March 31, 2025 • 23 mins
In this episode of the We Are PoWEr Podcast, we’re joined by Tarifa Simpson from Forvis Mazars, who shares the story of how she built her career and the lessons she learned along the way.
Tarifa opens up about how she explored different internships to find her true career path, leading to a graduate role in transactional services. What started as an opportunity turned into a 17-year journey at KPMG, shaping her expertise and leadership skills.
She reflects on the mentorship, coaching, and training that helped her develop confidence, embrace not having all the answers, and become an effective leader. Tarifa also highlights the importance of guiding and advising others, whether it’s leading a team or helping clients navigate critical decisions.
She also shares why she recommends reading The Psychology of Money, a book that goes beyond finance to explore what drives individuals to take their next leap in life and work.
This episode is packed with insights on career progression, leadership, and the value of lifelong learning—a must-listen for anyone looking to grow in their field.
Find out more about We Are PoWEr here. 💫
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Hello, hello and welcome to the we Are Power
podcast.
If this is your first time here, the we Are Power podcast is
the podcast for you, your careerand your life.
We release an episode everysingle Monday with listeners in
over 60 countries worldwide,where you'll hear personal life
stories, top-notch industryadvice and key leadership
insight from amazing role models.
(00:21):
As we Are Power is the umbrellabrand to Northern Power Women
Awards, which celebrateshundreds of female role models
and advocates every year.
This is where you can hearstories from all of our awards
alumni and stay up to date witheverything MPW Awards and we Are
Power.
I'm delighted today to bejoined by Tarifa Simpson from
(00:42):
4Vis.
Never imitated, neverreplicated, singularly wonderful
, everybody's wonder girl.
I'm delighted today to bejoined by Tarifa Simpson from
4Vis and Mazzars Welcome.
Thank you very much.
We've known each other forquite a long time now, haven't
you?
How long have you been atMazzars?
Now I'm coming up to five years.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Wow, where did that time go?
Yeah it's gone really fast.
I was a lockdown hire so it'skind of slow but also fast at
the same time.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Now tell us about your role, because I know you
talk about.
You fell into accounting.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
And I did so.
I originally thought I would gointo medicine and so I did a
lot of science A levels andthings was really into that and
that didn't work out for me.
Um, lesson learned, and so Iwent, I stayed.
I stayed at um, my, my hometown, birmingham, did my my degree
(01:34):
there.
As part of that, I had a yearout.
So it was quite good, becausethey sort of forced you to have
a year out to kind of you know,know, do an internship, which
was fantastic to me, went downto London, thought I'd see what
that's about Bright lights, bigcity, exactly and I think it
confirmed A.
I didn't.
I didn't feel like I needed tobe in London, but I loved the
experience.
I did a role in globalmarketing, so something very
(01:58):
different.
Again, fantastic, really goodexperience, but it actually gave
me an insight into professionalservices.
It wasn't something that I knewany family members or friends
were into, so it was quite aneducation in itself.
I then found the firm that Ijoined, sort of you know, became
aware of them.
(02:18):
So I did another internshipwith KPMG.
So I'm a big fan of sort ofdifferent internships and using
that as a, as a route to figureout what you want to do.
And then I got offered agraduate role and they said that
because I'd done thisinternship, I could choose
whichever office.
And I was very sensible andsaid I'd stay at home, you know,
(02:38):
raise some money to buy a housesort of things you think you're
meant to do.
And when I went for theinterview house, do all the sort
of things you think you'remeant to do, um, and when I went
for the interview, um, theysaid we've got a new role and,
um, it's in something calledtransaction services and we
think that you'd be suited to it.
So will you come up and chat tothe partner and see what you
think?
And I was like, is this a trick?
Speaker 1 (02:59):
question what is it?
Speaker 2 (03:01):
you know I was applying for a similar but
different role and from there,what was a conversation, turned
out to be a job offer, turnedout to be something that I did
with that firm for 17 years, youknow, had two children, had a
fantastic career, travelled theworld, and I did fall into it,
(03:22):
and part of that was fallinginto accounting as well, so I
chartered as an accountant aswell.
Um, so, yeah, I fell into it,but it was the best decision
ever and I think it was verytrue to something I've done
along my career and even how Isort of came to be at Vorbis
Mazars, which is, you knowwhat's the worst that can happen
.
Um, you know, I mean that in avery positive sense, you know,
(03:43):
give every opportunity a go.
So, yeah, I had conversationswith the firm, really liked the
team that I was joining, reallyliked the sense of actually
being really entrepreneurial.
So, you know, building up ateam in the Manchester area
actually supporting clientsacross the north, which I'd, you
(04:05):
know, I'd been based inManchester for a long time by
that point.
So it really appealed and Ijust felt, okay, now's the time
to maybe take the risk, you know, take the chance.
What I hadn't realised is Imade that big decision two weeks
before we went into lockdown.
So, it was.
It was scary.
It was quite a scary decisionto make.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
How did you build those connections?
Because you know we talk aboutthe power of connections, don't
we?
And building those individualsthat are either going to be part
of your team or you're workingas part of and you've got to
collaborate with, and it was ata time when we were making the
world up and the rules up, as wewere every day.
Weren't we making history?
Speaker 2 (04:45):
yeah, and I think part and part it was flexibility
.
So for the first few monthsthat I joined, I agreed I agreed
with the firm that I wouldn'tcome and work full-time.
So they gave me a lotflexibility because I didn't
know whether nurseries weregoing to close down.
I had a four-year-old and18-month-old at that.
You know, I had a young familyand I knew that.
(05:08):
You know, it could be verychallenging to actually come in
and do the justice that Ithought I need this role to, you
know, and this impact that Iwanted to make.
The connections bit wasdifficult.
I mean, it was obviously allvirtual, but I think that the
really nervous part was you know, it's a, it's a people business
.
It's all about connections withpeople you know, and, um, yes,
(05:32):
you take them through actually areally scary time in their,
their professional or businesscareer.
You know, you're helping themsell their business, you're
helping them buy something thattakes, you know, the business
into another stratosphere ofsuccess.
Um, so there's a lot ofemotions in that and I think
what it proved to me that thosepeople where I'd had really
(05:53):
successful transactions withthat, we'd worked together
really well.
First of all, they were hugelysupportive.
So when I announced that I wasmoving.
You know a lot of well wishesand success that gave me the
boost.
And then it was really just bitby bit just making those
connections and they had to beauthentic.
So it wasn't about sort ofpeppering everyone that I knew
(06:15):
to say I'm here and a big sale,and I've always been quite true
to that.
I think people can see throughthat clearly.
But you know, we're here, we'rea business and you know I have
to sort of you know, show that Ican make it work.
(06:37):
But I think, gradually over time, I just used, I used my network
A to find, you know,individuals that could be
referred on.
I used it to just find out whatwas going on in the marketplace
, because a lot of it wasaccepting what was there.
You know that you weren't goingto suddenly be winning lots of
projects and starting work.
That just wasn't the world wewere in, um, so very much using
that time to just actually, inquite a nice way, take stock, um
(07:00):
, and think about more, aboutsort of how I wanted to be
individually as a partner, how Iwanted to be in the firm.
So it gave me actually a lot ofthinking time about that style
because you know, I'd worked inthe industry.
I'd worked in my particularprofession and team transactions
(07:23):
for 17, 18 years by that point.
So I know a lot about the doingand that goes as a given.
But actually that heightenedsense of how you interact as a
partner.
Where the book stops with you,you've got to make those really
difficult decisions.
That bit it's a bit of an artand there isn't a textbook of
how to do it.
And I'm sure you know a lot ofthe listeners and watchers of
(07:45):
this will appreciate that aswell that you know you've really
you get to a point and it'scertainly a piece of advice that
I impart to a lot of peoplethat I mentor as well is, you
know, you've got to find thatauthenticity because otherwise
it's really tough.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
You just can't keep it up otherwise.
I think and I know mentoring isis something that you're very
passionate about, and you'vebeen a finalist yes, um for
Northern Power Women Awards on acouple of occasions.
Um, what is it that?
Has that really spurred youinto being a mentor?
Were you on the receiving end?
Speaker 2 (08:22):
um, I was, um I did.
I did have some mentors becausethe the profession I went into.
Um you go back.
So I I sort of started in theearly 2000s but back in the 90s
it was, um, you know, it waslike special projects, so it was
very much done out of umexisting teams.
It wasn't sort of a dedicatedteam for it, so it was still
(08:43):
evolving.
So I was kind of joining at atime when it was very new and at
a time when they wouldn't oftentake graduates that were still
studying for their accountancyexams.
So it was all new in terms of Ahow people had to coach me and
train me and help me tounderstand what was going on,
and there wasn't the same webresources or, you know, online
(09:05):
resources to research in thebackground.
So mentors were reallyimportant about helping me to
kind of bridge that gap andbeing a bit of a safe space for
me to say I really don't knowwhat that?
means you know, and you know,when we're in that meeting and
someone said, oh, this or this,what were they actually talking
about?
How does that actually relateto the big picture of what we're
(09:26):
doing?
So I had um, I did have quite afew mentors.
They weren't titled that way.
You know, I never thought ofthat in that way mentors come in
different boxes, don't they?
Speaker 1 (09:36):
in shapes and sizes?
Speaker 2 (09:37):
and they do, and time and they do, oh, absolutely, um
, and I think I I then gotaccess to sort of formal
mentoring courses.
Actually it was one helpingfemale founder startups, okay,
and that was when I'd moved toManchester and it was a program
and you know it was a range ofbusinesses.
(09:58):
One lady, she, basicallysupplied costumes into the big
television companies or intotheatres, et cetera, so it was
that, as well as professionalmakeup products.
So I was mentoring her.
So it was trying to switch mymind to actually you know where
(10:19):
are you trying to get to andhelp individuals actually to
think out situations, and I justreally enjoyed it.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
It's addictive isn't it, it is.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
It's something I don't think I can ever really
convey how much I love doing itand how I don't know.
I think just because I enjoy it.
I don't know if I'm any good atit I think my mentees would
have to be testament to that butI do really enjoy it and I
think it's all about just beinginterested in someone.
(10:51):
And you know, we were justtalking earlier before you know
we started recording around.
You know, finding thosedifferent connections connecting
people.
It's a lot of that as well.
It maybe strays more into sortof sponsoring, I think, where
you sort of go right, I knowsuch a body.
Why don't you just have a chatIf I don't know a woman or man?
Speaker 1 (11:08):
who can?
I always think.
I always think what thiscommunity is about, because you
never want anyone to be withoutor without that information, a
bit like taking it back toyourself around that table going
.
What did that mean?
Again, you know, having thosesafe space to ask the questions,
be curious, you know, and Ithink that's where the different
forms of mentoring comes in.
And I know you've got a newrole now, haven't you?
Which is a UKwide role.
(11:30):
What has been?
You know that's a big role itis.
You know, what are you?
Have you been most sort ofexcited and motivated about
creating this high-performingteam?
Speaker 2 (11:40):
I suppose yeah, it's been a challenge and actually
for about a year beforehand, theidea of taking over the head of
roles.
So in my line of due diligenceto take over the team for the UK
, it'd been discussions and Iwas really keen to do it.
As I said, you know never wantto sort of not take up an
(12:02):
opportunity, so I was reallykeen to do it but I was nervous.
I knew it was a big challenge.
I knew that it was a team thatwas obviously located in a
number of offices and I knewthat it wouldn't team that was
obviously located in a number ofoffices and I knew that it
wouldn't be easy.
And I knew that there was lotsof things that I wanted to do
whilst also driving the businessand ambitions that I've got
here in the north.
So I was apprehensive and evenpractical things, like my
(12:25):
daughter was starting school.
So I was even like I've got alot going on personally and so
I'm not sure if I do want, likeanother thing to actually, you
know, build up and that wasreally well respected.
So at first I think it feltlike you know, there's never
going to be a perfect time, butyou know we understand that
(12:46):
there is lots going on ineveryone's life, so don't put
extra pressure on yourself whenyou don't have to.
But no, when it got announcedand it was happening, I was
really excited.
And you know it's a fantasticteam.
First and foremost, it is afantastic team.
So you know, to a certainextent, there's not a lot I need
to do on that, you know.
Carry on being fantastic.
However, I think everyone canalways recognise when they, you
(13:10):
know, you come to taking on thatsort of role, you see it
through a different lens.
I see it through being, youknow, from a graduate all the
way up to a partner in a lot ofdifferent teams, in a lot of
different project situations anda lot of different cities.
So I feel like there's a lot ofthat that I can bring to say
there are different ways ofdoing this.
(13:31):
Let's give it a try.
I never know that it's going towork out, but I'm willing to
kind of take the hit.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
Be brave.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Yeah, exactly, totally.
And I think one thing that I'vebeen doing a lot of sort of
around the time of taking onthat role is really sort of
listening to a lot of audiobooks and reading a lot around
sort of.
I guess the listening to a lotof audio books and reading a lot
around sort of I guess thehuman psychology and the psyche
around you know why people thinkthe way they do, how you can
(13:58):
better communicate with eachother, the psychology around you
know people that operatebusinesses and are part of high
functioning teams.
What do they do?
Well, but how do they keep thatauthentic to their own style?
I think, going back to the pointabout leading and sort of you
(14:20):
know, advising people in yourown authentic way, same for
leading a team.
In this, you know, we're allworking with very different
clients and they can absolutelydo that in a way that works for
them and clearly our clientslove that too.
But how can then I understandthat better and understand the
(14:42):
differences?
So that's been quite afascinating, I suppose, side
part of just the doing of therole.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
Top tips, because I know you love the audible books.
You've been reading aboutleadership, reading about the
communication styles Any favesout there that you're reading at
the moment?
Speaker 2 (14:53):
or where they've gone must read that.
Yeah, I mean I kind of flipbetween sort of like true crime
podcasts and series to then likesort of deep psychology books I
really liked.
So, actually speaking ofpsychology, I listened to the
Psychology of Money, which isactually quite a short listen,
which is refreshing because someaudio books can be quite long.
I know I do a fair few miles inthe car but even so.
(15:18):
So psychology of money wasgreat and actually it was less
about you know how do you makemore money.
It was more about what's thethinking behind, what drives
individuals to you know, start abusiness, to take the next leap
.
You know, how have we asindividuals evolved?
Individuals evolved when wethink about the financial crash,
what actually happened there,even when we think about the
(15:40):
baby boomer era and post-war.
What was the thinking aroundthat and how has that evolved
over time and what we see assort of success now versus what
we did back then.
And that was really fascinating.
So I love that book.
So that's definitely arecommend.
It's well known as well.
I'm listening to SuperCommunicators at the moment.
(16:01):
That's a great one Still goingthrough that but again, it's
talking about lots of the sortof nonverbal cues how you can, I
suppose, kind of lean into aconversation, so how you, you
know, ask the right questions orreally think about the person
(16:22):
that's here with me or the teamthat's here with me, what, what
do they want to get out of thissession?
What's what's on their agendaand not in a um, not in a
strategic way, actuallygenuinely using those
opportunities, particularlypost-covid, to really start to
connect with individuals againso that you get what's
motivating them?
(16:42):
Um, because I suppose the onething you can guarantee is it's
like it's going to be differentto what motivates you.
So you've got to kind of findthose common paths.
But yeah, it's fascinating,there's, you know, lots in that
book, lots of different.
This could have been yoursliding to what motivates you.
So you've got to kind of findthose common paths, but yeah,
it's fascinating, there's, youknow, lots in that book, lots of
different examples.
Speaker 1 (16:55):
This could have been your sliding doors moment, I
think in psychology, couldn't it?
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
I mean, my degree was very varied and I quite liked
that.
But I kind of look back now andit's certainly the way that I'm
really interested about whatmakes people tick.
Interested about what makespeople tick?
Um, I could definitely seemyself doing something like a I
don't know psychology degree orsomething.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
Well, we've had Penny Traynor, dr Penny Traynor on
the podcast and you know she hasdoes DJing as a side hustle,
you know I mean.
So there's always space for aside hustle.
You never know where thoseskills and that passion is might
be your own podcast.
It might be your own bookseries, who knows?
We'll watch this space, but um,so your little ones?
Now, if my math serves me right, must be what?
Speaker 2 (17:39):
five and a half, no, six, six and nine ish, something
like that, because my math isreally good.
No, I can be a mathematician.
That is impressive.
So yeah, uh, son is about toturn nine in a couple of weeks
time.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
Yeah, my daughter's six, and and I'm not, you know,
I think it's always difficult tosort of look at how there's no
having it all.
It's impossible, you know.
But how do you ensure harmonyin your life?
Speaker 2 (18:03):
Yes, I mean, I think I'll sort of turn the phrase
around.
You know, behind this goodwoman there's a very good,
there's a good man as well.
You know, supporting myhusband's, also quite senior in
his profession.
It's a crazy juggle at the bestof times, but one that still
kind of works for us.
And I think I do have mentees,you know, that are in similar
(18:25):
positions, either starting afamily or thinking about that,
or looking to take on maybe amore senior role, and they do
ask you how do you manage it all?
I think you've really got tohave that deep, honest
conversation with those aroundyou maybe not a partner, but
maybe family or whoever's sortof supporting you as well
Friends too factor into thatabout what's going to work and a
(18:49):
bit of acceptance, of sort of atrial and error which you know
for us, I think, has been….
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Innovation.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
Yeah, for quite a long time, but it helps.
I think that we're in similarprofessions so we have a bit of
an insight.
I think we also share it withthe children.
You know we explain that thisis what we're doing, or you know
, before I came here.
You know son's actually poorlyat home today, so I said to him
(19:17):
he's fine, he's fine, he'swatching David Attenborough,
perfectly fine.
But you know, we explain to themkind of how our day looks.
You know, actually we sharewith them that we are traveling
around a lot more, but actuallyfor a lot of years and actually
a lot of the younger yearsthey've seen us at home a lot,
but actually now it's, yeah, youknow, before COVID came we
(19:38):
travelled and you know, butwe'll always be here and this is
how our day looks.
So it's quite interestingexplaining to an eight and six
year old what your job is.
They still don't quite get itand keep their attention.
yeah, yeah, other than you writereports and um yeah you're on a
train a lot or in a car thatthat too.
(19:58):
But, um, yeah, it's, it's, it'squite, it's quite an interesting
challenge and you know it's avery, it's a very real challenge
.
Um, but we just, yeah, we justride with it.
I think you just have to dothat.
And then sometimes, I think youjust have to sometimes accept
defeat, when things don't workout, and say, look, I just can't
do that, I just need a bit moretime or a bit more space.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
And how do you then factor in?
Because I know something thatyou're really, really passionate
about is weightlifting.
Yes, and those PBs, how arethey going?
Yeah, they're all right, I'vegot.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
I've got a bit of a shoulder injury at the moment so
that, yeah, it's, I'm, I'm, I'mhaving a bit of a, an easier
time, shall we say, at the gym.
It's a, it's a massive thingfor me, um, I think around sort
of wellness and whatever thatsort of outlet is.
Um, I've been doing sort ofstrength-based training now for
coming about four years.
Four years, four years solid Um, and I've done it in various
(20:53):
forms before.
I've always liked fitness and achallenge Um, but I really see
it as an outlet.
Now I think even my family willsay, when I've not had a chance
to go to the gym, I'm just notquite the same and I need that
release.
And I think, as I come into, youknow, um 40s, I sort of come to
a stage of life for me.
It is a really important way forme to get space away from the
(21:17):
desk, from the office.
Actually, when I've got a lotgoing in my head, it's a good
opportunity for me to think outthings, a bit like sort of
self-mentoring myself, I guess,really using that time to sort
of think through, right, how amI going to approach this
opportunity?
Or how am I going to approach,you know, this meeting I've got
tomorrow, so I use it a lot forthat.
But then on the other side, Ijust like the sort of
(21:38):
consistency gains, you know,those little wins every time I
go, and how to face setbacks.
You know, yeah, I've got aninjury here and there, but how
do I still keep going withoutkind of stopping and and and you
know, actually going, going,going backwards, which is which
is fine, but for me, again, it'san important kind of test that
(21:59):
I feel like I can bring to myprofessional life as well how I
build that it's a real crossover.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
It fings into, like the mentoring.
It's that the feedback for thatit's.
It's absolutely all tied up,isn't?
It in that you know, actuallyit's easy sometimes not to go
because it's cold outside or ithasn't quite all gone right at
home or at work.
One day.
It's easy not to go, butactually, like you say, if you
don't go you don't become Tarifayeah, no, and it is a really
(22:24):
big part of me.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
I mean that as well, as I think my job can be very
pressured at times.
You know the hours can be long,there can be quite a lot of
travel.
So for me, how I try and buildin sort of wellness in terms of
what I eat you know theactivities that I do it does
help me to be at my best.
You know you can't, you knowyou can't, you can't work when
(22:49):
you know you're not energizedyourself.
You can't give when you've gotnothing in the tank, basically.
So I think a lot of that isreally important and I don't
sort of say it as sort of ohlook at me I'm, you know I'm
great, I'm eating all thishealthy food and stuff.
You know it is it's kind ofchoosing my heart, and you know,
and it does take a lot of timechoosing my heart and you know,
(23:11):
and it does take a lot of time,but I personally really feel the
benefits of it.
Um, and I said yeah, it kind ofgives me that energy to sort of
keep, keep going when I need to.
I love that.
I feel like that's our tote bagmoment for the day for your
life.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
You're living like choosing your heart.
I love that.
I love that.
So if I thank you so much forbeing such an amazing member of
of our wider community.
You're you're always so keen toget involved and support and
give back.
So thank you so much and reallylook forward to staying
connected and and seeing youvery soon, thank you.
Thank you, subscribe on youtube, apple, amazon, music, spotify
(23:44):
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Leave us a review or follow uson socials.
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(00:21):
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Awards, which celebrateshundreds of female role models
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This is where you can hearstories from all of our awards
alumni and stay up to date witheverything MPW Awards and we Are
Power.
I'm delighted today to bejoined by Tarifa Simpson from
(00:42):
4Vis.
Never imitated, neverreplicated, singularly wonderful
, everybody's wonder girl.
I'm delighted today to bejoined by Tarifa Simpson from
4Vis and Mazzars Welcome.
Thank you very much.
We've known each other forquite a long time now, haven't
you?
How long have you been atMazzars?
Now I'm coming up to five years.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Wow, where did that time go?
Yeah it's gone really fast.
I was a lockdown hire so it'skind of slow but also fast at
the same time.
Speaker 1 (01:06):
Now tell us about your role, because I know you
talk about.
You fell into accounting.
Speaker 2 (01:13):
And I did so.
I originally thought I would gointo medicine and so I did a
lot of science A levels andthings was really into that and
that didn't work out for me.
Um, lesson learned, and so Iwent, I stayed.
I stayed at um, my, my hometown, birmingham, did my my degree
(01:34):
there.
As part of that, I had a yearout.
So it was quite good, becausethey sort of forced you to have
a year out to kind of you know,know, do an internship, which
was fantastic to me, went downto London, thought I'd see what
that's about Bright lights, bigcity, exactly and I think it
confirmed A.
I didn't.
I didn't feel like I needed tobe in London, but I loved the
experience.
I did a role in globalmarketing, so something very
(01:58):
different.
Again, fantastic, really goodexperience, but it actually gave
me an insight into professionalservices.
It wasn't something that I knewany family members or friends
were into, so it was quite aneducation in itself.
I then found the firm that Ijoined, sort of you know, became
aware of them.
(02:18):
So I did another internshipwith KPMG.
So I'm a big fan of sort ofdifferent internships and using
that as a, as a route to figureout what you want to do.
And then I got offered agraduate role and they said that
because I'd done thisinternship, I could choose
whichever office.
And I was very sensible andsaid I'd stay at home, you know,
(02:38):
raise some money to buy a housesort of things you think you're
meant to do.
And when I went for theinterview house, do all the sort
of things you think you'remeant to do, um, and when I went
for the interview, um, theysaid we've got a new role and,
um, it's in something calledtransaction services and we
think that you'd be suited to it.
So will you come up and chat tothe partner and see what you
think?
And I was like, is this a trick?
Speaker 1 (02:59):
question what is it?
Speaker 2 (03:01):
you know I was applying for a similar but
different role and from there,what was a conversation, turned
out to be a job offer, turnedout to be something that I did
with that firm for 17 years, youknow, had two children, had a
fantastic career, travelled theworld, and I did fall into it,
(03:22):
and part of that was fallinginto accounting as well, so I
chartered as an accountant aswell.
Um, so, yeah, I fell into it,but it was the best decision
ever and I think it was verytrue to something I've done
along my career and even how Isort of came to be at Vorbis
Mazars, which is, you knowwhat's the worst that can happen
.
Um, you know, I mean that in avery positive sense, you know,
(03:43):
give every opportunity a go.
So, yeah, I had conversationswith the firm, really liked the
team that I was joining, reallyliked the sense of actually
being really entrepreneurial.
So, you know, building up ateam in the Manchester area
actually supporting clientsacross the north, which I'd, you
(04:05):
know, I'd been based inManchester for a long time by
that point.
So it really appealed and Ijust felt, okay, now's the time
to maybe take the risk, you know, take the chance.
What I hadn't realised is Imade that big decision two weeks
before we went into lockdown.
So, it was.
It was scary.
It was quite a scary decisionto make.
Speaker 1 (04:25):
How did you build those connections?
Because you know we talk aboutthe power of connections, don't
we?
And building those individualsthat are either going to be part
of your team or you're workingas part of and you've got to
collaborate with, and it was ata time when we were making the
world up and the rules up, as wewere every day.
Weren't we making history?
Speaker 2 (04:45):
yeah, and I think part and part it was flexibility
.
So for the first few monthsthat I joined, I agreed I agreed
with the firm that I wouldn'tcome and work full-time.
So they gave me a lotflexibility because I didn't
know whether nurseries weregoing to close down.
I had a four-year-old and18-month-old at that.
You know, I had a young familyand I knew that.
(05:08):
You know, it could be verychallenging to actually come in
and do the justice that Ithought I need this role to, you
know, and this impact that Iwanted to make.
The connections bit wasdifficult.
I mean, it was obviously allvirtual, but I think that the
really nervous part was you know, it's a, it's a people business
.
It's all about connections withpeople you know, and, um, yes,
(05:32):
you take them through actually areally scary time in their,
their professional or businesscareer.
You know, you're helping themsell their business, you're
helping them buy something thattakes, you know, the business
into another stratosphere ofsuccess.
Um, so there's a lot ofemotions in that and I think
what it proved to me that thosepeople where I'd had really
(05:53):
successful transactions withthat, we'd worked together
really well.
First of all, they were hugelysupportive.
So when I announced that I wasmoving.
You know a lot of well wishesand success that gave me the
boost.
And then it was really just bitby bit just making those
connections and they had to beauthentic.
So it wasn't about sort ofpeppering everyone that I knew
(06:15):
to say I'm here and a big sale,and I've always been quite true
to that.
I think people can see throughthat clearly.
But you know, we're here, we'rea business and you know I have
to sort of you know, show that Ican make it work.
(06:37):
But I think, gradually over time, I just used, I used my network
A to find, you know,individuals that could be
referred on.
I used it to just find out whatwas going on in the marketplace
, because a lot of it wasaccepting what was there.
You know that you weren't goingto suddenly be winning lots of
projects and starting work.
That just wasn't the world wewere in, um, so very much using
that time to just actually, inquite a nice way, take stock, um
(07:00):
, and think about more, aboutsort of how I wanted to be
individually as a partner, how Iwanted to be in the firm.
So it gave me actually a lot ofthinking time about that style
because you know, I'd worked inthe industry.
I'd worked in my particularprofession and team transactions
(07:23):
for 17, 18 years by that point.
So I know a lot about the doingand that goes as a given.
But actually that heightenedsense of how you interact as a
partner.
Where the book stops with you,you've got to make those really
difficult decisions.
That bit it's a bit of an artand there isn't a textbook of
how to do it.
And I'm sure you know a lot ofthe listeners and watchers of
(07:45):
this will appreciate that aswell that you know you've really
you get to a point and it'scertainly a piece of advice that
I impart to a lot of peoplethat I mentor as well is, you
know, you've got to find thatauthenticity because otherwise
it's really tough.
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (08:05):
You just can't keep it up otherwise.
I think and I know mentoring isis something that you're very
passionate about, and you'vebeen a finalist yes, um for
Northern Power Women Awards on acouple of occasions.
Um, what is it that?
Has that really spurred youinto being a mentor?
Were you on the receiving end?
Speaker 2 (08:22):
um, I was, um I did.
I did have some mentors becausethe the profession I went into.
Um you go back.
So I I sort of started in theearly 2000s but back in the 90s
it was, um, you know, it waslike special projects, so it was
very much done out of umexisting teams.
It wasn't sort of a dedicatedteam for it, so it was still
(08:43):
evolving.
So I was kind of joining at atime when it was very new and at
a time when they wouldn't oftentake graduates that were still
studying for their accountancyexams.
So it was all new in terms of Ahow people had to coach me and
train me and help me tounderstand what was going on,
and there wasn't the same webresources or, you know, online
(09:05):
resources to research in thebackground.
So mentors were reallyimportant about helping me to
kind of bridge that gap andbeing a bit of a safe space for
me to say I really don't knowwhat that?
means you know, and you know,when we're in that meeting and
someone said, oh, this or this,what were they actually talking
about?
How does that actually relateto the big picture of what we're
(09:26):
doing?
So I had um, I did have quite afew mentors.
They weren't titled that way.
You know, I never thought ofthat in that way mentors come in
different boxes, don't they?
Speaker 1 (09:36):
in shapes and sizes?
Speaker 2 (09:37):
and they do, and time and they do, oh, absolutely, um
, and I think I I then gotaccess to sort of formal
mentoring courses.
Actually it was one helpingfemale founder startups, okay,
and that was when I'd moved toManchester and it was a program
and you know it was a range ofbusinesses.
(09:58):
One lady, she, basicallysupplied costumes into the big
television companies or intotheatres, et cetera, so it was
that, as well as professionalmakeup products.
So I was mentoring her.
So it was trying to switch mymind to actually you know where
(10:19):
are you trying to get to andhelp individuals actually to
think out situations, and I justreally enjoyed it.
Speaker 1 (10:26):
It's addictive isn't it, it is.
Speaker 2 (10:28):
It's something I don't think I can ever really
convey how much I love doing itand how I don't know.
I think just because I enjoy it.
I don't know if I'm any good atit I think my mentees would
have to be testament to that butI do really enjoy it and I
think it's all about just beinginterested in someone.
(10:51):
And you know, we were justtalking earlier before you know
we started recording around.
You know, finding thosedifferent connections connecting
people.
It's a lot of that as well.
It maybe strays more into sortof sponsoring, I think, where
you sort of go right, I knowsuch a body.
Why don't you just have a chatIf I don't know a woman or man?
Speaker 1 (11:08):
who can?
I always think.
I always think what thiscommunity is about, because you
never want anyone to be withoutor without that information, a
bit like taking it back toyourself around that table going
.
What did that mean?
Again, you know, having thosesafe space to ask the questions,
be curious, you know, and Ithink that's where the different
forms of mentoring comes in.
And I know you've got a newrole now, haven't you?
Which is a UKwide role.
(11:30):
What has been?
You know that's a big role itis.
You know, what are you?
Have you been most sort ofexcited and motivated about
creating this high-performingteam?
Speaker 2 (11:40):
I suppose yeah, it's been a challenge and actually
for about a year beforehand, theidea of taking over the head of
roles.
So in my line of due diligenceto take over the team for the UK
, it'd been discussions and Iwas really keen to do it.
As I said, you know never wantto sort of not take up an
(12:02):
opportunity, so I was reallykeen to do it but I was nervous.
I knew it was a big challenge.
I knew that it was a team thatwas obviously located in a
number of offices and I knewthat it wouldn't team that was
obviously located in a number ofoffices and I knew that it
wouldn't be easy.
And I knew that there was lotsof things that I wanted to do
whilst also driving the businessand ambitions that I've got
here in the north.
So I was apprehensive and evenpractical things, like my
(12:25):
daughter was starting school.
So I was even like I've got alot going on personally and so
I'm not sure if I do want, likeanother thing to actually, you
know, build up and that wasreally well respected.
So at first I think it feltlike you know, there's never
going to be a perfect time, butyou know we understand that
(12:46):
there is lots going on ineveryone's life, so don't put
extra pressure on yourself whenyou don't have to.
But no, when it got announcedand it was happening, I was
really excited.
And you know it's a fantasticteam.
First and foremost, it is afantastic team.
So you know, to a certainextent, there's not a lot I need
to do on that, you know.
Carry on being fantastic.
However, I think everyone canalways recognise when they, you
(13:10):
know, you come to taking on thatsort of role, you see it
through a different lens.
I see it through being, youknow, from a graduate all the
way up to a partner in a lot ofdifferent teams, in a lot of
different project situations anda lot of different cities.
So I feel like there's a lot ofthat that I can bring to say
there are different ways ofdoing this.
(13:31):
Let's give it a try.
I never know that it's going towork out, but I'm willing to
kind of take the hit.
Speaker 1 (13:37):
Be brave.
Speaker 2 (13:38):
Yeah, exactly, totally.
And I think one thing that I'vebeen doing a lot of sort of
around the time of taking onthat role is really sort of
listening to a lot of audiobooks and reading a lot around
sort of.
I guess the listening to a lotof audio books and reading a lot
around sort of I guess thehuman psychology and the psyche
around you know why people thinkthe way they do, how you can
(13:58):
better communicate with eachother, the psychology around you
know people that operatebusinesses and are part of high
functioning teams.
What do they do?
Well, but how do they keep thatauthentic to their own style?
I think, going back to the pointabout leading and sort of you
(14:20):
know, advising people in yourown authentic way, same for
leading a team.
In this, you know, we're allworking with very different
clients and they can absolutelydo that in a way that works for
them and clearly our clientslove that too.
But how can then I understandthat better and understand the
(14:42):
differences?
So that's been quite afascinating, I suppose, side
part of just the doing of therole.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
Top tips, because I know you love the audible books.
You've been reading aboutleadership, reading about the
communication styles Any favesout there that you're reading at
the moment?
Speaker 2 (14:53):
or where they've gone must read that.
Yeah, I mean I kind of flipbetween sort of like true crime
podcasts and series to then likesort of deep psychology books I
really liked.
So, actually speaking ofpsychology, I listened to the
Psychology of Money, which isactually quite a short listen,
which is refreshing because someaudio books can be quite long.
I know I do a fair few miles inthe car but even so.
(15:18):
So psychology of money wasgreat and actually it was less
about you know how do you makemore money.
It was more about what's thethinking behind, what drives
individuals to you know, start abusiness, to take the next leap
.
You know, how have we asindividuals evolved?
Individuals evolved when wethink about the financial crash,
what actually happened there,even when we think about the
(15:40):
baby boomer era and post-war.
What was the thinking aroundthat and how has that evolved
over time and what we see assort of success now versus what
we did back then.
And that was really fascinating.
So I love that book.
So that's definitely arecommend.
It's well known as well.
I'm listening to SuperCommunicators at the moment.
(16:01):
That's a great one Still goingthrough that but again, it's
talking about lots of the sortof nonverbal cues how you can, I
suppose, kind of lean into aconversation, so how you, you
know, ask the right questions orreally think about the person
(16:22):
that's here with me or the teamthat's here with me, what, what
do they want to get out of thissession?
What's what's on their agendaand not in a um, not in a
strategic way, actuallygenuinely using those
opportunities, particularlypost-covid, to really start to
connect with individuals againso that you get what's
motivating them?
(16:42):
Um, because I suppose the onething you can guarantee is it's
like it's going to be differentto what motivates you.
So you've got to kind of findthose common paths.
But yeah, it's fascinating,there's, you know, lots in that
book, lots of different.
This could have been yoursliding to what motivates you.
So you've got to kind of findthose common paths, but yeah,
it's fascinating, there's, youknow, lots in that book, lots of
different examples.
Speaker 1 (16:55):
This could have been your sliding doors moment, I
think in psychology, couldn't it?
Yeah, absolutely.
Speaker 2 (17:01):
I mean, my degree was very varied and I quite liked
that.
But I kind of look back now andit's certainly the way that I'm
really interested about whatmakes people tick.
Interested about what makespeople tick?
Um, I could definitely seemyself doing something like a I
don't know psychology degree orsomething.
Speaker 1 (17:17):
Well, we've had Penny Traynor, dr Penny Traynor on
the podcast and you know she hasdoes DJing as a side hustle,
you know I mean.
So there's always space for aside hustle.
You never know where thoseskills and that passion is might
be your own podcast.
It might be your own bookseries, who knows?
We'll watch this space, but um,so your little ones?
Now, if my math serves me right, must be what?
Speaker 2 (17:39):
five and a half, no, six, six and nine ish, something
like that, because my math isreally good.
No, I can be a mathematician.
That is impressive.
So yeah, uh, son is about toturn nine in a couple of weeks
time.
Speaker 1 (17:51):
Yeah, my daughter's six, and and I'm not, you know,
I think it's always difficult tosort of look at how there's no
having it all.
It's impossible, you know.
But how do you ensure harmonyin your life?
Speaker 2 (18:03):
Yes, I mean, I think I'll sort of turn the phrase
around.
You know, behind this goodwoman there's a very good,
there's a good man as well.
You know, supporting myhusband's, also quite senior in
his profession.
It's a crazy juggle at the bestof times, but one that still
kind of works for us.
And I think I do have mentees,you know, that are in similar
(18:25):
positions, either starting afamily or thinking about that,
or looking to take on maybe amore senior role, and they do
ask you how do you manage it all?
I think you've really got tohave that deep, honest
conversation with those aroundyou maybe not a partner, but
maybe family or whoever's sortof supporting you as well
Friends too factor into thatabout what's going to work and a
(18:49):
bit of acceptance, of sort of atrial and error which you know
for us, I think, has been….
Speaker 1 (18:53):
Innovation.
Speaker 2 (18:55):
Yeah, for quite a long time, but it helps.
I think that we're in similarprofessions so we have a bit of
an insight.
I think we also share it withthe children.
You know we explain that thisis what we're doing, or you know
, before I came here.
You know son's actually poorlyat home today, so I said to him
(19:17):
he's fine, he's fine, he'swatching David Attenborough,
perfectly fine.
But you know, we explain to themkind of how our day looks.
You know, actually we sharewith them that we are traveling
around a lot more, but actuallyfor a lot of years and actually
a lot of the younger yearsthey've seen us at home a lot,
but actually now it's, yeah, youknow, before COVID came we
(19:38):
travelled and you know, butwe'll always be here and this is
how our day looks.
So it's quite interestingexplaining to an eight and six
year old what your job is.
They still don't quite get itand keep their attention.
yeah, yeah, other than you writereports and um yeah you're on a
train a lot or in a car thatthat too.
(19:58):
But, um, yeah, it's, it's, it'squite, it's quite an interesting
challenge and you know it's avery, it's a very real challenge
.
Um, but we just, yeah, we justride with it.
I think you just have to dothat.
And then sometimes, I think youjust have to sometimes accept
defeat, when things don't workout, and say, look, I just can't
do that, I just need a bit moretime or a bit more space.
Speaker 1 (20:20):
And how do you then factor in?
Because I know something thatyou're really, really passionate
about is weightlifting.
Yes, and those PBs, how arethey going?
Yeah, they're all right, I'vegot.
Speaker 2 (20:30):
I've got a bit of a shoulder injury at the moment so
that, yeah, it's, I'm, I'm, I'mhaving a bit of a, an easier
time, shall we say, at the gym.
It's a, it's a massive thingfor me, um, I think around sort
of wellness and whatever thatsort of outlet is.
Um, I've been doing sort ofstrength-based training now for
coming about four years.
Four years, four years solid Um, and I've done it in various
(20:53):
forms before.
I've always liked fitness and achallenge Um, but I really see
it as an outlet.
Now I think even my family willsay, when I've not had a chance
to go to the gym, I'm just notquite the same and I need that
release.
And I think, as I come into, youknow, um 40s, I sort of come to
a stage of life for me.
It is a really important way forme to get space away from the
(21:17):
desk, from the office.
Actually, when I've got a lotgoing in my head, it's a good
opportunity for me to think outthings, a bit like sort of
self-mentoring myself, I guess,really using that time to sort
of think through, right, how amI going to approach this
opportunity?
Or how am I going to approach,you know, this meeting I've got
tomorrow, so I use it a lot forthat.
But then on the other side, Ijust like the sort of
(21:38):
consistency gains, you know,those little wins every time I
go, and how to face setbacks.
You know, yeah, I've got aninjury here and there, but how
do I still keep going withoutkind of stopping and and and you
know, actually going, going,going backwards, which is which
is fine, but for me, again, it'san important kind of test that
(21:59):
I feel like I can bring to myprofessional life as well how I
build that it's a real crossover.
Speaker 1 (22:03):
It fings into, like the mentoring.
It's that the feedback for thatit's.
It's absolutely all tied up,isn't?
It in that you know, actuallyit's easy sometimes not to go
because it's cold outside or ithasn't quite all gone right at
home or at work.
One day.
It's easy not to go, butactually, like you say, if you
don't go you don't become Tarifayeah, no, and it is a really
(22:24):
big part of me.
Speaker 2 (22:25):
I mean that as well, as I think my job can be very
pressured at times.
You know the hours can be long,there can be quite a lot of
travel.
So for me, how I try and buildin sort of wellness in terms of
what I eat you know theactivities that I do it does
help me to be at my best.
You know you can't, you knowyou can't, you can't work when
(22:49):
you know you're not energizedyourself.
You can't give when you've gotnothing in the tank, basically.
So I think a lot of that isreally important and I don't
sort of say it as sort of ohlook at me I'm, you know I'm
great, I'm eating all thishealthy food and stuff.
You know it is it's kind ofchoosing my heart, and you know,
and it does take a lot of timechoosing my heart and you know,
(23:11):
and it does take a lot of time,but I personally really feel the
benefits of it.
Um, and I said yeah, it kind ofgives me that energy to sort of
keep, keep going when I need to.
I love that.
I feel like that's our tote bagmoment for the day for your
life.
Speaker 1 (23:20):
You're living like choosing your heart.
I love that.
I love that.
So if I thank you so much forbeing such an amazing member of
of our wider community.
You're you're always so keen toget involved and support and
give back.
So thank you so much and reallylook forward to staying
connected and and seeing youvery soon, thank you.
Thank you, subscribe on youtube, apple, amazon, music, spotify
(23:44):
or wherever you get yourpodcasts.
Leave us a review or follow uson socials.
We are power underscore net oninsta, tiktok and twitter, or we
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