.
Yeah.
So when you find someone that you feel
that is giving you good information and it's
helpful, you tend to listen to them more
(05:21):
than read.
At least that's what's happened to me.
I still read, I have a book over
here.
Uh, it's right on the top there.
It is how to retire by how to
retire by Christine Benz.
Oh yeah.
She's great.
She's got plenty of books too.
Yeah.
Morningstar has tons of publications also.
Yeah.
(05:42):
It's on my pile because I'm going to
give it to a friend who's not a
client, but he's asked me, he said he's
thinking about retiring and I talked to him
and I'm going to follow up and have
him read that book because it's, it's a
little bit about a lot of things.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So there's, well, I think you make a
great point that, um, you know, if you,
(06:02):
if you were to talk about personal finance
and overview, that's one kind of category.
An investing book is a different category.
And even within that, you could get into,
you know, various types of investing approaches, you
know, that you could, uh, pursue.
I, um, yeah, I was thinking, well, it
(06:24):
was my favorite book and I was coming
across a, I couldn't remember the name of
this book.
It's, it was almost more of a textbook
in some respects.
Cause a lot of the books that like
I've done coursework for my professional development or
whatever, you know?
Um, and so those aren't really kind of
tech more technical, you know, but this particular
(06:46):
one was, was kind of a blend of,
it was just a ton of the, the
foundational basics, but it was done in a,
in an interesting way.
And it had some of the specifics, but
it also was more conversational in tone.
Right.
So I'm sorry, I don't remember the name
(07:06):
of it, but it, uh, I'll tell you
the background.
I, I used to do these seminars in
the nineties and the company that produced them
was called, uh, successful money management seminars.
Okay.
And then they created, um, financial security, no
(07:28):
financial strategies for secure retirement.
And then I did for re that was
geared toward pre-retirees.
And I did the one that was geared
toward retirees, lifelong strategies, um, LFS lifelong financial
strategies.
So, um, the author of these seminars had
(07:50):
this book that I was thinking about, but
they've retired, they sold the whole thing.
I went looking, I can't find it, but
anyway.
Um, but there's so many good options.
Let me, let me go through some of
the names.
You're going to recognize a lot of this
and, um, you've already given a few good
ideas already.
So here's a few, um, the millionaire next
(08:13):
door.
Oh, great.
I've read that.
Dr. Uh, Thomas Stanley.
Um, and there's, there's a, um, uh, a
followup for the revision.
Yeah.
I read the revision to a few years
ago and his daughter came out with another,
like an updated kind of version of this.
(08:33):
The, the insight of that one that I
always stuck with me was the distinction between
affluence and wealth.
Yep.
And that really was, uh, a significant eye
-opener.
Don't you think in terms of, there's, there's
people who have lots of money, lots of
income, and they may spend a lot of
(08:53):
that with a nice house and a big
car and fancy car or whatever.
And, and the, and the trips or Yep.
But are they creating wealth?
And so affluence may be about lifestyle, but
wealth is the accumulation of assets.
And, um, ultimately we, and the millionaire next
(09:15):
door is just the idea that it may
not be the people that look the most
successful who are the most wealthy.
That is so true.
And the people with all the, the shiny
stuff are most likely in debt.
Yeah, exactly.
You could have a huge income, lots of
great lifestyle, but you could be really underwater.
Right.
Yeah.
(09:35):
So yeah, that was a really, uh, insightful
and just a good book.
Um, you'll like the next one.
I bet the Bogle head's guide to investing.
Um, this was, uh, referencing Jack Bogle.
Yeah, that was a while ago.
Yeah.
Uh, he has the next book, the little
book of common sense investing, uh, by him,
(09:58):
uh, Jack Bogle, uh, your money or your
life, uh, by, uh, Vicki Robin and, uh,
Joe Dominguez.
I don't know that one.
I do not know that one either.
I will teach you to be rich.
Um, the next one we just talked about
earlier, rich dad, poor dad, right?
That's the one.
(10:19):
So she's made a good choice.
Yes.
Uh, the next one is really more of
an investing book of the intelligent investor, which
you were referencing on a podcast just a
few weeks ago.
We were talking about Warren Buffett and he,
uh, attributes much of his success to the
author of that book, Benjamin Graham, his mentor.
(10:39):
Now that's an old book now, but, uh,
anyway, some of these principles still apply.
Um, Dave Ramsey's is the next one.
There you go.
Um, total money makeover.
Yeah.
Great place for someone who might have debt
that they're struggling with.
And, you know, at the beginning of their
journey, it's a great foundational book.
(11:00):
The next one is a classic Napoleon Hills
think and grow rich.
Yep.
And, uh, I read this one.
I don't know if you read this one,
uh, Tony Robbins, um, this money master of
the game.
Yep.
I have read that.
It's, um, it's funny.
I didn't enjoy it that much, uh, because
I think maybe because of I'm being a
(11:21):
professional, you know what I mean?
It's a bit raw, right?
Yeah.
But at the same time, um, I bet
for someone starting out, that would be, that
would be a great, um, a lot, there's
a lot of great content in there.
I liked what he had to say.
I love motivational parts of these books, especially
when you're like unsure and the motivational tone
(11:45):
can really get you excited about starting.
Cause starting is the toughest part for a
lot of people, like getting organized and starting.
Cause it seems just so, I mean, you
can do the math and say, Oh yeah,
that's what I can end up with a
million dollars or, you know, whatever it is.
But to start with your first hundred dollars
is where do I begin?
It's like someone who's really overweight and that
(12:07):
those first steps on the walk and the
first saying no to that treat is the
toughest, right?
Getting started is the toughest.
So the motivational books have a place, especially
at the beginning of your financial journey.
Good point.
The, uh, the, uh, I'll, I'll, we'll come
back and talk about the, um, the challenges
(12:28):
that, uh, Laureen ran into, but let me,
uh, just hit on, I'll just run through
some of these books that were, um, uh,
I said, well, what about best investment investing
books of all time?
Here's what the list came out with the
intelligent investor.
Next one, Ben Graham and David Dodd, Graham
(12:52):
and Dodd.
You've heard of the value investor, sure.
You know, classic value investors.
Um, security analysis is that book, um, a
random walk down wall street street, um, um,
common stocks and uncommon profits.
The essays of Warren Buffett.
(13:14):
I didn't know that was a book.
Yeah.
Um, the little book of common sense investing
we talked about on the last list.
Uh, you mentioned Peter Lynch one up on
wall street.
Yeah.
I think a lot of people like Peter
Lynch cause that that's really accessible to say,
invest what you know, and pursue the things
(13:37):
that you observe, you know, the, where you
see still makes sense today.
Yeah.
You know, it's, it's like, there's a, there's
a accessibility of that.
Oh, I like that.
Yeah.
Anyway.
Um, the most important thing by Howard Marks,
uh, reminiscences of stock operator of a stock
operator.
And then the last one, uh, market wizards.
(14:00):
Anyway, I'll know some of those, but, uh,
okay.
Just threw it out there.
Some books for people to, if they're looking
for that list, let's talk about the other
aspect of this circumstance.
I'm curious if there's more to the story
with your hygienist.
Yeah.
So she, she said she had, um, tried
(14:22):
to meet with someone and, um, and had
a conversation then never heard back from them.
And I said, Oh, was, was he a
fiduciary?
She said, yes.
Are you a fiduciary?
You know, I immediately asked me.
I like that.
She's asking.
Yeah.
Which was good.
Yeah.
(14:42):
Um, and she's thinking about like, I liked
that.
She was talking about like, Oh, I want
to create, you know, multiple income streams, you
know, that kind of mindset.
So she's got, got the right idea.
Um, that idea of creating wealth and generating
cashflow from it.
Diversification.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But in any case, um, so, uh, you
(15:05):
know, I mean, while I'm like getting my
teeth prodded, so I couldn't, it wasn't a
lengthy conversation, you know what I mean?
But, uh, but in any case, um, uh,
it sounded like, you know, I was thinking
it's, it's challenging for people who are starting
out because our industry is really geared toward
(15:27):
working with people who have assets to manage
our, our compensation structure generally for advisors is,
uh, designed around assets under management.
Um, and so there's less incentive for advisors
to work with people who are starting out.
(15:49):
Now there are some compensation models that are
geared toward this, this population, but even those
require a wealth or, you know, income because,
you know, you're going to be charged for
time or, you know, some commitment of time.
Uh, it's common for some advisors, not, uh,
(16:10):
not everyone, but some advisors say, well, we'll
charge a subscription fee.
I'm going to charge you $250 a month
or whatever it is.
Right.
And we'll do your financial planning.
We'll help you prioritize.
We'll, you know, get you on the right
path.
But that's a commitment of a substantial sum
of money.
Right.
That's not going toward your savings investing or
(16:33):
debt reduction or whatever the priorities might be.
So, um, that's challenging, you know?
Uh, similarly, uh, if you work with an
advisor who doesn't charge you for time in
some fashion hourly or of the sort, you're
probably working with someone who's compensated to sell
(16:54):
you products.
Right.
And that can create challenges.
May it, if, if the advisor to use
that word loosely, maybe they have one product
that they sell or three products that they
sell.
Yeah.
Oh, you're a good fit for an annuity
life insurance or whatever.
Right.
(17:14):
That's their, you know, like that's their wheelhouse,
uh, where maybe that's not what's desirable for
you with what you're trying to do.
Right.
Um, so trying to find that, um, counsel
is, is definitely challenging as someone who's starting
out.
I know this is an area that you're
passionate about.
(17:35):
So I thought it would be an interesting
topic to just to discuss a little bit.
And by the way, I did give her
your name and email address saying, Hey, you
know, if you want to talk to Jeff,
um, you know, our firm, you know, uh,
can be a resource, but Jeff particularly loves
working with people who are motivated and getting
(17:55):
started.
Yeah.
I certainly won't give his name, but you
know, this is kind of timely.
Last week I did a review of a
young man who came with very little assets.
He was out of college getting his first
job and he wanted to start off on
the right course.
Yeah.
And, uh, a year later, or maybe it's
(18:16):
a year and a half now, but he's
made significant progress.
He's putting away money in his 401k.
That's, you know, he sees building, he started
a Roth IRA, he's full, fully funding it
every year.
And he just says, because he lives, he
has no debt.
He didn't create debt.
Um, since he's living below his means, he
(18:39):
has a good salary after, after college, but
he's sucking away money in a brokerage account
that he'll, you know, he doesn't have it
earmarked.
I can, we talked about what he thinks
it might be used for.
It might be used to buy his first
home.
Sure.
That makes sense.
But whatever it's used for.
Um, so he's got two retirements building.
He's in his mid twenties.
(19:00):
He's aggressively saving for this big goal, which
say it's a house.
Um, he's building wealth.
He's managing no debt because he's being responsible.
And I mean, so it's, you know, financially
as far as fees or anything, it's not
as productive as having a $10 million client
(19:22):
come in.
But I, you know, I have to, I
have to admit, I get more joy, I
guess, out of these little things that you
can inspire people.
To do when they're young and they're motivated
to do it.
Yeah.
Absolutely change their trajectory and foundational.
Yeah.
These habits that he's building and other, you
(19:44):
know, he's just the example from last week,
but these habits that young people can build
or helping people who have bad habits, you
know, make corrective courses and make changes in
their lives.
I mean, that's, that's, that's a great choice
of being motivated though.
Right.
You know, have to be, uh, you know,
(20:06):
serious about making these decisions and what's involved
in that, you know?
Yeah.
And if they are, they can make changes
that will forever, you know, improve their financial
stability and their financial success.
But, you know, sometimes you get people who
present as motivated, but they're really, they're coming
(20:27):
out of desperation and they're not ready to,
I mean, with anything that you're doing is
something you're giving up, right?
So if you're not staying within your means
or you're not ready to make those commitments
to your, your own future, then it's tough
to change that for somebody.
Yeah.
Um, I, I think, um, just to go
(20:48):
back to the notion of, um, the industry,
I think, I just, I don't think there's
an easy answer.
There's not a, there's not an ideal solution.
There may be, um, you know, multiple avenues
to pursue.
There may be some resources that are, you
know, relatively low costs.
(21:09):
There may be, there may be possibilities, but
I think at some level it, it requires,
if you're going to get professional help, there's
going to be a cost.
Sure.
Well, trying to find maybe that, how do
you get started?
Um, there are, you know, resources, podcasts, like
(21:33):
we were just talking about, people consume information
through podcasts like ours and others.
Um, you mentioned, uh, some, some of the
greats over the time, you know, the radio
listening that you've done with, you know, but
Dave Ramsey to this day has got a
lot of great resources for people as they
get started.
(21:53):
As they get started.
And, you know, Dave Ramsey has, um, always
suggested that people work with a financial advisor,
right.
You know, when they, when they have that
need, when they get through there, he has
baby steps when he gets through there, like
get your emergency fund, pay down your debt,
contribute to your 401k.
And then yeah, covered.
(22:15):
Okay.
We got the groundwork laid.
That's right.
Then you get to a more complex, right.
That's right.
Um, I think that's, that's good counsel.
Um, so in any case, um, I don't
know what else I just, this was on
my mind and I was like, having just
gone through that, I thought, Oh, this is
a, this is a topic that's challenging, but
(22:36):
worthy of discussion.
You know, it's absolutely challenging to a lot
of people.
I think the, the individuals have the, you
know, my example of the gentleman, um, that
young man we're helping, um, is a bit
unique.
Most people, when they get that first kind
of real job and they have that paperwork
in front of them and, you know, Oh,
(22:57):
we have a 401k.
Okay.
What is that?
You know?
So that's, that's a good time to seek
counsel.
Like, yeah, that's a good point.
Right.
Because a lot of times people just fill
out the and move on.
Right.
And may miss out on opportunity.
That's right.
Uh, may be because they're unfamiliar with markets
and risk.
(23:18):
Oh, the terms themselves.
They may be sitting in a, like a,
a fixed interest account when in reality they've
got maybe 40 years before they plan on
accessing these four resources and they'd be better
served with a more invested, uh, approach to
(23:39):
the, those funds or even worse.
They say, um, I don't know what that
is.
I'll deal with it later.
Do I have to do it now?
No, you don't.
You know, so yeah.
Missed opportunity may be giving up on, uh,
voluntary, uh, compensation.
Uh, if they don't do a match, if
they don't actually contribute, they may be giving
up on the match, which is, you know,
(24:02):
volunteering for a lower pay.
Yeah.
Free money, as they say.
Right.
Yeah.
But it all comes down to, um, seek
counsel and educate yourself.
You know, we're, we're, we're all responsible to
educate ourselves of the basics.
And I, I absolutely love what your hygienist
was asking you about.
Are you fiduciary?
(24:22):
Because you've heard my three things.
Um, and she, she got the first one,
like whoever you're working with, I don't in
the financial sector world, um, ask if they're
fiduciary and that means, uh, to, are they,
do they have your best interest at heart?
Are they, are they morally, ethically, legally responsible
to give you advice that is in your
(24:42):
best interest and not their own?
So that's a yes.
You want to hear yes.
The second one, um, is how are they
compensated?
You know, you've touched on different ways, but
if someone you're about to work with and
you're about to pay, however, that either pay
by your assets or pay, you know, hourly
or whatever the model is, if they can't
(25:04):
explain to you how they're compensated within a
minute, you know, maybe, maybe it's not a
straightforward way of compensation.
Maybe there, that should raise your, uh, your
concerns just for a moment or two to
step back.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Just step up and say, I don't, I'm
not sure.
Are you fiduciary?
Yes.
How are you compensated?
Reasonably quick answer.
(25:25):
And the third is where is, where are
my assets?
Where will my money be held?
We want it held at a third party
custodian.
The person giving you the advice, it's just
prudent and wise for them not to be
actually handling your actual dollars.
Yeah.
You want, um, sort of, it's like the
checks and balances we talk about in government,
(25:46):
right?
Right.
Same idea with your money.
Yeah.
You want, so for our example, if you
work with us, we're a fiduciary, we're typically
paid on assets under management, not always, uh,
special circumstances, and you'll be getting your statements
from us, but also from Schwab or Fidelity
(26:06):
or whoever we're using on behalf.
So brokerage platform, um, who actually holds the
assets and you can log into separately anytime,
day or night and see what's going on,
what's there.
Now we might have, uh, access to make
changes when we have discretion to manage the
(26:26):
portfolio, but, uh, it's, it's not something that's
in our back pocket.
It's something that's, uh, you know, it's not,
it's not just on a ledger.
It's it's, you can see the third party
is reporting to your assets.
And, uh, another way and I'm still self
-promotion here, but of learning is listening to
(26:47):
podcasts like this one, because we cover, we
cover a variety of these topics.
So I hope that you gave the hygienist
or will, no, I don't think I did,
but I'm going to send her this, I
think.
Yeah, absolutely.
She'll get a kick out of it.
But it's a good way.
You know, I think things have changed.
I read less books, but I listened to
more podcasts and when I find somebody credible
(27:08):
and a little entertaining, you know, we want
to be entertained too.
Yup.
That talks about issues that I care about.
Um, I subscribe.
It's your interest.
And, uh, if you're a listener, we hope
you subscribe and we hope you find this
interesting and entertaining and, and we hope you'll
share it.
Uh, hope you'll rate and, um, you know,
give a review of our podcast because it
(27:31):
does help others find our show.
There's lots of great ones out there.
Hopefully we're among the ones that you enjoy
the most.
Jeff, uh, thanks.
Good, good discussion.
Good topic.
Hopefully people got a couple of ideas for
their, uh, bedside reading if they want a
little financial, uh, uh, reading list.
I'm looking forward to hearing from your hygienist.
(27:55):
With that, everybody, thanks for being with us.
Um, until next time, keep striving for something
more.
Thank you for listening to something more with
Chris Boyd, call us for help, whether it's
for financial planning or portfolio management, insurance concerns,
or those quality of life issues that make
the money matters matter.
(28:16):
Whatever's on your mind, visit us at something
more with chrisboyd.com or call us toll
free at 866-771-8901, or send us
your questions to amr-info at wealthenhancement.com.
You're listening to something more with Chris Boyd,
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(28:57):
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