December 26, 2025 • 46 mins
🚨 ONE OF THE MOST SHOCKING UFO CASES EVER INVESTIGATED 🚨
On this episode of Truth Be Told Paranormal, host Tony Sweet sits down with award-winning filmmaker James Fox, the visionary behind Moment of Contact—a documentary that many are calling the Roswell of Brazil.
This isn’t a story about distant lights in the sky. This case involves living beings, military recovery operations, medical doctors, and eyewitnesses who stayed silent for nearly 30 years. James reveals what drew him to Brazil, why he initially dismissed the case, and what ultimately convinced him that something extraordinary truly happened in Varginha in 1996.
We also explore:
• Why this case may be more significant than Roswell
• Doctors and military officials now speaking publicly
• New revelations added to the updated version of the film
• How this case connects to modern UAP hearings and disclosure
• Why disclosure is a process, not a single moment
This is a powerful, emotional, and deeply human conversation about truth, fear, courage—and what happens when secrets can no longer stay buried.' 🎬 https://geni.us/MOC_NewRevelations
👉 Please follow James Fox on Instagram @jamesfoxdirector and watch the film Moment of Contact: New Revelations here:
👁️ If you’re serious about understanding the UFO phenomenon, this is an episode you cannot miss.
👉 SUBSCRIBE to Truth Be Told Paranormal
👉 FOLLOW for weekly deep dives into UFOs, the paranormal, hidden history, and disclosure
👉 LIKE & SHARE to help keep these conversations alive
🎧 Available wherever you get your podcasts
📺 Watch the full episode on YouTube
🔔 Connect & Follow 🌐 Website: clubparanormal.com
📧 Email: info@clubparanormal.com
📱 Social: @theclubparanormal
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/truth-be-told-paranormal--3589860/support.
On this episode of Truth Be Told Paranormal, host Tony Sweet sits down with award-winning filmmaker James Fox, the visionary behind Moment of Contact—a documentary that many are calling the Roswell of Brazil.
This isn’t a story about distant lights in the sky. This case involves living beings, military recovery operations, medical doctors, and eyewitnesses who stayed silent for nearly 30 years. James reveals what drew him to Brazil, why he initially dismissed the case, and what ultimately convinced him that something extraordinary truly happened in Varginha in 1996.
We also explore:
• Why this case may be more significant than Roswell
• Doctors and military officials now speaking publicly
• New revelations added to the updated version of the film
• How this case connects to modern UAP hearings and disclosure
• Why disclosure is a process, not a single moment
This is a powerful, emotional, and deeply human conversation about truth, fear, courage—and what happens when secrets can no longer stay buried.' 🎬 https://geni.us/MOC_NewRevelations
👉 Please follow James Fox on Instagram @jamesfoxdirector and watch the film Moment of Contact: New Revelations here:
👁️ If you’re serious about understanding the UFO phenomenon, this is an episode you cannot miss.
👉 SUBSCRIBE to Truth Be Told Paranormal
👉 FOLLOW for weekly deep dives into UFOs, the paranormal, hidden history, and disclosure
👉 LIKE & SHARE to help keep these conversations alive
🎧 Available wherever you get your podcasts
📺 Watch the full episode on YouTube
🔔 Connect & Follow 🌐 Website: clubparanormal.com
📧 Email: info@clubparanormal.com
📱 Social: @theclubparanormal
Become a supporter of this podcast: https://www.spreaker.com/podcast/truth-be-told-paranormal--3589860/support.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
What if one of the most compelling UFO encounters in
history didn't happen in Roswell, but thousands of miles away, yes,
in Brazil. Today, on Truth Be Told, we dive headfirst
into one of the most controversial and emotional powerful cases
ever documented, the Virginia Incident, often called the Roswell of Brazil.
(00:21):
This isn't just a story of light in the sky
or distant sightings. This is a case that includes living beings,
military involvement, medical professionals, and witnesses who have carried their
silence for nearly three decades. Today, our guest is award
winning filmmaker and investigative journalist James Fox, the mind behind
(00:41):
A Moment of Contact, the documentary that has shaken the
UFO community and pushed the global conversation on disclosure into
a new territory. James has spent over fifteen years uncovering
testimony from doctors, military officials, and everyday citizens. In this episode,
we explore why this case is fundamentally different from anything
(01:02):
that we have came across before, how new revelations has
emerged since the film's original release, in what this story
means in an era of congressional hearings and modern UAP disclosure.
This isn't speculation. It's a deep human story about fear, courage, truth,
and the cost of keeping secrets. I'm your host, Tony Sweet.
(01:24):
Welcome to The Truth Be Told Studios for the first time.
Award winning director producer James Fox. All right, we have
the one and only mister James Fox, producer extraordinaire, and
I am so excited to have you here, and I
just want to congratulate you on an amazing documentary. As
(01:49):
many of us here in America, we know about Roswell,
we know about nineteen forty seven, but you know, it's
been so long ago. We've heard a lot of the
the experts and the people that grew up around Roswell.
But I feel like this is kind of a second
chance at an opportunity to see an experience. So James,
(02:14):
let's dive in. And you've researched so many UFO contactees
and Roswell and many other events like this. But what
what made you choose Brazil Virginia.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
I think Brazil chose me. No. I mean that jokingly,
because I actually, and I've said this many times, I
was making my second UFO film Out of the Blue.
At the time, we didn't have a title for it.
I ever do, and I always when I'm making a
(02:54):
documentary or you know, in the early stages, I do
very broad stroke concepts, you know, like hey, let's let's
look into the Phoenix Lights case, or let's look into
the Belgian you know, eighty nine wave Bentwaters, et cetera.
(03:14):
And this was happening early on with Out of the
Blue and my partner and I had two partners, Boris
Zubov and Tim Coleman. And Tim was a British guy,
and he was He's like, oh, May, and this was
probably like nineteen ninety nine or maybe two thousand, probably
(03:34):
ninety nine, I think, and the incident happened in nineteen
ninety six, so it was probably only three years old.
And he's like, oh man, you know, we got this
this UFO rush in Brazil and the aliens were walking
around the town and blah blah blah, blah blah blah blah.
And I just was like, I am absolutely, positively, positively,
(03:57):
unequivocally not even going to touch that case, talk about
that case, read about that case, Like I'm not wasting
any time on that absurd, ridiculous case, right, And I didn't,
and he was upset with me at the time. He
was like, you're just so dismissive, and I was. I
had this knee jerk reaction. It can't be, therefore it isn't.
(04:20):
And and then it was at least ten years later
I did. So I finished Out of the Blue. Then
I did a director's cut Out of the Blue. Then
I did I know what I saw sold that And
then I get invited to Brazil, a place called battle Ebe,
which was south of South Ballow. I don't remember how many,
four or five hours on the coast, and speaking of Roswell,
(04:45):
Stanton Frieden was there, Wow in Betterwebe. And I remember
sitting at a cafe out in the street with Stan
and there was this island right off the coast, apparently
one of the only islands on the planet that has
this absolutely deadly snake that that venom is very valuable,
and so we were talking about this, you know this
(05:10):
these poachers that would go on to this island trying
to get the things, and the snakes would drop out
of this you know, out of the trees, and saw
these dead poachers and we're talking about that, and then
the death of the military soldier allegedly involved with with
the Virginia case in nineteen ninety six that came up,
(05:31):
and I thought, oh God, here we go. You know,
this this case again. And I think stan said, like,
you know, you're familiar with the case or something. I
was like, well, yeah, I've heard about it, but you know,
I'm not really left and alone. And he goes, he goes, yeah,
you know, that's many many people consider myself included to
be the Roswell of Brazil. And he said that he
(05:54):
had met some of the witnesses, he had researched it.
He was in Brazil at one point. I don't know
if it was like a year after the incident or
a couple of years after the incident. The impression I
got was it just a few years after the incident.
He was in Brazil and he met with some of
the witnesses and he's like, you know, James, you should
really look into that. And so I have tremendous respect
(06:18):
for Stanton Friedman and nuclear physics system. You know, I mean,
thanks to people like him and Don Schmidt, Kevin Randall,
we know about Roswell, and so I decided reluctantly to
look into it, and then I would probably you know,
make a quick determination that it was all hogwash and
(06:41):
that would be the end of it. But the more
I dug, the more I began to realize. And this
was years, right, This process was years, and now it's
been sixteen years. And then at one point, probably I
don't know, five or six years into it, I was like,
(07:01):
I think this happened. My gosh, I think this happened,
you know, and Marco and I and all the other
fellow researchers, we just kept digging and digging and digging,
and I was going to include a segment of this
case in the Phenomenon, but I ended up scrapping it.
I mean where I spent a lot of time, a
lot of effort. I had a translator, and I remember thinking,
(07:26):
I just there's just there's very complex, so so many
moving parts in this case, and I just can't squeeze
it into twelve minute or fifteen minutes. It just didn't
It didn't work. This is going to have to be
a standalone, you know, a film on just this case,
which is which is what we did. And then since
the release of the first version, of moment of contact.
(07:46):
There have been some very extremely significant developments, so much
so that I had to recut the movie and I'll
obviously include all the congressional hearings and so yeah, that's
that's that's my story, and I'm sticking to it.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Well, being married to a Brazilian and getting to know
a lot of the locals, and like I said, Manaos
is where my spouse is from. They can be very
skeptical about stuff like this, and so I know, just
coming forward with you about this incident was very remarkable,
(08:27):
So I want to jump in with the In the
new version, it included the neurosurgeon, which I have to
say was very touching right at the end, and I
don't want to give anything away, but because I want
people to see it. But you know, doctor Talil, It's
(08:47):
Brazilian names are difficult, difficult to speak about sometimes, but
it was very touching and what he said and he
got very emotional. How did you feel finally getting people
to open up to you about this incident when I
(09:09):
know they can be very stand offish, especially somebody from
another country.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
Yeah, you know, my partner marco Leal has been boots
on the ground and he's been so persistent. And we
we have certain individuals that we've been meeting with well
over a decade that sort of feeds us information. We
meet off the record, and hey, you need to go
(09:38):
see if you could track this person down. I'm pretty
convinced this person saw something or this person saw the tape.
And I jokingly say, you know, doctor I Telo was
like trying to grab a bor of soap in the
bathtub because we'd get near him and then ooh he
would be gone and then wow, I don't know. I
want to say a little over a year ago, we
had heard that he was one of the doctors that
(10:01):
had seen the videotaped evidence because obviously that's you know,
what we've been going after for for a while, because
that's Holy Grail, right, And we managed to get a
I was actually on a zoom call when Marco met
with him, my partner, Marco Leal, a co producer on
the film, and and in the zoom I was I
(10:22):
was being Marco was the translator, and we got I
got to see him and talk to him over the camera.
He he confessed that he had seen the video when
that's what we asked him Marco pressed him further to
find out if he'd seen the creature, and he denied
that he had seen the creature. But then after that
(10:43):
he had a heart attack, and then after that he
got prostate cancer. And he said that he was staring
at the ceiling in the ICU and thinking, if I
get through this, I think I can't take this to
the grave. His fellow neurosurgeon, Marcos Venisis he had died
from a heart attack in twenty eighteen, so he was
(11:05):
and I don't know at this point how many other
doctors or nurses also saw the creature At Regional. We're
you know, we're doing the best we can to get
in that inner circle and see if there's anybody else
willing to come forward. We have a huge screening with
the I don't know if it's going to be live
or if you're going to you're going to release this later.
(11:26):
So tonight's twenty second the film is actually released today,
and we're having a big screening with the town mayor,
and so you know, we're crossing our fingers that more
witnesses will come for and I think they will, yeah,
recognize that we're stronger together, and the courage of someone
(11:46):
like head neurosurgeon at Regional Hospital who's not doing this anonymously.
Remind your audience, he's never asked for a dime from me.
He's not doing this anonymously, and he's still performing, you know,
surgeries at Regions Hospital right now today.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
That's that is amazing And just like I said, the
emotion he got when he it's it's that holding that
secret in and finally releasing it. And I think people
that see this documentary, I'm getting chills thinking about it,
about how he spoke about his encounter. Uh. For the
(12:23):
people that are watching, I'm showing some pictures of him
in the hospital speaking about his encounter. So there's another
one another uh in a place in the in the
documentary where you went out into the countryside, uh, looking
for the location of the crash. And again the the
(12:48):
excitement of the the gentleman showing you the location, the
excitement he expressed when he actually remembers where the location was.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Carlos Desosa, Yes, yes, yeah, you know, I was just
laughing because Carlos is with us. Now. Oh hey Carlos
looking at him, he's right over there. That's why I
looked all over to the left. He's with us because
he's joining us for the screen for the for the
premiere tonight in in Virginia, as is one of the
lead investigators back in nineteen ninety six. Victorio Paccaccini is
(13:26):
going to be there and he's put says he put
his hand on a bible and taking public light detective
tests that he was shown a video of the creature
in captivity.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
I love And what was it like for you when
when you saw that excitement and you was at the
location where the crash happened? What what?
Speaker 2 (13:43):
What did you feel.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Not just emotional, but was there like feel like a
connection too?
Speaker 2 (13:50):
I was. I was frustrated because it was like our
first big shoot day and we were going to hear
shooting the entire film in one month after you know,
fifteen years of research whatever it was, and he couldn't
find it.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
I remember, I saw the frustration.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Yeah, but you don't really see it. When we were there.
It was I mean, I don't know, it felt like hours.
It could have been a lot less, I don't know,
but it was. And I was thinking to myself, how
could this guy not even like capable of the crash site,
like this this film was not off to a good start.
I mean, granted he had been back since nineteen ninety six,
(14:32):
but i mean, come on, you know. And he kept saying, oh,
there's a white house. There was a white house. I
could see the white house, and you know, trees and
stuff had grown. I guess we couldn't excuse me from
that vantage point, couldn't see it. And then we got
the drone. We were flying the drone. I was flying
the drone around and I'm looking and I'm like, oh gosh,
(14:53):
it looks like a white house off of the distance.
So we relocated, came down there, and then you know,
I remember, he starts to have these almost what looked
to me to be kind of flashbacks, and he's just
like fixated, and he starts running, and I remember our
cameraman who's a little older, Dave West, he was like,
(15:15):
you guys, slow down. You know, I'm having trouble keeping up.
I was like, I can't. I'm not gonna stop. What's
happening right now? Like, first of all, he's having clearly
he's having like flashbacks or memory, you know, and runs
down there and found the spot, you know, and just
managed to capture it all on camera. It was It
was a very powerful moment, very very powerful. You can't
(15:37):
make that stuff, you can't, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (15:39):
Oh no, for sure. I mean you could see the
excitement when he finally realized it. And like again, I
think if it was me, I probably would have been
going back almost every other day just just because of
my curiosity.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
So I.
Speaker 1 (15:56):
Can appreciate the excitement. But one thing that this really
talks about is the encounter of a live, living being,
which I think makes it different from Roswell. Can you
do the comparison and contrast of the Roswell versus this
and how important is this one versus Roswell?
Speaker 2 (16:19):
Well? With Roswell, we really only had Glen Dennis, right,
the mortician, and Glen Dennis had a friend who's a
nurse who told him and sketched stumping on a piece
of paper about the entities what they looked like. She
ended up vanishing. They said that she was relocated to London.
Then I think there was a plane CD. I don't know.
(16:39):
She's very mysterious, but anyway, she's vanished. So we never heard,
we never had any first hand eyewitness testimony and the
creatures that she reportedly saw were dead, right, and so really,
I mean, I think there was one other person. It
might have been mac Brasel, but I'm not positive the
(17:02):
rancher or it was the guy that put out the
press release. I'll think of his name of the second
But in any case, the only thing that I personally
me personally heard at the time. Now years later, there
was Colonel Philip Philip Corso who did an interview with
(17:23):
me in nineteen ninety seven where he had talked that
he had seen these entities dead in a casket I
think en route to write Patterson Air Force Base in
Texas or something. So now for the first time, and
I think it's in any case, I mean, we've got testimony,
for instance, dating you know, we got the close encounter
(17:45):
of the third kind or where he saw these creatures
and his wife thinks that there was some kind of
telepathic communication. She's like, he was never the same after
he locked eyes with one of these beans at a distance.
You know, obviously ruin Zimbabwe. You know, we've got allegations,
but this is a being. This is different because this
(18:05):
was a being in captivity. This was a being that
was inside a hospital with the head neurosurgeon. Yeah, and
the head neurosurgeon after twenty nine years. That's why he
gets emotional at the end, because you know you have this,
You imagine holding something like that back in the world
for that long. Yeah, you know that the pressure on
(18:28):
the weight of that on your shoulders. But yeah, I
think it's the first time in history that I'm aware of,
and I've talked to many other researchers in the field
that we have extremely credible, firsthand eyewitness testimony of communication
and contact with a with a captured being. So that's
how it's extremely different than Roswell in that case and
a lot of other people. I mean, you know, oh
(18:49):
of course, yeah, the girls, and you know, you got
the capture and the smell, and I mean, I don't
have many doctors. We've got the radiologists. We've got doctor
Cesario who worked on the military officer when he was
extremely sick through the kitchen sink at him, couldn't keep
him alive. He's never seen anything like it before or
after any bacteria act like that. Then you've got doctor
(19:12):
Armando coming forward on the record that did the autopsy
on the deceased military officer. Right then you got doctor
Jannini who looked and studied the tissue samples, who's the
founder of the company that did that IPD. He said
he's never seen bacteria like that in his career prior
or after. Who else? You know? So, how many doctors
(19:35):
is that?
Speaker 1 (19:35):
Is?
Speaker 2 (19:35):
That? Like? Five five doctors, right? I mean that's unprecedented,
that is. And all but one are coming forward publicly.
You know, they're not hiding, they're not in disguise. It's
you know, they're putting their name in their face on it.
It's it's quite remarkable. And most of them, except for Janini,
are still working.
Speaker 1 (19:56):
And that's pretty amazing because a lot of them probably
were afraid to speak out because of possible job loss
or you know, ridicule in the community. But I have
to say that the community itself is very embracing. I
mean I was. I mean even in the city itself,
I mean, they they definitely. It reminds me of Roswell
(20:19):
in a way, how they represent the UFO and the
aliens throughout the city. So which was kind of refreshing
to see that the city itself.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
Had Let me, let me say something about that monument.
You just showed it yea. Again, I was always kind
of I was always kind of confused. I was like, no,
wait a minute, why did they have a flying saucer
when all the witnesses say it was a cigar shaped object?
Speaker 1 (20:44):
That crass, right, right, But.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
Here's the distinction. And this is something that we learned
in the field out there that I really had a
difficult time coming to terms with. But I mean I
talked to so many different people, so many different people
that describe a disc multiple discs, you know, flying saucer,
(21:09):
moving with purpose, and like they kept saying that it
was clearly looking for something. And I remember asking, the way,
when do we talked about look, what do you mean?
How do you know it's looking for something? They said,
because it was. This is entire families, doctors, that it
(21:29):
was going down to the end, turn stop, come back, grid,
search down to the end stop. They what this one
family you know that didn't want their They so the
house was staying in right now. It's owned by doctors
and their friends are fellow doctors had witnessed the event,
(21:52):
and they said, oh, our friends are doctors. They their
witnesses the event that they really, you know, they'd love
to meet with you, well, we shut up their house
to meet with them because hey, it's a lead, right,
and they were like, oh no, no, no, not on camera.
We don't want to go on camera talking about it.
And I ultimately talked them into okay, look, i'll film
(22:14):
you from the back and faces. I want to include
your names, like and eventually got them to admit, you know,
to doing that. And then i'd flown the drone a
little earlier because I think it's really cool to get
an aerial perspective of like where the girls had the encounter,
where the capture is. And we started looking at proximity
to all these events, like you got the military blockade,
(22:37):
you know, on one block, and then just a block
or two away from that, you've got the girls encounter,
Like everything matches perfectly, and then you've got the alleged
capture from the two military police that's just a couple
of blocks away. So all this activity going on in
this one area of Virginia and the city of Virginia,
and then you have this entire family, the doctors, and
(23:02):
their house is just five blocks away, six blocks away.
So it's like, wow, if you're to believe all these
witnesses and if there was an effort to recover anyone
behind I hate this word, but an extraterrestrial search and
rescue effort or whatever, that would be the spot, you know.
(23:27):
So it makes perfectly good sense that if that was
the case, and if their accounts are true, why wouldn't
it be I know, it's a tall order. So then
we started thinking, my gosh, and that was an aspect
of the previous version of the film that we didn't
quite ourselves kind of realize. And then I had completely
(23:48):
restructured the opening. We have a twenty minute brand new
opening that includes all the stuff that's been happening on
the American side. Then we have a couple very quick
examples of alleged crash retrival cases dating back to the
nineteen thirties, and and I know there was a really
compelling video of a disk at night that we had
included as part of a montage of previous cases in Brazil,
(24:11):
but didn't make the connection. Well, wait a minute, this disc.
That's very impressive. It's in the movie. You probably remember.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
It, oh yet up for sure?
Speaker 2 (24:19):
Yeah, yeah, this disc. And we're like, wait a minute,
this is the same year. This is just a couple
months and it's just not that far as the crow flies,
you know, to the south, and I think it's southeast
of Virginia, of the city of Virginia. So it's like,
could those two be connected? Yeah, but you know, I
mean pretty compelling. No, it is.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
It is very compelling, And I even thought about that
watching it is. First of all, why why choose that area?
What was so important about that area? I guess we
always think, you know, like what was important about Roswell,
what was important about in certain areas? I can understand.
Speaker 2 (24:59):
I think when you a crash, you know, like all
the witnesses described as like gash in the back of
the crap. Now we have a new witness, Fabio Frontado,
and he saw it kind of more from the bottom,
and I don't believe he saw the gash in it,
(25:21):
but he said it was definitely having trouble and it
landed at his farm. And then of course we do
Google maps and we can kind of see proximity to
all the various uh you know, witness accounts, and they
all line up incredibly perfectly. But we also have heard
from a number of researchers that the Americans had informed
(25:42):
the authorities in Brazil that this object was coming in
right and it had this gash in it, And for
years I keep thinking like, how did how how did
that gash happen? Like you know, their their meteorite hit it,
or it was a right mean I mean you know,
(26:02):
or did the Americans shoot it? So I don't know,
I really don't know. I'm forced to speculate, but if
I had to take a guess, I would think the
most likely scenario is that the Americans shot it.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
Sure is funny because in ninety sick I guess ninety six,
we might have had some type of technology by then,
but which also was fascinating for the people that's gonna
watch this, and I recommend watching Moment of Contact New
Revelations of Alien Encounters because we have the amazing James
Fox here talking about it. But the Brazilian military did
(26:38):
get involved, but also the US military, which I was
really surprised that they mentioned the US Air Force were
on ground, which I felt very fascinating.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
USAF. And it's funny actually because I think it was
in twenty twenty one when we were filming uh the
moment of contact, the first cut of moment of contact
and the individual and I'm sorry that I'm struggling for
his name, but the guy that actually saw the USAFF
(27:13):
is what they called it, and the USAF, And at
first I was going TOSAF, what's USAF. Oh, of course
it's USAF, the United States Air Force. And he came
forward on a podcast while we were filming there and
his partner who's also I guess you call radar control
or you know that that monitor all the incoming flights
(27:36):
into Brazil and you have to have Brazilian government authorization
to fly into this country and land, and this plane
didn't have it, according to the flight control people that
we talked with, UH and that a high level military
official stepped into the room and said, let the plane land.
And the plane landed in Campenis, which is where we
(27:57):
have testimony from a number of people, a number of
people that the Americans came in and where, and that
the debris. Certainly the Aliens went to Campenis, so logically
that would be where the Americans would come in and land.
And I'm told they had a plane big enough where
two one or two helicopters were pulled out of it,
(28:19):
and then they flew into Virginia by by chopper as well,
and then back to Campenis loaded something on the plane
and then boom back to the States. And that's when, uh,
that's when the case goes goes cold. So that's too bad.
We need what we did, we I had to see
United States Air Force colonel retired and I didn't know
(28:42):
at the time that he was a United States Air
Force colonel, but he was. He was contacted me anonymously
for a while and he's like, you know, we got
to track this plane down, and I know where to look,
and you should do a foiler request and and and
then finally one day I was like, excuse me, like
(29:02):
because he's really smart, like he really knew what he
was talking about, And I said, do you mind me?
Like who are you? And he goes, well, I'm a
United States Air Force retired colonel and fighter pilot and
blah blah blah, you know, and had his own experience.
And so anyway, we filed in twenty twenty two, we
filed a FOYA request for flight records, and I quite honestly,
(29:26):
I just never heard back. We kind of forgot about
the fact that we had filed this FOYA. I mean,
you know, life goes on and I did the program,
and then in twenty twenty five we get a response
and it's a response from, well you saw it in
the movie. Yeah, from the CIA. Essentially we can either
confirm nor deny and based on some act from nineteen
(29:48):
forty nine or something, it's it's classified or nationalist can whatever,
you know, So we couldn't get we couldn't even find
out any planes that came in. They wouldn't even give us.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
That well, I mean, just by saying we can't confirm
or deny, that was the That was the key.
Speaker 2 (30:03):
That was the key. You know. It's I remember this
moment with Nick Pope. It was so funny confidence hmmm, well,
somebody asked some kind of a serious question and jokingly
he it was just one of these moments and and
uh in UFO history that I happened to have witnessed.
(30:26):
And he says, he says, ma'am, I can neither confirm
nor deny. So every time I hear those words, I
think if Nick Pope said he you know, it was
everybody laughed or would laughter in the room. But it
was really funny.
Speaker 1 (30:37):
I mean, it tells a lot. It does tell a lot.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
It does, isn't it? Well?
Speaker 1 (30:41):
In this film, I I was very impressed. You had
some very high level voices like doctor Ic Davis, Christopher Mellen,
and Kirk McConnell. How did the their perspectives help bridge
the this event with like modern you you you a
he disclosures?
Speaker 2 (31:01):
Well, I really feel like I mean, certainly when Moment
of Contact the first cut was released in twenty twenty two,
I don't know. I'm not sure that people outside of
the UFO community were ready for that. Yeah, I mean
that same response that I had when I was making
(31:24):
my second UFO doc of it can't be Therefore, it
isn't like it's hard to wrap your mind around something
like this, particularly if you don't have any background knowledge
on the phenomenon and previous cases, right, And I think
the media. It was the first time that I released
(31:48):
a film that I got not one invitation on any
mainstream outlets. It was more way more of a grassroots effort.
And I remember, I'll get to your question a minute,
but I remember the slow sort of evolution of its
(32:11):
its acceptance or level of interest, I guess would grow slowly.
And I remember a couple of moments on Joe Rogan
not with me with other guests, and the topic of
UFOs came up and I think the film have been
out for a couple of months something like this, and
their guest goes two of them separate guests. One of
(32:33):
them was Michael Schellenberger and the other one was Bill something.
I'll think of it the second any case, they were like, uh,
have you seen that the documentary moment of contact with
James Fox? And Joe's like, no, no, I've seeing that. Well,
what's it about it? They're like, well, you know.
Speaker 3 (32:52):
I I know this sounds really crazy. I'm not going
to tell you it doesn't, but man, you gotta watch
that maybe up crashing Aliens.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
And I could see this very like incredulous look on
Joe's face, like, oh, come on, really you know and
uh uh. And then another guest came on build something
great guy with company minds, and and he did the
same thing. He was like, well, you know, I know
it sounds kind of you know, it brings up with Joe.
(33:27):
And then Joe watches it and he was just floored
by it. And he sent me a text. And I
was in my workout class in Vermont and I go
to this dad bond classes. Everybody makes fun of each other.
It's a bunch of middle aged dudes get together to
work out and have a great time. It's just men,
men only, and uh, we're all in the class together.
(33:47):
And I hit my phone buzz and I just kind
of walked over in the middle of the workout and
I looked and it was Joe Rogan. He was like, hey,
you know, I just watched Moment of Contact. Holy, you know,
be wow. And he says, hey, you know, you want
to come on the show and talk about it. And
my response was, is the Pope Catholic? I got lol
or whatever. And then and then the film kind of
(34:12):
got some traction and then, of course not as a
direct result at all, but it's just interesting that, you know,
we had the congressional hearings and then David Grush came
forward the next year, and it was like, holy smokes man.
I never anticipated that was going to happen, that we
(34:33):
had these allegations at the highest levels. I mean, people
testifying to a bipartisan group of lawmakers under oath that
there's a crash retrieval program and this has been going
on for decades. You have no idea man, Like I
was just I just sat there, I was watching it live,
and I just had tears constantly flowing down my face
(34:54):
because I've been laughed at and ridiculed particularly, you know,
I mean, I put my neck out this first version
of moment of contact. Yeah, And I remember I even
had fellow members that I had a lot of respect
for in the community, and they were, hey, you know,
banning my ear, Like are you sure this is the
move you want to make right now? You know, like
(35:16):
that's a tall that's a that's a huge allegation, you know, Yeah,
And I was like, I know, I know, and they're like,
you know, you're coming off from the phenomenon and you
you know, we had the unprecedented cooperation. We had interviewed
with Senator Harry Reid and you know, Christopher Mellen and
Jumpedesta and a whole slew of others, and you know,
(35:37):
people are like, you know, you really want to jeopardize
those contacts and your reputation and all that stuff. But
you know, I was like, hey, I understand your skepticism,
and I appreciate it and I respect it. But I've
been there many times over the last whatever it was
twelve years at the time, thirteen years at the time,
and I'm convinced that it happened. So I'm going to
(35:58):
I'm going for it. You know. Good. Anyway, it's interesting
to see where this is going. I don't think at
this point we've had four congressional hearings in the last
couple of years. I don't think they're putting the genie
back in the bottle.
Speaker 1 (36:13):
So no, they haven't at all.
Speaker 2 (36:16):
Well, you know, and I don't even know how this
film is going to be received in mainstream. Now we'll see.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
I think it's I mean, if anything is so well
put together and the passion that you put into it
is so appreciated. But I think people will receive it well,
and if anything, it'll open many people's minds again.
Speaker 2 (36:40):
You know. Again, I don't know. Sorry, what looks like
is that camera thing on where it's moving the camera
around on my side? Is that? Okay?
Speaker 1 (36:48):
Not on your side?
Speaker 2 (36:49):
No, No, it's okay, right, Sorry, I just noticed that.
The I just look like it's offset a little bit
and I don't know why anyway, whatever, but yeah, so
carry on.
Speaker 1 (36:59):
Oh no, no, And one thing I do want to
go back, because since you did the filming, you said,
some new people have come forth, and also I want
to know about if any any headway with the gentleman
I can't remember his name that you went to visit
him and he threatened to shoot you, Eric Lope.
Speaker 2 (37:18):
So last night I'm in Brazil right now, as you
get told by my hat. Last night we had the
option of going and meeting with town officials, people that
have been instrumental and putting some stuff together that we're
doing here that will be happening next month, and or
going to church. And we were told that Eric Lopes
(37:39):
would probably be at that church, so we were going
to use and I boy, I was really torn. It
was one or the other. And I felt like if
I didn't respect the town officials that have been super
kind to us and they really wanted us to be there,
I would have we could have seen him at church.
I'm not giving I haven't given up on him. I
(38:01):
asked his wife, I don't know a couple of years
ago what it would take to get him to come forward,
and she said, bring my brother back to back to life.
And her brother is Marco Cheriz. Because Eric Lopes kind
of a weird little twist, but Eric Lopes married the
(38:21):
sister of Marco Scheriz, the military officer who allegedly jumped
out of the car and grabbed the creature with his
bare hands and put it together on this lap in
the back seat, and off they went to a clinic
and then I think they went to regional hospital. And
and yeah, as you know in the story, Marco series
(38:44):
died a few weeks later from some crazy infection. It
got a little scratch under his armpit from probably when
he grabbed this thing inadvertently. It just scratched him. So
it's crazy that his wife just said, he'll come forward
if you can bring my brother back to life. Wow,
now things could change. Who knows. Yeah, I think seeing
(39:06):
people like the forensic pathologists, the former chief chief of police,
you know, the head neurosurgeon, doctor Ichilo coming forward. The
thirtieth anniversary is coming up next month, maybe things will change,
Maybe more people will come forward. I'm quite optimistic that
will be the case. But we'll just have to wait
and see.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
I don't I don't want to keep you too long
because I know you have a busy day to day.
But you've said before that that disclosure is the process,
not a moment. Where does moment of contact fit in
that larger disclosure timeline?
Speaker 2 (39:43):
You know, I I'm doing everything I can, and I
think everything helps. All the efforts people like yourself and
many many others, it's all contributing to it. And I
remember a lot what I met with Senator Rounds in DC,
(40:07):
maybe about a year ago, and he's like, hey, I
hear the frustration. I know you feel like things aren't
happening fast enough. We have these extraordinary allegations from David
Grush and what's happened since and blah blah blah blah blah,
and you know, you see that out there, and I
have to remind people like you know, we've had four
congressional hearings in the last couple of years. We hadn't
(40:30):
had anything like that in over fifty years prior, so
be patient. But Senator Rounds addressed this issue and he said,
I want to remind you guys that these things don't
happen overnight. We're not running one hundred yard dash. We're
running a marathon. So be patient, you know. And I
think it's important for all of us in the community
(40:54):
and people that want answers, and even people that are skeptical.
It's fair enough, but you know, these allegations at the
highest levels. I mean, you know, the implications are so profound. Like,
let's let's support the effort. Let's let our elected representatives
know that we'd like this UAP Disclosure Act, you know,
(41:15):
little blower protection. Get this legislation passed. Hey man, if
there's nothing to hide, get the bill passed. Let's see, right.
It was interesting. Dave Grush brought up a very interesting
point on Rogan and we included in the program where
he says, he says, uh, you know, the people that
(41:37):
were behind, uh, the significant pushback that they've gotten from
a couple of representatives, they're just so happens their district
is like you know, right, Patters an Air Force base area,
and you know, raytheon and lockeed and like, oh, surprise, surprise.
You know, Oh, there's nothing to hide. No, it's all
ridiculous cases. But don't pass that bill. Whatever you do, right, right, right,
(42:03):
don't listen to what people say. What's what they do?
Speaker 1 (42:06):
Yeah, now, exactly exactly. Well, I know this is another
example of a very big impact not just in the
UFO community, the but the history of the world is
this disclosure and if this case was officially acknowledged tomorrow,
(42:31):
what implications would you think you would have on a
global disclosure not just in American narratives.
Speaker 2 (42:41):
Sorry, there's a mosquito. I was just I hate mosquitoes
me too. You know, it's a really complex question. I
remember how put Off talking to me about the complexities
of disclosure, aspects of it that I never dreamed of.
You know. I used to always think like this by
yah moment, like we're not alone in the universe. How
(43:02):
cool is that? What are you uniting? And it would be,
But there's other aspects to it. I think kind of
the world needs right now is it's become more unified,
particularly in the United States. Right But okay, let's just like,
let's just imagine it's all real. This is really happening.
(43:22):
Crash retrievals have happened. We're in possession of this extraordinary technology.
You know, whatever the observed technology is that's whizzing around
with impunity, ain't doing it on jet a fuel, right.
You know. You listen to the likes of you know,
Dave Fravor, and you hear about how the fastest military
jet you know in the Navy right this state flood
rings around it. I mean, it made a joke of it.
(43:47):
If you could like weaponize it, or if other countries
get their hands on it and they weaponize it, that
could that could I could see how that could be
an issue of naturally, unfortunately, I can see how that
could be an issue of national security. And I could
see the American government never giving this technology up unfortunately,
I really because of the fear of other countries possibly
(44:10):
weaponizing that. I mean, it's what do you do? I
don't know. But the biologics, you know, the aliens like
the ones that in Roswell and and for potentially Kecksburg
and all the various cases, particularly Virginia. I don't see
how that would be a national security issue. I mean,
maybe there could be an acknowledgment of the fact they've
(44:34):
they've recovered some of this technology and they give an
explanation of the reasons for national security and maybe people
will understand. But but the biologics, that that's something that
I think every everybody on the planet should should know about,
you know. But how they go about doing it, I
don't know. I really don't know. Because you know, if
(44:57):
if the president of the United States stood up tomorrow
and acknowledge this. I mean, it would make waves around
the world, right, But then for sure America would have
to prove it. Yeah, because implications are global, not just
for America. And then half the country hates the president
who it is. So I don't know. I don't know.
I don't know how, I don't know. I don't know
how you do it. I don't I'd like to see
(45:19):
it done, but it's it's more of a complex issue
than one might think.
Speaker 1 (45:24):
Yeah, yeah, I agree with you. It's it's one of
those things that it maybe they're waiting for the right time,
but it's like saying having kids or whatever, there's never
a right time. Sometimes we just have to pull the
band aid off and do it. But from what I
from what I've heard in the documentary, I'm more scared
of human beings than I would of the aliens.
Speaker 2 (45:47):
Or so me too, I know, right, Yeah, So.
Speaker 1 (45:52):
Well, mister Fox, I appreciate you being here, and I
congratulations on the great film. Good luck tonight at the premiere,
and I hope you continue to spread the love through
your work and hopefully one day we'll see you again
for the next one.
Speaker 2 (46:11):
I appreciate you having me on.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
Thanks so much, of course, and thank you everybody for
tuning in. This is Tony Sweet with truth be told
on Club Paranormal Network. I'll see you next Friday. Until then,
take care of yourself and each other.
Speaker 2 (46:23):
Bye,
What if one of the most compelling UFO encounters in
history didn't happen in Roswell, but thousands of miles away, yes,
in Brazil. Today, on Truth Be Told, we dive headfirst
into one of the most controversial and emotional powerful cases
ever documented, the Virginia Incident, often called the Roswell of Brazil.
(00:21):
This isn't just a story of light in the sky
or distant sightings. This is a case that includes living beings,
military involvement, medical professionals, and witnesses who have carried their
silence for nearly three decades. Today, our guest is award
winning filmmaker and investigative journalist James Fox, the mind behind
(00:41):
A Moment of Contact, the documentary that has shaken the
UFO community and pushed the global conversation on disclosure into
a new territory. James has spent over fifteen years uncovering
testimony from doctors, military officials, and everyday citizens. In this episode,
we explore why this case is fundamentally different from anything
(01:02):
that we have came across before, how new revelations has
emerged since the film's original release, in what this story
means in an era of congressional hearings and modern UAP disclosure.
This isn't speculation. It's a deep human story about fear, courage, truth,
and the cost of keeping secrets. I'm your host, Tony Sweet.
(01:24):
Welcome to The Truth Be Told Studios for the first time.
Award winning director producer James Fox. All right, we have
the one and only mister James Fox, producer extraordinaire, and
I am so excited to have you here, and I
just want to congratulate you on an amazing documentary. As
(01:49):
many of us here in America, we know about Roswell,
we know about nineteen forty seven, but you know, it's
been so long ago. We've heard a lot of the
the experts and the people that grew up around Roswell.
But I feel like this is kind of a second
chance at an opportunity to see an experience. So James,
(02:14):
let's dive in. And you've researched so many UFO contactees
and Roswell and many other events like this. But what
what made you choose Brazil Virginia.
Speaker 2 (02:31):
I think Brazil chose me. No. I mean that jokingly,
because I actually, and I've said this many times, I
was making my second UFO film Out of the Blue.
At the time, we didn't have a title for it.
I ever do, and I always when I'm making a
(02:54):
documentary or you know, in the early stages, I do
very broad stroke concepts, you know, like hey, let's let's
look into the Phoenix Lights case, or let's look into
the Belgian you know, eighty nine wave Bentwaters, et cetera.
(03:14):
And this was happening early on with Out of the
Blue and my partner and I had two partners, Boris
Zubov and Tim Coleman. And Tim was a British guy,
and he was He's like, oh, May, and this was
probably like nineteen ninety nine or maybe two thousand, probably
(03:34):
ninety nine, I think, and the incident happened in nineteen
ninety six, so it was probably only three years old.
And he's like, oh man, you know, we got this
this UFO rush in Brazil and the aliens were walking
around the town and blah blah blah, blah blah blah blah.
And I just was like, I am absolutely, positively, positively,
(03:57):
unequivocally not even going to touch that case, talk about
that case, read about that case, Like I'm not wasting
any time on that absurd, ridiculous case, right, And I didn't,
and he was upset with me at the time. He
was like, you're just so dismissive, and I was. I
had this knee jerk reaction. It can't be, therefore it isn't.
(04:20):
And and then it was at least ten years later
I did. So I finished Out of the Blue. Then
I did a director's cut Out of the Blue. Then
I did I know what I saw sold that And
then I get invited to Brazil, a place called battle Ebe,
which was south of South Ballow. I don't remember how many,
four or five hours on the coast, and speaking of Roswell,
(04:45):
Stanton Frieden was there, Wow in Betterwebe. And I remember
sitting at a cafe out in the street with Stan
and there was this island right off the coast, apparently
one of the only islands on the planet that has
this absolutely deadly snake that that venom is very valuable,
and so we were talking about this, you know this
(05:10):
these poachers that would go on to this island trying
to get the things, and the snakes would drop out
of this you know, out of the trees, and saw
these dead poachers and we're talking about that, and then
the death of the military soldier allegedly involved with with
the Virginia case in nineteen ninety six that came up,
(05:31):
and I thought, oh God, here we go. You know,
this this case again. And I think stan said, like,
you know, you're familiar with the case or something. I
was like, well, yeah, I've heard about it, but you know,
I'm not really left and alone. And he goes, he goes, yeah,
you know, that's many many people consider myself included to
be the Roswell of Brazil. And he said that he
(05:54):
had met some of the witnesses, he had researched it.
He was in Brazil at one point. I don't know
if it was like a year after the incident or
a couple of years after the incident. The impression I
got was it just a few years after the incident.
He was in Brazil and he met with some of
the witnesses and he's like, you know, James, you should
really look into that. And so I have tremendous respect
(06:18):
for Stanton Friedman and nuclear physics system. You know, I mean,
thanks to people like him and Don Schmidt, Kevin Randall,
we know about Roswell, and so I decided reluctantly to
look into it, and then I would probably you know,
make a quick determination that it was all hogwash and
(06:41):
that would be the end of it. But the more
I dug, the more I began to realize. And this
was years, right, This process was years, and now it's
been sixteen years. And then at one point, probably I
don't know, five or six years into it, I was like,
(07:01):
I think this happened. My gosh, I think this happened,
you know, and Marco and I and all the other
fellow researchers, we just kept digging and digging and digging,
and I was going to include a segment of this
case in the Phenomenon, but I ended up scrapping it.
I mean where I spent a lot of time, a
lot of effort. I had a translator, and I remember thinking,
(07:26):
I just there's just there's very complex, so so many
moving parts in this case, and I just can't squeeze
it into twelve minute or fifteen minutes. It just didn't
It didn't work. This is going to have to be
a standalone, you know, a film on just this case,
which is which is what we did. And then since
the release of the first version, of moment of contact.
(07:46):
There have been some very extremely significant developments, so much
so that I had to recut the movie and I'll
obviously include all the congressional hearings and so yeah, that's
that's that's my story, and I'm sticking to it.
Speaker 1 (08:01):
Well, being married to a Brazilian and getting to know
a lot of the locals, and like I said, Manaos
is where my spouse is from. They can be very
skeptical about stuff like this, and so I know, just
coming forward with you about this incident was very remarkable,
(08:27):
So I want to jump in with the In the
new version, it included the neurosurgeon, which I have to
say was very touching right at the end, and I
don't want to give anything away, but because I want
people to see it. But you know, doctor Talil, It's
(08:47):
Brazilian names are difficult, difficult to speak about sometimes, but
it was very touching and what he said and he
got very emotional. How did you feel finally getting people
to open up to you about this incident when I
(09:09):
know they can be very stand offish, especially somebody from
another country.
Speaker 2 (09:16):
Yeah, you know, my partner marco Leal has been boots
on the ground and he's been so persistent. And we
we have certain individuals that we've been meeting with well
over a decade that sort of feeds us information. We
meet off the record, and hey, you need to go
(09:38):
see if you could track this person down. I'm pretty
convinced this person saw something or this person saw the tape.
And I jokingly say, you know, doctor I Telo was
like trying to grab a bor of soap in the
bathtub because we'd get near him and then ooh he
would be gone and then wow, I don't know. I
want to say a little over a year ago, we
had heard that he was one of the doctors that
(10:01):
had seen the videotaped evidence because obviously that's you know,
what we've been going after for for a while, because
that's Holy Grail, right, And we managed to get a
I was actually on a zoom call when Marco met
with him, my partner, Marco Leal, a co producer on
the film, and and in the zoom I was I
(10:22):
was being Marco was the translator, and we got I
got to see him and talk to him over the camera.
He he confessed that he had seen the video when
that's what we asked him Marco pressed him further to
find out if he'd seen the creature, and he denied
that he had seen the creature. But then after that
(10:43):
he had a heart attack, and then after that he
got prostate cancer. And he said that he was staring
at the ceiling in the ICU and thinking, if I
get through this, I think I can't take this to
the grave. His fellow neurosurgeon, Marcos Venisis he had died
from a heart attack in twenty eighteen, so he was
(11:05):
and I don't know at this point how many other
doctors or nurses also saw the creature At Regional. We're
you know, we're doing the best we can to get
in that inner circle and see if there's anybody else
willing to come forward. We have a huge screening with
the I don't know if it's going to be live
or if you're going to you're going to release this later.
(11:26):
So tonight's twenty second the film is actually released today,
and we're having a big screening with the town mayor,
and so you know, we're crossing our fingers that more
witnesses will come for and I think they will, yeah,
recognize that we're stronger together, and the courage of someone
(11:46):
like head neurosurgeon at Regional Hospital who's not doing this anonymously.
Remind your audience, he's never asked for a dime from me.
He's not doing this anonymously, and he's still performing, you know,
surgeries at Regions Hospital right now today.
Speaker 1 (12:02):
That's that is amazing And just like I said, the
emotion he got when he it's it's that holding that
secret in and finally releasing it. And I think people
that see this documentary, I'm getting chills thinking about it,
about how he spoke about his encounter. Uh. For the
(12:23):
people that are watching, I'm showing some pictures of him
in the hospital speaking about his encounter. So there's another
one another uh in a place in the in the
documentary where you went out into the countryside, uh, looking
for the location of the crash. And again the the
(12:48):
excitement of the the gentleman showing you the location, the
excitement he expressed when he actually remembers where the location was.
Speaker 2 (13:03):
Carlos Desosa, Yes, yes, yeah, you know, I was just
laughing because Carlos is with us. Now. Oh hey Carlos
looking at him, he's right over there. That's why I
looked all over to the left. He's with us because
he's joining us for the screen for the for the
premiere tonight in in Virginia, as is one of the
lead investigators back in nineteen ninety six. Victorio Paccaccini is
(13:26):
going to be there and he's put says he put
his hand on a bible and taking public light detective
tests that he was shown a video of the creature
in captivity.
Speaker 1 (13:34):
I love And what was it like for you when
when you saw that excitement and you was at the
location where the crash happened? What what?
Speaker 2 (13:43):
What did you feel.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Not just emotional, but was there like feel like a
connection too?
Speaker 2 (13:50):
I was. I was frustrated because it was like our
first big shoot day and we were going to hear
shooting the entire film in one month after you know,
fifteen years of research whatever it was, and he couldn't
find it.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
I remember, I saw the frustration.
Speaker 2 (14:08):
Yeah, but you don't really see it. When we were there.
It was I mean, I don't know, it felt like hours.
It could have been a lot less, I don't know,
but it was. And I was thinking to myself, how
could this guy not even like capable of the crash site,
like this this film was not off to a good start.
I mean, granted he had been back since nineteen ninety six,
(14:32):
but i mean, come on, you know. And he kept saying, oh,
there's a white house. There was a white house. I
could see the white house, and you know, trees and
stuff had grown. I guess we couldn't excuse me from
that vantage point, couldn't see it. And then we got
the drone. We were flying the drone. I was flying
the drone around and I'm looking and I'm like, oh gosh,
(14:53):
it looks like a white house off of the distance.
So we relocated, came down there, and then you know,
I remember, he starts to have these almost what looked
to me to be kind of flashbacks, and he's just
like fixated, and he starts running, and I remember our
cameraman who's a little older, Dave West, he was like,
(15:15):
you guys, slow down. You know, I'm having trouble keeping up.
I was like, I can't. I'm not gonna stop. What's
happening right now? Like, first of all, he's having clearly
he's having like flashbacks or memory, you know, and runs
down there and found the spot, you know, and just
managed to capture it all on camera. It was It
was a very powerful moment, very very powerful. You can't
(15:37):
make that stuff, you can't, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (15:39):
Oh no, for sure. I mean you could see the
excitement when he finally realized it. And like again, I
think if it was me, I probably would have been
going back almost every other day just just because of
my curiosity.
Speaker 2 (15:54):
So I.
Speaker 1 (15:56):
Can appreciate the excitement. But one thing that this really
talks about is the encounter of a live, living being,
which I think makes it different from Roswell. Can you
do the comparison and contrast of the Roswell versus this
and how important is this one versus Roswell?
Speaker 2 (16:19):
Well? With Roswell, we really only had Glen Dennis, right,
the mortician, and Glen Dennis had a friend who's a
nurse who told him and sketched stumping on a piece
of paper about the entities what they looked like. She
ended up vanishing. They said that she was relocated to London.
Then I think there was a plane CD. I don't know.
(16:39):
She's very mysterious, but anyway, she's vanished. So we never heard,
we never had any first hand eyewitness testimony and the
creatures that she reportedly saw were dead, right, and so really,
I mean, I think there was one other person. It
might have been mac Brasel, but I'm not positive the
(17:02):
rancher or it was the guy that put out the
press release. I'll think of his name of the second
But in any case, the only thing that I personally
me personally heard at the time. Now years later, there
was Colonel Philip Philip Corso who did an interview with
(17:23):
me in nineteen ninety seven where he had talked that
he had seen these entities dead in a casket I
think en route to write Patterson Air Force Base in
Texas or something. So now for the first time, and
I think it's in any case, I mean, we've got testimony,
for instance, dating you know, we got the close encounter
(17:45):
of the third kind or where he saw these creatures
and his wife thinks that there was some kind of
telepathic communication. She's like, he was never the same after
he locked eyes with one of these beans at a distance.
You know, obviously ruin Zimbabwe. You know, we've got allegations,
but this is a being. This is different because this
(18:05):
was a being in captivity. This was a being that
was inside a hospital with the head neurosurgeon. Yeah, and
the head neurosurgeon after twenty nine years. That's why he
gets emotional at the end, because you know you have this,
You imagine holding something like that back in the world
for that long. Yeah, you know that the pressure on
(18:28):
the weight of that on your shoulders. But yeah, I
think it's the first time in history that I'm aware of,
and I've talked to many other researchers in the field
that we have extremely credible, firsthand eyewitness testimony of communication
and contact with a with a captured being. So that's
how it's extremely different than Roswell in that case and
a lot of other people. I mean, you know, oh
(18:49):
of course, yeah, the girls, and you know, you got
the capture and the smell, and I mean, I don't
have many doctors. We've got the radiologists. We've got doctor
Cesario who worked on the military officer when he was
extremely sick through the kitchen sink at him, couldn't keep
him alive. He's never seen anything like it before or
after any bacteria act like that. Then you've got doctor
(19:12):
Armando coming forward on the record that did the autopsy
on the deceased military officer. Right then you got doctor
Jannini who looked and studied the tissue samples, who's the
founder of the company that did that IPD. He said
he's never seen bacteria like that in his career prior
or after. Who else? You know? So, how many doctors
(19:35):
is that?
Speaker 1 (19:35):
Is?
Speaker 2 (19:35):
That? Like? Five five doctors, right? I mean that's unprecedented,
that is. And all but one are coming forward publicly.
You know, they're not hiding, they're not in disguise. It's
you know, they're putting their name in their face on it.
It's it's quite remarkable. And most of them, except for Janini,
are still working.
Speaker 1 (19:56):
And that's pretty amazing because a lot of them probably
were afraid to speak out because of possible job loss
or you know, ridicule in the community. But I have
to say that the community itself is very embracing. I
mean I was. I mean even in the city itself,
I mean, they they definitely. It reminds me of Roswell
(20:19):
in a way, how they represent the UFO and the
aliens throughout the city. So which was kind of refreshing
to see that the city itself.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
Had Let me, let me say something about that monument.
You just showed it yea. Again, I was always kind
of I was always kind of confused. I was like, no,
wait a minute, why did they have a flying saucer
when all the witnesses say it was a cigar shaped object?
Speaker 1 (20:44):
That crass, right, right, But.
Speaker 2 (20:46):
Here's the distinction. And this is something that we learned
in the field out there that I really had a
difficult time coming to terms with. But I mean I
talked to so many different people, so many different people
that describe a disc multiple discs, you know, flying saucer,
(21:09):
moving with purpose, and like they kept saying that it
was clearly looking for something. And I remember asking, the way,
when do we talked about look, what do you mean?
How do you know it's looking for something? They said,
because it was. This is entire families, doctors, that it
(21:29):
was going down to the end, turn stop, come back, grid,
search down to the end stop. They what this one
family you know that didn't want their They so the
house was staying in right now. It's owned by doctors
and their friends are fellow doctors had witnessed the event,
(21:52):
and they said, oh, our friends are doctors. They their
witnesses the event that they really, you know, they'd love
to meet with you, well, we shut up their house
to meet with them because hey, it's a lead, right,
and they were like, oh no, no, no, not on camera.
We don't want to go on camera talking about it.
And I ultimately talked them into okay, look, i'll film
(22:14):
you from the back and faces. I want to include
your names, like and eventually got them to admit, you know,
to doing that. And then i'd flown the drone a
little earlier because I think it's really cool to get
an aerial perspective of like where the girls had the encounter,
where the capture is. And we started looking at proximity
to all these events, like you got the military blockade,
(22:37):
you know, on one block, and then just a block
or two away from that, you've got the girls encounter,
Like everything matches perfectly, and then you've got the alleged
capture from the two military police that's just a couple
of blocks away. So all this activity going on in
this one area of Virginia and the city of Virginia,
and then you have this entire family, the doctors, and
(23:02):
their house is just five blocks away, six blocks away.
So it's like, wow, if you're to believe all these
witnesses and if there was an effort to recover anyone
behind I hate this word, but an extraterrestrial search and
rescue effort or whatever, that would be the spot, you know.
(23:27):
So it makes perfectly good sense that if that was
the case, and if their accounts are true, why wouldn't
it be I know, it's a tall order. So then
we started thinking, my gosh, and that was an aspect
of the previous version of the film that we didn't
quite ourselves kind of realize. And then I had completely
(23:48):
restructured the opening. We have a twenty minute brand new
opening that includes all the stuff that's been happening on
the American side. Then we have a couple very quick
examples of alleged crash retrival cases dating back to the
nineteen thirties, and and I know there was a really
compelling video of a disk at night that we had
included as part of a montage of previous cases in Brazil,
(24:11):
but didn't make the connection. Well, wait a minute, this disc.
That's very impressive. It's in the movie. You probably remember.
Speaker 1 (24:17):
It, oh yet up for sure?
Speaker 2 (24:19):
Yeah, yeah, this disc. And we're like, wait a minute,
this is the same year. This is just a couple
months and it's just not that far as the crow flies,
you know, to the south, and I think it's southeast
of Virginia, of the city of Virginia. So it's like,
could those two be connected? Yeah, but you know, I
mean pretty compelling. No, it is.
Speaker 1 (24:40):
It is very compelling, And I even thought about that
watching it is. First of all, why why choose that area?
What was so important about that area? I guess we
always think, you know, like what was important about Roswell,
what was important about in certain areas? I can understand.
Speaker 2 (24:59):
I think when you a crash, you know, like all
the witnesses described as like gash in the back of
the crap. Now we have a new witness, Fabio Frontado,
and he saw it kind of more from the bottom,
and I don't believe he saw the gash in it,
(25:21):
but he said it was definitely having trouble and it
landed at his farm. And then of course we do
Google maps and we can kind of see proximity to
all the various uh you know, witness accounts, and they
all line up incredibly perfectly. But we also have heard
from a number of researchers that the Americans had informed
(25:42):
the authorities in Brazil that this object was coming in
right and it had this gash in it, And for
years I keep thinking like, how did how how did
that gash happen? Like you know, their their meteorite hit it,
or it was a right mean I mean you know,
(26:02):
or did the Americans shoot it? So I don't know,
I really don't know. I'm forced to speculate, but if
I had to take a guess, I would think the
most likely scenario is that the Americans shot it.
Speaker 1 (26:14):
Sure is funny because in ninety sick I guess ninety six,
we might have had some type of technology by then,
but which also was fascinating for the people that's gonna
watch this, and I recommend watching Moment of Contact New
Revelations of Alien Encounters because we have the amazing James
Fox here talking about it. But the Brazilian military did
(26:38):
get involved, but also the US military, which I was
really surprised that they mentioned the US Air Force were
on ground, which I felt very fascinating.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
USAF. And it's funny actually because I think it was
in twenty twenty one when we were filming uh the
moment of contact, the first cut of moment of contact
and the individual and I'm sorry that I'm struggling for
his name, but the guy that actually saw the USAFF
(27:13):
is what they called it, and the USAF, And at
first I was going TOSAF, what's USAF. Oh, of course
it's USAF, the United States Air Force. And he came
forward on a podcast while we were filming there and
his partner who's also I guess you call radar control
or you know that that monitor all the incoming flights
(27:36):
into Brazil and you have to have Brazilian government authorization
to fly into this country and land, and this plane
didn't have it, according to the flight control people that
we talked with, UH and that a high level military
official stepped into the room and said, let the plane land.
And the plane landed in Campenis, which is where we
(27:57):
have testimony from a number of people, a number of
people that the Americans came in and where, and that
the debris. Certainly the Aliens went to Campenis, so logically
that would be where the Americans would come in and land.
And I'm told they had a plane big enough where
two one or two helicopters were pulled out of it,
(28:19):
and then they flew into Virginia by by chopper as well,
and then back to Campenis loaded something on the plane
and then boom back to the States. And that's when, uh,
that's when the case goes goes cold. So that's too bad.
We need what we did, we I had to see
United States Air Force colonel retired and I didn't know
(28:42):
at the time that he was a United States Air
Force colonel, but he was. He was contacted me anonymously
for a while and he's like, you know, we got
to track this plane down, and I know where to look,
and you should do a foiler request and and and
then finally one day I was like, excuse me, like
(29:02):
because he's really smart, like he really knew what he
was talking about, And I said, do you mind me?
Like who are you? And he goes, well, I'm a
United States Air Force retired colonel and fighter pilot and
blah blah blah, you know, and had his own experience.
And so anyway, we filed in twenty twenty two, we
filed a FOYA request for flight records, and I quite honestly,
(29:26):
I just never heard back. We kind of forgot about
the fact that we had filed this FOYA. I mean,
you know, life goes on and I did the program,
and then in twenty twenty five we get a response
and it's a response from, well you saw it in
the movie. Yeah, from the CIA. Essentially we can either
confirm nor deny and based on some act from nineteen
(29:48):
forty nine or something, it's it's classified or nationalist can whatever,
you know, So we couldn't get we couldn't even find
out any planes that came in. They wouldn't even give us.
Speaker 1 (29:57):
That well, I mean, just by saying we can't confirm
or deny, that was the That was the key.
Speaker 2 (30:03):
That was the key. You know. It's I remember this
moment with Nick Pope. It was so funny confidence hmmm, well,
somebody asked some kind of a serious question and jokingly
he it was just one of these moments and and
uh in UFO history that I happened to have witnessed.
(30:26):
And he says, he says, ma'am, I can neither confirm
nor deny. So every time I hear those words, I
think if Nick Pope said he you know, it was
everybody laughed or would laughter in the room. But it
was really funny.
Speaker 1 (30:37):
I mean, it tells a lot. It does tell a lot.
Speaker 2 (30:40):
It does, isn't it? Well?
Speaker 1 (30:41):
In this film, I I was very impressed. You had
some very high level voices like doctor Ic Davis, Christopher Mellen,
and Kirk McConnell. How did the their perspectives help bridge
the this event with like modern you you you a
he disclosures?
Speaker 2 (31:01):
Well, I really feel like I mean, certainly when Moment
of Contact the first cut was released in twenty twenty two,
I don't know. I'm not sure that people outside of
the UFO community were ready for that. Yeah, I mean
that same response that I had when I was making
(31:24):
my second UFO doc of it can't be Therefore, it
isn't like it's hard to wrap your mind around something
like this, particularly if you don't have any background knowledge
on the phenomenon and previous cases, right, And I think
the media. It was the first time that I released
(31:48):
a film that I got not one invitation on any
mainstream outlets. It was more way more of a grassroots effort.
And I remember, I'll get to your question a minute,
but I remember the slow sort of evolution of its
(32:11):
its acceptance or level of interest, I guess would grow slowly.
And I remember a couple of moments on Joe Rogan
not with me with other guests, and the topic of
UFOs came up and I think the film have been
out for a couple of months something like this, and
their guest goes two of them separate guests. One of
(32:33):
them was Michael Schellenberger and the other one was Bill something.
I'll think of it the second any case, they were like, uh,
have you seen that the documentary moment of contact with
James Fox? And Joe's like, no, no, I've seeing that. Well,
what's it about it? They're like, well, you know.
Speaker 3 (32:52):
I I know this sounds really crazy. I'm not going
to tell you it doesn't, but man, you gotta watch
that maybe up crashing Aliens.
Speaker 2 (33:04):
And I could see this very like incredulous look on
Joe's face, like, oh, come on, really you know and
uh uh. And then another guest came on build something
great guy with company minds, and and he did the
same thing. He was like, well, you know, I know
it sounds kind of you know, it brings up with Joe.
(33:27):
And then Joe watches it and he was just floored
by it. And he sent me a text. And I
was in my workout class in Vermont and I go
to this dad bond classes. Everybody makes fun of each other.
It's a bunch of middle aged dudes get together to
work out and have a great time. It's just men,
men only, and uh, we're all in the class together.
(33:47):
And I hit my phone buzz and I just kind
of walked over in the middle of the workout and
I looked and it was Joe Rogan. He was like, hey,
you know, I just watched Moment of Contact. Holy, you know,
be wow. And he says, hey, you know, you want
to come on the show and talk about it. And
my response was, is the Pope Catholic? I got lol
or whatever. And then and then the film kind of
(34:12):
got some traction and then, of course not as a
direct result at all, but it's just interesting that, you know,
we had the congressional hearings and then David Grush came
forward the next year, and it was like, holy smokes man.
I never anticipated that was going to happen, that we
(34:33):
had these allegations at the highest levels. I mean, people
testifying to a bipartisan group of lawmakers under oath that
there's a crash retrieval program and this has been going
on for decades. You have no idea man, Like I
was just I just sat there, I was watching it live,
and I just had tears constantly flowing down my face
(34:54):
because I've been laughed at and ridiculed particularly, you know,
I mean, I put my neck out this first version
of moment of contact. Yeah, And I remember I even
had fellow members that I had a lot of respect
for in the community, and they were, hey, you know,
banning my ear, Like are you sure this is the
move you want to make right now? You know, like
(35:16):
that's a tall that's a that's a huge allegation, you know, Yeah,
And I was like, I know, I know, and they're like,
you know, you're coming off from the phenomenon and you
you know, we had the unprecedented cooperation. We had interviewed
with Senator Harry Reid and you know, Christopher Mellen and
Jumpedesta and a whole slew of others, and you know,
(35:37):
people are like, you know, you really want to jeopardize
those contacts and your reputation and all that stuff. But
you know, I was like, hey, I understand your skepticism,
and I appreciate it and I respect it. But I've
been there many times over the last whatever it was
twelve years at the time, thirteen years at the time,
and I'm convinced that it happened. So I'm going to
(35:58):
I'm going for it. You know. Good. Anyway, it's interesting
to see where this is going. I don't think at
this point we've had four congressional hearings in the last
couple of years. I don't think they're putting the genie
back in the bottle.
Speaker 1 (36:13):
So no, they haven't at all.
Speaker 2 (36:16):
Well, you know, and I don't even know how this
film is going to be received in mainstream. Now we'll see.
Speaker 1 (36:24):
I think it's I mean, if anything is so well
put together and the passion that you put into it
is so appreciated. But I think people will receive it well,
and if anything, it'll open many people's minds again.
Speaker 2 (36:40):
You know. Again, I don't know. Sorry, what looks like
is that camera thing on where it's moving the camera
around on my side? Is that? Okay?
Speaker 1 (36:48):
Not on your side?
Speaker 2 (36:49):
No, No, it's okay, right, Sorry, I just noticed that.
The I just look like it's offset a little bit
and I don't know why anyway, whatever, but yeah, so
carry on.
Speaker 1 (36:59):
Oh no, no, And one thing I do want to
go back, because since you did the filming, you said,
some new people have come forth, and also I want
to know about if any any headway with the gentleman
I can't remember his name that you went to visit
him and he threatened to shoot you, Eric Lope.
Speaker 2 (37:18):
So last night I'm in Brazil right now, as you
get told by my hat. Last night we had the
option of going and meeting with town officials, people that
have been instrumental and putting some stuff together that we're
doing here that will be happening next month, and or
going to church. And we were told that Eric Lopes
(37:39):
would probably be at that church, so we were going
to use and I boy, I was really torn. It
was one or the other. And I felt like if
I didn't respect the town officials that have been super
kind to us and they really wanted us to be there,
I would have we could have seen him at church.
I'm not giving I haven't given up on him. I
(38:01):
asked his wife, I don't know a couple of years
ago what it would take to get him to come forward,
and she said, bring my brother back to back to life.
And her brother is Marco Cheriz. Because Eric Lopes kind
of a weird little twist, but Eric Lopes married the
(38:21):
sister of Marco Scheriz, the military officer who allegedly jumped
out of the car and grabbed the creature with his
bare hands and put it together on this lap in
the back seat, and off they went to a clinic
and then I think they went to regional hospital. And
and yeah, as you know in the story, Marco series
(38:44):
died a few weeks later from some crazy infection. It
got a little scratch under his armpit from probably when
he grabbed this thing inadvertently. It just scratched him. So
it's crazy that his wife just said, he'll come forward
if you can bring my brother back to life. Wow,
now things could change. Who knows. Yeah, I think seeing
(39:06):
people like the forensic pathologists, the former chief chief of police,
you know, the head neurosurgeon, doctor Ichilo coming forward. The
thirtieth anniversary is coming up next month, maybe things will change,
Maybe more people will come forward. I'm quite optimistic that
will be the case. But we'll just have to wait
and see.
Speaker 1 (39:27):
I don't I don't want to keep you too long
because I know you have a busy day to day.
But you've said before that that disclosure is the process,
not a moment. Where does moment of contact fit in
that larger disclosure timeline?
Speaker 2 (39:43):
You know, I I'm doing everything I can, and I
think everything helps. All the efforts people like yourself and
many many others, it's all contributing to it. And I
remember a lot what I met with Senator Rounds in DC,
(40:07):
maybe about a year ago, and he's like, hey, I
hear the frustration. I know you feel like things aren't
happening fast enough. We have these extraordinary allegations from David
Grush and what's happened since and blah blah blah blah blah,
and you know, you see that out there, and I
have to remind people like you know, we've had four
congressional hearings in the last couple of years. We hadn't
(40:30):
had anything like that in over fifty years prior, so
be patient. But Senator Rounds addressed this issue and he said,
I want to remind you guys that these things don't
happen overnight. We're not running one hundred yard dash. We're
running a marathon. So be patient, you know. And I
think it's important for all of us in the community
(40:54):
and people that want answers, and even people that are skeptical.
It's fair enough, but you know, these allegations at the
highest levels. I mean, you know, the implications are so profound. Like,
let's let's support the effort. Let's let our elected representatives
know that we'd like this UAP Disclosure Act, you know,
(41:15):
little blower protection. Get this legislation passed. Hey man, if
there's nothing to hide, get the bill passed. Let's see, right.
It was interesting. Dave Grush brought up a very interesting
point on Rogan and we included in the program where
he says, he says, uh, you know, the people that
(41:37):
were behind, uh, the significant pushback that they've gotten from
a couple of representatives, they're just so happens their district
is like you know, right, Patters an Air Force base area,
and you know, raytheon and lockeed and like, oh, surprise, surprise.
You know, Oh, there's nothing to hide. No, it's all
ridiculous cases. But don't pass that bill. Whatever you do, right, right, right,
(42:03):
don't listen to what people say. What's what they do?
Speaker 1 (42:06):
Yeah, now, exactly exactly. Well, I know this is another
example of a very big impact not just in the
UFO community, the but the history of the world is
this disclosure and if this case was officially acknowledged tomorrow,
(42:31):
what implications would you think you would have on a
global disclosure not just in American narratives.
Speaker 2 (42:41):
Sorry, there's a mosquito. I was just I hate mosquitoes
me too. You know, it's a really complex question. I
remember how put Off talking to me about the complexities
of disclosure, aspects of it that I never dreamed of.
You know. I used to always think like this by
yah moment, like we're not alone in the universe. How
(43:02):
cool is that? What are you uniting? And it would be,
But there's other aspects to it. I think kind of
the world needs right now is it's become more unified,
particularly in the United States. Right But okay, let's just like,
let's just imagine it's all real. This is really happening.
(43:22):
Crash retrievals have happened. We're in possession of this extraordinary technology.
You know, whatever the observed technology is that's whizzing around
with impunity, ain't doing it on jet a fuel, right.
You know. You listen to the likes of you know,
Dave Fravor, and you hear about how the fastest military
jet you know in the Navy right this state flood
rings around it. I mean, it made a joke of it.
(43:47):
If you could like weaponize it, or if other countries
get their hands on it and they weaponize it, that
could that could I could see how that could be
an issue of naturally, unfortunately, I can see how that
could be an issue of national security. And I could
see the American government never giving this technology up unfortunately,
I really because of the fear of other countries possibly
(44:10):
weaponizing that. I mean, it's what do you do? I
don't know. But the biologics, you know, the aliens like
the ones that in Roswell and and for potentially Kecksburg
and all the various cases, particularly Virginia. I don't see
how that would be a national security issue. I mean,
maybe there could be an acknowledgment of the fact they've
(44:34):
they've recovered some of this technology and they give an
explanation of the reasons for national security and maybe people
will understand. But but the biologics, that that's something that
I think every everybody on the planet should should know about,
you know. But how they go about doing it, I
don't know. I really don't know. Because you know, if
(44:57):
if the president of the United States stood up tomorrow
and acknowledge this. I mean, it would make waves around
the world, right, But then for sure America would have
to prove it. Yeah, because implications are global, not just
for America. And then half the country hates the president
who it is. So I don't know. I don't know.
I don't know how, I don't know. I don't know
how you do it. I don't I'd like to see
(45:19):
it done, but it's it's more of a complex issue
than one might think.
Speaker 1 (45:24):
Yeah, yeah, I agree with you. It's it's one of
those things that it maybe they're waiting for the right time,
but it's like saying having kids or whatever, there's never
a right time. Sometimes we just have to pull the
band aid off and do it. But from what I
from what I've heard in the documentary, I'm more scared
of human beings than I would of the aliens.
Speaker 2 (45:47):
Or so me too, I know, right, Yeah, So.
Speaker 1 (45:52):
Well, mister Fox, I appreciate you being here, and I
congratulations on the great film. Good luck tonight at the premiere,
and I hope you continue to spread the love through
your work and hopefully one day we'll see you again
for the next one.
Speaker 2 (46:11):
I appreciate you having me on.
Speaker 1 (46:12):
Thanks so much, of course, and thank you everybody for
tuning in. This is Tony Sweet with truth be told
on Club Paranormal Network. I'll see you next Friday. Until then,
take care of yourself and each other.
Speaker 2 (46:23):
Bye,
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