September 9, 2025 • 18 mins
Paid leave has transformed from a nice-to-have into a powerful retention and engagement tool for employers seeking to attract and keep top talent. Seth Turner of AbsintheSoft shares insights on how properly structured leave programs can create positive employee experiences that drive loyalty and productivity.
• 86% of employees look for paid leave when job hunting, and 42% won't apply without it
• Well-designed leave programs should address diverse workforce needs across life stages
• Employees who feel supported during leave are more likely to return engaged and become brand ambassadors
• The regulatory landscape is growing increasingly complex with 13 states now mandating paid family leave
• Technology helps streamline administration, maintain compliance, and improve employee experience
• Utilization rates vary by industry, ranging from 10-40% of employees taking leave annually
• Effective programs consider both compliance requirements and strategic business objectives
• Modern systems use AI and mobile communications to simplify processes for all stakeholders
To learn more about managing paid leave effectively, visit absensesoft.com or contact Seth directly at seth@absencesoft.com
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BenePower is an AI-powered platform helping advisors build high-impact, self-insured health plans quickly and seamlessly. By integrating best-in-class point solutions and eliminating inefficiencies, BenePower reduces costs, improves member outcomes, and positions advisors as industry leaders.
🔗 Learn more at BenePower.com
This episode is sponsored by Benepower, the platform of choice for a modern benefits experience. Benepower is an AI-powered benefits platform offering access to top products and services, enabling consultants and employers to create customized plans, optimize usage, and measure effectiveness. www.benepower.com
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Is paid leave, just another line item expense, or
can it become a powerfulretention and engagement tool?
We'll find out on this episodeof Shift Shapers.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
This is the Shift Shapers podcast, connecting
benefits advisors with thoughtleaders and entrepreneurs who
are shaping the shifts in theindustry.
And now here's your host, davidSaltzman.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
And to help us answer that question, we've invited
Seth Turner, founder and senioradvisor at AbsintheSoft.
Welcome, Seth.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Thanks, david, excited to spend some time with
you today.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
It's our pleasure, and this is, I think, a part of
the industry that a lot ofadvisors don't necessarily know
a lot about, and it's becomemore and more prevalent, so it's
a great time to be talkingabout it.
Let's just jump right in.
Paid leave is something that Ithink people used to think was
kind of a nice to have.
Has it really become a need tohave?
Speaker 3 (00:55):
It really has, david, I think you know.
For years in the United Statesit's been short-term disability
plans that are, you know,company-sponsored or
employee-paid, and so what we'veseen is a big shift that a lot
of states are passing someversion of paid leave that are
causing employers to rethink howthey structure their benefits.
There's also been a bigcomponent of really using leave
(01:17):
to attract and retain employees,particularly in certain
demographics of your workforce,such as younger parents and
those that are in a sandwichgeneration, that are caregiving
for both children as well as, asin many cases, their own
parents.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
You know, part of what we're hearing is that
there's a whole group of peoplewho won't even apply to a
company if it isn't part of thebenefits package.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
That's very true.
We did a survey at AbsintheSoft that really talked to about
800 different employees andreally looked at what they see
as their benefits.
86% of them responded they arelooking for some level of paid
leave when they're looking atjob descriptions and 42% of them
wouldn't apply without it.
So there's, you know, as welook at how to bring people in,
(02:01):
we're also eliminating them ifwe don't offer some sort of paid
benefit.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
So, as advisors counsel their clients or their
prospect, it's something thatthey really need to be aware of.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
So what is it?
I mean, beyond the actual timeoff itself?
What are those folks who won'tapply without it, or the 86% of
folks who actually, you know,want it in the first place?
What are they looking for?
Speaker 3 (02:26):
You know I think they're looking for, you know, a
fair wage or really a benefitthat that allows them to, that
meets them where they are.
So we have a lot of job seekersthat are in certain stages of
life and, whether that is, youknow, they're planning to start
a family in the coming years,and so they're evaluating ways
that they can do that in a waythat doesn't hurt them
(02:49):
financially as they're goingthrough.
We also have a large portion ofthe population now that's in
what we call the sandwichgeneration, that has aging
parents as well as youngchildren, and so having time and
flexibility, both from a jobprotectedprotected stage, which
is what we've had for a longtime, but also then a way to
protect their income so thatthey're able to do that and
(03:11):
still retain their pay benefits.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
I mean, you mentioned aging parents and managing
their own health.
Is there also a new, maybehyped-up, interest in this
because of mental health?
Speaker 3 (03:23):
There is, I think, mental health's driven a
significant portion of leaverequests and also accommodation
requests over the last few years, and so it is a holistic look
at how do we support thatemployee through the conditions
that they're struggling with ina way that both protects their
job but also then protects theirincome from negative impacts.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
We talked in the open a little bit about how this is
really a retention andengagement tool in addition to
all of the other reasons to havethis.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthat?
Speaker 3 (03:57):
Yeah, I think we all know that our employees are
going to go through differentlife changes as they're working
for us.
For example, at Absinthe Soft,we have an 18-week parental
leave, whether you're adoptingor having your own baby, and so
being able to provide thatbenefit to give people time to
bond, to spend that time withtheir newborn or with their
(04:20):
newly adopted baby, then allowsthem to return and so I think
you know, in a way, that they'reprepared to come back.
It doesn't rush them throughthe process and it allows them
to stay financially whole.
We've had great success of allof the employees that have taken
that benefit return and they'remore engaged and more committed
to what they're doing atAbsinthe Often.
That data also plays out in thesurvey that we did with
(04:43):
employees at other organizationsthat those that had a good
leave experience, those thatfelt supported by their employer
, were more likely to return andalso more likely to promote
that employer externally.
So when we talk about HR reallybeing focused on that
attracting and retaining as astrategic objective, how you
structure your leave benefitsand particularly the pay
(05:03):
component of that, can be a bigpiece of the success of them.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
Can a bad experience actually push people out the
door?
Speaker 3 (05:11):
Oh, absolutely.
I mean not surprisingly, thosethat had a bad experience, that
didn't feel supported by theiremployer, were much more likely
to look for another job, andalso they were much less likely
to really get our employees totalk positively and to get their
friends and associates involvedin the recruiting process.
(05:40):
We see just much better resultsthat way.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
I know one of the questions that I'm sure most
employers ask when an advisorstarts talking about a paid
leave program is okay, we'regoing to capture this pool of
hours that have a dollar valueto our company.
What percentage of folksactually take leave in any given
population during the course ofa year?
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Yeah, that's a great question, David, because it
really varies by industry.
So you have some industries thathave a very high utilization
rate just due to the nature ofthe job and you have others that
have a much lower request rate.
I think we've started to seethat, normalized, anywhere
between 10% and 40% of employeeswill take a leave on a given
year.
So it really is organization byorganization and, honestly,
(06:26):
when we talk about paid leave,it can be so broad in the
reasons that people take it thatwe really encourage
conversations with the employersabout their specific employee
population and what types ofleave benefits will help them
attract and retain thoseemployees.
It doesn't, you know, if I havean aging workforce, it doesn't
do me a ton of good to roll outa new parental benefit because
(06:49):
those employees won't see thatbenefit.
And the same case is, if I'mrolling out a parental benefit,
I don't want to forget aboutthose employees that are past
that time period in their life.
So it's really about how do weestablish an equity and a parity
in the benefits that we offerso that we can attract and
retain the employees that wehave based on our own
demographics?
Speaker 1 (07:09):
You mentioned that some industries have higher
utilization than others.
Could you give us a couple ofexamples?
Speaker 3 (07:14):
I think you know we see high utilization in health
care and we see high utilizationin others.
Could you give us a couple ofexamples?
I think you know we see highutilization in healthcare and we
see high utilization inhospitality.
You know those tend to be someof the higher retail has.
You know higher utilization aswell.
You know, I think anywhere whereyou know anywhere where there
is a real need for that employeeto be at the office, there's
much more likelihood to requestto leave versus more of the
(07:36):
white collar jobs where peoplecan kind of work around
sometimes in there and becreative in scheduling.
It doesn't make it lessimportant to offer the benefit
or to track the time, but itjust seems to drive down those
formal requests a little bit.
But I do think you knowcertainly where we've got
situations such as in a hospitalwhere you've got to have a
certain number of nurses, from alegal standpoint, to cover a
(07:57):
certain number of beds.
There's a huge need to be ableto actually capture who's on
leave and where and make sureyou're managing those
effectively.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
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(09:10):
And now back to ourconversation, and we're back
chatting with Seth Turner,founder and senior advisor at
Absinthe Soft Seth.
Are there regulatory andcompliance issues around these
paid leave programs?
Speaker 3 (09:23):
There certainly are.
I think the legislativelandscape continues to get more
and more complex and for manyyears it was the FMLA and then
very similar state laws toprotect the time off, to protect
jobs very similar state laws toprotect the time off, to
protect jobs.
What we've seen in the lastprobably five years is a
proliferation of these statelaws with paid leave.
(09:43):
So, you know, we had Californiastate disability insurance
early on, but we've seen NewYork and Washington and Oregon
and some others roll these out.
So I think we now have 13states that have their own
version of a paid family leavethat are requiring employers to
comply with that.
And it's, you know, it's morethan a payroll issue in that it
many of these laws bridgebetween job protection as well
(10:04):
as the pay protection, and soit's really caused employers to
have to rethink you know howthey manage that, how they track
it and to both integratesystems but also be much more
aware of the compliance piece ofit.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Is that something that you just build into the
system as the states come online?
Speaker 3 (10:25):
Yeah, that's.
I mean, compliance is acornerstone of what AbsintheSoft
does.
It's monitoring all the federallaws, all the state laws,
whether that's a paid leave,whether that's a family type of
leave, whether it's military,any of those types, sabbaticals.
You know we see a huge, youknow a huge variety within all
of our clients as to what theyoffer from a company standpoint
and then how they blend that inwith the ones, the laws and the
(10:46):
regulations that they're legallyrequired to comply with.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
Are you expecting more states to come online with
these kinds of mandates?
Speaker 3 (10:54):
I really am.
I think it's something thatwe're seeing.
We're seeing many that aresitting out there ready to be
passed or being proposed.
We're not seeing a lot ofaction at the federal level to
put a more broad umbrella acrossit.
And ultimately, what we've seenwith FMLA is, you know, it is a
federal law but yet states arestill passing it.
So I think you know, for thoseof us in the industry, we're
(11:16):
just expecting that there willbe more complexity continued to
be introduced over the next fewyears and that you know that's
going to just continue to causeemployers to be challenged by
that.
And then we're also seeing thatemployers are looking at it and
saying, okay, just because myemployees aren't in the state,
don't I want to be more holisticin how I support everybody that
works for me outside of justwhat I'm legally required to do.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
How does this impact HR departments?
I know a lot of advisors.
Sometimes the sale is made intwo different parts of the
business.
It's made to the C-suite andthen it's made to the HR folks
or the HR folks who are involved, and I know, you know they
always will tell you and to alarge extent at least, in my
experience, it's true thatthey're understaffed and
overworked.
How does this kind of a thinghelp them?
Speaker 3 (12:03):
Yeah, so you know, from an APSA soft standpoint,
we're helping them maintaincompliance, we're helping them
with the administration, sowe're streamlining the
day-to-day work, so ultimatelywe're enabling them to do more
with less.
But what I like to say is, youknow, in many cases teams are so
overworked, we're allowing themto do the same amount of work,
but just in compliance andefficiently, and ultimately what
(12:24):
that benefits, then, is itenables our HR teams to be able
to have those conversations withemployees, to support them, to
understand what that employee isgoing through, and that not
only improves the employeeexperience and the satisfaction
the employee has with theirleave experience, but it also
allows employers to be moreeffective in how they get people
back to work and really helpingthere.
(12:46):
And I think at the end of theday that drives to bottom line
of attracting retaining but alsoproductivity.
And so we're helping both theHR team be more effective and
efficient in how they're doingthings.
We're also helping the C-suiteachieve those business
objectives they're trying to do.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
Are you also helping them to create these policies?
Is that something, a servicethat you guys offer?
Speaker 3 (13:06):
I think that's what we see a lot of advisors doing
are the policies.
We can help them benchmark whatothers are doing.
But I think you know what I seeis a lot of organizations.
It's you know the how they wantthose policies to interact with
their business strategy.
I mean, it's it's really a youknow, organization by
organization, so we can tellthem a lot of what their peers
are doing.
But ultimately it goes intowhat your people strategy is and
(13:30):
what your employee demographicslook like as to how you want to
structure those policies.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
How big a part do you feel this plays in building and
maintaining employee cultures?
Speaker 3 (13:40):
I think it's a huge part of the culture, especially
as we look at.
We have five generations in theworkforce right now, and
certainly Gen Z and Gen Alphaand some of the others are much
more in tune with how their youknow their personal relationship
with their organization.
So it's no longer we kind ofwent through lifetime employment
and then we went through thejob changers and now we're into
(14:02):
the groups that really doidentify with their employer.
You know the company mission,and feeling that the
organization supports theiremployees and is, you know,
invested in them as people is asimportant as the job itself,
and so, to me, structuring thesebenefits and helping the
employees use them and supportthem is really important in the
kind of culture you create andthe success you're going to have
(14:24):
in retaining your employees.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
Other than perhaps keeping track of all the
different states and theirmandates and sorting those out
for employers.
I suspect that technology playsa big role in what you guys do.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
Well it's, I mean, it is what we do.
It's providing that technologyto be able to provide you know
whether it's, you know chatbotsto be able to do intake of
requests, whether it's providingresources to be able to allow
employees to understand whattheir benefits are, but also
then, just you know, I call itadministrivia, but the leave
laws are very paper intensive,they're very process intensive,
(14:59):
and so making sure that they canquickly get the right
information to employees, thatthey can process through the
workflows that need to happen,that they can make decisions in
a timely manner you know, withFMLA there's the two, five,
15-day kind of timelines thatare all from a compliance
standpoint, mandated, and so byautomating those through the
technology, or at leastprompting users to be able to do
(15:21):
those on time, it enhances thecompliance, but it also then
enhances that ability for HR tospend the time doing the things
that add value, which are theinteractions with employees and
the more strategic or the morecomplicated decision-making
around what looks like a leaveor how to accommodate an
employee's request, and so thosetypes of things are really
(15:43):
important from not onlycompliance but also from an
employee experience andsatisfaction standpoint.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
Well, I was going to follow up on that employee
satisfaction.
From an employee self-servicestandpoint, what are the things
that employees are looking for?
What do they want in a system?
Speaker 3 (16:00):
You know, I think they want what they get from
every other system out there,and HR systems have
traditionally been slow torespond to that, which is they
want usability, they want theinformation they need when they
need it, and they don't, youknow they don't want.
They want it to clarify thingsinstead of confusing things, and
so those three things, I wouldsay, are the big ones.
It's also just having abilityto access it when they need to
(16:22):
access it, versus having to doit when they're in the office or
where they are.
And so we're, you know, we'reseeing even uses of technology,
not just from a self-service ofrequests and viewing status and
uploading documents, but alsojust in communications, of using
text and some other.
You know I don't want to callthem new technologies, but in
many ways the leave space isstuck in faxes, and so text is a
(16:43):
new medium of communication fora lot of people, but it's one
that's been incredibly effectivefor getting to employees when
you need information, as well asthat employee's manager,
because I think we often losesight of them in the leave
process that they're looking forwhen that employee's coming
back or how to plan and how todeliver on their business
results, and so by communicatingclearly with them, using the
(17:04):
technology, you can also drivejust more satisfaction there.
Speaker 1 (17:08):
Has AI impacted?
Speaker 3 (17:08):
you guys, the technology, you can also drive
just more satisfaction there.
Has AI impacted you guys?
It has.
I think it helps with justmaking sure we're communicating
clearly.
It helps with some of the basicQ&A intake, some of those
pieces.
It helps a little bit withanalytics.
I think we're still in someways, you know, we're very much
looking at how we best utilizeit.
I think the DOL and, you know,department of Labor and the EEOC
(17:30):
have been kind of clear on howyou can and can't use AI.
So there's still a lot of roomfor people in the leave process.
But there are certain pieces ofautomation, certain pieces of
communication that we can use AIto make more efficient and
effective in how we get to allthe people that need to consume
the information.
(17:52):
Seth if anybody in the audiencewants to reach out and learn
more.
What's the best way to reachyou?
You can just reach us atabsensoftcom there's a way to
get us there.
Or you can contact me, seth, atabsensoftcom.
But we'd love to talk moreabout how we're helping
employers stay compliant withthe leave laws and manage their
leaves more effectively.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
And that's a great place to end our conversation
for today.
Seth Turner, founder and senioradvisor at Absinthe Soft Seth,
thanks for a really interestingdiscussion.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
Thank you, david, it's been fun.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
The Shift Shapers podcast is a production of Shift
Shapers LLC.
The content and images of thispodcast may not be used without
our express written permission.
Copyright 2023.
All rights reserved.
Is paid leave, just another line item expense, or
can it become a powerfulretention and engagement tool?
We'll find out on this episodeof Shift Shapers.
Speaker 2 (00:11):
This is the Shift Shapers podcast, connecting
benefits advisors with thoughtleaders and entrepreneurs who
are shaping the shifts in theindustry.
And now here's your host, davidSaltzman.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
And to help us answer that question, we've invited
Seth Turner, founder and senioradvisor at AbsintheSoft.
Welcome, Seth.
Speaker 3 (00:32):
Thanks, david, excited to spend some time with
you today.
Speaker 1 (00:35):
It's our pleasure, and this is, I think, a part of
the industry that a lot ofadvisors don't necessarily know
a lot about, and it's becomemore and more prevalent, so it's
a great time to be talkingabout it.
Let's just jump right in.
Paid leave is something that Ithink people used to think was
kind of a nice to have.
Has it really become a need tohave?
Speaker 3 (00:55):
It really has, david, I think you know.
For years in the United Statesit's been short-term disability
plans that are, you know,company-sponsored or
employee-paid, and so what we'veseen is a big shift that a lot
of states are passing someversion of paid leave that are
causing employers to rethink howthey structure their benefits.
There's also been a bigcomponent of really using leave
(01:17):
to attract and retain employees,particularly in certain
demographics of your workforce,such as younger parents and
those that are in a sandwichgeneration, that are caregiving
for both children as well as, asin many cases, their own
parents.
Speaker 1 (01:31):
You know, part of what we're hearing is that
there's a whole group of peoplewho won't even apply to a
company if it isn't part of thebenefits package.
Speaker 3 (01:38):
That's very true.
We did a survey at AbsintheSoft that really talked to about
800 different employees andreally looked at what they see
as their benefits.
86% of them responded they arelooking for some level of paid
leave when they're looking atjob descriptions and 42% of them
wouldn't apply without it.
So there's, you know, as welook at how to bring people in,
(02:01):
we're also eliminating them ifwe don't offer some sort of paid
benefit.
Speaker 1 (02:06):
So, as advisors counsel their clients or their
prospect, it's something thatthey really need to be aware of.
Speaker 3 (02:12):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (02:13):
So what is it?
I mean, beyond the actual timeoff itself?
What are those folks who won'tapply without it, or the 86% of
folks who actually, you know,want it in the first place?
What are they looking for?
Speaker 3 (02:26):
You know I think they're looking for, you know, a
fair wage or really a benefitthat that allows them to, that
meets them where they are.
So we have a lot of job seekersthat are in certain stages of
life and, whether that is, youknow, they're planning to start
a family in the coming years,and so they're evaluating ways
that they can do that in a waythat doesn't hurt them
(02:49):
financially as they're goingthrough.
We also have a large portion ofthe population now that's in
what we call the sandwichgeneration, that has aging
parents as well as youngchildren, and so having time and
flexibility, both from a jobprotectedprotected stage, which
is what we've had for a longtime, but also then a way to
protect their income so thatthey're able to do that and
(03:11):
still retain their pay benefits.
Speaker 1 (03:13):
I mean, you mentioned aging parents and managing
their own health.
Is there also a new, maybehyped-up, interest in this
because of mental health?
Speaker 3 (03:23):
There is, I think, mental health's driven a
significant portion of leaverequests and also accommodation
requests over the last few years, and so it is a holistic look
at how do we support thatemployee through the conditions
that they're struggling with ina way that both protects their
job but also then protects theirincome from negative impacts.
Speaker 1 (03:46):
We talked in the open a little bit about how this is
really a retention andengagement tool in addition to
all of the other reasons to havethis.
Can you talk a little bit aboutthat?
Speaker 3 (03:57):
Yeah, I think we all know that our employees are
going to go through differentlife changes as they're working
for us.
For example, at Absinthe Soft,we have an 18-week parental
leave, whether you're adoptingor having your own baby, and so
being able to provide thatbenefit to give people time to
bond, to spend that time withtheir newborn or with their
(04:20):
newly adopted baby, then allowsthem to return and so I think
you know, in a way, that they'reprepared to come back.
It doesn't rush them throughthe process and it allows them
to stay financially whole.
We've had great success of allof the employees that have taken
that benefit return and they'remore engaged and more committed
to what they're doing atAbsinthe Often.
That data also plays out in thesurvey that we did with
(04:43):
employees at other organizationsthat those that had a good
leave experience, those thatfelt supported by their employer
, were more likely to return andalso more likely to promote
that employer externally.
So when we talk about HR reallybeing focused on that
attracting and retaining as astrategic objective, how you
structure your leave benefitsand particularly the pay
(05:03):
component of that, can be a bigpiece of the success of them.
Speaker 1 (05:08):
Can a bad experience actually push people out the
door?
Speaker 3 (05:11):
Oh, absolutely.
I mean not surprisingly, thosethat had a bad experience, that
didn't feel supported by theiremployer, were much more likely
to look for another job, andalso they were much less likely
to really get our employees totalk positively and to get their
friends and associates involvedin the recruiting process.
(05:40):
We see just much better resultsthat way.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
I know one of the questions that I'm sure most
employers ask when an advisorstarts talking about a paid
leave program is okay, we'regoing to capture this pool of
hours that have a dollar valueto our company.
What percentage of folksactually take leave in any given
population during the course ofa year?
Speaker 3 (06:02):
Yeah, that's a great question, David, because it
really varies by industry.
So you have some industries thathave a very high utilization
rate just due to the nature ofthe job and you have others that
have a much lower request rate.
I think we've started to seethat, normalized, anywhere
between 10% and 40% of employeeswill take a leave on a given
year.
So it really is organization byorganization and, honestly,
(06:26):
when we talk about paid leave,it can be so broad in the
reasons that people take it thatwe really encourage
conversations with the employersabout their specific employee
population and what types ofleave benefits will help them
attract and retain thoseemployees.
It doesn't, you know, if I havean aging workforce, it doesn't
do me a ton of good to roll outa new parental benefit because
(06:49):
those employees won't see thatbenefit.
And the same case is, if I'mrolling out a parental benefit,
I don't want to forget aboutthose employees that are past
that time period in their life.
So it's really about how do weestablish an equity and a parity
in the benefits that we offerso that we can attract and
retain the employees that wehave based on our own
demographics?
Speaker 1 (07:09):
You mentioned that some industries have higher
utilization than others.
Could you give us a couple ofexamples?
Speaker 3 (07:14):
I think you know we see high utilization in health
care and we see high utilizationin others.
Could you give us a couple ofexamples?
I think you know we see highutilization in healthcare and we
see high utilization inhospitality.
You know those tend to be someof the higher retail has.
You know higher utilization aswell.
You know, I think anywhere whereyou know anywhere where there
is a real need for that employeeto be at the office, there's
much more likelihood to requestto leave versus more of the
(07:36):
white collar jobs where peoplecan kind of work around
sometimes in there and becreative in scheduling.
It doesn't make it lessimportant to offer the benefit
or to track the time, but itjust seems to drive down those
formal requests a little bit.
But I do think you knowcertainly where we've got
situations such as in a hospitalwhere you've got to have a
certain number of nurses, from alegal standpoint, to cover a
(07:57):
certain number of beds.
There's a huge need to be ableto actually capture who's on
leave and where and make sureyou're managing those
effectively.
Speaker 1 (08:07):
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(09:10):
And now back to ourconversation, and we're back
chatting with Seth Turner,founder and senior advisor at
Absinthe Soft Seth.
Are there regulatory andcompliance issues around these
paid leave programs?
Speaker 3 (09:23):
There certainly are.
I think the legislativelandscape continues to get more
and more complex and for manyyears it was the FMLA and then
very similar state laws toprotect the time off, to protect
jobs very similar state laws toprotect the time off, to
protect jobs.
What we've seen in the lastprobably five years is a
proliferation of these statelaws with paid leave.
(09:43):
So, you know, we had Californiastate disability insurance
early on, but we've seen NewYork and Washington and Oregon
and some others roll these out.
So I think we now have 13states that have their own
version of a paid family leavethat are requiring employers to
comply with that.
And it's, you know, it's morethan a payroll issue in that it
many of these laws bridgebetween job protection as well
(10:04):
as the pay protection, and soit's really caused employers to
have to rethink you know howthey manage that, how they track
it and to both integratesystems but also be much more
aware of the compliance piece ofit.
Speaker 1 (10:16):
Is that something that you just build into the
system as the states come online?
Speaker 3 (10:25):
Yeah, that's.
I mean, compliance is acornerstone of what AbsintheSoft
does.
It's monitoring all the federallaws, all the state laws,
whether that's a paid leave,whether that's a family type of
leave, whether it's military,any of those types, sabbaticals.
You know we see a huge, youknow a huge variety within all
of our clients as to what theyoffer from a company standpoint
and then how they blend that inwith the ones, the laws and the
(10:46):
regulations that they're legallyrequired to comply with.
Speaker 1 (10:50):
Are you expecting more states to come online with
these kinds of mandates?
Speaker 3 (10:54):
I really am.
I think it's something thatwe're seeing.
We're seeing many that aresitting out there ready to be
passed or being proposed.
We're not seeing a lot ofaction at the federal level to
put a more broad umbrella acrossit.
And ultimately, what we've seenwith FMLA is, you know, it is a
federal law but yet states arestill passing it.
So I think you know, for thoseof us in the industry, we're
(11:16):
just expecting that there willbe more complexity continued to
be introduced over the next fewyears and that you know that's
going to just continue to causeemployers to be challenged by
that.
And then we're also seeing thatemployers are looking at it and
saying, okay, just because myemployees aren't in the state,
don't I want to be more holisticin how I support everybody that
works for me outside of justwhat I'm legally required to do.
Speaker 1 (11:40):
How does this impact HR departments?
I know a lot of advisors.
Sometimes the sale is made intwo different parts of the
business.
It's made to the C-suite andthen it's made to the HR folks
or the HR folks who are involved, and I know, you know they
always will tell you and to alarge extent at least, in my
experience, it's true thatthey're understaffed and
overworked.
How does this kind of a thinghelp them?
Speaker 3 (12:03):
Yeah, so you know, from an APSA soft standpoint,
we're helping them maintaincompliance, we're helping them
with the administration, sowe're streamlining the
day-to-day work, so ultimatelywe're enabling them to do more
with less.
But what I like to say is, youknow, in many cases teams are so
overworked, we're allowing themto do the same amount of work,
but just in compliance andefficiently, and ultimately what
(12:24):
that benefits, then, is itenables our HR teams to be able
to have those conversations withemployees, to support them, to
understand what that employee isgoing through, and that not
only improves the employeeexperience and the satisfaction
the employee has with theirleave experience, but it also
allows employers to be moreeffective in how they get people
back to work and really helpingthere.
(12:46):
And I think at the end of theday that drives to bottom line
of attracting retaining but alsoproductivity.
And so we're helping both theHR team be more effective and
efficient in how they're doingthings.
We're also helping the C-suiteachieve those business
objectives they're trying to do.
Speaker 1 (13:01):
Are you also helping them to create these policies?
Is that something, a servicethat you guys offer?
Speaker 3 (13:06):
I think that's what we see a lot of advisors doing
are the policies.
We can help them benchmark whatothers are doing.
But I think you know what I seeis a lot of organizations.
It's you know the how they wantthose policies to interact with
their business strategy.
I mean, it's it's really a youknow, organization by
organization, so we can tellthem a lot of what their peers
are doing.
But ultimately it goes intowhat your people strategy is and
(13:30):
what your employee demographicslook like as to how you want to
structure those policies.
Speaker 1 (13:35):
How big a part do you feel this plays in building and
maintaining employee cultures?
Speaker 3 (13:40):
I think it's a huge part of the culture, especially
as we look at.
We have five generations in theworkforce right now, and
certainly Gen Z and Gen Alphaand some of the others are much
more in tune with how their youknow their personal relationship
with their organization.
So it's no longer we kind ofwent through lifetime employment
and then we went through thejob changers and now we're into
(14:02):
the groups that really doidentify with their employer.
You know the company mission,and feeling that the
organization supports theiremployees and is, you know,
invested in them as people is asimportant as the job itself,
and so, to me, structuring thesebenefits and helping the
employees use them and supportthem is really important in the
kind of culture you create andthe success you're going to have
(14:24):
in retaining your employees.
Speaker 1 (14:26):
Other than perhaps keeping track of all the
different states and theirmandates and sorting those out
for employers.
I suspect that technology playsa big role in what you guys do.
Speaker 3 (14:36):
Well it's, I mean, it is what we do.
It's providing that technologyto be able to provide you know
whether it's, you know chatbotsto be able to do intake of
requests, whether it's providingresources to be able to allow
employees to understand whattheir benefits are, but also
then, just you know, I call itadministrivia, but the leave
laws are very paper intensive,they're very process intensive,
(14:59):
and so making sure that they canquickly get the right
information to employees, thatthey can process through the
workflows that need to happen,that they can make decisions in
a timely manner you know, withFMLA there's the two, five,
15-day kind of timelines thatare all from a compliance
standpoint, mandated, and so byautomating those through the
technology, or at leastprompting users to be able to do
(15:21):
those on time, it enhances thecompliance, but it also then
enhances that ability for HR tospend the time doing the things
that add value, which are theinteractions with employees and
the more strategic or the morecomplicated decision-making
around what looks like a leaveor how to accommodate an
employee's request, and so thosetypes of things are really
(15:43):
important from not onlycompliance but also from an
employee experience andsatisfaction standpoint.
Speaker 1 (15:50):
Well, I was going to follow up on that employee
satisfaction.
From an employee self-servicestandpoint, what are the things
that employees are looking for?
What do they want in a system?
Speaker 3 (16:00):
You know, I think they want what they get from
every other system out there,and HR systems have
traditionally been slow torespond to that, which is they
want usability, they want theinformation they need when they
need it, and they don't, youknow they don't want.
They want it to clarify thingsinstead of confusing things, and
so those three things, I wouldsay, are the big ones.
It's also just having abilityto access it when they need to
(16:22):
access it, versus having to doit when they're in the office or
where they are.
And so we're, you know, we'reseeing even uses of technology,
not just from a self-service ofrequests and viewing status and
uploading documents, but alsojust in communications, of using
text and some other.
You know I don't want to callthem new technologies, but in
many ways the leave space isstuck in faxes, and so text is a
(16:43):
new medium of communication fora lot of people, but it's one
that's been incredibly effectivefor getting to employees when
you need information, as well asthat employee's manager,
because I think we often losesight of them in the leave
process that they're looking forwhen that employee's coming
back or how to plan and how todeliver on their business
results, and so by communicatingclearly with them, using the
(17:04):
technology, you can also drivejust more satisfaction there.
Speaker 1 (17:08):
Has AI impacted?
Speaker 3 (17:08):
you guys, the technology, you can also drive
just more satisfaction there.
Has AI impacted you guys?
It has.
I think it helps with justmaking sure we're communicating
clearly.
It helps with some of the basicQ&A intake, some of those
pieces.
It helps a little bit withanalytics.
I think we're still in someways, you know, we're very much
looking at how we best utilizeit.
I think the DOL and, you know,department of Labor and the EEOC
(17:30):
have been kind of clear on howyou can and can't use AI.
So there's still a lot of roomfor people in the leave process.
But there are certain pieces ofautomation, certain pieces of
communication that we can use AIto make more efficient and
effective in how we get to allthe people that need to consume
the information.
(17:52):
Seth if anybody in the audiencewants to reach out and learn
more.
What's the best way to reachyou?
You can just reach us atabsensoftcom there's a way to
get us there.
Or you can contact me, seth, atabsensoftcom.
But we'd love to talk moreabout how we're helping
employers stay compliant withthe leave laws and manage their
leaves more effectively.
Speaker 1 (18:13):
And that's a great place to end our conversation
for today.
Seth Turner, founder and senioradvisor at Absinthe Soft Seth,
thanks for a really interestingdiscussion.
Speaker 3 (18:18):
Thank you, david, it's been fun.
Speaker 2 (18:23):
The Shift Shapers podcast is a production of Shift
Shapers LLC.
The content and images of thispodcast may not be used without
our express written permission.
Copyright 2023.
All rights reserved.
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