Millennials and Zoomers Lost in the Matrix

Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
I'm watching this generation with fascination because their experience is different thanours in so many ways.

(00:06):
And it's interesting to see how their lives are like in what ways and what differentchoices they're making.
don't, I'm not, I don't want to shit on them because I was, I hated people shitting onmillennials.
so zoomers keep rocking

(00:55):
Happy inauguration day, Sean.
Happy Inauguration Day, Dan.
It's a frosty one out there.
I hope you have your booties on.
As they say in Groundhog Day, I think.
How frosty is Houston getting?
We are in the thirties, mid thirties, expecting to get down into the teens overnight andup to six inches of snow has been forecasted between now and sometime tomorrow.

(01:19):
So.
when Southeast Texas gets snow, what happens?
it depends.
Usually as long as we have power, it's not so bad.
like we had a couple, a storm a few years back, made a lot of news people probably heardabout winter storm Imelda believe it was, where we were down in the single digits across a
large swath of the state and the grid couldn't keep up.

(01:40):
And we had a lot of failures on the power grid and that caused chaos.
because you know, people's pipes were bursting and.
getting things brought back online.
for it.
Water heaters are in the garage.
An unheated garage.
You are in an addict.
It's poorly insulated or, you know, now it's pretty standard for everybody to put in likePex piping, the expandable polymer piping that if it freezes, it doesn't, you know,

(02:04):
rupture.
that's more typical nowadays.
yeah.
Microplastics.
Exactly.
Yeah, so that's what we're up to with the weather in Houston.
You still single digits up there?
Negative seven, think, right now.
I don't know that we get above zero today.
That's the high.
And that's with sun out kind of behind a thin, a very wispy thin layer of cloud.

(02:29):
And there was a dusting of snow.
So I've already shoveled once today.
Yeah.
If anybody lives in a place where they have snow to shovel, I made a purchase this yearand it was not an expensive purchase.
And it was one of the best purchases and it's called
in a very PC way, man plow.

(02:49):
It is like a 46 inch wide snow shovel.
And for anything that's like three inches or less, yeah, for all snows that are like threeinches or less, I used to spend like an hour shoveling my driveway.
It's a wider driveway.
And now I can get it done in like 10 minutes, as long as there's not a lot of snow to pickup because I really do like seven swipes instead of like 36.

(03:14):
wow.
I was expecting to be one of the shovels that have kind of like the Y shaped handle.
So you have better leverage, but this is just, this is just literally you're just bruteforce.
brute force.
So even on the bigger snows, I'll still open the driveway up with the man plow and thentake the smaller like pickup shovel to the edges.

(03:34):
It's still way faster, yeah.
makes a lot of sense, I suppose.
Hmm.
All right.
And as long as you're not digging out from like a foot plus, like it's way faster than asnowblower.
there's Dan's ringing endorsement for Manplow.
Check it out.

(03:54):
If it does, it's probably just due to the weather, Dan.
Let's not be full of ourselves.
Hatke or was it the weather?
Right.
Right.
So we wanted to talk about something that's been on our radar lately in terms of listeningcontent, right?
Do we wanna dive into this?
So.

(04:17):
I forgot.
A couple of months ago, this podcast came out and came across our radar called thetelepathy tapes.
And I've been thinking about how to talk about this.
And I think the way I want to talk about it is just to say,
First off, I recommend that you check it out.
It is a very well done, well produced show.

(04:39):
Think serial for those of you who remember the serial phenomenon back from, what was that,probably eight years ago, 10 years ago at this point.
That very much tone and kind of journalistic voice brought to a kind of sensitive topic ina way around basically those that grew up with autism and
reports that have amassed over the years that are coming to light of I think kind ofreaching that critical mass of reporting where there's enough reports where it's hard to

(05:08):
say well this isn't a thing and we shouldn't we shouldn't give this any credence at allbut basically of those individuals that have autism I'm reticent to say suffered from or
inflicted with suffering from or inflicted with but that experience autism have
with their closest people that they, helped them, their teachers, their parents developedan ability to speak without speaking for lack of a better word.

(05:31):
And hence the name of the podcast, the telepathy tapes.
And, the host Ky Dickens does a wonderful job of interviewing all of these parents and allof these, professional, caregivers and teachers that have these just
out of this out of these world reports, they do a number of basically trials, tests wherethey actually test this ability by keeping the parent in one room and showing the parent a

(06:00):
number and then in the other room, the autistic child on a letter board will hit you know,that number, you know, with off of a random number generator things that are, you know,
seemingly difficult to do if this weren't didn't have any credence to it.
And for me, it's something that this supernatural realm has always been something ofinterest to me since I was a little kid and the X files were around, I think.

(06:23):
And so I've always had a soft spot.
Yes, but I like to consider myself relatively skeptical overall.
But this podcast has just blown my mind in the detail they've gone into.
And
I'm having a difficult time remaining skeptical.
I'm still am skeptical, I think.
you know, there's a potential that this is, you know, it's one show right now.

(06:48):
It's that they there's some good audio and good video on their website.
You can go of them actually seeing some of these experiments, tests kind of conducted tohelp validate the just a couple.
Just watched two of
some of the trials of, of, again, it was like with the, you know, the child and parentssplit into different rooms, different areas, not able to visually make communication and

(07:13):
apparently being able to demonstrate a, sort of a telekinetic link or telepathic link.
are the autistic kids tapping completely unhelped or are they being helped to tap out theletters?
Uh, in the one I saw, uh, the way in particular, I'm specifically remembering they, werenot being touched.
They were, it was, they were not, they were, nobody was contacting physically the, um, isit Hunter?

(07:37):
I think it was the hunt.
Uh, uh, uh, nobody was physically contacting him.
Um, and he was tapping out, you know, showing essentially what they described in thepodcast.
I just had to go see it for my own eyes.
Right.
So, I mean, I'll say having.
You know, listen to the podcast and seen a couple of videos like, I feel like they'repretty doing a pretty accurate representation with what they're saying.

(08:00):
that's, that's the base layer, right?
I think it's just a.
Holy crap.
This is hard to refute, with, shouldn't say refute because it's, don't know if it's hard.
It's both hard to refute and hard to prove, right?
Yeah, and hard to accept depending on who you are or like where your priors are.
And so I think it's just a fascinating little level that layer that we're maybe science isready to explore.

(08:29):
And that's where I kind of want to take the discussion is I think that science might begetting ready to explore more in depth what consciousness truly is.
And I think we've been, you know, scientists and psychologists and psychiatrists have longstudied and wanting to understand consciousness better.
But I wonder if.
with discoveries like this, maybe some acceptance of what's going on here and furthersteeper study of what's going on.

(08:51):
Maybe we're able to start to unlock new understanding around what consciousness truly is.
and my take is just the whole thing is mind blowing and you should go listen to it becauseI'm not going to be able to, we're not going to be able to adequately summarize.
I think what everything that happens, but.
only that accurate, I think it's more meaningful to actually consume the material sort ofserially.

(09:15):
So I might go from there.
Yeah, I am with Sean on this one.
I, it was sort of blew my mind.
I find it hard to accept, but I also find it hard not to.
take as is.
Because I don't.
Other than like a few people who are like, well, you know, the spellers, they refer to thekids who use these mechanisms to tap out letters in order to communicate.

(09:39):
They call them spellers.
And yeah, other than like some, what do want to call it?
Not adult, but like,
people like us assisting the spellers and tapping out their responses.
Other than that, I'm not getting a whole lot of like,
Refutations that make sense.
That's fair.
The rest of it just seems like skeptics who want, who are clinging to being skeptical.

(10:00):
And that's one thing that they do spend, I think, an episode discussing is the use ofspelling in this community has not always been accepted as a way of communication and that
people, one of the messages that one of the mothers delivers, I think is very powerful iswe need to start assuming competence and that these people, that are against,

(10:26):
There's more substance to these.
Yeah.
Well, and that the, that the people that are, that are spelling and communicating this wayactually have a lot more knowledge and are a lot more intelligent than people give them
credit for.
when you're, when you let them tap into that ability, they can really wow everybody washow much, how brilliant they are and what they know.
And then it's interesting to think about how much they might know what they know.

(10:48):
And the podcast gets into that and, some interesting depths because some of it seemsimpossible that they would know it.
But, but yet it is.
people becoming best friends, but having never met in real life and living on oppositesides of the country.
or having being able to consume a book without ever actually even physically opened it upAnd it you know it relates to some of the nature of the of the savant nature of those who

(11:13):
people who have head trauma and then Just all the sudden can play piano there there's somehypothesizing they do around that point.
I think is kind of intriguing adds adds again.
I think more
When you start to look at the larger layer that they build out of, it's this, you know,starting off with this one thing that is this communication between autistic children and

(11:34):
their teachers or parents, and then to this greater sense of these greater areas ofphenomenon that we have proof of existing, like the savant type situation where, again,
people, you know, have...
some sort of a trauma or an experience and then can speak different languages or do, youknow, things that they never could before.

(11:54):
And how that all might tie together.
I think it starts to build a more interesting web and a more, like, it's not just, itbuilds a more firm foundation that, okay, there's something larger going on here that's
interlinking these different phenomenon perhaps.
Yeah.
Well said.
I don't know if it's well said, it like cuts to this, cuts to the weird chase that is veryhard to put to words.

(12:19):
Have you listened to much of Sam Harris talk about consciousness?
What has he referred to it, like the unsolvable question or?
I have not, no, Sam Harris.
It makes me want to go back and listen to a bunch of his stuff just on consciousness, notany of the other stuff.
Just in relation to telepathy tapes, like just listen to him talk about consciousness.

(12:40):
yeah, kind of just spend more time going back and re-relating to material that I'vealready listened to.
yeah, I was thinking the same thing about McGill Chris in a way, kind of wanting to goback and re-explore that, tome the master's emissary, with this in mind, it's something
I've been kind of wanting to re-explore anyway.
You gotta, you gotta get that in the PDF version and upload on Cod and then just ask Codquestions.

(13:04):
The thing is I don't know what questions I want to ask until I go through it again, Ithink.
What I need to do is go like listen to it again, hit my bookmarks and then go find mybookmarks in the PDF and say, okay, these are my questions.
Because right now I don't even know what questions I have.
Yeah, I don't even know what questions I would have.
I also really, I do eventually want to try to tackle his, his latest work, which issomething like 800 pages or 900 pages, but I don't know that I'll ever have the guts to

(13:32):
actually do that.
Guts over for, for me it's like attention span.
That true, that's true.
it on and I could like check the box, but it would be like, you know, it's summertime.
I've got the book running in my headphones while I run.
I've gotten through the book.
Did I?
Did it go into my brain like maybe a quarter of it, you know?

(13:54):
I think that's a lot of reading and, and consuming of anything really is like, much of itdo you actually absorb?
Right.
Um, the comprehension and retention is what's important Uh, and if you're not, it.
Yeah.
And sometimes it's just hard to keep your mind quiet enough to actually focus onsomething.

(14:14):
Cause you start thinking about, for me, at least when I'm, start to think applications orthoughts that like tangent thoughts that come up.
then I forget that I last three pages I read, I didn't actually absorb a bit of it.
Yes.
That happens to me way too frequently.
I don't know how to f-
like, how is it even possible?
How can I ever read this last page?

(14:36):
Because I don't remember a word.
You know what mean?
Like, but that's when your brain is in two places.
I'm like, there's like a, that could be a useful thing if, if it was like harnessedcorrectly.
But instead the way it manifests for me at least is like, I was in two places at once andbasically they both don't count now.
That's true.

(14:56):
Yeah.
And neither of them matter now.
Like I got nothing out of either place.
My mind was for that, for that two minutes I just spent, not really paying attention towhat I was reading and not really thinking.
Yeah.
cannot split your.
anyway,
Yeah.
So that's, that's been on my mind heavily for the last couple of weeks.
I'm looking forward to them coming out with season two.
And I think they're going to put out some sort of a video documentary as well.

(15:20):
Um, they did a little teaser for, for those future plans, looking forward to seeing howthat grows.
But I want everybody to go out and experience listening to that particular podcast, justso we can see what other, uh, what it does to other possible skeptics out there.
Cause I feel like people that
would be inclined to listen to us probably tend to be a little more skeptical.

(15:41):
and, wow.
it definitely messed with my perception.
So check it out.
Yeah.
And then you get to the last episode of season one.
yeah.
In their own words.
Yeah.
that was powerful.
Like what the, the spellers were communicating and saying, I think.
Did it change the way you want to approach anything in your life?

(16:05):
I don't know if it changed the way I want to, I think it will change the way I do.
same more.
Like, I don't know, like now just like thinking about this is more of a possibility.
Like in a way, this is in somewhat ways what they're talking about towards the end is alot of, you know, very much spirituality and the, you know, it gets into a very
metaphysical place of what are our beings after we die?
Where do we go?
Do we go somewhere?

(16:25):
And there, you know, there are...
and stories of here that yes, yes we do.
And that these people have these powers, for lack of a better word, are able to go to thisplace that they call the Hill.
And on the Hill frequently, they are visited by former loved ones that they've lost orpeople from the past.
And time is a flat circle.

(16:48):
it is...
It's it's, that's what, that's what's mind melting about it.
Right.
Is it, if they're to be believed, then this is like the closest we've in a way had to anyevidence of an afterlife.
God.
Like it's almost the hardest, closest thing to heart tangible, like witness, eyewitnesstestimony.

(17:12):
moment we use words to describe this, think it poisons, yeah, well, loses meaning or itpoisons the meaning because like, as soon as I said the word God, there is a certain
percentage of people that felt one way, a certain percentage of people that felt anotherway, and so on and so forth down the line and the different permutations, right?
But what I think is trying to be conveyed here is not necessarily the God, a God, more ofa power.

(17:39):
Mm-hmm.
thing, a black hole of, know what mean?
one thing that comes up is the simulation theory, right?
And is this all like that we're experiencing just like a simulation of consciousness likein some sort of a Weird computer or something You know is was Douglas Adam, right is 42
the answer.

(17:59):
We're just trying to get to
Yes, 42 universes.
I never thought about that way.
That seems far too narrow a number given the infinite improbability drive.
42 infinities.
There you go, that, that, that I'll buy, that I'll buy.

(18:21):
Okay.
Well, and so if you think about like, then, okay, let's say that this is somewhat, youknow, this is true, right?
And it also would relate to in a way what we heard about in the seventies about the CIAand remote viewing experiments.
It could be somehow tie in with that.
like, if it's true is our new, our, like imagine that if Trump listened to this podcast,

(18:43):
How many months before we have a department of precogs sitting there trying to predictcrime or something?
Like what are the weird things that could like terrible things that could spin off of thisis kind of what worries me somewhat.
Why?
Okay, so we moved to terrible, but what are the good things?
Okay, well, no, the good things would be a greater, deeper understanding probably of whatwe are, how to communicate better with other people, understanding our own consciousness.

(19:08):
I don't know what the benefits of that would be for me.
I would think that it would maybe.
level of interconnectivity and interconnectivity with things that are still yet unknown.
I think for me, it was like, you know, going back to meditative practices and stuff likethat, like loving kindness, gratitude.
I mean, those were two words that like kept coming back for me, some of these people whohad this connectivity to this other thing, whatever it is, there seemed to be this

(19:36):
undercurrent of everything being on a spectrum of
love, loving-kindness, gratitude.
And I guess if these people are able to tap into a different, higher level, moreinterconnected channel of consciousness, then my takeaway was I need to get better at
practicing loving-kindness and gratitude and try to get closer to that channel.

(20:00):
Mm-hmm.
That tracks, I...
And it makes me wonder if, you know, then is that what Buddhist monks are really about ina way that we don't understand?
Like them reaching Dharma is reaching this higher plane of consciousness where they'reconnecting with this hill, this, you know, where they're seeing, yeah, enlightenment,
yeah, and...

(20:21):
Yeah, what does, yeah, so another layer that makes me think that, okay, there's been thisother thing that's been going on for thousands of years that people have said, and like
maybe us Westerners don't think that's woo, we don't have much faith or put much faith orcredence in it, but maybe there's more truth to it than we've ever been willing to admit,
and maybe this is evidence of that we should be open to that line of thinking more so thanwe have been.

(20:49):
Yeah.
So yeah, makes you, yeah.
The podcast has made me ask a lot of questions, which is something I wanted to do thisyear.
So it's a good way to start off, right?
I don't know what, is there something that you think you're gonna take out of it that youcarry with you into how it impacts your?
Interaction with life your your lens that you're

(21:12):
Be more positive.
Yeah.
Again, it tracks with like the things that I already set forth for myself a little bitthis year was more optimism, more positivity, more believing.
I kept, like in some prior episodes here, I used the word manifestation or manifest a lot.
And there's a lot of woo attached with that word.

(21:34):
But I think I'm gonna, what I'm trying to do is be, you know,
self-confessed, rationalist, through God away a long time ago kind of person.
And I don't know what to do with any of this.
I don't know how it'll change me over the long run.
But I think instead of being like clinically cold with how I think about certain things,being just a little bit more warm.

(21:59):
And language is extremely imperfect for me to...
try to explain how I feel about all of this.
But there's like some, because I, you know, even saying this out loud, makes me feel likeI just explained myself like a robot for the past decade.
And that's not how I feel about myself or how I conducted myself in this world.
But there is an aspect of this like rationality, cold scientific method, method, sort ofapproach that is like, absolutely valid.

(22:27):
So
much in so many ways.
However, what if this other thing is a thing and I've thrown the baby out with thebathwater sort of thing, right?
Where it's like, actually you can have both.
You can have the scientific method.
You can have rationality, but you also are connected to this thing, this channel, thisriver.

(22:50):
And you've been actively plugging
plugging your ears to it.
And maybe I wanna unplug a little bit.
It's so imperfect.
I don't know how to say it.
Yeah.
I think I hear you.
I think I understand what you're saying in that.
Yeah, because it's more comforting to feel like you know and that you have it figured outand explained and that this is, which is what our rational brains are doing and the

(23:12):
embrace of the scientific method and testing and questioning.
the scientific method itself is a method of questioning, right?
It's not a method of, it's to ask, continue to ask questions and say, well, is that proof?
Does that stand up to?
trial and error, like if I think this is my hypothesis, this is my hypothesis, me come upwith a trial that tests it.
And okay, it stood up to that.

(23:32):
And only after many, many, many, many, many trials does a hypothesis be proven out andever become a law even.
You have to disprove all the counter arguments.
so again, as we said earlier, one thing about this concept of
telepathy and this higher plane of consciousness is that it's
To date, we have not had any good ways to prove or refute it in such that our rationalbrains will allow us to say, if we can't test it, therefore it must not be able to exist

(24:02):
if we can't test it, right?
Like it can't exist.
We can't test it, therefore it can't exist.
Are we are we edging into areas of science that are like this though, like in quantum orsome like neutrons or what are the what are the particles that just like.
or...
no.
Neutrinos?
No.
Neutrinos the ones that just like go through they just go through it's like What what'syou know?

(24:26):
We're still trying like measure and understand those things and why do they exist and whatare they doing?
and right
And, and as we've built our technology smaller in a way, like with our chips that we'reable to get more processing power out, we're able to start analyzing data on the massive
amounts of data you need to be able to actually analyze to be able to figure out what'sgoing on in this small, small, small, small, small scale.

(24:48):
It's interesting that the smaller we can make things, the smaller we can then see in away.
the processing power we're developing is allowing us, I think, to get a much bettermodeling of what's going on on these small scales and help us understand how some of the
things behave.
Not that we actually understand what they're doing, but we can at least start tounderstand their behavior.
And

(25:09):
And what about the things that we don't understand, that we don't even know how to payattention to?
We have not opened our eyes to them or we don't have the right instrumentation tounderstand.
So like when we think about a universe, we want it to be like our universe.
What if the next universe over is like...
infinitesimally small compared to ours.
And then the other one around the block is infinitesimally bigger than the one that welive in.

(25:33):
an interesting thought.
Never heard about that.
So like as you go down into an electron, is there another world inside that electron?
I mean, Men in Black asks this hard question.
If I recall correctly at the end of that movie.
No, exactly.
Like, do we understand like how do we understand how things scale?

(25:56):
is it like you could zoom in and it's fractal and as you go fractally in, it just opens upanother layer, same zooming out like and all this layer makes up some much bigger layer.
That's an interesting thought.
infinite gifts, right?
It's just like you just keep going down or keep going up or whatever.
yeah.
That's, that's a trippy thought.

(26:17):
You heard it here first.
Yeah, if that's the case, then we are definitely part of a computer.
I'm absolutely positive we are just part of a computer, if that is the case.
And I'm okay with that, I guess it's been fun.
you know, the reality, the...
if you knew 100 % sure it was a simulation, would you change your life?

(26:37):
I mean, I think you have to just by the name.
No, you don't have to.
Lots of people wouldn't.
Yeah.
was a simulation.
If it was a simulation, man, you could get real dark and be like, I'm just, no, nothingmatters.
This is just a simulation.
I'm just going to screw it.
I'm going to just drink like a fish all day and play video games or something.

(26:59):
I don't know.
like, yeah.
Or, or well, no, cause in the simulation, you still have laws that they apply to thesimulation.
Like I'd go try to
step off of a building knowing that gravity's not real, but that's not really how asimulation works.
Until you become Neo and can bend the actual...
until you're actually, yeah, you can see the matrix, right?

(27:21):
You can be able to understand that there's a matrix, if you actually see it, it doesn't doyou any good.
Yeah, was gonna say, if the matrix is still being applied to you.
Yeah, then Joey Pants character has it right about just that this steak tastes just asgood as anything else, you know, it's.
Don't care that it's not real, it tastes real.
Yeah, my lived experience says.
Mm-hmm.

(27:42):
So were the Wachowski's thinking about all this when they came up with the Matrix, Iwonder?
yeah, do you have their number?
I think I lost it.
I heard about them in long time.
Yeah.
Well, that's because the matrix three came out and then people gave up, I think.
I don't think I ever saw it.

(28:03):
Yeah, right.
you, why bother after the second one?
it clearly wasn't going anywhere good.
So.
can't remember the second one.
I can't tell you if I saw the second one.
All I remember about the second one is there was a fight scene on the freeway that was thebig deal for that one.
But that's all I remember about it.
people just like looked at the action they didn't ask the questions about.
what was actually being told.

(28:23):
Mm-hmm.
Well, I mean, it's science fiction.
That's what science fiction does is it takes just, you know, put something into anallegory and the set in the future set in a different space and time of that allows you to
embrace it through the view of just having a story told to you and not having to thinkdeeply about it, though that can say something very deeply if you actually do explore the

(28:48):
depths.
I guess it's all science fiction and fantasy writing, really.
Blade Runner 2049.
You mentioned that.
How'd that sit with you?
now that we appear to be getting a lot closer to AGI and Jensen's talking about likerobots and stuff.
was like, interesting.
yeah.
Mm-hmm.
So will we develop robots to be humanoid just because that's what we've always thought ofor is that like just, like I was thinking about that and like in these worlds where we're

(29:19):
developing these robots, why make them so human?
Cause so much of our built world is for humans.
they would plug and play?
Question mark.
mean, if you're building highly specialized robots that like do one particular thing on afactory floor, you can't easily repurpose that thing.
But if it was a human, no, I, with highly tactile, you know, fingers and thumbs and allthat kind of stuff.

(29:43):
That's fair.
just when I see when I see movies of the future and like, like, you know, they make theymake everything.
Yeah, they make everything exactly like why would C3PO be?
I don't know.
R2D2 seemed much more utilitarian compared to C3PO, but I guess.
Well, he was.
He was a little like a co-pilot.

(30:03):
Yeah.
Whereas C3PO was like a diplomat.
Translator, dude.
But if it was, yeah, he was diplomatic trade.
couldn't you just need a, all you need is something like a phone.
Really?
It doesn't have to have a, yeah, that would be fun to see how George Lucas rudere-imagined some of those things.

(30:26):
Now, if it were to.
would be because then why wouldn't your yeah, you would have a phone and you could plug.
You would have like your LLM running on the phone and see three POs right there with youall the time.
And you could just like cast the three PO up to whatever.
then, and the X wing, you just plug your phone in and then you've got our two D tworunning.

(30:48):
exactly.
Yeah, that's just Cassie three PO.
Yeah.
Cast your diplomatic droid to whatever screen it needs to be on.
Right.
It doesn't, don't need this big bookie like
Or space.
Yeah, they had those little like,
You know, like when Princess Leia's, know, big cast up in this hologram.
Yeah, exactly.
That would be, that would be, I mean, we're almost to that today, right?

(31:10):
I think.
I think so, if it weren't for Sunshine, yeah.
Yeah, so we're getting close to...
to worry about all that sunshine when you're on a Star Destroyer.
That's true.
It's a little darker.
Well, it can be, I guess.
Well, I mean, if you're on a star destroyer right off the coast of Earth, I mean, you'd beable to see the sun.
Why would it be any darker than on the face of the moon if you had windows?

(31:34):
Or on the surface of Earth if you had windows?
Yeah, but we're all plebes in the empire, right?
We don't have windows.
That's true.
We're deep inside the belly of that, of that giant.
Yeah.
It'd like being on the inside of a, a shitty room on a cruise liner or interior room.
No.
Yeah, you're right.
It would be dark.
There'd be LEDs just.

(31:56):
LEDs for days.
Yeah, you're you're just wishing for 10,000 Lux
I don't think people are built for this and I think that if we try it someday it's notgoing to go particularly well the first time.
I was thinking about this, well, watching Blade Runner, was the other thing that popped inmy head.
I was like, all these like star, post-apocalyptic on earth or in space kind of things.

(32:17):
And it's like, I don't think these human bodies are doing all that great with no access tosunshine.
I think this is a big problem.
And maybe why all these stories are so dark.
Literally, like, you know, figuratively.
Mm-hmm.
Hmm.
goes away and humans get more evil.
That's, that's true.

(32:37):
The circadian rhythm does a lot for us.
mean, I have, I, I,
Half the health influencers are telling you to like go out and nearly stare at the sun assoon as you wake up.
Well, I mean, I'll say like when the sun comes up, I naturally just wake up then now, likethat, like I am up with it at this point.
It used to be, I'd speak of sleep past it, but now, but now, no, I, for some reason, likethe sun's up, but I'm up and I'm like, okay, let's go.

(33:02):
But like, if my alarm goes off before the sun's up, those are like, yeah, it's, I just, Idon't function well.
so I think I personally would go insane on a ship.
deep in our space.
But maybe, I guess, if you had enough, you know, simulated light and UV light, maybe youcould get through it.
But I don't know.

(33:23):
Maybe they have like a sun deck, you know, you can go take a stroll and see the actualwhatever.
think the Empire would do that for us?
maybe the Republic.
don't know.
Yeah, that's, that's I'll, I'll, I'll be with my allegiance with everyone has the bestfringe benefits, please.
and put a chime in to Natalie and see what she can do for us.

(33:43):
Yeah.
I was thinking there, was this book called Galapagos by Vonnegut in which he had a devicehe called the Mandaracks, Mandaracks device.
And it was basically a, an iPhone.
He described an iPhone and it was like 1956.
It was like this little handheld device that it could do.
It could be a universal translator.

(34:04):
It could teach you the art of Ikebana, Japanese flower arrangement.
You could look anything up on it.
he was describing a phone and the internet Yeah.
we could build the phone, but if it was still prior to the internet, then lot of whatyou're saying still doesn't exist.
Right.
That's true.
Yeah, you're right.
You're right.
He was imagining.
Yes, he was imagining something deeper, but I don't without describing it.

(34:24):
Yeah.
Just thinking about science fiction that comes true.
Like, you know, eventually if we write about it, then it seems like we try to make it trueas humans.
You know, if we say.
Yeah, which is why do we need, we need more pause.
That's not a question.
This is statement.
We need more positive sci-fi.
What happened to like the, like.
just seems all so dark now.

(34:46):
And is that affecting the broader psyche and media cycles and therefore outcomes, right?
Like if everyone believes the economy sucks, it's gonna suck sooner.
We will manifest that as a hive mind.
Yeah.
We'll stop spending, which will cause you can create a cycle.

(35:10):
Yeah.
So, okay.
So I'm trying to think of some positive sci-fi examples.
Like, give me some examples that when you say positive sci-fi, what, what leaps to Dan'smind?
I need the internet.
Nah, that's all right.
I'm trying to think of like positive examples in science fiction or fantasy.
Well, to me...
Vodk was somewhat positive sci-fi.

(35:32):
Mm.
Yeah, like in the belief in humanity.
huh.
And I'd say like as much as he has science fiction.
Yes, that's a good one.
Okay, okay.
I like it.
I love The Martian.
Yeah.
Yeah, that was a great movie.
I said I needed to read it.

(35:53):
I still need to do that.
Bartholetail Mary is right up there too.
Same author, Andy Weir.
Yes, I have that on my list thanks to you actually.
I've seen it on my wishlist there waiting to be, we can be queued up.
what other sci-fi I've really loved that was had a positive.
I guess I don't read a lot of sci-fi.
Now that that's coming.
I don't read a ton of sci-fi, but I do like it.

(36:15):
But I think a lot of it, at least the newer stuff that seems to like find me is dark andlike, I don't know.
was overwhelmingly kind positive sci-fi, right?
That was a very positive.
someone would really try to spin that into like, well, they were colonialists orsomething, but like they were trying to
No, they weren't.
They were specifically expressly were not colonialists.

(36:37):
That was part of the prime directive.
God dang it.
I will defend against that.
They were scientists.
They were on science missions looking for expanding our knowledge and understanding.
Yeah, exactly.
I mean, of course, you know, star wars, I guess, is kind of positive sci-fi, like spacefighting space Nazis, right?

(37:02):
That's, was more of an allegory for world war two than anything, or at least that's way itfelt.
Yeah, so maybe my complaint is unfounded.
Well, everything we just referenced was older.
I don't know if we've referenced anything that's relatively modern other than maybe theMartian, the film was eight years ago.
I mean, that's still not, I don't know.

(37:22):
I'm guessing, but it feels like it was about eight.
mid teens.
We gotta remember in 2025.
So okay.
Sorry, that hurt.
Sean's 40 and he's still coming to grips with it.
Project Hail Mary was 2021.
Okay.
That's, that's, that's, that's, that's nice and current really.

(37:44):
to hang out with Andy Weir.
He lives in California.
His next book, Artemis, is available now.
Lifelong space nerd and devoted hobbyist of subjects such as relativistic physics, orbitalmechanics, the history of manned spaceflight.
I mean, he probably lives next door to JPL or something.
Yeah.
something I can think of that I've read recently that would maybe even come close toqualifying.

(38:04):
Eh, okay.
Well that's a genre maybe worth exploring and seeing what exists more of.
I've grown to like sci-fi more in...
and even some high fantasy more in the older I've gotten, appreciating it as literatureforms.
I think when I was younger I didn't appreciate...
Didn't resonate with me, I don't know why.
It just never clicked.
Same, I've been reconnecting more with it now.

(38:25):
Have you heard of Jeff Vandermeer?
Have I mentioned him before?
Author?
The name sounds familiar, but I couldn't tell you a thing about it.
I don't
Van Der Meer.
Florida.
something.
Let's see here, annihilation.
Absolution Authority Acceptance.
Anyway, I read this series by him.
No.
He's written a lot.
I mean, just go to his website here, jeffvandamere.com.

(38:46):
I think you will like his art, if nothing else.
But anyway, yeah, check out the books.
They're sort of, one of them was made into a movie, but they are kind of, they're outthere kind of.
Hmm.
know, just, they were fun little adventure toys.
With weird stuff that happens along the way.

(39:08):
Area X.
The Southern Reach series, that's the one that I read.
okay.
I like a good series.
I like a good series, I gotta be honest.
Because life is just, know, there's time to fill.
So it's nice to have a lot to fill it with.
So a series is definitely good way to do that.
No, I don't know.
I feel like, I feel like the authors can really get into the characters and develop muchbetter over, if you give them three, four books, it's, you get more, a better story and

(39:36):
you end up feeling much more attached to the characters than if just a single book.
Yeah.
of one movie.
You get to watch, you know, two seasons of eight episodes.
It's like three or four movies.
Yeah, like a book is good.
Like if you want to have the event is the important thing, but if the character is theimportant thing, then the series is I think the way to go.

(39:57):
depends what you're, I mean, that's not patently true, but,
Yeah, I get you.
Yeah, anyway.
All right, I've got a tweet that came across me that I thought was humorous.
I'm gonna share it with you, get your reaction.
Totally switching subjects here.
Being generationally sandwiched between people who had their brain rotted by cable newsand TikTokers who can't read is going to make for an absolute nightmare era.

(40:22):
I mean, I think we're being...
what are the reactions to that?
bet that get a lot of comments, they get ratioed or
let's go look again.
It has 107 comments, 4,000 retweets, 33,000 likes, and 1.3 thousand bookmarks.
of a, that's good response right there.
That's what you want.

(40:43):
Like nobody pushing back, relatively speaking.
That's an interesting way to take, an interesting take on what the millennials areexperiencing.
I think we're probably shitting a little bit too much on the Zoomers, but yeah, yeah,yeah.
And also,
When you think about how many people actually really do truly watch cable news that much,it's like five, 8 % of population.

(41:05):
It's not like, or, you know, even of the boomer generation, it's, it's a
More of a minority than we give it credit for.
I think.
I don't know.
but yeah, cable news, man.
What, what were we thinking?
that lasted for a while and it's still lasts.
mean, it's still going on, but I don't know as many people that watch it.
My parents still from their tune into CNN or emits and see your Fox and they rotatearound.

(41:28):
So I'm like, okay, you're bouncing around.
don't care.
Whatever it means.
I don't care.
If you weren't, yeah, I like the bouncing around.
Yeah.
Good.
Good on you.
Don't just listen to one thing and nothing else.
but, yeah, like cable news, feels like.
Losing relevance quickly.
mean, which it has been, I think, but with TikTok going away, that's not going to helpanything.

(41:52):
That flow is just going to go to some other platform where some something new comes up.
It's not going to go back to cable news.
I don't know.
I
I don't know.
I feel like people that watch it, I think it feels like niche.
I feel like it's a very niche thing.
Like it's yeah.
Yeah.
Right.
Like, I mean, the, the, audiences for each relative show network are all like the, likepeople tune into their, the echo chamber they want to listen to for an hour and then tune

(42:16):
out.
And it's not that they're like growing their audiences are really even like, I wonder howmuch they're even spreading ideas, like useful ideas at this point.
I don't know where I'm going with this.
Okay, well, the thing that...
How do I want to say it?
it seems that at least there was a time, and maybe this was driven by COVID, but maybeit's still like true today or whatever, that the journalists, let's call them reporters,

(42:46):
live on Twitter because all the news is being broken and released and everything'shappening on Twitter first, basically.
And then it gets up cycled into the news.
And obviously that's not the way it used to be.
And I think that's been another dynamic that has also changed the news in ways that we'restill having trouble like disentangling and those who aren't like already connected to

(43:12):
Twitter.
like anything that's on cable news is almost old to me.
Cause it's already gone through eight to 16 hours worth of like, yeah.
Yeah.
seeing people's hot takes and cold takes simultaneously.
And since I'm reading rather than watching the information density that I've got, thatI've received on Twitter was much higher than anything that would ever appear on a 35

(43:40):
second slot on CNN.
it's the and now this syndrome that you get from watching news.
It's like we're moving from this and now this, which is just a meaningless transition tosay we're moving on to something else.
We were just watching this thing about a murder.
Now we're to watch this story about a puppy coming down from a tree, but we know yourbrain doesn't know how to handle that transition.
So, and now this, it's, it's infotainment.

(44:03):
It's not actual.
right here.
Well, let's go back to amusing ourselves to death.
Yeah, exactly.
Well, I think that's where I just, I believe I stole that from been using ourselves as a,if I'm not mistaken, everything I just said there.
I should credit Neil Postman with that take.
Yeah.
But yeah, so good riddance to cable news.
I will miss you for nostalgia purposes only once you finally do succumb, but it'llprobably always be around in some level.

(44:28):
in some level.
But this like, zoomers can't can't write, read or write.
Yeah.
Or make a phone call is a common complaint I hear too.
But I think that's silly.
Yeah, I think that's also true of millennials.
Yeah, true.
If I can avoid it, I would.

(44:48):
Like the place that has like good reviews and good pictures on Google Maps is much morelikely to get my patronage than the place that doesn't.
That's true.
That's true.
Yeah.
Yeah.
If you have a nice form that I can fill out to come in and get things, the ball rollingand not have to call and explain and what I'm trying to say over language I'm not sure

(45:09):
about, but if I can see a checkbox and like, okay.
This is how this works.
I understand.
I'm much more likely to go with that.
Oftentimes probably to my, well, not often, sometimes probably to our detriment.
Yeah.
Yeah.
be guided.
Yeah.
But.
Yeah, no, there's something else that I read that why I'm picking on this like can'twrite, can't read thing is like somebody made the comment that they watched some zoomers

(45:34):
like try to work with AI and they were like, because everyone's like, they're going to beAI native.
This generation is going to be AI native and how amazing that's going to be for them.
And, you know, the world is uneven and unfair.
So yeah, for some of them.
But it seems that they're
At least according to this other comment that I come across, it was like, there's a bunchof them that can't read and write.

(45:59):
Like they can't really express ideas.
And if they can't express them, then they're not going to get AI to do what they, theoutput will not be what it ought to be.
That seems weird to me that that the generation would be poor at expressing ideas throughlike the written language because they spend so much time texting, right?
Or like, I don't know.
Or, I mean, the, SAT now is a writing portion that we never used to have.

(46:23):
Like they have to go through the, that's going and taking the SATs has to, I would thinkget some.
School specifically is schools I would think are specifically gearing students to withwriting skills to pass those tests.
so that's kind of surprises me.
college is going back to looking at the SATs or are we still in the regime that doesn'tlook at test scores?
mean, how long, how long has that regime been in place?

(46:44):
Only three, four years?
Like where they kind of went out the window.
Like I'm, yes, I think that's more likely to, yeah, yeah.
Yeah, no, that's fair.
That's true.
because S a looking, looking at SET score was somehow looking at SET score was somehowracist or something, right?
I forget why we stopped carrying.
a very imperfect but the best meritocratic system that we had.

(47:07):
Yeah.
I don't know.
So that's, it surprises me that, cause they're more sober.
So they shouldn't, they should at least be able to express their ideas more clearly,without the haze of, of, of Jack Daniel's.
Yeah.
So.
Dear AI, I had too much in Yeho last night.
Please help me with my paper.

(47:28):
Yeah, that's funny.
Abusing ourselves to death over here.
Sorry, zoomers.
And I'm not, like you.
I'm not trying to pick on you.
It's it's funny.
It's funny.
The differences that we have, but with us, the generation behind it really shocks me how,how much of a steep decline it was.
It has been in, like the data I see in alcohol sales.
It's like, it's like a six to eight fold decline.
Yeah.

(47:49):
It's, it's.
Yeah.
It's just a cliff for the, for these, these brands and these companies that, I don't know.
It's gonna, it's going to be a, a weird decade.
in the beverage industry coming up as this, unless something comes up to like dramaticallyreverse course, like we're going to probably see consolidation.
don't know.

(48:09):
Mmm, that's a good point.
It's funny.
It's like, you know, Lewis Hamilton just got into tequila Clooney made all his money intequila
You know, yeah some big names like right on the tail end here making making big money andthen Diageo is gonna be the bag holder or something
The hoctua girls gonna launch a vodka

(48:30):
but her demographic's still drinking, think.
Drinking and having sex.
Whereas the others are not doing either of those.
Yeah, that's, she'll, she'll have the niche, the niche of that demographic is stillpartaking, but
Yeah, like the numbers I've seen are like, I need to go back and look at like the scale atwhich they are, but it's talking like average spend per person per capita, essentially per

(48:53):
year on adult beverages.
It's like a 70 % decline.
just, don't.
Well, and they don't even have to risk driving drunk, they just get Ubers.
Maybe it's no fun without the risk.
I don't know.
No,
Ha ha ha!
I don't know.
It's unusual.

(49:13):
wonder.
I think risk here is like the interesting word.
I have a hard time believing that it's all just like health conscious.
There's something like, you know, it's alcohol and it is sex and it is so many otherthings.
are they just not going to leave home?
Like, has the risk profile gone to near zero?
Is this the generation that like sees 10 % of them like be wild?

(49:35):
successful because they're the only ones with any sort of appetite and the rest of themare just like barely skating along or like did the the the normal distribution get weirdly
shaped or something
interesting question.
Because if it's a generational shift in risk tolerance, let's say, among certainactivities...
Yeah, because it like, again.

(49:56):
Other than COVID, there's like no hardship.
None.
We came of career age during the great financial crisis.
Yeah, and COVID ultimately, like the job market ended up being really good.
So it wasn't like they were having a hard time finding jobs, right?
Their social life was hard.

(50:18):
That I'll give them.
But I don't know that there was true hardship or struggle almost anywhere.
We came to, you know, we came of life in a great financial crisis.
And, you know, it was people our age over in Iraq and Afghanistan.
Absolute numbers were small there, but still it was our generation doing that.
I was thinking about this recently.

(50:39):
It's funny.
This came up.
Somebody, one of my millennial friends made a comment about how we, seems like we've had aonce in a lifetime crisis that we've experienced every so many years as a millennial.
And I was like, it does feel like that, but I was trying to think about what those crisisactually were.
mean, so obviously the pandemic, the GFC.
Yep.
9 11 and then the after aftermath of that.

(51:04):
Yeah.
dot com bust into, yeah, that economy, which that was kind of pre a little, I mean, we sawit and it impacted the people in our lives.
I think I didn't impact me directly.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I remember like all the adults in my life at the time, cause I was a teenager.
But then the great financial crisis was different.

(51:25):
Like Indiana just lost its entire economy.
It was done.
Like there were no jobs, period.
I had to leave.
We had to leave the state in order to like make a living.
Is that, I mean, maybe that's probably putting a little harshly, but
My life wouldn't be what it was if I stayed.
No, that's, that's, that's, think the truth for a lot of people that ended up going toother climes yeah, the opportunities just weren't as dense for sure.

(51:51):
and then that also set a lot of people back on the home ownership path initially,Millennials, millennials tended to own homes later in their life than I think the
generations before.
I don't know what, how the zoomers are doing on that front.
I suspect they're doing a little better.
But I'm not certain, because...
let's go back.
we're picking, like, I know it may sound like we're picking on the zoomers.

(52:13):
I'm trying to understand.
Me too, me too.
Like, I'm like.
also trying to relate to my own lived experience, which was sitting in a ratty office inIndiana for the couple of years I there after school, and then the offices in New York
City that I worked in, and reading article after article after article after article abouthow millennials are lazy, do nothing, unworthy people who shouldn't be in the workplace.

(52:36):
Yeah.
And how's that going?
Well...
You know how in the corporate workplace, I don't feel like I see as many millennials as Ido other generations often.
Is that weird?
No, that's maybe not fair.
I don't know.
feel like it.
don't know.
feel like the level of at my level where I just got to it's all Xers at least, right?

(52:56):
I'm, I'm the only at my level.
Yeah.
and then below me.
Before moving up, before moving up, was a mix of millennials, I guess.
So maybe, yeah, we're just, it's, we're, still up and coming or hitting our forties andgetting into the upper management points.
I like, I'm, I w I'm on the older end of millennials and I'm just 41.
So let's say if like 43 is pretty much the top.

(53:17):
And especially in the corporate world, you kind of reach 45 to 55 is sort of like thepower stride.
Like you've either made it and you got to, yeah.
You've made it by then or you've been pushed out into some other sort of arena.
Yeah, I think that's, you've found a niche that you've, you've, you've, you've chosen aniche.

(53:38):
Like I really like designing this widget and I'm just going to sit here and designdifferent iterations of this widget for the rest of my career because somebody needs to
decide the hinge on the plane.
And I'm going to do that, you know?
Yeah.
think right now, like I would be just moving into a place of more power if I would havestayed on track, but I left, I parachuted out.

(54:00):
And so it's just a different, it's a different thing now.
That's true.
That's true.
It is interesting.
Like, and I really, I'm watching this outcome generation with fascination because theirexperience is different than ours in so many ways.
And it's interesting to see how their lives are like in what ways and what differentchoices they're making.
don't, I'm not, I don't want to shit on them because I was, I hated people shitting onmillennials.

(54:23):
so zoomers keep rocking like
If people are crapping on you, just get used to it.
It's just the generational thing.
It's every generation before us has jumped on us.
Yeah.
It's there is, yeah.
It's a little hazing.
You have to go through the generational hazing to be accepted in the workplace.

(54:43):
Like, all right, now you're finally welcome, I guess.
And if you're going to walk around with some sort of victim mindset, woe is me, the sky isfalling, then you will get jettisoned out of the organization.
Yeah.
but I suspect most of you are tough enough to realize that anyway, and know that us oldsare just full of our bullshit, that we like to sit and sip on every morning.
I, but yeah, it's interesting.
Like again, just the shifts and what, how they're spending their free time, what they'redoing with it.

(55:07):
Like obviously more health conscious than any generation before them has been to, sincehealth consciousness was a thing in a way.
Cause there was a point in time where health consciousness really wasn't so much a thingand it didn't matter.
Like obesity wasn't as big of an issue.
But then like what I'd say pre twenties, maybe that wasn't really thirties, 1930s.

(55:27):
And then after world war two,
Mass food processing.
I mean, we already had, you know, tobacco has been around for thousands of years, so youcan't blame that on a timeframe there.
but like things like health, like it moved into the consciousness of people and beinghealth conscious.
And like, think this generation is like the most amplified version of doing the thingsthat are best for their body to improve their likelihood at physical longevity.

(55:53):
I suppose.
Yeah, that would be interesting to see.
Every cohort kind of has its features and the conclusions that we can attempt to draw offof those changes as people move through life.
also, I imagine that the younger generation has been more vocal about seeking out mentalhealth services.

(56:17):
Like I imagine if you were to look at the percentage of, yeah, and I wonder if it's gonetoo far as in a way.
the self diagnosis, everyone thinks they are hurt when in fact they're just human.
Oof.
That's a good line, Dan.
No, because it's true.
Because sometimes so much of being human is that nature of, yeah, and also then the natureof always being kind of paranoid because there's risks and we survive because we look out

(56:53):
for risks and you feel like, well, if I'm constantly feeling like I'm at danger, then Ihave this anxiety.
yeah, some somewhat, but also some of that's just your natural system saying, don't forgetthings can go wrong.
of course there are absolutely people that suffer from anxiety disorders that have needhelp.

(57:14):
Yeah.
It's just more like the self-diagnosed.
Let me.
like a badge of Connor that yeah, a badge of honor in a way.
I feel like there's a, a, a, maybe it's just a small, but probably loud vocal group that,it's like trying to get glory from being the most hurt and the most sympathy.

(57:38):
don't know.
It's people that seek out sympathy and attention and then you.
Yeah.
that and you're like, there's a lot of people doing this and it's not just a handful, butthey're loud.
what suffering has this generation gone through, right?
Like I feel like that's when people are forged is in times of being pushed beyond aself-imposed boundary.

(57:59):
That you learn more about yourself as you push through those sorts of things.
Yeah, so maybe the suffering that they've experienced is being too sheltered, being toosheltered and being protected by helicopter parents that kept them out of any harm's way
and that.
coddling of the American mind.
I don't know.
Yeah, I mean, I think Jonathan Haidt's work is pretty clear on some of the stuff.

(58:23):
And he'd be the guy I would cite on that.
Yeah.
Interesting.
Well, yeah, I mean, I think it's a I think it's a an extremely important thing for humansto do is to realize how much more strength they have than the default download tells them
they have.
But the only way to go find that out is through suffering.

(58:46):
Mm-hmm.
And best to do it in some sort of way that is under some control.
Great financial crisis, I wouldn't recommend it.
Great depression, I wouldn't recommend it.
But an outdoor adventure where you and three other kids your age and one adult or twoadult, whatever, have to go scale rock walls and take risks.
That sounds good.

(59:07):
Can you push the boundaries a little bit?
It's preparable, yeah.
Yeah, my grandfather, like...
and you haven't even applied for college yet.
And then you fail at 18 and a half and goes you're one year late going into college.
Awesome.
That's cool.
You're to be better for it.
You know, just little things like that, right?

(59:28):
You know, 100 % there are people doing these things.
Um, but I think about it as a parent, right?
I think about rights of passage.
think about Richard Reeves and of boys and men.
think about, um, female empowerment and how.
What are we going and suffering?
think about suffering because I think it is, and integral to the lived experience and tosuffer when you're older and less capable or less flexible, less plastic.

(59:55):
Like that's not nearly as much fun and to be able to find your boundaries and to find yourstrength ahead of being 18, I think was kind of something I wish I had more of.
I think everybody wishes that nine site because we all were just scared kids going throughit, Dan, every single one of us.

(01:00:15):
And, we were guessing and listening to advice that was coming our way and picking andchoosing which of it we wanted to listen to or believe in.
if it resonated with us, we tend to follow it.
If not, you'd tend to ignore it and probably ignored more good advice than I listened to,honestly, in hindsight, but.

(01:00:36):
probably.
Going back to all these articles I read about my generation being full of shitbags.
Right?
Like how much, how much does that infect the psyche and then become true first?
Yeah.
You didn't want to listen.
of me was such shit anyway, so why bother listening to what you have to say?
Rebellious.
I think millennials are a little more rebellious than the generation that followed, butwe'll see how that, if that plays out.

(01:00:58):
I mean, the gig economy kind of sprung up around our youth and coming of age, really.
Because of.
Why?
Because people needed jobs and the internet was becoming a thing and people didn't want togo to the office nine to five.
with the GFC and events like it, there is a spawn of entrepreneurial activity.

(01:01:18):
Yeah.
Well, I'm just saying like even outside of the intra-annual, well, I guess, I guess in away you could say Uber's yeah, freelancing is entrepreneurial.
You're doing it on your own hours, on your own schedule, not at the, yeah, I can getbehind that.
Yeah, I don't get picky around people choosing between a lifestyle business, a freelancingbusiness and an Uber, right?

(01:01:43):
Like if you're out on your own and you eat what you kill.
Entrepreneur.
Fair enough.
Fair enough.
Well, anything else we got to say about Zoomers and millennials?
I feel like I need to go think about this some more.
like I'm...
genuinely curious.
In part because of own lived experience that I've, you know, yeah.

(01:02:03):
I was like, no one was asking questions of us, seemed.
I just read horrible things about me all the time.
what other trends like big demo shifts are happening between the millennial and thezoomers or Gen Z, know, other than alcohol needing to refigure out their business model.
Yeah.
Something like that.

(01:02:23):
all will grow up to hate the United States government now.
So I repeat that.
They all will grow up to hate the United States government now.
Will they?
I don't know.
Even I wonder what percentage of that generation is even like a percentage of ourgenerations on Twitter is actually still relatively small 25 % maybe
Yeah, but think anything that requires no reading whatsoever and it's like dopamine everypoint seven five seconds.

(01:02:47):
I'm not saying that I'm saying that's going to be pretty popular and the higher end of theTwitter requires reading and being a little bit on the higher end of the rung.
In terms of patience and ability to like teach the algorithm.
yeah.
Especially since they expanded it to above 140 characters.
but.
Yeah.
I, I, I, that's another.

(01:03:08):
in the way that I use it.
I'm sure I know that there's a lot of trash there too.
Yeah.
tons of trash anywhere.
If you want to find it, if you want trash in your feed, you can find trash in your feed.
It's that's what you're seeking out.
The feed will give it to you.
You just have to give it the right.
That's true.
The format is.
there's no good form.
I'm not saying there's no good material.
There is good material there, but I would say the format is trash.

(01:03:29):
It is meant to rot your brain.
Ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, yes.
And that's not even a comment on whether the CCP has control of information, which theydo.
exactly.
I don't mind what's going on with that thing going away, at least temporarily.
We'll see.
You know, this all could change by the next time we talk after, you know, the inaugurationis happening as we speak.

(01:03:50):
in three days, there might, I mean, there's supposed to be a hundred, you know, edicts orwhatever, executive orders coming out in the first day.
Right.
So let's see what, let's see what drops today.
Radical acceptance.
acceptance.
that's actually one of the edicts is he's outlawed radical acceptance.
You have to be, you have to be pissed off about everything.

(01:04:11):
Yeah.
yeah, I don't, yeah, I, I don't think that that will end up longterm impacting the.
that generation's view of government.
think what's much more likely to impact that generation's view of government is the nextfour years of grift that we're about to see.
Like we're, we're in grifters paradise as Coolio once saying, I think, right.

(01:04:33):
Yeah, the Trump point I think is all you need to know about how this whole thing works.
It's personal enrichment up and down.
huh.
It sure as shit is.
And...
It is.
But I try to be open-minded and listen to the other side, and they say the exact samething and have cogent arguments about the other side.
And then I just become my parents who are like, man, it's the government.

(01:04:56):
It's always been that way.
Ultimately, it just leads to apathy and apathy leads to letting shit just get worse.
Right.
guess.
Um, yeah.
Uh, cause then you see like whatever, and then you stop paying attention even more so, andthen allows even more shit to happen and fly by.
And I, uh,

(01:05:18):
Yeah, there's something poetic about that Trump coin coming out right before hisinauguration hours after Gary Gensler walks out of the sec for the last time.
And, and like, we're just going to have four years of much less regulation.
I think in many ways that can be a good thing because sometimes we're over-regulated.
I, I just worry about a little bit about level of grifting it's going to be happening andthat will be on the rise.

(01:05:40):
And so I think everybody just needs to be, keep your head on a swivel, but.
We'll get through it.
okay, let's, we're going to go non-judgmental.
We're going to go non-positional.
We're just going to look at what we believe the future looks like and.
One of the things I told someone recently was, I don't know if I'm looking forward to thisor not, but I believe it to be true.

(01:06:05):
That the incoming administration, we've already seen a flavor of it once before, and theytend to telegraph.
what they want to do and therefore you can make money ahead of or like post telegraphprior to yeah.
implementation.

(01:06:25):
And so crypto being like the clearest thing right now.
And we are only setting up Inauguration Day.
Would you participate?
If you had a clear vision on one of, it doesn't matter what it is, it just was very clearto you that the administration's moving in X direction and you can play that through
instrument Y.
Are you watching these things?

(01:06:47):
it, depending upon the situation, yes, as long as that, like I have no desire to run outand buy Trump coin.
but, you know, maybe increasing my crypto exposure on specifically Bitcoin is a good ideafrom a couple of hundred basis points to a few hundred basis points more.
I don't know.
because that does seem likely to with.

(01:07:08):
As we've discussed previously, Jay Powell's possible mandate to start stocking up onBitcoin.
But again, we think that might already come through other means.
It's not going to actually impact pricing so much.
Um, but it does create maybe a floor on some of that so that it helps de-risk it, whichgets other people in, which then creates that, that, that behavioral, that

(01:07:33):
that behavioral psychology spiral, right?
Of people like seeing it happening and then it manifesting itself as more people start tobelieve and, and partaking in the mania.
that's going to happen probably several times in the next four years, right?
That's a couple of times a year, at least probably have good two, three shots a year.
If you can, find them, and, feel confident enough and passionate enough.

(01:07:54):
Outside of crypto, I need to start thinking about what those other opportunities are.
Cause they're going to be a bound.
Me too.
Yeah.
probably as much as take to take and have start listening to what Trump's saying a littlemore closely than I have been in the last.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I think part of the reason why I was unable to participate last time I had my head in thesand and I didn't want to, I mean, a good portion of his term, was not even in country.

(01:08:20):
and the other part of it, I didn't have a job.
So I, you know, there wasn't a lot of money to be made, but I feel like with a 2.0 hereand, accepting reality as it is, kind of looking at like no excuses.
Right?
Head in the sand doesn't do any good.
Might as well try to make some money and do something with it.
I don't know.
I don't view them as like ill-begotten gains or anything like that, but maybe there'ssomething I can do with them or maybe I can, I don't know, maybe it's like enough money

(01:08:46):
that I can change my life and like teach a college course part-time or I don't know.
Things that I have on my mind that like I would love the flexibility to do that.
I don't have it right now, but some sort of giving back.
I don't know.
Whatever.
hear you.
I could see that being fun.
A fun thing to do.
Yeah, that's a good goal for what you want to do.
If you're gonna make money off of all this bullshit, then at least be higher minded aboutwhy you're making the money, right?

(01:09:12):
Okay, I do it, change, improve my life so I can do this thing.
I like that a lot.
Yeah, I mean, I I live and work in this little box.
And we talk together and publish it.
Hopefully that reaches some people.
I just think about, you know, what was it that I said?
Like, you can't save souls in an empty church.
That's one of my things for 2025.

(01:09:32):
It's like, how can I put myself out there more?
And I know I'll, you know.
connected with people that don't like me or what I have to say or something that'll bepart of it.
And then I think about more direct connection, whether there's some sort of mentorship ofyouth in my town or teaching at the community college or something.
But yeah.
at minds matter.
They have that in Denver.

(01:09:54):
I've been thinking about doing that here in Houston.
minds matter.org.
they pair, adult volunteers up with like, high potential youths from struggling schools inthe area.
Yeah.
Disadvantaged backgrounds trying to help them get a leg up on,
Like it's like a weekly tutoring thing.
they, have a guest.
I've, I've gone and I spoke to, spoke to the local group here.

(01:10:14):
a couple of times, one of my coworkers is a regular volunteer and I've gone a couple oftimes to speak.
I really enjoyed it.
It was, it was really fulfilling.
and something I think one thing that might be one of my things I want to do this year isgetting into, doing that more regularly.

(01:10:35):
specifically if I could.
I don't know, like you have to sign up for a commitment to like actually then be with thatstudent for a period of multiple years.
And that's a little, that's been a little intimidating, but like they have some otherthings where you can come in and regularly like offer to come in and do courses or, or,
you know, present on topics where you, might feel confident enough to speak in.
They'll, help provide you with some basic content and you can flesh it out and,

(01:10:57):
Say more about the intimidating longer relationship.
Well, because signing up for that is not in my ethos because I'm not a parent.
so I'm like, if I signed up for this two, three year relationship, then what if in twoyears I want to move?
in feeling, which I guess it is what it is.
feel like that is the thing that you can always use to not do it.

(01:11:21):
That's fair and probably need to get over that.
someone who's well, and I'm giving you that because I've used that on myself too much inmy life.
In part because we were extremely mobile for a few years.
So it felt very, you've moved cities once.
So like, it's like, I'm not going anywhere likely.
Like that's a stupid reason probably.

(01:11:43):
Eh, don't call it stupid.
It's a reason.
But is the reason valid?
Yeah, that's fair.
It's the reason valid.
And yeah, and I think there's something intimidating about signing up like to do somethingfor three years with somebody and like, what if the kid, just hate him.
I'm like, ah, this, I gotta go.
It's like this kid just is a dweeb.

(01:12:04):
I can't take it.
No, I mean.
Poor guy.
This kid doesn't like sci-fi.
I can't work with this.
exactly.
Like that, you know, the personality, potential personality clash and then having to be,you know, with that for a long period of time, I think is also intimidating, as a, as a
potential, know, something that would worry me when I was thinking about, have beenthinking about doing this, but I think it's something that it's on my brain and I at least

(01:12:27):
need to go do some more, sessions of, of volunteering and doing like deliver offering todeliver some classes, but, something like that.
think.
Yeah.
Someday I want to do.
more of that regular, more regularly.
think it's good for the.
day like starting February.
You
I love it.
Yeah, I know.
I don't know.
Yeah, let me reach out to Laura, see if she's still around there.

(01:12:49):
Think about that.
Since you've already got like a, you already know someone that's sort of in.
I feel like that's nice.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And they do it.
They meet five minutes away from my house.
It's nice.
It's not even time to go far.
That's nice.
Yeah.
Mine would probably be a 40, 40 minute drive.
Yeah.
Part of good part of living near downtown where all the dis, dis privileged students are.

(01:13:12):
It's yeah, it's true.
Yeah.
Capital flight.
Look, this guy looks like I'm going to look like this guy 20 years.
You
and I'll take that.
looks good.
No, this is cool.
It's got, or like I'm on the Colorado chapter here and it says one in four, one in fourColorado students will go to a four year college.

(01:13:33):
97 % of top jobs in Colorado that pay a living wage require education after high school.
Man, that's doing, there's some words and they're doing a lot of heavy lifting becausethat's implying education after high school is not the same as a only college that they
say 97 % required some education after it.
Sure.
Okay.

(01:13:53):
That could be getting.
plumbers in my area are making more money than I am.
Yeah, exactly.
And that there's some education, like apprenticeship training that you have to go throughfor that that I would consider to be, but even, yeah, or like, yeah.
my opinion.
We need all types of people doing all types of jobs.
Yeah, there's some verbiage that it's doing a lot of heavy lifting to imply that.

(01:14:16):
I don't know.
When I hear stuff worded like that, it makes me feel like they're...
Single-minded.
Yeah.
I think their mission is still good, but I just, it's like,
Yes, I totally agree with that.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Anyway, yeah, that, would be something, an experience I have had in the past where I, Ienjoyed, you know, my time doing that.

(01:14:36):
And I would recommend, recommend it to others, that wanted to get into it themselves.
because it was rewarding and it's not for everybody, right?
If, if being around teens and pre-teens stresses you out, I get that.
and maybe that's not your idea of, of a good rewarding thing, but there are programs outthere, for they're looking for volunteers and.

(01:14:59):
know.
How do they get their students?
Is it opt-in?
yes, they worked with a cut, a number of different areas, schools, and, it was like anopt-in program.
Kids could sign up for it.
think they had to, they had to be invited, I think as well that you, it wasn't just, itwasn't students can apply.
They're supposed to be 10th graders to when they're first joining.

(01:15:20):
They can be nominated by a teacher, like a guidance counselor, I think, and they can applythemselves.
And I think there, there are, as I understood it, some base level of requirements.
Like if they have students apply, they want them to get a note from a teacher or guidancecounselor, but you know, basically supporting their entry.
Not just taking
every single person, although I'm sure I bet that I bet they don't do much filtering.

(01:15:43):
bet if the students are willing to apply, they're probably getting in to the program forthe most part as long, you know, but yeah, they, then they pair every, I think a mentor up
with one or two students for a period of several years, like 10th to 12th grade.
And then they have like a weekly lecture series that goes on.
And then after that, they do other activities one-on-one with the mentors.

(01:16:04):
So like I said, it's an interesting program and good things in the world out there if youwant to partake.
There's lots of them.
They're just hard to I shouldn't say that.
I've had a difficult time honing in on which one or two to try to hook horns with.
Yeah.
And it's also, yeah, the time commitment of something like that.

(01:16:25):
It also was like, Oh, I have to do this in every Saturday for 26 Saturdays a year.
It's like, Oh, what did I just sign up for?
You know, something like that, that can also be part of the reticence of wanting to go toodeep into it is that's can seem like a lot.
And if you're busy in life, maybe, I don't know.

(01:16:45):
It's hard, it's, I don't know.
I need to do something like that though.
I think it would, yeah, I do.
I do as well, think I would get Joy out of it.
I know I would.
It's just scary.
It's scary.
It's scary though, Dan, it's scary.
Yeah, but going back to like suffering and pushing boundaries and going further than youbelieve you can go.

(01:17:08):
This is one of those things.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Anyway, that's my ideas around that, since you said that.
Yeah, cool.
I have bookmarked it.
That might be in my future at some point.
I'm have to get through some years of kids stuff first though, because that is a, it's abig time gift.
And right now, like, that is the thing I do not have.

(01:17:33):
I was listening to my brother talk about how like, my dad used to explain something tohim.
And he was like, sometimes I have money.
Sometimes I have time.
I rarely have both.
So I have to be judicious with like how I give, what I give, when I give.
yeah, I'm in the season of like, I don't really have any money, but I definitely don'thave time right now, but one day.

(01:17:54):
One day.
Someday.
Exactly.
That's the dream.
That's the dream to have both.
It is the dream.
Yeah, but again, go like you reach the dream.
It's like you don't just wallow in it.
I think you atrophy at that point.
So like, it's important to be going and you know, I'm saying like, here's here's, youknow, on one of their pages, I was like, there's a guy that's what I'm gonna look like in

(01:18:14):
20 years.
And I say that tongue in cheek.
But I also say that seriously, in 20 years, I hope that it's time and money is no problem.
And I can go spend like, they're gonna be telling me to go home because I'm spending toomuch time at their little get together because like, you know,
kids are in college and whatever, whatever.
You know what mean?
Mm-hmm.
I do.
I think I do.

(01:18:35):
Well, here's to here's to a time when we have more time in the future until then I thinkwe've taken up enough time today and Thank you all for tuning in.
We hope there is something of value and inspiration for you
Yeah, and let us hear it if you have comments.
Absolutely.
See you all next time.
So.

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