September 15, 2023 • 54 mins
Have you ever wondered how to skyrocket your plumbing and drain a company's revenues? You're in for a treat as we connect with Allan Ferguson, the master of transforming average tickets from $300 to an impressive $2,000 in record time. From highlighting the vital role of a solid sales process to the significance of top-quality drain cams and monitors, Allan lays out the roadmap to business success in the plumbing industry.
Ready for a deep dive into the sales potential of your drain cleaning technicians? Allan unpacks the importance of training your team to sell inspections effectively and how showing customers the problem before fixing it can lead to better sales. And we don't stop there – we explore the game-changing role of AI in marketing automation, discuss the essential role of customer communication and retention strategies, and even touch on the need for financial incentives to fuel your team's motivation.
We ended our conversation with Allan by discussing maximizing drain calls and hiring the right employees. Sharing insights on Joe Cunningham's training program for technicians and the Superdrains Academy, we delve into the potential of these programs to mold a team that can maximize revenue and reach the pinnacle of success. As a cherry on top, we broach the subject of the Service Success Academy and the paramount role of online interaction in today's business landscape. Step into the future of plumbing and drain business success with Allan Ferguson – you won't want to miss it!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to the Successful Life Podcast.
I'm your host, Cory Barrier,and I am here with Alton
Ferguson.
What's up, Alton?
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Yeah, look, currently down under again spending a bit
of time with family and yeah,really, I mean I've been really
excited to get back on thispodcast with you.
I really enjoyed the last timewe connected and we've had a few
conversations since then andthis is great.
Thank you for the opportunity,cory.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
For sure.
So you have a new, I believe.
Just to segue you a littlepersonally, you have a new
nephew or new no grandsonGrandson.
Sorry, I have a new nephew, myapologies, I got myself mixed up
.
So you have a new grandson,fairly like very new, right?
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Yeah, he's one month old.
He was born seven weekspremature, at a whopping three
pounds, which is not much to besaid, and yeah, but he's back
home with mom and he's healthy,and that's all that matters,
right.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
It's all that matters , that's right.
So, alan Rick, look I want totalk about.
I want to talk about some ofthe things that you work with
plumbing companies or and orjust drain companies and I think
the first place I want to gowith this is how do you improve
their revenue?
(01:23):
How is it that you're able totake them from a, let's call it,
a $200, $300 average ticket toa $12, $13, $14, $2,000?
I mean, I don't know thenumbers exactly, but tell me,
you could actually run throughsome of those numbers.
What's the biggest gap you'veseen?
You've taken somebody from whatto what.
What's the biggest jump you'veseen?
Speaker 2 (01:44):
So and look, this is, I've worked with a lot of
companies here and I do workwith companies that have got
average tickets that aredeplorable, like anything under
500 average ticket in drainage.
You're really not doing itright.
So I've worked with companiesthat let's call them 300.
(02:05):
And I've the best companiesthat I've worked with I've
personally helped go from, youknow, three or 400 bucks to
about $2,000 average tickets andin a short period of time.
So you do the math on that likeyou don't have to be a rocket
science scientist to understandthat's a dramatic increase in
(02:28):
revenues.
So the companies that I foundedwe had plumbing and drain
companies.
We were probably between 2000and 2500 in average tickets,
depending on some of the biggerjobs that we would win.
But a recent example really goodcompany and look one of the
things with If you want toincrease your average ticket and
(02:51):
let's say you're three or 400,if you're below $500, we need to
look at how much you'recharging.
The way you're charging, I meanI recommend flat rate or margin
pricing for everything you do,except for drain clearing and
drain cleaning.
I believe that should be doneon an hourly rate in 30 minute
increments.
(03:12):
We got to get those rates right.
So recently, an example greatcompany drain company out of
Omaha, rod, started working withme last year I think it was
around October.
Average ticket was about 400,420.
We got him to 1280 within threemonths and he didn't have to do
(03:34):
a lot of work.
But this guy is a seriousimplementer.
Okay, he went in and did thefucking work and he got the
results.
So you know, a lot of thecompanies I work with are just
not willing.
They don't want to charge more.
Well, okay, and they're notwilling to put in the hard work
to actually get your averageticket up.
So and some of the things youneed to, it's not just about
(03:56):
charging more, but you need tohave a sales process so that
every drain call you run, you'relooking for massive opportunity
, you're presenting options tocustomers, showing them problems
that they didn't know they had,and your average ticket will go
up and the overallprofitability of the company.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
It does.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
It's kind of hard to look for problems if you don't
run a camera, though, right yeahcamera is our eyes and it's
sort of like taking a car to themechanic and not letting him
lift the bonnet.
You know like the camera is soimportant and I just don't know
how we got by all these yearswithout the camera.
But your camera is your bestfriend.
(04:39):
And when it comes to draincameras, don't Anyone that's
listening in to this podcast,it's a Plumber, a drain cleaner.
Don't cut yourself short here.
Make sure you get good qualitycamera, good monitors.
You can actually show thecustomer the problem.
You need to educate yourcustomer.
You need to show them what itis.
(04:59):
You're trying to sell them byidentifying and just having real
good visibility.
But there is a process for that.
I mean it's now you're havingthe camera.
If you're just using it foryour own viewing pleasure, you
need to.
The customer needs to comealong on the journey.
That's right.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
You know, and I think by having a better piece of
equipment.
Well, tell me the difference.
Tell me the difference in, youknow, your average piece of
equipment that maybe somebody'sgoing to buy because it's, you
know, is reasonably but you know, reasonably priced, opposed to
one that you would recommend.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
We always look all of that we had, like we had about
back in Australia.
We had about 30 drain trucksand each truck had a camera.
We went for the good quality.
It was rigid, which it's one ofthe most expensive, probably
not the most expensive.
But when it comes to camerasyou've got to realize you're
giving them to you, to plumbersbasically, and they're you know
(06:01):
they can be pretty rough onequipment.
Now you can have processes inplace and tell them how to, but
at the end of the day they'regoing to use that camera like a
plunger and they're just goingto.
They just want to get thatcamera down the drain and they
don't look after it.
If it was their own theyprobably would.
But you want something that'stough, that will go the distance
(06:23):
.
You don't want some of the andI'm not bagging any equipment
Okay, I'm sure there's somereally good quality Chinese
cameras on the market and I'vetried a few of them.
They look the same, theyprobably do the same thing.
But if they're breaking downevery couple of weeks, that's
just.
That's going to kill yourefficiency.
So we went for equipment thatwe knew was tough.
(06:44):
It's a bit like buying a truck.
You know you want somethingthat's going to be able to go
the distance and be able tohandle the rough wear and tear.
So that's my recommendations,but I'm sure there's good
quality equipment out there thatdoes go the distance.
And yeah, I'm just not overlyaware of it.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Well and look, you probably can get some good ones
that are less expensive, but youtake the risk of it you know it
failing and then, like you said, that damages the efficiency,
which means you can't really runa 30 minute call for $79 or
whatever it is that they'rerunning it for, because the idea
behind that is that you don'tand correct me if I'm wrong but
(07:26):
the idea behind that is that youyou spend a half an hour for
that $79.
If it falls under the specificspecificity, I think, sort of
trying to say of what it of theoffer, right, and I think that's
that, potentially, is where alot of people fail is the offer
is also super important thatyou're very clear about what
(07:48):
you're doing and what you're notdoing in that 30 minute
timeframe.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Yeah, look, when it comes to the specials and look,
I see a lot of companies inAustralia as well as the US have
copied, you know, the modelthat we I didn't create, the
model I created, shit I'd take.
I see what successful companiesare doing and I follow it, you
know, and I try to be asoriginal as I can.
I'm not into plagiarism oranything like that, but I look
(08:16):
at you know, we brought what Isaw, I learned around 2006,
2007,.
Some really successfulcompanies in the US and I was
part of the best practice groupand I took what I learned down
to Australia and we and lookeven, and I know one of the
things we've talked about is thepower of implementation and you
(08:42):
know we I didn't really havestrong implementers in the
business, but I was pretty likedriven to implement or what I'd
learned, and I learned that noteverything that works in the US
works in Australia.
So I learned through trial anderror and you know, no one was
really doing what we were doingat the time.
(09:04):
So what I learned throughtesting is and then I look at
the successful companies here inthe US and I believe that most
companies that do a special aregiving away too much, like we've
tried giving away cameras,giving away water jetting,
giving away stuff, and it wasdetrimental to the sales process
(09:26):
.
So what I mean by that, corey,is that you send a technician to
a job where the camera is beinggiven, the water jet never is
being given.
What the fuck does he sell Likehe's?
You've removed a couple ofsteps in the process.
So I believe that it's moreimportant to have the technician
(09:46):
get used to being selling acamera inspection and he might
sell that inspection off theback of a membership.
Or you might have a specialwithin your sales process, like,
for example, you might do, andI highly recommend companies
learn to build in 30 minuteincrements, and I'm only talking
about drain clearing, draincleaning, camera work, location
(10:11):
work should be charged in 30minute increments because it's
what builds.
You need to be in front of thecustomer every 30 minutes.
You're working on arelationship.
You're not going to sell shitunless you've got I can't
believe I said that, but anywayI've drilled the word shit into
a drain cleaning conversationGood one.
(10:34):
So you're not going to sellanything unless you've got the
relationship with the customer.
So my observations are specialsare great to get the phone ring.
Limit them as much as you can.
Don't give away the farm.
Train your technicians, yourentry level technicians, the
guys that are going to the run,the special.
Just train them in the basicstuff how to sell a camera
(10:56):
inspection, the importance ofshowing the customer the problem
.
You're going to your specialmight include 20 minutes or 30
minutes.
With hand rods or an electriceel you might limit it to a
certain distance.
So then you need to.
The idea is to get the water togo down, to pop the drain.
That just means you punch thehole in whatever's blocking it.
(11:18):
That's when you need to takethe customer on the first.
You need to show them what thatproblem is.
Don't go and fucking remove theproblem completely, because
what are you going to show them?
A clean pipe.
That will work out well foryour sales process.
So, anyway, that's probablygoing on a bit about this, but
this is just everything's got tobe thought out.
(11:39):
If you want to be successful indrain cleaning, drain clearing
and drain cleaning, you need tohave a process and your
technicians and look, I learnedthis, I learned, you know, I
thought like giving away camerasand giving away water jetters
and all that was the way to dothis.
And then what I learned was mytechnicians said to me Alan,
(12:00):
what the like this has hurt usbecause you used to give us a
commission on selling a Camryused to give us a commission
like because we, I believe inwhat gets rewarded, gets done,
and we would give ourtechnicians a financial reward
for following process and makingsales, and then that would
(12:20):
always lead to more salesbecause they knew that their
earnings were from selling stuff.
When you start removing thatstuff from them, I believe
that's a problem.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
I would totally agree .
It's like taking somebody'scommission away or reducing
their commission structure.
Essentially, yeah, no, I thatmakes complete sense.
But I'm sure you get well, whatif I, you know, if I went out
there to clean, clean or clearthe drain, and what if I'm not
done in 30 minutes?
Right, I'm sure you get thatall the time.
(12:51):
What am I supposed to tell thecustomer?
Cause I didn't do the job?
Speaker 2 (12:55):
Look, anyone that's in the plumbing and drain
industry knows that not thatmany drains can be cleared in 30
minutes.
Okay, but they can.
And you know you've got andlook, I share some great
examples of customers that theywould just call us out just for
that 30 minute special, whetherit's 79 or 99.
(13:16):
There's no look, I don't tellanyone what to charge.
I've got companies that can bevery successful charging 49.
And I've got other companiesthat I'm not doing it for less
than 199.
I don't really care what youcharge, as long as you can get
the phone.
Call your staff.
When the higher, the more youcharge, the harder it is for
(13:39):
your call center staff toconvert it.
The lower the fee, the easierit is for them to get a
technician in front of thecustomer.
And if you've got well-trainedtechnicians, the goal is to get
that technician to do the work.
But the lower the fee, theharder it is for the technician
to move that to your desiredbreak-even.
(13:59):
Because this is all about whenyou're running a special, a loss
leader.
It's all about getting tobreak-even in the shortest
amount of time and my systemthat I train we're aiming for
about an hour.
In the first 30 minutes you'lllose some money Before you get
is the fee that you've chargedand that's where it stops.
(14:19):
You've missed a step and youhaven't followed the sales
process.
But if you're able to keepgoing and, let's say, the next
30 minutes should be moving intothe correct charges that you
need for your equipment youshould be able to get to a
break-even point in 60 minutes.
Some companies it takes 90minutes and this is something I
(14:44):
say to the companies that I workwith, and one of the key
performance indicators I want isyou're running a special great,
you're giving away too much,and that's just my observations.
But what's your conversion rate?
Out of every 10 calls you run,how many of those calls are only
(15:07):
the special, meaning you're 79or you're 99.
And how many of them move tothe next level?
And if that number, if you'reconverting better than 30%, so
you don't want the special to beany less, any more than 30%.
So, meaning, out of every 10calls, three of those calls all
(15:31):
you collected was your 79 oryour 99.
And then seven out of thosehave moved to at least
break-even or profit, and thatmight be.
You might have four jobs fitinto that category and then
you'll have a couple of jobsthat go past where extend, where
they either have an excavation,which is, I highly recommend,
(15:53):
adding cleanouts, repairing theproblem, could be a complete
drain replacement.
It could be a full, trenchless,no-dig solution.
So you need to know the numbersand it's when I work with any
company the very first thing Isay is do you, what numbers do
you know?
Do you know what yourconversion rate is?
Now, if your conversion rate onthe special, if you're, if
(16:20):
that's above 30%, let's say 50%of your calls are at the special
, you've got a problem and weneed to fix that as quickly as
possible.
But there is a marketingopportunity there because you
can actually take that in yourmarketing to your you know
whether it's on social orwhether it's in your website and
(16:41):
tell the world look, you knowthere's a lot of hype around $79
drain clears.
But here is an example of allthe happy customers that have
had their drains cleared for $79.
Now that is going to build,that's going to build your brand
and but you've got to haveyou've got to have happy
customers, you know.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
I think also, you know, I think what you're saying
too is that you've got to alsoset expectations, and I think if
you set expectations I don'tthink I know with any sales
process if you set expectationsof how the call is going to go
and you let them know at the 30minute mark, 25 minute, whatever
it is I'm going to come back,I'm going to tell you where.
(17:22):
You know where we're at.
Here's what could happen, right?
Is that how you do it?
Or how do you set theexpectation?
Okay?
Speaker 2 (17:30):
Oh, you've got to like.
You know, I teach contractors aprocess and a real simple
process.
I, if you know what I teach,can fit on one page.
It's a checklist and you know,if any of your cast listeners
want access to that checklist,I'm happy to share some
information on that.
But you've got to keep itsimple and you need a step by
(17:51):
step process.
So the very first thing that Iteach is the pre-call that
technician.
If currently your dispatchers oryour CSRs do the first point of
call to let them know thetechnicians on the way, I want
you to allow the technician toalso.
The technician should becommunicating with the customer
(18:11):
because that's his first pointof contact.
That's where he can say hey, mrJones, it's Alan.
From on go bongo plumbing,whatever your company name is.
I'm on my way.
Listen, I'm dropping by aStarbucks to get myself a coffee
.
Can I get you one on the way?
No, that's all right, alan, I'mgood, but I look forward to
seeing you in 30 minutes.
So I'll be there and let thecustomer know you're going to be
(18:33):
there and also confirm withthat customer the problem that
they've got.
So I mean, we know that shithappens in service companies,
especially when you're doing it.
We were doing up to 2000 callsa month that we, our dispatchers
, accidentally sent our drainguy to an electrical or a HBAC
(18:54):
call.
So make sure you confirm thatthis.
You know, mrs Jones, it is ablock drain that I'm attending.
Yeah, yeah, alan, that's whatyou're coming out for.
So that first point of contactconfirm the address, confirm the
problem, start to build therapport with the customer, ask
them if they want a coffee youdon't need to do any more than
(19:14):
that and then when you get therein front of the customer, it's
like they already know you,right, and then that's then.
Your second point of contact isabout getting them to show you
where the problem is.
From there you need to say,right, for 30 minutes I'm going
to work my tail off, I'm goingto try to get this drain cleared
for you.
If I can, great, but if I can't, I'll come back and I'll knock
(19:36):
on the door and we'll discussthe next steps and that's it.
That's a process, right, but bythat time you've had two
interactions with the customer.
You're not ready to presentanything, any big numbers, but
you're getting closer, you'removing the sale in the direction
it needs to go.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
Perfect.
You explained that great.
And just for context, alan, Ithink if I'm not mistaken, the
last year you ran your companyyou did about $24 million.
How much of that, I think?
I guess that breaks down toabout 2.5 million a month.
How much of that was drained?
Speaker 2 (20:15):
We were drains alone, we were probably approaching
about 1.5 million in revenueevery month, but about a million
of that was from runningspecials.
So we had, you know, I think wehad a lot.
We had a lot of existingcustomers let's call it 70,000
to 100,000, that we wouldgenerate.
And I look and this is an areaI don't know if you want to dive
(20:37):
into, but I'd love to get intoexisting customers and how you
get more from them, and that'sprobably the area where I put
more energy into anything elseand maybe we can we can morph
into that later.
But so about a million a monthcame from running specials and
(20:57):
we would run a $79 drain clearor an an 99,.
We split test and I recommendany company listening to this
you need to be testing shit.
Don't just rely on what youthink is working.
Always test it with somethingelse.
And I got that idea from BillyStevens, the founder of Sira,
talking about.
He was testing using zerodispatch fees versus charging
(21:21):
and it was all about the leastamount of resistance and he
found that zero service feeswork better than charging the
customer.
Conversion rates were fine, butso, yeah, so about a million a
month came from specials andthen about half a million a
month came from existingcustomers that just rung up and
say I've got a block dragging.
You, send someone out to fix it.
(21:42):
Yep, we can do that.
And look, there's much more thatcomes into this.
You know, it's not just aboutgetting that phone to ring, it's
about everything that your teamdo to lock that call in.
To me, a drain call was worthbig money.
Okay, so the average lifetimevalue of a customer let's say a
(22:05):
drain customer to me, let's sayit's a 10, that customer,
probably over the next threeyears, is probably worth 10
grand to me.
And I did this exercise with acompany down under last week and
they calculated that theiraverage lifetime value of a
customer was about 8,000,.
But look, but you need to knowwhat that customer's worth to
(22:25):
you.
Okay, and this is why marketingto your existing customers
needs to be number one priority.
I'd like you know you want towaste money on Google AdWords.
Fine, that's just not myrecommendation.
Only because we used to do thatand I realized that the gold
and the revenue should come fromyour existing customers and no
(22:48):
one I repeat, no one is fullyexploiting that, but we're about
to launch a product that isgoing to blow the minds of
anyone that's listening when itcomes to their existing
customers and how to get morefrom them.
So yeah, so about 1.5 million amonth just from drains.
We were really set up well fordrains.
We had about 30 drain trucks.
(23:09):
All the trucks had jetters andcameras and locators and I
focused on drains because therevenue potential for us and the
profit potential was justmassive.
Hope that answers your question, corey.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Yeah, 100%.
So look, here's how I see this.
If you've already paid for thecustomer, why would you not we
call it reactivation campaignhere why would you not
continually sell to that person?
I don't mean send them a salesemail every single week, but I
mean I guess you could right.
(23:43):
But you don't want to flood.
I don't want people to get thewrong idea because they'll flood
their customer base with abunch of crazy emails.
There doesn't have to besystematic.
There has to be a way to goabout doing it.
That is ultimately a salesemail, even if it's a value,
right?
Even if it's a value email.
And for you, you reactivatingthose drain customers also led
(24:06):
to electrical, plumbing, hvac,right.
Because now you get to tellthem all the other areas that
your business works in, andagain, you already paid for them
.
So why would you not utilizethose same people that you've
already sold to, opposed to,like you said, going on Google
and paying a fortune to get newpeople?
(24:28):
But people do it all the time100%.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
And look, I know we've discussed in.
You know we did a.
You were on a one of mypodcasts just recently and that
podcast is going to come out ina few days.
I'm not too sure when this iscoming out, so maybe your
podcast that you're a pipelineof profitability will come out
before this one is.
So it's funny how this allworks.
But you know we talked aboutthe power of AI and utilizing AI
(24:57):
with marketing automation.
I'm big on marketing automation.
I think we did it better thanmost people in the industry, but
it's very labor intensive.
So, to answer your question,why don't contractors market to
the customers they've alreadygot?
Because it's fucking hard work.
It really is Anyone that saysoh, it's easy, you just pick up
(25:20):
the phone and call them.
Well, yeah, you can do that,but it's you know if you can buy
.
And I learned this early in thepiece when we fought, when I
first started playing, you knowwe created a website.
Was probably around 2001, 2002.
Google AdWords I forget whatyear it was.
We started to play with that,but let's call it 2005.
(25:43):
I mean, I don't anyone that'slistened and hold me to the
dates, it's just I'm testing mymemory here.
It's pretty damn good, but it'snot perfect.
But we started playing withGoogle AdWords earlier than
anyone that I knew, and I waswatching all my fellow
contractors in the US boastingabout their full page yellow
(26:04):
paid page ads and I'm going fucklike.
What a waste of money.
It's a bit like Google AdWords.
Now, you know, I believe thatit's overpriced by a multiple of
at least 10.
And this is why it's theresponsibility of the marketing
manager and the owner to findleads at the lowest possible
(26:25):
denominator, and I believe thatcan be achieved from existing
customers.
So so, yeah, no, we talkedabout I marketing automation.
Now, if you were to engage, ifyou have someone in your
business that can get yourcustomers out of your job
management system whether that'sCIRA or there's some other
(26:46):
products out there not as goodIf you can get the data into a
full CRM that can email, sms,voice broadcast, remind your
outbound staff when to call, andthere's lots of other stuff
that it can do If you were to dothat manually or engage someone
, it's going to cost you a lotof money.
(27:06):
If you've got a lot of timeright, what if you could do the
same thing by using artificialintelligence?
And I know this is we're goingto.
We're going to venture intothis conversation because we're
about to launch a product whichis exactly what I'm talking
about, and this is not a salespitch, much, it's just.
(27:27):
I just want more contractors torealize what is possible, and I
believe that, by utilizing theright CRM with artificial
intelligence can reduce your thecost to market to your existing
customer to about 25%.
That's my view, and, look, I'vebeen wrong on more things than
(27:51):
I've been right, but I'mpredicting that this is the
future of AI.
Speaker 1 (27:57):
So I agree Because look, think about this there's
no human error with AI Once it'sset up.
If it's set up properly, you'renot going to have, you don't
have that.
You take that, and I don't meanlike you're taking out the
human element in all in yourbusiness.
I mean you're taking the humanelement out of sending those
(28:17):
manual emails or making thosefollow up not follow up calls,
but like to existing color.
It would take a lot of manpower.
It would take in again.
It would also take their humanerror.
That's involved with that, withwhat you're talking about there
.
If it's set up correctly and itwill be and it is it will be as
long as it Thanksgiving daymeal.
(28:37):
You don't have room for error.
Now don't get me wrong.
Is it perfect?
No, but it's pretty damn close.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
I look, I'm really excited about where this is all
going and with utilizing AI,with marketing, crm, follow up
and look, something that I wastaught and I probably I should
mention my business partner, joeCunningham, who taught me many
(29:07):
years ago the power of rehash.
Rehash is just following upleads that your technicians that
have left with your customersand not followed up for whatever
reason.
Look, I get it.
I mean trying to get whenyou've left proposals and
multiple proposals.
If you run your calls the waythat I teach, using the perfect
(29:29):
service call for drains andyou've left multiple options
with the customer and, forwhatever reason, your technician
didn't close, you've got anopportunity to get those sales,
bring those sales back in.
I did I think I may havementioned it on your podcast and
we've discussed this before isthat a company can generate up
(29:51):
to 30 percent of their sales canbe generated for just by
following up proposals and leadsthat have already been left
behind.
What if you could automate allthat stuff?
Now you can automate thereminder to call a customer,
because I believe that beforeyou get on the phone and ring
(30:13):
someone and follow up, youshould at least have some steps
in place.
Whether that's an email isquite unreliable.
I mean you might have a 15percent success rate where the
customer actually opens theemail doesn't mean they're going
to action the email.
You might then say well, smsworks better.
You might have a 30 percentsuccess rate with SMS, but
(30:37):
followed up with a voicebroadcast or a ringless voice
mark might deliver a 50 percent.
These are just numbers I'mpulling out of my ass, they're
not actual numbers.
But then with a follow-up callthat you might take that to 70
percent.
I learned this from Dan Kennedy,magnetic Marketing, years ago.
(30:59):
You've got to have a processand you've got to be consistent.
But I can be used for all thesteps, except for the actual
phone call.
And AI is not replacing staff,it's not replacing people.
You still need someone, stillneeds to get on the phone and
make the call, but the AI mightjust send you a reminder hey,
(31:21):
this customer needs to be calledtoday.
Fucking call them.
Speaker 1 (31:26):
Anyway, that's just Well, what if there was a way
that you send that sequence, thethree sequence, the ringless
voice mail, the email, the SMS.
But what if the SMS had theability to have an interactive
chatbot inside of it?
What that chatbot would dowould give you the ability, the
(31:48):
customer to say I want to goahead and book, or I don't want
to book, don't call me, do callme, or what do you have
available.
How do you see that working?
Because that is AI and that'sbeing implemented now.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
My thoughts.
Okay, look, I'll be honest withyou.
It's moving really fast and I'mnot a slow learner, but when I
learn something, I'm effing goodat it.
I believe that's just my view,but it's a bit like asking me
I've got no idea how electricityworks, but I love what it does.
(32:28):
It's much the same.
Corrie.
There's so much happening withAI.
All I know is what we'reutilising it in An example.
A great example of AI andsoftware would be CIRA software.
I mean what Billy Stevens isdoing with his product and AI is
(32:48):
just.
It's about to change theindustry for the better.
I would hate to be a competingsoftware to CIRA right now,
because they're about to gettheir ass handed to them
whoever's competing against itbecause he's using AI and the
shit that's going on with thatsoftware product.
It's just mind-boggling to meand I love that and I feel that
(33:13):
with a product like we'retalking about, that we're going
to be launching, that uses AI tohelp automate the marketing to
your existing customers and itdoes other shit as well, it does
way more than that.
It's about to revolutionise theindustry and that's just my
view and I'm entitled to it,right.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
That's right.
My point in saying that is thatyou want to make it as easy on
the customer as possible.
So if you hit them with all ofthose things and you give them
the ability to maybe go to yoursite, use a bot, send an SMS
back, communicate any way thatthey want to communicate, that's
really where you got to thinkabout the customer.
(33:58):
It's not what's necessarilyeasiest on me or you.
You got to think what's easieston the customer.
And the fact is customers aregetting younger and younger,
right?
I mean, younger people don'twant to pick up the phone and
call back.
Younger people would muchrather spend time on their phone
trying to book an appointment,and imagine if that appointment
(34:20):
goes straight to your calendar,which it will.
You've avoided forgetting tocall them back.
You avoided even having to callthem back because, look, nobody
loves calling people back,necessarily in playing phone tag
.
If you could eliminate thatwith this product, and I just
think it's going to make iteasier for everybody.
Speaker 2 (34:42):
Absolutely Look.
This is one thing.
And look, sometimes I go backto the basics and I keep to
anyone that's finding you knowthey're not getting the results
out of their business that theyshould be.
Sometimes you need to go backto the real basic shit and
because you tend to move awayfrom that and you tend to look
(35:03):
at all the some of the advancedstuff that's going on.
So one thing that I learned is,I mean, you know my companies.
I was proud to say that we dida frigging good job most of the
time.
And look, whenever you've gothumans that can make error,
there's going to be things thatjust don't go exactly as they
(35:24):
should.
But one of the things I learnedwas that we're, you know, like
the average service company.
Let's say, most of thecompanies I work are premium
companies.
They do a phenomenal job.
They might be a little bit onthe higher priced guys, but
they're providing a reallyquality service and they think
(35:45):
that their customer willremember them who they are.
I just want to challengeeveryone that's listening to
this.
Do not think that for a minute.
And I've learned the hard waywith I share my pest control guy
story that you know we alwayshad a lot of termites in our
homes and we got this companywho was recommended to us.
(36:06):
He was phenomenal.
He did a great job, hepresented us options, he found
termites, he fixed it and then,you know, it didn't cost an arm
and a leg.
We didn't have to take out asecond mortgage on my home to
fix the problem.
And then I said to him OK, sohow often do you need to check
for termites?
He said every six months.
I said will you remind me?
(36:27):
He said absolutely, I'll reachout.
We'll come back in six monthsand we'll just make sure there's
none of those little rascalshave snuck into any other part
of the home and anyone thatknows has had termites in their
home.
It can be quite devastating.
Homes get demolished whentermites have done too much
damage.
So six months later I said tomy wife at the time have you
(36:54):
heard from the termite guy?
No, have you.
Can you call him?
I said yeah, what's his phonenumber?
Well, I'd left that with you,haven't you got his?
I mean, this guy was good, weloved him, but neither of us
could remember the name of thecompany who he was, because
we're both leading busy livesand that's just.
I just wanted to share thatstory because if all you do with
(37:16):
your marketing automation islet your customers know who you
are and that you're still aroundand you've got to stay in
contact I mean, look, somepeople don't mind being emailed
daily I probably wouldn'trecommend it maybe weekly, but
don't just be throwing salespitches at them.
You've got to.
You know, I did a fantasticpodcast with a guy by the name
(37:39):
of Kevin Kniebel Kniebel Hope Isaid that right and he talked
about with communicating to yourcustomers.
You need, there needs to besome human element in there, you
know, and just sometimes justgot to connect with them.
How are you?
I hope everything is well andlook, when it comes to what to
(37:59):
say and what to do, that's notmy thing, but sometimes if
you're trying to sell them everyweek and you might piss them
off, so you need to think aboutthat.
But so that, just that onething just regularly
communicating to your existingcustomers so that they know who
you are and they'll remember you.
You should be putting stickersand magnets and valve tags
(38:21):
throughout the home foreverything you do, you know.
So you need to find a way tocontinually communicate and this
is one thing that I challengemy staff a lot on this and I
would throw I'd throw a questionat them and I knew that they
couldn't answer, but I would doit anyway, because that's just
the way I'm wired.
One of the things I used to sayto my CSR manager I'd say so,
(38:46):
out of all the customers on ourdatabase and let's call it
70,000, I think we had a lotmore how many of them know that
we now have the premium airconditioning company in Sydney?
And no one could answer thatquestion.
But the question itself is whatit was like.
(39:08):
Ok, let's get to work.
I want every single one ofthose customers to know that we
are now a premium airconditioning company, so that
that creates a challenge initself, right, because we know
that email might only deliver15%.
And so let's get to work.
Let's make sure that everysingle one of those customers
(39:28):
knows that we have the best airconditioning company in Sydney.
And that's just the way I roll,corey.
Speaker 1 (39:35):
Well, if you don't let them know who is, nobody
right.
I mean, you look, and youshouldn't feel bad about that.
You shouldn't feel bad aboutwanting to share how you can
help the people that havecontributed to your business.
That's how I see it.
Speaker 2 (39:54):
So yeah, so that's like that's just one thing.
There's so many.
There's so many more things youcan do.
You know, like we, one of thethings I want, the other, one of
the other things I teach my,the companies that me and Joe
work with and there's a lotwithin Australia and the US is,
when it comes to drains andwarranty, you need to be booking
(40:15):
.
You know, if you're going togive a lifetime warranty, which
I recommend, or 15 year,whatever, same 15 year, lifetime
, same thing.
Right, in my view, you need theability to book the warranty
inspection and, using AI, toreach out to those customers at
the desired time.
You know if it's a 12 monthlyinspection, maybe 10 or 11
(40:37):
months, before an email, theydon't respond, and the AI will
know that if they've opened theemail and not, right, and then
if they haven't, well then thatyou escalate that to a text
message.
Then you should know whetherthey've, and if they haven't
responded to that, then you'reon the upbound, but also sending
direct mail, and so the CRMwill actually communicate to a
(41:00):
mailhouse, or maybe you mighthave an internal ability.
So, and they're all some of thethings you can be doing that
you can be using artificialintelligence to help with right
100%, absolutely, and all right.
Speaker 1 (41:16):
so one more thing I want you to.
You know I should probably askyou this earlier, but I kind of
dropped the ball on it.
But you know the way I see.
When we were talking about yoursales process and how you
maximize drain calls, I wouldargue that you know everybody's
looking for employees,everybody's looking for
technicians, right?
But I think, if I'munderstanding you correctly, if
(41:39):
you run these calls the rightway, you run them efficiently,
maybe you wouldn't have to looknecessarily for more technicians
.
Speaker 2 (41:49):
So, look, you've touched on a look.
I might have to spend a littlebit longer on this one than
normal, because you've touchedon a key point for me, and it's
what I'm really about with my Isuppose passion for the
industry's been good for me andI want to be able to give back
as much as possible.
So, when it comes to growingand having technicians, I want
(42:15):
to ask everyone that's, I wanteveryone that's listening to
this podcast, and I'm sure it'sa lot of people right what's
what makes the better employee?
Someone who has got the skillthat you need and, yes, everyone
needs the skill, and I'll comeback to my thoughts on that or
do you want someone with theskill, or do you want someone
with the right attitude?
(42:36):
Okay now, attitude is important.
You want team players.
You want people that arewilling to, you know, to be
involved in a team environment.
You want people that are goingto go the extra mile.
So I feel my view is that it'smore important to get the right
(42:57):
person, the right personality,understanding whether that
person is a visionary or anintegrator and it's okay to have
visionaries in the business butyou want people that are going
to get shit done.
Excuse me Good, grab a drink ofwater.
Speaker 1 (43:14):
I'm surprised you hadn't had a drink of water
before now.
Speaker 2 (43:18):
No, I'm not losing my voice later on today, but
that's okay.
So, visionary, integrator andpersonality type.
You know I've done a lot oftraining just recently on the
different types of personalityand there's four personality
types.
You've got your sanguine,you're outgoing person, you got
(43:38):
your cholerax, or you're drivenmoney hungry buddy, want to
succeed at all costs.
You've got your.
You've got your melancholys,your analytical types, you've
got your phlegmatics.
Each position in your companyyou need a certain personality
type.
So I mean, if you're hiring anaccounts person and they don't
have any analytical personality,you're hiring the wrong person.
(44:01):
So there is the you know, thevisionary integrator test sheet,
which is something that Irecommend, and then the
personality type.
But I would much rather and I'vehad way better success we're
bringing in someone with a lowerskill level and then give them
that skill.
So I want the right attitude.
I want someone that's on boardwith my vision of where I want
(44:23):
to go.
And then there's ways to addskills.
So in plumbing and drains, forinstance, joe Cunningham has
amazing trade schools for airconditioning and for plumbing in
Houston and in 10 days you canget someone with zero skills to
a given skill level.
And Joe says it's about.
(44:44):
And you should get Joe on thepodcast because he'll be able to
explain this way better than meand he's had way more years in
the industry than me and most ofwhat I've learned is from Joe,
so he can get someone with zeroskill level to, let's say, 75%
of where they need to be in 10days straight and it's a really
(45:05):
low investment and I think it'sa good investment.
So you, let's say, you recruitsomeone, maybe a mature age
apprentice and I used to havegreat success with mature age
apprentices.
You know, using anywhere from25 years on ex-military is
perfect.
I love military personnelbecause they're structured and
(45:27):
they know how to follow a system.
So, ex-military, they've gotthe right attitude, their team
players, they're on board withthe vision.
Then you give them the skill.
So they go to Houston for 10days whether it's air
conditioning or plumbing andit's gonna be plumbing, because
that's the conversation todayand then they go back to their
company.
They get some experience out inthe field.
(45:49):
They get to understand, youknow, from doing the job.
Because, let's face it, you goto a 10 day training course.
You don't really learn shit.
You've got the basics and youknow what to do.
You learn when you actually getout there and do the work, and
actually I've got to retractthat statement.
You do actually get to do someof the hands-on stuff in the
(46:12):
school but let's face it, mostpeople learn when they're
actually in the real livesituation.
Okay, I mean, I can teach youhow to sell for day, I can spend
days with you teaching you howto sell plumbing, but until you
actually get out there in frontof a customer and do it, you
haven't really learned shit.
(46:32):
So, yeah, you do your 10 dayswith Joe and he's got some great
trainers.
You go back into the company,maybe spend a couple of weeks,
maybe a couple of months reallyimplementing what you've learned
, and then you send them to theSuperdrains Academy that's also
in Houston, which we are gonnarelocate that to South Carolina,
(46:53):
the American PipeliningSuppliers headquarters.
That might not be until the newyear.
So you've got the rightattitude.
You've made sure that thepersonality type is right.
They're not too much of avisionary, they're people that
will get you done.
You've trained them in Joe'sschool.
They come back into the company.
You've sent them back to theSuperdrains Academy.
(47:13):
They're ready to rock and roll.
They in let's call it threemonths to six months, you've got
an A-grader or at least ahigh-level B-grader that's gonna
sell drain repairs.
And look, I've trainedtechnicians that have worked for
me and other companies to sellup to $300,000 a month in drain
(47:35):
and transless drain repairs.
So there's that.
Look, there's so much more.
I could go on about thissubject, but, like I said, corey
, it's one that I am verypassionate about and yeah, I
just think, if you wanna scaleyour company and you wanna grow
it and you wanna grow it withthe right people, yeah, that's.
I now remember what I was gonnasay.
It's something that I'vecovered a few times now how many
(47:59):
companies actually know what itcosts to employ someone?
Speaker 1 (48:04):
what it really costs.
Speaker 2 (48:06):
And I my thoughts are , it's usually between three
months to six months of salary.
So if you're bringing onsomeone for 100K and a lot of
plumbers are earning way morethan that, now I know plumbers
that are getting paid north of200K a year.
That's just the way it is inSydney, australia.
(48:28):
But do you know what it coststo actually employ someone, with
the recruitment and thetraining?
It's between three to sixmonths of salary.
Speaker 1 (48:37):
So is that answer?
Speaker 2 (48:38):
your question.
It totally does.
Speaker 1 (48:42):
And I think we'll just kind of finish up with this
.
I think what you don't have badhabits when you're training
people that come potentiallyfrom outside the industry, they
don't have any bad habits thatyou have to break.
And it is hard to break badhabits.
It's hard to break trainingthat people have had good, bad
or indifferent to do it the wayyou wanna do it in your company,
(49:05):
and I think that's a lot of the, I think that's a lot of the
benefit of bringing someone fromoutside.
Would you agree?
Speaker 2 (49:12):
Yeah, absolutely.
But look, anyone that's been inbusiness for long enough knows
everything that I'm sayingprobably hits a nerve.
You know and I was having thisconversation the other day, I've
had this conversation quite afew times is that I believe in
my ability of being a coach andhelping other contractors in not
(49:34):
what went well for me, it'swhat didn't work for me, all the
things that caused me pain andfrustration and heartbreak.
Is where I've learnt my lessonsand I do my absolute best to
give back to any contractorthat's willing to work with me
and help them to avoid some ofthe pain that I've been through.
(49:56):
But look, if most contractorsare like me, you wanna learn the
hard way, you wanna learnyourself right, so, but all I
can do is advise you on what Ibelieve is the next best step
and helping a company to raiseits average drain tickets.
You know, from a couple ofhundred bucks to.
There's one client that I'veworked with that's got tickets
(50:17):
above $4,000.
And there's quite a fewcompanies out there that do big
average tickets in drains whenthey incorporate technology like
Translis, no Dig solutions.
So make sense.
Speaker 1 (50:32):
Well, alan, brick in, everybody find you.
By the way, this has been agreat conversation.
Brick in, everybody find you.
Speaker 2 (50:39):
Look, probably I'll give you some contacts to put in
the show notes.
So my email, direct email, isalan at service success network
dot com.
Don't ask me what my phonenumber is, cause I never
remember it.
It's written down somewhere.
But, look, I probably not givethat out.
I'll give you some contact bestcontact details service success
(51:01):
academy dot com is a good wayto get to our coaching, but I'll
give you some additionalcontact information to put into
your show notes.
So if anyone that wants to getto me, they can.
I'm currently down under butI'll be back in.
I'm based in Houston, texas,cause when I'm there I actually
(51:22):
do work for Joe Cunningham andhis great training organization,
and so I'll be back in Texas atthe end of July.
And, yeah, if anyone wants me,I'll look forward to seeing if I
can help.
Speaker 1 (51:35):
Yeah, and you got a great Facebook group too, which
is service.
Remind me the name of theservice success.
Speaker 2 (51:43):
We've got quite a few .
So we've got service successacademy.
But yeah, I'll get all thelinks For sure.
Speaker 1 (51:52):
Thank you, my friend, I really enjoyed it.
Speaker 2 (51:55):
Appreciate that and, yeah, you have a fantastic day,
corey, and I appreciate youhaving me on the podcast again.
Speaker 1 (52:02):
I appreciate you.
My friend Talk soon.
Thank you.
Welcome to the Successful Life Podcast.
I'm your host, Cory Barrier,and I am here with Alton
Ferguson.
What's up, Alton?
Speaker 2 (00:09):
Yeah, look, currently down under again spending a bit
of time with family and yeah,really, I mean I've been really
excited to get back on thispodcast with you.
I really enjoyed the last timewe connected and we've had a few
conversations since then andthis is great.
Thank you for the opportunity,cory.
Speaker 1 (00:29):
For sure.
So you have a new, I believe.
Just to segue you a littlepersonally, you have a new
nephew or new no grandsonGrandson.
Sorry, I have a new nephew, myapologies, I got myself mixed up
.
So you have a new grandson,fairly like very new, right?
Speaker 2 (00:48):
Yeah, he's one month old.
He was born seven weekspremature, at a whopping three
pounds, which is not much to besaid, and yeah, but he's back
home with mom and he's healthy,and that's all that matters,
right.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
It's all that matters , that's right.
So, alan Rick, look I want totalk about.
I want to talk about some ofthe things that you work with
plumbing companies or and orjust drain companies and I think
the first place I want to gowith this is how do you improve
their revenue?
(01:23):
How is it that you're able totake them from a, let's call it,
a $200, $300 average ticket toa $12, $13, $14, $2,000?
I mean, I don't know thenumbers exactly, but tell me,
you could actually run throughsome of those numbers.
What's the biggest gap you'veseen?
You've taken somebody from whatto what.
What's the biggest jump you'veseen?
Speaker 2 (01:44):
So and look, this is, I've worked with a lot of
companies here and I do workwith companies that have got
average tickets that aredeplorable, like anything under
500 average ticket in drainage.
You're really not doing itright.
So I've worked with companiesthat let's call them 300.
(02:05):
And I've the best companiesthat I've worked with I've
personally helped go from, youknow, three or 400 bucks to
about $2,000 average tickets andin a short period of time.
So you do the math on that likeyou don't have to be a rocket
science scientist to understandthat's a dramatic increase in
(02:28):
revenues.
So the companies that I foundedwe had plumbing and drain
companies.
We were probably between 2000and 2500 in average tickets,
depending on some of the biggerjobs that we would win.
But a recent example really goodcompany and look one of the
things with If you want toincrease your average ticket and
(02:51):
let's say you're three or 400,if you're below $500, we need to
look at how much you'recharging.
The way you're charging, I meanI recommend flat rate or margin
pricing for everything you do,except for drain clearing and
drain cleaning.
I believe that should be doneon an hourly rate in 30 minute
increments.
(03:12):
We got to get those rates right.
So recently, an example greatcompany drain company out of
Omaha, rod, started working withme last year I think it was
around October.
Average ticket was about 400,420.
We got him to 1280 within threemonths and he didn't have to do
(03:34):
a lot of work.
But this guy is a seriousimplementer.
Okay, he went in and did thefucking work and he got the
results.
So you know, a lot of thecompanies I work with are just
not willing.
They don't want to charge more.
Well, okay, and they're notwilling to put in the hard work
to actually get your averageticket up.
So and some of the things youneed to, it's not just about
(03:56):
charging more, but you need tohave a sales process so that
every drain call you run, you'relooking for massive opportunity
, you're presenting options tocustomers, showing them problems
that they didn't know they had,and your average ticket will go
up and the overallprofitability of the company.
Speaker 1 (04:18):
It does.
Speaker 2 (04:19):
It's kind of hard to look for problems if you don't
run a camera, though, right yeahcamera is our eyes and it's
sort of like taking a car to themechanic and not letting him
lift the bonnet.
You know like the camera is soimportant and I just don't know
how we got by all these yearswithout the camera.
But your camera is your bestfriend.
(04:39):
And when it comes to draincameras, don't Anyone that's
listening in to this podcast,it's a Plumber, a drain cleaner.
Don't cut yourself short here.
Make sure you get good qualitycamera, good monitors.
You can actually show thecustomer the problem.
You need to educate yourcustomer.
You need to show them what itis.
(04:59):
You're trying to sell them byidentifying and just having real
good visibility.
But there is a process for that.
I mean it's now you're havingthe camera.
If you're just using it foryour own viewing pleasure, you
need to.
The customer needs to comealong on the journey.
That's right.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
You know, and I think by having a better piece of
equipment.
Well, tell me the difference.
Tell me the difference in, youknow, your average piece of
equipment that maybe somebody'sgoing to buy because it's, you
know, is reasonably but you know, reasonably priced, opposed to
one that you would recommend.
Speaker 2 (05:38):
We always look all of that we had, like we had about
back in Australia.
We had about 30 drain trucksand each truck had a camera.
We went for the good quality.
It was rigid, which it's one ofthe most expensive, probably
not the most expensive.
But when it comes to camerasyou've got to realize you're
giving them to you, to plumbersbasically, and they're you know
(06:01):
they can be pretty rough onequipment.
Now you can have processes inplace and tell them how to, but
at the end of the day they'regoing to use that camera like a
plunger and they're just goingto.
They just want to get thatcamera down the drain and they
don't look after it.
If it was their own theyprobably would.
But you want something that'stough, that will go the distance
(06:23):
.
You don't want some of the andI'm not bagging any equipment
Okay, I'm sure there's somereally good quality Chinese
cameras on the market and I'vetried a few of them.
They look the same, theyprobably do the same thing.
But if they're breaking downevery couple of weeks, that's
just.
That's going to kill yourefficiency.
So we went for equipment thatwe knew was tough.
(06:44):
It's a bit like buying a truck.
You know you want somethingthat's going to be able to go
the distance and be able tohandle the rough wear and tear.
So that's my recommendations,but I'm sure there's good
quality equipment out there thatdoes go the distance.
And yeah, I'm just not overlyaware of it.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
Well and look, you probably can get some good ones
that are less expensive, but youtake the risk of it you know it
failing and then, like you said, that damages the efficiency,
which means you can't really runa 30 minute call for $79 or
whatever it is that they'rerunning it for, because the idea
behind that is that you don'tand correct me if I'm wrong but
(07:26):
the idea behind that is that youyou spend a half an hour for
that $79.
If it falls under the specificspecificity, I think, sort of
trying to say of what it of theoffer, right, and I think that's
that, potentially, is where alot of people fail is the offer
is also super important thatyou're very clear about what
(07:48):
you're doing and what you're notdoing in that 30 minute
timeframe.
Speaker 2 (07:53):
Yeah, look, when it comes to the specials and look,
I see a lot of companies inAustralia as well as the US have
copied, you know, the modelthat we I didn't create, the
model I created, shit I'd take.
I see what successful companiesare doing and I follow it, you
know, and I try to be asoriginal as I can.
I'm not into plagiarism oranything like that, but I look
(08:16):
at you know, we brought what Isaw, I learned around 2006,
2007,.
Some really successfulcompanies in the US and I was
part of the best practice groupand I took what I learned down
to Australia and we and lookeven, and I know one of the
things we've talked about is thepower of implementation and you
(08:42):
know we I didn't really havestrong implementers in the
business, but I was pretty likedriven to implement or what I'd
learned, and I learned that noteverything that works in the US
works in Australia.
So I learned through trial anderror and you know, no one was
really doing what we were doingat the time.
(09:04):
So what I learned throughtesting is and then I look at
the successful companies here inthe US and I believe that most
companies that do a special aregiving away too much, like we've
tried giving away cameras,giving away water jetting,
giving away stuff, and it wasdetrimental to the sales process
(09:26):
.
So what I mean by that, corey,is that you send a technician to
a job where the camera is beinggiven, the water jet never is
being given.
What the fuck does he sell Likehe's?
You've removed a couple ofsteps in the process.
So I believe that it's moreimportant to have the technician
(09:46):
get used to being selling acamera inspection and he might
sell that inspection off theback of a membership.
Or you might have a specialwithin your sales process, like,
for example, you might do, andI highly recommend companies
learn to build in 30 minuteincrements, and I'm only talking
about drain clearing, draincleaning, camera work, location
(10:11):
work should be charged in 30minute increments because it's
what builds.
You need to be in front of thecustomer every 30 minutes.
You're working on arelationship.
You're not going to sell shitunless you've got I can't
believe I said that, but anywayI've drilled the word shit into
a drain cleaning conversationGood one.
(10:34):
So you're not going to sellanything unless you've got the
relationship with the customer.
So my observations are specialsare great to get the phone ring.
Limit them as much as you can.
Don't give away the farm.
Train your technicians, yourentry level technicians, the
guys that are going to the run,the special.
Just train them in the basicstuff how to sell a camera
(10:56):
inspection, the importance ofshowing the customer the problem
.
You're going to your specialmight include 20 minutes or 30
minutes.
With hand rods or an electriceel you might limit it to a
certain distance.
So then you need to.
The idea is to get the water togo down, to pop the drain.
That just means you punch thehole in whatever's blocking it.
(11:18):
That's when you need to takethe customer on the first.
You need to show them what thatproblem is.
Don't go and fucking remove theproblem completely, because
what are you going to show them?
A clean pipe.
That will work out well foryour sales process.
So, anyway, that's probablygoing on a bit about this, but
this is just everything's got tobe thought out.
(11:39):
If you want to be successful indrain cleaning, drain clearing
and drain cleaning, you need tohave a process and your
technicians and look, I learnedthis, I learned, you know, I
thought like giving away camerasand giving away water jetters
and all that was the way to dothis.
And then what I learned was mytechnicians said to me Alan,
(12:00):
what the like this has hurt usbecause you used to give us a
commission on selling a Camryused to give us a commission
like because we, I believe inwhat gets rewarded, gets done,
and we would give ourtechnicians a financial reward
for following process and makingsales, and then that would
(12:20):
always lead to more salesbecause they knew that their
earnings were from selling stuff.
When you start removing thatstuff from them, I believe
that's a problem.
Speaker 1 (12:30):
I would totally agree .
It's like taking somebody'scommission away or reducing
their commission structure.
Essentially, yeah, no, I thatmakes complete sense.
But I'm sure you get well, whatif I, you know, if I went out
there to clean, clean or clearthe drain, and what if I'm not
done in 30 minutes?
Right, I'm sure you get thatall the time.
(12:51):
What am I supposed to tell thecustomer?
Cause I didn't do the job?
Speaker 2 (12:55):
Look, anyone that's in the plumbing and drain
industry knows that not thatmany drains can be cleared in 30
minutes.
Okay, but they can.
And you know you've got andlook, I share some great
examples of customers that theywould just call us out just for
that 30 minute special, whetherit's 79 or 99.
(13:16):
There's no look, I don't tellanyone what to charge.
I've got companies that can bevery successful charging 49.
And I've got other companiesthat I'm not doing it for less
than 199.
I don't really care what youcharge, as long as you can get
the phone.
Call your staff.
When the higher, the more youcharge, the harder it is for
(13:39):
your call center staff toconvert it.
The lower the fee, the easierit is for them to get a
technician in front of thecustomer.
And if you've got well-trainedtechnicians, the goal is to get
that technician to do the work.
But the lower the fee, theharder it is for the technician
to move that to your desiredbreak-even.
(13:59):
Because this is all about whenyou're running a special, a loss
leader.
It's all about getting tobreak-even in the shortest
amount of time and my systemthat I train we're aiming for
about an hour.
In the first 30 minutes you'lllose some money Before you get
is the fee that you've chargedand that's where it stops.
(14:19):
You've missed a step and youhaven't followed the sales
process.
But if you're able to keepgoing and, let's say, the next
30 minutes should be moving intothe correct charges that you
need for your equipment youshould be able to get to a
break-even point in 60 minutes.
Some companies it takes 90minutes and this is something I
(14:44):
say to the companies that I workwith, and one of the key
performance indicators I want isyou're running a special great,
you're giving away too much,and that's just my observations.
But what's your conversion rate?
Out of every 10 calls you run,how many of those calls are only
(15:07):
the special, meaning you're 79or you're 99.
And how many of them move tothe next level?
And if that number, if you'reconverting better than 30%, so
you don't want the special to beany less, any more than 30%.
So, meaning, out of every 10calls, three of those calls all
(15:31):
you collected was your 79 oryour 99.
And then seven out of thosehave moved to at least
break-even or profit, and thatmight be.
You might have four jobs fitinto that category and then
you'll have a couple of jobsthat go past where extend, where
they either have an excavation,which is, I highly recommend,
(15:53):
adding cleanouts, repairing theproblem, could be a complete
drain replacement.
It could be a full, trenchless,no-dig solution.
So you need to know the numbersand it's when I work with any
company the very first thing Isay is do you, what numbers do
you know?
Do you know what yourconversion rate is?
Now, if your conversion rate onthe special, if you're, if
(16:20):
that's above 30%, let's say 50%of your calls are at the special
, you've got a problem and weneed to fix that as quickly as
possible.
But there is a marketingopportunity there because you
can actually take that in yourmarketing to your you know
whether it's on social orwhether it's in your website and
(16:41):
tell the world look, you knowthere's a lot of hype around $79
drain clears.
But here is an example of allthe happy customers that have
had their drains cleared for $79.
Now that is going to build,that's going to build your brand
and but you've got to haveyou've got to have happy
customers, you know.
Speaker 1 (17:01):
I think also, you know, I think what you're saying
too is that you've got to alsoset expectations, and I think if
you set expectations I don'tthink I know with any sales
process if you set expectationsof how the call is going to go
and you let them know at the 30minute mark, 25 minute, whatever
it is I'm going to come back,I'm going to tell you where.
(17:22):
You know where we're at.
Here's what could happen, right?
Is that how you do it?
Or how do you set theexpectation?
Okay?
Speaker 2 (17:30):
Oh, you've got to like.
You know, I teach contractors aprocess and a real simple
process.
I, if you know what I teach,can fit on one page.
It's a checklist and you know,if any of your cast listeners
want access to that checklist,I'm happy to share some
information on that.
But you've got to keep itsimple and you need a step by
(17:51):
step process.
So the very first thing that Iteach is the pre-call that
technician.
If currently your dispatchers oryour CSRs do the first point of
call to let them know thetechnicians on the way, I want
you to allow the technician toalso.
The technician should becommunicating with the customer
(18:11):
because that's his first pointof contact.
That's where he can say hey, mrJones, it's Alan.
From on go bongo plumbing,whatever your company name is.
I'm on my way.
Listen, I'm dropping by aStarbucks to get myself a coffee
.
Can I get you one on the way?
No, that's all right, alan, I'mgood, but I look forward to
seeing you in 30 minutes.
So I'll be there and let thecustomer know you're going to be
(18:33):
there and also confirm withthat customer the problem that
they've got.
So I mean, we know that shithappens in service companies,
especially when you're doing it.
We were doing up to 2000 callsa month that we, our dispatchers
, accidentally sent our drainguy to an electrical or a HBAC
(18:54):
call.
So make sure you confirm thatthis.
You know, mrs Jones, it is ablock drain that I'm attending.
Yeah, yeah, alan, that's whatyou're coming out for.
So that first point of contactconfirm the address, confirm the
problem, start to build therapport with the customer, ask
them if they want a coffee youdon't need to do any more than
(19:14):
that and then when you get therein front of the customer, it's
like they already know you,right, and then that's then.
Your second point of contact isabout getting them to show you
where the problem is.
From there you need to say,right, for 30 minutes I'm going
to work my tail off, I'm goingto try to get this drain cleared
for you.
If I can, great, but if I can't, I'll come back and I'll knock
(19:36):
on the door and we'll discussthe next steps and that's it.
That's a process, right, but bythat time you've had two
interactions with the customer.
You're not ready to presentanything, any big numbers, but
you're getting closer, you'removing the sale in the direction
it needs to go.
Speaker 1 (19:53):
Perfect.
You explained that great.
And just for context, alan, Ithink if I'm not mistaken, the
last year you ran your companyyou did about $24 million.
How much of that, I think?
I guess that breaks down toabout 2.5 million a month.
How much of that was drained?
Speaker 2 (20:15):
We were drains alone, we were probably approaching
about 1.5 million in revenueevery month, but about a million
of that was from runningspecials.
So we had, you know, I think wehad a lot.
We had a lot of existingcustomers let's call it 70,000
to 100,000, that we wouldgenerate.
And I look and this is an areaI don't know if you want to dive
(20:37):
into, but I'd love to get intoexisting customers and how you
get more from them, and that'sprobably the area where I put
more energy into anything elseand maybe we can we can morph
into that later.
But so about a million a monthcame from running specials and
(20:57):
we would run a $79 drain clearor an an 99,.
We split test and I recommendany company listening to this
you need to be testing shit.
Don't just rely on what youthink is working.
Always test it with somethingelse.
And I got that idea from BillyStevens, the founder of Sira,
talking about.
He was testing using zerodispatch fees versus charging
(21:21):
and it was all about the leastamount of resistance and he
found that zero service feeswork better than charging the
customer.
Conversion rates were fine, butso, yeah, so about a million a
month came from specials andthen about half a million a
month came from existingcustomers that just rung up and
say I've got a block dragging.
You, send someone out to fix it.
(21:42):
Yep, we can do that.
And look, there's much more thatcomes into this.
You know, it's not just aboutgetting that phone to ring, it's
about everything that your teamdo to lock that call in.
To me, a drain call was worthbig money.
Okay, so the average lifetimevalue of a customer let's say a
(22:05):
drain customer to me, let's sayit's a 10, that customer,
probably over the next threeyears, is probably worth 10
grand to me.
And I did this exercise with acompany down under last week and
they calculated that theiraverage lifetime value of a
customer was about 8,000,.
But look, but you need to knowwhat that customer's worth to
(22:25):
you.
Okay, and this is why marketingto your existing customers
needs to be number one priority.
I'd like you know you want towaste money on Google AdWords.
Fine, that's just not myrecommendation.
Only because we used to do thatand I realized that the gold
and the revenue should come fromyour existing customers and no
(22:48):
one I repeat, no one is fullyexploiting that, but we're about
to launch a product that isgoing to blow the minds of
anyone that's listening when itcomes to their existing
customers and how to get morefrom them.
So yeah, so about 1.5 million amonth just from drains.
We were really set up well fordrains.
We had about 30 drain trucks.
(23:09):
All the trucks had jetters andcameras and locators and I
focused on drains because therevenue potential for us and the
profit potential was justmassive.
Hope that answers your question, corey.
Speaker 1 (23:23):
Yeah, 100%.
So look, here's how I see this.
If you've already paid for thecustomer, why would you not we
call it reactivation campaignhere why would you not
continually sell to that person?
I don't mean send them a salesemail every single week, but I
mean I guess you could right.
(23:43):
But you don't want to flood.
I don't want people to get thewrong idea because they'll flood
their customer base with abunch of crazy emails.
There doesn't have to besystematic.
There has to be a way to goabout doing it.
That is ultimately a salesemail, even if it's a value,
right?
Even if it's a value email.
And for you, you reactivatingthose drain customers also led
(24:06):
to electrical, plumbing, hvac,right.
Because now you get to tellthem all the other areas that
your business works in, andagain, you already paid for them
.
So why would you not utilizethose same people that you've
already sold to, opposed to,like you said, going on Google
and paying a fortune to get newpeople?
(24:28):
But people do it all the time100%.
Speaker 2 (24:33):
And look, I know we've discussed in.
You know we did a.
You were on a one of mypodcasts just recently and that
podcast is going to come out ina few days.
I'm not too sure when this iscoming out, so maybe your
podcast that you're a pipelineof profitability will come out
before this one is.
So it's funny how this allworks.
But you know we talked aboutthe power of AI and utilizing AI
(24:57):
with marketing automation.
I'm big on marketing automation.
I think we did it better thanmost people in the industry, but
it's very labor intensive.
So, to answer your question,why don't contractors market to
the customers they've alreadygot?
Because it's fucking hard work.
It really is Anyone that saysoh, it's easy, you just pick up
(25:20):
the phone and call them.
Well, yeah, you can do that,but it's you know if you can buy
.
And I learned this early in thepiece when we fought, when I
first started playing, you knowwe created a website.
Was probably around 2001, 2002.
Google AdWords I forget whatyear it was.
We started to play with that,but let's call it 2005.
(25:43):
I mean, I don't anyone that'slistened and hold me to the
dates, it's just I'm testing mymemory here.
It's pretty damn good, but it'snot perfect.
But we started playing withGoogle AdWords earlier than
anyone that I knew, and I waswatching all my fellow
contractors in the US boastingabout their full page yellow
(26:04):
paid page ads and I'm going fucklike.
What a waste of money.
It's a bit like Google AdWords.
Now, you know, I believe thatit's overpriced by a multiple of
at least 10.
And this is why it's theresponsibility of the marketing
manager and the owner to findleads at the lowest possible
(26:25):
denominator, and I believe thatcan be achieved from existing
customers.
So so, yeah, no, we talkedabout I marketing automation.
Now, if you were to engage, ifyou have someone in your
business that can get yourcustomers out of your job
management system whether that'sCIRA or there's some other
(26:46):
products out there not as goodIf you can get the data into a
full CRM that can email, sms,voice broadcast, remind your
outbound staff when to call, andthere's lots of other stuff
that it can do If you were to dothat manually or engage someone
, it's going to cost you a lotof money.
(27:06):
If you've got a lot of timeright, what if you could do the
same thing by using artificialintelligence?
And I know this is we're goingto.
We're going to venture intothis conversation because we're
about to launch a product whichis exactly what I'm talking
about, and this is not a salespitch, much, it's just.
(27:27):
I just want more contractors torealize what is possible, and I
believe that, by utilizing theright CRM with artificial
intelligence can reduce your thecost to market to your existing
customer to about 25%.
That's my view, and, look, I'vebeen wrong on more things than
(27:51):
I've been right, but I'mpredicting that this is the
future of AI.
Speaker 1 (27:57):
So I agree Because look, think about this there's
no human error with AI Once it'sset up.
If it's set up properly, you'renot going to have, you don't
have that.
You take that, and I don't meanlike you're taking out the
human element in all in yourbusiness.
I mean you're taking the humanelement out of sending those
(28:17):
manual emails or making thosefollow up not follow up calls,
but like to existing color.
It would take a lot of manpower.
It would take in again.
It would also take their humanerror.
That's involved with that, withwhat you're talking about there
.
If it's set up correctly and itwill be and it is it will be as
long as it Thanksgiving daymeal.
(28:37):
You don't have room for error.
Now don't get me wrong.
Is it perfect?
No, but it's pretty damn close.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
I look, I'm really excited about where this is all
going and with utilizing AI,with marketing, crm, follow up
and look, something that I wastaught and I probably I should
mention my business partner, joeCunningham, who taught me many
(29:07):
years ago the power of rehash.
Rehash is just following upleads that your technicians that
have left with your customersand not followed up for whatever
reason.
Look, I get it.
I mean trying to get whenyou've left proposals and
multiple proposals.
If you run your calls the waythat I teach, using the perfect
(29:29):
service call for drains andyou've left multiple options
with the customer and, forwhatever reason, your technician
didn't close, you've got anopportunity to get those sales,
bring those sales back in.
I did I think I may havementioned it on your podcast and
we've discussed this before isthat a company can generate up
(29:51):
to 30 percent of their sales canbe generated for just by
following up proposals and leadsthat have already been left
behind.
What if you could automate allthat stuff?
Now you can automate thereminder to call a customer,
because I believe that beforeyou get on the phone and ring
(30:13):
someone and follow up, youshould at least have some steps
in place.
Whether that's an email isquite unreliable.
I mean you might have a 15percent success rate where the
customer actually opens theemail doesn't mean they're going
to action the email.
You might then say well, smsworks better.
You might have a 30 percentsuccess rate with SMS, but
(30:37):
followed up with a voicebroadcast or a ringless voice
mark might deliver a 50 percent.
These are just numbers I'mpulling out of my ass, they're
not actual numbers.
But then with a follow-up callthat you might take that to 70
percent.
I learned this from Dan Kennedy,magnetic Marketing, years ago.
(30:59):
You've got to have a processand you've got to be consistent.
But I can be used for all thesteps, except for the actual
phone call.
And AI is not replacing staff,it's not replacing people.
You still need someone, stillneeds to get on the phone and
make the call, but the AI mightjust send you a reminder hey,
(31:21):
this customer needs to be calledtoday.
Fucking call them.
Speaker 1 (31:26):
Anyway, that's just Well, what if there was a way
that you send that sequence, thethree sequence, the ringless
voice mail, the email, the SMS.
But what if the SMS had theability to have an interactive
chatbot inside of it?
What that chatbot would dowould give you the ability, the
(31:48):
customer to say I want to goahead and book, or I don't want
to book, don't call me, do callme, or what do you have
available.
How do you see that working?
Because that is AI and that'sbeing implemented now.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
My thoughts.
Okay, look, I'll be honest withyou.
It's moving really fast and I'mnot a slow learner, but when I
learn something, I'm effing goodat it.
I believe that's just my view,but it's a bit like asking me
I've got no idea how electricityworks, but I love what it does.
(32:28):
It's much the same.
Corrie.
There's so much happening withAI.
All I know is what we'reutilising it in An example.
A great example of AI andsoftware would be CIRA software.
I mean what Billy Stevens isdoing with his product and AI is
(32:48):
just.
It's about to change theindustry for the better.
I would hate to be a competingsoftware to CIRA right now,
because they're about to gettheir ass handed to them
whoever's competing against itbecause he's using AI and the
shit that's going on with thatsoftware product.
It's just mind-boggling to meand I love that and I feel that
(33:13):
with a product like we'retalking about, that we're going
to be launching, that uses AI tohelp automate the marketing to
your existing customers and itdoes other shit as well, it does
way more than that.
It's about to revolutionise theindustry and that's just my
view and I'm entitled to it,right.
Speaker 1 (33:35):
That's right.
My point in saying that is thatyou want to make it as easy on
the customer as possible.
So if you hit them with all ofthose things and you give them
the ability to maybe go to yoursite, use a bot, send an SMS
back, communicate any way thatthey want to communicate, that's
really where you got to thinkabout the customer.
(33:58):
It's not what's necessarilyeasiest on me or you.
You got to think what's easieston the customer.
And the fact is customers aregetting younger and younger,
right?
I mean, younger people don'twant to pick up the phone and
call back.
Younger people would muchrather spend time on their phone
trying to book an appointment,and imagine if that appointment
(34:20):
goes straight to your calendar,which it will.
You've avoided forgetting tocall them back.
You avoided even having to callthem back because, look, nobody
loves calling people back,necessarily in playing phone tag
.
If you could eliminate thatwith this product, and I just
think it's going to make iteasier for everybody.
Speaker 2 (34:42):
Absolutely Look.
This is one thing.
And look, sometimes I go backto the basics and I keep to
anyone that's finding you knowthey're not getting the results
out of their business that theyshould be.
Sometimes you need to go backto the real basic shit and
because you tend to move awayfrom that and you tend to look
(35:03):
at all the some of the advancedstuff that's going on.
So one thing that I learned is,I mean, you know my companies.
I was proud to say that we dida frigging good job most of the
time.
And look, whenever you've gothumans that can make error,
there's going to be things thatjust don't go exactly as they
(35:24):
should.
But one of the things I learnedwas that we're, you know, like
the average service company.
Let's say, most of thecompanies I work are premium
companies.
They do a phenomenal job.
They might be a little bit onthe higher priced guys, but
they're providing a reallyquality service and they think
(35:45):
that their customer willremember them who they are.
I just want to challengeeveryone that's listening to
this.
Do not think that for a minute.
And I've learned the hard waywith I share my pest control guy
story that you know we alwayshad a lot of termites in our
homes and we got this companywho was recommended to us.
(36:06):
He was phenomenal.
He did a great job, hepresented us options, he found
termites, he fixed it and then,you know, it didn't cost an arm
and a leg.
We didn't have to take out asecond mortgage on my home to
fix the problem.
And then I said to him OK, sohow often do you need to check
for termites?
He said every six months.
I said will you remind me?
(36:27):
He said absolutely, I'll reachout.
We'll come back in six monthsand we'll just make sure there's
none of those little rascalshave snuck into any other part
of the home and anyone thatknows has had termites in their
home.
It can be quite devastating.
Homes get demolished whentermites have done too much
damage.
So six months later I said tomy wife at the time have you
(36:54):
heard from the termite guy?
No, have you.
Can you call him?
I said yeah, what's his phonenumber?
Well, I'd left that with you,haven't you got his?
I mean, this guy was good, weloved him, but neither of us
could remember the name of thecompany who he was, because
we're both leading busy livesand that's just.
I just wanted to share thatstory because if all you do with
(37:16):
your marketing automation islet your customers know who you
are and that you're still aroundand you've got to stay in
contact I mean, look, somepeople don't mind being emailed
daily I probably wouldn'trecommend it maybe weekly, but
don't just be throwing salespitches at them.
You've got to.
You know, I did a fantasticpodcast with a guy by the name
(37:39):
of Kevin Kniebel Kniebel Hope Isaid that right and he talked
about with communicating to yourcustomers.
You need, there needs to besome human element in there, you
know, and just sometimes justgot to connect with them.
How are you?
I hope everything is well andlook, when it comes to what to
(37:59):
say and what to do, that's notmy thing, but sometimes if
you're trying to sell them everyweek and you might piss them
off, so you need to think aboutthat.
But so that, just that onething just regularly
communicating to your existingcustomers so that they know who
you are and they'll remember you.
You should be putting stickersand magnets and valve tags
(38:21):
throughout the home foreverything you do, you know.
So you need to find a way tocontinually communicate and this
is one thing that I challengemy staff a lot on this and I
would throw I'd throw a questionat them and I knew that they
couldn't answer, but I would doit anyway, because that's just
the way I'm wired.
One of the things I used to sayto my CSR manager I'd say so,
(38:46):
out of all the customers on ourdatabase and let's call it
70,000, I think we had a lotmore how many of them know that
we now have the premium airconditioning company in Sydney?
And no one could answer thatquestion.
But the question itself is whatit was like.
(39:08):
Ok, let's get to work.
I want every single one ofthose customers to know that we
are now a premium airconditioning company, so that
that creates a challenge initself, right, because we know
that email might only deliver15%.
And so let's get to work.
Let's make sure that everysingle one of those customers
(39:28):
knows that we have the best airconditioning company in Sydney.
And that's just the way I roll,corey.
Speaker 1 (39:35):
Well, if you don't let them know who is, nobody
right.
I mean, you look, and youshouldn't feel bad about that.
You shouldn't feel bad aboutwanting to share how you can
help the people that havecontributed to your business.
That's how I see it.
Speaker 2 (39:54):
So yeah, so that's like that's just one thing.
There's so many.
There's so many more things youcan do.
You know, like we, one of thethings I want, the other, one of
the other things I teach my,the companies that me and Joe
work with and there's a lotwithin Australia and the US is,
when it comes to drains andwarranty, you need to be booking
(40:15):
.
You know, if you're going togive a lifetime warranty, which
I recommend, or 15 year,whatever, same 15 year, lifetime
, same thing.
Right, in my view, you need theability to book the warranty
inspection and, using AI, toreach out to those customers at
the desired time.
You know if it's a 12 monthlyinspection, maybe 10 or 11
(40:37):
months, before an email, theydon't respond, and the AI will
know that if they've opened theemail and not, right, and then
if they haven't, well then thatyou escalate that to a text
message.
Then you should know whetherthey've, and if they haven't
responded to that, then you'reon the upbound, but also sending
direct mail, and so the CRMwill actually communicate to a
(41:00):
mailhouse, or maybe you mighthave an internal ability.
So, and they're all some of thethings you can be doing that
you can be using artificialintelligence to help with right
100%, absolutely, and all right.
Speaker 1 (41:16):
so one more thing I want you to.
You know I should probably askyou this earlier, but I kind of
dropped the ball on it.
But you know the way I see.
When we were talking about yoursales process and how you
maximize drain calls, I wouldargue that you know everybody's
looking for employees,everybody's looking for
technicians, right?
But I think, if I'munderstanding you correctly, if
(41:39):
you run these calls the rightway, you run them efficiently,
maybe you wouldn't have to looknecessarily for more technicians
.
Speaker 2 (41:49):
So, look, you've touched on a look.
I might have to spend a littlebit longer on this one than
normal, because you've touchedon a key point for me, and it's
what I'm really about with my Isuppose passion for the
industry's been good for me andI want to be able to give back
as much as possible.
So, when it comes to growingand having technicians, I want
(42:15):
to ask everyone that's, I wanteveryone that's listening to
this podcast, and I'm sure it'sa lot of people right what's
what makes the better employee?
Someone who has got the skillthat you need and, yes, everyone
needs the skill, and I'll comeback to my thoughts on that or
do you want someone with theskill, or do you want someone
with the right attitude?
(42:36):
Okay now, attitude is important.
You want team players.
You want people that arewilling to, you know, to be
involved in a team environment.
You want people that are goingto go the extra mile.
So I feel my view is that it'smore important to get the right
(42:57):
person, the right personality,understanding whether that
person is a visionary or anintegrator and it's okay to have
visionaries in the business butyou want people that are going
to get shit done.
Excuse me Good, grab a drink ofwater.
Speaker 1 (43:14):
I'm surprised you hadn't had a drink of water
before now.
Speaker 2 (43:18):
No, I'm not losing my voice later on today, but
that's okay.
So, visionary, integrator andpersonality type.
You know I've done a lot oftraining just recently on the
different types of personalityand there's four personality
types.
You've got your sanguine,you're outgoing person, you got
(43:38):
your cholerax, or you're drivenmoney hungry buddy, want to
succeed at all costs.
You've got your.
You've got your melancholys,your analytical types, you've
got your phlegmatics.
Each position in your companyyou need a certain personality
type.
So I mean, if you're hiring anaccounts person and they don't
have any analytical personality,you're hiring the wrong person.
(44:01):
So there is the you know, thevisionary integrator test sheet,
which is something that Irecommend, and then the
personality type.
But I would much rather and I'vehad way better success we're
bringing in someone with a lowerskill level and then give them
that skill.
So I want the right attitude.
I want someone that's on boardwith my vision of where I want
(44:23):
to go.
And then there's ways to addskills.
So in plumbing and drains, forinstance, joe Cunningham has
amazing trade schools for airconditioning and for plumbing in
Houston and in 10 days you canget someone with zero skills to
a given skill level.
And Joe says it's about.
(44:44):
And you should get Joe on thepodcast because he'll be able to
explain this way better than meand he's had way more years in
the industry than me and most ofwhat I've learned is from Joe,
so he can get someone with zeroskill level to, let's say, 75%
of where they need to be in 10days straight and it's a really
(45:05):
low investment and I think it'sa good investment.
So you, let's say, you recruitsomeone, maybe a mature age
apprentice and I used to havegreat success with mature age
apprentices.
You know, using anywhere from25 years on ex-military is
perfect.
I love military personnelbecause they're structured and
(45:27):
they know how to follow a system.
So, ex-military, they've gotthe right attitude, their team
players, they're on board withthe vision.
Then you give them the skill.
So they go to Houston for 10days whether it's air
conditioning or plumbing andit's gonna be plumbing, because
that's the conversation todayand then they go back to their
company.
They get some experience out inthe field.
(45:49):
They get to understand, youknow, from doing the job.
Because, let's face it, you goto a 10 day training course.
You don't really learn shit.
You've got the basics and youknow what to do.
You learn when you actually getout there and do the work, and
actually I've got to retractthat statement.
You do actually get to do someof the hands-on stuff in the
(46:12):
school but let's face it, mostpeople learn when they're
actually in the real livesituation.
Okay, I mean, I can teach youhow to sell for day, I can spend
days with you teaching you howto sell plumbing, but until you
actually get out there in frontof a customer and do it, you
haven't really learned shit.
(46:32):
So, yeah, you do your 10 dayswith Joe and he's got some great
trainers.
You go back into the company,maybe spend a couple of weeks,
maybe a couple of months reallyimplementing what you've learned
, and then you send them to theSuperdrains Academy that's also
in Houston, which we are gonnarelocate that to South Carolina,
(46:53):
the American PipeliningSuppliers headquarters.
That might not be until the newyear.
So you've got the rightattitude.
You've made sure that thepersonality type is right.
They're not too much of avisionary, they're people that
will get you done.
You've trained them in Joe'sschool.
They come back into the company.
You've sent them back to theSuperdrains Academy.
(47:13):
They're ready to rock and roll.
They in let's call it threemonths to six months, you've got
an A-grader or at least ahigh-level B-grader that's gonna
sell drain repairs.
And look, I've trainedtechnicians that have worked for
me and other companies to sellup to $300,000 a month in drain
(47:35):
and transless drain repairs.
So there's that.
Look, there's so much more.
I could go on about thissubject, but, like I said, corey
, it's one that I am verypassionate about and yeah, I
just think, if you wanna scaleyour company and you wanna grow
it and you wanna grow it withthe right people, yeah, that's.
I now remember what I was gonnasay.
It's something that I'vecovered a few times now how many
(47:59):
companies actually know what itcosts to employ someone?
Speaker 1 (48:04):
what it really costs.
Speaker 2 (48:06):
And I my thoughts are , it's usually between three
months to six months of salary.
So if you're bringing onsomeone for 100K and a lot of
plumbers are earning way morethan that, now I know plumbers
that are getting paid north of200K a year.
That's just the way it is inSydney, australia.
(48:28):
But do you know what it coststo actually employ someone, with
the recruitment and thetraining?
It's between three to sixmonths of salary.
Speaker 1 (48:37):
So is that answer?
Speaker 2 (48:38):
your question.
It totally does.
Speaker 1 (48:42):
And I think we'll just kind of finish up with this
.
I think what you don't have badhabits when you're training
people that come potentiallyfrom outside the industry, they
don't have any bad habits thatyou have to break.
And it is hard to break badhabits.
It's hard to break trainingthat people have had good, bad
or indifferent to do it the wayyou wanna do it in your company,
(49:05):
and I think that's a lot of the, I think that's a lot of the
benefit of bringing someone fromoutside.
Would you agree?
Speaker 2 (49:12):
Yeah, absolutely.
But look, anyone that's been inbusiness for long enough knows
everything that I'm sayingprobably hits a nerve.
You know and I was having thisconversation the other day, I've
had this conversation quite afew times is that I believe in
my ability of being a coach andhelping other contractors in not
(49:34):
what went well for me, it'swhat didn't work for me, all the
things that caused me pain andfrustration and heartbreak.
Is where I've learnt my lessonsand I do my absolute best to
give back to any contractorthat's willing to work with me
and help them to avoid some ofthe pain that I've been through.
(49:56):
But look, if most contractorsare like me, you wanna learn the
hard way, you wanna learnyourself right, so, but all I
can do is advise you on what Ibelieve is the next best step
and helping a company to raiseits average drain tickets.
You know, from a couple ofhundred bucks to.
There's one client that I'veworked with that's got tickets
(50:17):
above $4,000.
And there's quite a fewcompanies out there that do big
average tickets in drains whenthey incorporate technology like
Translis, no Dig solutions.
So make sense.
Speaker 1 (50:32):
Well, alan, brick in, everybody find you.
By the way, this has been agreat conversation.
Brick in, everybody find you.
Speaker 2 (50:39):
Look, probably I'll give you some contacts to put in
the show notes.
So my email, direct email, isalan at service success network
dot com.
Don't ask me what my phonenumber is, cause I never
remember it.
It's written down somewhere.
But, look, I probably not givethat out.
I'll give you some contact bestcontact details service success
(51:01):
academy dot com is a good wayto get to our coaching, but I'll
give you some additionalcontact information to put into
your show notes.
So if anyone that wants to getto me, they can.
I'm currently down under butI'll be back in.
I'm based in Houston, texas,cause when I'm there I actually
(51:22):
do work for Joe Cunningham andhis great training organization,
and so I'll be back in Texas atthe end of July.
And, yeah, if anyone wants me,I'll look forward to seeing if I
can help.
Speaker 1 (51:35):
Yeah, and you got a great Facebook group too, which
is service.
Remind me the name of theservice success.
Speaker 2 (51:43):
We've got quite a few .
So we've got service successacademy.
But yeah, I'll get all thelinks For sure.
Speaker 1 (51:52):
Thank you, my friend, I really enjoyed it.
Speaker 2 (51:55):
Appreciate that and, yeah, you have a fantastic day,
corey, and I appreciate youhaving me on the podcast again.
Speaker 1 (52:02):
I appreciate you.
My friend Talk soon.
Thank you.
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