September 1, 2025 • 61 mins
In this episode of The Articulate Fly fishing podcast, host Marvin Cash sits down with Dave Huff, the driving force behind Whuff Rod Co. and founder of the Kentucky River Musky Classic tournament.
Guest Expertise: From Custom Rod Builder to Industry Innovator
Dave Huff brings a unique perspective to fly rod design through his background in industrial design and mentorship under legendary rod builder Mike Arnold from the Northern Kentucky Fly Fishers. What started as custom rod building in 2016 evolved into Whuff Rod Co., driven by Dave's frustration with existing musky fly rods that lacked soul and proper mid-flex action.
What You'll Learn: Rod Design Philosophy and Business Strategy
Discover how Dave's "better mousetrap" mentality led to developing rods with superior feel and casting comfort. Learn about his commitment to organic growth over flash marketing, his unique $65 full rod replacement warranty policy and why he believes affordable quality rods ($179-$459 price points) can democratize fly fishing access.
Featured Techniques: Mid-Flex Rod Design for Musky Fishing
Dave explains why traditional saltwater rods repurposed for musky fishing fail when throwing "wet socks at tree stumps." His River Wolf 11-weight and complete lineup from 3-weight to 12-weight prioritize all-day casting comfort and fish-fighting capability over stiffness.
Kentucky River Musky Classic Insights
Get inside details on this growing tournament that went from 21 teams in year one to 112 anglers in year two, despite historic flooding challenges. Dave shares how the event supports Muskies Inc. Chapter 52 conservation efforts and influences state fisheries management decisions.
Upcoming Innovations and Trade Show Circuit
Learn about the upcoming "Destination Series" mid-priced rods and Dave's ambitious three-pack rod bundles for saltwater slam fishing. Plus, find out where to catch Whuff Rod Co. at 2026 trade shows and the new Whuff Pack YouTube series.
Ready to discover how thoughtful rod design and authentic business practices are reshaping the fly fishing industry? This episode delivers actionable insights for anglers and entrepreneurs alike.
Sponsors
Thanks to TroutRoutes for sponsoring this episode. Use artfly20 to get 20% off of your TroutRoutes Pro membership.
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All Things Social Media
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:03):
Hey folks, it's Marvin Cash,the host of The Articulate Fly. On
this episode, I'm joined byDave Huff, the driving force behind
Whuff Rod Co and the KentuckyRiver Musky Classic. Dave shares
his passion for chasing muskieon the fly and what drove him to
make Whuff Rod Co a reality. Ithink you're really going to enjoy
this one, but before we get tothe interview, just a couple of housekeeping
(00:25):
items. If you like thepodcast, please tell a friend and
please subscribe and leave usa rating and review in the podcatcher
of your choice. It reallyhelps us out. And a shout out to
our newest game changerpatron, Michael Bryan. Thanks for
your support. And rememberfolks, we host our community on Patreon.
Check out the link in the shownotes to learn more about all the
great benefits like discountson tying materials and guide trips
(00:48):
and much more. And finally, ashout out to our sponsor. Trout Routes.
We all know streams aregetting crowded, and chances are
you're not the only one atyour local access point. Get away
from the crowds and busygravel lots by using TroutRoutes
Pro. With over 350,000 accesspoints mapped across 50,000 trout
streams and much more, TroutRoutes has all the data you need
(01:10):
to help you find anglingopportunities that others will overlook.
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all one word for 20% off ofyour Trout Routes Pro membership
at maps.troutroutes.com now onto our interview. Well, Dave, welcome
to the Articulate Fly.
(01:32):
Yeah, thanks for having me.
Yeah, I'm looking forward toour conversation. And we have a tradition
on the Articulate Fly. We liketo ask all of our guests to share
their earliest fishing memory.
Okay. Yeah, Farm pond fishingfor me, man. My, you know, I grew
up in Kentucky, rural Boonecounty area and fishing with my grandpa.
(01:54):
Probably, probably the, thesingle moment that sticks out the
most is, you know, I was maybesix or seven and I remember casting
out a Rapala or something andhooking two fish on the same lure
(02:14):
and bringing them in. And Iremember that pretty vividly is after
that I was like, I was allabout fishing. You know, like I want
to, you know, lunch break atthe farm. I was fishing after work.
I was fishing, just trying to,you know, chase stuff. And I was
notoriously like late for, fordinner with my, with my buddies.
(02:38):
You know, my mom would belike, you know, we'd be, we'd walk
down a creek and before yourealize that you're, you're two miles
down the creek and realize youhave to be back for dinner and, you
know, a half hour and you'renot going to make it, you know, kind
of stuff. So, yeah, whateverkind of outdoor adventures I could
get into, I always tried totie into, you know, try to tie in
(03:01):
fish into that stuff.
Yeah. Very, very neat. So whendid you come to the dark side of
fly fishing?
I tried it. At one point. Ihad a relative from, like, Texas
that had a fly rod orsomething that he brought up on,
like, a family trip. And Inoted. I saw it. I. And I. I mean,
(03:22):
I tried it a couple times, andI feel like I had. I don't remember
the year necessarily, but Idefinitely know, like, in my younger
years, you know, middle schoolage is. You know, I've tried it a
few more times and didn'treally pick it back up until after
(03:43):
college. And it was one ofthose things where it just kind of
set the. The rod just kind ofsat in the corner, you know, it was
cool. And then other stuff gotcool. I grew up racing dirt bikes
and got into cars and thencollege, and, you know, I. I picked
it back up later in life on atrip down to Brevard and fishing
(04:10):
the Davidson River. That kindof like, re. Ignited fly fishing
for me. And then from there,it was kind of. It was kind of on,
you know, still. I still dosome spin fishing from time to time,
but I'm about a 90 percenterwhen it comes to fly fishing.
(04:31):
Yeah, it's pretty neat. TheDavidson is probably my favorite
river to fish in North Carolina.
Yeah. Yeah. I was. It was on akind of a whim. A buddy of mine was
down there. We were on a trip,and, you know, we were kind of. We
have been talking about flyfishing, and we had new fly fishing
setups that we were. We weretrying to plan this big boundary
(04:53):
water trip, and we were gonnatry to go up there and, you know,
live out of canoes for three,three to four weeks and take some
fly rods with us. And we wentdown there one year just on vacation,
and we're kind of like, man,we should just book a guide trip
so we could kind of take acrash course and, like, learning
(05:16):
all this, because it's like. Iwas like. It's way different from
when I did it. Did I come upand we met. We met up with a guide.
Guide down there by the nameof Jeb. And I remember we showed
up. We showed up and look likenoobs, probably. And, you know, we
get out in the water, and thefirst thing he Said to me, to us
(05:39):
is said, this ain't a riverruns through it, and woolly buggers
ain't, you know, he's like,we're not. You're not going to be
waving these things around inthe air all day trying to make false
casts. He's like, I'm going toshow you how to roll cast. I'm going
to show you how to catch somefish. You. And I kind of. I kind
of looked at my buddy. I'mlike, this guy's my kind of people,
you know? So, yeah, from thenit was. It was kind of on. We. My
(06:02):
buddy hooked into. Immediatelyhooked into a huge brown trout that
the guide kind of opened hiseyes when he saw it jump out of the
water and realized it was abig one, you know, and we caught
a bunch more fish that day.And, yeah, rest is history. Now it's
just a challenge of gettingout of as many days as I can and
(06:23):
trying to learn as manydifferent, you know, styles of fishing
that you can. So.
Yeah, I bet that was Jeb hallfrom Davidson River Outfitters, wasn't
it?
Oh, yeah. He's a bad man.
Yeah, I've. So I've knownthose guys forever, and I have a
tradition with my boys. I takethem fishing during the Christmas
holidays, and Jeb was ourguide on one of those trips because
(06:45):
I always know that it's betterfor him to work with the kids so
I don't lose my patience whenthey were younger and yell at them
and ruin the day.
So. Yep, yep. Yeah, he's got alot of patience, and he's just a
really fishy dude. So.
Yeah, absolutely. Jeb is. Jebis a great guy. All the guys at DRO
Are awesome and, you know, soyou kind of come back to it a little
(07:06):
bit later on in your life, youknow? Who are some of the folks that
have mentored you as you'vegotten kind of deeper into the sport.
Man, Mostly. Mostly guys fromthe fly fishing club up here. The
Northern Kentucky fly fishers.They're just. There's so much knowledge
(07:26):
there. It's an. It's an agingclub, you know, Mike Arnold is one
of the oldest members of theclub, and he's actually the one that
taught me how to. How to buildfly rods. And he's still there. He's
still active with the club. Hestill teaches rod building. And I
(07:49):
just kind of. I'm one of thosedudes. Like, my wife knows when we
go on vacation, she's probablygonna. I'm gonna disappear for a
Couple hours and she canalways probably find me at the, the
old bait shop talking to theold crusty, salty dudes. Like she
just knows that she's gonnalose me for a couple hours to those
dudes. You know, I just lovehearing stories and love learning
(08:13):
and those, those guys are justa wealth of knowledge. And yeah,
they're probably some of my,as far as fly fishing goes, like
some of my biggest mentorscame from the NKFF for sure. Yeah.
It's interesting. I know MikeArnold from my time is the president
of the Southeastern council offff. And yeah, yeah, he's a great
(08:37):
guy and he was always, heknow, always doing tons of stuff
with the council. I haven'tseen him in a long time because the,
you know, the, the councilwasn't as active as it has been and
it's kind of coming back. Butyeah, he's a great, great person
to learn from for sure.
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.
And so kind of funny, right?So, you know, Wolf Rod Company is
almost 10 years old. You know,you, you kind of get into fly fishing.
(08:59):
Like, you know, what makes youcrazy enough to want to start a rod
company?
I mean, in the early days Iwas doing custom rods. So I started
doing custom rods in 2016 andI just basically, I really enjoyed
the process. You know, mybackground in design, you know, creating
(09:25):
things has always beensomething that I, I love to do. I
mean, even in my full timejob, I build mountain bike trails
and hiking trails for aliving. So we're just creating things
in nature and forests andtrying to make things out of dirt
that look like they've beenthere for 10 years, you know, so,
(09:47):
so yeah, I mean, started doingcustom rods. It got to a point where
with the full time job, I justcouldn't really. I hated the fact
that I had to tell people,like, hey, it might be, you know,
four, five months before I canget your rod done. You know, that
was like that for me. That waslike the turning point from where
(10:07):
it went from like Davebuilding rods on his kitchen table
or in the basement in hisgarage, whatever, to like trying
to figure out like, maybe thisneeds to be something else. And then
the icing on the cake for mefor the actual birth of Wolf Rodco
was I was like, I started flyfishing for Muskie, you know, 10
(10:33):
years ago or something and Ijust didn't enjoy the rods. I, they
weren't, you know, I, I tried,I tried a few and they just like
some. I didn't know what Ididn't like, but I Knew I didn't
like them, you know, andthat's when I kind of went to the
(10:53):
drawing board. And now, youknow, I was super active in my club,
the, you know, the. The localclub. And we were getting a ton of,
like, new members every month.Like, we were getting like 10 or
12 new members showing up tothe fly club, and then they weren't
(11:13):
coming back. So, like,between. There's like, a little culmination
of, you know, not. Not lovingthe fly rods that I had access to,
seeing people that were reallypassionate about fly fishing not
come back to the meetings. AndI just kind of. My brain is so focused
(11:34):
on, like, the bettermousetrap, so to speak. You know,
I. I kind of put my head downand realized, like, most of the people
were going to our local shop,they were trying on waiters, they
were doing all the stuff that.That they were taught to do, you
know, to get set up. And thenthey'd go to the rods and they'd
(11:56):
put a Thomas and Thomas infront of them, and they'd be like,
holy crap, you know, like.Like, I'm going to be spending, like,
$2,000 to go fly fishing. Andthen, you know, it was kind of like
they just. I'm fine with justspin fishing. You know, they didn't
know another way. Um, so itwas a little bit of rod performance.
(12:18):
I wanted something thatwasn't, you know, necessarily super
popular at that time. Um, andthen price. I wanted to be able to
provide a rod that had reallygood quality at an affordable cost
so that people could actuallyget out and enjoy fishing and not
be stressed about saving moneyto buy a fly rod.
(12:39):
Yeah, got it. And so, youknow, tell me a little bit. You know,
you were saying there wassomething specifically you didn't
like in the musky sticks youwere fishing. So tell me, like, how
that translated into the styleand feel of the wolf rodco rides.
I just. They. They were reallystiff and didn't handle musky flies
(13:00):
well, you know, and at thattime, I didn't know why, because
I didn't know enough about flyrod design. I just knew I didn't
like it. And when I don't likesomething, I try to figure out how
to make it work. You know, Ican work with anything, but I know,
I know what I want and I knowwhat I don't like, you know, And
(13:20):
I think part of it is the longtime frame from when I learned how
to fly fish to where I pickedit back up to where, you know, I
just remember as a Kid and youknow, being younger, how much feeling
and like soul a flyer I'd had,like, that was the thing I loved
(13:42):
about it is you could feel thefish, you could feel the cast when
you caught a fish, you couldfeel the fight. And these new, these,
these fly rods I was using formuskie, you know, they're looking
at it now. They were justessentially rebranded saltwater rods
that weren't made to throw wetsocks, you know, at, at tree stumps.
(14:05):
They just, they were made forthrowing little flies through wind.
They had a lot of tip feel andthat was about it. And that's just
not what I, you know, I, Iwent back to the drawing board and
wanted to really, I wanted toprovide a, a really mid flex heavy
rod that you could cast day inand day out for an entire four day
(14:27):
trip and not wear yourselfout. And it would be built like a
tank and affordable. Andthat's the Riverwolf, one of our
rods, the 11 weight, that wasthe first rod that I actually developed
was an 11 weight, which isprobably not something most flop
(14:48):
companies start with, butthat's where I went. So.
Yeah, it's interesting toobecause I think having a little bit
more feel in the rod certainlyhelps from a timing perspective.
And you know, because you feelthe rod better and it makes it, I
think, you know, fishing a rodwith a little bit more sole actually
makes it more pleasant becauseyou don't have to sit there and watch
what's happening because youcan feel what's happening.
(15:11):
Yep, yep.
So, you know, you have abackground in industrial design.
Tell me a little bit about howthat kind of works its way kind of
into your, your ride designsand your, your manufacturing process.
I mean for the most part I, Iprobably did things really backwards
from like what a traditionalfly rod company would do. I just
(15:34):
ordering blanks, figuring outthe ones that I really liked, figuring
out like learning about tapersand learning about mandrels. And
I, I designed the first fewones in my rods. I designed them
out of feel like reverseengineering them essentially off
of like blanks that I wouldjust order from a catalog, you know,
(15:54):
until I found the ones that Iliked, you know, and then from there,
you know, doing somemeasurements, figuring out what,
what I liked about them andwhat they, what made them, you know,
react the way they did. Nothaving that background fly fishing
wise, but having theindustrial design background to kind
of know like how to takesomething apart and dissect it and
(16:18):
really like figure it out.That's what, that's kind of where
the influence part comes inis, you know, obviously like people,
people know us from ourcolors. Our colors are definitely
stand out against the crowd.And that was another thing. The industrial
design side of me was like,like, if I'm going to come out here
(16:40):
and I'm going to come outswinging against all these big companies,
I, I got to not look like allthose big companies. You know, if
I come out with the, you know,a standard green rod with black wraps
or a black rod with graywraps, like I'm going to get lost
in the crowd real quick, youknow. Yeah.
Plus it helps, you know, whenpeople bump into people fishing your
(17:01):
rods on the water and they'relike, well, what's that kind of lime
green rod? Who made that?
Right? Yep, absolutely. Imean, and it's great. Like we've
been a major supporter of likethe Beast of the east tournament
for the last four years orfive years now. And it's cool being
on the water in a tournamentsetting and seeing a bunch of our
(17:22):
like blue 12 weights withbright orange wraps standing up in
a rod tube, like going, youknow, flying down the river, you
know, you can see them rightaway. Yeah. And it's just, it's just,
it's, it's been cool. I mean,I've had a lot of really great feedback.
People like, really like therods, you know, and even at trade
(17:44):
shows and stuff, yousurprisingly had a good amount of
older folks that voice theiropinions positively that they're
like, man, these things lookso great. Sometimes those other rods,
Rods just got really boring,you know, And I'm like, dude, coming
(18:04):
from like a 78 year old dude,that's kind of, that's pretty cool,
you know. So, yeah, absolutely.
And I would, I wonder too. SoI was kind of curious. So have you
found people making blanksthat you like or have you gotten
to designing tapers that youlike and you have people making the
blanks for you?
So I, I, I have a factoryoverseas. They have, they have their
(18:27):
own full R and D facility andI basically utilize their R D facility
to produce me tapers that I,that I want in the beginning. It
might like the, the 11 weight.I think I built 10 or 11 rods before.
(18:53):
I was like, this is the one.I've used the same shop from day
one when I went, when Idecided to go factory built. I still
build all the originals andI've got a really good working relationship
with them. I can at thispoint, I can kind of tell them what
(19:14):
tweaks I want to make andthey'll send me a blank to test.
And you know, the last two orthree, man, they, they nail them,
dude, straight out of thegate. That like I. Our communication's
so good after 5 years beendealing with the same person in the
company and it's been great.They own all the mandrels. And that's
(19:39):
just a cost thing for me rightnow. Like, it's not super important
for me to own the mandrel.It's more important for me to have
access to a full R D facilitythat can tweak, you know, tapers
and do things that I wantbecause I don't have the ability
to. To build my own, you know,facility like that yet. So they do,
(20:01):
they do all that. I do all thespecs and then I'll blueprint. I'll.
I'll blueprint a rod. Once Iget it where I want it, I'll spec
the taper that they. That'sthe. Whatever the final revision
is. I'll spec that and thenI'll spec everything down to thread
wrap color, you know, spacingguides, cork grade, you know, rating
(20:25):
grain, grain window, the wholedeal and then do all the artwork
for them. And it's a, it's acool process. I enjoy it. I really
do enjoy it. You know, thefirst few rods that I developed were
I really, you know, the 5weight, the 7 weight and our 11 weight,
(20:48):
they have like that more midflex feel. Really got a ton of soul
to them and just kind of takeyou back to your roots cast kind
of feeling. But then, youknow, I've got some other rods that
have a little bit more actionto them and a little wider, a little
faster, you know, so there's alittle bit of everything that every
(21:10):
one of our rods isn't built onthe same taper or blank material.
So very neat.
And so, you know, it's kind ofinteresting hearing you talk about
having stuff made overseas.How are you dealing with the tariff
stuff right now?
So far so good. I know somecompanies are having a little harder
time than we are. It's the,the biggest hurdle for us has been
(21:35):
freight costs. The freightcompanies are really dinging you.
Their freight costs havedoubled over what they were, which,
you know, is unfortunate. Ithink they're trying to take advantage
of a situation more than. Imean, the costs haven't gone up that
much for them. It's just. Theysee a chink in the armor and they
(21:56):
go for the throw. Right. So. So.
Well, let's, let's hope thatthat gets better. And the terror
Stuff doesn't cause you any,any lost sleep, right?
Yeah, man, I'm, I'm gonna, youknow, we had a few questions about
that this year at the tradeshows and things. And I just kind
of told them, you know, like,we know our numbers. We're gonna
(22:17):
try to hold steadfast as farand long as we can to our current
pricing. And, you know, if wegot to make changes, we do. But for
now, we're, you know, my wifeand I are, are the entire company
and we're both, we're bothcomfortable with where we're at and
(22:38):
we want to try to. I'd ratherget more hand, more rods out in people's
hands fishing than pad mypockets more. So.
Yeah. And so, you know, kindof help us, help me kind of, you
know, help our listeners kindof understand what differentiates
your rods, you know, in thesense of, you know, you're at a great
price point. How do youcompare to like the super high price
(22:59):
points in terms of performanceand warranties and things like that?
And then similarly to kind ofcome down, you know, I think one
of the things that like, forexample, TFO really did in the fly
rod business is basedbasically made everyone start to
make, you know, for lack of abetter word, like an entry, mid level
and high level rod. You know,how do you kind of compare to, you
know, other kind of, you know,entry level rods from other manufacturers?
(23:23):
Yeah, I mean, you know, thebeauty, the beauty of it is we're
so new that our biggest hurdleis getting our name in front of people.
Our rods perform very, verywell. And most people that test cast
one of our rods at a tradeshow, their, their immediate response
(23:47):
is this rod tests or this rodcasts as good as X, Y or Z, you know,
which are typically all fourto five hundred dollar rods, you
know, and then the other thingis like, I can't believe it's. I
can't believe this. You'reselling these rods for this much,
you know, and we've got abouta 75% conversion rate at trade shows.
(24:14):
If we're at a trade show thathas a, has a casting lane and the
availability for people topick a rod up and go cast it, about
75% of those people come backand buy a rod. So I think that we're
doing the right thing. We'vegrown organically. I've been a super
(24:34):
big proponent from day one. Idon't, I don't believe in flash in
the pan marketing. I want togrow organically and slowly. Word
of mouth is you know, word ofmouth is still king no matter what.
You know, we, we don't buy, wedon't buy likes, we don't buy followers
and we, you know, we put ourmoney where our mouth is. And I think,
(24:57):
you know, from a rod'sperspective, you know, a lot of our,
a lot of our 250, $250 plusrods are built on Fuji Alkanite guides.
Really good modulus blanks.You know, the, the componentry is
there. You can see it and feelit. Another cool thing for us, you
(25:22):
know, from a salesperspective, everything, everything
six weight and above comeswith an extra tip in the, in the
rod tube. Part of my reasoningfor that is just because I've been
on trips before where I didsomething stupid and broke a tip
and it just ruined my tripbecause I was just bombed, you know,
(25:44):
so having an extra one there,you know, it, it's not, it's not
a huge thing, but it'ssomething, it's, it's a nod to let
people know like, hey man,like I grew up, you know, I grew
up fishing and traveling andfishing and I'm trying, we're trying
(26:05):
to think through all thoselittle details. You know, another
really big thing that we dothat a lot of companies don't do,
we do not replace sections ofa rod. I just don't, don't agree
with it. I've never had a goodexperience with trying to get one
section replaced on a rod. Therod just has never felt the same
(26:30):
ever again. So if one of ourcustomers breaks a rod, there is
a replacement fee, 65 plusshipping. And you know, if it's on
their side, if they smash itin a car door or something, $65 plus
shipping, they're getting abrand new fly rod shipped to their
(26:50):
door. So, and if it'ssomething on our end, you know, a
guy, they have a guide failureor something happens that we can
identify as a quality issue,then we ship them a brand new rod
on our dime. So I think that'ssomething that's kind of unheard
of in the industry. Mostpeople don't know that's our policy
(27:13):
just because we're so smallstill. But it's just another thing
that we do to try to getpeople back out fishing quickly and
not have ongoing problems witha rod that they have, you know, three
sections that are two yearsold and then one section that's brand
new. It's just, it's aphilosophy that we're going to stick
(27:34):
with and you know, it'sObviously not the best financial
model, but we're, we'rewilling to put our money where our
mouth is and we want people tobe happy with our product and get
back out to fishing. Yeah.
It's funny you say that. Weshould have a few beers sometime
(27:55):
and talk about organic,Organic growth. Cause I think that's,
I actually think it's asuperpower in this day and age. And
I think the more and more wesee technology, I think it's going
to be more and more importantfor, for real companies to grow their
businesses.
Yeah, I, I mean, I think thata man's word is always going to be
(28:17):
valuable, you know, andorganic growth is a lot like that.
Organic growth to me is kindof like a man's handshake. Right.
So it's not something, youknow, if, if you stand behind it
and you stand behind yourproduct and you do what you say you're
going to do. And I, I thinkit's. Yeah. I mean, in this world
(28:39):
of AI and all this otherstuff, like, people can create fake
things, but if you're a humandoing good things and being a good
person and creating a goodbrand and sticking behind it, like,
they can't take that away fromyou. So.
Yeah, and I've neverunderstood this whole game of buying
followers. Like, I just, itjust makes no.
(29:01):
Sense to me, man. When youstart putting a dollar figure to
it, that's what, that's,that's how they make it make sense,
you know, that's where it wentwrong, you know, so every 10,000
followers you get is a dollaramount and that's, that's when things
kind of go, go askew a little bit.
(29:22):
Yeah, it's interesting. So,like, in my world, you know, you
know, I, I don't believe inbuying the listeners and the followers
because when you go to selladvertising, you want to sell people
real engagement. Right. It'salso too, like, I, you know, I don't
know how you feel aboutpromotions and things like that,
but I'm very promotion averseunless it's got a really good kind
(29:45):
of reason behind it. Because Ithink, you know, my, my feeling is
people understand what freemeans. And you're not really testing
anything other than peoplethat are looking for, you know, free
tires, basically.
Yeah, Yeah. I mean, we're,we're kind of similar to that. I
mean, we, we get people, youknow, do you, do you have a pro staff?
(30:05):
And, you know, I kind ofalways tell them like, like everyone's,
you know, like our, our rodprices are pretty affordable. And
you know, when you buy a rod,you become a member of the wolf pack,
and the wolf packs are prostaff. You know, like, we've got,
we've got folks in Canada andin America here in the North America,
too. Like, they bought onerod, and within a year, they own
(30:28):
every rod we make, you know,and like, they paid full price for
all of them. And like, when wewent to Canada for the Toronto Sportsman
show this year, two customersthat I met at a fly fishing Muskie
tournament in 2019, they took,they took days off to come work the
(30:49):
booth with us. Like, justsurprised me. Like, they didn't,
you know, they're like, oh,if. I just thought they meant, like,
they were going to come hangout or, like, see us. Like, they're
like, no, we took the, we tookthe days off to come help you work
the booth, you know, liketaking people over to the casting
lane to, like, teach them howto cast and fly, you know, like work
(31:13):
with kids and things. Becausethey just knew, like, we were going
to be inundated with people. Ithink, like 70,000 people came through
that show in four days. So,like, that's something you can't
buy.
Yeah, I would say, too. Imean, it's, it's the, the real power
of it is, you know, plenty ofpeople will fish and wear stuff that
people give them for free.
(31:34):
Yep. Right.
And so, you know, kind of tothat point, like, I'm a big believer.
Like, I just tell people,like, this is what I spend my money
on.
Right.
And I think that's a very,very powerful brand testimony.
Yeah, I think so, too. I mean,and, you know, we have started trying
to mess with the, the guideside of things to try to get our
(31:57):
name out there more. But, youknow, I grew, I grew up racing motorcycles
and bicycles, too, and I'verun teams and done the team manager
thing. And one of the petpeeves for me as a team manager was
always like, you know, you hadyour bike sponsor and the first thing
you did at the beginning ofthe year was you got your discounts
(32:18):
and everyone ordered all theirparts, you know, so you, you, you
got, you know, whatever, 50,65% off for all your stuff to get.
To get all your stuff ready tobuild your bike to go for the racing,
you know, and then it wascrickets, you know, the whole deal
was here, you guys are goingto be on this team, you're going
to get your jerseys, you'regoing to get all your parts, and
then you're going to race allseason, and you're going to do all
(32:40):
these things on social mediaand promote the, you know, promote
the companies that support us.And then once they got their stuff,
it was like they forgot allthat, you know, and you can't take
it all back because they didpay for it, you know, to some degree.
And that was my worry with thewhole pro deal, like guide ambassador
(33:02):
thing was like, like, how doyou, how do you patrol that? You
know, we're going up, we'regoing up against these huge companies
that, you know, you might geta new guide that wants to get a good
deal on some rods, but thefirst chance they get, or the first
sniff they get by G. Loomis orone of these big companies to get
(33:22):
some support, like the firstthing they do is drop us, you know,
because, because Orvis or G.Loomis is way cooler. Right. So it's,
it's a hard thing to police.So we just kind of done that organically
too, you know. And I've justmet people along the way and kind
(33:42):
of let them ask me what theywant, what they need. Most of them
want to support us becausethey like us as humans and they think
the rods cast well and they'renot under any kind of obligation
through a shop to run acertain brand in their boat, you
(34:04):
know, so we're, we're stillplaying with it. We've got a couple
different tiers of guideambassadorship, you know, so if,
if people, if guides are outthere and they want to get some of
our product in their boats, weusually test the waters with a smaller
discount, see if they're gonnado what they say they're gonna do,
(34:26):
and then they can work theirway up into a bigger discount as
a guide. Because it isimportant when people are out catching
fish, they look down and seewhat they're fishing usually. And
if, you know, we could getsome brand recognition out of that,
it's important. So very, very neat.
(34:47):
And so why don't you, Dave,walk us through. I think you've got
what, about a half a dozenspecific rod rides? You want to walk
us through those?
Yeah. So we, we run, we haveeverything from a 10 foot 3 weight
up to a 9 foot 12 weight. Sowe've got our high stick, which is
our 10 foot 3 weight. Greatentry level price at 179. A really,
(35:13):
I mean it's a, it's a funcasting rod. You know, whether you're
Kentucky farm ponding for panfish out of a canoe. Uh, tons of
guys do that. Just, they justuse that extra one foot of length
to roll cast their cast outthere while they're sitting down.
It's an effortless cast androd. Great, great, great option for
(35:36):
someone that wants to not justhave a, a ten foot three weight that
is solely just built for euronymphing. You know, like it casts
well, it roll casts well. It'snot, it doesn't have a, a down locking
reel seat on it. I did thatfor a reason. I wanted to, I left
(35:58):
a little bit of room in thequiver to, to develop a more euro
specific rod down the road aswe grew. And then we've our 9 foot
5 weight, the roll caster.It's going to be more of a medium,
medium action rod. A lot ofpeople compare it to like the Reddington
(36:20):
classic trout, like that kindof a feeling rod. So lot, lot more
forgiveness, a little bit moresoul roll cast beautifully. The beauty
of that rod, when I wasdeveloping it, I really wanted a
rod that was light in hand butlike a beginner could pick up and
(36:40):
put a loop together and notfeel like they're fighting the rod
the whole time. And it, it'scool watching people pick that rod
up for the first time. Evenlike casting instructors, they'll
pick it up and they'll,they'll, they'll try to cast at like
a super fast dry fly rod orsomething and they'll slow down their
(37:04):
cast and get it and thenthey'll just be, they'll weld it.
You know, it's like they canimmediately adjust to that rod and
get it working the way itneeds to. And then you pick up. A
beginner will pick it up andgo out there and they immediately
have confidence, you know, so,so that's our nine foot five weight.
We have got a nine foot sixweight with a fighting butt called
(37:26):
the Fish Whistle. That's goingto be our first rod that has more
of a salt inspired taper, Alittle wider modulus, a little more
tip action so it's a littlelighter, a little faster. That rod
was originally designed forfishing dock light fishing for juvenile
(37:47):
tarpon and snook down inFlorida for a guide buddy of mine.
And once I got done with it, Ijust really enjoyed casting it. I
was like, you know man, I needto add this one to the lineup. So
nine foot six weight Fishwhistle. Then our nine foot seven
is the streamer stick that isgoing to be going back to more of
(38:12):
the traditional mid flexfeeling rod. Super fun to cast. You
know, all of our rods are kindof named something a little different
and based off of their kind ofindicative of, you know, what their
qualities are. So that one's179 price point for that one because
(38:35):
of the componentries, youknow, a little bit more in line with
the five weight stuff. The,the next rod that we have is the
eight foot bomber is ourgraphite eight weight. The nine foot
(38:56):
nine foot eight weight bomber.That one is built on a similar taper
to our six weight. So a littlelighter, a little faster. Salt. Salt.
Inspired Fuji alkaline guides.Spare tip. Yeah, lot, lot of fun
for your snook, red fish, seatrout, things like that. And we have
(39:22):
another 8 weight is a 8 foot 8weight power glass which is a fiberglass
rod. Super fun carp rod. It'sgot a lot of power. Started that
rod out as a nine footer anddidn't like it, but then got it down.
Once we got it down to theeight foot range, it was punching
(39:43):
through some wind. I did a lotof testing down in Texas for that
red fishing and it just turnedinto a really fun rod. I, I kind
of, I knew I wanted to add atleast one fiberglass rod in the lineup
and it was, I didn't want todo a three weight or anything real
light because there's a ton ofpeople doing them. And I was just
(40:04):
kind of, I was kind of sold onthe eight weight because of its versatility.
I feel like you can take thatthing, you can take that thing to
a little creek and catch somepan fish and it's still fun or you
could really, you know, gocatch some bigger fish and it's forgiving
enough to, to, you know, youknow, I've got customers that have
(40:25):
caught 30 inch, you know, pikeand muskie on it up north. So it's
got a good range. As for aglass rod and then going back to
the graphite stuff, We've gota 9 foot 9 weight strip set which
also built on that fastertaper like the 6 and the 8. And then
(40:47):
we've got our river Wolf whichis our 9 foot 11 muskie stick that
comes in two colors like agold metallic and orange or an OD
green matte and black. Andthat's going to have that, that medium
deep flex for casting big,bigger, heavier flies. And just a
(41:07):
rod that's really comfortableto cast like day in and day out for
like four days at a time, youknow. And then we've got our 9 foot
12 weight which is the doublehall, which is a little bit lighter
and a little bit faster thanour 11. A lot of people use it for
musky but it's a great rod togo take to the salt. If you're, if
(41:29):
you're a dude that primarilyfishes freshwater and you want to
do a couple tarpon trips ayear or whatever. One a year. It's,
it's a great option for thatand for you know, Amber Jackson,
bigger fish and assault. Soyeah, that's, that's our current
lineup and we're working onsome other stuff too. So. Yeah.
Can you share tease anydetails of the other stuff?
(41:52):
Yeah. So been working on ashorter rod. Working on a. A seven
foot probably. I was kind ofup in the air between a 771 and a
73 trying to figure out what Iwant. I think it's going to end up
being a 7 foot 2 weight calledthe pocket knife. And that's, that's
just come out of. We've had alot of requests for a shorter rod
(42:14):
especially in the Appalachiansand the brook trout guys. So going
to try to create something.It's, it's, it's in process and just
trying to refine it a littlebit and get it. Most of our rods
go through about a year oftesting and just prototyping before,
(42:35):
before they land on thewebsite for the general public. And
then the other really coolexciting thing I'm working on, I'm
working on our first lineup ofmid priced rods. Gonna be called
the Destination series. Gonnabuilt. Be built with a little bit
(42:55):
higher end. Components haven'tlanded on the exact guides yet. They're
either gonna be like seaguides or, or recoil guides. It's
the jury's still out on that.I'm testing both. There's some pros
and cons to both of them butthe modulus is gonna be a little
lighter, a little faster. Thereel seat's gonna be nicer, the cork's
(43:18):
gonna be nicer. Price pointfor it. We're shooting for like a
$459 price point for theDestination series. And it's going
to be the first series that weare going to offer in different sizes.
So you'll be able to, you'll,you'll be able to go on the website
(43:39):
and order anything from a 7 upthrough like a 12 or a 14 weight.
So up until now our rods haveall been just whatever that model
is is. It's, that's, that'sthat color and that's the size. So
this will be the first likestep into our like mid priced range.
And I've also kind of. My goalis to be able to create a price point
(44:04):
around the $459 range with alot of performance. And ultimately
what I want to do is be ableto. I want people to be able to go
on our website and buy a threepack of rods for what the cost of
like one heliognose cost. Sopeople are trying to go on a trip
to, you know, Belize. Theywant to knock out the slam. They
(44:28):
can go, you know, I'm workingon some packaging designs so that
they could, you know, buy an8, 10 12, 3 pack that comes in a
case. They can just buy allthat for 1200 bucks, jump on a plane
and be set, take some reelswith them, you know. So that's kind
of one of the more excitingprojects I've been working on. And
(44:50):
I've got a lot of hours in onthe 12 weight that I've been testing.
And everyone that's castedit's really loved it. So I'm excited
to get those out there.
Yeah. So when should folksexpect to see those on the website?
Man, I don't have a. I don'thave an exact data on it yet. It's
a big ask from us financiallyto, to, to get that inventory in.
(45:15):
That's the biggest hurdle forus right now. The, the rod development
is farther ahead than, youknow, we just gotta be careful. Most
of em, it's kind of easy.Cause we can bring in, you know,
a couple hundred of a nineweight or something. But when you're
bringing in a couple hundredof seven, seven through 12, like
(45:35):
you're talking a pretty bigchunk. So we're just trying to see,
you know, test the waters.We're working on some other marketing
stuff to try to get in a fewmore shops and things like that and
really get some samples inpeople's hands so that we kind of
have a little bit more productmoving across the country versus
(45:55):
just in the eastern side wherewe're at now, and make us feel a
little bit more comfortableabout making that last push, you
know. So yeah, I got it.
Cause it'll, it'll probablymore than double your inventory to,
to make that purchase, right?
Yeah, yeah, for sure. Andhonestly, we were kind of, you know,
kind of waiting to see whatthe tariff thing did too. You know,
(46:18):
you don't want to go drop ororder for 1400 rods or you know,
2000 rods right away. And we,we got a decent shipment of rods
in to refill some inventorythat we were sold out on a few models,
you know, about a month and ahalf ago and pleasantly Surprised
(46:38):
that the tariffs didn't reallyaffect us as bad. So kind of refocused
and, like, all right, well,maybe we can make this happen. So
the biggest thing for me is,like, just making sure the testing's
exactly the way we want it. SoI'm going to get some final samples
back from the R D facility andhopefully be able to show some of
(47:00):
those off during show season.And what I'd really like to do is
push some orders through showseason so they can, you know, show
up in March or April and hitthe shelves. So, yeah, absolutely.
You know, folks may not knowthat you are also the founder of
the Kentucky River MuskieClassic, and just kind of curious,
you know, when did you get thefever to chase muskie on the fly?
(47:22):
Oh, man, like, 2015. I think Istarted 2015 late, like, that fall,
and then it's kind of just.Yeah, it's been 10 years now. So
I'm, you know, I think for me,it's a heritage thing. They're native
to Kentucky. I just got reallyinterested. Anything that's super
(47:48):
challenging and is, like,something that most people just would
think is dumb and pointless,those are the things that I get attached
to somehow. And musky fishingwas one of those things. You know,
it was a challenge. It was,you know, you get your highs and
your lows. And once I startedcatching a few fish, floating some
(48:12):
beautiful rivers in. In myhome state and learned about all
the history of those riverswith the Indians and, you know, the
hunting and the. Thebackstories of all these, you know,
these rivers and creeks, itjust, you know, it kind of stuck
with me. And then thecommunity behind it, too, was just
(48:34):
so. So cool. And. Yeah, just.Yeah. Just was kind of drawn to it.
And I've met a lot of awesomefolks along the way because of the
musky fishing thing. I mean, Iwould say, if anything, it's. It's
been one of the harder hurdlesfor us to. To. To cover or. Or get
(48:58):
away from. Like, if all I hadto do was sell musky rods, I'd be
fine. Um, just trying to letpeople know we saw other odds, you
know, So I was so heavilyfocused in the muskie community from
the beginning, just trying toget our name out there to the world,
you know? Yeah.
Very neat. So tell us a littlebit more about the event.
(49:20):
Yeah. So last weekend InFebruary started two years ago, we
had 21 teams, I believe thefirst year. The second year, we had
40 teams. Two teams didn'tshow, so we ended up with 38 total.
Teams and 112 anglers. Sohuge, huge growth. And within the
(49:47):
first year, the. This secondyear, we had 38 teams, 112 anglers,
and 38 fish got boated. Soreally, really good outcome for the
tournament. Most folks didn'teven think we were going to be able
to put the tournament onbecause three weeks before the tournament,
(50:09):
we had like, historic, like,catastrophic flooding that affected
southern Kentucky. And a lotof the waters that we were fishing,
even during the tournament,about 2/3 of the fishable water was
just not fishable because therivers were just getting blown out
(50:29):
because all the reservoirsabove them were just full. So the
dams were just wide open, youknow, so to have that good of a turnout,
everyone had a blast. Everyonewas catching fish and seeing fish.
You know, it was cool to see.And we're going to continue to grow
it every year and just make itbetter and try to raise as much money
(50:55):
for the Muskies Inc. Chapter,chapter 52, the Daniel Boone Chapter.
We're, you know, it's. It wasan idea, and we're trying to figure
out ways to help them raisesome more money. And the growth of
the. The growth of thetournament has actually got us a
(51:17):
seat at the table with some ofthe fisheries biologists and people
that we actually need to betalking with to make some changes
because we've had some reallybad stocking years. You know, Covid
didn't help, and then it kindof just snowballed from there. So
we're trying to. Trying tomake some changes. We've got the
(51:41):
hatchery there at the bottomof cave. Ron has had a lot of water
problems the last few yearsjust with algae blooms and things
like that. So the, the fishhealth has been bad, and they're.
They're going to change someof that up and grow some muskies
in a different facility thathas a little bit better water situation
(52:05):
to help us with our stocking.So, you know, none of that would
have been possible withoutmultiple tourism boards noticing
how many people were comingthrough their city and renting airbnbs
and buying fuel and haulingtheir rafts and jet boats and stuff.
Like, people immediatelyunderstood, like, man, there's a
(52:25):
lot of people coming for this,you know, so it was. It's been a
huge, huge help. And we'reonly going to continue to hopefully
raise more and more money to,you know, keep our conservation good
for the muskies.
Very, very neat. And so folkswanted to get more information for
February of 2026. Where shouldthey go?
(52:45):
You can go to The KentuckyRiver Muskie Classic. Instagram or
Facebook. We don't currentlyhave a website but it's managed all
through social media. It'sbeen. Been great. Easy to get a hold
of us. Super small group. Soanybody needs any information, you
(53:06):
know, obviously the Instagramor, or Facebook page and then obviously
you can reach out to the WolfRod co page too and we can point
you in the right direction onthat. It's just, yeah, I mean it's
just a really cool, it's sucha cool river system with you know,
I was super, I was super hardon myself. You know, the musky zinc
(53:32):
guys were wanting to do itearlier and you know, I was super
worried about, you know,affecting the fishery and then I,
we kind of sat down and we'rejust like, man, there's like over
500 miles of fishable water.Like it's going to be like the fisheries
not going to be bothered by,you know, 40, 40 boats showing up
(53:56):
to fish for two days, youknow, so. And it, it's been great.
It's, it really has beengreat. It's, it's a beautiful river
system. The Kentucky riverdrainage is, you know, it's, it's
huge. There's so many tribs.There's three main rivers that flow
into one big river and it'sjust, there's just a lot of water
(54:16):
and it's all filled with fish.So yeah, definitely look for sign
ups soon. It's coming aroundthe corner. I guess we'll, we'll
start, we'll start gettingregistrations out about six months
before the event and it'sgoing to fill up. Filled up last
year. So I'd imagine it'sgoing to fill up again and then you
(54:39):
know, one of the favoritesfrom all the people that come there,
Black Barn Barbecue. Local,local barbecue place. They do our,
they do our food every yearand they do it upright. They smoke
chicken wings and gouda Macand cheese and cornbread and brisket.
The whole deal. We, we do itupright Kentucky style. So yeah,
(54:59):
better get a team, get a teamfigured out. Three man teams, two
man teams, whatever you wantto do. And get signed up when you
see that registration pop up.Because it won't, it won't take long
to fill up. Yeah.
Well, there you go. And sowhere can folks find you on the show
circuit in 20, 26?
Oh man. So we're going to tryto hit a couple of the big fly fishing
(55:22):
shows. I don't know exactlywhich ones yet. We're trying to be
in Atlanta for sure. Denver'sanother one, but it's. I think it's
gonna. It overlapped with theTrout Fest and the Guadalupe River
Trout Fest last year down inNew Braunfels, Texas. So we're still
(55:45):
trying to figure out finalcalendar on that. We'll definitely
be back in Toronto again atthe Sportsman show. And then, man,
I don't know. We did like nineshows this year. It was pretty much
full bore from like January tothe end of March. So we did. We're
(56:08):
going to be at the VirginiaFly Fishing and Wine Festival. That's
in Doswell, Virginia. That'llbe the first one we're at. And then
we typically, we always do theKentucky and a fly fishing show that's
just, that's just south ofLouisville. That's more of a local
show, but it's, it's usuallyon a weekend where then there's no
(56:29):
other big shows going on. Andthen obviously Trout Fest, we did
the Midwest Fly Fishing Expoup in Warren, Michigan last year,
then the Toronto show and thenwe did the Maggie Valley Fly Fishing
Festival this year as well. Sothat's our second year doing that.
So probably honestly at thispoint we're going to try to stick
(56:50):
to all of the shows that wehave been doing and then add on.
So just going to try to keepgrowing it and letting people tell
people about our product, man,getting it in people's hands. Hopefully
we can get a decent booth at acouple of these bigger shows. We
are even talking aboutpotentially trying to go to ICAST
(57:10):
this year or next year. Just,you know, get in front of more of
the industry, so to speak.
Got it. And before I let yougo tonight, Dave, is there anything
else you'd like to share withour listeners?
Man, I just, you know, we're,we're here for the long haul. I.
(57:32):
It's, it's, it's a, it's adefinitely a cutthroat world. You
know, the industry as a wholeis just, it's, it's always changing.
But I think that, you know, ifyou have an opportunity to, to get
a hold of one of our rods,test it out and I think you'll be
(57:52):
pleasantly surprised with,with its performance and just keep
an eye on our, on our website.Another thing, you know, we're working
on, I told you briefly touchedbase that we're working on some new
marketing stuff and beentrying to film some YouTube stuff.
So we do have a YouTubechannel. It doesn't have a lot of
(58:14):
stuff on it now, but we'regoing to start, we're going to have
some teasers out there soon.We're doing a, we're doing a new
series on YouTube called theWolf Pack Series. So it's essentially
just a series of YouTubeepisodes where I travel around the
country and meet fly shopsthat carry our products or fish with
guide companies that fish ourstuff on their boats. And yeah, it's
(58:39):
going to be real,professionally done. Got some great
film folks helping along theway with, you know, way more expensive
stuff than I even knowanything about. But let, let them
capture all the stuff. I'mjust gonna, you know, do my thing
which is talk to the shops andintroduce people and do some fishing
(59:01):
and hopefully catch some fish.But yeah, look for the Wolf Pack
series. We've got some, gotsome cool stuff on this on the schedule.
We'll be up in Canada doingsome filming with some of the folks
that I've met over the years.And yeah, should be a cool series
and hopefully another avenuefor folks to learn more about us
(59:22):
as a brand and more about how,how our, you know, what our vibes
are and what kind of people we are.
So yeah, and I'll drop a linkto your YouTube channel in the show
notes. And are there otherplaces that folks should go to follow
Wolf Rodco, get updates on theKentucky River Muskie Classic and
just generally follow youradventures on the water?
(59:42):
Yeah, man, the Wolf RodCompany, Instagram and Facebook,
definitely Instagram's, we'rea little heavier on that. It's just
a lot easier for us to manageas a small company. And then the
Kentucky River Muskie Classic,Instagram as well. But yeah, definitely
(01:00:03):
the website wolf rodco.com hasall of our stuff. Got some cool hats.
Keep, keep an eye out forsome, some new rods popping up down
the road. And then I guess theonly other thing I would ask is if
anyone is, you know, a shopowner or you know, even guides. If
(01:00:25):
you're interested in learningmore about what we have to offer
and what you know, we've gotsome great dealer pricing, super
competitive pricing and ourwarranties second to none. So you're
interested in getting us inyour shop, hit me up Wolf radco at
gmail. Be happy to hear morefrom you and send you a little bit
(01:00:50):
more info on us.
Well, there you go. Well,Dave, I really appreciate you taking
some time out of your eveningto talk with me.
All right, man, I appreciate it.
Take care.
Thanks.
Well, folks, we hope youenjoyed the interview as much as
we enjoyed bringing it to you.Remember, links to all this episode's
sponsors are in the shownotes. Check them out. Tight lines,
everybody.
Hey folks, it's Marvin Cash,the host of The Articulate Fly. On
this episode, I'm joined byDave Huff, the driving force behind
Whuff Rod Co and the KentuckyRiver Musky Classic. Dave shares
his passion for chasing muskieon the fly and what drove him to
make Whuff Rod Co a reality. Ithink you're really going to enjoy
this one, but before we get tothe interview, just a couple of housekeeping
(00:25):
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(00:48):
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(01:10):
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at maps.troutroutes.com now onto our interview. Well, Dave, welcome
to the Articulate Fly.
(01:32):
Yeah, thanks for having me.
Yeah, I'm looking forward toour conversation. And we have a tradition
on the Articulate Fly. We liketo ask all of our guests to share
their earliest fishing memory.
Okay. Yeah, Farm pond fishingfor me, man. My, you know, I grew
up in Kentucky, rural Boonecounty area and fishing with my grandpa.
(01:54):
Probably, probably the, thesingle moment that sticks out the
most is, you know, I was maybesix or seven and I remember casting
out a Rapala or something andhooking two fish on the same lure
(02:14):
and bringing them in. And Iremember that pretty vividly is after
that I was like, I was allabout fishing. You know, like I want
to, you know, lunch break atthe farm. I was fishing after work.
I was fishing, just trying to,you know, chase stuff. And I was
notoriously like late for, fordinner with my, with my buddies.
(02:38):
You know, my mom would belike, you know, we'd be, we'd walk
down a creek and before yourealize that you're, you're two miles
down the creek and realize youhave to be back for dinner and, you
know, a half hour and you'renot going to make it, you know, kind
of stuff. So, yeah, whateverkind of outdoor adventures I could
get into, I always tried totie into, you know, try to tie in
(03:01):
fish into that stuff.
Yeah. Very, very neat. So whendid you come to the dark side of
fly fishing?
I tried it. At one point. Ihad a relative from, like, Texas
that had a fly rod orsomething that he brought up on,
like, a family trip. And Inoted. I saw it. I. And I. I mean,
(03:22):
I tried it a couple times, andI feel like I had. I don't remember
the year necessarily, but Idefinitely know, like, in my younger
years, you know, middle schoolage is. You know, I've tried it a
few more times and didn'treally pick it back up until after
(03:43):
college. And it was one ofthose things where it just kind of
set the. The rod just kind ofsat in the corner, you know, it was
cool. And then other stuff gotcool. I grew up racing dirt bikes
and got into cars and thencollege, and, you know, I. I picked
it back up later in life on atrip down to Brevard and fishing
(04:10):
the Davidson River. That kindof like, re. Ignited fly fishing
for me. And then from there,it was kind of. It was kind of on,
you know, still. I still dosome spin fishing from time to time,
but I'm about a 90 percenterwhen it comes to fly fishing.
(04:31):
Yeah, it's pretty neat. TheDavidson is probably my favorite
river to fish in North Carolina.
Yeah. Yeah. I was. It was on akind of a whim. A buddy of mine was
down there. We were on a trip,and, you know, we were kind of. We
have been talking about flyfishing, and we had new fly fishing
setups that we were. We weretrying to plan this big boundary
(04:53):
water trip, and we were gonnatry to go up there and, you know,
live out of canoes for three,three to four weeks and take some
fly rods with us. And we wentdown there one year just on vacation,
and we're kind of like, man,we should just book a guide trip
so we could kind of take acrash course and, like, learning
(05:16):
all this, because it's like. Iwas like. It's way different from
when I did it. Did I come upand we met. We met up with a guide.
Guide down there by the nameof Jeb. And I remember we showed
up. We showed up and look likenoobs, probably. And, you know, we
get out in the water, and thefirst thing he Said to me, to us
(05:39):
is said, this ain't a riverruns through it, and woolly buggers
ain't, you know, he's like,we're not. You're not going to be
waving these things around inthe air all day trying to make false
casts. He's like, I'm going toshow you how to roll cast. I'm going
to show you how to catch somefish. You. And I kind of. I kind
of looked at my buddy. I'mlike, this guy's my kind of people,
you know? So, yeah, from thenit was. It was kind of on. We. My
(06:02):
buddy hooked into. Immediatelyhooked into a huge brown trout that
the guide kind of opened hiseyes when he saw it jump out of the
water and realized it was abig one, you know, and we caught
a bunch more fish that day.And, yeah, rest is history. Now it's
just a challenge of gettingout of as many days as I can and
(06:23):
trying to learn as manydifferent, you know, styles of fishing
that you can. So.
Yeah, I bet that was Jeb hallfrom Davidson River Outfitters, wasn't
it?
Oh, yeah. He's a bad man.
Yeah, I've. So I've knownthose guys forever, and I have a
tradition with my boys. I takethem fishing during the Christmas
holidays, and Jeb was ourguide on one of those trips because
(06:45):
I always know that it's betterfor him to work with the kids so
I don't lose my patience whenthey were younger and yell at them
and ruin the day.
So. Yep, yep. Yeah, he's got alot of patience, and he's just a
really fishy dude. So.
Yeah, absolutely. Jeb is. Jebis a great guy. All the guys at DRO
Are awesome and, you know, soyou kind of come back to it a little
(07:06):
bit later on in your life, youknow? Who are some of the folks that
have mentored you as you'vegotten kind of deeper into the sport.
Man, Mostly. Mostly guys fromthe fly fishing club up here. The
Northern Kentucky fly fishers.They're just. There's so much knowledge
(07:26):
there. It's an. It's an agingclub, you know, Mike Arnold is one
of the oldest members of theclub, and he's actually the one that
taught me how to. How to buildfly rods. And he's still there. He's
still active with the club. Hestill teaches rod building. And I
(07:49):
just kind of. I'm one of thosedudes. Like, my wife knows when we
go on vacation, she's probablygonna. I'm gonna disappear for a
Couple hours and she canalways probably find me at the, the
old bait shop talking to theold crusty, salty dudes. Like she
just knows that she's gonnalose me for a couple hours to those
dudes. You know, I just lovehearing stories and love learning
(08:13):
and those, those guys are justa wealth of knowledge. And yeah,
they're probably some of my,as far as fly fishing goes, like
some of my biggest mentorscame from the NKFF for sure. Yeah.
It's interesting. I know MikeArnold from my time is the president
of the Southeastern council offff. And yeah, yeah, he's a great
(08:37):
guy and he was always, heknow, always doing tons of stuff
with the council. I haven'tseen him in a long time because the,
you know, the, the councilwasn't as active as it has been and
it's kind of coming back. Butyeah, he's a great, great person
to learn from for sure.
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah.
And so kind of funny, right?So, you know, Wolf Rod Company is
almost 10 years old. You know,you, you kind of get into fly fishing.
(08:59):
Like, you know, what makes youcrazy enough to want to start a rod
company?
I mean, in the early days Iwas doing custom rods. So I started
doing custom rods in 2016 andI just basically, I really enjoyed
the process. You know, mybackground in design, you know, creating
(09:25):
things has always beensomething that I, I love to do. I
mean, even in my full timejob, I build mountain bike trails
and hiking trails for aliving. So we're just creating things
in nature and forests andtrying to make things out of dirt
that look like they've beenthere for 10 years, you know, so,
(09:47):
so yeah, I mean, started doingcustom rods. It got to a point where
with the full time job, I justcouldn't really. I hated the fact
that I had to tell people,like, hey, it might be, you know,
four, five months before I canget your rod done. You know, that
was like that for me. That waslike the turning point from where
(10:07):
it went from like Davebuilding rods on his kitchen table
or in the basement in hisgarage, whatever, to like trying
to figure out like, maybe thisneeds to be something else. And then
the icing on the cake for mefor the actual birth of Wolf Rodco
was I was like, I started flyfishing for Muskie, you know, 10
(10:33):
years ago or something and Ijust didn't enjoy the rods. I, they
weren't, you know, I, I tried,I tried a few and they just like
some. I didn't know what Ididn't like, but I Knew I didn't
like them, you know, andthat's when I kind of went to the
(10:53):
drawing board. And now, youknow, I was super active in my club,
the, you know, the. The localclub. And we were getting a ton of,
like, new members every month.Like, we were getting like 10 or
12 new members showing up tothe fly club, and then they weren't
(11:13):
coming back. So, like,between. There's like, a little culmination
of, you know, not. Not lovingthe fly rods that I had access to,
seeing people that were reallypassionate about fly fishing not
come back to the meetings. AndI just kind of. My brain is so focused
(11:34):
on, like, the bettermousetrap, so to speak. You know,
I. I kind of put my head downand realized, like, most of the people
were going to our local shop,they were trying on waiters, they
were doing all the stuff that.That they were taught to do, you
know, to get set up. And thenthey'd go to the rods and they'd
(11:56):
put a Thomas and Thomas infront of them, and they'd be like,
holy crap, you know, like.Like, I'm going to be spending, like,
$2,000 to go fly fishing. Andthen, you know, it was kind of like
they just. I'm fine with justspin fishing. You know, they didn't
know another way. Um, so itwas a little bit of rod performance.
(12:18):
I wanted something thatwasn't, you know, necessarily super
popular at that time. Um, andthen price. I wanted to be able to
provide a rod that had reallygood quality at an affordable cost
so that people could actuallyget out and enjoy fishing and not
be stressed about saving moneyto buy a fly rod.
(12:39):
Yeah, got it. And so, youknow, tell me a little bit. You know,
you were saying there wassomething specifically you didn't
like in the musky sticks youwere fishing. So tell me, like, how
that translated into the styleand feel of the wolf rodco rides.
I just. They. They were reallystiff and didn't handle musky flies
(13:00):
well, you know, and at thattime, I didn't know why, because
I didn't know enough about flyrod design. I just knew I didn't
like it. And when I don't likesomething, I try to figure out how
to make it work. You know, Ican work with anything, but I know,
I know what I want and I knowwhat I don't like, you know, And
(13:20):
I think part of it is the longtime frame from when I learned how
to fly fish to where I pickedit back up to where, you know, I
just remember as a Kid and youknow, being younger, how much feeling
and like soul a flyer I'd had,like, that was the thing I loved
(13:42):
about it is you could feel thefish, you could feel the cast when
you caught a fish, you couldfeel the fight. And these new, these,
these fly rods I was using formuskie, you know, they're looking
at it now. They were justessentially rebranded saltwater rods
that weren't made to throw wetsocks, you know, at, at tree stumps.
(14:05):
They just, they were made forthrowing little flies through wind.
They had a lot of tip feel andthat was about it. And that's just
not what I, you know, I, Iwent back to the drawing board and
wanted to really, I wanted toprovide a, a really mid flex heavy
rod that you could cast day inand day out for an entire four day
(14:27):
trip and not wear yourselfout. And it would be built like a
tank and affordable. Andthat's the Riverwolf, one of our
rods, the 11 weight, that wasthe first rod that I actually developed
was an 11 weight, which isprobably not something most flop
(14:48):
companies start with, butthat's where I went. So.
Yeah, it's interesting toobecause I think having a little bit
more feel in the rod certainlyhelps from a timing perspective.
And you know, because you feelthe rod better and it makes it, I
think, you know, fishing a rodwith a little bit more sole actually
makes it more pleasant becauseyou don't have to sit there and watch
what's happening because youcan feel what's happening.
(15:11):
Yep, yep.
So, you know, you have abackground in industrial design.
Tell me a little bit about howthat kind of works its way kind of
into your, your ride designsand your, your manufacturing process.
I mean for the most part I, Iprobably did things really backwards
from like what a traditionalfly rod company would do. I just
(15:34):
ordering blanks, figuring outthe ones that I really liked, figuring
out like learning about tapersand learning about mandrels. And
I, I designed the first fewones in my rods. I designed them
out of feel like reverseengineering them essentially off
of like blanks that I wouldjust order from a catalog, you know,
(15:54):
until I found the ones that Iliked, you know, and then from there,
you know, doing somemeasurements, figuring out what,
what I liked about them andwhat they, what made them, you know,
react the way they did. Nothaving that background fly fishing
wise, but having theindustrial design background to kind
of know like how to takesomething apart and dissect it and
(16:18):
really like figure it out.That's what, that's kind of where
the influence part comes inis, you know, obviously like people,
people know us from ourcolors. Our colors are definitely
stand out against the crowd.And that was another thing. The industrial
design side of me was like,like, if I'm going to come out here
(16:40):
and I'm going to come outswinging against all these big companies,
I, I got to not look like allthose big companies. You know, if
I come out with the, you know,a standard green rod with black wraps
or a black rod with graywraps, like I'm going to get lost
in the crowd real quick, youknow. Yeah.
Plus it helps, you know, whenpeople bump into people fishing your
(17:01):
rods on the water and they'relike, well, what's that kind of lime
green rod? Who made that?
Right? Yep, absolutely. Imean, and it's great. Like we've
been a major supporter of likethe Beast of the east tournament
for the last four years orfive years now. And it's cool being
on the water in a tournamentsetting and seeing a bunch of our
(17:22):
like blue 12 weights withbright orange wraps standing up in
a rod tube, like going, youknow, flying down the river, you
know, you can see them rightaway. Yeah. And it's just, it's just,
it's, it's been cool. I mean,I've had a lot of really great feedback.
People like, really like therods, you know, and even at trade
(17:44):
shows and stuff, yousurprisingly had a good amount of
older folks that voice theiropinions positively that they're
like, man, these things lookso great. Sometimes those other rods,
Rods just got really boring,you know, And I'm like, dude, coming
(18:04):
from like a 78 year old dude,that's kind of, that's pretty cool,
you know. So, yeah, absolutely.
And I would, I wonder too. SoI was kind of curious. So have you
found people making blanksthat you like or have you gotten
to designing tapers that youlike and you have people making the
blanks for you?
So I, I, I have a factoryoverseas. They have, they have their
(18:27):
own full R and D facility andI basically utilize their R D facility
to produce me tapers that I,that I want in the beginning. It
might like the, the 11 weight.I think I built 10 or 11 rods before.
(18:53):
I was like, this is the one.I've used the same shop from day
one when I went, when Idecided to go factory built. I still
build all the originals andI've got a really good working relationship
with them. I can at thispoint, I can kind of tell them what
(19:14):
tweaks I want to make andthey'll send me a blank to test.
And you know, the last two orthree, man, they, they nail them,
dude, straight out of thegate. That like I. Our communication's
so good after 5 years beendealing with the same person in the
company and it's been great.They own all the mandrels. And that's
(19:39):
just a cost thing for me rightnow. Like, it's not super important
for me to own the mandrel.It's more important for me to have
access to a full R D facilitythat can tweak, you know, tapers
and do things that I wantbecause I don't have the ability
to. To build my own, you know,facility like that yet. So they do,
(20:01):
they do all that. I do all thespecs and then I'll blueprint. I'll.
I'll blueprint a rod. Once Iget it where I want it, I'll spec
the taper that they. That'sthe. Whatever the final revision
is. I'll spec that and thenI'll spec everything down to thread
wrap color, you know, spacingguides, cork grade, you know, rating
(20:25):
grain, grain window, the wholedeal and then do all the artwork
for them. And it's a, it's acool process. I enjoy it. I really
do enjoy it. You know, thefirst few rods that I developed were
I really, you know, the 5weight, the 7 weight and our 11 weight,
(20:48):
they have like that more midflex feel. Really got a ton of soul
to them and just kind of takeyou back to your roots cast kind
of feeling. But then, youknow, I've got some other rods that
have a little bit more actionto them and a little wider, a little
faster, you know, so there's alittle bit of everything that every
(21:10):
one of our rods isn't built onthe same taper or blank material.
So very neat.
And so, you know, it's kind ofinteresting hearing you talk about
having stuff made overseas.How are you dealing with the tariff
stuff right now?
So far so good. I know somecompanies are having a little harder
time than we are. It's the,the biggest hurdle for us has been
(21:35):
freight costs. The freightcompanies are really dinging you.
Their freight costs havedoubled over what they were, which,
you know, is unfortunate. Ithink they're trying to take advantage
of a situation more than. Imean, the costs haven't gone up that
much for them. It's just. Theysee a chink in the armor and they
(21:56):
go for the throw. Right. So. So.
Well, let's, let's hope thatthat gets better. And the terror
Stuff doesn't cause you any,any lost sleep, right?
Yeah, man, I'm, I'm gonna, youknow, we had a few questions about
that this year at the tradeshows and things. And I just kind
of told them, you know, like,we know our numbers. We're gonna
(22:17):
try to hold steadfast as farand long as we can to our current
pricing. And, you know, if wegot to make changes, we do. But for
now, we're, you know, my wifeand I are, are the entire company
and we're both, we're bothcomfortable with where we're at and
(22:38):
we want to try to. I'd ratherget more hand, more rods out in people's
hands fishing than pad mypockets more. So.
Yeah. And so, you know, kindof help us, help me kind of, you
know, help our listeners kindof understand what differentiates
your rods, you know, in thesense of, you know, you're at a great
price point. How do youcompare to like the super high price
(22:59):
points in terms of performanceand warranties and things like that?
And then similarly to kind ofcome down, you know, I think one
of the things that like, forexample, TFO really did in the fly
rod business is basedbasically made everyone start to
make, you know, for lack of abetter word, like an entry, mid level
and high level rod. You know,how do you kind of compare to, you
know, other kind of, you know,entry level rods from other manufacturers?
(23:23):
Yeah, I mean, you know, thebeauty, the beauty of it is we're
so new that our biggest hurdleis getting our name in front of people.
Our rods perform very, verywell. And most people that test cast
one of our rods at a tradeshow, their, their immediate response
(23:47):
is this rod tests or this rodcasts as good as X, Y or Z, you know,
which are typically all fourto five hundred dollar rods, you
know, and then the other thingis like, I can't believe it's. I
can't believe this. You'reselling these rods for this much,
you know, and we've got abouta 75% conversion rate at trade shows.
(24:14):
If we're at a trade show thathas a, has a casting lane and the
availability for people topick a rod up and go cast it, about
75% of those people come backand buy a rod. So I think that we're
doing the right thing. We'vegrown organically. I've been a super
(24:34):
big proponent from day one. Idon't, I don't believe in flash in
the pan marketing. I want togrow organically and slowly. Word
of mouth is you know, word ofmouth is still king no matter what.
You know, we, we don't buy, wedon't buy likes, we don't buy followers
and we, you know, we put ourmoney where our mouth is. And I think,
(24:57):
you know, from a rod'sperspective, you know, a lot of our,
a lot of our 250, $250 plusrods are built on Fuji Alkanite guides.
Really good modulus blanks.You know, the, the componentry is
there. You can see it and feelit. Another cool thing for us, you
(25:22):
know, from a salesperspective, everything, everything
six weight and above comeswith an extra tip in the, in the
rod tube. Part of my reasoningfor that is just because I've been
on trips before where I didsomething stupid and broke a tip
and it just ruined my tripbecause I was just bombed, you know,
(25:44):
so having an extra one there,you know, it, it's not, it's not
a huge thing, but it'ssomething, it's, it's a nod to let
people know like, hey man,like I grew up, you know, I grew
up fishing and traveling andfishing and I'm trying, we're trying
(26:05):
to think through all thoselittle details. You know, another
really big thing that we dothat a lot of companies don't do,
we do not replace sections ofa rod. I just don't, don't agree
with it. I've never had a goodexperience with trying to get one
section replaced on a rod. Therod just has never felt the same
(26:30):
ever again. So if one of ourcustomers breaks a rod, there is
a replacement fee, 65 plusshipping. And you know, if it's on
their side, if they smash itin a car door or something, $65 plus
shipping, they're getting abrand new fly rod shipped to their
(26:50):
door. So, and if it'ssomething on our end, you know, a
guy, they have a guide failureor something happens that we can
identify as a quality issue,then we ship them a brand new rod
on our dime. So I think that'ssomething that's kind of unheard
of in the industry. Mostpeople don't know that's our policy
(27:13):
just because we're so smallstill. But it's just another thing
that we do to try to getpeople back out fishing quickly and
not have ongoing problems witha rod that they have, you know, three
sections that are two yearsold and then one section that's brand
new. It's just, it's aphilosophy that we're going to stick
(27:34):
with and you know, it'sObviously not the best financial
model, but we're, we'rewilling to put our money where our
mouth is and we want people tobe happy with our product and get
back out to fishing. Yeah.
It's funny you say that. Weshould have a few beers sometime
(27:55):
and talk about organic,Organic growth. Cause I think that's,
I actually think it's asuperpower in this day and age. And
I think the more and more wesee technology, I think it's going
to be more and more importantfor, for real companies to grow their
businesses.
Yeah, I, I mean, I think thata man's word is always going to be
(28:17):
valuable, you know, andorganic growth is a lot like that.
Organic growth to me is kindof like a man's handshake. Right.
So it's not something, youknow, if, if you stand behind it
and you stand behind yourproduct and you do what you say you're
going to do. And I, I thinkit's. Yeah. I mean, in this world
(28:39):
of AI and all this otherstuff, like, people can create fake
things, but if you're a humandoing good things and being a good
person and creating a goodbrand and sticking behind it, like,
they can't take that away fromyou. So.
Yeah, and I've neverunderstood this whole game of buying
followers. Like, I just, itjust makes no.
(29:01):
Sense to me, man. When youstart putting a dollar figure to
it, that's what, that's,that's how they make it make sense,
you know, that's where it wentwrong, you know, so every 10,000
followers you get is a dollaramount and that's, that's when things
kind of go, go askew a little bit.
(29:22):
Yeah, it's interesting. So,like, in my world, you know, you
know, I, I don't believe inbuying the listeners and the followers
because when you go to selladvertising, you want to sell people
real engagement. Right. It'salso too, like, I, you know, I don't
know how you feel aboutpromotions and things like that,
but I'm very promotion averseunless it's got a really good kind
(29:45):
of reason behind it. Because Ithink, you know, my, my feeling is
people understand what freemeans. And you're not really testing
anything other than peoplethat are looking for, you know, free
tires, basically.
Yeah, Yeah. I mean, we're,we're kind of similar to that. I
mean, we, we get people, youknow, do you, do you have a pro staff?
(30:05):
And, you know, I kind ofalways tell them like, like everyone's,
you know, like our, our rodprices are pretty affordable. And
you know, when you buy a rod,you become a member of the wolf pack,
and the wolf packs are prostaff. You know, like, we've got,
we've got folks in Canada andin America here in the North America,
too. Like, they bought onerod, and within a year, they own
(30:28):
every rod we make, you know,and like, they paid full price for
all of them. And like, when wewent to Canada for the Toronto Sportsman
show this year, two customersthat I met at a fly fishing Muskie
tournament in 2019, they took,they took days off to come work the
(30:49):
booth with us. Like, justsurprised me. Like, they didn't,
you know, they're like, oh,if. I just thought they meant, like,
they were going to come hangout or, like, see us. Like, they're
like, no, we took the, we tookthe days off to come help you work
the booth, you know, liketaking people over to the casting
lane to, like, teach them howto cast and fly, you know, like work
(31:13):
with kids and things. Becausethey just knew, like, we were going
to be inundated with people. Ithink, like 70,000 people came through
that show in four days. So,like, that's something you can't
buy.
Yeah, I would say, too. Imean, it's, it's the, the real power
of it is, you know, plenty ofpeople will fish and wear stuff that
people give them for free.
(31:34):
Yep. Right.
And so, you know, kind of tothat point, like, I'm a big believer.
Like, I just tell people,like, this is what I spend my money
on.
Right.
And I think that's a very,very powerful brand testimony.
Yeah, I think so, too. I mean,and, you know, we have started trying
to mess with the, the guideside of things to try to get our
(31:57):
name out there more. But, youknow, I grew, I grew up racing motorcycles
and bicycles, too, and I'verun teams and done the team manager
thing. And one of the petpeeves for me as a team manager was
always like, you know, you hadyour bike sponsor and the first thing
you did at the beginning ofthe year was you got your discounts
(32:18):
and everyone ordered all theirparts, you know, so you, you, you
got, you know, whatever, 50,65% off for all your stuff to get.
To get all your stuff ready tobuild your bike to go for the racing,
you know, and then it wascrickets, you know, the whole deal
was here, you guys are goingto be on this team, you're going
to get your jerseys, you'regoing to get all your parts, and
then you're going to race allseason, and you're going to do all
(32:40):
these things on social mediaand promote the, you know, promote
the companies that support us.And then once they got their stuff,
it was like they forgot allthat, you know, and you can't take
it all back because they didpay for it, you know, to some degree.
And that was my worry with thewhole pro deal, like guide ambassador
(33:02):
thing was like, like, how doyou, how do you patrol that? You
know, we're going up, we'regoing up against these huge companies
that, you know, you might geta new guide that wants to get a good
deal on some rods, but thefirst chance they get, or the first
sniff they get by G. Loomis orone of these big companies to get
(33:22):
some support, like the firstthing they do is drop us, you know,
because, because Orvis or G.Loomis is way cooler. Right. So it's,
it's a hard thing to police.So we just kind of done that organically
too, you know. And I've justmet people along the way and kind
(33:42):
of let them ask me what theywant, what they need. Most of them
want to support us becausethey like us as humans and they think
the rods cast well and they'renot under any kind of obligation
through a shop to run acertain brand in their boat, you
(34:04):
know, so we're, we're stillplaying with it. We've got a couple
different tiers of guideambassadorship, you know, so if,
if people, if guides are outthere and they want to get some of
our product in their boats, weusually test the waters with a smaller
discount, see if they're gonnado what they say they're gonna do,
(34:26):
and then they can work theirway up into a bigger discount as
a guide. Because it isimportant when people are out catching
fish, they look down and seewhat they're fishing usually. And
if, you know, we could getsome brand recognition out of that,
it's important. So very, very neat.
(34:47):
And so why don't you, Dave,walk us through. I think you've got
what, about a half a dozenspecific rod rides? You want to walk
us through those?
Yeah. So we, we run, we haveeverything from a 10 foot 3 weight
up to a 9 foot 12 weight. Sowe've got our high stick, which is
our 10 foot 3 weight. Greatentry level price at 179. A really,
(35:13):
I mean it's a, it's a funcasting rod. You know, whether you're
Kentucky farm ponding for panfish out of a canoe. Uh, tons of
guys do that. Just, they justuse that extra one foot of length
to roll cast their cast outthere while they're sitting down.
It's an effortless cast androd. Great, great, great option for
(35:36):
someone that wants to not justhave a, a ten foot three weight that
is solely just built for euronymphing. You know, like it casts
well, it roll casts well. It'snot, it doesn't have a, a down locking
reel seat on it. I did thatfor a reason. I wanted to, I left
(35:58):
a little bit of room in thequiver to, to develop a more euro
specific rod down the road aswe grew. And then we've our 9 foot
5 weight, the roll caster.It's going to be more of a medium,
medium action rod. A lot ofpeople compare it to like the Reddington
(36:20):
classic trout, like that kindof a feeling rod. So lot, lot more
forgiveness, a little bit moresoul roll cast beautifully. The beauty
of that rod, when I wasdeveloping it, I really wanted a
rod that was light in hand butlike a beginner could pick up and
(36:40):
put a loop together and notfeel like they're fighting the rod
the whole time. And it, it'scool watching people pick that rod
up for the first time. Evenlike casting instructors, they'll
pick it up and they'll,they'll, they'll try to cast at like
a super fast dry fly rod orsomething and they'll slow down their
(37:04):
cast and get it and thenthey'll just be, they'll weld it.
You know, it's like they canimmediately adjust to that rod and
get it working the way itneeds to. And then you pick up. A
beginner will pick it up andgo out there and they immediately
have confidence, you know, so,so that's our nine foot five weight.
We have got a nine foot sixweight with a fighting butt called
(37:26):
the Fish Whistle. That's goingto be our first rod that has more
of a salt inspired taper, Alittle wider modulus, a little more
tip action so it's a littlelighter, a little faster. That rod
was originally designed forfishing dock light fishing for juvenile
(37:47):
tarpon and snook down inFlorida for a guide buddy of mine.
And once I got done with it, Ijust really enjoyed casting it. I
was like, you know man, I needto add this one to the lineup. So
nine foot six weight Fishwhistle. Then our nine foot seven
is the streamer stick that isgoing to be going back to more of
(38:12):
the traditional mid flexfeeling rod. Super fun to cast. You
know, all of our rods are kindof named something a little different
and based off of their kind ofindicative of, you know, what their
qualities are. So that one's179 price point for that one because
(38:35):
of the componentries, youknow, a little bit more in line with
the five weight stuff. The,the next rod that we have is the
eight foot bomber is ourgraphite eight weight. The nine foot
(38:56):
nine foot eight weight bomber.That one is built on a similar taper
to our six weight. So a littlelighter, a little faster. Salt. Salt.
Inspired Fuji alkaline guides.Spare tip. Yeah, lot, lot of fun
for your snook, red fish, seatrout, things like that. And we have
(39:22):
another 8 weight is a 8 foot 8weight power glass which is a fiberglass
rod. Super fun carp rod. It'sgot a lot of power. Started that
rod out as a nine footer anddidn't like it, but then got it down.
Once we got it down to theeight foot range, it was punching
(39:43):
through some wind. I did a lotof testing down in Texas for that
red fishing and it just turnedinto a really fun rod. I, I kind
of, I knew I wanted to add atleast one fiberglass rod in the lineup
and it was, I didn't want todo a three weight or anything real
light because there's a ton ofpeople doing them. And I was just
(40:04):
kind of, I was kind of sold onthe eight weight because of its versatility.
I feel like you can take thatthing, you can take that thing to
a little creek and catch somepan fish and it's still fun or you
could really, you know, gocatch some bigger fish and it's forgiving
enough to, to, you know, youknow, I've got customers that have
(40:25):
caught 30 inch, you know, pikeand muskie on it up north. So it's
got a good range. As for aglass rod and then going back to
the graphite stuff, We've gota 9 foot 9 weight strip set which
also built on that fastertaper like the 6 and the 8. And then
(40:47):
we've got our river Wolf whichis our 9 foot 11 muskie stick that
comes in two colors like agold metallic and orange or an OD
green matte and black. Andthat's going to have that, that medium
deep flex for casting big,bigger, heavier flies. And just a
(41:07):
rod that's really comfortableto cast like day in and day out for
like four days at a time, youknow. And then we've got our 9 foot
12 weight which is the doublehall, which is a little bit lighter
and a little bit faster thanour 11. A lot of people use it for
musky but it's a great rod togo take to the salt. If you're, if
(41:29):
you're a dude that primarilyfishes freshwater and you want to
do a couple tarpon trips ayear or whatever. One a year. It's,
it's a great option for thatand for you know, Amber Jackson,
bigger fish and assault. Soyeah, that's, that's our current
lineup and we're working onsome other stuff too. So. Yeah.
Can you share tease anydetails of the other stuff?
(41:52):
Yeah. So been working on ashorter rod. Working on a. A seven
foot probably. I was kind ofup in the air between a 771 and a
73 trying to figure out what Iwant. I think it's going to end up
being a 7 foot 2 weight calledthe pocket knife. And that's, that's
just come out of. We've had alot of requests for a shorter rod
(42:14):
especially in the Appalachiansand the brook trout guys. So going
to try to create something.It's, it's, it's in process and just
trying to refine it a littlebit and get it. Most of our rods
go through about a year oftesting and just prototyping before,
(42:35):
before they land on thewebsite for the general public. And
then the other really coolexciting thing I'm working on, I'm
working on our first lineup ofmid priced rods. Gonna be called
the Destination series. Gonnabuilt. Be built with a little bit
(42:55):
higher end. Components haven'tlanded on the exact guides yet. They're
either gonna be like seaguides or, or recoil guides. It's
the jury's still out on that.I'm testing both. There's some pros
and cons to both of them butthe modulus is gonna be a little
lighter, a little faster. Thereel seat's gonna be nicer, the cork's
(43:18):
gonna be nicer. Price pointfor it. We're shooting for like a
$459 price point for theDestination series. And it's going
to be the first series that weare going to offer in different sizes.
So you'll be able to, you'll,you'll be able to go on the website
(43:39):
and order anything from a 7 upthrough like a 12 or a 14 weight.
So up until now our rods haveall been just whatever that model
is is. It's, that's, that'sthat color and that's the size. So
this will be the first likestep into our like mid priced range.
And I've also kind of. My goalis to be able to create a price point
(44:04):
around the $459 range with alot of performance. And ultimately
what I want to do is be ableto. I want people to be able to go
on our website and buy a threepack of rods for what the cost of
like one heliognose cost. Sopeople are trying to go on a trip
to, you know, Belize. Theywant to knock out the slam. They
(44:28):
can go, you know, I'm workingon some packaging designs so that
they could, you know, buy an8, 10 12, 3 pack that comes in a
case. They can just buy allthat for 1200 bucks, jump on a plane
and be set, take some reelswith them, you know. So that's kind
of one of the more excitingprojects I've been working on. And
(44:50):
I've got a lot of hours in onthe 12 weight that I've been testing.
And everyone that's castedit's really loved it. So I'm excited
to get those out there.
Yeah. So when should folksexpect to see those on the website?
Man, I don't have a. I don'thave an exact data on it yet. It's
a big ask from us financiallyto, to, to get that inventory in.
(45:15):
That's the biggest hurdle forus right now. The, the rod development
is farther ahead than, youknow, we just gotta be careful. Most
of em, it's kind of easy.Cause we can bring in, you know,
a couple hundred of a nineweight or something. But when you're
bringing in a couple hundredof seven, seven through 12, like
(45:35):
you're talking a pretty bigchunk. So we're just trying to see,
you know, test the waters.We're working on some other marketing
stuff to try to get in a fewmore shops and things like that and
really get some samples inpeople's hands so that we kind of
have a little bit more productmoving across the country versus
(45:55):
just in the eastern side wherewe're at now, and make us feel a
little bit more comfortableabout making that last push, you
know. So yeah, I got it.
Cause it'll, it'll probablymore than double your inventory to,
to make that purchase, right?
Yeah, yeah, for sure. Andhonestly, we were kind of, you know,
kind of waiting to see whatthe tariff thing did too. You know,
(46:18):
you don't want to go drop ororder for 1400 rods or you know,
2000 rods right away. And we,we got a decent shipment of rods
in to refill some inventorythat we were sold out on a few models,
you know, about a month and ahalf ago and pleasantly Surprised
(46:38):
that the tariffs didn't reallyaffect us as bad. So kind of refocused
and, like, all right, well,maybe we can make this happen. So
the biggest thing for me is,like, just making sure the testing's
exactly the way we want it. SoI'm going to get some final samples
back from the R D facility andhopefully be able to show some of
(47:00):
those off during show season.And what I'd really like to do is
push some orders through showseason so they can, you know, show
up in March or April and hitthe shelves. So, yeah, absolutely.
You know, folks may not knowthat you are also the founder of
the Kentucky River MuskieClassic, and just kind of curious,
you know, when did you get thefever to chase muskie on the fly?
(47:22):
Oh, man, like, 2015. I think Istarted 2015 late, like, that fall,
and then it's kind of just.Yeah, it's been 10 years now. So
I'm, you know, I think for me,it's a heritage thing. They're native
to Kentucky. I just got reallyinterested. Anything that's super
(47:48):
challenging and is, like,something that most people just would
think is dumb and pointless,those are the things that I get attached
to somehow. And musky fishingwas one of those things. You know,
it was a challenge. It was,you know, you get your highs and
your lows. And once I startedcatching a few fish, floating some
(48:12):
beautiful rivers in. In myhome state and learned about all
the history of those riverswith the Indians and, you know, the
hunting and the. Thebackstories of all these, you know,
these rivers and creeks, itjust, you know, it kind of stuck
with me. And then thecommunity behind it, too, was just
(48:34):
so. So cool. And. Yeah, just.Yeah. Just was kind of drawn to it.
And I've met a lot of awesomefolks along the way because of the
musky fishing thing. I mean, Iwould say, if anything, it's. It's
been one of the harder hurdlesfor us to. To. To cover or. Or get
(48:58):
away from. Like, if all I hadto do was sell musky rods, I'd be
fine. Um, just trying to letpeople know we saw other odds, you
know, So I was so heavilyfocused in the muskie community from
the beginning, just trying toget our name out there to the world,
you know? Yeah.
Very neat. So tell us a littlebit more about the event.
(49:20):
Yeah. So last weekend InFebruary started two years ago, we
had 21 teams, I believe thefirst year. The second year, we had
40 teams. Two teams didn'tshow, so we ended up with 38 total.
Teams and 112 anglers. Sohuge, huge growth. And within the
(49:47):
first year, the. This secondyear, we had 38 teams, 112 anglers,
and 38 fish got boated. Soreally, really good outcome for the
tournament. Most folks didn'teven think we were going to be able
to put the tournament onbecause three weeks before the tournament,
(50:09):
we had like, historic, like,catastrophic flooding that affected
southern Kentucky. And a lotof the waters that we were fishing,
even during the tournament,about 2/3 of the fishable water was
just not fishable because therivers were just getting blown out
(50:29):
because all the reservoirsabove them were just full. So the
dams were just wide open, youknow, so to have that good of a turnout,
everyone had a blast. Everyonewas catching fish and seeing fish.
You know, it was cool to see.And we're going to continue to grow
it every year and just make itbetter and try to raise as much money
(50:55):
for the Muskies Inc. Chapter,chapter 52, the Daniel Boone Chapter.
We're, you know, it's. It wasan idea, and we're trying to figure
out ways to help them raisesome more money. And the growth of
the. The growth of thetournament has actually got us a
(51:17):
seat at the table with some ofthe fisheries biologists and people
that we actually need to betalking with to make some changes
because we've had some reallybad stocking years. You know, Covid
didn't help, and then it kindof just snowballed from there. So
we're trying to. Trying tomake some changes. We've got the
(51:41):
hatchery there at the bottomof cave. Ron has had a lot of water
problems the last few yearsjust with algae blooms and things
like that. So the, the fishhealth has been bad, and they're.
They're going to change someof that up and grow some muskies
in a different facility thathas a little bit better water situation
(52:05):
to help us with our stocking.So, you know, none of that would
have been possible withoutmultiple tourism boards noticing
how many people were comingthrough their city and renting airbnbs
and buying fuel and haulingtheir rafts and jet boats and stuff.
Like, people immediatelyunderstood, like, man, there's a
(52:25):
lot of people coming for this,you know, so it was. It's been a
huge, huge help. And we'reonly going to continue to hopefully
raise more and more money to,you know, keep our conservation good
for the muskies.
Very, very neat. And so folkswanted to get more information for
February of 2026. Where shouldthey go?
(52:45):
You can go to The KentuckyRiver Muskie Classic. Instagram or
Facebook. We don't currentlyhave a website but it's managed all
through social media. It'sbeen. Been great. Easy to get a hold
of us. Super small group. Soanybody needs any information, you
(53:06):
know, obviously the Instagramor, or Facebook page and then obviously
you can reach out to the WolfRod co page too and we can point
you in the right direction onthat. It's just, yeah, I mean it's
just a really cool, it's sucha cool river system with you know,
I was super, I was super hardon myself. You know, the musky zinc
(53:32):
guys were wanting to do itearlier and you know, I was super
worried about, you know,affecting the fishery and then I,
we kind of sat down and we'rejust like, man, there's like over
500 miles of fishable water.Like it's going to be like the fisheries
not going to be bothered by,you know, 40, 40 boats showing up
(53:56):
to fish for two days, youknow, so. And it, it's been great.
It's, it really has beengreat. It's, it's a beautiful river
system. The Kentucky riverdrainage is, you know, it's, it's
huge. There's so many tribs.There's three main rivers that flow
into one big river and it'sjust, there's just a lot of water
(54:16):
and it's all filled with fish.So yeah, definitely look for sign
ups soon. It's coming aroundthe corner. I guess we'll, we'll
start, we'll start gettingregistrations out about six months
before the event and it'sgoing to fill up. Filled up last
year. So I'd imagine it'sgoing to fill up again and then you
(54:39):
know, one of the favoritesfrom all the people that come there,
Black Barn Barbecue. Local,local barbecue place. They do our,
they do our food every yearand they do it upright. They smoke
chicken wings and gouda Macand cheese and cornbread and brisket.
The whole deal. We, we do itupright Kentucky style. So yeah,
(54:59):
better get a team, get a teamfigured out. Three man teams, two
man teams, whatever you wantto do. And get signed up when you
see that registration pop up.Because it won't, it won't take long
to fill up. Yeah.
Well, there you go. And sowhere can folks find you on the show
circuit in 20, 26?
Oh man. So we're going to tryto hit a couple of the big fly fishing
(55:22):
shows. I don't know exactlywhich ones yet. We're trying to be
in Atlanta for sure. Denver'sanother one, but it's. I think it's
gonna. It overlapped with theTrout Fest and the Guadalupe River
Trout Fest last year down inNew Braunfels, Texas. So we're still
(55:45):
trying to figure out finalcalendar on that. We'll definitely
be back in Toronto again atthe Sportsman show. And then, man,
I don't know. We did like nineshows this year. It was pretty much
full bore from like January tothe end of March. So we did. We're
(56:08):
going to be at the VirginiaFly Fishing and Wine Festival. That's
in Doswell, Virginia. That'llbe the first one we're at. And then
we typically, we always do theKentucky and a fly fishing show that's
just, that's just south ofLouisville. That's more of a local
show, but it's, it's usuallyon a weekend where then there's no
(56:29):
other big shows going on. Andthen obviously Trout Fest, we did
the Midwest Fly Fishing Expoup in Warren, Michigan last year,
then the Toronto show and thenwe did the Maggie Valley Fly Fishing
Festival this year as well. Sothat's our second year doing that.
So probably honestly at thispoint we're going to try to stick
(56:50):
to all of the shows that wehave been doing and then add on.
So just going to try to keepgrowing it and letting people tell
people about our product, man,getting it in people's hands. Hopefully
we can get a decent booth at acouple of these bigger shows. We
are even talking aboutpotentially trying to go to ICAST
(57:10):
this year or next year. Just,you know, get in front of more of
the industry, so to speak.
Got it. And before I let yougo tonight, Dave, is there anything
else you'd like to share withour listeners?
Man, I just, you know, we're,we're here for the long haul. I.
(57:32):
It's, it's, it's a, it's adefinitely a cutthroat world. You
know, the industry as a wholeis just, it's, it's always changing.
But I think that, you know, ifyou have an opportunity to, to get
a hold of one of our rods,test it out and I think you'll be
(57:52):
pleasantly surprised with,with its performance and just keep
an eye on our, on our website.Another thing, you know, we're working
on, I told you briefly touchedbase that we're working on some new
marketing stuff and beentrying to film some YouTube stuff.
So we do have a YouTubechannel. It doesn't have a lot of
(58:14):
stuff on it now, but we'regoing to start, we're going to have
some teasers out there soon.We're doing a, we're doing a new
series on YouTube called theWolf Pack Series. So it's essentially
just a series of YouTubeepisodes where I travel around the
country and meet fly shopsthat carry our products or fish with
guide companies that fish ourstuff on their boats. And yeah, it's
(58:39):
going to be real,professionally done. Got some great
film folks helping along theway with, you know, way more expensive
stuff than I even knowanything about. But let, let them
capture all the stuff. I'mjust gonna, you know, do my thing
which is talk to the shops andintroduce people and do some fishing
(59:01):
and hopefully catch some fish.But yeah, look for the Wolf Pack
series. We've got some, gotsome cool stuff on this on the schedule.
We'll be up in Canada doingsome filming with some of the folks
that I've met over the years.And yeah, should be a cool series
and hopefully another avenuefor folks to learn more about us
(59:22):
as a brand and more about how,how our, you know, what our vibes
are and what kind of people we are.
So yeah, and I'll drop a linkto your YouTube channel in the show
notes. And are there otherplaces that folks should go to follow
Wolf Rodco, get updates on theKentucky River Muskie Classic and
just generally follow youradventures on the water?
(59:42):
Yeah, man, the Wolf RodCompany, Instagram and Facebook,
definitely Instagram's, we'rea little heavier on that. It's just
a lot easier for us to manageas a small company. And then the
Kentucky River Muskie Classic,Instagram as well. But yeah, definitely
(01:00:03):
the website wolf rodco.com hasall of our stuff. Got some cool hats.
Keep, keep an eye out forsome, some new rods popping up down
the road. And then I guess theonly other thing I would ask is if
anyone is, you know, a shopowner or you know, even guides. If
(01:00:25):
you're interested in learningmore about what we have to offer
and what you know, we've gotsome great dealer pricing, super
competitive pricing and ourwarranties second to none. So you're
interested in getting us inyour shop, hit me up Wolf radco at
gmail. Be happy to hear morefrom you and send you a little bit
(01:00:50):
more info on us.
Well, there you go. Well,Dave, I really appreciate you taking
some time out of your eveningto talk with me.
All right, man, I appreciate it.
Take care.
Thanks.
Well, folks, we hope youenjoyed the interview as much as
we enjoyed bringing it to you.Remember, links to all this episode's
sponsors are in the shownotes. Check them out. Tight lines,
everybody.
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