August 27, 2025 • 18 mins
“Theme parks and national parks may seem different, but they are both in the people business. Each offers a chance to step away from stress and into something extraordinary.”
Notable Moments
1:03 – Why Glacier and Yellowstone hold such unique places in my heart
2:22 – How a behind-the-scenes safari ride shifted my perspective
4:17 – The slow realization of connecting ranger life with Disney lessons
7:18 – The surprising way I first connected with Lee Cockerell
9:58 – A recent trip to Chile that opened up new horizons for exploration
13:17 – How early mistakes in parks helped shape better practices worldwide
15:35 – The joy of lecturing on Alaska cruises and engaging with travelers
Jody Maberry reflects on the surprising ways his passions for national parks and theme parks connect. From Glacier to Disney, and even adventures in South America, he shares stories that highlight the overlap between nature, storytelling, and service.
Read the blog for more from this episode.
Connect with Jody
About Jody - https://jodymaberry.com/about-jody-maberry/
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/sugarjmaberry
LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/jodymaberry/
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Foreign
Mayberry Show. Last episode, we talked to
author Sam Genway. And as we do
when there's a guest on the show, the guest returns to
ask me three questions. I don't know what Sam's going to ask.
(00:20):
It's just going to be a surprise to me like it is to you. Sam,
welcome back. I'm happy to be here. Well, Sam, let's just
get right into it. What is your first question? Ooh, this
is tough. But I think I want to try to get inside of your head.
So let me unscrew your head for a moment and I want you to tell
me what is your. It's going to be a combination of three
(00:42):
questions. What is your favorite national park? What is
your favorite ride within Disney parks? What
is your favorite ride within the Universal parks?
Okay. My favorite national park, I will say
sometimes it depends. My right away
answer is Glacier National Park. Okay. However,
(01:04):
if I've been to Yellowstone more recently, sometimes I'll say
Yellowstone because it is so spectacular. But I will tell
people, if they ask if I can only visit one, which park
should I go to? I say if you just want
absolutely spectacular, raw beauty.
Glacier National Park. If you want wildlife,
(01:25):
there's nothing in North America like Yellowstone National Park.
You've got to go there. Okay, so there's the first answer.
Favorite ride at Universal. I think I.
I have to go with Flights of Passage because it's just spectacular.
Okay. I have to give honorable mention, though, to the safari
because I had the chance recently to ride that with
(01:48):
dejuan Rivers, who was the vice president of Disney's animal
kingdom, and Dr. Scott, who oversees the animal program.
Oh, I'm jealous. And it was just us, me and Dr. Scott in the back
row. And it was phenomenal. It changed my view
of a ride or an attraction I've always enjoyed.
But to hear him explain why they did some of the things
(02:11):
they do and how proud he was of that, he said, you
wouldn't know the difference. You could be in Kenya right now. This is exactly what
it looks like. And I think that changed my view of.
I really enjoy this attraction to. Wow, this attraction is really
something special, something that they are so proud of what
they've created. So I think that has gone up a few notches now.
(02:34):
And my favorite ride at Universal,
there's one in particular that my
kids like. But I'm going to go with one that. That
just really was a treat for me that adds.
If you've not written it, there might be a bit of a spoiler in here.
But the motorbike ride. The Harry Potter motorbike ride.
(02:57):
Oh, yeah. Okay. So that's a lot of fun. But it had something
I completely did not expect to happen. And there
are a lot of rides at Universal that delight me. But to have
one that was just completely unexpected, like,
I did not know that was going to happen, that was a lot of fun
for me. And I enjoy now doing the motorbike
(03:20):
ride with someone who hasn't done it before because I know what's about to happen,
and I can watch how they react when it happens.
Very cool. Very cool. Second question is going to be,
at what point in your life or your career did
you get this aha moment? That your mission in life was to
try to engage others, to find these same passions, both
(03:43):
where those worlds collide. That's how I kind of look at my life, is that
theme parks and national parks, to most people don't seem like they collide,
but they certainly do. And that was based off of my background as an urban
planner. But at what point did you get that aha moment where
your life as a ranger and your passion for the theme parks
really crossed over to each other? I like that question.
(04:06):
And it's just simply combining passions, I guess. Although I
will say, when I started working with Lee
Cockrell, I had never been to Disney World before.
Okay. So my fascination with Disney
came through marveling at their operations because
I learned so much from Lee. Then I went to Disney and I'm like,
(04:28):
wow, there's something special here. So I think
there came a point, though. I used to not
talk so much about being a park ranger. I know now
you are lucky if you escape the conversation with me. And I
did not talk about parks and being a park ranger because I fully
embraced it. Now I know people like it. People like to hear the
(04:49):
stories. And it wasn't until I started to
learn how and why Disney does things. Yes. And
then realizing, wait a minute, we did similar things,
but people don't often see that there's a connection. In fact,
the only time that I know of that I've been booed
during a presentation is I was talking to park people
(05:12):
and I mentioned Disney World, and someone booed
because even park people don't always see the crossover.
But both of them are in the people business, and both of them
are places where no matter what you do, you could be a
doctor, police officer, firefighter, school teacher, accountant,
and your job gets to be too much. I just need
(05:35):
a stress relief. I just need something else. You
can go to either type of park, natural park or theme park.
And it's like a release away from all of your
stress and you, you're really somewhere else.
And I know Lee Cockrell says Disney World is where
fantasy is real and reality is fantastic. And I think
(05:58):
there's some of that in natural parks as well.
Because, yeah, it's real. Everything there is real. But
my goodness, is it fantastic. And I find if given
the choice, I don't think I've ever said this publicly on an episode,
but given the choice, you give me a week at Disney World or a week
at Glacier, and I'm going to choose Glacier because that's just
(06:21):
more my thing. There are other people, though. You give them that option, they're
going to choose Disney World because it accomplishes for them what
Glacier does for me. And I think some of the best
leaders, the best storytellers, the best operators, the best
managers I've ever met are in part, but they're
humble servants and don't brag about
(06:44):
what they do. They're not out there. They're just serving people.
So I love both of them. I think there is a
connection and a crossover. I think natural parks can learn from
theme parks, I think theme parks can learn from natural parks and every
other type of business can learn from both of them. So to answer your question
more directly, it was a slow process,
(07:06):
okay, just a slow process that happened over years. But
interesting part it was the whole Disney thing came about
because of national parks. I had
this. My very first podcast is the Park Leader show.
And I wanted to talk to someone from Disney about
what parks can learn from themed parks. I found the book
(07:28):
Creating Magic online, read it, reached out to the authority. I
thought this guy ran Walt Disney World for a decade. There's no way
he's going to say yes to being on this little podcast
for park rangers. But I reached out and I asked anyway because
I let people say no for themselves. So I made the
offer. What I did not know Lee Cockrell's
(07:51):
sister in law at that time. She has since retired at that time
had been a National park service ranger for 30
years. He was the superintendent of Glacier Bay national park in
Alaska. His response was, I love parks. I love park
rangers. Yeah, I'll be on your show. Well, that first episode led
to a second episode which led to us doing a podcast together. And
(08:13):
now we've been working together for more than 10 years. So it
was his interest in park rangers that led to
us working together. Wow, that's a good story. I have to Say that
a lot of people don't recognize. I mean, a lot of people who understand the
National Park System recognize that the leadership and the staffing
was based on a military model. But very few people recognized
(08:35):
that Disneyland would not exist if it wasn't for the aerospace industry
because of Van France. He's the guy who came up with the idea of the
cast member versus an employee that you're, you're a guest, you're not
just a visitor. And all this nomenclature with the idea
being that when you were trying to build planes During World War II,
everybody on the staff had to know exactly how to do their job absolutely
(08:56):
perfectly, says that bolt fell out, then those people die. So
everybody had to do repeatedly the same thing. Exactly. Perfect.
And so the training methodology for both the parks, National Park
Service staff and the training for Disney cast members, when it's
done at its best, are actually very similar with the same goal.
My final question for you is, what's the next big adventure?
(09:18):
What's the one thing, either natural parks or theme parks that you
haven't done yet? But boy, you're just waiting for the right timing
or the having the money for it or whatever it is. What's the next
adventure? Oh, my goodness, Sam. I have a two
part answer because it would have been different
had you asked a month ago or two months ago.
(09:41):
Okay. I would have said, believe it or not, there's two
parks and I've been all 50 states. I've been to so many
parks, but I have never been to Acadia. I've never been to Big
Ben and I've got to make it to both of those. That's what I would
have told you two months ago. Okay. Since then,
dejuan Rivers and I took a trip to southern Chile
(10:03):
and did this adventure with the Nature Conservancy
into an area that they're helping facilitate the
purchase of that will eventually become a national park. And it
was phenomenal. Went in on horseback. We did a lot of
hiking. We flew in a helicopter to the top of a mountain and hiked down.
Wow. It was incredible. And I'm. Now I'm thinking, oh,
(10:25):
my goodness, Sam, there, there is so much
worldwide adventure that there's places elsewhere
in the world I need to get to. And I actually had no
interest in exploring outside of this country. Yeah.
Before. But in 2019, I went with Jeff Noel on
a business trip to Kuwait. And it was pretty fun. And I thought, I
(10:47):
had no idea Kuwait would be this fun. What else is out there? And then
I started exploring our neighbor countries and
now went all the way to Chile. So my two part answer
is, I got to get to Acadia. I've got to get to Big
Bend. Okay? Those are the two big parks I've never made it to
in the States, but now I'm fascinated with
(11:09):
the Andes and some of the exploration that is down in South
America. Oh, that sounds so cool. I worked at Big Ben, by the way, and
it's like living in a planetarium. It is a life changing experience.
When you talk about dark sky parks and there's a fair number of them right
now, none of them compare to Big Bend. It is a life changing experience
when you look up at that night sky. I also would suggest to everyone, if
(11:31):
you're a big Disney fan and you're listening to this, you've never really been to
a Disney park until you've been to Tokyo Disneyland and DisneySea. Those
are two of the best theme parks in the entire world. And I'm going to
throw in Osaka, New Universal Studios Osaka, which
by about the end of next year we'll have a larger visitation than the two
Disney parks. The three Japanese parks are
(11:52):
what theme parks really are supposed to be. The way that they're
managed, who runs them and stuff, and the intensity of the fan base.
So if you are, if you're a theme park fan and you've not been to
one of the Japanese theme parks, it's probably cheaper than going to Florida these
days. Go to Japan, you will be blown away. And you'll also come back
a little bit disappointed with the American parks
(12:14):
as well. But oh, I love this Andes and going international
these, these parks, because ultimately they were all inspired by the
creation of the national parks in the United States. It's as Wallace Dieger once
said, it was the America's great best idea. And you've been now seeing what
happens when that best idea spreads. Very cool. Very cool.
Yeah, it is a fascinating idea. I just
(12:36):
heard Ken Burns say, and I've listen to a lot of Ken
Burns. I've never heard him say this before and I forget exact his exact
words, but he said that our national park
system is the Declaration of Independence expressed through
nature or how we've done our parks. And that's an interesting
thought. And we are the best in the world at it. I know
(12:59):
I'm biased, but we do parks really well
and it is a good. But we've also not done parks well.
Sometimes some of the things we did at Yellowstone or Yosemite
we would never do now because we know better yeah, but that
also helps other countries because we've tried it. It
was a bad idea. And now we can help other countries learn that
(13:21):
as well. You've been to so many parks in the United
States now. Is there anything left that you say, oh, this is on
my list, I've got to get there? Yeah, yeah, there is. I mean,
I had rules, and one of the rules was if I couldn't drive my van
to it, I couldn't go to that park. So I'd like to get back to
the Hawaii parks. I've been to a couple of those in the Virgin Islands, Alaska,
(13:43):
I would love to do on the national park side, because that's like a whole
nother summer sort of thing. So I have to really think through. And the Alaska
parks aren't necessarily friendly to vehicles. They were one of those things that
you just talked about. You know, we've gone through different phases within the national
parks, and now conservation is one of the primary ones. Wilderness
is paramount. That started in 1940 with Kings Canyon.
(14:05):
And the Alaska parks are all big versions of Kings Canyon, where there's generally
only one road. Then even that's not necessarily an approved road,
an improved road. So, you know, I always creak when I go and drive
my van on dirt roads because it just shakes it like an earthquake and
destroys the poor thing. I'd like to do those. I would like to get to
Epic Universe because I know a lot of people who worked on that project
(14:27):
and helped design that project. And so I'm very anxious to see their work
because it was fun predicting about 10 years ago that the
Universal parks would outstrip the Disney parks. And it's kind of fun to see that
that actually may be taking place right now. So I'd like to do
that. But now you've got me really excited about going to South America and seeing
some of these South American parks because they just must be glorious
(14:48):
because they were basically there and people didn't abuse
them. And so they're still there and they're remote enough that
they're going to be these impeccable environments that. And just to
see the compare and contrast between what I've seen in the United States and
what I would see down there, I'm just sure must be mind boggling.
When I went to this place in South America, it's called Chigeen, when we,
(15:11):
before we got there, someone said, it's like Yosemite. And I
said, oh, that's great. Yosemite is beautiful. They said, no, you are
thinking Yosemite Today, this is like Yosemite in
1830. Oh, wow. They were right. It is just
untouched, beautiful. It is remote enough. No one had
even climbed the granite faces there until
(15:33):
1999. Wow. Yeah, pretty incredible.
And speaking of Alaska, last year, this year and
next year, I am a guest lecturer for Royal Caribbean
on cruises to Alaska. And one of my talks is on national
parks of Alaska, which is fabulous. I love just getting
up there for an hour and talking about the national parks. What a great gig.
(15:56):
Congratulations. Yeah, it's fun because you get to cruise to
Alaska and talk to people about Alaska. It's. It's fun. It's a
little like. I. I called it always called this the magic. And the magic is
when person's apprehension turns into awe and delight. And if
you're a speaker, it's the most rewarding experience. When somebody's
looking at you and just sort of staring at you, and then all of a
(16:16):
sudden their eyes light up, they start to lean forward, they start to
engage, and then, you know, you've got them. And I think that for
every cast member that works at a park, for every visitor, for everyone
who ever works at a national park, ultimately, that's the drug that we're
all trying to seek, is that magic, and seeing that person that we're
staring at being really genuinely engaged and as passionate
(16:39):
as we are about the place that they're in right now. And that's what keeps
us going, especially for the big bucks that you're usually paid if you're a
frontline cast member. So, well, you. You're right on. And it
brings to mind a unique situation. When you are
a lecturer on a cruise, normally you give a talk,
people might come up and ask questions afterwards, but in a
(17:01):
cruise, you're there for a week. So people
that see you give a presentation, you run into them for the rest of the
week. And this just delighted me. I gave two talks,
National Parks of Alaska. Whales of Alaska. Whale was a second one.
Okay. Whales of Alaska was my first one. For the rest
of the cruise, I would have people come up and show me pictures of
(17:23):
whales they saw on the cruise. It was wonderful.
I love it. That's great. All right. Good. Good answers to those three questions. I.
This is a fun game. Yeah. Well, thank you, Sam. And I want to
remind you again, Sam is the author of the new book Sacred
Landscapes. I would highly recommend that because I love
park, our national park so much. He also wrote
(17:45):
Universal versus Disney, the Disneyland Story, and J.
Bangs, which are full of great. Well, you'll be good at
theme park trivia if you read those, I think. Yeah.
Well, Sam, it was great to have you back. Thank you for those three wonderful
questions. I love it. It's very, very good to see you again. And thank you
for listening to the Jody Mayberry Show.
(18:13):
Pull your head in, sugar J.
Foreign
Mayberry Show. Last episode, we talked to
author Sam Genway. And as we do
when there's a guest on the show, the guest returns to
ask me three questions. I don't know what Sam's going to ask.
(00:20):
It's just going to be a surprise to me like it is to you. Sam,
welcome back. I'm happy to be here. Well, Sam, let's just
get right into it. What is your first question? Ooh, this
is tough. But I think I want to try to get inside of your head.
So let me unscrew your head for a moment and I want you to tell
me what is your. It's going to be a combination of three
(00:42):
questions. What is your favorite national park? What is
your favorite ride within Disney parks? What
is your favorite ride within the Universal parks?
Okay. My favorite national park, I will say
sometimes it depends. My right away
answer is Glacier National Park. Okay. However,
(01:04):
if I've been to Yellowstone more recently, sometimes I'll say
Yellowstone because it is so spectacular. But I will tell
people, if they ask if I can only visit one, which park
should I go to? I say if you just want
absolutely spectacular, raw beauty.
Glacier National Park. If you want wildlife,
(01:25):
there's nothing in North America like Yellowstone National Park.
You've got to go there. Okay, so there's the first answer.
Favorite ride at Universal. I think I.
I have to go with Flights of Passage because it's just spectacular.
Okay. I have to give honorable mention, though, to the safari
because I had the chance recently to ride that with
(01:48):
dejuan Rivers, who was the vice president of Disney's animal
kingdom, and Dr. Scott, who oversees the animal program.
Oh, I'm jealous. And it was just us, me and Dr. Scott in the back
row. And it was phenomenal. It changed my view
of a ride or an attraction I've always enjoyed.
But to hear him explain why they did some of the things
(02:11):
they do and how proud he was of that, he said, you
wouldn't know the difference. You could be in Kenya right now. This is exactly what
it looks like. And I think that changed my view of.
I really enjoy this attraction to. Wow, this attraction is really
something special, something that they are so proud of what
they've created. So I think that has gone up a few notches now.
(02:34):
And my favorite ride at Universal,
there's one in particular that my
kids like. But I'm going to go with one that. That
just really was a treat for me that adds.
If you've not written it, there might be a bit of a spoiler in here.
But the motorbike ride. The Harry Potter motorbike ride.
(02:57):
Oh, yeah. Okay. So that's a lot of fun. But it had something
I completely did not expect to happen. And there
are a lot of rides at Universal that delight me. But to have
one that was just completely unexpected, like,
I did not know that was going to happen, that was a lot of fun
for me. And I enjoy now doing the motorbike
(03:20):
ride with someone who hasn't done it before because I know what's about to happen,
and I can watch how they react when it happens.
Very cool. Very cool. Second question is going to be,
at what point in your life or your career did
you get this aha moment? That your mission in life was to
try to engage others, to find these same passions, both
(03:43):
where those worlds collide. That's how I kind of look at my life, is that
theme parks and national parks, to most people don't seem like they collide,
but they certainly do. And that was based off of my background as an urban
planner. But at what point did you get that aha moment where
your life as a ranger and your passion for the theme parks
really crossed over to each other? I like that question.
(04:06):
And it's just simply combining passions, I guess. Although I
will say, when I started working with Lee
Cockrell, I had never been to Disney World before.
Okay. So my fascination with Disney
came through marveling at their operations because
I learned so much from Lee. Then I went to Disney and I'm like,
(04:28):
wow, there's something special here. So I think
there came a point, though. I used to not
talk so much about being a park ranger. I know now
you are lucky if you escape the conversation with me. And I
did not talk about parks and being a park ranger because I fully
embraced it. Now I know people like it. People like to hear the
(04:49):
stories. And it wasn't until I started to
learn how and why Disney does things. Yes. And
then realizing, wait a minute, we did similar things,
but people don't often see that there's a connection. In fact,
the only time that I know of that I've been booed
during a presentation is I was talking to park people
(05:12):
and I mentioned Disney World, and someone booed
because even park people don't always see the crossover.
But both of them are in the people business, and both of them
are places where no matter what you do, you could be a
doctor, police officer, firefighter, school teacher, accountant,
and your job gets to be too much. I just need
(05:35):
a stress relief. I just need something else. You
can go to either type of park, natural park or theme park.
And it's like a release away from all of your
stress and you, you're really somewhere else.
And I know Lee Cockrell says Disney World is where
fantasy is real and reality is fantastic. And I think
(05:58):
there's some of that in natural parks as well.
Because, yeah, it's real. Everything there is real. But
my goodness, is it fantastic. And I find if given
the choice, I don't think I've ever said this publicly on an episode,
but given the choice, you give me a week at Disney World or a week
at Glacier, and I'm going to choose Glacier because that's just
(06:21):
more my thing. There are other people, though. You give them that option, they're
going to choose Disney World because it accomplishes for them what
Glacier does for me. And I think some of the best
leaders, the best storytellers, the best operators, the best
managers I've ever met are in part, but they're
humble servants and don't brag about
(06:44):
what they do. They're not out there. They're just serving people.
So I love both of them. I think there is a
connection and a crossover. I think natural parks can learn from
theme parks, I think theme parks can learn from natural parks and every
other type of business can learn from both of them. So to answer your question
more directly, it was a slow process,
(07:06):
okay, just a slow process that happened over years. But
interesting part it was the whole Disney thing came about
because of national parks. I had
this. My very first podcast is the Park Leader show.
And I wanted to talk to someone from Disney about
what parks can learn from themed parks. I found the book
(07:28):
Creating Magic online, read it, reached out to the authority. I
thought this guy ran Walt Disney World for a decade. There's no way
he's going to say yes to being on this little podcast
for park rangers. But I reached out and I asked anyway because
I let people say no for themselves. So I made the
offer. What I did not know Lee Cockrell's
(07:51):
sister in law at that time. She has since retired at that time
had been a National park service ranger for 30
years. He was the superintendent of Glacier Bay national park in
Alaska. His response was, I love parks. I love park
rangers. Yeah, I'll be on your show. Well, that first episode led
to a second episode which led to us doing a podcast together. And
(08:13):
now we've been working together for more than 10 years. So it
was his interest in park rangers that led to
us working together. Wow, that's a good story. I have to Say that
a lot of people don't recognize. I mean, a lot of people who understand the
National Park System recognize that the leadership and the staffing
was based on a military model. But very few people recognized
(08:35):
that Disneyland would not exist if it wasn't for the aerospace industry
because of Van France. He's the guy who came up with the idea of the
cast member versus an employee that you're, you're a guest, you're not
just a visitor. And all this nomenclature with the idea
being that when you were trying to build planes During World War II,
everybody on the staff had to know exactly how to do their job absolutely
(08:56):
perfectly, says that bolt fell out, then those people die. So
everybody had to do repeatedly the same thing. Exactly. Perfect.
And so the training methodology for both the parks, National Park
Service staff and the training for Disney cast members, when it's
done at its best, are actually very similar with the same goal.
My final question for you is, what's the next big adventure?
(09:18):
What's the one thing, either natural parks or theme parks that you
haven't done yet? But boy, you're just waiting for the right timing
or the having the money for it or whatever it is. What's the next
adventure? Oh, my goodness, Sam. I have a two
part answer because it would have been different
had you asked a month ago or two months ago.
(09:41):
Okay. I would have said, believe it or not, there's two
parks and I've been all 50 states. I've been to so many
parks, but I have never been to Acadia. I've never been to Big
Ben and I've got to make it to both of those. That's what I would
have told you two months ago. Okay. Since then,
dejuan Rivers and I took a trip to southern Chile
(10:03):
and did this adventure with the Nature Conservancy
into an area that they're helping facilitate the
purchase of that will eventually become a national park. And it
was phenomenal. Went in on horseback. We did a lot of
hiking. We flew in a helicopter to the top of a mountain and hiked down.
Wow. It was incredible. And I'm. Now I'm thinking, oh,
(10:25):
my goodness, Sam, there, there is so much
worldwide adventure that there's places elsewhere
in the world I need to get to. And I actually had no
interest in exploring outside of this country. Yeah.
Before. But in 2019, I went with Jeff Noel on
a business trip to Kuwait. And it was pretty fun. And I thought, I
(10:47):
had no idea Kuwait would be this fun. What else is out there? And then
I started exploring our neighbor countries and
now went all the way to Chile. So my two part answer
is, I got to get to Acadia. I've got to get to Big
Bend. Okay? Those are the two big parks I've never made it to
in the States, but now I'm fascinated with
(11:09):
the Andes and some of the exploration that is down in South
America. Oh, that sounds so cool. I worked at Big Ben, by the way, and
it's like living in a planetarium. It is a life changing experience.
When you talk about dark sky parks and there's a fair number of them right
now, none of them compare to Big Bend. It is a life changing experience
when you look up at that night sky. I also would suggest to everyone, if
(11:31):
you're a big Disney fan and you're listening to this, you've never really been to
a Disney park until you've been to Tokyo Disneyland and DisneySea. Those
are two of the best theme parks in the entire world. And I'm going to
throw in Osaka, New Universal Studios Osaka, which
by about the end of next year we'll have a larger visitation than the two
Disney parks. The three Japanese parks are
(11:52):
what theme parks really are supposed to be. The way that they're
managed, who runs them and stuff, and the intensity of the fan base.
So if you are, if you're a theme park fan and you've not been to
one of the Japanese theme parks, it's probably cheaper than going to Florida these
days. Go to Japan, you will be blown away. And you'll also come back
a little bit disappointed with the American parks
(12:14):
as well. But oh, I love this Andes and going international
these, these parks, because ultimately they were all inspired by the
creation of the national parks in the United States. It's as Wallace Dieger once
said, it was the America's great best idea. And you've been now seeing what
happens when that best idea spreads. Very cool. Very cool.
Yeah, it is a fascinating idea. I just
(12:36):
heard Ken Burns say, and I've listen to a lot of Ken
Burns. I've never heard him say this before and I forget exact his exact
words, but he said that our national park
system is the Declaration of Independence expressed through
nature or how we've done our parks. And that's an interesting
thought. And we are the best in the world at it. I know
(12:59):
I'm biased, but we do parks really well
and it is a good. But we've also not done parks well.
Sometimes some of the things we did at Yellowstone or Yosemite
we would never do now because we know better yeah, but that
also helps other countries because we've tried it. It
was a bad idea. And now we can help other countries learn that
(13:21):
as well. You've been to so many parks in the United
States now. Is there anything left that you say, oh, this is on
my list, I've got to get there? Yeah, yeah, there is. I mean,
I had rules, and one of the rules was if I couldn't drive my van
to it, I couldn't go to that park. So I'd like to get back to
the Hawaii parks. I've been to a couple of those in the Virgin Islands, Alaska,
(13:43):
I would love to do on the national park side, because that's like a whole
nother summer sort of thing. So I have to really think through. And the Alaska
parks aren't necessarily friendly to vehicles. They were one of those things that
you just talked about. You know, we've gone through different phases within the national
parks, and now conservation is one of the primary ones. Wilderness
is paramount. That started in 1940 with Kings Canyon.
(14:05):
And the Alaska parks are all big versions of Kings Canyon, where there's generally
only one road. Then even that's not necessarily an approved road,
an improved road. So, you know, I always creak when I go and drive
my van on dirt roads because it just shakes it like an earthquake and
destroys the poor thing. I'd like to do those. I would like to get to
Epic Universe because I know a lot of people who worked on that project
(14:27):
and helped design that project. And so I'm very anxious to see their work
because it was fun predicting about 10 years ago that the
Universal parks would outstrip the Disney parks. And it's kind of fun to see that
that actually may be taking place right now. So I'd like to do
that. But now you've got me really excited about going to South America and seeing
some of these South American parks because they just must be glorious
(14:48):
because they were basically there and people didn't abuse
them. And so they're still there and they're remote enough that
they're going to be these impeccable environments that. And just to
see the compare and contrast between what I've seen in the United States and
what I would see down there, I'm just sure must be mind boggling.
When I went to this place in South America, it's called Chigeen, when we,
(15:11):
before we got there, someone said, it's like Yosemite. And I
said, oh, that's great. Yosemite is beautiful. They said, no, you are
thinking Yosemite Today, this is like Yosemite in
1830. Oh, wow. They were right. It is just
untouched, beautiful. It is remote enough. No one had
even climbed the granite faces there until
(15:33):
1999. Wow. Yeah, pretty incredible.
And speaking of Alaska, last year, this year and
next year, I am a guest lecturer for Royal Caribbean
on cruises to Alaska. And one of my talks is on national
parks of Alaska, which is fabulous. I love just getting
up there for an hour and talking about the national parks. What a great gig.
(15:56):
Congratulations. Yeah, it's fun because you get to cruise to
Alaska and talk to people about Alaska. It's. It's fun. It's a
little like. I. I called it always called this the magic. And the magic is
when person's apprehension turns into awe and delight. And if
you're a speaker, it's the most rewarding experience. When somebody's
looking at you and just sort of staring at you, and then all of a
(16:16):
sudden their eyes light up, they start to lean forward, they start to
engage, and then, you know, you've got them. And I think that for
every cast member that works at a park, for every visitor, for everyone
who ever works at a national park, ultimately, that's the drug that we're
all trying to seek, is that magic, and seeing that person that we're
staring at being really genuinely engaged and as passionate
(16:39):
as we are about the place that they're in right now. And that's what keeps
us going, especially for the big bucks that you're usually paid if you're a
frontline cast member. So, well, you. You're right on. And it
brings to mind a unique situation. When you are
a lecturer on a cruise, normally you give a talk,
people might come up and ask questions afterwards, but in a
(17:01):
cruise, you're there for a week. So people
that see you give a presentation, you run into them for the rest of the
week. And this just delighted me. I gave two talks,
National Parks of Alaska. Whales of Alaska. Whale was a second one.
Okay. Whales of Alaska was my first one. For the rest
of the cruise, I would have people come up and show me pictures of
(17:23):
whales they saw on the cruise. It was wonderful.
I love it. That's great. All right. Good. Good answers to those three questions. I.
This is a fun game. Yeah. Well, thank you, Sam. And I want to
remind you again, Sam is the author of the new book Sacred
Landscapes. I would highly recommend that because I love
park, our national park so much. He also wrote
(17:45):
Universal versus Disney, the Disneyland Story, and J.
Bangs, which are full of great. Well, you'll be good at
theme park trivia if you read those, I think. Yeah.
Well, Sam, it was great to have you back. Thank you for those three wonderful
questions. I love it. It's very, very good to see you again. And thank you
for listening to the Jody Mayberry Show.
(18:13):
Pull your head in, sugar J.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist
It’s 1996 in rural North Carolina, and an oddball crew makes history when they pull off America’s third largest cash heist. But it’s all downhill from there. Join host Johnny Knoxville as he unspools a wild and woolly tale about a group of regular ‘ol folks who risked it all for a chance at a better life. CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist answers the question: what would you do with 17.3 million dollars? The answer includes diamond rings, mansions, velvet Elvis paintings, plus a run for the border, murder-for-hire-plots, and FBI busts.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com