September 8, 2025 • 27 mins
The brilliant Alison Lowe OBE joins the We Are PoWEr Podcast - bringing energy, honesty, and a lifetime of serving others with courage and compassion. Based in Leeds and named on the 2025 Northern PoWEr Women Awards PoWEr List, Alison has spent her career challenging injustice, leading with heart, and showing that authenticity is a strength, not something to dial down.
From growing up in a political household to becoming Deputy Mayor for Policing and Crime in West Yorkshire, Alison has always refused to be a bystander. She shares how her mum’s confidence inspired her to embrace her true self, why living your values matters more than titles, and what receiving her OBE meant as both a daughter and a proud Black woman.
Alison also opens up about the pain of childhood abuse, her journey through healing, and how honesty and openness helped her turn wounds into light – for herself and for others. Whether through her leadership at mental health charity Touchstone, her advocacy for inclusivity, or her belief in kindness above all, Alison reminds us that poWEr is not about status, but about creating spaces where people can thrive.
In this episode:
From political roots to Deputy Mayor for Policing and Crime
Why bringing your whole self to work is a superpower
Living your values, not just talking about them
Healing, honesty, and transforming wounds into wisdom
The day she received her OBE and why it mattered so deeply
Building thriving communities through openness and kindness
What she’s learned as a mum, nanna, and leader
⚠️ Trigger Warning: This episode contains discussion of childhood sexual abuse.
Find out more about We Are PoWEr here. 💫
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello, hello and welcome to the we Are Power
podcast.
If this is your first time here, the we Are Power podcast is
the podcast for you, your careerand your life.
We release an episode everysingle Monday with listeners in
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insight from amazing role models.
(00:21):
As we Are Power is the umbrellabrand to Northern Power Women
Awards, which celebrateshundreds of female role models
and advocates every year.
This is where you can hearstories from all of our awards
alumni and stay up to date witheverything.
Mpw Awards and we Are PowerHello and welcome to the podcast
(00:41):
.
Every week, I get to chat withNever imitated, never replicated
, singularly wonderful,everybody's wonder girl.
Hello and welcome to thepodcast.
Every week, I get to chat withbrilliant legends, and this week
is no exception Alison Lowe,obe, and on this year's 2025
Northern Powering AwardsPowerless Welcome.
Welcome Yorkshire into the mix.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Thank you so much for inviting me.
I'm delighted to be here.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
I'm delighted you're here.
You are literally someone whois that inclusive leader who
lives by your values.
But how on earth do youdescribe what you do?
Because it's endless.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
Yeah, I've always, always, had more than one thing
to do in my life, you know,whether that be a parent,
whether that be a chief exec, acounsellor, politician, uh, more
widely, and it's because, uh,you know, I love it, I'm very
passionate, um, I've got a lotof energy and I like to serve.
You know, I feel like I'm thearchetypal public public servant
(01:40):
, and that's what makes me, um,feel happy, it makes me feel
satisfied and it's good for mymental health.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
And you talk about.
We talked about where you arein the world today, but you were
forged in Leeds, east Leeds.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Absolutely.
I'm a Seacroft girl proud of myEast Leeds roots.
My mum's Irish heritage andmany people in East Leeds were
from Ireland.
You know they came over to helpbuild Leeds build the roads,
the A64, et cetera, and many ofthose communities settled in
East Leeds.
And then my dad came from theCaribbean, from St Kitts.
(02:16):
So I'm a fusion of theCaribbean, ireland and Leeds and
I think that that combinationhas really contributed to the
person that I am today.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
It's the recipe, isn't it that makes you who you
are, and along the way, you'vehad lots of dishes, haven't you
in that recipe, and have donelots of very big, difficult
roles.
How have you found yourself onthat adventure where?
Where did it all start?
Speaker 2 (02:46):
So I think it all started with first of all having
a really strong mother, a verypolitical mother.
She was a trade unionist.
We had lots of politicaldebates, arguments, and that
made me interested in the ideathat change was possible at that
really local and grassrootslevel.
I remember moving to ChapelTown having two tiny children
(03:08):
and being really angry becausethe community centre next door
it was about three doors up kepton playing the blues every
Friday and Saturday night hadbig parties, and it occurred to
me that I could do somethingabout that, and so I joined the
management committee, became thechair of the management
committee and I stopped thoseblues and so I could sleep and
so could my kids.
And so that local influencethat you could have by getting
(03:31):
involved rather than standingand carping on the sidelines,
that really showed me that whenyou get involved, you throw
yourself in, that you can make adifference and a change.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Because you can be a bystander, right, Courtney?
Oh yeah, but who wants to be a?
Speaker 2 (03:43):
bystander.
Right, can't you?
Oh yeah, but who wants to be abystander?
Because bystanders are moanersfor whingers, you know.
They're those people who havealways got an opinion about
everything that everybody elseis doing.
But what are you doing?
How are you contributing to thechange that you want to see in
the world?
Speaker 1 (03:56):
and it resonates with me because I always talk about
we focus on the things that wecan do, rather than finger point
about all the things that youcan't do, although something
else is doing that you don'tagree with, but you're not doing
anything to.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
You know, live your own values.
I don't have a problem ifpeople don't like what I'm doing
, but do something instead.
Don't just moan about what I'mdoing.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
Do what you believe is the right thing and what is
making you proud right now?
Because you've got a big role,haven't you?
Deputy Mayor for Policing andCrime for West Yorkshire Police
Just that little job KeepingTracy in check, quite frankly.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Yeah, tracy and I work really well together.
I love working with Tracy.
She's so authentic and she'sgot my back.
You know I've learned over theyears that I'm not your average
Joe.
Thank goodness I've got ADHD.
I sometimes struggle with thefilter that everybody else sees
(04:54):
the world through.
I don't always manage myself asother people do in meetings and
all the rest of it, because Ibring my whole self to work all
the time and that's a bit muchfor some people.
But for Tracy she reallyembraces that and recognizes
that my authenticity adds to therole that we're doing together.
So what I'm really proud of isthe partnership that we forged,
(05:17):
the authenticity of the workthat we're doing, the truth that
we bring to the role of PCCshe's the PCC, but I deliver
most of that function and therelationship that we forged with
West Yorkshire Police, thehonest conversations about what
they're doing well but also whatthey could improve, because I
(05:38):
see myself particularly as abridge between West Yorkshire
Police and the communities ofWest Yorkshire and I want to
tell them straight you thinkthis, this, but this is the
reality.
Let's work together to changethat perception, to improve
performance and deliver for thepeople that you're here to serve
because we're all publicservants.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
And have you been told along the way that you need
to dial down some of thatauthenticity or just yeah, how
do you, how do you get over that?
How do you manage that?
Speaker 2 (06:08):
um, I think it goes back to my Irish heritage mother
.
You know, my mother was alwaysdominant.
She wasn't just prominent Ilike to see myself as prominent
my mum were dominant.
You know, she was always onstage at working men's clubs
singing uh.
When it would open mic.
She was always center of everyparty, every coming together, no
matter who it was.
(06:28):
She loved herself, she loved tomake people laugh and I think
that that confidence that I sawin her, obviously it's given me
the confidence to be myself.
I've not always felt comfortablebeing myself.
Sometimes I thought I'm toomuch, um.
There was a word that um, thatI used to long to be, uh, which
(06:50):
was uh, you know proportion.
I wanted to be.
I wanted to be that quiet,gentle person who just dropped
in those wise words from time totime.
I never was that person, um,and I always used to think I was
too much.
But um, by being too much, bybeing me, I have made a lot of
good things happen for a lot ofpeople.
I fought the good fight, notfor me but for other people, and
(07:12):
if it works, then obviouslyit's something that I've got to
embrace and I've got to keep ondoing and I've come to accept
myself.
I love myself now.
I didn't love myself when I wasyounger.
You know I've talked a lotabout my childhood, the
childhood trauma that Iexperienced, the domestic abuse
that I lived with for 10 years.
You know that does hack away atyour confidence, at your
(07:34):
self-esteem, at your beliefsystem, but you can overcome
those things.
You know, and as I like to say,hugh Rumi, the poet and
philosopher, long gone now, buthe says, the wound is the place
where the light enters.
Without the pain, you don't getthe light.
Without the dark, you don't getthe sunshine.
(07:54):
So all of us learn that we'renot perfect.
Bad things might happen in ourlives.
It's how you deal with thosebad things, it's how you turn
them into success and help thenother people to deal with the
challenges that they face is andthat's what I've tried to do
use it for good.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
And you have had.
You talked about the trauma.
You had trauma as both a childand, later on, as an adult how
did you?
Speaker 2 (08:21):
I was sexually yet, and how?
Speaker 1 (08:25):
you talked about that , how, and you've talked
powerfully about this as well,and there'll be people listening
or watching today thinking Idon't know how I deal with that,
I don't know how I survive thisor I don't know how I move
forward.
What advice would you tell youryounger Alison?
Speaker 2 (08:45):
You've got to come to terms with what happened.
So I was very young I was fiveyears old taken out of the
garden, sexually abused by aneighbour, and because I had
this big Irish Catholic family,you know, I didn't feel able to
tell about what happened.
I held it inside and then Ibegan to convince myself that, a
(09:05):
it hadn't happened and, b itdidn't matter anyway.
But it did matter.
It did happen and it reallybegan to impact my mental health
.
In my 20s I was very unwell, Iwas very distressed.
It all came flooding back to meand I didn't deal with it.
I internalized it.
I was very angry.
I was always angry, angrybecause I was a victim and I
(09:27):
hadn't been able to get justice.
And what I now reflect on is inmy 40s I finally got some
coaching and I absolutelyconfronted that little girl that
was still sat next to me.
She was walking with me, I wasdragging her around with me and
she didn't want to be there.
But I was forcing her to bethere because I'd never allowed
(09:47):
her to go.
I'd never dealt with that painand that distress.
And when I went through thathorrible process in my 40s, when
I was again having a majormental health episode, I was
able to confront what hadhappened, acknowledge that I had
been a victim, that I now gavemyself permission to move to
survivorhood and not just beinga survivor, but thriving and
(10:10):
using that lived experience forgood.
So if I could use it to helpother people in that same
experience, then I knew that I'dbeen.
I didn't want that thing tohappen to me, but it happened to
me for a reason because I couldhelp other people by talking
about what happened to me.
So you've got to confront it,you've got to acknowledge what's
happened and then you've got tobe open about it, because
(10:30):
actually now I see it as mysuperpower.
I can tell people about whathappened to me, not in a oh feel
sorry for me kind of way, butbad things happen to different
people all the time and it canbe, um, sometimes a reason, um,
an excuse maybe for some peopleto not live the lives that we're
supposed to live, to give up,to give up when really we should
(10:54):
have pushed on.
And I want people to know thereis no excuse.
People might try and bring youdown in all sorts of ways.
Don't let them win.
You don't have to them win.
You can win, no matter whathappens to you in your life.
You determine your destination,nobody else.
The journey might have otherpeople interrupting it from time
(11:14):
to time, but the destination isyours to decide.
So decide where you're goingand get there.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
And it's not easy to get you talked about going from
victimhood to survivahood andnow you see that as a superpower
.
But it's not an easy.
It's not.
You can't just go the thepharmacist and get prescribed
that to make that easy it takestime, it takes self-love, it
takes openness, openness andhonesty.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
I've got a really lovely friendship group and a
family group that I can talk to.
Um, and since I started talkingabout it in my mid-40s, I tell
everybody now and it is very,very therapeutic for me, it is
like a talking therapy and I'vegot to be really careful that
it's on my terms that I talkabout this stuff.
When I want to talk about it,when I'm ready to talk about it,
(12:03):
I don't let other people makeit part of their story.
Because you know I've hadpeople who have tried to label
me and pigeonhole me.
And you know I'm had people whohave tried to label me and
pigeonhole me.
And you know I'm not just awoman, I'm a black woman and I'm
a working class woman andpeople always want to minimize
you, minimize your successes,label you to suit their stuff,
(12:25):
you know.
But I say to them that's yourstuff, you keep it.
Thank you very much.
I know who I am and I'm goingto be who I am, irrespective of
what you're trying to do to me,because that's about you, it's
not about me.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
And how does that?
How do people react to that?
Because sometimes people wantthat.
They think oh, but you're.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
Yeah, I mean, it depends on where the person is
on their journey.
Many people find itinspirational and think, wow,
that's what I'm going to do.
I'm going to not allow otherpeople's, whatever it is, to
impact on me.
I'm going to be the person Iwant to be.
I'm going to live the life thatI want to live.
I'm going to be respectful ofother people's views, but I'm
(13:07):
going to move forward with theconfidence that my beliefs are
enough, good enough, they'remine and I'm going to live them.
I'm going to want to run forother people.
It becomes adversarial, but Idon't engage.
It's not my battle, it's theirbattle.
It's like you want to have afight.
See you later.
You know I don't need to engagebecause you know can only have
a battle if two sides agree.
I don't agree.
I know who I am, I know whatI'm doing in the world, and if
(13:28):
other people want to have afight, let them get on with it.
You see, from my social media Iget a lot of stuff.
I don't engage.
I don't engage.
Let them wallow in there,whatever it is bitterness,
sadness, whatever I don't needto engage in a war and what
parts.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
social media is interesting, isn't it?
Because it can be amazinglypowerful and positive to amplify
and to support and convene, butit can be so toxic.
Is that your advice?
Just don't even throw any fuelon it, just ignore the
negativity.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
Absolutely, and I don't block anyone, but I mute
lots of people.
If people send me messages orsay something, if there's a
challenge mate, I don't have aproblem with that.
I'll respond, but if people arehorrible or, you know,
defamatory or verging on theoffensive, I just mute them.
I just mute them because it'slike I don't need you in my life
, but I follow all the lovely,happy people.
(14:26):
I like all the things that makeme feel good about myself.
I'm constantly on social medialooking for the people that
connect with me and that Iconnect with and the stories,
because there's some beautifulthings on social media.
It has a huge power for good.
And also, don't let's forgetthat, for all the, there's some
negativity on social media.
Lots of it is bots.
(14:47):
It's not real people, and alsothat real people, in the main,
are good.
Most people are good in themain.
Um, you know, we might havemisunderstandings.
We might have, you know,stories that mean that we
believe certain things that arenot true.
Um, and that's an opportunityto have a conversation, isn't it
?
To say, oh, that's aninteresting perspective on the
(15:08):
world.
Let's have a conversation aboutthat.
Let me put a different mirror.
Let's have an opening on thisconversation, and then that
pleases me if I'm able to helpsomebody see the world through a
slightly different lens, to bekinder to people that may be
going into the conversation theyfelt quite hostile towards.
I'm all about love.
That's my mantra.
You're here once, you're herefor a very short time, and then
you're gone.
Please, you're here once.
(15:29):
You're here for a very shorttime and then you're gone.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
Please bring love and kindness while you're here, and
that is just tremendousleadership as well, isn't it?
And before your roles, multipleroles, and your existing role.
Now, you've had a previous liferight, or many previous life,
but you were chief exec ofTouchstone and that's a charity.
Tell us about that charity,because you grew that immensely.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Yeah, yeah.
So Touchstone is a mentalhealth charity specialising in
working with diverse communitiesso black minority ethnic
communities, lgbt pluscommunities, refugee, asylum
seekers and we really developedan expertise for working with
people who came to us in alltheir glorious differences and
(16:18):
connecting them with mentalhealth services and responses
that met their needs.
And we did that across thewhole of West Yorkshire and
parts of South Yorkshire and Igrew it from a 1 million to a 10
million pound charity over 17years.
We won multiple awards forinclusion, were IIP Platinum
(16:39):
twice, still IIP Platinum.
The last year I left, we werein the Stonewall Top 100 from
2013.
So lots and lots of differentplaudits best companies, top 10
in best companies.
And we won the Giving BackAward five years running and
that was about the work we didto recruit people with different
(16:59):
lived experiences.
And then the Giving Back Awardwe won that three years running
and that was about the work wedid with our communities to give
back and to build resilience inthose communities.
So we were like a family.
We were like, yeah, a bitdysfunctional from time to time,
but because I talked about mymental health, I talked about my
childhood abuse, I talked aboutmy domestic abuse.
I talked about the things that Iwasn't very good at.
(17:21):
It meant other people couldtalk about their stuff.
It gave permission and everyonewas open and honest and
everyone came through the doorknowing that they were good
enough, no matter what they'dbeen told by whoever in their
lives.
They came to Touchstone andthey weren't just tolerated
which I don't like that wordthey were accepted and they were
loved, and that meant peoplethrived, the work they did was
(17:43):
outstanding, the connectionswith the communities we worked
with were second to none, andthe communities we worked with
they also benefited from thatapproach.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
What is the biggest leadership lesson that you
learned during that time atTouchstone?
Because not only did you growthe business, you were very
present and public, with all ofthat acknowledgement awards, not
to mention all of thetremendous good work you do.
But as a leader, what did youlearn most?
Speaker 2 (18:09):
Juggling, oh, absolutely.
You know.
You know you can't have it all.
That is not true.
You can't have it all.
You've got to live your values.
So if I'm saying the policy isthis or the belief system is
this, then everything we do hasgot to speak to that value, that
policy, because otherwiseyou're a liar, you you're a
(18:30):
hypocrite, and once you'reexposed as a liar or a hypocrite
, everything that you have saidand done before falls.
You're on a bed of sand.
Never say one thing and doanother.
Always have harmony about whatyou're doing and the way that we
were able to do that.
Because obviously, when you'reup the career ladder, you're
(18:52):
getting further and further awayfrom the people that you're
there to serve, from your staffon the front line.
Sometimes you think you'redoing the right thing, but you
don't understand theimplications of what you're
doing.
So you have to have thattwo-way conversation constantly
so that staff will feel able tosay do you really mean to do
this?
Because you do know that if youdo that it'll lead to X, y and
(19:18):
z.
You know something the labourparty, I think, would learn very
well from you know you've gotto have that honesty and
transparency, that open doorpolicy, um, that connection with
all your staff.
It don't matter if you're thecleaner I've been cleaner for
burtons, you know I did it wellbecause you've got to do every
job well, um or if the chiefexec.
We are human beings and no oneis better than anybody else.
So I constantly used to say tomy staff you are our last line
of defence If you do not havebravery and raise issues with us
(19:41):
when you see that we're headingoff a cliff and we're not
living our values.
You are the last line ofdefence.
We need you to tell us whenwe're doing things wrong.
So if it feels wrong, if itfeels incongruous with what
we're saying, I'm begging you,please don't let us make that
mistake.
Tell us.
There's no punishment, there'sno detriment, there's love and
(20:01):
thanks that you're giving usthat perspective, because at top
you can't know everything.
So allow yourself to beconstantly learning, not just
from your employees, but alsofrom the people that you're
there to serve, because if youdon't, you will make a mistake
that will be counter to yourstated culture and values.
You won't mean to do that, butthen nobody will believe you
(20:23):
ever, ever again.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
Lifelong learning, and it strikes me that you're
someone so positive and I couldsit and chat all day long, right
and you want to spotlightothers and help and support
others.
So the moment when you got thebrown envelope through it might
have been an email actually,because it was during COVID
wasn't it when you got yourrecognition from Her Majesty,
(20:48):
getting your OBE, and that wasfor services to mental health
and diverse communities?
Wasn't it for your work atTouchstone?
Did you naturally think, oh,but what about everyone else?
Or did you embrace it?
You know what?
Actually, I'm proud of this.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
I really embraced it, I was really proud of it.
I had a little tear because mydaddy wasn't here to see it.
Oh, I love him and I miss himevery day, but my mum was here
and I was really proud that mymum was able to see.
She came from Ireland.
Well, her family came fromIreland.
She'd been in Holland more, youknow, she'd been a clippy on
the buses, she'd worked in thekitchen and her daughter was
(21:30):
going to to be honored by thequeen.
In the end it was prince charles, now the king, of course, um,
and she was really proud and itwas.
It was also about being a blackperson, um, and thinking that
it's not about being part of theestablishment, it's about, um,
countering that racism anddifferent treatment that my dad
(21:51):
experienced, that I was creatingthat link between, uh, you know
, the uk and uh, the windrushgeneration and the children who
came from the windrushgeneration, and that I was
proved positive that ourforefathers my dad, you know,
all those people who came in the50s and 60s, as my dad did,
(22:13):
they did the right thing.
They placed the trust in the UK, they worked hard and they did
the right thing because we'rethriving.
So that's what.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
I thought, and who did you take to the palace, or
was it Windsor Castle?
Where did you go?
Speaker 2 (22:27):
It was Windsor Castle .
It was amazing.
I took my best friend of nearly50 years, tanya, who I went to
school with, and, yeah, we had abrilliant, brilliant day and I
was so proud to be with herbecause it was Covid.
I couldn't take anybody elsebecause I would have taken my
mum and my sisters, but my mumwas quite frail at that point
(22:48):
and the sins passed.
But, yeah, it was a greatmoment and everybody, even the
secret service who weresearching your car for bombs
even they were happy and joyous.
It was a very, very surrealexperience.
Speaker 1 (23:02):
And you are.
You've got such a story andsuch energy and positivity.
It's hard to fit everythinginto this conversation.
What do we not know about you?
What's your secret?
Little talent?
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Tell me you're on a unicycle, a flute yeah, I
learned it when I was a child atschool.
I've still got a flute and I'vegot bronchiectasis, so I'm not
so good at the breathing anymorethat I have got a float.
But I think the secret thingthat people will be surprised is
is that I'm a nana and I lovebeing a nana.
I love my grandchildren.
(23:37):
They bring me so much joy andhappiness and now that I'm
getting to the twilight of myyears I was 60 last year I'm
really reflecting on family, theimportance of family and what
next, and you know I'm stillworking really hard with Tracy
for this term and thinking aboutwhat will come after.
But I have no fear because,whatever happens, I've got my
(23:59):
beautiful little family, mylittle rainbow family, because
both my children are gay andboth happily married and living
great lives.
I've got my lovelygrandchildren to look forward to
and I'm really looking forwardto being an honor for as much as
possible when that time comes.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
And if you had a superpower and also endless
budget, right and then whatwould you do with it?
We know your superpower.
You've got your superpowers.
Have you had the magic wand?
Speaker 2 (24:28):
I would feed every child.
I would feed every child everyday because, you know, child
poverty is something that I feelvery passionately about.
I come from Seedcroft.
We didn't have a lot of money,we didn't have a lot of food,
but we had just enough to, youknow, to eat every day, and that
that shouldn't be a gift in the21st century, that that you're
(24:50):
expected to have a meal everyday.
So I would love to feed everychild in the world, but
definitely in the UK, every day,for every meal time, and if I
could do that, I would.
Speaker 1 (25:02):
And personally, what's left on that bucket list
because you said earlier youknow we only go this way once.
Right left on that bucket listbecause you said earlier.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
You know we only go this way once, right?
Um, so I've done lots of things.
I've jumped out of an airplane,I've climbed the Himalayas.
Um, you know, I've met the king, I've met the queen, I've met
Nelson Mandela.
You know I've met lots ofbeautiful people, um, and so I
don't have any burning ambitionto oh, you know, I need to um,
do this out of the other.
Now I want to travel tobeautiful places, often with my
(25:30):
sister.
Me and my sister go all overthe place together.
We just went to Jane Austen'shouse.
It doesn't have to be inanother country, um, and I just
want to see, uh, places in theUK that I've never seen before,
um, and maybe in Europe thatI've never seen before, and uh,
just really, um, you know,understand the beauty of the
surroundings that I've neverseen before, and just really.
You know, understand the beautyof the surroundings that I'm
(25:52):
fortunate enough to live in, andI just want to give thanks for
everything that I've got.
I'm very grateful foreverything that I've got and I
want to enjoy the things thatI've got for as long as is
possible, because that's whatpeace looks like.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
Wow, what a way to end.
Alison, you are amazing.
Can't wait to hop over to LeedsIn person.
I'll be hand delivering thatpowerless badge.
We'll need to write out thewhole afternoon.
I'm pretty certain.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Yes, Thank you, I'll go to Liverpool.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
I love shopping in Liverpool.
Speaker 2 (26:22):
Well, there we go.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
Liverpool won.
I love it.
This episode is brought to youby Liverpool won.
They'll love that.
Thank you so much.
It's great to spend time withyou today.
Keep being amazing.
Keep being awesome and keepthat energy.
That energy is phenomenal.
Thank you so much, alison.
Thank you, simone.
Subscribe on YouTube, apple,amazon Music, spotify or
(26:47):
wherever you get your podcasts,leave us a review or follow us
on socials.
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Hello, hello and welcome to the we Are Power
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(00:21):
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Every week, I get to chat withNever imitated, never replicated
, singularly wonderful,everybody's wonder girl.
Hello and welcome to thepodcast.
Every week, I get to chat withbrilliant legends, and this week
is no exception Alison Lowe,obe, and on this year's 2025
Northern Powering AwardsPowerless Welcome.
Welcome Yorkshire into the mix.
Speaker 2 (01:02):
Thank you so much for inviting me.
I'm delighted to be here.
Speaker 1 (01:05):
I'm delighted you're here.
You are literally someone whois that inclusive leader who
lives by your values.
But how on earth do youdescribe what you do?
Because it's endless.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
Yeah, I've always, always, had more than one thing
to do in my life, you know,whether that be a parent,
whether that be a chief exec, acounsellor, politician, uh, more
widely, and it's because, uh,you know, I love it, I'm very
passionate, um, I've got a lotof energy and I like to serve.
You know, I feel like I'm thearchetypal public public servant
(01:40):
, and that's what makes me, um,feel happy, it makes me feel
satisfied and it's good for mymental health.
Speaker 1 (01:46):
And you talk about.
We talked about where you arein the world today, but you were
forged in Leeds, east Leeds.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Absolutely.
I'm a Seacroft girl proud of myEast Leeds roots.
My mum's Irish heritage andmany people in East Leeds were
from Ireland.
You know they came over to helpbuild Leeds build the roads,
the A64, et cetera, and many ofthose communities settled in
East Leeds.
And then my dad came from theCaribbean, from St Kitts.
(02:16):
So I'm a fusion of theCaribbean, ireland and Leeds and
I think that that combinationhas really contributed to the
person that I am today.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
It's the recipe, isn't it that makes you who you
are, and along the way, you'vehad lots of dishes, haven't you
in that recipe, and have donelots of very big, difficult
roles.
How have you found yourself onthat adventure where?
Where did it all start?
Speaker 2 (02:46):
So I think it all started with first of all having
a really strong mother, a verypolitical mother.
She was a trade unionist.
We had lots of politicaldebates, arguments, and that
made me interested in the ideathat change was possible at that
really local and grassrootslevel.
I remember moving to ChapelTown having two tiny children
(03:08):
and being really angry becausethe community centre next door
it was about three doors up kepton playing the blues every
Friday and Saturday night hadbig parties, and it occurred to
me that I could do somethingabout that, and so I joined the
management committee, became thechair of the management
committee and I stopped thoseblues and so I could sleep and
so could my kids.
And so that local influencethat you could have by getting
(03:31):
involved rather than standingand carping on the sidelines,
that really showed me that whenyou get involved, you throw
yourself in, that you can make adifference and a change.
Speaker 1 (03:41):
Because you can be a bystander, right, Courtney?
Oh yeah, but who wants to be a?
Speaker 2 (03:43):
bystander.
Right, can't you?
Oh yeah, but who wants to be abystander?
Because bystanders are moanersfor whingers, you know.
They're those people who havealways got an opinion about
everything that everybody elseis doing.
But what are you doing?
How are you contributing to thechange that you want to see in
the world?
Speaker 1 (03:56):
and it resonates with me because I always talk about
we focus on the things that wecan do, rather than finger point
about all the things that youcan't do, although something
else is doing that you don'tagree with, but you're not doing
anything to.
Speaker 2 (04:08):
You know, live your own values.
I don't have a problem ifpeople don't like what I'm doing
, but do something instead.
Don't just moan about what I'mdoing.
Speaker 1 (04:17):
Do what you believe is the right thing and what is
making you proud right now?
Because you've got a big role,haven't you?
Deputy Mayor for Policing andCrime for West Yorkshire Police
Just that little job KeepingTracy in check, quite frankly.
Speaker 2 (04:32):
Yeah, tracy and I work really well together.
I love working with Tracy.
She's so authentic and she'sgot my back.
You know I've learned over theyears that I'm not your average
Joe.
Thank goodness I've got ADHD.
I sometimes struggle with thefilter that everybody else sees
(04:54):
the world through.
I don't always manage myself asother people do in meetings and
all the rest of it, because Ibring my whole self to work all
the time and that's a bit muchfor some people.
But for Tracy she reallyembraces that and recognizes
that my authenticity adds to therole that we're doing together.
So what I'm really proud of isthe partnership that we forged,
(05:17):
the authenticity of the workthat we're doing, the truth that
we bring to the role of PCCshe's the PCC, but I deliver
most of that function and therelationship that we forged with
West Yorkshire Police, thehonest conversations about what
they're doing well but also whatthey could improve, because I
(05:38):
see myself particularly as abridge between West Yorkshire
Police and the communities ofWest Yorkshire and I want to
tell them straight you thinkthis, this, but this is the
reality.
Let's work together to changethat perception, to improve
performance and deliver for thepeople that you're here to serve
because we're all publicservants.
Speaker 1 (05:56):
And have you been told along the way that you need
to dial down some of thatauthenticity or just yeah, how
do you, how do you get over that?
How do you manage that?
Speaker 2 (06:08):
um, I think it goes back to my Irish heritage mother
.
You know, my mother was alwaysdominant.
She wasn't just prominent Ilike to see myself as prominent
my mum were dominant.
You know, she was always onstage at working men's clubs
singing uh.
When it would open mic.
She was always center of everyparty, every coming together, no
matter who it was.
(06:28):
She loved herself, she loved tomake people laugh and I think
that that confidence that I sawin her, obviously it's given me
the confidence to be myself.
I've not always felt comfortablebeing myself.
Sometimes I thought I'm toomuch, um.
There was a word that um, thatI used to long to be, uh, which
(06:50):
was uh, you know proportion.
I wanted to be.
I wanted to be that quiet,gentle person who just dropped
in those wise words from time totime.
I never was that person, um,and I always used to think I was
too much.
But um, by being too much, bybeing me, I have made a lot of
good things happen for a lot ofpeople.
I fought the good fight, notfor me but for other people, and
(07:12):
if it works, then obviouslyit's something that I've got to
embrace and I've got to keep ondoing and I've come to accept
myself.
I love myself now.
I didn't love myself when I wasyounger.
You know I've talked a lotabout my childhood, the
childhood trauma that Iexperienced, the domestic abuse
that I lived with for 10 years.
You know that does hack away atyour confidence, at your
(07:34):
self-esteem, at your beliefsystem, but you can overcome
those things.
You know, and as I like to say,hugh Rumi, the poet and
philosopher, long gone now, buthe says, the wound is the place
where the light enters.
Without the pain, you don't getthe light.
Without the dark, you don't getthe sunshine.
(07:54):
So all of us learn that we'renot perfect.
Bad things might happen in ourlives.
It's how you deal with thosebad things, it's how you turn
them into success and help thenother people to deal with the
challenges that they face is andthat's what I've tried to do
use it for good.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
And you have had.
You talked about the trauma.
You had trauma as both a childand, later on, as an adult how
did you?
Speaker 2 (08:21):
I was sexually yet, and how?
Speaker 1 (08:25):
you talked about that , how, and you've talked
powerfully about this as well,and there'll be people listening
or watching today thinking Idon't know how I deal with that,
I don't know how I survive thisor I don't know how I move
forward.
What advice would you tell youryounger Alison?
Speaker 2 (08:45):
You've got to come to terms with what happened.
So I was very young I was fiveyears old taken out of the
garden, sexually abused by aneighbour, and because I had
this big Irish Catholic family,you know, I didn't feel able to
tell about what happened.
I held it inside and then Ibegan to convince myself that, a
(09:05):
it hadn't happened and, b itdidn't matter anyway.
But it did matter.
It did happen and it reallybegan to impact my mental health
.
In my 20s I was very unwell, Iwas very distressed.
It all came flooding back to meand I didn't deal with it.
I internalized it.
I was very angry.
I was always angry, angrybecause I was a victim and I
(09:27):
hadn't been able to get justice.
And what I now reflect on is inmy 40s I finally got some
coaching and I absolutelyconfronted that little girl that
was still sat next to me.
She was walking with me, I wasdragging her around with me and
she didn't want to be there.
But I was forcing her to bethere because I'd never allowed
(09:47):
her to go.
I'd never dealt with that painand that distress.
And when I went through thathorrible process in my 40s, when
I was again having a majormental health episode, I was
able to confront what hadhappened, acknowledge that I had
been a victim, that I now gavemyself permission to move to
survivorhood and not just beinga survivor, but thriving and
(10:10):
using that lived experience forgood.
So if I could use it to helpother people in that same
experience, then I knew that I'dbeen.
I didn't want that thing tohappen to me, but it happened to
me for a reason because I couldhelp other people by talking
about what happened to me.
So you've got to confront it,you've got to acknowledge what's
happened and then you've got tobe open about it, because
(10:30):
actually now I see it as mysuperpower.
I can tell people about whathappened to me, not in a oh feel
sorry for me kind of way, butbad things happen to different
people all the time and it canbe, um, sometimes a reason, um,
an excuse maybe for some peopleto not live the lives that we're
supposed to live, to give up,to give up when really we should
(10:54):
have pushed on.
And I want people to know thereis no excuse.
People might try and bring youdown in all sorts of ways.
Don't let them win.
You don't have to them win.
You can win, no matter whathappens to you in your life.
You determine your destination,nobody else.
The journey might have otherpeople interrupting it from time
(11:14):
to time, but the destination isyours to decide.
So decide where you're goingand get there.
Speaker 1 (11:20):
And it's not easy to get you talked about going from
victimhood to survivahood andnow you see that as a superpower
.
But it's not an easy.
It's not.
You can't just go the thepharmacist and get prescribed
that to make that easy it takestime, it takes self-love, it
takes openness, openness andhonesty.
Speaker 2 (11:40):
I've got a really lovely friendship group and a
family group that I can talk to.
Um, and since I started talkingabout it in my mid-40s, I tell
everybody now and it is very,very therapeutic for me, it is
like a talking therapy and I'vegot to be really careful that
it's on my terms that I talkabout this stuff.
When I want to talk about it,when I'm ready to talk about it,
(12:03):
I don't let other people makeit part of their story.
Because you know I've hadpeople who have tried to label
me and pigeonhole me.
And you know I'm had people whohave tried to label me and
pigeonhole me.
And you know I'm not just awoman, I'm a black woman and I'm
a working class woman andpeople always want to minimize
you, minimize your successes,label you to suit their stuff,
(12:25):
you know.
But I say to them that's yourstuff, you keep it.
Thank you very much.
I know who I am and I'm goingto be who I am, irrespective of
what you're trying to do to me,because that's about you, it's
not about me.
Speaker 1 (12:37):
And how does that?
How do people react to that?
Because sometimes people wantthat.
They think oh, but you're.
Speaker 2 (12:43):
Yeah, I mean, it depends on where the person is
on their journey.
Many people find itinspirational and think, wow,
that's what I'm going to do.
I'm going to not allow otherpeople's, whatever it is, to
impact on me.
I'm going to be the person Iwant to be.
I'm going to live the life thatI want to live.
I'm going to be respectful ofother people's views, but I'm
(13:07):
going to move forward with theconfidence that my beliefs are
enough, good enough, they'remine and I'm going to live them.
I'm going to want to run forother people.
It becomes adversarial, but Idon't engage.
It's not my battle, it's theirbattle.
It's like you want to have afight.
See you later.
You know I don't need to engagebecause you know can only have
a battle if two sides agree.
I don't agree.
I know who I am, I know whatI'm doing in the world, and if
(13:28):
other people want to have afight, let them get on with it.
You see, from my social media Iget a lot of stuff.
I don't engage.
I don't engage.
Let them wallow in there,whatever it is bitterness,
sadness, whatever I don't needto engage in a war and what
parts.
Speaker 1 (13:45):
social media is interesting, isn't it?
Because it can be amazinglypowerful and positive to amplify
and to support and convene, butit can be so toxic.
Is that your advice?
Just don't even throw any fuelon it, just ignore the
negativity.
Speaker 2 (14:03):
Absolutely, and I don't block anyone, but I mute
lots of people.
If people send me messages orsay something, if there's a
challenge mate, I don't have aproblem with that.
I'll respond, but if people arehorrible or, you know,
defamatory or verging on theoffensive, I just mute them.
I just mute them because it'slike I don't need you in my life
, but I follow all the lovely,happy people.
(14:26):
I like all the things that makeme feel good about myself.
I'm constantly on social medialooking for the people that
connect with me and that Iconnect with and the stories,
because there's some beautifulthings on social media.
It has a huge power for good.
And also, don't let's forgetthat, for all the, there's some
negativity on social media.
Lots of it is bots.
(14:47):
It's not real people, and alsothat real people, in the main,
are good.
Most people are good in themain.
Um, you know, we might havemisunderstandings.
We might have, you know,stories that mean that we
believe certain things that arenot true.
Um, and that's an opportunityto have a conversation, isn't it
?
To say, oh, that's aninteresting perspective on the
(15:08):
world.
Let's have a conversation aboutthat.
Let me put a different mirror.
Let's have an opening on thisconversation, and then that
pleases me if I'm able to helpsomebody see the world through a
slightly different lens, to bekinder to people that may be
going into the conversation theyfelt quite hostile towards.
I'm all about love.
That's my mantra.
You're here once, you're herefor a very short time, and then
you're gone.
Please, you're here once.
(15:29):
You're here for a very shorttime and then you're gone.
Speaker 1 (15:32):
Please bring love and kindness while you're here, and
that is just tremendousleadership as well, isn't it?
And before your roles, multipleroles, and your existing role.
Now, you've had a previous liferight, or many previous life,
but you were chief exec ofTouchstone and that's a charity.
Tell us about that charity,because you grew that immensely.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Yeah, yeah.
So Touchstone is a mentalhealth charity specialising in
working with diverse communitiesso black minority ethnic
communities, lgbt pluscommunities, refugee, asylum
seekers and we really developedan expertise for working with
people who came to us in alltheir glorious differences and
(16:18):
connecting them with mentalhealth services and responses
that met their needs.
And we did that across thewhole of West Yorkshire and
parts of South Yorkshire and Igrew it from a 1 million to a 10
million pound charity over 17years.
We won multiple awards forinclusion, were IIP Platinum
(16:39):
twice, still IIP Platinum.
The last year I left, we werein the Stonewall Top 100 from
2013.
So lots and lots of differentplaudits best companies, top 10
in best companies.
And we won the Giving BackAward five years running and
that was about the work we didto recruit people with different
(16:59):
lived experiences.
And then the Giving Back Awardwe won that three years running
and that was about the work wedid with our communities to give
back and to build resilience inthose communities.
So we were like a family.
We were like, yeah, a bitdysfunctional from time to time,
but because I talked about mymental health, I talked about my
childhood abuse, I talked aboutmy domestic abuse.
I talked about the things that Iwasn't very good at.
(17:21):
It meant other people couldtalk about their stuff.
It gave permission and everyonewas open and honest and
everyone came through the doorknowing that they were good
enough, no matter what they'dbeen told by whoever in their
lives.
They came to Touchstone andthey weren't just tolerated
which I don't like that wordthey were accepted and they were
loved, and that meant peoplethrived, the work they did was
(17:43):
outstanding, the connectionswith the communities we worked
with were second to none, andthe communities we worked with
they also benefited from thatapproach.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
What is the biggest leadership lesson that you
learned during that time atTouchstone?
Because not only did you growthe business, you were very
present and public, with all ofthat acknowledgement awards, not
to mention all of thetremendous good work you do.
But as a leader, what did youlearn most?
Speaker 2 (18:09):
Juggling, oh, absolutely.
You know.
You know you can't have it all.
That is not true.
You can't have it all.
You've got to live your values.
So if I'm saying the policy isthis or the belief system is
this, then everything we do hasgot to speak to that value, that
policy, because otherwiseyou're a liar, you you're a
(18:30):
hypocrite, and once you'reexposed as a liar or a hypocrite
, everything that you have saidand done before falls.
You're on a bed of sand.
Never say one thing and doanother.
Always have harmony about whatyou're doing and the way that we
were able to do that.
Because obviously, when you'reup the career ladder, you're
(18:52):
getting further and further awayfrom the people that you're
there to serve, from your staffon the front line.
Sometimes you think you'redoing the right thing, but you
don't understand theimplications of what you're
doing.
So you have to have thattwo-way conversation constantly
so that staff will feel able tosay do you really mean to do
this?
Because you do know that if youdo that it'll lead to X, y and
(19:18):
z.
You know something the labourparty, I think, would learn very
well from you know you've gotto have that honesty and
transparency, that open doorpolicy, um, that connection with
all your staff.
It don't matter if you're thecleaner I've been cleaner for
burtons, you know I did it wellbecause you've got to do every
job well, um or if the chiefexec.
We are human beings and no oneis better than anybody else.
So I constantly used to say tomy staff you are our last line
of defence If you do not havebravery and raise issues with us
(19:41):
when you see that we're headingoff a cliff and we're not
living our values.
You are the last line ofdefence.
We need you to tell us whenwe're doing things wrong.
So if it feels wrong, if itfeels incongruous with what
we're saying, I'm begging you,please don't let us make that
mistake.
Tell us.
There's no punishment, there'sno detriment, there's love and
(20:01):
thanks that you're giving usthat perspective, because at top
you can't know everything.
So allow yourself to beconstantly learning, not just
from your employees, but alsofrom the people that you're
there to serve, because if youdon't, you will make a mistake
that will be counter to yourstated culture and values.
You won't mean to do that, butthen nobody will believe you
(20:23):
ever, ever again.
Speaker 1 (20:24):
Lifelong learning, and it strikes me that you're
someone so positive and I couldsit and chat all day long, right
and you want to spotlightothers and help and support
others.
So the moment when you got thebrown envelope through it might
have been an email actually,because it was during COVID
wasn't it when you got yourrecognition from Her Majesty,
(20:48):
getting your OBE, and that wasfor services to mental health
and diverse communities?
Wasn't it for your work atTouchstone?
Did you naturally think, oh,but what about everyone else?
Or did you embrace it?
You know what?
Actually, I'm proud of this.
Speaker 2 (21:03):
I really embraced it, I was really proud of it.
I had a little tear because mydaddy wasn't here to see it.
Oh, I love him and I miss himevery day, but my mum was here
and I was really proud that mymum was able to see.
She came from Ireland.
Well, her family came fromIreland.
She'd been in Holland more, youknow, she'd been a clippy on
the buses, she'd worked in thekitchen and her daughter was
(21:30):
going to to be honored by thequeen.
In the end it was prince charles, now the king, of course, um,
and she was really proud and itwas.
It was also about being a blackperson, um, and thinking that
it's not about being part of theestablishment, it's about, um,
countering that racism anddifferent treatment that my dad
(21:51):
experienced, that I was creatingthat link between, uh, you know
, the uk and uh, the windrushgeneration and the children who
came from the windrushgeneration, and that I was
proved positive that ourforefathers my dad, you know,
all those people who came in the50s and 60s, as my dad did,
(22:13):
they did the right thing.
They placed the trust in the UK, they worked hard and they did
the right thing because we'rethriving.
So that's what.
Speaker 1 (22:22):
I thought, and who did you take to the palace, or
was it Windsor Castle?
Where did you go?
Speaker 2 (22:27):
It was Windsor Castle .
It was amazing.
I took my best friend of nearly50 years, tanya, who I went to
school with, and, yeah, we had abrilliant, brilliant day and I
was so proud to be with herbecause it was Covid.
I couldn't take anybody elsebecause I would have taken my
mum and my sisters, but my mumwas quite frail at that point
(22:48):
and the sins passed.
But, yeah, it was a greatmoment and everybody, even the
secret service who weresearching your car for bombs
even they were happy and joyous.
It was a very, very surrealexperience.
Speaker 1 (23:02):
And you are.
You've got such a story andsuch energy and positivity.
It's hard to fit everythinginto this conversation.
What do we not know about you?
What's your secret?
Little talent?
Speaker 2 (23:16):
Tell me you're on a unicycle, a flute yeah, I
learned it when I was a child atschool.
I've still got a flute and I'vegot bronchiectasis, so I'm not
so good at the breathing anymorethat I have got a float.
But I think the secret thingthat people will be surprised is
is that I'm a nana and I lovebeing a nana.
I love my grandchildren.
(23:37):
They bring me so much joy andhappiness and now that I'm
getting to the twilight of myyears I was 60 last year I'm
really reflecting on family, theimportance of family and what
next, and you know I'm stillworking really hard with Tracy
for this term and thinking aboutwhat will come after.
But I have no fear because,whatever happens, I've got my
(23:59):
beautiful little family, mylittle rainbow family, because
both my children are gay andboth happily married and living
great lives.
I've got my lovelygrandchildren to look forward to
and I'm really looking forwardto being an honor for as much as
possible when that time comes.
Speaker 1 (24:16):
And if you had a superpower and also endless
budget, right and then whatwould you do with it?
We know your superpower.
You've got your superpowers.
Have you had the magic wand?
Speaker 2 (24:28):
I would feed every child.
I would feed every child everyday because, you know, child
poverty is something that I feelvery passionately about.
I come from Seedcroft.
We didn't have a lot of money,we didn't have a lot of food,
but we had just enough to, youknow, to eat every day, and that
that shouldn't be a gift in the21st century, that that you're
(24:50):
expected to have a meal everyday.
So I would love to feed everychild in the world, but
definitely in the UK, every day,for every meal time, and if I
could do that, I would.
Speaker 1 (25:02):
And personally, what's left on that bucket list
because you said earlier youknow we only go this way once.
Right left on that bucket listbecause you said earlier.
Speaker 2 (25:07):
You know we only go this way once, right?
Um, so I've done lots of things.
I've jumped out of an airplane,I've climbed the Himalayas.
Um, you know, I've met the king, I've met the queen, I've met
Nelson Mandela.
You know I've met lots ofbeautiful people, um, and so I
don't have any burning ambitionto oh, you know, I need to um,
do this out of the other.
Now I want to travel tobeautiful places, often with my
(25:30):
sister.
Me and my sister go all overthe place together.
We just went to Jane Austen'shouse.
It doesn't have to be inanother country, um, and I just
want to see, uh, places in theUK that I've never seen before,
um, and maybe in Europe thatI've never seen before, and uh,
just really, um, you know,understand the beauty of the
surroundings that I've neverseen before, and just really.
You know, understand the beautyof the surroundings that I'm
(25:52):
fortunate enough to live in, andI just want to give thanks for
everything that I've got.
I'm very grateful foreverything that I've got and I
want to enjoy the things thatI've got for as long as is
possible, because that's whatpeace looks like.
Speaker 1 (26:06):
Wow, what a way to end.
Alison, you are amazing.
Can't wait to hop over to LeedsIn person.
I'll be hand delivering thatpowerless badge.
We'll need to write out thewhole afternoon.
I'm pretty certain.
Speaker 2 (26:19):
Yes, Thank you, I'll go to Liverpool.
Speaker 1 (26:21):
I love shopping in Liverpool.
Speaker 2 (26:22):
Well, there we go.
Speaker 1 (26:24):
Liverpool won.
I love it.
This episode is brought to youby Liverpool won.
They'll love that.
Thank you so much.
It's great to spend time withyou today.
Keep being amazing.
Keep being awesome and keepthat energy.
That energy is phenomenal.
Thank you so much, alison.
Thank you, simone.
Subscribe on YouTube, apple,amazon Music, spotify or
(26:47):
wherever you get your podcasts,leave us a review or follow us
on socials.
We are Power underscore net onInsta, tiktok and Twitter.
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