Hamlet (3.4), Week 3: "A Mother's Burden" - Confronting Gertrude | The Rehearsal Room - The Working Actor's Journey

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>> Paul Nicholas (00:00):
Kathleen.

>> Kathleen (00:02):
Yeah.

is there anything about
Gertrude? After
watching Slash, listening to our session
last week, is there anything about
Gertrude or her lines that you want to
comment on?

yes, I think one important
note which we could go down the road
of, oh, he brings all this stuff
up to make her feel guilty. And the black and graded
spots, her looking inward
can be related to perhaps
on the audience's point of view, she's looking inward

(00:43):
and feeling guilty that she was, in
part aware or in part,
caused the death of her, her
husband. I don't happen to
think personally she's that
woman. I think she's. I think the
important thing about Gertrude, in my opinion

(01:06):
is she's first a mom.
She's not a Lady Macbeth. She's polar opposite,
in my opinion. She is not a
self starter. She is a responder.
She is the woman that responds to her son
feeling bad, badly,
acting out poorly,

(01:27):
even if it's in front of her. she does
admonish him as much as she can, but I think
once she says
he's mad, that
for her that turns the whole situation.
If in Shakespeare's day one
was deemed to be mad,

(01:49):
it wasn't just like, oh, send them to an
insane asylum. It was, they are possessed by the
devil. And it's very
dangerous to have that
going on
in court. He's the prince
you don't want to be. You

(02:09):
know, letting him hang out. It's
dangerous for him to stay.

Right.

So I think she does everything
she can to, if not make
excuses, she does
kind of go to her husband. Oh,
he's upset because of its art or hasty
marriage. And I think her looking inward
is perhaps, perhaps, and I'm

(02:36):
certainly willing to be talked down on this.
for those that might not agree,
I think when she looks
inward, she's looking inward
to the point of
rethinking what harm
she might have done her son by

(02:59):
this marriage and this,
seemingly, turning her back on
their family. And, you know, this is, feels
very human to me when I
look at movies or hear stories about
parents that divorce or separate

(03:19):
or are widowed and then
marry again or find
a new boyfriend or girlfriend. The child
is a huge deal in that
situation.
Then if one can support
my feeling, and then I'll shut up soon.

(03:41):
But, if one can support my feeling that
mother and son have grown up fairly close
together with a kind of an absent father who
was off. He was an a personality out fighting
wars. he was the big
bully guy and he grew up
with her and it's no wonder that

(04:01):
he's a philosopher. It's no wonder that he
fights with himself because he had. There's a
feminine quality, in his
character that he's fighting against, I feel,
like the big feminine. Like.

Like especially in this version.

Correct. Yeah. Well, you can take it any way you
want, but I feel like.
Part of perhaps why he reacts so
negatively against womankind,
you know, the weakness of
womankind is the fighting
in, fighting that part of

(04:37):
himself, the part that
is not demonstrative, the part that
is reactive, the part that is willing to
look at the gray and, you know,
equivocate, perhaps that he sees that as
weak. But he's grown up in the shadow of
a dad who. There was no
equivocation. You just go out and you kill people

(05:00):
and you do this, you know, Anyway,
so. So I think she's a mom.

There are lots of topics in there to unpack. I want to
say, first of all, I'm glad that you raised the.
The thing about he's mad. And I would say to
the Hamlets, think,
about that when you are saying to your
mother that I'm not mad, but mad in crap
because being labeled as mad is. Is,

(05:28):
as Kathleen said, would really be bad.
and I have a question for you, Kathleen, which you may have heard me
ask in last week's video.
Does Gertrude at some
point believe
that Claudius is responsible for Senior
Hamlet's death? And B, when

(05:50):
in the scene does that realization
come to her? If it does.

So he's. If I'm not
mistaken, he makes reference to
Claudius being responsible
early on before I say he's mad, right?

I think so, yeah. Hamlet
says, to kill a king. I. Lady, it was my work.

Yeah, to kill a king. What are you talking
about? And then he goes on to explain
certain things, but
then when the ghost,
okay, so I'm going, okay, does he. Is
this. I can even justify
Gertrude going, wait a minute, did he.
Did my husband. What happened? You know, I

(06:38):
can understand that she would be drawn into
that story, but
when he starts saying that he's
talking to that guy over there that isn't
in the room. That's the
explanation. Oh my
God.

So you think that, you start to
believe that Claudius is responsible for it?

Quite possibly. Quite
possibly. And then the train of
this play really, in my opinion,
starts in this
scene. The train of it. The
pace starts here or
perhaps even starts after
the players, you know, after,

(07:23):
Claudius runs out. Okay.

I think it starts.

Train starts. But I Mean, for. For
Gertrude. I think she's kind of like,
how do I make it better for my son? How do I make
this better for him? so.

So I just wanted to get to that one little
fine detail. Does she ever
accept or start to accept
that Claudius was responsible for her. Her ex
husband's death? She has to. She has to.
But I want. I'm wondering where. I
think someone said last week that. Or am

(08:00):
I thinking of some other conversation about Hamlet, that she doesn't
realize it until the final scene,
which is why she intentionally
drinks the poison. I don't know if I buy that. I don't know that.
I don't buy that she knows that it's poison, which.

Well, we've all been. We've all been in situations
where someone tells us something about
a husband, a wife, a lover, a friend even,
who has abused us in some way
or abused a situation in some way. And we
don't have evidence, but

(08:35):
if the story is palpable enough,
we look for signs going forward.
And I think there's time
for Gertrude to kind of do a little bit
of a double take, like,
you know, to examine him a little bit more. But again,
she doesn't, because

(08:57):
shit happens, Ophelia.

Examine who? Claudius or Hamlet?

Yeah, but there's no. From
here on out, there's no, tete a
tete between she and Claudius. There's other stuff at
play. Ophelia dies.
you know, there's all this other stuff to
occupy the situation.
And it just gets worse where I

(09:23):
think, and this is what makes I feel
her a heroic character and not simply a
tragic character like Amelia is. Simply,
to me, Amelia. And Othello is
simply a tragic character. I think
Gertrude is heroic in that
at the very last moment,

(09:44):
she sees the ruse, she sees
what Claudius has done. She sees that
there's a plan to kill him with a poison. With poison.
And she picks that damn cup up and she
looks at him, perhaps, and drinks
it right on down. Because the last word
out of her body is Hamlet.

(10:07):
She's reaching for her son. So,
Emilia also realizes
just before she's killed. But I don't think she's
a heroic character. I think she's a victim of the
situation. But both of them
are reactive characters.

In my opinion, that's what we should do next as a fellow.
Okay.

Huh?

I said that's what we should do next. Is Othello.

Oh, I'm dying. That role again.

I have a question for the
Hamlets, the Hamlettos,
the Omelettes.
the bit about
not this. By no means that I bid you
do. That whole thing which

(10:56):
we have said is sarcastic.
Do you think that Maxis Hamlet should say
that bit instead of Charlotte's Hamlet?
Would, Would the Charlotte's Hamlet that we have come to
know and love, would that Hamlet

(11:16):
speak in reverse terms like that. Would
that Hamlet just come out and say, don't do this?
I don't know. I'm just, asking. How do you all feel about that?

>> Charlotte Northeast (11:27):
Well, I, I mean, I, I'm not on board with the
sarcastic take. So
that to me, I haven't thought of it in that term.
So, to me I can, I m. Can make it work. I
see how it works. But I, you know, if, if you feel
like it should be flipped, you can talk about that. But
I, I don't think it's

(11:48):
sarcastic. I think it's something else.

Here's my challenge. If
the one sentence, one sentence
me up in that whole thing, and that is
toward good, you let him know.
What else could that be but sarcasm?
Because we know for sure Hamlet is saying
don't tell him. we know that for

(12:13):
sure Hamlet is saying don't tell him. Hamlet is not saying
tell him. Hamlet is saying don't tell him. But the words
that he uses for in
this case she is toward good you let him know. How
could that not be sarcasm? And that's a real question. I would love for
somebody to help me to understand that that sentence is
probably my least favorite in the entire, entire

(12:33):
canon because it just makes no sense.

boy, I can think of something.

What would you let him know? It has to be sarcasm to
me, in my opinion.

I don't think it's sarcastic, personally.

What is it then? For who but I'm not even reading it, but
for who but a queen, fair
wise, whatever would keep such a thing from
a, From a spider, a bat.
that whole section is weird. And
I know we can play it and make it work, but I
would like to know what it is. I'd love to

(13:08):
explore it.

Twere good you let him know. I think could be
a warning for her to pass on to
Claudius that he knows exactly what the fuck
is going on. He knows.

That's out of context though, that doesn't it?
Toward good you let him know. Let me, Let me pull it up.
Toward good you let him know comes right after don't
tell him that I am essentially, I'm not in madness, but
mad in craft.

(13:42):
I said I. To me. I said there is no
sarcasm in Shakespeare.

That he's not an idiot.

He's saying it wouldn't work. And the. The great
mind Gideon Rapoport put me in my place.
He goes, oh, there's lots of sarcasm all over Shakespeare.
And he gave me some examples.
Hm.

Make sure he knows I'm not a fucking idiot.

No, but the Hamlet is saying, don't tell him that.
Let him think I'm mad. That's exactly what he's saying.
Right? Am I right? Somebody tell me.

my brain, I don't read it that way. No,
you don't read it.

That he's saying, don't tell him that I'm not actually mad.
M. So you think
he's saying to her, tell Claudius that I'm mad in
craft.

That I'm not really crazy.

Right.

There's. There's method to. To my madness.

Well, it might be the game of. If you let him know
this, Claudius isn't going to believe me. But that's
on fucking him, isn't it?

Well, now we're getting really complicated now. We're
adding layers upon layers.

Okay, look, see on,
line 199,
just above that. So again, good night. I
must be cruel only to be kind. This
bad begins and worse remains
behind. Okay, that is a
signal perhaps to the actor from

(15:14):
the author that. Okay,
we're tying this up now.

Yeah.

But, then he goes one
word more, good lady.
He's changing tack, in my opinion.
Yeah, he's completely changing
tack. That what he just said
was, you know, don't go. You
know, don't go to his bed. It's so gross.
You know, boys thinking of their mothers having sex

(15:43):
is kind of gross. And we don't want to go there.
We don't want to have dirty semen sheets and all
of that. But
for whatever reason, in my
opinion, because it's a good reason to
kind of drive ahead with action

(16:03):
here, which is what he kind of does now in
the play. He starts being much more active.
Is. So again, good night. I must
be cruel. Only do kind. This bad begins and worse
remains behind. That sounds like a. Ah, fucking exit line if I
ever heard one. Right?
Yes. But then he thinks of something

(16:25):
else. Wait a minute. One more word.
Okay. Don't. Don't do what I just
said. Look, here's another idea.

No, no, that's not. He's not saying. He's not saying.
He's not saying don't do what I just said. He's saying, don't do what I'm about To
tell you, this is not answering my
question.

Oh, wait. I was taking,
you know, following through of what? I was just
suggesting that
B, I D
refers to what I just bid you do.
No.

Which was what?

Which was don't go to his bed. It's gross.
I don't want.

That was near the top of the scene.

No, correct. It was. It was the top of the page.
Right. So he
goes.

So, the new B to my uncle's bed tonight. That was where.
Help, somebody.

Yeah, that. Yeah.
line.

Throw, away the worst of part of it. Yeah, throw away the worst part of it.

So that was 180, line. 180
is the beginning of the new idea. Don't go to his bed.
Right.

But go not to my uncle's bed.

Okay.

Huh?

Okay. But then that beat kind of
in the way I'm seeing it, ends this
bad begins and worse remains behind.
And now there's something. There's a
shift. One more word, good lady.
Not this by no means that I bid you do.
Don't do what I just said.

Now, I think there's a
beat change earlier,
because when Hamlet is done talking about how
habit can change
your natural instinct and
either hold the devil or throw him out with wondrous
potency, that idea is over.

(18:23):
And Hamlet says, okay, good night.

Yes. Okay.

and now we're going to talk about Polonius for this body
that I just. This mistake that I just made.
I'm very sorry about it, but I'm going to take care of it.
So I don't think. I don't see how. By no
means that I bid you do could refer
to don't go to my uncle's bed. Oh, okay.

All right.

And it. And he says, not this,
by no means that I bid you do, which sounds very present.
Not. Not that by no means that I bid you
do, which was passed. I don't know.
I'm. I'm. I'm riffing here. Somebody else. Am I
way off?

>> Cassie (19:01):
Because I agree with the folks who are,
making the point that playing sarcasm and
irony is not very interesting. And I
wonder if instead there is some play
acting at madness perhaps
because we've reached, a
level of earnestness that feels maybe a little bit
uncomfortable and backpedaling in

(19:24):
order to shroud in some, like
antics. it's a complicated relationship,
Hamlet and Gertrude and I. I really loved what,
Kathleen was saying earlier about Gertrude being
a mother first and foremost. And then
this second marriage maybe feels like the first
time in a long time that Gertrude has done something for
herself, thinking first about herself and

(19:46):
not about her son. And that. That
has created a tremendous and kind
of world. Like the.
Hamlet's universe is off of its axis
because of that. And it's easy to get
fixated on on the death of his father
and on the new kingship of
Uncle Stepdad, all of that. But.

(20:09):
But we haven't really talked about. About
this relationship and what that broken trust
means.

And when you say we, you mean us in this room or you mean.

>> Cassie (20:19):
In the play in this room. We have not talked about
that very often. And that's not really an angle that
we've introduced into the playing here of. There has
been a lot of earnestness and. And
I wonder if, Because
it feels so uncharacteristic,
it is a tactic change. What if we are playing

(20:39):
at introducing some sort of madness from. From
a sense of like feeling like we
got. We got too close to being very
painfully real and now have to change
this up because I can't be honest with mom
anymore. And look what she's done. Or
a sense of having like
disclosed, really disclosed so much of

(21:02):
the plan to mother, who's not
entirely a trustworthy person. Or
is Hamlet hedging some bets by
reverting to this play acting at mad.
certainly the line is contradictory. And
if we want to play it actively as
being not sarcasm. I wonder if it's

(21:22):
feigned madness for a purpose of establishing some
distance with Gertrude once we have.
We've really been very close for such. For so
much of this scene.

Okay, we could try that. But when you say
the line is definitely contradictory, you're saying
for good. You let him know is not what he means.

The notes that I'm reading say, say.

Just answer that real quick, Cassie. Is that what you mean?

>> Cassie (21:52):
I was talking about the the double negative at the
top of. Not this. By no means. I bid you do.

Like he's.

>> Cassie (21:58):
He's backpedaling and being. We have
seen Hamlet, who we acknowledge as being a very
intelligent person. We have seen him speak clearly
and now this is a different
type of rhetoric than we've seen from him. He's kind
of ping ponging back and forth. There are double
negatives all over the place.

(22:19):
That's not a Hamlet that we've seen before.

Right. Okay. Sorry, Charlotte, go ahead.

The notes that I'm saying say that that line means
after this general statement of negation, Hamlet lists the things he would
have Gertrude not do for, for example, go to bed
with Claudius.

Right.

So It's a reiteration, just in a
different form of, what he's already
said.

Just, just to fine tune it a little bit.
He's. He has already said don't go to
bed with Claudia. But what he's saying here
is don't let his
foreplay and his flirtation
get you to tell him that I am actually not mad.

Yeah, Paul, you're right. I think you're
right.

In the, in the exchanges before, it is
should be clear to Gertrude that he's not mad after the
ghost leaves. I mean, other than talking to
a ghost that Gertrude can't see, that's evidence that he's mad.
But the conversation they have after the ghost leaves,
it should be clear to Gertrude that he is not actually
mad. And he just said, okay, I'm going to put the body

(23:24):
away because this is going to. The, the,
the aftermath of this is going to bring more trouble
down in my head. I have to deal with it. It should be clear to her
that he is not mad. And he says, bye, I'm gone.
And then he goes, wait, I have one more thing to tell you.
Don't tell him that I'm actually not mad.
Right.

Right. No, Paul, thank you
for. Thanks for parsing all that because I
think, I think you're right. I
think you're really right. I was really off.

Max had his hand up. Kathleen, hold on. Go ahead.

>> Max (23:58):
I didn't want to interrupt the flow, but I, I've been looking at
the passage and it was striking
me as like incongruent to have
him go like, twere good. You let him know.
And I think another way of looking at that whole section
could possibly be starting with a reiteration
of like, don't go to bed with him. But then there's a

(24:18):
turning point when he says, and let him for a
pair of ricci kisses. So it could be like saying,
don't go to bed with him, but let him
get this information out because it would be good. You let him know.
So that could be seen as a turning point.

I think you have to look at the beginning of the sentence though.
Don't do this. Don't let the bloke king tempt you
to bed, pinch wanton on your cheek, call you his
mouth and don't let him. I think it, Max,
I think.

It'S all one idea. Don't let him do all those things
to get you to talk about what just happened. Yeah, right.

>> Max (24:51):
And that's how I saw that. That's how I understood it
initially, but if I'm looking for
a reason for him to say to a goody, let him know I'm
led to that possibility. That that's like an antithesis kind
of thing. Like, don't go to bed with him. And
then there's maybe a double meaning with Richie kisses, where it's like,
on the one side, it's disgusting and vile, but also reaching,

(25:11):
like, from afar. Richie kisses,
like, let him get this information out. Because you're a
queen and you have no reason to hide information from him,
and he's just a vermin. That's just the
only way that I can. Like, if I'm looking, trying to look at
it from another angle. That's what comes to mind.

Further thoughts, because I have to tell you,
I love the way Charlotte is playing everything
up to that line.
Don't let him come flirt with you and kiss you on your neck
and start pillow talk. And then you let
the secret out that I'm not mad, but that line
is just so weird for

(25:55):
good. You let him know.

I've always read it as a bit of a challenge.
Their relationship is so complicated, and
I think this is the most fractured we've ever seen it.
And they're trying. There are moments of them trying to reconnect.
And Hamlet's very bad at it in this moment.

(26:19):
and. And I wonder if it's. I wonder if it's a. The way I've
always read it is like, if I put this out there, what
are you going to do with it? And that's a test.
I don't know.

That's just the thing that's
good about letting him know
that is
that I, Mama,
will stay on the side of my son,
m. The fair, sober, wise woman,
and direct myself away from the

(26:52):
evil, the
pattern, the bat.

Yeah, and I agree with that because also the. The next
part that we go into is about the school fellows
and about the plot. So Hamlet's
mind is going into the political.
It's going into the strategy part.
It's coming out of all the emotion and being like, oh, fuck,

(27:17):
now I have to expand the lens because, I'm
being sent to England. Remember that, Mom?

Also, do we think that if
I were to let the king know,
let my husband know that he's
only doing this as craft that's
actually more dangerous and grounds for,
like, legitimate murder right.

Now, like, way more dangerous.

So he is protecting him.
We would be protecting Hamlet
if I agree not to.

Right. And that's the challenge of hey, mom, Whose side are
you on?

Yeah, and so. Right, great.
So,
I must to England, you know, that is not.
Remember we talked a couple weeks ago? Like, that's not a question.

Right.

It's almost as if to say,
that's the whole reason why you
shouldn't alert the king
that I am crafty in my.
In my behavior.

Right.

Let him, think I'm crazy.
It's a weaker place for him to
view me, not as a challenge to
him who's crafty and trying to
take, control, you know?
Anyway.

>> Max (28:40):
Yes, Max, another thought.
kind of harkening back to what the
ghost says about, like, look to your
mother's face, look at the concern and, like,
kind of address
that, and calm her. What if there's a beat
shift between but madencraft

(29:01):
and then seeing the resistance on Gertrude,
and then he changes his tactic about toward good.
You let him know because he's asking her to essentially
lie. And it's like, it's good to let him
know. Like, that is good. That is virtuous, but
because you are a queen and you have no reason to hide.
But I'm asking you to do something that's not good. I'm asking you

(29:23):
to lie. I'm asking you to conceal. And I know that's
beneath you, but, like, who would do that?
Because it's needed. And then she does agree to do it.
So why else would she agree to do it if he's, like, acting
erratic and crazy?
Unless he's, like, taking that moment to be like, I know you
want to do the good thing, and it would be good to tell him.

Because you're sense, Max. I
like that. Yeah.

>> Max (29:51):
And then because it's ending with questions, it's like,
like, such, like a queen who's virtuous and sober
and wise wouldn't hide from a vermin
or a bat. But, like, who would do
that? So he's asking her to do something that's not
queenly.

And the word good scans on the,
strong beat.

Yeah, that's
better than the idea that I was about to come up with.
So are you saying that Hamlet is
saying. Yes, I understand
that it would be the right thing to do to
always tell the truth.

(30:33):
And so therefore, who would do so is
the test right?

>> Max (30:38):
Like, would you do this for me?

Who. Who would.
Huh? Huh?

So in order, he's saying, twere good, you let him know.
Could that be, as you just said, Max,
a response to,
her perhaps looking like she's not going to
go for it. And he's saying it's not bad, it's
good. It twere good you'd let him know
because you're good.

Because, that's confusing again because what we
said, what we're saying is that it would not be good for my
situation as Hamlet for you to let him know that I'm being
crafted.

>> Max (31:17):
I think there's a difference.

By the way, Charlotte, I think this whole, whole
section, Hamlet is thinking politically. The
fact that he has to
bestow Polonius's body
somewhere, that's a political thing.
not letting Claudius know that he's
putting on an anti disposition and

(31:40):
knowing that the trip to England is coming up and he has a plan for
those two rats.
This is fascinating stuff.
I was going to wonder if the other meaning of the word
let would be useful. And that is to
leave. To leave

(32:02):
someone alone. To let them alone. what line
toward you let him know?
I was wondering if it's possible that that could
mean it would be
fine if you let him think what he's thinking. Just leave him
alone to think what he's thinking.

(32:24):
instead of it sounding like twere good that you told him,
I wonder if it would mean that you
just leave him alone and don't tell him. Right. But it
still doesn't make sense.

(32:50):
can I do this? Is everybody looking at that line toward. Would you let
him know? Can we just
give M. Hamlet that line? So M. Hamlet, you
start your bit from there.
So C. Hamlet says, I'm not
in madness, but mad in craft. And M. Hamlet comes in
and takes it to the end.

>> Max (33:10):
Yeah,
that makes sense.

Or should C. Hamlet say who would do
so?
Huh? Huh? What do you think, C. Hamlet?
if who would do so? Is the test to say, do you love
me more than, more than

(33:38):
your political obligations?
Is that what we're saying with that line? Who would do so?

Well, what good
mom and queen who's fair, sober and
wise would,

If M. Hamlet is saying,
yes, I know that it is the right thing to do
because. Because of who you are and how
virtuous you are, you would do that. And then the line
about who would do so
Is a test to see, are you going to go
along with what I just asked you by not telling him

(34:21):
if that's a test? And then she says, believe
me, I don't have enough breath to say to speak what you just
told me. If that's a test, which Hamlet
should say, it doesn't really matter.

So in other words, but be thou assured, if words be
made of breath, is her
saying, I don't know. I can't do this.
And then his answer is, I must
to England.

Wait, what do you mean you can't do this? I think be
the. I think, be thou assured. You're saying, I understand
what you just asked me to do, and I'm on board. I think that's what you're saying.
No.

Right. But I. I can't. I. Okay.

I.

>> Max (35:01):
To.

Yes, Max.

>> Max (35:03):
To bridge these topics. I think, I think it makes
sense to me. M. If M says,
who would do so? Because it's
tying that in with twere good you let him know
because as a queen, you're virtuous and sober and wouldn't hide
a thing from even the worst vermin. But,
like, if that's what a queen would do. Are you a queen or

(35:24):
are you my mom? Who would do this for me?

Okay. I mean, that's exactly what I was thinking. So I was wondering
if C. Hamlet should say it, but I'm okay either way.

Yeah, no, I wasn't.

Charlotte was. Charlotte was nodding
as you were saying that. So I'm assuming.

Yeah, I wasn't inclined to. To ask the question. I think it
takes the fuel away from what Max has
just set up in that section.

Okay. All right.

>> Max (35:49):
I think.

Yeah.

>> Max (35:51):
And like earlier.

Go ahead.

>> Max (35:56):
Well, I was just going to piggyback on what you said earlier about how
they do come from such a close background where
they relied on each other so much in the absence of the father.
And so in this moment, he's asking, like, are you a queen or are
you my mom who would, like,
keep this secret with me, even though it's not what a virtuous
queen would do?

So. Okay.
Right above the bottom. Above
210.
Hamlet's, talking about making you
ravel all this matter out, right?

Yeah.

And I think it's you, Paul, and
you, Max that were correct
when I say. And I never ever so.
Thank you. I never read this line this way,
but the word assured
is her agreement, right?

I think so.

Assured. I
will not. I can't. I
couldn't allow him to kiss
my neck and grav. You know,
turn on you. Right.

I, will. What she's saying is I will not breathe a word of a word of
this.

Yeah, I never ever
read the line this way before. Thank you.

>> Max (37:17):
It's interesting that she only mentions like, I will
not breathe a word, but she's not agreeing to the
touch and the bed stuff. She's just agreeing
to keep the secret, essentially.

Which is his point. I mean, it's really his
point. He knows they're.
He knows she's probably enjoying it.

Okay, I'm moving on.
really quickly. Line 229
for. Tis the sport to have the engineer hoist
with his own petard.
I have all.
Any production I've been in, it's been engineer. But the word
in the folio or in the second quarto

(38:02):
is engineer. Do we have strong feelings
about that?

Either way, Lexicon doesn't say he's ever
used the word engineer, ever.
Only engineer.

Does it mean the same thing? Does it sound better
Engineer? You want to say it one time,
Charlotte, and let's hear it.

Sure.

From Let it work.

Let it work. Which is the sport to have the engineer
hoist with his own petard. I'm not a fan of it.
It's a word that people immediately go.
And I'm never a fan of creating a wall when
we don't have to. Sorry, that's
just my own thought. it's like Mutiny last week.

well, you're not going to like what I have to say next.
Engineer. Engineer.
It does sound more muscular. Engineer sounds
more muscular. The.

The lexicon says,
the later
folio and some middle. I'm
sorry, I don't understand all of this. contrive.
That it means contriver,
inventor. Not merely the person that
runs the train, but the actual

(39:29):
heart of the source
of the. You know,
the contriver of the, of the
engine. And it's a military
term.
Contriver of means for military
purposes. So he's. I

(39:49):
feel. I feel like Hamlet's changing me.
Changing here. He's becoming a different
Hamlet. But
that's just neither here nor there.

this. This one's not a big deal in terms of meaning.
but in poetry, it does
sound more muscular. An engineer slows us down
a smidge. To have the engineer
hoist with his own petard is different than to have the
engineer hoist with his own. It's. It. It. Like,
engineer slows us down a little bit, but I'm

(40:24):
not really stressing over it.
but that's the. What you just read, Kathleen, is
the sense I got from the word engineer that it wasn't
just the person operating the machinery, it was the person
who. Who built the machinery.

Yeah. And it's a military term.

back then.

He uses it actually again
in hamlet in Act 5. And I, I. I
never My ear never heard the word before, but
I'd be interested to go to Act 5. Where is
it?

I don't think we have time, but if you have the line in front of you, just say the line.

Let's see.
Let's see. It's. Sorry.
I'm sorry. I can't, I can't find.

Well, I'm gonna. I'm gonna talk about something else while you do that.
Charlotte, you're not gonna
like this.
I've been thinking about it all, last week.
I miss mutine.

All right?

And I think mutine,
the contemporary audience will get that it's the verb
of mutiny. And, what we
decided to do was take out the. The
indefinite article that. Ah. so it's
mutine in a matron's bones. We
changed to mutiny in matron's bones.

(42:04):
Grammatically, that's. That sounds different.
And also, the word mutine sounds
more. I don't want to use the word muscular
again.
It sounds more energized. Mutiny sounds weaker to

(42:26):
me.

All right.

Because it has a weak ending. Mutiny sounds
weaker than mutine.
You don't love it?

No. But, hey, that's fine.

Let's try it.

Don't we have to parse our own
ear with. It doesn't feel right or sound
right with the actual reality
that these are the words. Maybe it's an editor's
mistake, but these are the words that are on the.
This is the poetry that the poet has written.
I don't think any poet would be okay with

(43:08):
you changing.

So I think Shakespeare is a living language,
and Shakespeare in especially today should be a living
language. And that, we.
We build accessibility. This is part
of a larger conversation, but we build accessibility when
we don't build walls intentionally with words
that might be adjacent to something
people already know. That's just. It's

(43:34):
not a hard and fast rule. I think there's exceptions to everything,
but it's just generally not where my mind
lands.

Yeah, I agree with that. Kathleen. There are certain words
like niggardly will never be
said in any production that I'm involved in. And I know
that's not what it means, but the way that
in poetry, how a word sounds
affects the audience. And we know what it sounds like in today's
audience.

Correct. And I. I don't personally think you can
interchange the two, like use one for
the same example. Do you know what I mean?
Mute. no,
I'm just.

My only comment was I don't agree with that. We should Never change
any word ever. I don't agree with that, but let's
try to. If we don't have to, let's try
to not.

>> Cassie (44:22):
That makes sense. I just think the danger is. And I'll. I'll side with
Charlotte here only because the words are so close that I
think the audience is just going to assume that she mispronounced
a word.

No, that.

>> Cassie (44:34):
That would be my thought. If I'm watching an online reading of something
and people say a weird word that's almost close to a word that I
know I'm going to be like, they just misread that.

So.

>> Cassie (44:43):
So I think it is easier to me to find a
word that has the same amount of syllables that
we understand what it means. or we
use it in our modern vernacular, which I don't think is dumbing
down the text, but rather, just as Charlotte
was saying, removing barriers to access. So we all come
at it from the same place. These were written 400 years ago,

(45:03):
and while we. We love the poetry of them,
there are things that just don't make sense to modern
audiences or that create a weird barrier.

There's nothing obscure about the sound of the
word mutine. There's nothing. We know. We
understand that. It's. That it's mutinous. We
understand that.

I don't know. I think you and I and the five
of us in this room probably do. But I think Kathy's point is.
Cassie's point is valid, that there may be people in a
regular audience who wouldn't, but it would take them a second
to go, oh, mutine. Related to
Mutiny. That's what she meant. I get it. You're right.
Cassie, you feel the same way about engineer. You think

(45:43):
engineer people would think that Charlotte mispronounced it
after seeing how skillful she is with the language.

>> Cassie (45:50):
I think that it. I think people are going to be like, what
didn't she mean Engineer? Like that. It's just. It's so
close. I think it's just a mental blip. And I would.
I would buy quickly the,
the alternative that Charlotte proposed. But also, I
don't. I don't feel precious about it. I just.
I wanted to pipe up and say that when.

(46:10):
When our goal is. Is to make things
more clear and less obscure. That,
That I don't. That I don't mind taking creative
liberties in order to get there.

Okay. All right.
Let, us start,
the next exercise, which
is scansion. And we probably won't be done
by 10, but we can Start next week with
scansion before we do our full read.
Oh, let me ask a question about the full read. Do you

(46:44):
all think we need stage directions? Do you think,
like, some. Someone should say, polonius hides behind the
aris. Is that necessary? Or after he's get
stabbed, Polonius falls on the floor. Do we need to say that? What do you think?

>> Max (46:58):
I think if I were viewing, I'd appreciate stage
directions. That's just me.

Yeah, because they're not seeing the script. They're just
hearing and seeing, I think, even if they know it.

Okay, I will look at the stage directions between
now and next week, and I'll have some set for next week.
Okay, let us
go through from tippy top,

(47:35):
including 33,
and just decide on
scansion and what I think
is a wise way to do it or a simple way to do it.
Not that wise. Just simple is to try to
read it in regular verse.
Not. Not like robotic, but like, for example,

(48:01):
bow stubborn knees, and heart
with strings of steel be soft as sinews
of the newborn babe. So it. It
makes sense. But I'm just trying to
apply the regular verse to
it and see where it doesn't work. For example,
bow stubborn. That clearly does not work

(48:23):
to me. In my mouth, that doesn't work. So I would go, okay, that didn't
work. So it should be bow stubborn knees.
So it's a trochee and an im. Bow
stubborn knees. Okay. And we can make
decisions about why that is, but I don't know that we really have to.
But I just want us to make decisions about what.
What the scansion is. Am I making

(48:44):
sense because my brain is foggy. Yeah.

>> Max (48:46):
I, have a question though.

Would you.

>> Max (48:48):
Would you like us to try to anticipate any, like,
breaks in that. Like, for example, Hamlet's first
line, which is a C line. just as an example,
it's like, now might I do it Pat? Now
he is a praying. Those now feel important. So instead of it.
Those being the. The low stress, would those be
like, would we anticipate those being a high stress?

Sure, you can if you see it coming. Sure.
I don't want us to jump ahead. Lines ahead. But
like, if you get to a line and you realize, oh, no, that's weird. That
should start with a stressed syllable. Yeah, absolutely.

Yet the stress on the first syllable of
the word stubborn can inform
the actor about how
to play the line.

Yes.

Not saying bow knees. He's
saying bow stubborn knees.

Well, these are the kind of conversations we can have.

Yeah.

This is exactly what I want to do.
let's go from now might I do it, Pat?

Now might I do it Pat? Now he
is a praying. And
now I'll do it.

How did that feel? Did any of that feel weird?

Yeah, it all feels weird.
Yeah, it's fine. Keep going.

Should that be a trochee at the beginning of the line?
So the stress syllable would be the now.
So it would be now might I.

(50:53):
Charlotte's not saying anything. I'm not sure she's listening.

I don't know. I my brain doesn't work this way. So I'm,
I'm trying to do some translation in my head.

well, well how would you scan that?
I'm wondering if it's stressed, unstressed. Unstressed
stressed. And then the rest of it is regular

(51:26):
or not regular.
M.

Well it's certainly an odd.
It's certainly an odd line and might give way
to showing us, telling us how,
how turned around he really is. He doesn't
say now will I do it?

We also, we're also going to have some at least
one three syllable foot in that line
because that's prayer has to be
stressed. And that gives us
Interesting.

That now is twice in there too.

Yeah.
So I think the second now is stressed
and the prey is stressed. So those
three syllables in between are either
attached to the now or attached to the prey. Or
two of them are attached to now the prayer. But clearly the

(52:30):
stressed syllables are now
do Pat. Now
pray. Those are the five. Yeah.

Yeah.

You could do the exercise that way, Charlotte. You could just go through
and figure out, I mean say the whole line, but figure out which
ones, which syllables are stressed,
where the five feet are. And I think that we might find a couple of
lines that have six feet.

Sure.

so go from now again and keep going.

M sorry, what do you, what do you want me to do? I'm sorry, I don't understand.

Just start again and then keep going.

But am I doing it? How am I doing it? I
don't.

Where do you think the stresses are? Okay.

Now, might I do it, Pat? Now he is
a praying and now
I'll do it.
And so he goes to
heaven.

And.

So am I revenged.

>> Max (53:54):
That would be scanned.

Does that feel weird?

No, it's fine.

>> Max (54:10):
Feels fine.

I think. You think stressing
the wood feels comfy?

>> Max (54:17):
Yeah, because he's thinking about it since like he's reaching a
conclusion. Like instead of like being so definite like
that would be scanned like that would be scanned. It's
like.

Okay.

>> Max (54:26):
It feels more thoughtful.

Okay, I like it. Keep going,
Max.

>> Max (54:33):
A villain kills my father and. And for that
I, his sole son, do this same
villain send to heaven.

Why?

>> Max (54:43):
This is hire and salary, not revenge.
He took my father grossly. Full of
bread, with all his crimes broad
blown. As flush as may.

Hold. Hold. With all his
crimes broad blown. Yep, that's right.
So broadblown. Broad blown is its own. I am.
yeah, that's lovely. Sorry. Keep going. Go ahead,
Charlie.

And how his audit.
And how his audit stands.
Who knows save heaven?

>> Max (55:21):
But in our circumstance and course of thought,
tis heavy with him. And am I
then revenged to take him
in the purging of his soul when
he is fit and seasoned for his
passage.

Hold. Tis heavy.
Tis heavy with him.
But in our circumstance and course of thought,
tis heavy with him. Tis heavy
with him.
Huh? Tis heavy with him.

(55:58):
And am, I then revenged.
So
heavy.

(56:20):
So heavy with him. Yeah,
never mind. Yes, the. The heav and the him
have to be stressed.

>> Max (56:28):
Okay.

This is another one with like 12 syllables that we
need to do. Some not
alighting, but some
expanding of feet.

>> Max (56:46):
Want me to take that one again?

no, no.
I'm just curious where the
irregular
lines are, because some of it is very regular. To take
him in the purging of his soul when he is
fit and seasoned for his passage. That has a weak
ending. So not totally regular, but so
much of it is regular.

(57:11):
Huh?
I'm, sorry. yeah,
go from up sword. Max.

>> Max (57:21):
Up sword.

Right after the notes. Line 92. 94.

What is it?

>> Max (57:33):
Thank you. I was scrolling back.
Absorbed and know thou. up
sword and know thou more horrid hint.
Absorbed and know.
Absorbed and know thou a more horrid hint.

This one's tricky.

>> Max (57:53):
Yeah, I think,
Upsword and know thou a more
horrid hint.

When he is asleep.

Hold. Hold a sec. So I think,
thou ah is its own.
I am unstressed,
stressed. The ah ah is not more stressed
than the word more. But thou, is
a totally fine. I am.
And know thou a more horrid hint is totally

(58:28):
fine. Even though is not as stressed as the
more. Am I making sense?

>> Max (58:34):
I think so.

So the feet. One foot is thou ah.
it sounds like an I am unstressed, stressed. Thou,
more har ID hint.
Okay, so I don't think we need to hit the ah that
hard. I hear you, but I do
think it starts. I think you were right. It Starts with a
trochee upsword and.

>> Max (58:54):
Know thou up sword,
and know thou a more horrid hint.

Yep, sorry. Keep going.
Charlotte.

When he is drunk, asleep, or in
his rage, or in the incestuous
pleasure.

>> Max (59:11):
Of his bed at game a,
swearing or about some. An act that
has no relish of salvation in,
then trip him that his heels may kick at
heaven, and that.

his soul may be as damned and black
as hell, whereto it goes.

>> Max (59:30):
My mother.

Would you want to say. Would you want to say then trip him.
By the way. By the way, this exercise is not to
like
restrain your creativity by saying we need to
observe all the scansion. That's not what this is about.

(59:51):
I just want you to understand what the scansion is
and think about why it is what it is. But when you get to
reading it, I mean, you do, you're going to read it like a human
being. a human being
who understands the poetry of it.
Sorry. So would you like to say then trip him or
then trip him?

>> Max (01:00:14):
I like the emphasis on trip.
It's more active.

>> Paul Nicholas (01:00:21):
And here's another example of but then.

>> Max (01:00:23):
But then. If you do emphasize then it puts more
emphasis on like, then trip him.
Like not now, but later.

A more horrid head.

>> Max (01:00:35):
I can see that too.

>> Kathleen (01:00:38):
But the sound of the word trip and the sound of the word
kick is an opportunity there.

>> Max (01:00:44):
Right. And trip him that his
heels may kick at heaven,
then trip him.

I think either way works,
man. Do you realize how many times Hamlet says heaven in this
speech?
Wow.
Sorry.

(01:01:17):
My mother stays
my.

>> Max (01:01:22):
I know that one's mine, I'm looking for it. My mother
stays.

100.

>> Max (01:01:26):
Thank you. My mother stays.

>> Charlotte Northeast (01:01:32):
This physic but prolongs
thy sickly days.

Oh,
He will come straight. Pray you be round with him.

>> Kathleen (01:01:48):
I warrant you.

Is this regular verse? I'll warrant you.
Fear me not, withdraw. It is.
Wow.

>> Kathleen (01:02:03):
It's actually nine beats. But I,
I am only dealing
with what's written on our
page here, not multitudes of
others. So,
if I'm working with a nine beat line,

(01:02:27):
I would take one beat before
withdraw.

Or you could take it before fear. Either one.

>> Kathleen (01:02:37):
Yes, Better. That's even better.
Okay. I'll warrant you,
fear me not withdraw. I hear him coming.

Yeah, because fear is stressed. Not is
stressed and draw is stressed. So taking the
beat before fear poetically is easier
or easier to hear.
Sorry. Go Hamlets.

Are, we doing stage direction there though, just for next week?
Like will there be something there we don't know yet.

Yes. I won't say enter Hamlet. Or actually,
I might ask, Cassie to read stage directions, but we'll talk about
that. But, I mean, it could be just.

As simple as Polonius hides. I mean that, you know.

Ah, that's brilliant. Thank you. Polonius hides.
I. It. It bugs me.
I think I'm going to put it. I don't want to make a decision
now, but I think I'm going to put it before
I hear him coming so that we
don't miss out on this shared line. But that's
me being a scansion nerd, and you

(01:03:45):
all can tell me to shut the hell up.

I just want to know. To expect it so we don't
step on each other.

I think I'll put it
before I hear him coming, But I'll make that decision during the
week. We have. We have time next week to rehearse a little bit before
we actually do it, so. But, yes, that's
a good point. Polonius Heights.

>> Max (01:04:07):
Now, Mother, what's the matter?

>> Kathleen (01:04:10):
Hamlet, thou hast thy father much
offended.

>> Max (01:04:14):
Mother, you have my father much offended.

>> Kathleen (01:04:17):
Come, Come. You answer with an idle
tongue.

Go, go.

You question with a wicked
tongue.

>> Kathleen (01:04:27):
Why, how now, Hamlet.

>> Max (01:04:29):
What's the matter now?

>> Kathleen (01:04:31):
Have you forgot me?

>> Max (01:04:33):
No, by the rude, not so.

Hold. Have you forgot
me? Have you forgot me? No.
Yeah, I think by the root is one foot.
By the rude. M. Have you
forgotten? No, by the rude,
not so.

>> Max (01:04:54):
I hear that.

Which is how you read it. that was the correction. That's exactly how you read it.
Okay, cool. Keep going. You are the queen.

>> Max (01:05:03):
You are the queen. Your husband's brother's
wife.

And would it were not so,
you are my mother.

>> Kathleen (01:05:13):
Nay, then I'll.

I want to give you. I want to give you an example of why I like going through
this.
And I do this on my own when I'm working on Shakespeare.
There are some lines that you just
naturally read a certain way for whatever reason.
We don't need to get into why. And then when you do the scans and you
realize, oh, it really should be the other way,

(01:05:35):
and one of them is, almost
everyone that I've ever seen play Hamlet says,
you are the queen.
No, by the root, not so. You are the queen,
which you can justify, but I think it's
how you just said it, Max. You are the queen.
I, So anyway, that's just me saying this is why I like these.

(01:05:57):
These scansion exercises, because you can find stuff, and you go,
oh, wait a minute. What does that Mean, what is the difference between
you are the queen and you
are the queen? There's a difference. And you may
choose to go the other way and that's fine, but as long as we understand what
the difference is.

>> Kathleen (01:06:13):
Yeah.

And you can justify either way. But this is why I love
this kind of stuff. I'm sorry for geeking out. Go ahead.
Sorry. Go ahead, Kathleen. Nay, then I'll set.

>> Kathleen (01:06:25):
Nay, then I'll set those
to you that can set. Speak.

that's an interesting line. N.
Then I'll set
those to you that can speak.
Nay, then I'll set those to you that can
speak. Huh?

>> Kathleen (01:06:48):
Nay, then I'll set those to you
that can speak.
Because maybe you're not letting me. I don't
know.
I have heard, in
fact, in the Kenneth
Brenna movie,

(01:07:09):
she stresses can, and it
makes sense,
in a way, but speak
is,
I'd like to try stressing
speak instead of.

I think it has to be speak. I don't know how you can stress can in this
situation, but I'm always willing to learn.

>> Kathleen (01:07:33):
Yeah.

But what was interesting to me is that there's an I am.
Those two is an I am set
those to you that can speak.

>> Kathleen (01:07:46):
Nay, then I'll set those to you
that can speak.

That's so interesting. You want to stress the can, don't you?

>> Kathleen (01:07:55):
Kind of. But,
there's something demonstrative about
not stressing the word can or making
the word speak speak
more.

Is there something that we have said earlier that would
make her go, you can't speak or I can't speak.
I'm going to find somebody who can speak. I don't think we've
set that up. So I don't know that we need to stress the can.

>> Max (01:08:22):
Well, I just said something rude to you.
Husband's brother's wife.

>> Kathleen (01:08:27):
Yeah. That can speak properly. That can
speak properly. That can,
not disabuse me.

Right. So I don't think stressing the word can would
help me to understand the story.

>> Kathleen (01:08:39):
No, I agree. I agree.

Okay. I'm so sorry. Keep going. Charlotte, come, come.

Come and sit you down. You
shall not budge.
You go. Not till I set you up a
glass where you may see the
inmost part of you.

>> Kathleen (01:08:59):
What wilt thou do? Thou wilt not
murder me?
Help, ho.

What ho. Help.

Now, now a rat dead
for a ducket.

Dead.

>> Kathleen (01:09:15):
I have a question.

Yes.

>> Kathleen (01:09:17):
After help ho.

Yes.

>> Kathleen (01:09:22):
There are five beats,
possibly
that, come in the middle of that line.
Help, ho, ba.
What Help. Ho, Help.
Right. If. If
we're treating Help ho and

(01:09:44):
what ho, help. As the
front and the back of a line.
I'm just wondering, you know, it's sort of
stupid on zoom to even think about it, but.

Yeah, there's not even going to worry about it. I'm not even.

>> Kathleen (01:10:01):
But there's an opportunity for action here. If it was. Were being
staged.

Yeah.
Okay. after Dead for a Ducket Dead, there will
be a stage direction.
oh, I am slain.

>> Kathleen (01:10:20):
okay. can you say that again, Paul?

Oh, I am slain.

>> Kathleen (01:10:24):
O me, what hast thou done?

>> Max (01:10:27):
Nay, I know not. Is
it the king?

>> Kathleen (01:10:32):
O what? Ah, a rash and bloody deed.

>> Max (01:10:35):
Is this a bloody deed?

Almost as bad, good
mother, as kill a king and
marry with his brother.

Let me ask a question. nay, I know not.
Is it the king?
That is clearly a short line. Right,
Is so.

>> Kathleen (01:11:05):
Yeah.

I don't think there's a line of prose in this whole
scene. So how should we treat
that?

>> Kathleen (01:11:13):
That I take a breath before I
say, oh, what a ration bloody deed is this?

Okay, cool. Done.
Sorry. Go ahead, Kathleen, ask. Kill a king.

>> Max (01:11:27):
Well, also, I could take a beat before. Nay, I know not where
he's like, nay, I know not. Is
it the king? Where he's trying to put it
together.

>> Kathleen (01:11:37):
That's another possibility. Yeah, that's. That's
really up to you, as the
owner of that part of that line.

>> Max (01:11:48):
O me, what has thou done?
Nay, I know not. Is it a king? So if
there's a foot before that, like, beat, beat.
Nay, I know not. Is it the king?

>> Kathleen (01:12:00):
Oh, what a ration bloody deed.

>> Max (01:12:02):
Is this a bloody deed?

Almost as bad, good mother,
as kill a king and
marry with his brother.

>> Kathleen (01:12:14):
As, kill a king.

Ay, lady,
it was my word.

>> Max (01:12:25):
Thou wretched, rash, intruding fool,
farewell. I took thee for thy better.
Take thy fortune.
Thou find' st to be too busy in some
danger.

Is some, Danger.

>> Max (01:12:38):
Yeah, thou find' st to be too busy.
Is some danger.

Leave ringing of your hands.

>> Kathleen (01:12:50):
Peace.

Sit you down.

Okay, this is a very interesting scansion.
What are the. What are the stressed syllables in this one?

Be more specific. What line?

what you just read, Lee. Ringing of your hands. Please sit you down.

I mean, to me it's always the verbs. So ringing and sit
are going to get the love.

And what are the other three? So down
for sure.

>> Kathleen (01:13:22):
And hands.

Leave ringing of your hands.
So of is also a stress. Not super stressed.
But in scansion world,
it's leave ringing of your
hands. Please sit you down. Or is it
okay you want to stress? Sit. Okay. Never mind. Okay, cool.

I mean, if this were staged, I imagine there's a lot
of hubbub and it's like.

>> Kathleen (01:13:54):
You know.

Get her down. You're not going to
fucking run away. You're not going to mess this up. Right now I'm in
charge.

Yes. Okay.
Sorry. Keep going back.

>> Max (01:14:07):
And let me wring your heart. For so I shall,
if it be made of penetrable stuff.

If damned custom have not
brazed it so.
Let it be proof and
bulwark against sense.

>> Kathleen (01:14:25):
What have I done that thou
darest wag thy tongue in
noise, sleep so rude against me?

>> Max (01:14:33):
Such an act that blurs the grace
and blush of modesty. Calls
virtue hypocrite.

Takes off the rose from
the fair. From the fair forehead
of an innocent love
and sets a blister there.
Makes marriage vows as
false as dicers oaths.

Hold, please.
I, don't want you to go nuts with this, Max, but,
A blush of modesty.
That is. That is. And I'm not
saying this is how you did it, but just keep in mind that is not a
weak ending. The. The why

(01:15:19):
in modesty is actually the end of a, Of
a stress syllable that blurs the grace and
blush of modesty. You should not read it like that. I'm not
saying you should read it like that, but just be aware that the
poet put that syllable in a
stress position.

>> Max (01:15:35):
Okay.

And think about why.

>> Max (01:15:39):
Can I try that one again?

Sure. Such an act.

>> Max (01:15:43):
Such an act that blurs the grace and blush
of modesty.
That was too much.

Yeah, yeah. You don't have to go nuts with it. But, but, but he wanted
you to get to the end of the word anyway.

>> Max (01:15:57):
The grace and blush of modesty.

Yes.

>> Max (01:16:05):
okay, so back to. Oh. Such a deed
as from the body of contraction plucks
the very soul and sweet release religion makes
a rhapsody of words.

Heaven's face doth glow
with tristful visage as
against the doom is thought
sick at the act.

>> Kathleen (01:16:29):
I me. What act that roars
so loud and thunders in the
index.

>> Max (01:16:36):
Look here upon this picture and on
this the counterfeit presentment
of two brothers. See what a
grace was seated on this brow.
Hyperion's curls, the front of Jove
himself.

I like Mars to
threaten or command
a station like the herald
Mercury new lighted on a heaven
kissing hill.

Hold, please. too little. Two little
words that. I just wanted to let you guys Know are in
stress position. That does not mean that they need to be hammered.
Just want you to let you know that they're in stress position. The first one
is. And on this.
Look here upon this picture. And on
this. You don't have to read it like that. And the other one

(01:17:25):
is or command. And I
like Mars to threaten or command.
I'm, just letting you know they're in stress positions. Those were not line readings.
Anyway. Let's keep going. Max. A combination.

>> Max (01:17:39):
A combination and a form indeed.
Where every God did seem to set his seal
to give the world assurance of a man.
This was your husband.

Look you now what
follows. Here is
your husband, like a
mildewed ear
blasting his wholesome brother.
Have you amazed?
Could you on this fair mountain
leave to feed and batten on

(01:18:16):
this moor.

Ah.

Have you eyes?

>> Max (01:18:20):
You cannot call it love.

For at your age the heyday
in the blood is tame.
It's humble and waits
upon the judgment. And
what judgment would step
from this to this?

>> Max (01:18:41):
Sense. Sure you have. Else could
you not have motion? But sure that
sense.

Max. Sense. Sure you have. How you want to
scan that?

>> Max (01:18:57):
I put the emphasis on sense and have.

Okay, I agree. Sorry. Keep going.

>> Max (01:19:04):
Sense. Sure you have. Else could you not
have motion? But sure that sense is
apoplexed. For madness would not err
nor sense to ecstasy was ne' er so thought
brawled. But it.
But it reserved some quantity of choice
to serve in such a difference.

I think the first way you were going was. Was correct.
But it reserved some. Yeah,
okay. I don't think the but is that important.

>> Max (01:19:33):
Okay. But it reserved some
quantity of choice to serve in such a
difference.

What devil was that
thus hath cozened you at hoodman
Blind.
Eyes without feeling,
feeling without sight,
ears without hands or
eyes. Smelling songs

(01:20:02):
all or, But a
sickly part of one true sound
sense could not so
mope.

Isn't that interesting? Listen to. Listen to how many
trochee Iams there are. Eyes without
feeling. Feeling without sight.
Eyes without feeling.
Feeling.
That's a very interesting line. Eyes without
m. Feeling. Feeling without. Without

(01:20:32):
sight. Feeling without
sight.
Eyes. Eyes without feeling.
Feeling without sight. That's
fantastic poetry.
Ears without hands or eyes.
smelling songs. All

(01:20:54):
fantastic. Sorry, Charlotte. Go ahead.
Could not so mop. Sorry, Max.

>> Max (01:21:01):
Oh, shame. Where is thy blush?

Rebellious hell.

What?

Ah, did we decide on this?

Whatever.

Well, I've got it all twisted now. So what. What is
the original line?

because I can't moutine In a matron's
bones.

Rebellious hell. if thou canst
mutine in a matron's bones.
To flaming youth let virtue
be as wax and
melt in her own fire.

>> Max (01:21:50):
Proclaim no shame.
When the compulsive.

Hold a second, Hold a second. Hold on a second. And
melt in her own fire.
Proclaim no shame.
Isn't that interesting that her is in a stress
position? And melt in her own fire.

(01:22:15):
Her referring to virtue or referring.
Her referring to virtue? Yes. To flaming
youth let virtue be as wax
and melt in. Yes. The, her refers to virtue.
Right?

>> Kathleen (01:22:29):
Yeah.

And melt in her own fire.

(01:22:55):
Yeah. Charlotte, I don't think
this is interesting. I like the sound of it
when we. When we hear own be
lifted in her own fire.
I like the sound of that.

(01:23:17):
But I'm m wondering if that's
better. I don't like the word better. I'm wondering how
does that compare to
and melt into in her own fire?
M. Let virtue be as wax
and melt in her own fire.

(01:23:39):
Let's have a conversation about it, everybody. What do you think?
And it's not a big deal, but it fascinates
me. Cassie, I see
an idea struggling to get out of your
face.

>> Cassie (01:23:52):
Yeah. I need to hear it out loud.
I think I'm having a hard time
imagining the implication. Does that make
sense?

Yeah. Meaning. Is that a nice way of saying it doesn't matter?

>> Cassie (01:24:09):
I would like to hear the two proposals
before I decide which one feels
juiciest.

You want to do it, Charlotte, or you want me to do it?

hold on.

I wish I could get paid to just do this. Just
talk about stupid
scansion in Shakespeare.

>> Kathleen (01:24:56):
Melt her fire seems to
be
an activity that he's trying to do right now
with his mom.

Yeah. I don't know if the virtue is. Is the her. Is
it the matron's bones? I don't know. I'm confused on
that.

Thou canst moutine in a matron's bones.

>> Max (01:25:23):
Well, if virtue is wax, isn't
that what's melting?

Let virtue be as wax.
And. And what is. What is
mutining in a, matron's bones? Is it hell?
Rebellious hell?

>> Kathleen (01:25:49):
I'm gonna.

Sorry, go ahead.

>> Kathleen (01:25:52):
I'm gonna take a guess that.
That she's mutinying mut
her matronliness.
And having joyful sex. Basically.

>> Max (01:26:09):
She's like, if thou can't mutine in a matron's bones.
It's like if you can.

>> Kathleen (01:26:14):
If you can turn into a. A youth, you know?

Right.

>> Max (01:26:16):
A rebellious Teenager. Like, if you can
rebel as an old woman, as you should
have in your youth, or as youth would.

>> Kathleen (01:26:25):
Yeah.

>> Max (01:26:26):
So can in a matron's bones,
to flaming youth let virtue be as wax.

>> Kathleen (01:26:35):
Do.

>> Cassie (01:26:35):
Do all the things you want to while you're young
and can enjoy it.

M.
Charlotte raises a very interesting question. Does he.
Does her refer to virtue
or the matron? And if hell.

(01:27:04):
If hell can mutiny take over
a matron's bones,
flaming youth, to the heat and passion of the
youth, virtue does not stand a chance.

(01:27:28):
But
we already knew that. Shakespeare.

>> Max (01:27:35):
I mean, is this a sarcastic line?
Because then he's like, mocking his
mother, like, oh, well, if you can mutiny in a
matron's bones, like, live. Live like a youth.
To flaming youth let virtue be as wax and melt in her own fire.
Proclaim no shame when the compulsive ardor gives the chase.
Since frost itself as actively doth burn

(01:27:57):
and reason panders will.

Yeah, it's. I don't know if it's sarcasm. It might be, but
it's certainly, passive aggressiveness for
short. because he's saying when.
When desire. When sexual desire is strong,
nothing else matters.
the compulsive ardor gives the
charge that even frost
would burn. When everybody's gets hot

(01:28:24):
and reason goes out the window and
gives into urges. Mm.

>> Kathleen (01:28:31):
Yep.

>> Max (01:28:34):
It's like panders means gives into.

No, let's look it up. Like, I think I know how to use it in
a sentence, but I don't know exactly what it means.

>> Max (01:28:43):
Oh, you're pandering.

You're just pandering to. Yeah, you're
like, kissing up to. Right.

>> Max (01:28:49):
Or you're just agreeing to gratify or
indulge.

>> Kathleen (01:28:54):
Yeah, reason. Reason
panders to will.

Yeah.

>> Max (01:29:00):
Like allowing the will to indulge itself.

>> Kathleen (01:29:03):
Correct.

>> Cassie (01:29:06):
And, in the line previous the
analysis I'm reading, credit her
to be the fire of the
woman's lustful loins, according
to this analysis. But I don't know
how much credence we want to give that.
So virtue,

(01:29:26):
like wax, is melting when it comes into
contact with your lady
parts.
Yes, melted because of stuff that's
happening. And I hope that that is the.

>> Kathleen (01:29:41):
Sound bite from this week.

M.

>> Cassie (01:29:52):
You know, it's all chased up here in the Shakespeare zoom room, you
know, always.

>> Kathleen (01:29:58):
You know, the. The fact that he goes on and on about
this makes me
really understand, it goes without saying almost
how much Gertrude has changed,
you know, in her new
marriage, in her. I, Think she's been having a really
good time

(01:30:20):
up until now.

>> Cassie (01:30:23):
I. I love, love, love that reading of
Gertrude. I really do. I think it makes so much
sense. I find it very compelling.

>> Kathleen (01:30:32):
Yeah. I can even think of her as a. Almost
as a party girl. You know, she.
You know, she's enjoying herself.

Yeah.

>> Kathleen (01:30:43):
And Hamlet's like, mom, what the heck?

All right,
let, us move on. And all I
will say is I just. I think,
Charlotte, that that is a
regular verse line. And melt in her
own fire, proclaim no
shame. I think that's as close to regular.

(01:31:11):
let's keep going. Oh, hamlet, speak no more. 99.
No chance we're getting to the end before 10. But let's see.

>> Kathleen (01:31:18):
Oh, Hamlet, speak no more.
Thou turns my eyes into
my very soul,
and there I see such black and
grained spots as will
not leave their tinct.

A.

But to live.

>> Kathleen (01:31:42):
In the rank sweat.

Of an enceamed bed,
stewed in corruption,
honeying and making love
over the nasty sty.

Okay, hold on a sec.
In rank.
This is an interesting line in terms of scansion,
because there's no way you can leave
rank unstressed
or sweat. We need to. Both of those words need
to be lifted.

(01:32:18):
So.

>> Kathleen (01:32:23):
So you could actually
say of an M very quickly, because
the vowel sounds of an in of an
m seemed of an in m.
But.

But seem is stressed. So I like that an
is in a stressed position of an. Of an.
And seem at bed. And because
of an is an I am to itself. That's a foot
to itself. So I. I don't like running over the
end. Got, it of Ann and
seemed bed. I mean, you don't have to say it like

(01:32:56):
that, but sweat.

>> Kathleen (01:33:01):
Yeah, but.

But how do we treat the first two words of that
line? Do we say in the rank sweat or
do we stay. Do we run over the. In the.
In the rank sweat or
in the rank sweat? It's. That's the
beginning is what we need to iron out. And once we do,
it'll be amazing.

>> Kathleen (01:33:23):
Well, everything is one syllable except the word
encyemid. And that might
give you some
currency. To stress
the. And sweat
and.

Or stress in nay. But
to live in the rank sweat.

>> Kathleen (01:33:47):
In the, ranks of
an enceament.

Hamlet really means this.

>> Kathleen (01:33:55):
Yeah. Yeah. It's not flowery
there.

Highlighting a lot of words.

>> Kathleen (01:34:00):
Yeah.

What do you think, Charlotte?

Yeah, I can. Yeah, I'll hit the stresses that need to be hit.

Yeah.

I. Yeah.

Stewed in corruption.
All three of these. Yeah. I think in Is.
I think this is a trochee. To start all three of these
lines in the stewed
in over all three of these, start with a
trochee.

(01:34:48):
Okay, cool. Where were we? Oh, speak to me no
more.

>> Kathleen (01:34:52):
Oh, speak to me no more. These
words like daggers, enter in
my ears
no more. Sweet Hamlet.

A murderer and a villain.
A slave that is not
20th part the tithe
of your precedent lord.
A vice of kings
cut purse of the empire
and the rule that

(01:35:25):
from a shelf the precious
diadem stole
and put it in his pocket
no more. King of
shreds and patches.

Kathleen.

>> Kathleen (01:35:46):
Yeah?
I think there's a beat before I say no more.

Yeah, I think so too. Even though it looks like an interruption. I think
there's a beat.

>> Kathleen (01:35:58):
Yeah.

Yep, we're missing a stressed
syllable. And in his pocket
no more keep. Hm.
A king of shreds and patches. The ghost enters. Go ahead.

>> Max (01:36:18):
Save me and hover over me with your
wings, you
heavenly guards.

Whose piano is that?

>> Max (01:36:27):
It's on my end. It's in the space. I'm in a
shared space.

Gotcha.

>> Max (01:36:33):
Save me and hover over me with your wings,
you heavenly guards. What would your gracious
figure.

>> Kathleen (01:36:43):
Can you say that last line again?

>> Max (01:36:46):
What would your gracious figure.

>> Kathleen (01:36:48):
Alas, he's mad.

Do you not come your tardy son to
chide that
lapsed in time and passion lets
go by the important acting of your
dread comes command?

>> Max (01:37:04):
Oh, stay.

Oh, say, do not forget
this visitation is but to wet thy almost
blunted purpose. But look, amazement, m on thy
mother sits so. Step between her inner fighting soul, Conceited,
weakest body, strongest works. Speak to her,
Hamlet.

>> Max (01:37:23):
Speak to her, Hamlet. How is it with
you, lady?

And I don't think this is a shared line. I think. I think you can take your time
before you say it. Okay? Because you're trying to come up with like, oh, speak to
her. Okay. What am I gonna say? okay. I'll try this.

>> Max (01:37:36):
How is it with you, lady?

>> Kathleen (01:37:40):
Alas. How is't with you
that you do bend your eye on vacancy?
And with the incorporeal
and with the incorporeal heir do
hold discord
forth at your eyes your spirits
wildly peep.

(01:38:02):
And as the sleeping
soldiers in the alarm your
bedded hair, like life in
excrements, start up and
stand on an end.
O gentle son,
upon the heat and flame of thy

(01:38:23):
distemper sprinkle
cool patience. Whereon do you
look?

Very, nice, by the way. When? Next week. I
want to talk about what this passage Means. So think
about it over the week. Or you and I can email about it during the week.
Not now. fourth at your eyes. Do
you want to say fourth at your eyes or fourth at your
eyes?

(01:38:51):
Or you can think about it. Let's keep going.

>> Max (01:38:56):
On him.

On, him.

>> Max (01:39:00):
Look you how pale he glares.
His form and cause conjoined. Preaching to
stones would make them capable.

Okay, hold a sec. His form and
cause conjoined and then
he goes to a trochee. Right? Because that can't be
preaching. Could it be preaching to stones? It
needs to be preaching to stones, right?

>> Max (01:39:26):
Preaching to stones.

There's a little weirdness in there. His form and
cause conjoined. Preaching to stones. So
it disrupts the rhythm a little bit. I wonder
why would make them capable.
Sorry. Go ahead.

Do not look upon me,
lest with this piteous action you convert
my stern effects.
Then what I have to do will want
true color. Tears
perchance for blood.

>> Kathleen (01:39:59):
To whom do you speak this?

>> Max (01:40:02):
Do you see nothing there?

>> Kathleen (01:40:05):
Nothing at all. Yet all that
is I see.

>> Max (01:40:10):
Nor did you nothing here
know nothing but ourselves.

Why, look you there. Look
how it steals away.
My father in his habit as
he lived.

>> Max (01:40:27):
Look where he goes even now,
out at the portal.

>> Kathleen (01:40:33):
This is the very coinage of your brain.
This bodiless creation
ecstasy is very cunning
in.

Ecstasy.
My pulse, as yours doth temperately
keep time and makes as
healthful music.

>> Max (01:40:55):
It is not madness that I have uttered.
Bring me to the test, and I the matter
will reword which madness would
gamble from. Mother, for love of
grace, lay not that flattering unction to your
soul that not your trespass,
but my madness speaks.

Max, I just want to. We don't need to go back. But I just want to highlight.
Bring me to the test. I just want to highlight. That too
is in a stress position. It doesn't mean it needs to be,
you know, lifted off the page, but just know
that. That,
That I have uttered. Bring me to the
test. Just keep that in mind. Oh, sorry, sorry, sorry.

(01:41:35):
Keep going. It will but skin.

It will but skin and film the
ulcerous place whiles rank
corruption, mining, or all within
infect unseen.

>> Max (01:41:50):
Confess yourself to heaven.

Repent what's past,
avoid what is to come,
and do not spread the compost on the
weeds to make them
ranker.

>> Max (01:42:06):
Forgive me this my virtue,
for in the fatness of these percy
times, virtue itself of vice
must pardon beg yea,
curb and woo for leave to do him good.

>> Kathleen (01:42:20):
O Hamlet, thou hast cleft
my heart in twain.

Oh, throw
away the worser part of it
and live the purer with the other
half.

>> Max (01:42:37):
Good night.

But go not to my uncle's bed.
Assume a virtue if you have it
not.

>> Max (01:42:47):
Refrain tonight, and that shall
lend a kind of easiness
to the next abstinence, the next more
easy, for use almost can
change the stamp of nature
and.

Either hold or the devil or
throw him out with
wondrous potency.

>> Max (01:43:10):
Once more, good night. And when you
are desirous to be blessed, I'll blessing
beg of you.

For this same lord
I do repent.
But heaven hath pleased it so to
punish me with this and this
with me, that I must
be their scourge and minister.

>> Max (01:43:37):
I will bestow him and will answer well the
death I gave him. So again,
good night. I must be cruel only to
be kind. This bad begins and
worse remains behind.

One word more, good
lady.

>> Kathleen (01:43:56):
What shall I do?

Not this by no means
that I bid you do.
Let the bloat king tempt you
again to bed. Pinch
wanton on your cheek, call
you his mum, m his mouse, and
let him, for a pair of

(01:44:19):
ricci kisses or
paddling in your neck with his
damned fingers, make
you to ravel all this
matter out. But I
essentially am not in madness,
mad in craft.

>> Max (01:44:40):
For good. You let him know for who
that's but a queen. They're sober watch wise
would from a paddock, from a bat a
gib such dear concernings hide.
Who would do so?

>> Kathleen (01:44:55):
Be thou assured. If
words be made of breath and
breath of life, I have
no life to breathe what thou
hast said to me.

>> Max (01:45:09):
I must to England, you know that.

>> Kathleen (01:45:12):
A lack I had
forgot to so concluded on.

There's letters sealed.
And my two school fellows,
whom I will trust as I will
adders fanged, they bear
the mandate. They must sweep
my way and marshal me to
Nebry.

Let it work.

For tis the sport to have the engineer
hoist with his own petard.
And it shall go hard, and ants shall
go hard. But I will delve
one yard below their minds
and blow them at the moon.

Oh.

Tis most sweet when in
one line two crafts directly meet.

>> Max (01:46:08):
This man shall set me packing.
I'll, lug the guts into the neighbor room.
Mother. Good night. Indeed. This counselor
is now most still, most secret
and most grave who was
in.

Life a foolish prating knave.
Come, sir, to draw
toward an end with you.

>> Max (01:46:33):
Good night, Mother.

Wow. We made it to the end. Holy crap.
I wanna. I'm. I'm back on
this engineer line.
The, the. The person who
is getting hoisted with their own petard, is
it Gildan, Stern and Rosencrantz or is it

(01:46:57):
Claudius
to have the whatever
engineer or engineer hoist with his own
petard? Is it Claudius or is it the two school fellow?

I think it's Rosencrantz and Gildan's turn. Because then that
same second part of the line is about the minds.

And the second part of the line, you, you use a
plural, pronoun.
Their, Their minds and blow them at the
moon.

And I know I'm going on the ship with them.

Right, but in this part of the line you use a singular.
You say his hoist with his own petard.
It's very interesting. I just noticed that.

>> Cassie (01:47:46):
I don't know that the metaphor makes sense. Plurals.
You're not having engineers hoisting with their own
petards. Like plural plural
doesn't work with the metaphor. I think he can be talking about
plural Rosencrantz and Guildenstern,
but I, I don't think that plural tracks
in the metaphor itself. Does that make sense?

Makes total sense. I don't. I, So this is why I'm thinking
he's. That Hamlet's talking about Claudius.
Or do you not think that, Cassie, you think he's talking about
Rosencrant and Gildenstern the whole time?

>> Cassie (01:48:20):
what I am saying is that I don't think it being singular
means that it can't mean Rosencrantz and Guildenstern. what
I'm saying is I don't think that the metaphor holds up were it to be
plural. But since the rest of the line is about them,
then it makes sense for me
that it is about my two school
fellows.

Okay, then let's go back to engineer.
Is that cool, Charlotte? Yep, that's fine.
We made it. Look at us.

(01:48:59):
I am going to sleep and I'm going to put
like four blankets on and try to
sweat this out of my body.

>> Kathleen (01:49:08):
Oh, hope you feel better soon.

>> Max (01:49:13):
Sending soup.

>> Kathleen (01:49:14):
Is Philly getting warmer tomorrow? It is here
In New York?

Yeah.

>> Kathleen (01:49:19):
40S, 44.

>> Cassie (01:49:23):
Should be in the 50s by Saturday.
Should be in the 50s By Saturday. Fingers crossed.

>> Kathleen (01:49:30):
I'm ready.

And then is it next week that another snowstorm is coming?

>> Cassie (01:49:34):
Another snowstorm on the. Because when you said that I got nervous
and looked in my app and I didn't see any
snowflakes. But that doesn't mean that they're not coming.

Okay. You all are
glorious and I adore you.
Mine says 80% chance of snow
on Sunday. Oh,

>> Cassie (01:49:56):
I see. Rain, you shall see.

It's funny it says rain, but the little diagram thingy
is of snow that.

>> Cassie (01:50:04):
What?

>> Kathleen (01:50:06):
Hey, Paul, can I ask a question? Quick question.

No, you're right, Cassie. It's rain. It's rain. My
bad. Yes, yes.

>> Kathleen (01:50:14):
On line 119,
you heavenly guards. Guards.
That's a short line. And I wonder if
that's what makes
her say, alas, he's mad. Because
she goes right into

(01:50:34):
finishing. What would your graces figure?
Alas, he's mad.

I think that's. That works fantastically. Good
point. Okay, I'm not keeping you. Not even one minute
over. Good night. You are all fin. Fantastic. I love
you all. I will be better next week, I
promise you.

>> Kathleen (01:50:50):
Next week.

Kathleen. Next week I want to discuss. Or you and I can discuss
it during the week. That section about, like, the
soldiers in the alarm. I want to talk about that passage.

>> Kathleen (01:51:00):
Sure, sure, sure.

And then, we'll read it one time, and I'll give, like,
notes. I. I loathe to
say acting notes, but notes.
And then we'll talk and talk and geek out, and then we'll do it.
Great. Oh, here's a question for you. No, I'll ask it next week. I don't want
to keep you.

Thank you.

Thanks.

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Hamlet (3.4), Week 3: "A Mother's Burden" - Confronting Gertrude | The Rehearsal Room

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.css-14f5ked{margin:0;word-break:break-word;display:-webkit-box;-webkit-box-orient:vertical;box-orient:vertical;-webkit-line-clamp:2;overflow:hidden;}Hamlet (3.4), Week 3: "A Mother's Burden" - Confronting Gertrude | The Rehearsal Room