February 27, 2025 • 53 mins
In this episode of The Relaxed Male, we have a special guest, Todd, who is one of my clients. Todd is a father, husband, and coworker who has faced relationship challenges that many men encounter, whether at home or work. This episode provides a unique opportunity to experience firsthand how coaching with me can transform relationships from feeling like roommates to ones you can truly enjoy.
We delve into Todd's journey, discussing the struggles he faced in his marriage, particularly financial disagreements with his wife. We also discuss how coaching helped him shift his perspective and improve their relationship. Todd shares how he learned to approach his wife with care and understanding, which led to positive changes in their dynamic.
We also explore Todd's challenges at work, dealing with a coworker who has a different approach to leadership. Todd opens up about his frustrations with the lack of direction and how it impacts the team's performance. Through our conversation, we discuss effective communication styles, the importance of assertiveness, and how to lead a team by providing the necessary resources and support.
This episode helps people see the practical aspects of coaching, showing how intentional thoughts and actions can lead to significant improvements in both personal and professional relationships. Join us as we uncover the tools and strategies that can help you navigate your own challenges and enhance your relationships.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Bryan Goodwin (00:00):
Today,
I brought one of my clients on, and so we have a special
means
of seeing and listening
to how
coaching with me
actually works,
How
we are able to have
conversations that
(00:21):
transform
your relationship
from
roommate syndrome,
being
lost in your own thoughts, to
the
type of relationship you can relax into
and actually enjoy. We're gonna be talking about that this week
(00:42):
on episode two sixty four of
The Relaxed Male.
This is The Relaxed Male,
a show that comes to you each week helping men to remove the nice guy from their life so they can actually live their life on on their terms.
Join the host certified coach, Brian Goodwin, as he helps men step out of their heads and become free from the thoughts that bind them.
(01:12):
Today, I'm bringing Todd on. Todd is a
a father
and a husband
and a coworker, and this gentleman
has had
relationship
struggles
that most of us men
find ourselves in from one time to another, whether it's about his wife
(01:34):
or about his coworker.
These are things that we struggle with
on
regular basis,
really.
And
so
wanted to bring
Todd in
just to be able to show you what coaching with me is like
And to one just just to show that
(01:57):
you don't have to worry. It we're not I don't
berate you. I don't break you down. I don't tell you you're being an idiot or anything like that. That's not what coaching is like. If you're thinking coaching is
where I've donna a,
some short shorts and a polo shirt and a and a ball cap with a whistle, you've got the wrong type of coach.
(02:20):
And I'm not gonna get in your face. I'm not gonna yell at you unless you need to be
pushed in that direction.
But that is something that
rarely ever happens. And the way
this conversation goes with Todd
is kind of the typical style of coaching that
you get hit with.
(02:40):
Yeah. Sometimes we get a little deeper. Sometimes we don't, and we get,
we stay very shallow. Sometimes we have short conversations. Sometimes we have long conversations.
So this time this week, we're bringing on Todd
and, listen in and see how you can relate to what he's doing,
what he's struggling with,
(03:01):
and maybe
you can apply what he's doing,
imply what he and how
I help him
to help you see what coaching
is like.
Hey, Todd. Alright. So we are
here today, and I wanna first say thank you very much for,
(03:21):
giving me the coming on on the, show and giving the, the other listeners an opportunity to see what it's like
to be coached and what it's like to have a
just a general
coaching session because we're we're, pushing a a new means of being able to help the guys out. Just giving them a a
(03:43):
a a sample of what coaching is like, and and,
you were you're graceful enough to say, yeah. Let's let's come on. Let's let's do a,
do a a an obsession here, and and we'll see what we what we can do.
So, anyhow, so what are you
wanting to talk about today? What are you wanting what are you trying to work on?
Todd (04:06):
Well, you know, as you know, I mean, I've been meeting with you for just look back at my notes since December of twenty three, so
that's crazy.
And I've I've struggled a lot with working with my relationship with my wife. Right? Like Mhmm. When I first started meeting with you, we had difficulties in our relationship.
And a lot of that had to do with,
(04:28):
my perception that my wife was spending money like crazy
and that I really had no control.
And,
that was a big challenge for me, and I I think that's that's gotten a lot better. Right. And, you know, I I really appreciate you helping me there. I'm glad.
I mean, today, I'd maybe I'd like to talk a little bit about that. And then,
(04:49):
as you know, I've kinda struggled a little bit here and there with relationships at work and just, like, how to deal with people who were
got, you know, different opinions. I've got this,
program manager that I work with that sometimes we don't always see eye to eye, and so that creates challenges. And sometimes my tendency is to just get honorary
and,
(05:10):
you know, talk about him behind his back or,
Bryan Goodwin (05:14):
you know, go I've had first stood with the drama of of it all. So
Todd (05:18):
Yeah. And so I think, you know, the tools you've given me have helped me with that a lot.
And so yeah. I mean, I I don't know if you wanna start somewhere with one of those two topics. Okay. Well,
Bryan Goodwin (05:29):
which one feels more more pressing for you?
Todd (05:32):
I mean, right now, the work situation maybe is a little more pressing just because things have been so great with my wife lately. Like,
once I started showing up with,
actually caring about her, and I I really like that, you know, the things you taught me about. Well, like, you know, hey,
you know, what what would it look like if you were dating her again type of thing? Mhmm. She actually totally changed her behavior in my opinion, and she stepped up. And we still got a long road to go, and we have our arguments here and there. But Oh, yeah. Feel like we have tools to address it now. Right.
(06:04):
So and then whereas, like, at work, I think things are still going well. It's it's kind of different in the way that,
you know, your bosses want you to,
be successful and and meet their needs, and it's maybe you don't have as much flexibility
to
be patient Okay. With someone else's kind of bad behavior, maybe.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I get you. And it's easier to be critical at work too. I think, no. Maybe that's not totally true, but sometimes it feels like it's easier to be critical at work and just, you know, blame everyone else and
(06:34):
go tell your boss, like, hey. I'm done with this, and I don't wanna deal with with this person anymore or whatever.
Bryan Goodwin (06:40):
No. And
and those
those instances
with a
with a,
a a coworker because it's they're one that you kinda have to
you don't have a a whole lot of choice in whether you get to
to work with them or not. I mean, you can. You can always go, you know what? I'm not gonna work with this guy and and just leave the leave the job. So, I mean, we're not ever
(07:06):
completely without a choice. We always have a choice, and some a lot of times people make the choice of, well,
just just keep my head down and and
let's not
let's not make a, make an impact. And
sometimes that
might
work, you know, especially if you're if you're dealing with the direct boss and the boss just happens to be a very poor leader.
(07:33):
The the issue that
sounds like what you're running into is that you've got someone who is
not the best of leaders all either because he's actually a little bit above you. Right?
Todd (07:45):
We're kinda the same level, and Okay. You know, our organizations
where we're kind of a matrix organization, I guess they call it, where
he's in the program management office, and he has his own chain of command. Mhmm. I'm in an engineering office, and I have my chain of command. And we work together ultimately on the project we're working on. He's the kind of the head honcho, if you will. He makes the ultimate say. Okay. But from engineering,
(08:11):
I'm kinda the engineering leader. And so, yeah, I guess you could say he's
my boss in a way,
but, like, he doesn't hold any anything over me as far as, like, promotions
and raises and that sort of thing. Okay. Okay.
Bryan Goodwin (08:25):
So okay. So what is the what is it more specifically
about,
or give me an instance of where you've kind of ran into a little bit of a,
of a wall with him where you are
really kinda button heads.
Todd (08:41):
Yeah. Well, first of all, like, he's a great guy. I I admire him in a lot of ways. Like, he's
definitely different from me in that he doesn't like to
criticize people in the open. And,
so I I really appreciate several things I've learned from him. But one of the things that I think has been difficult for the team is that
he's often unwilling to, like, provide direction to the team. K. And the answer is always, like, okay. Well, something's going on. We're not sure we should be working on this.
(09:12):
It isn't really in line with what we plan to do,
but the customer may need it. And, in fact, some of these things are so far out of there that we really shouldn't be doing them. Okay. But, hey, go study it some more. Go
figure out how we're gonna do it. Go figure out a bunch of questions to ask the customer and then come back.
And I think, ultimately, some of those
(09:33):
things where it's like, hey. Go study it some more. The team ends up, like, spending a ton of effort and therefore money
and time
in
kind of some stuff that maybe is not in line with what we should have been working on. And then that puts the project that we're working on,
in jeopardy in a way as far as, like, hey. We're not holding to our cost. Okay. And we're not holding to our schedule. And so it's it's been frustrating for the team. In fact, that's one of the reasons why I got put on the team was to try and help correct that.
Bryan Goodwin (10:04):
Gotcha. Gotcha. So
so,
if, say, we were able to just
wave a wand and and all of a sudden, this was the perfect scenario,
Todd (10:18):
What were you wanting how are you wanting Adam to show up at this? I mean, I guess, in a perfect world, he would make decisions and say, yes. That's something we should be working on.
Go do
it. Or, hey. No. Like, I need to go back to our stakeholders, probably mostly our customer, and say, hey. You know, we only bid x amount of money to do this project, and we had this vision in place, and this is what we were gonna do for you. And now what you're asking us to do is, like, you know, a little bit out of left field from that, and we're happy to do it.
(10:53):
But we need to figure out how we're gonna, pay for that, whether it be not doing something we plan to do
or you giving us extra money or or something of that nature, right, versus just kinda like it almost feels like, at least to me and I think some of the other engineers on the team, it's just like, well, if we ignore it and we just kinda
do everything,
it'll all work out. Right. But in the end, it's kinda like, well, okay. Maybe it will, but what, you know, what are we sacrificing as far as, like, overruns or
(11:22):
bad performance? And then, you know, we look like we don't know what we're doing to our bosses. Okay. So
Bryan Goodwin (11:27):
sounds like some of the, some of the problem that you're running that you have is just
kind of the
the the view that,
what
the view of what you want,
you would like for,
Adam to almost portray for
(11:48):
for your your stockholders, your your clients,
and stuff like that. So to be able to
to say, hey. Let's
let's go for,
let's
let's know and stick to what our plan is as opposed
to being as as free willing as as we
(12:10):
as we are
so that we know
what now that we've set our budget, we can,
for this
this particular project, we can actually
take the
accomplish or accomplish the the the pain or the the, not pain, pain, the
(12:30):
the objective that we've actually set out for
and to alleviate whatever that, whatever that pain at the moment is.
So
with Adam
kind
of doing
going at how he's doing or coming at, at things in the way that he's coming, you're kinda saying he's,
(12:52):
what, a little bit wishy washy, I guess.
Not very committed? Yeah. Absolutely.
Todd (12:57):
I don't know. I think he's committed,
and the thing I always struggle with is, like, on projects like this, for sure, like, when you're designing something, you don't know exactly what you're gonna have to do. Right. There needs to be some flexibility.
But on a on a project where, like, you know, you're
you ultimately have a budget,
(13:18):
you need to accomplish whatever you can accomplish within that budget and schedule. Right? Because a lot of times,
like, with this particular client,
they're hoping to do something Right. You know, in August of twenty twenty six or something, let's say.
And,
we very much need to deliver and and meet those expectations. Right? It's kinda like what's most important
(13:39):
and, you know, managing your resources to accomplish the goal without,
like, wildly exceeding cost or budget or cost or schedule type of thing. Okay. So how do you handle
Bryan Goodwin (13:50):
anytime you come across when he's feeling being a little
a little soft, a little wishy washy, how do you how are you
how do you normally approach that that particular problem?
Todd (14:02):
Like I told you before, kind of what we ended up doing most recently is,
putting, like, this formal change control
process
in place, and that's been
helpful.
And then he and I decided that we were gonna meet every morning, basically, and just talk for fifteen minutes about what's going on.
I think that's helped.
(14:24):
My feeling has been, like,
at some level, that's kinda kicking the can down the road a little bit because,
you know, we we saw problems. We put together some of these things.
We presented,
we presented some of these things to our customer
that kinda got ignored a little bit.
And then a couple months later, we're still talking about it. And now
(14:47):
it's like, okay. Now we need to go present this to our leadership and have them just help decide, you know, does the company step in and
help pay for some of the work, or does
do we go back and push the customer even harder? And so I think I think we're ultimately on a good path. I guess it's just taken, like, way too long in my mind. Okay. And, yeah, I certainly probably coulda handled it better back then or something. Okay. So what would if you're saying you could have, what would have been what would have been a better way that you could've handled that?
(15:15):
Well, I mean, I guess
I guess it could have been more candid with him about what was going on. Although,
sometimes when I feel like I do that, it's I I get, you know, the right answer and an answer of, like, oh, yeah. We we submitted a list to the customer, and we're just waiting to hear back from them. Right.
And then,
you know, fast forward a couple months, and it's like, oh, well, you know, they're not really gonna fund the whole list
(15:38):
of things, so we need to get very specific about we want, what we want. And it just kinda felt like it was,
continuing to drag on. And and maybe I just need to realize, like, that's part of the process.
But at the same time, right, like, our our bosses are saying, hey. Are you guys on budget? Are you on schedule? Yeah. This is a problem project, and,
you know, we're meeting with leadership once a week or more to talk about where we're at. Okay. So when
Bryan Goodwin (16:04):
when you're
when you wish that,
or when you
when you run into,
a particular problem, say, like, you're you're doing these meetings every every week and stuff, and you're just kinda kicking the can down the road,
What would have been what would be a way that you could
resolve that issue?
(16:25):
Or do you think or that you believe that you could resolve the issue?
Todd (16:31):
Well, I mean, what I tried was
I I originally tried to, like, focus on some of the things where he and I disagreed. Right? And I put some things
in our message to leadership, like, no. You know, this is happening, and,
you know, the project manager is saying that we should do this thing,
which I totally disagree with. And then he felt attacked. Right? He's like, why are you throwing me under the bus in front of my
(16:54):
bosses and stuff, and we need to figure this out. And that's when we started
meeting weekly.
Looking back, I'm not sure. Like, I I think in a way that helped kinda bring the issue to light a little bit. Okay.
I I certainly don't like to feel like I'm not being fully open
with my boss and with, you know, those that I work with.
So that was a fine balance for me. Like, okay. You know? How do I handle it where we don't agree?
(17:19):
Right. And he's got a different perspective.
Yet I'm tasked with trying to to make things better and do things differently. It was kind of it's it's been a challenge. Okay. So when y'all have these meetings,
Bryan Goodwin (17:32):
were they just
meetings to talk about what the problem was, or did y'all talk and decide, okay. This is the topic that we're going to address and we're gonna find a solution to. We all actually trying to
find a solution, or was it just a means to just
kinda just talk about it and talk through it and maybe someone would have the moment,
(17:54):
and and all of a sudden, the light would come on where everything would be fixed and fine.
Todd (17:59):
Yeah. No. Thinking about that a little, I guess the meetings have often been to inform
our bosses, right, on where we're at and what the challenges are. And I think the ultimate goal is to
to find and fix problems and figure out where we're
needing additional help. Okay.
So in in that regard, it maybe is a little bit of troubleshooting
(18:22):
or or or working on it. Mhmm.
But that even that seemed difficult. Right? Like, because
sometimes the engineering group would be all on the same page and say, oh, no. We shouldn't be working on that. That's exactly
what we were you know, what we decided here when we had a review with our customer several months ago. Mhmm.
But then that wasn't really the direction we
(18:44):
I mean, that was that was the thought. But then further down the road, it was like, oh, well, maybe we need to find a way to go do this. And,
maybe we're open with our customer about, like, hey. Here's what we are doing. Here's what we're not doing. Because
part of my frustration has been, like, I think the customer thinks we're doing
things that we aren't really working on Right.
(19:05):
Because we haven't been fully open in communicating with them.
Bryan Goodwin (19:09):
So how do you fix that particular problem?
Todd (19:12):
I mean, I think I could
I don't know. I hate to step on someone's toes and, you know, I'm kinda new
to this particular,
client.
Right. But I think that I could,
you know,
engage a little bit more there and and bring that up.
Bryan Goodwin (19:29):
K. So, normally, when y'all are having meetings with the client and stuff, you're what? Just kinda setting off to the side, just grab notes, or or what are what are you normally doing?
Todd (19:40):
I mean, kind of a mixture of that. And then,
the the the few meetings that I've been in with the client, you know, we're able to put together
a list of things that are going on. And and there's one instance where I was able to say, like, hey. You know, we're not exactly sure what we need to do here,
and we aren't working on it. And and that was helpful because
(20:01):
client said, hey. We've got to figure this out. And
the next time we meet person, you know, face to face, let's
let's come up with a solution.
And so I and, you know, I think that that probably is the best way to go about it is
find a way to where I can work in those concerns,
without, like,
Bryan Goodwin (20:20):
stepping on the project manager's toes, basically. So when y'all had that meeting and you had that that little moment with the with the client where they were like,
yeah. We definitely wanna work through this and find a solution.
What was Adam's response to that? Was that a favorable response? Or
Todd (20:38):
Yeah. I think it was. I mean, it maybe I was in a bad,
mindset at the time that it was kinda like, well, you guys need to go get your questions together,
and, let's get ready for this meeting. Like, okay. We've, you know, we put together a question. We've asked them.
I guess in my perfect world, I was hoping for more of, like, okay.
(20:58):
As a company, we've done enough, and we've presented this to the customer, and they've not been very responsive. And so let's go
follow-up with them. And it was more of, like, no. We need to put together our questions, and we need to go,
come up with an approach because, you know, the customer is not gonna know exactly what to do.
Right. And I guess I've always kinda struggle with that. Right? Like, if we're working on something that's,
(21:20):
outside of what we planned,
but,
something that the customer wants, I think the customer
needs to have some
responsibility to help us kinda understand what they want without us,
having to go figure it all out for them. And maybe that's something where we need to decide, like, okay. We are gonna go figure it out for them, and let's figure out a way that we can,
(21:42):
go figure out all the details for them and present them a solution Right. Or proposed solution. K. So may it almost
Bryan Goodwin (21:49):
at least to me, it sounds like you're saying that
it would help if you just
and
it's probably not the best phrase because it's not it's not gonna
sound a whole lot
sound really favorable, but at the same time, to step up just a little bit more than what you have been
so so that you actually voice those particular concerns.
(22:13):
And
and that way
because it sound like Adam didn't have a didn't have too big of an issue when you
did voice some of the, some of the issues. So maybe if you were
if you were speaking up and and doing a little bit more
of your insight into it, maybe that's
Todd (22:37):
that helps Yeah. I think Adam's team. So. Yeah. Looking back, I mean, I think that was probably the best thing and that,
I probably should have been
in that mindset and doing that much earlier on
instead of kinda sitting back and
and taking the position where it's like, oh, I'm just gonna complain because I'm not getting what I want Right. Or things aren't going the way I think they should go. And I think that's kinda played out my relationship with my wife too. Right? Like,
(23:05):
early on, I was like, oh, I I'm not getting what I want as far as how you're treating the finances and how you're showing up for a relationship. And so I'm just gonna be,
Bryan Goodwin (23:13):
you know, angry, upset, howdy. You just kinda sit there and pout and wonder why no one's picking you up and and and playing with you.
Todd (23:22):
Right. Yeah. If I throw a fit and, like, get mad, then
then I'll get it all off my chest and things will be better.
Bryan Goodwin (23:28):
But in the end, it's, like, not really the solution. Yeah. It's like, I don't know why everything's all broken. I just threw a fit. I mean, come on. What's what's the deal here?
But I sure felt better after I threw a picture. Yeah. We all do. We feel yeah. Yeah. Let's feel 10 times better after throw throwing an ashtray or something.
But at the same time, then you have a broken ashtray.
(23:50):
So we
got a hole in the wall.
And that's, I mean, that's one of the big
problems that we run into is
those,
what a lot of people often call unintentional consequences.
Those
instances of where it's like, well, if I if I do this, yeah, I feel better, but what what are the, what are the ramifications?
(24:14):
What are the results that I am getting from
doing whatever it is that I that I did? So if I get angry and I get mad and I yell,
like, say, like, yelling at at your wife, say you had a problem at in marriage,
and you holler and yell,
then we turn around and go, well, why is my wife not
(24:36):
closer to me? Why do we not have that connection? Well, I mean, come on. You just got finished yelling and throwing a fit. I mean, come on. You're how much connection is there actually in a relationship?
And
with
in a in a in a work environment, that can be
a very different dynamic because,
(24:58):
one, you have people who
are
going to respond to
how you speak
in completely different ways. I mean, there's those four different types of of communication,
styles. You have your you have your aggressive, you have your passive, you have your passive aggressive,
and then you've got your assertive.
(25:19):
And the assertive communication style is
often
misread by
the other
communication styles
because they take you as if you're speaking in a very assertive tone,
they're gonna take you as being the jerk.
But yet, at the same time, they're that's because your communication style is actually a lot more effective.
(25:44):
People who are passive, they're just kinda
wishy washy,
mealy mouthed, just well, you know, we probably might wanna kinda start looking in this general vicinity of doing something, and you don't have any specifics.
And so
when, they get finished talking, you're like going, okay. Are we really doing what we just talked about? Are we not doing there's a lot of unknowns that are being being,
(26:11):
being conveyed because there's nothing
concrete.
And then you have your, your,
your aggressive
speaker
who likes to talk aggressively, and
they're the ones that come in and go, it's my way or the highway, and if you can't do it, then you're out of here and bah bah bah. You know? And that's not ever gonna build a good team either because,
one,
(26:32):
your
that type of communication style stifles any type of creativity, stifles that person's ability to show,
to put their their soul into whatever the project is.
And so, yeah, we have a lot.
You have one where the guys just there's almost too much freedom. There's one that there's not enough freedom. You have the combination of the passive aggressive, and they're just the the slimeball
(26:56):
of the, of the commune
communication group because they're they're being
aggressive
while trying to be nice at the same time. And so you can just feel how greasy and nasty that, that whole communication style is, and no one really
trusts anything that they say.
So you have you have the
(27:19):
the
the aggressive,
the the passive, and the passive aggressive, while the assertive
is just stating the facts.
The assertive is just,
we're going to have,
you know, this is what we need to get done. You need to find out you need to start doing that. We'll start figuring out how do we get to,
(27:39):
you know, the objective. How do we get your your part of the part of your job is to find the objective here. So
if you need some help, reach out. I'll help where I can, but at the same time, this is this is what your job,
job title
and job description entails.
Figure out figure it out. I'm you're a smart enough person. Figure it out, and and we'll we'll meet up next week and see where you're at.
(28:05):
And
it gives a lot of responsibility
to
the person that you're talking to. And, if a a passive person doesn't wanna have that responsibility, they're trying to mealy mouth their way
out of having to be responsible for it.
The
aggressive person
has no idea how to really handle
(28:27):
responsibility. They wanna have all the power. They wanna have all the the
the the say,
and so
that's why it's their way of the highway because,
again, they don't wanna give
or they they want they don't even actually want the responsibility
either,
And they wanna have it done their way, but if it fails, they're I can guarantee you, they're never they're not gonna go, well, yeah. It's my fault. I told them to do that.
(28:56):
They're gonna be pointing at that other person going, dude, you you screwed it all up. You you you know what it was supposed to be, and they're going to they're gonna point the the the finger at anybody else other than them.
Todd (29:09):
Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. And sometimes, Brian, I feel like I'm a passive aggressive communicator. Right? Like,
I I kinda have the tendency to to do that, I think. At the same time,
I try to be assertive. So I guess it's hard for me to find the balance there. Like, I wanna be kind
without,
you know, being a jerk. And Okay. So tend to lean towards being a jerk maybe too often. I don't know. Well, maybe you're it's not even the a matter of kind.
Bryan Goodwin (29:36):
Assertive communication
isn't so much,
are you being kind? Are you being a jerk?
Assertive is,
I trust you enough
to know that you can get the job done.
Mhmm. And as the leader, you would go
you get what you're needing done. Because what's a leader's responsibility
(29:58):
overall?
Todd (29:59):
Achieve the I mean, I guess where I'm at is achieve the the work that we're supposed to, you know, help the team
Bryan Goodwin (30:06):
achieve the goal the end goal. Right? Right. Doing the thing That design point. Yeah. But, one way I've looked at I've seen, and had, leadership described to me, and I like it a lot,
is a leader
is there to provide the resources
so the team can accomplish the goal. You're there to serve
(30:27):
the the the
team in any way that you can.
Yeah. It is a lot of times you have to do some direction. Alright. We're getting close to what we're needing to do. Let's you know, what's a different way we can we can pose this, you know, this solution?
And allowing the team to utilize
their their creativity, and, like I said, implement their soul into into the project
(30:54):
so they have something that they are proud of.
And at the end, instead of it being such a a slog, it becomes a a passion project for everybody.
When you're able to
effectively
lead, it doesn't mean that you're being
being the nice guy because the nice guy is is
a nice guy and an and and a jerk are two sides of the same asshole.
(31:18):
Alright? So it's just Yeah. Just both you know, we're just working on different extremes.
They both are trying to manipulate the person to get so that they feel better.
While a a leader who can speak,
with assertion,
you know, we're not going to we're not gonna paddle,
and and patty cake around whatever the problem is. If the problem if there's a problem there that needs to be addressed,
(31:44):
we address the problem. We get it done. We get it said. We get it and and we get, find a resolution,
and then we don't bring it up anymore. It's okay. You've got we've got it handled. If you've got it handled, we're good. Don't have to worry about bringing this up anymore. It's in the past.
But if all of a sudden I come to you and I told you, hey. We need to get,
(32:06):
step 423
done by by Thursday, and we get there and you're still,
you know, three steps behind,
then it's time to come in and go,
so where where am I failing? Where do we what am I failing to provide for you so that you can get this done? What are you needing
out of
(32:26):
out of me to be able to get this? And you can hear a lot of most of the time, people will be
inspired to go ahead and step up and go, well,
it's just I I and they will have some excuses. Like, okay. Well, we don't need an excuse. We need this done.
And, yeah, you're speaking directly to them. You're not going well. Okay. Here. Let me go ahead and I'll start doing this for you. Because, again, you're when you're you're caretaking, you're taking care from somebody.
(32:56):
So
Todd (32:57):
Yeah. I I like that idea because,
then you're, like, putting the
the responsibility on the person and then asking them, like, what what do you need from me to help you do it? And I think
that would probably be something that I can greatly improve upon. Right? Like, instead of
trying to step in and maybe do everything or,
Bryan Goodwin (33:18):
micromanage at some level. Yeah. No. Micromanage no one likes a micromanager.
Todd (33:25):
Well and then that also makes makes them not perform as well. Like, you're saying, like, if Right. If there's a person who's
got a task and they realize it's theirs and they need to get it done,
then they'll find a way to do it, and they'll have more pride in in ownership, if you will, of the of their work and that sort of thing. Right. And, yeah, it's when you because if you're able to go off
Bryan Goodwin (33:48):
and give a vision of what the end product is supposed to look like, or even if you have a good drawing
or visualization
of what the end product
looks like,
it doesn't matter how they get to it as long as they get to that finished product.
It's kinda like,
cleaning the cleaning the house. I may personally
I I think you ought to start from, the high
(34:11):
horizontal surfaces and get all those clean
and work your way down to the floor and then sweep the floor up
while other people think, oh, no. No. You can start at the floor and work your way up.
As long as you have a clean room at the end,
does it really matter?
I mean, the one person who goes from the bottom up may have to go over the floor two or three times,
(34:32):
But if it's not hindering anything
Yeah.
Then then what's what's the problem?
And, yeah, a lot of guys,
a lot of lot of people
who are ineffectual,
ineffective leaders,
they do. They like to micromanage because they want it done
their way.
Now you have to use
(34:54):
this particular bolt
into this particular,
in this particular,
slot. And it's like, well, okay. But it's, why does it have to be this particular bolt and not this other bolt?
And a lot of times, they can't because and they can't answer that or they will come up with the response of because I said so.
(35:15):
And if we ever hear a because I said so, that is a ineffectual leader
right off the bat because it's like, I don't have the answer. I just want it done this way.
Yeah. And so you can go, okay. Okay. I I now know who I'm dealing with if you give up because I said so, or that's the way it's always been done is a is a death knell to any organization. Well, that's how we've always done it. Well,
(35:39):
maybe there's better ways of doing it, and we can look at it, in a in a different,
in a different light and be able to do something even better.
And so and that's where, you know, again, being able to inspire
your
the the people working underneath you and
taking the,
the the leadership notes that your that your leadership
(36:04):
gives you and then being able to incorporate those into your particular department. That's where
things become
become exciting because you're able to rally literally rally the troops to a,
to do better and to to finish whatever the the project is.
And, heck, a lot of times, if you're if you do it, do it right, they will actually even
(36:29):
they'll they'll follow you they'll follow you into hell and back
and and be happy that they did so.
And all
because, one, you are,
one, not able not willing or you are willing to get yourself just as dirty as they are.
Two, you take your the responsibility
of the team,
but, also, you're allowing them all the creativity
(36:51):
creative licenses they they need
to be able to reach or whatever that objective is. And that's when again,
and that all falls into
the all that freedom and and free,
free expression comes in
because you're speaking assertively.
You don't have to be the bully. You don't have to yell. I mean, whatever a person does, that's, you know, even if somebody gets mad at you,
(37:18):
what do you make that mean?
Even if your boss is mad at you, you know, you can make that mean a hundred thousand different things. What do you wanna make your boss being angry mean? Did you screw up?
Okay. Maybe you did. But what is what are you making him yelling at you
mean?
Not mean just mean that, okay. I need to I I've dropped the ball. I let too many things fall through the cracks. I've got a, you know, I've got a knuckle under and get my stuff taken care of better.
(37:46):
Or it could be,
it means I'm gonna lose my job. I better panic. I'm gonna I I'll just let myself fall apart and, you know, which one's gonna be the better results.
And you have to start that's where you wanna have the intentional thoughts of of what
what the end result is.
When you're living
(38:06):
a intentionally,
alright,
you then
know you can start planning, hey, this is how
I wanna show up for, you know, for the meetings with Adam.
Alright. This is how I wanna show up for for the meetings. I wanna be a cool, calm, collected. We're going to find a solution to
whatever the topic of the day is.
Todd (38:28):
Yeah. That's the hardest part sometimes for me though is just like when in that moment something happens and then you just go back to, like, your default mode of thinking. It's like, sure. I wanna show up as this person who,
is assertive
but not a jerk.
And but then it's like, okay. Something happens, and it's just like, oh, you know, I all this stuff feels like How do you how do you keep that from happening?
(38:52):
I mean, both, you know, at work and then in my personal relationship at home, I I've struggled with that as you know.
I think some of the things are just,
stopping and taking a breath. Right? Like Mhmm.
Maybe giving time for the situation to relax. And then,
I haven't done as well at as maybe I could have, but,
(39:13):
doing the
the model, right, of just like, okay. What is what is the circumstance here?
What am I thinking about it? And is that thought really serving me?
You know, the few times I've done that, it's been helpful
because I do. I have, like, this tendency to just like, oh, world's, you know, the world's ending or whatever.
Bryan Goodwin (39:32):
We all we all our brain instantly is going boom. Oh my gosh. We're coming to an end. We're fixing to die. And that's just how we're our brain has evolved
through the the centuries and the and the millennia
is because,
you know, it's was designed to look for the worst
worst possible case. Because if you're out there on Serengeti
(39:54):
and you see an antelope and you're like, hey.
I've got there's an antelope there. We can eat real good for a couple three days now. If I get that, antelope and you start running heading that direction off to your side, you all of a sudden, you see a clump of of grass move.
Was that the wind or was that a lion?
What do you do? You know? If it's a lion and you go and get that antelope, well, the lion's probably gonna get you, and now he's gonna eat twice as good. So, you know, you we we are designed
(40:23):
to to fall into the bad spot, but to, to the bad
worst case scenario types of thinking.
The but the great thing about us is that we have this front part of our brain
that when we can
activate it,
we can actually slow ourselves down. We can take that breath and go,
(40:44):
okay.
I didn't handle that the right way.
How do I handle that next time?
And we have to train ourselves. It's,
the saying of we never rise to our intentions. We always fall to our training.
Yeah. And so we want to yeah. We can intend
to
be
awesome all the time. We can be this great,
(41:07):
all caring person, but this gonna take it takes time. It takes a
a moment of
catching the fact that you're in that, in that routine again because it's just a habit. Our brain loves to be seek pleasure, avoid pain, do it as efficiently as possible. And when we run into our into our tailspin mode again, that's us being efficient. It's it's easy. It it just
(41:30):
I guess, the hippocampus is the habit center of the brain, I think, something like that.
And so it's easy for the brain to go, oh, hey. We've seen this before. Throw throw it over to, to the habit center. Habit center knows what to do. The habits just well, okay. Yep. Now throw this in here. Let's throw a fit, throw
a grumble, gripe, blame somebody else, and okay. There we go. The end of routine. And it was easy.
(41:52):
But to stop and go, well, no. No. We're not playing that game no more. We're going to rewrite
our how we respond.
I want to look at how I how I respond to something, doing an after action review. What did I do right? What did I do wrong? What can I improve on?
And
every time you get finished doing an action, start or doing something,
(42:14):
you know, writing that down, looking at it and going, okay. Now I know I can I can actually do this a lot better if I
next time I catch this coming up,
what happens if I take a take a take a breath? Just stop
10 deep breaths,
and then proceed.
Come up with a plan. And that and and literally ask myself,
(42:37):
how do I want to show up? How do I want to be
thought of
in this circumstance?
And
whatever the answer to that is, then you can proceed from there. And you'll probably show up, and I no guarantees because,
again, we're human. We're gonna try something. We're gonna fail, and then we're gonna go, oh my god. It didn't work. And I
(42:58):
and go stop laughing and
say this is stupid.
But then we come back, we try it again. And eventually,
it's it's scientific method.
It's basically what it is. What happens if I if I approach the situation this way? Oh, that didn't work. Alright.
Well, let's try approaching it this way. Oh, that didn't work either. Eventually, you're gonna go, well, let's try it this way. Hey. Look at that. We got a really good response from Adam. Oh, hey. Look at that. The wife is
(43:27):
is doing great. Hey. The kids responded really well to the way I showed up this way. Let's try
responded really well to the way I showed up this way. Let's try it that way from now on.
And, yeah, you're still gonna fall back in the old old habit. I mean, you're still going to
to you and the wife have a have an argument. You're still going to fall into the old thoughts of, oh, great. She's fixing to leave me.
(43:47):
The boss is gonna yell at you, and you're still gonna go, oh, great. I'm fixing to get fired.
Or, you know, you
you hack the kid off, and the kid just hauling and screaming. She's you're like, oh, great. She's fixing
dramatics
a a teenage kid wants to do.
Lock herself up in a room and and and play play annoying music for the for the rest of the day. Whatever, you know, whatever the kids want
(44:15):
are doing.
We all have our
our fallbacks on, and those fallbacks are gonna happen, but
the more you're
work on being mindful
and you pay attention, okay. This is what
I need to do. This is what I need to work on. This is, okay, the after action review, after action review, after action review, you're going to eventually start
(44:40):
seeing,
again, those incremental changes, the ones that you've been making
for the past year. Where now,
yeah, the sometimes the wife likes to go and and indulge herself.
She likes to spend money and and and stuff. And,
you know, we I used to joke around that she'd buy organic flossers,
(45:00):
but, you know, it was just
it
it was one of those things where
what did you make that spending mean? And when you started to relax into it and soften yourself around what the circumstance was
and that that circumstance wasn't a dig against you, it wasn't that she hated the the fact that you wanted to save money.
(45:23):
You actually found out that, no, no, she actually wants to save money too.
But
what we're but we're going off in making
the
sell,
or the purchasing
of of products
mean two different things. She's got her meaning.
She it is a means of her feeling a little bit better for a little bit a little bit.
(45:45):
Mhmm.
And when
you go off and and get all excited and become, as you say, ornery
about the about the circumstance,
that's not that almost robs her of her feel good,
and so she's gotta go replace that feel good now with buying more stuff.
And so we would make it this
(46:05):
little feedback loop of spend money. Oh, you're spending money. Oh, spend money. No. Don't spend money. Spend money. Oh my god. You're gonna get put us into bankruptcy.
And so it was but with moment you as you noticed, moment you stopped
and just
allowed,
and it sounds
so weird to even now to say
(46:27):
and allow her to just spend the money.
Yeah. She realizes, oh, okay. I'm not having to be
nervous about this, and let's he's allowing me to show up to the,
to the circumstance
in my own way.
And all of a sudden, the the feedback loop got interrupted.
(46:49):
And now she's like, okay. We we we do need to save some money.
And it's not that you're allowing her to spend your
your hard earned cash into oblivion,
but you're allowing her to
examine herself.
So when we find when we end up just hitting allowing our thoughts to just,
(47:09):
you know, just run amok,
that's when we we start having the,
the issues running running into into place because we
it's how do I get this taken care of? How do we get,
you know, how am I supposed to save money if she's gonna spend it all? Well,
you're not she's not gonna spend all the money.
(47:30):
You're not gonna save as fast as you would like. Yeah. That can be a that could be a
a a frustrating
part of life just because you would like to be able to save.
You know? If you're like me, I'd like to be able to save take 90% of my the money I bring in and just stick it in a bank and invest it and let it grow.
But for some reason, there's people out there that want money money for me because I use their services. And, you know,
(47:56):
I don't know why the house folks still want their money. I mean, I've been paying it for twenty years now. So, I mean, come on. You know? I figured twenty years out of thirty, we're we're mostly there, so that should be good.
Yeah.
But so
we can
we can accept the fact that, yeah,
our wife is likes to likes to
(48:19):
spend money
when she is either a stressed
or she likes to show it as means of of I love you. I'm going to buy this,
and, I want the best for my family.
And we can either wig out about it and go, oh my gosh. They're just you know, they're
it it's a shirt. You don't have to spend a hundred $50 on a t shirt. Yeah. But have you tried wearing that hundred $50 t shirt and gone, oh,
(48:45):
that feels really nice? Okay. There might be a reason why there's a hundred and $50 worth of T shirt on this. Don't know why there would be a hundred $50 T shirt. I do know there are $50 T shirts, and those are two for me, at least, that's still too much. I I I throw a fit to spending $20 on a T shirt. So
Todd (49:00):
Yeah.
But Yeah. For sure. No. I I totally agree with everything you just said.
Bryan Goodwin (49:06):
So
but but, yeah, it's
it you've done
Todd (49:11):
on on
Bryan Goodwin (49:13):
all these different
circumstances. I mean, we didn't even get around to talking about, about your daughter
and
all the,
all the ways that you've been able to step in and and help her. She,
you've been able to do
so many things just because you have allowed yourself to
(49:33):
to examine what your thoughts are
because
that's our thoughts create our our feelings, our feelings create our actions, our actions create results. That's the whole model.
And a lot of times, we do very unintentional
models.
We and we have a thought
that we're not even aware that we're having,
(49:54):
and and the rest of the,
the the events happen, and then we're like going, well, okay. So what, why did this not go right? Why why is
my marriage falling apart? Well, you're are you intentionally trying to have a better marriage,
or are you just sitting there
idly floating through life
(50:16):
with no rudder?
Because if you're not you know, if you're gonna go through life rudderless, then, yeah, you're gonna wind up in places you don't wanna be. You may not even get out of the harbor.
Todd (50:26):
Absolutely. That's gold because, like, when I show up in my relationship, like, with my wife,
then she feels seen and heard and, you know, appreciated, and then she shows up too. So I I totally agree. Like, I was thinking
last year, I did all these like, I made it her birthday week. Right? Corny. But,
like, just every day, I stopped and got her something.
(50:47):
And I was just amazed at, like, how much she really enjoyed just silly little things. Like, I I got her some
crown at the local five dollar store type of thing, and she loved it. And it was like, it was fun for me because I got to, you know, figure out what I can surprise her with, and she really enjoyed it too. And it, like, helped our connection.
And I think in the past, I wasn't intentional.
And, like, I totally agree with what you're saying. Being intentional and just it doesn't take much, but just being intentional about what you're doing and why, and,
(51:15):
it goes a long ways
Bryan Goodwin (51:17):
both for you and for the other person. So Right. And I think we can just leave it right there because, bam, that was a good one. And that was a real good summary, and I liked how I liked how you were able to phrase that. And, yeah, that absolutely, man.
So
so, anyhow, Todd, again, appreciate everything that you have,
(51:38):
the the
the paths that you have and and distances that you have made are are
astounding, and I'm glad that you,
have decided to to put your, your marriage and your your your leadership abilities
onto the next level to bring to raise those up. And
(51:58):
and we've been, working here for, for a year, so and it's been
it's been a great one. So,
again, thanks for, thanks for coming on, and and we'll,
we'll talk to you, talk to you down the road.
Todd (52:11):
Yeah. Thank you, Brian. I really appreciate you. Uh-huh. Well, we'll talk to y'all later.
Bryan Goodwin (52:16):
See you.
So if you'd like to try coaching, there's just
three steps that you have to do, and this is it.
Go to relaxedmail.com/trycoaching,
Schedule a time that's convenient for you. And then the final step,
show up.
From there, we will have a
(52:38):
powerful
session that can help you change your relationship
with your wife and those around you. Again, if you're interested, relax mail
Com forward / try coaching.
Have a good day.
Today,
I brought one of my clients on, and so we have a special
means
of seeing and listening
to how
coaching with me
actually works,
How
we are able to have
conversations that
(00:21):
transform
your relationship
from
roommate syndrome,
being
lost in your own thoughts, to
the
type of relationship you can relax into
and actually enjoy. We're gonna be talking about that this week
(00:42):
on episode two sixty four of
The Relaxed Male.
This is The Relaxed Male,
a show that comes to you each week helping men to remove the nice guy from their life so they can actually live their life on on their terms.
Join the host certified coach, Brian Goodwin, as he helps men step out of their heads and become free from the thoughts that bind them.
(01:12):
Today, I'm bringing Todd on. Todd is a
a father
and a husband
and a coworker, and this gentleman
has had
relationship
struggles
that most of us men
find ourselves in from one time to another, whether it's about his wife
(01:34):
or about his coworker.
These are things that we struggle with
on
regular basis,
really.
And
so
wanted to bring
Todd in
just to be able to show you what coaching with me is like
And to one just just to show that
(01:57):
you don't have to worry. It we're not I don't
berate you. I don't break you down. I don't tell you you're being an idiot or anything like that. That's not what coaching is like. If you're thinking coaching is
where I've donna a,
some short shorts and a polo shirt and a and a ball cap with a whistle, you've got the wrong type of coach.
(02:20):
And I'm not gonna get in your face. I'm not gonna yell at you unless you need to be
pushed in that direction.
But that is something that
rarely ever happens. And the way
this conversation goes with Todd
is kind of the typical style of coaching that
you get hit with.
(02:40):
Yeah. Sometimes we get a little deeper. Sometimes we don't, and we get,
we stay very shallow. Sometimes we have short conversations. Sometimes we have long conversations.
So this time this week, we're bringing on Todd
and, listen in and see how you can relate to what he's doing,
what he's struggling with,
(03:01):
and maybe
you can apply what he's doing,
imply what he and how
I help him
to help you see what coaching
is like.
Hey, Todd. Alright. So we are
here today, and I wanna first say thank you very much for,
(03:21):
giving me the coming on on the, show and giving the, the other listeners an opportunity to see what it's like
to be coached and what it's like to have a
just a general
coaching session because we're we're, pushing a a new means of being able to help the guys out. Just giving them a a
(03:43):
a a sample of what coaching is like, and and,
you were you're graceful enough to say, yeah. Let's let's come on. Let's let's do a,
do a a an obsession here, and and we'll see what we what we can do.
So, anyhow, so what are you
wanting to talk about today? What are you wanting what are you trying to work on?
Todd (04:06):
Well, you know, as you know, I mean, I've been meeting with you for just look back at my notes since December of twenty three, so
that's crazy.
And I've I've struggled a lot with working with my relationship with my wife. Right? Like Mhmm. When I first started meeting with you, we had difficulties in our relationship.
And a lot of that had to do with,
(04:28):
my perception that my wife was spending money like crazy
and that I really had no control.
And,
that was a big challenge for me, and I I think that's that's gotten a lot better. Right. And, you know, I I really appreciate you helping me there. I'm glad.
I mean, today, I'd maybe I'd like to talk a little bit about that. And then,
(04:49):
as you know, I've kinda struggled a little bit here and there with relationships at work and just, like, how to deal with people who were
got, you know, different opinions. I've got this,
program manager that I work with that sometimes we don't always see eye to eye, and so that creates challenges. And sometimes my tendency is to just get honorary
and,
(05:10):
you know, talk about him behind his back or,
Bryan Goodwin (05:14):
you know, go I've had first stood with the drama of of it all. So
Todd (05:18):
Yeah. And so I think, you know, the tools you've given me have helped me with that a lot.
And so yeah. I mean, I I don't know if you wanna start somewhere with one of those two topics. Okay. Well,
Bryan Goodwin (05:29):
which one feels more more pressing for you?
Todd (05:32):
I mean, right now, the work situation maybe is a little more pressing just because things have been so great with my wife lately. Like,
once I started showing up with,
actually caring about her, and I I really like that, you know, the things you taught me about. Well, like, you know, hey,
you know, what what would it look like if you were dating her again type of thing? Mhmm. She actually totally changed her behavior in my opinion, and she stepped up. And we still got a long road to go, and we have our arguments here and there. But Oh, yeah. Feel like we have tools to address it now. Right.
(06:04):
So and then whereas, like, at work, I think things are still going well. It's it's kind of different in the way that,
you know, your bosses want you to,
be successful and and meet their needs, and it's maybe you don't have as much flexibility
to
be patient Okay. With someone else's kind of bad behavior, maybe.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I get you. And it's easier to be critical at work too. I think, no. Maybe that's not totally true, but sometimes it feels like it's easier to be critical at work and just, you know, blame everyone else and
(06:34):
go tell your boss, like, hey. I'm done with this, and I don't wanna deal with with this person anymore or whatever.
Bryan Goodwin (06:40):
No. And
and those
those instances
with a
with a,
a a coworker because it's they're one that you kinda have to
you don't have a a whole lot of choice in whether you get to
to work with them or not. I mean, you can. You can always go, you know what? I'm not gonna work with this guy and and just leave the leave the job. So, I mean, we're not ever
(07:06):
completely without a choice. We always have a choice, and some a lot of times people make the choice of, well,
just just keep my head down and and
let's not
let's not make a, make an impact. And
sometimes that
might
work, you know, especially if you're if you're dealing with the direct boss and the boss just happens to be a very poor leader.
(07:33):
The the issue that
sounds like what you're running into is that you've got someone who is
not the best of leaders all either because he's actually a little bit above you. Right?
Todd (07:45):
We're kinda the same level, and Okay. You know, our organizations
where we're kind of a matrix organization, I guess they call it, where
he's in the program management office, and he has his own chain of command. Mhmm. I'm in an engineering office, and I have my chain of command. And we work together ultimately on the project we're working on. He's the kind of the head honcho, if you will. He makes the ultimate say. Okay. But from engineering,
(08:11):
I'm kinda the engineering leader. And so, yeah, I guess you could say he's
my boss in a way,
but, like, he doesn't hold any anything over me as far as, like, promotions
and raises and that sort of thing. Okay. Okay.
Bryan Goodwin (08:25):
So okay. So what is the what is it more specifically
about,
or give me an instance of where you've kind of ran into a little bit of a,
of a wall with him where you are
really kinda button heads.
Todd (08:41):
Yeah. Well, first of all, like, he's a great guy. I I admire him in a lot of ways. Like, he's
definitely different from me in that he doesn't like to
criticize people in the open. And,
so I I really appreciate several things I've learned from him. But one of the things that I think has been difficult for the team is that
he's often unwilling to, like, provide direction to the team. K. And the answer is always, like, okay. Well, something's going on. We're not sure we should be working on this.
(09:12):
It isn't really in line with what we plan to do,
but the customer may need it. And, in fact, some of these things are so far out of there that we really shouldn't be doing them. Okay. But, hey, go study it some more. Go
figure out how we're gonna do it. Go figure out a bunch of questions to ask the customer and then come back.
And I think, ultimately, some of those
(09:33):
things where it's like, hey. Go study it some more. The team ends up, like, spending a ton of effort and therefore money
and time
in
kind of some stuff that maybe is not in line with what we should have been working on. And then that puts the project that we're working on,
in jeopardy in a way as far as, like, hey. We're not holding to our cost. Okay. And we're not holding to our schedule. And so it's it's been frustrating for the team. In fact, that's one of the reasons why I got put on the team was to try and help correct that.
Bryan Goodwin (10:04):
Gotcha. Gotcha. So
so,
if, say, we were able to just
wave a wand and and all of a sudden, this was the perfect scenario,
Todd (10:18):
What were you wanting how are you wanting Adam to show up at this? I mean, I guess, in a perfect world, he would make decisions and say, yes. That's something we should be working on.
Go do
it. Or, hey. No. Like, I need to go back to our stakeholders, probably mostly our customer, and say, hey. You know, we only bid x amount of money to do this project, and we had this vision in place, and this is what we were gonna do for you. And now what you're asking us to do is, like, you know, a little bit out of left field from that, and we're happy to do it.
(10:53):
But we need to figure out how we're gonna, pay for that, whether it be not doing something we plan to do
or you giving us extra money or or something of that nature, right, versus just kinda like it almost feels like, at least to me and I think some of the other engineers on the team, it's just like, well, if we ignore it and we just kinda
do everything,
it'll all work out. Right. But in the end, it's kinda like, well, okay. Maybe it will, but what, you know, what are we sacrificing as far as, like, overruns or
(11:22):
bad performance? And then, you know, we look like we don't know what we're doing to our bosses. Okay. So
Bryan Goodwin (11:27):
sounds like some of the, some of the problem that you're running that you have is just
kind of the
the the view that,
what
the view of what you want,
you would like for,
Adam to almost portray for
(11:48):
for your your stockholders, your your clients,
and stuff like that. So to be able to
to say, hey. Let's
let's go for,
let's
let's know and stick to what our plan is as opposed
to being as as free willing as as we
(12:10):
as we are
so that we know
what now that we've set our budget, we can,
for this
this particular project, we can actually
take the
accomplish or accomplish the the the pain or the the, not pain, pain, the
(12:30):
the objective that we've actually set out for
and to alleviate whatever that, whatever that pain at the moment is.
So
with Adam
kind
of doing
going at how he's doing or coming at, at things in the way that he's coming, you're kinda saying he's,
(12:52):
what, a little bit wishy washy, I guess.
Not very committed? Yeah. Absolutely.
Todd (12:57):
I don't know. I think he's committed,
and the thing I always struggle with is, like, on projects like this, for sure, like, when you're designing something, you don't know exactly what you're gonna have to do. Right. There needs to be some flexibility.
But on a on a project where, like, you know, you're
you ultimately have a budget,
(13:18):
you need to accomplish whatever you can accomplish within that budget and schedule. Right? Because a lot of times,
like, with this particular client,
they're hoping to do something Right. You know, in August of twenty twenty six or something, let's say.
And,
we very much need to deliver and and meet those expectations. Right? It's kinda like what's most important
(13:39):
and, you know, managing your resources to accomplish the goal without,
like, wildly exceeding cost or budget or cost or schedule type of thing. Okay. So how do you handle
Bryan Goodwin (13:50):
anytime you come across when he's feeling being a little
a little soft, a little wishy washy, how do you how are you
how do you normally approach that that particular problem?
Todd (14:02):
Like I told you before, kind of what we ended up doing most recently is,
putting, like, this formal change control
process
in place, and that's been
helpful.
And then he and I decided that we were gonna meet every morning, basically, and just talk for fifteen minutes about what's going on.
I think that's helped.
(14:24):
My feeling has been, like,
at some level, that's kinda kicking the can down the road a little bit because,
you know, we we saw problems. We put together some of these things.
We presented,
we presented some of these things to our customer
that kinda got ignored a little bit.
And then a couple months later, we're still talking about it. And now
(14:47):
it's like, okay. Now we need to go present this to our leadership and have them just help decide, you know, does the company step in and
help pay for some of the work, or does
do we go back and push the customer even harder? And so I think I think we're ultimately on a good path. I guess it's just taken, like, way too long in my mind. Okay. And, yeah, I certainly probably coulda handled it better back then or something. Okay. So what would if you're saying you could have, what would have been what would have been a better way that you could've handled that?
(15:15):
Well, I mean, I guess
I guess it could have been more candid with him about what was going on. Although,
sometimes when I feel like I do that, it's I I get, you know, the right answer and an answer of, like, oh, yeah. We we submitted a list to the customer, and we're just waiting to hear back from them. Right.
And then,
you know, fast forward a couple months, and it's like, oh, well, you know, they're not really gonna fund the whole list
(15:38):
of things, so we need to get very specific about we want, what we want. And it just kinda felt like it was,
continuing to drag on. And and maybe I just need to realize, like, that's part of the process.
But at the same time, right, like, our our bosses are saying, hey. Are you guys on budget? Are you on schedule? Yeah. This is a problem project, and,
you know, we're meeting with leadership once a week or more to talk about where we're at. Okay. So when
Bryan Goodwin (16:04):
when you're
when you wish that,
or when you
when you run into,
a particular problem, say, like, you're you're doing these meetings every every week and stuff, and you're just kinda kicking the can down the road,
What would have been what would be a way that you could
resolve that issue?
(16:25):
Or do you think or that you believe that you could resolve the issue?
Todd (16:31):
Well, I mean, what I tried was
I I originally tried to, like, focus on some of the things where he and I disagreed. Right? And I put some things
in our message to leadership, like, no. You know, this is happening, and,
you know, the project manager is saying that we should do this thing,
which I totally disagree with. And then he felt attacked. Right? He's like, why are you throwing me under the bus in front of my
(16:54):
bosses and stuff, and we need to figure this out. And that's when we started
meeting weekly.
Looking back, I'm not sure. Like, I I think in a way that helped kinda bring the issue to light a little bit. Okay.
I I certainly don't like to feel like I'm not being fully open
with my boss and with, you know, those that I work with.
So that was a fine balance for me. Like, okay. You know? How do I handle it where we don't agree?
(17:19):
Right. And he's got a different perspective.
Yet I'm tasked with trying to to make things better and do things differently. It was kind of it's it's been a challenge. Okay. So when y'all have these meetings,
Bryan Goodwin (17:32):
were they just
meetings to talk about what the problem was, or did y'all talk and decide, okay. This is the topic that we're going to address and we're gonna find a solution to. We all actually trying to
find a solution, or was it just a means to just
kinda just talk about it and talk through it and maybe someone would have the moment,
(17:54):
and and all of a sudden, the light would come on where everything would be fixed and fine.
Todd (17:59):
Yeah. No. Thinking about that a little, I guess the meetings have often been to inform
our bosses, right, on where we're at and what the challenges are. And I think the ultimate goal is to
to find and fix problems and figure out where we're
needing additional help. Okay.
So in in that regard, it maybe is a little bit of troubleshooting
(18:22):
or or or working on it. Mhmm.
But that even that seemed difficult. Right? Like, because
sometimes the engineering group would be all on the same page and say, oh, no. We shouldn't be working on that. That's exactly
what we were you know, what we decided here when we had a review with our customer several months ago. Mhmm.
But then that wasn't really the direction we
(18:44):
I mean, that was that was the thought. But then further down the road, it was like, oh, well, maybe we need to find a way to go do this. And,
maybe we're open with our customer about, like, hey. Here's what we are doing. Here's what we're not doing. Because
part of my frustration has been, like, I think the customer thinks we're doing
things that we aren't really working on Right.
(19:05):
Because we haven't been fully open in communicating with them.
Bryan Goodwin (19:09):
So how do you fix that particular problem?
Todd (19:12):
I mean, I think I could
I don't know. I hate to step on someone's toes and, you know, I'm kinda new
to this particular,
client.
Right. But I think that I could,
you know,
engage a little bit more there and and bring that up.
Bryan Goodwin (19:29):
K. So, normally, when y'all are having meetings with the client and stuff, you're what? Just kinda setting off to the side, just grab notes, or or what are what are you normally doing?
Todd (19:40):
I mean, kind of a mixture of that. And then,
the the the few meetings that I've been in with the client, you know, we're able to put together
a list of things that are going on. And and there's one instance where I was able to say, like, hey. You know, we're not exactly sure what we need to do here,
and we aren't working on it. And and that was helpful because
(20:01):
client said, hey. We've got to figure this out. And
the next time we meet person, you know, face to face, let's
let's come up with a solution.
And so I and, you know, I think that that probably is the best way to go about it is
find a way to where I can work in those concerns,
without, like,
Bryan Goodwin (20:20):
stepping on the project manager's toes, basically. So when y'all had that meeting and you had that that little moment with the with the client where they were like,
yeah. We definitely wanna work through this and find a solution.
What was Adam's response to that? Was that a favorable response? Or
Todd (20:38):
Yeah. I think it was. I mean, it maybe I was in a bad,
mindset at the time that it was kinda like, well, you guys need to go get your questions together,
and, let's get ready for this meeting. Like, okay. We've, you know, we put together a question. We've asked them.
I guess in my perfect world, I was hoping for more of, like, okay.
(20:58):
As a company, we've done enough, and we've presented this to the customer, and they've not been very responsive. And so let's go
follow-up with them. And it was more of, like, no. We need to put together our questions, and we need to go,
come up with an approach because, you know, the customer is not gonna know exactly what to do.
Right. And I guess I've always kinda struggle with that. Right? Like, if we're working on something that's,
(21:20):
outside of what we planned,
but,
something that the customer wants, I think the customer
needs to have some
responsibility to help us kinda understand what they want without us,
having to go figure it all out for them. And maybe that's something where we need to decide, like, okay. We are gonna go figure it out for them, and let's figure out a way that we can,
(21:42):
go figure out all the details for them and present them a solution Right. Or proposed solution. K. So may it almost
Bryan Goodwin (21:49):
at least to me, it sounds like you're saying that
it would help if you just
and
it's probably not the best phrase because it's not it's not gonna
sound a whole lot
sound really favorable, but at the same time, to step up just a little bit more than what you have been
so so that you actually voice those particular concerns.
(22:13):
And
and that way
because it sound like Adam didn't have a didn't have too big of an issue when you
did voice some of the, some of the issues. So maybe if you were
if you were speaking up and and doing a little bit more
of your insight into it, maybe that's
Todd (22:37):
that helps Yeah. I think Adam's team. So. Yeah. Looking back, I mean, I think that was probably the best thing and that,
I probably should have been
in that mindset and doing that much earlier on
instead of kinda sitting back and
and taking the position where it's like, oh, I'm just gonna complain because I'm not getting what I want Right. Or things aren't going the way I think they should go. And I think that's kinda played out my relationship with my wife too. Right? Like,
(23:05):
early on, I was like, oh, I I'm not getting what I want as far as how you're treating the finances and how you're showing up for a relationship. And so I'm just gonna be,
Bryan Goodwin (23:13):
you know, angry, upset, howdy. You just kinda sit there and pout and wonder why no one's picking you up and and and playing with you.
Todd (23:22):
Right. Yeah. If I throw a fit and, like, get mad, then
then I'll get it all off my chest and things will be better.
Bryan Goodwin (23:28):
But in the end, it's, like, not really the solution. Yeah. It's like, I don't know why everything's all broken. I just threw a fit. I mean, come on. What's what's the deal here?
But I sure felt better after I threw a picture. Yeah. We all do. We feel yeah. Yeah. Let's feel 10 times better after throw throwing an ashtray or something.
But at the same time, then you have a broken ashtray.
(23:50):
So we
got a hole in the wall.
And that's, I mean, that's one of the big
problems that we run into is
those,
what a lot of people often call unintentional consequences.
Those
instances of where it's like, well, if I if I do this, yeah, I feel better, but what what are the, what are the ramifications?
(24:14):
What are the results that I am getting from
doing whatever it is that I that I did? So if I get angry and I get mad and I yell,
like, say, like, yelling at at your wife, say you had a problem at in marriage,
and you holler and yell,
then we turn around and go, well, why is my wife not
(24:36):
closer to me? Why do we not have that connection? Well, I mean, come on. You just got finished yelling and throwing a fit. I mean, come on. You're how much connection is there actually in a relationship?
And
with
in a in a in a work environment, that can be
a very different dynamic because,
(24:58):
one, you have people who
are
going to respond to
how you speak
in completely different ways. I mean, there's those four different types of of communication,
styles. You have your you have your aggressive, you have your passive, you have your passive aggressive,
and then you've got your assertive.
(25:19):
And the assertive communication style is
often
misread by
the other
communication styles
because they take you as if you're speaking in a very assertive tone,
they're gonna take you as being the jerk.
But yet, at the same time, they're that's because your communication style is actually a lot more effective.
(25:44):
People who are passive, they're just kinda
wishy washy,
mealy mouthed, just well, you know, we probably might wanna kinda start looking in this general vicinity of doing something, and you don't have any specifics.
And so
when, they get finished talking, you're like going, okay. Are we really doing what we just talked about? Are we not doing there's a lot of unknowns that are being being,
(26:11):
being conveyed because there's nothing
concrete.
And then you have your, your,
your aggressive
speaker
who likes to talk aggressively, and
they're the ones that come in and go, it's my way or the highway, and if you can't do it, then you're out of here and bah bah bah. You know? And that's not ever gonna build a good team either because,
one,
(26:32):
your
that type of communication style stifles any type of creativity, stifles that person's ability to show,
to put their their soul into whatever the project is.
And so, yeah, we have a lot.
You have one where the guys just there's almost too much freedom. There's one that there's not enough freedom. You have the combination of the passive aggressive, and they're just the the slimeball
(26:56):
of the, of the commune
communication group because they're they're being
aggressive
while trying to be nice at the same time. And so you can just feel how greasy and nasty that, that whole communication style is, and no one really
trusts anything that they say.
So you have you have the
(27:19):
the
the aggressive,
the the passive, and the passive aggressive, while the assertive
is just stating the facts.
The assertive is just,
we're going to have,
you know, this is what we need to get done. You need to find out you need to start doing that. We'll start figuring out how do we get to,
(27:39):
you know, the objective. How do we get your your part of the part of your job is to find the objective here. So
if you need some help, reach out. I'll help where I can, but at the same time, this is this is what your job,
job title
and job description entails.
Figure out figure it out. I'm you're a smart enough person. Figure it out, and and we'll we'll meet up next week and see where you're at.
(28:05):
And
it gives a lot of responsibility
to
the person that you're talking to. And, if a a passive person doesn't wanna have that responsibility, they're trying to mealy mouth their way
out of having to be responsible for it.
The
aggressive person
has no idea how to really handle
(28:27):
responsibility. They wanna have all the power. They wanna have all the the
the the say,
and so
that's why it's their way of the highway because,
again, they don't wanna give
or they they want they don't even actually want the responsibility
either,
And they wanna have it done their way, but if it fails, they're I can guarantee you, they're never they're not gonna go, well, yeah. It's my fault. I told them to do that.
(28:56):
They're gonna be pointing at that other person going, dude, you you screwed it all up. You you you know what it was supposed to be, and they're going to they're gonna point the the the finger at anybody else other than them.
Todd (29:09):
Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. And sometimes, Brian, I feel like I'm a passive aggressive communicator. Right? Like,
I I kinda have the tendency to to do that, I think. At the same time,
I try to be assertive. So I guess it's hard for me to find the balance there. Like, I wanna be kind
without,
you know, being a jerk. And Okay. So tend to lean towards being a jerk maybe too often. I don't know. Well, maybe you're it's not even the a matter of kind.
Bryan Goodwin (29:36):
Assertive communication
isn't so much,
are you being kind? Are you being a jerk?
Assertive is,
I trust you enough
to know that you can get the job done.
Mhmm. And as the leader, you would go
you get what you're needing done. Because what's a leader's responsibility
(29:58):
overall?
Todd (29:59):
Achieve the I mean, I guess where I'm at is achieve the the work that we're supposed to, you know, help the team
Bryan Goodwin (30:06):
achieve the goal the end goal. Right? Right. Doing the thing That design point. Yeah. But, one way I've looked at I've seen, and had, leadership described to me, and I like it a lot,
is a leader
is there to provide the resources
so the team can accomplish the goal. You're there to serve
(30:27):
the the the
team in any way that you can.
Yeah. It is a lot of times you have to do some direction. Alright. We're getting close to what we're needing to do. Let's you know, what's a different way we can we can pose this, you know, this solution?
And allowing the team to utilize
their their creativity, and, like I said, implement their soul into into the project
(30:54):
so they have something that they are proud of.
And at the end, instead of it being such a a slog, it becomes a a passion project for everybody.
When you're able to
effectively
lead, it doesn't mean that you're being
being the nice guy because the nice guy is is
a nice guy and an and and a jerk are two sides of the same asshole.
(31:18):
Alright? So it's just Yeah. Just both you know, we're just working on different extremes.
They both are trying to manipulate the person to get so that they feel better.
While a a leader who can speak,
with assertion,
you know, we're not going to we're not gonna paddle,
and and patty cake around whatever the problem is. If the problem if there's a problem there that needs to be addressed,
(31:44):
we address the problem. We get it done. We get it said. We get it and and we get, find a resolution,
and then we don't bring it up anymore. It's okay. You've got we've got it handled. If you've got it handled, we're good. Don't have to worry about bringing this up anymore. It's in the past.
But if all of a sudden I come to you and I told you, hey. We need to get,
(32:06):
step 423
done by by Thursday, and we get there and you're still,
you know, three steps behind,
then it's time to come in and go,
so where where am I failing? Where do we what am I failing to provide for you so that you can get this done? What are you needing
out of
(32:26):
out of me to be able to get this? And you can hear a lot of most of the time, people will be
inspired to go ahead and step up and go, well,
it's just I I and they will have some excuses. Like, okay. Well, we don't need an excuse. We need this done.
And, yeah, you're speaking directly to them. You're not going well. Okay. Here. Let me go ahead and I'll start doing this for you. Because, again, you're when you're you're caretaking, you're taking care from somebody.
(32:56):
So
Todd (32:57):
Yeah. I I like that idea because,
then you're, like, putting the
the responsibility on the person and then asking them, like, what what do you need from me to help you do it? And I think
that would probably be something that I can greatly improve upon. Right? Like, instead of
trying to step in and maybe do everything or,
Bryan Goodwin (33:18):
micromanage at some level. Yeah. No. Micromanage no one likes a micromanager.
Todd (33:25):
Well and then that also makes makes them not perform as well. Like, you're saying, like, if Right. If there's a person who's
got a task and they realize it's theirs and they need to get it done,
then they'll find a way to do it, and they'll have more pride in in ownership, if you will, of the of their work and that sort of thing. Right. And, yeah, it's when you because if you're able to go off
Bryan Goodwin (33:48):
and give a vision of what the end product is supposed to look like, or even if you have a good drawing
or visualization
of what the end product
looks like,
it doesn't matter how they get to it as long as they get to that finished product.
It's kinda like,
cleaning the cleaning the house. I may personally
I I think you ought to start from, the high
(34:11):
horizontal surfaces and get all those clean
and work your way down to the floor and then sweep the floor up
while other people think, oh, no. No. You can start at the floor and work your way up.
As long as you have a clean room at the end,
does it really matter?
I mean, the one person who goes from the bottom up may have to go over the floor two or three times,
(34:32):
But if it's not hindering anything
Yeah.
Then then what's what's the problem?
And, yeah, a lot of guys,
a lot of lot of people
who are ineffectual,
ineffective leaders,
they do. They like to micromanage because they want it done
their way.
Now you have to use
(34:54):
this particular bolt
into this particular,
in this particular,
slot. And it's like, well, okay. But it's, why does it have to be this particular bolt and not this other bolt?
And a lot of times, they can't because and they can't answer that or they will come up with the response of because I said so.
(35:15):
And if we ever hear a because I said so, that is a ineffectual leader
right off the bat because it's like, I don't have the answer. I just want it done this way.
Yeah. And so you can go, okay. Okay. I I now know who I'm dealing with if you give up because I said so, or that's the way it's always been done is a is a death knell to any organization. Well, that's how we've always done it. Well,
(35:39):
maybe there's better ways of doing it, and we can look at it, in a in a different,
in a different light and be able to do something even better.
And so and that's where, you know, again, being able to inspire
your
the the people working underneath you and
taking the,
the the leadership notes that your that your leadership
(36:04):
gives you and then being able to incorporate those into your particular department. That's where
things become
become exciting because you're able to rally literally rally the troops to a,
to do better and to to finish whatever the the project is.
And, heck, a lot of times, if you're if you do it, do it right, they will actually even
(36:29):
they'll they'll follow you they'll follow you into hell and back
and and be happy that they did so.
And all
because, one, you are,
one, not able not willing or you are willing to get yourself just as dirty as they are.
Two, you take your the responsibility
of the team,
but, also, you're allowing them all the creativity
(36:51):
creative licenses they they need
to be able to reach or whatever that objective is. And that's when again,
and that all falls into
the all that freedom and and free,
free expression comes in
because you're speaking assertively.
You don't have to be the bully. You don't have to yell. I mean, whatever a person does, that's, you know, even if somebody gets mad at you,
(37:18):
what do you make that mean?
Even if your boss is mad at you, you know, you can make that mean a hundred thousand different things. What do you wanna make your boss being angry mean? Did you screw up?
Okay. Maybe you did. But what is what are you making him yelling at you
mean?
Not mean just mean that, okay. I need to I I've dropped the ball. I let too many things fall through the cracks. I've got a, you know, I've got a knuckle under and get my stuff taken care of better.
(37:46):
Or it could be,
it means I'm gonna lose my job. I better panic. I'm gonna I I'll just let myself fall apart and, you know, which one's gonna be the better results.
And you have to start that's where you wanna have the intentional thoughts of of what
what the end result is.
When you're living
(38:06):
a intentionally,
alright,
you then
know you can start planning, hey, this is how
I wanna show up for, you know, for the meetings with Adam.
Alright. This is how I wanna show up for for the meetings. I wanna be a cool, calm, collected. We're going to find a solution to
whatever the topic of the day is.
Todd (38:28):
Yeah. That's the hardest part sometimes for me though is just like when in that moment something happens and then you just go back to, like, your default mode of thinking. It's like, sure. I wanna show up as this person who,
is assertive
but not a jerk.
And but then it's like, okay. Something happens, and it's just like, oh, you know, I all this stuff feels like How do you how do you keep that from happening?
(38:52):
I mean, both, you know, at work and then in my personal relationship at home, I I've struggled with that as you know.
I think some of the things are just,
stopping and taking a breath. Right? Like Mhmm.
Maybe giving time for the situation to relax. And then,
I haven't done as well at as maybe I could have, but,
(39:13):
doing the
the model, right, of just like, okay. What is what is the circumstance here?
What am I thinking about it? And is that thought really serving me?
You know, the few times I've done that, it's been helpful
because I do. I have, like, this tendency to just like, oh, world's, you know, the world's ending or whatever.
Bryan Goodwin (39:32):
We all we all our brain instantly is going boom. Oh my gosh. We're coming to an end. We're fixing to die. And that's just how we're our brain has evolved
through the the centuries and the and the millennia
is because,
you know, it's was designed to look for the worst
worst possible case. Because if you're out there on Serengeti
(39:54):
and you see an antelope and you're like, hey.
I've got there's an antelope there. We can eat real good for a couple three days now. If I get that, antelope and you start running heading that direction off to your side, you all of a sudden, you see a clump of of grass move.
Was that the wind or was that a lion?
What do you do? You know? If it's a lion and you go and get that antelope, well, the lion's probably gonna get you, and now he's gonna eat twice as good. So, you know, you we we are designed
(40:23):
to to fall into the bad spot, but to, to the bad
worst case scenario types of thinking.
The but the great thing about us is that we have this front part of our brain
that when we can
activate it,
we can actually slow ourselves down. We can take that breath and go,
(40:44):
okay.
I didn't handle that the right way.
How do I handle that next time?
And we have to train ourselves. It's,
the saying of we never rise to our intentions. We always fall to our training.
Yeah. And so we want to yeah. We can intend
to
be
awesome all the time. We can be this great,
(41:07):
all caring person, but this gonna take it takes time. It takes a
a moment of
catching the fact that you're in that, in that routine again because it's just a habit. Our brain loves to be seek pleasure, avoid pain, do it as efficiently as possible. And when we run into our into our tailspin mode again, that's us being efficient. It's it's easy. It it just
(41:30):
I guess, the hippocampus is the habit center of the brain, I think, something like that.
And so it's easy for the brain to go, oh, hey. We've seen this before. Throw throw it over to, to the habit center. Habit center knows what to do. The habits just well, okay. Yep. Now throw this in here. Let's throw a fit, throw
a grumble, gripe, blame somebody else, and okay. There we go. The end of routine. And it was easy.
(41:52):
But to stop and go, well, no. No. We're not playing that game no more. We're going to rewrite
our how we respond.
I want to look at how I how I respond to something, doing an after action review. What did I do right? What did I do wrong? What can I improve on?
And
every time you get finished doing an action, start or doing something,
(42:14):
you know, writing that down, looking at it and going, okay. Now I know I can I can actually do this a lot better if I
next time I catch this coming up,
what happens if I take a take a take a breath? Just stop
10 deep breaths,
and then proceed.
Come up with a plan. And that and and literally ask myself,
(42:37):
how do I want to show up? How do I want to be
thought of
in this circumstance?
And
whatever the answer to that is, then you can proceed from there. And you'll probably show up, and I no guarantees because,
again, we're human. We're gonna try something. We're gonna fail, and then we're gonna go, oh my god. It didn't work. And I
(42:58):
and go stop laughing and
say this is stupid.
But then we come back, we try it again. And eventually,
it's it's scientific method.
It's basically what it is. What happens if I if I approach the situation this way? Oh, that didn't work. Alright.
Well, let's try approaching it this way. Oh, that didn't work either. Eventually, you're gonna go, well, let's try it this way. Hey. Look at that. We got a really good response from Adam. Oh, hey. Look at that. The wife is
(43:27):
is doing great. Hey. The kids responded really well to the way I showed up this way. Let's try
responded really well to the way I showed up this way. Let's try it that way from now on.
And, yeah, you're still gonna fall back in the old old habit. I mean, you're still going to
to you and the wife have a have an argument. You're still going to fall into the old thoughts of, oh, great. She's fixing to leave me.
(43:47):
The boss is gonna yell at you, and you're still gonna go, oh, great. I'm fixing to get fired.
Or, you know, you
you hack the kid off, and the kid just hauling and screaming. She's you're like, oh, great. She's fixing
dramatics
a a teenage kid wants to do.
Lock herself up in a room and and and play play annoying music for the for the rest of the day. Whatever, you know, whatever the kids want
(44:15):
are doing.
We all have our
our fallbacks on, and those fallbacks are gonna happen, but
the more you're
work on being mindful
and you pay attention, okay. This is what
I need to do. This is what I need to work on. This is, okay, the after action review, after action review, after action review, you're going to eventually start
(44:40):
seeing,
again, those incremental changes, the ones that you've been making
for the past year. Where now,
yeah, the sometimes the wife likes to go and and indulge herself.
She likes to spend money and and and stuff. And,
you know, we I used to joke around that she'd buy organic flossers,
(45:00):
but, you know, it was just
it
it was one of those things where
what did you make that spending mean? And when you started to relax into it and soften yourself around what the circumstance was
and that that circumstance wasn't a dig against you, it wasn't that she hated the the fact that you wanted to save money.
(45:23):
You actually found out that, no, no, she actually wants to save money too.
But
what we're but we're going off in making
the
sell,
or the purchasing
of of products
mean two different things. She's got her meaning.
She it is a means of her feeling a little bit better for a little bit a little bit.
(45:45):
Mhmm.
And when
you go off and and get all excited and become, as you say, ornery
about the about the circumstance,
that's not that almost robs her of her feel good,
and so she's gotta go replace that feel good now with buying more stuff.
And so we would make it this
(46:05):
little feedback loop of spend money. Oh, you're spending money. Oh, spend money. No. Don't spend money. Spend money. Oh my god. You're gonna get put us into bankruptcy.
And so it was but with moment you as you noticed, moment you stopped
and just
allowed,
and it sounds
so weird to even now to say
(46:27):
and allow her to just spend the money.
Yeah. She realizes, oh, okay. I'm not having to be
nervous about this, and let's he's allowing me to show up to the,
to the circumstance
in my own way.
And all of a sudden, the the feedback loop got interrupted.
(46:49):
And now she's like, okay. We we we do need to save some money.
And it's not that you're allowing her to spend your
your hard earned cash into oblivion,
but you're allowing her to
examine herself.
So when we find when we end up just hitting allowing our thoughts to just,
(47:09):
you know, just run amok,
that's when we we start having the,
the issues running running into into place because we
it's how do I get this taken care of? How do we get,
you know, how am I supposed to save money if she's gonna spend it all? Well,
you're not she's not gonna spend all the money.
(47:30):
You're not gonna save as fast as you would like. Yeah. That can be a that could be a
a a frustrating
part of life just because you would like to be able to save.
You know? If you're like me, I'd like to be able to save take 90% of my the money I bring in and just stick it in a bank and invest it and let it grow.
But for some reason, there's people out there that want money money for me because I use their services. And, you know,
(47:56):
I don't know why the house folks still want their money. I mean, I've been paying it for twenty years now. So, I mean, come on. You know? I figured twenty years out of thirty, we're we're mostly there, so that should be good.
Yeah.
But so
we can
we can accept the fact that, yeah,
our wife is likes to likes to
(48:19):
spend money
when she is either a stressed
or she likes to show it as means of of I love you. I'm going to buy this,
and, I want the best for my family.
And we can either wig out about it and go, oh my gosh. They're just you know, they're
it it's a shirt. You don't have to spend a hundred $50 on a t shirt. Yeah. But have you tried wearing that hundred $50 t shirt and gone, oh,
(48:45):
that feels really nice? Okay. There might be a reason why there's a hundred and $50 worth of T shirt on this. Don't know why there would be a hundred $50 T shirt. I do know there are $50 T shirts, and those are two for me, at least, that's still too much. I I I throw a fit to spending $20 on a T shirt. So
Todd (49:00):
Yeah.
But Yeah. For sure. No. I I totally agree with everything you just said.
Bryan Goodwin (49:06):
So
but but, yeah, it's
it you've done
Todd (49:11):
on on
Bryan Goodwin (49:13):
all these different
circumstances. I mean, we didn't even get around to talking about, about your daughter
and
all the,
all the ways that you've been able to step in and and help her. She,
you've been able to do
so many things just because you have allowed yourself to
(49:33):
to examine what your thoughts are
because
that's our thoughts create our our feelings, our feelings create our actions, our actions create results. That's the whole model.
And a lot of times, we do very unintentional
models.
We and we have a thought
that we're not even aware that we're having,
(49:54):
and and the rest of the,
the the events happen, and then we're like going, well, okay. So what, why did this not go right? Why why is
my marriage falling apart? Well, you're are you intentionally trying to have a better marriage,
or are you just sitting there
idly floating through life
(50:16):
with no rudder?
Because if you're not you know, if you're gonna go through life rudderless, then, yeah, you're gonna wind up in places you don't wanna be. You may not even get out of the harbor.
Todd (50:26):
Absolutely. That's gold because, like, when I show up in my relationship, like, with my wife,
then she feels seen and heard and, you know, appreciated, and then she shows up too. So I I totally agree. Like, I was thinking
last year, I did all these like, I made it her birthday week. Right? Corny. But,
like, just every day, I stopped and got her something.
(50:47):
And I was just amazed at, like, how much she really enjoyed just silly little things. Like, I I got her some
crown at the local five dollar store type of thing, and she loved it. And it was like, it was fun for me because I got to, you know, figure out what I can surprise her with, and she really enjoyed it too. And it, like, helped our connection.
And I think in the past, I wasn't intentional.
And, like, I totally agree with what you're saying. Being intentional and just it doesn't take much, but just being intentional about what you're doing and why, and,
(51:15):
it goes a long ways
Bryan Goodwin (51:17):
both for you and for the other person. So Right. And I think we can just leave it right there because, bam, that was a good one. And that was a real good summary, and I liked how I liked how you were able to phrase that. And, yeah, that absolutely, man.
So
so, anyhow, Todd, again, appreciate everything that you have,
(51:38):
the the
the paths that you have and and distances that you have made are are
astounding, and I'm glad that you,
have decided to to put your, your marriage and your your your leadership abilities
onto the next level to bring to raise those up. And
(51:58):
and we've been, working here for, for a year, so and it's been
it's been a great one. So,
again, thanks for, thanks for coming on, and and we'll,
we'll talk to you, talk to you down the road.
Todd (52:11):
Yeah. Thank you, Brian. I really appreciate you. Uh-huh. Well, we'll talk to y'all later.
Bryan Goodwin (52:16):
See you.
So if you'd like to try coaching, there's just
three steps that you have to do, and this is it.
Go to relaxedmail.com/trycoaching,
Schedule a time that's convenient for you. And then the final step,
show up.
From there, we will have a
(52:38):
powerful
session that can help you change your relationship
with your wife and those around you. Again, if you're interested, relax mail
Com forward / try coaching.
Have a good day.
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