BIG 12 PREVIEW: Tiers of the Unpredictable Kingdom | 2025 College Football

We dive deep into the Big 12 with the first of our three-part conference preview and break out all 16 teams into contender tiers, discuss the biggest storylines shaping the season, and use goofy metaphors, quotes and sounds to capture the delightful uncertainty that defines the league. From Arizona State's quest to repeat as champions to the transfer portal revolution reshaping rosters across the league, we unpack what makes this conference so addictively unpredictable.

In this college football podcast episode, we discuss why the Big 12 in 2025 feels like the ultimate chaos conference where almost anything is possible. We have a healthy debate over which teams belong in the top tier, with Arizona State and Kansas State leading the way, discuss the hype around Texas Tech and Baylor, and wonder if Iowa State can take the next step. Plus, we analyze the most meaningful coordinator changes at programs like Utah and Oklahoma State, examine rosters heavily influenced by the portal, and revel in the fact that nearly every team has at least at 35% change of reaching a bowl.

We also explore the post-Shedeur and Travis Hunter era at Colorado, debate whether Texas Tech's investment will pay dividends, and wonder if this is finally the year Kansas State breaks through under Chris Klieman. Plus, can Baylor's explosive offense carry them despite defensive concerns? Will Utah's new-look offense complement their traditionally strong defense? Can Kansas ride good vibes to 7 or 8 wins? And why does Mike Gundy's Oklahoma State feel like it's entered desperation mode?

Consider this your starter pack for navigating the beautiful chaos that is Big 12 football in 2025.

Timestamps:
2:47 - Opening Thoughts
8:37 - Top Tier
29:09 - Middle Tier
41:42 - Oklahoma State Tier
46:34 - Bottom Tier
58:23 - Predictions

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:02):
Welcome to the solid verbal hull.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
For me, I'm a man, I'm forty.

Speaker 1 (00:08):
I've heard so many players say, well I want to
be happy.

Speaker 2 (00:10):
You want to be happy for a day? Edo State?

Speaker 3 (00:13):
Is that? Whoo whoom?

Speaker 2 (00:14):
And Dan and Tie.

Speaker 1 (00:18):
Dan Rubinstein, welcome back to the show. My good friend,
can you do me a favor? Always anything? For Tie,
I want you to hold up twelve fingers.

Speaker 2 (00:28):
Well, okay, so there's there's the one in two to
form a twelve or one and two depending on your angle.
Here's ten and two. Okay, I'm doing the best I can.
Or I guess sixteen would make more sense with this.

Speaker 1 (00:39):
Oh right, well see that's the confusing part of college football.
Now everybody's got a different conference name than the number
of teams in the conference.

Speaker 2 (00:48):
You know, you know, maybe Cody Campbell. How many fingers
you need? I can buy those. How many fingers you need?
I can get you fingers in the next hour and
a half. What do you need per finger?

Speaker 1 (00:58):
It is the Big twelve Preview Episode Part one Today,
Part one where we go through our tier rankings, talk
through contenders, talk through main storylines.

Speaker 2 (01:10):
Things like that.

Speaker 1 (01:10):
We're going to get into team previews on the next
two episodes. We promise us sixteen teams in this freaking conference.
We will get into that, I promise you over the
next two episodes. And go back and listen to the
ACC and the G five previews and the intro to
the twenty twenty five season and preview episode that we
did a couple weeks back. Now we are deep in

(01:31):
the weeds here reviewing all you need to know for
this college football season. Dan, how are you today? Welcome back?

Speaker 2 (01:38):
I'm good. I have my legal pad out with both
my Big ten notes. I'm also taking out my pen
to write down to pull. There will be blood sounds
for when we talk Texas Tech specifically on I assume
part two of our Big twelve previews to say, who's
to say we haven't made think I need some Daniel
plainview into the Texas Tech conversation. All right, that's it. Continue.

Speaker 1 (01:59):
I love it. If you were new here, we got
a lot of new people finding us right now. Hit follow,
hit subscribe so they don't miss any of the episodes. Reballers
dot com is where you can go to sign up
and support what we do, but also get ads or
get episodes without the ads. Get episodes a little bit
early BTUs content discord access. We're going to play a
game once the season gets a little bit cool, so

(02:19):
you get access to all that stuff.

Speaker 2 (02:21):
And screw it.

Speaker 3 (02:22):
TIE.

Speaker 2 (02:22):
This year, we're going to give people early ads so
before the shows come out, so you can get a
heads up on whatever Sherry's berries or mattress or uh
literally anything that might be a partner of the show.
We'll give you early access to the ads. How about that? TIE.
That's my promise to you.

Speaker 1 (02:41):
If that's what you want to do, we can find
a way to do it. My friend.

Speaker 2 (02:45):
Okay, good, Where are you at with the Big twelve?
Pure entertainment tie? That's where I'm at. We'm at with
the Big Twelve. The Big Twelve is fascinating, not unlike
a lot of these conferences, but it's fascinating because you
can tuck yourself into more teams in the Big Twelve
regarding a sensational season or fixing an element of their

(03:07):
team that was in dire straits and dire need of
being fixed. And with how the season wound down last
year with so many teams like okay, if this team wins,
if this team's loses, this wh whin's the next two
This team loses the next one, like there is. It's
not that it's just wide open, It's that there are

(03:28):
so many very specific mysteries that I can't wait to
unwrap this wrapping paper.

Speaker 1 (03:35):
I'm pretty excited too. In the last episode, or I
guess a couple episodes ago, now, I compared the Big
twelve to the Grand pre Mode of Mario Kart. Sure,
everybody's just in a big old mishmash, racing around the track,
red shells, blue shells, green shells, coming at you, all
that type of stuff that kills you when you're out front.

(03:58):
This is the ultimate chaos conference in definitely is what
I found interesting, and you know we read all these previews,
is we're trying to put this together. No two previews
had the same teams at the top. No two previews
had the same teams in the top half of the conference.
So there's a lot of variability here that we're going

(04:18):
to get into over the next hour or so. I
would caution everybody, don't assume that crazy parody, don't assume
that chaos means a lack of quality, because I think
there are some really good teams in this conference. I
hope we get more than one playoff spot out of
the Big Twelve, because who doesn't want the chaos candidates

(04:39):
to be part of the college football playoff. I think
that'd be a lot of fun.

Speaker 2 (04:42):
If they if they're very clearly competitive, yes, if they're competitive.

Speaker 1 (04:46):
To put things in context, our friend Bill Connolly from
over at ESPN dropped his Big Twelve preview. All sixteen
teams in the conference have at least a thirty five
percent chance of getting to say wins, which is atypical.
That is not normal.

Speaker 2 (05:04):
Yeah, I mean it speaks to high floor, first and foremost.

Speaker 1 (05:07):
If anything reinforces the fact that it's going to get weird,
it's a stat like that.

Speaker 2 (05:11):
Yes, I think there is a certain floor, a high
floor of quarterback competency. For some reason, Jalen Daniels is
eligible once again to play college football. But no, you
look across this conference, and even if you have quarterback
questions about whoever, you may have questions about bri It
be it. You know, Brendan Sorosby or Tavin Jackson. You know,

(05:34):
take your pick rock o'beck or Josh Hoover or Baron Morton.
It's hard to make a case that they're not. They're
not all at least decent, which is nice when you're
talking about a wide open conference and there's a lot
of huge questions about all of these teams based on
last year, based on what their roster looks like this year.
But you're right, and I appreciate you bringing that up. Ty.

(05:56):
By the way, the conference in aggregate because media members
were not all loud to predict the Big twelve order
of finish at media day after Arizona State was picked
last and won the conference last year, which I think
is so cowardly. By the way, what who cares? It's
actually an incredible story. What the media members did last

(06:16):
year was legitimately incredible in picking the champion last. Like
you want attention like that, you want a story like that,
you want a team to feel like overlooked like that.
It does nothing but help the conference to have that
story like, oh, I'm sorry, like some columnists from the
Oklahoman was wrong about the Big twelve. Booh, who cares?

(06:37):
It was great? So yes, I appreciate Bill doing this,
I appreciate Athlon doing this. Whoever picked and predicted an
order of finish? Good Onya, because the Big twelve hates it.
The Big twelve does not like it, does not speak
with its chest. No, not at all.

Speaker 1 (06:54):
Five kind of a bummer. Yeah, well, we're gonna make
our picks here, Yes, and just a little little bit
of course, you've got a chaos conference like this, and
there are no shortage of interesting storylines. The one that
jumps off the page, I think, And they're not going
to be in a contender tier this year, at least
I don't think they are. Who knows dionnat Colorado losing

(07:16):
both his son Shador and Travis Hunter to the NFL.

Speaker 2 (07:20):
But also why not? Also why not be a contender?
You know, I don't know.

Speaker 1 (07:25):
I mean, they're gonna be led by defense this year,
which is a bit of a zag as compared to
first couple of years of Colorado. But curious to see
what that next chapter looks like. Curious to see what
the next chapter looks like for Arizona State, which we
will get into. We're going to do our tiers here momentarily.
But just a lot of I think interesting storylines that
we saw develop last season that we're going to see

(07:46):
a continuation of in twenty twenty five. Is partially why
I'm so high on the Big Twelve this year.

Speaker 2 (07:52):
By the way, if you're watching on YouTube, I am
stretching and folding sourdough. Stretching and folding sourdough while doing
this because I don't know. You gotta do what you
gotta do, and I'm very excited for both this hour
Day and the Big Twelve continue.

Speaker 1 (08:05):
I'm glad you bring that up, because, not to give
too much away, I have one of my dumbest bits
ever this year for the Big Twelve. It's true, it's
really a step above in terms of dumbness. Oh my god,
Ty both of them are food related, just for me,
just so I'm doing this just for you. Yeah, this
year feels so honored. I don't know if I'm going

(08:25):
to get into it on this episode, but I've got
two that are percolating and they're really bad.

Speaker 2 (08:32):
So the Big Twelve as a whole is bringing this
out of you. Okay, okay, wait it is okay, okay.
I want to talk through our contender tiers with you.
And something that bounced around in my head this morning
as I was in the shower thinking about this episode
is how the Big Twelve finds itself let's say on

(08:55):
the opposite end of this fight to preserve college football.
You know, we hear so much about the Big Ten
and the SEC and how they're trying to.

Speaker 1 (09:04):
Destroy the college football universe. And I thought, as we're
putting our tiers together, my wonderful wife, who is currently
upstairs and can't hear me saying any of this. Okay, good,
has been fixated on a game called the Legends of
Zelda Tears of the Kingdom, in which there is also
a bad guy, Gannendorf, trying to destroy the world. Okay,

(09:27):
this is a clunky reference, but I thought maybe we
could call these the Big twelve Tiers of the Kingdom.

Speaker 3 (09:33):
Ready, get ready, dance? Sixteen teams in this damn conference. Yes,
these are the tiers of the Kingdom. Who's at the
very top for you.

Speaker 2 (09:48):
Arizona State? Okay, I'm going ASO. It's a very easy answer,
but when faced with the chaoskic nature of the Big Twelve,
with transfers and nobody really jumping out, I'm going to
go with the team with proven championship DNA. Sam Levitt

(10:08):
was sensational down the stretch. They returned so much on
defense Number one receiver is once again healthy. Their biggest
game changer on offense last year is gone. But ultimately,
I think running back not the very specific kind of
way Cam Scataboo was successful last year, which is just
bruising and trampling everybody, But I'm less worried about replacing

(10:32):
a running back in twenty twenty five. So ASU, with
a tricky schedule, mind you, is the team I feel
the most confident in if I were assigned to pick one.

Speaker 1 (10:44):
I really struggled with this top tier. I've got six
teams in my top tier. We talked through who those are.
Obviously Arizona State is clearly in that upper crust. Nearly
everybody's back, as you said, Sam Levitt, Jordan Tyson good
line a lot on defense, they got to figure out
a pass rush.

Speaker 2 (11:02):
That's they definitely do.

Speaker 1 (11:04):
I think the other point of contention I have, and
I'm a little bit leary because a lot of their
success clearly came from Camp Skataboo, but also they had
a really good turnover margin that they used to their
advantage last year, and those don't tend to be stats
that you can blindly expect to continue. A lot of
that's luck clearly there's a defensive philosophy that plays into it.

(11:25):
But you know, if you don't get the margins this
year the way you did last year, you're losing your
big engine in Scataboo if you don't generate a pass
rush to kind of help you maybe force some of
those turnovers. I that was I think my main sticking
point with ASU and why I don't have them at
the very top.

Speaker 2 (11:45):
Counterpoint, they won their final Big twelve game last year
by seventy seven over Iowa State at the championship game,
and that's plenty to account for a loss of turnovers. Continue.

Speaker 1 (11:57):
I also have Iowa State in this tier okay, and
I think Iowa State, if you want to play this
game and be as straightforward as you can, keep it
simple stupid. I think Iowa State as the most straightforward
case to be at the top here. Because they bring
back Roco back the Boer, best of all Rocos two

(12:20):
running backs. They got a good line. I pumped the
brakes a bit because the secondary and the schedule which
has a lot of land mines on it. Also, they're
losing two thousand yard receivers to the NFL, which leads
a bit of a void, and it's by of an
open question. Bit of an open question is to go
to Ireland for a week zero. But Iowa State, I
think definitely deserves to be in this tier.

Speaker 2 (12:41):
Okay, Yeah, I was a little bit worried about the
step back they took on defense, especially situationally last season,
red zone, third down, you know, the front. Dealing with
all of those injuries was very worrisome. Hopefully they're a
little bit healthier. They were pretty bad upfront, but now
they're replacing a bunch along that defensive line as well.
So yeah, amount unknown about Iowa State, but you know,

(13:02):
if your starting point is Rock Quebec, it's a great
starting point.

Speaker 1 (13:05):
It's a great starting point, and there's steam on this program.
It was the first double digit win season in the
one hundred and thirty three year history of the Iowa's
Hate Football, but quite literally the best season ever for
the Clones. Last season they ran into the buzzsaw that
is Arizona State in the Yes Big twelve title game,
but they did win the real national championship by knocking

(13:28):
off Miami and the.

Speaker 2 (13:29):
Pop Tarts Bowl. Yes they did. They The second half
was a little bit different from the first half with
regard to who was playing quarterback for Miami, but nevertheless,
winning is better than losing.

Speaker 1 (13:40):
I tend to agree, who else do you got in
this top tier? Or how do your tiers look? Let's
put it that way.

Speaker 2 (13:46):
I went back and forth on Iowa State, but I'm
willing to have them in there. I would have Kansas
State in the top tier. I would have Texas Tech
in the top tier. I went a little bit back
and forth with the Utah because I think, I mean,
we're talking about the best returning defense and returns a
bunch of playmakers on this defense, including their defensive coordinator
Morgan Scaley. I just there's too much unknown about the

(14:07):
offense for me to feel incredible about Utah in this moment.
That if you know, Utah is just in a place
that they can bounce back from a down couple of seasons,
or if this is just sort of a new normal
where they're still not able to figure out dynamic offense
and so you know, it's a new Mexico transfer in
Devin Dampierre at quarterback for Utah. Otherwise that's likely my cutoff.

(14:32):
I think TCU has an interesting place at the table,
but their schedule is brutal.

Speaker 1 (14:37):
Schedule sucks, and.

Speaker 2 (14:38):
So that's that's where I land on TCU. I'm still
too concerned about Baylor's back end. And you know, if
we're talking about a high floor for quarterbacks and Baylor
having a ton to prove against the pass, I don't
know that I'm right there, even though Baylor in terms
of offensive firepower, especially through the air, has a pretty
easy case that they're right there with ASU.

Speaker 1 (15:00):
Let's keep it there for a second. Okay, Okay, two
teams in particular in the Big Twelve. That again, reading
all these previews are getting a disproportionate amount of steam
Baylor and Baylor in Texas Tech. Okay, yeah, so Baylor
was a Shador Sanders hail Mary away from the Big

(15:20):
Twelve title game. Well and fumble at the goal line,
yeah Taylor, Yeah yeah. Leaping across the offense is good
enough to win the conference.

Speaker 2 (15:31):
Definitely.

Speaker 1 (15:32):
The defense needs to take a medium step forward, I think,
to put them in better position to do it, because
otherwise they're a half team. They got annihilated last year
with chunk plays. So I'm being cautious. Yep, but there's
a ton back. There's a lot of reason to be optimistic.

Speaker 2 (15:48):
Agree, I've got.

Speaker 1 (15:50):
Baylor in my top tier. I think Baylor gets a
couple of breaks, gets a little bit better on defense.
David Randa took the reins last season. They improved on defense.

Speaker 2 (15:59):
And of remind me is that Baylor has a SMU
and Auburn in the non conference portion of the schedule, right,
which doesn't affect where they finish in the Big Twelve.

Speaker 1 (16:10):
Back to back weeks. Mind you, They've got Auburn on
a Friday night August of twenty ninth, then they're at
SMU the next week, September the sixth.

Speaker 2 (16:18):
It's a tough one too, but again does not affect
the Big Twelve race. Just part of the context of
the Baylor season.

Speaker 1 (16:23):
Okay, I've also got Texas Tech in this top tier.

Speaker 2 (16:26):
Fascinating.

Speaker 1 (16:27):
Yes, this is the most scheme I can ever remember
on the Texas Tech team in the history of our show. Anyway.
I think they're really smart with how they use the portal.
I think the best of Texas Tech is probably a
year or two down the road, given all the investments
they're making right.

Speaker 2 (16:43):
Now high school recruiting and oh yeah, the roster will continue. Yeah,
this is.

Speaker 1 (16:47):
This is the tip of the iceberg for Texas Tech.
I am skeptical though that they're going to be able
to fix the defense with a couple portal guys and
a new defensive coordinator.

Speaker 2 (16:57):
It's more than a couple. But yeah, I.

Speaker 1 (16:59):
Like Mac Left, which their new offensive coordinator from Texas State.
As you know, I bow at the altar of Texas
State all things GJ. Kinney, But I just think it's
unfair that it's unfair to expect that all of it's
just going to click. There is a lot new, despite
the fact that it's exciting and new.

Speaker 2 (17:18):
Agree. So I mean the bigger question with Texas Tech.
We'll get into this more on the Texas Techa specific
portion of I guess the next show. But it's not
just are these transfers good enough to help Texas Tech
win the conference? It's are they coached by a coach
who is of that caliber? He was of that caliber

(17:39):
to lead a team past both teams in the Big
Twelve championship game last year in Iowa State and Arizona State.
But it's the weekend, week out focus of this team
now making the changes that they did at coordinator absolutely crucial.
So it's new coordinators, you know, a new defense upfront,
new some semi new guys on offense, including the key

(18:01):
left tackle coming over from North Carolina. It's that Texas
Tech as a program is not a ranked program in
the modern era. They haven't finished the season ranked I
believe in what fifteen sixteen years, And so it's Joey
Maguire's ability to culturally take this team week in week

(18:21):
out with much more attention than they've received since like
Michael Crabtree era Texas Tech Mike Leach time, is he
that person to guide this ship and keep everything steady
as they become without any sort of recent previous success,
more hunted than ever because of the attention they've received
this offseason in the conference. That's an interesting question me

(18:44):
with Texas Tech, like are they ready to ascend without
taking the like eight and four to nine and three
to ten and two season right that you're like building
sort of more thoughtfully. Everything is pushed to the middle
for twenty twenty five. So that's my question.

Speaker 1 (19:01):
When I was going through this, I was thinking a
lot of the duke situation from a year ago, not
that there's a whole lot of overlap Okay. Duke was
a team that we I think liked more than we
expected because the schedule was very favorable. And so I
came into this knowing that there was a lot of

(19:22):
new exciting things at Texas Tech, particularly interested in the schedule.
And I think this is tough despite all the steam
that's on this program, and rightfully so. But they got
road games at Utah, which is tough as hell, at Houston,
which is an in state thing, and I think Houston's
going to be better. At Arizona State, who we just

(19:43):
discussed has a lot back, and at Kansas State, who
we didn't really even mention and we can talk about
in a little bit, who I also think deserves to
be in the contender tier. In addition to on the
road at West Virginia, I don't make too much of
West Virginia this year. They are basically hitting control of
delete at West Virginia a tough place to play to
close out the year. That's tough, man, That is tough.

(20:05):
They've also got Kansas who could rise to your weird
little stinker, yes they call caliber. They've got BYU off
of buy. I don't know what to expect that at
BYU but it's off a buy and it's a week
after that Kansas Stakian. There's just a lot here that
to your point, this is a program that hasn't really
finished ranked in a good long time to expect that

(20:25):
it's all going to click. They're going to fire on
all cylinders and suddenly they're going to be atop the
conference again. I don't want to rain on the parade.
I get the optimism. That's just I think asking a
lot of us to expect that it's going to get
to that level.

Speaker 2 (20:38):
I agree. You know, there's a lot of mystery on
this schedule. You know, if a lot of these team
and there's myster on everybody's schedule, you can say somebody
is a tough schedule. Then three or four weeks into
the season, you're like, oh, that's the easiest schedule in
the conference. But right now with so much new and
then the types of road games they have. I understand
your concern.

Speaker 1 (20:56):
I've got Texas Tech in there regardless, though I still
think a couple breaks go their way if, if maybe
it does click, I do want to hedge a little bit.
Do you want to hedge a little bit and at
least give ourselves some latitude there. I've got case State
in here. You I'm assuming you've got case State in
your content.

Speaker 2 (21:14):
I do have k State there. I have my own
concerns about KSE State, especially the back end and what
they're replacing on defense.

Speaker 1 (21:19):
But yeah, some questions along the line. I share your
concern about the back end of the defense, but I
think a really stout front seven. I really like David Johnson,
I really like Dylan Edwards. I really like the schedule.
If we want to ed we want to make this
a schedule conversation, I think Case State is set up

(21:40):
with an optimal schedule to make a run at this thing,
at least domestically. At least domestically. I think Matt Wells
being kind of the main play caller this year is
definitely a step forward, and I think that's something that
at will be interesting to follow. How they modify the

(22:04):
offense to steer more into Avery Johnson and Dylan Edwards.
That's the combo that I'm most interested in, because they're
still kind of figuring out what they're going to do
out wide. I look for some misdirection. I look for
them to use speed in different ways this season against
the schedule, it seems like it sets up really well
for the Wildcats. So for me, I've got it k State,

(22:27):
Iowa State, Arizona State as one, two three.

Speaker 2 (22:31):
No, Texas Tech.

Speaker 1 (22:32):
They'refore, Baylor is four for me, Baylor.

Speaker 2 (22:35):
Four, Texas Tech five, Texas.

Speaker 1 (22:37):
Tech five, and then I've got Utah at six.

Speaker 2 (22:40):
What is the margin between Baylor and Texas Tech?

Speaker 1 (22:44):
Not much?

Speaker 2 (22:45):
Okay? Is it schedule? Is it? You like Sawyer Robertson
more than Baron Morton. You like, you know, the combination
of all the guys returning, especially in the backfield for
Baylor loss of Taje Brooks replaced in Quentin Joyner, Like,
is there anything else?

Speaker 1 (22:59):
I like the offen more?

Speaker 2 (23:01):
Okay?

Speaker 1 (23:01):
I like the offense more. I think the offense last
season under Jake Spavodoal was electric. I think they're going
to take another step forward this year.

Speaker 2 (23:09):
Okay.

Speaker 1 (23:10):
So the offense I think is in a better, more
reliable place, even though I do like Texas Tech, but
losing Todge Brooks is a bit of a dagger.

Speaker 2 (23:18):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (23:19):
Secondly, on the defensive side of the ball, Randa did
improve things when he took the rings. Okay, So I
am of the mind that Baylor is going to have
a better offense and hopefully going to have a better
defense with the Randa at the rings, Texas Tech has upside.
But if I'm looking at this and if you're asking Margins,

(23:40):
the margin for me is basically Dave Randa and his
defensive prowess.

Speaker 2 (23:45):
You need guys, though, and then they went to the portal,
but you do need guys. You needed to sort of
actually make plays. So how many teams is that in
your top tier six? And then the six is Utah?

Speaker 1 (23:56):
Yeah?

Speaker 2 (23:56):
Is Utah.

Speaker 1 (23:57):
I love Utah. I really like you Uta. I am
aggressively on the over seven and a half for Utah
because I love what they did on offense. Genuinely, I
think they're going to be one of the better, more
interesting offenses in the Big twelve. I think depth on defense,
weirdly is something to watch for this team, like usually
they're known for that, you know, but with how banged

(24:18):
up this team has been over the last couple of seasons,
depth on defense isn't where I would like it to
be to feel a little bit more comfortable about that.
There's also low Kia rebuild going on along the defensive line,
which again is something that we can usually rely upon
when we talk about Utah. Oh and this also might
be the toughest schedule in the Big Twelve.

Speaker 2 (24:39):
It's a real tough schedule.

Speaker 1 (24:41):
But I don't want to count him out because I
like Kyle Whittingham. Kyle Whittingham has been one of the
rare points of stability throughout college football, and he generally
figures out a way to make it work. He just
needs to get that offense humming a little bit more.
And I like the higher adjacent beck for New Mexico.
I like Devin dan Pier, I like what they have

(25:01):
done here. I'm not willing to fully commit to it,
but I don't want to take them lower than that
top tier.

Speaker 2 (25:07):
It's just something. There's something about Utah that I want
to know that they have the ability to score twenty
eight points with some regularity, and I'm not there like
I need even if they're so far ahead on defense
as it relates to their offense right now, it appears
I want some sort of hint that they can score
four touchdowns in a game. And after last season, you know,

(25:31):
it's a ton of new players, but like we kind
of this is the sort of mo with Kyle winningham teams,
and in this conference specifically, if they don't have a
guy who's been in the program forever, or they don't
seem to have all American tight ends, or I mean,
they've never had a guy who can stretch the field deep,
it seems I don't know. And a conference this wide open,

(25:53):
with how many changes they have on offense, I'm at
this moment, I'm not putting them in my top tier.

Speaker 1 (25:57):
So is what is your top tier? Then if mine
is those six teams, where is your cutoff? And secondly,
what is the margin between Arizona State and whoever you have?

Speaker 2 (26:08):
Second not dramatic because you're right about the turnover thing
from last year, and you know, I always get a
little bit scared when a team is able to just
sort of turn it on at a certain point of
the season, like ASU was, And I like that teams
can figure it out and they can build on it.
But it's a new year. Every team. Every year is
a fluid thing. So I'm going to say it's not

(26:30):
particularly dramatic because I don't love Arizona State's schedule. It
is tricky. They went Mississippi State early on in the season.
Do they have anybody else non conference and don't on
the schedule in front of me.

Speaker 1 (26:40):
Yeah, Arizona State's got Northern Illinois, the Lumberjacks. They hated Lumberjacks.
They're at Mississippi State. They're home against Texas State the
first three weeks of the season.

Speaker 2 (26:50):
You call it, you said, Northern Illinois is the Lumberjacks
or Northern Arizona Northern Arizona excuse me playing a dome
by the way, though, Yeah they do. That's a little
dome up there, I think in flag Staff. Yeah, I mean,
we'll see what the Texas State offense looks like, the
Mississippi State offense looks like the Baylor offense and TCU
back to back are going to be tough. Texas Tech
offense should be tough. We'll see on Iowa States, and

(27:11):
then a big old wild card to finish out the
season with those last three of West Virginia, Colorado, Arizona.
I'm gonna put my top tier as ASU, Kansas State,
Texas Tech. Actually do I want Texas Tech three.

Speaker 1 (27:28):
See, this is the best part of the Big twelve.
This is the best part.

Speaker 2 (27:32):
Yeah, I'm gonna put Texas Tech against ahead of Iowa State.
Those are gonna be my four. I'm gonna cut it
at four before Baylor in Utah and TCU. So you're
pretty high on Tech, then I am decently high on
Texas Tech. I have outstanding questions about Baron Morton against
good teams. He has not been that guy against teams

(27:52):
with winning records at all. Downfield consistently they leaned on
Todje Brooks. I assume they're going to enjoy the Quentin
Joyner ex An's no pun intended, but I worry about
the amount of new coupled with new expectations that were
not earned on the field these last three years. So
I have Texas Tech behind there, but I have them

(28:14):
ahead of Iowa State in this moment because this is
also a team that I'm going to need some answers
on defense if this is a team led by defense.

Speaker 1 (28:22):
So since I'm jotting this down and sea four, we
have separate teers. You've got Arizona State, You've got Kansas State, Yes,
You've got Texas Tech, and you've got Iowa.

Speaker 2 (28:35):
Yes, okay, And that's my cutoff.

Speaker 1 (28:39):
So what is holding back? I'm assuming Baylor, I'm assuming Utah.

Speaker 2 (28:46):
It's that those teams need to win. It seems right. Now,
we'll see on the hopeful improvement, but if the improvement
is decent but not overwhelming, then Baylor's going to need
to win a bunch of games forty one thirds and
Utah is gonna need to win a bunch of games
seventeen thirteen. And I'm just never enamored with teams who
need to win games in very specific ways.

Speaker 1 (29:09):
Who else do you have in that tier down?

Speaker 2 (29:10):
Then I've got TCU. I don't really know what to
make of BYU given the late Jake Okay, when I
say the late, the late transfer portal edition of Jake
Rhetz laugh no longer at BYU, and so I think
it's what m McKay McCrae hill as stand. I don't know.
It kind of sounds like your last name. So I

(29:31):
don't know what to make of BYU beyond I like
pieces on their defense, but offensively they lose a good
amount of pop out wide, and obviously Jake Rhet's laugh
was very good for them, So they're sort of TBD
in that second tier. I think that's kind of it.
So it's Baylor, Utah TCU. I kind of reserve the

(29:51):
right to put Kansas there, but I'm not there yet
with Kansas.

Speaker 1 (29:54):
I've got TCU there. I really like Josh Houver, Yeah,
I really like them. My problem though, is that you
have to like Josh Hoover a lot to put them higher. Yeah,
he's got to do a lot of it himself. Yeah,
they can't run the ball. It's all going to be
on joshuit. Maybe they get better at it, but if
we use last year as a proof of concept, it
was all on Josh Hoover, right, and they didn't run
it all. I think the defense will be better this

(30:16):
season for TCU, which is why I have them at
the top of my next tier up. Okay, but they
were really bad against the run last season and it's
a brutal schedule, so I can't go higher with TCU.
I do have Kansas in my like, I guess middle
tier whatever we're.

Speaker 2 (30:34):
Calling this a lot back on defense up front. Yeah,
I've got Kansas as a seven win team, man, Okay,
I mean they looked like it after the first four
or five games last year. They were of that kind
of seven eight win quality. The way they looked against
Colorado after Warren Sapp was very confident they were that
team and they just took a month and a half
to figure out how to get there.

Speaker 1 (30:54):
There is a lot of steam on Kansas right now
because they're real opening the booth, their stadium, which was.

Speaker 2 (31:02):
They played away from home, they didn't play home games.

Speaker 1 (31:04):
Last year and extended renovations. We're going to get to
see that on display relatively early. But let me do
use my Ashanti quote here. Okay, it's about trust. It's
about trust with Kansas. Do we trust that Jalen Daniels
can stay healthy? Do we trust the back seven? Do
we think the coordinator shift can restart the Andy kotil

(31:26):
Nikki offense? That's kind of what they're.

Speaker 2 (31:28):
Banking on, was it Matt Lubick well traveled.

Speaker 1 (31:32):
Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2 (31:32):
Kansas is in a nice spot emotionally to me. I
think there were expectations last year, a year before this year.
They're just kind of underneath the surface. You know, there's
as you your term, there's steam on Kansas State, there's
steam on Texas Tech, obviously, ASU champ Iowa State right there.
Last year they were kind of quietly in that mix.

(31:52):
Kansas is just lurking. They're in a nice place. To
have a nice kick near the end of the year
if they can win a couple of winnable games early,
which they didn't do last year.

Speaker 1 (32:02):
So if my top tier is those six teams that
I mentioned before, Case State, Iowa State, Arizona State, Baylor,
Texas Tech, and Utah in that order, my next one
up is TCU and then Kansas, and then I've got Cincinnati. Okay,
And I'm curious to get your thoughts on this because

(32:23):
Cincinnati's got a defense with a lot back. Cincinnati was better,
I think than the record showed last season. I really
like Brendan Sowersby the counterpoint, of course, they're losing four
starting offensive linemen, top six receivers, a twelve hundred.

Speaker 2 (32:40):
Yard pack, yeah, Corey Kiner.

Speaker 1 (32:42):
Yeah, but they've got a good schedule, and I think
that again, this is a team that was better than
maybe the record indicated last season. So it's like, which
side of the coin are you with Cincinnati? Are you
on the side of this is a good schedule with
a lot back on defense and a quarterback that I
think we both would agree is at least serviceable. He's decent. Yeah,

(33:05):
I kind of like him. But then on the flip side.
There still is a lot new to figure out. There
is mounting pressure. If you go out and read Cincinnati
football previews, there is no stage, no shortage of frustration
with respect to Scott Sadderfield trying to turn this thing around.
You can kind of pick your own adventure here with

(33:26):
Cincinnati this year.

Speaker 2 (33:27):
It's also a question of like, Okay, Cincinnati seems decent,
but if they're more than decent, why right? It was
a very average offense overall last year and a pretty
average defense, and so that gets you a pretty average team.
Average is better than bat We can write that down.
But also, where's the pop? Where's the spice? Where's the

(33:48):
identity that has them beating a team that seems more talented,
seems better, seems that they're more well positioned to win
this conference. It can happen a week. But that's also
a kind of team that can lose to a team
that we're pretty sure is clearly worse than Cincinnati. That's
the problem with Cincinnati to me right now is don'das

(34:09):
do l pop? That's it.

Speaker 1 (34:11):
This is going to be year three under Sadurfield. Correct
his record so far as eight and sixteen, he went
five and seven a year ago, Vegas has the win
total at six and a half. I get the sense
again from reading all this stuff that there is palpable
frustration here. This was a team that was winning nine

(34:32):
games a year with Luke Fickle, went to the playoff
with Luke Fickle. So I think it's fair to wonder
if six wins, if that's what it ends up being,
is enough progress to cool the hot seat. I don't
know the answer to that. We have Cincinnati fans who
listen way in. Let me know Solidverbo atgmail dot com.
But that's a really interesting situation.

Speaker 2 (34:52):
College fans being increasingly frustrated with Scott Sadderfield is something
that I feel like I've written down seven straight years.
I don't even know how many years. It's also a
program that you know, bouncing around conferences. But you would think,
given location, given the wide open nature of their current
major conference, that Cincinnati would be as well positioned as

(35:13):
anybody as a program that wins with a bunch of
different coaches. I guess, short of Scott Saderfield and Tommy
Tupperville that this is just a winning program and now
with more resources and more attention, it can only help things.
The first you know, non power conference team to go
to the college football playoff, and it just feels like

(35:34):
they're in a little bit too much mud.

Speaker 1 (35:36):
Still, if I've got Cincinnati ninth, I've got BYU tenth,
and I share your uncertainty with BYU.

Speaker 2 (35:47):
Yeah, I don't know how anybody could be certain of
BYU right now. It's a Utah State transfer from a
couple of years ago coming in who appeared to be
the backup heading into the season, and because of the defense,
because of the returning quantities on offense, BYU seems like
a program that has the highest upside to move up

(36:07):
because everybody's kind of putting him in the middle of
the conference right now because we don't know what we're
going to get out of this offense. It's specifically at quarterback,
and so if you don't know that right now, it's
hard to feel super confident in mid July.

Speaker 1 (36:19):
So Jake Rehetzlif amid well, you can go and read
what's going on with Jake Retzlaf, sure, but amid honor
code violations and a civil lawsuit and all sorts of
stuff going down there, he has withdrawn from school and
he is now I guess actively shopping himself out there
to other teams. Our friend John Kurtz, who was on

(36:41):
the show, writes an open for business newsletter, said that
Oklahoma State might have some interest in Reds left they should,
West Virginia might have some interest in So there's a
chance we will see him elsewhere in the Big twelve,
but at time of recording, we don't know if that's
going to come to fruition or not. I tend to

(37:01):
trust in Kialani Sataki, and the reason that I trust
in him is because I didn't trust in him a
couple of years ago, and he proved me wrong. Not
that he needed to prove anything to me. I remember
reading preview publications and everybody was high on Kilanie Sataki
as a coach. This is a guy who's going to
figure it out. This is the guy who knows what
he's doing. And at the time, I said, why, why,

(37:23):
why is anybody giving him the benefit of the doubt.
He's proven to be a really good coach since and
I don't know how he handles this thing with the
quarterback leaving the team so late in the game. I
don't know how he handles it with so much new
in the secondary. I think it's tough to be high
on BYU given what's new out there, but I also

(37:44):
don't expect this to be a total disaster of a season.
Like if we come back to this conversation six months
from now and we're talking about a seven and five
or an eight and four BYU team, that is not
what I'm expecting. But if that's the way that this
thing goes, I just want everybody to have expected it,
because Kilani Sataki finds a way to weather these storms.

Speaker 2 (38:05):
The important thing, too, is there if you're talking about
a wide open conference, you're generally talking about a lot
of teams who have a bunch of answers on offense
and a bunch of quests or not offense on one
side of the ball and a bunch of questions on
the other side of the ball. Last season in the
Big Twelve, only one team finished in the top forty
of points per drive scored and points per drive allowed.
That's BYU. That means it's a roster. That means it's

(38:27):
good coaching. That means it's finishing games. That means it's
creativity on offense. He's you know, had to shuffle through
coordinators and Kalani Sataki has found answers and he built
the most over the course of the season. Obviously, they
didn't beat ASU and that cost him a trip to
the Big twelve Championship game. But he built the most
complete full season team of twenty twenty four. And that's

(38:49):
something you talk about Chopped coaches, correct. I think Kilanie
Sataki is very much a chops as in the show Chopped.
You give him a bunch of ingredients, he'll figure it out.

Speaker 1 (38:59):
Yeah, he's going to figure out a way to make
a delicious dish out of this. I don't know how,
but he's going.

Speaker 3 (39:06):
To do it.

Speaker 2 (39:06):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (39:07):
I've got Byu in here tenth. Not super high on
BYU given circumstances, but again I put them in kind
of my meaty middle tier yep. And the last one
at the very bottom of this tier. For me, I've
got Houston. I'm higher on Houston than I expected.

Speaker 2 (39:23):
I may lose a lot, but okay.

Speaker 1 (39:25):
Upgrade at quarterback. Connor Wigman comes over from Texas A
and M, and honestly, it's just everything you read about
Houston screams. Willie Fritz knows what the hell he's doing.

Speaker 2 (39:40):
He's a great year two coach.

Speaker 1 (39:41):
Yeah, screams that there is a plan that they are
being deliberate with how they use the transfer portal. There's
not really any panic. It's just a guy who knows
his craft and it's very calm. It may not pop yet,
but they are just making slow, methodical upgrades in many

(40:05):
cases through the portal, and it's going to be an
improvement over what we saw last season. Don't be surprised
if Houston takes somebody big down. Don't be surprised at all,
because this is a team that played with fight. They
didn't have the record, but I think slowly but surely
Willie Fritz is going to find a way to make
them better. So I've got them at the bottom of
my middle tier.

Speaker 2 (40:26):
Yeah. The only concern is if you're going to say,
like I don't have faith that Jalen Daniels is going
to be healthy. In what world can you have faith
that Connor Wegman is going to be behind a patchwork
offensive line, And so you're basically you get three and
a half five and a half games Connor Wegman and
then if it doesn't work out physically, it's back to
Xeon Chris. That's I guess that's why you don't have

(40:48):
him in your first tier. All the losses and the
patchwork elements of this roster. But yes, the best of
Connor Wegman is interesting. I like a couple of these receivers.
But I'm with you. You got to pick somebody to
be a sleeper, and you're speaking with your chest. I
appreciate it now.

Speaker 1 (41:02):
I did go through phonetic spellings for a lot of
these guys. Okay, I believe it is Wigman Wigman, and
that pains me because you know, I'm a Wegman's guy.
I know.

Speaker 2 (41:14):
So you're talking about like wigg would be.

Speaker 1 (41:16):
How w I have it written here? W ig First off,
he spells Connor with an E instead of an O, yeah,
which is weird. Secondly, it is spelled w E I
G M A N. And it's pronounced Wigman like he's
working a whig.

Speaker 2 (41:31):
Hey, it's his name. He can pronounce it however you want,
do whatever you want.

Speaker 1 (41:34):
I listen. I'm not criticizing. I'm just saying for the
people out there who see this Wigman fair enough. I've
got a tier in here with just one team, and
I hope people don't take offense to the title of
this tier. I'm ready to listen, but I frankly didn't

(41:55):
know what else to call it. I'm calling this tier
Jesus take the Wheel, okay, and the only team in
it is Oklahoma State.

Speaker 2 (42:04):
Oklahoma State ahead of Colorado.

Speaker 1 (42:06):
Yeah, okay.

Speaker 2 (42:08):
Explain.

Speaker 1 (42:10):
I can't call it a rebuild because it's not really
a rebuild. But we've got two new coordinators, a ton
of transfers, questions literally at every position. Mike Gundy coming
off of what sounded as if a very tumultuous off
season in which they almost got rid of him. He

(42:33):
had to take a million dollar pay cut. He took
the pay cut. Now he's using the portal. It feels
like there is a lot of let's say, motion to
create emotion, not necessarily sold on what they're doing on defense.
There is just so much upheaval and so much going
down that it can't help but feel, at least to me,

(42:56):
like there's a lot of desperation here of just trying
to do a million things that wants to make the
whole thing better, and I don't know if any of
it will.

Speaker 2 (43:04):
It's hard to see after these last couple of seasons
or I guess last year.

Speaker 1 (43:08):
Yeah, there is just a lot of stuff going on,
kicking up dust, Mike Gundy throwing up his hands. We'll
see what happens.

Speaker 2 (43:20):
So two of the past three seasons have been catastrophic
for Oklahoma States. They replace basically all of their offense
and I think basically all of their defense this year, right,
Do I have that right?

Speaker 1 (43:34):
Yeah? Yeah, I'm looking at it right now.

Speaker 2 (43:36):
And so there's a lot of chaos and stillwater. Will
he won't he stay? Regarding Mike Gundy? And who do
you bring in to steady the ship on defense? Todd Grantham, Okay,
all right, yeah.

Speaker 1 (43:54):
I jotted down here to quote the wise prophet Cosmo Kramer.
Sweet fancy on that, Todd Grantham, higher, Yeah, forty one transfers,
forty one transfers. I look at this roster. I'm reminded
of the quote from Major League quote. Who are these
FN guys? So many quotes this episode. You're really in

(44:15):
your bag. I like it. I really went deep with
the Big twelve.

Speaker 2 (44:19):
Okay, who are these guys? I think mostly UTEP players.
If I had to guess, UTAP also lost like forty
guys does everybody in this conference have at least one
UTEP transfer. Yes, there are minors spread throughout this conference.
That's m I n eers. Let's be clear. Yeah, it's

(44:40):
tough to see. I can't squint and see much good
happening in still Water this year. It's just it doesn't
seem like the recipe for a bounce back year. I
mean for a lot of these teams. I guess after
in that like that's Cincinnati BYU Zone as soon as
we start lumping in UCF, Arizona, West Virginia, Oklaho home
of state, and maybe Colorado. Though it's a little bit

(45:04):
easier with Colorado to squint because the step forward they
took on defense whole offense is basically new for Colorado.
But I just lump those in. I think those are
just your snakes, man, They're gonna come out of the
toilet at some point. Those are just the snakes residing
in residential plumbing that you're probably not gonna see them

(45:27):
a bunch doing all that scary a saturday. But occasionally
they're gonna, you know, they'll slither out and take a
big old bite out of something hanging down. It's just
I don't see a ceiling beyond that for a lot
of these.

Speaker 1 (45:40):
Every time I sit, yep, I think of a snake
in the toilet.

Speaker 2 (45:45):
Of course, how could you not.

Speaker 1 (45:47):
I feel like we have caused undo, mental damage, mental trauma.
You know, the big thing we should be doing is
if we're going to introduce the concept of a snake
in the toilet, we should also introduce a service that
desnakeifies residential plumbing desnakeify dot com.

Speaker 2 (46:06):
Buy it desnakeify dot com. You know the rule in movies,
by the way, if you if you ever say a
r l out loud or show it, you have to
buy it before the movie comes out. Yeah, all right, continue?

Speaker 1 (46:17):
Uh so, Yeah, I've got Mike Gundy in the car,
hands up, screaming, hair blowing in the breeze. Hope we
don't crash. See what happens? Right, one last hurrah? That's
how it felt, mailing in the wind. Yeah, Jesus take
the wheel. I've got Colorado. Next, he talked about Colorado
there for a second. I've got four teams at the bottom. Yeah,

(46:40):
I've got Colorado. I've got West Virginia, I've got UCF,
and I've got areas.

Speaker 2 (46:44):
And you have Oklahoma State ahead just because of track record.

Speaker 1 (46:48):
Just because of track record. Yeah, and I felt weird
about that because usually I don't subscribe to that the
way that many of the preview publications do. He's legitimately
a very good coach. Very good coach, Yeah, incredible coach,
and he's been there for a long time. There is
also this thing with Gundhy when just kind of like,

(47:08):
when you count him out, he finds a way to
make it work, which again I went to a roster
with that, though I know I hate leaning on that,
but I'm going to give him benefit of the doubt.
I'm not picking them the like win the conference. I've
got him fifth from the bottom or fourth from the bottom,
fifth from the bottom, eleventh in the conference. But yeah,

(47:31):
I don't know. Colorado's next up for me? Colorado. I look,
Colorado's defied expectations for two straight years under Dion. The
first year was an incredible grand opening with what they
did against TCU.

Speaker 2 (47:48):
Okay, I was ready to see where you're gonna go
with incredible for a four and eight team, but yeah, no.

Speaker 1 (47:53):
It was incredible opening. They were able to build off
of that. People talked about Colorado maybe the most talked
about four to eighteen that you, yeah, last season a
good season. It's like indisputable that it was a good season.
Travis Hunter wins the Heisman, obviously should or provided a
lot of highlights. Both are gone now, Yep, the wide

(48:15):
receiver room is cleaned out. They're gonna need to lean
a little bit more heavily on the defense, new quarterback.
There's just there's a lot new on offense, with that
being the strength that was a year ago and now
basically role reversal, we got to rely on defense. I
can't go higher than this With Colorado, I.

Speaker 2 (48:34):
Think that's that's reasonable. It's rotation guys at receiver, it's
another patchwork offensive line. I think Jordan's seatons, I mean,
I know he's still there, the left tackle. He was
a very good freshman tackle. The defense, especially that secondary,
was what led the way last year. And there are
pieces back, but they're another team. We were like, Okay,
new quarterback, new line, new full time starting receivers. They've

(48:58):
been a god awful running team. So there's not a
ton safe to lean on, and so Shador was obviously
good enough to do so much of it on his own,
you know, paired with Travis Hunter and a good receiving
corps last year. And just because they're gone doesn't mean
they can't find new guys. But it just feels like
there's too much new in the same way that this

(49:19):
sort of sensation appears for a lot of teams across
the country. And what are you leaning on that's very
good right now when you do lose the pieces that
they lose on defense as well. So I think they're
gonna be fine. I think they're gonna be competitive. I
just don't think they're gonna be consistent.

Speaker 1 (49:38):
And honestly, that wouldn't be so much of a black eye.
You know, they're losing two of the all time great
players in the program. Agree they leaned a lot on
those guys. Sometimes it takes a minute to try and
figure out what happens next. I think that's okay. Also,
it's worth mentioning, just like I said at the top,

(49:59):
with the Colorado bit, Colorado has defied expectations two years
running in some way, shape or form. It would not
be a big surprise if they did it again. I
don't know what that looks like. But if they did
it again here again, if we're talking about the six
months from now and Colorado ends up being better than expected,
that would be more of a trend than a bug,

(50:20):
because it'd be three years in a row.

Speaker 2 (50:22):
The good news, by the way, for Colorado is their
schedule features a ton of unknowns and half teams and
opening night is opening night against it's Georgia Tech. But
that's at home. Yes, I believe the Colorado game. There's
not a lot of proven good teams until the end
of the year for Colorado, so they might have some

(50:44):
space to figure things out.

Speaker 1 (50:46):
I've got West Virginia and UCF in a rebuilding tier.
Say it's a full on rebuild for Rich Rody, switching schemes,
new coordinators, new I mean new roster.

Speaker 2 (51:00):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (51:01):
UCF is in the same boat, and there is uncertainty
pretty much everywhere on offense. Did you see Scott Frost's
quote at media Day? You didn't see this?

Speaker 2 (51:11):
Oh about Nebraska?

Speaker 1 (51:12):
Yeah? Ah, what a quote?

Speaker 2 (51:15):
Got to pick better jobs? Yeah, I don't want to
go was pressured into it. That's what you want from
your head coach, just immediate, no accountability. Yeah, that's what
you want.

Speaker 1 (51:29):
I saw that. My jaw dropped when I saw I'm
sure it'll go great. My jaw dropped in.

Speaker 2 (51:34):
I understand. I think the message he was sending and
the manner he was sending it were two very different things.
I think the message he wanted to send was man,
I didn't realize how good I had it here. I
couldn't make it work in Nebraska, and that's on me.
But I think UCF is a lot more special than

(51:55):
I really gave it credit for when I decided to leave.
Or that's why leaving was so difficult, because I found
UCF to be so special, and Nebraska is special to
me in its own way. Sure, but I think I'm
more cut out to be a UCF coach. And that's fine.
That's not what came out. No, that's and that's okay.

Speaker 1 (52:16):
You know what he did not rehearse before he gave
that answer.

Speaker 2 (52:20):
Let me also be clear, if that's how he honestly feels,
and you can take a very clear exception to it.
But if that's how he feels, I appreciate honesty. Sure, Okay,
that's all.

Speaker 1 (52:35):
I've got UCF here, one from the bottom, and then
I've got Arizona at the very bottom.

Speaker 2 (52:41):
You have Arizona after West Virginia and UCF I think
this is a hot mess. It's a hot mess. Well, okay,
so there's a bunch of new players everywhere. They hired,
in my opinion, a much better and much more proven
defensive coordinator in Danny Gonzalez. Right, he's taking over his

(53:03):
three three five for Duyna Kina, who is going back
to Texas. I believe yep, no fa Fida loses. The
best wide receiver in program history is Setdeggy guy.

Speaker 1 (53:12):
He likes Set Daggy.

Speaker 2 (53:14):
He's making the rounds. He is making the rounds in
this sport.

Speaker 1 (53:17):
Did you say on slack collecting team Merch?

Speaker 2 (53:19):
Yeah, he's a Merch all star. Five five schools in
five years, I think is the number right now. It's
still not quite Brendan Marion, who's like seven or eight
schools in light or nine years, who's now at sax State.
A lot of buzz around sax State, by the way. Yeah,
I know, I don't know if I'm a huge Set
DGGA guy, but I can appreciate an improvement from year

(53:42):
one to year two. Unfortunately, with as much going out
and coming in with Arizona, it doesn't feel like they're
on the most solid of ground, So I'm with you
in terms of like, they definitely qualify as a snake team.

Speaker 1 (53:56):
To me, we heard from multiple people last year that
there were active conversations about whether or not they were
going to retain Brent Brennan. Right, obviously they did. They invested,
I guess something into their nil instead of buying him out.
But there was sort of this sense that he was

(54:18):
in over his head. Yes, I liked him at his
previous style. I liked them at San Jos at times. Yeah,
but there was definitely a growing sense that this guy's
not going to be able to get it done, but
he's getting another year here. Just does not feel like
a good situation to me. Does not feel like a
good situation. To me, I'm more of a skeptic this
year than it was last year. You've got to be

(54:41):
a full on escape artist to avoid the wrath when
year zero essentially occurs in year two, which is what
it feels like for me this year with Arizona, it
just feels like a total reboot.

Speaker 2 (54:55):
So the schedule isn't like horrific for Arizona, whatever that
means to you. They have Kansas State at home. Iowa
stayed on the road BYU is at home. Colorado's on
the road.

Speaker 1 (55:07):
I mean, Baylor's on this thing. They're at Arizona for
the time at Oorial Cup, Kansas is I mean, but
we have no idea if.

Speaker 2 (55:16):
This is a tough schedule or not. As I say this, no,
we don't.

Speaker 1 (55:19):
You're right about that. I mean, nobody knows anything in
the Big twelve.

Speaker 2 (55:22):
We're also not that far off, Like a year and
a half ago, you'd have to go further than a
year from Noah Fafida being one of the more encouraging
young quarterbacks in the nation. That was under a different coach,
different offensive coordinator, throwing at different receivers protected by a
different offensive line. But in terms of talent, there is
talent there at quarterback. He just had a down year

(55:45):
and saw so many ghosts last year and year one
of Brent Brennan.

Speaker 3 (55:48):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (55:50):
He took him out of games and it was unfortunate
to see.

Speaker 1 (55:52):
If you read some of the preview publications. I'll throw
Phil Steele out there, because I know he was talking
about this in in his write up. Right, Phil Steele
does a good job. Tends to take the most optimistic view,
which actually is a breath of fresh air. Frankly, he
tends to think, well, no, feat is just going to

(56:15):
snap back to his previous form. Yeah, that's it was
an aberration. It was a one off last year. We
can't assume that that's going to continue. Well maybe it
well maybe it will. You lose, as you said, your
best receiver program history. Who also was I think a
close friend of his.

Speaker 2 (56:34):
Yeah, of course, they played in high school together.

Speaker 1 (56:36):
You know that that tends to leave a mark. So
I am not at all optimistic about Arizona. I've got
on bottom of the pack. Okay, So here's the way
this thing shakes out for me. Let me go through
my one more time than I want you to do
the same, just because we have a little bit of
a disparity here. I've got in this order k State,

(56:58):
Iowa State, Arizona State as my top three, Baylor, Texas Tech, Utah.

Speaker 2 (57:07):
So are those three teams in a different tier than
your top three?

Speaker 1 (57:10):
They're all in the same tier.

Speaker 2 (57:11):
Okay, So this is the top six. So you just
broke that's right, part one and part two of your
top six.

Speaker 1 (57:17):
And then after that we've got TCU seven, Kansas eight,
Cincinnati nine, BYU ten, Houston eleven, Oklahoma State twelve, Colorado thirteen,
and then West Virginia, UCF, and Arizona in that order.

Speaker 2 (57:36):
Okay, I have Arizona State, Kansas State, Texas Tech, Iowa
State space Yeah, right, Baylor, Utah, TCU space. I'm gonna
put Kansas, Colorado, and BYU in that next area space space,

(58:02):
and then I have just snakes. So my snakes are Houston, Cincinnati,
Oklahoma State, West Virginia, Arizona, UCF. Okay space space.

Speaker 1 (58:16):
Yeah, there, tiers of the Kingdom, Tiers of the Kingdom.

Speaker 2 (58:22):
Those are my tiers.

Speaker 1 (58:23):
So is that then to assume that you've got Arizona
State over Case State in the title.

Speaker 2 (58:28):
Game, I've got Arizona State over k State in the
title game. Yes, repeating as Big twelve champs Case State
with offensive firepower, with my assumption that the combination of
Avery Johnson and Matt Wells is going to be fruitful
for the Cats, that the offensive line with a bunch
of transfers will come together, if I'm gonna you know,

(58:49):
I still don't love where they're at in terms of
proven guys on all three levels of the defense and
the issues that the defense had last year. But if
you're starting point is a promising, talented quarterback, good skill
position dudes, and a winning coach and Chris Cleman, I
think they're right there. Yeah. My issue is my answer

(59:11):
with Cliss Cleman is that he always seems to be
good but not great. Yeah, like he's just a good
coach who doesn't play for Big Twelve championships all that often. Yeah.

Speaker 1 (59:21):
I think you can be a good team though and
win this conference. You don't have to be a great team.
And he's won this conference before. You don't need to
be a great team to win the Big Twelve. And
again I say that not to try and dunk on
the Big Twelve. I love this conference. This conference is
beautiful with a capital B. But there is a lot

(59:41):
of parody, let's say, in the upper half of the conference.
I mean, frankly, if you wanted to, if you wanted
to be very optimistic, you could find a way to
put TCU in your contender tier. They're going to have
a really good offense, they've got one of the better
quarterbacks in the league.

Speaker 2 (59:58):
They finished last year so quietly strong. Oh yeah, we're
almost doing a disservice not putting them in our top tier.

Speaker 1 (01:00:07):
I agree, I absolutely agree, and.

Speaker 2 (01:00:10):
I imagine there's a decent chance I will regret not
doing it come you know, mid October.

Speaker 1 (01:00:15):
But so there are a lot of good teams. I
think we are going to wait and see to find
out if any of them prove to be great. Yep,
I've got k stated over Iowa State. Oh no, ASU, No, No,
Texas Tech No, okay no. I like Baylor. I understand
the path for them to get into that game. I

(01:00:35):
like Texas Tech not as much as I like Baylor,
but I also understand the path for them to get
into that game. Arizona State. To me, what's holding me
back is the Camp Scataboo thing.

Speaker 2 (01:00:46):
Oh, I'm not that you're really that worried.

Speaker 1 (01:00:49):
I am.

Speaker 2 (01:00:51):
You think he's that irreplaceable.

Speaker 1 (01:00:53):
I think he's irreplaceable, And I also don't I don't
think you can assume that Sam le It is going
to progress linearly, you know it, like especially now losing Scataboo. Yeah,
I don't know if it's fair to assume that he's
just automatically going to get better.

Speaker 2 (01:01:15):
I mean, ASU is basically without their number one receiver,
a miss targeting call away from ending up. I know,
the College Football sat Collegebale playoff semi finals and beating Texas.

Speaker 1 (01:01:26):
I get it.

Speaker 2 (01:01:27):
On a quote unquote neutral site, I get it. Okay,
I get it.

Speaker 1 (01:01:31):
I'm just the Skataboo thing is spooking me out here.

Speaker 2 (01:01:35):
Is there anybody in this conference you'd rather have calling
your offense than Kenny Dillingham? No, I mean it's Kenny
Dillingham and Marcus Arroyo. But the creativity, because replacing camp
Scataboo isn't finding the next Camp Scataboo, it's finding the
next person to just find the same or comparable amount
of grass as Cam Scataboo. However you find the grass

(01:01:56):
is your choice. Camp Scataboo found it. Run through spleens,
but you could be faster. You can run around, you
can run over it, you can run above whatever. So
that's why I'm not as worried that they have a
creatively minded coach, creative minded coach and running backs on
this roster. I think they'll be all right.

Speaker 1 (01:02:18):
There's a strong possibility that we're going to have like
a four way tie a top this absolutely yes, you know,
I think we're foolish to assume that there's any kind
of clear cut one and two in whatever your contender
tier looks like, it may look different than Dans or mine, like,
you can write into the email address or to anywhere

(01:02:39):
we're on social media and let us know what your
tiers look like in the Big twelve. But I think
it's a near certainty that we're going to see some
sort of tie breaker situation here with this conference, just
because it feels like the margin between the top and
the middle is so thin, if it exists at all.
But for me, it's the scataboo thing. It's a scataboo thing.

(01:03:01):
And also the turnover look thing, which again, I know
that this is a really strong culture that Kenny Dillingham
is building, and I know that some of those stats
tend to reflect effort more than anything else. I'm just
not there. I'm not there. It wouldn't surprise me if
they want it, don't hedge, it wouldn't surprise me.

Speaker 2 (01:03:23):
But no, I'm not picking it. I'm not picked Okay, okay,
fair enough, I'm not picking it.

Speaker 1 (01:03:27):
And I did go back and forth between K State
and Iowa State, but I'm gonna stick with K State.
I just think it's a really good schedule. I like
Avery Johnson, I like Dylan Edwards, I like Matt Wells,
and I like their Front seven.

Speaker 2 (01:03:41):
And you like your wife who's currently playing Zelda.

Speaker 1 (01:03:43):
I like my wife. Where's this at tears in it?

Speaker 2 (01:03:46):
Is she good at Zelda? Is Zelda a priority game
for a gamer like herself?

Speaker 1 (01:03:52):
A priority game? I think?

Speaker 3 (01:03:53):
So?

Speaker 1 (01:03:53):
Yeah, actually plays Zelda more than other games. Okay, see
she does the state. It's one of those open world games,
but there's like a million things to conquer. If you
want to, you can beat the game, but then you
can continue playing afterwards. Sure, I don't know if that's
where she is at with this one. I have not
gotten the recent update from her, but she was of

(01:04:14):
the mind that she just wanted to go and conquer
like all of the little mini challenges within this ginormous
world of the video game. Okay, so she basically was
playing it for like two and a half years.

Speaker 2 (01:04:25):
Solid, wife Kate conquering Zelda challenges, the big twelve tiers
of the Kingdom.

Speaker 1 (01:04:30):
Now in the books, all right, I've got k State
over Iowa State. You've got Arizona State over k State. Yep,
let us know what you have by writing in solid
verbal at gmail dot com, or of course you can
find us out on social media. Would love to hear
from you.

Speaker 2 (01:04:46):
Be nice.

Speaker 1 (01:04:47):
But if you want to call us an idiot or
a clown or not doing our research, we've already gotten
those comments. It's fine.

Speaker 2 (01:04:55):
Hold on, but you can text tie too. Six one out.
What's the number? Give it out real slowly? No, okay,
it is six to one. Oh though, right, that'll narrow
it down.

Speaker 1 (01:05:06):
Six one, I've got they got a sign behind me.

Speaker 2 (01:05:08):
Six. There you go.

Speaker 1 (01:05:11):
Why don't we leave it there? As always, feedback is appreciated, yes,
if not required. As part of being in the verballer hood,
hit follow, hit subscribe. If you made it this far
and enjoyed what you heard. Verbowlers dot com is where
you can go again for ad free episodes, bonus content,
a whole bunch of other perks.

Speaker 2 (01:05:32):
Yeah, any sourdough thoughts, by the way, I'll take those
two were right. We're squarely in the middle of bulk fermentation.
You still have the bread yips. No, they've been better.
They haven't been baking Frisbees lately, which has been nice.
The bread has been tasty. It's a stiffer starter for
this fermentation tie. A little less water in the starter, Okay,
I did a little bassonage. Yeah, so that's adding water

(01:05:53):
different stages of the domax. I'm feeling really good about
a strong, dependable, soured.

Speaker 1 (01:05:59):
O'bake tomorrow morning, stiff stiff starter.

Speaker 2 (01:06:03):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (01:06:04):
Well, I hope the bread turns out and is everything
you ever wanted it to be.

Speaker 2 (01:06:09):
I hope so too.

Speaker 1 (01:06:11):
I'm glad that you're able to bring a little bit
of sour dough to this here big twelve conference.

Speaker 2 (01:06:16):
I bring that funk, ty, you know me.

Speaker 1 (01:06:18):
We will be back on our next episode and we're
going to talk through half of the conference.

Speaker 2 (01:06:25):
More in depth team talk.

Speaker 1 (01:06:27):
Yeah, more in depth team previews, just like we did
with the ACC on the last two episodes. You're just
gonna have to wait and see which eight teams we select. Okay,
that's true. Let's leave it there.

Speaker 2 (01:06:40):
Got gray with that.

Speaker 1 (01:06:41):
A little bit of suspense for that guy over there,
my good friend Dan Rubistein. For myself, Ty Hillebrand, thanks
for tuning in, Thanks for joining us here. Hope to
see you on the next episode. In the meantime, As always,
stay solid, peace,