October 14, 2025 • 29 mins
Logan Freeman is the founder of LiveFree Investments, launched in early 2018 after recognizing that the corporate world couldn’t offer the fulfillment or freedom he was seeking. Fueled by his passion for real estate—which began with a live-in flip in 2013—Logan has since built a thriving business, completing over 80 successful transactions and managing more than $13 million in investments annually.
What sets Logan apart is his relentless drive and proactive communication. He believes deeply in personal growth and continually invests in himself to stay ahead of market trends and provide maximum value to his clients. His philosophy, “What got you here, won’t get you there,” drives his commitment to adapt, evolve, and serve investors with confidence and clarity.
With a proven track record and a client-first mindset, Logan empowers investors to build wealth and security through strategic real estate investments.
During the show we discussed:
- Incorporating the 18.6-year real estate cycle into your strategy
- Where we are in today’s CRE market cycle
- How macro trends guide CRE investment decisions
- The 5 stages of real estate cycles and their impact
- Risks of ignoring market cycles
- Navigating uncertain markets with confidence
- Ways to partner with LiveFree Investments
- Advantages of the LiveFree brokerage model
- Uncovering off-market deals through equity syndications
- The role and structure of joint ventures
- Overlooked trends in commercial and multifamily real estate
- Staying ahead in the next 3–5 years with LiveFree Investments
Resources:
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:02):
(Transcribed by TurboScribe.ai. Go Unlimited to remove this message.) Welcome to the Business Credit and Financing Show.
Each week, we talk about the growth strategies
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(00:22):
of topics from advertising and marketing to the
nuts and bolts of running a highly successful
business.
And now, to introduce the host of our
show, financial expert and award-winning author, Ty
Crandall.
Hello, and thanks for joining us today.
I'm super excited you could be here.
So today, we're talking about a lot of
things, especially relating to real estate.
(00:43):
And we're gonna do something we never talked
about on the show, which is real estate
cycles, how to actually recognize and know where
we are right now, know what's coming up
in the future to be able to break
into real estate investing or continue to build
an empire within real estate investing.
You have to know these cycles, but we've
never had this discussion.
And so with us today is like the
king of the topic, which is Logan Freeman.
(01:04):
Now, Logan's actually the founder of Live Free
Investments launched in early 2018 after recognizing that
the corporate world really couldn't offer the fulfillment
or freedom that he was seeking.
So fueled by his passion for real estate,
which began with a live-in flip in
2013, Logan has since built a thriving business,
competing over 80 successful transactions and managing more
(01:25):
than 13 million in investments annually.
So what sets him apart really is his
relentless drive and proactive communication.
He believes deeply in personal growth and continuously
invests in himself to stay ahead of the
market trends and provide maximum value to his
clients.
His philosophy is what got you here won't
get you there.
(01:46):
And that drives his commitment to adapt, evolve
and serve investors with confidence and clarity.
So the proven track record and a client
-first mindset, Logan actually empowers investors to build
wealth and security through strategic real estate investments.
Logan, what's up, man?
Thanks for joining us.
Man, that was an awesome bio, brother.
I appreciate you getting that out to the
world.
It's fun to hear that.
I mean, it's been a crazy nine years
(02:07):
of, nine or 10 years of being in
real estate.
And people always ask me like, what do
you do?
And every year has been different, right?
I mean, if you think about it, like
every year that I've been active in real
estate has not been the same.
You know, we've dealt with a lot of
different geopolitical things.
We've dealt with pandemics.
We've dealt with interest rates going up and
down and all around.
(02:28):
But it's really just me trying, this whole
journey has been me trying to figure out
since I wasn't doing real estate in 2008,
I was playing college football, right?
Like, so I wasn't really thinking about real
estate and the finance world and all of
these different things.
I got to learn from the past, right?
So I can remember the future.
(02:49):
That's what I'm trying to do, right?
Is remember the future so that I can
look back in the past.
And I know that history doesn't repeat itself,
but it often does rhyme.
And that's Mark Twain, I believe.
And so I try to learn from guys
like Ray Dalio and Sam Zell and Stephen
Schwartzman and Howard Marks, right?
These folks that have been in the industry
for so long and try to pull out
(03:09):
nuggets on things that are principles that we
can utilize on a regular basis to try
to position ourselves successfully.
And I think that doing that has allowed
me to make pivots.
It's allowed me to make pivots in front
of market changes, which has been crucial in
real estate.
And it's put me in a good position.
We've done close to $400 million worth of
(03:31):
real estate now.
And that's on the brokerage side.
It's on the owning and managing side.
And I've just about done every asset class.
So I'm just excited to be here and
try to add some value to the listeners
today.
That's great, man.
I'm really glad you could be here because
we've never even had discussion about real estate
cycles.
And I see, I might be saying this
wrong, but I think you talk about like
(03:51):
an, what is it, an 18-6 real
estate cycle?
Is that accurate?
What is that?
Yeah, yeah.
So, I mean, if you think about this,
real estate has had a long history of
operating within cycles.
And I think it's shaped by fundamental forces
of supply, demand, and here's what Howard Marks
taught me, speculative behavior.
Among these cycles, there is something that is
called the 18.6-year real estate cycle.
(04:13):
And I think it stands out as one
of the more reliable and predictable frameworks for
understanding how property markets ebb and flow.
And this was popularized by economists like Fred
Harrison and more recently, Phil Anderson and Akhil
Patel.
So you definitely go read their books, The
Secret Wealth Advantage, The Power Is in the
Land, and The Secret Life of Real Estate
(04:34):
and Finance, because those are three incredible reads.
But that framework traces its roots to a
foundational economic principle that's been around for a
long time.
And that is Ricardo's Law of Economic Rent.
So by both understanding the mechanics of the
real estate cycle and the theory of economic
rent, we can gain a powerful lens for
interpreting market trends and anticipating those opportunities.
(04:57):
And a lot of people are like, what
the heck is Ricardo's Law of Economic Rent,
right?
Well, I mean, it was developed by David
Ricardo in the early 19th century.
And it just explains how the value of
land is derived from its scarcity and productive
potential rather than the effort or capital put
into it.
So in essence, economic rent is the income
earned by the land or natural resources based
(05:20):
on its location and its desirability rather than
the active improvement by the owner.
So it's tied to land scarcity.
And because land is a finite resource, right,
which is unlike labor or manufactured goods, which
can be expanded.
So we'll give you an example.
Prime real estate in a central business district
generates significantly higher rent than a property on
the outskirts of a city simply because of
(05:42):
its location and access to resources, infrastructure, or
population, right?
And so the reason that this matters is
that land value appreciation drives the cycle.
Land being limited becomes a focal point of
speculative investment during periods of economic growth.
That drives up prices during expansions and creates
oversupply or misallocation of resources during contractions, okay?
(06:07):
So that speculation and mispricing, you can see
that Ricardo's insights reveal how speculative behavior often
detaches land values from its productive use, which
leads to bubbles and eventual corrections, right?
And then we have economic inequality, right?
So land value appreciation benefits landowners disproportionately, right?
So that widens wealth gaps, and that's a
(06:27):
pattern frequently observed during the winner's curse phase
of the cycle, which I believe is where
we are at, and Ray Dalio would definitely
agree with me.
So I just wanna, I'll stop there because
I just dropped a lot of information just
on kind of the framework and Ricardo's law
of economic rent, but I can kind of
go through the whole 18.6-year real
estate cycle as well if you think that's
valuable, but I wanna stop and pause to
(06:48):
see if you have any questions.
No, I think, I think carry on because
that's what I was wanting to know is
more about, and I was also wanting to
know more about the cycle, where we are
right now in the cycle.
Okay.
Yeah, please continue.
So, I mean, Ricardo's principles underpin the mechanics
of the 18.6-year real estate cycle,
and that cycle repeats over nearly two decades,
okay?
So that's driven by land scarcity, speculative behavior,
(07:10):
and credit markets, and that cycle consists of
five key phases.
The first key phase is the expansion phase.
This is give or take around seven years.
Please keep this in mind, that this is
not a specific number, right?
18.6 years is not like the exact
number, but over the last 200 years or
so, every 18 years, you can see these
(07:30):
ebbs and flows, okay?
But the first expansion phase is seven years,
and this is what happens here.
We have a recovery from a downturn, right?
So the crisis fuels economic growth and investment,
and land and property values rise steadily as
the confidence returns.
And so connecting that to Ricardo's law of
economic rent, the productive potential of that undervalued
land is realized, which drives the increased demand
(07:53):
for development, okay?
So then we have a mid-cycle slowdown.
This is typically two to three years.
And during this period of time, external factors,
trade tensions, geopolitical risks, pandemics, temporarily slow the
growth, right?
And so development and transactions pause, creating a
cooling off period, right?
So then we move into the second expansion
phase, which is typically four to five years.
(08:14):
So we have rapid economic growth is resuming.
It's fueled by more speculative investment, increased credit
availability.
So land values are rising rapidly, and development
accelerates, often leading to oversupply.
Well, what did we see in Austin and
certain areas in California, and maybe not California,
sorry, Austin, but Phoenix, Arizona is the other
(08:34):
one that you can maybe point to, right?
That's four to five years, okay?
So then we move into what is called
the winner's curse, right, or the mania phase,
right?
And so that's kind of where I believe
we're at today.
So asset prices are peaking, driven by that
speculative frenzy and optimism.
We start to see a lot of oversupply.
We start to see rising interest rates, which
begin to reveal vulnerabilities, right?
(08:56):
And so Ricardo's connection to this would be
that landowners demand unsustainable rents, further detaching land
values from that productive capacity.
Finishing up the cycle about two to three
years is the contraction phase.
And in this is where the market correction
or recession reduces the land values and transaction
volume.
So underperforming assets face financial stress, speculative excesses
(09:18):
are flushed out, and the repricing of land
values bring back in line with productive potential,
creating opportunities for strategic investors.
So if you think about that, right, in
2007, we went through our last winner's curse
in 2007, right, the 2007 real estate peak
before the GFC perfectly illustrates Ricardo's theory and
(09:40):
the cycle in action.
We had speculative frenzy, land values skyrocketed as
easy credit and overconfidence fueled those speculative investments.
We had overpricing, right?
Landowners demanding excessive rents, leading to a misalignment
with productive use.
And then there was a correction, right?
So the subsequent crash reset land values and
exposed the inefficiencies of that speculative behavior.
(10:01):
Now we all know that the GFC was
a lot speculative on the financial side more
than anything, right?
But that credit flows is definitely a part
of the land values, right?
And so where we're at in 2025, I
mean, I think according to the 18.6
year real estate cycle we're currently in and
or potentially exiting the winner's curse phase, entering
(10:22):
the early stages of a contraction.
And I think Ricardo's principles highlight the speculative
overpricing that often defines this phase.
We've seen land values have surged due to
scarcity and the speculative activity in hot markets.
I just read yesterday that multifamily starts are
up 31%.
Ty, they're up 31% in the multifamily
starts.
So, I mean, we are right there.
(10:43):
Developers are gonna start facing higher costs.
We already seen that, right?
We have financing costs, we have construction costs,
we have labor costs.
We've got oversupply in some areas as well,
likely triggering to some corrections.
I don't know, you probably know this better
than me, but I've heard in certain parts
of Florida there's a lot of single family
homes that have been developed that might be
sitting out on the market, right?
And I'm just reading headlines there, Ty.
(11:04):
So, I'm not bashing Florida before we started.
I told Ty that I absolutely love Florida.
But when national developers come in and they
deliver 500, 1,000, 1,500 homes and
people can't pay for them, what happens, right?
They start to drop in those prices.
So, investors are beginning to recalibrate their expectations.
They're focusing on productive potential and sustainable returns.
(11:26):
So, I think we're right there in 2025,
we're gonna start to see, and we already
have, pricing go back up and to the
point where at some point in 2026, we're
gonna have a big correction and that's gonna
bring a big opportunity.
So, what I'm doing right now is positioning
my portfolio as well as consulting many other
owners on how to take advantage of this
(11:47):
winner's purse phase, right?
And so, that represents the peak of the
second expansion phase.
And the last time that we're in this
position was approximately 2007.
You guys can do the math on 18
years in regards to that.
So, that's a good framework, I believe, that
you can at least start to apply to
your portfolio type.
I appreciate all that, Logan, and the detail
of the stages and walking through the framework.
(12:09):
So, from where you think that we are
now, what are you doing different with your
portfolio and what are you instructing, excuse me,
those that you teach to do based on
where we are and where we're going?
Yeah, well, I think there's a lot of
different things to think about, right?
Well, first and foremost, I start with, hey,
and I just did this kind of portfolio
analysis for a couple of different clients.
And I said, look, when is your debt
(12:31):
coming due?
Let's start there, right?
Like, we need to understand when your debt
is coming due.
Is it in the next two years?
Is it in the next three years?
Because that is super important to understand when
you need to start making some changes due
to your portfolio.
So, I've given kind of this playbook for
real estate investors from 2024 all the way
to 2030, right?
(12:51):
So, 2024 to 2026, we're late cycle.
So, harvest your gains from land speculation, harvest
your gains from the asset prices appreciated, refinance
into fixed rate long-term debt, strengthen your
cashflow on your existing properties if you are
looking to hold those for a long time,
need to maintain liquidity for future buying opportunities,
(13:13):
right?
To get ready for this 2027 to 2030
correction phase where you can acquire distressed land
and real estate assets.
You can focus on essential sectors, right?
Housing, industrial, logistics, essential retail has proven to
be extremely successful.
I think a lot of folks are into
self-storage as well, right?
And so, that's kind of how I'm thinking
about how to position from 2024 to 2026,
(13:36):
getting ready for a next big buying opportunity
sometime late 26, early 27.
Logan, what do you see happens when people
ignore this?
Like, when people are not paying attention to
cycles, which most people aren't, man.
I mean, I have a lot of real
estate guys on here, investing guys, they're not
describing, they don't understand this the way that
you understand this.
So, like, what happens when you don't?
(13:57):
Like, what are the biggest risks that these
other investors are dealing with out there when
they're just so disconnected from even the understanding
that these cycles are there and let alone
what cycle we're in?
It's a great question, Ty.
And I would say this, man.
I mean, many times I hear, well, this
time is different.
Well, if you go read folks like Ray
Dalio, he was so surprised when the dollar
(14:19):
became off of the gold standard, right?
He thought the stock market was gonna drop,
that the world was going to end, financial
crisis was going to happen.
He showed up on the trade desk at
the trade floor that day and guess what
happened?
Stocks were through the roof, right?
Prices were through the roof.
And he looked at himself and said, oh
my gosh, this time is not different.
(14:40):
This has had to have happened in the
past.
So he went back and researched.
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When this happened the last time in the
last 50 years, right, and now he's prepared,
right?
So I think that you have to first
and foremost get through that idea that this
time is different.
Whatever the administration is telling you, whatever other
(15:23):
investors are telling you, go back, find the
data, find the cycles, find the history and
what has happened in those periods of time.
Because I was talking to an investor the
other day and I said, look, to move
the big ship takes a long time.
You can't just turn it around, right?
And our global financial economy, right?
And our GDP, it takes a long time
(15:44):
to move that ship.
So you're going to have opportunities to see
things happen in the residential markets before you're
going to see it in the commercial, the
multifamily sectors, right?
Because those sectors take a little bit longer.
You also will see it in the stock
market before you will start to see the
things happen in the real estate market.
So there are ways and markers to be
(16:06):
thinking about and tracking on a regular basis
to say, man, it might be time to
really start to evaluate the portfolio.
I try to tell people like you need
to be evaluating your portfolio on a quarterly
basis regardless, talking to people like myself or
other folks in the industry that are trading
deals, they're in the market, they're in the
know on what's going on and have them
do analysis for you, right?
(16:27):
And find somebody who can say, all right,
there's a big demand for that type of
product type.
Your debt's coming due in the next 12
to 15 months.
We need to get a plan in place.
It might not be, hey, sell that deal
right now.
It might be, hey, that person that you've
had on month to month for the last
three years, it might be time to exit
them or get them on a 12 month
lease on a higher rate, right?
We need to start positioning this asset to
(16:48):
be able to sell with the highest net
operating income that you possibly can.
So I see a lot of people coasting
on their investments because everything's working right now.
But now if the market's going to change,
you need to have your foundations and your
fundamentals really strong.
It's the time to get your baseline and
your strength underneath you to be able to
(17:08):
weather the storm.
And that might be selling off some assets.
It might be creating some more liquidity.
It might be getting out of some of
your real estate or other investments at this
point so you can get ready for this
or refinancing some of that debt.
But just remember that this time is not
different.
This has happened many times in the past
and there is a lot of research and
a lot of data for us to go
(17:28):
and analyze to get ready for the next
downturn.
And just be, I think the answer is
like, you have to be willing to say
that this time is not different and it's
going to happen again.
It's just win and getting prepared for that.
Yeah, that's powerful.
What do you guys do at Live Free
Investments?
I know you invest obviously and you've done
a lot of investing successfully, but what other
(17:50):
options do you have to help other people
break into investing or further build their empire
in investing?
Absolutely.
I've got a brokerage called Midwest Commercial Real
Estate Advisors.
And we are advising over 25 clients right
now on dispositions.
We work with a lot of investors that
are doing 1031 exchanges, right?
They're selling a fourplex at a highly appreciated.
(18:11):
We're talking about, hey, let's look at your
return on equity.
Your fourplex in California is bringing in 3
,500, 4,500 per unit, right?
But guess what?
Your rents have not kept up with the
amount of appreciation that has happened on your
property.
So when you purchased it, you had a
good return on equity because you didn't have
much equity built up.
But now you've got 45, 50% appreciation
(18:33):
and the income that's coming on that property
does not keep up with the appreciation.
Your ROE is actually pretty low.
So how do we unlock that?
Well, we move it into somewhere in the
Midwest or some other market that you can
go get 15, 20, five different doors and
you can drastically increase that return on equity.
Or I have a lot of investors that
buy flex industrial properties, neighborhood retail shopping centers,
(18:56):
and we're advising them on how to do
that.
So lots of conversations going on in regards
to 1031 exchanges, as well as portfolio performance
audits.
What should I do with my portfolio?
Should I hold it?
Should I sell it?
Should I refinance it?
I'm gonna give you an objective view.
I don't need another listing, Ty.
I'll work on it, but like, I am
to the top with my capacity in regards
(19:18):
to the amount of deals that we are
working on.
So I'm trying to give true advice and
that has built a long-term relationship type
of situation where people come to me and
say, hey, I need your advice because I
know you're not just gonna go for a
listing and tell me to sell it, right?
And so we're trying to do that on
a regular basis.
That's pretty free.
I mean, I have a lot of folks
that say, man, you should really build a
(19:39):
consulting company, but I think it's more or
less better just to have the resources available
for folks so they can make informed decisions
and that when they get ready to make
a decision and actually make a move, they're
gonna call you.
And I build my business on that.
What about syndications?
You do stuff with joint ventures, syndications as
well.
Are those things?
And if so, how might that work?
(19:59):
Yeah, absolutely.
I've done over 25 different syndications across four
different states, spanning office, industrial, retail, multifamily.
And now doing a lot of land and
land development opportunities, bringing some ground up flex
industrial contractor garages out of the ground, building
some urban infill subdivisions, working with landowners on
(20:21):
how to capitalize on that front.
I would say this, syndications, you have to
ensure that you have a good long-term
plan.
I never took any floating rate debt on
any of our deals.
And so been doing those since 2018.
I have been quiet in regards to new
acquisitions.
And that's because I've been reading the tea
(20:42):
leaves here.
Asset price appreciation, why hasn't kept up?
There's a lot of speculation going on.
Debt prices have gone out.
That's really pushed me out of kind of
the acquisition of existing assets.
So I kind of repositioned myself to say,
hey, let me go learn this land.
Let me understand this, Ricardo's law of economic
rent.
And I have bought strategically some properties in
the line of infrastructure development.
(21:04):
And I have played Ricardo's law of economic
rent pretty well.
I've got a couple of properties that we
have bought that we knew the streetcar was
gonna be moving down right in front of
it.
And I've been able to sell those assets
at a much higher price because maybe the
multifamily property didn't have parking.
Well, now it has the streetcar that stops
right out front.
So you might not need as much parking
as you would have when we purchased that.
(21:25):
So I've been a little quiet on the
syndication side of things.
Just kind of getting ready, I would say,
for my next buying opportunity.
And I really do know Kansas City pretty
well and so I can get a pretty
good sense of where and when to really
make the next move.
But I just don't think it's yet.
What about commercial multifamily trends?
What are you finding in those areas that
(21:45):
investors you're seeing are ignoring that they really
should be paying more attention to?
Absolutely.
I mean, first and foremost, I think that
historic tax credits and opportunity zones are absolutely
a strategy people need to be revitalizing and
looking into.
We've been doing a lot of studying and
bringing some projects to market that have these
tax credits.
They have incentives, right?
(22:06):
And so I have been in so many
meetings with planning and zoning commissions and the
Finance and Economic Development Councils talking about how
do we partner public-private partnerships to make
these deals make sense?
What incentives are available?
We have a quasi-governmental agency here in
Kansas City called the Port Authority.
We've got the Economic Development Council.
If you're bringing new jobs into the market,
(22:27):
then you can go get certain incentives.
And where construction costs are, where labor costs
are, honestly, doing new projects, it takes incentives
to make those make sense.
So I think that's overlooked.
And it's a blue ocean strategy because many
investors aren't willing to spend the time to
figure out what it takes to get those
deals done.
And so if you are, if you are
(22:47):
willing to do what others won't, you will
be able to gather deals and create opportunities
that they're not going to, right?
Because everybody that calls me wants the 2000s
and newer vintage, 100 plus units in a
great area.
I hear class B property in a class
A area.
Like that competition is very high, right?
So you're going to have to pay for
(23:08):
that.
So what I'm advising is more creative deal
structures.
Can we get the landowner?
Can we get the property owner to contribute
the property to a project?
We bring capital to the deal or the
new buyer brings capital to the deal.
We structure a joint venture.
We make that asset worth more.
And after three years, we're going to be
able to stabilize and sell that deal.
Right?
And so doing a lot more creative deal
structures right now and being willing to ask
(23:30):
those questions I think is really important.
Seller financing, also a great opportunity right now
for properties that have been owned with sellers
for a very long time.
Do not ignore seller financing on that front.
On the commercial side, one thing that's got
me most excited right now, well, two things
is Flex Industrial.
Flex product in Kansas City has not been
developed in the last five to 10 years.
(23:51):
We have very big logistic hubs going in,
500,000 square feet, a million square feet.
But if you look at the trend of
on-shoring and near-shoring jobs in the
manufacturing logistics space, in 2011, we had about
11,000, sorry, 2015, we had about 11
,000 jobs on-shore or near-shore.
You fast forward to 2023, 357,000 jobs
(24:15):
on-shore or near-shore to the North
America and to the United States.
That is a huge tailwind for you to
go capitalize on.
How do you capitalize on it?
Well, those people, they need those service vendors,
those contractors, they need places for their businesses.
And so what's been developed is big logistic
hubs.
What hasn't been developed is anything under 10
(24:36):
,000 square feet.
So if you can find a building and
you can retrofit that, or you can take
a 50,000 square foot building and chunk
it down to five tens, you are going
to get top of the market rents.
If you can bring 14 foot doors and
16 foot ceilings, 18 foot ceilings and bring
some technology into those buildings, you are going
to have tenants lining up and leasing that
(24:56):
product up.
We're doing that on a regular basis for
many different clients right now as well.
The other piece that I would say is
very interesting is data centers.
And if you are an investor and you
understand transmission and powers and distribution and utility
companies, huge goldmine right now is if you
can find land zoned for data centers, and
(25:19):
you can work with utility companies to bring
power to that site, you will be able
to get paid handsomely to doing those types
of deals.
And so those two areas on the commercial
side that got me most excited right now.
What do you think investors should be doing
right now?
Stay ahead of the game.
I mean, you've given a pretty clear outlook
of what's to happen and you should be
conserving resources and preparing to take advantage of
(25:39):
the opportunities that are about to come.
We all know the opportunities like in 2007,
six, eight in that timeframe that was there.
And we always say that in every downturn
or every negative, there's all this opportunity.
And so what are you doing?
Like, what do you advise investors?
What should investors be doing right now to
make the moves, to prepare themselves, I think
with the liquidity they're going to need to
(26:00):
take advantage of what's to come.
Man, you got to get into your portfolio
right now.
You got to get into the books.
I mean, I'm working with so many owners
for the last two to three years, they've
just been coasting.
They'll send me financials, I'll review it.
And I'm saying, hey guys, you're saying you're
in a wise 350.
I'm seeing 125, what's going on?
And they go in there and they're saying,
oh my gosh, we have not done these
(26:21):
CAM reconciliations right for the last three years.
Get into your portfolio, call your asset managers,
call your property managers, review your books, get
in there.
What opportunities do you see?
What's the weighted average lease term on your
deals right now?
Do you need to be restructuring leases?
When is your debt coming due?
Can you refinance?
(26:41):
Are you going to have to do a
cash in refinance?
Talk to lenders, get ready for that.
What deals can you sell right now to
create some liquidity on the properties that you
want to hold or you want to go
acquire?
Those are the things that I would be
advising people to do.
And that takes a lot of time.
It takes a lot of work and it's
a lot of detail oriented or find somebody
like myself that's willing to do that work
(27:03):
with you to make sure that you get
your portfolio ready.
There's many people out there and great resources
in the commercial real estate space that can
help you do that.
I love it.
Logan, thanks for coming on with us today.
There's a lot of people out there that
want to learn more, want to learn more
about following what you're teaching and then also
want to check out the different opportunities they
have to get involved with you with real
(27:24):
estate investing to be able to help their
portfolio or even launch to begin with.
So where should they go?
What should they do?
Yeah, I mean, thank you, Ty.
I appreciate that.
I'm super active on LinkedIn.
You can follow me there, Logan Freeman, the
Kansas City commercial real estate guy.
I will pop up.
I have been on there for nine to
10 years, posting daily, trying to add value.
Over 33,000 followers now.
(27:45):
I've got a newsletter there that I post
all of these insights.
I write articles about the 18.6 year
real estate cycle.
I give market reports on the Midwest, on
Kansas City, on what's going on, what I'm
seeing.
All of the opportunities that we have as
a team are going to be pitched there
on LinkedIn and everything's on our website as
well, mwcreadvisors.com.
(28:07):
You can find everything there and I'm very
accessible.
You can find me.
I appreciate that.
All right.
Thank you very much for coming on this
day.
I appreciate it.
Thanks for having me, Ty.
All right.
So listen, if you're watching this, one thing
you could do right now is go to
livefreeinvestments.com.
If you go to livefreeinvestments.com, Logan had
mentioned his LinkedIn social media channels are right
on the top right of the page.
So if you go to the page, you're
(28:28):
able to find the social media channels right
there.
Logan's got a great podcast as well that
I think you're going to love.
You're able to access his podcast there.
You're also able to access other resources as
well.
And there's a lot of information about how
you can get involved into real estate investing
and the type of things that they could
do to help you get involved.
So it all happens in one place.
That's livefreeinvestments.com.
Make sure you check it out today.
And again, take less than a minute because
(28:49):
as you can see how knowledgeable he is
about real estate cycles, something you've probably never
heard of this depth of knowledge.
So it takes less than a minute at
the top right of his page, just to
follow him on his social channels, including LinkedIn,
to get the real up-to-date information.
So make sure you do that while you're
at livefreeinvestments.com.
Thanks for tuning in.
Take care.
Have a great day.
(29:15):
You've been listening to The Business Credit and
Financing Show with your host, Ty Crandall.
Watch for our next episode to get even
more insight on financing and growing your business.
And don't forget to check us out online
at creditsuite.com for even more business growth
strategies.
(Transcribed by TurboScribe.ai. Go Unlimited to remove this message.) Welcome to the Business Credit and Financing Show.
Each week, we talk about the growth strategies
that matter most to entrepreneurs.
Listen in as we discuss the secrets to
getting credit and money to start and grow
your business.
And enjoy as we talk with seasoned business
owners, coaches, and industry leaders on a variety
(00:22):
of topics from advertising and marketing to the
nuts and bolts of running a highly successful
business.
And now, to introduce the host of our
show, financial expert and award-winning author, Ty
Crandall.
Hello, and thanks for joining us today.
I'm super excited you could be here.
So today, we're talking about a lot of
things, especially relating to real estate.
(00:43):
And we're gonna do something we never talked
about on the show, which is real estate
cycles, how to actually recognize and know where
we are right now, know what's coming up
in the future to be able to break
into real estate investing or continue to build
an empire within real estate investing.
You have to know these cycles, but we've
never had this discussion.
And so with us today is like the
king of the topic, which is Logan Freeman.
(01:04):
Now, Logan's actually the founder of Live Free
Investments launched in early 2018 after recognizing that
the corporate world really couldn't offer the fulfillment
or freedom that he was seeking.
So fueled by his passion for real estate,
which began with a live-in flip in
2013, Logan has since built a thriving business,
competing over 80 successful transactions and managing more
(01:25):
than 13 million in investments annually.
So what sets him apart really is his
relentless drive and proactive communication.
He believes deeply in personal growth and continuously
invests in himself to stay ahead of the
market trends and provide maximum value to his
clients.
His philosophy is what got you here won't
get you there.
(01:46):
And that drives his commitment to adapt, evolve
and serve investors with confidence and clarity.
So the proven track record and a client
-first mindset, Logan actually empowers investors to build
wealth and security through strategic real estate investments.
Logan, what's up, man?
Thanks for joining us.
Man, that was an awesome bio, brother.
I appreciate you getting that out to the
world.
It's fun to hear that.
I mean, it's been a crazy nine years
(02:07):
of, nine or 10 years of being in
real estate.
And people always ask me like, what do
you do?
And every year has been different, right?
I mean, if you think about it, like
every year that I've been active in real
estate has not been the same.
You know, we've dealt with a lot of
different geopolitical things.
We've dealt with pandemics.
We've dealt with interest rates going up and
down and all around.
(02:28):
But it's really just me trying, this whole
journey has been me trying to figure out
since I wasn't doing real estate in 2008,
I was playing college football, right?
Like, so I wasn't really thinking about real
estate and the finance world and all of
these different things.
I got to learn from the past, right?
So I can remember the future.
(02:49):
That's what I'm trying to do, right?
Is remember the future so that I can
look back in the past.
And I know that history doesn't repeat itself,
but it often does rhyme.
And that's Mark Twain, I believe.
And so I try to learn from guys
like Ray Dalio and Sam Zell and Stephen
Schwartzman and Howard Marks, right?
These folks that have been in the industry
for so long and try to pull out
(03:09):
nuggets on things that are principles that we
can utilize on a regular basis to try
to position ourselves successfully.
And I think that doing that has allowed
me to make pivots.
It's allowed me to make pivots in front
of market changes, which has been crucial in
real estate.
And it's put me in a good position.
We've done close to $400 million worth of
(03:31):
real estate now.
And that's on the brokerage side.
It's on the owning and managing side.
And I've just about done every asset class.
So I'm just excited to be here and
try to add some value to the listeners
today.
That's great, man.
I'm really glad you could be here because
we've never even had discussion about real estate
cycles.
And I see, I might be saying this
wrong, but I think you talk about like
(03:51):
an, what is it, an 18-6 real
estate cycle?
Is that accurate?
What is that?
Yeah, yeah.
So, I mean, if you think about this,
real estate has had a long history of
operating within cycles.
And I think it's shaped by fundamental forces
of supply, demand, and here's what Howard Marks
taught me, speculative behavior.
Among these cycles, there is something that is
called the 18.6-year real estate cycle.
(04:13):
And I think it stands out as one
of the more reliable and predictable frameworks for
understanding how property markets ebb and flow.
And this was popularized by economists like Fred
Harrison and more recently, Phil Anderson and Akhil
Patel.
So you definitely go read their books, The
Secret Wealth Advantage, The Power Is in the
Land, and The Secret Life of Real Estate
(04:34):
and Finance, because those are three incredible reads.
But that framework traces its roots to a
foundational economic principle that's been around for a
long time.
And that is Ricardo's Law of Economic Rent.
So by both understanding the mechanics of the
real estate cycle and the theory of economic
rent, we can gain a powerful lens for
interpreting market trends and anticipating those opportunities.
(04:57):
And a lot of people are like, what
the heck is Ricardo's Law of Economic Rent,
right?
Well, I mean, it was developed by David
Ricardo in the early 19th century.
And it just explains how the value of
land is derived from its scarcity and productive
potential rather than the effort or capital put
into it.
So in essence, economic rent is the income
earned by the land or natural resources based
(05:20):
on its location and its desirability rather than
the active improvement by the owner.
So it's tied to land scarcity.
And because land is a finite resource, right,
which is unlike labor or manufactured goods, which
can be expanded.
So we'll give you an example.
Prime real estate in a central business district
generates significantly higher rent than a property on
the outskirts of a city simply because of
(05:42):
its location and access to resources, infrastructure, or
population, right?
And so the reason that this matters is
that land value appreciation drives the cycle.
Land being limited becomes a focal point of
speculative investment during periods of economic growth.
That drives up prices during expansions and creates
oversupply or misallocation of resources during contractions, okay?
(06:07):
So that speculation and mispricing, you can see
that Ricardo's insights reveal how speculative behavior often
detaches land values from its productive use, which
leads to bubbles and eventual corrections, right?
And then we have economic inequality, right?
So land value appreciation benefits landowners disproportionately, right?
So that widens wealth gaps, and that's a
(06:27):
pattern frequently observed during the winner's curse phase
of the cycle, which I believe is where
we are at, and Ray Dalio would definitely
agree with me.
So I just wanna, I'll stop there because
I just dropped a lot of information just
on kind of the framework and Ricardo's law
of economic rent, but I can kind of
go through the whole 18.6-year real
estate cycle as well if you think that's
valuable, but I wanna stop and pause to
(06:48):
see if you have any questions.
No, I think, I think carry on because
that's what I was wanting to know is
more about, and I was also wanting to
know more about the cycle, where we are
right now in the cycle.
Okay.
Yeah, please continue.
So, I mean, Ricardo's principles underpin the mechanics
of the 18.6-year real estate cycle,
and that cycle repeats over nearly two decades,
okay?
So that's driven by land scarcity, speculative behavior,
(07:10):
and credit markets, and that cycle consists of
five key phases.
The first key phase is the expansion phase.
This is give or take around seven years.
Please keep this in mind, that this is
not a specific number, right?
18.6 years is not like the exact
number, but over the last 200 years or
so, every 18 years, you can see these
(07:30):
ebbs and flows, okay?
But the first expansion phase is seven years,
and this is what happens here.
We have a recovery from a downturn, right?
So the crisis fuels economic growth and investment,
and land and property values rise steadily as
the confidence returns.
And so connecting that to Ricardo's law of
economic rent, the productive potential of that undervalued
land is realized, which drives the increased demand
(07:53):
for development, okay?
So then we have a mid-cycle slowdown.
This is typically two to three years.
And during this period of time, external factors,
trade tensions, geopolitical risks, pandemics, temporarily slow the
growth, right?
And so development and transactions pause, creating a
cooling off period, right?
So then we move into the second expansion
phase, which is typically four to five years.
(08:14):
So we have rapid economic growth is resuming.
It's fueled by more speculative investment, increased credit
availability.
So land values are rising rapidly, and development
accelerates, often leading to oversupply.
Well, what did we see in Austin and
certain areas in California, and maybe not California,
sorry, Austin, but Phoenix, Arizona is the other
(08:34):
one that you can maybe point to, right?
That's four to five years, okay?
So then we move into what is called
the winner's curse, right, or the mania phase,
right?
And so that's kind of where I believe
we're at today.
So asset prices are peaking, driven by that
speculative frenzy and optimism.
We start to see a lot of oversupply.
We start to see rising interest rates, which
begin to reveal vulnerabilities, right?
(08:56):
And so Ricardo's connection to this would be
that landowners demand unsustainable rents, further detaching land
values from that productive capacity.
Finishing up the cycle about two to three
years is the contraction phase.
And in this is where the market correction
or recession reduces the land values and transaction
volume.
So underperforming assets face financial stress, speculative excesses
(09:18):
are flushed out, and the repricing of land
values bring back in line with productive potential,
creating opportunities for strategic investors.
So if you think about that, right, in
2007, we went through our last winner's curse
in 2007, right, the 2007 real estate peak
before the GFC perfectly illustrates Ricardo's theory and
(09:40):
the cycle in action.
We had speculative frenzy, land values skyrocketed as
easy credit and overconfidence fueled those speculative investments.
We had overpricing, right?
Landowners demanding excessive rents, leading to a misalignment
with productive use.
And then there was a correction, right?
So the subsequent crash reset land values and
exposed the inefficiencies of that speculative behavior.
(10:01):
Now we all know that the GFC was
a lot speculative on the financial side more
than anything, right?
But that credit flows is definitely a part
of the land values, right?
And so where we're at in 2025, I
mean, I think according to the 18.6
year real estate cycle we're currently in and
or potentially exiting the winner's curse phase, entering
(10:22):
the early stages of a contraction.
And I think Ricardo's principles highlight the speculative
overpricing that often defines this phase.
We've seen land values have surged due to
scarcity and the speculative activity in hot markets.
I just read yesterday that multifamily starts are
up 31%.
Ty, they're up 31% in the multifamily
starts.
So, I mean, we are right there.
(10:43):
Developers are gonna start facing higher costs.
We already seen that, right?
We have financing costs, we have construction costs,
we have labor costs.
We've got oversupply in some areas as well,
likely triggering to some corrections.
I don't know, you probably know this better
than me, but I've heard in certain parts
of Florida there's a lot of single family
homes that have been developed that might be
sitting out on the market, right?
And I'm just reading headlines there, Ty.
(11:04):
So, I'm not bashing Florida before we started.
I told Ty that I absolutely love Florida.
But when national developers come in and they
deliver 500, 1,000, 1,500 homes and
people can't pay for them, what happens, right?
They start to drop in those prices.
So, investors are beginning to recalibrate their expectations.
They're focusing on productive potential and sustainable returns.
(11:26):
So, I think we're right there in 2025,
we're gonna start to see, and we already
have, pricing go back up and to the
point where at some point in 2026, we're
gonna have a big correction and that's gonna
bring a big opportunity.
So, what I'm doing right now is positioning
my portfolio as well as consulting many other
owners on how to take advantage of this
(11:47):
winner's purse phase, right?
And so, that represents the peak of the
second expansion phase.
And the last time that we're in this
position was approximately 2007.
You guys can do the math on 18
years in regards to that.
So, that's a good framework, I believe, that
you can at least start to apply to
your portfolio type.
I appreciate all that, Logan, and the detail
of the stages and walking through the framework.
(12:09):
So, from where you think that we are
now, what are you doing different with your
portfolio and what are you instructing, excuse me,
those that you teach to do based on
where we are and where we're going?
Yeah, well, I think there's a lot of
different things to think about, right?
Well, first and foremost, I start with, hey,
and I just did this kind of portfolio
analysis for a couple of different clients.
And I said, look, when is your debt
(12:31):
coming due?
Let's start there, right?
Like, we need to understand when your debt
is coming due.
Is it in the next two years?
Is it in the next three years?
Because that is super important to understand when
you need to start making some changes due
to your portfolio.
So, I've given kind of this playbook for
real estate investors from 2024 all the way
to 2030, right?
(12:51):
So, 2024 to 2026, we're late cycle.
So, harvest your gains from land speculation, harvest
your gains from the asset prices appreciated, refinance
into fixed rate long-term debt, strengthen your
cashflow on your existing properties if you are
looking to hold those for a long time,
need to maintain liquidity for future buying opportunities,
(13:13):
right?
To get ready for this 2027 to 2030
correction phase where you can acquire distressed land
and real estate assets.
You can focus on essential sectors, right?
Housing, industrial, logistics, essential retail has proven to
be extremely successful.
I think a lot of folks are into
self-storage as well, right?
And so, that's kind of how I'm thinking
about how to position from 2024 to 2026,
(13:36):
getting ready for a next big buying opportunity
sometime late 26, early 27.
Logan, what do you see happens when people
ignore this?
Like, when people are not paying attention to
cycles, which most people aren't, man.
I mean, I have a lot of real
estate guys on here, investing guys, they're not
describing, they don't understand this the way that
you understand this.
So, like, what happens when you don't?
(13:57):
Like, what are the biggest risks that these
other investors are dealing with out there when
they're just so disconnected from even the understanding
that these cycles are there and let alone
what cycle we're in?
It's a great question, Ty.
And I would say this, man.
I mean, many times I hear, well, this
time is different.
Well, if you go read folks like Ray
Dalio, he was so surprised when the dollar
(14:19):
became off of the gold standard, right?
He thought the stock market was gonna drop,
that the world was going to end, financial
crisis was going to happen.
He showed up on the trade desk at
the trade floor that day and guess what
happened?
Stocks were through the roof, right?
Prices were through the roof.
And he looked at himself and said, oh
my gosh, this time is not different.
(14:40):
This has had to have happened in the
past.
So he went back and researched.
And now a quick break to hear from
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When this happened the last time in the
last 50 years, right, and now he's prepared,
right?
So I think that you have to first
and foremost get through that idea that this
time is different.
Whatever the administration is telling you, whatever other
(15:23):
investors are telling you, go back, find the
data, find the cycles, find the history and
what has happened in those periods of time.
Because I was talking to an investor the
other day and I said, look, to move
the big ship takes a long time.
You can't just turn it around, right?
And our global financial economy, right?
And our GDP, it takes a long time
(15:44):
to move that ship.
So you're going to have opportunities to see
things happen in the residential markets before you're
going to see it in the commercial, the
multifamily sectors, right?
Because those sectors take a little bit longer.
You also will see it in the stock
market before you will start to see the
things happen in the real estate market.
So there are ways and markers to be
(16:06):
thinking about and tracking on a regular basis
to say, man, it might be time to
really start to evaluate the portfolio.
I try to tell people like you need
to be evaluating your portfolio on a quarterly
basis regardless, talking to people like myself or
other folks in the industry that are trading
deals, they're in the market, they're in the
know on what's going on and have them
do analysis for you, right?
(16:27):
And find somebody who can say, all right,
there's a big demand for that type of
product type.
Your debt's coming due in the next 12
to 15 months.
We need to get a plan in place.
It might not be, hey, sell that deal
right now.
It might be, hey, that person that you've
had on month to month for the last
three years, it might be time to exit
them or get them on a 12 month
lease on a higher rate, right?
We need to start positioning this asset to
(16:48):
be able to sell with the highest net
operating income that you possibly can.
So I see a lot of people coasting
on their investments because everything's working right now.
But now if the market's going to change,
you need to have your foundations and your
fundamentals really strong.
It's the time to get your baseline and
your strength underneath you to be able to
(17:08):
weather the storm.
And that might be selling off some assets.
It might be creating some more liquidity.
It might be getting out of some of
your real estate or other investments at this
point so you can get ready for this
or refinancing some of that debt.
But just remember that this time is not
different.
This has happened many times in the past
and there is a lot of research and
a lot of data for us to go
(17:28):
and analyze to get ready for the next
downturn.
And just be, I think the answer is
like, you have to be willing to say
that this time is not different and it's
going to happen again.
It's just win and getting prepared for that.
Yeah, that's powerful.
What do you guys do at Live Free
Investments?
I know you invest obviously and you've done
a lot of investing successfully, but what other
(17:50):
options do you have to help other people
break into investing or further build their empire
in investing?
Absolutely.
I've got a brokerage called Midwest Commercial Real
Estate Advisors.
And we are advising over 25 clients right
now on dispositions.
We work with a lot of investors that
are doing 1031 exchanges, right?
They're selling a fourplex at a highly appreciated.
(18:11):
We're talking about, hey, let's look at your
return on equity.
Your fourplex in California is bringing in 3
,500, 4,500 per unit, right?
But guess what?
Your rents have not kept up with the
amount of appreciation that has happened on your
property.
So when you purchased it, you had a
good return on equity because you didn't have
much equity built up.
But now you've got 45, 50% appreciation
(18:33):
and the income that's coming on that property
does not keep up with the appreciation.
Your ROE is actually pretty low.
So how do we unlock that?
Well, we move it into somewhere in the
Midwest or some other market that you can
go get 15, 20, five different doors and
you can drastically increase that return on equity.
Or I have a lot of investors that
buy flex industrial properties, neighborhood retail shopping centers,
(18:56):
and we're advising them on how to do
that.
So lots of conversations going on in regards
to 1031 exchanges, as well as portfolio performance
audits.
What should I do with my portfolio?
Should I hold it?
Should I sell it?
Should I refinance it?
I'm gonna give you an objective view.
I don't need another listing, Ty.
I'll work on it, but like, I am
to the top with my capacity in regards
(19:18):
to the amount of deals that we are
working on.
So I'm trying to give true advice and
that has built a long-term relationship type
of situation where people come to me and
say, hey, I need your advice because I
know you're not just gonna go for a
listing and tell me to sell it, right?
And so we're trying to do that on
a regular basis.
That's pretty free.
I mean, I have a lot of folks
that say, man, you should really build a
(19:39):
consulting company, but I think it's more or
less better just to have the resources available
for folks so they can make informed decisions
and that when they get ready to make
a decision and actually make a move, they're
gonna call you.
And I build my business on that.
What about syndications?
You do stuff with joint ventures, syndications as
well.
Are those things?
And if so, how might that work?
(19:59):
Yeah, absolutely.
I've done over 25 different syndications across four
different states, spanning office, industrial, retail, multifamily.
And now doing a lot of land and
land development opportunities, bringing some ground up flex
industrial contractor garages out of the ground, building
some urban infill subdivisions, working with landowners on
(20:21):
how to capitalize on that front.
I would say this, syndications, you have to
ensure that you have a good long-term
plan.
I never took any floating rate debt on
any of our deals.
And so been doing those since 2018.
I have been quiet in regards to new
acquisitions.
And that's because I've been reading the tea
(20:42):
leaves here.
Asset price appreciation, why hasn't kept up?
There's a lot of speculation going on.
Debt prices have gone out.
That's really pushed me out of kind of
the acquisition of existing assets.
So I kind of repositioned myself to say,
hey, let me go learn this land.
Let me understand this, Ricardo's law of economic
rent.
And I have bought strategically some properties in
the line of infrastructure development.
(21:04):
And I have played Ricardo's law of economic
rent pretty well.
I've got a couple of properties that we
have bought that we knew the streetcar was
gonna be moving down right in front of
it.
And I've been able to sell those assets
at a much higher price because maybe the
multifamily property didn't have parking.
Well, now it has the streetcar that stops
right out front.
So you might not need as much parking
as you would have when we purchased that.
(21:25):
So I've been a little quiet on the
syndication side of things.
Just kind of getting ready, I would say,
for my next buying opportunity.
And I really do know Kansas City pretty
well and so I can get a pretty
good sense of where and when to really
make the next move.
But I just don't think it's yet.
What about commercial multifamily trends?
What are you finding in those areas that
(21:45):
investors you're seeing are ignoring that they really
should be paying more attention to?
Absolutely.
I mean, first and foremost, I think that
historic tax credits and opportunity zones are absolutely
a strategy people need to be revitalizing and
looking into.
We've been doing a lot of studying and
bringing some projects to market that have these
tax credits.
They have incentives, right?
(22:06):
And so I have been in so many
meetings with planning and zoning commissions and the
Finance and Economic Development Councils talking about how
do we partner public-private partnerships to make
these deals make sense?
What incentives are available?
We have a quasi-governmental agency here in
Kansas City called the Port Authority.
We've got the Economic Development Council.
If you're bringing new jobs into the market,
(22:27):
then you can go get certain incentives.
And where construction costs are, where labor costs
are, honestly, doing new projects, it takes incentives
to make those make sense.
So I think that's overlooked.
And it's a blue ocean strategy because many
investors aren't willing to spend the time to
figure out what it takes to get those
deals done.
And so if you are, if you are
(22:47):
willing to do what others won't, you will
be able to gather deals and create opportunities
that they're not going to, right?
Because everybody that calls me wants the 2000s
and newer vintage, 100 plus units in a
great area.
I hear class B property in a class
A area.
Like that competition is very high, right?
So you're going to have to pay for
(23:08):
that.
So what I'm advising is more creative deal
structures.
Can we get the landowner?
Can we get the property owner to contribute
the property to a project?
We bring capital to the deal or the
new buyer brings capital to the deal.
We structure a joint venture.
We make that asset worth more.
And after three years, we're going to be
able to stabilize and sell that deal.
Right?
And so doing a lot more creative deal
structures right now and being willing to ask
(23:30):
those questions I think is really important.
Seller financing, also a great opportunity right now
for properties that have been owned with sellers
for a very long time.
Do not ignore seller financing on that front.
On the commercial side, one thing that's got
me most excited right now, well, two things
is Flex Industrial.
Flex product in Kansas City has not been
developed in the last five to 10 years.
(23:51):
We have very big logistic hubs going in,
500,000 square feet, a million square feet.
But if you look at the trend of
on-shoring and near-shoring jobs in the
manufacturing logistics space, in 2011, we had about
11,000, sorry, 2015, we had about 11
,000 jobs on-shore or near-shore.
You fast forward to 2023, 357,000 jobs
(24:15):
on-shore or near-shore to the North
America and to the United States.
That is a huge tailwind for you to
go capitalize on.
How do you capitalize on it?
Well, those people, they need those service vendors,
those contractors, they need places for their businesses.
And so what's been developed is big logistic
hubs.
What hasn't been developed is anything under 10
(24:36):
,000 square feet.
So if you can find a building and
you can retrofit that, or you can take
a 50,000 square foot building and chunk
it down to five tens, you are going
to get top of the market rents.
If you can bring 14 foot doors and
16 foot ceilings, 18 foot ceilings and bring
some technology into those buildings, you are going
to have tenants lining up and leasing that
(24:56):
product up.
We're doing that on a regular basis for
many different clients right now as well.
The other piece that I would say is
very interesting is data centers.
And if you are an investor and you
understand transmission and powers and distribution and utility
companies, huge goldmine right now is if you
can find land zoned for data centers, and
(25:19):
you can work with utility companies to bring
power to that site, you will be able
to get paid handsomely to doing those types
of deals.
And so those two areas on the commercial
side that got me most excited right now.
What do you think investors should be doing
right now?
Stay ahead of the game.
I mean, you've given a pretty clear outlook
of what's to happen and you should be
conserving resources and preparing to take advantage of
(25:39):
the opportunities that are about to come.
We all know the opportunities like in 2007,
six, eight in that timeframe that was there.
And we always say that in every downturn
or every negative, there's all this opportunity.
And so what are you doing?
Like, what do you advise investors?
What should investors be doing right now to
make the moves, to prepare themselves, I think
with the liquidity they're going to need to
(26:00):
take advantage of what's to come.
Man, you got to get into your portfolio
right now.
You got to get into the books.
I mean, I'm working with so many owners
for the last two to three years, they've
just been coasting.
They'll send me financials, I'll review it.
And I'm saying, hey guys, you're saying you're
in a wise 350.
I'm seeing 125, what's going on?
And they go in there and they're saying,
oh my gosh, we have not done these
(26:21):
CAM reconciliations right for the last three years.
Get into your portfolio, call your asset managers,
call your property managers, review your books, get
in there.
What opportunities do you see?
What's the weighted average lease term on your
deals right now?
Do you need to be restructuring leases?
When is your debt coming due?
Can you refinance?
(26:41):
Are you going to have to do a
cash in refinance?
Talk to lenders, get ready for that.
What deals can you sell right now to
create some liquidity on the properties that you
want to hold or you want to go
acquire?
Those are the things that I would be
advising people to do.
And that takes a lot of time.
It takes a lot of work and it's
a lot of detail oriented or find somebody
like myself that's willing to do that work
(27:03):
with you to make sure that you get
your portfolio ready.
There's many people out there and great resources
in the commercial real estate space that can
help you do that.
I love it.
Logan, thanks for coming on with us today.
There's a lot of people out there that
want to learn more, want to learn more
about following what you're teaching and then also
want to check out the different opportunities they
have to get involved with you with real
(27:24):
estate investing to be able to help their
portfolio or even launch to begin with.
So where should they go?
What should they do?
Yeah, I mean, thank you, Ty.
I appreciate that.
I'm super active on LinkedIn.
You can follow me there, Logan Freeman, the
Kansas City commercial real estate guy.
I will pop up.
I have been on there for nine to
10 years, posting daily, trying to add value.
Over 33,000 followers now.
(27:45):
I've got a newsletter there that I post
all of these insights.
I write articles about the 18.6 year
real estate cycle.
I give market reports on the Midwest, on
Kansas City, on what's going on, what I'm
seeing.
All of the opportunities that we have as
a team are going to be pitched there
on LinkedIn and everything's on our website as
well, mwcreadvisors.com.
(28:07):
You can find everything there and I'm very
accessible.
You can find me.
I appreciate that.
All right.
Thank you very much for coming on this
day.
I appreciate it.
Thanks for having me, Ty.
All right.
So listen, if you're watching this, one thing
you could do right now is go to
livefreeinvestments.com.
If you go to livefreeinvestments.com, Logan had
mentioned his LinkedIn social media channels are right
on the top right of the page.
So if you go to the page, you're
(28:28):
able to find the social media channels right
there.
Logan's got a great podcast as well that
I think you're going to love.
You're able to access his podcast there.
You're also able to access other resources as
well.
And there's a lot of information about how
you can get involved into real estate investing
and the type of things that they could
do to help you get involved.
So it all happens in one place.
That's livefreeinvestments.com.
Make sure you check it out today.
And again, take less than a minute because
(28:49):
as you can see how knowledgeable he is
about real estate cycles, something you've probably never
heard of this depth of knowledge.
So it takes less than a minute at
the top right of his page, just to
follow him on his social channels, including LinkedIn,
to get the real up-to-date information.
So make sure you do that while you're
at livefreeinvestments.com.
Thanks for tuning in.
Take care.
Have a great day.
(29:15):
You've been listening to The Business Credit and
Financing Show with your host, Ty Crandall.
Watch for our next episode to get even
more insight on financing and growing your business.
And don't forget to check us out online
at creditsuite.com for even more business growth
strategies.
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