April 24, 2025 • 44 mins
Co-Host Dr. Rick Kirschner (https:/mountaintoppodcast.com/rick) Everyone is talking about how to be healthier. The elusive quest for happiness is also a hot topic. But what if health and happiness are actually related? And which comes first? This is a conversation every man who expects to lead and succeed must have. And obviously, it's hard to be attractive to women if you're sickly and cranky. My guest Dr. Rick Kirschner famously wrote a book on how to deal with people we can't stand. How does THAT idea fit in to all of this? Next, Rick talks about how the 'sick care system' here in the United States is robbing so many of us of our happiness as well as our health, even from a shockingly early age. And what is the link between your blood sugar, your testosterone and your weight relative to your psychological and even spiritual well-being? I mean, is happiness itself a function of health? What is the 'triangle of health'? What is Rick's theory regarding what state brings about the best combination of health and happiness? How has the last decade or so in particular dramatically affected both our health and our happiness for the worse? Although it seems obvious that fear would destroy both health and happiness, it seems there's more fearmongering in the media and in society at large than ever before. What's up with that, and how do you stand up to it? And what about our lifestyle choices? Can some of those have a tangible impact on our happiness we might not even see coming? Why do so many dudes die right after they retire? Obviously, being unhealthy and cranky is a bad looks, so what are Rick's steps to keep us out of falling into that trap, or getting us unstuck if we're already in a rut? All of the latest goodies are there for you at https://mountaintoppodcast.com
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Episode Transcript
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>> Scot McKay (00:00):
all right, gentlemen, it's masterclass time again. And
this coming Wednesday, April 30,
2025, if you're listening to this show, within a few days of
its release is going to be one of the most powerful
master classasses yet. It's simply called
winning. No excuses,
no apologies, just victory.
In this masterclass, yes, you can expect
(00:23):
actual practical steps to winning,
along with the mindsets you need to install
to emerge victorious. More than you ever
have before in your entire life until now. And
yes, like so many other things in this life, being
a champion is a learned skill.
Winning is a habit. And you can learn it.
Gentlemen, the most terrible insult that can ever be levied
(00:45):
upon one of us as a man is to be called a
loser. You know it and I know it.
Yet whenever someone says, hey, there goes a winner, we
know exactly what's being spoken.
Respect and honor towards the man who is
seen amongst his fellow men and yes, among women as
well. As a champion, when you win in
(01:05):
life, you're getting the most out of your Life. Today with
Dr. Rick Kirchner, we're going to be talking about how health
and happiness are related. It all adds up to
winning, gentlemen. And if you're not winning, you're
not getting the most out of your life. As
a masculine man who was indeed born to
win, grab your ticket for this absolutely
essential masterclass@mountaintoppodcast.com
(01:26):
masterclass
and I'll see you there this coming Wednesday at 8 o'clock sharp
Eastern Daylight Time. That's GMT -4
for you guys overseas. And now here
comes that excellent episode with my good friend and returning
guest, Dr. Rick Kirchner.
Enjoy this one, gentlemen.
(01:54):
Live from the mist and shrouded mountaintop
fortress that is X and Y communications
headquarters, you're listening to the world famous
Mountain Top podcast. And now here's your
host, Scot McKay.
Greetings, gentlemen. Welcome to yet another episode of the world famous
Mountainop podcast. As always, I am
(02:14):
your host, Scot McKay and today I have a returning guest on
who's going to talk about something that. Well, every one
of us as men should find this to be an incredibly important topic.
And if you don't, maybe we can convince you that it should be
after we're done with this discussion. Before I reintroduce
you to him, however, I want to remind you that you can find me
at Scot McKay on most
(02:34):
everywhere. That is a social mediaash
online content promoting place online,
including YouTube on X and on tiktk
and on true social. And you can find Me Rcoott
mckay on Instagram and threads, although I
barely use threads, so don't even bother there. The welcome
Matt is out for you at the Mountainop Summit on
(02:55):
Facebook. Gentlemen, if you have not joined that thriving
Facebook group yet, you really should. We're waiting to meet you there
and talk about ways to be a better man and to get better
with women. Also, last but not least, visit
mountainopodcast.com comm which is the
website of this show. Indeed,
from Northern Idaho. My returning guest
(03:15):
is an author, a
filmmaker, which we're going to talk about, and a
retired doctor of naturathic medicine.
Coming to us once again, none other than the
author of dealing with people you can't
stand, how to bring out the best in
people at their worst. And also also the producer and
director of a new documentary on the healthcare
(03:37):
industry. Today's topic is health
and happiness are related. Dr. Rick
Kirchner. Welcome back man.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (03:45):
Hey, nice to be back with you.
>> Scot McKay (03:47):
Yeah, you know we had a great time the last time you were
on a couple years back talking about your
core topic of your multi time
best selling book now in its fourth edition by the way
with 90 new pages. You just keep adding content to it,
right?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (04:02):
Yeah, just keeps growing.
>> Scot McKay (04:03):
Yeah. Dealing with people you can't stand, how to bring out
the best and people with the worst. I guess there's just,
well, there are just more people we can't stand coming out of the woodwork
on the daily.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (04:14):
You know, years and years I got up in front of
audiences and did presentations on
this particular topic all over the world.
And after about 30 some years I began to
wonder, hasn't everybody heard this by now?
And then I realized there's new people coming along all
the time and new problems that they bring with them.
(04:35):
So the problem of problem people isn't going anywhere.
>> Scot McKay (04:37):
Yeah. And you know, as you're talking, I'm thinking there are probably more
ways than ever before
for people to be annoying and unlikable.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (04:47):
Yeah, there most certainly are. And
you know, I'd say social media has brought out the worst and
a whole lot of people, the use
of devices has created so much
separation between people. it seems to me
like the ability to engage with other people and do what
you and I are doing, which is to have a conversation,
(05:07):
that ability is fading away for a lot of people.
And it's a shame because a healthy society,
a happy society, depends on our ability to
talk with each other. A happy relationship
requires on the ability to talk with each other.
So I'm glad we have a chance to do this.
>> Scot McKay (05:24):
Yeah, it's good to talk to you, man. You know, what you're talking about
is very well documented. During the course of
this show, we're all about getting better with women and being better
men. And if you want to be good with women, you have
to actually get out there and interact with real women and
hopefully be likable and charming so that they'll like you
back. And, you know, this is something that your book
hits right down the fairway. You have a new
(05:47):
documentary out that kind of dovetails with the topic
today. it's on the healthcare system. Give
us the elevator pitch on what that's about.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (05:56):
Well, this is a documentary I made.
It's called How Healthcare Became Sick Care
the True History of Medicine. And it tells the
story of how we wound up with a system
that's more interested in getting people on
drugs and cutting off troublesome body parts than it is
in providing health care.
So, it's an interesting movie. It's free on my
(06:19):
website@talknatural.coma, 24 hours a
day. Anybody can watch it that wants to. But I
felt like it was a story that needed to be told, and
it was a research project for me. I really wanted
to understand it for myself, and I'm real
happy with the.
>> Scot McKay (06:34):
Way it turned out now, indeed, what we're talking
about today is how health and happiness are
related. So perhaps not
coincidentally, two of the topics you're passionate about
are the sick care system, which I believe you
correctly referred to it as here in the United States,
and people being hard to deal with.
(06:55):
What's the relationship between those two X
factors? This ought to be good. I want to hear your answer
there.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (07:02):
Well, I would say that, in a
increasingly sick society, which is what
we have, we have more chronic illness than
ever before. We have, more
serious illness than ever before. And
it's moving further down the,
life cycle into younger and younger people. Now you've got
(07:22):
people in their 20s now with serious chronic illness,
something that, when I was in my 20s, you almost
never came across. so the
society has been sickened by the way that it takes
care of itself, the way that it approaches the subject
of health. And we have a medical
system in place that actually reinforces the
(07:43):
bad choices that people make by giving them the
idea that there's a quick way out. Take this pill
or let us cut that thing off.
>> Scot McKay (07:50):
Or shoot that Ozempic.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (07:52):
Yeah, exactly. Take. Take a pill and your problem
is solved. And you know, it's a beautiful promise on the
front end, but what people discover over time is,
it's an unfulfilled promise on the back end
that nothing works out exactly that way. And in
fact, one of the things that I think men
intrinsically. No. Is that
adversity builds character. You have
(08:15):
to push back in life, you have to
strive, you have to take on a challenge in
order to become who you're meant to be.
And that's how health works too. You have to meet
the challenge of taking care of yourself. I'm
75 years old, I have tremendous vitality and I
have zero interest in taking drugs or relying
on a, on a system that I see as a very sick
(08:38):
system. And I have focused
on my own health and well being for
my entire adult life. And I feel like it
shows. So I encourage people to take
this on, take on this challenge of being the
best person you can be, the most fulfilled person
you can be, because that's going to have the
(08:58):
side effect of making you resilient
and healthy.
>> Scot McKay (09:02):
Now, a lot of the meds that were
prescribed are indeed managing something, not curing
or solving any problem, that the problem is,
hey, you know, now you're on this drug for the rest of your life, thank
you for contributing to big Pharma and we appreciate
you. And when you die someday of it, too bad,
so sad. I would,
(09:22):
I'd like to go ahead and throw on the table this idea.
When you're not at your best physically
as a man, as a woman, as a human being, as a kid,
you know, even as a pet, really, you know,
livestock. We can go through
the entire vertebratee kingdom here. When you're
too fat, when your
(09:43):
blood sugar is off, when your testosterone levels
aren't what they should be, it affects your
personality, it affects who you are, it affects
your psychology, it's even linked to
depression. In other words, you get a little fatter,
you get a little bit sicker, and your brain starts playing little
tricks on you. I think they're almost spiritual,
they're almost satanic tricks. You start telling
(10:06):
yourself these lies that, oh, you know what, you're
getting sicker, you're over the hill, you're old
now, your joints are creaking and everything hurts
and you're losing your memory and it's just the way it is and you're washed
up and, you know, maybe life isn't even worth living
anymore. And yet, okay, and
yet when you give up the
alcohol, which of Course is driven by big business,
(10:28):
right? big tobaccos fading, thank God, in this country a little
bit now you got big marijuana coming, right?
You got all these factors that are just
shooting holes in our health. You know, all the additives in our
food, high fructose corn syrup and fake
sugar. And our diet is a bunch of
chemicals. What ends up happening is our
(10:48):
psychology suffers. We get depressed,
we get crankier, Our T levels
cause us to be a little angrier, we get a little more
persnickety. And it is
related, isn't it?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (11:02):
Well, it is. And it's really more of a chicken and
egg situation. What came, what comes first
is that your psychology goes bad and then you
make choices that support that, or is it
that, that your body goes bad and you
make psychological choices based on that? I
think a lot of people are driven to
comfort. They think somehow that if life
(11:24):
is easy, if it's comfortable, that
that's going to solve things for them. But the
reality of life is that this is earth. It's
hard here. You have to face up to that
and take that on. You want a happy marriage,
you got to work at that, at least for a while, till you sort
it out. You want a great career,
(11:44):
you have to care about the work you choose to
do. So when I was a
student, in med school, I learned
this model called the Triangles of
Health. And basically, so you got the
ascending line of a triangle that
represents, the choices that you make. You have
the baseline of the triangle that represents the
(12:07):
hand you've been dealt. So some people have a
really strong constitution when they're born,
Unstoppable people. I always think of, of
George Burns, who was a famous comedian when I was a
kid. George Burns lived to be 100 years
old and he smoked 18 cigars
a day, and he drank whiskey every day. And
(12:27):
he was running around with women in their 20s right up to
the end of his life. And when he was about 92 years
old, an interviewer asked him,
your lifestyle choices are terrible. What do your doctors
say about it? And he goes, what can they say? They're all dead.
So he had a really strong
constitution. He was able to do all of
those things and still have a great life. But
(12:50):
that baseline for some people is very short. They
don't have a strong constitution. Some people are born
with weak kidneys, weak livers, weak heart.
Some people, ah, are born with mental
defects, visual defects, hearing
defects. So that's the hand you're given.
So if that line is
short because you have a weak constitution,
(13:12):
but the ascending line of that triangle is
long because you make great choices. The
hypotenuse of the triangle is long and that's your
quality of life. Conversely, if you
have a long baseline, if your
constitution is really strong,
and we all have known people, I know
my college days, there were people that could do an all nighter
(13:34):
every single night and it didn't seem to
phase them. And I could do that once or twice and then I'd be
like out of it for a few days. So we're all a
little different in this regard. But if you have a really strong
constitution, you can make crappy choices and still have a
great quality of life. I think it's better to bet
on you not having that long a baseline
(13:55):
and making that ascending line, the choices
you make, the best choices you possibly can
make. So, you know, we're talking
about health and its relationship to happiness.
And I think one of the basic things
that people can do to increase
the quality of their life and give them
(14:15):
the best health possible is to live a life
that means something to you, to live a
life of purpose, a life that's fulfilling.
So that requires having a sense
of purpose for yourself, a sense of mission
for yourself in your life. And if you have that,
that's going to drive you, you're going to make a lot of choices
(14:36):
to support completing your mission, staying
on purpose. But if you don't have
that, what I used to say, in the absence of
a clear sense of purpose in your life, you can
become consumed with trivia. Things that
don't amount to anything don't matter at all, and
literally squander away your day to day life
force until it's all over and you have nothing to show
(14:59):
for it.
>> Scot McKay (14:59):
Yeah, social media loves to load you down with all of that
flotsam jetsum, doesn't it?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (15:04):
Yeah, really. But you see
these young people now where they're scrolling, it's just
scrolling, sliding their finger up and down on a
device and they're looking for, dopamine head,
a little stimulation to make them feel
alive. I feel sad when I see that.
Because here's an idea. How about actually
living your life if you want to feel alive,
(15:26):
Bravo.
>> Scot McKay (15:27):
I call that, living vicariously through yourself.
In other words, you're watching everybody else have all these adventures on
TV and mistaking that for real, actual adventure,
or somebody did something really cool on
YouTube or some Instagram influencer
is having the time of their life and you're like, wow, I like
that I'm on board with that. And you didn't do anything but
(15:47):
stare into your screen.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (15:48):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I get that. That's
a, that sense of vicarious living
where you're watching somebody live, you're
watching somebody make good choices. That's not the
same as you living and you making good choices.
>> Scot McKay (16:02):
Yeah, Covid wasn't any help there either. It was
a grand social experiment to see if we could get
literally the entire society to sit down,
shut up, stay inside and not talk to each other.
And the socioitical fallout from
that was dire. Starting abso
and the workplaces and everywhere else.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (16:22):
Right, yeah, absolutely. This is, I
agree with you. This was a grand social experiment
and sadly a lot of people just knuckled under
and complied. And in part that's
because fear is such a powerful
force in human lives. I
used to teach this idea about motivation
(16:42):
being, the direction in which you're moving.
You'either moving towards something or away from
something. So if you're moving towards something, that's
the motivation of desire, of wanting.
And the motivation of desire is a
long term motivation. There were things I wanted to do as a
kid and I achieved those things by the
(17:02):
time I got to this current age of
75 because my desire was strong.
It carried across all of those years. Fear, on
the other hand, is a short term motivator. Fear is
the kick in the rear that makes you move when you don't
really want to. And what we watched
was fear being weaponized
(17:23):
by the authorities
in such a way that it intimidated
people and scared people so much that they
believed what they were being told. And most of it
we now see wasn't even true. social
distancing, for example, which is an oxymoron. There's
nothing social about distancing,
but that was made up, just made up out of
(17:45):
whole cloth. There was nothing scientific about
it, yet they told us this was science talking to
us.
>> Scot McKay (17:51):
Well, remember also, ivermectin was
vilified be proof that it worked for some
people. And now they finally come out and said, yeah, you know, the truth
is it kind of does work for a lot of people. But the problem was it
was freely available and
cheapeah. And that doesn't help big Pharma to
thrive. So here, take Pax Loid instead. Which
is brought to you by the same company that brought you the
(18:14):
shot that you were supposed to take to keep it from happening to begin with.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (18:17):
Yeah, we saw so many people
fold where they just, they
cut themselves off they stayed inside, they
wore a mask, which is ridiculous.
20 years of science un masking. We
know that a mask doesn't keep viruses out and that if you
breathe into it long enough, it fills up with bacteria and
mold and you're breathing your own carbon dioxide.
(18:39):
You're literally sickening yourself by wearing a mask.
But they needed people to comply
because they were moving in the direction of
this, gene therapy that they wanted to get
into every human being, this experimental
MRNA gene therapy. And it was really
effective. I think 81% of Americans,
(19:00):
adult Americans, took at least one of those shots.
Think about that. 81.
Now that number has collapsed. I think now you're down
to like 10, 15% of people that
are still rolling up their sleeves for these shots that don't
work. But that was a very
successful program because of the power
(19:21):
of fear. And they made
the fear into what sounded like something
desirable. You want to protect grandma, you want to protect the
weak among us. And a lot of people bought into
that as an excuse for giving into their
fear. But I live in a place where most people
didn't fall for it. That's one of the beautiful things
about north Idaho is people value their
(19:43):
freedom here, they value their medical freedom here.
And they did not comply with things that made no sense.
Instead, they had the curiosity to
test the things they were being told. And
it didn't take a lot of testing to see that what we were being told
was not accurate.
>> Scot McKay (19:59):
You know, the significance of fear to the
topic at hand a is something I really want to
underscore here. You know, my wife and I do watch
TV like everybody else does, despite
us decrying the negative,
problematic situation of everybody
staring into their screen so much. Of course we watch our
(20:19):
shows and the streaming
services know who we are. They probably
eavesdrop on us. And we keep getting fed a
bunch of pharma ads trying to tell us we should be afraid of some
illness I didn't even know existed until 30 seconds
ago. Yeah, and
it is, it's all fear based. And the
drugs that we're going to be on are design
(20:42):
to, you know, assuage our fear that we're go going toa die
of this thing. And if we just take these pills, we'll live
longer, it won't cure us, it'll help us manage it.
You know, it's crazy. And we keep
feeding this machine and
it's at the expense of our happiness. You
know, one of the things that you brought up that I think
(21:02):
is very significant to this whole idea of fear,
charging. This whole thing, you know, supercharging
it, is that we don't know if it's the chicken or
the egg. Did we get unhappy first, then get
unhealthy, or did we get unhealthy first and then
did we get unhappy? And I think the quick and dirty
answer there, Rick, is it's both
almost by design. I mean, you know, my marriage
(21:24):
breaks up, I lose my job, I start, you
know, drinking a little too much, I start
smoking again, I start eating all wrong and,
you know, food comforts my pain. All this, that and the
other. Next thing you know, I'm fat, sick and nearly
dead like the famous documentary says. And I
feel like, well, you know what? I should just give up my
psychology, my well being gets flushed down the toilet
(21:47):
with the rest of my health. But then again, you know, we can
be having the time of our lives out there on vacation, eating
a few too many, you know, calories,
drinking, imbibing a little bit too much,
and the next thing you know, we're fat and happy
until we start getting depressed. And the
proof in the proverbial pudding seems to me
(22:07):
that if I make a decision now, this is
anecdotal on my part, but I've heard it from other people too.
And I've visited a dietitian recently who
corroborated this. Maybe you can also. Maybe you'll argue with
it, I don't know. But it's a good point to bring up regardless.
If I'm not doing so well, my lbs are
starting to creep up. I'm, not feeling so
(22:28):
fulfilled at work. This, that and the other. I
start feeling a little more depressed, like this isn't worth it.
You know, my doctor will want to put me on Zoloft when she hears
that I have had like one day out of the last 30 where I
didn't feel at my best. But again, that's
just feeding the whole sick care culture. I don't need a pill.
I need to stop drinking, I need to lose
(22:49):
some pounds, I need to go on keto again. And the next thing you know,
when my body gets kicked back into gear In a
mere 72 hours, Rick, I feel
great again. I feel like I'm 30 years younger already. I'm
looking for projects to do. There's something to
this. And this sick care culture that you
speak of, and you're not the only one. My goodness,
RFK's entire mandate, working with the Trump administration
(23:11):
for the next four years is basically all about that,
right?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (23:15):
I'm so glad, too.
>> Scot McKay (23:17):
Oh, yeah, for sure. I mean, I think he's got some crazy ideas, but hopefully
he sticks to the ones that are valid. That's, another
podcast. Probably another whole, podcast host
also should be covering that. Not me. But
I do like the direction of this country.
Putting the brakes on just this crazy
lack of health and us being complacent
about it at best and inviting it at worst.
(23:39):
It's almost like we like being
comfortably miserable. It's like the movie Wall E.
Yeah.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (23:48):
Well, that's interesting. So, you know, I
think that if you want to be
happy, you have to be as healthy as you
can be because, an unhealthy
body is going to weigh you down and make you
miserable. And you could be comfortable in that
misery because it's familiar. But that's not the same
(24:08):
as being happy. Comfort and happy
are not necessarily connected.
>> Scot McKay (24:14):
There you.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (24:14):
So, all right, so if you, if you're
feeding yourself, food and
drink, that's causing inflammation in your
system, that inflammation becomes, an
invitation for disease and
dysfunction. But if you remove inflammation
from your system by minimizing your intake
of those kinds of things and you focus on healthy
(24:37):
foods and make sure you're hydrated,
that's a big step towards putting in a place
where you can fulfill yourself with purpose and live a
life like it means something. I've, coached and counseled a
lot of people over the years, and the bottom line is, if
you live your life like it means something to you,
it will, and you will reap the reward of
(24:57):
that. But if you allow your days to
pass and you're not fulfilling yourself as
if somehow you'll get around to it later.
You don't know how long you've got, and maybe you'll never get
around to it, and you will have missed the opportunity
for a life of health and happ happiness
quickly.
>> Scot McKay (25:15):
And this will be review for a lot of guys. But rattle
off some poor dietary choices that
cause inflammation real quickly. Doct.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (25:23):
Well, I'd say that number one cause
of inflammation for most people is sugar.
You know, white sugar in particular, but sugaryary
foods, soft drinks, things like that. Your
body is inflamed from sugar,
so minimizing that. I'm lucky.
My wife knows how to make all kinds of delicious
foods without using sugar. She does
(25:46):
use a little bit of honey, a little bit of monk fruit. There
are recipes out there. There she makes me
brownies and banana muffins and
baklava and all kinds of peanut butter balls and
all of it is delicious and none of it is
inflammatory because she doesn't use sugar in her
cooking. So I would say that's one of those things that if
(26:06):
you could just cut that out, you'd be gaining
a huge advantage. One of the things that,
is finally starting to come to light is that it
wasn't fat making people fat. It was the sugar
and the inflammation that was causing people to
gain so much weight. So that's a simple
choice anybody could make. And
(26:27):
another choice you can make to minimize inflammation is
to stay hydrated. Doesn't mean you need to drink a ton of
water, but it means you need to drink water. Most of the
time. When people are thirsty for something, if they reach
for an alcoholic beverage or
a soft drink, actually their body is wanting
water. Pick up a glass of water, drink it down.
(26:47):
That helps your body eliminate stuff it can't
use. And because we are mostly water,
it's nourishing and replenishing. So those are a
couple of simple things that anybody could do,
to increase, their health and minimize
inflammation.
>> Scot McKay (27:02):
Yeah, most of us are chronically dehydrated.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (27:05):
Yep. Think about it. If you spend most of your
time indoors, you're missing
all these cues that you would have if you spent time in
nature. If you're taking a hike, your body wants
water, it'll tell you, if you're working in an office,
sitting at a desk, you may be getting that
message and not noticing it because your brain is so
preoccupied with whatever task you're doing.
>> Scot McKay (27:27):
Isn't that something? Alcohol, caffeine,
seed oils. I've heard all of those things are
inflammatory.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (27:34):
Well, so I'm of the school of thought that
says moderation and all things, including
moderation.
>> Scot McKay (27:41):
So, fair enough.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (27:42):
You, you gotta leave a little wiggle room.
So, you know, I remember when we go to
my in law's house and my mother in law used to
make cookies using terrible ingredients. And
I'd always eat a couple of them because she made them for
me. And I felt like that was the better
thing to do than be like, I don't eat that. And it
(28:02):
didn't hurt me because it wasn't a, normal part of my
life. It was kind of a dietary
aberration. That kind of thing is okay. Every
once in a while you go, let go, go have fun.
Go drink two beers and sit at the bar and
laugh with a friend. It's when you do these
things chronically that they lead to chronic
inflammation and chronic problems. So I
(28:25):
think it's important to have Some wiggle room in life where
you can make different choices, but it's a
momentary thing, not a lifestyle choice.
>> Scot McKay (28:33):
Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. I think it's all about
your habits and the lifestyle you're living. Not, you know,
one specific plate of food or one specific
cocktail at a specific time. Makes sense.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (28:43):
That's right.
>> Scot McKay (28:44):
Yeah. I really want to
talk a little bit more about this
relationship between the
messaging from the media and in the 21st century
world and the fear
that drives us to, frankly, be
bored and unfulfilled. Because I think that might be
(29:04):
the kernel of this entire topic, Rick.
I mean, the landscape is littered with the
graves of dudes who retired at age
67 and were dead eight months later.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (29:14):
That's true.
>> Scot McKay (29:15):
Because they were bored, they didn't have anything to do, didn't want
anything, and didn't find out till later that
retirement wasn't going to be everything they thought it was going to
be. Also, people lose the love of their lives and
are dead six, eight months later following them to the
grave.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (29:30):
Yep.
>> Scot McKay (29:31):
When we lose our purpose, when we lose
the life force that drives us to get up in the morning
and want to do something and want to have purpose and want
to, want to feel capable and useful,
we get sick and we get depressed and we, you
know, probably get unlikable. Again, linking your favorite
topics here. And
(29:51):
it's because we weren't happy, we become
unhealthy. And it is,
it's a vicious circle. And
yet, if you look at what I
unaffectionately call a suburban sleepwalk,
people are told that, you know, having
a safe house in the suburbs and living a safe
life with, you know, a cat and a dog
(30:12):
and, well, cats and dogs can make your life
more interesting, actually, definitely people don't
have the cats and dogs because they're too much trouble. They don't have any kids because
they're too much trouble. Right. And most
people aren't even getting married anymore because it's too much trouble.
I just want to be alone in my suburban
environment, lock the doors, have nobody
(30:33):
bother me. Heck, I don't even want to go outside. Just let
me order doordash. Right.
And watch it all happen on tv. And then we go, well,
I'm miserable. And then we get on social media and what do we,
the most blessed people in the world do? We
complain. And we have something to complain
about. we ordered up this lifestyle or
we followed that rabbit hole because it's what we were told to
(30:55):
do. And now we're not. So Happy. And
everybody out there who's making a difference in the world.
Dating, having kids, you know, buying
the dogs and cats. Although these two whippets around here are going to
drive me nuts. I always tell everybody having whippets
is like dating an aerobics instructor. No matter what you do, they're
gonna be better than you. And it's really keeps you
on your toes. But, all these things that
(31:18):
fill our life with stuff to do and with
activity and that s pseudo activity, like, you
know, churning on a StairMaster, walking with
the dogs around the neighborhood at night. But going on an adventure and
going on a mountain bike trip, or even, darn it, going
fishing. This is stuff people don't think to
do. And as far as my
(31:39):
vocation, it isn't necessarily going to be anything that I'm
passionate about. My goodness. Work is supposed to be work, right? It
can't be something that's actually fulfilling and that I like doing.
It's got to be this drudgery that I put
40 hours a week minimum towards so I can get a paycheck.
And someday when I'm 65 or 70, you know, this is Tim
Ferriss stuff, of course, right? you know, I'll be free
(32:00):
from it, and I can do whatever I want. And then you wake up that day when
you have a gold watch, it can do whatever you want,
and voila. You got nothing to do.
And. And we sit here and we wonder why
our health sucks and why our psychology sucks and why we're mean
to each other. It all kind of makes sense when you
roll it up.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (32:19):
It sure does.
>> Scot McKay (32:20):
Let's roll it out, man. What should men
do if they can really relate to what we're talking about here? Rick,
what's the magical elixir to cure all this?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (32:31):
I sit around solving the world's problems with
my friends, and we come up with all kinds of things. But
I would say this. First of all, I'm retired.
I retired at 67. It was a, career
ambition of mine to retire at the age of 67.
I'm now 75. Whenever people, I
would tell people I was retired, I'd say I'm tired
(32:51):
twice. But the truth is, I just
wanted to free myself up for a new chapter
in my life. My purpose
remains what it's always been. My sense of
purpose in my life has carried over past my
retirement. And that's why I have a very active
life. As soon as I'm done talking with you, I'm heading to
town for a town hall meeting. Dr.
(33:14):
Friend of mine is hosting a town hall, to talk about
public health. And I'm going to go just because I'm
interested. I'll probably have something to say. I'm involved in
the political system up here because I don't
think we can afford to sit on the sidelines and watch what
politicians do to us anymore. That was another
big lesson of the last few years, as we have
to participate or we are
(33:36):
literally victimizing ourselves. But I
would like to offer this to your audience.
I think this idea of purpose is so
fundamental, and a lot of people think that it's
impossible to figure out. But I know a way to
figure it out real easy. A purpose consists
of two vision and
values. What I mean by values
(33:58):
are the stepping stones of importance
in your life. What matters more than anything to
you. So some people, what matters is
adventure. Other people, it matters, is family. Other people,
it matters, is other people just love.
Love. But whatever you value in life,
you know, somebody said to you, if you had no
excuses, what would you be doing right now?
(34:20):
And you could come up with an answer to that. And then somebody said,
okay, but why that. That would tell you what you
value. So I told this to somebody one
time. They said, oh, I'd be sailing the seas on a tall ship.
I'm like, really? You could do anything of all the time,
money, energy, talent and opportunity in the world. That's what
you'd be doing? Like, yeah, go. Why that? They said
(34:41):
adventure. It seems like it'd be a great adventure. Well, you don't
have to sail the seas on a tall ship to have adventure in
your life. You can have adventure by driving home away
you've never taken before, or trying food you've never
tried before, or talking to somebody you've never talked to
before. Adventure is something you can bring into
your real life without needing to go to such
(35:01):
extraordinary circumstances. So if you know what
your values are, if you know three to five
answers to the question, if you had no excuses, what would you
be doing right now? You can come up with that. I always
tell people, take a month. Ask yourself every day at
different times of day, if I had no excuses, what would I be doing right
now? Why, that. That gives you your values.
(35:22):
Second part is vision. Well, we
can't really see very far ahead in life. We're
driving, like, through a fog. We got the headlamps on.
We see 10 yards in front of us. But
the vision I'm talking about is if the
world was the way you think it ought to be? What would that
world look like? What would that. What would that world
be? Your vision of a perfect world.
(35:45):
Because if you combine your vision of how you think the
world ought to be with your values, let's
say, fun, adventure, creativity, and
love, you combine those two things,
you can get up every morning and know, the purpose of my
life is to create a world
in which, children are the top
(36:05):
priority of society and everything is
organized to benefit them, while
fulfilling my values of creating creativity,
love, family, and relationship. You can have
that sense of purpose every day of your life,
Even on a bad day where you use a little bit of fear
to kick yourself in the rear. I don't want to let this day get away from
me. How can I use it better? If you have that sense
(36:28):
of purpose, it will drive you in your
relationships, it will drive you in your career choices.
And when you retire, it will continue to
drive you towards fulfillment. And to me,
fulfillment and happiness, we're talking about the
same thing.
>> Scot McKay (36:43):
You know, everything you're talking about seems so obvious as
you speak it so clearly to us.
And yet here we are as men, and we
love our setup. We love
our routine. We want to get up and keep doing the same thing we
always did. We don't like being disruptive. That feels
unsafe to us. And the next thing you know, we're
(37:03):
unfulfilled, and we keep doing
that unfulfilling thing, like
hamsters running on a wheel, which must be very
unfulfilling for years and years and years. And
adding to the irony, there is the
first guy who could step up to the plate and offer life's
most simple adventure to a
woman is going to capture that woman's attention.
(37:25):
Because the women are just as bored and
afraid as certainly any man
is. And we've got to lead. We've got
to be the ones who step up and say, hey, you know what? Enough of
this mundane melodrama of American
life. I want to go out there, make an adventure happen, even if
it's this big. And it's just amazing to
watch women light up. It's amazing to watch your kids light up
(37:48):
when you do that. And, you know, you're absolutely
correct. As many grand adventures as we've had
around this household over the years, sometimes
it's the simple adventures that
really make everybody happier.
And, well, you know what? Going out and doing something
other than sitting around eating high fructose corn syrup all day
(38:08):
make you healthier. So there we go, full circle.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (38:11):
I think that women are drawn to,
attracted to, and Want to be with
men who live their lives with
purpose. I don't think there's a better turn
on in the world than somebody who's making
something with their life, who's creating something with their
life, who's living every day like it means
something. Women are drawn to that and
(38:33):
children. That gives them something to look up to, that
creates role models for them. when I was a
kid, I looked up to astronauts because look at
what they were doing. They were risking everything. They were just
going for it. And I got lucky
by the way. I, in my speaking career some years
ago, I got to know a few astronauts and
(38:54):
I actually got to be part of a mission to the International
Space Station. I got a thing on my wall with a couple of mission
passches on.
>> Scot McKay (39:00):
You actually flew to it. You were an astronaut?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (39:03):
no, I wish. I was a ground, part of the
ground support team for one of the astronauts on the
space station and he called me twice from
space and both times I had somebody standing around.
Yeah, I was like, hang on, I got to take this, it's from
space.
>> Scot McKay (39:17):
Right on. That's a long distance phone call. I got to take it.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (39:20):
Yeah, exactly.
>> Scot McKay (39:21):
I think that's wonderful. And one thing that I would present
as a caveat to what you just said is you have that purpose, be
driven. But you can't do that
at the expense of the people in your life. You got
to love your wife, you got to love your girlfriend,
you've got to make time for your children and find joy in
what that purpose is. Otherwise if you're just grinding,
(39:41):
grinding, grinding, you're going toa make yourself unhappy and sick
again. So there's got to be some balance like you said, moderation
and everything, including moderation, right?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (39:50):
That's right, yeah.
>> Scot McKay (39:51):
His name is Dr. Rick Kirscner, coming to us from Northern
Idaho. The website is
talknatural.com but you can go to
mountainoppodcast.com
Rick, and get there quickly and easily without having
to remember that URL. when you go to his website
you will get to see Rick's documentary about the
healthcare system. Absolutely for free. when you go
(40:13):
to that website, which you can once again head to
by going to mountainoppodcast.com
rick after
240 some episodes we have not had
a front slash Rick yet. Go figure. Also,
Rick's book dealing with people you can't stand, how to bring out
the best and people at their worst is going to go
back to the top of the Amazon influencer
(40:34):
que@mountainoppdcast.com
Amazon if you're listening to this show within a
couple weeks of its release, you'll find it right there near the top. I
highly recommend it. It's good stuff. Dr. Rick
Kirscer, thank you so much for joining us again. you're such a
great guest. I love the fact that you're a 75 year old guy
living your best life and I think that alone is inspiring.
(40:54):
add to that all the great words and wisdom that you're
bestowing upon us and it just made for a great show.
Thanks.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (41:00):
Hey, thanks for having me back on's fun talking
to you.
>> Scot McKay (41:03):
Yeah man, likewise. And gentlemen, go to
mountoppodcast.com Visit our
sponsors Origin in Maine, the Keyport
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classes Every month we do a deep
(41:25):
dive into an area that is going to help you be
a better man and be better with women. And this fortune would
have it. As I talked about at the beginning of
this episode, this coming Wednesday, April
30, 2025 is going to be the
masterclass on winning. No
excuses, no apologies, just
victory. Go ahead and grab your ticket for that
(41:48):
by going to mountaintoppodcast.com
masterclass. Men who get in on the
masterclasses are almost always glad they did get
in on the master classes. When I say almost it's like Ah, a
99.9% happiness
rate. Okay, I don't know if they're going to make you healthier,
but you know, sometimes maybe so. So check out the master
classasses Also get on my calendar. Let's talk for 25 or 30
(42:10):
minutes gentlemen about you, where you are or hey,
how are you going to live your best life, especially with the right woman in
it? We can get on the phone or on Zoom and
talk about that. Won't cost you a dime. I call it results in
advance. You will emerge from that call with something you can take
with you to well do exactly that. Be a better
man and get better with women. And if it makes sense to put a coaching
(42:31):
program together, we can do that as well.
Mountaintoppodcast.com is where you
sign up and until I talkt to you again real soon. This
is Scot McKay from X&Y Communications in San
Antonio, Texas. Be good out there.
(42:51):
The Mountaintop podcast is produced by X and
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newsletter for men. This is Ed
(43:11):
Roy Odam speaking for, the Mountain Top Podcast.
all right, gentlemen, it's masterclass time again. And
this coming Wednesday, April 30,
2025, if you're listening to this show, within a few days of
its release is going to be one of the most powerful
master classasses yet. It's simply called
winning. No excuses,
no apologies, just victory.
In this masterclass, yes, you can expect
(00:23):
actual practical steps to winning,
along with the mindsets you need to install
to emerge victorious. More than you ever
have before in your entire life until now. And
yes, like so many other things in this life, being
a champion is a learned skill.
Winning is a habit. And you can learn it.
Gentlemen, the most terrible insult that can ever be levied
(00:45):
upon one of us as a man is to be called a
loser. You know it and I know it.
Yet whenever someone says, hey, there goes a winner, we
know exactly what's being spoken.
Respect and honor towards the man who is
seen amongst his fellow men and yes, among women as
well. As a champion, when you win in
(01:05):
life, you're getting the most out of your Life. Today with
Dr. Rick Kirchner, we're going to be talking about how health
and happiness are related. It all adds up to
winning, gentlemen. And if you're not winning, you're
not getting the most out of your life. As
a masculine man who was indeed born to
win, grab your ticket for this absolutely
essential masterclass@mountaintoppodcast.com
(01:26):
masterclass
and I'll see you there this coming Wednesday at 8 o'clock sharp
Eastern Daylight Time. That's GMT -4
for you guys overseas. And now here
comes that excellent episode with my good friend and returning
guest, Dr. Rick Kirchner.
Enjoy this one, gentlemen.
(01:54):
Live from the mist and shrouded mountaintop
fortress that is X and Y communications
headquarters, you're listening to the world famous
Mountain Top podcast. And now here's your
host, Scot McKay.
Greetings, gentlemen. Welcome to yet another episode of the world famous
Mountainop podcast. As always, I am
(02:14):
your host, Scot McKay and today I have a returning guest on
who's going to talk about something that. Well, every one
of us as men should find this to be an incredibly important topic.
And if you don't, maybe we can convince you that it should be
after we're done with this discussion. Before I reintroduce
you to him, however, I want to remind you that you can find me
at Scot McKay on most
(02:34):
everywhere. That is a social mediaash
online content promoting place online,
including YouTube on X and on tiktk
and on true social. And you can find Me Rcoott
mckay on Instagram and threads, although I
barely use threads, so don't even bother there. The welcome
Matt is out for you at the Mountainop Summit on
(02:55):
Facebook. Gentlemen, if you have not joined that thriving
Facebook group yet, you really should. We're waiting to meet you there
and talk about ways to be a better man and to get better
with women. Also, last but not least, visit
mountainopodcast.com comm which is the
website of this show. Indeed,
from Northern Idaho. My returning guest
(03:15):
is an author, a
filmmaker, which we're going to talk about, and a
retired doctor of naturathic medicine.
Coming to us once again, none other than the
author of dealing with people you can't
stand, how to bring out the best in
people at their worst. And also also the producer and
director of a new documentary on the healthcare
(03:37):
industry. Today's topic is health
and happiness are related. Dr. Rick
Kirchner. Welcome back man.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (03:45):
Hey, nice to be back with you.
>> Scot McKay (03:47):
Yeah, you know we had a great time the last time you were
on a couple years back talking about your
core topic of your multi time
best selling book now in its fourth edition by the way
with 90 new pages. You just keep adding content to it,
right?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (04:02):
Yeah, just keeps growing.
>> Scot McKay (04:03):
Yeah. Dealing with people you can't stand, how to bring out
the best and people with the worst. I guess there's just,
well, there are just more people we can't stand coming out of the woodwork
on the daily.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (04:14):
You know, years and years I got up in front of
audiences and did presentations on
this particular topic all over the world.
And after about 30 some years I began to
wonder, hasn't everybody heard this by now?
And then I realized there's new people coming along all
the time and new problems that they bring with them.
(04:35):
So the problem of problem people isn't going anywhere.
>> Scot McKay (04:37):
Yeah. And you know, as you're talking, I'm thinking there are probably more
ways than ever before
for people to be annoying and unlikable.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (04:47):
Yeah, there most certainly are. And
you know, I'd say social media has brought out the worst and
a whole lot of people, the use
of devices has created so much
separation between people. it seems to me
like the ability to engage with other people and do what
you and I are doing, which is to have a conversation,
(05:07):
that ability is fading away for a lot of people.
And it's a shame because a healthy society,
a happy society, depends on our ability to
talk with each other. A happy relationship
requires on the ability to talk with each other.
So I'm glad we have a chance to do this.
>> Scot McKay (05:24):
Yeah, it's good to talk to you, man. You know, what you're talking about
is very well documented. During the course of
this show, we're all about getting better with women and being better
men. And if you want to be good with women, you have
to actually get out there and interact with real women and
hopefully be likable and charming so that they'll like you
back. And, you know, this is something that your book
hits right down the fairway. You have a new
(05:47):
documentary out that kind of dovetails with the topic
today. it's on the healthcare system. Give
us the elevator pitch on what that's about.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (05:56):
Well, this is a documentary I made.
It's called How Healthcare Became Sick Care
the True History of Medicine. And it tells the
story of how we wound up with a system
that's more interested in getting people on
drugs and cutting off troublesome body parts than it is
in providing health care.
So, it's an interesting movie. It's free on my
(06:19):
website@talknatural.coma, 24 hours a
day. Anybody can watch it that wants to. But I
felt like it was a story that needed to be told, and
it was a research project for me. I really wanted
to understand it for myself, and I'm real
happy with the.
>> Scot McKay (06:34):
Way it turned out now, indeed, what we're talking
about today is how health and happiness are
related. So perhaps not
coincidentally, two of the topics you're passionate about
are the sick care system, which I believe you
correctly referred to it as here in the United States,
and people being hard to deal with.
(06:55):
What's the relationship between those two X
factors? This ought to be good. I want to hear your answer
there.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (07:02):
Well, I would say that, in a
increasingly sick society, which is what
we have, we have more chronic illness than
ever before. We have, more
serious illness than ever before. And
it's moving further down the,
life cycle into younger and younger people. Now you've got
(07:22):
people in their 20s now with serious chronic illness,
something that, when I was in my 20s, you almost
never came across. so the
society has been sickened by the way that it takes
care of itself, the way that it approaches the subject
of health. And we have a medical
system in place that actually reinforces the
(07:43):
bad choices that people make by giving them the
idea that there's a quick way out. Take this pill
or let us cut that thing off.
>> Scot McKay (07:50):
Or shoot that Ozempic.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (07:52):
Yeah, exactly. Take. Take a pill and your problem
is solved. And you know, it's a beautiful promise on the
front end, but what people discover over time is,
it's an unfulfilled promise on the back end
that nothing works out exactly that way. And in
fact, one of the things that I think men
intrinsically. No. Is that
adversity builds character. You have
(08:15):
to push back in life, you have to
strive, you have to take on a challenge in
order to become who you're meant to be.
And that's how health works too. You have to meet
the challenge of taking care of yourself. I'm
75 years old, I have tremendous vitality and I
have zero interest in taking drugs or relying
on a, on a system that I see as a very sick
(08:38):
system. And I have focused
on my own health and well being for
my entire adult life. And I feel like it
shows. So I encourage people to take
this on, take on this challenge of being the
best person you can be, the most fulfilled person
you can be, because that's going to have the
(08:58):
side effect of making you resilient
and healthy.
>> Scot McKay (09:02):
Now, a lot of the meds that were
prescribed are indeed managing something, not curing
or solving any problem, that the problem is,
hey, you know, now you're on this drug for the rest of your life, thank
you for contributing to big Pharma and we appreciate
you. And when you die someday of it, too bad,
so sad. I would,
(09:22):
I'd like to go ahead and throw on the table this idea.
When you're not at your best physically
as a man, as a woman, as a human being, as a kid,
you know, even as a pet, really, you know,
livestock. We can go through
the entire vertebratee kingdom here. When you're
too fat, when your
(09:43):
blood sugar is off, when your testosterone levels
aren't what they should be, it affects your
personality, it affects who you are, it affects
your psychology, it's even linked to
depression. In other words, you get a little fatter,
you get a little bit sicker, and your brain starts playing little
tricks on you. I think they're almost spiritual,
they're almost satanic tricks. You start telling
(10:06):
yourself these lies that, oh, you know what, you're
getting sicker, you're over the hill, you're old
now, your joints are creaking and everything hurts
and you're losing your memory and it's just the way it is and you're washed
up and, you know, maybe life isn't even worth living
anymore. And yet, okay, and
yet when you give up the
alcohol, which of Course is driven by big business,
(10:28):
right? big tobaccos fading, thank God, in this country a little
bit now you got big marijuana coming, right?
You got all these factors that are just
shooting holes in our health. You know, all the additives in our
food, high fructose corn syrup and fake
sugar. And our diet is a bunch of
chemicals. What ends up happening is our
(10:48):
psychology suffers. We get depressed,
we get crankier, Our T levels
cause us to be a little angrier, we get a little more
persnickety. And it is
related, isn't it?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (11:02):
Well, it is. And it's really more of a chicken and
egg situation. What came, what comes first
is that your psychology goes bad and then you
make choices that support that, or is it
that, that your body goes bad and you
make psychological choices based on that? I
think a lot of people are driven to
comfort. They think somehow that if life
(11:24):
is easy, if it's comfortable, that
that's going to solve things for them. But the
reality of life is that this is earth. It's
hard here. You have to face up to that
and take that on. You want a happy marriage,
you got to work at that, at least for a while, till you sort
it out. You want a great career,
(11:44):
you have to care about the work you choose to
do. So when I was a
student, in med school, I learned
this model called the Triangles of
Health. And basically, so you got the
ascending line of a triangle that
represents, the choices that you make. You have
the baseline of the triangle that represents the
(12:07):
hand you've been dealt. So some people have a
really strong constitution when they're born,
Unstoppable people. I always think of, of
George Burns, who was a famous comedian when I was a
kid. George Burns lived to be 100 years
old and he smoked 18 cigars
a day, and he drank whiskey every day. And
(12:27):
he was running around with women in their 20s right up to
the end of his life. And when he was about 92 years
old, an interviewer asked him,
your lifestyle choices are terrible. What do your doctors
say about it? And he goes, what can they say? They're all dead.
So he had a really strong
constitution. He was able to do all of
those things and still have a great life. But
(12:50):
that baseline for some people is very short. They
don't have a strong constitution. Some people are born
with weak kidneys, weak livers, weak heart.
Some people, ah, are born with mental
defects, visual defects, hearing
defects. So that's the hand you're given.
So if that line is
short because you have a weak constitution,
(13:12):
but the ascending line of that triangle is
long because you make great choices. The
hypotenuse of the triangle is long and that's your
quality of life. Conversely, if you
have a long baseline, if your
constitution is really strong,
and we all have known people, I know
my college days, there were people that could do an all nighter
(13:34):
every single night and it didn't seem to
phase them. And I could do that once or twice and then I'd be
like out of it for a few days. So we're all a
little different in this regard. But if you have a really strong
constitution, you can make crappy choices and still have a
great quality of life. I think it's better to bet
on you not having that long a baseline
(13:55):
and making that ascending line, the choices
you make, the best choices you possibly can
make. So, you know, we're talking
about health and its relationship to happiness.
And I think one of the basic things
that people can do to increase
the quality of their life and give them
(14:15):
the best health possible is to live a life
that means something to you, to live a
life of purpose, a life that's fulfilling.
So that requires having a sense
of purpose for yourself, a sense of mission
for yourself in your life. And if you have that,
that's going to drive you, you're going to make a lot of choices
(14:36):
to support completing your mission, staying
on purpose. But if you don't have
that, what I used to say, in the absence of
a clear sense of purpose in your life, you can
become consumed with trivia. Things that
don't amount to anything don't matter at all, and
literally squander away your day to day life
force until it's all over and you have nothing to show
(14:59):
for it.
>> Scot McKay (14:59):
Yeah, social media loves to load you down with all of that
flotsam jetsum, doesn't it?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (15:04):
Yeah, really. But you see
these young people now where they're scrolling, it's just
scrolling, sliding their finger up and down on a
device and they're looking for, dopamine head,
a little stimulation to make them feel
alive. I feel sad when I see that.
Because here's an idea. How about actually
living your life if you want to feel alive,
(15:26):
Bravo.
>> Scot McKay (15:27):
I call that, living vicariously through yourself.
In other words, you're watching everybody else have all these adventures on
TV and mistaking that for real, actual adventure,
or somebody did something really cool on
YouTube or some Instagram influencer
is having the time of their life and you're like, wow, I like
that I'm on board with that. And you didn't do anything but
(15:47):
stare into your screen.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (15:48):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I get that. That's
a, that sense of vicarious living
where you're watching somebody live, you're
watching somebody make good choices. That's not the
same as you living and you making good choices.
>> Scot McKay (16:02):
Yeah, Covid wasn't any help there either. It was
a grand social experiment to see if we could get
literally the entire society to sit down,
shut up, stay inside and not talk to each other.
And the socioitical fallout from
that was dire. Starting abso
and the workplaces and everywhere else.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (16:22):
Right, yeah, absolutely. This is, I
agree with you. This was a grand social experiment
and sadly a lot of people just knuckled under
and complied. And in part that's
because fear is such a powerful
force in human lives. I
used to teach this idea about motivation
(16:42):
being, the direction in which you're moving.
You'either moving towards something or away from
something. So if you're moving towards something, that's
the motivation of desire, of wanting.
And the motivation of desire is a
long term motivation. There were things I wanted to do as a
kid and I achieved those things by the
(17:02):
time I got to this current age of
75 because my desire was strong.
It carried across all of those years. Fear, on
the other hand, is a short term motivator. Fear is
the kick in the rear that makes you move when you don't
really want to. And what we watched
was fear being weaponized
(17:23):
by the authorities
in such a way that it intimidated
people and scared people so much that they
believed what they were being told. And most of it
we now see wasn't even true. social
distancing, for example, which is an oxymoron. There's
nothing social about distancing,
but that was made up, just made up out of
(17:45):
whole cloth. There was nothing scientific about
it, yet they told us this was science talking to
us.
>> Scot McKay (17:51):
Well, remember also, ivermectin was
vilified be proof that it worked for some
people. And now they finally come out and said, yeah, you know, the truth
is it kind of does work for a lot of people. But the problem was it
was freely available and
cheapeah. And that doesn't help big Pharma to
thrive. So here, take Pax Loid instead. Which
is brought to you by the same company that brought you the
(18:14):
shot that you were supposed to take to keep it from happening to begin with.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (18:17):
Yeah, we saw so many people
fold where they just, they
cut themselves off they stayed inside, they
wore a mask, which is ridiculous.
20 years of science un masking. We
know that a mask doesn't keep viruses out and that if you
breathe into it long enough, it fills up with bacteria and
mold and you're breathing your own carbon dioxide.
(18:39):
You're literally sickening yourself by wearing a mask.
But they needed people to comply
because they were moving in the direction of
this, gene therapy that they wanted to get
into every human being, this experimental
MRNA gene therapy. And it was really
effective. I think 81% of Americans,
(19:00):
adult Americans, took at least one of those shots.
Think about that. 81.
Now that number has collapsed. I think now you're down
to like 10, 15% of people that
are still rolling up their sleeves for these shots that don't
work. But that was a very
successful program because of the power
(19:21):
of fear. And they made
the fear into what sounded like something
desirable. You want to protect grandma, you want to protect the
weak among us. And a lot of people bought into
that as an excuse for giving into their
fear. But I live in a place where most people
didn't fall for it. That's one of the beautiful things
about north Idaho is people value their
(19:43):
freedom here, they value their medical freedom here.
And they did not comply with things that made no sense.
Instead, they had the curiosity to
test the things they were being told. And
it didn't take a lot of testing to see that what we were being told
was not accurate.
>> Scot McKay (19:59):
You know, the significance of fear to the
topic at hand a is something I really want to
underscore here. You know, my wife and I do watch
TV like everybody else does, despite
us decrying the negative,
problematic situation of everybody
staring into their screen so much. Of course we watch our
(20:19):
shows and the streaming
services know who we are. They probably
eavesdrop on us. And we keep getting fed a
bunch of pharma ads trying to tell us we should be afraid of some
illness I didn't even know existed until 30 seconds
ago. Yeah, and
it is, it's all fear based. And the
drugs that we're going to be on are design
(20:42):
to, you know, assuage our fear that we're go going toa die
of this thing. And if we just take these pills, we'll live
longer, it won't cure us, it'll help us manage it.
You know, it's crazy. And we keep
feeding this machine and
it's at the expense of our happiness. You
know, one of the things that you brought up that I think
(21:02):
is very significant to this whole idea of fear,
charging. This whole thing, you know, supercharging
it, is that we don't know if it's the chicken or
the egg. Did we get unhappy first, then get
unhealthy, or did we get unhealthy first and then
did we get unhappy? And I think the quick and dirty
answer there, Rick, is it's both
almost by design. I mean, you know, my marriage
(21:24):
breaks up, I lose my job, I start, you
know, drinking a little too much, I start
smoking again, I start eating all wrong and,
you know, food comforts my pain. All this, that and the
other. Next thing you know, I'm fat, sick and nearly
dead like the famous documentary says. And I
feel like, well, you know what? I should just give up my
psychology, my well being gets flushed down the toilet
(21:47):
with the rest of my health. But then again, you know, we can
be having the time of our lives out there on vacation, eating
a few too many, you know, calories,
drinking, imbibing a little bit too much,
and the next thing you know, we're fat and happy
until we start getting depressed. And the
proof in the proverbial pudding seems to me
(22:07):
that if I make a decision now, this is
anecdotal on my part, but I've heard it from other people too.
And I've visited a dietitian recently who
corroborated this. Maybe you can also. Maybe you'll argue with
it, I don't know. But it's a good point to bring up regardless.
If I'm not doing so well, my lbs are
starting to creep up. I'm, not feeling so
(22:28):
fulfilled at work. This, that and the other. I
start feeling a little more depressed, like this isn't worth it.
You know, my doctor will want to put me on Zoloft when she hears
that I have had like one day out of the last 30 where I
didn't feel at my best. But again, that's
just feeding the whole sick care culture. I don't need a pill.
I need to stop drinking, I need to lose
(22:49):
some pounds, I need to go on keto again. And the next thing you know,
when my body gets kicked back into gear In a
mere 72 hours, Rick, I feel
great again. I feel like I'm 30 years younger already. I'm
looking for projects to do. There's something to
this. And this sick care culture that you
speak of, and you're not the only one. My goodness,
RFK's entire mandate, working with the Trump administration
(23:11):
for the next four years is basically all about that,
right?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (23:15):
I'm so glad, too.
>> Scot McKay (23:17):
Oh, yeah, for sure. I mean, I think he's got some crazy ideas, but hopefully
he sticks to the ones that are valid. That's, another
podcast. Probably another whole, podcast host
also should be covering that. Not me. But
I do like the direction of this country.
Putting the brakes on just this crazy
lack of health and us being complacent
about it at best and inviting it at worst.
(23:39):
It's almost like we like being
comfortably miserable. It's like the movie Wall E.
Yeah.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (23:48):
Well, that's interesting. So, you know, I
think that if you want to be
happy, you have to be as healthy as you
can be because, an unhealthy
body is going to weigh you down and make you
miserable. And you could be comfortable in that
misery because it's familiar. But that's not the same
(24:08):
as being happy. Comfort and happy
are not necessarily connected.
>> Scot McKay (24:14):
There you.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (24:14):
So, all right, so if you, if you're
feeding yourself, food and
drink, that's causing inflammation in your
system, that inflammation becomes, an
invitation for disease and
dysfunction. But if you remove inflammation
from your system by minimizing your intake
of those kinds of things and you focus on healthy
(24:37):
foods and make sure you're hydrated,
that's a big step towards putting in a place
where you can fulfill yourself with purpose and live a
life like it means something. I've, coached and counseled a
lot of people over the years, and the bottom line is, if
you live your life like it means something to you,
it will, and you will reap the reward of
(24:57):
that. But if you allow your days to
pass and you're not fulfilling yourself as
if somehow you'll get around to it later.
You don't know how long you've got, and maybe you'll never get
around to it, and you will have missed the opportunity
for a life of health and happ happiness
quickly.
>> Scot McKay (25:15):
And this will be review for a lot of guys. But rattle
off some poor dietary choices that
cause inflammation real quickly. Doct.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (25:23):
Well, I'd say that number one cause
of inflammation for most people is sugar.
You know, white sugar in particular, but sugaryary
foods, soft drinks, things like that. Your
body is inflamed from sugar,
so minimizing that. I'm lucky.
My wife knows how to make all kinds of delicious
foods without using sugar. She does
(25:46):
use a little bit of honey, a little bit of monk fruit. There
are recipes out there. There she makes me
brownies and banana muffins and
baklava and all kinds of peanut butter balls and
all of it is delicious and none of it is
inflammatory because she doesn't use sugar in her
cooking. So I would say that's one of those things that if
(26:06):
you could just cut that out, you'd be gaining
a huge advantage. One of the things that,
is finally starting to come to light is that it
wasn't fat making people fat. It was the sugar
and the inflammation that was causing people to
gain so much weight. So that's a simple
choice anybody could make. And
(26:27):
another choice you can make to minimize inflammation is
to stay hydrated. Doesn't mean you need to drink a ton of
water, but it means you need to drink water. Most of the
time. When people are thirsty for something, if they reach
for an alcoholic beverage or
a soft drink, actually their body is wanting
water. Pick up a glass of water, drink it down.
(26:47):
That helps your body eliminate stuff it can't
use. And because we are mostly water,
it's nourishing and replenishing. So those are a
couple of simple things that anybody could do,
to increase, their health and minimize
inflammation.
>> Scot McKay (27:02):
Yeah, most of us are chronically dehydrated.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (27:05):
Yep. Think about it. If you spend most of your
time indoors, you're missing
all these cues that you would have if you spent time in
nature. If you're taking a hike, your body wants
water, it'll tell you, if you're working in an office,
sitting at a desk, you may be getting that
message and not noticing it because your brain is so
preoccupied with whatever task you're doing.
>> Scot McKay (27:27):
Isn't that something? Alcohol, caffeine,
seed oils. I've heard all of those things are
inflammatory.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (27:34):
Well, so I'm of the school of thought that
says moderation and all things, including
moderation.
>> Scot McKay (27:41):
So, fair enough.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (27:42):
You, you gotta leave a little wiggle room.
So, you know, I remember when we go to
my in law's house and my mother in law used to
make cookies using terrible ingredients. And
I'd always eat a couple of them because she made them for
me. And I felt like that was the better
thing to do than be like, I don't eat that. And it
(28:02):
didn't hurt me because it wasn't a, normal part of my
life. It was kind of a dietary
aberration. That kind of thing is okay. Every
once in a while you go, let go, go have fun.
Go drink two beers and sit at the bar and
laugh with a friend. It's when you do these
things chronically that they lead to chronic
inflammation and chronic problems. So I
(28:25):
think it's important to have Some wiggle room in life where
you can make different choices, but it's a
momentary thing, not a lifestyle choice.
>> Scot McKay (28:33):
Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. I think it's all about
your habits and the lifestyle you're living. Not, you know,
one specific plate of food or one specific
cocktail at a specific time. Makes sense.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (28:43):
That's right.
>> Scot McKay (28:44):
Yeah. I really want to
talk a little bit more about this
relationship between the
messaging from the media and in the 21st century
world and the fear
that drives us to, frankly, be
bored and unfulfilled. Because I think that might be
(29:04):
the kernel of this entire topic, Rick.
I mean, the landscape is littered with the
graves of dudes who retired at age
67 and were dead eight months later.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (29:14):
That's true.
>> Scot McKay (29:15):
Because they were bored, they didn't have anything to do, didn't want
anything, and didn't find out till later that
retirement wasn't going to be everything they thought it was going to
be. Also, people lose the love of their lives and
are dead six, eight months later following them to the
grave.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (29:30):
Yep.
>> Scot McKay (29:31):
When we lose our purpose, when we lose
the life force that drives us to get up in the morning
and want to do something and want to have purpose and want
to, want to feel capable and useful,
we get sick and we get depressed and we, you
know, probably get unlikable. Again, linking your favorite
topics here. And
(29:51):
it's because we weren't happy, we become
unhealthy. And it is,
it's a vicious circle. And
yet, if you look at what I
unaffectionately call a suburban sleepwalk,
people are told that, you know, having
a safe house in the suburbs and living a safe
life with, you know, a cat and a dog
(30:12):
and, well, cats and dogs can make your life
more interesting, actually, definitely people don't
have the cats and dogs because they're too much trouble. They don't have any kids because
they're too much trouble. Right. And most
people aren't even getting married anymore because it's too much trouble.
I just want to be alone in my suburban
environment, lock the doors, have nobody
(30:33):
bother me. Heck, I don't even want to go outside. Just let
me order doordash. Right.
And watch it all happen on tv. And then we go, well,
I'm miserable. And then we get on social media and what do we,
the most blessed people in the world do? We
complain. And we have something to complain
about. we ordered up this lifestyle or
we followed that rabbit hole because it's what we were told to
(30:55):
do. And now we're not. So Happy. And
everybody out there who's making a difference in the world.
Dating, having kids, you know, buying
the dogs and cats. Although these two whippets around here are going to
drive me nuts. I always tell everybody having whippets
is like dating an aerobics instructor. No matter what you do, they're
gonna be better than you. And it's really keeps you
on your toes. But, all these things that
(31:18):
fill our life with stuff to do and with
activity and that s pseudo activity, like, you
know, churning on a StairMaster, walking with
the dogs around the neighborhood at night. But going on an adventure and
going on a mountain bike trip, or even, darn it, going
fishing. This is stuff people don't think to
do. And as far as my
(31:39):
vocation, it isn't necessarily going to be anything that I'm
passionate about. My goodness. Work is supposed to be work, right? It
can't be something that's actually fulfilling and that I like doing.
It's got to be this drudgery that I put
40 hours a week minimum towards so I can get a paycheck.
And someday when I'm 65 or 70, you know, this is Tim
Ferriss stuff, of course, right? you know, I'll be free
(32:00):
from it, and I can do whatever I want. And then you wake up that day when
you have a gold watch, it can do whatever you want,
and voila. You got nothing to do.
And. And we sit here and we wonder why
our health sucks and why our psychology sucks and why we're mean
to each other. It all kind of makes sense when you
roll it up.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (32:19):
It sure does.
>> Scot McKay (32:20):
Let's roll it out, man. What should men
do if they can really relate to what we're talking about here? Rick,
what's the magical elixir to cure all this?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (32:31):
I sit around solving the world's problems with
my friends, and we come up with all kinds of things. But
I would say this. First of all, I'm retired.
I retired at 67. It was a, career
ambition of mine to retire at the age of 67.
I'm now 75. Whenever people, I
would tell people I was retired, I'd say I'm tired
(32:51):
twice. But the truth is, I just
wanted to free myself up for a new chapter
in my life. My purpose
remains what it's always been. My sense of
purpose in my life has carried over past my
retirement. And that's why I have a very active
life. As soon as I'm done talking with you, I'm heading to
town for a town hall meeting. Dr.
(33:14):
Friend of mine is hosting a town hall, to talk about
public health. And I'm going to go just because I'm
interested. I'll probably have something to say. I'm involved in
the political system up here because I don't
think we can afford to sit on the sidelines and watch what
politicians do to us anymore. That was another
big lesson of the last few years, as we have
to participate or we are
(33:36):
literally victimizing ourselves. But I
would like to offer this to your audience.
I think this idea of purpose is so
fundamental, and a lot of people think that it's
impossible to figure out. But I know a way to
figure it out real easy. A purpose consists
of two vision and
values. What I mean by values
(33:58):
are the stepping stones of importance
in your life. What matters more than anything to
you. So some people, what matters is
adventure. Other people, it matters, is family. Other people,
it matters, is other people just love.
Love. But whatever you value in life,
you know, somebody said to you, if you had no
excuses, what would you be doing right now?
(34:20):
And you could come up with an answer to that. And then somebody said,
okay, but why that. That would tell you what you
value. So I told this to somebody one
time. They said, oh, I'd be sailing the seas on a tall ship.
I'm like, really? You could do anything of all the time,
money, energy, talent and opportunity in the world. That's what
you'd be doing? Like, yeah, go. Why that? They said
(34:41):
adventure. It seems like it'd be a great adventure. Well, you don't
have to sail the seas on a tall ship to have adventure in
your life. You can have adventure by driving home away
you've never taken before, or trying food you've never
tried before, or talking to somebody you've never talked to
before. Adventure is something you can bring into
your real life without needing to go to such
(35:01):
extraordinary circumstances. So if you know what
your values are, if you know three to five
answers to the question, if you had no excuses, what would you
be doing right now? You can come up with that. I always
tell people, take a month. Ask yourself every day at
different times of day, if I had no excuses, what would I be doing right
now? Why, that. That gives you your values.
(35:22):
Second part is vision. Well, we
can't really see very far ahead in life. We're
driving, like, through a fog. We got the headlamps on.
We see 10 yards in front of us. But
the vision I'm talking about is if the
world was the way you think it ought to be? What would that
world look like? What would that. What would that world
be? Your vision of a perfect world.
(35:45):
Because if you combine your vision of how you think the
world ought to be with your values, let's
say, fun, adventure, creativity, and
love, you combine those two things,
you can get up every morning and know, the purpose of my
life is to create a world
in which, children are the top
(36:05):
priority of society and everything is
organized to benefit them, while
fulfilling my values of creating creativity,
love, family, and relationship. You can have
that sense of purpose every day of your life,
Even on a bad day where you use a little bit of fear
to kick yourself in the rear. I don't want to let this day get away from
me. How can I use it better? If you have that sense
(36:28):
of purpose, it will drive you in your
relationships, it will drive you in your career choices.
And when you retire, it will continue to
drive you towards fulfillment. And to me,
fulfillment and happiness, we're talking about the
same thing.
>> Scot McKay (36:43):
You know, everything you're talking about seems so obvious as
you speak it so clearly to us.
And yet here we are as men, and we
love our setup. We love
our routine. We want to get up and keep doing the same thing we
always did. We don't like being disruptive. That feels
unsafe to us. And the next thing you know, we're
(37:03):
unfulfilled, and we keep doing
that unfulfilling thing, like
hamsters running on a wheel, which must be very
unfulfilling for years and years and years. And
adding to the irony, there is the
first guy who could step up to the plate and offer life's
most simple adventure to a
woman is going to capture that woman's attention.
(37:25):
Because the women are just as bored and
afraid as certainly any man
is. And we've got to lead. We've got
to be the ones who step up and say, hey, you know what? Enough of
this mundane melodrama of American
life. I want to go out there, make an adventure happen, even if
it's this big. And it's just amazing to
watch women light up. It's amazing to watch your kids light up
(37:48):
when you do that. And, you know, you're absolutely
correct. As many grand adventures as we've had
around this household over the years, sometimes
it's the simple adventures that
really make everybody happier.
And, well, you know what? Going out and doing something
other than sitting around eating high fructose corn syrup all day
(38:08):
make you healthier. So there we go, full circle.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (38:11):
I think that women are drawn to,
attracted to, and Want to be with
men who live their lives with
purpose. I don't think there's a better turn
on in the world than somebody who's making
something with their life, who's creating something with their
life, who's living every day like it means
something. Women are drawn to that and
(38:33):
children. That gives them something to look up to, that
creates role models for them. when I was a
kid, I looked up to astronauts because look at
what they were doing. They were risking everything. They were just
going for it. And I got lucky
by the way. I, in my speaking career some years
ago, I got to know a few astronauts and
(38:54):
I actually got to be part of a mission to the International
Space Station. I got a thing on my wall with a couple of mission
passches on.
>> Scot McKay (39:00):
You actually flew to it. You were an astronaut?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (39:03):
no, I wish. I was a ground, part of the
ground support team for one of the astronauts on the
space station and he called me twice from
space and both times I had somebody standing around.
Yeah, I was like, hang on, I got to take this, it's from
space.
>> Scot McKay (39:17):
Right on. That's a long distance phone call. I got to take it.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (39:20):
Yeah, exactly.
>> Scot McKay (39:21):
I think that's wonderful. And one thing that I would present
as a caveat to what you just said is you have that purpose, be
driven. But you can't do that
at the expense of the people in your life. You got
to love your wife, you got to love your girlfriend,
you've got to make time for your children and find joy in
what that purpose is. Otherwise if you're just grinding,
(39:41):
grinding, grinding, you're going toa make yourself unhappy and sick
again. So there's got to be some balance like you said, moderation
and everything, including moderation, right?
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (39:50):
That's right, yeah.
>> Scot McKay (39:51):
His name is Dr. Rick Kirscner, coming to us from Northern
Idaho. The website is
talknatural.com but you can go to
mountainoppodcast.com
Rick, and get there quickly and easily without having
to remember that URL. when you go to his website
you will get to see Rick's documentary about the
healthcare system. Absolutely for free. when you go
(40:13):
to that website, which you can once again head to
by going to mountainoppodcast.com
rick after
240 some episodes we have not had
a front slash Rick yet. Go figure. Also,
Rick's book dealing with people you can't stand, how to bring out
the best and people at their worst is going to go
back to the top of the Amazon influencer
(40:34):
que@mountainoppdcast.com
Amazon if you're listening to this show within a
couple weeks of its release, you'll find it right there near the top. I
highly recommend it. It's good stuff. Dr. Rick
Kirscer, thank you so much for joining us again. you're such a
great guest. I love the fact that you're a 75 year old guy
living your best life and I think that alone is inspiring.
(40:54):
add to that all the great words and wisdom that you're
bestowing upon us and it just made for a great show.
Thanks.
>> Dr. Rick Kirchner (41:00):
Hey, thanks for having me back on's fun talking
to you.
>> Scot McKay (41:03):
Yeah man, likewise. And gentlemen, go to
mountoppodcast.com Visit our
sponsors Origin in Maine, the Keyport
and Hero Soap. And when you do partake of anything
from our wonderful longtime sponsors,
please use the coupon code Mountain10 to take an
additional 10% off. Master
classes Every month we do a deep
(41:25):
dive into an area that is going to help you be
a better man and be better with women. And this fortune would
have it. As I talked about at the beginning of
this episode, this coming Wednesday, April
30, 2025 is going to be the
masterclass on winning. No
excuses, no apologies, just
victory. Go ahead and grab your ticket for that
(41:48):
by going to mountaintoppodcast.com
masterclass. Men who get in on the
masterclasses are almost always glad they did get
in on the master classes. When I say almost it's like Ah, a
99.9% happiness
rate. Okay, I don't know if they're going to make you healthier,
but you know, sometimes maybe so. So check out the master
classasses Also get on my calendar. Let's talk for 25 or 30
(42:10):
minutes gentlemen about you, where you are or hey,
how are you going to live your best life, especially with the right woman in
it? We can get on the phone or on Zoom and
talk about that. Won't cost you a dime. I call it results in
advance. You will emerge from that call with something you can take
with you to well do exactly that. Be a better
man and get better with women. And if it makes sense to put a coaching
(42:31):
program together, we can do that as well.
Mountaintoppodcast.com is where you
sign up and until I talkt to you again real soon. This
is Scot McKay from X&Y Communications in San
Antonio, Texas. Be good out there.
(42:51):
The Mountaintop podcast is produced by X and
Y Communications. All rights reserved
worldwide. Be sure to visit
www.mountaintoppodcast.com
for show notes. And while you're there, sign
up for the free X and Y Communication
newsletter for men. This is Ed
(43:11):
Roy Odam speaking for, the Mountain Top Podcast.
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