Eastern Wisdom, Western Routines, and the Art of Being Present

Hello show notes readers!

This week, Billy Pilgrim is becoming unstuck in time as we talk about how "the daily routine" is simultaneously a blessing and a curse. We explore the importance of marking life's milestones - "punctuations in time" - and how they shape our sense of memory and progress.

We ask, "Can carefully curating your media diet help with your sanity?" and dive into the mental toll of algorithms, social media, and the constant noise of the digital age. Along the way, we urge you to check out Tim Urban's Monkey, and reflect on the fascinating interplay of rationality and chaos in our minds.

Other highlights include:

• The magic and madness of Spotify Wrapped and what it reveals about us.
• Eastern vs. Western philosophies and how cultural lenses shape perception.
• Reflections on AGI, the future of sensory technologies, and what comes after the Information Age.
• Parenthood, presence, and finding joy amidst the chaos of family life.
• Manifesting intentions for 2025 and the art of asking more meaningful questions.

Join us as we laugh, reflect, and try to make sense of the absurdity of it all.

Things to Check Out

1. The Daily Tay: this or this.
2. Tim Urban's Monkey,

Books Discussed

1. How to Know a Person by David Brooks
2. Chatter by Ethan Kross
3. The Tao Te Ching by Lao Tsu
4. The WEIRDest People in the World by Joseph Henrich 

Companies Discussed

1. Spotify
2. Apple (Apple Music, Apple One)
3. Tidal
4. Osmo.ai (smell digitization)
5. Lux Capital (investments in innovation)
6. Obsidian (note-taking app)

Chapters

• 00:00 - Spotify Wrapped Insights
• 04:19 - Economics of Streaming Services
• 06:34 - Questions for Reflection and Personal Growth
• 14:13 - AGI and the Future of Technology
• 28:06 - Travel and Routine in Parenting
• 41:29 - Internal Dialogue and Mental Health
• 48:28 - Eastern vs. Western Philosophies
• 55:10 - Manifesting Goals for 2025
• 1:09:56 - Closing Thoughts and Humor

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
I think that's what I've learned.
Without the punctuation, without the highs and the lows, we forget.
And if we forget, time disappears.
And

(00:58):
Hi, Sean.
Hey Dan, so what have you been listening to this year?
The answer blows me away.
Well, Spotify rap came out and you know, I think sometimes these things like hit you inthe face of like, really?
That's how it went last year.
Or this year.

(01:19):
in awe.
I'm looking to figure out where my rapt is.
Well, I think it should be noted that like, you know, there's a lot of inactive listeninggoing on in my life now, right?
Like I'll put something that's piano driven on and it might run for eight hours.
And it's very nice to have in the house.
It's very calming.
think the kid, it's not that the kids actively enjoy it.
I think it's a good part of the environment and, that mixed with, some background musicfor jamming in front of screens and getting work done.

(01:48):
I think that's how he, arrived at the top of the list.
I was trying to figure out is it, it takes into all listening, not just active clicks,right?
We were, I was debating this with a friend cause he was surprised at some songs that likeweren't in his queue cause he knew he heard them a ton that they were just played

(02:09):
ambiently.
So I, but you're saying that you're getting like your signal is saying, yeah, it is, it isjust all encompassing.
that, that, that helps settle that debate, I guess.
I thought it would take everything into account.
Yeah, yeah, because like my wife's wrapped just now all screwed up, right?
It's like frozen soundtrack and merry go round music, you know?

(02:36):
You know, you probably could, if you have a family plan, you probably could just set up a,like a, yeah, like this is the family listening account.
but then you have to log into that and device management.
yeah, then we need another device like in the kitchen and another device in the car.
Those are the two places that happens the most.
And I don't know.
I'm sure there's ways and people have figured it out and I have spent zero time.

(02:59):
that big of an issue for you.
I told you before that like, if my Spotify algorithm gets wrecked, I'm canceling theaccount.
I don't need it anymore.
I already have access to Apple Music, but there's no intelligence there because I'venever, since like Spotify came out, I have never used it.
And I only recently paid for Apple One.

(03:21):
I would switch over because the, what is it?
The moat would have disappeared quickly.
Yeah.
interesting.
I think that's probably true for, I mean, I wonder how many, I think I feel the same way,honestly.
if I, I think it's Spotify wrapped that almost keeps me around every year in a way.

(03:42):
Like I look forward to that every year.
I'm surprised.
honestly am sitting here surprised.
I haven't watched mine on my own.
I don't, I don't know what mine even is.
Have you seen, they've done some, like extra products on, the wrapped thing, right?
Like that used to be just this, you got the playlist and now it's like this playlist withthis little video that you get to watch with some like, statistics.

(04:03):
And now the DJ feature will like hone in on your wrapped for a while.
And then there, I have not listened to this, but there is a podcast about my rap.
Yeah, I saw that.
I saw when I just searched that there was like all these, all these, all these things forit now.
And I was like, I don't know which one of these I would even click on at the moment.

(04:26):
they've really, they've really changed it.
I mean, really, really made it a part of their value offering to their customers, right?
where that is something I think we all talk about now with friends and coworkers and, itkeeps them relevant and, know, like title, somebody said title to me there.

(04:46):
I'm like, what's that?
I had to think about it for a minute, but, know, the, music service title.
Yeah.
Title is like, I just signed up for title.
like,
Title.
is that?
the, the, better music quality and that, you know, better different artists pay structure,suppose.

(05:07):
is that the other selling point?
I think so.
they're, they're supposed to be a little more generous towards the artists is myunderstanding or the, the, the way it flows.
about that.
I mean, maybe we should go into the economics of that one day just to know more because Ifeel like, I mean, there is fraud in Spotify, right?
And if there's fraud, then there's money to be made.

(05:30):
like our artists not being treated fairly, like, or is it just a comparison to CDs?
Like the economic structure has changed, period.
And now that you have, you know, how much of that revenue or podcast getting is it, Iguess it's divided up by total listening time, right?
Cause I don't know, Dan.

(05:50):
I don't, I don't know if anybody listens to us on Spotify.
I think you might need more than, you know, a few dozen downloads an episode one day, oneday.
so thank you to those of you that are here.
we appreciate it.
So, was thinking, for me, you know, I couldn't think of, let's preface this, Dan sharedwith me a link from

(06:20):
He is or she like I literally don't know.
This is a this is one that found me via the algorithm.
I don't follow this person actively.
I do now.
I want to circle back to that.
Found you via the algorithm, but please continue.
Yeah.
But I think this person is the leader, founder or something rather of what's that app.

(06:42):
obsidian.
which is like a very complicated note taking app.
Okay, yeah, Obsidian is a, is it markdown language based app essentially?
good question.
I used to know these things because I'd like look at them all and then I get reallyexcited about using them one day and then I pay for them and then I never use them because
I'm a constant mess.

(07:03):
in
So we're circling back around to the, what we're discussing.
We have this list of 40 questions from the creator or one of the creators of obsidian.
they asked himself, he or she, goes by at Kapano K E P A N O on Twitter, slash X.com.
And there are these 40 questions that Dan shared the list and it seemed like kind of aninteresting year end inventory.

(07:33):
for lack of a better word, right.
And, so we decided to, kind of tackle a few of them because we just thought they were,putting a cap on, on our year here in 2024 and looking into 2025 and, maybe making some
resolutions and setting some goals for ourselves to help, help drive some personalimprovements.
That sounded about right.

(07:53):
That sounds about right.
And I also think it creates space for reflection on things that, Hi, I don't know.
You're all busy.
There's only so much mind space that you've, it silly to say forgotten that happened tothis year that you want to like remember.
or maybe you're trying to actively avoid it and pretend it didn't happen, but it's good.

(08:14):
It's a good time now to like look back and with some distance, appreciate it or.
reflect on it.
Exactly, and that was one of the things looking this list over and why we ended up talkingabout Spotify is that one of the questions is,
What song will we remind you of this year?
Or something like that.

(08:35):
remind you of this year?
And because I didn't go to a Tay-Tay concert, I don't have one.
Like I don't, like I don't have any distinctive song that was like that I'm going to belike, that was a 2024.
Like I could do that for some songs back in 2008 or 12.

(08:55):
Give me one.
it's 2008 T pain T low featuring T pain or, like from 2008 that that's the one thatimmediately pops into my head.
that, that Zuckerberg just re did with them actually.
Wild.
Yeah, it was him and his wife's jam.

(09:17):
Zuckerberg got T-Pain to re-record it with him for his wife's birthday or something.
It was like...
It's good to be a billionaire.
Isn't it though?
Zuckerberg, the most wholesome billionaire.
Maybe not true, I don't know.
Yeah, depending on the season of life.
What's another one?

(09:38):
Actually, know, last year I could probably say LCD sound system was probably an artistthat like I will, will be carved in my head for, for like 2023 for some weird reason, just
because like that's when I kind of really like found them in a way that like they reallyclicked with me.
you should have come to my wedding.

(09:59):
Well, it's funny, I think I had them on these playlists from that used to you shared withme from, you know, a decade ago or something and they've been passed my radar once or
twice and then they just finally, like, I don't know.
New York, I love you, but you're bringing me down.
I love that song.

(10:19):
Yeah, LCD sound system.
That's like a strong place in my heart for that group.
I was going to go next after asking you that question was tying music to smell or theother way around, frankly, smell reminding me of particular music.
So I had this, like one of my first cars was this 1994 Bronco and we found it for sale onthe side of the road.

(10:44):
And whoever owned it must've smoked like 18 packs a day.
I got so much tar out of that thing.
And every single day, every single time I cleaned it, I got more tar out of that thing.
which is to say it had a very particular smell and, the offspring conspiracy of one.

(11:04):
Okay, yes, that album, that's an album, right?
these.
Yeah, yeah, it's an album.
will, these things will take me back to that Bronco.
Or if I smell something like that Bronco, it'll bring me back to that, those albums.
That's interesting.
that's, yeah, that's, I can picture that though.

(11:25):
I think Camp Fire can kind of do that to me in certain ways, but.
campfire.
Interestingly, I was with you and I and Trevor and some, you know, our usual crew there,out in the woods behind the apple orchard.
And I split my thumb open pretty badly.

(11:47):
And I think, Aaron had his car with the doors open blasting, modest mouse.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Cause I think I remember everybody disappeared for a while to go tend to that.
like, it was just myself and like Andrea hanging out down by the fire with like two otherpeople, I think.

(12:13):
So yeah.
can, there's the scars still there.
I have another smell for you or maybe a taste.
Citronella oil.
Okay, where's that take you?

(12:34):
for reference, everyone.
Yeah.
Sean and I used to breathe fire.
It was our party trick.
Yeah.
Yeah.
it worked just fine.
Yeah.
we're just fine.
yeah, boys and fire.
You know, now I think about the things that I did and I worry about my kids.

(12:56):
But you know.
I, you know, thankfully they won't have access to the wide expanses that you did probably,in some ways.
Yeah, or like the forest fire danger is too high.
There are no campfires here.
They're not allowed.
You have to bring gas.

(13:17):
Exactly.
Have you heard of Osmo.ai?
It's a company that is working to, you were talking about the, sense of smell.
they're working to digitize the sense of smell essentially, like be able to, I guess,somehow creates, I'm guessing eventually smell a vision.
don't know, what the end use product is going to be, but they've been, saw.

(13:41):
Lux has been a backer of them.
and I've been kind of interesting to see what they've, how they've been developingtechnology around.
I guess being able to, again, I don't know what the use case is.
Like if you can say here, here's the digital footprint of a, of an aroma and being able toport that a thousand miles.
I can think of warfare applications.

(14:03):
Interesting.
instead of a dog.
Yeah?
you're hunting a particular person.
have it if you have a digital sensor.
Duh.
Yeah.
Or.
positive, throw a flashbang.
Mm-hmm.
Or, yeah, at the, all of your bags at the error, at TSA just now go past thissmell-o-sensor.

(14:25):
I was thinking of, you know, trying to think of a positive application, Dan, not a, not ananny state application, but way to.
Nanny's state?
Yeah.
I don't know.
I like my planes to stay in the air.
No, I know, I know, I know.
It's not know that would be fine application of it a good, guess reasonably good safetyapplication.
Something, I mean, it's the first thing that came to mind and part of the reason my brainwent there first is Lux I know is not shy about their investments in sort of national

(14:54):
security and safety and, you know, real world hardware application kind of stuff.
They do some of the harder types of investing.
Yeah, that probably makes way more sense than anything I had in my brain.
was picturing the Jetsons.
Yeah.
Well, I think the, well it was funny.
You and I were texting, what was the last night?

(15:14):
And it's like, the same Altman saying that like, he's basically saying without saying AGIis coming in 2025.
And then it's like, we're in the information age.
What comes after the information age?
Like, what does that look like?
and these are like interesting questions to ponder and impossible to answer.
But then I think about AGI and I'm like, is AGI complete like, because it can think or.

(15:39):
Does it need to be able to smell?
Does it need to be able to taste?
Does it need to be able to, and these other like ancillary things that seem like toys areactually going to become integral at some point.
I think it's going to be interesting in the way that it's going to offload a lot ofuseless thought processes that we spend a lot of time wasting stuff filtering through bad

(16:01):
information on.
my, this, you know, as good as your spam filter can be in your email, you still get stuffcoming in that you don't need.
And eventually this is going to be the point where, Hey, it's helping you focus on thethings that are truly important so that you have time to focus on more on what you want to
in your life.
think is what I think the
cultural benefit we stand to gain from this is, but, yeah, without the ability to have thesensors and to actually fully understand and replicate, like understand the situation and

(16:31):
the ways that a human does, and take up, take, take in those little cues and thin societyas them into a, into a,
construct the way the human brain would I don't see how it's there, right?
Yeah, no, yeah.
Yeah.
I don't know.
Not that you need smell per se, but I definitely see where that would be an interesting, Imean, you know, how you would incorporate that.

(16:55):
Well, I think that some of these demonstrations of like AI driven robots or even softwaredriven robots, you know, making cocktails or whatever it is.
It's like, I'm not putting them in charge of making cocktails.
can put them in charge of washing dishes, but until they can smell and know that thecocktail is made well or something, you know, it's like, or isn't the

(17:19):
by which you're judging the correctness of it, right?
Like folding laundry, easy.
yeah, easy.
But isn't one of the, interesting features that we want out of this, right?
Is sort of a little bit of the human-ness, right?
Like if I give you a particular cocktail, you know, it's like this robot can makeold-fashions, Negronis and whatever, French 75s.

(17:44):
But, but that's it because like we had to load the recipes in and if,
It finds out that it's out of Campari, then it doesn't know how to proceed.
Right.
Or, or, or can it ask you like, well, you're ordering, old fashioned.
What kind of bourbon do you prefer?
Why do you like that kind of bourbon?
Have you heard of this one from, you know, this other, and you're, lacking the servicelevel of the exchange.

(18:10):
Like you're not going be able to replace that.
Right.
That's where.
Maybe, I mean, some of that I feel like could be programmed in old school software too.
It's the, well, I was really feeling like an old fashioned, but I think I'd rather go withtequila tonight.
Mm-hmm.

(18:31):
And then not working off of a library.
Right?
Like it actually draws connections.
That to me is like the bigger thing about AI is like it's at least from our perceptionthinking rather than regurgitating or rule-based actions.
Yeah, or just looking at the, you know, a mean reversion curve and saying, well, this isthe average of what would happen here.

(18:56):
You know, it's not the
Yeah, then we all just live in a world of a...
the average.
Yeah, exactly.
So,
do you go to nice cocktail places?
To not get the average cocktail.
Yeah, exactly.
And to have a experience that feels one off and unique and to.
But then is anyone going to go to a robot?
I don't know.

(19:16):
I don't know.
50 years from now, who knows, man.
I mean, probably in Vegas, right?
There'll be some light.
It'll be like a, a, it'll start off as a, it would start off as a novelty thing, right?
That'd be the first phase of it.
It'd be becoming that into the, we're, I'm, I'm thinking if we're in the information ageright now, the next thing is, is the intelligence age.
In my opinion, that's what we're moving to is this layer of technology that is able toprocess information, synthesize a, you know,

(19:43):
construct itself a worldview and act within it in ways that we want it to or want it to,don't want it to that that's maybe that's the problem.
Yeah, I don't know.
Neo found out.
I don't know.
Anyway, that's that was I don't know where that where that one question came from or tookus to but there you go.
What do we start with?

(20:04):
What were we listening to?
remind you of this year?
so there were a couple of things I was noting, you know, it's like, I don't have goodanswers for, for, for, for what's a date you'll remember from this year?
Is there a date that is, you know, ingrained in your head that you will always remember?
February 14th, 2024.

(20:27):
why that?
I had my prostate removed.
And I lived, which is to say that there was an infection that could have killed me.
So it came out.
And it changed our family planning and yeah, it changed our lives.
It changed my family.
See, you have an answer.

(20:48):
Damn, yeah, I would never forget that either.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I mean, was just, what is today?
December 6th.
I'm three days away from my anniversary of my first ER visit in my life.
Yeah.
Not to bring us down, but the one of the questions is like, did you have an illness orsomething?
And I was like, man.
Yeah.
Illness, hardship, a particular date, like all that sort of, sort of tied into being sickfor almost four months, like on and off.

(21:15):
don't want to make it sound like I was bedridden for four months, but I was in and out ofthe hospital for four months.
Yeah.
was, I know trying to schedule stuff with you there for a while.
There was, a challenge because you just, you didn't, you weren't really sure.
Yeah.
I'd wake up and be like, well, it's hospital day.
Yeah, not moving today.

(21:36):
Man, that was, I, yeah, it's wild that that was this year.
feels, that feels like it was years ago to me for some reason, but it was this year.
It's been a wild year, In 2023, said, 2024 is my year.
And then it just was so not.
I'm really looking forward to this year ending.
I feel like I felt more of those years the older I get.

(22:01):
It's like, just let's get to the next one.
wishing your life away.
Right?
And it's not, I don't like that attitude.
I don't like it that I don't like that attitude either.
I don't like it for you.
So how are going to change it?
I don't know.
What would change it?
Is it a reframing?
it in your mind?
Or is it more external and you need to create some more demarcations in life ofappreciation?

(22:28):
I mean, that's a good that's a good that's a good.
Huh, I wasn't expecting to think about this.
like then within the cycle of like work, everything is on that calendar year.
So you get to Q, you know, Q three and it's like,
we're working on the same, the same fricking KPOs.
We've been working all year.
They're not having the effect that we wanted to, or this was a, you know, a stupid goal.

(22:51):
Why are we, know, can we just get to next year so we can work on something new?
in that kind of way, I think a lot of it's tied to the way our, just our, our annualschedule of project cycles or
Yeah, but you, you don't have control over that.
That's not something you can affect change upon.
Right.
So is there an area in your life that you could affect change that would help change thisrelationship?

(23:20):
Hmm.
I don't know.
I've, I, I look more forward now towards the end of the year than I used to because Istarted taking like time off at the end of the year.
I think I need it.
Like, think traveling more periodically throughout the year and like having like morelike, like things to look forward to in way signposts within the year would be a positive

(23:42):
step.
where like sometimes, especially like since the pandemic, like you're doing pandemics,like,
Yeah.
nothing going on at end of this year.
let's just wait till the next year happens.
Yeah.
And so it's like, well, I guess maybe next year there'll be more going on.
Yeah.
I mean, I was so for sharing my perspective on this a little bit as like,

(24:06):
working from home with the kids around and having a fairly flexible life.
you know, Saturday and Sunday are definitely distinctly different days for me, but
It really very quickly begins to feel like every day is exactly the same.

(24:26):
despite, despite the weekends, I'm me being pretty disciplined with trying to keep theweekends be weekends.
And that's not like for me, it's a luxury or anything.
It's like, literally I need to spend time with the kids and be more present and involved.
But yeah, I recently had a conversation with a team member and I was like, yeah, we talkedabout that like, you know, month, month and a half ago, right?

(24:47):
And she was like, no, it was in March.
And I'm like, my relationship with time is broken.
And that just happened a couple of weeks ago.
So that was like a realization for me.
I'm like, what I'm trying to say is like, I kind of feel the same.
I don't know that it is the same exactly for me, but there's this notion that like, it'sa, it's a midlife crisis as well.
there that my brain just latched onto the idea of this sameness, right?

(25:16):
And that there's like, we do have like, okay, it's Christmas time, it's Easter, it'sFourth of July, it's Halloween, it's Thanksgiving, et cetera.
Right?
Yeah.
like my household has never decorated like almost ever because it's always been lean.

(25:37):
We're not going to spend the money.
We have roommates.
It's just a tiny apartment anyway.
You know, there's like the list of excuses goes on and on and this year is a lean year sowe don't really have to create.
We did a little bit.
We did enough to make it feel like maybe it's a little festive in here, but,
Mm-hmm.
Walking around my house right now, like, I think this is actually walking around arelative's house.

(26:01):
I was like, this is why, this is why you spend a whole month, month and a half feelinglike your house is completely different.
statement.
It's more of a question.
I'm still trying to circle around like how to help my, like you said, guide posts or sortof, you know, things planted in the sand throughout the year.
And I'm trying to think of the same thing.
not like events, like things like, it's this time of year, but it's more like, I'm likegiving myself more things in the future to like look forward and grasp towards rather than

(26:31):
just saying, I just want this year to be over, right?
It's, I'm looking forward to this thing I'm doing in November, or I'm looking forward tothis thing that's going on in January, or rather than just wishing away the time, hoping
that.
the w you know, within the wishing away of it, that in itself improves it, which will nothappen.

(26:51):
Right.
How much of the travel that you did this year was travel that you looked forward to?
I mean,
Yeah, that's the problem, I don't think I traveled at all.
That's the problem,
feel like there is something.
You came out here.
Yeah, there was that little ship out there.
Which was kind of, yeah, was just a, that was a nice little weekend.

(27:13):
And then.
I think other than that, that was really it.
Can I drive anywhere?
Yeah, no.
Uh-uh.
Yeah, from our side, like, we've done some travel.
But even like our little, know, I'm gonna sound like a spoiled something here, I think, isthat like we've had, we get to do a little bit of travel, but it's 100 % family oriented.

(27:37):
And then even our little trips into the mountains and stuff like that, it's nice.
I don't wanna give them up.
However, it's also not like.
It's not rewarding in the way that it used to be, right?
Like you got out of your house, you got out of your routine.
No, it's like you wait, the routines are harder because now it's like you are operatingwithout a kitchen and you've got two kids that are really hungry.

(27:58):
You know, it's like,
Yeah.
So yeah, I don't think my wife likes my attitude about travel now, but it's completelychanged.
It's interesting how, I mean, it makes perfect sense why it would change and why you...
especially if you're traveling with the kids.
Like if it was just you and your wife going on a trip.

(28:21):
totally different.
I'd be totally amped.
Yeah.
See, it would be, it would be a different experience, right?
So, so maybe, maybe that's the trick for you for the next year and a half is to plan atrip for just the two of you to go and have, four days somewhere.
I don't know how practical that is.
Yeah.

(28:42):
Yeah.
these days we've talked about it.
It's like drop the kids off in Hawaii and then we're going to go to Tokyo for threenights.
It'll be a whiplash trip.
It'll be nice, you know, but we'll see.
have to like, and then having the freedom is a little more of a benefit because it's like,we don't have, we don't, we don't want the strictures of the routine, but right now you
need the routine because of the demands of life.

(29:04):
yeah, I don't want to make it sound like I'm complaining about the routine.
I'm complaining about the routine for my mental health.
The or like my mental experience even my mental health is improved by the routine becauseeveryone else around me is much better if we stick to the routine, you know, if we deviate
from the routine, things just are not nearly as fun.
yeah, it's because they're, yeah, you have these little biologic creatures that are verymuch just, eating and pooping machines for a while, right?

(29:35):
Like they have to, you know.
They don't care where they are.
You going somewhere you want to go to doesn't matter to them at all.
And they take from your experience and the new location.
But again, add five years on this, it'll totally be different.
They'll be out and exploring and their perspectives will be totally different.

(29:56):
So all this stuff that like, it's just the season, man.
It's just the season.
it's just season.
So there's one other question here that popped out at me.
I don't know.
This is one that I don't know my answer to.
What kept you sane?
Yeah, I was, I, that one, that one jumped out at me as well.
one, these conversations that we have every so often, it's a big help.
Definitely helped me on that.
And Dan, thank you for, thank you for being party to it.

(30:19):
And thank you for anybody who listened along and got something out of it.
Honestly, I think
I think being disconnected from a lot of media and social media I followed in years prior,I disconnected from a good chunk of it.

(30:40):
This is, remember I said, I want to circle back to something.
You said something about the algorithm.
this is part of that.
but being disconnected from, from certain, certain feeds that I had in years prior was, itwas a big help because it was, you know, an election year and I kind of just.
in the year said, I'm just going to really restrict my, really restrict my media diet.

(31:02):
And, because not that, you know, I mean, it's, it's just, there's a lot of noise and likepeople yelling at each other and it's not productive.
You start to, whether you want to, or not, you start to have emotions and feel thesethings about these things that by and large, oftentimes don't practically affect you.
You have no control over that.

(31:23):
even though these things are being said, aren't ever gonna come to fruition because it'stheir campaign talk that you can't actually get done.
So why be anxious about, you know, and bring tomorrow's worry forward to today aboutthings that might not ever happen.
You know, 80 % of it's not gonna happen.
Why spend so much time worrying about it?

(31:44):
So I think at the beginning, you know, and it just started a couple years ago for me,
Was it was really limiting and constricting that diet to the things that are a wellcurated experience for me.
And so my question for you was when you talk about, well, no, before I go on that, whatabout you?
Like, is there anything that you said that you would say it helped keep you sane?

(32:05):
Things that you did that improved your mental ability to cope with it this year.
Yeah, I'm going to copy your answer and say these conversations.
Having a team helps.
I'm not completely alone anymore.
Mmm.
And then, I mean, this started in Jan of 23, but I have an executive coach and that,that's been just a absolute game changer for my mental health and like relations.

(32:33):
to help keep you sane has helped keep you sane in a way.
Having a resource dedicated to...
A resource dedicated to asking me hard questions and making sure that I see myself andmaking sure that I'm asking myself the right questions.
Some, you know, I think one of his magical superpowers is like being, I think, I thinksome people want, coaches or therapists or whatever to like, ask them the hard questions.

(33:05):
my coach has a way of.
sourcing making those questions get sourced from within.
It gets you thinking about it and it actually gets you to ask, like, accepts the question,so to speak.
Incepts the question.
That's a good way putting it.
They're doing a job of accepting the question.
So is there an example of like a hard question or a good question that.

(33:29):
You can share.
I'm curious, like, like an example of something that was impactful for you.
And if you can't share or don't want to share, also understand.
might be a hard one to come up with right now.
That's fair.
Once that leaves your mind, we'll circle back.
If it comes back, we can circle back.
But the other thing, the other skill that I think he has is forcing me to reframe things.

(33:49):
And sometimes he'll do the reframing for me.
Like, is this valid?
Yeah.
Question, reframing, asking things, asking questions of my thoughts.
Is this a valid thought?
Is this an accurate thought?
You know, if you're at all familiar with CPT, I think there's, he, takes, he takes hisskill sets from lots of different things, but having studied a little bit of CPT years

(34:19):
ago, there's.
It's one thing to know something and it's another thing to be able to practice it.
Right.
And so to be able to examine your own thoughts.
Yeah.
That's like Buddha level something, right?
I think it takes a friend, mentor, coach, therapist, something, to sometimes, shine thelight at the bullshit that we manufacture in our own heads.

(34:47):
Sure as hell does.
Along those lines, think one thing that, one area that,
helped me in that way was a book you recommended, the book, How to Know a Person by nowI'm just all of sudden blanking on the name.

(35:10):
Yes, David Brooks.
Thank you.
A lot of discussion around trying to see that thought process in others, but also withinyourself I took out of that and.
I think that's something I've gotten better at over the years is separating myself from mythoughts and realizing those are two different entities.

(35:32):
And, but you can't, it's hard to consistently always do it and you can still get wrappedup, but being able to every once in a while, just grab yourself and pull yourself out of
the depths and, and slap yourself across the face is helpful.
Yeah, or like, you know, I feel like sometimes this inner internal dialogue can just runamok.

(35:55):
But then you can ask questions too, right?
Like you can, what's the, what's the old, like there's a Buddhist sort of, or maybe it'sHindu, you know, the rider and the elephant.
That sounds so familiar, but I can't.
I know I'm gonna have to like look it up in order to explain it to the audience who
It's worth getting right.

(36:18):
Go for it.
the rider and the elephant.
the elephant has the emotional side, right?
It's just this big, hunking animal who has a mind of its own and can wander off and nottake direction sometimes.
And then you've got the rider who's like the more rational or maybe analytical side, whocan supply direction, to, to the elephant and,

(36:44):
But there's, think the reason why the imagery, the analogy works is because, you know, thewriter might have all of the correct answers.
That does not necessarily mean that the elephant is always going to be obedient.
Mm-hmm.
But realizing that there are these two entities and realizing that you are and can be thewriter, you don't necessarily have to sink into just being the elephant and being

(37:12):
complacent or non-participatory in the elephant's wanderings is also helpful.
Some of us need permission or empowerment sometimes.
Yeah.
I think that those are good lessons and I think that's a, that's a good, parable overall.
It reminds me a lot of Tim Urban's Chaos Monkey?

(37:38):
huh.
Yeah.
Which I'll put the link to that maybe in the notes for the YouTube audience.
It's a there's a good TED talk he did about About that very thing with some lovely littlelovely little graphics as well.
Anyway, I don't want to belabor that No, that's yeah, I think
Controlling.
Yeah, you can't control yourself, but being able to realize that you are your thoughts,but being able to separate those two things and realize there's two separate entities that

(38:02):
are making up your consciousness and are part of your worldview and how you construct yourworldview and that your worldview itself is through a lens that is constructed that is
different from my lens is different from your lens is different from everybody else's lenswhere we might look at the same thing and see

(38:23):
way different things because of what we expect to see or what we don't expect to see orwhat we're,
know, what our biases are or, or what we want even to, you know, see in some ways like,you know, we want to see something so we see them that way.
And so yeah, it's

(38:43):
might see the world in a different way than your elephant.
It doesn't even need to be.
there's a did you know or have you heard of this book?
The author is Ethan Cross.
He's out of University of Michigan.
The book is called chatter.
I've not heard of it, no.
My brother gifted it to me while back.
if you, if this segment of this discussion, really strikes a chord or something with you,like read the book.

(39:10):
I think it's one of the books that, I don't know if you find Ethan on a good two hour longpodcast, that's probably going to get you the 80 20.
but yeah, it's about this, this internal dialogue, the power of that internal dialogue andthe power you have over that internal dialogue.
is how I would summarize it if I had only one sentence.

(39:32):
Interesting.
That was chatter, you said?
I think so.
think that's what it called.
Okay, might give that one a check.
Check that one out.
You usually have a...
finding him on a podcast or something, just listening to him talk about his research.
Cause the book is, you know, it's filled with stories to sort of pound the message home.
But if you just, I don't know, get the message, can, you're already familiar enough withthe topic.

(39:55):
It's not like.
so what are the things that can, you know, drive that internal dialogue and chatters, thethings you put across it, right?
Like across your, your incoming sensors and like what you're, what you're opening your,your, your experience up to information wise.
So searching back finally to how you get your information on, you know, and how you foundthis tweet, said the algorithm served it to you.

(40:17):
So you're the type of person that actually goes and, and serves through the follow, thefor you tab on, various apps then.
Twitter.
On yeah, Twitter specifically rather than just the following.
Yeah, I go back and forth.
See, I'm almost exclusively just following.
Wow.
I mean, I can't blame you now.

(40:38):
Four years ago, algorithm was awesome for me.
I learned a ton.
Now it's much more inflammatory.
It's much less useful is my position.
I feel like I've always been defaulted to the wanting to just stick to the followingbecause I didn't want useless ads or useless.

(40:59):
Like I didn't want to be.
Yeah.
Not ads isn't the right word because you're still getting ads.
I didn't want to be.
The junk mail, if you will.
Yeah, junk mail would be like, I like, didn't want to be subverted in my lines of things.
Like I'll find the people that I want to listen to and go with that.
Which I guess maybe did restrict me from having like finding certain things as quickly asothers or being late on certain things or never finding certain things.

(41:26):
But.
Man, I don't know.
think I would have gone insane otherwise.
Hmm.
I
I don't know.
think, now that I think the algorithm is much more junk and inflammatory and click baityand FUD, I, I'm finding I have to be very careful about like what I tap into because I'm

(41:47):
teaching the algorithm more and, and I'm just getting more junk if I, you know, yeah, I'lladmit though, once it's there, it's real tempting to like, I'll watch that video.
And then it's, you know,
It's terrible.
It's this evil little loop going back to like the internal dialogue.
It's like you're saying like your environment and the things that you bring in affect yourinternal dialogue.

(42:10):
It's like your internal dialogue can affect all this stuff on the outside world too.
Right?
Like if your internal dialogue is a failure or you're worthless or whatever, right.
if it's all negative, then I think you begin to manifest that in the world.
which is a very dangerous place.
I think it's a very dangerous place to go, which is why either quieting or channeling thisinernal dialogue in a more positive direction is like so essential to getting what you

(42:41):
want out of life.
Yeah, it absolutely, you can absolutely manifest.
mean, because when you do it, then you also, in some de facto, we give yourself permissionto let it happen.
And by
Well, then you're not surprised.
this is how it's supposed to be.
yeah.
And you just say, well, that's out of my control and you don't fight the way you could.

(43:04):
Yeah.
Yes.
That is, that happens to me from time to time.
I have to say it's a, I have to struggle to fight against personally.
Yeah, right.
most people need to, whether they do or don't is different.

(43:24):
Yeah.
Anyway.
human, human.
Aren't these brains awesome?
And also just really hard.
yeah.
And we just keep going through, like you said, you know, the right thing.
It's the loop.
We just keep going through these loops in our, in our.
pulling this information and interacting with it, digesting it, acting upon it.

(43:48):
And when you let it get corrupted, or when you let it get corrupted with the idea of howit should go through that, you're, I'm sorry, I'm rambling.
But yeah, our brains are just insane.
It all works.
Let's do it.
All right, so we would tackle another question What what else on this list?

(44:13):
Interest, piqued interests.
What piqued my interest?
The answer to that one.
was question 22.
Did you fall in love this year?
Interesting.
I kind of wrote that one off as a, I don't think so.
Okay.
I mean, I feel like it's a complicated answer and the only way to like put it into wordsremoves all that complicatedness.
Hmm.
and like makes it more cliche.

(44:35):
But I fall in love with my kids every day.
They also drive me crazy, but I fall in love with them every day.
And then, seeing my wife be a mother, that's like, just, I don't know how, I mean, I'msure there are writers and people who have put up better than I ever will be able to, but

(44:56):
that question made me think of those things.
Thanks.
Like I said, it feels cliche.
It feels kind of weird to say, but like that's exactly where my mind went with thatquestion.
I think that makes sense that that jumps out to you being, I think parenthood drives thatfor people in a lot of ways.

(45:16):
I also like questions 29 and 30, like what did you want and get?
What did you want and not get?
I do not know my answers.
That's what, and that bugs me about myself.
And that's one thing I was, like there's a number of things on this list that I don't haveanswers for and that it annoys me furiously.
And.

(45:36):
Why, why the annoyance?
Because why don't I have an answer for that?
Like if I were to ask myself the same question going forward into next year.
So your frustration with it is a question of has this year been too much stasis?
Yes.

(45:57):
same.
Yes.
Stasis not for lack and not a lack of progress.
I don't feel like this is right word, but like there's not been anything that I've been.
Yeah.
Or, or.
Yeah, like there's not anything like if I'm looking into next year and I say, is it that Iwant out of it?

(46:19):
I don't know what that looks like.
And that's okay, I guess.
don't need to have a plan or say this is how everything's gonna go, but at the sametime...
I don't know.
What do want to get out of it?
My word for this episode is punctuation.
I think that's what I've learned.
Without the punctuation, without the highs and the lows, we forget.

(46:41):
And if we forget, time disappears.
And if time disappears, that's the only resource that you have, technically.
Like you can make more money, you can make less money, you can't make more time.
You can only spend it.
Once it's spent, it's gone forever.
Am I being too woo woo with my drawing connections there?

(47:04):
I am reminded of the Tao Te Ching for some reason.
Perfect.
Bring me in.
maybe we need to look at Wu Wei a little bit more closely and the way of the water and thelack of punctuation and that it's the flow and the continuous movement and the change that
you experienced without knowing, without that punctuation as you put it.

(47:30):
Okay.
Yeah, think my mind was a, yeah, no, I think that's a great, that's a great connection.
I think my mind went straight up Western, Western mind, right?
Like, you know, blow them up or, you know, you didn't live versus like Eastern philosophy,which is more like you got to slow down in order to appreciate the all.

(47:53):
I think that's, yes.
And even when things aren't changing, you don't have those punctuations like you can stilltake a measure and say, this is where we are and where we've been, but I don't know.
Then I would say that the punctuation is a different kind of punctuation then it is thesitting with nothing To reflect that could be in the you know, that's gonna form different

(48:20):
ways for different People right some people might write a journal other people mightmeditate Whatever, but it's creating the space and time for your mind to appreciate the
things that are
not being reflected upon or appreciated or seen even.
Yeah.
So then, so then is it okay to look into then the future and say, what is it you want outof it?

(48:43):
Or what is it that you want to get and say, I don't, I want to get what the, you know,where the river is going to take me.
want to continue the float down the stream and see where I go, but I don't know.
I don't know, it feels rudderless and I don't like that.
Yeah, I don't like the rudder.
Like, I don't like that.
I don't like being a passenger to life.
but isn't this the yin and yang of it all though, right?

(49:06):
Like there are times where it's like, you've got to be okay with the fact that you becamea path, like, things happened to you.
You didn't really have choice or control.
you were a passenger to something and you are here now.
versus also being an active participant and trying to drive and manifest and be.

(49:27):
To you versus through you, in a way.
Yeah, you know, just makes me want to read more Eastern philosophy and get more confused.
interesting anecdote from not just the anecdote necessarily, but little piece ofinformation from, that, Robert Brooks book, how to know a person was looking at a study of

(49:48):
children, looking at pictures, from children from, know, traditionally Eastern philosophytype countries, versus Western philosophy type countries where you have, more of an
individualistic mindset in the winds.
in the West and a more of a collectivist mindset in the East.
and they would show children a picture of a, a mom, a dad and a kid.

(50:16):
And the Western children would put the mom and the dad together because they go together.
Whereas the children of the East put the mom and the kid together because the mom takescare of the kid.
And in
They would show him a picture of a cow, a chicken and, and grass and say, which of thesego together and the, the Western kids had put the chicken and the, cow together because

(50:40):
they're the same category of animal.
And the Eastern kids had put the cow and the grass together because the cow eats thegrass.
It's a relationship versus categorical kind of mindset that's different in the way wethink about things.
And I think it is interesting to want to explore more.
I'm with you if you want to go down that path.
There was a book I started, and I have since left and I'll definitely be coming back toit.

(51:07):
It's like the weirdest people or something like that.
And weird is an acronym, Western individualistic something.
And I remember one anecdote out of that book was that the Eastern or Asian cultures,
there was some sort of study that they were doing and watching that eye patterns whenputting, putting a novel picture in front of them.

(51:33):
the, Asian participants scanned more of the picture versus us Westerners or weird people,would find the focus point, not focal, but focus the focus of the, painting or picture or

(51:54):
whatever it was.
and really focus on them, on that, rather than taking in the whole.
I don't know what to do with that information, but I thought it was an interestingcontrast.
Wait.
Repeat the last part?
they're focusing on what?
Just like the...

(52:15):
Whatever the folk, you know, think of any picture, there's usually a subject or a focuspoint, right?
Yeah.
Us, weird people find it, focus on it.
Eastern populations take it all in.
Yes, yes, exactly.
We're in the minority here in like our way of thinking.

(52:37):
And this is that, yeah, we're looking for that, the causal center of everything ratherthan, which is interesting if you think about Asian art versus European art, you very much
see that in the way that they're.
wow.
I need to go back to the MFA Houston and check out this exhibit now with that in mind.

(53:01):
their landscapes are very detailed, they lack that central focal point of like every, youreye coming to this one thing.
It's much more of an experience like wallpaper almost versus a painting, which is not theright word, but it's.
I think that is a decent analogy for how we might experience it.

(53:24):
Like I, I mean, it was just the other day I saw this, it was a big painting of like thegreat wall.
but see that therein lies my, like my trying to describe what it was, but it was much morethan that.
Right.
It was this huge sprawling landscape with lots of different things to pay attention to.
Was there a subject?

(53:45):
I think that's arguable, but if I'm describing it.
to someone I'm going to say it was a painting of the Great Wall, but it definitely was notthe...
Yeah.
Yeah.
It was a good example of the difference between.
That's well said.
Well, 2025, let's dig into mission philosophy at some point, I think.

(54:08):
Have you ever read The Toa Te Ching?
I listened to it once.
It's not long.
No, it's not much.
I was surprised how short it was.
it's not like picking up the Bible or something.
No, no, it's, it's, there's, it's very brief and it's, not brief is not the right word,but it's.
Sparse.

(54:28):
It's sparse, like it's very well edited is maybe the way I would say.
It's edited onto the core of each idea in a way to really just convey the meme.
of it.
Yeah, which I mean, I think therein lies some of the difficulty with it.
It would almost be cool to have like a, and I'm sure it exists, like a companion book oryeah, but companion for each phrase.

(54:52):
It's not even passages really.
It's like these one sentence, one-liners sometimes, know, aphorisms.
right?
Like, will...
Governing a people is like cooking a fish, easy to overdo it.
William, do you think the people in charge now should be going back in their history andtaking lessons?

(55:18):
We don't need to go there.
Maybe.
Well, you know, you know, it's funny what US president quoted that.
would that be like a Teddy Roosevelt thing?
But more recent than that.
Not that recent, but well, I don't know.
Not since before this millennia.
How's that before the turn of the millennia.

(55:40):
I mean, it seems like something Reagan would say.
Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding.
Yeah, definitely Reagan.
Reagan, cribbing on.
Yeah.
Yeah, exactly.
no, I don't know why I know that Reagan quoted that, but he did

(56:00):
Interesting.
Wasn't he called the great communicator?
I think that was probably his highest level skill.
Yeah.
2025, it's inbound and coming.
We've talked about manifesting.
We've talked about a little bit of a review of the year that we just had and ourrelationship with it.
Are there any comments or thoughts that you'd like to put out into the world to try tomanifest in this next year?

(56:26):
I think 2025 needs for me.
Hmm.
Did I want to manifest in the world?
Actually now, now I got to rethink that.
I think in 2025, would like, if I could, would manifest the idea of,
That the way you experience the world and the way you see the world is through a lens ofyour own that nobody else shares.

(56:50):
that.
Rather than making as many statements, we should try to ask a few more questions nextyear.
You're using the Royal We there?
Yes, as a people.
just like I think.
We've gotten very good about making a lot of brash statements everywhere.
And I would like to just spend 2025 asking a lot of questions, and trying to learn moreabout the.

(57:13):
get here?
And to also understand the, think, views outside of my own in a more deep and meaningfulway.
how are you going to find at least approximations of answers to some of these questions?
I mean, a lot of it's just conversing with people and.

(57:34):
Listening to I am in a fortunate situation where I get exposed to people from around theworld on a regular basis So I have the good fortune of being able to go and ask somebody
from China what they think of this or I was just this morning chatting with my buddy fromRomania about the Election result that they just annulled there this morning You know, so

(57:58):
I get I said well, what's your take?
How does this make you feel rather than?
You know, trying to say, well, this seems terrible.
And like, aren't you glad to be here in America?
I I just asked, you know, rather than say anything, I just asked questions and I had avery good exchange with him.
rather than trying to put, you know, project my own feelings into the situation, justletting the situation wash over me.

(58:22):
or what letting, letting his relationship with the situation wash over me rather thantrying to be part of it.
Just being.
I don't know, being around it, present for it.
Being.
Yeah, present.
I think I would like to manifest more of that into the world because I think there's a lotof miscommunication that we could probably do best to avoid.

(58:46):
That we could avoid, rather.
I mean, but this is timeless advice.
You could say that any year, right?
Yeah, that's the trouble.
But which doesn't negate what you're trying to say or do here.
I think it's one of those like, it's a consonant practice.
Like you never stop.
and
Yeah, that's where I'm at.

(59:07):
That's, that's, yeah, there is no destination.
It's all the, it's all the endless river.
to practice.
the journey.
How about you Dan?
What would you manifest into the the being of 2025 into the world in 2025?
I guess, you know, I really like where you took it.

(59:28):
were sort of, you were taking over the torch of Jim O'Shaughnessy there and trying toincept everyone.
I was thinking a little bit more internally, just myself.
And that's not to be selfish.
It was more like, what practicable change am I going to try to make upon myself, right?
And, you know, I could go into like tactical things.

(59:51):
I think I need better time management.
and little other adjustments like that, that I think are achievable.
I don't know if I'm going to express this well or not, but quality of presence issomething that I would like to change in 2025.

(01:00:12):
I love that so much.
That phrase, if it means what I think it means.
Now's your time to ask questions rather than...
What do you mean by that?
Please.
I'm still exploring it, so don't know if my definition is fully fleshed out yet, but...

(01:00:32):
I think there's a lot of time that I give to different aspects of my life that is at 40 %or 60 % rather than 100.
And I think this leads to a feeling of I don't have enough time.

(01:00:53):
or the time that I have is unfulfilling.
My cup isn't filled by XYZ.
And it's largely because it's like, I didn't even apply myself.
My quality of being there in that particular moment was too low.
maybe part distraction, maybe, subconscious was cooking a little hard and moved intoconsciousness.

(01:01:19):
And I
wasn't there anymore.
I don't know, there's a lot to think about right now.
So a little something along those lines.
But it's I think it's easy to say like, just be present, or try to be more present.
But there's I think, I don't know, I like this aspect of quality.
I think maybe that illuminates it more for me.

(01:01:45):
Yeah, I think, yeah, because being present is one thing, but if it sucks being present,sometimes there's things when you're being present for us like this just sucks to begin
with.
How is that training?
You don't have to go there.
boy.
case in point.

(01:02:05):
Yes.
There's just certain things in life that you, you, can force yourself to be present andattentive for.
And even then like the quality of, of that presence is, is, is that's why, that's why Iliked what you said.
Repeat the phrase one more time for me.
quality of presence.
quality of presence.
Yeah.

(01:02:26):
I think a sub question to that, to kind of piggyback off of what you were thinking alittle bit about is say that you are in a thing and you don't care about your presence.
You'd rather just not be there.
Yeah.
That's that I think that's where I was trying to come to is like, it's like the editing,like, I don't want to talk about the quality of the presence, but it's like, it's the,

(01:02:48):
the, the, the, where I'm spending the time on the things that I want to be present for,right?
Editing that.
So is this saying no to more things?
Yeah.
And clearing up.
executive power over things that perhaps you thought you didn't control.

(01:03:08):
Mm-hmm.
But you could try.
I think this part is the scary part, especially if it's saying no to employers.
over those things?
how do you not manifest, like, yeah, exert or.
Even lobby.
Like it might not be a binary, yes or no.
It might.
Yeah.
Influence.

(01:03:29):
influence maybe is the right word.
in you're not going to control it, maybe you can influence it.
I think that's a good...
influence how you feel about a thing.
That's true.
There's a stoic, Aurelius kind of thing there.
Or you can choose not to feel anything about something as well, which is kind of, guess,influenced the way you feel about it.

(01:03:52):
Well, that's maybe not, I don't know.
That's not true.
No, you know, that's you, you can't do that.
we'd like to think we could.
And I think a lot of people try.
You can always try, but I don't think you can.
deep down you're always, everyone's grading everything.
We are comparing everything by nature.
That's how our models work of comparing, you know, that thing we start our IC to our modelof what it is in our head.

(01:04:20):
And, that's a, that thing's a cup.
That thing's a lamp.
That thing's computer.
That's a good looking human.
That's a bad looking human.
it just, you know,
That's exhausting.
We, like to, we'd like to constantly compare.
wonder, I wonder if we had, if we had, if we knew somebody of a, of a more Easternmindset, if they, if they would say the same thing, if that, if they, if that thought

(01:04:44):
process works, from somebody who's been brought up in a, with perhaps a different line ofthought.
Yeah, be a good question.
Yeah, I don't know.
don't know.
Yeah, we grew up in the same town.
What was I gonna say?
you it's like you move, you edge closer and closer to nihilism.

(01:05:10):
Right?
Like this whole, you know, be present but non-judgmental thing is like...
There's a darker side to it.
You know, it's the yin and yang all the way down.
Yeah, way out over my skis.
I mean, we are, we are, we are built to, we are, we are psychologically built to want tojudge everything.

(01:05:31):
That's why we like competition shows here in the United States or things like the Olympicsor everything's meant to be compared to something else.
it's nothing stands alone.
There you go.
Take something.
We need to learn how to just take things and frame them by themselves for what they areand not, not have to.
pair everything to everything else.

(01:05:53):
Yeah, okay, so one of the things, it's like this thing slaps me in the face from time totime.
I like to complain.
Mm-hmm.
Okay.
think it's funny, mostly.
feel the way my relationship with it is I'm pointing out absurdities or stupidities, orcan you frickin believe that this is a thing in our world or this is how people behave?

(01:06:19):
However, sometimes it comes out of my mouth and I think it stresses those around me out.
Like I'm complaining and that's it.
That's their only experience of it.
And then I watched, it was one evening on the YouTube algorithm, algorithm.
again, served me up this video of Jerry Seinfeld and like two other guys in this garageand you know, it's car talk, totally up my alley.

(01:06:41):
And it's Seinfeld, who is like a professional complainer.
And in the episode, like he's just going at it, and he's pointing and they're laughing.
It's all joyous laughter with them.
And that's how anyway, I think
come, because those people who are on the same loop, they were experiencing the same loopas him.

(01:07:04):
They're experiencing, it's like Hofstadter talking about when people are communicating,they are basically riding the same loops and waves together.
And why it works for him in that situation is they're all of the mindset and they're allin that channel looking to expect a joke.
They are coming from the expectation of it and it's not a surprise to them.

(01:07:25):
because it's Seinfeld that's already influencing everyone else's relationship with what'scoming
with a camera on their face saying, we're gonna tell some jokes.
Yeah, okay.
Well, so, okay, I'll go back in time.
There was a place I worked.
and this style of like complaining about absurdities and stupidities was very alive andwell.

(01:07:45):
It was happening every single day.
Some of it is probably illegal in a workplace or something.
You know what I mean?
Like, but there was, there were a certain amount of people that were, exacerbated by it,right?
Just like,
Can you believe that's what was said?

(01:08:05):
And another portion of us were like, that's hilarious.
We had a great time in the morning meeting because we all were smiling and laughing at theabsurdities.
And then we broke off and went back to our desks and did work.
I don't know what to, you know, I enjoyed that.
There is, we have those conversations as managers about employees where.

(01:08:34):
Well, no, yet, like,
Mind you, mind you, no one in the room was, well, I shouldn't say no one in the room wasattacked, but this was throwing.
I don't know, I guess I would have to hear an example of the type of complaints and likethese, like, I don't think it depends upon the situation, I guess.
yeah, yeah.
This wasn't a personal shakedown or anything like that.
was like it was commenting on the world or maybe a particular company.

(01:08:57):
Just like, yeah.
Everybody gets touchy about things, right?
I don't know.
Is it like...
Some people are just joyless.
It's true.
I'd much rather laugh at all the things that are crazy.
So my wife sent me this one video from this girl on Instagram.
I think it's the daily Tay.

(01:09:19):
And I subsequently watched like three more of her videos and they are hilarious.
I think maybe she's like, I only watched three or four videos.
Maybe she's like a, from a subject matter standpoint, a one hit wonder.
don't know.
but I really enjoyed two of the videos that I watched.
And one of them was like, I forget the actual topic.

(01:09:44):
Like she gets on and is like, I'm gonna point out an absurdity and laugh about it orwhatever, something like that, right?
And then it cuts to her in this wig and glasses outfit thing.
And she's like, this joke was about me and blah, blah.
And then it comes back to her and she's like, no, it's not about you.
don't.
Hahaha
trying to be funny and bring joy to the world and then cut back to her.

(01:10:06):
She's like I feel seen and yeah, it's funny
Yeah, that might be, know, when you, anytime you can complain about something, there'ssomebody who can have the opposite viewpoint of like, this thing's okay, right?
So if you're, if you're making a sarcastic comment, it's been as a joke and kind of acomplaint about it.
Somebody might be like, I think that's just fine.
Like it's because they.
I don't know.

(01:10:27):
It comes into your personal biases, right?
Of what is...
Yeah.
Yeah.
and all the things, right?
Like it's probably easy for me to joke about a particular subject because I've neverexperienced it before.
And then someone who has is like, you asshole.
And I'm like, maybe.
Yeah.
Yep.

(01:10:48):
Everybody's, everybody's an asshole.
Everybody.
Well, everybody's got one.
All right, Sean, we got to wrap this thing up.
we'll catch you assholes next time.
Everybody have a good week.

(01:11:08):
Bring your bidets.