All Episodes

September 4, 2025 14 mins

“If someone isn’t motivated, it doesn’t matter how much skill they have, they won’t apply themselves.”

Notable Moments

[02:47] Why hiring for experience alone can be a mistake

[04:05] The three qualities every high performer shares

[05:28] Why motivation matters more than raw skill

[09:54] The Disney story that proves skills can be taught

[12:57] Using motivation-based interviews to find true fit

[15:41] Resource: Learn more about motivation-based interviewing

[15:57] How Best Culture Solutions applies this method for clients

Too often, leaders hire based on experience or by looking for a specific skillset. Unfortunately, it doesn’t take long to discover that experience or skill without motivation and passion doesn’t add up to performance. In this conversation, we dig into the three components that make someone a true high achiever, why motivation-based interviewing is a game-changer, and how leaders can better evaluate fit in any role.

Read the blog for more from this episode. 

Connect with Tim and his team:

Website: https://bestculturesolutions.ca/

LinkedIn: Best Culture Solutions, Inc

Instagram: @best.culture.solutions  

Email: tim@bestculturesolutions.ca

 

 

Mark as Played
Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Foreign. Welcome to
the World at Work podcast, where business leaders and job seekers come together
to create winning cultures and fulfilling careers. I'm your host,
Katie Currins, and I am here with Tim Dick, founder of Best
Culture Solutions. Tim, great to be back with you.
If I feel like it's been a while. Has it been a while? It feels

(00:22):
that way. It feels that way. But, you know, sometimes life also just
gets very busy. And it might feel like it's been a while, but it's only
been a week or two. But this time, I think it really has been a
while. It has been a while, and that's,
for me, an issue. But that's okay. How have you been? You went away
too, didn't you? I did, I did. I know we

(00:43):
have both shared that we quite enjoy our Disney
trips, and this time I. Our family took a nice Disney
cruise. It was absolutely wonderful.
Met a lot of great people and went to many new
places. So was. It was pretty. One. Pretty
fantastic way to step away from things for a bit.

(01:05):
So in the meantime, you got to have conversations with
Jody and you had Mike Simmons back. So
you were out there meeting and talking with some great people
as well. I was, and it was fine. You know, I mean, it was
okay. I did, actually, to your point, I actually ran into Jody in
person in Washington state on Bainbridge Island. So we.

(01:28):
That was nice. That was nice. And it made me think, well, we have never
recorded in person. Or have we? Have we recorded in person? No,
no, I don't think we have. Because the time we were in Orlando,
it was so busy with Lee Cockerel and all that stuff. So. No, we
need to make that happen. Okay, well, one day. Right? One day
since we know Jody is real, I. I am real. Like,

(01:49):
we are real people. Anyway, so speaking
of all these great people, you know, a lot of times when you
are a leader in a business, you'll have a lot of great people brought to
the table for positions. And so thinking about some of the
conversations you've had lately with them, and then just some
out in the world every day, there's a lot

(02:12):
of. I don't want to say debate, but there seem to
be some strong opinions on skill versus experience.
You know, if I'm somebody that has a ton of
knowledge under my. I've. I been well trained, I have a ton
of technical understanding, yet
there might be an application right next to somebody that has

(02:34):
years of experience. And sometimes,
you know, one might outweigh the other. But what's your take on that approach?
Because it can certainly evoke some strong emotions from some people.
Yeah, well, and that's a good question. And so like, and I, we were just
chatting about this too. Like I see employers all the time. They will get

(02:55):
somebody's resume, right? Or they get somebody that was referred to
them and they will say, oh, they've got great experience or they've been in this
business before, so let's just hire them, right? And,
and you know, that's a mistake. And the reason for that is
like, the reason why it's a mistake is because,

(03:18):
you know, just because somebody has experience, just because somebody has a skill set,
just because somebody has done this before,
right. It doesn't mean that they're going to do it
again. And just
because that happens, right, it like,
it doesn't mean that they're motivated. Right? And so skill is one

(03:40):
thing. And a lot of employers make the mistake of hiring skill. And when they
see somebody with experience on the resume or a certain degree or a certain piece
of education, they say, well, they have the skill
to do this, so let's bring them on board. But what they don't
realize is that. And they think they're hiring a higher performer,
but what they don't realize is that they're not. There's no guarantee

(04:02):
there. They might be, they might not be. It's a bit of a crapshoot. And
here's the thing. All high performers, right, have three things in
common. Is part of it
skill? You bet, right? That's the first component that a high performer
has. But there's two other components and those two components
are related to their self motivation to use the skill.

(04:26):
And basically if they're not self motivated to use their
skills, then they're not going to use them.
It's just like how many times do we hear
parents tell their kids, oh, if you just applied
yourself, you could really succeed. That's the same principle
here. People are sometimes not motivated to apply

(04:47):
themselves. And, and so basically
because of that, skill is one of three
components that is required for people to,
to be a high performer. Absolutely. But the other two
components are rated, are related to motivation and they are a
self or an I can attitude, the ability to overcome obstacles

(05:10):
and, and, and passion.
Right. For the work that they do and enjoyment out of the work that they
do. If those things aren't there, it doesn't matter how skilled somebody is,
they're just not going to use it. It really won't matter. Like, you know, it
goes back to that whole thing. If you don't you'd be so great if you'd
apply yourself. Absolutely. Everybody would be. If they're not motivated,

(05:31):
it doesn't matter how much skill they have, they're not going to apply themselves. And
so employers make the mistake of hiring people based on skill all
the time. And what they're missing out on is they don't
realize that it doesn't mean they're going to use it right. They have to have
the skill, they have to have an ICANN attitude and they have to be passionate
about the work. Those are the three components of anybody that's truly going to be
a high achiever in any role. So hiring just on the skill is actually quite

(05:53):
a mistake. I really appreciate that you threw
passion out there because I see that
as a caution to the focus
on experience and that, you know, not to say that somebody
with experience isn't passionate. That's not always the case
at all. However, I have seen where

(06:15):
somebody that has years of experience has stuck with something
because it's a paycheck. And that doesn't mean they're bringing the
passion. They're not really motivated until they're told they need
to be. And so it's the other side of the
cautionary tale I feel with skill versus experience. So
I love those three pieces you laid out. It kind of falls

(06:38):
in the middle of both. You know, you, you do need some skill, whether
it's because you've had experience or you were trained or you've
just figured it out, which leads into that self
motivation. Are you finding problems or
situations that might need addressed and are you taking initiative to
either speak up about it or learn how to address

(07:00):
it yourself? If it's something within the scope of your
work and are you passionate about continuing to learn and
grow? That is to me, if, if you are in a position
for a long time, unfortunately sometimes that
passion can dwindle. Which is why I also
personally love the idea of mentor, a

(07:22):
reverse mentorship with new employees because they can also help
kind of build that passion back into somebody you
know. Is that something you ever notice if a
long term employee, once a position,
how do you help them recognize like where is the passion? How do you
pull out the self motivation piece? Well, it's funny. So like

(07:46):
I, it's funny that you asked that because I actually view that a little bit
differently. I actually don't believe that you can teach people to be
passionate or motivated to do something. Yeah, they are
motivated and passionate for it or they're not now, are they? Can you teach
the skill Absolutely. But can I force somebody to care about
something they don't care about? Probably not. Right? And I have

(08:07):
seen people think that they can. Right. They just need to
be engaged in some way or, you know, or what have you, and then
they'll become passionate about something. But it doesn't really work that way. You might
get, you might get flashes of it, right? But at the
end of the day, you are the one motivating them, not themselves.
When you push them forward to stay with something temporarily

(08:30):
and it, you know, could you help them reignite
their passion? Maybe. But I also
think that a more realistic
thing, you know, is that those efforts that you might take to try to
make somebody passionate about something again would be better served
instead cultivating passion that already exists in somebody that is passionate

(08:52):
for the role. If that makes sense. Right? Like, because you
can't. It's like our kids, right? We can, if they hate school, we can
force them and poke them to get through school, but
they're not going to love school after they're done school. It's not going to change.
We can't force people to be self motivated and have an I can attitude to
overcome obstacles. They need to decide that that's how they want to live for themselves.

(09:15):
We also can't force people to like something they don't. You know, you can
put me in front of, I don't know, a sport that I don't like
or I'm not as passionate about and try to get me to watch it. And
I might watch it with you once, but probably never again
because it's just not where I'm at. And so that's why it's so
vitally important when we're hiring people to make

(09:37):
sure that we are doing a proper assessment of their ICANN attitude
and their passion, even more so than the skill. Because if you have the
ability to train, then, then
you can teach the skill. But you cannot force somebody to suddenly become
a motivated person. And you can't force them to be passionate and they're not
passionate about. It's like asking me to work at Universal Studios instead of

(10:00):
Disney. No offense to my Universal friends, I've actually never been there and I might
love it and one day I'm sure I'll get there. But just to kind of
use a lighthearted example and proof that you can
teach the skill, like you can teach the skill. There's infinite proof that you can
and it pays off to give you an example.
You know, I was, I had a good, positive, I can

(10:21):
attitude and I was passionate
about working at Disney, but I had
never served tables before like I was going to have to at Disney.
Never in my life had I ever done that. And,
and they hired me because I had that passion, right. And that
self motivated attitude. And they chose to teach me the skill.

(10:45):
And I counted by the end of my contract I had,
I was able to learn the skill. I had over 300,
300 positive comment cards from guests
who had spent time with me at La Salier Steakhouse when I worked there,
or letters that they actually took the time to write and mail to
the company. And so you can teach

(11:07):
the skill, but you cannot teach the passion.
As you were saying that. I'm picturing situations where,
you know, a company might have to restructure, be it financially or
new, new leadership. And it, the quick
reaction I see more times than not is, well, we'll just,

(11:29):
let's do the internal movement. It feels like we're doing a
favor because people aren't going to have to lose their job.
And while there might be an initial excitement for some people, like,
oh, I get to kind of switch up what I'm doing, there's an element
of curiosity. Unfortunately, a
lot of times it can feel like, oh, well, now I've been placed

(11:51):
here and the passion they had for a job they may have applied for
suddenly gets a little bit, it just goes down
a little bit because of that restructuring. So how do you help
guide leaders? And maybe I feel like this could be a whole other topic
through that process to make sure you're not
creating a culture downturn

(12:15):
by having to have that movement because you have long time people
that are maybe high performers in their role, but that doesn't
always translate to a new role. That's right. And so I'm
glad you asked that. And that's why it's just so important, Katie, because it's not
to say that people can't transfer to new roles and be passionate about it. Of
course they can. But it's so important to use a motivation

(12:37):
based interview to find out what they're really passionate about. They
might be wonderfully passionate
about the new role and learning something new. 100%
they could be. And,
and, and that might be a great move for them. It might bring them

(12:58):
new life. I mean we know both, we both know people that have worked, say
at Disney that have had, you know, tons of different
experiences while they're there and, and, and you know, that
has worked, but that's because they were going to be passionate about learning that.
And I Think you know people can be
wonderfully passionate about new rules. So but to answer your question,

(13:22):
you know, the reality is that you need to do a proper
motivation based interview to find out if people have
a good I can attitude. This can be self motivated
to overcome obstacles and passion for the role.
And, and that that really is it like and if you don't do that, it

(13:42):
won't matter what experience
they, they may have or what skills they have to bring to any
job if it's an internal change or if it's a, an external change
or what have you. The reality is that if they do not,
if you do not put them through a proper motivation

(14:03):
based interview to find out if they have both the I can
attitude and the passion for the job, then you
know you will be setting them up to fail point blank and you will not
be getting a high achiever in that role. Yep. And then I have
a feeling you'll probably end up having to find somebody new or
there will be another change. And that that's not, it's certainly

(14:24):
not what you want to have happen. So I love the, I love that
you mentioned the motivation base. That's such an important
factor that should not be looked overlooked in
interviews. That skill is important.
Having experience is nice. But are they motivated?
How will they face those obstacles?

(14:46):
Sorely underrated. So sounds like that's a big, big
piece that you support many people with, right?
100%. So like all of our recruitment
work is done, all of our recruitment work story is done using
motivation based interviewing. But
but if people want to learn directly about mbi, that's what we

(15:09):
call it and how to use it and how to and get certified
in it, they can also visit higher authority.com
because motivation based interviewing is a method that we use to measure. Now
don't get me wrong, it also measures skill. Like I told, I was telling you
about how skill is just one piece but it measures all three of those components
that high performers, high achievers have. The skill,

(15:32):
the eye can attitude and the passion. If they go to higherauthority.com
they can learn about it there as well.
Perfect. Well, I appreciate this. I think it's
important that you highlight that it's not just skill versus experience.
There is certainly more to it. And thank you for that

(15:52):
resource. You said hire authority.com
exactly. Yeah. And then if they want help recruiting using motivation based
interviewing, then our website is bestculturesolutions ca and
and if you need that referral back to higher authority, we can point you that
right in that direction as well. There's lots of training resources there, and we can
help you with it, too. So. Perfect. Absolutely.

(16:14):
Well, there's no doubt in my mind why you got all those
compliments from your years at Disney. You certainly
have made sure to make sure everybody has that great experience.
And I appreciate the way that's translated into the work you do now,
making sure that that continues for other companies. So I
appreciate you as always, Tim. All those things you say.

(16:36):
I sure hope so. We definitely work hard at trying to do that every day.
And as always, good to spend time with YouTube. Yeah, we'll have
to do this again. Don't threaten me.
Well, thank you, Tim. I look forward to talking soon.
Advertise With Us

Popular Podcasts

CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist

CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist

It’s 1996 in rural North Carolina, and an oddball crew makes history when they pull off America’s third largest cash heist. But it’s all downhill from there. Join host Johnny Knoxville as he unspools a wild and woolly tale about a group of regular ‘ol folks who risked it all for a chance at a better life. CrimeLess: Hillbilly Heist answers the question: what would you do with 17.3 million dollars? The answer includes diamond rings, mansions, velvet Elvis paintings, plus a run for the border, murder-for-hire-plots, and FBI busts.

Crime Junkie

Crime Junkie

Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.

Stuff You Should Know

Stuff You Should Know

If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.

Music, radio and podcasts, all free. Listen online or download the iHeart App.

Connect

© 2025 iHeartMedia, Inc.