August 19, 2025 • 58 mins
Join us as we dive into Clarence's dream and murder in Shakespeare's Richard III.
🏁 In this session, highlights include:
➤ A deep dive into character motivations as Clarence faces his fate
➤ The importance of collaboration and feedback in the rehearsal process
➤ Insights into the unique challenges and discoveries of performing remotely
➤ Plus a Q&A with the artists!
Featuring Geoffrey Wade (DIRECTOR), Gideon Rappaport (DRAMATURG), Peter Van Norden (CLARENCE), Aubrey Saverino (FIRST MURDERER) and Dan Cordova (SECOND MURDERER).
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
>> Nathan Agin (00:00):
Again, hello and welcome to our scene presentation
(00:02):
for August. my name is Nathan Agin. I'm an
actor and host of the Working Actors Journey, which
began as a podcast with in depth conversations with
lifelong actors. And this year we have branched out into
online readings and now workshops. We, do plan
to hold another series of workshops and we'll be sure to let you all know
when that's happening next. if you have any
(00:23):
questions, either for me or for the artists,
please feel free to use the chat feature in Zoom
and I'll see all of those come in and be able to forward those long.
now I'm very excited we can share this scene tonight
from Richard III, Clarence's Dream
and Murder, Act 1, Scene 4. what you see
tonight is the culmination of work over the past
(00:44):
month. it's a bit of a peek inside the
rehearsal room. It's a final presentation of sorts.
and the participants may use this time to try something
different or, or experiment. I'll introduce
everyone briefly and then turn it over to the
group so if, all the artists could, come
back on camera just, very briefly.
(01:05):
All right, let me.
>> Gideon (01:06):
Okay.
>> Nathan Agin (01:07):
Okay. and let's
see here. Okay, just getting everything
lined up. Perfect. so, we have two
acting veterans, here with us tonight. Jeffrey Wade,
our director and playing the Keeper,
and Peter, Van Norden playing Clarence. Both have
extensive theater, film and TV credits. they've both
(01:28):
done shows on and off Broadway. Jeffrey, has also done
national tours and is part of the Harry Potter show in
San Francisco. When things can start back up. and
Peter has worked at several major theaters in Southern California, working
with multiple genres, authors and styles.
as for First Murderer, we have Aubrey
Saverino, a graduate of the Old Globe USD
(01:49):
MFA program who has worked across the country in
classical plays and as second murderer. Daniel
Cordova, a SoCal based actor who has worked at South
Coast Rep and with the UK based group. The show must go
online. The, dramaturg for our workshop is
Gideon Rapoport, a, San Diego teacher
and author of the forthcoming book A Shakespeare
(02:09):
Companion for Students. Thank you all,
all of you artists for being part of this. and Gideon, I
will turn it over to you to share a bit about the play.
>> Gideon (02:27):
Okay, thank you. I'm just going to say a few words
about where we are in the play we are looking at. Act
one, scene four. Richard III
begins at the end of the wars of the Roses
and it has devolved into wars between the house of
Lancaster and the house of York. At the beginning of
this play, the Lancastrian kings,
(02:48):
Henry, VI and his son, the heir, have
been murdered by the York brothers. They are three
brothers. The eldest is Edward. He is
now the king. His next brother is
Clarence. And Clarence has a history of
betrayals. Clarence was for his brothers,
and then he went against them. And he promised
to fight for the Lancastrian kings. And then in the
(03:10):
end, he turned against them and helped kill them.
and the youngest brother is Richard,
famously hunchbacked and evil
willed. And he's decided he wants to be
king. To do that, he's going to kill everybody between
himself and the crown. And that includes his brother
Clarence, whom he has arranged to be put in.
(03:31):
Into the tower and to be
killed there. we are
going to have a short cut in the
scene, between line 76
and line 98. Where,
normally the character of Brackenbury would appear. But
we've cut that out. And so there will be just
a skip to, the scene where,
(03:54):
after we hear about Clarence's dream. the scene where the
murderers come in. so that's the
basic information. This play will form the
end of the wars of the Roses. And at its
end, Henry VII will come to power. And
he's the grandfather of Queen Elizabeth,
who was the queen when Shakespeare was writing
(04:15):
the play. So now our
presentation of, Richard III, Act 1,
Scene 4.
>> Geoffrey Wade (04:29):
Why looks your grace so heavily today?
>> Peter (04:32):
Oh, I have passed a miserable night.
So full of fearful dreams, of ugly
sights. That as I am a Christian, faithful
man. I would not spend another such a night.
Though twere to buy a world of happy days. So
full of dismal terror was the time.
>> Geoffrey Wade (04:49):
What was your dream, my lord? I pray you, tell me.
>> Peter (04:53):
Methoughts that I had broken from the tower.
And was embarked to cross to Burgundy. And
in my company, my brother Gloucester, who from
my cabin tempted me to walk upon the hatches.
Thence we looked toward England.
And sighted up a thousand heavy times. During
the wars of York and Lancaster that had befallen
(05:14):
us. As we paced along
upon the giddy footing of the hatches.
Methought that Gloucester stumbled.
and in falling struck me that thought to stay
him. Overboard into the tumbling billows of the
main. O Lord, methought
what pain it was to drown.
(05:34):
What dreadful noise of waters in
my ears. What sights of
ugly death within my eyes.
Methought I thought I saw a thousand
fearful racks. A thousand
men that fishes gnawed upon
wedges of gold, great anchors, heaps
(05:54):
of pearl, Inestimable stones,
unvalued jewels. All scattered
in the bottom of the sea.
Some lay in dead men's skulls.
And in the holes where eyes did once inhabit. There
were crept as twere in scorn of
eyes reflecting gems. That wooed
(06:15):
the slimy bottom of the deep. And mocked
the dead bones that lay scattered by.
>> Geoffrey Wade (06:21):
Had you such leisure in the time of death.
To gaze upon these secrets of the deep?
>> Peter (06:27):
Methought I had, and often did. I
strive to yield the ghost. But still
the envious flood stopped in my soul.
And would not let it forth to find the empty,
vast and wandering air. But
smothered it within my panting bulk. Who
almost burst to belch it in the sea.
>> Geoffrey Wade (06:47):
awaked you not in this sore agony?
>> Peter (06:50):
No, no, My dream was
lengthened after life.
>> Gideon (06:56):
Oh.
>> Peter (06:56):
Then began the tempest. To my soul
I passed, methought, the melancholy flood. With
that sour ferryman which poets write of.
Unto the kingdom of perpetual night.
The first that there did greet my stranger
soul. Was my great father in law, renowned Warwick.
(07:17):
Who spake aloud. What
scourge for perjury can this
dark monarchy afford false
Clarence?
And so he vanished.
Then came wandering by a shadow like an angel.
With bright hair that dabbled in blood. And he
shrieked out aloud, Clarence has
(07:39):
come. False, fleeting,
perjured Clarence. That stabbed me in the
field by Tewkesbury. Seize on him,
Furies. Take him unto, torment.
With that, methought a legion
of foul fiends environed me. And
howlered in mine ears some hideous
(07:59):
cries. That with the very noise
I trembling waked.
And for a season after could not believe
but that I was in hell.
Such terrible impression made my dream.
>> Geoffrey Wade (08:14):
No marvel, lord, though it affrighted you. I am
afraid, methinks, to hear you tell it.
>> Gideon (08:19):
Keeper.
>> Peter (08:20):
Keeper. I have done these things. That now give evidence
against my soul. For Edward's sake.
And see how he requites me.
O God, if my
deep prayers cannot appease thee. But thou wilt be
avenged on my misdeeds.
Yet execute thy wrath in
(08:41):
me alone. O spare my
guiltless wife and my poor children.
Keeper, I prithee, sit by me awhile.
My soul is heavy, and I fain would sleep.
>> Geoffrey Wade (08:55):
I will, my lord. God give your grace
good rest.
>> Dan Cordova (09:10):
What, shall he stab him as he sleeps?
>> Aubrey Saverino (09:13):
No, he'll say, twas done cowardly when he wakes.
>> Dan Cordova (09:16):
Why, he shall never wake until the great judgment
day.
>> Aubrey Saverino (09:19):
Why, then he'll say we stabbed him sleeping.
>> Dan Cordova (09:23):
The urging of that word judgment hath
bred a kind of remorse in me.
>> Aubrey Saverino (09:28):
What, art thou afraid?
>> Dan Cordova (09:31):
Not to kill him, having a warrant, but
to be damned for killing him, from the which no
warrant can defend me.
>> Aubrey Saverino (09:38):
I thought thou hadst been resolute.
>> Dan Cordova (09:40):
So I am to let him
live.
>> Aubrey Saverino (09:44):
I'll back to the Duke of Gloucester and tell him so.
>> Dan Cordova (09:47):
I prithee, stay a little. I hope
this passionate humor of mine will change.
It was wont to hold me but while one tells 20.
>> Aubrey Saverino (10:05):
How dost thou feel thyself now?
>> Dan Cordova (10:08):
Faith, some certain dregs of conscience are yet
within me.
>> Aubrey Saverino (10:13):
Remember thy reward when the deed's done.
>> Dan Cordova (10:17):
Since he dies, I had forgot the reward.
>> Aubrey Saverino (10:20):
Where's thy conscience now?
>> Dan Cordova (10:22):
In the Duke of Gloucester's purse.
>> Aubrey Saverino (10:23):
when he opens his purse to give us our reward, thy conscience
flies out.
>> Dan Cordova (10:27):
Tis no matter. Let it go. There's few, or
none will entertain it.
>> Aubrey Saverino (10:32):
What if it come to thee again?
>> Dan Cordova (10:34):
I'll not meddle with. Makes a
man a coward. A man
cannot steal, but it accuseth him.
A man cannot swear, but it checks him.
A man cannot lie with his neighbor's wife, but it
detects him. It is a flushing,
blushing, shame faced spirit that
(10:54):
mutinies in a man's bosom. It
makes, obstacles. It fills a man
full of obstacles. It made me
once restore a purse of gold that by chance I found.
It beggars every man that keeps it. It is turned
out of towns and cities for a dangerous thing.
And every man that makes means to live well. Endeavours
(11:15):
to trust to himself and live without
it.
>> Gideon (11:19):
Ah.
>> Dan Cordova (11:20):
zounds. Tis even now at my elbow, persuading me
not to kill the duke.
>> Aubrey Saverino (11:24):
Take the devil in thy mind and believe him not. He
would insinuate with thee but to make thee sigh.
>> Dan Cordova (11:30):
I am strong framed. He
cannot prevail with me.
>> Aubrey Saverino (11:35):
Spoke like a tall man that respects thy reputation.
Come, shall we fall to work?
>> Dan Cordova (11:42):
Take him on the Costard with the hilts of thy sword. And
then throw him into the malmsy butt in the next room.
>> Aubrey Saverino (11:48):
Excellent device. And make a sop of him.
>> Dan Cordova (11:52):
Soft. He wakes.
>> Aubrey Saverino (11:54):
Strike.
>> Peter (11:56):
No.
>> Dan Cordova (11:57):
We'll reason with him.
>> Peter (12:00):
Where are thou, keeper? Give me a cup of wine.
>> Aubrey Saverino (12:04):
You shall have wine enough, my lord, anon.
>> Peter (12:08):
In God's name, what art thou?
>> Dan Cordova (12:11):
A man as you are.
>> Peter (12:13):
But not as I am, royal.
>> Dan Cordova (12:15):
Nor you as we are loyal.
>> Peter (12:19):
Thy voice is thunder, but thy looks are
humble.
>> Dan Cordova (12:23):
My voice is now the king's. My
looks, mine own.
>> Peter (12:27):
How darkly and how deadly dost thou speak.
Your eyes do menace me.
Why, look you pale. Who sent you hither? Wherefore do
you come.
>> Geoffrey Wade (12:39):
To?
>> Peter (12:41):
To murder me?
>> Aubrey Saverino (12:42):
I?
>> Dan Cordova (12:43):
I.
>> Peter (12:45):
You scarcely have the heart to tell me so. And
therefore cannot have the heart to do it.
Wherein, my friends, have I offended you?
>> Aubrey Saverino (12:54):
Offended us you have not. But the king.
>> Peter (12:56):
I shall be reconciled to him again.
>> Dan Cordova (13:00):
Never, my lord. Therefore prepare to
die.
>> Peter (13:04):
Are you drawn forth among a world of
men to slay the innocent? What
is my offence? Where is the
evidence that doth accuse me?
What lawful quests have given their verdict up
upon the frowning judge? Or who pronounced the
bitter sentence of poor Clarence?
>> Dan Cordova (13:23):
Death.
>> Peter (13:24):
Before I be convict by course of law.
Threaten me with death is most unlawful.
I charge you, as you hope to have redemption. By
Christ's dear blood shed for our grievous
sins. That you depart and lay no
hands on me. The deed you
undertake is damnable.
>> Aubrey Saverino (13:46):
What we will do, we do upon command.
>> Dan Cordova (13:48):
And he that hath commanded is our king.
>> Peter (13:51):
Erroneous vassals.
The great king of kings hath in the
table of his law commanded. Thou shalt do no
murder. Will you then spurn at
his edict and fulfil a man's?
Take heed, for he holds
vengeance in his hand. To hurl upon the heads that
break his law.
>> Dan Cordova (14:12):
And that same vengeance doth he hurl on thee.
For swearing and for murder too.
Thou didst receive the sacrament to fight
in quarrel of the house of Lancaster.
>> Aubrey Saverino (14:23):
And like a traitor to the name of God didst break
that vow. And with thy treacherous blade.
Unripst the bowels of thy sovereign son.
>> Dan Cordova (14:31):
Whom thou wast sworn to cherish and defend.
>> Aubrey Saverino (14:34):
How canst thou urge God's dreadful law to us. When
thou hast broke it in such dear degree?
>> Peter (14:39):
Alas. For whose sake did I that ill
deed? For Edward. For my brother. For
his sake. He sends you not to murder
me for this. For in that sin he is as deep as I.
If God will be avenged for the deed. O
know you yet he doth it publicly.
(15:00):
Take not the quarrel from his powerful arm. He
needs no indirect or lawless course.
To cut off those that have offended him.
>> Aubrey Saverino (15:08):
Who made thee then a bloody minister. When gallant,
springing, brave Plantagenet. That princely novice
was struck dead by.
>> Peter (15:15):
Thee, my brother's love, the
devil and my rage.
>> Aubrey Saverino (15:20):
Thy brother's, love. Our duty and thy faults.
Provoke us hither now to slaughter thee.
>> Peter (15:25):
If you do love my brother, hate not me.
I am his brother, and I love him
well. If you are hired for
me, go back again. I will send you to my brother
Gloucester. Who shall reward you better for my life
than Edward will for tidings of my death.
>> Dan Cordova (15:44):
You are deceived. Your brother
Gloucester hates you.
>> Peter (15:48):
Oh, no. He loves me, and he holds me
dear. Go you to him from me.
>> Aubrey Saverino (15:53):
Ay, so we will tell him.
>> Peter (15:56):
When that our princely father York blessed his three
sons with his victorious arm, he
little thought of this divided friendship.
Bid Gloucester think of this, and he will weep.
>> Aubrey Saverino (16:08):
Ay, millstones, as he lessen'd us to weep.
>> Peter (16:10):
Oh, do not slander him, for he.
>> Aubrey Saverino (16:12):
Is kind, right as snow in harvest.
Come. You deceive yourself. Tis he
that sends us to destroy you here.
>> Peter (16:21):
It cannot be, for he be
wept my fortune, and hugged me in his arms,
and swore with sobs that he would
labour for my delivery.
>> Aubrey Saverino (16:31):
Why, so he doth, when he delivers you from this
earth's thraldom to the joys of heaven.
>> Dan Cordova (16:36):
Make peace with God, for you
must die, my lord.
>> Peter (16:41):
Have you that holy feeling in your souls to counsel me
to make my peace with God? And are you yet
to your own souls so blind that you will
war with God by murdering me? O,
sir, consider they that set you on
to do this deed will hate you for this
deed.
>> Dan Cordova (17:01):
What shall we do?
>> Peter (17:02):
Relent, and save your souls.
>> Aubrey Saverino (17:04):
Relent? No. Tis cowardly and womanish.
>> Peter (17:07):
Not to relent is beastly, savage,
devilish. Which of you, if you were a
prince's son, being penned from liberty as I am now,
if two such murderers as yourselves came to
you, would not entreat for life? Ay,
you, would beg, were you in my distress.
My friend, I spy some
(17:28):
pity in thy looks. Or, if thine
eye be not a flatterer, come thou on my
side, and entreat for me a
begging prince. What beggar pities
not?
>> Dan Cordova (17:41):
Look behind you, my lord.
>> Aubrey Saverino (17:43):
Take that and that.
If all this will not do, I'll drown you in the
mamsy butt within.
>> Dan Cordova (17:53):
Oh, a, bloody deed, and
desperately dispatched.
How fain like Pilate, would I wash my hands of
this most grievous murder.
>> Aubrey Saverino (18:06):
How now. What mean' st thou? That
thou help' st me not? By heavens, the Duke
shall know how slack you have been.
>> Dan Cordova (18:14):
I would he knew that I had saved his brother.
Take thou the fee and tell him what I say, for I
repent me that the duke is slain.
>> Aubrey Saverino (18:23):
So do not I
go, coward as thou art.
Well, I'll go hide the body
in some hole to let the duke give order for his burial.
And when I have my meed, I will away
for this will out, and then I must not stay.
>> Geoffrey Wade (19:00):
Come Back, Little Shiva.
>> Nathan Agin (19:02):
Come back.
>> Geoffrey Wade (19:04):
There we go. Am I unmuted yet?
Yes. Hello, Hello. We're all
back. Where's the lovely Peter? There you are.
Nicely done, you guys.
>> Gideon (19:14):
Very nicely done.
>> Geoffrey Wade (19:19):
I,
>> Gideon (19:20):
Yeah, I'm just.
>> Geoffrey Wade (19:21):
I'm delighted.
so, although it's weird there, the invisible people watching us,
let me ask you, first of all, I thought, and I think
Gideon agrees, I thought it went well,
even with the usual typical sort of minor
stumbles over to, you know, find your script and stuff. Please
don't worry about that stuff. It didn't show.
(19:42):
It was really good. It was a great distillation of all
these things we'd been working on, which I'm just going
to mention so that people again in the audience
there. we worked on,
We've gone through this piece extremely slowly a
couple of times, giving everyone a chance to do a lot of,
investigating about what's going on before, ah, she or
(20:03):
he said their line m
and kind of work through their lines,
working out every particular, nuance in
what was going on. and then towards the end
we sort of telescoped that or collapsed it and I
think were able certainly before
and this time to move through it at a quite
(20:24):
reasonable pace, without, belaboring it.
And I'll be interested to hear what, some of our
observers might have to say about
how well, they could follow it or not if they
had problems. because I know,
I, and certainly all of us as actors, we're always wondering if we're making
the point, if we're getting the point across.
and I, And I think Gideon will agree with me,
(20:48):
think, that certainly in this case, but often,
certainly with Shakespeare, but usually the author does
most of the heavy lifting for you and if you will trust
her or him.
ah, do the actors work, but you don't have
to rewrite the thing for the author, as it were.
So we worked on.
>> Gideon (21:05):
Especially for this author.
>> Geoffrey Wade (21:06):
Especially for this author, exactly.
so we worked on things like paste. We certainly went through and made sure we knew what
we were saying in, some of these expressions.
It's not a particularly difficult,
or verbally naughty
scene. But, there are things that needed clearing
up and I think those came out very clearly. We worked on,
(21:29):
ah, scansion and stress.
sometimes there's a, bit of a
fielder's choice, you know, with how you want to work at
what words you want to stress. so
we touched on a little bit of everything, so I'm going to stop
talking for a second and ask,
you guys, Gideon included, how you felt about
(21:50):
it, how you thought it went. I know it's always difficult for an actor because you're not
supposed to be thinking about how it's going as you do it, but
give us something to talk about now.
Aubrey, you want to start? Why don't you start?
>> Peter (22:02):
Sure, sure.
>> Aubrey Saverino (22:03):
I mean, I think, first of all, you can't ignore the fact that we're working in
this strange medium, because this is what's afforded to
us. So inevitably, there are things as an actor you
miss, like being in the room with people. but at
the same time, I think what's interesting, Exciting about Shakespeare is
that it's so much meant to be heard and listened to.
and so there's a lot of it that does work in
(22:24):
Zoom, because it's about the language anyway.
and it does feel like once you've done the work
and taken the time and unpacked it and looked at the
language really closely, that you are jumping on a
train that just moves, once
it begins. And you have to kind of trust
that you've done the work already.
(22:46):
and then it just seems to fly. So. And obviously, like, working
with these, fine folks,
it's easy to
feel that, you know, just passing the
torch off.
>> Geoffrey Wade (23:00):
Daniel, you're sort of the next on my screen.
How do you think, in general, you enjoyed working on it or
not? And, I mean, feel free because
it feels great.
>> Dan Cordova (23:11):
It's stretching muscles that haven't been stretched for a while,
so it feels really good. and, you know, as Aubrey
said, it's awkward doing it in Zoom, but it is nice
to be able to do it with
live partners, even though they're on
computer, but, you know, so that you can actually hear
the words being spoken by your partner. And it really,
(23:32):
informs how you respond and the words that,
you know, the emphasis that you put on words as you respond
to them, just hearing somebody else say the words
makes such a big difference than, you know, than reading it
off the page.
>> Geoffrey Wade (23:48):
Peter, how did you. How did you feel
about what we just did? Any thoughts
one way or the other?
>> Peter (23:56):
well, I mean, it's, It's always been a
favorite scene of mine, so it's
kind of, a pleasure to get to do it,
even in this strange Hollywood
square boxes,
which, ah, as Aubrey says, it
makes you put the concentration on the words,
(24:16):
on the language, and on the clarity of the
language, which we worked
on considerably, you know, and there's a lot to be
learned from that before you would get on your feet and
try to move around and do this murder scene, you
know? so it's really kind of, Kind
of a pleasure to have that time to
(24:36):
just work the language pretty much,
and the thoughts, you know,
and how they come and the different ways of presenting
them, the different speeds of presenting them.
>> Gideon (24:48):
the.
>> Peter (24:48):
Clarence. I said in the very beginning. Clarence speaks
in very long thoughts.
and it's really nice to be able to work on that,
and try to get. Try to sort of,
come to terms with that. so that's been. It's been
fun, and working with these two guys has been great.
>> Geoffrey Wade (25:07):
Good. Gideon,
you want to say anything?
>> Gideon (25:12):
Well, I'm very happy to hear Peter say this, because
I'm always lobbying for a little more table work
before we get Shakespeare on his feet.
and we got to do that this time. I also want
to say what a pleasure it is to work with
such good actors, because you take the notes and then
you run with it. And I thought
(25:32):
all of you did that. the notes that Jeffrey
gave last week when we worked on this,
to Aubrey about the murderer, the first murderer, and to
Daniel about relaxing into the park,
and to Peter about varying. You took all
those notes, and you took my verbal notes, and
it just. It just got better and better.
(25:53):
And today I thought it was really tough.
I did take about, eight or ten
specific word notes, but I'll only give those
to you if you want them. But,
I thought it was really effective, and you used the camera really
well, so that, to me,
it came across quite well.
>> Geoffrey Wade (26:14):
Yes, Kudos for that, all of
you, because that was not something we really
worked on at all. But you obviously all have a
natural inclination for it. and we
literally didn't work at all. But it was,
terrific, the way you use the camera, that part of
it. Gideon, why don't you give the notes? And then I
(26:35):
actually. again, because there are people
watching, and it might be kind of fun. There's
one of two sections that I want to just
go over again, not because they were wrong, you guys, just
to show perhaps how things can be approached
differently.
>> Gideon (26:51):
Okay, so I'm going to nitpick a little bit.
Aubrey, 116.
resolute. Rather than resolute.
Daniel, 146. I'm talking line
numbers now for people who are watching.
It beggars Any man that keeps it. It's turned out of
towns and cities for a dangerous thing. And every man that needs to
(27:14):
live. So you used every
in both. But the first one's any
man, and then every man got it. And you
can just remember it because it's in alphabetical order.
>> Geoffrey Wade (27:26):
also, I m mean, that's. That's a great example
of a, Of an
antithesis. Right. The difference between any and every.
>> Gideon (27:35):
Yeah. So you're right.
>> Geoffrey Wade (27:36):
It's really important that they be different.
>> Gideon (27:38):
Yeah. 155.
Daniel, you hit the pronoun me
instead of the verb prevail. So I want you to think about that.
Whether Whether it's stronger to
hit prevail in that line than the pronoun.
Peter 167.
(28:00):
Oh, you said, where are thou, keeper?
And it's where art thou, keeper? That's
just English grammar from the Renaissance.
>> Peter (28:10):
I was just waking up, you know.
>> Gideon (28:12):
Yeah. Nice.
Where are all of you, keeper? line
191.
Ah, Peter, you said,
What did you say Unto the frowning
judge? I think your problem
was unto.
(28:35):
I think that wasn't clear. What lawful quest have given their verdict
up unto.
>> Peter (28:38):
Unto the frowning judge.
>> Gideon (28:40):
I think you said to. Or something like that. Okay.
It just unto wasn't clear. Daniel, line
208.
you left out false for false. Forswearing.
>> Dan Cordova (28:51):
Thank you.
>> Gideon (28:52):
And you've got three. You got four F's in that line.
Yeah. Which Shakespeare is doing on purpose. So you can play with
those Fs for false, for swearing
and for. In fact, there are three fours
for forswear and for murder.
Do you see that? And then
false is the modifier. So you
(29:14):
just. It's, it's there for a reason. line
210, Lancaster.
I don't have to say more than that.
line 255. Whose is that? This is the
last one, Peter.
Oh, you said that he would labor. You
added for my delivery. But I did it.
>> Peter (29:36):
Yeah.
>> Gideon (29:36):
Yeah. Okay. Great. That's it, guys. It was
really good.
>> Geoffrey Wade (29:41):
It's an interesting thing. again, for the people who are
listening, when you're doing this kind of verse and
this part of the scene, you know, the bulk of the scene is in verse.
Peter, said he realized
he'd done that the second he did it. Because Peter
could internally feel the rhythm going a
little off. Right. It's a great
(30:03):
thing. You know, all this
Shakespeare stuff looks intimidating, but often
the rhythm and the verse of it, Helps you. It
helps you learn lines because you learn a rhythm as well
as actual words.
>> Gideon (30:17):
and you learn stresses. Very often you. If you pay attention
to the I.
>> Geoffrey Wade (30:21):
Am, it actually helps give you readings,
because you were in the middle of giving a note there. I just wanted to
note again, for the people who are listening on this
Clarence speech that starts. Are you drawn forth
among a world of men to slay the innocent? What is my offense?
Where is the evidence that doth accuse me? That was,
ah, something that, we looked at early
(30:42):
on and made sure that we knew that,
Clarence is actually asking questions again. It's
easy, I think often in
drama, but certainly in Shakespeare. Suddenly when you're presented
with what seems to be a long speech to make
your questions rhetorical instead of actual
questions. M. And,
(31:02):
again, you know, sort of does the work for you. That's your
objective right there, is to find out who these people are, what's. It's
as simple as that. You know, you don't know you're about to be murdered yet.
so, again, for the people listening. Question marks, I
always say in Shakespeare are your friend.
Use them as question marks, not assumptions.
(31:23):
and I'm just. I thought Peter did it
exquisitely. I just wanted to point out that that was something we,
we had worked on.
I would, I would like
again, just for, Just for the fun of it and
because we can. I would like to just
go through,
(31:44):
that sequence from when,
Clarence wakes up and it's a lot of
second murderer stuff, right?
And, Dan, my note to you is
again, to
look for the person that's just within.
You don't feel you have to apply any sort
(32:07):
of. Again, it's a temptation when, you know, we're doing a
presentation. So I'm going to do, Just
remember that you are sufficient under yourself. You're a big
guy, you're strong. I mean, you look like
you could be the second murderer. So don't
feel you have to do anything
more than what you are.
(32:27):
and his
hesitation, his lack of true
conviction about what he's doing.
Again,
you don't have to put a lot of decorative
frosting on that. It's in the words, right?
And it's in your mind. I know it's in your mind. So you don't have to show me what's
(32:48):
in your mind. These are again, for everybody, for you
in particular, everyone who's listening.
these are sort of minor things we're sort of buffing up with
you Know quadruple zero steel wool at this
point, but, let's try it that
way. And,
let's start with,
(33:14):
Let's go from the second murderer's line. Soft, he
wakes. First murderer,
strike. No, we'll reason with him.
Do you guys all see where we are?
I'm gonna take myself off. Just give
yourself a second or two
to reinsert yourself in the world of what we're doing
(33:35):
and then start.
>> Dan Cordova (33:46):
Soft, he wakes.
>> Aubrey Saverino (33:48):
Strike.
>> Dan Cordova (33:49):
No, we'll reason with him.
>> Peter (33:52):
Where art, thou, keeper? give me a cup of wine.
>> Aubrey Saverino (33:55):
We shall have wine enough, my lord, anon.
>> Peter (33:58):
In God's name, what art thou?
>> Dan Cordova (34:01):
A man as you are.
>> Peter (34:03):
But not as I am, royal.
>> Dan Cordova (34:06):
Nor you, as we are
loyal.
>> Peter (34:10):
My voice is thunder, but thy looks are humble.
>> Dan Cordova (34:14):
My voice is now the king's.
My looks, mine own.
>> Peter (34:19):
How darkly and how deadly dost thou speak?
Her eyes do menace me. Why look you pale?
Who sent you hither? Wherefore do you come?
>> Geoffrey Wade (34:29):
To. To.
>> Dan Cordova (34:32):
To.
>> Peter (34:33):
To murder me?
>> Aubrey Saverino (34:35):
Ay, ay,
>> Peter (34:36):
You scarcely have the heart to tell me so, and
therefore cannot have the heart to do it.
Wherein, my friends, have I offended you?
>> Aubrey Saverino (34:45):
Offended us? You have not. But the king.
>> Peter (34:47):
I shall be reconciled to him again.
>> Dan Cordova (34:51):
Never, my lord. Therefore
prepare to die.
>> Peter (34:55):
Are you drawn forth among a world of men
to slay the innocent?
What is my offence?
Where is the evidence that doth accuse me?
What lawful quest have given their verdict up,
unto the frowning judge? Or who
pronounced the bitter sentence of poor Clarence? Death.
(35:15):
Before I be convict by course of law.
To threaten me with death is most unlawful.
I charge you, as you hope to have redemption by
Christ's dear blood shed for our grievous sins, that
you depart and lay no hands upon me.
The deed you undertake is
(35:35):
damnable.
>> Aubrey Saverino (35:36):
What we will do, we do upon command.
>> Dan Cordova (35:39):
And he that hath commanded is our king.
>> Peter (35:41):
Erroneous vassals. The great king of
kings hath, in the table of his laws commanded that
thou shalt do no murder. Will you then
spurn his edict and fulfil a
man's? Take heed,
for he holds vengeance in his hand to hurl
upon the heads that break his law.
>> Dan Cordova (36:01):
And that same vengeance doth he hurl on thee
for false forswearing and for murder too.
Thou didst receive the sacrament to fight in
quarrel of the house of Lancaster.
>> Aubrey Saverino (36:14):
And like a traitor to the name of God didst break
that vow. And with thy treacherous blade
unripst the bowels of thy sovereign
son, whom thou.
>> Dan Cordova (36:24):
Wast sworn to Cherish and defend.
>> Aubrey Saverino (36:27):
How canst thou urge God's dreadful law to us when
thou has broke it in such dear degree?
>> Geoffrey Wade (36:32):
Good. I'm gonna stop you. I'll stop you.
that was really terrific, Daniel.
Really interesting. Absolutely.
the first one is perfectly valid. I found that one actually
more powerful and more,
affecting, to me, somehow,
when you, feel less, need
(36:54):
to urge it on us, it lets us
in a little more. So well done all.
And, Peter, that your speech was even
better than before.
>> Gideon (37:04):
So I agree. can I make a little
note on 174?
>> Peter (37:09):
Sure.
>> Gideon (37:10):
I discovered it now that in Daniel's way
of saying it this time, Clarence says,
thy voice is thunder, but thy looks are humble. So there's
a. There's an antithesis there. And the second
murderer says, my voice is now the king's.
My looks, mine own. And I just realized why
there's the same antithesis. The
(37:30):
thunder is because he's speaking as the king
that's gonna get Clarence killed. But his
looks are his own and humble.
And that's why he has these second thoughts
as the scene progresses. So
the separation in the
second murderer's line is exactly reflecting
the separation in Clarence's line.
(37:53):
It struck me this time wonderfully.
>> Geoffrey Wade (37:56):
Yeah, that's interesting. And there's an interesting play on,
humble there too, because humble, of course, means not
royal.
>> Gideon (38:03):
That's right.
>> Geoffrey Wade (38:04):
But it also, implies his state, ah,
of mind. Well, that was terrific, you
guys. I don't know if, Nathan, can you hear me? I hope
you do. I can hear you.
I think we've done enough, and we've
had some notes and had a chance to even rework a bit so
people can see what happens when there's, Again, the way
(38:24):
these marvelous people are able to make
adjustments of shading. Much less
big blocks, but just shading, which is wonderful in
an actor. So, I open it back to you if
other people have questions or comments or anything.
>> Nathan Agin (38:39):
Sure, sure, sure. Yeah. there have been a few
comments coming in.
Marcelo loved, your stash, Jeffrey.
You have a nice stash. and he also said
that, he said, well done. The intentions were clear, so is the
language. and I wanted to just kind of build on, a couple
things that were mentioned. I love. I mean,
he's a bit of a kid in the candy store watching this stuff. You
(39:02):
know, as Gideon said, you know, you have great actors who can do their thing.
but I love that this gives Actors an opportunity to do something that they
don't normally get, which is plenty of time
to work on the text. and as
Gideon mentioned about working with actors, it
is great when you have already great actors doing this.
And I hope that these
(39:22):
workshops can help people become even better
actors. And that this workshop, without all
the other demands of a production, it allows you
to be able to do things like really focus on
implementing the notes. When you don't have to worry about
the lighting, the costume, the props and all that other
stuff. You can just really, just tell the story. So
(39:42):
it's just really great to watch and see all this come
through. I wanted to kind
of maybe bring up a couple things from the rehearsals that I
sat in on that I thought were really fascinating. And
I open feedback from anyone who would like to
speak. But there were two items that stood out. One
was the discussion you guys had about which
(40:02):
murderer says which lines. And obviously
that wasn't just an arbitrary discussion, but in different
versions they're kind of broken up differently. And I
thought it was just interesting how you went about figuring out,
well, which first murderer
should say this or does it make sense for second murder? That.
And then also the exercise of you
alluded to Jeffrey going through very slowly, but that
(40:25):
exercise where it was really slow and
direct to camera, I thought that was also an
interesting exercise that everybody worked on. And of course in this kind
of quasi theater film medium,
you know, it can kind of pay dividends as well. So open
to you know, either, either
item that people would like to address or talk about their experience.
>> Geoffrey Wade (40:47):
Well, I'll talk about the camera part. It's a, it's a
rehearsal technique that I didn't
invent. I can't remember who I learned it from, but
I use it in theater directing
which is that
you need to have gone through the script a few times. It helps to have
some familiarity with it. But each actor
(41:08):
in a two hander scene, you look at the
script and pick up as much of the
sentence or the speech as you can. And that may be one
clause, it may be a whole sentence, maybe a whole speech, but you
pick it up and then you deliver those lines
directly to your scene partner.
And if you forget something,
(41:29):
you look down and pick up the rest so that everything is directly
here. And if you begin to forget something, you don't turn to your book and
pick it up and go like that. You keep everything
directly to your partner. The same partner, the other
person, to whom you're speaking, on the other hand,
looks directly at the speaker
and does not look down, does not try to pick
(41:50):
up a cue, does not look down until you know, if it's Aubrey, until
she for example, feels that the speech is
over and then she'll look down and pick up
her thing and go, so that every part
of every speech is delivered directly to the other person.
It's very difficult. It's a little
easier to, well, I don't know.
(42:11):
The temptation is always to be generous,
to your partner and pick up the line so you're ready
to go. And that's not the deal. The deal is to. It
works particularly well. It was particularly helpful
on this because we never
get a chance, you know, even when we're doing the
scene in the end we don't even get what you would get
(42:33):
normally in a rehearsal and certainly a, a performance,
a chance to look in the other actors eyes because
we're looking at the script or even if we're looking in the
camera, which is what we should be doing, you can't
glance down and see the person here. The eyes give you
away. So I found it
particularly useful and I hope the,
(42:53):
I think the actors did, rehearsal
technique. But it's one that I use in theater. But it
was invaluable here.
>> Aubrey Saverino (43:01):
Yeah, I told Jeffrey I'm stealing it. I teach acting at
Moorpark College, which obviously right now is on
online, on Zoom. and I thought
it was such a great, I mean a great exercise probably in a regular
rehearsal room, but particularly on Zoom, when
I think people are conscious of like where are my eyes
going and when do I get to, Am I looking at myself? Am I looking at the camera?
Am I looking at my scene partner? It just gave us a chance to slow
(43:24):
down, look at our scene partners,
listen to each other, listen to the words and
let everything else go. And that changed some of the choices
that we were making because I heard something that Daniel
said, that I wouldn't maybe have heard otherwise or something because
I was thinking about what I'm going to say next. So.
Yeah, no, it's just, it's great to slow down and just. I mean
(43:44):
it's, it's the first thing I teach in acting, right, is just
acting is listening and responding. It's just listening to each other
and responding, responding truthfully. And it's nice to
take that time and make sure that that is indeed what
we're doing and not trying to be good Actors by. Oh, we know
Shakespeare has a certain rhythm. Oh, we better pick up our cues. Oh, we
better. You know, I don't want to let there be a pause.
(44:04):
Can't do that until we know what we're saying. But
more importantly, what the other actors are saying.
>> Gideon (44:13):
if you want.
>> Dan Cordova (44:14):
I think a lot of the. For us, for the
actors. I think that, that exercise, at least for
me, really kind of was,
when a lot of the
emotional meaning of the lines kind of,
made sense, started to really make sense.
The literary meanings, you know, we had kind of gone through.
(44:35):
But to understand what the person is really
meaning, what they're feeling and how that affects me,
that eye contact makes so much difference.
>> Gideon (44:45):
Good.
>> Geoffrey Wade (44:46):
Gideon, do you want to talk about the, choosing of.
>> Gideon (44:48):
Yes. I just wanted to say that the textual problem
with Richard III is
elaborate and challenging because the two early texts,
the Folio and the Quarto, are both authoritative,
and they're very different in little ways.
and one of the ways we found they were different in this scene
was that the. The, lines given to second
(45:08):
murderer are sometimes given to first in one of
the texts and then to the second in the other. So
Jeffrey saw this, and we talked about
how we wanted to split them up.
And although we were going basically from one text,
we picked this,
structure from the other text because
we wanted to separate the two
(45:30):
murderers as much as possible in of terms character.
And we talked a lot about that, how we can. How we can
distinguish them and make them distinct and separate, different
from each other so that each has his own character.
and the picking the other text helped us
do that a lot. and that
just. That made it more. I think it made it more
(45:51):
interesting to work on it, but also made it
more interesting to hear it when it was in
profound performance.
>> Nathan Agin (46:03):
Did anyone have any other, further thoughts, any of the
actor, like, for specifically Aubrey and Daniel?
that process of, you know, working through which
murderer said which line. What was that like for you guys
to be involved in that discussion and as
Gideon was talking about, to, you know, really try to define these
characters? because a lot of times as actors, you show up
and. And the play is cut as it is
(46:25):
and that kind of stuff. So what was it like to be part of that discussion?
>> Aubrey Saverino (46:29):
I always find it fascinating. I mean,
I'm definitely a Shakespeare nerd and a Shakespeare lover. I
think, looking at different versions of Shakespeare,
and trying to decipher with some
intelligence and detective work to the best of our abilities.
what maybe they were doing then or what works now.
(46:50):
and it did make sense. I had questions about the character with the
first cut. and I was curious. I
was like, I would have had to as an actor be like, alright, well it's
interesting. I don't want to murder him at the top and
I do want to murder her. So like where do I shift and change?
As opposed to the second version which we ended up
using, which was. It was clear what my character wanted from.
(47:11):
Clearer to me what my character wanted from the get go.
So I found that. Yeah, I find that stuff really
interesting.
>> Geoffrey Wade (47:17):
Yeah.
>> Peter (47:17):
And I think
>> Dan Cordova (47:17):
you know, that. That part of it where we worked through that,
as you're saying, it helped to define each of our characters a little
bit. Which. Which made the rest of the rehearsals,
you know, a little bit easier because we kind of knew
we're not the same. And it's very easy in a play like this. Once
again, not, you know, not huge roles in
the overall scope of this play. It would be very easy to
(47:39):
just have them be, you know, very
similar characters and
No distinguishing characteristics between, you know, between
them. but the way we went through the text and
I believe it was the second version that Jeffrey had
really defined the characters separately.
>> Nathan Agin (47:58):
Great, great. and I'll mention again for anyone, watching
and part of this you can use the zoom, chat, to add
any questions in.
Peter, I would love to. By the way, I'm
thrilled that you finally have a chance to work on this
part. Work on the scene like that delights me to no end
that we can make that happen even in these strange times.
and with all the roles you've done, we find yet
(48:19):
another that You can at least put a small check m.
next to it.
>> Gideon (48:23):
At least put it on your resume.
>> Nathan Agin (48:26):
But I'd love to hear. Peter, Were there any challenges particular
to you? Like Either with the dream speech
that. Either something that surprised you as you started to work
on it. Because I'm sure you knew of the scene. M. I imagine
and you knew its shape. But Either. Yeah. Was there
something that surprised. Challenged you with dream speech itself
or in the discussion with the murderers? Because one of the things that
(48:47):
Richard tells the murderers is don't let him
talk. he's going to convince you otherwise.
So I was just curious. I wanted to hear your Your take on this.
>> Peter (48:56):
I think the thing that both Jeffrey and I found
in this, both in the
Dream sequence, and in the defending
your life sequence with the murderers
is the constant,
the constant need for a new approach to a new
thought, that keeps the scene moving
(49:17):
and alive. so it doesn't sort of all
sit on one sort of,
emotional level. Every single
excuse that he has for them not killing him, every
single experience that he has in the
dream sequence in the nightmare is a new experience.
And, it builds
(49:37):
on the experiences before that. And I think you have to
pay attention to that because it really, really
helps keep it afloat, you
know, keep it. You keep people listening to it,
and it helps clarify the
emotional need in Clarence, which
is critical in this scene. And it becomes
semi desperate by the end, I think, to
(50:00):
try to save his life. So that part of it was kind of
fun to explore. When do the new thoughts occur?
How do you make them new? What's new about them?
you know, how do you play that?
effectively. that was kind of fun to explore. And you don't think
about that when you just read the speech. Sure,
that was kind of fun.
>> Gideon (50:21):
I want to just add to that that, if
you ever try to cut a speech, like you want to
make everything shorter, you find out that
those new things are
unfolding in a direction. And if you try to
skip something, it's very hard to get from one to the next.
and the later in Shakespeare's career, the harder that is because it
(50:42):
becomes so integrated and interconnected.
>> Peter (50:44):
It's really true.
>> Gideon (50:45):
So that as you're discovering each new thought,
if you're trying to shorten the speech and cut something out,
you think, well, I'll just go from this one to this one. But then it
doesn't work. You need to get through this one before you can
get to that one. And Peter's
discoveries make us realize
that there's a. There are all these new
(51:07):
discoveries and then there's an overall shape to the argument.
>> Geoffrey Wade (51:12):
And what I will, ah, just add. And
I suppose the people who are listening can chime in if they want,
but I always find that you
think, I'm going to cut this speech because it's so long and it'll
just bore people. But when
you execute a long speech,
well, brilliantly, like Peter
(51:32):
just did, it actually feels
shorter than, you know, than if
you would. If you don't do it so well but
have fewer words. It's odd because the
listener gets carried on this journey that the listener wants
to go on. They're not just listening to a recitation
of, I did this, then I did this, and then I did this.
>> Gideon (51:51):
It reminds me of Salieri in,
Amadeus saying too many notes or
somebody.
>> Geoffrey Wade (51:59):
I actually have to say that it's.
It's the Baron Orsini, whatever his name
is.
>> Gideon (52:07):
And you just think you're not listening to Mozart if you
think there are too many or too few notes, you're not getting.
Exactly. And the same is true here.
>> Geoffrey Wade (52:16):
Too many notes. Yeah.
>> Nathan Agin (52:19):
to echo your point, Jeffrey, that,
Exactly. Right. That it doesn't feel like you're just all of
a sudden hearing this actor do a speech. You know, you haven't just
suddenly been transported like, oh, this must be a. This must be his big
speech. It's that combination of the
newness of the thoughts that keeps the
audience, you know, connected. And you're just.
(52:39):
It's like somebody in real life telling you a story. You don't know
where they're going, but they just kind of keep. They're
reliving this experience that they want to relate. And,
you're engaged with that.
>> Geoffrey Wade (52:49):
So.
>> Nathan Agin (52:49):
Yeah, I totally agree that it takes what
could be considered long and makes it feel. It's that
psychological time makes it feel short. I just
want to mention, a couple, comments. Steve mentioned that,
we were talking about the murderers. He had two editions that
assigned the two murderers lines differently, and the way
that you, guys performed it tonight sounded right to him.
(53:10):
So I think. I think there is some truth, to that in
terms of, like, really figuring out if you want to go about
making those two characters distinct. That seems to be a
good, thing to explore. and, Marcelo added that
this is a wonderful platform to rehearse and work on the text,
and of course, present it. So, you know, as
I've said, hopefully, all the actors here have
(53:30):
enjoyed, using this medium to work on this and
really explore this, and, then use it to, share their
work, with those elsewhere in the world.
So, yeah, I mean, I'll leave it open just a little bit longer for
any questions. you know, we don't have to leave, but,
you know, if there's anything else, the artists, director,
dramaturg, actors want to say or share, but,
(53:51):
otherwise we can all, wrap this up for this evening.
>> Gideon (53:54):
I would just like to say that I don't want us to
get too comfortable with this medium
because I'd like to see us back on the stage
in the same space as soon as
possible.
>> Geoffrey Wade (54:07):
I think you're not alone there.
>> Gideon (54:10):
As good as this is and as good as you guys have made it,
and it's certainly been fun for me to have this time to work
with you, I would
really love to be invited onto a single stage for table
work and do the same thing
and then watch it come alive on the stage.
So let's all not get too Covid,
(54:30):
friendly here.
>> Geoffrey Wade (54:32):
Your lips to God's ears, my friend.
>> Nathan Agin (54:34):
Well, I only hope that,
perhaps this may become, an addendum,
an additional tool we can use as we all go
forward, to be able to connect actors from anywhere on the planet,
to work on Shakespeare or other scenes or things like that.
>> Gideon (54:48):
That's true. I agree with that.
>> Nathan Agin (54:50):
So, all right, well, does anyone else have
anything else to add? Speak
now for anything other than to.
>> Geoffrey Wade (54:57):
Say it's been a distinct pleasure to work with all of
you guys. Really? What a
pleasure. Thank you.
>> Gideon (55:05):
Great.
>> Nathan Agin (55:06):
Great. And, Gideon, and also
again, thank you to all the artists for being. Being part of this. And,
thank you to all of you for joining and keeping
theater alive. as I mentioned, we plan to hold more
workshops in the future, and look forward to perhaps
some of you joining us in the scenes.
So, that's it. Thanks again very much, and we'll see you at the next
night of virtual theater. So. All right, good
(55:29):
night, everyone.
>> Geoffrey Wade (55:30):
Take care. Thank you, Grace. Bye. Thanks,
guys.
>> Gideon (55:33):
Bye.
>> Nathan Agin (55:33):
Bye.
>> Gideon (55:34):
Thank you.
>> Aubrey Saverino (55:34):
Thank you.
>> Gideon (55:35):
Good work.
>> Aubrey Saverino (55:36):
Yeah. Thank you, guys.
Again, hello and welcome to our scene presentation
(00:02):
for August. my name is Nathan Agin. I'm an
actor and host of the Working Actors Journey, which
began as a podcast with in depth conversations with
lifelong actors. And this year we have branched out into
online readings and now workshops. We, do plan
to hold another series of workshops and we'll be sure to let you all know
when that's happening next. if you have any
(00:23):
questions, either for me or for the artists,
please feel free to use the chat feature in Zoom
and I'll see all of those come in and be able to forward those long.
now I'm very excited we can share this scene tonight
from Richard III, Clarence's Dream
and Murder, Act 1, Scene 4. what you see
tonight is the culmination of work over the past
(00:44):
month. it's a bit of a peek inside the
rehearsal room. It's a final presentation of sorts.
and the participants may use this time to try something
different or, or experiment. I'll introduce
everyone briefly and then turn it over to the
group so if, all the artists could, come
back on camera just, very briefly.
(01:05):
All right, let me.
>> Gideon (01:06):
Okay.
>> Nathan Agin (01:07):
Okay. and let's
see here. Okay, just getting everything
lined up. Perfect. so, we have two
acting veterans, here with us tonight. Jeffrey Wade,
our director and playing the Keeper,
and Peter, Van Norden playing Clarence. Both have
extensive theater, film and TV credits. they've both
(01:28):
done shows on and off Broadway. Jeffrey, has also done
national tours and is part of the Harry Potter show in
San Francisco. When things can start back up. and
Peter has worked at several major theaters in Southern California, working
with multiple genres, authors and styles.
as for First Murderer, we have Aubrey
Saverino, a graduate of the Old Globe USD
(01:49):
MFA program who has worked across the country in
classical plays and as second murderer. Daniel
Cordova, a SoCal based actor who has worked at South
Coast Rep and with the UK based group. The show must go
online. The, dramaturg for our workshop is
Gideon Rapoport, a, San Diego teacher
and author of the forthcoming book A Shakespeare
(02:09):
Companion for Students. Thank you all,
all of you artists for being part of this. and Gideon, I
will turn it over to you to share a bit about the play.
>> Gideon (02:27):
Okay, thank you. I'm just going to say a few words
about where we are in the play we are looking at. Act
one, scene four. Richard III
begins at the end of the wars of the Roses
and it has devolved into wars between the house of
Lancaster and the house of York. At the beginning of
this play, the Lancastrian kings,
(02:48):
Henry, VI and his son, the heir, have
been murdered by the York brothers. They are three
brothers. The eldest is Edward. He is
now the king. His next brother is
Clarence. And Clarence has a history of
betrayals. Clarence was for his brothers,
and then he went against them. And he promised
to fight for the Lancastrian kings. And then in the
(03:10):
end, he turned against them and helped kill them.
and the youngest brother is Richard,
famously hunchbacked and evil
willed. And he's decided he wants to be
king. To do that, he's going to kill everybody between
himself and the crown. And that includes his brother
Clarence, whom he has arranged to be put in.
(03:31):
Into the tower and to be
killed there. we are
going to have a short cut in the
scene, between line 76
and line 98. Where,
normally the character of Brackenbury would appear. But
we've cut that out. And so there will be just
a skip to, the scene where,
(03:54):
after we hear about Clarence's dream. the scene where the
murderers come in. so that's the
basic information. This play will form the
end of the wars of the Roses. And at its
end, Henry VII will come to power. And
he's the grandfather of Queen Elizabeth,
who was the queen when Shakespeare was writing
(04:15):
the play. So now our
presentation of, Richard III, Act 1,
Scene 4.
>> Geoffrey Wade (04:29):
Why looks your grace so heavily today?
>> Peter (04:32):
Oh, I have passed a miserable night.
So full of fearful dreams, of ugly
sights. That as I am a Christian, faithful
man. I would not spend another such a night.
Though twere to buy a world of happy days. So
full of dismal terror was the time.
>> Geoffrey Wade (04:49):
What was your dream, my lord? I pray you, tell me.
>> Peter (04:53):
Methoughts that I had broken from the tower.
And was embarked to cross to Burgundy. And
in my company, my brother Gloucester, who from
my cabin tempted me to walk upon the hatches.
Thence we looked toward England.
And sighted up a thousand heavy times. During
the wars of York and Lancaster that had befallen
(05:14):
us. As we paced along
upon the giddy footing of the hatches.
Methought that Gloucester stumbled.
and in falling struck me that thought to stay
him. Overboard into the tumbling billows of the
main. O Lord, methought
what pain it was to drown.
(05:34):
What dreadful noise of waters in
my ears. What sights of
ugly death within my eyes.
Methought I thought I saw a thousand
fearful racks. A thousand
men that fishes gnawed upon
wedges of gold, great anchors, heaps
(05:54):
of pearl, Inestimable stones,
unvalued jewels. All scattered
in the bottom of the sea.
Some lay in dead men's skulls.
And in the holes where eyes did once inhabit. There
were crept as twere in scorn of
eyes reflecting gems. That wooed
(06:15):
the slimy bottom of the deep. And mocked
the dead bones that lay scattered by.
>> Geoffrey Wade (06:21):
Had you such leisure in the time of death.
To gaze upon these secrets of the deep?
>> Peter (06:27):
Methought I had, and often did. I
strive to yield the ghost. But still
the envious flood stopped in my soul.
And would not let it forth to find the empty,
vast and wandering air. But
smothered it within my panting bulk. Who
almost burst to belch it in the sea.
>> Geoffrey Wade (06:47):
awaked you not in this sore agony?
>> Peter (06:50):
No, no, My dream was
lengthened after life.
>> Gideon (06:56):
Oh.
>> Peter (06:56):
Then began the tempest. To my soul
I passed, methought, the melancholy flood. With
that sour ferryman which poets write of.
Unto the kingdom of perpetual night.
The first that there did greet my stranger
soul. Was my great father in law, renowned Warwick.
(07:17):
Who spake aloud. What
scourge for perjury can this
dark monarchy afford false
Clarence?
And so he vanished.
Then came wandering by a shadow like an angel.
With bright hair that dabbled in blood. And he
shrieked out aloud, Clarence has
(07:39):
come. False, fleeting,
perjured Clarence. That stabbed me in the
field by Tewkesbury. Seize on him,
Furies. Take him unto, torment.
With that, methought a legion
of foul fiends environed me. And
howlered in mine ears some hideous
(07:59):
cries. That with the very noise
I trembling waked.
And for a season after could not believe
but that I was in hell.
Such terrible impression made my dream.
>> Geoffrey Wade (08:14):
No marvel, lord, though it affrighted you. I am
afraid, methinks, to hear you tell it.
>> Gideon (08:19):
Keeper.
>> Peter (08:20):
Keeper. I have done these things. That now give evidence
against my soul. For Edward's sake.
And see how he requites me.
O God, if my
deep prayers cannot appease thee. But thou wilt be
avenged on my misdeeds.
Yet execute thy wrath in
(08:41):
me alone. O spare my
guiltless wife and my poor children.
Keeper, I prithee, sit by me awhile.
My soul is heavy, and I fain would sleep.
>> Geoffrey Wade (08:55):
I will, my lord. God give your grace
good rest.
>> Dan Cordova (09:10):
What, shall he stab him as he sleeps?
>> Aubrey Saverino (09:13):
No, he'll say, twas done cowardly when he wakes.
>> Dan Cordova (09:16):
Why, he shall never wake until the great judgment
day.
>> Aubrey Saverino (09:19):
Why, then he'll say we stabbed him sleeping.
>> Dan Cordova (09:23):
The urging of that word judgment hath
bred a kind of remorse in me.
>> Aubrey Saverino (09:28):
What, art thou afraid?
>> Dan Cordova (09:31):
Not to kill him, having a warrant, but
to be damned for killing him, from the which no
warrant can defend me.
>> Aubrey Saverino (09:38):
I thought thou hadst been resolute.
>> Dan Cordova (09:40):
So I am to let him
live.
>> Aubrey Saverino (09:44):
I'll back to the Duke of Gloucester and tell him so.
>> Dan Cordova (09:47):
I prithee, stay a little. I hope
this passionate humor of mine will change.
It was wont to hold me but while one tells 20.
>> Aubrey Saverino (10:05):
How dost thou feel thyself now?
>> Dan Cordova (10:08):
Faith, some certain dregs of conscience are yet
within me.
>> Aubrey Saverino (10:13):
Remember thy reward when the deed's done.
>> Dan Cordova (10:17):
Since he dies, I had forgot the reward.
>> Aubrey Saverino (10:20):
Where's thy conscience now?
>> Dan Cordova (10:22):
In the Duke of Gloucester's purse.
>> Aubrey Saverino (10:23):
when he opens his purse to give us our reward, thy conscience
flies out.
>> Dan Cordova (10:27):
Tis no matter. Let it go. There's few, or
none will entertain it.
>> Aubrey Saverino (10:32):
What if it come to thee again?
>> Dan Cordova (10:34):
I'll not meddle with. Makes a
man a coward. A man
cannot steal, but it accuseth him.
A man cannot swear, but it checks him.
A man cannot lie with his neighbor's wife, but it
detects him. It is a flushing,
blushing, shame faced spirit that
(10:54):
mutinies in a man's bosom. It
makes, obstacles. It fills a man
full of obstacles. It made me
once restore a purse of gold that by chance I found.
It beggars every man that keeps it. It is turned
out of towns and cities for a dangerous thing.
And every man that makes means to live well. Endeavours
(11:15):
to trust to himself and live without
it.
>> Gideon (11:19):
Ah.
>> Dan Cordova (11:20):
zounds. Tis even now at my elbow, persuading me
not to kill the duke.
>> Aubrey Saverino (11:24):
Take the devil in thy mind and believe him not. He
would insinuate with thee but to make thee sigh.
>> Dan Cordova (11:30):
I am strong framed. He
cannot prevail with me.
>> Aubrey Saverino (11:35):
Spoke like a tall man that respects thy reputation.
Come, shall we fall to work?
>> Dan Cordova (11:42):
Take him on the Costard with the hilts of thy sword. And
then throw him into the malmsy butt in the next room.
>> Aubrey Saverino (11:48):
Excellent device. And make a sop of him.
>> Dan Cordova (11:52):
Soft. He wakes.
>> Aubrey Saverino (11:54):
Strike.
>> Peter (11:56):
No.
>> Dan Cordova (11:57):
We'll reason with him.
>> Peter (12:00):
Where are thou, keeper? Give me a cup of wine.
>> Aubrey Saverino (12:04):
You shall have wine enough, my lord, anon.
>> Peter (12:08):
In God's name, what art thou?
>> Dan Cordova (12:11):
A man as you are.
>> Peter (12:13):
But not as I am, royal.
>> Dan Cordova (12:15):
Nor you as we are loyal.
>> Peter (12:19):
Thy voice is thunder, but thy looks are
humble.
>> Dan Cordova (12:23):
My voice is now the king's. My
looks, mine own.
>> Peter (12:27):
How darkly and how deadly dost thou speak.
Your eyes do menace me.
Why, look you pale. Who sent you hither? Wherefore do
you come.
>> Geoffrey Wade (12:39):
To?
>> Peter (12:41):
To murder me?
>> Aubrey Saverino (12:42):
I?
>> Dan Cordova (12:43):
I.
>> Peter (12:45):
You scarcely have the heart to tell me so. And
therefore cannot have the heart to do it.
Wherein, my friends, have I offended you?
>> Aubrey Saverino (12:54):
Offended us you have not. But the king.
>> Peter (12:56):
I shall be reconciled to him again.
>> Dan Cordova (13:00):
Never, my lord. Therefore prepare to
die.
>> Peter (13:04):
Are you drawn forth among a world of
men to slay the innocent? What
is my offence? Where is the
evidence that doth accuse me?
What lawful quests have given their verdict up
upon the frowning judge? Or who pronounced the
bitter sentence of poor Clarence?
>> Dan Cordova (13:23):
Death.
>> Peter (13:24):
Before I be convict by course of law.
Threaten me with death is most unlawful.
I charge you, as you hope to have redemption. By
Christ's dear blood shed for our grievous
sins. That you depart and lay no
hands on me. The deed you
undertake is damnable.
>> Aubrey Saverino (13:46):
What we will do, we do upon command.
>> Dan Cordova (13:48):
And he that hath commanded is our king.
>> Peter (13:51):
Erroneous vassals.
The great king of kings hath in the
table of his law commanded. Thou shalt do no
murder. Will you then spurn at
his edict and fulfil a man's?
Take heed, for he holds
vengeance in his hand. To hurl upon the heads that
break his law.
>> Dan Cordova (14:12):
And that same vengeance doth he hurl on thee.
For swearing and for murder too.
Thou didst receive the sacrament to fight
in quarrel of the house of Lancaster.
>> Aubrey Saverino (14:23):
And like a traitor to the name of God didst break
that vow. And with thy treacherous blade.
Unripst the bowels of thy sovereign son.
>> Dan Cordova (14:31):
Whom thou wast sworn to cherish and defend.
>> Aubrey Saverino (14:34):
How canst thou urge God's dreadful law to us. When
thou hast broke it in such dear degree?
>> Peter (14:39):
Alas. For whose sake did I that ill
deed? For Edward. For my brother. For
his sake. He sends you not to murder
me for this. For in that sin he is as deep as I.
If God will be avenged for the deed. O
know you yet he doth it publicly.
(15:00):
Take not the quarrel from his powerful arm. He
needs no indirect or lawless course.
To cut off those that have offended him.
>> Aubrey Saverino (15:08):
Who made thee then a bloody minister. When gallant,
springing, brave Plantagenet. That princely novice
was struck dead by.
>> Peter (15:15):
Thee, my brother's love, the
devil and my rage.
>> Aubrey Saverino (15:20):
Thy brother's, love. Our duty and thy faults.
Provoke us hither now to slaughter thee.
>> Peter (15:25):
If you do love my brother, hate not me.
I am his brother, and I love him
well. If you are hired for
me, go back again. I will send you to my brother
Gloucester. Who shall reward you better for my life
than Edward will for tidings of my death.
>> Dan Cordova (15:44):
You are deceived. Your brother
Gloucester hates you.
>> Peter (15:48):
Oh, no. He loves me, and he holds me
dear. Go you to him from me.
>> Aubrey Saverino (15:53):
Ay, so we will tell him.
>> Peter (15:56):
When that our princely father York blessed his three
sons with his victorious arm, he
little thought of this divided friendship.
Bid Gloucester think of this, and he will weep.
>> Aubrey Saverino (16:08):
Ay, millstones, as he lessen'd us to weep.
>> Peter (16:10):
Oh, do not slander him, for he.
>> Aubrey Saverino (16:12):
Is kind, right as snow in harvest.
Come. You deceive yourself. Tis he
that sends us to destroy you here.
>> Peter (16:21):
It cannot be, for he be
wept my fortune, and hugged me in his arms,
and swore with sobs that he would
labour for my delivery.
>> Aubrey Saverino (16:31):
Why, so he doth, when he delivers you from this
earth's thraldom to the joys of heaven.
>> Dan Cordova (16:36):
Make peace with God, for you
must die, my lord.
>> Peter (16:41):
Have you that holy feeling in your souls to counsel me
to make my peace with God? And are you yet
to your own souls so blind that you will
war with God by murdering me? O,
sir, consider they that set you on
to do this deed will hate you for this
deed.
>> Dan Cordova (17:01):
What shall we do?
>> Peter (17:02):
Relent, and save your souls.
>> Aubrey Saverino (17:04):
Relent? No. Tis cowardly and womanish.
>> Peter (17:07):
Not to relent is beastly, savage,
devilish. Which of you, if you were a
prince's son, being penned from liberty as I am now,
if two such murderers as yourselves came to
you, would not entreat for life? Ay,
you, would beg, were you in my distress.
My friend, I spy some
(17:28):
pity in thy looks. Or, if thine
eye be not a flatterer, come thou on my
side, and entreat for me a
begging prince. What beggar pities
not?
>> Dan Cordova (17:41):
Look behind you, my lord.
>> Aubrey Saverino (17:43):
Take that and that.
If all this will not do, I'll drown you in the
mamsy butt within.
>> Dan Cordova (17:53):
Oh, a, bloody deed, and
desperately dispatched.
How fain like Pilate, would I wash my hands of
this most grievous murder.
>> Aubrey Saverino (18:06):
How now. What mean' st thou? That
thou help' st me not? By heavens, the Duke
shall know how slack you have been.
>> Dan Cordova (18:14):
I would he knew that I had saved his brother.
Take thou the fee and tell him what I say, for I
repent me that the duke is slain.
>> Aubrey Saverino (18:23):
So do not I
go, coward as thou art.
Well, I'll go hide the body
in some hole to let the duke give order for his burial.
And when I have my meed, I will away
for this will out, and then I must not stay.
>> Geoffrey Wade (19:00):
Come Back, Little Shiva.
>> Nathan Agin (19:02):
Come back.
>> Geoffrey Wade (19:04):
There we go. Am I unmuted yet?
Yes. Hello, Hello. We're all
back. Where's the lovely Peter? There you are.
Nicely done, you guys.
>> Gideon (19:14):
Very nicely done.
>> Geoffrey Wade (19:19):
I,
>> Gideon (19:20):
Yeah, I'm just.
>> Geoffrey Wade (19:21):
I'm delighted.
so, although it's weird there, the invisible people watching us,
let me ask you, first of all, I thought, and I think
Gideon agrees, I thought it went well,
even with the usual typical sort of minor
stumbles over to, you know, find your script and stuff. Please
don't worry about that stuff. It didn't show.
(19:42):
It was really good. It was a great distillation of all
these things we'd been working on, which I'm just going
to mention so that people again in the audience
there. we worked on,
We've gone through this piece extremely slowly a
couple of times, giving everyone a chance to do a lot of,
investigating about what's going on before, ah, she or
(20:03):
he said their line m
and kind of work through their lines,
working out every particular, nuance in
what was going on. and then towards the end
we sort of telescoped that or collapsed it and I
think were able certainly before
and this time to move through it at a quite
(20:24):
reasonable pace, without, belaboring it.
And I'll be interested to hear what, some of our
observers might have to say about
how well, they could follow it or not if they
had problems. because I know,
I, and certainly all of us as actors, we're always wondering if we're making
the point, if we're getting the point across.
and I, And I think Gideon will agree with me,
(20:48):
think, that certainly in this case, but often,
certainly with Shakespeare, but usually the author does
most of the heavy lifting for you and if you will trust
her or him.
ah, do the actors work, but you don't have
to rewrite the thing for the author, as it were.
So we worked on.
>> Gideon (21:05):
Especially for this author.
>> Geoffrey Wade (21:06):
Especially for this author, exactly.
so we worked on things like paste. We certainly went through and made sure we knew what
we were saying in, some of these expressions.
It's not a particularly difficult,
or verbally naughty
scene. But, there are things that needed clearing
up and I think those came out very clearly. We worked on,
(21:29):
ah, scansion and stress.
sometimes there's a, bit of a
fielder's choice, you know, with how you want to work at
what words you want to stress. so
we touched on a little bit of everything, so I'm going to stop
talking for a second and ask,
you guys, Gideon included, how you felt about
(21:50):
it, how you thought it went. I know it's always difficult for an actor because you're not
supposed to be thinking about how it's going as you do it, but
give us something to talk about now.
Aubrey, you want to start? Why don't you start?
>> Peter (22:02):
Sure, sure.
>> Aubrey Saverino (22:03):
I mean, I think, first of all, you can't ignore the fact that we're working in
this strange medium, because this is what's afforded to
us. So inevitably, there are things as an actor you
miss, like being in the room with people. but at
the same time, I think what's interesting, Exciting about Shakespeare is
that it's so much meant to be heard and listened to.
and so there's a lot of it that does work in
(22:24):
Zoom, because it's about the language anyway.
and it does feel like once you've done the work
and taken the time and unpacked it and looked at the
language really closely, that you are jumping on a
train that just moves, once
it begins. And you have to kind of trust
that you've done the work already.
(22:46):
and then it just seems to fly. So. And obviously, like, working
with these, fine folks,
it's easy to
feel that, you know, just passing the
torch off.
>> Geoffrey Wade (23:00):
Daniel, you're sort of the next on my screen.
How do you think, in general, you enjoyed working on it or
not? And, I mean, feel free because
it feels great.
>> Dan Cordova (23:11):
It's stretching muscles that haven't been stretched for a while,
so it feels really good. and, you know, as Aubrey
said, it's awkward doing it in Zoom, but it is nice
to be able to do it with
live partners, even though they're on
computer, but, you know, so that you can actually hear
the words being spoken by your partner. And it really,
(23:32):
informs how you respond and the words that,
you know, the emphasis that you put on words as you respond
to them, just hearing somebody else say the words
makes such a big difference than, you know, than reading it
off the page.
>> Geoffrey Wade (23:48):
Peter, how did you. How did you feel
about what we just did? Any thoughts
one way or the other?
>> Peter (23:56):
well, I mean, it's, It's always been a
favorite scene of mine, so it's
kind of, a pleasure to get to do it,
even in this strange Hollywood
square boxes,
which, ah, as Aubrey says, it
makes you put the concentration on the words,
(24:16):
on the language, and on the clarity of the
language, which we worked
on considerably, you know, and there's a lot to be
learned from that before you would get on your feet and
try to move around and do this murder scene, you
know? so it's really kind of, Kind
of a pleasure to have that time to
(24:36):
just work the language pretty much,
and the thoughts, you know,
and how they come and the different ways of presenting
them, the different speeds of presenting them.
>> Gideon (24:48):
the.
>> Peter (24:48):
Clarence. I said in the very beginning. Clarence speaks
in very long thoughts.
and it's really nice to be able to work on that,
and try to get. Try to sort of,
come to terms with that. so that's been. It's been
fun, and working with these two guys has been great.
>> Geoffrey Wade (25:07):
Good. Gideon,
you want to say anything?
>> Gideon (25:12):
Well, I'm very happy to hear Peter say this, because
I'm always lobbying for a little more table work
before we get Shakespeare on his feet.
and we got to do that this time. I also want
to say what a pleasure it is to work with
such good actors, because you take the notes and then
you run with it. And I thought
(25:32):
all of you did that. the notes that Jeffrey
gave last week when we worked on this,
to Aubrey about the murderer, the first murderer, and to
Daniel about relaxing into the park,
and to Peter about varying. You took all
those notes, and you took my verbal notes, and
it just. It just got better and better.
(25:53):
And today I thought it was really tough.
I did take about, eight or ten
specific word notes, but I'll only give those
to you if you want them. But,
I thought it was really effective, and you used the camera really
well, so that, to me,
it came across quite well.
>> Geoffrey Wade (26:14):
Yes, Kudos for that, all of
you, because that was not something we really
worked on at all. But you obviously all have a
natural inclination for it. and we
literally didn't work at all. But it was,
terrific, the way you use the camera, that part of
it. Gideon, why don't you give the notes? And then I
(26:35):
actually. again, because there are people
watching, and it might be kind of fun. There's
one of two sections that I want to just
go over again, not because they were wrong, you guys, just
to show perhaps how things can be approached
differently.
>> Gideon (26:51):
Okay, so I'm going to nitpick a little bit.
Aubrey, 116.
resolute. Rather than resolute.
Daniel, 146. I'm talking line
numbers now for people who are watching.
It beggars Any man that keeps it. It's turned out of
towns and cities for a dangerous thing. And every man that needs to
(27:14):
live. So you used every
in both. But the first one's any
man, and then every man got it. And you
can just remember it because it's in alphabetical order.
>> Geoffrey Wade (27:26):
also, I m mean, that's. That's a great example
of a, Of an
antithesis. Right. The difference between any and every.
>> Gideon (27:35):
Yeah. So you're right.
>> Geoffrey Wade (27:36):
It's really important that they be different.
>> Gideon (27:38):
Yeah. 155.
Daniel, you hit the pronoun me
instead of the verb prevail. So I want you to think about that.
Whether Whether it's stronger to
hit prevail in that line than the pronoun.
Peter 167.
(28:00):
Oh, you said, where are thou, keeper?
And it's where art thou, keeper? That's
just English grammar from the Renaissance.
>> Peter (28:10):
I was just waking up, you know.
>> Gideon (28:12):
Yeah. Nice.
Where are all of you, keeper? line
191.
Ah, Peter, you said,
What did you say Unto the frowning
judge? I think your problem
was unto.
(28:35):
I think that wasn't clear. What lawful quest have given their verdict
up unto.
>> Peter (28:38):
Unto the frowning judge.
>> Gideon (28:40):
I think you said to. Or something like that. Okay.
It just unto wasn't clear. Daniel, line
208.
you left out false for false. Forswearing.
>> Dan Cordova (28:51):
Thank you.
>> Gideon (28:52):
And you've got three. You got four F's in that line.
Yeah. Which Shakespeare is doing on purpose. So you can play with
those Fs for false, for swearing
and for. In fact, there are three fours
for forswear and for murder.
Do you see that? And then
false is the modifier. So you
(29:14):
just. It's, it's there for a reason. line
210, Lancaster.
I don't have to say more than that.
line 255. Whose is that? This is the
last one, Peter.
Oh, you said that he would labor. You
added for my delivery. But I did it.
>> Peter (29:36):
Yeah.
>> Gideon (29:36):
Yeah. Okay. Great. That's it, guys. It was
really good.
>> Geoffrey Wade (29:41):
It's an interesting thing. again, for the people who are
listening, when you're doing this kind of verse and
this part of the scene, you know, the bulk of the scene is in verse.
Peter, said he realized
he'd done that the second he did it. Because Peter
could internally feel the rhythm going a
little off. Right. It's a great
(30:03):
thing. You know, all this
Shakespeare stuff looks intimidating, but often
the rhythm and the verse of it, Helps you. It
helps you learn lines because you learn a rhythm as well
as actual words.
>> Gideon (30:17):
and you learn stresses. Very often you. If you pay attention
to the I.
>> Geoffrey Wade (30:21):
Am, it actually helps give you readings,
because you were in the middle of giving a note there. I just wanted to
note again, for the people who are listening on this
Clarence speech that starts. Are you drawn forth
among a world of men to slay the innocent? What is my offense?
Where is the evidence that doth accuse me? That was,
ah, something that, we looked at early
(30:42):
on and made sure that we knew that,
Clarence is actually asking questions again. It's
easy, I think often in
drama, but certainly in Shakespeare. Suddenly when you're presented
with what seems to be a long speech to make
your questions rhetorical instead of actual
questions. M. And,
(31:02):
again, you know, sort of does the work for you. That's your
objective right there, is to find out who these people are, what's. It's
as simple as that. You know, you don't know you're about to be murdered yet.
so, again, for the people listening. Question marks, I
always say in Shakespeare are your friend.
Use them as question marks, not assumptions.
(31:23):
and I'm just. I thought Peter did it
exquisitely. I just wanted to point out that that was something we,
we had worked on.
I would, I would like
again, just for, Just for the fun of it and
because we can. I would like to just
go through,
(31:44):
that sequence from when,
Clarence wakes up and it's a lot of
second murderer stuff, right?
And, Dan, my note to you is
again, to
look for the person that's just within.
You don't feel you have to apply any sort
(32:07):
of. Again, it's a temptation when, you know, we're doing a
presentation. So I'm going to do, Just
remember that you are sufficient under yourself. You're a big
guy, you're strong. I mean, you look like
you could be the second murderer. So don't
feel you have to do anything
more than what you are.
(32:27):
and his
hesitation, his lack of true
conviction about what he's doing.
Again,
you don't have to put a lot of decorative
frosting on that. It's in the words, right?
And it's in your mind. I know it's in your mind. So you don't have to show me what's
(32:48):
in your mind. These are again, for everybody, for you
in particular, everyone who's listening.
these are sort of minor things we're sort of buffing up with
you Know quadruple zero steel wool at this
point, but, let's try it that
way. And,
let's start with,
(33:14):
Let's go from the second murderer's line. Soft, he
wakes. First murderer,
strike. No, we'll reason with him.
Do you guys all see where we are?
I'm gonna take myself off. Just give
yourself a second or two
to reinsert yourself in the world of what we're doing
(33:35):
and then start.
>> Dan Cordova (33:46):
Soft, he wakes.
>> Aubrey Saverino (33:48):
Strike.
>> Dan Cordova (33:49):
No, we'll reason with him.
>> Peter (33:52):
Where art, thou, keeper? give me a cup of wine.
>> Aubrey Saverino (33:55):
We shall have wine enough, my lord, anon.
>> Peter (33:58):
In God's name, what art thou?
>> Dan Cordova (34:01):
A man as you are.
>> Peter (34:03):
But not as I am, royal.
>> Dan Cordova (34:06):
Nor you, as we are
loyal.
>> Peter (34:10):
My voice is thunder, but thy looks are humble.
>> Dan Cordova (34:14):
My voice is now the king's.
My looks, mine own.
>> Peter (34:19):
How darkly and how deadly dost thou speak?
Her eyes do menace me. Why look you pale?
Who sent you hither? Wherefore do you come?
>> Geoffrey Wade (34:29):
To. To.
>> Dan Cordova (34:32):
To.
>> Peter (34:33):
To murder me?
>> Aubrey Saverino (34:35):
Ay, ay,
>> Peter (34:36):
You scarcely have the heart to tell me so, and
therefore cannot have the heart to do it.
Wherein, my friends, have I offended you?
>> Aubrey Saverino (34:45):
Offended us? You have not. But the king.
>> Peter (34:47):
I shall be reconciled to him again.
>> Dan Cordova (34:51):
Never, my lord. Therefore
prepare to die.
>> Peter (34:55):
Are you drawn forth among a world of men
to slay the innocent?
What is my offence?
Where is the evidence that doth accuse me?
What lawful quest have given their verdict up,
unto the frowning judge? Or who
pronounced the bitter sentence of poor Clarence? Death.
(35:15):
Before I be convict by course of law.
To threaten me with death is most unlawful.
I charge you, as you hope to have redemption by
Christ's dear blood shed for our grievous sins, that
you depart and lay no hands upon me.
The deed you undertake is
(35:35):
damnable.
>> Aubrey Saverino (35:36):
What we will do, we do upon command.
>> Dan Cordova (35:39):
And he that hath commanded is our king.
>> Peter (35:41):
Erroneous vassals. The great king of
kings hath, in the table of his laws commanded that
thou shalt do no murder. Will you then
spurn his edict and fulfil a
man's? Take heed,
for he holds vengeance in his hand to hurl
upon the heads that break his law.
>> Dan Cordova (36:01):
And that same vengeance doth he hurl on thee
for false forswearing and for murder too.
Thou didst receive the sacrament to fight in
quarrel of the house of Lancaster.
>> Aubrey Saverino (36:14):
And like a traitor to the name of God didst break
that vow. And with thy treacherous blade
unripst the bowels of thy sovereign
son, whom thou.
>> Dan Cordova (36:24):
Wast sworn to Cherish and defend.
>> Aubrey Saverino (36:27):
How canst thou urge God's dreadful law to us when
thou has broke it in such dear degree?
>> Geoffrey Wade (36:32):
Good. I'm gonna stop you. I'll stop you.
that was really terrific, Daniel.
Really interesting. Absolutely.
the first one is perfectly valid. I found that one actually
more powerful and more,
affecting, to me, somehow,
when you, feel less, need
(36:54):
to urge it on us, it lets us
in a little more. So well done all.
And, Peter, that your speech was even
better than before.
>> Gideon (37:04):
So I agree. can I make a little
note on 174?
>> Peter (37:09):
Sure.
>> Gideon (37:10):
I discovered it now that in Daniel's way
of saying it this time, Clarence says,
thy voice is thunder, but thy looks are humble. So there's
a. There's an antithesis there. And the second
murderer says, my voice is now the king's.
My looks, mine own. And I just realized why
there's the same antithesis. The
(37:30):
thunder is because he's speaking as the king
that's gonna get Clarence killed. But his
looks are his own and humble.
And that's why he has these second thoughts
as the scene progresses. So
the separation in the
second murderer's line is exactly reflecting
the separation in Clarence's line.
(37:53):
It struck me this time wonderfully.
>> Geoffrey Wade (37:56):
Yeah, that's interesting. And there's an interesting play on,
humble there too, because humble, of course, means not
royal.
>> Gideon (38:03):
That's right.
>> Geoffrey Wade (38:04):
But it also, implies his state, ah,
of mind. Well, that was terrific, you
guys. I don't know if, Nathan, can you hear me? I hope
you do. I can hear you.
I think we've done enough, and we've
had some notes and had a chance to even rework a bit so
people can see what happens when there's, Again, the way
(38:24):
these marvelous people are able to make
adjustments of shading. Much less
big blocks, but just shading, which is wonderful in
an actor. So, I open it back to you if
other people have questions or comments or anything.
>> Nathan Agin (38:39):
Sure, sure, sure. Yeah. there have been a few
comments coming in.
Marcelo loved, your stash, Jeffrey.
You have a nice stash. and he also said
that, he said, well done. The intentions were clear, so is the
language. and I wanted to just kind of build on, a couple
things that were mentioned. I love. I mean,
he's a bit of a kid in the candy store watching this stuff. You
(39:02):
know, as Gideon said, you know, you have great actors who can do their thing.
but I love that this gives Actors an opportunity to do something that they
don't normally get, which is plenty of time
to work on the text. and as
Gideon mentioned about working with actors, it
is great when you have already great actors doing this.
And I hope that these
(39:22):
workshops can help people become even better
actors. And that this workshop, without all
the other demands of a production, it allows you
to be able to do things like really focus on
implementing the notes. When you don't have to worry about
the lighting, the costume, the props and all that other
stuff. You can just really, just tell the story. So
(39:42):
it's just really great to watch and see all this come
through. I wanted to kind
of maybe bring up a couple things from the rehearsals that I
sat in on that I thought were really fascinating. And
I open feedback from anyone who would like to
speak. But there were two items that stood out. One
was the discussion you guys had about which
(40:02):
murderer says which lines. And obviously
that wasn't just an arbitrary discussion, but in different
versions they're kind of broken up differently. And I
thought it was just interesting how you went about figuring out,
well, which first murderer
should say this or does it make sense for second murder? That.
And then also the exercise of you
alluded to Jeffrey going through very slowly, but that
(40:25):
exercise where it was really slow and
direct to camera, I thought that was also an
interesting exercise that everybody worked on. And of course in this kind
of quasi theater film medium,
you know, it can kind of pay dividends as well. So open
to you know, either, either
item that people would like to address or talk about their experience.
>> Geoffrey Wade (40:47):
Well, I'll talk about the camera part. It's a, it's a
rehearsal technique that I didn't
invent. I can't remember who I learned it from, but
I use it in theater directing
which is that
you need to have gone through the script a few times. It helps to have
some familiarity with it. But each actor
(41:08):
in a two hander scene, you look at the
script and pick up as much of the
sentence or the speech as you can. And that may be one
clause, it may be a whole sentence, maybe a whole speech, but you
pick it up and then you deliver those lines
directly to your scene partner.
And if you forget something,
(41:29):
you look down and pick up the rest so that everything is directly
here. And if you begin to forget something, you don't turn to your book and
pick it up and go like that. You keep everything
directly to your partner. The same partner, the other
person, to whom you're speaking, on the other hand,
looks directly at the speaker
and does not look down, does not try to pick
(41:50):
up a cue, does not look down until you know, if it's Aubrey, until
she for example, feels that the speech is
over and then she'll look down and pick up
her thing and go, so that every part
of every speech is delivered directly to the other person.
It's very difficult. It's a little
easier to, well, I don't know.
(42:11):
The temptation is always to be generous,
to your partner and pick up the line so you're ready
to go. And that's not the deal. The deal is to. It
works particularly well. It was particularly helpful
on this because we never
get a chance, you know, even when we're doing the
scene in the end we don't even get what you would get
(42:33):
normally in a rehearsal and certainly a, a performance,
a chance to look in the other actors eyes because
we're looking at the script or even if we're looking in the
camera, which is what we should be doing, you can't
glance down and see the person here. The eyes give you
away. So I found it
particularly useful and I hope the,
(42:53):
I think the actors did, rehearsal
technique. But it's one that I use in theater. But it
was invaluable here.
>> Aubrey Saverino (43:01):
Yeah, I told Jeffrey I'm stealing it. I teach acting at
Moorpark College, which obviously right now is on
online, on Zoom. and I thought
it was such a great, I mean a great exercise probably in a regular
rehearsal room, but particularly on Zoom, when
I think people are conscious of like where are my eyes
going and when do I get to, Am I looking at myself? Am I looking at the camera?
Am I looking at my scene partner? It just gave us a chance to slow
(43:24):
down, look at our scene partners,
listen to each other, listen to the words and
let everything else go. And that changed some of the choices
that we were making because I heard something that Daniel
said, that I wouldn't maybe have heard otherwise or something because
I was thinking about what I'm going to say next. So.
Yeah, no, it's just, it's great to slow down and just. I mean
(43:44):
it's, it's the first thing I teach in acting, right, is just
acting is listening and responding. It's just listening to each other
and responding, responding truthfully. And it's nice to
take that time and make sure that that is indeed what
we're doing and not trying to be good Actors by. Oh, we know
Shakespeare has a certain rhythm. Oh, we better pick up our cues. Oh, we
better. You know, I don't want to let there be a pause.
(44:04):
Can't do that until we know what we're saying. But
more importantly, what the other actors are saying.
>> Gideon (44:13):
if you want.
>> Dan Cordova (44:14):
I think a lot of the. For us, for the
actors. I think that, that exercise, at least for
me, really kind of was,
when a lot of the
emotional meaning of the lines kind of,
made sense, started to really make sense.
The literary meanings, you know, we had kind of gone through.
(44:35):
But to understand what the person is really
meaning, what they're feeling and how that affects me,
that eye contact makes so much difference.
>> Gideon (44:45):
Good.
>> Geoffrey Wade (44:46):
Gideon, do you want to talk about the, choosing of.
>> Gideon (44:48):
Yes. I just wanted to say that the textual problem
with Richard III is
elaborate and challenging because the two early texts,
the Folio and the Quarto, are both authoritative,
and they're very different in little ways.
and one of the ways we found they were different in this scene
was that the. The, lines given to second
(45:08):
murderer are sometimes given to first in one of
the texts and then to the second in the other. So
Jeffrey saw this, and we talked about
how we wanted to split them up.
And although we were going basically from one text,
we picked this,
structure from the other text because
we wanted to separate the two
(45:30):
murderers as much as possible in of terms character.
And we talked a lot about that, how we can. How we can
distinguish them and make them distinct and separate, different
from each other so that each has his own character.
and the picking the other text helped us
do that a lot. and that
just. That made it more. I think it made it more
(45:51):
interesting to work on it, but also made it
more interesting to hear it when it was in
profound performance.
>> Nathan Agin (46:03):
Did anyone have any other, further thoughts, any of the
actor, like, for specifically Aubrey and Daniel?
that process of, you know, working through which
murderer said which line. What was that like for you guys
to be involved in that discussion and as
Gideon was talking about, to, you know, really try to define these
characters? because a lot of times as actors, you show up
and. And the play is cut as it is
(46:25):
and that kind of stuff. So what was it like to be part of that discussion?
>> Aubrey Saverino (46:29):
I always find it fascinating. I mean,
I'm definitely a Shakespeare nerd and a Shakespeare lover. I
think, looking at different versions of Shakespeare,
and trying to decipher with some
intelligence and detective work to the best of our abilities.
what maybe they were doing then or what works now.
(46:50):
and it did make sense. I had questions about the character with the
first cut. and I was curious. I
was like, I would have had to as an actor be like, alright, well it's
interesting. I don't want to murder him at the top and
I do want to murder her. So like where do I shift and change?
As opposed to the second version which we ended up
using, which was. It was clear what my character wanted from.
(47:11):
Clearer to me what my character wanted from the get go.
So I found that. Yeah, I find that stuff really
interesting.
>> Geoffrey Wade (47:17):
Yeah.
>> Peter (47:17):
And I think
>> Dan Cordova (47:17):
you know, that. That part of it where we worked through that,
as you're saying, it helped to define each of our characters a little
bit. Which. Which made the rest of the rehearsals,
you know, a little bit easier because we kind of knew
we're not the same. And it's very easy in a play like this. Once
again, not, you know, not huge roles in
the overall scope of this play. It would be very easy to
(47:39):
just have them be, you know, very
similar characters and
No distinguishing characteristics between, you know, between
them. but the way we went through the text and
I believe it was the second version that Jeffrey had
really defined the characters separately.
>> Nathan Agin (47:58):
Great, great. and I'll mention again for anyone, watching
and part of this you can use the zoom, chat, to add
any questions in.
Peter, I would love to. By the way, I'm
thrilled that you finally have a chance to work on this
part. Work on the scene like that delights me to no end
that we can make that happen even in these strange times.
and with all the roles you've done, we find yet
(48:19):
another that You can at least put a small check m.
next to it.
>> Gideon (48:23):
At least put it on your resume.
>> Nathan Agin (48:26):
But I'd love to hear. Peter, Were there any challenges particular
to you? Like Either with the dream speech
that. Either something that surprised you as you started to work
on it. Because I'm sure you knew of the scene. M. I imagine
and you knew its shape. But Either. Yeah. Was there
something that surprised. Challenged you with dream speech itself
or in the discussion with the murderers? Because one of the things that
(48:47):
Richard tells the murderers is don't let him
talk. he's going to convince you otherwise.
So I was just curious. I wanted to hear your Your take on this.
>> Peter (48:56):
I think the thing that both Jeffrey and I found
in this, both in the
Dream sequence, and in the defending
your life sequence with the murderers
is the constant,
the constant need for a new approach to a new
thought, that keeps the scene moving
(49:17):
and alive. so it doesn't sort of all
sit on one sort of,
emotional level. Every single
excuse that he has for them not killing him, every
single experience that he has in the
dream sequence in the nightmare is a new experience.
And, it builds
(49:37):
on the experiences before that. And I think you have to
pay attention to that because it really, really
helps keep it afloat, you
know, keep it. You keep people listening to it,
and it helps clarify the
emotional need in Clarence, which
is critical in this scene. And it becomes
semi desperate by the end, I think, to
(50:00):
try to save his life. So that part of it was kind of
fun to explore. When do the new thoughts occur?
How do you make them new? What's new about them?
you know, how do you play that?
effectively. that was kind of fun to explore. And you don't think
about that when you just read the speech. Sure,
that was kind of fun.
>> Gideon (50:21):
I want to just add to that that, if
you ever try to cut a speech, like you want to
make everything shorter, you find out that
those new things are
unfolding in a direction. And if you try to
skip something, it's very hard to get from one to the next.
and the later in Shakespeare's career, the harder that is because it
(50:42):
becomes so integrated and interconnected.
>> Peter (50:44):
It's really true.
>> Gideon (50:45):
So that as you're discovering each new thought,
if you're trying to shorten the speech and cut something out,
you think, well, I'll just go from this one to this one. But then it
doesn't work. You need to get through this one before you can
get to that one. And Peter's
discoveries make us realize
that there's a. There are all these new
(51:07):
discoveries and then there's an overall shape to the argument.
>> Geoffrey Wade (51:12):
And what I will, ah, just add. And
I suppose the people who are listening can chime in if they want,
but I always find that you
think, I'm going to cut this speech because it's so long and it'll
just bore people. But when
you execute a long speech,
well, brilliantly, like Peter
(51:32):
just did, it actually feels
shorter than, you know, than if
you would. If you don't do it so well but
have fewer words. It's odd because the
listener gets carried on this journey that the listener wants
to go on. They're not just listening to a recitation
of, I did this, then I did this, and then I did this.
>> Gideon (51:51):
It reminds me of Salieri in,
Amadeus saying too many notes or
somebody.
>> Geoffrey Wade (51:59):
I actually have to say that it's.
It's the Baron Orsini, whatever his name
is.
>> Gideon (52:07):
And you just think you're not listening to Mozart if you
think there are too many or too few notes, you're not getting.
Exactly. And the same is true here.
>> Geoffrey Wade (52:16):
Too many notes. Yeah.
>> Nathan Agin (52:19):
to echo your point, Jeffrey, that,
Exactly. Right. That it doesn't feel like you're just all of
a sudden hearing this actor do a speech. You know, you haven't just
suddenly been transported like, oh, this must be a. This must be his big
speech. It's that combination of the
newness of the thoughts that keeps the
audience, you know, connected. And you're just.
(52:39):
It's like somebody in real life telling you a story. You don't know
where they're going, but they just kind of keep. They're
reliving this experience that they want to relate. And,
you're engaged with that.
>> Geoffrey Wade (52:49):
So.
>> Nathan Agin (52:49):
Yeah, I totally agree that it takes what
could be considered long and makes it feel. It's that
psychological time makes it feel short. I just
want to mention, a couple, comments. Steve mentioned that,
we were talking about the murderers. He had two editions that
assigned the two murderers lines differently, and the way
that you, guys performed it tonight sounded right to him.
(53:10):
So I think. I think there is some truth, to that in
terms of, like, really figuring out if you want to go about
making those two characters distinct. That seems to be a
good, thing to explore. and, Marcelo added that
this is a wonderful platform to rehearse and work on the text,
and of course, present it. So, you know, as
I've said, hopefully, all the actors here have
(53:30):
enjoyed, using this medium to work on this and
really explore this, and, then use it to, share their
work, with those elsewhere in the world.
So, yeah, I mean, I'll leave it open just a little bit longer for
any questions. you know, we don't have to leave, but,
you know, if there's anything else, the artists, director,
dramaturg, actors want to say or share, but,
(53:51):
otherwise we can all, wrap this up for this evening.
>> Gideon (53:54):
I would just like to say that I don't want us to
get too comfortable with this medium
because I'd like to see us back on the stage
in the same space as soon as
possible.
>> Geoffrey Wade (54:07):
I think you're not alone there.
>> Gideon (54:10):
As good as this is and as good as you guys have made it,
and it's certainly been fun for me to have this time to work
with you, I would
really love to be invited onto a single stage for table
work and do the same thing
and then watch it come alive on the stage.
So let's all not get too Covid,
(54:30):
friendly here.
>> Geoffrey Wade (54:32):
Your lips to God's ears, my friend.
>> Nathan Agin (54:34):
Well, I only hope that,
perhaps this may become, an addendum,
an additional tool we can use as we all go
forward, to be able to connect actors from anywhere on the planet,
to work on Shakespeare or other scenes or things like that.
>> Gideon (54:48):
That's true. I agree with that.
>> Nathan Agin (54:50):
So, all right, well, does anyone else have
anything else to add? Speak
now for anything other than to.
>> Geoffrey Wade (54:57):
Say it's been a distinct pleasure to work with all of
you guys. Really? What a
pleasure. Thank you.
>> Gideon (55:05):
Great.
>> Nathan Agin (55:06):
Great. And, Gideon, and also
again, thank you to all the artists for being. Being part of this. And,
thank you to all of you for joining and keeping
theater alive. as I mentioned, we plan to hold more
workshops in the future, and look forward to perhaps
some of you joining us in the scenes.
So, that's it. Thanks again very much, and we'll see you at the next
night of virtual theater. So. All right, good
(55:29):
night, everyone.
>> Geoffrey Wade (55:30):
Take care. Thank you, Grace. Bye. Thanks,
guys.
>> Gideon (55:33):
Bye.
>> Nathan Agin (55:33):
Bye.
>> Gideon (55:34):
Thank you.
>> Aubrey Saverino (55:34):
Thank you.
>> Gideon (55:35):
Good work.
>> Aubrey Saverino (55:36):
Yeah. Thank you, guys.
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