October 31, 2024 • 28 mins
Kevin Kilpatrick and Bobbi Maxwell, hosts of the Making Wavs podcast, join me to discuss their backgrounds in radio and how they transitioned into voiceover.
Kevin primarily works in automotive and e-learning, while Bobbi focuses on commercial work, particularly in the automotive and political genres. They also talk about the advantages and disadvantages of coming from a radio background in voiceover.
The conversation covers topics such as the different tiers of automotive work, the evolution of their podcast from the Middle Class VO Podcast to Making Wavs, and the importance of repeat clients in the voiceover industry.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Well, apparently welcome to Ball Cap Day on the VOPro Podcast.
I'm your host, Paul Schmidt.
And joining me today is kind of a, it's, we did a home and home series with these folks.
Kevin Kilpatrick and Bobbi Maxwell, the hosts of the Making Wavs podcast.
I've been listening to them back since it was called the, what was it?
(00:23):
The blue collar?
There we go.
Middle -class.
That's what it was.
So I've been listening to you guys for a long time.
Kevin just celebrated 20 years in the VO business.
I'm sure it's been close to that long for Bobbi.
And so I wanted to dig in and get to know these guys a little bit today.
Please welcome Kevin Kilpatrick and Bobbi Maxwell, hosts of Making Wavs.
(00:46):
Welcome guys.
Thanks, Paul.
Thanks for having us.
This was not planned this I don't think I've ever interviewed a guest that had a ball capon I do it quite often But we all showed up on camera and went well, holy hell what
happened here Bobbi for you yours first, which tigers are you touting today?
(01:10):
the Bengal tigers, the one and only Bengal tigers from Cincinnati.
see now we're gonna have a problem, because I'm a lifelong Ravens fan, so...
you are.
I know you are.
I'm see you in a few weeks, buddy.
right.
And Kev, you're rocking the St.
Louis Cardinals.
Yes, sir.
I've been a St.
Louis Cardinals fan since I was knee high to a coyote.
(01:31):
grew up loving them.
my family loved them.
And so I, I just was brought up organically loving the Cardinals.
Nice.
Well, we, my, your, original incarnation of your Cardinals turned into the BaltimoreOrioles in 1954.
Yep.
That was the Browns.
That was the St.
Louis Browns came to Baltimore and became the Baltimore Orioles.
(01:53):
Yep.
I do.
And in fact, it would have been, would have been 2014.
They celebrated the, 60th anniversary of that move.
And the Orioles played the Cardinals at Camden yards and I was able to take my son andthey brought back every Oriole living hall of Famer.
(02:15):
So there were like 23 hall of Famers there and they did this huge, after the game, theydid this huge tribute to those guys and a laser light show on the warehouse wall and the
Orioles hit, seven home runs that game.
And, and we ended up winning like 11 to four, I think I actually felt bad for theCardinals fans sitting next to us.
Ha ha ha!
(02:36):
at some point, but enough baseball, enough inside baseball.
I wanted to, to, to talk to you guys today because as I explained to a lot of people, oneof the great things about this podcast is I get to learn about folks that either I've met
in person and don't know all that well because at conferences and events, you don't gettime to sit or folks like you who
(02:59):
I've known about online for a long time, but never really have gotten to speak to outsideof doing your podcast a few weeks ago.
So I want to first find out how VO started with each of you.
Bobbi, I'm going to break the ladies first rule here because Kevin's celebrating his 20year anniversary.
(03:22):
Kev, how did it start for you?
It Paul, it started from radio.
of I started in radio in 1987, senior in high school.
and so I started doing VO for radio, you know, back then, obviously, but my first, timemaking it, making money outside of radio was I started doing it on the side and it came
(03:43):
about with automotive spots.
It's probably about 99, 98, 99, somewhere in there.
I was working in Miami at WKIS Kiss Country.
Where I was Gator my air name was Gator by the way, and so I had some buddies That workedwith me and they were doing car spots on the side they had good gigs with agencies and
stuff like that and One guy came up to me one day and he's like hey Kev.
(04:07):
I've got a client that needs another voice.
I can't do it
You do great production, you do great spots.
Would you be interested in making a little extra money doing a car spot?
like, yeah.
And so that one spot turned into more.
I had a radio guy from the United Stations radio network that did, we carried a countdownshow of theirs.
(04:30):
He asked me if I could do some hosting of some of their national shows.
And I'm like, yeah.
yeah, sure.
and so automotive was what really made the transition for me because I did automotivespots on the side for four or five years, did a couple of things here and there.
And I started to seek that out and I started to learn from my fellow radio DJs that hadleft radio and did voiceover full time.
(04:56):
And I'm like, I could do that.
I can do that.
And so 2004, I kind of had it with corporate radio and I was tired of watching all my DJfriends get fired.
whatever do you mean?
Yeah.
Yeah, my gosh, exactly.
But I was watching these legendary radio DJs that had made great money, know, deep sixfigures, and then all of a sudden they get fired because they want to hire somebody else
(05:19):
that's making a third of what they're making.
And so I did not want to be that guy in my mid -50s getting fired from a radio gig andgoing, what the F do I do now?
So I...
made a conscious decision in 2004 that I'm changing my career path.
I'm going to do voiceover full time.
I'm going to hustle.
I'm going to grind.
(05:39):
And I'm going to make it happen.
So that's what happened in 2004.
That's amazing, man.
Congratulations.
Our stories are actually very close in parallel.
All the way up to the nausea with corporate radio, right?
Yeah, I concur wholeheartedly.
Bobbi, how did it start for you?
(06:00):
Well, I'm right there with you.
have the trifecta going here,
I'm starting to sense a little bit of chemistry here,
for sure.
a little bit.
I actually started radio at my high school.
We had a little tiny radio station and knew that, you know, this is fun.
(06:20):
It was an easy A in high school, but wanted to do that as a career rather than go tocollege like all my other friends were.
And I moved from Cincinnati where I was raised as a Catholic girl of
a family of 11 to Las Vegas.
Does that make sense?
(06:42):
I know back then it's like.
there.
First of all, family of 11.
My God, you can field a softball team and have two on the bench.
And then secondly, to take that upbringing and move to Vegas.
Holy mackerel.
Yeah, yeah.
So that's where I got really got my radio start.
Stayed out there for a few years, came back to Cincinnati and worked there for many, many,many years.
(07:08):
Now just jump into what you guys did.
Same thing, tired of corporate radio.
But I really kind of made the decision based for health reasons.
There was so much going on then with a not only my
my cluster and the whole company and then adding on a network after that.
(07:29):
There was just so much work for one person, but no increase in pay and so stressful.
And I had been doing voiceover just like you guys throughout my radio career.
And it was just, I had just gotten married.
My husband said, just go for it, go for it, we'll be fine.
And best decision I've made in a long, time to go full time.
(07:50):
That was in 2016.
Yeah.
All right.
So you and I are closer together on timing.
I started doing the side hustle when I was on the air in 98 and didn't go full time until2018.
So it's, yeah, it took me, it was a long, slow burn for me.
(08:12):
But I got, I got, first of all, I got tired of corporate radio and then I got tired ofcorporate in general.
and said, there's gotta be a better boss out there.
And I, and I found it.
so, God.
And honestly, Kevin, that is one of the reasons my program is called the VO Freedom MasterPlan, because it's exactly what it gave me in my life.
(08:36):
Right?
Yeah.
So.
you hear of, right now, this past two weeks, iHeart is doing their annual layoffs, itseems, and you just go, I am so glad they made that decision, you know?
Yeah.
And I feel badly for folks that I know that are still in the business because let's faceit, we're all of a certain age.
(08:58):
And when the Telecom Act of 96 came along, it changed the entire business.
And then of course, technology is piled on, but the radio business today is not evenremotely close to the ones you and I got into, you know, 30 years ago.
So let's talk about VO from a radio perspective.
Do you guys feel, and Bobbi you'll go first on this one, do you guys feel like having comefrom radio is an advantage or a disadvantage in voiceover and why?
(09:30):
Depends on the genre.
Commercial, probably a disadvantage with where the industry is right now with thecommercial or flat read.
mean, we have so much personality and it's hard to rein that in sometimes or be able tomake adjustments.
Promo, obviously an advantage.
(09:52):
I can't tell you how many promo coaches or people in the industry have said, you know,this will help you.
coming from radio so it's you know it's half and half really.
Kevin, any thoughts on that?
Yeah, I'm going to I love that Bobbi broke it down by genre.
I'm going to say overall as a whole, I would say an advantage.
(10:14):
And basically, let's talk, you know, fundamentals, you know, you learn how to work gear,you learn how to operate a microphone, you learn the importance.
of sound and sound quality and those things.
think that part is an advantage, Paul, getting into voiceover.
But I will echo what Bobbi said.
If you want to do those national commercial spots, unless they're calling for anannouncer, if they want...
(10:40):
they want the warm guy next door who has three children and takes his kids to soccerpractice and also had a burrito the night before, then sometimes those specs can be a
little bit challenging, right?
When you do come from radio.
But here we are, all three of us grinding, hustling to get better all this time.
(11:00):
So overall an advantage coming from radio, I think.
But when you get down to certain areas, I think there is a big disadvantage.
think you guys broke that down separately and beautifully and I agree with both of you.
I'm gonna take Bobbi's cue on genres.
What genres are each of you working in today and how has that evolved over the course ofyour career?
(11:22):
Bobbi, yeah, Bobbi, ahead.
Definitely commercial is my biggest genre, specifically automotive, which Kevin is mybiggest client.
Thank you again, buddy.
So commercial, probably 75 % of it.
I do a lot of political, which is going crazy right now.
(11:43):
And I do a fair amount of explainer work.
So yeah, I'd break it down like that.
Correct me if I'm wrong, a couple of weeks ago in Dallas I think I saw your name up on thescreen, didn't I, Bobbi?
Yes, you did.
That was for an automotive category.
And I actually got the job from Kevin.
(12:08):
I know.
so we share ball caps and referrals and all kinds of stuff around here.
That's very cool.
Congratulations on your one voice nomination.
yeah, that's very cool.
Kev, where are you working these days?
The majority of what I do is automotive and you know, that's what started my VO journey.
My voiceover journey started with a path of automotive spots.
(12:31):
And it's so, I love it when people say my voiceover journey because it really is ajourney.
And I say that a little in jest, but you know, it's funny to hear that.
So my voiceover journey started with automotive and that is what has sustained me mycareer all this time.
Probably...
you know, 40, 50 % of my work is automotive.
(12:53):
But Paul, you know, I manage a roster of a dozen or so talent.
I manage all of the audio.
I actually manage the sound design of the VO of a major automotive agency.
And I'm talking, we crank out 200 spots a month for sound design.
And then I am individually myself producing probably a couple of dozen radio spots everymonth.
(13:18):
And then beyond that, I am voicing 50 markets right now, and that's probably 60 to 70spots per month in automotive.
After that, it's e -learning.
And I also manage a roster of talent for an e -learning account.
And then after that, maybe telephony.
(13:41):
I have some great OG accounts.
I'm the voice of Enterprise Rent -A -Car, if you call, the voice of the majority of PizzaHut's, you call, Kia and Canada, Lowe's.
I'm just very fortunate in that regard.
And then I do, I've got a handful of radio imaging clients too.
(14:02):
And then I get the, you know, the occasional national commercial.
So that's kind of how it all breaks down.
Automotive, e -learning, radio, telephony, and then
Business management.
You know, I don't know if that's a genre.
Wow.
As far as automotive goes, man, you guys are hip deep in it.
So let me ask you this, and for the sake of maybe our newer audience members, newer voiceactors, break down the three different kinds of automotive that there are.
(14:32):
And when you say automotive, what are you guys referring to?
Bobbi, I'll let you go first.
The three different categories, Tier 1, Tier 2, Tier 3, is that what you're talking about?
Yeah, obviously we do both do a lot of Tier 3, which are your local markets, the regionalor Tier 2, and then of course the national automotive spots as Tier 1, which is difficult
(14:54):
because a lot of the stipulations when you're hired for a national automotive spot is youcan't...
you you have to sign a non -compete.
You can't do anything else.
So I don't really even audition for those, knowing I would never give up all my otherautomotive clients just for one national.
I mean, that's my bread and butter.
(15:15):
But yeah, that's pretty much what it is.
And it could be anything from the announcer read, mostly in the tier three, up to thatvery conversational read in tier one.
And we've done them all.
And so are you doing so tier two for those of you that might not be super familiar withautomotive tier two is generally the dealer associations.
(15:42):
You know, your capital area Volvo dealers, your tri -state area Toyota dealers, thingslike that.
Are you guys doing two tier two work at all?
I had the like the Northeast Honda dealerships for about a year.
I no longer have those, but no.
I'm not doing any right now, but I've done a handful of them over the years.
(16:05):
The Delmarva GMC dealers, I don't know if you know those, Paul, but Delaware, Maryland,Virginia.
I did those for about three or four years.
And I've done some, I don't know, Oklahoma Honda, Southwest, Nissan, a handful of those.
But the majority of what I do is tier three from New York to Houston.
(16:29):
to Miami, everywhere in between.
Nice.
You mentioned briefly telephony, Kevin.
And I want to get your perspective on this because telephony, I've heard kind of throughthe grapevine and I've also assumed that telephony was going to be sort of, God, I hate
(16:50):
this phrase, but I'm going to use it anyway.
Some of the low hanging fruit for AI, right?
And I even had a conversation recently with Tom Deere about that.
Are you personally,
Seeing a lot of that work erode.
And if you know, do you know is it, if it's going specifically to clients who are nowchoosing to use AI for telephone menu work, free IVR work.
(17:16):
me personally.
I have I have not seen it erode thankfully I I picked up this telephony account in Miamiwhen I was on air down there one of the editors listened to me on the air and he reached
out to me and he this is like This is like five or six years before that.
It's one of the little things that I'm like, okay All these little things keep coming in.
(17:37):
I might be able to leave radio.
It was one of those
it's like 98, 99 he reached out, but I have been with them ever since.
And we worked out a retainer agreement.
I don't know, 20 years ago because they wanted that immediate access.
Yeah, it right around the time I went full -time BO.
They wanted that immediate access.
Kev, we sometimes have urgent stuff.
(17:59):
I'm like, well, let's work out an agreement then where, you know, I'm kind of on call foryou.
And I turn stuff quickly.
So I haven't seen it myself personally, but I'm very lucky to be able to work with a lotof big clients.
Now, the thing is though, Paul, I wouldn't know.
if some stuff was going the way of AI, I do know this group really well.
(18:23):
And I think they would tell me, I think they would be like, Hey, we're starting to funnelsome of our stuff in the AI space, but
So far so good.
And the way things change, the way pronunciations are, you know, if you're callingenterprise, run a car and you're trying to call enterprise, a car in Baltimore and you
have a wonky street name that needs pronunciation, you know, that's a lot of what I do islike for directions to our location in Baltimore, please press one.
(18:52):
And, know, then Kev comes back on.
Just off of I -95, take the exit, you know, whatever it might be.
If you've got some wonky names, AI is not going to be able to manage that without youhaving to go back again and again.
Nope, it's said like this, it's said like this.
Where old Kev, if you say it one time, Kev can say it the proper way.
I haven't seen it yet, but I do agree with you that I think that will be among the morelow -hanging fruit that will go by the way of AI.
(19:21):
Once those with smaller budgets.
kind of decide to go that route.
I hear you.
Bobbi, said something interesting earlier.
You said that for commercial, coming from radio can be a disadvantage.
You came from radio and yet you're working in a lot of commercial work.
So begs the question, what did you do to overcome those challenges?
(19:46):
I would say most of that work is local markets, non -agent work.
And it's, yeah, I don't book a lot through my agents.
You know, if there's one regret in radio or in my career, I wish I would have had a bit ofa theater background because it's so helpful these days.
(20:11):
And I really, really want to
nail that conversational read.
And I can to an extent, but when you've got some of those people out there who are like,you know, we're on the stage forever, it's nothing to them.
So I think a lot of the work I am getting are commercials that don't requireconversational read and they're repeat clients.
(20:32):
And that's huge in this business is to have those repeat clients.
So I don't need to have to audition as much, which are the conversational jobs.
Yeah, I hear that.
think that and I did a lot of stage when I was younger.
And while I think that helped stage and radio are both big, right?
(20:54):
You've got to be able to project to hit the back row.
You've got to keep the energy up, right?
I think that and in limited on camera training that I've had, think on camera, film work,TV work is much more akin to voiceover because it's more right sized, right?
That camera, that microphone is sometimes a foot away, right?
(21:16):
And so you've got to learn to bring it down and be small.
And, and that's really where you develop the nuance.
And that's been my challenge too, Bobbi, is learning to not be so broad and big and to beable to be very subtle.
it, as my, my dear friend and coach, Tina Morasko says, you trained yourself in radio for15 years.
(21:39):
That's not a switch you just flip off overnight.
You're going to have to retrain your brain to think small, to rely on nuance.
I should probably change that to not theater.
I don't know anything about theater, but that's interesting that you said that.
Acting, thank you.
I was just gonna say changing into an acting background.
(22:00):
absolutely.
You guys, how did you two come into contact with each other?
Was it through radio?
I've always thought, man, these guys have such great chemistry, I wonder if they'remarried to each other.
You are not, right?
He is my work husband.
husband and wife though.
There we go.
How'd you guys come across each other?
(22:20):
Bobbi, do you want to tell it?
No, go ahead, you always tell the story so well.
I was at a Tim...
Yeah.
I was at a Tim McGraw and Faith Hill concert.
I was a security guard for Faith Hill at the time and I saw this gal with blonde hair anda bingles ball cap on and I said, you look like you have a good voice.
(22:43):
Do you want to do a podcast together?
No, no.
You're so full of it.
know, but see that's improv.
I love ad lib, I love improv.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's funny, people sometimes even to this day will go, what do do for a living?
I'm a foot model.
I'm big with flip flops and crew socks.
(23:03):
Anyway.
tell people I install the plumbing in those rotating restaurants.
Ha ha!
That's it.
That's it right there.
But no, I actually so, you know, I managed a roster I managed the production for a bigautomotive agency and we were looking for a new female voice to add to the roster and I
(23:24):
did I handled the casting and I think it was voice one two three and Yeah, I didn't thiswas 2016 I think right 2016 2017 somewhere in there
somewhere around
and did the casting, narrowed it down to I think a top 10 PS Paul, another mutual friendLinda Bruno was also met the exact same way.
(23:50):
But long story short, Bobbi was the selected recipient of being added to this automotiveagency roster.
I started sending her spots and she was a pro.
We chatted, we hit it off great.
And we just ended up talking about
you know, voiceover and radio and our careers and stuff.
And she was, her daughters lived in Nashville when we first met and she was still inCincinnati, but she goes, Kev, hey, I'm coming to Nashville to see my daughters.
(24:19):
would you like to grab lunch?
I'm like, sure, let's do it.
And where do you want to go?
And I'm like, there's, I had an outside studio at the time.
I'm like, there's a great sushi place real close by.
And so we met for sushi and we laughed and we hit it off as good friends and the rest ishistory.
Very cool.
And anytime you can bond over sushi, that's always a good time.
(24:41):
now you're making me hungry.
Yeah, the podcast came together just because we both came from radio and we said we shouldhave been on the air together, you know, just because of that rapport that we had.
And then we said, well, we can.
It's just in the form of a podcast.
So the podcast started when?
think 18.
18.
So that's right about the time I started listening.
(25:02):
I didn't realize I got in on the ground floor of that.
Okay.
exactly how it came about.
As Bobbi mentioned, we, just, we ended up talking a lot about voiceover and exchangingideas, sharing stories.
And one of us, both of us, I don't know how, who said the words, but we were like, we needto be recording our conversations and publish this because there's some good insight.
(25:25):
There's good fun.
have great chemistry and banter back and forth.
We have fun.
Educate, inform.
bring our passion in all these things.
So that was the impetus of our podcast.
So it started out as the middle class VO podcast and then evolved into making waves.
Why the, why the rebranding Bobbi?
(25:48):
Actually, I was getting some coaching with Maurice Tobias, who's an incredible coach.
We asked her to be on the podcast.
She said to me, she goes, I don't understand.
Why are you the middle class VO podcast?
That means nothing.
(26:09):
I I can't understand what...
That means, so that tells me what is your podcast even worth it, blah, blah, blah.
And I talked to Kevin and I said, maybe she's right.
And we just put our heads together, brainstormed and making waves, WAVS worked.
(26:29):
Well, that's what we all do for a living.
W A V S is right.
So, very cool.
we're going to edit this out in post, but occasionally I just, I sometimes at this time ofday, my brain just checks out and I apologize.
I had another question.
This is why we call it in my family.
We call it Paul's Heimers.
(26:50):
That's good.
to that and then you can make your cut there and then maybe your thoughts come together?
Okay.
And Paul, I would like to add to that.
It came out of some frustration for me too in getting liners from people.
So we run liners on our podcast and I was going around at Vio Atlanta one time and I'm canyou, you know, and I'm not going to name any specific names, but let's just say the
(27:14):
majority of folks could not.
get what I was saying.
Can you give me a liner say, Hey, this is so and so Hey, I'm Paul Schmidt and you'relistening to the middle class VO podcast with Kevin and Bobbi, just something simple like
that.
Everybody always messed it up.
They always forgot VO.
They always called it the middle VO podcast.
They called it the middle class podcast.
They called it the middle podcast VO.
(27:34):
And they just, got so frustrated and I'm like, Bobbi, we need something easier, moresimple or something.
And I'm like, plus we're kind of outgrowing that brand.
I always say that Bobbi's making too much money now.
We're beyond the middle class now.
And then when the Bobbi story, Maurice came in, I'm like, that's it.
We're done.
We're changing it.
(27:55):
We're doing it.
So that's, that's, you know, that's my side of that story too.
Yeah.
Yeah, for sure.
when, I mean, there are so many voiceover podcasts now, speaking of which, just watchedand listened to yours of the top 14 lists that you did, Pod.
I'm gonna call you Pod.
Hey, Pod, Pod Schmidt.
(28:17):
podcast, Paul Schmidt, Paul cast, pod Schmidt.
Maybe I'll go by pod Schmidt from here on.
There you go.
But yeah, I didn't realize how many really, really good voiceover podcasts there are untilI watched that.
So thanks for doing it.
Bobbi, they were like, had to keep the VO to a certain length, you know, and I thought, myGod, I could do 25 of these if I really, and then you got to make a cut and then you feel
(28:40):
awful about the people you left out.
So I'm not sure I'm going to be doing a whole lot of those type of lists in the future.
we're humbled and honored, by the way.
Thank you for that.
We make the list.
said, yours was one of the first, guess because of the timing that I latched onto, right?
It was you guys, it was the VO School with Jamie Muffet.
(29:02):
Terry Daniel, I think had a podcast and still does.
And those were like, those were the initial ones where I started to learn really about thebusiness.
I had a side hustle for a long time and I knew a lot about the craft.
not so much about the business and I, you know, I had to get up to speed pretty quickly.
(29:23):
I knew how to market, but I didn't know the business of voiceover and you guys were a bighelp in helping me learn that.
So that's one of the reasons I wanted to have you guys on today.
It's been an absolute...
That's the first time I've ever seen anybody dab their eyes with a protein bar.
(29:46):
That's amazing.
you
Kevin Kilpatrick, Bobbi Maxwell, the podcast is called Making Wavs, W -A -V -S, you canfind it on, I know Apple and Spotify and wherever you get your podcasts.
I highly recommend it.
Guys, thanks so much for hanging out today.
It's been fun.
Thank you.
quick and painless, man.
(30:07):
Thank you.
All right.
Wow, that came out to like within a few seconds of 30.
Well, apparently welcome to Ball Cap Day on the VOPro Podcast.
I'm your host, Paul Schmidt.
And joining me today is kind of a, it's, we did a home and home series with these folks.
Kevin Kilpatrick and Bobbi Maxwell, the hosts of the Making Wavs podcast.
I've been listening to them back since it was called the, what was it?
(00:23):
The blue collar?
There we go.
Middle -class.
That's what it was.
So I've been listening to you guys for a long time.
Kevin just celebrated 20 years in the VO business.
I'm sure it's been close to that long for Bobbi.
And so I wanted to dig in and get to know these guys a little bit today.
Please welcome Kevin Kilpatrick and Bobbi Maxwell, hosts of Making Wavs.
(00:46):
Welcome guys.
Thanks, Paul.
Thanks for having us.
This was not planned this I don't think I've ever interviewed a guest that had a ball capon I do it quite often But we all showed up on camera and went well, holy hell what
happened here Bobbi for you yours first, which tigers are you touting today?
(01:10):
the Bengal tigers, the one and only Bengal tigers from Cincinnati.
see now we're gonna have a problem, because I'm a lifelong Ravens fan, so...
you are.
I know you are.
I'm see you in a few weeks, buddy.
right.
And Kev, you're rocking the St.
Louis Cardinals.
Yes, sir.
I've been a St.
Louis Cardinals fan since I was knee high to a coyote.
(01:31):
grew up loving them.
my family loved them.
And so I, I just was brought up organically loving the Cardinals.
Nice.
Well, we, my, your, original incarnation of your Cardinals turned into the BaltimoreOrioles in 1954.
Yep.
That was the Browns.
That was the St.
Louis Browns came to Baltimore and became the Baltimore Orioles.
(01:53):
Yep.
I do.
And in fact, it would have been, would have been 2014.
They celebrated the, 60th anniversary of that move.
And the Orioles played the Cardinals at Camden yards and I was able to take my son andthey brought back every Oriole living hall of Famer.
(02:15):
So there were like 23 hall of Famers there and they did this huge, after the game, theydid this huge tribute to those guys and a laser light show on the warehouse wall and the
Orioles hit, seven home runs that game.
And, and we ended up winning like 11 to four, I think I actually felt bad for theCardinals fans sitting next to us.
Ha ha ha!
(02:36):
at some point, but enough baseball, enough inside baseball.
I wanted to, to, to talk to you guys today because as I explained to a lot of people, oneof the great things about this podcast is I get to learn about folks that either I've met
in person and don't know all that well because at conferences and events, you don't gettime to sit or folks like you who
(02:59):
I've known about online for a long time, but never really have gotten to speak to outsideof doing your podcast a few weeks ago.
So I want to first find out how VO started with each of you.
Bobbi, I'm going to break the ladies first rule here because Kevin's celebrating his 20year anniversary.
(03:22):
Kev, how did it start for you?
It Paul, it started from radio.
of I started in radio in 1987, senior in high school.
and so I started doing VO for radio, you know, back then, obviously, but my first, timemaking it, making money outside of radio was I started doing it on the side and it came
(03:43):
about with automotive spots.
It's probably about 99, 98, 99, somewhere in there.
I was working in Miami at WKIS Kiss Country.
Where I was Gator my air name was Gator by the way, and so I had some buddies That workedwith me and they were doing car spots on the side they had good gigs with agencies and
stuff like that and One guy came up to me one day and he's like hey Kev.
(04:07):
I've got a client that needs another voice.
I can't do it
You do great production, you do great spots.
Would you be interested in making a little extra money doing a car spot?
like, yeah.
And so that one spot turned into more.
I had a radio guy from the United Stations radio network that did, we carried a countdownshow of theirs.
(04:30):
He asked me if I could do some hosting of some of their national shows.
And I'm like, yeah.
yeah, sure.
and so automotive was what really made the transition for me because I did automotivespots on the side for four or five years, did a couple of things here and there.
And I started to seek that out and I started to learn from my fellow radio DJs that hadleft radio and did voiceover full time.
(04:56):
And I'm like, I could do that.
I can do that.
And so 2004, I kind of had it with corporate radio and I was tired of watching all my DJfriends get fired.
whatever do you mean?
Yeah.
Yeah, my gosh, exactly.
But I was watching these legendary radio DJs that had made great money, know, deep sixfigures, and then all of a sudden they get fired because they want to hire somebody else
(05:19):
that's making a third of what they're making.
And so I did not want to be that guy in my mid -50s getting fired from a radio gig andgoing, what the F do I do now?
So I...
made a conscious decision in 2004 that I'm changing my career path.
I'm going to do voiceover full time.
I'm going to hustle.
I'm going to grind.
(05:39):
And I'm going to make it happen.
So that's what happened in 2004.
That's amazing, man.
Congratulations.
Our stories are actually very close in parallel.
All the way up to the nausea with corporate radio, right?
Yeah, I concur wholeheartedly.
Bobbi, how did it start for you?
(06:00):
Well, I'm right there with you.
have the trifecta going here,
I'm starting to sense a little bit of chemistry here,
for sure.
a little bit.
I actually started radio at my high school.
We had a little tiny radio station and knew that, you know, this is fun.
(06:20):
It was an easy A in high school, but wanted to do that as a career rather than go tocollege like all my other friends were.
And I moved from Cincinnati where I was raised as a Catholic girl of
a family of 11 to Las Vegas.
Does that make sense?
(06:42):
I know back then it's like.
there.
First of all, family of 11.
My God, you can field a softball team and have two on the bench.
And then secondly, to take that upbringing and move to Vegas.
Holy mackerel.
Yeah, yeah.
So that's where I got really got my radio start.
Stayed out there for a few years, came back to Cincinnati and worked there for many, many,many years.
(07:08):
Now just jump into what you guys did.
Same thing, tired of corporate radio.
But I really kind of made the decision based for health reasons.
There was so much going on then with a not only my
my cluster and the whole company and then adding on a network after that.
(07:29):
There was just so much work for one person, but no increase in pay and so stressful.
And I had been doing voiceover just like you guys throughout my radio career.
And it was just, I had just gotten married.
My husband said, just go for it, go for it, we'll be fine.
And best decision I've made in a long, time to go full time.
(07:50):
That was in 2016.
Yeah.
All right.
So you and I are closer together on timing.
I started doing the side hustle when I was on the air in 98 and didn't go full time until2018.
So it's, yeah, it took me, it was a long, slow burn for me.
(08:12):
But I got, I got, first of all, I got tired of corporate radio and then I got tired ofcorporate in general.
and said, there's gotta be a better boss out there.
And I, and I found it.
so, God.
And honestly, Kevin, that is one of the reasons my program is called the VO Freedom MasterPlan, because it's exactly what it gave me in my life.
(08:36):
Right?
Yeah.
So.
you hear of, right now, this past two weeks, iHeart is doing their annual layoffs, itseems, and you just go, I am so glad they made that decision, you know?
Yeah.
And I feel badly for folks that I know that are still in the business because let's faceit, we're all of a certain age.
(08:58):
And when the Telecom Act of 96 came along, it changed the entire business.
And then of course, technology is piled on, but the radio business today is not evenremotely close to the ones you and I got into, you know, 30 years ago.
So let's talk about VO from a radio perspective.
Do you guys feel, and Bobbi you'll go first on this one, do you guys feel like having comefrom radio is an advantage or a disadvantage in voiceover and why?
(09:30):
Depends on the genre.
Commercial, probably a disadvantage with where the industry is right now with thecommercial or flat read.
mean, we have so much personality and it's hard to rein that in sometimes or be able tomake adjustments.
Promo, obviously an advantage.
(09:52):
I can't tell you how many promo coaches or people in the industry have said, you know,this will help you.
coming from radio so it's you know it's half and half really.
Kevin, any thoughts on that?
Yeah, I'm going to I love that Bobbi broke it down by genre.
I'm going to say overall as a whole, I would say an advantage.
(10:14):
And basically, let's talk, you know, fundamentals, you know, you learn how to work gear,you learn how to operate a microphone, you learn the importance.
of sound and sound quality and those things.
think that part is an advantage, Paul, getting into voiceover.
But I will echo what Bobbi said.
If you want to do those national commercial spots, unless they're calling for anannouncer, if they want...
(10:40):
they want the warm guy next door who has three children and takes his kids to soccerpractice and also had a burrito the night before, then sometimes those specs can be a
little bit challenging, right?
When you do come from radio.
But here we are, all three of us grinding, hustling to get better all this time.
(11:00):
So overall an advantage coming from radio, I think.
But when you get down to certain areas, I think there is a big disadvantage.
think you guys broke that down separately and beautifully and I agree with both of you.
I'm gonna take Bobbi's cue on genres.
What genres are each of you working in today and how has that evolved over the course ofyour career?
(11:22):
Bobbi, yeah, Bobbi, ahead.
Definitely commercial is my biggest genre, specifically automotive, which Kevin is mybiggest client.
Thank you again, buddy.
So commercial, probably 75 % of it.
I do a lot of political, which is going crazy right now.
(11:43):
And I do a fair amount of explainer work.
So yeah, I'd break it down like that.
Correct me if I'm wrong, a couple of weeks ago in Dallas I think I saw your name up on thescreen, didn't I, Bobbi?
Yes, you did.
That was for an automotive category.
And I actually got the job from Kevin.
(12:08):
I know.
so we share ball caps and referrals and all kinds of stuff around here.
That's very cool.
Congratulations on your one voice nomination.
yeah, that's very cool.
Kev, where are you working these days?
The majority of what I do is automotive and you know, that's what started my VO journey.
My voiceover journey started with a path of automotive spots.
(12:31):
And it's so, I love it when people say my voiceover journey because it really is ajourney.
And I say that a little in jest, but you know, it's funny to hear that.
So my voiceover journey started with automotive and that is what has sustained me mycareer all this time.
Probably...
you know, 40, 50 % of my work is automotive.
(12:53):
But Paul, you know, I manage a roster of a dozen or so talent.
I manage all of the audio.
I actually manage the sound design of the VO of a major automotive agency.
And I'm talking, we crank out 200 spots a month for sound design.
And then I am individually myself producing probably a couple of dozen radio spots everymonth.
(13:18):
And then beyond that, I am voicing 50 markets right now, and that's probably 60 to 70spots per month in automotive.
After that, it's e -learning.
And I also manage a roster of talent for an e -learning account.
And then after that, maybe telephony.
(13:41):
I have some great OG accounts.
I'm the voice of Enterprise Rent -A -Car, if you call, the voice of the majority of PizzaHut's, you call, Kia and Canada, Lowe's.
I'm just very fortunate in that regard.
And then I do, I've got a handful of radio imaging clients too.
(14:02):
And then I get the, you know, the occasional national commercial.
So that's kind of how it all breaks down.
Automotive, e -learning, radio, telephony, and then
Business management.
You know, I don't know if that's a genre.
Wow.
As far as automotive goes, man, you guys are hip deep in it.
So let me ask you this, and for the sake of maybe our newer audience members, newer voiceactors, break down the three different kinds of automotive that there are.
(14:32):
And when you say automotive, what are you guys referring to?
Bobbi, I'll let you go first.
The three different categories, Tier 1, Tier 2, Tier 3, is that what you're talking about?
Yeah, obviously we do both do a lot of Tier 3, which are your local markets, the regionalor Tier 2, and then of course the national automotive spots as Tier 1, which is difficult
(14:54):
because a lot of the stipulations when you're hired for a national automotive spot is youcan't...
you you have to sign a non -compete.
You can't do anything else.
So I don't really even audition for those, knowing I would never give up all my otherautomotive clients just for one national.
I mean, that's my bread and butter.
(15:15):
But yeah, that's pretty much what it is.
And it could be anything from the announcer read, mostly in the tier three, up to thatvery conversational read in tier one.
And we've done them all.
And so are you doing so tier two for those of you that might not be super familiar withautomotive tier two is generally the dealer associations.
(15:42):
You know, your capital area Volvo dealers, your tri -state area Toyota dealers, thingslike that.
Are you guys doing two tier two work at all?
I had the like the Northeast Honda dealerships for about a year.
I no longer have those, but no.
I'm not doing any right now, but I've done a handful of them over the years.
(16:05):
The Delmarva GMC dealers, I don't know if you know those, Paul, but Delaware, Maryland,Virginia.
I did those for about three or four years.
And I've done some, I don't know, Oklahoma Honda, Southwest, Nissan, a handful of those.
But the majority of what I do is tier three from New York to Houston.
(16:29):
to Miami, everywhere in between.
Nice.
You mentioned briefly telephony, Kevin.
And I want to get your perspective on this because telephony, I've heard kind of throughthe grapevine and I've also assumed that telephony was going to be sort of, God, I hate
(16:50):
this phrase, but I'm going to use it anyway.
Some of the low hanging fruit for AI, right?
And I even had a conversation recently with Tom Deere about that.
Are you personally,
Seeing a lot of that work erode.
And if you know, do you know is it, if it's going specifically to clients who are nowchoosing to use AI for telephone menu work, free IVR work.
(17:16):
me personally.
I have I have not seen it erode thankfully I I picked up this telephony account in Miamiwhen I was on air down there one of the editors listened to me on the air and he reached
out to me and he this is like This is like five or six years before that.
It's one of the little things that I'm like, okay All these little things keep coming in.
(17:37):
I might be able to leave radio.
It was one of those
it's like 98, 99 he reached out, but I have been with them ever since.
And we worked out a retainer agreement.
I don't know, 20 years ago because they wanted that immediate access.
Yeah, it right around the time I went full -time BO.
They wanted that immediate access.
Kev, we sometimes have urgent stuff.
(17:59):
I'm like, well, let's work out an agreement then where, you know, I'm kind of on call foryou.
And I turn stuff quickly.
So I haven't seen it myself personally, but I'm very lucky to be able to work with a lotof big clients.
Now, the thing is though, Paul, I wouldn't know.
if some stuff was going the way of AI, I do know this group really well.
(18:23):
And I think they would tell me, I think they would be like, Hey, we're starting to funnelsome of our stuff in the AI space, but
So far so good.
And the way things change, the way pronunciations are, you know, if you're callingenterprise, run a car and you're trying to call enterprise, a car in Baltimore and you
have a wonky street name that needs pronunciation, you know, that's a lot of what I do islike for directions to our location in Baltimore, please press one.
(18:52):
And, know, then Kev comes back on.
Just off of I -95, take the exit, you know, whatever it might be.
If you've got some wonky names, AI is not going to be able to manage that without youhaving to go back again and again.
Nope, it's said like this, it's said like this.
Where old Kev, if you say it one time, Kev can say it the proper way.
I haven't seen it yet, but I do agree with you that I think that will be among the morelow -hanging fruit that will go by the way of AI.
(19:21):
Once those with smaller budgets.
kind of decide to go that route.
I hear you.
Bobbi, said something interesting earlier.
You said that for commercial, coming from radio can be a disadvantage.
You came from radio and yet you're working in a lot of commercial work.
So begs the question, what did you do to overcome those challenges?
(19:46):
I would say most of that work is local markets, non -agent work.
And it's, yeah, I don't book a lot through my agents.
You know, if there's one regret in radio or in my career, I wish I would have had a bit ofa theater background because it's so helpful these days.
(20:11):
And I really, really want to
nail that conversational read.
And I can to an extent, but when you've got some of those people out there who are like,you know, we're on the stage forever, it's nothing to them.
So I think a lot of the work I am getting are commercials that don't requireconversational read and they're repeat clients.
(20:32):
And that's huge in this business is to have those repeat clients.
So I don't need to have to audition as much, which are the conversational jobs.
Yeah, I hear that.
think that and I did a lot of stage when I was younger.
And while I think that helped stage and radio are both big, right?
(20:54):
You've got to be able to project to hit the back row.
You've got to keep the energy up, right?
I think that and in limited on camera training that I've had, think on camera, film work,TV work is much more akin to voiceover because it's more right sized, right?
That camera, that microphone is sometimes a foot away, right?
(21:16):
And so you've got to learn to bring it down and be small.
And, and that's really where you develop the nuance.
And that's been my challenge too, Bobbi, is learning to not be so broad and big and to beable to be very subtle.
it, as my, my dear friend and coach, Tina Morasko says, you trained yourself in radio for15 years.
(21:39):
That's not a switch you just flip off overnight.
You're going to have to retrain your brain to think small, to rely on nuance.
I should probably change that to not theater.
I don't know anything about theater, but that's interesting that you said that.
Acting, thank you.
I was just gonna say changing into an acting background.
(22:00):
absolutely.
You guys, how did you two come into contact with each other?
Was it through radio?
I've always thought, man, these guys have such great chemistry, I wonder if they'remarried to each other.
You are not, right?
He is my work husband.
husband and wife though.
There we go.
How'd you guys come across each other?
(22:20):
Bobbi, do you want to tell it?
No, go ahead, you always tell the story so well.
I was at a Tim...
Yeah.
I was at a Tim McGraw and Faith Hill concert.
I was a security guard for Faith Hill at the time and I saw this gal with blonde hair anda bingles ball cap on and I said, you look like you have a good voice.
(22:43):
Do you want to do a podcast together?
No, no.
You're so full of it.
know, but see that's improv.
I love ad lib, I love improv.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's funny, people sometimes even to this day will go, what do do for a living?
I'm a foot model.
I'm big with flip flops and crew socks.
(23:03):
Anyway.
tell people I install the plumbing in those rotating restaurants.
Ha ha!
That's it.
That's it right there.
But no, I actually so, you know, I managed a roster I managed the production for a bigautomotive agency and we were looking for a new female voice to add to the roster and I
(23:24):
did I handled the casting and I think it was voice one two three and Yeah, I didn't thiswas 2016 I think right 2016 2017 somewhere in there
somewhere around
and did the casting, narrowed it down to I think a top 10 PS Paul, another mutual friendLinda Bruno was also met the exact same way.
(23:50):
But long story short, Bobbi was the selected recipient of being added to this automotiveagency roster.
I started sending her spots and she was a pro.
We chatted, we hit it off great.
And we just ended up talking about
you know, voiceover and radio and our careers and stuff.
And she was, her daughters lived in Nashville when we first met and she was still inCincinnati, but she goes, Kev, hey, I'm coming to Nashville to see my daughters.
(24:19):
would you like to grab lunch?
I'm like, sure, let's do it.
And where do you want to go?
And I'm like, there's, I had an outside studio at the time.
I'm like, there's a great sushi place real close by.
And so we met for sushi and we laughed and we hit it off as good friends and the rest ishistory.
Very cool.
And anytime you can bond over sushi, that's always a good time.
(24:41):
now you're making me hungry.
Yeah, the podcast came together just because we both came from radio and we said we shouldhave been on the air together, you know, just because of that rapport that we had.
And then we said, well, we can.
It's just in the form of a podcast.
So the podcast started when?
think 18.
18.
So that's right about the time I started listening.
(25:02):
I didn't realize I got in on the ground floor of that.
Okay.
exactly how it came about.
As Bobbi mentioned, we, just, we ended up talking a lot about voiceover and exchangingideas, sharing stories.
And one of us, both of us, I don't know how, who said the words, but we were like, we needto be recording our conversations and publish this because there's some good insight.
(25:25):
There's good fun.
have great chemistry and banter back and forth.
We have fun.
Educate, inform.
bring our passion in all these things.
So that was the impetus of our podcast.
So it started out as the middle class VO podcast and then evolved into making waves.
Why the, why the rebranding Bobbi?
(25:48):
Actually, I was getting some coaching with Maurice Tobias, who's an incredible coach.
We asked her to be on the podcast.
She said to me, she goes, I don't understand.
Why are you the middle class VO podcast?
That means nothing.
(26:09):
I I can't understand what...
That means, so that tells me what is your podcast even worth it, blah, blah, blah.
And I talked to Kevin and I said, maybe she's right.
And we just put our heads together, brainstormed and making waves, WAVS worked.
(26:29):
Well, that's what we all do for a living.
W A V S is right.
So, very cool.
we're going to edit this out in post, but occasionally I just, I sometimes at this time ofday, my brain just checks out and I apologize.
I had another question.
This is why we call it in my family.
We call it Paul's Heimers.
(26:50):
That's good.
to that and then you can make your cut there and then maybe your thoughts come together?
Okay.
And Paul, I would like to add to that.
It came out of some frustration for me too in getting liners from people.
So we run liners on our podcast and I was going around at Vio Atlanta one time and I'm canyou, you know, and I'm not going to name any specific names, but let's just say the
(27:14):
majority of folks could not.
get what I was saying.
Can you give me a liner say, Hey, this is so and so Hey, I'm Paul Schmidt and you'relistening to the middle class VO podcast with Kevin and Bobbi, just something simple like
that.
Everybody always messed it up.
They always forgot VO.
They always called it the middle VO podcast.
They called it the middle class podcast.
They called it the middle podcast VO.
(27:34):
And they just, got so frustrated and I'm like, Bobbi, we need something easier, moresimple or something.
And I'm like, plus we're kind of outgrowing that brand.
I always say that Bobbi's making too much money now.
We're beyond the middle class now.
And then when the Bobbi story, Maurice came in, I'm like, that's it.
We're done.
We're changing it.
(27:55):
We're doing it.
So that's, that's, you know, that's my side of that story too.
Yeah.
Yeah, for sure.
when, I mean, there are so many voiceover podcasts now, speaking of which, just watchedand listened to yours of the top 14 lists that you did, Pod.
I'm gonna call you Pod.
Hey, Pod, Pod Schmidt.
(28:17):
podcast, Paul Schmidt, Paul cast, pod Schmidt.
Maybe I'll go by pod Schmidt from here on.
There you go.
But yeah, I didn't realize how many really, really good voiceover podcasts there are untilI watched that.
So thanks for doing it.
Bobbi, they were like, had to keep the VO to a certain length, you know, and I thought, myGod, I could do 25 of these if I really, and then you got to make a cut and then you feel
(28:40):
awful about the people you left out.
So I'm not sure I'm going to be doing a whole lot of those type of lists in the future.
we're humbled and honored, by the way.
Thank you for that.
We make the list.
said, yours was one of the first, guess because of the timing that I latched onto, right?
It was you guys, it was the VO School with Jamie Muffet.
(29:02):
Terry Daniel, I think had a podcast and still does.
And those were like, those were the initial ones where I started to learn really about thebusiness.
I had a side hustle for a long time and I knew a lot about the craft.
not so much about the business and I, you know, I had to get up to speed pretty quickly.
(29:23):
I knew how to market, but I didn't know the business of voiceover and you guys were a bighelp in helping me learn that.
So that's one of the reasons I wanted to have you guys on today.
It's been an absolute...
That's the first time I've ever seen anybody dab their eyes with a protein bar.
(29:46):
That's amazing.
you
Kevin Kilpatrick, Bobbi Maxwell, the podcast is called Making Wavs, W -A -V -S, you canfind it on, I know Apple and Spotify and wherever you get your podcasts.
I highly recommend it.
Guys, thanks so much for hanging out today.
It's been fun.
Thank you.
quick and painless, man.
(30:07):
Thank you.
All right.
Wow, that came out to like within a few seconds of 30.
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I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com