October 23, 2025 • 51 mins
Co-Host George Dubec (https://mountaintoppodcast.com/networker) What if you could leverage your entire social network to find women to date? Or even your future wife? We're not talking about your aunt Gertrude setting you up with her friend's "nice" daughter here, for sure. My first-time guest George Dubec has developed what he calls the Referral Matchmaking System, and it's like being a "connector" on steroids. While talking about that is way too much fun in and of itself, we kick off the episode with war stories from when George was a classic ladies' man, long before the PUA movement was even thought about. He had the Saturday Night Fever clothes and the Smokey And The Bandit car. How much of his "old school" strategy still applies today? More than you think. For example, wait until you hear his answer to women showing up on dates with a bunch of endless Q & A. And what about chemistry? George has an interesting definition for that, as far as male/female interaction is concerned. Next, George talks about what he calls "The Love List". And it looks like we just coined "The Wingman Workshop" right after that. Next, we talk about the weirdest version of "approach anxiety" that's very real, but which nobody ever talks about...and yes, it has everything to do with social networking. And who exactly should we let "network" us into a date? There's a clear answer to that one. Have you checked out the official X & Y Communications dating advice chatbot yet? https://vamanos.chat
=== HELP US SEND THE MESSAGE TO GREAT MEN EVERYWHERE ===
The show is now available as a VIDEO version on YouTube. For some reason, the episodes seem funnier...if a bit more rough around the edges. If you love what you hear, please rate the show on the service you subscribed to it on (takes one second) and leave a review. As we say here in Texas, I appreciate you!
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:03):
Alright gentlemen, how's it going?
This is your main man, Scot McKay coming at you again with another episode of the worldfamous Mountain Top Podcast.
Gentlemen today, we're going to get you out from behind your computer and out in the realworld meeting some women.
And this is a topic that I was very, very thrilled to put on the table for you guys.
(00:27):
And I got to tell you, I think we found exactly the right guest.
His name is George Dubec .
He's from Boca Raton, Florida.
And, uh, we're going to talk about this and we're going to hash it out and you're going tohave everything you need to know about how to use your personal network as kind of your
personal matchmaking implementation.
(00:47):
It's pretty cool.
Before we dive in, I want to remind you guys that The Mountain Top Summit is our Facebookgroup.
And if you guys aren't on it, you should be, we're having a great conversation.
The website is mountaintoppodcast.com
and I'm basically at Scot McKay SCOT MCKAY on just about every social media platform outthere if you haven't checked out Substack then definitely do that also if you guys if
(01:12):
you're looking to watch this show literally on video.
We have been doing video podcasts for some time now.
You don't have to be just tethered to your listening device you can now also watch.
That's on YouTube.
And all that good stuff's there for you.
If you want to find us on Instagram
That is where I'm at real Scot McKay, not just Scot McKay.
didn't get there early enough to snag my own name, so...so be it.
(01:35):
But enough about me.
What we're going to do is we're going to introduce you to our guest, George Dubec fromFlorida.
George, how's it going, man?
Hey, great.
Glad to be on your show, Scot.
ah I'm here to basically provide some good advice, tips, strategies, uh and maybe providesome really good nuggets that people can use in their lives to be more successful.
(01:57):
Yeah, love it, man.
Love where you're coming from.
I love the promise that you're making to these guys, and I think we should dive right in.
You have something that you call Referral Matchmaking and you've developed this overdecades.
Scot, from 1985 to 1992, my wife and I ran the largest singles network in South Floridacalled the Find-A-Mate Singles Network.
(02:21):
We had over 10,000 people before online dating, before computers, and we had courses atall the local colleges all up and down
South Florida.
We had singles, dances, cruises.
We had all kinds of events and we used to teach the course on how to find a mate usingReferral Matchmaking.
And actually, Scot, that's how I found my wife of 46 years using this technique.
(02:48):
You know, we talk about the new school being the old school, the online dating apps andsites basically have killed the golden goose.
They got greedy.
They started concerning themselves more with addicting everybody to their platform thanactually pairing people off.
People are now wise to that.
Um, plus AI has taken over and you know, people's profiles are fake.
(03:10):
People's pictures are enhanced.
Even the quote unquote beautiful people don't even know who they're going to be sitting infront of if they
venture to use an online dating app nowadays.
So people are shying away from that.
It's certainly not their go-to anymore.
Um, and people are starving to be social again.
People are being social again out there in the real world.
So, you know, short of meeting someone at work, which, you know, can be no bueno sometimesbecause, the HR department's going to come after you if you flirt at work, right.
(03:39):
Um, or, you know, some other means of just cold approaching pickup artistry.
You know, going to a grocery store and, you know, asking a woman how she chooses avocadosor something.
You're advocating that our best bet is what has indeed always been our best bet, which istaking the referral of people we actually know and having them introduce us.
(04:02):
And, you know, being a connector is a great thing in the business world.
And I know you don't just talk about dating and relationships, but you know, I have peoplecome on my show all the time and I end up saying, you know, you should meet this other
person I've had on as a guest.
You two would get along famously.
And away they go and people who are connectors are beloved by their social circle.
And indeed, uh, people pay that forward to other people.
(04:23):
And then they also come back to you and introduce you to people because they return thefavor.
So this is all along the wavelength of what you're talking about, right?
This, this idea of what's always worked will still work if we just give it half a chance,right?
Yeah, well, and also it has an element of there's more accountability because whensomebody introduces you to somebody in their network, that person feels more
(04:45):
responsibility to act right, to be a more honorable person.
You meet somebody online, they don't have to act any way.
They could be a predator or whatever.
But, so just just to give you that story on how this works, it worked for me.
This is 1979, okay?
I had a three-piece white suit, black shirt, gold chains, big sideburns, I had a SmokeyAnd The Bandit Firebird.
(05:11):
I was a great disco dancer.
So Scot, I had all the dates I wanted.
The problem was, I just really never hooked up with, what's that?
it sounded like you had John Travolta and Burt Reynolds all rolled up into one persona.
Yeah.
Hot stuff.
Yeah.
We used to have discos back in the day.
(05:31):
You'd go to night clubs on Friday night.
And if you watched the movie Saturday Night Fever, I I actually lived Tony Manero's life.
I'd walk in a club and all these girls would run up to me and say, will you dance with mewhen Boogie Oogie Oogie comes on?
Or, you know, it was amazing.
But, okay, here's the problem, okay, and especially for guys.
(05:52):
Guys are visual, right?
So most of the girls I dated were blondes with large breasts because I'd walk in a club...
Or bimbo girls, girls that wore tight dresses, showing everything.
And I finally realized after a while, you know, I don't want to marry these girls.
You know, you're attracted to them because they're sexy, but I wanted to find, you know,the right partner for the rest of my life.
(06:19):
So what I did, Scot, is I made what I call the love list.
Everything I wanted in the opposite sex, personality traits, physical characteristics,background, experience, deal breakers, deal makers, I made copies and gave it to my 10
best male friends who were single.
And three months later, my best friend Paul calls me up.
He says, you got to meet this gal.
(06:42):
I met that gal.
We've been married 46 years now.
How about that?
Well, you you brought up two amazing points there.
Uh, the most recent one you brought up with the most, the The most recent one you broughtup is that not only did you make this list, you know, I call it The Depth Chart.
Uh, you come up with 10 dimensions of what you're looking for in a woman.
(07:06):
You know, I've had guys who are engineers come up with like 85 of them and break them downthat way, but
the least complicated, less messy way is to come up with 10 traits you're really lookingfor in this human being you'd like to spend the rest of your life with someday.
And then you can grade a woman like a term paper because you can make each one, onethrough 10.
(07:26):
And then you can make a list of all the women you're socializing with and how they rank.
And what this does is first of all, it lets you quantify something that's very subjective.
You know, I can be dating this pretty Latina,
this brown eyed blondie and this redhead and they all look great.
I can't really decide which one of them is more attractive to me, but I can quantify how,how good they are for me long-term and vice versa, how, how, how high quality the
(08:00):
connection is.
And then what you've done is you said, Hey, hand this thing out.
Don't keep it private.
And you know, I'm amazed a little bit by that because I actually had a guy
up at a university in New England get publicly canceled by his college newspaper because abunch of women found out he had this list.
And I mean, I don't see anything wrong with having this list.
(08:22):
I mean, women come to dates with check boxes all the time, but for some reason, this wasreally sexist and horrible.
Probably because he took the women's soccer team and ranked all of them.
That's probably what got him in trouble.
But you're taking this dimension.
Well, you're taking this whole thing
further by adding a dimension of handing this out to your friends and saying, help me,man, help me.
(08:46):
And I think that's amazing.
thing is Scot, that's phase one.
But phase two, and I always would teach people, you gotta take this serious like abusiness, okay?
Love, sex, and romance doesn't work.
The hot chicks and having great...
In fact, another phrase I use, a good date does not make a good mate.
You can have lots of fun, you can travel, you can go out, you can do all this stuff, butthen you get married and life hits and all of a sudden that fun date is no longer a fun
(09:13):
date, it's your mate.
Yeah, the honeymoon period is over.
Right, but people don't seem to understand it's going to be over.
Well, I want to talk about that.
But again, you mentioned something else that I think shouldn't be just water under thebridge.
You mentioned the accountability of the process that you're advocating, which, you know,is nothing new.
(09:35):
What is new is you're actually bringing it back to the forefront.
Everybody's talking about the next big thing.
How can I use my smartphone nowadays?
And, you know, I'm raising my right hand, literally, if you're watching.
I agree with that, but you're talking about
old school networking through friends, neighbors, acquaintances, cetera.
(09:55):
The accountability is also tied to the person doing the recommendation.
Because if they send you in the wrong direction, then you're going to blame them.
You're going to be upset with them.
So they know if they're recommending someone to you, they're going to be on the hook forit also.
(10:16):
Not even only, yeah, not only limited to the person
who is the recommendee saying, you I was recommended, I'd better make this work.
This could be exciting.
But the person doing the recommending is on the hook too.
I think you make an excellent point.
Yeah, no, it's critical.
And then, like I said, I had what was called, after I would meet the girls in person, Ihad a 20-question interview.
(10:38):
And I would ask the females as soon as possible, as soon as I can, before going on two orthree dates, to find all this information, I'd say, hey, by the way, do you mind if I ask
you some questions?
Now, number one, if they didn't like it or they became uncomfortable, that's alreadydisqualifies me.
They're not interested in me.
That's irritating them.
And it's like, I don't want to tell this guy stuff.
(11:01):
Any woman that answered my questions had, I knew had some interest in me because they'rewilling to answer my questions.
So anyway, my present wife was the only female during that whole process that everanswered all the questions to my satisfaction.
In fact, Scot, I remember looking at her and I said, you know, you would make somebody agood wife someday.
(11:23):
I walked away and I go, yeah.
For me.
So it was like, because it was shocking that she did answer everything the way I wouldlike to have a woman answer.
She had the physical, she had the personality, we had chemistry, and then she answered allthe questions.
So it just lined up.
I think the chemistry has to be there before the question and answer routine starts.
(11:46):
I mean yeah, I mean you got to have a chemistry is a very strange thing.
I mean, it has to do with the touch of the skin, the smell of a person, the way they walk,the way they talk.
uh In fact, I was attracted back in the day, Scot, to many girls that on a scale of one to10 might have been a five.
But I don't know when I was around them, there was some kind of a weird chemistry like.
(12:10):
Yeah, and I was around beautiful Playboy bunny girls.
And it was like, just didn't, they didn't do anything for me.
They looked great, but it wasn't happening, you know?
So yeah, whatever.
And I wasn't their type.
They weren't my type, you know?
oh
is interesting.
I did a masterclass on that for my guys not too long ago.
(12:31):
And it seems like chemistry is one of those things we have a really hard time defining.
It seems like chemistry is one of those things we have a really hard time defining, yet weknow it when we see it.
And that's frustrating because when it's not there, it's game over.
I mean, you're not going to have a romantic relationship.
and there's things like I said.
Do you know that even the rate of speech between two people, if one people's a fast talkerand the other one's a slow talker, they're gonna clash.
(12:59):
So even the wavelength of your speech and the way you communicate, like I said, the smell,some people, like some women, like their scent would just like drive you crazy.
ah You know, the touch of their skin.
I remember some girls, I would touch their skin and I'd get electrical shocks
run up through my body.
So again, it's hard to define it.
(13:21):
Yeah.
A lot of that is scientific by the way, you know, the scent or even what you, what you'redetecting that you don't realize you smell at the olfactory level.
The pheromones are all designed to either give you a white flag or a red flag.
A white flag is surrendering, right?
What's the opposite of a red flag?
Maybe a checkered flag, right?
(13:41):
Green flag.
Green means go, right?
That is a good question.
thought of that.
What's opposite of a red flag?
I don't know.
Okay, and we gotta look that one up.
uh
from a biological perspective, like you're going to make ugly, you know, deformed babiesor something relative to, yeah, you two are genetically compatible.
That's actually a real thing.
(14:03):
Yeah.
You know, and I, I know what you're talking about.
I've been out with women who, uh you know, not to get too crass, but once you get themnaked, you just don't like how they, how they smell naturally.
Other women, you could, you hope they don't take a shower.
They smell so amazing and female.
Yeah.
It's primal.
Certain ethnic groups have like stronger, uh what do call it, body scents.
(14:23):
You know, because I remember uh I had gone out with a girl that had a different ethnicity.
She was beautiful.
But I don't know what, I don't know, maybe it's because their diet sometimes.
You know, they like a certain diet and they give off like spicy.
Some people have spicy diets.
I don't know.
It's crazy.
don't know either.
And I, I'm not going to go there.
(14:43):
It just seems fraught.
But I think it's true.
I, I not denying it.
Interestingly enough, I don't think I ever went on a single blind date ever again afterthe digital age started.
But before that, I remember at least three blind dates I went on and all three were great.
(15:09):
And I think it's because people were on the hook.
Like you said, this person wouldn't recommend this other person to me unless they werepretty sure I wasn't going to get really, really upset with them.
You know, the stereotype is I think you should meet this, this girl.
really?
What's she like?
Well, she's really nice.
She's a very nice girl.
I think that's apocryphal.
I think people know better than to do that to someone they care about.
(15:33):
You know, they're like either, well, they're too...
These two are going to like each other or not.
strategy that I used to teach is a thing that you can form uh a more social group evenamongst your friends.
Let's say every guy and girl has two to five single friends.
Alright?
I would imagine.
So some night, get your friends together and sit down and everybody start working on theirlove list.
(15:56):
Then share it with your friends, your single friends.
Now, here's the fun part.
When you go out with or without your friends, it doesn't matter.
You look for people that would be a good match for your friends.
So you're not looking for yourself.
You take the onus off of the emotions of, oh, there's a hot guy over there.
(16:18):
I don't know.
How am I going to talk to him?
No.
You see somebody that's good for your girlfriend, and you go over and introduce yourself.
And you can show your girlfriend on the phone and say, hey, my girlfriend would love tomeet a guy like you.
So you can, and that's old phrase, the wingman approach.
Yeah, it sounds like a wingman workshop.
Hashtag trademark.
(16:40):
yeah.
that component.
That's a biz op right there, man.
Don't sue me if I steal it.
it's powerful.
And then you get closer to your friends because now you're all working together.
You're kind of learning about each other and you're helping each other and it makes it forgreat socialization.
(17:01):
I think it's fantastic.
I don't know why people are so shy about asking other people to introduce them to them.
I think it's pride.
think it's not unlike what happens when someone's recently unemployed and they're lookingfor a job and they're really reticent to say they're between jobs to anybody else because
(17:23):
they're afraid they'll be looked down upon or disrespected for it.
When in reality, especially nowadays
where these job boards are just fake and ineffective.
Like, and I'm looking at you LinkedIn, right?
Indeed has already been uh nailed for leaving old job reqs up there that have already beenfilled.
(17:48):
You know, and then these crazy things where you're interviewed by AI six times before youget to a human person or, you know, take this 10 person quiz that's going to
decide whether you're a good salesperson or not.
And the person who actually developed the quiz has half the experience you do kind ofthing.
You know, those are, those are just as bad as online dating and apps.
The way people who have lost their job in this economy are getting a new one is...
(18:12):
wait for it.
Networking with people they know.
It's the same thing.
Oh, yeah.
Chalk up another similarity between dating and your career.
And now you brought up another good point, and this is across the board for everything,Scot.
People don't know or afraid to ask for anything.
(18:34):
They're even afraid to ask their own mate for certain things.
Even family members, there was a book out called The Aladdin Factor, and it's a great bookthat all they talk about in the book is how to ask.
Get in your head.
You have to, actually we talked about this earlier off camera, but training is soimportant.
So if you want to ask,
(18:56):
be able to ask, you have to kind of train yourself.
You have to get in the mode of doing it.
Okay, you can't just do it once in a while.
So I train myself to ask.
I ask for everything I could think of.
I network and I ask people.
All they can say is no.
So what?
Yeah, and they won't say yes until you ask them.
I'll tell you one of my favorite stories.
(19:18):
I was a young engineer at General Motors and I went with this older sales guy.
We went up to Detroit on a business trip and I was young, know, wet behind the ears andthis guy said, he says, watch me.
We went to this nightclub one night and he went from gal to gal to gal at the bar, went upto them, told him that he had a room here at the hotel and I watched him go from girl to
(19:42):
girl to girl to finally after about the eighth one,
she was like smiling and boom, they went up to the room.
So you gotta ask, just ask.
The first three or four you ask are gonna say no, but maybe the fifth or sixth or seventh.
Well, that kind of flies in the face to the kind of flies in the face of the long-termapproach you're advocating.
(20:05):
But I guess when you're young, dumb and full of cum, that's, that's a good plan.
Yeah.
real direct hardcore uh punch approach, but...
Well, yeah, as we all know, most men are horrified of women.
They're not only just horrified of being rejected because of their egos, but they'rehorrified they're going to bother women nowadays.
as if women, As if women don't even want to be talked to.
(20:26):
Scot, back in the day when my wife and I ran the big singles network, I used to have guysthat were very successful, good looking guys, running companies, hiring and firing people.
They would hire me back in the day to take them to nightclubs and I would show them how toapproach women.
It used to amaze me.
I'm going...
I said, look at you.
I said, you got everything going for you and you can't go up and approach a woman.
(20:50):
So I would pick a woman out in a club.
I'd say, okay, pick somebody out
and they would watch me and they were amazed.
They go, how did you do that?
I said, just practice.
You just learn how to go over and start casual conversation and a lot of times you'regonna get disinterest or they're gonna blow you off, so what?
You know, um, interestingly enough, I still do that with guys from time to time.
(21:14):
take them out in field and almost invariably the guy will get off the plane when he fliesin here and look at me up and down and go, you, you know, because I'm not a genetic
lottery winner.
And oh man, I've been accused of hiring actresses.
I've been accused of paying people off, having ringers here and there.
And finally, they have to admit there's no way I could have had it that well coordinated.
(21:38):
What we do is we go to what has to be one of the largest outlet shopping centers in, inNorth America.
It's huge.
It's over a half mile long, which doesn't seem like a lot until you actually go there andrealize that's a long freaking huge, you know, outlet mall.
We can get there at 10 in the morning, leave at six at night.
(21:58):
And we haven't gone to everywhere we could have gone, you know,
And all you do is you...
In the morning, what you do is you just go from place to place and it's in a college town.
So it's all cute girls working.
They have nobody to talk to.
And then by the afternoon, it's starting to fill up.
So you can talk to the people who are shopping as well.
And it's just nonstop immersion in talking to cute girls.
(22:19):
And guys just, you know, the older they are, the more frustrated they get because they'relike, man, what have I been doing my whole life?
This is not hard.
It's not dangerous.
And it's all about making women feel safe and helping them have fun.
Cause most men are allergic to fun.
They're trying to be all serious, you know, and you know, women just, they're going tofeed off that energy and give you right back what you invest in it.
(22:44):
And the more lightweight, warm, I call it warm levity.
Most guys are trying to be stoic and serious because that's what some men's website orYouTube channel told them.
But really women, girls just love to have fun.
And if you bring up a woman's energy like that, she's going to love you.
It doesn't even matter what you look like anymore, because first of all, you had theconfidence, which is sexy as hell to approach them and talk to them.
(23:10):
And you have the confidence to have a conversation with them.
You make it all about them instead of bragging about your boat and your law degree and allthat stuff.
And the next thing you know, you have all these women within about 60 to 90 seconds,rising up to your exact energy that you bring.
And guys will be like, that's amazing.
How do you do it?
I said, well, it's a learned skill.
(23:33):
And sometimes guys will say, well, prove it.
And I'll go, alright great.
What I'll do is I'll be the same exact guy, same exact day, same bat time, same batchannel, same clothes.
And I'll go to a woman and I'll, I'll lack that energy or I'll be reticent and the womanwill be disinterested and she won't want to talk to me.
And she'll be like looking for an escape hatch.
You know how they do.
And the guy will be like, well, she didn't like you at all.
(23:53):
go, yeah, cause I engineered that socially.
And then what I'll do is I'll, I'll kind of, you know, this is probably unfair to realhuman beings.
I usually apologize to them afterwards and told them what I did, you know, break thefourth wall a little, but I can start off low energy with a woman and she's kind of just
going through the motions with me and then I'll raise it up and be my charming self andshe'll rise up to meet that.
(24:16):
Or I can go and be charming at first and then kind of like lose my mojo on purpose andshe'll kind of lose her interest level as well.
And guys are like,
you're in total control of this interaction.
I go yeah, and you are in total control of your interactions.
And the light bulb goes on.
The next thing you know, this guy is firing on all cylinders.
He's a machine.
And you are so right.
(24:36):
You couldn't be more correct.
Sometimes these guys are genetic lottery winners.
They're built like an NFL cornerback.
You know, they could be free safety for, you know, the Philadelphia Eagles or the Ravens.
And not this year, because we have pretty good free safeties.
They'd have a hard time cracking that rotation.
Ravens.
I'm a Ravens fan.
And then,
They're tall, good looking, making great money.
(24:58):
Cause you know what I do isn't cheap.
And yet they don't have the women they want because 90 % of this game is half mental,right, Yogi Berra?
And yet not only are they out of practice with this, right?
You're talking about how you have to train yourself.
You have to get out there and put this to the test, but just a little bit of practice halfa morning.
(25:23):
And they're like, man, where has this been my whole life?
These women are great.
I'm having a great time.
You take them out to, you know, a nighttime venue.
We don't really have discos anymore per se in San Antonio.
Everybody's doing these outdoor park like settings where they, you know, play corn holeand just socialize with the Christmas lights all year.
those are a lot harder to socialize than the old dance clubs, but anyway.
(25:44):
Well, I find it easier because they're not dark and smoky.
They're brightly lit and people are actually out there being social.
But you know, your mileage may vary.
used to use dancing to make the connection.
Anyway...
but yeah.
I mean, you know, if you're John Travolta from, you know, Saturday Night Fever, you're in.
Heck, yeah.
Especially if you've got Burt Reynolds's car to whisk him away with after the, you know,after the Bee Gees are done.
(26:09):
um
But it is, it's out there and saying, okay, I'm going to give this a shot, even thoughit's outside my comfort zone, even though it's not something I'm used to doing.
They realize it's just not that scary.
And, and here's the connection I want to make to what you're talking about.
(26:30):
I think it's equally scary.
You know, equivalent to the fear factor of approaching a woman to approach a friend andsay, hey
who can you introduce me to because I'm single and looking?
Or who can you introduce me to who's hiring someone with my kind of expertise?
There's, some humility in there.
(26:51):
There's some vulnerability in that Brene Brownish good sense of, I have to be, becourageous, step outside of this and take some risk.
And it may turn out well, or it may not, but if I never ask, I'll never receive.
So I think it's almost like we got to get over our approach anxiety of having someone inour network help us.
What do you think?
Oh yeah, definitely.
(27:12):
Back in the day, back in the disco days, my friends and I, I'd pick one of my friends,we'd go into the disco, and I'd say, you go to the left, I'll go to the right, and let's
meet back in 20 minutes and see who gets the most phone numbers.
We didn't even care about the women.
It was like we were practicing.
What does it take to get a girl's phone number?
(27:32):
And it was amazing.
I mean, in other words, it's training.
You were training yourself to be able to talk to them, to get their sense of humor.
And one of my favorite approaches, and this is hilarious, but I'd walk up to a gal with abig smile and I'd look at her and I'd say, hey, what do you think of me so far?
I mean, it's amazing what you get out of that because they have to come up with an answer.
(27:57):
Sometimes it looks like they're sucking on a lemon.
And it's like, my God, it's like, who is this guy?
But it's amazing, the girls that liked me would always touch me.
They would lean over and it was like, they wanted to assure me, oh yeah, I think you're anice looking guy.
And they would smile and they'd tilt their head.
(28:19):
So you could read the woman, you didn't have to go through the whole process.
You could read them within seconds.
Yeah.
You know what?
I have something I call "The Half Step" that I tell guys about.
And I think we're getting a little bit off track here, but these guys eat this stuff up.
So I'm not worried about it.
"The Half Step" is for guys who, okay.
They've gotten over the fear.
(28:41):
They they've summoned the boldness to go talk to a woman, but now it's time to get hernumber or find out what her interest level is, is as the dear departed Doc Love, my friend
would have always talked about.
And, and they don't want to ask her out because that could
equal rejection.
And I go, well, instead of swimming into this, you know, diving into the swimming pool,you can just stick, stick your toe in the water.
(29:02):
And they're like, how do you do that?
I go, well, I call it "The Half Step.
It's halfway to the full step of saying, hey let's go out on a date.
And I have them do kind of the mirror image of what you just suggested.
I say, I say to the guys, ask her, why do I find you so interesting?
What is it about you that I find so intriguing?
(29:26):
And you let her answer.
And if she goes, well, actually I'm not all that intriguing and really my friends are overhere and I'm done with you.
There you go.
That's everything you needed to know.
Have a nice night.
Sa-lute, right?
But if she starts selling you on all her traits, if she starts pitching herself to you,well, because I'm so cute and feminine and I'm adorable and I make great sandwiches.
(29:47):
Well then, hey there you go.
She's in, you know, it's same general psychological principle.
Yeah.
Yeah, one other uh part of the equation that uh most guys don't understand, and evenfemales, is persistence.
One of my favorite stories is one night at a disco, I approached this beautiful girl.
(30:08):
She was talking to a couple other girls.
I asked her to dance, and she went like, get away.
Two weeks later, at a party, same girl.
My friend brings me over, introduces me to her.
She was all over me.
And I looked at her and I said,
Hey, do you remember two weeks ago I met you at the club?
And she goes, no.
(30:30):
So, right.
So if you keep persisting, the first time it doesn't necessarily mean that's the end time.
You can go back to the same girl later and ask her again.
that by saying you can't keep begging the same girl over and over again when she's clearlynot interested.
You know, that's...
Unless there's a, a reason that's above and beyond who you are.
(30:51):
Like the famous example is Michael Jordan's wife, who he divorced a couple of decadeslater, but who eventually married him famously rejected him because she didn't want to
date some arrogant NBA guy.
Yeah.
Well, that's not about him.
That's about her perception of what he does.
He changes that perception.
He gets there.
Have you seen the movie, um, Hidden Figures, which is about the African-American ladieswho helped the moonshot at NASA happen?
(31:19):
Well, Mahershala Ali, who's a wonderful actor plays a very persistent, uh, guy, a guy whowants this woman who's a very smart engineer.
And she's having a hard time believing that he's the sapiosexual guy who just thinks she'snot only hot, but smart.
And he's all over that.
He is just very patient.
If you know anything about Mahershala Ali, he's got that wonderful ability to to carrythat part in an acting role just brilliantly.
(31:47):
And it's really I've actually used it as an object lesson before that you really like thiswoman and she's just not ready to date or she's fresh off a divorce or she's angry at men
lately.
You you kind of just hold space, as they like to say in the woowoo crowd.
And you just keep being a man.
You keep doing your thing and you keep
being masculine and keep doing what it takes to turn a woman on, make her feel safe andshe'll come around.
(32:10):
I'm all about that.
I think that is absolutely true.
And I also think the nuance of what you said is that venue change.
I remember back when online dating was a thing and I was doing it, you know, 20 years agowhen match.com was the place to meet women.
I was also on another site for single parents, which was a bonanza by the way, cause I hadfull time
(32:33):
custody of my little daughter and man, talk about instant security blanket in the eyes ofwomen.
If a judge gave my little daughter to me, I can't be an ax murderer.
Right?
So instant safety and security.
Yeah.
I'll meet you in any dark restaurant anywhere without, know, you can pick me up at myplace.
I'll come over to your place.
You can cook me dinner.
You're, you're already in like Flynn, right?
(32:54):
And I remember there was this little gal and she was exactly my type.
right?
She was what She was, what I like and
she, she was going to connect well with me.
You know, we, we prayed to the same God, pulled the same lever in the voting booth.
We were going to get along great.
(33:14):
All I needed was to get in front of her and get a date and she would love me.
And you know, after you write someone on match.com and they don't write you back, it'skind of, you got to be really creative.
You know, hey, cat got your tongue?
You too shy?
A couple of weeks later.
I found
three different iterations of making her, hopefully, feel somewhat interested enough to beable to at least write back.
(33:39):
And just crickets, man.
And this little gal couldn't have been more perfect for me on paper.
You know, six months later, she turns up on the other site, the single parent site.
And I, you know, one of the things I did, and this is an online dating strategy from thedays of yore, which probably doesn't even matter anymore, but never put the same narrative
(34:01):
and the pictures on two different sites.
Mix it up, you know, put different pictures of yourself, put a different narrative on eachsite that you go to for this reason.
George man, I wrote her on that site as if I'd never talked to her before.
I got whiplash.
She answered me so fast.
It was crazy.
I mean, it was like within five minutes.
Oh, you seem so nice.
(34:22):
When can we meet and blah, blah, You know, unfortunately when I met her, I wasn'tattracted to her, you know, stuff happens, but it was amazing.
It was just the venue change made all the difference.
So yeah.
And when it comes to being persistent, you know, and when it comes to saying, hey, what doyou think of me?
I think a lot of guys, the danger they run into is I could be needy.
(34:42):
I'm looking for validation.
I need you.
You are in the power position.
I put you on a pedestal, but the way you're laying it out is the exact opposite.
It's more strategy there.
I like it.
well, you know, like I said, there's a lot of tricks and things like that that we used to,we learned all the tricks in the book.
And one more story about persistence.
(35:04):
You're familiar with Grant Cardone, right?
He's very consistent, persistent, relentless.
Anyway, he met his now wife at a networking event that he was running.
Beautiful blonde.
He went and got her phone number, asked her out.
She said, no.
So then she lived in another city or whatever.
So he called her periodically, kept trying to call her, connect with her.
(35:26):
She basically kept blowing him off, wasn't interested.
Anyway, but back when he met her, he said that he was gonna marry that girl when he sawher.
One year later, they were married.
There's an aspect to how attraction works with women that operates such that when womenfeel chosen by a guy, they feel attraction towards him.
(35:52):
that's a special feature there.
Now the caveat is if this is a desperate needy guy who's going around choosing anythingthat can fog a mirror, not so much, but when she sees him as a man of value, obviously he
could date some other chick.
He could get a date.
He's not desperate for female attention.
(36:13):
And you know, guys, these are all things we can work on.
This is all self work that all of us as men need to do.
95 % of us aren't genetic lottery winners.
It's all learned skill.
So this isn't something that only special guys in some good positive way can do.
But if you have options with women, you're not coming off desperate or needy and youchoose a woman, you say you, you're exactly what I like.
(36:39):
I like you.
You know, even on the first date, just to announce that you actually like this person, youcan sometimes watch a woman go, oh, and the tension is cut through right there, like a hot
knife through butter.
But so many guys are playing keep away going, I have to put up the stoic front that Idon't know if I'm liking her or not.
Cause I don't want the power position to be given away.
(37:01):
I don't want her to steal my, my power from me.
the poor girl's on the other side of table, not knowing where she stands with you, But ittakes a certain kind of guy in a certain situation with the right woman to say, you know
what?
I'm done here.
I like you.
I did that with my wife.
You know, when I met my wife,
(37:21):
both of us were going on plenty of dates.
Both of us were obviously able to get a date, but man, by the time we were done the firstdate, it's like, alright, I like you.
You, you, I want more of you.
don't, I, you know, And a week later I said, you know, I don't think I need other women atall anymore.
(37:42):
I think you and I should just hang out with each other from now on.
She goes, great.
I completely agree.
You know, it was, it was all these people talk about chasing.
Stop chasing women.
Have them chase you instead.
I know people who have built their entire brand around that.
Nobody should be chasing anybody and this is the kind of thing going back to thenetworking see what I did there
(38:08):
When someone knows you, they know the type of person you are and they know the personthey're setting you up with.
They know instinctively, these are the two kinds of people who will choose each other.
If they just have a chance to meet, you know what I'm saying?
No, it's a, well, one other thing that I realized about the whole dating and mating thingis, um...
(38:30):
Once you connect with that person, there's four things that are critical.
You gotta have the chemistry, you got to have the intellect, the communication skills, yougotta be on the same wavelength, have the same basic likes and dislikes.
But it just feels like what you kinda said.
You both feel it, it's like a flow.
You can't put your finger on it, it's just like you said.
(38:51):
I don't wanna go out with any other women, man.
You fulfill everything that I'm looking for, so to speak.
And that's kinda what happens.
Yeah.
Well, I actually have 10 dimensions of chemistry.
I'm not going to go through them right now.
It's in the Masterclass guys, August, 2025 in the catalog.
But I think you can define chemistry and I think there's dimensions of it.
(39:13):
And the more of those check boxes you can knock out with a, with a woman, the more thefireworks are going to fly.
You know, people who were comedy teams, famously the three guys who do Top Gear in the UK.
You know, it's a bunch of dudes and they have chemistry.
Chemistry is what makes that show unable to be replicated in other markets.
(39:36):
They've tried it a couple of times in the United States, but the three hosts they puttogether just don't have the three.
They don't have the chemistry of those three guys in the UK.
Right.
is not only just for male females.
It's for business partners.
It's for uh accomplishing different tasks.
It's, yeah, it's...
I call that performative chemistry.
And you know what's interesting?
(39:58):
Performative chemistry is actually one of the dimensions that can help you with women.
My wife and I actually have performative chemistry together.
We do a podcast together that, you know, we finish each other's sentences.
We do great karaoke duets together.
I mean, we can bring the house down with Paradise by the Dashboard Light by Meat Loaf, youknow, doing that duet together.
(40:19):
And funny because I joked to someone years ago, if I could ever find a woman who would dothat duet with me, I'd marry her.
But it turns out it's just one of many reasons why my wife is my honey.
But yeah, I mean, performative chemistry is even a thing with women.
I mean, obviously it's probably not number one, but there are also other cases where theperformative chemistry led to the relationship.
(40:40):
uh Terry Fator is a great example.
I, we basically, we operated two or three businesses together.
We worked together and it was like, great.
We never had arguments.
It was just like a perfect, you know, chemistry we had working a business together andbeing married.
Well, a great example.
I mentioned Terry Fator, and you made a great point on top of that, but I don't want thatto go by the wayside.
(41:04):
He's a guy who years ago won the first edition, I think, of America's Got Talent, milliondollars, and he got a show in Vegas.
And his wife and he had settled for each other.
They weren't good for each other and they got a divorce.
Well, Terry Fator hired an assistant.
A very pretty girl to be with him on stage.
And if you know anybody, anything about this guy, Terry Fator is a ventriloquist and adarn good one.
(41:29):
OK.
I haven't heard about him much lately, but he was famous for a number of years.
I hope he's still alive and well and doing something very well.
uh Jeff Dunham, he's not quite there, but he's he's almost as good as Jeff Dunham and howmany ventriloquists are left and people take them seriously at all.
Right?
But he had he had this very hot.
(41:50):
I mean, hot stuff.
Uh, stage assistant.
And he was a dumpy little middle-aged dude.
And they ended up getting married because of the performative chemistry at first.
They were just so good together on stage that spilled over socially, then sexually.
And unfortunately they ended up, uh, breaking up because she wanted to make babies and hewas done.
(42:13):
And he literally freed her up to find a guy who would start a family with her.
Cause he said, I'm too old and I'm done with that.
Well, you know what, you know, actually that's another good point is to not only uh lookat the micro of the day to day, the present situation, but I'm I'm stressing even more now
than ever as couples when they meet, get into the macro like I mean, I tell girls right upfront when you meet a guy and you think it's a good relationship, ask him, say, listen.
(42:45):
And if the girl wants to have kids, I say, ask him right then and there.
Hey look, I'd like to have three kids, what about you?
And if the guy's scared, if he goes, my God, no, I don't want to have the kids.
Well, then why go through the process?
I mean, if the people aren't aligned for the long-term situation you want, that's anotherthing you gotta confront.
(43:08):
Come up front as soon as possible and ask these questions.
and what people are afraid to ask.
Two things there.
First of all, if you stick your head in the sand, you're just going to postpone yourdisappointment.
So you got to be fearless enough to ask those questions.
Second of all, you got to believe what people tell you.
I mean, I need probably a whole hand to count the number of women who've come to Emily andI going, this guy's such a jerk and a liar.
(43:35):
Well, we've been going out for a year now and he doesn't want any children.
And it turns out the guy told her on the first date, I don't want to ever have anychildren.
But now he's a jerk and a liar because a year later, she hasn't been able to talk him offthat ledge or talk him into it.
And, know, in her mind, he couldn't have been serious, but he announced early on exactlywho he was and what he's about.
(43:59):
And now he's a bad guy for it.
I do think in all honesty, there's an element of men who are afraid to be dads, don't wantto be dads.
And then inevitably almost it happens.
And we're smitten with the first kid, you know, our little daughter looks like us andwe're like, my God, you know,
And, and, you know, I call that God's dirty little trick, but I mean, ultimately you're,you're dead on man.
(44:20):
You've got to believe what people tell you.
And either you're going to have this long-term compatibility that has to be considered.
Not just this short-term spark, you know, this chemistry, I believe chemistry does last,um, as far as the honeymoon period.
Okay.
Maybe that does have a shelf life.
My wife and I are still looking for when that shelf life expires, but I think
(44:43):
under normal circumstances, lots of happy couples, uh, start having normal life togethersooner than later, but they still have chemistry together.
They're still a good team.
Um, excellent.
Yeah, but you gotta, you gotta open up and let the people who know you perhaps in manyways better than you know yourself because they get to see you and act as a third party
(45:04):
rather than someone who's emotionally invested.
Let those people start
pairing you off with people and trust that process.
I think it's old school, but I do think it's the new school.
Fantastic.
best way and you can trust it much more so than any other way.
(45:24):
Meeting a guy at a bar or online dating and all that stuff.
I mean, it just fits the bill.
It's just much better for everybody involved.
And you're a grown ass man who's mature nowadays.
And you know, you and I are basically the old bulls on the hill nowadays telling theseyoung bulls to, you know, walk down there and get them all instead of let's run down there
(45:46):
and get one.
So you've been through the whole process here and here you are talking about networkingand the importance of finding someone who's long-term.
I love it.
What I want to do, George, is I want to send these guys to your website and, um, let metell you what guys George isn't limited to
just dating and relating.
He can help you become a networking machine in a whole bunch of different ways.
(46:09):
And when you go to mountaintoppodcast.com /networker N E T W O R K E R, you'll, you'll hiton George's site.
What are they going to find there, George?
Actually, Scot, it's theultimatenetworker.com.
Well, yeah, but what I'm going to do is I'm making it mountaintoppodcast.comfrontslashnetworker.
(46:29):
So it trends, it trends ports them there, you know, basically transparently.
So that way they don't have to remember it.
Indeed.
It is the ultimate networker.com.
That's where they're going to be referred to, you know, it'll be a, a redirect in theinternet system, but it'll be mountaintop.mountaintoppodcast.com frontslashnetworker.
(46:52):
which is the easy way to remember that way they only have to remember the word networker.
But indeed, the full URL you gave is where they're going to land.
ah And indeed, what are they going to find there?
if anybody signs up on the site and mentions your show, I'll send them PDF copies of mybooks.
How's that?
Wow, that sounds great, because I was going to send them to Amazon next to pay good money.
You know, you've got two books.
(47:13):
to do sign up on my email list and they can either buy it on Amazon, get the hard copy orI'll send them a PDF.
That's a good deal right there guys.
Yeah.
You want to go to mountaintoppodcast.com /networker just to get the two books.
The books are Personal Introduction Handbook For Singles and then Sexuality Probe, whichis kind of a question book to ask.
(47:36):
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's one where you bring it on dates and ask the questions and you make or break yourmate or date.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Both good ones.
What I'm going to do is I'm going to put them at the top of my Amazon influencer queue atmountaintoppodcast.com.
/amazon anyway, even though you can get them free.
And I just think it's great stuff.
George, what a pleasure to meet you, man.
(47:57):
I love your years of experience and the yarns you spin about the good old days back in thedisco era.
And here we are nowadays, both talking about...
it.
When I hear the old Stayin' Alive song, I get tears in my eyes.
That might have been the best era ever.
When I hear the Bee Gees, I get tears in my eyes probably for a different reason, butyeah.
(48:18):
Yeah.
You're a, you're a little bit more advanced than I am.
I, my teenage years were Devo and Depeche Mode and, and the like, and surfing and skatingand BMXing.
Yeah.
And, good stuff.
Probably about the same age as you were
(48:39):
during the disco era was the grunge era for me, early 90s.
well was in my 30s, early 30s.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's when I was in my twenties.
Yeah.
Right on, man.
Well, either way, I appreciate you, man.
And I'm so glad you're here.
And won't you come back and talk about that sexuality probe stuff with us?
could do a whole show on uh love, sex and romance.
(49:00):
And how to actually talk to your partner and get the questions answered you need.
Guys are guys are tough with that.
That's a sticking point.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Good stuff, man.
Appreciate you.
And guys, if, if you haven't been to mountaintoppodcast.com lately, go there, grab all thefree goodies.
You grab all the free goodies from George.
Then you come back to mountaintoppodcast.com.
(49:22):
Grab the free book Sticking Points Solved from me.
Uh, go check out the Substack.
Uh, if you can handle the truth.
Just like the banner says at the top of the video edition of this particular show, you'regoing to love my Substack.
I talk about things that I don't talk about on the mailing list that I send you every day.
Uh, the emails I send to guys who are subscribed are fluff free.
(49:43):
I talk about how to get better with women, how to be a better man and the process.
And, um, all of that and more is there for you at mountaintoppodcast.com.
Also check out our sponsors, Jocko Willink's company Origin in Maine guys, they have
new pants, new shorts, new shirts.
Man, Origin has quietly become your one stop shop for looking manly.
(50:07):
I mean, it's just great.
And my favorite product will always be their boots.
Check them out.
They're amazing.
And if you haven't been to thekeyport.com lately, those guys have the most amazingeveryday carry device for you.
It's not your grandfather's Swiss army knife.
uh
Titanium components now sharp stuff, stuff you can be proud to carry and herosoap.com.
(50:33):
If you haven't gotten their shampoo, if you haven't gotten their honey bourbon soap, man,there's your shopping cart right there.
Start with those two items from John and the good guys over at herosoap.com and whicheverone of our sponsors you choose to work with, if not all three, use the coupon code
mountain10 for an extra 10 % off at checkout.
(50:55):
All of that and more is always accessible through mountaintoppodcast.com.
And until I talk to you again real soon, this is Scot McKay from X & Y communications inSan Antonio, Texas.
Be good out there.
Alright gentlemen, how's it going?
This is your main man, Scot McKay coming at you again with another episode of the worldfamous Mountain Top Podcast.
Gentlemen today, we're going to get you out from behind your computer and out in the realworld meeting some women.
And this is a topic that I was very, very thrilled to put on the table for you guys.
(00:27):
And I got to tell you, I think we found exactly the right guest.
His name is George Dubec .
He's from Boca Raton, Florida.
And, uh, we're going to talk about this and we're going to hash it out and you're going tohave everything you need to know about how to use your personal network as kind of your
personal matchmaking implementation.
(00:47):
It's pretty cool.
Before we dive in, I want to remind you guys that The Mountain Top Summit is our Facebookgroup.
And if you guys aren't on it, you should be, we're having a great conversation.
The website is mountaintoppodcast.com
and I'm basically at Scot McKay SCOT MCKAY on just about every social media platform outthere if you haven't checked out Substack then definitely do that also if you guys if
(01:12):
you're looking to watch this show literally on video.
We have been doing video podcasts for some time now.
You don't have to be just tethered to your listening device you can now also watch.
That's on YouTube.
And all that good stuff's there for you.
If you want to find us on Instagram
That is where I'm at real Scot McKay, not just Scot McKay.
didn't get there early enough to snag my own name, so...so be it.
(01:35):
But enough about me.
What we're going to do is we're going to introduce you to our guest, George Dubec fromFlorida.
George, how's it going, man?
Hey, great.
Glad to be on your show, Scot.
ah I'm here to basically provide some good advice, tips, strategies, uh and maybe providesome really good nuggets that people can use in their lives to be more successful.
(01:57):
Yeah, love it, man.
Love where you're coming from.
I love the promise that you're making to these guys, and I think we should dive right in.
You have something that you call Referral Matchmaking and you've developed this overdecades.
Scot, from 1985 to 1992, my wife and I ran the largest singles network in South Floridacalled the Find-A-Mate Singles Network.
(02:21):
We had over 10,000 people before online dating, before computers, and we had courses atall the local colleges all up and down
South Florida.
We had singles, dances, cruises.
We had all kinds of events and we used to teach the course on how to find a mate usingReferral Matchmaking.
And actually, Scot, that's how I found my wife of 46 years using this technique.
(02:48):
You know, we talk about the new school being the old school, the online dating apps andsites basically have killed the golden goose.
They got greedy.
They started concerning themselves more with addicting everybody to their platform thanactually pairing people off.
People are now wise to that.
Um, plus AI has taken over and you know, people's profiles are fake.
(03:10):
People's pictures are enhanced.
Even the quote unquote beautiful people don't even know who they're going to be sitting infront of if they
venture to use an online dating app nowadays.
So people are shying away from that.
It's certainly not their go-to anymore.
Um, and people are starving to be social again.
People are being social again out there in the real world.
So, you know, short of meeting someone at work, which, you know, can be no bueno sometimesbecause, the HR department's going to come after you if you flirt at work, right.
(03:39):
Um, or, you know, some other means of just cold approaching pickup artistry.
You know, going to a grocery store and, you know, asking a woman how she chooses avocadosor something.
You're advocating that our best bet is what has indeed always been our best bet, which istaking the referral of people we actually know and having them introduce us.
(04:02):
And, you know, being a connector is a great thing in the business world.
And I know you don't just talk about dating and relationships, but you know, I have peoplecome on my show all the time and I end up saying, you know, you should meet this other
person I've had on as a guest.
You two would get along famously.
And away they go and people who are connectors are beloved by their social circle.
And indeed, uh, people pay that forward to other people.
(04:23):
And then they also come back to you and introduce you to people because they return thefavor.
So this is all along the wavelength of what you're talking about, right?
This, this idea of what's always worked will still work if we just give it half a chance,right?
Yeah, well, and also it has an element of there's more accountability because whensomebody introduces you to somebody in their network, that person feels more
(04:45):
responsibility to act right, to be a more honorable person.
You meet somebody online, they don't have to act any way.
They could be a predator or whatever.
But, so just just to give you that story on how this works, it worked for me.
This is 1979, okay?
I had a three-piece white suit, black shirt, gold chains, big sideburns, I had a SmokeyAnd The Bandit Firebird.
(05:11):
I was a great disco dancer.
So Scot, I had all the dates I wanted.
The problem was, I just really never hooked up with, what's that?
it sounded like you had John Travolta and Burt Reynolds all rolled up into one persona.
Yeah.
Hot stuff.
Yeah.
We used to have discos back in the day.
(05:31):
You'd go to night clubs on Friday night.
And if you watched the movie Saturday Night Fever, I I actually lived Tony Manero's life.
I'd walk in a club and all these girls would run up to me and say, will you dance with mewhen Boogie Oogie Oogie comes on?
Or, you know, it was amazing.
But, okay, here's the problem, okay, and especially for guys.
(05:52):
Guys are visual, right?
So most of the girls I dated were blondes with large breasts because I'd walk in a club...
Or bimbo girls, girls that wore tight dresses, showing everything.
And I finally realized after a while, you know, I don't want to marry these girls.
You know, you're attracted to them because they're sexy, but I wanted to find, you know,the right partner for the rest of my life.
(06:19):
So what I did, Scot, is I made what I call the love list.
Everything I wanted in the opposite sex, personality traits, physical characteristics,background, experience, deal breakers, deal makers, I made copies and gave it to my 10
best male friends who were single.
And three months later, my best friend Paul calls me up.
He says, you got to meet this gal.
(06:42):
I met that gal.
We've been married 46 years now.
How about that?
Well, you you brought up two amazing points there.
Uh, the most recent one you brought up with the most, the The most recent one you broughtup is that not only did you make this list, you know, I call it The Depth Chart.
Uh, you come up with 10 dimensions of what you're looking for in a woman.
(07:06):
You know, I've had guys who are engineers come up with like 85 of them and break them downthat way, but
the least complicated, less messy way is to come up with 10 traits you're really lookingfor in this human being you'd like to spend the rest of your life with someday.
And then you can grade a woman like a term paper because you can make each one, onethrough 10.
(07:26):
And then you can make a list of all the women you're socializing with and how they rank.
And what this does is first of all, it lets you quantify something that's very subjective.
You know, I can be dating this pretty Latina,
this brown eyed blondie and this redhead and they all look great.
I can't really decide which one of them is more attractive to me, but I can quantify how,how good they are for me long-term and vice versa, how, how, how high quality the
(08:00):
connection is.
And then what you've done is you said, Hey, hand this thing out.
Don't keep it private.
And you know, I'm amazed a little bit by that because I actually had a guy
up at a university in New England get publicly canceled by his college newspaper because abunch of women found out he had this list.
And I mean, I don't see anything wrong with having this list.
(08:22):
I mean, women come to dates with check boxes all the time, but for some reason, this wasreally sexist and horrible.
Probably because he took the women's soccer team and ranked all of them.
That's probably what got him in trouble.
But you're taking this dimension.
Well, you're taking this whole thing
further by adding a dimension of handing this out to your friends and saying, help me,man, help me.
(08:46):
And I think that's amazing.
thing is Scot, that's phase one.
But phase two, and I always would teach people, you gotta take this serious like abusiness, okay?
Love, sex, and romance doesn't work.
The hot chicks and having great...
In fact, another phrase I use, a good date does not make a good mate.
You can have lots of fun, you can travel, you can go out, you can do all this stuff, butthen you get married and life hits and all of a sudden that fun date is no longer a fun
(09:13):
date, it's your mate.
Yeah, the honeymoon period is over.
Right, but people don't seem to understand it's going to be over.
Well, I want to talk about that.
But again, you mentioned something else that I think shouldn't be just water under thebridge.
You mentioned the accountability of the process that you're advocating, which, you know,is nothing new.
(09:35):
What is new is you're actually bringing it back to the forefront.
Everybody's talking about the next big thing.
How can I use my smartphone nowadays?
And, you know, I'm raising my right hand, literally, if you're watching.
I agree with that, but you're talking about
old school networking through friends, neighbors, acquaintances, cetera.
(09:55):
The accountability is also tied to the person doing the recommendation.
Because if they send you in the wrong direction, then you're going to blame them.
You're going to be upset with them.
So they know if they're recommending someone to you, they're going to be on the hook forit also.
(10:16):
Not even only, yeah, not only limited to the person
who is the recommendee saying, you I was recommended, I'd better make this work.
This could be exciting.
But the person doing the recommending is on the hook too.
I think you make an excellent point.
Yeah, no, it's critical.
And then, like I said, I had what was called, after I would meet the girls in person, Ihad a 20-question interview.
(10:38):
And I would ask the females as soon as possible, as soon as I can, before going on two orthree dates, to find all this information, I'd say, hey, by the way, do you mind if I ask
you some questions?
Now, number one, if they didn't like it or they became uncomfortable, that's alreadydisqualifies me.
They're not interested in me.
That's irritating them.
And it's like, I don't want to tell this guy stuff.
(11:01):
Any woman that answered my questions had, I knew had some interest in me because they'rewilling to answer my questions.
So anyway, my present wife was the only female during that whole process that everanswered all the questions to my satisfaction.
In fact, Scot, I remember looking at her and I said, you know, you would make somebody agood wife someday.
(11:23):
I walked away and I go, yeah.
For me.
So it was like, because it was shocking that she did answer everything the way I wouldlike to have a woman answer.
She had the physical, she had the personality, we had chemistry, and then she answered allthe questions.
So it just lined up.
I think the chemistry has to be there before the question and answer routine starts.
(11:46):
I mean yeah, I mean you got to have a chemistry is a very strange thing.
I mean, it has to do with the touch of the skin, the smell of a person, the way they walk,the way they talk.
uh In fact, I was attracted back in the day, Scot, to many girls that on a scale of one to10 might have been a five.
But I don't know when I was around them, there was some kind of a weird chemistry like.
(12:10):
Yeah, and I was around beautiful Playboy bunny girls.
And it was like, just didn't, they didn't do anything for me.
They looked great, but it wasn't happening, you know?
So yeah, whatever.
And I wasn't their type.
They weren't my type, you know?
oh
is interesting.
I did a masterclass on that for my guys not too long ago.
(12:31):
And it seems like chemistry is one of those things we have a really hard time defining.
It seems like chemistry is one of those things we have a really hard time defining, yet weknow it when we see it.
And that's frustrating because when it's not there, it's game over.
I mean, you're not going to have a romantic relationship.
and there's things like I said.
Do you know that even the rate of speech between two people, if one people's a fast talkerand the other one's a slow talker, they're gonna clash.
(12:59):
So even the wavelength of your speech and the way you communicate, like I said, the smell,some people, like some women, like their scent would just like drive you crazy.
ah You know, the touch of their skin.
I remember some girls, I would touch their skin and I'd get electrical shocks
run up through my body.
So again, it's hard to define it.
(13:21):
Yeah.
A lot of that is scientific by the way, you know, the scent or even what you, what you'redetecting that you don't realize you smell at the olfactory level.
The pheromones are all designed to either give you a white flag or a red flag.
A white flag is surrendering, right?
What's the opposite of a red flag?
Maybe a checkered flag, right?
(13:41):
Green flag.
Green means go, right?
That is a good question.
thought of that.
What's opposite of a red flag?
I don't know.
Okay, and we gotta look that one up.
uh
from a biological perspective, like you're going to make ugly, you know, deformed babiesor something relative to, yeah, you two are genetically compatible.
That's actually a real thing.
(14:03):
Yeah.
You know, and I, I know what you're talking about.
I've been out with women who, uh you know, not to get too crass, but once you get themnaked, you just don't like how they, how they smell naturally.
Other women, you could, you hope they don't take a shower.
They smell so amazing and female.
Yeah.
It's primal.
Certain ethnic groups have like stronger, uh what do call it, body scents.
(14:23):
You know, because I remember uh I had gone out with a girl that had a different ethnicity.
She was beautiful.
But I don't know what, I don't know, maybe it's because their diet sometimes.
You know, they like a certain diet and they give off like spicy.
Some people have spicy diets.
I don't know.
It's crazy.
don't know either.
And I, I'm not going to go there.
(14:43):
It just seems fraught.
But I think it's true.
I, I not denying it.
Interestingly enough, I don't think I ever went on a single blind date ever again afterthe digital age started.
But before that, I remember at least three blind dates I went on and all three were great.
(15:09):
And I think it's because people were on the hook.
Like you said, this person wouldn't recommend this other person to me unless they werepretty sure I wasn't going to get really, really upset with them.
You know, the stereotype is I think you should meet this, this girl.
really?
What's she like?
Well, she's really nice.
She's a very nice girl.
I think that's apocryphal.
I think people know better than to do that to someone they care about.
(15:33):
You know, they're like either, well, they're too...
These two are going to like each other or not.
strategy that I used to teach is a thing that you can form uh a more social group evenamongst your friends.
Let's say every guy and girl has two to five single friends.
Alright?
I would imagine.
So some night, get your friends together and sit down and everybody start working on theirlove list.
(15:56):
Then share it with your friends, your single friends.
Now, here's the fun part.
When you go out with or without your friends, it doesn't matter.
You look for people that would be a good match for your friends.
So you're not looking for yourself.
You take the onus off of the emotions of, oh, there's a hot guy over there.
(16:18):
I don't know.
How am I going to talk to him?
No.
You see somebody that's good for your girlfriend, and you go over and introduce yourself.
And you can show your girlfriend on the phone and say, hey, my girlfriend would love tomeet a guy like you.
So you can, and that's old phrase, the wingman approach.
Yeah, it sounds like a wingman workshop.
Hashtag trademark.
(16:40):
yeah.
that component.
That's a biz op right there, man.
Don't sue me if I steal it.
it's powerful.
And then you get closer to your friends because now you're all working together.
You're kind of learning about each other and you're helping each other and it makes it forgreat socialization.
(17:01):
I think it's fantastic.
I don't know why people are so shy about asking other people to introduce them to them.
I think it's pride.
think it's not unlike what happens when someone's recently unemployed and they're lookingfor a job and they're really reticent to say they're between jobs to anybody else because
(17:23):
they're afraid they'll be looked down upon or disrespected for it.
When in reality, especially nowadays
where these job boards are just fake and ineffective.
Like, and I'm looking at you LinkedIn, right?
Indeed has already been uh nailed for leaving old job reqs up there that have already beenfilled.
(17:48):
You know, and then these crazy things where you're interviewed by AI six times before youget to a human person or, you know, take this 10 person quiz that's going to
decide whether you're a good salesperson or not.
And the person who actually developed the quiz has half the experience you do kind ofthing.
You know, those are, those are just as bad as online dating and apps.
The way people who have lost their job in this economy are getting a new one is...
(18:12):
wait for it.
Networking with people they know.
It's the same thing.
Oh, yeah.
Chalk up another similarity between dating and your career.
And now you brought up another good point, and this is across the board for everything,Scot.
People don't know or afraid to ask for anything.
(18:34):
They're even afraid to ask their own mate for certain things.
Even family members, there was a book out called The Aladdin Factor, and it's a great bookthat all they talk about in the book is how to ask.
Get in your head.
You have to, actually we talked about this earlier off camera, but training is soimportant.
So if you want to ask,
(18:56):
be able to ask, you have to kind of train yourself.
You have to get in the mode of doing it.
Okay, you can't just do it once in a while.
So I train myself to ask.
I ask for everything I could think of.
I network and I ask people.
All they can say is no.
So what?
Yeah, and they won't say yes until you ask them.
I'll tell you one of my favorite stories.
(19:18):
I was a young engineer at General Motors and I went with this older sales guy.
We went up to Detroit on a business trip and I was young, know, wet behind the ears andthis guy said, he says, watch me.
We went to this nightclub one night and he went from gal to gal to gal at the bar, went upto them, told him that he had a room here at the hotel and I watched him go from girl to
(19:42):
girl to girl to finally after about the eighth one,
she was like smiling and boom, they went up to the room.
So you gotta ask, just ask.
The first three or four you ask are gonna say no, but maybe the fifth or sixth or seventh.
Well, that kind of flies in the face to the kind of flies in the face of the long-termapproach you're advocating.
(20:05):
But I guess when you're young, dumb and full of cum, that's, that's a good plan.
Yeah.
real direct hardcore uh punch approach, but...
Well, yeah, as we all know, most men are horrified of women.
They're not only just horrified of being rejected because of their egos, but they'rehorrified they're going to bother women nowadays.
as if women, As if women don't even want to be talked to.
(20:26):
Scot, back in the day when my wife and I ran the big singles network, I used to have guysthat were very successful, good looking guys, running companies, hiring and firing people.
They would hire me back in the day to take them to nightclubs and I would show them how toapproach women.
It used to amaze me.
I'm going...
I said, look at you.
I said, you got everything going for you and you can't go up and approach a woman.
(20:50):
So I would pick a woman out in a club.
I'd say, okay, pick somebody out
and they would watch me and they were amazed.
They go, how did you do that?
I said, just practice.
You just learn how to go over and start casual conversation and a lot of times you'regonna get disinterest or they're gonna blow you off, so what?
You know, um, interestingly enough, I still do that with guys from time to time.
(21:14):
take them out in field and almost invariably the guy will get off the plane when he fliesin here and look at me up and down and go, you, you know, because I'm not a genetic
lottery winner.
And oh man, I've been accused of hiring actresses.
I've been accused of paying people off, having ringers here and there.
And finally, they have to admit there's no way I could have had it that well coordinated.
(21:38):
What we do is we go to what has to be one of the largest outlet shopping centers in, inNorth America.
It's huge.
It's over a half mile long, which doesn't seem like a lot until you actually go there andrealize that's a long freaking huge, you know, outlet mall.
We can get there at 10 in the morning, leave at six at night.
(21:58):
And we haven't gone to everywhere we could have gone, you know,
And all you do is you...
In the morning, what you do is you just go from place to place and it's in a college town.
So it's all cute girls working.
They have nobody to talk to.
And then by the afternoon, it's starting to fill up.
So you can talk to the people who are shopping as well.
And it's just nonstop immersion in talking to cute girls.
(22:19):
And guys just, you know, the older they are, the more frustrated they get because they'relike, man, what have I been doing my whole life?
This is not hard.
It's not dangerous.
And it's all about making women feel safe and helping them have fun.
Cause most men are allergic to fun.
They're trying to be all serious, you know, and you know, women just, they're going tofeed off that energy and give you right back what you invest in it.
(22:44):
And the more lightweight, warm, I call it warm levity.
Most guys are trying to be stoic and serious because that's what some men's website orYouTube channel told them.
But really women, girls just love to have fun.
And if you bring up a woman's energy like that, she's going to love you.
It doesn't even matter what you look like anymore, because first of all, you had theconfidence, which is sexy as hell to approach them and talk to them.
(23:10):
And you have the confidence to have a conversation with them.
You make it all about them instead of bragging about your boat and your law degree and allthat stuff.
And the next thing you know, you have all these women within about 60 to 90 seconds,rising up to your exact energy that you bring.
And guys will be like, that's amazing.
How do you do it?
I said, well, it's a learned skill.
(23:33):
And sometimes guys will say, well, prove it.
And I'll go, alright great.
What I'll do is I'll be the same exact guy, same exact day, same bat time, same batchannel, same clothes.
And I'll go to a woman and I'll, I'll lack that energy or I'll be reticent and the womanwill be disinterested and she won't want to talk to me.
And she'll be like looking for an escape hatch.
You know how they do.
And the guy will be like, well, she didn't like you at all.
(23:53):
go, yeah, cause I engineered that socially.
And then what I'll do is I'll, I'll kind of, you know, this is probably unfair to realhuman beings.
I usually apologize to them afterwards and told them what I did, you know, break thefourth wall a little, but I can start off low energy with a woman and she's kind of just
going through the motions with me and then I'll raise it up and be my charming self andshe'll rise up to meet that.
(24:16):
Or I can go and be charming at first and then kind of like lose my mojo on purpose andshe'll kind of lose her interest level as well.
And guys are like,
you're in total control of this interaction.
I go yeah, and you are in total control of your interactions.
And the light bulb goes on.
The next thing you know, this guy is firing on all cylinders.
He's a machine.
And you are so right.
(24:36):
You couldn't be more correct.
Sometimes these guys are genetic lottery winners.
They're built like an NFL cornerback.
You know, they could be free safety for, you know, the Philadelphia Eagles or the Ravens.
And not this year, because we have pretty good free safeties.
They'd have a hard time cracking that rotation.
Ravens.
I'm a Ravens fan.
And then,
They're tall, good looking, making great money.
(24:58):
Cause you know what I do isn't cheap.
And yet they don't have the women they want because 90 % of this game is half mental,right, Yogi Berra?
And yet not only are they out of practice with this, right?
You're talking about how you have to train yourself.
You have to get out there and put this to the test, but just a little bit of practice halfa morning.
(25:23):
And they're like, man, where has this been my whole life?
These women are great.
I'm having a great time.
You take them out to, you know, a nighttime venue.
We don't really have discos anymore per se in San Antonio.
Everybody's doing these outdoor park like settings where they, you know, play corn holeand just socialize with the Christmas lights all year.
those are a lot harder to socialize than the old dance clubs, but anyway.
(25:44):
Well, I find it easier because they're not dark and smoky.
They're brightly lit and people are actually out there being social.
But you know, your mileage may vary.
used to use dancing to make the connection.
Anyway...
but yeah.
I mean, you know, if you're John Travolta from, you know, Saturday Night Fever, you're in.
Heck, yeah.
Especially if you've got Burt Reynolds's car to whisk him away with after the, you know,after the Bee Gees are done.
(26:09):
um
But it is, it's out there and saying, okay, I'm going to give this a shot, even thoughit's outside my comfort zone, even though it's not something I'm used to doing.
They realize it's just not that scary.
And, and here's the connection I want to make to what you're talking about.
(26:30):
I think it's equally scary.
You know, equivalent to the fear factor of approaching a woman to approach a friend andsay, hey
who can you introduce me to because I'm single and looking?
Or who can you introduce me to who's hiring someone with my kind of expertise?
There's, some humility in there.
(26:51):
There's some vulnerability in that Brene Brownish good sense of, I have to be, becourageous, step outside of this and take some risk.
And it may turn out well, or it may not, but if I never ask, I'll never receive.
So I think it's almost like we got to get over our approach anxiety of having someone inour network help us.
What do you think?
Oh yeah, definitely.
(27:12):
Back in the day, back in the disco days, my friends and I, I'd pick one of my friends,we'd go into the disco, and I'd say, you go to the left, I'll go to the right, and let's
meet back in 20 minutes and see who gets the most phone numbers.
We didn't even care about the women.
It was like we were practicing.
What does it take to get a girl's phone number?
(27:32):
And it was amazing.
I mean, in other words, it's training.
You were training yourself to be able to talk to them, to get their sense of humor.
And one of my favorite approaches, and this is hilarious, but I'd walk up to a gal with abig smile and I'd look at her and I'd say, hey, what do you think of me so far?
I mean, it's amazing what you get out of that because they have to come up with an answer.
(27:57):
Sometimes it looks like they're sucking on a lemon.
And it's like, my God, it's like, who is this guy?
But it's amazing, the girls that liked me would always touch me.
They would lean over and it was like, they wanted to assure me, oh yeah, I think you're anice looking guy.
And they would smile and they'd tilt their head.
(28:19):
So you could read the woman, you didn't have to go through the whole process.
You could read them within seconds.
Yeah.
You know what?
I have something I call "The Half Step" that I tell guys about.
And I think we're getting a little bit off track here, but these guys eat this stuff up.
So I'm not worried about it.
"The Half Step" is for guys who, okay.
They've gotten over the fear.
(28:41):
They they've summoned the boldness to go talk to a woman, but now it's time to get hernumber or find out what her interest level is, is as the dear departed Doc Love, my friend
would have always talked about.
And, and they don't want to ask her out because that could
equal rejection.
And I go, well, instead of swimming into this, you know, diving into the swimming pool,you can just stick, stick your toe in the water.
(29:02):
And they're like, how do you do that?
I go, well, I call it "The Half Step.
It's halfway to the full step of saying, hey let's go out on a date.
And I have them do kind of the mirror image of what you just suggested.
I say, I say to the guys, ask her, why do I find you so interesting?
What is it about you that I find so intriguing?
(29:26):
And you let her answer.
And if she goes, well, actually I'm not all that intriguing and really my friends are overhere and I'm done with you.
There you go.
That's everything you needed to know.
Have a nice night.
Sa-lute, right?
But if she starts selling you on all her traits, if she starts pitching herself to you,well, because I'm so cute and feminine and I'm adorable and I make great sandwiches.
(29:47):
Well then, hey there you go.
She's in, you know, it's same general psychological principle.
Yeah.
Yeah, one other uh part of the equation that uh most guys don't understand, and evenfemales, is persistence.
One of my favorite stories is one night at a disco, I approached this beautiful girl.
(30:08):
She was talking to a couple other girls.
I asked her to dance, and she went like, get away.
Two weeks later, at a party, same girl.
My friend brings me over, introduces me to her.
She was all over me.
And I looked at her and I said,
Hey, do you remember two weeks ago I met you at the club?
And she goes, no.
(30:30):
So, right.
So if you keep persisting, the first time it doesn't necessarily mean that's the end time.
You can go back to the same girl later and ask her again.
that by saying you can't keep begging the same girl over and over again when she's clearlynot interested.
You know, that's...
Unless there's a, a reason that's above and beyond who you are.
(30:51):
Like the famous example is Michael Jordan's wife, who he divorced a couple of decadeslater, but who eventually married him famously rejected him because she didn't want to
date some arrogant NBA guy.
Yeah.
Well, that's not about him.
That's about her perception of what he does.
He changes that perception.
He gets there.
Have you seen the movie, um, Hidden Figures, which is about the African-American ladieswho helped the moonshot at NASA happen?
(31:19):
Well, Mahershala Ali, who's a wonderful actor plays a very persistent, uh, guy, a guy whowants this woman who's a very smart engineer.
And she's having a hard time believing that he's the sapiosexual guy who just thinks she'snot only hot, but smart.
And he's all over that.
He is just very patient.
If you know anything about Mahershala Ali, he's got that wonderful ability to to carrythat part in an acting role just brilliantly.
(31:47):
And it's really I've actually used it as an object lesson before that you really like thiswoman and she's just not ready to date or she's fresh off a divorce or she's angry at men
lately.
You you kind of just hold space, as they like to say in the woowoo crowd.
And you just keep being a man.
You keep doing your thing and you keep
being masculine and keep doing what it takes to turn a woman on, make her feel safe andshe'll come around.
(32:10):
I'm all about that.
I think that is absolutely true.
And I also think the nuance of what you said is that venue change.
I remember back when online dating was a thing and I was doing it, you know, 20 years agowhen match.com was the place to meet women.
I was also on another site for single parents, which was a bonanza by the way, cause I hadfull time
(32:33):
custody of my little daughter and man, talk about instant security blanket in the eyes ofwomen.
If a judge gave my little daughter to me, I can't be an ax murderer.
Right?
So instant safety and security.
Yeah.
I'll meet you in any dark restaurant anywhere without, know, you can pick me up at myplace.
I'll come over to your place.
You can cook me dinner.
You're, you're already in like Flynn, right?
(32:54):
And I remember there was this little gal and she was exactly my type.
right?
She was what She was, what I like and
she, she was going to connect well with me.
You know, we, we prayed to the same God, pulled the same lever in the voting booth.
We were going to get along great.
(33:14):
All I needed was to get in front of her and get a date and she would love me.
And you know, after you write someone on match.com and they don't write you back, it'skind of, you got to be really creative.
You know, hey, cat got your tongue?
You too shy?
A couple of weeks later.
I found
three different iterations of making her, hopefully, feel somewhat interested enough to beable to at least write back.
(33:39):
And just crickets, man.
And this little gal couldn't have been more perfect for me on paper.
You know, six months later, she turns up on the other site, the single parent site.
And I, you know, one of the things I did, and this is an online dating strategy from thedays of yore, which probably doesn't even matter anymore, but never put the same narrative
(34:01):
and the pictures on two different sites.
Mix it up, you know, put different pictures of yourself, put a different narrative on eachsite that you go to for this reason.
George man, I wrote her on that site as if I'd never talked to her before.
I got whiplash.
She answered me so fast.
It was crazy.
I mean, it was like within five minutes.
Oh, you seem so nice.
(34:22):
When can we meet and blah, blah, You know, unfortunately when I met her, I wasn'tattracted to her, you know, stuff happens, but it was amazing.
It was just the venue change made all the difference.
So yeah.
And when it comes to being persistent, you know, and when it comes to saying, hey, what doyou think of me?
I think a lot of guys, the danger they run into is I could be needy.
(34:42):
I'm looking for validation.
I need you.
You are in the power position.
I put you on a pedestal, but the way you're laying it out is the exact opposite.
It's more strategy there.
I like it.
well, you know, like I said, there's a lot of tricks and things like that that we used to,we learned all the tricks in the book.
And one more story about persistence.
(35:04):
You're familiar with Grant Cardone, right?
He's very consistent, persistent, relentless.
Anyway, he met his now wife at a networking event that he was running.
Beautiful blonde.
He went and got her phone number, asked her out.
She said, no.
So then she lived in another city or whatever.
So he called her periodically, kept trying to call her, connect with her.
(35:26):
She basically kept blowing him off, wasn't interested.
Anyway, but back when he met her, he said that he was gonna marry that girl when he sawher.
One year later, they were married.
There's an aspect to how attraction works with women that operates such that when womenfeel chosen by a guy, they feel attraction towards him.
(35:52):
that's a special feature there.
Now the caveat is if this is a desperate needy guy who's going around choosing anythingthat can fog a mirror, not so much, but when she sees him as a man of value, obviously he
could date some other chick.
He could get a date.
He's not desperate for female attention.
(36:13):
And you know, guys, these are all things we can work on.
This is all self work that all of us as men need to do.
95 % of us aren't genetic lottery winners.
It's all learned skill.
So this isn't something that only special guys in some good positive way can do.
But if you have options with women, you're not coming off desperate or needy and youchoose a woman, you say you, you're exactly what I like.
(36:39):
I like you.
You know, even on the first date, just to announce that you actually like this person, youcan sometimes watch a woman go, oh, and the tension is cut through right there, like a hot
knife through butter.
But so many guys are playing keep away going, I have to put up the stoic front that Idon't know if I'm liking her or not.
Cause I don't want the power position to be given away.
(37:01):
I don't want her to steal my, my power from me.
the poor girl's on the other side of table, not knowing where she stands with you, But ittakes a certain kind of guy in a certain situation with the right woman to say, you know
what?
I'm done here.
I like you.
I did that with my wife.
You know, when I met my wife,
(37:21):
both of us were going on plenty of dates.
Both of us were obviously able to get a date, but man, by the time we were done the firstdate, it's like, alright, I like you.
You, you, I want more of you.
don't, I, you know, And a week later I said, you know, I don't think I need other women atall anymore.
(37:42):
I think you and I should just hang out with each other from now on.
She goes, great.
I completely agree.
You know, it was, it was all these people talk about chasing.
Stop chasing women.
Have them chase you instead.
I know people who have built their entire brand around that.
Nobody should be chasing anybody and this is the kind of thing going back to thenetworking see what I did there
(38:08):
When someone knows you, they know the type of person you are and they know the personthey're setting you up with.
They know instinctively, these are the two kinds of people who will choose each other.
If they just have a chance to meet, you know what I'm saying?
No, it's a, well, one other thing that I realized about the whole dating and mating thingis, um...
(38:30):
Once you connect with that person, there's four things that are critical.
You gotta have the chemistry, you got to have the intellect, the communication skills, yougotta be on the same wavelength, have the same basic likes and dislikes.
But it just feels like what you kinda said.
You both feel it, it's like a flow.
You can't put your finger on it, it's just like you said.
(38:51):
I don't wanna go out with any other women, man.
You fulfill everything that I'm looking for, so to speak.
And that's kinda what happens.
Yeah.
Well, I actually have 10 dimensions of chemistry.
I'm not going to go through them right now.
It's in the Masterclass guys, August, 2025 in the catalog.
But I think you can define chemistry and I think there's dimensions of it.
(39:13):
And the more of those check boxes you can knock out with a, with a woman, the more thefireworks are going to fly.
You know, people who were comedy teams, famously the three guys who do Top Gear in the UK.
You know, it's a bunch of dudes and they have chemistry.
Chemistry is what makes that show unable to be replicated in other markets.
(39:36):
They've tried it a couple of times in the United States, but the three hosts they puttogether just don't have the three.
They don't have the chemistry of those three guys in the UK.
Right.
is not only just for male females.
It's for business partners.
It's for uh accomplishing different tasks.
It's, yeah, it's...
I call that performative chemistry.
And you know what's interesting?
(39:58):
Performative chemistry is actually one of the dimensions that can help you with women.
My wife and I actually have performative chemistry together.
We do a podcast together that, you know, we finish each other's sentences.
We do great karaoke duets together.
I mean, we can bring the house down with Paradise by the Dashboard Light by Meat Loaf, youknow, doing that duet together.
(40:19):
And funny because I joked to someone years ago, if I could ever find a woman who would dothat duet with me, I'd marry her.
But it turns out it's just one of many reasons why my wife is my honey.
But yeah, I mean, performative chemistry is even a thing with women.
I mean, obviously it's probably not number one, but there are also other cases where theperformative chemistry led to the relationship.
(40:40):
uh Terry Fator is a great example.
I, we basically, we operated two or three businesses together.
We worked together and it was like, great.
We never had arguments.
It was just like a perfect, you know, chemistry we had working a business together andbeing married.
Well, a great example.
I mentioned Terry Fator, and you made a great point on top of that, but I don't want thatto go by the wayside.
(41:04):
He's a guy who years ago won the first edition, I think, of America's Got Talent, milliondollars, and he got a show in Vegas.
And his wife and he had settled for each other.
They weren't good for each other and they got a divorce.
Well, Terry Fator hired an assistant.
A very pretty girl to be with him on stage.
And if you know anybody, anything about this guy, Terry Fator is a ventriloquist and adarn good one.
(41:29):
OK.
I haven't heard about him much lately, but he was famous for a number of years.
I hope he's still alive and well and doing something very well.
uh Jeff Dunham, he's not quite there, but he's he's almost as good as Jeff Dunham and howmany ventriloquists are left and people take them seriously at all.
Right?
But he had he had this very hot.
(41:50):
I mean, hot stuff.
Uh, stage assistant.
And he was a dumpy little middle-aged dude.
And they ended up getting married because of the performative chemistry at first.
They were just so good together on stage that spilled over socially, then sexually.
And unfortunately they ended up, uh, breaking up because she wanted to make babies and hewas done.
(42:13):
And he literally freed her up to find a guy who would start a family with her.
Cause he said, I'm too old and I'm done with that.
Well, you know what, you know, actually that's another good point is to not only uh lookat the micro of the day to day, the present situation, but I'm I'm stressing even more now
than ever as couples when they meet, get into the macro like I mean, I tell girls right upfront when you meet a guy and you think it's a good relationship, ask him, say, listen.
(42:45):
And if the girl wants to have kids, I say, ask him right then and there.
Hey look, I'd like to have three kids, what about you?
And if the guy's scared, if he goes, my God, no, I don't want to have the kids.
Well, then why go through the process?
I mean, if the people aren't aligned for the long-term situation you want, that's anotherthing you gotta confront.
(43:08):
Come up front as soon as possible and ask these questions.
and what people are afraid to ask.
Two things there.
First of all, if you stick your head in the sand, you're just going to postpone yourdisappointment.
So you got to be fearless enough to ask those questions.
Second of all, you got to believe what people tell you.
I mean, I need probably a whole hand to count the number of women who've come to Emily andI going, this guy's such a jerk and a liar.
(43:35):
Well, we've been going out for a year now and he doesn't want any children.
And it turns out the guy told her on the first date, I don't want to ever have anychildren.
But now he's a jerk and a liar because a year later, she hasn't been able to talk him offthat ledge or talk him into it.
And, know, in her mind, he couldn't have been serious, but he announced early on exactlywho he was and what he's about.
(43:59):
And now he's a bad guy for it.
I do think in all honesty, there's an element of men who are afraid to be dads, don't wantto be dads.
And then inevitably almost it happens.
And we're smitten with the first kid, you know, our little daughter looks like us andwe're like, my God, you know,
And, and, you know, I call that God's dirty little trick, but I mean, ultimately you're,you're dead on man.
(44:20):
You've got to believe what people tell you.
And either you're going to have this long-term compatibility that has to be considered.
Not just this short-term spark, you know, this chemistry, I believe chemistry does last,um, as far as the honeymoon period.
Okay.
Maybe that does have a shelf life.
My wife and I are still looking for when that shelf life expires, but I think
(44:43):
under normal circumstances, lots of happy couples, uh, start having normal life togethersooner than later, but they still have chemistry together.
They're still a good team.
Um, excellent.
Yeah, but you gotta, you gotta open up and let the people who know you perhaps in manyways better than you know yourself because they get to see you and act as a third party
(45:04):
rather than someone who's emotionally invested.
Let those people start
pairing you off with people and trust that process.
I think it's old school, but I do think it's the new school.
Fantastic.
best way and you can trust it much more so than any other way.
(45:24):
Meeting a guy at a bar or online dating and all that stuff.
I mean, it just fits the bill.
It's just much better for everybody involved.
And you're a grown ass man who's mature nowadays.
And you know, you and I are basically the old bulls on the hill nowadays telling theseyoung bulls to, you know, walk down there and get them all instead of let's run down there
(45:46):
and get one.
So you've been through the whole process here and here you are talking about networkingand the importance of finding someone who's long-term.
I love it.
What I want to do, George, is I want to send these guys to your website and, um, let metell you what guys George isn't limited to
just dating and relating.
He can help you become a networking machine in a whole bunch of different ways.
(46:09):
And when you go to mountaintoppodcast.com /networker N E T W O R K E R, you'll, you'll hiton George's site.
What are they going to find there, George?
Actually, Scot, it's theultimatenetworker.com.
Well, yeah, but what I'm going to do is I'm making it mountaintoppodcast.comfrontslashnetworker.
(46:29):
So it trends, it trends ports them there, you know, basically transparently.
So that way they don't have to remember it.
Indeed.
It is the ultimate networker.com.
That's where they're going to be referred to, you know, it'll be a, a redirect in theinternet system, but it'll be mountaintop.mountaintoppodcast.com frontslashnetworker.
(46:52):
which is the easy way to remember that way they only have to remember the word networker.
But indeed, the full URL you gave is where they're going to land.
ah And indeed, what are they going to find there?
if anybody signs up on the site and mentions your show, I'll send them PDF copies of mybooks.
How's that?
Wow, that sounds great, because I was going to send them to Amazon next to pay good money.
You know, you've got two books.
(47:13):
to do sign up on my email list and they can either buy it on Amazon, get the hard copy orI'll send them a PDF.
That's a good deal right there guys.
Yeah.
You want to go to mountaintoppodcast.com /networker just to get the two books.
The books are Personal Introduction Handbook For Singles and then Sexuality Probe, whichis kind of a question book to ask.
(47:36):
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's one where you bring it on dates and ask the questions and you make or break yourmate or date.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Both good ones.
What I'm going to do is I'm going to put them at the top of my Amazon influencer queue atmountaintoppodcast.com.
/amazon anyway, even though you can get them free.
And I just think it's great stuff.
George, what a pleasure to meet you, man.
(47:57):
I love your years of experience and the yarns you spin about the good old days back in thedisco era.
And here we are nowadays, both talking about...
it.
When I hear the old Stayin' Alive song, I get tears in my eyes.
That might have been the best era ever.
When I hear the Bee Gees, I get tears in my eyes probably for a different reason, butyeah.
(48:18):
Yeah.
You're a, you're a little bit more advanced than I am.
I, my teenage years were Devo and Depeche Mode and, and the like, and surfing and skatingand BMXing.
Yeah.
And, good stuff.
Probably about the same age as you were
(48:39):
during the disco era was the grunge era for me, early 90s.
well was in my 30s, early 30s.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's when I was in my twenties.
Yeah.
Right on, man.
Well, either way, I appreciate you, man.
And I'm so glad you're here.
And won't you come back and talk about that sexuality probe stuff with us?
could do a whole show on uh love, sex and romance.
(49:00):
And how to actually talk to your partner and get the questions answered you need.
Guys are guys are tough with that.
That's a sticking point.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Good stuff, man.
Appreciate you.
And guys, if, if you haven't been to mountaintoppodcast.com lately, go there, grab all thefree goodies.
You grab all the free goodies from George.
Then you come back to mountaintoppodcast.com.
(49:22):
Grab the free book Sticking Points Solved from me.
Uh, go check out the Substack.
Uh, if you can handle the truth.
Just like the banner says at the top of the video edition of this particular show, you'regoing to love my Substack.
I talk about things that I don't talk about on the mailing list that I send you every day.
Uh, the emails I send to guys who are subscribed are fluff free.
(49:43):
I talk about how to get better with women, how to be a better man and the process.
And, um, all of that and more is there for you at mountaintoppodcast.com.
Also check out our sponsors, Jocko Willink's company Origin in Maine guys, they have
new pants, new shorts, new shirts.
Man, Origin has quietly become your one stop shop for looking manly.
(50:07):
I mean, it's just great.
And my favorite product will always be their boots.
Check them out.
They're amazing.
And if you haven't been to thekeyport.com lately, those guys have the most amazingeveryday carry device for you.
It's not your grandfather's Swiss army knife.
uh
Titanium components now sharp stuff, stuff you can be proud to carry and herosoap.com.
(50:33):
If you haven't gotten their shampoo, if you haven't gotten their honey bourbon soap, man,there's your shopping cart right there.
Start with those two items from John and the good guys over at herosoap.com and whicheverone of our sponsors you choose to work with, if not all three, use the coupon code
mountain10 for an extra 10 % off at checkout.
(50:55):
All of that and more is always accessible through mountaintoppodcast.com.
And until I talk to you again real soon, this is Scot McKay from X & Y communications inSan Antonio, Texas.
Be good out there.
Popular Podcasts
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist
It’s 1996 in rural North Carolina, and an oddball crew makes history when they pull off America’s third largest cash heist. But it’s all downhill from there. Join host Johnny Knoxville as he unspools a wild and woolly tale about a group of regular ‘ol folks who risked it all for a chance at a better life. CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist answers the question: what would you do with 17.3 million dollars? The answer includes diamond rings, mansions, velvet Elvis paintings, plus a run for the border, murder-for-hire-plots, and FBI busts.