In this episode of the Profitable Christian Business Podcast, host Doug Greathouse dives deep with Kurt and Kristen Luidhardt, co-founders of Liberty Spenders. They reveal the overlooked $5 trillion market of conservative and Christian consumers—and how conviction-driven marketing can unlock it for your business.
They share:
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The power of authenticity in marketing
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Why trust is the new currency
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How to build an audience that aligns with your values
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Actionable tips for small businesses to reach Liberty Spenders
This isn’t just theory—Kurt and Kristen have decades of experience in political campaigns, fundraising, and faith-driven brand growth. If you’re ready to leverage your values for impact and profit, this episode is a must-listen.
🔑 Key Quotes:
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“Authenticity is key in marketing today.”
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“Trust is the new currency.”
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“The $5 trillion market of Liberty Spenders is your opportunity.”
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“Faith and values build loyal customers.”
📌 Chapters:
00:00 – Meet Kurt & Kristen
11:57 – What is Conviction-Driven Marketing?
23:53 – Building Trust Through Identity
36:09 – The $5 Trillion Liberty Spender Market
47:55 – Strategies for Small Christian Businesses
50:54 – The Future of Authenticity & Relationships
🔗 Connect with Kurt & Kristen:
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Facebook: Liberty Spenders
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Instagram: @libertyspenders
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X (Twitter): @LibertySpenders
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Website: LibertySpenders.com
📘 Resources Mentioned:
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Free eBook – libertyspenders.com/free
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hello and welcome to another edition of the Profit of Christian Business.
I am really stoked today because uh I have Kurt and Kristen Luthart with me today ofLiberty Spenders.
They do something that I was very, very interested in.
We're gonna talk about their faith a little bit.
We're gonna talk about how to leverage conservative Christian audiences that they can showyou exactly how to tap into those audiences.
(00:24):
I'm really excited to delve into that because of course, uh most of the people watchingthis are
are Christian business owners, right?
So they would love to know how to tap further into the Christian, conservative Christianmarket.
So without further ado, ah would you mind giving a brief introduction?
Don't mind at all.
Go ahead.
(00:44):
I'm in charge of introductions over here.
We are Kurt and Kristen Luthart.
And for 20 years, we've owned the Prosper Group, which is our marketing agency.
for 19, well, 18 of those years, we just worked with political candidates for a living allover the country of all sizes, Republicans.
(01:06):
And we'll get into that, I'm sure.
But now we help.
conservative and Christian businesses who are looking to add more leads by talking to amarket segment we like to call Liberty Spenders.
Nice, nice.
And I see you have that book.
I was waiting.
I have that book in my cart on Amazon.
(01:26):
I was waiting to talk to you first before I ordered it.
But as soon as this is over, I'm going to go push send.
All right, all right.
So I like to start every interview just kind of casually, kind of get to know you a littlebit better.
Let the audience get to know you a little bit better.
So one of the questions I have for you around that.
(01:48):
is relative, but still kind of fun.
If you could create a new national holiday to highlight value-based businesses, what wouldyou call it?
You know, the first word that comes to my head is abundance, although abundance daydoesn't sound cool, as cool as say Independence Day or I know, yeah.
(02:09):
I was thinking about freedom, but see, that's already kind of into, that's already in theether, that's part of what we celebrate on July 4th.
So, know, so abundance is the word, I think.
It's a good one.
Abundance day.
Imagine, hey, how are you celebrating Abundance Day?
That would be such a great thing to say.
Yeah.
(02:30):
Yes.
Well, we all need to have that more in our mindset, right?
That's so true.
uh Side note, um how long have you two been married?
Okay, we got married in 2004.
Why do you said that?
Because I can't do because I'm always afraid to say the wrong number, right?
It's not every married couples like, you know, you know, I were every at 21.
(02:54):
We will be 21 this.
Okay, this August, it'll be 21.
Okay.
early congratulations on your anniversary.
No issues here.
I am the same way.
I'll look over at my wife and I was like, I hope I get this right.
It's no problem when it's been just a couple of years, right?
But once you get into the 15 to 20 years, you start to...
(03:17):
year now?
The running joke that we have is that Kurt likes to round up with just about everything.
So our kids ages, he rounds up how long we've been in business, he rounds up.
And so I'm just always like, okay, when it comes to how long you've been married, let'sget that right.
I don't want to age myself any more than I need to.
(03:38):
She's being my fact checker because...
You know, I, you know, I round up to 20 years in business.
It's really like 19 and some odd change, you know.
Well, I will tell you, I don't know how relevant this is.
It's not really relevant, but I want to share it anyway.
My wife has two birthdays.
And the one being is very memorable because it's January 1st and she hated having herbirthday on New Year's Day.
(04:02):
So we decided she was going to move her birthday to June 21st, the first day of summer,because she loves summer.
Right.
So now I have to remember two birthdays.
One's really easy to remember.
man, I get that, because my birthday is July 6th, so it's right around, right the 4th.
But um it's worked out because things are decorated, there's fireworks going off, youknow?
(04:27):
But I can absolutely empathize with your wife.
Nice, nice.
So, what's the most on-brand Liberty Spender purchase you've made recently that mightsurprise us?
That's a great question and we have a really good answer for you because we just finishedthe Indianapolis 500 um Indy car race.
(04:51):
It is the biggest uh race or biggest sporting event in all of the world is held inIndianapolis of Indianapolis Motor Speedway and we are now completely hooked and we bought
we bought Some excellent merch.
We are supporting a driver stingray Rob.
He was car number 77
And uh all because we got introduced to him and his faith and how he's using his platformand IndyCar and as a driver, you know, as a mission field.
(05:21):
And so it is completely a Liberty Spender, completely on brand.
And in fact, we learned that charity he supports and bought a couple of their hats, whichis Freedom Service Dogs of America.
And again, not knowing uh when this goes or maybe this is live, but.
you know, Memorial Day weekend, obviously we just celebrated that.
so they, um, they train service dogs for veterans and give them free of charge.
(05:47):
And, um, it's just, it's a beautiful thing.
so, uh, that inspired us.
And it's a Liberty Spender purchase is we were Andy 500 fans.
You know, you can't live in Indianapolis and not be an Indy 500 fan as Kristen referenced.
mean, there was old, there was somewhere between 350 and 400,000 people there on Sunday.
And, uh,
(06:08):
But we've never really followed IndyCar.
There's 17 races.
So we always follow the Indy 500, which is sort of their Super Bowl, right?
That's the biggest, most, that's the biggest, most high profile car race in the world.
But the, we've never really followed it, but now we are, because we've connected withStingray on convictions and where he stands on faith.
(06:29):
And we've now heard him share his testimony two or three times.
And every time I'm impacted by it.
And he sees that as a big part of why he races and he puts scripture on his car.
He's got that in common a little bit with Tim Tebow.
And so that's our kind of on-brand Liberty Spender purchase, but a little off the, youknow, it's not coffee.
(06:49):
It's a Indy car.
Yeah, that's super cool.
It's interesting.
I've always been this way.
I've never really followed a sports team.
I follow people, right?
Michael Jordan.
know, I was a Michael Jordan fan.
If he had left the Bulls, I would have followed him.
Hometown hero for you, probably Peyton Manning, right?
(07:12):
For the longest time was there.
I followed Peyton when he left Indy.
I followed him to Denver.
I became a Denver fan because he was in Denver.
I didn't really
route for the team.
I really feel like it's about the bond that you get with the players, not so much with theteam.
Yeah, well, there's some truth to that.
Yeah, there's some truth.
I'm a little more I mean, when Manning left and Luck came in here in Indianapolis, bestgame ever was when he came back the following year.
(07:40):
was Luck's rookie year, I think, and played us here in Indianapolis and we won.
It felt great.
Yeah.
Well, just well, I mean, we still love him.
No, it's not like that.
We let him go.
Yeah.
So wasn't like he left on purpose and
You know, he wanted to stay.
But I, you know, I was, I'm here to support the team.
(08:02):
And so, in fact, the most interesting piece of that was there was uh a key moment in thegame when Robert Mathis, our defensive end, sacked Peyton Manning in the end zone for
safety.
Might have been a touchdown.
I can't remember.
Either way, I saw Robert Mathis a couple of years later and I told him that was one of myfavorite moments of his when he sacked Manning.
(08:22):
That was, you know, it was a crazy game.
We stood up the entire time.
And he said that was also his favorite because for his entire NFL career, Manning hasalways worn red jerseys, so he was never allowed to hit him.
And it wasn't until then he was allowed to hit him.
And so it was immensely satisfying.
Nice.
(08:43):
Not to turn this into sports podcast.
This is the last thing I'm going to talk about as far as sports.
I love sports.
I'm more of a college football fan myself.
Just to reference, there is one team that I follow no matter who's there.
And that's the Clemson Tigers because I live here in the upstate South Carolina.
Dabo, I'm a big Dabo Sweeney fan.
He raises them up right.
(09:04):
So yeah.
And he's, and he's a man of God too.
Dabo, if you ever hear him speak, he,
You know, at the end of games, he's always given the credit where credit is due.
So it's really, really good.
So I think this is a really fun question.
If you're stranded on a desert island, but can only bring one marketing book and one itemfrom your home, what are you choosing?
(09:26):
And you each get one.
Well, I'm thinking about this and it's like, okay, well should I think survival?
Like, okay, if I'm on a desert island and there's salt water, I should probably bring afilter, you know?
uh But also, gosh, do I wanna go how long being stranded without the word of God?
don't, I probably, you know, that would probably help sustain me.
(09:51):
So that's, I'll pick the item from home.
You wanna, you can do the marketing book.
Well, the marketing book, that's my favorite.
than my own, maybe, I don't know.
Is Influence by Robert Cialdini.
Must read for anyone in marketing or sales.
um Absolutely brilliant.
(10:12):
And uh one of those few books that you just can't skim quickly because there's a gem inevery page.
So that's my endorsement for Robert Cialdini's Influence.
Yeah, he's genius.
With every, like if I was to scan this room and I showed you all the marketing books thatwe have, I can't believe that is not on my shelf.
(10:35):
I have so many marketing books.
I'm gonna get your book and that book at the cart.
cart.
I give it a resounding endorsement.
I'll tell you, um much of what we see in other marketing and sales books today originatedwith some of his thoughts about how we influence people.
(10:58):
Some of the basic seven levers of influence, the idea of reciprocity and authority andurgency.
These are all principles I've used in marketing.
probably read them somewhere else, but they were originated in his book and so well worththe read.
Nice, nice.
And Kristen, I have to applaud you on your picking of the Bible because I feel like if youhave God, you need nothing else, right?
(11:24):
So.
Yes.
Yeah, I mean, it's the right answer, you know.
That's the best answer possible.
So one of the things that we do every time on the Proper Christian Business is a fill inthe blank question.
And either one of you can answer this.
Again, this is first time I've had a couple on the podcast.
(11:46):
either one of you that wants to answer it can answer it.
The fill in the blank is, conviction-driven marketing begins with blank.
Authenticity.
uh
yes, yes.
Do you wanna dive into that at all?
Yeah, I mean, it is a big part of what we talk about, which I realized we referencedLiberty Spenders without explaining what that means or who they are.
(12:12):
But our concept of what we're teaching our clients is that conviction-driven marketing,which is a new form of strategic marketing, you're really aligning based on values.
And so you're leading in with that.
And we argue you should do that with
faith and political beliefs.
There's a million ways to do that in a way that again feels authentic.
(12:36):
people just trust is the new currency.
um And people's attentions are short.
We have a very high BS meter.
We don't believe things.
Our trust in institutions is broken and the news is broken and big organizations isbroken.
And so the way of now of marketing is to build authentic trust.
(12:57):
That's the only way you can have it is with authenticity and building out your brand in away that is consistent um so that your clients and consumers really feel connected to you
and that they can do business with you.
Yeah.
I think it's the building wave.
think still most marketers are thinking, let's just grab attention, right?
(13:18):
Let's do, let's have a funny ad and people are blowing through paper.
We're like Dollar Shave Club, right?
Everybody talks about that as marketing brilliance and to some extent, it was wildlysuccessful.
But on the other hand, I don't think that's an approach that's gonna work in today'senvironment where people don't believe anything they see.
(13:39):
They don't believe the news.
They don't believe marketing communications.
They don't trust anything.
We live in a society where we are flooded with information and starving for truth, right?
And that's a...
marketing statements, also a spiritual statement, right?
But the, we're starving for it.
And so uh brands need to think about how am I, not just how am I getting eyeballs on mystuff.
(14:04):
That's easy, right?
You can, you can put something on TikTok, TikTok and have 2 million views later.
You know, when we, I was just thinking about this a couple years ago, uh one of ourcaregivers posted a video of our daughter laughing on TikTok and she was just cute laugh.
And a week later, there's 1.2 million views on that video, right?
(14:26):
So it's easy, right?
You don't have to do anything particularly creative.
She's just laughing and just a cute laugh.
But it's hard to build trust.
That's the commodity you've got to go after.
And most of your marketers aren't thinking that.
They're still saying, hey, let's work on your logo.
Let's get a really cool, fun ad.
Maybe you're doing something silly.
But trust is what's such an expensive commodity right now.
(14:50):
And to go back to Christian statement, that's often about authenticity, although it'sdeeper than that.
And that's really what we're trying to teach people with the conviction-driven marketing.
And just to add some weight to it, 85 % of all US consumers are now saying that they'reconsidering a brand's values when they buy their products.
(15:11):
And 75 % of all consumers are saying they've switched a product in the last 12 months overa values misalignment.
And we can think of the high profile examples.
We've got people out there these days keying Elon Musk's Tesla cars or whatever, or peopleleaving Bud Light over uh brand misalignment there.
And so we see it with these big brands, but it's also true of your company.
(15:36):
If you're doing just a couple million dollars in sales, people really want to know, when Ibuy from you, is my money going where, you know,
where something into places that I would approve of, right?
Are you treating your employees the way I approve of?
And so that is something that the whole country is looking at, not just conservatives andChristians, but even, but amongst conservatives and Christians of which there are 76 and a
(16:08):
half million of them from our study.
They spend $5 trillion a year and they really want to know, Hey, if I'm buying from you,
Do you match my values?
Yeah, that's going to segue really nicely.
I don't feel like you've answered it wholly yet uh to the secret question.
So the secret question, what is the secret to creating trust in a marketing situation?
(16:32):
Yeah, I think it's connecting on an identity level, right?
So we talked about sports earlier, right?
And so right today, right now, I'm a rather enthusiastic Pacers fan because the Pacers areprogressing in the playoffs, they're pulling off all these unexpected wins.
(16:54):
But four months ago in the middle of their season, I couldn't tell you what their recordwas.
I couldn't name all of their starting players, but now I'm watching it.
Now I'm emotional about it.
They lost on Sunday after winning two games in New York, right?
So now I'm all emotional about it.
But that fandom is really sort of temporary, right?
(17:16):
I don't, there's nothing, you know, I'll feel bad for 24 hours and I might have a coupleof friends from New York who'll razz me if the Knicks beat the Pacers, but it really
doesn't.
change my life in one way or the other.
don't feel affected significantly.
And too many of us are trying to market to that kind of level, right?
(17:42):
We're talking to people, we got a best price.
We have a cool new feature.
Those are all fleeting.
They go away and all that has to happen is for your competitor to drop their price by 5 %and that whole thing goes away or they add a new feature.
Or you're selling on Amazon and Amazon decides to start copying your product or someChinese knockoff.
(18:04):
Those are completely indefensible positions right now for a company.
But when you can connect with people on an identity level, I share your values.
We're people who we share faith, we share a uh political identity.
You're connecting with them in a way that makes them loyal to you so much deeper than whatI'm just buying.
(18:28):
Because it's cheaper than the store next door.
They've got a special going on.
I got a coupon.
It's all very fleeting.
Identity is unchangeable.
People's faith and politics remain very similar over time.
Whereas you were a Colts fan one day, and then you were a Broncos fan the next day.
em And so we've got to connect on a much deeper level.
(18:51):
That's, think, the secret today.
And again, a lot of people are missing it in their marketing.
Okay, if you're listening, wherever you're listening to this, or you're watching this onYouTube, I want you to rewind and listen to that whole piece again.
That's one of the things that we talk about all the time at the Prophet Christian Businessis what are your underlying values?
(19:12):
How are you, like the word profitable, I tell people this all the time.
Yes, we want your business to be more profitable, but we want you to be profitable for thekingdom.
Those values from your business need to represent kingdom values, right?
I'm sure you can go into this really well.
I'll give a short story first about a local business here.
uh There's a, it's grown since then.
(19:34):
There's a business here called Trop, when it started it was called Tropical Chicken.
And it was run, it's run by this guy named Lazaro uh Montoya, I think is his last name.
But uh he had this little one man like business, right?
Went there all the time.
He attracted a crowd.
And when you walked in, what was playing on the speakers?
(19:55):
Praise music.
Mm-hmm.
had a woman come in there, sit down and says, you will not make it if you keep playingthat music.
And he's like, I appreciate your opinion, but I'm not going to stop doing that.
Right?
Today he's opening up a new restaurant every single month and he's expanded into otherrestaurants.
(20:16):
It is just so great to see that kind of thing.
Cause he stood on his values.
Right?
And I think I'd love your take on Chick-fil-A because I'm a Chick-fil-A fan.
I'm never going to go away from Chick-fil-A.
So that's to me, that's one of the best businesses that represents this.
Well, and to your point, it's interesting because there are signals, right?
(20:36):
In your example of this restaurant, right?
There are signals that are being sent.
It's not like you've got to put a big, you know, Jesus fish, you know, on all your things.
It's the music he's playing.
mean, Chick-fil-A, we know about the values of the founders, but their service isoutstanding.
(20:56):
Outstanding.
which is a big piece of this too, which is you want to exemplify that in everything you doand how you treat your employees, how you treat your customers, what's your follow-up,
what's the experience that they have.
uh And so all of those things go into it because you still have to have an excellentproduct.
You still have to compete at that level.
um But yeah, I mean, again, they have an amazing chicken sandwich, but I will drive out ofmy way.
(21:21):
I will inconvenience myself.
pay more to eat at Chick-fil-A than I would uh another place.
Yeah, and we tell people, and this would be true of tropical chicken, right?
There's 76 and a half million Liberty spenders in this country, people who aresignificantly more likely to buy from a brand if they know it matches their conservative
or Christian values.
(21:41):
So whereas you might be a little worried, well, maybe I turned off this one customerbecause they didn't like the Christian music playing.
But you're going to bring in people who, out of the 76 and a half million, and for arestaurant to thrive,
They don't need even a fraction of that, particularly in upstate New York, right?
(22:02):
They need to find the 5,000 people who really, uh really, really love this and arewilling, are gonna come back to that restaurant two or three times a month to eat because
they know that the ownership aligns with their values.
And so that example is something that sometimes scares people off because they think, oh,I lost this person.
(22:25):
But the people you attract,
are going to outnumber the people who don't find you in alignment with them.
Yeah, I had my own battle with this.
me and God butted heads because I had this whole notion.
I want to appeal to everybody.
Right.
I, and I was more of a behind the scenes.
(22:45):
didn't have a podcast that you rarely find me on social media.
And God basically told me, I want you to come out from behind the scenes and share my wordand have me all throughout your business.
was like, God, how am going to track the loss that way?
He's like, don't worry about it.
I got.
Right?
Like because we help businesses grow and the more that we help businesses grow the morethat they're gonna help the kingdom grow.
(23:09):
So, oh yes.
what's exactly the thinking.
That's exactly right.
And by the way, you know, not only attracting people that are that are, you know, reallybought in, but those people are more likely to refer you right to repurchase, reorder
higher lifetime value.
So, I mean, depending on your business and which one of those things applies, all of thosethings are adding to the bottom line um and giving you a greater chance to have more
(23:35):
impact.
I was really astounded by this number that you use in your marketing.
$5 trillion market.
um Wow.
um How did you come up with that number?
So here's what we did.
(23:55):
Coming from politics, we're big about data, right?
And we were curious.
We know that there are businesses that are thriving by marketing to conservatives andChristians.
uh Black Rifle Coffee Company went public for over a billion dollars, right?
We know that Chick-fil-A and Hobby Lobby are thriving.
We know that Patriot Mobile, Every Life Diapers,
(24:17):
and a countless number of other businesses are really starting to take off on this basicconcept.
But we were curious, how big is this, right?
mean, Chick-fil-A also has a really killer sandwich.
So maybe they're just grabbing a lot of Americans who just love their chicken.
Maybe they just like it more than Popeyes and to Kristen's point, have a good service.
(24:39):
So we did a big deep dive, a big national survey asking consumers
How much do they value this and how much is it likely to change their purchasing patterns?
And then built out a nationwide model based on that survey to find 76 and a half millionpeople who care about, significantly more likely to buy if they associate your brand with
(25:04):
conservative or Christian values.
Now of that 76 and a half million, 45 million like to see both.
Of the rest of 30 million, they're
basically evenly split.
care about Christian values, not really conservative values, or they care aboutconservative values, not really Christian.
So we're also capturing some people in that list that might not be a faith at all, or hemay be politically conservative, but they're, you know, they're, they're Muslim or
(25:31):
something.
So they're, we do capture a pretty diverse audience.
That group of people based on what we know of them and all of the data on them.
makes and spends about $5 trillion a year.
That's a little bit of an inexact science.
Either way though, it's a massive market, but it does tie to what we know of thepopulation in general, because we know that the, of the population in general, 75 % of
(25:55):
them, as I mentioned earlier, no matter what faith they are, no matter where they stand onthe political spectrum have said, hey, we've switched a brand on this.
So if you're not thinking about this as a business, you're behind already, right?
because this isn't some emerging uh thing that's kind of percolating with 5 % ofpopulation.
It might become a thing later.
(26:16):
This is now two, three quarters of American consumers are saying this is already one oftheir top issues when they buy from a brand.
So, and it also helps with people who are just scared to do it.
As your customers are already asking and they're already looking.
So you might as well tell them, right?
(26:37):
And so, uh
So that's a long winded answer probably to your $5 trillion question.
No, no, no, that was really good.
We've talked about some big businesses.
We've talked about Chick-fil-A, Black Rifle Coffee.
A lot of my audience are kind of the smaller Christian businesses, right?
do uh you have any insights into how a small Christian business, uh maybe it's not evenjust Christian, a conservative, my audience is going to be Christian, but how can they
(27:05):
leverage their resources to begin to leverage the conviction-driven marketing to reach theliberty spenders?
I think, you know, for us, that's what I get so excited about.
It's because there are so many ways to do this.
It's not just one way.
In fact, we highlight that in our book, um which is, you know, we don't just go to paidadvertising.
(27:29):
Like we don't go there.
There's so many other things that I would even argue a lot of times more effective.
So for a smaller business, again, depending on if you're B2B or B2C, there's podcasts,right?
Like what we're doing right now.
um There's email.
You know, do you have your customer list?
Do you have their contact information?
You can start putting in those messaging and value add moments with your customers inemail.
(27:56):
There's organic social without having to pay.
And then there's just what networking opportunities, right?
So if you're a service business and you're B2B, networking with intention.
So I want to find people of like mind, okay, what's that going to be?
You know, what is authentic to me?
What do I want to highlight with my business?
(28:17):
And then where do I find, you know, where do I think are the best places to network tofind those people?
And so it's amazing how we are able to help clients just with those things that don'tcost, I mean, marginal, maybe email, if you don't already have it, but marginal to
nothing.
And just by being intentional about it, are increasing their relationships, they'reforming strategic partnerships, and they're finding all kinds of ways to increase their
(28:41):
business.
um And by the way, getting more fulfillment out of it because it's now connected.
It's aligned.
And so, you know, for many business owners, this is em not to get sidetracked, but it canbe lonely, you know, um being an entrepreneur and you have so much hanging on you.
And so this kind of helps, think also get out of this rat race of just, okay, I got to mysales quota, you know, or I got to reach this goal for this quarter.
(29:07):
Then I got to go again, go again.
There's so many things we think about as business owners with the culture, with thequality of product and service.
m And by also tying this in and making this a core piece of your marketing, oh gosh, it'sjust the fulfillment just goes through the roof because of those things being in
alignment.
I would also argue this is a best strategy for small businesses.
(29:34):
I look at it this way.
If you're a landscaper in
You know, Rochester, New York, how many landscape companies are in Rochester?
There's probably dozens.
Right.
And if you're a consumer saying, I got to go pick one of these people, what are you goingto do?
And you're to do a couple of things.
You might ask a friend, I like your lawn.
(29:55):
Who does that stuff?
Or you might Google it and then you're going to see 10 landscapers.
You're going to think, how do I know who's the best?
Maybe you look at a rating site, but if, but by coming out and saying, you know what?
We're a landscape, we're landscapers and we're people of faith.
And we give our employees Sundays off or we donate a percentage of our profits to thechurch or, you know, we're really involved in various charities or, you know, we really
(30:23):
believe in doing it right because we're people of faith.
That's a differentiator that just by stating it makes you different than anybody else whenthey are out looking for a landscaper.
So you might be shocked how much business you would get simply
by stating this, it's a differentiator.
It's really powerful for small business because you don't, again, you don't need 76 and ahalf million of them.
(30:47):
You know, there are thousands of customers in Rochester, New York today saying, I reallywant to hire a landscaper and they could, and I'm a Christian, this is some, this would be
a decision maker for me.
I know for me, that's the person I'm calling first.
Yeah, a couple things.
(31:07):
I want to go to your answer, then I want to go back to Christian's answer.
You're actually hurting your growth the more you're trying to appeal to everybody, right?
Especially when you're smaller, because uh you're not Coca-Cola yet, right?
You may never be Coca-Cola, right?
And you're actually hurting your growth if you're trying to try to think everybody is yourmarket, because it's just not true.
(31:30):
ah That's one thing that we talk about a lot.
in what we do.
And Kristen, I love what you said, because we talk about this a lot as well is marketingthrough relationship building.
Right?
Almost everything that you mentioned was about relationship building.
Was it networking?
Was it some organic social media, those type of things, podcasting?
uh We're building a relationship right now.
(31:52):
This is the first time I met you, but we're building a relationship.
And I already knew coming on that you were going to lie.
But uh I really feel like some of the biggest
business moves for me has been in the relationship building.
It hasn't been paid media.
It has been building a relationship with somebody and boom, that sparked something else,right?
So uh I love what you had to say there.
(32:14):
And even in big consumer facing brands, that relationship building is priceless becauseagain, it leads to deals or distribution or so.
mean, that's just, that just works across any size, any industry.
Yeah, yeah, I love it.
Can we dive into your faith a little bit?
(32:35):
All right.
So is there a particular biblical principle or story that guides you?
You know, I think a lot about
You know, I think a lot about Tim Keller's book, Every Good Endeavor, if you've ever readit.
It should be essential reading for every Christian business owner about the value of workand why God created and work.
(33:03):
And uh I'm moved by the idea that God created a world and wanted man to work it and makeit better, right, to organize it.
And wanted us to do
good and get joy from it.
And Kristin hit the nail on the head when she was saying, a lot of business owners havelost that joy.
(33:26):
There have been years in our 20 years in business, or as Kristin would say moreaccurately, 19 years in business, that I just wasn't sure why I was doing this because I
realized I was just doing it because it was a paycheck, right, at that point.
um
I was making money and I'd lost a sense of how I was making the world a better place andhow I was doing what God asked.
(33:55):
so crazy considering we worked in politics.
You know, we tell people this, they're like, you couldn't make that connection.
You're, you know, you're electing congressmen, governors, it worked for a president andyou're losing sight of this.
So it can happen in any business, right?
Absolutely.
Can we dive into that a little bit about the whole political background?
(34:15):
how did you get, I wanna know a little bit of the story now.
So how did you get started in that?
And then how did it transform to where you are now?
Is that too long of a story?
Well, that depends on who tells it, I suppose.
We both uh struggle little bit telling this because, you know, as with any entrepreneur,it is not linear, it is not a straight line, it is like crazy.
(34:41):
It's like, well, which part of the crazy story do you want to hear?
um
We met in college.
This is the best way I think to start it.
We met at Indiana Wesleyan University in Marion, Indiana.
Christian school.
Wonderful, by the way.
Triple endorsement for anyone.
(35:01):
And we met in the college Republicans of all places, right?
I know, nerd alert.
Yes.
uh And we were both passionate about changing the world.
And we thought the way to do it was electing politicians.
I mean, I got interested in politics even in high school.
I was a super nerd in that.
regard.
And we thought, man, he a briefcase to high school.
(35:24):
Yeah.
I can't believe I married this guy.
Yeah.
Well, she wasn't she wasn't around for all that.
So we but yeah, we just thought we're just you know, we're going to elect thesepoliticians and the Red Sea is going to part.
The sun's going to come out.
Everything's going to be wonderful.
And, know, it wasn't I grew up in in high school was in nineteen in nineteen ninety fourwhen Republicans took control of Congress for the first time in 40 years, I thought.
(35:49):
Everything's going to be great.
And so we got involved.
We ran campaigns and we did the things political operatives do.
And then we thought, well, hey, we hate being unemployed after every election.
That's the worst part about being a political campaign manager is day after the election,win, lose, or draw, it's over.
Your job's gone.
(36:10):
So we had the brilliant idea, which was not so brilliant, that what we should do is starta business serving these people because then we wouldn't be unemployed after the election.
So the new problem was...
We weren't unemployed, but we lost all our clients after the election.
But either way, we started that back in 06 and started working for small campaigns.
(36:33):
Just here in Indiana.
Yeah, just here.
City council races, state reps, and worked our way up by doing bigger and bigger races.
In 2010, we got our first big break.
We did a couple of really big campaigns.
you know, state Senator Scott Brown, who ran for US Senator in Massachusetts, if anybodyremembers this race, because it was now 15 years ago, where he beat, he won a US Senate
(37:01):
race in Massachusetts as a Republican, which hasn't happened since.
And, uh and that really helped us, you know, grow.
And what we had gotten good at during this time was raising small dollar funds online.
So think of us as crowdfunding for
political campaigns.
We had people who would find the 25 or 35 or $50 email or text donations for candidates.
(37:27):
And so over this time period from 2006 through 2024, we had helped raise over $500billion.
Million.
Million.
Sorry.
500 million.
500 billion would be awesome.
Yeah.
500 million.
I think we're approaching 600 and we're being a little conservative in that number.
(37:50):
But four Republican political candidates and helped elect over 100 members of Congress and15 governors and 15 senators.
And we worked for Donald Trump in 16.
And so uh that's what we built.
And it was a crazy ride because in 2009, you know, so we started our business, we'reyoung, we don't know anything about business.
(38:10):
uh And there were no elections in Indiana.
And it was really rough.
And we're like, how are we going to do this?
You know, we've got no money, you know.
And we started just traveling.
We hit the road and we would sometimes sleep in our car because we couldn't afford hotels.
We couldn't afford plane flights, right?
Anybody who's listening, who's like, you know, started their business scrappy.
(38:31):
You guys will get this.
And we just worked.
You know, we did not have the network.
We built our business the exact opposite of other people in our space who typically workon high profile races.
And then they hang out their shingle after they've built some relationships.
So they get clients coming to them.
We were just kids, just absolute nobodies, working really small local races um and thentraveled and traveled.
(38:56):
We've traveled over a million miles, you know, on our car um and that's how we did it.
Again, back to that relationship building and just uh being the people that we're gonnawork and serve.
And so it was all God, God really blessed us and he just put us in these right places.
Cause again, this big breakout campaign ended up being the...
national flashpoint because Obama had been elected.
(39:18):
uh And so this was the big race after that.
And it was huge, covered everywhere.
And that just catapulted us.
And we got that race because we were friends with someone and their web vendor had quitand they didn't have any money to pay us.
And we thought, well, sure, we'll do it.
What else do we have going on?
And so again, it's just, I can't even say anything we did.
(39:41):
We worked.
But obviously it was just God's
God's favor and putting us in that right place.
then that led to us doing Mitt Romney's campaign and helping him raise money in 2012.
And it just kept building from there because we built that expertise.
And that's what we're so excited to bring to businesses now, because all this time we'dhave people say, can you, you're a marketing company.
(40:01):
Can you my business?
You know, no, no, this is our niche.
This is what we know.
I don't want to pretend to be something I'm not.
I can't help you.
And now we can.
Now we can because we have figured out and God has put in our hearts all these thingswe've learned about, you know, converting people to vote and to open their wallets when
they get nothing in return.
(40:23):
We now understand those principles.
We know the ecosystem, we know the media, we know what they watch and listen to.
And we can now help uh impact driven, visionary, kingdom building entrepreneurs buildtheir business and have an impact for their family, their community and the kingdom.
Wow.
I love your story.
(40:43):
heard you had to have a very strong why buried underneath there because uh often there'sthat breaking point where most entrepreneurs give up, right?
When they're going through that struggling period and like, maybe entrepreneurship isn'tfor me, right?
But deep down we know it's God's calling on our life and we push through, right?
(41:03):
Because he's given us a mission, right?
and we're here to complete it.
So I love that story so much.
um I do want to talk a little bit more about exactly like dive into that just a little bitmore about how you help businesses with what you do.
So um what sort of specific things do you help them with?
(41:28):
Yeah.
um, we, so as we talked about our basic proposition is you've got this market segment thatyou didn't even know existed until we told you about it called Liberty Spenders.
And we're going to help you be popular with that group and generate leads for yourbusiness.
(41:49):
So our, our goal, our outcome we're pursuing on our clients is let's amp up your revenueand sales by teaching you how to talk to those people.
And we take people through.
And if you read our book, you get it all.
um Our five P's for success, engaging in conviction driven marketing to get to theseLiberty Spender consumers.
(42:11):
And so we'll walk people through it.
And we, for some customers, what we do is simply kind of hold their hand through theprocess, but they do all the work.
We show them how to do it.
um
We teach them how to do it.
We put them in front of some amazing, successful people who've already done it to learnthe whole process, but they do it all.
(42:34):
We have a program where we do that with them in a group setting, and they also get tonetwork with other people achieving this, and there's a lot of opportunity for people to
collaborate and work together.
And then for some consumers or companies more on an invitation basis, we will actually doit for them.
will become their marketing agency.
(42:55):
A lot of times we're collaborating with who they already have.
We're not here to get your marketing agency fired.
We're here to make them more effective, right?
But in some cases, we'll come in in a really big way.
We've got a team of 30 people and we can really, really dig in in multiple places.
And in that case, we would help them with things like how to get out into the market.
(43:19):
We'll help them with PR, podcast booking.
We'll help run...
ads for them will help develop new creatives or connect them with our vast network ofemail, conservative email newsletter owners, things like that.
So we will have two tracks.
Yeah.
I was just thinking, uh depending on if you have a product, one amazing thing too is umbrand ambassadors or spokespeople.
(43:48):
And so that's one thing we've been doing a lot of, it's been having a lot of success aswell, but
Because again, it's like, how does anybody, the number one question we get, people say,gosh, this is amazing.
I love this concept.
Now what?
Like, how is anybody going to know who I am?
How am I going to connect or build that trust?
And so sometimes you can leverage other people's trust, right?
(44:10):
By aligning with someone who's excited about your product or service and they can be abrand spokesman for you.
Yeah.
And we just finished one, crossed my fingers, maybe by today.
with uh a uh Christian actor for one of our customers.
And it took a couple of months to really come up with a good agreement.
(44:32):
And this actor really wanted to be confident in the quality of their product.
But that's gonna be uh something that's gonna take a wellness brand that nobody knowsabout to an audience of hundreds of thousands, if not millions, overnight.
Because you're borrowing the trust.
Mm-hmm.
Christian actor is well known and well trusted by their people.
(44:55):
So instead of having to go through what could be a months long process of trying toeducate people, hey, I'm a Christian business owner and I sell health and wellness
products and we try to honor Christ in everything we do and try to get attention, they'renow borrowing the credibility that this particular actor has.
And I think it's gonna be a really powerful opportunity for them.
(45:17):
And so Chris is right to mention this is something we actually really enjoy these kinds ofdeals because they're really cool for a company.
Some of them get to end up working with people that they've, you know, always admired or,or, you know, watched their TV shows, you know, and so it can be really fun.
Yeah, I imagine that's a big amplifier.
it takes the timeline.
(45:38):
It speeds the timeline way up because, you know, we know when you're trying to establish abrand from fresh, right from start, it takes a little while because you got to get out
there.
You've got to start putting your your values out there, your personality out there.
And it just takes a little while to develop that.
when you can begin by leveraging someone else's authenticity, I'm not even saying thatright.
(46:02):
Authenticity, that's the word I'm trying to say.
Authenticity, I'm just thinking, if you could get Tim Tebow to endorse your product, boom,you're immediately on the world stage.
uh
we do that.
And also, you know, if you are going to then put paid paid dollars, you want somethinglike that.
You know, not every business owner or founder is going to want to be the face of the ofthe brand or, you know, they may not feel comfortable being in the spotlight in that way.
(46:27):
And so this is a great way to solve that problem.
Yeah.
Yeah, wow.
I love all this.
I feel like I could have you all on for a second time and maybe we'll talk about that downthe road.
I'm glad that I met you.
I think there's like I mentioned off camera, there's some opportunity here for us.
I have some people that I wanted to introduce you to.
(46:47):
So yeah, that's right.
And I will say, just Doug, from what you shared, if I could encourage you, because anybodywho's listening, you know, can feel your heart.
It really shines through even through a zoom.
And, you know, your decision, I think, to put yourself out there and what I just I was soexcited about talking to you because, again, the profitable Christian business is so like,
(47:13):
I think sometimes we have such big hearts.
You know, people of faith, we want to help people, which I do.
um But we need to be successful.
We need to have profit.
That is what drives future growth.
That is what drives generosity, contribution.
And so I just want to give kudos to you for putting that out there because it is abusiness, not a charity.
(47:35):
Now, the idea is we then fuel charities.
But the business like we need to be, God calls us to be wise and shrewd.
And um and so I
I give props to you on what you're doing.
Thank you, thank you, yeah.
You have to have something to give in order to give, right?
And the more profitable you can be, the more you can have to give.
(47:56):
So, well, thank you again.
Where can we, I almost forgot, but let's do this.
First of all, where can we send people to find out more about Liberty Spenders and whatyou do?
Yeah, well they can go to LibertySpenders.com and we also have a place where they candownload the book.
And so they can also go to LibertySpenders.com backslash free and they can download ourbook for free.
(48:22):
Now, if you want to make a donation to college fund for our three or five year old, youcan also go to Amazon and buy it.
Speaking of profitable business, yes, you can buy it on Amazon.
Yes.
Or you can download a digital version.
We're able to do that.
And then go to LibertySpenders.com flesh free and um make sure you sign up for your, foremail there.
(48:48):
I think you'll give an email address to do it because we're about to uh be promoting ournext uh invitation to join our, our, our group and work with us on your marketing.
And so uh that's a great way to start with us.
And, but also for people who don't want to do that.
We tried to write the book so it wasn't just a, it's not just some like really flimsymarketing book that you don't learn anything from.
(49:13):
It's pretty exhaustive.
You could read the book and implement pretty much all of what we told you yourself, right?
There's worksheets and access to things.
I think working with us makes it faster, but you could do it.
And so definitely go and check it out.
I do have a comment about that because one of the things that like we pound the table withis lead with value, right?
(49:37):
And with what you just said about your book, you're leading with value.
Like when we're talking to people about how they should uh engage, how they should, whattheir lead magnet should be, make sure that they're leaving with value, right?
That it's not just something they're just gonna put, they have to be able to take actionfrom what you give them.
mm-hmm.
(49:58):
Yeah.
Yeah, and this isn't some AI-generated book, you know.
No, it'd be a lot better if it, you we wrote this.
I'm sorry to say.
Right.
Yes.
Yep, the audiobook's out there.
We read it ourselves, so it's in our voice.
So if you really want help falling asleep, you know, you could also listen to the audioversion and...
(50:23):
Check us out at audible.com.
I listen to most of my audiobooks while I'm working out, so I don't think I'd fall asleep.
Let's hope not.
I do have one last question for every single person that comes on the Prophet Christianbusiness.
And that is, I hate to leave any stone unturned.
And there may be in either one of your heads right now, I wish I could have said this.
(50:46):
I really wanted to share this.
So any parting words of wisdom for the audience.
I I may have said this already, but I just want to reemphasize it.
I think what we're talking about here with conviction-driven marketing, genericallyspeaking, and with Liberty Spenders more specifically, I think this is the marketing
(51:11):
strategy for the next decade.
Everything that's happening in our world, all the tribalism we've come to expect frompolitics is now affecting consumer behavior.
And so some of you are listening to this and thinking, is cute, but maybe not for me.
I'm going to, I'm going to do what we've been doing for the last two decades.
(51:31):
I'm going to talk about why we're the market leader here.
We're the cost leader, know, we're Walmart falling prices, whatever the thing is.
Um, but I think that stuff just isn't working the way it used to.
And if you're struggling right now thinking why I've got a good thing going, I've got agood business and you just can't break through.
(51:53):
I think this is your recipe for it.
And so you don't have to work with us, but you dive into this concept because I really dobelieve what we're talking about here, everyone's gonna be talking about in five or six
years.
You could be somebody who grabs onto this early as a business and build something beforeeverybody else realizes, yeah, I need to be doing this too.
(52:17):
Well, and with AI, you know,
content, it's just going to get easier and easier to flood the zone with all kinds ofstuff.
Again, it goes back to, don't know what it is.
I don't know who wrote it.
I don't.
And that's why that authenticity and building that brand and building that trust is socritical, because it's only going to get harder and harder to stand out and for people to
(52:39):
trust you and connect.
Yeah, I'm in the uh lane of the relationship builders are really going to start standingout.
uh The authenticity is really going to start standing out because it's going to be floodedwith so much inauthenticity and so much AI generated stuff, right?
(52:59):
That people want to connect with real people.
Yeah, when creating content is now free and easy, then it's now commoditized and lessvaluable.
So all the stuff that we used to think about doing in just a few years is just not asvaluable anymore.
(53:20):
When I can push a button and say, want to make a video and have ChatGPT created, or I wantto write a case study and have ChatGPT make it up.
All of that stuff becomes devalued.
And so that's only going to accelerate what we're talking about right here in my opinionis em because all of this stuff that we used to do that used to take forever.
(53:44):
If you wanted to make a cool ad that everybody watched, you're to to spend a lot of moneyon it and you're going to spend a lot of time.
That's, that's all gone.
And so it's, it's time just to join in on this trend em because it's going to define uhmarketing, I think for the next decade.
Yeah.
Wow.
uh Thank you again.
(54:05):
You have been some of my favorite guests uh ever on the podcast.
So much great information.
Again, go to Liberty, anyone that's watching or listening, go to LibertySpenders.com.
you're one of my audience, I implore you to go to Amazon to buy their book.
We'll put that link below.
There is a free version, but we're talking about profitable.
(54:26):
The name is in the podcast.
uh
ha.
want your business to be profitable.
Let's continue to help Liberty Spenders continue to be profitable.
uh go to that link, buy the book.
uh Actionable content in there, not just fluff.
So uh go use it and then hire them uh once you've read the book and said, wow, this issome great stuff.
(54:46):
I really need some more leverage.
So uh thanks again, Kurt and Christian.
It has been uh really, really nice to have you on the show.
Thank you Doug.
All right, and until next time, entrepreneurs, keep moving forward.
Hello and welcome to another edition of the Profit of Christian Business.
I am really stoked today because uh I have Kurt and Kristen Luthart with me today ofLiberty Spenders.
They do something that I was very, very interested in.
We're gonna talk about their faith a little bit.
We're gonna talk about how to leverage conservative Christian audiences that they can showyou exactly how to tap into those audiences.
(00:24):
I'm really excited to delve into that because of course, uh most of the people watchingthis are
are Christian business owners, right?
So they would love to know how to tap further into the Christian, conservative Christianmarket.
So without further ado, ah would you mind giving a brief introduction?
Don't mind at all.
Go ahead.
(00:44):
I'm in charge of introductions over here.
We are Kurt and Kristen Luthart.
And for 20 years, we've owned the Prosper Group, which is our marketing agency.
for 19, well, 18 of those years, we just worked with political candidates for a living allover the country of all sizes, Republicans.
(01:06):
And we'll get into that, I'm sure.
But now we help.
conservative and Christian businesses who are looking to add more leads by talking to amarket segment we like to call Liberty Spenders.
Nice, nice.
And I see you have that book.
I was waiting.
I have that book in my cart on Amazon.
(01:26):
I was waiting to talk to you first before I ordered it.
But as soon as this is over, I'm going to go push send.
All right, all right.
So I like to start every interview just kind of casually, kind of get to know you a littlebit better.
Let the audience get to know you a little bit better.
So one of the questions I have for you around that.
(01:48):
is relative, but still kind of fun.
If you could create a new national holiday to highlight value-based businesses, what wouldyou call it?
You know, the first word that comes to my head is abundance, although abundance daydoesn't sound cool, as cool as say Independence Day or I know, yeah.
(02:09):
I was thinking about freedom, but see, that's already kind of into, that's already in theether, that's part of what we celebrate on July 4th.
So, know, so abundance is the word, I think.
It's a good one.
Abundance day.
Imagine, hey, how are you celebrating Abundance Day?
That would be such a great thing to say.
Yeah.
(02:30):
Yes.
Well, we all need to have that more in our mindset, right?
That's so true.
uh Side note, um how long have you two been married?
Okay, we got married in 2004.
Why do you said that?
Because I can't do because I'm always afraid to say the wrong number, right?
It's not every married couples like, you know, you know, I were every at 21.
(02:54):
We will be 21 this.
Okay, this August, it'll be 21.
Okay.
early congratulations on your anniversary.
No issues here.
I am the same way.
I'll look over at my wife and I was like, I hope I get this right.
It's no problem when it's been just a couple of years, right?
But once you get into the 15 to 20 years, you start to...
(03:17):
year now?
The running joke that we have is that Kurt likes to round up with just about everything.
So our kids ages, he rounds up how long we've been in business, he rounds up.
And so I'm just always like, okay, when it comes to how long you've been married, let'sget that right.
I don't want to age myself any more than I need to.
(03:38):
She's being my fact checker because...
You know, I, you know, I round up to 20 years in business.
It's really like 19 and some odd change, you know.
Well, I will tell you, I don't know how relevant this is.
It's not really relevant, but I want to share it anyway.
My wife has two birthdays.
And the one being is very memorable because it's January 1st and she hated having herbirthday on New Year's Day.
(04:02):
So we decided she was going to move her birthday to June 21st, the first day of summer,because she loves summer.
Right.
So now I have to remember two birthdays.
One's really easy to remember.
man, I get that, because my birthday is July 6th, so it's right around, right the 4th.
But um it's worked out because things are decorated, there's fireworks going off, youknow?
(04:27):
But I can absolutely empathize with your wife.
Nice, nice.
So, what's the most on-brand Liberty Spender purchase you've made recently that mightsurprise us?
That's a great question and we have a really good answer for you because we just finishedthe Indianapolis 500 um Indy car race.
(04:51):
It is the biggest uh race or biggest sporting event in all of the world is held inIndianapolis of Indianapolis Motor Speedway and we are now completely hooked and we bought
we bought Some excellent merch.
We are supporting a driver stingray Rob.
He was car number 77
And uh all because we got introduced to him and his faith and how he's using his platformand IndyCar and as a driver, you know, as a mission field.
(05:21):
And so it is completely a Liberty Spender, completely on brand.
And in fact, we learned that charity he supports and bought a couple of their hats, whichis Freedom Service Dogs of America.
And again, not knowing uh when this goes or maybe this is live, but.
you know, Memorial Day weekend, obviously we just celebrated that.
so they, um, they train service dogs for veterans and give them free of charge.
(05:47):
And, um, it's just, it's a beautiful thing.
so, uh, that inspired us.
And it's a Liberty Spender purchase is we were Andy 500 fans.
You know, you can't live in Indianapolis and not be an Indy 500 fan as Kristen referenced.
mean, there was old, there was somewhere between 350 and 400,000 people there on Sunday.
And, uh,
(06:08):
But we've never really followed IndyCar.
There's 17 races.
So we always follow the Indy 500, which is sort of their Super Bowl, right?
That's the biggest, most, that's the biggest, most high profile car race in the world.
But the, we've never really followed it, but now we are, because we've connected withStingray on convictions and where he stands on faith.
(06:29):
And we've now heard him share his testimony two or three times.
And every time I'm impacted by it.
And he sees that as a big part of why he races and he puts scripture on his car.
He's got that in common a little bit with Tim Tebow.
And so that's our kind of on-brand Liberty Spender purchase, but a little off the, youknow, it's not coffee.
(06:49):
It's a Indy car.
Yeah, that's super cool.
It's interesting.
I've always been this way.
I've never really followed a sports team.
I follow people, right?
Michael Jordan.
know, I was a Michael Jordan fan.
If he had left the Bulls, I would have followed him.
Hometown hero for you, probably Peyton Manning, right?
(07:12):
For the longest time was there.
I followed Peyton when he left Indy.
I followed him to Denver.
I became a Denver fan because he was in Denver.
I didn't really
route for the team.
I really feel like it's about the bond that you get with the players, not so much with theteam.
Yeah, well, there's some truth to that.
Yeah, there's some truth.
I'm a little more I mean, when Manning left and Luck came in here in Indianapolis, bestgame ever was when he came back the following year.
(07:40):
was Luck's rookie year, I think, and played us here in Indianapolis and we won.
It felt great.
Yeah.
Well, just well, I mean, we still love him.
No, it's not like that.
We let him go.
Yeah.
So wasn't like he left on purpose and
You know, he wanted to stay.
But I, you know, I was, I'm here to support the team.
(08:02):
And so, in fact, the most interesting piece of that was there was uh a key moment in thegame when Robert Mathis, our defensive end, sacked Peyton Manning in the end zone for
safety.
Might have been a touchdown.
I can't remember.
Either way, I saw Robert Mathis a couple of years later and I told him that was one of myfavorite moments of his when he sacked Manning.
(08:22):
That was, you know, it was a crazy game.
We stood up the entire time.
And he said that was also his favorite because for his entire NFL career, Manning hasalways worn red jerseys, so he was never allowed to hit him.
And it wasn't until then he was allowed to hit him.
And so it was immensely satisfying.
Nice.
(08:43):
Not to turn this into sports podcast.
This is the last thing I'm going to talk about as far as sports.
I love sports.
I'm more of a college football fan myself.
Just to reference, there is one team that I follow no matter who's there.
And that's the Clemson Tigers because I live here in the upstate South Carolina.
Dabo, I'm a big Dabo Sweeney fan.
He raises them up right.
(09:04):
So yeah.
And he's, and he's a man of God too.
Dabo, if you ever hear him speak, he,
You know, at the end of games, he's always given the credit where credit is due.
So it's really, really good.
So I think this is a really fun question.
If you're stranded on a desert island, but can only bring one marketing book and one itemfrom your home, what are you choosing?
(09:26):
And you each get one.
Well, I'm thinking about this and it's like, okay, well should I think survival?
Like, okay, if I'm on a desert island and there's salt water, I should probably bring afilter, you know?
uh But also, gosh, do I wanna go how long being stranded without the word of God?
don't, I probably, you know, that would probably help sustain me.
(09:51):
So that's, I'll pick the item from home.
You wanna, you can do the marketing book.
Well, the marketing book, that's my favorite.
than my own, maybe, I don't know.
Is Influence by Robert Cialdini.
Must read for anyone in marketing or sales.
um Absolutely brilliant.
(10:12):
And uh one of those few books that you just can't skim quickly because there's a gem inevery page.
So that's my endorsement for Robert Cialdini's Influence.
Yeah, he's genius.
With every, like if I was to scan this room and I showed you all the marketing books thatwe have, I can't believe that is not on my shelf.
(10:35):
I have so many marketing books.
I'm gonna get your book and that book at the cart.
cart.
I give it a resounding endorsement.
I'll tell you, um much of what we see in other marketing and sales books today originatedwith some of his thoughts about how we influence people.
(10:58):
Some of the basic seven levers of influence, the idea of reciprocity and authority andurgency.
These are all principles I've used in marketing.
probably read them somewhere else, but they were originated in his book and so well worththe read.
Nice, nice.
And Kristen, I have to applaud you on your picking of the Bible because I feel like if youhave God, you need nothing else, right?
(11:24):
So.
Yes.
Yeah, I mean, it's the right answer, you know.
That's the best answer possible.
So one of the things that we do every time on the Proper Christian Business is a fill inthe blank question.
And either one of you can answer this.
Again, this is first time I've had a couple on the podcast.
(11:46):
either one of you that wants to answer it can answer it.
The fill in the blank is, conviction-driven marketing begins with blank.
Authenticity.
uh
yes, yes.
Do you wanna dive into that at all?
Yeah, I mean, it is a big part of what we talk about, which I realized we referencedLiberty Spenders without explaining what that means or who they are.
(12:12):
But our concept of what we're teaching our clients is that conviction-driven marketing,which is a new form of strategic marketing, you're really aligning based on values.
And so you're leading in with that.
And we argue you should do that with
faith and political beliefs.
There's a million ways to do that in a way that again feels authentic.
(12:36):
people just trust is the new currency.
um And people's attentions are short.
We have a very high BS meter.
We don't believe things.
Our trust in institutions is broken and the news is broken and big organizations isbroken.
And so the way of now of marketing is to build authentic trust.
(12:57):
That's the only way you can have it is with authenticity and building out your brand in away that is consistent um so that your clients and consumers really feel connected to you
and that they can do business with you.
Yeah.
I think it's the building wave.
think still most marketers are thinking, let's just grab attention, right?
(13:18):
Let's do, let's have a funny ad and people are blowing through paper.
We're like Dollar Shave Club, right?
Everybody talks about that as marketing brilliance and to some extent, it was wildlysuccessful.
But on the other hand, I don't think that's an approach that's gonna work in today'senvironment where people don't believe anything they see.
(13:39):
They don't believe the news.
They don't believe marketing communications.
They don't trust anything.
We live in a society where we are flooded with information and starving for truth, right?
And that's a...
marketing statements, also a spiritual statement, right?
But the, we're starving for it.
And so uh brands need to think about how am I, not just how am I getting eyeballs on mystuff.
(14:04):
That's easy, right?
You can, you can put something on TikTok, TikTok and have 2 million views later.
You know, when we, I was just thinking about this a couple years ago, uh one of ourcaregivers posted a video of our daughter laughing on TikTok and she was just cute laugh.
And a week later, there's 1.2 million views on that video, right?
(14:26):
So it's easy, right?
You don't have to do anything particularly creative.
She's just laughing and just a cute laugh.
But it's hard to build trust.
That's the commodity you've got to go after.
And most of your marketers aren't thinking that.
They're still saying, hey, let's work on your logo.
Let's get a really cool, fun ad.
Maybe you're doing something silly.
But trust is what's such an expensive commodity right now.
(14:50):
And to go back to Christian statement, that's often about authenticity, although it'sdeeper than that.
And that's really what we're trying to teach people with the conviction-driven marketing.
And just to add some weight to it, 85 % of all US consumers are now saying that they'reconsidering a brand's values when they buy their products.
(15:11):
And 75 % of all consumers are saying they've switched a product in the last 12 months overa values misalignment.
And we can think of the high profile examples.
We've got people out there these days keying Elon Musk's Tesla cars or whatever, or peopleleaving Bud Light over uh brand misalignment there.
And so we see it with these big brands, but it's also true of your company.
(15:36):
If you're doing just a couple million dollars in sales, people really want to know, when Ibuy from you, is my money going where, you know,
where something into places that I would approve of, right?
Are you treating your employees the way I approve of?
And so that is something that the whole country is looking at, not just conservatives andChristians, but even, but amongst conservatives and Christians of which there are 76 and a
(16:08):
half million of them from our study.
They spend $5 trillion a year and they really want to know, Hey, if I'm buying from you,
Do you match my values?
Yeah, that's going to segue really nicely.
I don't feel like you've answered it wholly yet uh to the secret question.
So the secret question, what is the secret to creating trust in a marketing situation?
(16:32):
Yeah, I think it's connecting on an identity level, right?
So we talked about sports earlier, right?
And so right today, right now, I'm a rather enthusiastic Pacers fan because the Pacers areprogressing in the playoffs, they're pulling off all these unexpected wins.
(16:54):
But four months ago in the middle of their season, I couldn't tell you what their recordwas.
I couldn't name all of their starting players, but now I'm watching it.
Now I'm emotional about it.
They lost on Sunday after winning two games in New York, right?
So now I'm all emotional about it.
But that fandom is really sort of temporary, right?
(17:16):
I don't, there's nothing, you know, I'll feel bad for 24 hours and I might have a coupleof friends from New York who'll razz me if the Knicks beat the Pacers, but it really
doesn't.
change my life in one way or the other.
don't feel affected significantly.
And too many of us are trying to market to that kind of level, right?
(17:42):
We're talking to people, we got a best price.
We have a cool new feature.
Those are all fleeting.
They go away and all that has to happen is for your competitor to drop their price by 5 %and that whole thing goes away or they add a new feature.
Or you're selling on Amazon and Amazon decides to start copying your product or someChinese knockoff.
(18:04):
Those are completely indefensible positions right now for a company.
But when you can connect with people on an identity level, I share your values.
We're people who we share faith, we share a uh political identity.
You're connecting with them in a way that makes them loyal to you so much deeper than whatI'm just buying.
(18:28):
Because it's cheaper than the store next door.
They've got a special going on.
I got a coupon.
It's all very fleeting.
Identity is unchangeable.
People's faith and politics remain very similar over time.
Whereas you were a Colts fan one day, and then you were a Broncos fan the next day.
em And so we've got to connect on a much deeper level.
(18:51):
That's, think, the secret today.
And again, a lot of people are missing it in their marketing.
Okay, if you're listening, wherever you're listening to this, or you're watching this onYouTube, I want you to rewind and listen to that whole piece again.
That's one of the things that we talk about all the time at the Prophet Christian Businessis what are your underlying values?
(19:12):
How are you, like the word profitable, I tell people this all the time.
Yes, we want your business to be more profitable, but we want you to be profitable for thekingdom.
Those values from your business need to represent kingdom values, right?
I'm sure you can go into this really well.
I'll give a short story first about a local business here.
uh There's a, it's grown since then.
(19:34):
There's a business here called Trop, when it started it was called Tropical Chicken.
And it was run, it's run by this guy named Lazaro uh Montoya, I think is his last name.
But uh he had this little one man like business, right?
Went there all the time.
He attracted a crowd.
And when you walked in, what was playing on the speakers?
(19:55):
Praise music.
Mm-hmm.
had a woman come in there, sit down and says, you will not make it if you keep playingthat music.
And he's like, I appreciate your opinion, but I'm not going to stop doing that.
Right?
Today he's opening up a new restaurant every single month and he's expanded into otherrestaurants.
(20:16):
It is just so great to see that kind of thing.
Cause he stood on his values.
Right?
And I think I'd love your take on Chick-fil-A because I'm a Chick-fil-A fan.
I'm never going to go away from Chick-fil-A.
So that's to me, that's one of the best businesses that represents this.
Well, and to your point, it's interesting because there are signals, right?
(20:36):
In your example of this restaurant, right?
There are signals that are being sent.
It's not like you've got to put a big, you know, Jesus fish, you know, on all your things.
It's the music he's playing.
mean, Chick-fil-A, we know about the values of the founders, but their service isoutstanding.
(20:56):
Outstanding.
which is a big piece of this too, which is you want to exemplify that in everything you doand how you treat your employees, how you treat your customers, what's your follow-up,
what's the experience that they have.
uh And so all of those things go into it because you still have to have an excellentproduct.
You still have to compete at that level.
um But yeah, I mean, again, they have an amazing chicken sandwich, but I will drive out ofmy way.
(21:21):
I will inconvenience myself.
pay more to eat at Chick-fil-A than I would uh another place.
Yeah, and we tell people, and this would be true of tropical chicken, right?
There's 76 and a half million Liberty spenders in this country, people who aresignificantly more likely to buy from a brand if they know it matches their conservative
or Christian values.
(21:41):
So whereas you might be a little worried, well, maybe I turned off this one customerbecause they didn't like the Christian music playing.
But you're going to bring in people who, out of the 76 and a half million, and for arestaurant to thrive,
They don't need even a fraction of that, particularly in upstate New York, right?
(22:02):
They need to find the 5,000 people who really, uh really, really love this and arewilling, are gonna come back to that restaurant two or three times a month to eat because
they know that the ownership aligns with their values.
And so that example is something that sometimes scares people off because they think, oh,I lost this person.
(22:25):
But the people you attract,
are going to outnumber the people who don't find you in alignment with them.
Yeah, I had my own battle with this.
me and God butted heads because I had this whole notion.
I want to appeal to everybody.
Right.
I, and I was more of a behind the scenes.
(22:45):
didn't have a podcast that you rarely find me on social media.
And God basically told me, I want you to come out from behind the scenes and share my wordand have me all throughout your business.
was like, God, how am going to track the loss that way?
He's like, don't worry about it.
I got.
Right?
Like because we help businesses grow and the more that we help businesses grow the morethat they're gonna help the kingdom grow.
(23:09):
So, oh yes.
what's exactly the thinking.
That's exactly right.
And by the way, you know, not only attracting people that are that are, you know, reallybought in, but those people are more likely to refer you right to repurchase, reorder
higher lifetime value.
So, I mean, depending on your business and which one of those things applies, all of thosethings are adding to the bottom line um and giving you a greater chance to have more
(23:35):
impact.
I was really astounded by this number that you use in your marketing.
$5 trillion market.
um Wow.
um How did you come up with that number?
So here's what we did.
(23:55):
Coming from politics, we're big about data, right?
And we were curious.
We know that there are businesses that are thriving by marketing to conservatives andChristians.
uh Black Rifle Coffee Company went public for over a billion dollars, right?
We know that Chick-fil-A and Hobby Lobby are thriving.
We know that Patriot Mobile, Every Life Diapers,
(24:17):
and a countless number of other businesses are really starting to take off on this basicconcept.
But we were curious, how big is this, right?
mean, Chick-fil-A also has a really killer sandwich.
So maybe they're just grabbing a lot of Americans who just love their chicken.
Maybe they just like it more than Popeyes and to Kristen's point, have a good service.
(24:39):
So we did a big deep dive, a big national survey asking consumers
How much do they value this and how much is it likely to change their purchasing patterns?
And then built out a nationwide model based on that survey to find 76 and a half millionpeople who care about, significantly more likely to buy if they associate your brand with
(25:04):
conservative or Christian values.
Now of that 76 and a half million, 45 million like to see both.
Of the rest of 30 million, they're
basically evenly split.
care about Christian values, not really conservative values, or they care aboutconservative values, not really Christian.
So we're also capturing some people in that list that might not be a faith at all, or hemay be politically conservative, but they're, you know, they're, they're Muslim or
(25:31):
something.
So they're, we do capture a pretty diverse audience.
That group of people based on what we know of them and all of the data on them.
makes and spends about $5 trillion a year.
That's a little bit of an inexact science.
Either way though, it's a massive market, but it does tie to what we know of thepopulation in general, because we know that the, of the population in general, 75 % of
(25:55):
them, as I mentioned earlier, no matter what faith they are, no matter where they stand onthe political spectrum have said, hey, we've switched a brand on this.
So if you're not thinking about this as a business, you're behind already, right?
because this isn't some emerging uh thing that's kind of percolating with 5 % ofpopulation.
It might become a thing later.
(26:16):
This is now two, three quarters of American consumers are saying this is already one oftheir top issues when they buy from a brand.
So, and it also helps with people who are just scared to do it.
As your customers are already asking and they're already looking.
So you might as well tell them, right?
(26:37):
And so, uh
So that's a long winded answer probably to your $5 trillion question.
No, no, no, that was really good.
We've talked about some big businesses.
We've talked about Chick-fil-A, Black Rifle Coffee.
A lot of my audience are kind of the smaller Christian businesses, right?
do uh you have any insights into how a small Christian business, uh maybe it's not evenjust Christian, a conservative, my audience is going to be Christian, but how can they
(27:05):
leverage their resources to begin to leverage the conviction-driven marketing to reach theliberty spenders?
I think, you know, for us, that's what I get so excited about.
It's because there are so many ways to do this.
It's not just one way.
In fact, we highlight that in our book, um which is, you know, we don't just go to paidadvertising.
(27:29):
Like we don't go there.
There's so many other things that I would even argue a lot of times more effective.
So for a smaller business, again, depending on if you're B2B or B2C, there's podcasts,right?
Like what we're doing right now.
um There's email.
You know, do you have your customer list?
Do you have their contact information?
You can start putting in those messaging and value add moments with your customers inemail.
(27:56):
There's organic social without having to pay.
And then there's just what networking opportunities, right?
So if you're a service business and you're B2B, networking with intention.
So I want to find people of like mind, okay, what's that going to be?
You know, what is authentic to me?
What do I want to highlight with my business?
(28:17):
And then where do I find, you know, where do I think are the best places to network tofind those people?
And so it's amazing how we are able to help clients just with those things that don'tcost, I mean, marginal, maybe email, if you don't already have it, but marginal to
nothing.
And just by being intentional about it, are increasing their relationships, they'reforming strategic partnerships, and they're finding all kinds of ways to increase their
(28:41):
business.
um And by the way, getting more fulfillment out of it because it's now connected.
It's aligned.
And so, you know, for many business owners, this is em not to get sidetracked, but it canbe lonely, you know, um being an entrepreneur and you have so much hanging on you.
And so this kind of helps, think also get out of this rat race of just, okay, I got to mysales quota, you know, or I got to reach this goal for this quarter.
(29:07):
Then I got to go again, go again.
There's so many things we think about as business owners with the culture, with thequality of product and service.
m And by also tying this in and making this a core piece of your marketing, oh gosh, it'sjust the fulfillment just goes through the roof because of those things being in
alignment.
I would also argue this is a best strategy for small businesses.
(29:34):
I look at it this way.
If you're a landscaper in
You know, Rochester, New York, how many landscape companies are in Rochester?
There's probably dozens.
Right.
And if you're a consumer saying, I got to go pick one of these people, what are you goingto do?
And you're to do a couple of things.
You might ask a friend, I like your lawn.
(29:55):
Who does that stuff?
Or you might Google it and then you're going to see 10 landscapers.
You're going to think, how do I know who's the best?
Maybe you look at a rating site, but if, but by coming out and saying, you know what?
We're a landscape, we're landscapers and we're people of faith.
And we give our employees Sundays off or we donate a percentage of our profits to thechurch or, you know, we're really involved in various charities or, you know, we really
(30:23):
believe in doing it right because we're people of faith.
That's a differentiator that just by stating it makes you different than anybody else whenthey are out looking for a landscaper.
So you might be shocked how much business you would get simply
by stating this, it's a differentiator.
It's really powerful for small business because you don't, again, you don't need 76 and ahalf million of them.
(30:47):
You know, there are thousands of customers in Rochester, New York today saying, I reallywant to hire a landscaper and they could, and I'm a Christian, this is some, this would be
a decision maker for me.
I know for me, that's the person I'm calling first.
Yeah, a couple things.
(31:07):
I want to go to your answer, then I want to go back to Christian's answer.
You're actually hurting your growth the more you're trying to appeal to everybody, right?
Especially when you're smaller, because uh you're not Coca-Cola yet, right?
You may never be Coca-Cola, right?
And you're actually hurting your growth if you're trying to try to think everybody is yourmarket, because it's just not true.
(31:30):
ah That's one thing that we talk about a lot.
in what we do.
And Kristen, I love what you said, because we talk about this a lot as well is marketingthrough relationship building.
Right?
Almost everything that you mentioned was about relationship building.
Was it networking?
Was it some organic social media, those type of things, podcasting?
uh We're building a relationship right now.
(31:52):
This is the first time I met you, but we're building a relationship.
And I already knew coming on that you were going to lie.
But uh I really feel like some of the biggest
business moves for me has been in the relationship building.
It hasn't been paid media.
It has been building a relationship with somebody and boom, that sparked something else,right?
So uh I love what you had to say there.
(32:14):
And even in big consumer facing brands, that relationship building is priceless becauseagain, it leads to deals or distribution or so.
mean, that's just, that just works across any size, any industry.
Yeah, yeah, I love it.
Can we dive into your faith a little bit?
(32:35):
All right.
So is there a particular biblical principle or story that guides you?
You know, I think a lot about
You know, I think a lot about Tim Keller's book, Every Good Endeavor, if you've ever readit.
It should be essential reading for every Christian business owner about the value of workand why God created and work.
(33:03):
And uh I'm moved by the idea that God created a world and wanted man to work it and makeit better, right, to organize it.
And wanted us to do
good and get joy from it.
And Kristin hit the nail on the head when she was saying, a lot of business owners havelost that joy.
(33:26):
There have been years in our 20 years in business, or as Kristin would say moreaccurately, 19 years in business, that I just wasn't sure why I was doing this because I
realized I was just doing it because it was a paycheck, right, at that point.
um
I was making money and I'd lost a sense of how I was making the world a better place andhow I was doing what God asked.
(33:55):
so crazy considering we worked in politics.
You know, we tell people this, they're like, you couldn't make that connection.
You're, you know, you're electing congressmen, governors, it worked for a president andyou're losing sight of this.
So it can happen in any business, right?
Absolutely.
Can we dive into that a little bit about the whole political background?
(34:15):
how did you get, I wanna know a little bit of the story now.
So how did you get started in that?
And then how did it transform to where you are now?
Is that too long of a story?
Well, that depends on who tells it, I suppose.
We both uh struggle little bit telling this because, you know, as with any entrepreneur,it is not linear, it is not a straight line, it is like crazy.
(34:41):
It's like, well, which part of the crazy story do you want to hear?
um
We met in college.
This is the best way I think to start it.
We met at Indiana Wesleyan University in Marion, Indiana.
Christian school.
Wonderful, by the way.
Triple endorsement for anyone.
(35:01):
And we met in the college Republicans of all places, right?
I know, nerd alert.
Yes.
uh And we were both passionate about changing the world.
And we thought the way to do it was electing politicians.
I mean, I got interested in politics even in high school.
I was a super nerd in that.
regard.
And we thought, man, he a briefcase to high school.
(35:24):
Yeah.
I can't believe I married this guy.
Yeah.
Well, she wasn't she wasn't around for all that.
So we but yeah, we just thought we're just you know, we're going to elect thesepoliticians and the Red Sea is going to part.
The sun's going to come out.
Everything's going to be wonderful.
And, know, it wasn't I grew up in in high school was in nineteen in nineteen ninety fourwhen Republicans took control of Congress for the first time in 40 years, I thought.
(35:49):
Everything's going to be great.
And so we got involved.
We ran campaigns and we did the things political operatives do.
And then we thought, well, hey, we hate being unemployed after every election.
That's the worst part about being a political campaign manager is day after the election,win, lose, or draw, it's over.
Your job's gone.
(36:10):
So we had the brilliant idea, which was not so brilliant, that what we should do is starta business serving these people because then we wouldn't be unemployed after the election.
So the new problem was...
We weren't unemployed, but we lost all our clients after the election.
But either way, we started that back in 06 and started working for small campaigns.
(36:33):
Just here in Indiana.
Yeah, just here.
City council races, state reps, and worked our way up by doing bigger and bigger races.
In 2010, we got our first big break.
We did a couple of really big campaigns.
you know, state Senator Scott Brown, who ran for US Senator in Massachusetts, if anybodyremembers this race, because it was now 15 years ago, where he beat, he won a US Senate
(37:01):
race in Massachusetts as a Republican, which hasn't happened since.
And, uh and that really helped us, you know, grow.
And what we had gotten good at during this time was raising small dollar funds online.
So think of us as crowdfunding for
political campaigns.
We had people who would find the 25 or 35 or $50 email or text donations for candidates.
(37:27):
And so over this time period from 2006 through 2024, we had helped raise over $500billion.
Million.
Million.
Sorry.
500 million.
500 billion would be awesome.
Yeah.
500 million.
I think we're approaching 600 and we're being a little conservative in that number.
(37:50):
But four Republican political candidates and helped elect over 100 members of Congress and15 governors and 15 senators.
And we worked for Donald Trump in 16.
And so uh that's what we built.
And it was a crazy ride because in 2009, you know, so we started our business, we'reyoung, we don't know anything about business.
(38:10):
uh And there were no elections in Indiana.
And it was really rough.
And we're like, how are we going to do this?
You know, we've got no money, you know.
And we started just traveling.
We hit the road and we would sometimes sleep in our car because we couldn't afford hotels.
We couldn't afford plane flights, right?
Anybody who's listening, who's like, you know, started their business scrappy.
(38:31):
You guys will get this.
And we just worked.
You know, we did not have the network.
We built our business the exact opposite of other people in our space who typically workon high profile races.
And then they hang out their shingle after they've built some relationships.
So they get clients coming to them.
We were just kids, just absolute nobodies, working really small local races um and thentraveled and traveled.
(38:56):
We've traveled over a million miles, you know, on our car um and that's how we did it.
Again, back to that relationship building and just uh being the people that we're gonnawork and serve.
And so it was all God, God really blessed us and he just put us in these right places.
Cause again, this big breakout campaign ended up being the...
national flashpoint because Obama had been elected.
(39:18):
uh And so this was the big race after that.
And it was huge, covered everywhere.
And that just catapulted us.
And we got that race because we were friends with someone and their web vendor had quitand they didn't have any money to pay us.
And we thought, well, sure, we'll do it.
What else do we have going on?
And so again, it's just, I can't even say anything we did.
(39:41):
We worked.
But obviously it was just God's
God's favor and putting us in that right place.
then that led to us doing Mitt Romney's campaign and helping him raise money in 2012.
And it just kept building from there because we built that expertise.
And that's what we're so excited to bring to businesses now, because all this time we'dhave people say, can you, you're a marketing company.
(40:01):
Can you my business?
You know, no, no, this is our niche.
This is what we know.
I don't want to pretend to be something I'm not.
I can't help you.
And now we can.
Now we can because we have figured out and God has put in our hearts all these thingswe've learned about, you know, converting people to vote and to open their wallets when
they get nothing in return.
(40:23):
We now understand those principles.
We know the ecosystem, we know the media, we know what they watch and listen to.
And we can now help uh impact driven, visionary, kingdom building entrepreneurs buildtheir business and have an impact for their family, their community and the kingdom.
Wow.
I love your story.
(40:43):
heard you had to have a very strong why buried underneath there because uh often there'sthat breaking point where most entrepreneurs give up, right?
When they're going through that struggling period and like, maybe entrepreneurship isn'tfor me, right?
But deep down we know it's God's calling on our life and we push through, right?
(41:03):
Because he's given us a mission, right?
and we're here to complete it.
So I love that story so much.
um I do want to talk a little bit more about exactly like dive into that just a little bitmore about how you help businesses with what you do.
So um what sort of specific things do you help them with?
(41:28):
Yeah.
um, we, so as we talked about our basic proposition is you've got this market segment thatyou didn't even know existed until we told you about it called Liberty Spenders.
And we're going to help you be popular with that group and generate leads for yourbusiness.
(41:49):
So our, our goal, our outcome we're pursuing on our clients is let's amp up your revenueand sales by teaching you how to talk to those people.
And we take people through.
And if you read our book, you get it all.
um Our five P's for success, engaging in conviction driven marketing to get to theseLiberty Spender consumers.
(42:11):
And so we'll walk people through it.
And we, for some customers, what we do is simply kind of hold their hand through theprocess, but they do all the work.
We show them how to do it.
um
We teach them how to do it.
We put them in front of some amazing, successful people who've already done it to learnthe whole process, but they do it all.
(42:34):
We have a program where we do that with them in a group setting, and they also get tonetwork with other people achieving this, and there's a lot of opportunity for people to
collaborate and work together.
And then for some consumers or companies more on an invitation basis, we will actually doit for them.
will become their marketing agency.
(42:55):
A lot of times we're collaborating with who they already have.
We're not here to get your marketing agency fired.
We're here to make them more effective, right?
But in some cases, we'll come in in a really big way.
We've got a team of 30 people and we can really, really dig in in multiple places.
And in that case, we would help them with things like how to get out into the market.
(43:19):
We'll help them with PR, podcast booking.
We'll help run...
ads for them will help develop new creatives or connect them with our vast network ofemail, conservative email newsletter owners, things like that.
So we will have two tracks.
Yeah.
I was just thinking, uh depending on if you have a product, one amazing thing too is umbrand ambassadors or spokespeople.
(43:48):
And so that's one thing we've been doing a lot of, it's been having a lot of success aswell, but
Because again, it's like, how does anybody, the number one question we get, people say,gosh, this is amazing.
I love this concept.
Now what?
Like, how is anybody going to know who I am?
How am I going to connect or build that trust?
And so sometimes you can leverage other people's trust, right?
(44:10):
By aligning with someone who's excited about your product or service and they can be abrand spokesman for you.
Yeah.
And we just finished one, crossed my fingers, maybe by today.
with uh a uh Christian actor for one of our customers.
And it took a couple of months to really come up with a good agreement.
(44:32):
And this actor really wanted to be confident in the quality of their product.
But that's gonna be uh something that's gonna take a wellness brand that nobody knowsabout to an audience of hundreds of thousands, if not millions, overnight.
Because you're borrowing the trust.
Mm-hmm.
Christian actor is well known and well trusted by their people.
(44:55):
So instead of having to go through what could be a months long process of trying toeducate people, hey, I'm a Christian business owner and I sell health and wellness
products and we try to honor Christ in everything we do and try to get attention, they'renow borrowing the credibility that this particular actor has.
And I think it's gonna be a really powerful opportunity for them.
(45:17):
And so Chris is right to mention this is something we actually really enjoy these kinds ofdeals because they're really cool for a company.
Some of them get to end up working with people that they've, you know, always admired or,or, you know, watched their TV shows, you know, and so it can be really fun.
Yeah, I imagine that's a big amplifier.
it takes the timeline.
(45:38):
It speeds the timeline way up because, you know, we know when you're trying to establish abrand from fresh, right from start, it takes a little while because you got to get out
there.
You've got to start putting your your values out there, your personality out there.
And it just takes a little while to develop that.
when you can begin by leveraging someone else's authenticity, I'm not even saying thatright.
(46:02):
Authenticity, that's the word I'm trying to say.
Authenticity, I'm just thinking, if you could get Tim Tebow to endorse your product, boom,you're immediately on the world stage.
uh
we do that.
And also, you know, if you are going to then put paid paid dollars, you want somethinglike that.
You know, not every business owner or founder is going to want to be the face of the ofthe brand or, you know, they may not feel comfortable being in the spotlight in that way.
(46:27):
And so this is a great way to solve that problem.
Yeah.
Yeah, wow.
I love all this.
I feel like I could have you all on for a second time and maybe we'll talk about that downthe road.
I'm glad that I met you.
I think there's like I mentioned off camera, there's some opportunity here for us.
I have some people that I wanted to introduce you to.
(46:47):
So yeah, that's right.
And I will say, just Doug, from what you shared, if I could encourage you, because anybodywho's listening, you know, can feel your heart.
It really shines through even through a zoom.
And, you know, your decision, I think, to put yourself out there and what I just I was soexcited about talking to you because, again, the profitable Christian business is so like,
(47:13):
I think sometimes we have such big hearts.
You know, people of faith, we want to help people, which I do.
um But we need to be successful.
We need to have profit.
That is what drives future growth.
That is what drives generosity, contribution.
And so I just want to give kudos to you for putting that out there because it is abusiness, not a charity.
(47:35):
Now, the idea is we then fuel charities.
But the business like we need to be, God calls us to be wise and shrewd.
And um and so I
I give props to you on what you're doing.
Thank you, thank you, yeah.
You have to have something to give in order to give, right?
And the more profitable you can be, the more you can have to give.
(47:56):
So, well, thank you again.
Where can we, I almost forgot, but let's do this.
First of all, where can we send people to find out more about Liberty Spenders and whatyou do?
Yeah, well they can go to LibertySpenders.com and we also have a place where they candownload the book.
And so they can also go to LibertySpenders.com backslash free and they can download ourbook for free.
(48:22):
Now, if you want to make a donation to college fund for our three or five year old, youcan also go to Amazon and buy it.
Speaking of profitable business, yes, you can buy it on Amazon.
Yes.
Or you can download a digital version.
We're able to do that.
And then go to LibertySpenders.com flesh free and um make sure you sign up for your, foremail there.
(48:48):
I think you'll give an email address to do it because we're about to uh be promoting ournext uh invitation to join our, our, our group and work with us on your marketing.
And so uh that's a great way to start with us.
And, but also for people who don't want to do that.
We tried to write the book so it wasn't just a, it's not just some like really flimsymarketing book that you don't learn anything from.
(49:13):
It's pretty exhaustive.
You could read the book and implement pretty much all of what we told you yourself, right?
There's worksheets and access to things.
I think working with us makes it faster, but you could do it.
And so definitely go and check it out.
I do have a comment about that because one of the things that like we pound the table withis lead with value, right?
(49:37):
And with what you just said about your book, you're leading with value.
Like when we're talking to people about how they should uh engage, how they should, whattheir lead magnet should be, make sure that they're leaving with value, right?
That it's not just something they're just gonna put, they have to be able to take actionfrom what you give them.
mm-hmm.
(49:58):
Yeah.
Yeah, and this isn't some AI-generated book, you know.
No, it'd be a lot better if it, you we wrote this.
I'm sorry to say.
Right.
Yes.
Yep, the audiobook's out there.
We read it ourselves, so it's in our voice.
So if you really want help falling asleep, you know, you could also listen to the audioversion and...
(50:23):
Check us out at audible.com.
I listen to most of my audiobooks while I'm working out, so I don't think I'd fall asleep.
Let's hope not.
I do have one last question for every single person that comes on the Prophet Christianbusiness.
And that is, I hate to leave any stone unturned.
And there may be in either one of your heads right now, I wish I could have said this.
(50:46):
I really wanted to share this.
So any parting words of wisdom for the audience.
I I may have said this already, but I just want to reemphasize it.
I think what we're talking about here with conviction-driven marketing, genericallyspeaking, and with Liberty Spenders more specifically, I think this is the marketing
(51:11):
strategy for the next decade.
Everything that's happening in our world, all the tribalism we've come to expect frompolitics is now affecting consumer behavior.
And so some of you are listening to this and thinking, is cute, but maybe not for me.
I'm going to, I'm going to do what we've been doing for the last two decades.
(51:31):
I'm going to talk about why we're the market leader here.
We're the cost leader, know, we're Walmart falling prices, whatever the thing is.
Um, but I think that stuff just isn't working the way it used to.
And if you're struggling right now thinking why I've got a good thing going, I've got agood business and you just can't break through.
(51:53):
I think this is your recipe for it.
And so you don't have to work with us, but you dive into this concept because I really dobelieve what we're talking about here, everyone's gonna be talking about in five or six
years.
You could be somebody who grabs onto this early as a business and build something beforeeverybody else realizes, yeah, I need to be doing this too.
(52:17):
Well, and with AI, you know,
content, it's just going to get easier and easier to flood the zone with all kinds ofstuff.
Again, it goes back to, don't know what it is.
I don't know who wrote it.
I don't.
And that's why that authenticity and building that brand and building that trust is socritical, because it's only going to get harder and harder to stand out and for people to
(52:39):
trust you and connect.
Yeah, I'm in the uh lane of the relationship builders are really going to start standingout.
uh The authenticity is really going to start standing out because it's going to be floodedwith so much inauthenticity and so much AI generated stuff, right?
(52:59):
That people want to connect with real people.
Yeah, when creating content is now free and easy, then it's now commoditized and lessvaluable.
So all the stuff that we used to think about doing in just a few years is just not asvaluable anymore.
(53:20):
When I can push a button and say, want to make a video and have ChatGPT created, or I wantto write a case study and have ChatGPT make it up.
All of that stuff becomes devalued.
And so that's only going to accelerate what we're talking about right here in my opinionis em because all of this stuff that we used to do that used to take forever.
(53:44):
If you wanted to make a cool ad that everybody watched, you're to to spend a lot of moneyon it and you're going to spend a lot of time.
That's, that's all gone.
And so it's, it's time just to join in on this trend em because it's going to define uhmarketing, I think for the next decade.
Yeah.
Wow.
uh Thank you again.
(54:05):
You have been some of my favorite guests uh ever on the podcast.
So much great information.
Again, go to Liberty, anyone that's watching or listening, go to LibertySpenders.com.
you're one of my audience, I implore you to go to Amazon to buy their book.
We'll put that link below.
There is a free version, but we're talking about profitable.
(54:26):
The name is in the podcast.
uh
ha.
want your business to be profitable.
Let's continue to help Liberty Spenders continue to be profitable.
uh go to that link, buy the book.
uh Actionable content in there, not just fluff.
So uh go use it and then hire them uh once you've read the book and said, wow, this issome great stuff.
(54:46):
I really need some more leverage.
So uh thanks again, Kurt and Christian.
It has been uh really, really nice to have you on the show.
Thank you Doug.
All right, and until next time, entrepreneurs, keep moving forward.
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