September 20, 2024 • 22 mins
In this episode of the DeWinter Difference, Derek sits down with Dave Stephenson, Chief Business Officer and Head of Employee Experience at Airbnb. Dave shares his incredible career journey, from being a ski racer and aspiring architect at Montana State, to roles at Procter & Gamble, Amazon, and his current position at Airbnb.
They discuss the importance of gaining deep functional skills, the value of mentorship, and the critical role Airbnb played as an Olympic sponsor. Dave also offers advice for aspiring leaders and reflects on his own experiences, including teaching skiing and what he’s learned hosting on the Airbnb platform.
Chapters:
0:00 Intro
00:30 Meet Dave Stephenson: From Amazon to Airbnb
01:05 Dave's Early Career and Education
02:35 Transition to Amazon and Joining Airbnb
04:26 New Role at Airbnb and Leadership Insights
07:20 Advice for Aspiring Leaders
10:36 Airbnb's Role in the Olympics
14:44 Personal Experiences with Airbnb
18:41 Future Aspirations and Final Thoughts
About Dave Stephenson:
Dave Stephenson is responsible for growing Airbnb’s global businesses and overseeing Airbnb’s employee experience. As Chief Business Officer, he is focused on commercializing Airbnb’s new and existing businesses, recruiting and developing Airbnb’s global supply of stays, Experiences, and services, and executing Airbnb’s global in market strategy. As Head of Employee Experience at Airbnb, he oversees talent and leadership development, recruiting, compensation, diversity initiatives, and Airbnb’s Live and Work Anywhere program. Dave previously spent five years as Airbnb’s Chief Financial Officer.
Prior to joining Airbnb, Dave spent 17 years at Amazon, where he was Vice President and CFO of their Worldwide Consumer Organization. Dave also served as CFO of Amazon’s International Consumer business and led finance across many areas of the company, including Amazon Web Services, North America Retail, and Merchant Services.
Dave holds an MBA from the University of Iowa and a BS in Industrial and Management Engineering from Montana State University. He is an Airbnb host in Washington State.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
everyone.
My name is Derek DeWinter and welcometo our listeners who are tuning into
the DeWinter Difference, an audiopodcast where I spend a bit of time
with incredible executives I've knownfor years, and you get to listen in, I
hope our conversations are unique, fun,insightful, short enough to keep your
attention, but long enough to listento on the way from point A to point B,
our goal is to have fun and share a fewtakeaways that you can apply in your
(00:23):
own career, life, and relationships.
Today, you get to listen to aconversation between yours truly and Dave
Stevenson, chief business officer andhead of employee experience at Airbnb.
This is a newish role for Dave, whomore recently was the CFO at Airbnb.
Prior to that, he spent ahandful of incredible years at
a little company called amazon.
com and Procter and Gamble.
(00:44):
Dave, thanks a ton for joining us today.
Derek, it's great to be here.
Thanks for having me.
you know,
it's one thing to look at thisfinished product, which is you and
maybe you wouldn't describe yourselfas a finished product quite yet,
but it's a whole other thing tosee how you came to be here today.
And so kind of going back all the way tobeing a Bobcat at Montana State, can you
share a little bit about your journeyand how you got from there to here?
(01:10):
Sure.
Yeah, you know, I grew up in Montana.
Both of my parents from Montana wouldgo back, you know, multiple generations.
Uh, Love to be a big skier in Montana.
And I stayed in Montana to go to schoolin Montana state and be a ski racer.
Also thought at the time Iwanted to be an architect.
And then I realized that an architectwas an amazing career, but maybe
(01:31):
not one that could get me to whereI wanted to be in the future.
And I felt like engineering.
Was an opportunity for meto use my kind of analytical
skills and do something bigger.
And I was fortunate to have a first job.
Out of Montana State going towork for Procter and Gamble.
My first job out of college,I made shampoo and toothpaste.
So you can ask me about puttingtoothpaste and toothpaste tubes.
(01:55):
But it was a great learning ground to kindof expand my skills and experience coming
from engineering, out into the real world.
I moved to the Midwest.
Moved to Iowa.
So it's hard being a big ski racerand moving to the flatlands of Iowa.
But um, Procter and Gamble isjust such a great training ground.
I was willing to make that sacrifice.
And, you know, along the way Igot my MBA at Procter and Gamble.
(02:18):
They supported me and, getting mymaster's degree and I was buying
my books off of this little.
online bookstore called Amazon.
And one day there was a jobposting on the website for a role.
And I was like, you know, I asked mywife, Hey, can I, you know, put my resume
in for this job opportunity in Seattle?
And I did.
(02:38):
And, you know, it was fortunate enough tobe able to join all the way back in 1999.
So yeah, it's incredible ride spentthere almost 20 years at Amazon on
a bunch of different finance roles.
I felt like I was going to be there fora long time, maybe the rest of my career.
And then Brian Chesky called me and toldme what he wanted to build in terms of
(02:59):
Airbnb and the skills that he needed outof his next CFO and felt like I could
use the 30 years of experience that Ihad had at Amazon to kind of bring to
Airbnb to help him achieve his ambition.
So I was really fortunateto be able to join in 2019.
Little did I know I was gonnabe the CFO of Airbnb in the
midst of a global pandemic.
was a heck of a ride.
But I feel like it's been an incrediblejourney where I've really been able to
(03:24):
kind of use all that experience fromengineering days, all the way back
through Amazon to, help Airbnb, be nowa fortune 500 company, so I don't know.
It's been an incredible ride.
That's funny for a guy whois often accused of being
a little bit old school me.
It is amazing to hear you say thatyou Applied to something on amazon.
(03:44):
com off the website.
And I think it's interesting people seeAmazon for what it is today, but Amazon
was not a, gigantic company back in 1999.
It was.
And certainly even if youwere years earlier than that.
So I love hearing that.
That's
Yeah, well, I told my wife, she says,look, you know, there's Amazon starting
(04:05):
to sell CDs, they're selling DVDs.
I said, like, this thingis going to be huge.
And yeah, little did I knowhow amazing it was going to be.
That's great.
Well, you are in a new roleat Airbnb and one that you
created or was created for you.
And you can tell us alittle bit about that.
And that's not something that happensovernight and neither does elevating
people on your team into rolesthat you leave, which as CFO, Of
(04:27):
Airbnb is a really, really big one.
anyone who has dealt with or metwith Ellie knows she's an incredible
finance leader and will veryadmirably step into your shoes.
those things don't always happenand take sponsorship and effort.
so can you talk to us a little bit aboutthat transition and the advice that you
might give other senior leaders in financeor otherwise as they develop their teams?
(04:50):
Yeah.
You know, it was really fortunatewhen I came into Airbnb to have such a
senior leader, like Ellie Mertz on theteam as part of my team and, you know,
clearly knew that she was going to be a.
Very capable CFO in the future.
And we worked together to makesure that she gained the kind of
skills and experiences she neededso that she could be, the next CFO.
(05:11):
And so we were very intentional abouthow we work together and that support.
So I was fortunate in having heras a partner and I couldn't be more
proud about her success and not beingthe new CFO, you know, this chief
business officer role, it is new.
we created it as a way for Airbnbto enter in the next chapter
(05:33):
that we have as a company.
You know, we, we've been so focusedon working on just the core part of
the business, and now we're working tokind of expand beyond the core stays
business into services and experiences.
And in order to do that, it felt likeneeded to create this chief business
officer role to help stitch together andwork with all the different functions
(05:54):
to ensure they're working together.
To achieve our ultimate results, Airbnbis different than many other companies.
We're a functional company.
So we have, you know, a designfunction, a product function, a
marketing function, an engineeringfunction, and all those functions
roll up to Brian Chesky as our CEO.
But as this chief business officerrole, I can help him ensure that all
(06:15):
those functions are working togetherto deliver outstanding results.
And so I'm really excitedabout the new opportunity.
You've been in the role now about.
nine months and it's been veryrewarding and challenging.
And I look forward to, what we'regoing to be doing in the future.
Well, you've got all the hard skills tobring lots of different perspectives to
the table, you know, not just startingin engineering, but finance and obviously
(06:37):
a big focus on culture and people.
So I think he's very lucky to have you inthat role and, on the path to different.
Senior level positionsin corporate America.
you need to pick up talent and skilland allyship and a little bit of luck,
a lot of work ethic, you know, it goesinto success let's pretend you're walking
along the beach and seashells represent.
(06:57):
Those different skills and attributes,and you only have enough room in
your pocket to collect three orfour skills or, or those attributes.
And for purposes of myanalogy, those are seashells.
So which ones are youfocused on picking up?
Yeah, I'll go to the seashells in aminute, but even maybe just step back
that I think one of the best pieceof advice I ever got as I Entered my
(07:17):
career was for my mom who told me justto work for the best company you can
work for at any given point in time.
And then if you can do that,you're going to get the skills
and the training that you need.
And I say that because that was thatexample, I left Montana for Iowa
to go work for Procter and Gamble.
And it was an incredible experiencebecause the PNG gave me, I think
(07:37):
the foundational skills thathave led to my success to date.
So those seashells.
Came from Procter and Gamble andthey really are some of the basics.
So, I mean, it's super simple things howto run an effective meeting, what are
the basics of being a good team leader?
I think that would be number one.
(07:57):
Number two is just organizational skills.
How do you kind of prioritize what'smost important and give it some
structure so that you are alwaysworking on the most important things,
not always the most urgent thingsand then just analytical skills.
I think, how do you measure success?
what are the measures and yourgoals and how do you Know that
(08:19):
you're making progress against it.
I think all those skills I learnedearly on in my career and I attribute
them back to that first decisionto go work for Procter and Gamble.
Interesting.
What sort of, I mean, you seepeople that maybe don't achieve
the level of success that you have.
Do you think there are folksthat covet the wrong attributes?
(08:40):
And if they do, wheredo you see a consistent.
Missed area of focus for that.
I think they, when I see some of theissues is when somebody aspires to a
title, a huge responsibility, and maybea small company too quickly, because
then there's no one to learn from.
(09:01):
Like, so yeah, they, they're the.
Senior vice president ofa hundred person company.
And, you know, they're not surroundingthemselves with the best people
that they can go learn from.
You know, you'd rather be aengineering manager in a multi
thousand person company, where youget to surround yourself with these
amazing people and learn from them.
(09:21):
And I'd even say that at Airbnb,we, you know, we have, I don't
know, 6, 000 employees and we striveto have some of Best employees
in the world working for us.
This functional structure Italked about is we kind of,
it's like a T shaped structure.
It's broad where we have to collaborateacross functions, but it's deep and you
have this deep functional expertise.
And what's amazing about that isthat then you can learn from one
(09:44):
another and build upon the skills.
But if you go be this.
SVP of a hundred person companytoo early in your career.
There's no one to kind of learn from.
There's no structure to kind of giveyou the skill and experience you need.
It's one of the more frustrating thingsthat I see in the advisory part of my
career over the years, You almost seeit coming like a train in the decision
(10:06):
making that some people make and youjust, wish you could fast forward
things a few years and show people theChristmas future that somebody might
have if they just stuck with the decisionthat they had versus going for that SVB
title or being adorned with somethingthat, Is more flash than substance.
So you're we're talking about takingthings from the same playbook for sure.
Well I don't know how much peopleknow about this, but this would be
(10:28):
a good chance for you to extol thevirtues of Airbnb in Paris, but the
summer Olympics are now in the rearview mirror and Airbnb played a
pretty big role as sponsor this year.
And you were there.
Maybe throughout the entireOlympics, you could let us know.
In fact for those who don't know it,you were actually a torch bearer.
So I definitely want to know about howthat felt and maybe a little bit about
(10:51):
how this partnership came to pass.
Sure.
So we became a top sponsor of theOlympics back in 2019 and had a nine year.
sponsorship all the way through the L.
A.
28 Olympics, and then,you know, we had COVID.
So that challenged us with theTokyo Olympics where we couldn't
(11:12):
actually have people together,and then we had the challenge of.
Beijing, which was a winter Olympics andhad its own kind of geopolitical issues.
Paris has been the really first timewhere we, I think, have had the full
expression and the benefit of Airbnbkind of sponsoring the Olympics.
and if you kind of think back, what'samazing about the Olympics is they're
(11:33):
the ultimate hosted event, right?
You have a city hosting people fromall around the world to go participate
in this incredible community.
Of athleticism.
it's just the quintessential hosted event.
And so, you know, with Airbnb being thequintessential hosted company, where we
want to be able to connect people fromall around the world in person, in real
(11:54):
life, it's like, it's a perfect synergy.
for, Paris specifically, we had over 400,000 people staying in Airbnbs During the
Olympics and the Olympics really couldn'thappen in the same way, if it wasn't
for Airbnb, we made them accessible tohundreds of thousands of people from
all around the world and from France.
we made them very affordable.
(12:14):
So the cost of an Airbnb duringthe Olympics was about the
same as it was the year before.
So it just enabled you know,more people to experience it.
And then when people do come.
And stay in the Airbnb, they actuallyalso experienced the community.
They experienced theneighborhood they're living in.
We actually had Airbnbs cause part ofthe Olympics were not all in Paris.
(12:35):
They were spread around the country tosomewhere on like Lille and somewhere in
Bordeaux and somewhere down in Marseille.
And so they were staying inAirbnbs all around the country.
It was incredible.
And so yeah, I was there almost two weeks.
It was super fortunate tobe able to carry the torch.
And I thought.
The energy was amazing.
I carry the torch you kind of trot alongand say run with the torch, but you kind
(12:57):
of trot along for a couple hundred yards.
But it was this greatneighborhood called St.
Denis, which is near wherethe Olympic village was.
and there were thousands of people liningthe streets, cheering on the torch.
They have no idea who I am runningwith the torch, but they were so
excited to, see the torch run by.
It is invigorating and energizing.
I never expected it to be so amazing.
(13:20):
That's awesome.
Are there going to be the sameopportunities or different challenges
in the cost containment part ofit for Los Angeles that you were
able to somehow affect in Paris?
you know, absolutely.
I mean, again, we're goingto be able to house hundreds
of thousands of people in L.
A.
They wouldn't really be able to holdthe games the same way without it.
(13:43):
you know, was able to kind ofmeet with the LA 28 Olympic team.
And one of their objectives is to havean expression of the community of LA
and the actual different cultures of LA.
It said that, that L.
A.
actually is home for the second largestpopulation of dozens of countries around
(14:05):
the world, outside of the home country,the second largest population of many
of these communities are actually in L.
A.
It's incredibly diverse, and one ofthe things we're going to be able to do
with Airbnb is actually Have people stayin those communities, experience those
communities, eat at those restaurants.
We have Airbnb experiences where you cankind of learn about the culture and really
engage in those cultures and stay there.
(14:27):
And I don't know, it's super exciting.
I think we had an incrediblysuccessful Paris Olympics games,
and I think LA is going to justtake it to a whole nother level.
That's awesome.
So, you know, I've had conversations goingback a bunch of years some about things
totally unwork related like volleyball.
I mean, you're a volleyballdad and I'm a volleyball dad.
Your daughter's ascended to greaterheights than my kids did, but
(14:47):
volleyball dads are volleyballdads lots of people we know in
common and more recently about how.
I may be self annoying myselfas one of Airbnb's biggest fans.
In fact, we were scheduling thisconversation or you agreed to this
conversation while I was in anAirbnb on Kauai, which is really
kind of a fun type of thing.
So, you know, as a consumer versusthe chief business officer, how do you
(15:09):
describe the appeal to the experienceof staying in an Airbnb and, you
know, what does your user experiencemean to you as an employee of Airbnb?
Yeah.
Well, a couple of things.
I first started staying in Airbnbs.
When I worked at Amazon, I wasleading finance for the international
websites and in the summer I wasable to take my family to Europe and
(15:31):
we lived on Airbnbs in community.
So we lived in Paris for a summer.
We lived in London for a summer and it wasamazing because by living in the Airbnb
we had that we lived in the neighborhood.
We were shopping at thelocal grocery store.
We had our favorite restaurants, ourfavorite coffee shops, our favorite parks.
And, you know, it was that ultimateexpression of that Airbnb is so great at.
(15:52):
It's like part of being part ofthe community, feeling at home.
And not kind of just feelinglike you're an outsider.
So really connecting and that'swhat resonated with me at the time.
That's what got me excited.
When I first started talking about Brian,about his vision for what it could be.
And I think this is what we continue todo an amazing job at, which is allowing
people to kind of travel, but live likea local, connect with the community.
(16:17):
Really feel that sense of belonging.
in the world, and I'm excited tocontinue to do more and more of that.
my wife.
I was a very early adopter ofAirbnb and almost refused to
stay in a hotel at this point.
My wife, on the other hand, was not,and she really kind of fought it for
a little while, and now she's sortof in the same boat that I am, which
(16:38):
is, it just makes, it makes the lifeexperience much richer than going into
a fairly sanitary, albeit lovely, hotel.
I actually have three stays upcomingbetween now and the end of the year
in a couple of different places.
And I always get excited aboutwalking into a new place.
(16:59):
There's some familiarity aboutstaying in the same Airbnb,
which is actually kind of cool.
But what are the two or threethings that you appreciate when
you walk into a new Airbnb or anAirbnb that you've been at before?
Well, one thing you may or may notknow, I'm actually an Airbnb host.
I host a cabin here just outsideof Seattle near Crystal Mountain,
(17:21):
Washington, Mount Rainier.
And I also host a place in PalmSprings and I, it gives you a nice
appreciation of being on the other side.
You know, one of the things thatI appreciate as a guest is like I
said, feeling part of the community.
So what I try to provide as ahost is a bit of that sense.
So in the cabin that I have.
You know, we have a, a pizza oven,you know, that I you know, give them
(17:45):
great, you know, pizza dough recipes.
And we have some great hikingtrails and I introduced them,
the best places to go hike.
You know, we have ourfavorite coffee shop.
That's a few miles down the roadand make sure that they stop
and get some ice cream there.
And so, you know, I think that'swhat I appreciate is kind of that
sense of feeling like, Oh, I kindof know this place, I'm part of it.
And so as a host, I try to workreally hard to kind of give
(18:07):
them that same kind of sense.
I think the best days are those whenyou connect with the host and they
instantly make you part of that community.
I have a number of Airbnb stays whereI still stay in touch with that host.
And you know, if I'm back in that samecommunity again, I'd love to stay with
the same host again in the future.
That connection, I think, is truly uniqueand not something that you get in a hotel.
(18:32):
Yeah.
So early in our conversation,you mentioned that going into
college, you thought maybe youwould go into architecture.
You may not feel the same way now,but what would you be doing if you
weren't in a senior leadership role?
Like you're in now?
Would it be architecture?
You know, actually,
maybe it's what you're doing now.
Yeah, no, it's fun.
It's a great question.
(18:52):
I actually, when I joinedAmazon, we said that all roads
will lead to Vail, Colorado.
I said, you know, this is going to beincredibly successful career and I will
then just retire to Vail and be a skieror it's going to completely implode.
In reality, I really liked whatI was doing and I felt like, and
I've been doing it for many years.
So I, neither of those has happened, but.
I might go back and teach skiing again.
(19:12):
I love, love being in the mountains.
I love sharing an expertise with others.
I love teaching.
I think, it's an incredible sport.
And I think you learn a lot aboutlife when you are an athlete and can
kind of share Those skills of others.
Love that.
So I've been asking youa bunch of questions.
Now's the time we return the tablesand you get to ask me a question,
(19:35):
and I don't know what it is, soyou can fire away, my friend.
Well, again, I've been in this chiefbusiness officer role now, eight months,
brand new job role, never existed ata big, you know, fortune 500 company.
What advice would you give me to besuccessful in this new, never done before?
(19:55):
Well somebody said it, I didn't, butyou've got two ears and one mouth, and
I've always approached my job listeningmore than talking, and I think if you're
in a new role, trying to create somethingthat has not been done before, The very
best thing you can do is truly listen andtake in from everybody, even the people
(20:18):
that you question, you know, there's lotsof smart people that you're surrounded by.
And then there's always somebody thatMaybe it's a little bit off or maybe
a little bit different, but I thinkeven that type of perspective can
help you kind of shape the decisionsthat you make when you make big and,
important and costly recommendations fora company in terms of their strategy.
So I think whether it's life orwhether it's work, I just think
(20:42):
listening is, a bit of a lost art.
And I would, not that I need to tell you.
What you need to do to be successful.
You're incredibly successful, butthat would be probably the one piece
of advice I would give someone in aunique situation like you're in now.
I love that.
I think I a hundred percent agree thatlistening that that's great advice.
I appreciate it.
(21:02):
Like being a little patient, likecoming to a new role, you could
get in a real hurry to try to makea lot of change and listening to
start is, is I think great advice.
I love that.
Thank you.
Yeah.
The world likes to fill up space,you know, like dead space or no
noise, or, you know, whether it'ssticking in a picture or a photo.
Or a video or a voiceor a noise or something.
(21:23):
And I think sometimes just sittingback and listening and letting
silence, you know fill up thespace is a really good thing.
So, big fan, big fans.
So let's see I'm goingto let you get going.
With one final question, becausethe greatest bite of food I've ever
had in my life has been in Montana,
Wow.
I'm, yes, I know.
(21:43):
Have you, have you everspent any time in Kalispell?
I've of course I have.
But what's the restaurant or
The DeSoto Grill.
I have not been to the DeSoto grill.
I'll be there probably this winter.
So I'll have to go check it out.
we had some friends that went up thereyears ago, and we continue to order
food from them and have it shipped.
To us because it was so amazing there.
(22:03):
They're BLT.
So anybody who's listening,if you plan a trip to Montana,
don't fall asleep on Kalispell.
It's amazing place um, and an amazing BLT.
So Dave, I I appreciate your time.
Thank you for sharing alittle bit of that with us.
And I will look forward tocatching up with you on a personal,
professional basis down the roadand good luck in this new role.
And good luck withAirbnbs continued success.
(22:25):
Thank you, Derek.
Really enjoyed the conversation.
everyone.
My name is Derek DeWinter and welcometo our listeners who are tuning into
the DeWinter Difference, an audiopodcast where I spend a bit of time
with incredible executives I've knownfor years, and you get to listen in, I
hope our conversations are unique, fun,insightful, short enough to keep your
attention, but long enough to listento on the way from point A to point B,
our goal is to have fun and share a fewtakeaways that you can apply in your
(00:23):
own career, life, and relationships.
Today, you get to listen to aconversation between yours truly and Dave
Stevenson, chief business officer andhead of employee experience at Airbnb.
This is a newish role for Dave, whomore recently was the CFO at Airbnb.
Prior to that, he spent ahandful of incredible years at
a little company called amazon.
com and Procter and Gamble.
(00:44):
Dave, thanks a ton for joining us today.
Derek, it's great to be here.
Thanks for having me.
you know,
it's one thing to look at thisfinished product, which is you and
maybe you wouldn't describe yourselfas a finished product quite yet,
but it's a whole other thing tosee how you came to be here today.
And so kind of going back all the way tobeing a Bobcat at Montana State, can you
share a little bit about your journeyand how you got from there to here?
(01:10):
Sure.
Yeah, you know, I grew up in Montana.
Both of my parents from Montana wouldgo back, you know, multiple generations.
Uh, Love to be a big skier in Montana.
And I stayed in Montana to go to schoolin Montana state and be a ski racer.
Also thought at the time Iwanted to be an architect.
And then I realized that an architectwas an amazing career, but maybe
(01:31):
not one that could get me to whereI wanted to be in the future.
And I felt like engineering.
Was an opportunity for meto use my kind of analytical
skills and do something bigger.
And I was fortunate to have a first job.
Out of Montana State going towork for Procter and Gamble.
My first job out of college,I made shampoo and toothpaste.
So you can ask me about puttingtoothpaste and toothpaste tubes.
(01:55):
But it was a great learning ground to kindof expand my skills and experience coming
from engineering, out into the real world.
I moved to the Midwest.
Moved to Iowa.
So it's hard being a big ski racerand moving to the flatlands of Iowa.
But um, Procter and Gamble isjust such a great training ground.
I was willing to make that sacrifice.
And, you know, along the way Igot my MBA at Procter and Gamble.
(02:18):
They supported me and, getting mymaster's degree and I was buying
my books off of this little.
online bookstore called Amazon.
And one day there was a jobposting on the website for a role.
And I was like, you know, I asked mywife, Hey, can I, you know, put my resume
in for this job opportunity in Seattle?
And I did.
(02:38):
And, you know, it was fortunate enough tobe able to join all the way back in 1999.
So yeah, it's incredible ride spentthere almost 20 years at Amazon on
a bunch of different finance roles.
I felt like I was going to be there fora long time, maybe the rest of my career.
And then Brian Chesky called me and toldme what he wanted to build in terms of
(02:59):
Airbnb and the skills that he needed outof his next CFO and felt like I could
use the 30 years of experience that Ihad had at Amazon to kind of bring to
Airbnb to help him achieve his ambition.
So I was really fortunateto be able to join in 2019.
Little did I know I was gonnabe the CFO of Airbnb in the
midst of a global pandemic.
was a heck of a ride.
But I feel like it's been an incrediblejourney where I've really been able to
(03:24):
kind of use all that experience fromengineering days, all the way back
through Amazon to, help Airbnb, be nowa fortune 500 company, so I don't know.
It's been an incredible ride.
That's funny for a guy whois often accused of being
a little bit old school me.
It is amazing to hear you say thatyou Applied to something on amazon.
(03:44):
com off the website.
And I think it's interesting people seeAmazon for what it is today, but Amazon
was not a, gigantic company back in 1999.
It was.
And certainly even if youwere years earlier than that.
So I love hearing that.
That's
Yeah, well, I told my wife, she says,look, you know, there's Amazon starting
(04:05):
to sell CDs, they're selling DVDs.
I said, like, this thingis going to be huge.
And yeah, little did I knowhow amazing it was going to be.
That's great.
Well, you are in a new roleat Airbnb and one that you
created or was created for you.
And you can tell us alittle bit about that.
And that's not something that happensovernight and neither does elevating
people on your team into rolesthat you leave, which as CFO, Of
(04:27):
Airbnb is a really, really big one.
anyone who has dealt with or metwith Ellie knows she's an incredible
finance leader and will veryadmirably step into your shoes.
those things don't always happenand take sponsorship and effort.
so can you talk to us a little bit aboutthat transition and the advice that you
might give other senior leaders in financeor otherwise as they develop their teams?
(04:50):
Yeah.
You know, it was really fortunatewhen I came into Airbnb to have such a
senior leader, like Ellie Mertz on theteam as part of my team and, you know,
clearly knew that she was going to be a.
Very capable CFO in the future.
And we worked together to makesure that she gained the kind of
skills and experiences she neededso that she could be, the next CFO.
(05:11):
And so we were very intentional abouthow we work together and that support.
So I was fortunate in having heras a partner and I couldn't be more
proud about her success and not beingthe new CFO, you know, this chief
business officer role, it is new.
we created it as a way for Airbnbto enter in the next chapter
(05:33):
that we have as a company.
You know, we, we've been so focusedon working on just the core part of
the business, and now we're working tokind of expand beyond the core stays
business into services and experiences.
And in order to do that, it felt likeneeded to create this chief business
officer role to help stitch together andwork with all the different functions
(05:54):
to ensure they're working together.
To achieve our ultimate results, Airbnbis different than many other companies.
We're a functional company.
So we have, you know, a designfunction, a product function, a
marketing function, an engineeringfunction, and all those functions
roll up to Brian Chesky as our CEO.
But as this chief business officerrole, I can help him ensure that all
(06:15):
those functions are working togetherto deliver outstanding results.
And so I'm really excitedabout the new opportunity.
You've been in the role now about.
nine months and it's been veryrewarding and challenging.
And I look forward to, what we'regoing to be doing in the future.
Well, you've got all the hard skills tobring lots of different perspectives to
the table, you know, not just startingin engineering, but finance and obviously
(06:37):
a big focus on culture and people.
So I think he's very lucky to have you inthat role and, on the path to different.
Senior level positionsin corporate America.
you need to pick up talent and skilland allyship and a little bit of luck,
a lot of work ethic, you know, it goesinto success let's pretend you're walking
along the beach and seashells represent.
(06:57):
Those different skills and attributes,and you only have enough room in
your pocket to collect three orfour skills or, or those attributes.
And for purposes of myanalogy, those are seashells.
So which ones are youfocused on picking up?
Yeah, I'll go to the seashells in aminute, but even maybe just step back
that I think one of the best pieceof advice I ever got as I Entered my
(07:17):
career was for my mom who told me justto work for the best company you can
work for at any given point in time.
And then if you can do that,you're going to get the skills
and the training that you need.
And I say that because that was thatexample, I left Montana for Iowa
to go work for Procter and Gamble.
And it was an incredible experiencebecause the PNG gave me, I think
(07:37):
the foundational skills thathave led to my success to date.
So those seashells.
Came from Procter and Gamble andthey really are some of the basics.
So, I mean, it's super simple things howto run an effective meeting, what are
the basics of being a good team leader?
I think that would be number one.
(07:57):
Number two is just organizational skills.
How do you kind of prioritize what'smost important and give it some
structure so that you are alwaysworking on the most important things,
not always the most urgent thingsand then just analytical skills.
I think, how do you measure success?
what are the measures and yourgoals and how do you Know that
(08:19):
you're making progress against it.
I think all those skills I learnedearly on in my career and I attribute
them back to that first decisionto go work for Procter and Gamble.
Interesting.
What sort of, I mean, you seepeople that maybe don't achieve
the level of success that you have.
Do you think there are folksthat covet the wrong attributes?
(08:40):
And if they do, wheredo you see a consistent.
Missed area of focus for that.
I think they, when I see some of theissues is when somebody aspires to a
title, a huge responsibility, and maybea small company too quickly, because
then there's no one to learn from.
(09:01):
Like, so yeah, they, they're the.
Senior vice president ofa hundred person company.
And, you know, they're not surroundingthemselves with the best people
that they can go learn from.
You know, you'd rather be aengineering manager in a multi
thousand person company, where youget to surround yourself with these
amazing people and learn from them.
(09:21):
And I'd even say that at Airbnb,we, you know, we have, I don't
know, 6, 000 employees and we striveto have some of Best employees
in the world working for us.
This functional structure Italked about is we kind of,
it's like a T shaped structure.
It's broad where we have to collaborateacross functions, but it's deep and you
have this deep functional expertise.
And what's amazing about that isthat then you can learn from one
(09:44):
another and build upon the skills.
But if you go be this.
SVP of a hundred person companytoo early in your career.
There's no one to kind of learn from.
There's no structure to kind of giveyou the skill and experience you need.
It's one of the more frustrating thingsthat I see in the advisory part of my
career over the years, You almost seeit coming like a train in the decision
(10:06):
making that some people make and youjust, wish you could fast forward
things a few years and show people theChristmas future that somebody might
have if they just stuck with the decisionthat they had versus going for that SVB
title or being adorned with somethingthat, Is more flash than substance.
So you're we're talking about takingthings from the same playbook for sure.
Well I don't know how much peopleknow about this, but this would be
(10:28):
a good chance for you to extol thevirtues of Airbnb in Paris, but the
summer Olympics are now in the rearview mirror and Airbnb played a
pretty big role as sponsor this year.
And you were there.
Maybe throughout the entireOlympics, you could let us know.
In fact for those who don't know it,you were actually a torch bearer.
So I definitely want to know about howthat felt and maybe a little bit about
(10:51):
how this partnership came to pass.
Sure.
So we became a top sponsor of theOlympics back in 2019 and had a nine year.
sponsorship all the way through the L.
A.
28 Olympics, and then,you know, we had COVID.
So that challenged us with theTokyo Olympics where we couldn't
(11:12):
actually have people together,and then we had the challenge of.
Beijing, which was a winter Olympics andhad its own kind of geopolitical issues.
Paris has been the really first timewhere we, I think, have had the full
expression and the benefit of Airbnbkind of sponsoring the Olympics.
and if you kind of think back, what'samazing about the Olympics is they're
(11:33):
the ultimate hosted event, right?
You have a city hosting people fromall around the world to go participate
in this incredible community.
Of athleticism.
it's just the quintessential hosted event.
And so, you know, with Airbnb being thequintessential hosted company, where we
want to be able to connect people fromall around the world in person, in real
(11:54):
life, it's like, it's a perfect synergy.
for, Paris specifically, we had over 400,000 people staying in Airbnbs During the
Olympics and the Olympics really couldn'thappen in the same way, if it wasn't
for Airbnb, we made them accessible tohundreds of thousands of people from
all around the world and from France.
we made them very affordable.
(12:14):
So the cost of an Airbnb duringthe Olympics was about the
same as it was the year before.
So it just enabled you know,more people to experience it.
And then when people do come.
And stay in the Airbnb, they actuallyalso experienced the community.
They experienced theneighborhood they're living in.
We actually had Airbnbs cause part ofthe Olympics were not all in Paris.
(12:35):
They were spread around the country tosomewhere on like Lille and somewhere in
Bordeaux and somewhere down in Marseille.
And so they were staying inAirbnbs all around the country.
It was incredible.
And so yeah, I was there almost two weeks.
It was super fortunate tobe able to carry the torch.
And I thought.
The energy was amazing.
I carry the torch you kind of trot alongand say run with the torch, but you kind
(12:57):
of trot along for a couple hundred yards.
But it was this greatneighborhood called St.
Denis, which is near wherethe Olympic village was.
and there were thousands of people liningthe streets, cheering on the torch.
They have no idea who I am runningwith the torch, but they were so
excited to, see the torch run by.
It is invigorating and energizing.
I never expected it to be so amazing.
(13:20):
That's awesome.
Are there going to be the sameopportunities or different challenges
in the cost containment part ofit for Los Angeles that you were
able to somehow affect in Paris?
you know, absolutely.
I mean, again, we're goingto be able to house hundreds
of thousands of people in L.
A.
They wouldn't really be able to holdthe games the same way without it.
(13:43):
you know, was able to kind ofmeet with the LA 28 Olympic team.
And one of their objectives is to havean expression of the community of LA
and the actual different cultures of LA.
It said that, that L.
A.
actually is home for the second largestpopulation of dozens of countries around
(14:05):
the world, outside of the home country,the second largest population of many
of these communities are actually in L.
A.
It's incredibly diverse, and one ofthe things we're going to be able to do
with Airbnb is actually Have people stayin those communities, experience those
communities, eat at those restaurants.
We have Airbnb experiences where you cankind of learn about the culture and really
engage in those cultures and stay there.
(14:27):
And I don't know, it's super exciting.
I think we had an incrediblysuccessful Paris Olympics games,
and I think LA is going to justtake it to a whole nother level.
That's awesome.
So, you know, I've had conversations goingback a bunch of years some about things
totally unwork related like volleyball.
I mean, you're a volleyballdad and I'm a volleyball dad.
Your daughter's ascended to greaterheights than my kids did, but
(14:47):
volleyball dads are volleyballdads lots of people we know in
common and more recently about how.
I may be self annoying myselfas one of Airbnb's biggest fans.
In fact, we were scheduling thisconversation or you agreed to this
conversation while I was in anAirbnb on Kauai, which is really
kind of a fun type of thing.
So, you know, as a consumer versusthe chief business officer, how do you
(15:09):
describe the appeal to the experienceof staying in an Airbnb and, you
know, what does your user experiencemean to you as an employee of Airbnb?
Yeah.
Well, a couple of things.
I first started staying in Airbnbs.
When I worked at Amazon, I wasleading finance for the international
websites and in the summer I wasable to take my family to Europe and
(15:31):
we lived on Airbnbs in community.
So we lived in Paris for a summer.
We lived in London for a summer and it wasamazing because by living in the Airbnb
we had that we lived in the neighborhood.
We were shopping at thelocal grocery store.
We had our favorite restaurants, ourfavorite coffee shops, our favorite parks.
And, you know, it was that ultimateexpression of that Airbnb is so great at.
(15:52):
It's like part of being part ofthe community, feeling at home.
And not kind of just feelinglike you're an outsider.
So really connecting and that'swhat resonated with me at the time.
That's what got me excited.
When I first started talking about Brian,about his vision for what it could be.
And I think this is what we continue todo an amazing job at, which is allowing
people to kind of travel, but live likea local, connect with the community.
(16:17):
Really feel that sense of belonging.
in the world, and I'm excited tocontinue to do more and more of that.
my wife.
I was a very early adopter ofAirbnb and almost refused to
stay in a hotel at this point.
My wife, on the other hand, was not,and she really kind of fought it for
a little while, and now she's sortof in the same boat that I am, which
(16:38):
is, it just makes, it makes the lifeexperience much richer than going into
a fairly sanitary, albeit lovely, hotel.
I actually have three stays upcomingbetween now and the end of the year
in a couple of different places.
And I always get excited aboutwalking into a new place.
(16:59):
There's some familiarity aboutstaying in the same Airbnb,
which is actually kind of cool.
But what are the two or threethings that you appreciate when
you walk into a new Airbnb or anAirbnb that you've been at before?
Well, one thing you may or may notknow, I'm actually an Airbnb host.
I host a cabin here just outsideof Seattle near Crystal Mountain,
(17:21):
Washington, Mount Rainier.
And I also host a place in PalmSprings and I, it gives you a nice
appreciation of being on the other side.
You know, one of the things thatI appreciate as a guest is like I
said, feeling part of the community.
So what I try to provide as ahost is a bit of that sense.
So in the cabin that I have.
You know, we have a, a pizza oven,you know, that I you know, give them
(17:45):
great, you know, pizza dough recipes.
And we have some great hikingtrails and I introduced them,
the best places to go hike.
You know, we have ourfavorite coffee shop.
That's a few miles down the roadand make sure that they stop
and get some ice cream there.
And so, you know, I think that'swhat I appreciate is kind of that
sense of feeling like, Oh, I kindof know this place, I'm part of it.
And so as a host, I try to workreally hard to kind of give
(18:07):
them that same kind of sense.
I think the best days are those whenyou connect with the host and they
instantly make you part of that community.
I have a number of Airbnb stays whereI still stay in touch with that host.
And you know, if I'm back in that samecommunity again, I'd love to stay with
the same host again in the future.
That connection, I think, is truly uniqueand not something that you get in a hotel.
(18:32):
Yeah.
So early in our conversation,you mentioned that going into
college, you thought maybe youwould go into architecture.
You may not feel the same way now,but what would you be doing if you
weren't in a senior leadership role?
Like you're in now?
Would it be architecture?
You know, actually,
maybe it's what you're doing now.
Yeah, no, it's fun.
It's a great question.
(18:52):
I actually, when I joinedAmazon, we said that all roads
will lead to Vail, Colorado.
I said, you know, this is going to beincredibly successful career and I will
then just retire to Vail and be a skieror it's going to completely implode.
In reality, I really liked whatI was doing and I felt like, and
I've been doing it for many years.
So I, neither of those has happened, but.
I might go back and teach skiing again.
(19:12):
I love, love being in the mountains.
I love sharing an expertise with others.
I love teaching.
I think, it's an incredible sport.
And I think you learn a lot aboutlife when you are an athlete and can
kind of share Those skills of others.
Love that.
So I've been asking youa bunch of questions.
Now's the time we return the tablesand you get to ask me a question,
(19:35):
and I don't know what it is, soyou can fire away, my friend.
Well, again, I've been in this chiefbusiness officer role now, eight months,
brand new job role, never existed ata big, you know, fortune 500 company.
What advice would you give me to besuccessful in this new, never done before?
(19:55):
Well somebody said it, I didn't, butyou've got two ears and one mouth, and
I've always approached my job listeningmore than talking, and I think if you're
in a new role, trying to create somethingthat has not been done before, The very
best thing you can do is truly listen andtake in from everybody, even the people
(20:18):
that you question, you know, there's lotsof smart people that you're surrounded by.
And then there's always somebody thatMaybe it's a little bit off or maybe
a little bit different, but I thinkeven that type of perspective can
help you kind of shape the decisionsthat you make when you make big and,
important and costly recommendations fora company in terms of their strategy.
So I think whether it's life orwhether it's work, I just think
(20:42):
listening is, a bit of a lost art.
And I would, not that I need to tell you.
What you need to do to be successful.
You're incredibly successful, butthat would be probably the one piece
of advice I would give someone in aunique situation like you're in now.
I love that.
I think I a hundred percent agree thatlistening that that's great advice.
I appreciate it.
(21:02):
Like being a little patient, likecoming to a new role, you could
get in a real hurry to try to makea lot of change and listening to
start is, is I think great advice.
I love that.
Thank you.
Yeah.
The world likes to fill up space,you know, like dead space or no
noise, or, you know, whether it'ssticking in a picture or a photo.
Or a video or a voiceor a noise or something.
(21:23):
And I think sometimes just sittingback and listening and letting
silence, you know fill up thespace is a really good thing.
So, big fan, big fans.
So let's see I'm goingto let you get going.
With one final question, becausethe greatest bite of food I've ever
had in my life has been in Montana,
Wow.
I'm, yes, I know.
(21:43):
Have you, have you everspent any time in Kalispell?
I've of course I have.
But what's the restaurant or
The DeSoto Grill.
I have not been to the DeSoto grill.
I'll be there probably this winter.
So I'll have to go check it out.
we had some friends that went up thereyears ago, and we continue to order
food from them and have it shipped.
To us because it was so amazing there.
(22:03):
They're BLT.
So anybody who's listening,if you plan a trip to Montana,
don't fall asleep on Kalispell.
It's amazing place um, and an amazing BLT.
So Dave, I I appreciate your time.
Thank you for sharing alittle bit of that with us.
And I will look forward tocatching up with you on a personal,
professional basis down the roadand good luck in this new role.
And good luck withAirbnbs continued success.
(22:25):
Thank you, Derek.
Really enjoyed the conversation.
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