May 14, 2025 • 29 mins
In this vulnerable and hope-filled episode, we’re joined by writer, speaker, and mentor Michelle Konson, who shares how the pain and mess of our past can show up in our present—especially in parenting. Michelle opens up about her own journey of unraveling, the toll it took on her relationships, and the invitation God extends to all of us: to enter our stories, do the work of healing, and experience redemption—not just for ourselves, but for our children too.
If you’ve ever felt like you’ve messed up too much or missed your chance to be the parent you hoped to be, this conversation is a gentle, powerful reminder that it’s not too late.
Key Takeaways:
- How naming your pain can lead to true healing
- Why it’s never too late for redemption in your story
- Insight into how perfectionism can be a survival response
- The importance of doing story work in safe, supportive community
- Encouragement to honor your past so you can walk in freedom
Connect with Michelle: Website| Instagram
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:13):
Hey there. Welcome to theCollide Podcast. This is Willow Weston,
and I am so excited to handyou this interview I just had with
Michelle Konson. She's awriter, speaker, and mentor, and
she has a huge heart forencouraging moms who feel like they've
(00:36):
messed up and who wonder if.If it's too late for redemption.
And I just love her heart. Ilove her story. I love the way she
thinks. And I think it willbless you, Mama. Whether you feel
like you've messed up amillion times or just one time or
(01:00):
with the whole darn thing, shewill invite you to something much
d
Thanks, Willow. I'm so excitedto be here.
Where are you signing in from?
I'm signing in from NorthernVirginia. So in the Washington, D.C.
metro area. Yep. We've beenhere for about 16 years.
I love it. We are so far apartfrom each other.
(01:21):
It's amazing.
It's good to be with you. I'veread up on you, I've read your story,
and I have so many things Iwant to ask you. It sounds like you
have this huge heart for momswho feel like they've messed up.
And I just want to start rightthere and say, where did you get
this heart? What gave you this passion?
(01:43):
I think because I am one ofthose moms, and I lived in that place
for so long and thought I wasalone. And once I realized that I
wasn't alone, that there werepeople around me that could help
me, it was like a lifeline.And I long to give that lifeline
to as many women as I can. Ithink we all feel like we failed
(02:05):
in some way in our parenting.And I think we often think that parenting
is a one and done event andthat if we failed, it's over. We
failed at class, and we justneed to move on with that in the
rearview mirror. And I don'tthink that that's true. I think that
God provides us theopportunity for restoration and for
(02:25):
redemption and for hope. And Iwant to let as many people know that
as possible, because I'veexperienced it, am still experiencing
it, and I know that it's possible.
Can you invite us into yourown experience as a mom where you
had a moment or moments or aseason where you feel like you messed
up and it felt like it was too late?
(02:47):
Yeah. So I have four children,and three of them are. I've already
left the home. I have onedaughter left living with us at home.
And, you know, I've startedworking through my story about 12
years ago, but, you know, ittakes a long time. And by the time
I realized some of the reallybig mistakes I'd made, you know,
my older kids were leavinghome and I felt like they'd left.
(03:11):
And my primary responsibilitywas those 18 years while they were
at home and they left and Imessed up. And I think I started
realizing that one of the bigways I harmed my children was through
not letting them feel theirfeelings. And I think that comes
from I've learned me not beingable to feel my feelings as a child.
(03:32):
And so I didn't know how tolet them do that right. And so I
constantly tried to minimizeor to contain their feelings. And
in so doing, I think I reallywounded them because I didn't give
them the opportunity to bereally sad, really mad, really joyful.
I didn't really know what todo with those feelings. And as I
(03:54):
realized what I had done andas I had people meet me where I was
at and start helping meprocess my feelings, I was then able
to go back and to say, I am sosorry that I was not able to let
you feel your feelings. Iconstantly had to manage them and
control them because I feltlike I was unsafe and I felt like
(04:16):
I was in territory that Icouldn't handle. And through doing
that, through going back, it'sreally given me the opportunity to
be able to do it over and overagain and to keep going back and
saying, oh, yeah, I rememberwhen that happened. I'm so sorry
that I did that, or for themto now come to me and say, when you
do that, that really remindsme of this. Or you're not really
(04:38):
listening to me, or I didn'tfeel like you're letting me feel
what I'm feeling, or you'reinvalidating what I'm feeling. So,
yeah, that was one of the bigways that I realized that I'd really
wounded my kids.
This is so huge because a lotof times, not only do we not realize
what we're doing in parenting,but then when we have this wake up
(05:01):
call and we realize, oh, no,for example, I'm dismissing my own
children's emotions, thereseems to be another sort of epiphany
that happens where we realize,oh, I'm doing that because that's
how I was taught to deal withpain. And that's what you're describing.
(05:21):
When you go back and rewind,what were you taught? Like, when
you had big emotions and bigfeelings. What were you invited to
do with your emotions?
So I grew up in a family witha very dominant dad. And my father
had lost his dad when he was 6and his first wife when she was really
(05:43):
young. And I don't believe heever really dealt with that grief.
And so that grief just cameout sideways to all of us in my family.
And so I had a dad who Ibelieve ultimately was a narcissist,
and, you know, gaslit all ofus in our family by letting us know
that our reality wasn't reallywhat was going on and that it was
(06:03):
the story that he was tellingus that was happening. And so that's
a very confusing place to growup, right? To feel one thing in your
body and to be told, no,that's not actually what's happening.
Right. So I feel like I wassilenced over years and years through
my dad's actions andinteractions in our family. And I
also realized that my emotionswere not safe. Right. There was no
(06:26):
one to hear that I was reallyscared when he yelled at my mom,
that I was really sad when Isaw my mom crying. And my mom was
dealing with her own grief andher own sadness and just trying to
survive. And so there wasreally no room for me to feel any
emotions. So I learned, on theone hand, to silence whatever I was
(06:51):
feeling in my body. And on theother hand, there was nowhere for
me to go. And so I was left tojust deal with them on my own. And
that meant as a child, that Ihad to really invoke some survival
strategies of trying to onlycontrol my little world that was
around me, because I knew Ihad no control over what was beyond
(07:12):
that. You know, not sharingwhat I was feeling, not even knowing
what I was feeling after awhile because it was too dangerous
or it didn't really matter.Like, it wouldn't avail anything
if I did feel sad or mad. So,yeah, so that was some of the ways
that I learned as a child, orrather didn't learn to deal with
my emotions or to let myemotions out in some way.
(07:35):
And then how did you seeyourself repeating history with your
own kids? What were some. Somemoments where you were like, oh,
I'm doing to them. I'mteaching them to deal with their
emotions in the same way thatI was invited to.
So I think that realizationonly came much later, right after
I had started going through mystory and started realizing what
(07:56):
had happened to me. Thatrealization came quite a bit later
on. Oh, wait a minute. Like, Iam processing this pattern from my
childhood. And look, I'm doingthe same thing. And, you know, I
have three girls and a boy.And, you know, teenage girls can
tend to have very bigemotions. I think it's a rite of
(08:19):
passage. And I, you know, Iwould. I would berate my. My girls
especially and be, you know,when they have those big emotions
and be like, you are wayoverreacting right now. What you're
feeling right now doesn'tcompare to the emotion that I'm seeing,
right? So there are peoplestarving and there are people dying,
(08:40):
and that's where this level ofemotion is appropriate. Not right
now. I mean, I said thosewords. They're horrible. Now that
I, you know, say them again.And I think about the fact that I
said them many times. But, youknow, I think looking back, you know,
there was pushback. And as amom, you're trying to, you know,
extend your authority and, youknow, not have your kids disrespect
(09:01):
you. And there's just. There'sjust so much in that battle. But
I think, you know, when Istarted looking back, I was like,
oh, man, I. I did the samething. I did it differently, right?
I. I thought I was doing abetter job, right. I went into parenting
thinking I was going to do abetter job. Don't we all, right?
We all feel like I'm going todo it better, I'm going to do it
(09:21):
right? I' going to make thesame mistakes. And then they just
look different, right? Theyare. A lot of them are very similar
mistakes. They just look verydifferent. And so, yeah, was able
to then, you know, afterhaving my kids tell me that over
and over again, having me workon my story, and then eventually
realizing I did this too. AndI feel like my children in some ways
(09:44):
were like a Nathan to David,right? Where David was not able to
see what he had done, butNathan needed to help him open his
eyes. It took a long time,right. My kids had to be very patient
with me and still do, becauseI'm a real work in progress.
Aren't we all? Let's talkabout this for a minute, because
(10:06):
you've mentioned it a fewtimes, and I'm not sure that people
understand what story work isunless they've actually done it.
I know what you're referringto, but these realizations you were
having were happening intherapy. Is that what was happening?
Can you tell us a little bitabout that? Because I think that'll
be helpful for peoplelistening to understand what story
(10:29):
work is and how impactful it is.
Yeah. So Story work really isa type of therapy that started coming
together, I would say, in theearly 2000s from my understanding.
Dan Allender from the Allendercenter was really instrumental in
starting this movement andthis body of work. And basically,
(10:53):
story work is looking at yourpast, especially your formative childhood
years, and looking at yourwoundings there and how they affect
your present and your future,and especially how you relate in
relationships. And I would saythat a lot of what my work was done
(11:14):
with therapists, but I alsoattended story workshops through
the Allender Center. I read alot of books. I, you know, spoke
with wise mentors. I was in acouple of groups that were working
on story work together. I'mcurrently and have been for the last
four years in a confessionalcommunity with the center for Being
(11:38):
Known with Kurt Thompson. Andso, you know, story work has looked
different for me, but I wouldsay a lot of my work was done with
very wise, compassionateChristian counselors.
Yeah, I mean, I'm a huge fanof going back to the origin of the
pain or the trauma andinviting God to go back there. When
(12:01):
you talk about the story workthat you did, how did you experience
Jesus coming with you backinto your story in bringing healing?
So I don't know that I couldhave done the work that I've done
and continue to do the workthat I've done on my story without
him being with me. I havefound Jesus to be incredibly compassionate
(12:24):
and kind. And I think that'sone of the things that we really
miss when we look back at ourpast. I think we often look back
at our past with a lot ofcontempt and judgment and shame,
and doing those things doesn'treally help us to look for the redemptive
story right in our past. Butwhen we're able to look back on ourselves
(12:47):
as younger children and thebattles that we had to face as those
young children, and we're ableto actually be compassionate to those
young children. I believethat's where the healing starts.
But in order for us to dothat, I really think it's vital that
we are experiencing and knowthe Lord's compassion and kindness
towards us in that journey.And we know that he's patient with
(13:13):
us, too. He doesn't just say,oh, you want to look back and dump
our whole history on us.Right. We'd never be able to contain
that. So he's been reallypatient in the way that I feel like
layers and layers keepinguncovered and parts of my story keeping
revealed. And I think we'll dothis work till we die and go meet
him face to face. But yeah, Ifound him to be incredibly kind and
(13:35):
compassionate. And also, youknow, I believe, you know, Jesus
says that the truth will setus free. And I believe that the Lord
wants healing and freedom forus, and so he really wants us to
find the truth. And once wefinally are able to see that truth
and start grieving the lossesthat we had from our childhood years
(13:58):
with compassion and kindnessand patience and gentleness, I believe
that really is the start ofour healing Shop with a purpose.
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apparel and more at storeWecollide.net it's really interesting,
Michelle. I've done some ofthis similar work as you in my own
(14:43):
life, and it's been incrediblyhealing for me inviting Jesus to
go back to the painful placesin my childhood, and his compassion
has met me there. So I lovethat you're bringing that word up.
How do you think for youpersonally experiencing Jesus compassion
when you returned back to theorigin of moments of pain that you
(15:05):
experienced as a childhood,how do you think that gave you compassion
to then be able to go andapologize to your children for the
pain you caused them?
I mean, I think it was vital,you know, without that, like I said,
I think that we sit in a lotof the shame and the guilt and the
(15:25):
regret, right? And we saythings like, you're never going to
get better. You're just a badmom. You know, this was always going
to be your path. You're notworthy of getting better. We tell
ourselves those lies, right?And I think without compassion, we
are not able to stop those oldlies and that narrative that the
(15:49):
enemy wants us to stay in,right? But once I think we're able
to start seeing the Lord'scompassion towards us and we start
experiencing some of thathealing by looking at that young
child and actually reallyunderstanding, oh, it makes so much
sense that you were like that.It makes so much sense that you had
to develop those survivalstrategies and that that's the way
(16:09):
you're parenting right now,right? Once we're able to see that,
I believe it gives us thefreedom to then go back to our kids.
Because I'm not actuallyneeding to be defensive anymore.
I'm not having to defend, oh,I'm not a bad mom, or I'm not a mistake,
or I'm not irreparably broken,right? I'm a mom who made a mistake.
(16:30):
I made lots of mistakes. ButJesus has forgiven me. And because
he's forgiven me, I'm allowedto come to you now, and I can ask
you for forgiveness, right?Because I know that he's forgiven
me and it's okay. And I reallyhope and pray that you will forgive
me, too. But I can do this nowbecause I know that I'm not the baddie
(16:51):
here. And there is hope for meand there's freedom for me here.
What have those moments doneto change your relationship with
your kids? Those moments whereyou've gone to them and owned up
to the ways you've messed up?
You know, I don't want to givethe impression that you just tie
a nice neat bow by going backto your kids once or twice, and then
(17:12):
everything is forgiven andeverything's great and you have a
perfect relationship. Becausethat's not reality. That's not true.
I will say it's somethingthat's been happening over years
as I have changed. I'm then adifferent person with them. And like
I said, I think it's going tocontinue for years and years until
I'm not here anymore to keepdoing that. But by constantly going
(17:38):
back and being different andresponding differently and letting
them know that you see themand that you were blinded for a long
time, I think it startsopening the doors for more honest
and authentic communication.Right? So where I was unsafe in the
past because I wouldn't reallylisten to what they were feeling,
(17:58):
right? That's not very safe.Like, I'm sad or mad mom, and you're
not listening to me. You'renot even validating that I'm feeling
this by now going back overand over again and saying, I'm really
sorry. Will you forgive me forwhat I did? Or in a conversation,
I can be like, oh, I canrecognize what I'm doing now. Let
me pause for a minute and letme redirect. By doing that over and
(18:21):
over again, I think it startsmaking you a safer person, which
you should be in thebeginning, right? But some of us
weren't. And so I think itmakes you a safer person. And then
that, in turn allows mychildren to then start coming to
me and start telling me hardthings that I've done that they've
done. You know, I've had someof my kids start Coming back to me
(18:43):
and saying, you know, when Idid this, I did it because of xyz,
and I am so sorry. So, youknow, I'm starting to see just, you
know, the relationshipschange. They're looking different.
And again, it's not a neatlittle bow. They weren't changed
overnight. It's a long, slowprocess, but it's happening and it's
(19:07):
real, and I'm really gratefulfor it.
That's beautiful. I love thatyou're experiencing that when you
think about moms listening,because I know there are some who
are like, oh, man, I've eithermessed up big time or I'm messing
up consistently, and it justfeels like it's too late. What's
some practical advice that youhave for them to move out of this
(19:30):
stuck place where they feellike they can't get grounding, to
sort of make up for their wrongs?
So I think for a long time,you know, when I found myself in
that place, I tried to fix thesituation with external measures,
right? So read everything Icould on patience and how to be kind
(19:52):
to your kids and, you know,all the books, right. On how to be
a good Christian mom. Right.Listen to all the podcasts. And so
I think I was. What I wastrying to do was I was trying to
change my behavior, right? Iwas trying to put this band aid on
the scaping wound of mywounds, right. Of my childhood wounds
(20:12):
and thinking that these bandaids and these fixes, these little
exterior behaviormodifications would. Would do it.
Right? And of course, theycontinue to fail over and over again.
And as they failed over andover again, I felt like a worse and
worse mom, right? Like, oh, Ican't be more patient. I can't be
more kind. I really am just alost cause. I'm never going to get
better at this. But I thinkthe key came when I realized that
(20:35):
I needed to look at my heartand I needed to look at my past and
my healing. And Adam Youngsays these words. I love them. He
says, the point of engagingyour past is so that you can actually
live in the present. Until youengage your past and your story,
you're actually living as muchin the past as you are in the present.
And those words are just soconvicting and I think, so true,
(20:58):
Right? And so I think for momslistening who feel like they've blown
it, I would say stop trying tofix it from the outside. It's not
going to work. And I'm sureyou've tried it. But I would say
there is a Reason you'reacting the way you're acting. And
it's a scary place, right?Because we covered those wounds up
and we numbed those feelingswhen we were young because they were
(21:21):
hard. There's a reason wecovered up that pain. No one wants
to willingly go back and workon their pain, but I think that's
what's necessary. I thinkthat's the path to healing. And so
I would say, you know, sitdown with someone you trust. Maybe
if you have a Christiancounselor that you can meet with,
just start the conversationand see where you can go. But I would
(21:42):
say start looking at wherethis behavior is coming from, because
I can almost guarantee youthat it's coming from a place of
wounding. And until you dealwith that wounding and until you
start healing, your externalbehavior is not going to change.
But also that it's never toolate. You can do this at any point
(22:03):
and you can start reaping the benefits.
I so agree with you. And myfollow up question to that is, what
took you as long as it tookyou to finally start dealing with
it? Was it that you didn'tthink you had wounds? Was it that
you were avoiding them and youknew you did? Because I think a listener,
(22:26):
there might be peoplelistening who have a variety of reasons
for why they're not doing thework you just invited us into. So
why did you wait as long asyou did to start doing the work on
the inside?
Yeah. So like I mentionedearlier, one of my survival strategies
(22:47):
was control, right? And so Ifelt like as long as I can control,
could control my little world,I was going to be okay. And when
you're younger, that littleworld is pretty small, right. And
as I got older, that worldbecame my husband and then my children.
And when children are young,they're easier to control. But those
children kept growing, right?And those of us who, those of us
(23:08):
who are parents know that wereally can't control anything and
we're really not in control ofanything. Right. As much as we think
we are. And so I think I wastrying so hard to control everything
and keep it neat and tidy andunder wraps and just, you know, as
long as this looked okay, thenwe were okay. Because, you know,
(23:29):
again, that's one of thethings I grew up with too. Right.
You kept external peace aslong as everything was quiet, there
was no fighting, everythingwas okay. Even though inside, you
know, there was completeturmoil and chaos and dysfunction.
And so I think I needed to getto the point where I absolutely realized
(23:49):
I was not in control anymore.And I was about to fall off a cliff.
And so for me, that's thepoint I got to. And I would love
for people not to have to getto that point to let them know there
is a way. Right. And so I gotto that point and, you know, out
of pure desperation, reachedout for help. And, you know, I will
say, too, because I think thismight be relevant for some listeners,
(24:10):
the act of asking for help canalso be an area of wounding and is
for a lot of us. Right.Because as kids, we reach out for
help a lot. And when we don'tget it, we start to learn that reaching
out for help doesn't reallywork. Right. No one's heard me. So
why is that going to change?Right. So you stop asking for help.
And so the act of then saying,I'm going to ask for help again when
(24:34):
I'm at my most vulnerablefeels like a huge step. But I would
really love to invite anylisteners that are listening that
find themselves in that place,close to that place, or feel like
they're heading in thatdirection to reach out for help,
because we can't do this workalone. I tried for a long time. It
(24:56):
doesn't work. And, you know,there's so much research out now,
especially that Dr. Thompson'sdoing on, you know, how we literally
rewire our brains by tellingour story to an empathetic listener
and seeing it mirrored back ontheir faces and in their responses.
And so I believe that we aremade to do this work with other people.
(25:18):
We cannot do this work alone.It's too hard. You know, we were
created by a triune God whothere's connection between the Father,
Son and the Holy Spiritalways. None of them are alone. And
so we were created in hisimage. And we're not meant to do
this work alone. So I wouldreally encourage you to reach out
for help earlier than when youfeel like you're falling off a cliff
(25:41):
or if you're feeling likeyou're falling off a cliff or you've
already fallen off the cliff,it's okay. You can still reach out
for help.
Absolutely. And I mean, I'mgoing to remind listeners we have
counseling resources andmental health therapists around here
and ways that we can help youget help. So you can email us at
(26:02):
info@wecollide.net if you'refeeling like you need help. That's
why we're here. That is whywe're here.
I love that.
I would love to hear,Michelle, before we hear how people
can connect with you and allthat you're doing. What's your final
word and hope for moms whofeel like it's too late to heal their
(26:22):
parenting?
That it's not too late, eventhough it feels like it, and even
though the world might tellyou it's too late, and even though
you might have done someterrible things right, even though
your mothering journey mighthave looked really bad, even if you
abandoned your kids, neglectedyour kids, there is forgiveness in
(26:43):
Christ. And if God can forgiveus, then we need to be able to forgive
ourselves and seek thatforgiveness with our children. It
is never too late. That's thegospel story. It's never too late.
There is always hope. And Ibelieve that we can pursue healing.
And I will also say thatpursuing healing and freedom doesn't
(27:07):
necessarily have to look likereconciliation with your children
or with other family members.We hope that it does and it often
does. But even if it doesn't,I don't think that should be a barrier
to you pursuing healing andwholeness. Because we find that with
the Lord ultimately and, youknow, then we follow his lead for,
(27:28):
you know, where he would takeus. And we are, again, not in control
of other people's responses.But just because they haven't responded
in a certain way doesn't meanthat we aren't doing the hard work,
that we aren't pursuingothers, and that we aren't looking
for hope and healing and redemption.
I appreciate all that you'veshared with us today, and I know
(27:48):
that there's going to be womenwho want to connect with you and
follow along on your journey.How can they do that?
Yeah, you can follow me on mywebsite michellekonson.com or I'm
on Instagram or Facebook. JustMichelle Konson and I would love
to connect with anybody who ison this journey wants to start this
journey. Happy for you toreach out, answer any questions,
(28:11):
to give you any resources Ihave. I have a great list of resources
if you want to start the storywork journey, some books and podcasts
and websites for you to lookat. But I would really just say it
is a hard journey, but it'sincredibly worth it and worthwhile.
And yeah, I think it's veryakin to the narrow road that Jesus
(28:34):
calls us to. It's not easy,but it's totally worth it.
Thank you for reminding usit's not too late.
Absolutely, friend.
I hope that this conversationwith Michelle Konson encouraged you
and if you know it'llencourage another mama, will you
just share it? Just send itoff and encourage another mom. Right
(28:59):
now. All it takes is the pressof a button, and next thing you know,
she can be encouraged withyou. I absolutely love Michelle ending
that interview by reminding usthat isn't the gospel story about
the fact that it's never toolate. Man, I'm going to chew on that
(29:20):
all week. Keep colliding,friend, and we'll catch you next
week.
Hey there. Welcome to theCollide Podcast. This is Willow Weston,
and I am so excited to handyou this interview I just had with
Michelle Konson. She's awriter, speaker, and mentor, and
she has a huge heart forencouraging moms who feel like they've
(00:36):
messed up and who wonder if.If it's too late for redemption.
And I just love her heart. Ilove her story. I love the way she
thinks. And I think it willbless you, Mama. Whether you feel
like you've messed up amillion times or just one time or
(01:00):
with the whole darn thing, shewill invite you to something much
d
Thanks, Willow. I'm so excitedto be here.
Where are you signing in from?
I'm signing in from NorthernVirginia. So in the Washington, D.C.
metro area. Yep. We've beenhere for about 16 years.
I love it. We are so far apartfrom each other.
(01:21):
It's amazing.
It's good to be with you. I'veread up on you, I've read your story,
and I have so many things Iwant to ask you. It sounds like you
have this huge heart for momswho feel like they've messed up.
And I just want to start rightthere and say, where did you get
this heart? What gave you this passion?
(01:43):
I think because I am one ofthose moms, and I lived in that place
for so long and thought I wasalone. And once I realized that I
wasn't alone, that there werepeople around me that could help
me, it was like a lifeline.And I long to give that lifeline
to as many women as I can. Ithink we all feel like we failed
(02:05):
in some way in our parenting.And I think we often think that parenting
is a one and done event andthat if we failed, it's over. We
failed at class, and we justneed to move on with that in the
rearview mirror. And I don'tthink that that's true. I think that
God provides us theopportunity for restoration and for
(02:25):
redemption and for hope. And Iwant to let as many people know that
as possible, because I'veexperienced it, am still experiencing
it, and I know that it's possible.
Can you invite us into yourown experience as a mom where you
had a moment or moments or aseason where you feel like you messed
up and it felt like it was too late?
(02:47):
Yeah. So I have four children,and three of them are. I've already
left the home. I have onedaughter left living with us at home.
And, you know, I've startedworking through my story about 12
years ago, but, you know, ittakes a long time. And by the time
I realized some of the reallybig mistakes I'd made, you know,
my older kids were leavinghome and I felt like they'd left.
(03:11):
And my primary responsibilitywas those 18 years while they were
at home and they left and Imessed up. And I think I started
realizing that one of the bigways I harmed my children was through
not letting them feel theirfeelings. And I think that comes
from I've learned me not beingable to feel my feelings as a child.
(03:32):
And so I didn't know how tolet them do that right. And so I
constantly tried to minimizeor to contain their feelings. And
in so doing, I think I reallywounded them because I didn't give
them the opportunity to bereally sad, really mad, really joyful.
I didn't really know what todo with those feelings. And as I
(03:54):
realized what I had done andas I had people meet me where I was
at and start helping meprocess my feelings, I was then able
to go back and to say, I am sosorry that I was not able to let
you feel your feelings. Iconstantly had to manage them and
control them because I feltlike I was unsafe and I felt like
(04:16):
I was in territory that Icouldn't handle. And through doing
that, through going back, it'sreally given me the opportunity to
be able to do it over and overagain and to keep going back and
saying, oh, yeah, I rememberwhen that happened. I'm so sorry
that I did that, or for themto now come to me and say, when you
do that, that really remindsme of this. Or you're not really
(04:38):
listening to me, or I didn'tfeel like you're letting me feel
what I'm feeling, or you'reinvalidating what I'm feeling. So,
yeah, that was one of the bigways that I realized that I'd really
wounded my kids.
This is so huge because a lotof times, not only do we not realize
what we're doing in parenting,but then when we have this wake up
(05:01):
call and we realize, oh, no,for example, I'm dismissing my own
children's emotions, thereseems to be another sort of epiphany
that happens where we realize,oh, I'm doing that because that's
how I was taught to deal withpain. And that's what you're describing.
(05:21):
When you go back and rewind,what were you taught? Like, when
you had big emotions and bigfeelings. What were you invited to
do with your emotions?
So I grew up in a family witha very dominant dad. And my father
had lost his dad when he was 6and his first wife when she was really
(05:43):
young. And I don't believe heever really dealt with that grief.
And so that grief just cameout sideways to all of us in my family.
And so I had a dad who Ibelieve ultimately was a narcissist,
and, you know, gaslit all ofus in our family by letting us know
that our reality wasn't reallywhat was going on and that it was
(06:03):
the story that he was tellingus that was happening. And so that's
a very confusing place to growup, right? To feel one thing in your
body and to be told, no,that's not actually what's happening.
Right. So I feel like I wassilenced over years and years through
my dad's actions andinteractions in our family. And I
also realized that my emotionswere not safe. Right. There was no
(06:26):
one to hear that I was reallyscared when he yelled at my mom,
that I was really sad when Isaw my mom crying. And my mom was
dealing with her own grief andher own sadness and just trying to
survive. And so there wasreally no room for me to feel any
emotions. So I learned, on theone hand, to silence whatever I was
(06:51):
feeling in my body. And on theother hand, there was nowhere for
me to go. And so I was left tojust deal with them on my own. And
that meant as a child, that Ihad to really invoke some survival
strategies of trying to onlycontrol my little world that was
around me, because I knew Ihad no control over what was beyond
(07:12):
that. You know, not sharingwhat I was feeling, not even knowing
what I was feeling after awhile because it was too dangerous
or it didn't really matter.Like, it wouldn't avail anything
if I did feel sad or mad. So,yeah, so that was some of the ways
that I learned as a child, orrather didn't learn to deal with
my emotions or to let myemotions out in some way.
(07:35):
And then how did you seeyourself repeating history with your
own kids? What were some. Somemoments where you were like, oh,
I'm doing to them. I'mteaching them to deal with their
emotions in the same way thatI was invited to.
So I think that realizationonly came much later, right after
I had started going through mystory and started realizing what
(07:56):
had happened to me. Thatrealization came quite a bit later
on. Oh, wait a minute. Like, Iam processing this pattern from my
childhood. And look, I'm doingthe same thing. And, you know, I
have three girls and a boy.And, you know, teenage girls can
tend to have very bigemotions. I think it's a rite of
(08:19):
passage. And I, you know, Iwould. I would berate my. My girls
especially and be, you know,when they have those big emotions
and be like, you are wayoverreacting right now. What you're
feeling right now doesn'tcompare to the emotion that I'm seeing,
right? So there are peoplestarving and there are people dying,
(08:40):
and that's where this level ofemotion is appropriate. Not right
now. I mean, I said thosewords. They're horrible. Now that
I, you know, say them again.And I think about the fact that I
said them many times. But, youknow, I think looking back, you know,
there was pushback. And as amom, you're trying to, you know,
extend your authority and, youknow, not have your kids disrespect
(09:01):
you. And there's just. There'sjust so much in that battle. But
I think, you know, when Istarted looking back, I was like,
oh, man, I. I did the samething. I did it differently, right?
I. I thought I was doing abetter job, right. I went into parenting
thinking I was going to do abetter job. Don't we all, right?
We all feel like I'm going todo it better, I'm going to do it
(09:21):
right? I' going to make thesame mistakes. And then they just
look different, right? Theyare. A lot of them are very similar
mistakes. They just look verydifferent. And so, yeah, was able
to then, you know, afterhaving my kids tell me that over
and over again, having me workon my story, and then eventually
realizing I did this too. AndI feel like my children in some ways
(09:44):
were like a Nathan to David,right? Where David was not able to
see what he had done, butNathan needed to help him open his
eyes. It took a long time,right. My kids had to be very patient
with me and still do, becauseI'm a real work in progress.
Aren't we all? Let's talkabout this for a minute, because
(10:06):
you've mentioned it a fewtimes, and I'm not sure that people
understand what story work isunless they've actually done it.
I know what you're referringto, but these realizations you were
having were happening intherapy. Is that what was happening?
Can you tell us a little bitabout that? Because I think that'll
be helpful for peoplelistening to understand what story
(10:29):
work is and how impactful it is.
Yeah. So Story work really isa type of therapy that started coming
together, I would say, in theearly 2000s from my understanding.
Dan Allender from the Allendercenter was really instrumental in
starting this movement andthis body of work. And basically,
(10:53):
story work is looking at yourpast, especially your formative childhood
years, and looking at yourwoundings there and how they affect
your present and your future,and especially how you relate in
relationships. And I would saythat a lot of what my work was done
(11:14):
with therapists, but I alsoattended story workshops through
the Allender Center. I read alot of books. I, you know, spoke
with wise mentors. I was in acouple of groups that were working
on story work together. I'mcurrently and have been for the last
four years in a confessionalcommunity with the center for Being
(11:38):
Known with Kurt Thompson. Andso, you know, story work has looked
different for me, but I wouldsay a lot of my work was done with
very wise, compassionateChristian counselors.
Yeah, I mean, I'm a huge fanof going back to the origin of the
pain or the trauma andinviting God to go back there. When
(12:01):
you talk about the story workthat you did, how did you experience
Jesus coming with you backinto your story in bringing healing?
So I don't know that I couldhave done the work that I've done
and continue to do the workthat I've done on my story without
him being with me. I havefound Jesus to be incredibly compassionate
(12:24):
and kind. And I think that'sone of the things that we really
miss when we look back at ourpast. I think we often look back
at our past with a lot ofcontempt and judgment and shame,
and doing those things doesn'treally help us to look for the redemptive
story right in our past. Butwhen we're able to look back on ourselves
(12:47):
as younger children and thebattles that we had to face as those
young children, and we're ableto actually be compassionate to those
young children. I believethat's where the healing starts.
But in order for us to dothat, I really think it's vital that
we are experiencing and knowthe Lord's compassion and kindness
towards us in that journey.And we know that he's patient with
(13:13):
us, too. He doesn't just say,oh, you want to look back and dump
our whole history on us.Right. We'd never be able to contain
that. So he's been reallypatient in the way that I feel like
layers and layers keepinguncovered and parts of my story keeping
revealed. And I think we'll dothis work till we die and go meet
him face to face. But yeah, Ifound him to be incredibly kind and
(13:35):
compassionate. And also, youknow, I believe, you know, Jesus
says that the truth will setus free. And I believe that the Lord
wants healing and freedom forus, and so he really wants us to
find the truth. And once wefinally are able to see that truth
and start grieving the lossesthat we had from our childhood years
(13:58):
with compassion and kindnessand patience and gentleness, I believe
that really is the start ofour healing Shop with a purpose.
When you buy something fromthe Collide Shop, you can feel good
about your purchase knowingthat 100% of the proceeds go back
into funding the Ministry ofCollide. That means that that adorable
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(14:21):
not only going to look greaton you, but they're also going to
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apparel and more at storeWecollide.net it's really interesting,
Michelle. I've done some ofthis similar work as you in my own
(14:43):
life, and it's been incrediblyhealing for me inviting Jesus to
go back to the painful placesin my childhood, and his compassion
has met me there. So I lovethat you're bringing that word up.
How do you think for youpersonally experiencing Jesus compassion
when you returned back to theorigin of moments of pain that you
(15:05):
experienced as a childhood,how do you think that gave you compassion
to then be able to go andapologize to your children for the
pain you caused them?
I mean, I think it was vital,you know, without that, like I said,
I think that we sit in a lotof the shame and the guilt and the
(15:25):
regret, right? And we saythings like, you're never going to
get better. You're just a badmom. You know, this was always going
to be your path. You're notworthy of getting better. We tell
ourselves those lies, right?And I think without compassion, we
are not able to stop those oldlies and that narrative that the
(15:49):
enemy wants us to stay in,right? But once I think we're able
to start seeing the Lord'scompassion towards us and we start
experiencing some of thathealing by looking at that young
child and actually reallyunderstanding, oh, it makes so much
sense that you were like that.It makes so much sense that you had
to develop those survivalstrategies and that that's the way
(16:09):
you're parenting right now,right? Once we're able to see that,
I believe it gives us thefreedom to then go back to our kids.
Because I'm not actuallyneeding to be defensive anymore.
I'm not having to defend, oh,I'm not a bad mom, or I'm not a mistake,
or I'm not irreparably broken,right? I'm a mom who made a mistake.
(16:30):
I made lots of mistakes. ButJesus has forgiven me. And because
he's forgiven me, I'm allowedto come to you now, and I can ask
you for forgiveness, right?Because I know that he's forgiven
me and it's okay. And I reallyhope and pray that you will forgive
me, too. But I can do this nowbecause I know that I'm not the baddie
(16:51):
here. And there is hope for meand there's freedom for me here.
What have those moments doneto change your relationship with
your kids? Those moments whereyou've gone to them and owned up
to the ways you've messed up?
You know, I don't want to givethe impression that you just tie
a nice neat bow by going backto your kids once or twice, and then
(17:12):
everything is forgiven andeverything's great and you have a
perfect relationship. Becausethat's not reality. That's not true.
I will say it's somethingthat's been happening over years
as I have changed. I'm then adifferent person with them. And like
I said, I think it's going tocontinue for years and years until
I'm not here anymore to keepdoing that. But by constantly going
(17:38):
back and being different andresponding differently and letting
them know that you see themand that you were blinded for a long
time, I think it startsopening the doors for more honest
and authentic communication.Right? So where I was unsafe in the
past because I wouldn't reallylisten to what they were feeling,
(17:58):
right? That's not very safe.Like, I'm sad or mad mom, and you're
not listening to me. You'renot even validating that I'm feeling
this by now going back overand over again and saying, I'm really
sorry. Will you forgive me forwhat I did? Or in a conversation,
I can be like, oh, I canrecognize what I'm doing now. Let
me pause for a minute and letme redirect. By doing that over and
(18:21):
over again, I think it startsmaking you a safer person, which
you should be in thebeginning, right? But some of us
weren't. And so I think itmakes you a safer person. And then
that, in turn allows mychildren to then start coming to
me and start telling me hardthings that I've done that they've
done. You know, I've had someof my kids start Coming back to me
(18:43):
and saying, you know, when Idid this, I did it because of xyz,
and I am so sorry. So, youknow, I'm starting to see just, you
know, the relationshipschange. They're looking different.
And again, it's not a neatlittle bow. They weren't changed
overnight. It's a long, slowprocess, but it's happening and it's
(19:07):
real, and I'm really gratefulfor it.
That's beautiful. I love thatyou're experiencing that when you
think about moms listening,because I know there are some who
are like, oh, man, I've eithermessed up big time or I'm messing
up consistently, and it justfeels like it's too late. What's
some practical advice that youhave for them to move out of this
(19:30):
stuck place where they feellike they can't get grounding, to
sort of make up for their wrongs?
So I think for a long time,you know, when I found myself in
that place, I tried to fix thesituation with external measures,
right? So read everything Icould on patience and how to be kind
(19:52):
to your kids and, you know,all the books, right. On how to be
a good Christian mom. Right.Listen to all the podcasts. And so
I think I was. What I wastrying to do was I was trying to
change my behavior, right? Iwas trying to put this band aid on
the scaping wound of mywounds, right. Of my childhood wounds
(20:12):
and thinking that these bandaids and these fixes, these little
exterior behaviormodifications would. Would do it.
Right? And of course, theycontinue to fail over and over again.
And as they failed over andover again, I felt like a worse and
worse mom, right? Like, oh, Ican't be more patient. I can't be
more kind. I really am just alost cause. I'm never going to get
better at this. But I thinkthe key came when I realized that
(20:35):
I needed to look at my heartand I needed to look at my past and
my healing. And Adam Youngsays these words. I love them. He
says, the point of engagingyour past is so that you can actually
live in the present. Until youengage your past and your story,
you're actually living as muchin the past as you are in the present.
And those words are just soconvicting and I think, so true,
(20:58):
Right? And so I think for momslistening who feel like they've blown
it, I would say stop trying tofix it from the outside. It's not
going to work. And I'm sureyou've tried it. But I would say
there is a Reason you'reacting the way you're acting. And
it's a scary place, right?Because we covered those wounds up
and we numbed those feelingswhen we were young because they were
(21:21):
hard. There's a reason wecovered up that pain. No one wants
to willingly go back and workon their pain, but I think that's
what's necessary. I thinkthat's the path to healing. And so
I would say, you know, sitdown with someone you trust. Maybe
if you have a Christiancounselor that you can meet with,
just start the conversationand see where you can go. But I would
(21:42):
say start looking at wherethis behavior is coming from, because
I can almost guarantee youthat it's coming from a place of
wounding. And until you dealwith that wounding and until you
start healing, your externalbehavior is not going to change.
But also that it's never toolate. You can do this at any point
(22:03):
and you can start reaping the benefits.
I so agree with you. And myfollow up question to that is, what
took you as long as it tookyou to finally start dealing with
it? Was it that you didn'tthink you had wounds? Was it that
you were avoiding them and youknew you did? Because I think a listener,
(22:26):
there might be peoplelistening who have a variety of reasons
for why they're not doing thework you just invited us into. So
why did you wait as long asyou did to start doing the work on
the inside?
Yeah. So like I mentionedearlier, one of my survival strategies
(22:47):
was control, right? And so Ifelt like as long as I can control,
could control my little world,I was going to be okay. And when
you're younger, that littleworld is pretty small, right. And
as I got older, that worldbecame my husband and then my children.
And when children are young,they're easier to control. But those
children kept growing, right?And those of us who, those of us
(23:08):
who are parents know that wereally can't control anything and
we're really not in control ofanything. Right. As much as we think
we are. And so I think I wastrying so hard to control everything
and keep it neat and tidy andunder wraps and just, you know, as
long as this looked okay, thenwe were okay. Because, you know,
(23:29):
again, that's one of thethings I grew up with too. Right.
You kept external peace aslong as everything was quiet, there
was no fighting, everythingwas okay. Even though inside, you
know, there was completeturmoil and chaos and dysfunction.
And so I think I needed to getto the point where I absolutely realized
(23:49):
I was not in control anymore.And I was about to fall off a cliff.
And so for me, that's thepoint I got to. And I would love
for people not to have to getto that point to let them know there
is a way. Right. And so I gotto that point and, you know, out
of pure desperation, reachedout for help. And, you know, I will
say, too, because I think thismight be relevant for some listeners,
(24:10):
the act of asking for help canalso be an area of wounding and is
for a lot of us. Right.Because as kids, we reach out for
help a lot. And when we don'tget it, we start to learn that reaching
out for help doesn't reallywork. Right. No one's heard me. So
why is that going to change?Right. So you stop asking for help.
And so the act of then saying,I'm going to ask for help again when
(24:34):
I'm at my most vulnerablefeels like a huge step. But I would
really love to invite anylisteners that are listening that
find themselves in that place,close to that place, or feel like
they're heading in thatdirection to reach out for help,
because we can't do this workalone. I tried for a long time. It
(24:56):
doesn't work. And, you know,there's so much research out now,
especially that Dr. Thompson'sdoing on, you know, how we literally
rewire our brains by tellingour story to an empathetic listener
and seeing it mirrored back ontheir faces and in their responses.
And so I believe that we aremade to do this work with other people.
(25:18):
We cannot do this work alone.It's too hard. You know, we were
created by a triune God whothere's connection between the Father,
Son and the Holy Spiritalways. None of them are alone. And
so we were created in hisimage. And we're not meant to do
this work alone. So I wouldreally encourage you to reach out
for help earlier than when youfeel like you're falling off a cliff
(25:41):
or if you're feeling likeyou're falling off a cliff or you've
already fallen off the cliff,it's okay. You can still reach out
for help.
Absolutely. And I mean, I'mgoing to remind listeners we have
counseling resources andmental health therapists around here
and ways that we can help youget help. So you can email us at
(26:02):
info@wecollide.net if you'refeeling like you need help. That's
why we're here. That is whywe're here.
I love that.
I would love to hear,Michelle, before we hear how people
can connect with you and allthat you're doing. What's your final
word and hope for moms whofeel like it's too late to heal their
(26:22):
parenting?
That it's not too late, eventhough it feels like it, and even
though the world might tellyou it's too late, and even though
you might have done someterrible things right, even though
your mothering journey mighthave looked really bad, even if you
abandoned your kids, neglectedyour kids, there is forgiveness in
(26:43):
Christ. And if God can forgiveus, then we need to be able to forgive
ourselves and seek thatforgiveness with our children. It
is never too late. That's thegospel story. It's never too late.
There is always hope. And Ibelieve that we can pursue healing.
And I will also say thatpursuing healing and freedom doesn't
(27:07):
necessarily have to look likereconciliation with your children
or with other family members.We hope that it does and it often
does. But even if it doesn't,I don't think that should be a barrier
to you pursuing healing andwholeness. Because we find that with
the Lord ultimately and, youknow, then we follow his lead for,
(27:28):
you know, where he would takeus. And we are, again, not in control
of other people's responses.But just because they haven't responded
in a certain way doesn't meanthat we aren't doing the hard work,
that we aren't pursuingothers, and that we aren't looking
for hope and healing and redemption.
I appreciate all that you'veshared with us today, and I know
(27:48):
that there's going to be womenwho want to connect with you and
follow along on your journey.How can they do that?
Yeah, you can follow me on mywebsite michellekonson.com or I'm
on Instagram or Facebook. JustMichelle Konson and I would love
to connect with anybody who ison this journey wants to start this
journey. Happy for you toreach out, answer any questions,
(28:11):
to give you any resources Ihave. I have a great list of resources
if you want to start the storywork journey, some books and podcasts
and websites for you to lookat. But I would really just say it
is a hard journey, but it'sincredibly worth it and worthwhile.
And yeah, I think it's veryakin to the narrow road that Jesus
(28:34):
calls us to. It's not easy,but it's totally worth it.
Thank you for reminding usit's not too late.
Absolutely, friend.
I hope that this conversationwith Michelle Konson encouraged you
and if you know it'llencourage another mama, will you
just share it? Just send itoff and encourage another mom. Right
(28:59):
now. All it takes is the pressof a button, and next thing you know,
she can be encouraged withyou. I absolutely love Michelle ending
that interview by reminding usthat isn't the gospel story about
the fact that it's never toolate. Man, I'm going to chew on that
(29:20):
all week. Keep colliding,friend, and we'll catch you next
week.
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