March 12, 2025 • 35 mins
In this special episode of the Historical Romance Sampler podcast, trailblazer, icon, and bestselling author Beverly Jenkins sits down for an interview. Jenkins shares her journey from her first book 'Nightsong' to her expansive career spanning 30 years. We talk about how she stays inspired to keep writing, the evolution of the genre, her research process, and future projects.
00:00 Introduction to the Historical Romance Sampler Podcast
00:37 Special Guest: Beverly Jenkins
01:37 Beverly Jenkins' Journey to Becoming a Writer
04:37 The Evolution of Romance and Representation
09:28 Writing Process and Inspirations
18:25 Future Projects and Reflections
27:07 Fun Segment: Love it or Leave it
33:59 Closing Remarks
Find out more about Beverly Jenkins at https://www.beverlyjenkins.net/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:04):
Welcome to the historicalromance sampler podcast.
I'm your host, Katherine Grant, andeach week I introduce you to another
amazing historical romance author.
My guest reads a little sampleof their work, and then we move
into a free ranging interview.
If you like these episodes, don'tforget to subscribe to the historical
(00:24):
romance sampler, wherever youlisten to podcasts and follow us
on Instagram, TikTok, and YouTube.
Now let's get into this week's episode.
I am thrilled to host avery special episode of the
Historico Romance Sampler today.
An interview with icon Beverly Jenkins.
(00:48):
Ms. Bev started publishing in1994 and since then she has led
the charge for inclusive romance.
Her work has been a constantdarling of reviewers, fans, and
peers alike, garnering accoladesfrom the likes of The Wall Street
Journal, People Magazine, and NPR.
She is the recipient of the 2017Romance Writers of America Nora Roberts
(01:12):
Lifetime Achievement Award, as wellas the 2016 Romantic Times Reviewer's
Choice Award for Historical Romance.
She has been nominated for the NAACP ImageAward in Literature, and was featured
both in the documentary Love Betweenthe Covers and on CBS Sunday Morning.
She has even been the namesakefor a character in a historical
(01:34):
romance novel by Eva Leigh.
So, Ms. Bev, I want to start, thank you somuch for sharing your time with me today.
Oh, thank you for the invite.
We, you know, I would tellfolks I was sick last month
and I sort of slept through.
I forgot all about it.
I was just dead.
So.
That's all good.
I mean.
She's been just wonderful.
(01:55):
She's been, Katherine'sbeen wonderful to me.
So.
Whatever she wants me todo, I'm, I'm here to do it.
Whatever you need to do torecover, we want you to do.
Yeah.
I'm feeling good now.
So, you've said before that youdid not consider yourself a writer.
And yet, here you are.
So, first of all, do youconsider yourself a writer yet?
(02:17):
Yes.
Yeah, I guess I do.
I mean, I've been doing thisnow for 30 years, 31 years.
I don't think I'm qualified todo anything else at this point.
And plus I love what I do.
So, you know, it's, it's, it's kindof, you like what you're doing.
(02:38):
You look forward to the next chapteror next book, met some lovely people
along the way, both authors and readers.
So it's all good.
I think, you know, yeah, I, I,I guess I do consider myself.
A writer.
Now.
Do you have a sense?
Was that like within the last fiveyears or the last 20 years or?
(03:02):
You know, I don't know.
After the first book, excuse me,they kept sending me contracts.
I kept sending them books.
They kept sending me more contracts.
I kept sending them more books.
So now 30 years later,we're still doing that.
So, you know, I guess, I don't know, youknow, I, my girlfriends often tell me that
(03:28):
I have no sense of my impact on the genrebecause I'm just writing kissing books.
Right.
I'm, I'm not trying to, I'm tryingto write the stories that I would
have loved to read growing up.
(03:48):
Cause there was nothing in the marketplacethat reflected me or looked like me,
or, You know, my mom and my sistersand I'm just trying to write books, you
know, Tony Morrison's got that quote.
I know I'm going to mess it up, but shesaid that, you know, if there's a book
out there that you want to read that isn'tout there, then you need to write it.
(04:08):
Yeah.
So that's how I feel.
And I guess, you know, a lot ofaccolades along the way, and I try
not to pay any attention to thatbecause you know, your heads get so
big, you can't get through the door,
but to be known for writing good stories.
I think that's all I really want out ofthis whole quote unquote legendary life.
(04:35):
Yeah, absolutely.
Well, who were some of the,were you reading romance before
you started writing romance?
Yeah, I mean, I read everything.
I mean, there was really no quote unquotedesignated romance when I was coming up.
You had Mary Stewart, you hadVictoria Holt, you had who else?
(04:56):
I also read Louis L'Amour, and I read,you know, Shakespeare, and I read,
you know, Sherlock Holmes, and I read,you know, everything, you know, I'm
one, and I've told this story before,I'm one of those kids that, that
read everything in my neighborhoodlibrary, you know, from the, from the
kiddie books to, to the adult books.
(05:17):
So, romance.
As a pre genre, because that's reallywhat it was back then was just one of the
many, many, many things that, that I read.
But I'd always loved a good love story.
I mean, you know, it was on screen,like I said, nothing in print.
But my sisters and I, we, youknow, we loved the Rock Hudson
and the Doris Day movies and JamesGarner and, you know, all of that.
(05:41):
And and we had romance in our lives withour parents and our aunts and our uncles.
And You know, and we all, you know,if you go to church, you have that,
that little old couple that's beenmarried for 50 years who is still
holding hands, coming out of thechurch, going across the parking lot
to the car to go home for dinner.
So you know, the romance is there,even though it wasn't reflected
(06:05):
in the, in the major culture.
So,
yeah.
And did you write your first manuscriptthinking I'm going to sit down and write
a kissing book or were you writing a storythat you found interesting and then found
a publisher who wanted a kissing book?
I was writing strictly for me becausethis was gosh, I think I started
(06:26):
night song back in the seventies.
Oh wow.
Yeah.
I'm an old lady.
And this was BC- before children.
So my husband who playedtennis in high school.
He was a printer back thenwhen we first got together.
So he would come home from work, youknow, wash off the ink and go play tennis.
(06:47):
And I was working at theMichigan State University
library, in the graduate library.
So I could go down to cataloging andgrab, you know, whatever was on a,
on a card as long as I brought itback and it, you know, wasn't dirty
or cleaned or, you know, wasn'tdropped in the mud or whatever.
I would come home and read.
And, right, working on this story for me.
(07:09):
So fast forward aboutmaybe 10 years, 15 years.
I was working for another Iwas working for Park Davis
Pharmaceuticals in their library.
And one of my colleagues hadjust written a, a sweet romance.
And she had just gotten that published.
We were celebrating her.
I was telling her about this littleromance that I was working on.
(07:30):
And she said, you know, bring it in.
I've told this story a thousand times.
Bring it in.
She looked at it.
She said, I needed to get it published.
And, you know, this iswhat market was closed.
I'm like, where, where am Igoing to get this published?
You know?
So I tell people, she, youknow, harassed me every day.
I didn't do an agent.
Fine.
So some kind of way Ifound Vivian Stephens.
(07:50):
I have no idea how I found Vivian.
She's my first agent.
She had gotten out of publishing and Isent her my little raggedy manuscript
and she called me less than a weeklater, said she wanted to represent me.
And then like a thousand rejectionslater Ellen Edwards at Avon bought
(08:13):
the book on my husband's birthday.
Yeah.
Yeah, I told the story.
I told the story at one of the RWAs.
We were having a hell of a fight that day.
I mean, I don't know whatwe were fighting about.
We were fighting up and down the stepsand their necks rocking and all of that.
And the phone rang.
And it was Ellen.
And she said she wanted to buy my book.
So time out on the fight.
(08:35):
You know, my husband said, I guess Igot to take your little butt to dinner.
Yes, you do.
So then it was published a year later,which was Nightsong my first book.
So it was a summer of Black lovebecause that was also the summer that
Arabesque published their first AfricanAmerican contemporaries with Bette
(08:56):
Ford and Donna Hill and those ladies.
But I was the only one doing historicals.
So, so now what, 30years later, I'm still.
But then I've been in a lot of sandboxes,you know, I've, I've, I've been blessed to
have a publisher that trusts my writing.
So, historical, I've done contemporaries,I've done YA women's fiction.
(09:20):
I'm glad that I was not justrelegated to one box, one sandbox.
Yeah.
One question I have for you that mighttie into that is, how do you maintain
the stamina or finding inspiration forwriting book after book over 30 years?
I have no trouble with stories.
(09:42):
I have what I call the green room inmy head and there are characters in
there that are sitting there doing this.
You know, when's my turn?
When's my turn, lady?
Come on, lady.
You know, whereas I have somegirlfriends who are writers who have
a really hard time trying to come upwith something different, but we all
bring different stuff to the table.
You know, they may be strongerin other areas than I am.
(10:05):
But I have no trouble coming up with, youknow, whether I can turn it in on time.
Now that's, that's a, that's aissue sometimes, but I got stories.
When I'm, you know, when, when my lastday on earth comes around, you know,
I'll be banging on the edge of the,on the inside of the urn going, wait,
wait, wait, I got, you know, four morestories I need to write, you know, so
(10:27):
I think it's part of the imaginationand I have no trouble coming up with,
with stories, which is good for me.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
And what about maintaining a careerpart of the authoring for 30 years?
Do you think there's a secret saucefor you and your peers who are still
publishing 30 years later as opposedto people who maybe started at the same
(10:49):
time as you and aren't still publishing?
Yeah.
You know, I don't know how or why that is.
You know, people drop out, Ithink, for different reasons.
Some people are, youknow, have health issues.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Some people have family issues,some people have personal issues.
And then there's some of us, like I said,who are not qualified to do anything else.
(11:11):
So we're just, you know, writing,writing, writing, writing, writing.
It's a, it's a blessing at leastthat's the way I look at it, to be
able to do this for 30 years andstill have people buying your books.
I mean, that's the, the biggestthing, you know, I, I, And even
though, you know, I've been at thisa long time, I all, I still worry.
(11:36):
Are they gonna throwtomatoes at me this time?
You know, is it gonna be terrible?
You know, and I, I, I try and make aneffort not to write the same book twice.
Mm-hmm . I give my readers adifferent, a different flavor, a
different swagger, a different, adifferent theme, you know, every time.
(11:56):
And ' cause they, they will be truthfulwith me, which is a good thing.
Yes.
You know, they will tell me if I'm writingcrap, you know, so, because you want that.
But I've been lucky so far, you know,not too many tomatoes have been thrown my
way.
Well, not just lucky.
I think there's a fair amount oftalent and skill that goes behind it.
(12:17):
Well, you know, you try to, you tryand be, you know, humble about it.
Yeah.
And not, you know, well, yes, it's becauseI'm this, and this, and this, and this.
No, no.
You're only as good as your last book, so.
Well, and have you ever had to putout a book, because of contract
deadlines and stuff, have you everhad to put out a book that you
wished you had more time to work on?
(12:38):
And you don't have to nameit, but do you have advice for
authors who might have that?
Yeah, yeah, I think we all, we all wouldlike a redo sometimes on some things.
I have some books that I know areabsolutely perfect and I could not have
have done more with, some that I wish Ihad had another two weeks to play around
with it would have been a lot biggeror a lot whatever, but yeah, I think
(13:03):
we, but you know, you can't go back.
So you just have to sort of takethe lessons that you learned
or didn't learn and put thoseinto the stories going forward.
So, yeah.
Yeah.
And You're iconic for one reason, forthe level of research that you put
(13:26):
into your books, especially historical.
Mm-hmm
. Where does the research fit into your creative process?
Oh, well, you know, Iwanna tell the story.
I, you know, I, I, I call itedutainment entertainment and
education because I think one ofthe functions of art is to educate.
One of the functions is, is toentertain, and one is to educate.
(13:47):
Which is why I love writing romance,because you can do that in so
many different ways with romance.
So to be able to tell thetrue story of American history
in ways that it hasn't been told before,whether we're dealing with women,
whether we're dealing with AfricanAmericans, whether we're dealing with,
(14:10):
you know, Chinese Americans or, or NativeAmericans as told through their gaze,
I think you get a truer vision of history.
And then
make that the backgroundfor a great love story.
(14:31):
And you have a perfectstory, at least in my mind.
And there's no test on, and notest on Friday, you know, so.
Absolutely.
And so, so when you're thinking aboutlike the next book that you're going
to write, do you begin by doing, youknow, a month's worth of research
and then coming up with the story?
Each book's different.
I'm a pantser.
So each book is different.
(14:52):
Sometimes it's a kernel of a story.
Sometimes it's a character.
Sometimes it's a historical incident.
I just sort of go with whatever themuse gives me and then try and figure
out what the muse wants me to say.
(15:12):
Because if I had to, you know, I lovebeing a pantser because if I had to write
out everything and outline and for me,it takes all the energy out of the story.
And I'm ready to go on to thenext book, so this way I am as
surprised as the readers are.
Oh, this is what we're going to do?
Okay, okay, you know, hold on,let me catch up, you know, so, but
(15:36):
yeah, I, I like being a pantser.
I like being a pantser because, like Isaid, I, I, it's more fun for me this way.
Absolutely.
And sometimes that gut reaction thatyou get tells you whether you're This
is a good idea, or, or, oh, this isboring, need something more exciting.
Yeah, because if it, you know, if youreyes are going to glaze over, then the
(15:58):
reader's eyes are going to glaze over.
And if you're going to cry, thenthe readers are going to cry.
And if you're going to laugh, morethan likely they're going to laugh too.
So I try and, and I write forme, basically, and then see what
happens when it, when the, ifthe readers get the same kind of
(16:19):
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Of all the different eras and pocketsof history that you have researched and
(18:31):
written about, do you have a favorite?
I think the whole 19th century ismy favorite because there's so many
different stories to tell that haven'tbeen told or haven't been told fully.
Whether you're talking about, youknow, the years leading up, whether
you're talking about abolition, orCivil War, or Reconstruction, or a
(18:53):
redemption, or the move west, or themove north whether you're dealing with
the, the Hispanics and the Blacks inCalifornia, or whether you're dealing
with, the small towns in Kansas.
I mean, there's just, just a wealthof stories out there told from a
different point of view that, youknow, you can have fun with and educate
(19:17):
and entertain and all those othergood things that makes a good story.
So.
I, like I said, I love what I do.
I really do.
That's wonderful.
I mean, I'm sure that's one of thereasons why your books keep speaking
to us is because you love it.
Yeah.
I see.
Now, one of the things that's goingaround the internet these days is
(19:37):
that historical romance is dead.
Is this a cycle that you have seen before?
Have you heard this before?
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
We've heard this before.
But nobody has said this to thereaders of historical romance.
You got a lot of pushback from,from some of the publishers.
You are getting pushback from thelittle kids Booktok and TikTok
(20:01):
and all of the clock people.
But you're not getting thatfrom the mainstream readers.
Historical readers.
Mm-hmm . They're waitingfor more stuff, you know?
And I don't know, I think it'ssomething that's gonna come back
and bite 'em in the butt publishers.
(20:22):
Mm-hmm.
Because the community is so large.
And a lot from what I'm seeing havestopped reading because of how different
the books are now, as opposed to theway that they were constructed and, and,
and written, say, even 10 years ago.
(20:44):
So it's going to be interestingto see what happens.
I think those of us who writehistoricals are going to continue to
write historicals, whether it's goingto be romance or whether it's going
to be paranormal or whatever it'sgoing to be, it's going to still be.
With a historical viewbecause like I said, I'm not
qualified to do anything else.
So I'm going to do that.
(21:06):
I like some dragons.
I'm going to do some dragons.
But then I can also write suspense andI, you know, cause I've got suspense
titles that I've been promising myreaders for the last 15 years, lying
to them about having this book done.
So as long as, you know, aslong as I got a publisher, you
know, I'll write something.
(21:26):
Yeah.
Historicals are my first love.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Do you look back and think, do youhave any observations on how your
writing has changed and or do youhave observations on how your writing
has remained constant to itself?
Yeah.
I think the writing has changed in the,in, And who gets to be in the story.
(21:50):
Because back when I started the heroineswere mostly, well, were all white.
Size six.
Most of the men were, were alpha holes.
And now you have just this wealth of, of,of diverse characters, all identities.
(22:12):
Women and men doing different stuff.
Men writing
stories for people who don't reallyidentify as, as, as love stories.
So I think that's a wonderful thingbecause it puts, you know, regardless
of the political machinations going onright now, it puts romance, I think,
(22:39):
ahead of a lot of genres and whogets to participate and who gets to
be, who gets to be seen on the page.
Yeah, I think we lead the way in that.
But there's still a lot to do,you know, it's not perfect.
Otherwise we wouldn'thave had to burn down RWA.
(23:02):
But
I guess I think we lead still a lot to do.
My writing has changed in the sense thatI don't rely as much on the research
as I used to because I've alreadyeducated my readers and I don't have to.
(23:24):
And I don't have to hit them overthe head anymore, or myself, with
like what's happening in Louisiana in1877 or, you know, I don't have to do
the, the great exodus of 1879 anymorebecause we've already done that.
So I can take the stories, make thoseparts of it, the foundation, and not
(23:44):
have to teach because they already know.
So it makes, it makesfor less of a historical.
Historical, historical, but youstill get that foundation and you
still get, hopefully, a great story.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's really interesting.
And can you tell us anythingabout what we can expect
(24:08):
from you in the next year?
Well, right now, right now,the the book 12 of the Blessing
series coming out in August.
And that's the last book of the series.
And for the first time in 30 years,I have no contract, which is kind of
cool because, you know, my agent andI can, you know, play with stuff.
(24:29):
We can, you know, float stuff that, youknow, I've been maybe sitting on or,
you know seeing who's interested in,in different parts of, of the Beverly
Jenkins universe whereas the kids saythe multiverse and see what happens.
I'm kind of excited.
I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm home for, you know,the first time really, and I think I
(24:53):
did 14 visits last 14 flights last year.
I'm too old for this girl.
So we're going to see what,you know, what, what happens.
My birthday was last weekend.
Oh, happy belated.
Thank you.
Thank you.
So it's kind of exciting because Igot a lot of stuff in the pipeline
(25:15):
that I would love to do, butwe're going to keep, keep going.
We're going to keep it quiet and see andwait and see what my agent comes up with.
But she's got great ideas too.
So yeah, the two of us, you know, we.
We may conquer the worldbefore this is over, who knows?
Well, do you, are you going to use thistime to just literally write for yourself
(25:36):
since no one is waiting on a book for you?
I mean, we are all waitingon a book from you,
but
you're contractually obligated.
And I, and I, and people areasking for, because I haven't
done a historical in a while.
In at least, what, two years, three years?
So people want historicals.
People want the suspense bookthat I've been lying to them
(25:56):
about for the last 20 years.
I want to play in the dragon sandboxbecause I'm a big fantasy reader.
So I don't really knowwhat we're going to do.
We're going to see who bites.
We're going to put the line outthere and bait it with all kinds
of stuff and see who nibbles.
Yeah.
Go from there.
But yeah, I want to write for me,but I also got to pay my mortgage.
(26:20):
So, you know, there, there is that.
But my agent has a good.
Indie shop in her agency too.
So that's going
to
I was going to say you could clean up.
Yeah, that, that, that's also, you know,on, on the, on the line too, you know,
it is, is to be able to do it Indie.
So, so we'll see.
(26:42):
Cause you know, I got less timeahead of me than I got behind me.
So you want to try and havefun but still pay the mortgage.
But also, like I said, have fun becausethat's what this is about, you know, is.
It's about the journey.
It's not necessarilyabout the destination.
(27:03):
So
yeah, where it
goes.
Yeah.
Well speaking of having fun I'd liketo close it out by playing my game.
Love it or leave it.
Okie dokie.
[Musical Interlude]
All right Do you love it or leave it?
Protagonists meet in thefirst 10 percent of the story
Yeah, cuz you know, I don't I'mtrying to think of my books.
(27:29):
Yeah, everybody meets Within the first,
yeah, I do, because, you know, you wantto get the story started, you know, you
don't be like, well, what are they doing?
Where, where is he?
Or where is she?
You know, so, yeah.
Yeah.
Love it or leave it, dualpoint of view narration.
(27:50):
Definitely.
Because when I started in94, everybody wrote dual.
And now we got these new, and Iguess they're not new anymore, but
these newer, younger editors whodon't like that for some reason.
But I love it.
I mean, I want to see her reaction.
(28:11):
I want to hear his reaction.
I don't want a whole chapterfrom his point of view, a whole
chapter from her point of view.
It's a ruined romance.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!
Alright love it or leaveit, third person past tense.
God, what is that?
I don't even know, I don't know,what is third person past tense?
(28:33):
Like he said, she said, insteadof he says, she says, or I say.
Oh, okay.
Eh, I can take it or leave it.
You know, just give me a good story.
A lot of times you don't even needthe tags, if you're doing it right.
All right.
Love it or leave it, thirdact, breakup, or dark moment?
Sometimes a story,
(28:56):
sometimes yes, sometimes no.
Depends on the couple and whatyou're trying to do with the story.
Sometimes like I had this great storyand it had no conflict at the end.
And the editor was like,well, we need a conflict.
I'm like, why?
You know, they've accomplishedall they need to accomplish.
(29:17):
And the readers sometimes say, why arethey fighting at the end of the book?
They've already, you know.
So it depends, I think, on.
The couple, it depends on the storyand what you're trying to achieve.
And I'm not saying no to it.
I'm just saying, sometimes youwant to do something different.
Alright, love it or leave it,always end with an epilogue.
(29:40):
No.
Have I always ended with an epilogue?
No.
And I know some people say, well, ifI need an epilogue and I need a baby,
y'all need a life.
All right.
(30:00):
Sometimes, you know, cause I have a storywhere within Wild Rain where she didn't
want any kids and there's no epilogue.
And I got a lot cause we do, I dothe book club on my Facebook page.
And so there were some people thatwere asking, well, Are you going
to write a sequel where she's withthese kids that she didn't want?
(30:25):
I'm like, no, she didn't want any babies.
She's not having any babies.
People who have babies don't want babies.
I'm like, come on now.
But people seem to think that...some people seem to think that you
need an epilogue and you need ababy for it to be a true romance.
And you know, not everybody wants that.
(30:47):
So,
All right.
Love it or leave it, always shareresearch in your author's note.
Yeah, I do, because I want people to,if they want to do more research, I
want them to be able to find it andnot wonder where I got this stuff from.
(31:09):
I also put that in the first bookbecause I kept getting these questions,
were the black people really do this?
Yes, they did.
Here's the sites.
Go read the sites and comeback and we can talk, you know
so I think they're important.
I borrowed that from, from theicon, Susan Johnson, but she has
footnotes in her early in her early.
(31:31):
Wow.
So I thought this is really coolbecause she did a lot of Native
American stories and she had footnotes.
And so I was like, okay, I need to, Ineed to copy her so that I can, you know,
help people find out more informationon, on whatever the subject is.
So.
(31:51):
So I did not invent that.
I sort of borrowed it from Susan.
Well, that's fascinating andit's interesting to have the
idea of footnotes in fiction.
Yeah.
All right, well, and then arethere any other romance rules I
didn't ask about that you break?
Well, I don't know.
I mean, I've done just about everything.
(32:12):
I've broken all the rules.
And you're still standing.
I'm still standing.
Books are still standing.
I don't think I don'tthink anybody has ever.
done a Orgasm on the first page.
Yeah, I think, I think, Billy andArcher, not Archer, Billy and what was
(32:33):
his, Andrew, from Destiny's Surrender?
One of those.
Captives, no, Surrender, yeah.
Captive was the pirate book.
I've had a heroine shootpeople a couple times.
Mm hmm.
Generational.
(32:56):
No, I think, you know, I, I, I don'tlike secret babies, but somebody told
me that I did write a secret baby book.
And I realized I did, eventhough I don't like secrets.
Secret baby books, and I waslike, I was like, no, I didn't
write a secret baby book.
They were like, Ms. Bev, thisis what happened in this story.
(33:19):
Is that a secret baby or not?
I was like, Oh shit.
Yeah, I guess it's a secret,
but well, I think you were sayingthat you don't always understand
or have a feeling for the legacythat you've created for this genre.
And I would say part of it comes fromthe fact that you have broken rules
(33:39):
and shown us that these rules can bebroken and it can still be a romance.
And in fact, it can bea better romance for it.
Yeah.
Oh,
I like that.
I like that.
I'll send you a check
for that.
That's in the mail, babe.
Well, I want to thank youvery much again for coming on.
(34:04):
Are there any specificplugs you want to make?
Do you want people to follow you yousign up for your newsletter or follow
you on a social media or anything?
Okay.
Newsletters.
I'm terrible at it.
I can, I can hear my assistant screaming.
At me from North Carolina about gettingthe newsletter, but I do have one.
It's very infrequent, but you cansign up on my website, beverlyjenkins.
(34:27):
net.
You can follow me on Blue Sky.
I left the hell mouth afterthe election and the romance
community on Blue Sky is amazing.
We have rebuilt Romancelandia.
Facebook, I have one, two, three pagesand a fans of Beverly Jenkins page
(34:50):
that you can hook up with and theyhave great fun and they do all kinds of
stuff, giveaways and all kinds of stuff.
So, follow me that's why I cannever get a book in on time, I'm
too busy playing on social media.
All right, well, I will put linksin the show notes, so listeners, you
can hop on over and click through.
(35:12):
Thank you.
Thank you.
And thank you.
This has been amazing.
I am so honored to have beenable to ask you all my questions.
Well, thank you for having me and,and we should do this again sometime.
Let's, please.
That's it for this week!
Don't forget to subscribe to theHistorical Romance Sampler wherever
you listen, and follow us onInstagram, TikTok, and YouTube.
(35:37):
Until next week, happy reading!
Welcome to the historicalromance sampler podcast.
I'm your host, Katherine Grant, andeach week I introduce you to another
amazing historical romance author.
My guest reads a little sampleof their work, and then we move
into a free ranging interview.
If you like these episodes, don'tforget to subscribe to the historical
(00:24):
romance sampler, wherever youlisten to podcasts and follow us
on Instagram, TikTok, and YouTube.
Now let's get into this week's episode.
I am thrilled to host avery special episode of the
Historico Romance Sampler today.
An interview with icon Beverly Jenkins.
(00:48):
Ms. Bev started publishing in1994 and since then she has led
the charge for inclusive romance.
Her work has been a constantdarling of reviewers, fans, and
peers alike, garnering accoladesfrom the likes of The Wall Street
Journal, People Magazine, and NPR.
She is the recipient of the 2017Romance Writers of America Nora Roberts
(01:12):
Lifetime Achievement Award, as wellas the 2016 Romantic Times Reviewer's
Choice Award for Historical Romance.
She has been nominated for the NAACP ImageAward in Literature, and was featured
both in the documentary Love Betweenthe Covers and on CBS Sunday Morning.
She has even been the namesakefor a character in a historical
(01:34):
romance novel by Eva Leigh.
So, Ms. Bev, I want to start, thank you somuch for sharing your time with me today.
Oh, thank you for the invite.
We, you know, I would tellfolks I was sick last month
and I sort of slept through.
I forgot all about it.
I was just dead.
So.
That's all good.
I mean.
She's been just wonderful.
(01:55):
She's been, Katherine'sbeen wonderful to me.
So.
Whatever she wants me todo, I'm, I'm here to do it.
Whatever you need to do torecover, we want you to do.
Yeah.
I'm feeling good now.
So, you've said before that youdid not consider yourself a writer.
And yet, here you are.
So, first of all, do youconsider yourself a writer yet?
(02:17):
Yes.
Yeah, I guess I do.
I mean, I've been doing thisnow for 30 years, 31 years.
I don't think I'm qualified todo anything else at this point.
And plus I love what I do.
So, you know, it's, it's, it's kindof, you like what you're doing.
(02:38):
You look forward to the next chapteror next book, met some lovely people
along the way, both authors and readers.
So it's all good.
I think, you know, yeah, I, I,I guess I do consider myself.
A writer.
Now.
Do you have a sense?
Was that like within the last fiveyears or the last 20 years or?
(03:02):
You know, I don't know.
After the first book, excuse me,they kept sending me contracts.
I kept sending them books.
They kept sending me more contracts.
I kept sending them more books.
So now 30 years later,we're still doing that.
So, you know, I guess, I don't know, youknow, I, my girlfriends often tell me that
(03:28):
I have no sense of my impact on the genrebecause I'm just writing kissing books.
Right.
I'm, I'm not trying to, I'm tryingto write the stories that I would
have loved to read growing up.
(03:48):
Cause there was nothing in the marketplacethat reflected me or looked like me,
or, You know, my mom and my sistersand I'm just trying to write books, you
know, Tony Morrison's got that quote.
I know I'm going to mess it up, but shesaid that, you know, if there's a book
out there that you want to read that isn'tout there, then you need to write it.
(04:08):
Yeah.
So that's how I feel.
And I guess, you know, a lot ofaccolades along the way, and I try
not to pay any attention to thatbecause you know, your heads get so
big, you can't get through the door,
but to be known for writing good stories.
I think that's all I really want out ofthis whole quote unquote legendary life.
(04:35):
Yeah, absolutely.
Well, who were some of the,were you reading romance before
you started writing romance?
Yeah, I mean, I read everything.
I mean, there was really no quote unquotedesignated romance when I was coming up.
You had Mary Stewart, you hadVictoria Holt, you had who else?
(04:56):
I also read Louis L'Amour, and I read,you know, Shakespeare, and I read,
you know, Sherlock Holmes, and I read,you know, everything, you know, I'm
one, and I've told this story before,I'm one of those kids that, that
read everything in my neighborhoodlibrary, you know, from the, from the
kiddie books to, to the adult books.
(05:17):
So, romance.
As a pre genre, because that's reallywhat it was back then was just one of the
many, many, many things that, that I read.
But I'd always loved a good love story.
I mean, you know, it was on screen,like I said, nothing in print.
But my sisters and I, we, youknow, we loved the Rock Hudson
and the Doris Day movies and JamesGarner and, you know, all of that.
(05:41):
And and we had romance in our lives withour parents and our aunts and our uncles.
And You know, and we all, you know,if you go to church, you have that,
that little old couple that's beenmarried for 50 years who is still
holding hands, coming out of thechurch, going across the parking lot
to the car to go home for dinner.
So you know, the romance is there,even though it wasn't reflected
(06:05):
in the, in the major culture.
So,
yeah.
And did you write your first manuscriptthinking I'm going to sit down and write
a kissing book or were you writing a storythat you found interesting and then found
a publisher who wanted a kissing book?
I was writing strictly for me becausethis was gosh, I think I started
(06:26):
night song back in the seventies.
Oh wow.
Yeah.
I'm an old lady.
And this was BC- before children.
So my husband who playedtennis in high school.
He was a printer back thenwhen we first got together.
So he would come home from work, youknow, wash off the ink and go play tennis.
(06:47):
And I was working at theMichigan State University
library, in the graduate library.
So I could go down to cataloging andgrab, you know, whatever was on a,
on a card as long as I brought itback and it, you know, wasn't dirty
or cleaned or, you know, wasn'tdropped in the mud or whatever.
I would come home and read.
And, right, working on this story for me.
(07:09):
So fast forward aboutmaybe 10 years, 15 years.
I was working for another Iwas working for Park Davis
Pharmaceuticals in their library.
And one of my colleagues hadjust written a, a sweet romance.
And she had just gotten that published.
We were celebrating her.
I was telling her about this littleromance that I was working on.
(07:30):
And she said, you know, bring it in.
I've told this story a thousand times.
Bring it in.
She looked at it.
She said, I needed to get it published.
And, you know, this iswhat market was closed.
I'm like, where, where am Igoing to get this published?
You know?
So I tell people, she, youknow, harassed me every day.
I didn't do an agent.
Fine.
So some kind of way Ifound Vivian Stephens.
(07:50):
I have no idea how I found Vivian.
She's my first agent.
She had gotten out of publishing and Isent her my little raggedy manuscript
and she called me less than a weeklater, said she wanted to represent me.
And then like a thousand rejectionslater Ellen Edwards at Avon bought
(08:13):
the book on my husband's birthday.
Yeah.
Yeah, I told the story.
I told the story at one of the RWAs.
We were having a hell of a fight that day.
I mean, I don't know whatwe were fighting about.
We were fighting up and down the stepsand their necks rocking and all of that.
And the phone rang.
And it was Ellen.
And she said she wanted to buy my book.
So time out on the fight.
(08:35):
You know, my husband said, I guess Igot to take your little butt to dinner.
Yes, you do.
So then it was published a year later,which was Nightsong my first book.
So it was a summer of Black lovebecause that was also the summer that
Arabesque published their first AfricanAmerican contemporaries with Bette
(08:56):
Ford and Donna Hill and those ladies.
But I was the only one doing historicals.
So, so now what, 30years later, I'm still.
But then I've been in a lot of sandboxes,you know, I've, I've, I've been blessed to
have a publisher that trusts my writing.
So, historical, I've done contemporaries,I've done YA women's fiction.
(09:20):
I'm glad that I was not justrelegated to one box, one sandbox.
Yeah.
One question I have for you that mighttie into that is, how do you maintain
the stamina or finding inspiration forwriting book after book over 30 years?
I have no trouble with stories.
(09:42):
I have what I call the green room inmy head and there are characters in
there that are sitting there doing this.
You know, when's my turn?
When's my turn, lady?
Come on, lady.
You know, whereas I have somegirlfriends who are writers who have
a really hard time trying to come upwith something different, but we all
bring different stuff to the table.
You know, they may be strongerin other areas than I am.
(10:05):
But I have no trouble coming up with, youknow, whether I can turn it in on time.
Now that's, that's a, that's aissue sometimes, but I got stories.
When I'm, you know, when, when my lastday on earth comes around, you know,
I'll be banging on the edge of the,on the inside of the urn going, wait,
wait, wait, I got, you know, four morestories I need to write, you know, so
(10:27):
I think it's part of the imaginationand I have no trouble coming up with,
with stories, which is good for me.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
And what about maintaining a careerpart of the authoring for 30 years?
Do you think there's a secret saucefor you and your peers who are still
publishing 30 years later as opposedto people who maybe started at the same
(10:49):
time as you and aren't still publishing?
Yeah.
You know, I don't know how or why that is.
You know, people drop out, Ithink, for different reasons.
Some people are, youknow, have health issues.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Some people have family issues,some people have personal issues.
And then there's some of us, like I said,who are not qualified to do anything else.
(11:11):
So we're just, you know, writing,writing, writing, writing, writing.
It's a, it's a blessing at leastthat's the way I look at it, to be
able to do this for 30 years andstill have people buying your books.
I mean, that's the, the biggestthing, you know, I, I, And even
though, you know, I've been at thisa long time, I all, I still worry.
(11:36):
Are they gonna throwtomatoes at me this time?
You know, is it gonna be terrible?
You know, and I, I, I try and make aneffort not to write the same book twice.
Mm-hmm . I give my readers adifferent, a different flavor, a
different swagger, a different, adifferent theme, you know, every time.
(11:56):
And ' cause they, they will be truthfulwith me, which is a good thing.
Yes.
You know, they will tell me if I'm writingcrap, you know, so, because you want that.
But I've been lucky so far, you know,not too many tomatoes have been thrown my
way.
Well, not just lucky.
I think there's a fair amount oftalent and skill that goes behind it.
(12:17):
Well, you know, you try to, you tryand be, you know, humble about it.
Yeah.
And not, you know, well, yes, it's becauseI'm this, and this, and this, and this.
No, no.
You're only as good as your last book, so.
Well, and have you ever had to putout a book, because of contract
deadlines and stuff, have you everhad to put out a book that you
wished you had more time to work on?
(12:38):
And you don't have to nameit, but do you have advice for
authors who might have that?
Yeah, yeah, I think we all, we all wouldlike a redo sometimes on some things.
I have some books that I know areabsolutely perfect and I could not have
have done more with, some that I wish Ihad had another two weeks to play around
with it would have been a lot biggeror a lot whatever, but yeah, I think
(13:03):
we, but you know, you can't go back.
So you just have to sort of takethe lessons that you learned
or didn't learn and put thoseinto the stories going forward.
So, yeah.
Yeah.
And You're iconic for one reason, forthe level of research that you put
(13:26):
into your books, especially historical.
Mm-hmm
. Where does the research fit into your creative process?
Oh, well, you know, Iwanna tell the story.
I, you know, I, I, I call itedutainment entertainment and
education because I think one ofthe functions of art is to educate.
One of the functions is, is toentertain, and one is to educate.
(13:47):
Which is why I love writing romance,because you can do that in so
many different ways with romance.
So to be able to tell thetrue story of American history
in ways that it hasn't been told before,whether we're dealing with women,
whether we're dealing with AfricanAmericans, whether we're dealing with,
(14:10):
you know, Chinese Americans or, or NativeAmericans as told through their gaze,
I think you get a truer vision of history.
And then
make that the backgroundfor a great love story.
(14:31):
And you have a perfectstory, at least in my mind.
And there's no test on, and notest on Friday, you know, so.
Absolutely.
And so, so when you're thinking aboutlike the next book that you're going
to write, do you begin by doing, youknow, a month's worth of research
and then coming up with the story?
Each book's different.
I'm a pantser.
So each book is different.
(14:52):
Sometimes it's a kernel of a story.
Sometimes it's a character.
Sometimes it's a historical incident.
I just sort of go with whatever themuse gives me and then try and figure
out what the muse wants me to say.
(15:12):
Because if I had to, you know, I lovebeing a pantser because if I had to write
out everything and outline and for me,it takes all the energy out of the story.
And I'm ready to go on to thenext book, so this way I am as
surprised as the readers are.
Oh, this is what we're going to do?
Okay, okay, you know, hold on,let me catch up, you know, so, but
(15:36):
yeah, I, I like being a pantser.
I like being a pantser because, like Isaid, I, I, it's more fun for me this way.
Absolutely.
And sometimes that gut reaction thatyou get tells you whether you're This
is a good idea, or, or, oh, this isboring, need something more exciting.
Yeah, because if it, you know, if youreyes are going to glaze over, then the
(15:58):
reader's eyes are going to glaze over.
And if you're going to cry, thenthe readers are going to cry.
And if you're going to laugh, morethan likely they're going to laugh too.
So I try and, and I write forme, basically, and then see what
happens when it, when the, ifthe readers get the same kind of
(16:19):
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Of all the different eras and pocketsof history that you have researched and
(18:31):
written about, do you have a favorite?
I think the whole 19th century ismy favorite because there's so many
different stories to tell that haven'tbeen told or haven't been told fully.
Whether you're talking about, youknow, the years leading up, whether
you're talking about abolition, orCivil War, or Reconstruction, or a
(18:53):
redemption, or the move west, or themove north whether you're dealing with
the, the Hispanics and the Blacks inCalifornia, or whether you're dealing
with, the small towns in Kansas.
I mean, there's just, just a wealthof stories out there told from a
different point of view that, youknow, you can have fun with and educate
(19:17):
and entertain and all those othergood things that makes a good story.
So.
I, like I said, I love what I do.
I really do.
That's wonderful.
I mean, I'm sure that's one of thereasons why your books keep speaking
to us is because you love it.
Yeah.
I see.
Now, one of the things that's goingaround the internet these days is
(19:37):
that historical romance is dead.
Is this a cycle that you have seen before?
Have you heard this before?
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
We've heard this before.
But nobody has said this to thereaders of historical romance.
You got a lot of pushback from,from some of the publishers.
You are getting pushback from thelittle kids Booktok and TikTok
(20:01):
and all of the clock people.
But you're not getting thatfrom the mainstream readers.
Historical readers.
Mm-hmm . They're waitingfor more stuff, you know?
And I don't know, I think it'ssomething that's gonna come back
and bite 'em in the butt publishers.
(20:22):
Mm-hmm.
Because the community is so large.
And a lot from what I'm seeing havestopped reading because of how different
the books are now, as opposed to theway that they were constructed and, and,
and written, say, even 10 years ago.
(20:44):
So it's going to be interestingto see what happens.
I think those of us who writehistoricals are going to continue to
write historicals, whether it's goingto be romance or whether it's going
to be paranormal or whatever it'sgoing to be, it's going to still be.
With a historical viewbecause like I said, I'm not
qualified to do anything else.
So I'm going to do that.
(21:06):
I like some dragons.
I'm going to do some dragons.
But then I can also write suspense andI, you know, cause I've got suspense
titles that I've been promising myreaders for the last 15 years, lying
to them about having this book done.
So as long as, you know, aslong as I got a publisher, you
know, I'll write something.
(21:26):
Yeah.
Historicals are my first love.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Do you look back and think, do youhave any observations on how your
writing has changed and or do youhave observations on how your writing
has remained constant to itself?
Yeah.
I think the writing has changed in the,in, And who gets to be in the story.
(21:50):
Because back when I started the heroineswere mostly, well, were all white.
Size six.
Most of the men were, were alpha holes.
And now you have just this wealth of, of,of diverse characters, all identities.
(22:12):
Women and men doing different stuff.
Men writing
stories for people who don't reallyidentify as, as, as love stories.
So I think that's a wonderful thingbecause it puts, you know, regardless
of the political machinations going onright now, it puts romance, I think,
(22:39):
ahead of a lot of genres and whogets to participate and who gets to
be, who gets to be seen on the page.
Yeah, I think we lead the way in that.
But there's still a lot to do,you know, it's not perfect.
Otherwise we wouldn'thave had to burn down RWA.
(23:02):
But
I guess I think we lead still a lot to do.
My writing has changed in the sense thatI don't rely as much on the research
as I used to because I've alreadyeducated my readers and I don't have to.
(23:24):
And I don't have to hit them overthe head anymore, or myself, with
like what's happening in Louisiana in1877 or, you know, I don't have to do
the, the great exodus of 1879 anymorebecause we've already done that.
So I can take the stories, make thoseparts of it, the foundation, and not
(23:44):
have to teach because they already know.
So it makes, it makesfor less of a historical.
Historical, historical, but youstill get that foundation and you
still get, hopefully, a great story.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's really interesting.
And can you tell us anythingabout what we can expect
(24:08):
from you in the next year?
Well, right now, right now,the the book 12 of the Blessing
series coming out in August.
And that's the last book of the series.
And for the first time in 30 years,I have no contract, which is kind of
cool because, you know, my agent andI can, you know, play with stuff.
(24:29):
We can, you know, float stuff that, youknow, I've been maybe sitting on or,
you know seeing who's interested in,in different parts of, of the Beverly
Jenkins universe whereas the kids saythe multiverse and see what happens.
I'm kind of excited.
I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm home for, you know,the first time really, and I think I
(24:53):
did 14 visits last 14 flights last year.
I'm too old for this girl.
So we're going to see what,you know, what, what happens.
My birthday was last weekend.
Oh, happy belated.
Thank you.
Thank you.
So it's kind of exciting because Igot a lot of stuff in the pipeline
(25:15):
that I would love to do, butwe're going to keep, keep going.
We're going to keep it quiet and see andwait and see what my agent comes up with.
But she's got great ideas too.
So yeah, the two of us, you know, we.
We may conquer the worldbefore this is over, who knows?
Well, do you, are you going to use thistime to just literally write for yourself
(25:36):
since no one is waiting on a book for you?
I mean, we are all waitingon a book from you,
but
you're contractually obligated.
And I, and I, and people areasking for, because I haven't
done a historical in a while.
In at least, what, two years, three years?
So people want historicals.
People want the suspense bookthat I've been lying to them
(25:56):
about for the last 20 years.
I want to play in the dragon sandboxbecause I'm a big fantasy reader.
So I don't really knowwhat we're going to do.
We're going to see who bites.
We're going to put the line outthere and bait it with all kinds
of stuff and see who nibbles.
Yeah.
Go from there.
But yeah, I want to write for me,but I also got to pay my mortgage.
(26:20):
So, you know, there, there is that.
But my agent has a good.
Indie shop in her agency too.
So that's going
to
I was going to say you could clean up.
Yeah, that, that, that's also, you know,on, on the, on the line too, you know,
it is, is to be able to do it Indie.
So, so we'll see.
(26:42):
Cause you know, I got less timeahead of me than I got behind me.
So you want to try and havefun but still pay the mortgage.
But also, like I said, have fun becausethat's what this is about, you know, is.
It's about the journey.
It's not necessarilyabout the destination.
(27:03):
So
yeah, where it
goes.
Yeah.
Well speaking of having fun I'd liketo close it out by playing my game.
Love it or leave it.
Okie dokie.
[Musical Interlude]
All right Do you love it or leave it?
Protagonists meet in thefirst 10 percent of the story
Yeah, cuz you know, I don't I'mtrying to think of my books.
(27:29):
Yeah, everybody meets Within the first,
yeah, I do, because, you know, you wantto get the story started, you know, you
don't be like, well, what are they doing?
Where, where is he?
Or where is she?
You know, so, yeah.
Yeah.
Love it or leave it, dualpoint of view narration.
(27:50):
Definitely.
Because when I started in94, everybody wrote dual.
And now we got these new, and Iguess they're not new anymore, but
these newer, younger editors whodon't like that for some reason.
But I love it.
I mean, I want to see her reaction.
(28:11):
I want to hear his reaction.
I don't want a whole chapterfrom his point of view, a whole
chapter from her point of view.
It's a ruined romance.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!
Alright love it or leaveit, third person past tense.
God, what is that?
I don't even know, I don't know,what is third person past tense?
(28:33):
Like he said, she said, insteadof he says, she says, or I say.
Oh, okay.
Eh, I can take it or leave it.
You know, just give me a good story.
A lot of times you don't even needthe tags, if you're doing it right.
All right.
Love it or leave it, thirdact, breakup, or dark moment?
Sometimes a story,
(28:56):
sometimes yes, sometimes no.
Depends on the couple and whatyou're trying to do with the story.
Sometimes like I had this great storyand it had no conflict at the end.
And the editor was like,well, we need a conflict.
I'm like, why?
You know, they've accomplishedall they need to accomplish.
(29:17):
And the readers sometimes say, why arethey fighting at the end of the book?
They've already, you know.
So it depends, I think, on.
The couple, it depends on the storyand what you're trying to achieve.
And I'm not saying no to it.
I'm just saying, sometimes youwant to do something different.
Alright, love it or leave it,always end with an epilogue.
(29:40):
No.
Have I always ended with an epilogue?
No.
And I know some people say, well, ifI need an epilogue and I need a baby,
y'all need a life.
All right.
(30:00):
Sometimes, you know, cause I have a storywhere within Wild Rain where she didn't
want any kids and there's no epilogue.
And I got a lot cause we do, I dothe book club on my Facebook page.
And so there were some people thatwere asking, well, Are you going
to write a sequel where she's withthese kids that she didn't want?
(30:25):
I'm like, no, she didn't want any babies.
She's not having any babies.
People who have babies don't want babies.
I'm like, come on now.
But people seem to think that...some people seem to think that you
need an epilogue and you need ababy for it to be a true romance.
And you know, not everybody wants that.
(30:47):
So,
All right.
Love it or leave it, always shareresearch in your author's note.
Yeah, I do, because I want people to,if they want to do more research, I
want them to be able to find it andnot wonder where I got this stuff from.
(31:09):
I also put that in the first bookbecause I kept getting these questions,
were the black people really do this?
Yes, they did.
Here's the sites.
Go read the sites and comeback and we can talk, you know
so I think they're important.
I borrowed that from, from theicon, Susan Johnson, but she has
footnotes in her early in her early.
(31:31):
Wow.
So I thought this is really coolbecause she did a lot of Native
American stories and she had footnotes.
And so I was like, okay, I need to, Ineed to copy her so that I can, you know,
help people find out more informationon, on whatever the subject is.
So.
(31:51):
So I did not invent that.
I sort of borrowed it from Susan.
Well, that's fascinating andit's interesting to have the
idea of footnotes in fiction.
Yeah.
All right, well, and then arethere any other romance rules I
didn't ask about that you break?
Well, I don't know.
I mean, I've done just about everything.
(32:12):
I've broken all the rules.
And you're still standing.
I'm still standing.
Books are still standing.
I don't think I don'tthink anybody has ever.
done a Orgasm on the first page.
Yeah, I think, I think, Billy andArcher, not Archer, Billy and what was
(32:33):
his, Andrew, from Destiny's Surrender?
One of those.
Captives, no, Surrender, yeah.
Captive was the pirate book.
I've had a heroine shootpeople a couple times.
Mm hmm.
Generational.
(32:56):
No, I think, you know, I, I, I don'tlike secret babies, but somebody told
me that I did write a secret baby book.
And I realized I did, eventhough I don't like secrets.
Secret baby books, and I waslike, I was like, no, I didn't
write a secret baby book.
They were like, Ms. Bev, thisis what happened in this story.
(33:19):
Is that a secret baby or not?
I was like, Oh shit.
Yeah, I guess it's a secret,
but well, I think you were sayingthat you don't always understand
or have a feeling for the legacythat you've created for this genre.
And I would say part of it comes fromthe fact that you have broken rules
(33:39):
and shown us that these rules can bebroken and it can still be a romance.
And in fact, it can bea better romance for it.
Yeah.
Oh,
I like that.
I like that.
I'll send you a check
for that.
That's in the mail, babe.
Well, I want to thank youvery much again for coming on.
(34:04):
Are there any specificplugs you want to make?
Do you want people to follow you yousign up for your newsletter or follow
you on a social media or anything?
Okay.
Newsletters.
I'm terrible at it.
I can, I can hear my assistant screaming.
At me from North Carolina about gettingthe newsletter, but I do have one.
It's very infrequent, but you cansign up on my website, beverlyjenkins.
(34:27):
net.
You can follow me on Blue Sky.
I left the hell mouth afterthe election and the romance
community on Blue Sky is amazing.
We have rebuilt Romancelandia.
Facebook, I have one, two, three pagesand a fans of Beverly Jenkins page
(34:50):
that you can hook up with and theyhave great fun and they do all kinds of
stuff, giveaways and all kinds of stuff.
So, follow me that's why I cannever get a book in on time, I'm
too busy playing on social media.
All right, well, I will put linksin the show notes, so listeners, you
can hop on over and click through.
(35:12):
Thank you.
Thank you.
And thank you.
This has been amazing.
I am so honored to have beenable to ask you all my questions.
Well, thank you for having me and,and we should do this again sometime.
Let's, please.
That's it for this week!
Don't forget to subscribe to theHistorical Romance Sampler wherever
you listen, and follow us onInstagram, TikTok, and YouTube.
(35:37):
Until next week, happy reading!
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