Sammi Kinghorn: Finding new paths forward

Sammi Kinghorn’s journey from a life-changing farming accident to the top of the Paralympic podium is nothing short of extraordinary. A double world champion, Commonwealth medallist, Paralympic gold winner and now a popular BBC presenter, Sammi’s story is one of unbreakable resilience.

In this powerful conversation, Sammi opens up about:

• Rebuilding her life as a teenager after a devastating spinal injury
• The mental battles behind the medals – and how anxiety has shaped her racing career
• The fight for equality and representation in para sport
• Finding purpose beyond the track and redefining what success really looks like
• An inspiring and honest conversation 

Thank you to Sport England who support The Game Changers Podcast with a National Lottery award.

Find out more about The Game Changers podcast here: https://www.fearlesswomen.co.uk/thegamechangers

Hosted by Sue Anstiss
Produced by Sam Walker, What Goes On Media

A Fearless Women production

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hello and welcome to the Game Changers.
I'm Sue Anstis, and this is thepodcast where you'll hear from
trailblazing women in sport whoare knocking down barriers and
challenging the status quo forwomen and girls everywhere.
What can we learn from theirjourneys as we explore key
issues around equality in sportand beyond?
I'd like to start with a bigthank you to our partners, sport

(00:25):
England, who support the GameChangers podcast with a national
lottery award.
Today, I'm joined by SammyKinghorn, an extraordinary
Scottish wheelchair racer andnow TV presenter, who's won
numerous World, european andCommonwealth medals over the
past decade and last summertopped it all by winning a gold

(00:47):
medal for Great Britain at theParis 2024 Paralympics in the
100m T53.
Sammy's also been awarded an MBEand an OBE for her services to
athletics.
It was my absolute privilege tobe partnered with Sammy for the
Women's Sport Trust Unlockedprogramme back in 2021, where I
had the opportunity to get toknow this fabulous woman a

(01:09):
little better.
So, sammy, it's really been ahuge year for you an OBE in the
New Year's Honours, and then yougot married in January too.
So how's life been since thatincredible start to 2025?
How's life been since that?

Speaker 2 (01:23):
incredible start to 2025?
Oh, yeah, no, it's beenincredible.
I feel like, yeah, it's beenone of those years, I guess,
because of what happened inParis, I've just been able to
really enjoy everything and soakit all in and kind of like a
nice build up into, yeah,getting married at the end of
January and then, yeah, I went acouple of weeks ago to get my
OB, which was lovely.
It's such a strange thing likehonors and things like that.
I always find it quite a weirdthing because obviously I train

(01:44):
every day, train twice a day,six days a week and hope that
one day I'll win a medal, butlike something like an OB and MB
is like you don't really knowwhat you need to achieve to get
that.
So, like when you're given it,you're a bit like, oh gosh, like
people are are watching andpeople are, yeah, obviously want
to honor me for what I'veachieved, which seems bad,
because to me it's just a hobbyand I love it.

Speaker 1 (02:03):
Absolutely, absolutely.
And we mentioned there in theopening that you won your first
Paralympic gold in Paris lastsummer in 100 metres, added to
this incredible medal haul thatyou've had over the years.
But what did that mean to you,that kind of gold medal after
all you've achieved so far?

Speaker 2 (02:19):
Yeah, I mean it's.
I have to say again, it's whatI'm training for twice a day,
six days a week.
But I think the reason Iactually managed to win that I
think it's just becauseexperience, you know, through
games and working at what Ineeded to perform and actually
taking a lot of the pressure offmyself Because I just I'm
really bad for putting nobodyelse is putting pressure on me,
it's just myself.
But I kind of realized it'slike it's quite weird thing, I

(02:43):
guess, for an elite athlete torealize.
But in Tokyo, I guess the leadup to Tokyo, I was like all I
ever have wanted is to win aParalympic medal and I thought,
if I win this Paralympic medalit'll make my whole life happy.
And that's just not the case.
And I think I was like, well,why am I really doing this?
Then what?
What do I actually want toachieve?
Because I might never win goldand that's horrible and

(03:04):
terrifying.
But I would rather accept thatnow and then, or instead of
being bitter for years and yearsthat you know that hasn't
happened.
And I think once I realized thatand realized obviously I'm
training twice a day, six days aweek, because I want to win
gold, but if I don't, it'll hurtin the moment, but it'll be
okay and I just like reallyfocus on, after Tokyo, actually
figuring out who Samantha is notthe sports person you know who,

(03:27):
yeah, who I am outside of sport, which is also very, very hard
and difficult.
That's when I started doingthat the TV presenting and
things, just to kind of break upthe world of sport.
Um, because I think it'simportant for everyone to have a
hobby outside of you know theirjob.
So, yeah, it's.
It's been a really, reallyexciting year and yeah, it's
interesting, isn't it?

Speaker 1 (03:46):
because I do think that whole we focus so much on
gold.
I mean, my questioning is thereis like oh my goodness, that
gold, and seeing you ring thathuge bell in celebration, you
know it's so passionate, itmeant so much.
But you're absolutely right,for so many athletes you know
far more athletes than will everbe at the top of the podium.
You know, winning gold actuallyit might be an eighth place or

(04:07):
it might not even be getting toa final, but it's still
extraordinary what they've doneand achieved.
And I imagine then finding thatbalance and satisfaction and
knowing you've competed at thehighest level.
It shouldn't really be allabout the icing on the cake.

Speaker 2 (04:21):
No, it shouldn't be.
And I just think that you know,when I went into Tokyo, I was
ranked number one in the worldfor the 100 meters and I
literally threw up on the startline because I was so nervous
and I put so much pressure onmyself and all I wanted was that
gold medal because I thought,if I win this and everyone's
expecting me to win because I'mnumber one in the world and then
I, you know, came third in theend, it's quite a yeah, it's a
hard, hard thing to actuallywork out and realize that this

(04:44):
might never happen and I need tobe okay with that.
And I think by doing that on thestart line I was so much more
relaxed.
I obviously, you know, I stillwant to, I'm still going to push
as fast as I can.
I'm still there to compete forthe medal, but I knew I'd be
okay and again, it's fine not tobe okay in the moment because
of course, you're going to be,you've put a lot of hours into
it, but I knew the weeks comingafter I would be okay about it.

(05:04):
And, yeah, I think that washonestly like the biggest
turning point for me in sporthas been really like just
learning how to take thatpressure off.

Speaker 1 (05:13):
Do you work with a sports psychologist?
Have they helped you throughthat process?

Speaker 2 (05:17):
Yeah, 100%.
Yeah, yeah, jelani's mypsychologist, who's fantastic.
He's really quite.
He's very nice, chilled, likeDormina, but you can tell when
he kind of like switches andhe's like right.
So why don't we try this andthis?
And yeah, he's been really good.
Because I think that wassomething I really wanted to
work on, especially morerecently, because after Paris, I
was just so mentally drainedbecause it's so many highs and
lows and I was racing twice aday for five, six days in a row

(05:40):
and I was just, I was absolutelyphysically, but most
importantly, mentally knackered,um, and I really just wanted to
work on that, especially thisyear, trying to figure out like
how can I be a more confidentracer because I know that is
something I struggle with a lotlike I'm sick before every
single race, even if it's alocal one.
Are you always?
Yeah, yeah, I get so, sonervous and I think I think part
of it's because I am.

(06:02):
I never wanted to be a growingup.
You know, I was never underpressure as a child, so I don't
know how to deal with it.
It's very new to me.
So, yeah, it's quite a straight, whereas obviously you know
some of these girls.
They've been doing it sincethey were seven years old,

(06:23):
they've been nervous and doneall that, whereas I'm like I
don't know who I was and what Ineeded from it.

Speaker 1 (06:28):
You also took part in the London Marathon this April,
as if you hadn't had enoughamazing things this year and
you'd placed fourth, I think, inthe marathon in the
Commonwealth Games in 2018.
So how do you manage that kindof training on such vastly
different distances, from like100 metres to the marathon?

Speaker 2 (06:47):
I think that's like the most common question that we
get as wheelchair racers.
So how can you do that?
Because a sprinter would neverdo that Just completely, of
course, but a cyclist would anda swimmer would.
It's all about.
You know, obviously, whenyou're running you can only
focus on one thing at a time.
You're either sprinting andyou're taking long breaks
because you're putting outthrough so much power, or you're
doing longer runs and you'reendurance like you have to pick.

(07:08):
When you're a runner becausethere there's just obviously so
much going up through the groundinto your, there's nothing to
take the force, whereas on abike or in a racing chair or
when you're swimming, the forceisn't directly through you.
So even though when I'm forparis I was training for 100
meters, I was still doingprobably 60 miles a week, 70
miles a week.
I don't imagine many 100-metersprinters are doing that much.

(07:30):
But it's also if I roll 150fast, I'll roll the next 300
easy, so we can build up miles alot easier and a lot quicker
than other people.
The hardest thing in wheelchairracing is getting it going.
Once you've got it going, it'sjust about momentum and
endurance.
After that you know it's aweird one trying like explain
because it definitely.
I think if it was invented nowit'd probably be with cycling

(07:51):
and not so much with them withathletics, because it's very,
very different to it do you havea favorite to race or to train
for?
to train for would be the.
Would it be the marathon?
That's quite far.
I love training on the roadslike I really really enjoy that.
Like when I still lived at homemom and dad's I would just push
up and down our country roadbefore school in the morning and

(08:12):
that's what I've always.
I've always been an outdoorsperson.
So being outdoors and doingstuff like that, that's what I
really really enjoy.
I enjoy the 100 meters becauseit's technical and I like like
technical changes and that sortof thing.
I like analyzing and watchingback and so you know, I enjoy,
enjoy doing that as well.
I think my favorite eventprobably would be the 100, but

(08:32):
it is the one I get most nervousabout because you can't mess up
, because if you mess up thenit's gone and before you even
know it's gone.
So that one, yeah, definitelybrings a bit more pressure, but
when you get it right it's areally nice feeling.
You can normally know as wellwhich is really interesting.
I normally know from about 20meters in if I've got it right
how interesting is that?

Speaker 1 (08:52):
and and you're now training, I assume, for the
world championships in New Delhiin September no, I'm not
actually.

Speaker 2 (08:58):
Oh okay, which is a such a hard decision again to
make, yeah, and that manyathletes maybe don't understand
when I'm definitely like ashoo-in and to probably win a
medal as well.
But because I've struggled somuch, I've just decided to take
a bit of time out.
That's why I've done LondonMarathon and I'm going to do
Sydney Marathon at the end ofAugust as well, but because I
love training, that's never,ever an issue.

(09:19):
I don't have any problems withbeing motivated to train, but
the racing part, I just need tosort that out before I burn out,
you know, and I don't want toburn out before, really.
So it's like, okay, I'm justgoing to take this year, do
something I just enjoy withoutputting myself under so much
pressure, because I thinkpressure is great and I think
it's really really important tohave pressure, but I think
there's only so long you can.

Speaker 1 (09:39):
Your body can maintain that does that impact
your funding at all or in termsof it?
You need to be racing at worldchampionships or you can choose
no, we can choose.

Speaker 2 (09:48):
I think, um, because I've done so well last year, I'm
in a very privileged position,um, and I've spoken to the
british athletics and just said,like, if you want me to go to
la, I need time now, and I'mstarting to struggle with the
level of pressure and just myown, my own mind and um, it's
something I kind of want to talkabout a bit more, because I
haven't really I've told peopleI get sick and I'm nervous

(10:08):
before races, but it's actuallya bit more than that.
I do get extremely anxiousabout it, and it's not just the
night before, it's months beforeif I know that I'm racing.
So I just kind of want to workthat out so that when I get to
LA, I'm on that start line andI'm confident, both physically
and mentally.

Speaker 1 (10:26):
Not to at all compare my little triathlon foray to
what you're doing, but I didsome DB age group triathlon
stuff about five, six years agoand one of the reasons I stopped
was in the almost the weeksbefore, so two or three before I
would have this hideous senseof foreboding and fear and
anxiety.
I realized eventually I thinkit was about the swim start that
although I'm a strong swimmer,it was a swim start that caused

(10:48):
that anxiety and I tried to workthrough it anyway.
I didn't not stop doingtriathlon, but it was, but even
on a small scale.
I thought why am I doing thiswhen I have this horrible dread
and anxiety, almost for it wasfor two or three weeks
beforehand building up to it?
It's not a pleasant place to beand I don't compare that at all
with kind of where you are.
I'm a learner, you're racing,but I can completely understand

(11:09):
it's it.

Speaker 2 (11:09):
You know it's not something you would want in your
life and some people thrive offit and that's amazing, and I do
think it's important to putyourself in uncomfortable
situations.
I definitely don't think thatyou should ever shy away from
things, but yeah, it issomething that I really struggle
with and I would like to figurethat out.
Because I do the sport becauseI love it.
You know, it's not like we getpaid a lot to do it, so it's not
.
That's not the reason I do it.
It's because I love it and I'mnot that I'm falling out of love

(11:32):
with it, but it's just I'mfinding it harder to love racing
as much.
So I kind of just need a littlebit of time now just to kind of
work that out and just try andsee if there's anything I can do
with my sports psych to to makeit a bit easier.
Because I love, like when thegun goes, I love it, yeah, yeah,
it's just like that lead up onthe start line, that feeling.
Then just your body is awful toitself sometimes, the things
that it makes me think andbelieve, yeah, so it's just like

(11:54):
, as soon as the gun goes, Ilove it, I'm in my element,
that's what I do, um, but I justwant to, I want to enjoy the
whole thing, because I genuinelybelieve one day, when I'm lying
on my deathbed I don't thinkit's the medals I'm going to be
like, oh I'm really glad I wonthat medal.
I think it's going to be thememories and I don't want to
remember just being terrifiedand throwing up every morning
and not wanting to go and sitwith lots of people in the

(12:15):
dinner hall wanting to set up myown.
That's not how I want toremember my sport.
I want to remember it for, forall the good things.

Speaker 1 (12:25):
And how else has your training evolved, the physical
training over?
I guess more than a decade now,but the last 10 years?

Speaker 2 (12:29):
It's not changed too much.
Obviously, the mileage hasstepped up and because I'm
getting older, I'm needing to domore mileage, and that would
probably be the same.
I guess there's a lot moregoing into wheelchair racing and
they're now looking ataerodynamics and chairs and all
that sort of stuff.
So that's changing and trainingpeaks and things like that,
obviously, which put cyclists tokind of looking into a bit more
of that and just trying totrain a bit smarter, which is

(12:50):
something I struggle with,because I like to go as fast as
I can.
Every single time I get myracing chair, which is not good
for you, and so I'm trying tolearn.
You know that sort of thing.
And yeah, I think there's stillso much to learn in wheelchair
racing because it is still avery obviously underfunded sport
.
And yeah, you know, therethere's some countries where are
miles ahead of us and we'rejust kind of playing catch up,

(13:12):
which is exciting in some ways,because you're seeing how fast
they're going in like new fancyracing chairs and you're like,
okay, but it comes with a hugeexpense, which is because the
profile is building, which isamazing.
But it's then you knowcompanies like Honda and Sauber
and things are now buildingracing chairs, which has now
obviously pushed the price toridiculous levels.

Speaker 1 (13:33):
Yeah, yeah, it's interesting, isn't it, where
that goes to in the future, asyou kind of look ahead and I
guess, whether it's F1 or on thetrack, the cycling, we've kind
of seen that huge investmentthat does make a massive,
massive difference.

Speaker 2 (13:47):
so so you're really seeing that disparity with
countries that can afford toinvest in those at the moment
yeah, you know, it's kind oflike a catch-22 for for us
because we want to be seen as anelite sport, for, like cyclists
and things, their bikes arevery expensive.
So you know, if we want to beseen as elite sport, then that's
the way it's going to go.
Things are going to to be moreexpensive because there's going
to be more technology.
But power sport is meant to beabout inclusion and it's hard

(14:11):
enough to get onto fundinganyways.
But how do you get onto fundingif you can't afford a carbon
chair, because the carbon chairsare forcing the times to go
faster, so then it's even harderfor grassroots to get up to
those times.
So you're like, well, how isthat kid ever going to get onto
funding to be able to buy aracing chair if we're not
bridging that gap or helpingthem in any way?
As I said, it's catch 22because we want both of those

(14:32):
things.
Um, but it's quite a hard oneto kind of balance and manage
and how much is a top carbonchair?

Speaker 1 (14:38):
what, what kind of prices are people talking?

Speaker 2 (14:40):
you're talking about 35 to 50 000 pounds.

Speaker 1 (14:42):
Wow, wow, that really has jumped on, hasn't it from
yeah, and that's what I mean.

Speaker 2 (14:48):
That's with wheels and everything, so, um,
everything you need to race with.
So, but that's exhortation,isn't it?

Speaker 1 (14:55):
and can you take us back to your early life in the
Scottish borders?
What kind of chance did youhave before your injury?
But what was life like for youas a young girl?

Speaker 2 (15:04):
it was lovely.
It was nice.
I um brought up on a farm so Ihad lots of space to run and
play.
I enjoyed school.
I loved school.
I wanted to be a zoologistgrowing up because I was
absolutely obsessed with SteveIrwin, like a bit too much, like
I mourned his death for far toolong and, yes, that's what I
wanted to do.
I used to tell my dad, withlike the farm animals I'm going
to work with, like lions andtigers, so, yeah, that was kind

(15:27):
of what I'd had my heart set on.
Yeah, I loved school, had lotsof friends at school.
Yeah, it was a pretty normalchildhood, I guess.
Yeah, like mum and dad workedincredibly hard.
My first thing I'd do when Igot home would be take off my
school clothes and put on mywork clothes and go and find dad
on the farm and follow himaround like his shadow, which
I'm sure he hated sometimes, butI'm sure he looks back fondly
on now.

(15:47):
Yeah, so it was a nicechildhood and I love going back
home even now, just being ableto be in that open space and out
in the countryside.

Speaker 1 (15:56):
And at just 14, your life changed dramatically with a
spinal cord injury.
Are you okay to talk about whathappened and I know it's funny,
isn't it?
I was preparing this this.
I thought it's obviously partof your story, but I appreciate
it must be hard for you toconstantly have to revisit it as
part of your story.

Speaker 2 (16:12):
Yeah, do you know it's not, I'm not too bad
talking about it and thingsbecause I think it's important
to talk about it.
Um, because, one, it's part offarm safety, because there's so
many accidents happen on thefarm, so it's a good thing to
kind of um, obviously, mine'sslightly different to other farm
injuries and the fact that youknow it wasn't anyone else's

(16:32):
fault but myself.
But I know that a lot of them,farmers, do things without
thinking twice because they'vedone it every single morning,
kind of thing.
And the other thing is like Ihad zero idea that I was going
to be in a wheelchair.
I'd never seen anyone in awheelchair before my accident
and my mom and dad were alsogiven.
They were literally just told,oh, she'll never walk again, and
that was kind of it.
And I just think, if I'm ableto share my story and oh gosh,

(16:54):
god forbid, oh, it never happensto anyone but if there was a
parent and it was to happen tothem, they might be a bit more
like okay, well, she'll be okay,or he'll be okay, they'll be
okay, because I've heard this orI've seen this on telly and
I've seen.
And I'm not meaning sport, I'mmeaning just, you know, I'm
alive and thriving.
Yeah, and I think that would bereally important because my mom
and dad were just told she'llnever walk again and given no
more advice, and sent home.
So it was like I think it washarder for them in the first

(17:15):
moments than it was for me.
But yeah, so I.
It was the December of 2010 andI was meant to be doing my exams
at school and my best friendhad come over to study and we
got snowed in.
So it was like just fantastic.
I loved it.
And then I was getting to playevery day on the farm and help
my dad out, and on that morningmy dad was just clearing up the
snow with like a telehandler,like a forklift sort of thing,

(17:36):
and for some reason I genuinelyhave no idea why I thought this
would be a good idea.
I started to walk in front ofthe forklift, just really trying
to put them off, and then Ijust jumped on to part of it
like underneath, where the artof the main arm comes in, which
is something I'd never donebefore.
I was never allowed to goanywhere near machinery.
I was never allowed to touch it.
My dad used to say, likemachinery has no mercy for human
life, like he'd be, like itdoesn't care if I hurt you, just

(17:59):
don't be there, don't touch it.
So yeah, it's something that Iwould have no idea.
No idea why I thought it'd be agood idea.
But, yeah, I jumped on and Iwas just showing off to to my
friends and laughing away and Iwas.
I was certain that my dad hadseen me jump on, but he became
very clear quite quickly that heobviously hadn't seen me jump
on and start to just lower theshovel down and continue to do
his job and unfortunately, yeah,the, the pressure and

(18:22):
everything went straight down myspine.
I still remember, like thefeeling.
I remember feeling the pressureon the top of my neck and being
like dad, and I remember doingthis like, almost like manic
laugh, because I was like, ah,because I thought he was joking.
My dad was quite bad for takingthings too far with the child,
so I was like he's just joking.
And then I was like dad, dad,dad, and I remember just like
the sheer panic, thinking, oh,my God, I'm going to die.

(18:43):
And just in that feeling likebefore you know, before that I
couldn't, didn't feel much painat that moment.
It was just like guilt andbecause my dad loves his job and
my dad loves me, and I'm aboutto take two of those things away
from him right now by doingsomething so stupid in the
moment and not thinking twiceabout it was that your first
thought?

Speaker 1 (19:02):
was that your major thought?
At the time you felt that girl.

Speaker 2 (19:05):
I remember because I remember at one point it to me
it went in slow motion and whenI've watched dad use the, the
telehandler and forklift he isvery quick, but to me it was so
slow like I just remember myhead just like move, it like my
obviously my whole spine wasjust being crushed and my head
at one point was like in mycrotch and I remember just just

(19:25):
being like okay, and I rememberclosing my eyes, just thinking
okay, are you going to die now?

Speaker 1 (19:30):
And how did you not?
That's extraordinary in a way,how you didn't die, I know yeah.

Speaker 2 (19:36):
So like obviously after the accident they had to
bring insurance and stuff in andthey had to almost like put a
dummy into the space that I wasin.
And the guy was like we have noidea how you survived this.
And actually one of the doctorssaid to me that it was quite
probable.
The reason I did survive it wasbecause I'd done gymnastics
from such a young age and I wasso flexible so that almost like
my spine could take actuallyquite a lot, and because I could

(19:59):
squeeze into quite a small balland my muscles and ligaments
were quite loose because ofgymnastics.
And he reckons that might besomething that kind of saved me.
Yeah, I remember my dad bringingthe bucket back up and my eyes.
It felt like my heart wasbeating in my head, like that
adrenaline rush of like I needto get out now.
If I'm going to get out, I needto get out now.
I remember sliding myselfforward.
I remember looking down at myfeet because it felt weird, but

(20:21):
it wasn't like I could stillmove them, but I couldn't feel
them at all, and so like Ijumped down and landed in the
snow and I remember being likethis is so strange.
I was like I need to startrunning.
So I just kind of like ranforward and then I slipped and I
fell.
And that's when my dad's likeseen me obviously slip and fall
on the ground and he thought Ijust slipped and fell and
everyone kind of came, he hadn'tseen.

Speaker 1 (20:40):
At that point, he still hadn't known my friend had
, and so she'd obviously seen me.

Speaker 2 (20:46):
Yeah, it happened to me because she was walking
alongside which I should havebeen doing too.
Yeah, as I kind of like laythere in the snow, I just I knew
instantly, instantly that I'dbroken my back and I wasn't
gonna walk in and I don't knowwhy, because, again, I hadn't, I
hadn't really I knew, so Icould feel.
I turned, I put my hand by myback and I could feel the bone,
um, and I remember feeling itand being like, oh god, you've

(21:06):
really really.
And I remember looking down atmy feet and not feeling them.
So I just kind of, I guess Iput two and two together.
That you know.
Obviously I understood what thespinal cord was and I understood
that that that was very soreand you're probably not going to
get away with this one.
There's going to be some sortof consequence to this one.
And then, yeah, after that Iwas kind of just sent to the
spinal unit.
Well, I was.
I spent my local hospital firstand obviously got all the tests

(21:27):
and everything done, and thenhelicoptered through to the
local spinal unit in Glasgow andspent six months there doing
rehab.
Wow.

Speaker 1 (21:34):
Well, just the way you say, six months there.
But as a 14-year-old girl Imean just that.
How did you cope with that,both mentally and I guess that
whole your family, the impact onyour family, on your dad.

Speaker 2 (21:49):
Yeah, that whole your family, the impact on your
family, on your dad, yeah, Ithink like six months it was.
That was pretty hard becauseobviously I just turned yeah, I
was 14 in December, turned 15 inthe December.
You're at that age where you'restarting to do some parties and
you're starting to go out withyour friends and I was like
seeing what they were doing butI wasn't able to do it and you
kind of think maybe I'll neverbe able to do that and that was
quite.
That was probably the hardestpart was just kind of seeing

(22:10):
everyone else move forward,where you're like it's almost.
I feel like the way I explain aspinal injury to everyone is
like it's like being born again,but you have all the added
frustrations that you alreadyhave learned it.
Yeah, you remember how easy itwas to get out of bed in the
morning and now everything justtakes so much longer, especially
at the start.
I remember having to dressmyself for the first time and
someone giving me some leggingsand I'm like how do I do this

(22:33):
when I can't lift my bum off it?
Like, how am I even justrolling and rolling around in
the bed and thinking this is,I'm just gonna have to be naked
for the rest of my life becauseI'm never gonna be doing this.
So it's awful, but obviouslyeventually you do.
But yeah, mum and dad wereprobably two hours away from
Glasgow and I was in an adult'shospital and it's not a normal
hospital, it's a rehabilitationhospital, so mum and dad were
only allowed once.
I was obviously into the actualrehab side of the hospital.

(22:55):
Mum and dad weren't allowed upthrough the week.
They were only allowed up forthe weekends and I was 14.
And I had to do my own washing.

Speaker 1 (23:07):
And I had to, and that was the closest person in
age with me and how do you feelthat's impacted?
It's almost like having met youand I don't know you well, but
I met you over the years.
How do you feel that hasimpacted you as the person now,
because it's such a formativetime?
I've got three kids.
I've been through that agemyself, that key time of 15 to
16 and so on, and then nothaving that parental you know,
home life yeah, I think I grewup pretty quickly because I

(23:31):
realized what I found funny.

Speaker 2 (23:33):
All these older people in the in the hospital
didn't find us funny.
So I am, yeah, I had to kind ofgrow up quite quickly and just
learn to be this, this new me,and I didn't cry very often.
Um, I don't think I actuallycried until I got out of
hospital about my accident,which is probably quite strange.
But I feel like in hospital Iwas so aware of how lucky I was

(23:57):
because you know, you're in award of 10 other people.
Some people are can't evenbreathe for themselves, some
people can't move their arms ortalk or do lots of stuff.
So I automatically felt reallyquite lucky that the only thing
I couldn't do was move my legs.
I think they were kind ofunsure whether they were going
to send me to the children'shospital or the um adults

(24:18):
hospital, and I think I'm gladthey sent me to the adults
hospital because I imagine itwould have been the other way,
right, I probably would havebeen one of the older ones in
the children's also.
That probably would have beenquite weird.
But yeah, I feel like I justkind of adapted pretty well.
I was quite aware quite quicklythat I was one of the lucky
ones and I just had to get onwith it.

Speaker 1 (24:40):
I feel like I'm asking you the same in terms of
your working with a sportspsychologist, but did you have
therapy?
Was there support in terms ofyour mental well-being through
your rehabilitation?

Speaker 2 (24:50):
yeah, no, we had, um, we had like someone that had to
do like a assessment on us whenwe first came in and then
before you left, but he, wedidn't go on very well I think
he told me, um, he was like, sohow often have you cried?
And I was like I haven't, I'venot cried yet.
And he was just like, oh well,if you don't cry now, then it'll

(25:12):
hit you when you get to about50 and you'll be depressed.
And I was like great, thank you, thanks for that.
Yeah, but I think a lot ofpeople were very confused by the
way I dealt with it, which isjust because that's, you know, I
was brought up quite aware ofconsequences and it seems quite
strange, but mom and dad workedincredibly long hours and so
quite often nobody was in thehouse and you know I was left to

(25:34):
set my alarm at night, makesure I got up in the morning,
get on the school bus myself,and if I didn't, you know my dad
were never forceful with evenlike studying or anything like
that.
They were just kind of likeit's your life, but if you fail,
then you feel like it.
They were, yeah, quite quicklyaware of like consequence if I
stood the wrong place in thelamb and shed and got smacked by
a lamb, dad was like well,there's a consequence to every

(25:55):
action.
So I think I just kind of putthat head on as soon as I kind
of realized that this was quiteserious and obviously as well.
You know, when my mom and dadcame in to like speak to me
about what happened, my mum wasjust screaming and crying and my
dad couldn't even look at meand I knew in that moment, like
if I start crying they'll neverstop.
So I just kind of need to getgoing and I never, ever want my
dad to blame himself for forbeing part of it, and that's,

(26:17):
you know, people always ask methat as well.
Like, how does your dad feel?
I'm like I'm sure he feelspretty rotten.
No parent would even want to beinvolved in any way, let alone
actually be driving the, thevehicle.
So me and my dad talk about it alot, which is I think it's
really good and I think it'schanged my, my family and my dad
a lot.

(26:37):
And my dad would say that youknow he obviously is a farmer,
you have ridiculous long hours,but his life was farming too
much.
You know he was lucky that Ienjoyed being on the farm, or I
would never have spent any timewith my dad.
He was over the weekend and wasspeaking to him about it.
I mean we're talking aboutsports days because obviously
it's different sports days andthings.
Just now and dad said one ofhis biggest regrets is he never

(26:58):
watched me on sports day and youlike after my accident he was
like, okay, yeah, you actuallycould have died and I would have
had all these regrets.
Now I can't get rid of him.
He comes to every single raceand I'm like dad, I'm nearly 30,
you need to leave me alone now.
But you know, I think,thankfully it changed our, our
family positively, because Iknow it can put a lot of strain

(27:18):
on on families and onrelationships and that sort of
thing, but because I neverblamed them and I never, ever
will, um, I think that helpedit's interesting.

Speaker 1 (27:26):
A couple of my friends are from Yorkshire,
farming families way back whenthey live locally here, and one
of them particularly has thatreally grounded.
This is as it is.
I do wonder whether there'salmost that when you experience
life, a life and death, and youknow everything in between on a
farm life, whether that it's my,it's a very small straw pole of
two women that I knew that grewup in that environment, but

(27:48):
very grounded.
Matter of fact, this is as itis.
Uh, yeah, yeah.
Of all the friends I have, yeah, yeah, that's how I was.

Speaker 2 (27:55):
I was very much like okay, because, honestly, of
course, there was nights whereI'd lie there and I think, oh
gosh, why, why has this happenedto me?
I remember going down the routeof sometimes being like did I
know something really bad in apast life that then has made
this is what happened to me, butI think it was a realization
that I had one night and I can.
I was like I can sit here everynight before bed and be annoyed
of why did I do that.

(28:15):
The frustration of now look howit's left me.
What if I never get to do this?
What if I never get to that?
And I can sit there and wallow,but tomorrow morning I'm going
to wake up and I'm still goingto be paralyzed.
But there's nothing I can doabout that.
All I can do now is just likemake sure that I give myself
every opportunity to succeed insomething, and I was just so, so
lucky that I found sport andfound something that I love
doing and I was able to pushmyself in and and that I was

(28:37):
good at as well and how did youfind wheelchair racing?

Speaker 1 (28:40):
what was it that kind of drew you to it or introduce
you to it?

Speaker 2 (28:44):
so I found it through when I was in the spinal unit.
So they were really, reallygreat.
My, my physiotherapist, claire,was actually honestly the best
woman.
I put everything down to her.
You know how able I am.
People are always saying to megosh, you're so able.
And I'm like, because she spentso much time with me and effort
and wanted me to be as able asI could.
She, I remember asking me do,do you like sport?
And I was like, yeah, I lovesport.

(29:05):
But again, I grew up in an erawhere I didn't see women doing
sport.
I'd done gymnastics, I'd donehockey, I'd done rugby, I played
lots of sports, but I neverknew I could be a sports person.
I was never.
I didn't know that was a job.
I'd never watched a womancompete on the telly, so I
didn't know that was somethingthat I could even be or do.
So it wasn't in my realms ofthinking at all.
So when she was like, yeah,like did you?
I was like, yeah, yeah, Ienjoyed being active.

(29:27):
Yeah.
So she was like, sent me downto the spinal unit games, which
is something that happens.
It's Willpower, who's thecharity kind of run it, and it's
in Sokman and Avobar each other, and the way you compete is
that you literally get a sheetwith all the different sports on

(29:48):
it and you work your way aroundand you get ticked if you've
tried everything.
And so I was literally tryingeverything and I remember just
being in awe of all the sportsthat could be adapted, which
seems so stupid, because ofcourse they can be.
There's no reason for thingsnot to be adapted.
It's actually very simple, butI just I'd never seen it and I
didn't realize it was going tobe.
You know, it was going to be.
Something I was going to beable to take part in again was
the sport.

(30:08):
So, yeah, I tried tennis andbadminton and rugby and curling
and fencing and table tennis,and yeah, I literally tried
every sport.
And then it was the last morningwe were going to try athletics
and I thought that was the one.
I really didn't understand howthey were going to get me to do
athletics.
I remember just being like Ican't run, I'm not sure what

(30:29):
you're expecting from here.
And I went down and there wasthis girl her name was Nikki
Emerson and she was going aroundon the track and she's in a
silver chair with pink stars.
I still remember it so clearlyand I was watching her go around
and I remember just thinkingshe's cool, like I remember her
back muscles and our biceps andjust been like, yes, that's who
I'm going to be.
And that was it.
Like I was honestly just likefrom watching someone I was

(30:49):
hooked and I got into um TanaGray Thompson's husband's racing
chair, which Ian Thompson so hewas the first one to put me in
a racing chair at that SaltMandeville Games and he was like
to me you know, I think youcould be good at this and
obviously I'd had somethingpretty traumatic happen to me.
So for anyone to say you couldbe good at this, I was like I'm
taking that and running with it,thank you.
So that was it.
I literally got home to my dadand I was like, right, I have a

(31:11):
plan now, but again, still notthinking that it was going to be
a job, I was just more.
It was nice to be doingsomething that I was with people
that were, that were the sameas me, and that's kind of why I
fell in love with wheelchairracing.
To start with you, my firstever race was London Mini
Marathon and I think at somepoints I thought it was just
going to be me on the start line, because there's not that many
of us in Scotland and I wentdown and there was just like

(31:32):
there was like 60 of us and justlooking around and being like
this is so cool.
And obviously that was.
That was year 2012, so it waslike Jade Jones I was racing
with and she literally went toLondon 2012.
And I remember just being likethat's mental, like this is so
cool.
So I was absolutely hooked bythem.

Speaker 1 (31:48):
And how easy was it to find a coach, to get a chair,
to have a chance to train.
You talked about those lovelycountry lanes to train in, but
how easy was that for you whenyou got back from the hospital?

Speaker 2 (31:59):
Again, I have to put it all down to Claire, my physio
.
I literally came back and I waslike this sport's cool and
she'd done all the research,found Red Star and Ian Murfin
and Janice Eaglesham like sheliterally out of her hours came
and picked me up one night, tookme to the track when they were
training and I got to have alittle look at me, ian.
And then she took me to anothertasting day as well, like

(32:20):
taster day, to try differentsports.
But she knew Ianan and janicewere going to be there too, so I
got to meet them again and then, yeah, start to raise some
money for a race into him.
I think that's one thing.
I'm really lucky that I comefrom such a small area that
everyone knew about my accidentand everyone wanted to help.
So people were quite happy.
Small businesses were giving me, you know, a couple hundred
pound here and there, which was,you know, went a long way.

(32:41):
So I managed to get my get myfirst racing chair at the start
of 2012.

Speaker 1 (32:44):
And what's her full name?
Your physio?
I feel we should give her ashout out, because she sounds
like an extraordinary woman.

Speaker 2 (32:49):
She is an extraordinary woman.
Well, it was Claire Lincoln,but I don't.
She married, she is.
She's still got it as ClaireLincoln on her Facebook, so
we'll go with that.

Speaker 1 (32:59):
That's amazing, isn't it?
What an incredible impact oneperson can have and I guess that
ripple effect then on you andthen all the impact you're
having for other kind of youngpeople to see what you've
achieved, and so on.
Through what?
Through that one person'sactions.

Speaker 2 (33:14):
It's amazing, isn't it yeah, I think, I think that
sometimes all you need is youneed that one person to believe
in you.
You know that one person thatyou respect because she spent
six hours a day for six monthswith me, which is a long time.
So, you know, she got to knowme very well and, yeah, it was
nice to have the support fromsomeone that wanted to me to be
as able as I could be and atwhat point did you realize that

(33:37):
you could make a career of, ortake it very seriously, from
that mini marathon in 2012?
so I kept racing.
I just raced, like in Britainin 2012 and then in 2013.
My coach was like right, Ithink we should get you
classified, which everypara-athlete needs to get done,
so that you can race againstpeople with the same injury

(33:57):
level or disability as you.
So I got sent to, we went toDubai, which was very exciting,
and I got classified over thereas a T53.
And quite quickly, because Iwas classified as a T53, it
meant that I could be on funding.
So I feel like as soon as thatkind of happened, I was a bit
like oh, is this a job?
What's happening here?
And then, as soon as I was putonto funding, you kind of then

(34:17):
start going to all the GB daysand learning all about that and
learning all about that andfiguring out that if I actually
want this to be my career, Ijust need to keep training
harder and start winning somemedals.

Speaker 1 (34:28):
And what is it you think that makes you such an
amazing athlete fastest in theUK in terms of wheelchair racing
?
Do you look and think?
Obviously you're determined andyou train hard, but are there
other elements do you think thathave made you have that success
?

Speaker 2 (34:46):
My dad says it's farm strength.
I don't know.
I don't know what it is.
I was always active.
As I said, if I was ever goingto be grounded, my dad didn't
take anything off me, it wasyou're not going outside and I
would be in the sobs.
I'd be like you can't do thatto me.
What am I supposed to do inthis house?
I've always been into justrunning around and playing and
yeah, so I feel like that's justkind of put me in good stead

(35:06):
and transferable.
You know, being doinggymnastics and being flexible.
Obviously, wheelchair racingand your shoulders need to be
pretty pretty good and um andstrong and powerful.
And I was always quite strongand powerful because, because
I'd done gymnastics for such along time, I just loved it.
I loved how hard it was, likethat's what I loved the most.
It was like how technical itwas.
I love, I love things that arelike technical and I used to

(35:28):
just train with like loads ofmirrors around me and try and
get the push perfectly.
I'd watch races and races overand over again on YouTube and I
don't know I don't really knowstill why how I got so fast so
good it's really interesting.

Speaker 1 (35:40):
it's interesting almost that you don't know, but
obviously there is that sciencebehind it and the technicality
and the understanding you wenton to make your Paralympic debut
in Rio in 2016.
So what do you remember aboutthat Paralympic experience?

Speaker 2 (35:56):
Yeah, it was mad.
Obviously, I got to go toCommonwealth Games in 2014, so
I'd already experienced thevillage.
So I'd already experienced thevillage, but that was obviously
it wasn't just disabled people,so I think there was only yeah,
there wasn't very many disabledsports.
It's not like you were justsurrounded by lots of
wheelchairs or anything.
When you go to Paralympics, yourealise this must be a
logistical nightmare, but theymake it work and I don't know

(36:17):
how they do it, but it'sabsolutely incredible and it's
like a little village where youdon't need to worry about
accessibility.
For me anyways.
I know that you know some.
You know having differentimpairments is still very
difficult, but for me it's justlike a little accessible village
, a perfect place.
Yes, a perfect little villagefor me, spending time with all

(36:38):
my training partners and doingthat sort of thing.
But I remember I think Rio wasthe first time that I was like
really nervous.
I'd done races and I'd doneCommonwealth Games, but again, I
had really hadn't been doing itvery long.
I mean, I was still ill in themorning.
I remember in 2014.
But when I got on to the startline, I didn't feel very nervous
at all.
I was kind of okay about it, um, whereas in Rio people take it

(37:02):
a lot more seriously becausethat is possible level and
everyone wants to win.
So nobody's talking to you andit's terrifying.
And I was just literallythought I was trying to convince
my coach in the morning that Ishould go home because I'm ill
and he was like just nerves.
And I was like these can't bejust nerves, I actually feel
awful.
My heart was like pounding, Iwas like sweating.
Yeah, it was a really weirdfeeling and I definitely didn't

(37:30):
do as well as I wanted to do inthe first few races.
And then I remember getting tomy 800 and I think I was ranked
like 10th in the world, sodidn't know if I was going to
make the final.
And I remember my coach justsaying like just throw
everything at it.
And I remember I didn't want toleave my first games, not
feeling like I'd achieved what Iwanted to achieve.
I think I came fifth in the 100meters and probably should have
come fourth from where mystanding was.
I got disqualified in the 400.
And I was just like I can'tleave like this, like I can't, I
need to do better and yeah, Iabsolutely just went for it in

(37:51):
that 800.
And I remember tasting blood atthe end I tasted blood within
about 200 meters and andpersonal best, which was amazing
, like that was my first record.
I had to do it in a Paralympicyou know heat as well and then I

(38:13):
went on to the final and I gotanother PB and I think I came
fifth in the end, which for meat that time I was gosh.
I was so happy.
And I remember saying to my dadlike, like, after the races I
sat with him to watch the girlsthat I just like watched, well,
raced with sorry, and I watchedthem get their medals.
And I remember just turned tomy dad and be like, one day
that'll be me.
One day that's that's gonna beme.

(38:34):
And I feel like I'm so luckythat I was able to go to games
where there wasn't anyexpectation and I did just get
to go out there and have fun.
I mean, mean, I was terrifiedand I felt like I'd inhaled the
Sahara Desert every single timeI went out into the stadium.
But it was an incredibleexperience and my best friend
came, my mum and dad and mycoach's wife, janice, came, and
loads of people come and supportme all the way to Rio, which is

(38:56):
mad, and it was just like areally nice thing to share with
other people, because we didn'tknow about the Paralympics.
Really, obviously, we watchedLondon 2012,.
But it's very different beingthere and my mum and dad
actually watching me there.
Yeah, it was a very surrealthing where it was like, okay,
no, no, this has ignitedsomething.

Speaker 1 (39:15):
And how has that evolved then through to Tokyo
and then Paris, was thatexperience very different?
I guess Tokyo was different onmany levels, wasn't it?
It was pretty awful.

Speaker 2 (39:27):
Yeah, I struggled with Tokyo a lot because, as I
say, I'm not the mostcompetitive person in the world.
So when I am racing, what Ilove most in the world is people
there, and I remember winningmy first Paralympic medal and
looking up and being like thisis sad.
And then phoning my dad.
They had a big marquee in thegarden and all their friends

(39:48):
right.
They were having a lovely timeand I was like I'm not even
gonna see you for another.
Yeah, I was just like gosh,that's, this is not how I
thought I'd ever.
Yeah, and it's not like wecould even go out.
We were literally had to stayin the village and spit in a
tube every morning and it's just, it was.
Yeah, it was pretty, prettyhorrible and I feel bad for any
athlete that that was their oneand only games.

Speaker 1 (40:04):
I was going to say that it's tough.
If you then didn't, at leastyou then had the opportunity in
Paris to have family and on agood time zone and everything as
well too for people to watch.

Speaker 2 (40:14):
Yeah, exactly, yeah.
So Rio was amazing because justthe culture and everything was
just so incredibly different towhat I'm used to.
Tokyo not so much Again, justmore learning curves, though.
But Paris was amazing.
It was just so cool, the citydone it so well.
The crowds were so loud, likedeafening loud, because they

(40:36):
said the way that the stadiumwas made was like so all the
sounds came straight into thetrack and it, honestly, was like
it was actually deafening thenoise.
It was incredible.
So that was really fun to beable to be a part of that.

Speaker 1 (40:47):
That's lovely.
I was there for the rugbysevens actually, so the same.
But you're right, just like acauldron of noise, it was
amazing.

Speaker 2 (40:55):
Yeah, everyone was up for it and that's why it was so
cool and even the locals werepretty excited by it and yeah,
it was fun.

Speaker 1 (41:01):
And how do you define success?
And obviously we've talked toher, didn't we?
That gold medal, but acrossyour career, has that definition
changed for you?
Do you think in terms of whatsuccess looks like?

Speaker 2 (41:14):
Yeah, I think success is just happiness.
I don't think success shouldever be pinned on to anything
specific, because I think that'sa really dangerous place to
live and I think that's that's.
That's what I've learned isthat as long as I'm happy and as
long as I will be happy after,then I think that's success.

Speaker 1 (41:33):
And I was going to move on to talk a bit about your
TV career.
But we love you on Country,absolutely love you on Country
Far.
So I wonder how did that comeabout and how you found that.
Did it feel like a very natural?
Clearly you've been in thatworld of the farming world for
so long, but in terms of beingin front of camera and talking,
how was that for you?

Speaker 2 (41:53):
Yeah.
So I got contacted when I wason holding camp, of course, in
some training camp somewhere.
And yeah, they contacted me andI just done like a little
meeting with them and they askedif I would fancy doing a guest
presenting slot.
And I was like, yeah, theycontacted me and I just done
like a little meeting with themand they asked if I would fancy
doing a guest presenting slotand I was like, yeah, that
sounds incredible.
I was like, you know, I'venever done this before, like no
idea what I'm doing.
And they're like, yeah, it'sfine, like we'll come down, like

(42:15):
we'll obviously be there.
This was the producers andthings like that.
They were like, oh, you'll havemore people on, like there'd be
a lot of people there to helpyou and support you, and that
sort of thing and I was likeokay, yeah, cool, but like
that'll be fun and I thinkthat's probably the proudest my
dad's ever been of me.
When I phoned him to tell himI'm going to go country, well, I
uh, yeah.
So I just kind of got thatphone call and I thought it was
just going to be a one-off.
I didn't think it was going tobe any more than that.

(42:41):
And then I feel like I wouldhave been a lot more on edge if
that had been the case.
So, yeah, literally maybe twoweeks later I um well, after
it'd been aired and stuff got aphone call just to ask if I
wanted to be a full-timepresenter.
And that kind of is how thatall kind of came about and
happened.
And yeah, it was all verysurreal and I feel very lucky,
um, that that they did find meand they're keeping me on.

(43:02):
So that's really nice.
But I don't, yeah, I don't findit very difficult.
I don't find it anywhere nearas terrifying as racing, nowhere
near.

Speaker 1 (43:12):
It's interesting, isn't it?
And I guess a bit of that ishow good they are at putting you
at ease and you're in your, andI love watching I think it was
the last we're not so I, but youwith your dad, on the farm with
your dad and interact anyway.
That makes me laugh.
The relationship and the chatthat the two of you have.

Speaker 2 (43:28):
It's very, that's very real and really nice to see
too yeah, I feel like, um, it'sprobably sounded really really
strange because obviously I'mthe presenter, but like, I don't
feel like the limelight's on meand I like that.
I like that I'm getting togetting the opportunity to share
someone else's story and that'swhat, what I enjoy doing.
I love all I watch.
I've not watched any Disneymovies my friends hate me for it

(43:49):
but I have watched everydocumentary from you know,
stacey Dooley and Louis Theroux.
I've watched so many.
Like, I love that sort of thing, just getting to know someone
and finding out.
I'm naturally a curious person.
I like to know about people andwhat they do, and especially if
someone's passionate someone'spassionate about stick I could

(44:10):
sit and listen to them talkabout the stick not a problem
and ask questions about why.
So I yeah, I don't.
I don't find it too terrifyingand the cameras as well, like
the team are so friendly and sonice that it just doesn't.
Yeah, it's not something.
It's something that I reallyreally look forward to when I
know it's coming around and Idon't get nervous at all for it,
and how much are you doing?

Speaker 1 (44:25):
how much filming is there at the moment?

Speaker 2 (44:27):
I normally try and do like one a month, yeah, but it
depends obviously how busy I am,um, but they're very good like
that.
Thankfully they're.
You know I've not got any.
I don't have to do a certainamount, um, which is very good.
They just kind of ask me canyou do this day?
And if I can't do it, that'sfine.
If I can, great, um, butobviously there's times in the
season where I'm like I can domore.
Now, please send me, then I'llgo wherever.
And yeah, that's kind of how itworks, which is it works really

(44:49):
well with, obviously, sport andtraining.
I think I've taken my race likeI'd done loads before Paris, and
I think there was a few peoplethat were like, are you sure you
should be doing?
Like, is this not going toimpact?
But for me but again, becausesport wasn't something I always
wanted to do, I've got some,I've got another personality
that I wanted to explore and Iactually felt like it was like a
distraction in a good way,though you know, it wasn't like

(45:09):
I was going to the pub anddrinking hundreds of pints and
eating really sloppy food.
I was just going and speakingto people, I was bringing my
racing chair, I was training,and I've trained in every
primary and up and down thecountry, I'm sure, and, yeah, I
was still still doing all of,but it just meant that through
the day I wasn't as fixated on.
I've got Paralympic Gamescoming up.
What if this is my last one?
Oh, my goodness, what if I need?

(45:29):
Like?
I was just doing somethingcompletely different and, yeah,
my mind was being distracted bysomething else.

Speaker 1 (45:35):
You are lovely to watch.
I love watching you, and itmight be that it's because
you're so natural, you're in theright environment, and so on.
Is it something that you, foryou, and clearly other people do
, because they've kept you onand keep bringing you back, but
is it something that you'd liketo do more of in terms of future
career?

Speaker 2 (45:51):
yeah, that's definitely what I would like to
do in the future, and so I'mjust kind of like picking along
at that just now.
Obviously, it's going to take along time, which is completely
understandable, because nobodyputs wants to put you on live tv
without experience, but thenhow do you experience with live
tv?
And so that's kind of whatwe're trying to work out and
negotiate just now and I'mfiguring out how that might look
in the future, which is reallyexciting because, yeah,
unfortunately, sport isn't goingto be there forever, and I've

(46:13):
I've watched so many peoplecontinue in sport, although
they're not loving it, justbecause they've got nothing else
, and I don't ever want to bethat.
Or when they stop, it'sterrifying.
It's like an identity crisis,which I totally get, and I just
I just want that transition atsome point, hopefully when it's
my choice, you know to me tohave sort of an idea of where

(46:35):
I'm going to go with it.

Speaker 1 (46:36):
We mentioned, in terms of representation and a
little bit around, theCommonwealth Games, where you're
kind of included, but perhapsnot to the same level as and we
see that, don't we, with theDiamond League events and so on,
where there is somerepresentation.
How are you feeling at themoment in terms of that wider
sport and representation fordisability?
What do you feel needs toimprove still?

Speaker 2 (46:59):
I mean the Diamond Leagues.
It's actually a joke.
They frustrate me so muchbecause even when they do invite
us, where we could be on a 1035 and the tv coverage will
start at 10, 10, 40, and youjust think I give us the chance
and the opportunity and and theonly reason we're ever going to
get big sponsors is if we canactually give them something.

(47:19):
But I, I offer.
I'm like you go to companiesand you say, can you sponsor me?
And they go well, yeah, whatcan you do for me?
And I say, well, I can come andtalk to your company.
That's kind of the only thing Ican offer, because I can't wear
your kit, because I can't wearthe competitions that I'm on
telly, because that would be theParalympic Games, because I
don't get the opportunity torace the Diamond Leagues, where
you know, if I had a chance torace the Diamond Leagues, it's
going to be on BBC.
I could go to companies and say,well, I could put your name on

(47:41):
the side of my racing chair.
That will be on the BBC atseven o'clock on a Monday night.
But I don't get thatopportunity.
So it makes it very, verydifficult.
And then, obviously, money.
You know we only have lotteryfunding.
We don't get prize money unlessyou're doing the marathons no
other way to win prize money.

Speaker 1 (48:09):
So it makes it very, very difficult when you're ever
not invited to any of those sortof races, which I just think
that is something that theydefinitely could do.

Speaker 2 (48:12):
Has it got any better across your career, or I think
it's probably kind of ebbs andflows like it.
There's bits where you think,like this year we don't even
have an event in the londondiamond league, which is just a
joke, nothing wow, yeah oh mygoodness, which isn't fair.
No, no, um, so so I don't thinkany of them.
We've got one in Eugene, butnone of the Brits have been
invited to them.

Speaker 1 (48:30):
I thought it was more than that.

Speaker 2 (48:31):
I don't know why I thought I guess it's because
it's a little bit, and then youjust assume each year there's
going to be more, one in Zurichand one in Lucerne, but they're
just and is anybody campaigningand making noise?

Speaker 1 (48:43):
here?
But who is out there?

Speaker 2 (48:45):
Yeah, johnny Peacock done a good bit, like at Paris.
That was like one of the thingshe really tried to push when he
was getting interviewed.
I just think we all kind ofneed to stand together a bit and
say right, I think we've beenoff.
I think that at some point wewere kind of offered, you know,
maybe we could be part of theLondon Diamond League, but we
wouldn't get any prize moneyyeah that's not fair.
It's not.
It's not right when you knowthe able bodies are winning ten

(49:05):
thousand pounds and you can'teven give us the hundred pound
that you gave us last year yeahright, it's just yeah, it's,
it's, it's, it's unfair, um, andit's something that I hope.
I hope at some point I'll change.
I really really do, because Ithink that we deserve it,
especially with how expensivethings are going in our sport.
We're winning, yeah, we'redoing, but yeah, it's a shame
that we kind of only have thatone you know, whatever the major

(49:27):
is that year to kind of showourselves.
I mean, this year it's not evenbeen shown on telly the World
Champs.

Speaker 1 (49:31):
Is it not Mm-mm?
Oh, my goodness, I know.
Okay, again, that assumptionthat you assume it will be.

Speaker 2 (49:38):
So there'll probably be like a YouTube live Channel 4
and doing anything for it, andI don't think that's just to
blame for Channel 4.
I think it's the IPC andeveryone else involved that
you're not pushing it hardenough and trying to get as much
coverage as possible.

Speaker 1 (49:52):
Yeah, in a while we'll be talking about
inspiration and all the amazingthings that you're doing and
then actually, if people aren'table to kind of see that and
celebrate that, that is sodisappointing, isn't't it?
I know that you clearly you'rean amazing role model,
especially for young people withdisabilities.
As you say, what do you hopeyour impact, your visibility

(50:13):
could have for that nextgeneration and and I guess,
people of all ages it's not justyoung people, is it?

Speaker 2 (50:18):
yeah, exactly, people of all ages.
But I think for for youngpeople, I hope that me, you know
, they can see me and know thatanything's possible.
And because I think, as a kidwith a disability, when you're
faced sometimes so manyobstacles, you can think that
things aren't possible, and Iwould hate that.
I'd hate to think that there'sa child sitting one day and
thinks, you know, because theycan't get into their school on

(50:39):
their own, they're never goingto amount to anything, or if
that's something they'veoverheard or if that's something
you know.
I hope that seeing myself onthe screen, you know, not even
just doing sport, but doingcountry fowl, doing, you know
we're entitled to have everyopportunity, just like everyone
else, um, so you know, I hope,hope that and I hope for for
everyone, um, I hope I can show,like, the power of sport.

(51:01):
It's something I really try andshow my friends because I think
it's really difficult, as awoman especially.
You know we've done sport atschool and then you leave and if
you're not part of a team it'squite hard to keep going and a
lot of my friends are like I'dlove to go to the gym, but I'm
terrified, I don't know where tostart and I just think that's
so sad.
I think you can't really bebothered to do this, but I

(51:24):
always feel better after I have.
Yeah, oh, I always do, and it'sjust like it doesn't have to be
going out and running as fastas you can, it's just going out
for a walk and I think it reallychanges and elevates people's
emotions and mental health.
And because it does mine, Iknow I know how much it helps
mine.
If I was trapped inside all day,every day, I would go stir
crazy.
I know, I know I would.
But I think, especially as thewarmer months and stuff, I think

(51:45):
just people just to get out andI think that's what Contra Fowl
shows really nicely is allthese places you can go in
Britain that are just full andpeaceful for people to actually
just enjoy that.
So, yeah, hopefully I can showpeople that anything is possible
.

Speaker 1 (51:59):
Just finally looking back on your journey so far.
But from your injury, yourParalyic gold, your TV
presenting and everything elsein between, what do you feel
you're most proud of?
I know there's a lot more tocome in the future, but what do
you feel most proud of today?

Speaker 2 (52:15):
I think I'm just really proud of the person I'm
becoming Overall, I would say,in my personal life.
I managed to buy a house, whichis incredible.
I'm married, which isincredible, and I'm married,
which is, you know, amazing.
I've managed to, like, conquerquite a lot of what I've wanted
to achieve it by this pointwhich, gosh, I'm so so grateful

(52:36):
for because I, you know, I'vejust been so lucky and been
given opportunities and I'venever said no and just kind of
run with them and taken oneverything that, you know, I
don't think there's even onemoment I could pinch at.
I mean, I mean crossing thatline in Paris and knowing I'd
done it and knowing that, youknow, if I never do it again I'd
done it and having my dadstanding there just crying, and

(52:58):
you know that that lap where Ihad to go to see, like I had 25
of my friends and family, thatmoment was amazing, you know.
And especially after the race,they all stood up on like the
just outside the stadium, and Iwent up to see them and just
everyone screaming and runningand spent sharing that that
moment with with everyone else.
You know the people that havekept me sane.
That moment is something I'llremember for the rest of my life
.

Speaker 1 (53:22):
Thank you to Sami for speaking so openly about her
story and what we can all do toensure sport is more inclusive
for everyone.
I'm excited to follow hercareer on and off the track in
the years ahead.
If you'd like to hear from moreextraordinary women like Sami,
there are over 200 episodes ofthe Game Changers that are free
to listen to on all podcastplatforms or from our website at

(53:46):
fearlesswomencouk.
My guests have included eliteathletes like Sammy, along with
entrepreneurs, broadcasters,scientists, agents, journalists,
ceos all women who are changingthe game in sport.
Other Paralympic champions haveincluded Ellie Simmons, tanni
Grey-Thompson, sarah Story,lauren Steadman and Anne

(54:08):
Wafula-Streich.
As well as listening to all thepodcasts on the website, you
can also find out more about theWomen's Sport Collective, a
free, inclusive community forall women working in sport.
We now have over 13,000 membersacross the world, so please do
come and join us.

(54:28):
The whole of my book Game On theUnstoppable Rise of Women's
Sport is also free to listen toon the podcast.
Every episode of Series 13 isme reading a chapter of the book
.
Thank you once again to SportEngland for backing the Game
Changers and the Women's SportCollective with the National
Lottery Award, and also to SamWalker at what Goes On Media,

(54:51):
who does such an excellent jobas our executive producer.
Thank you also to my brilliantand talented colleague, kate
Hannan at Fearless Women.
At Fearless Women, you can findthe Game Changers podcast on
all platforms, so please followus now.
You won't miss out on futureepisodes.

(55:12):
Come and say hello on socialmedia, where you'll find me, at
Sue Anstis on LinkedIn and onInstagram.
The Game Changers Fearlesswomen in sport.