August 29, 2025 • 44 mins
From the Clobo Archives comes another "classic" episode! In September of 2023, Cliff and Bobo spoke with John Andrews, a researcher with decades of experience in the field of sasquatchery! John details some of the evidence he's collected, his ongoing research, and his work with luminaries like Wes Summerlin and Bob Titmus!
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Big Food and Beyond.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
With Cliff and Bubo.
Speaker 3 (00:08):
These guys are your favorites, so like to subscribe and
rade it.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
I'm study and me.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
Righteous on yesterday and listening, oh watching Lin always keep
it squatching and now you're hosts Cliff Berrickman and James
Bubo Fay.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
This guy's a big figure. We respect him a lot.
He's been involved for fifty sixty years. Whatever it's been,
well the information, he's still got stuff going on. He
just sent me some audio through the other day. That's
something out just in the last two weeks. Great guy,
great researcher and a friend of the Squatch and this show.
John Andrews from Washington.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
John, thank you very much for coming on Big Putting
Beyond and welcome. We're so pleased and honored to have you.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (00:58):
Well, John Andrews, And as I say, I've been at
this long and I'd like to admit since believe it
or not, the late nineteen fifties and into the sixties
in Colorado. So I started there and expanded my research
into several of the Western States and British Columbia as well,
and even at one point was already to go on
(01:19):
an expedition to Mongolia to look for the almas for
the almasty. So you know, in all these years, well,
I've had quite a bit here. I've always wanted to
go to other areas more of a worldwide view of
what's going on. And we can discuss that later.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Well, John, so you said you got into it in
the late nineteen fifties early nineteen sixties. Was it the
Jerry Crewe incident that got you in it, or perhaps
John Green or what got you going?
Speaker 4 (01:44):
Yeah? Hey, what a guy questioned, Because I've been reviewing
my notes here and I just put down the word
Jerry Crew and so you might have remembered in the
well Boy Scout article back at that time, was talking
about Jerry Crew, and I talked about the Go Road,
which you all know about, and I visited and spent
(02:04):
about a week back in there here several years ago,
starting off with rather a strained incident even before we
went in to that area. So all the things had
happened there, you know, the earth moving wheel being picked
up and rolled, and then culverts, and I've worked with culverts,
(02:25):
you know, twenty foot long culverts being literally picked up
and carriaging them. The thrown into a little ravine or something.
When I read that, it only took me two seconds
to realize something real is going on. It didn't take
me long to figure out Bigfoot Israel.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Now, did you ever have a chance to meet Jerry
Crew back in the day or did there never made
the connection.
Speaker 4 (02:46):
No, it was some time before we even got into
northern California and going up the Go Road, hearing about
the history of it and knowing that it was the
one of the local bands I won't call him, tried
Indian bands that actually stopped the Go Road from going
into their sacred area. And it was like a movie,
driving up this nice uh it looked like freshly black
(03:08):
asphalted road and seeing the four slowly en roach upon
that road, and then parking and then hiking in from
there into a big burn area where we spent four
or five or six days. So I never met him,
but I've certainly had become familiar with that country here
more recently, I see.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
And you were living out in Colorado at that time.
Speaker 4 (03:29):
You said, yeah, I was in Colorado, and then we
moved to Montana after that, and I carried on my
research there.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
Now you've been back then everybody was in contact with
snail mail and phone calls pretty much, because that was
only those are the only games in town. Do you
remember being in contact with some of those early researchers
back of the day, and what were those interactions like?
Speaker 4 (03:49):
Well, you know, obviously I'd probably forgotten more than I remember,
but Bob Tipmas, who really was a big figure. I
think they might have faded a bit now because he's died,
and as you know, he spent a lot of his
life as the next paid up in Harrison. Hodgeprings close
to John Green, and I visited him on several occasions
on my own and spent hours with him, and he
(04:10):
told me some fabulous stories that I'm sure he didn't
tell anybody else. And he also gave me a cast
of his bigfoot that he had in northern California, and
so I've got that to this day.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
You gotta tell us some of those stories.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
Yeah, yeah, So can you tell us something that Bob
told me? Because unfortunately, Bob, to me is this figure
that almost nobody knows about because the new generation of
bigfooters came in with TV and YouTube and whatnot, and Bob,
mister Tipmos is just this figure that we're standing on
his shoulders, whether we realize it or not. You know,
I mean, I'm lucky, Boba and I are lucky enough
(04:45):
to realize it. But so many people have no idea
who he is. And part of that is because mister
Tipmos never really wrote much down. He recorded things on
the back of footprint casts in his beautiful, flowing cursive script,
but he never wrote a book. He didn't do very
many interviews. He didn't really seek attention at all. So
Bob is this kind of elusive, mysterious figure in the
(05:06):
history of Bigfoot which we all need to tip our
hats to. So anything you can share with us and
our audience about Bob Timmas would be very much appreciated.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
No, I think I sure can't give you some insight
into him. I really admired that guy, o end. He
was small and wiry, tougher than hell. Again, an next
American who ended up working for the Canadian government, I think,
on a wildlife officer capacity. And he spent a lot
of times plying the inner the inner passage from here
(05:35):
to Alaska in a sailboat and in other things. And
he got hurt when he was dragging his boat sailboat
onto a beach with an Indian friend, and trying to
get that boat off of the beach, he badly sprained
or injured his back. And from then on until he died,
he was in constant pain. And he tried to be
(05:58):
civil when he was there to overcome him. But he
did his best, and he traveled. He's had some amazing
things happened to him in northern California, and then we
took him on his last trip to British Columbia.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
Tell us about that a little bit.
Speaker 4 (06:14):
Well, you know, he spent a lot of time in
northern California, and I'll start with that one. And his
story there where he got the footcast was he was
by himself with a dog, and we met him there
on one occasion, and that he had by himself traveled
up what was then a dry river bed, and evening
(06:34):
caught up with him, and rather than go back, he
laid down in the river bed and covered himself with
branches and sticks and things like that to keep a
little warm. And upstream from there, up dry river. From there,
he heard these heavy footsteps and they came toward him,
back back and forth away from him, and toward him
(06:55):
on one side of the river, and he could hear
that going on all night long. And anyway, he got
up the next morning and he came out. But that's
the kind of guy that he is. He nothing scared
the guy. He was absolutely amazing. And he spent a
lot of time with John Green, since John Green only
lived about a five or ten minute drive away from him,
(07:18):
and so they became good companions over the years. So
that's how I met him. He told me a lot
of stories again that he hasn't told anybody else, I think.
And then we took him on his last trip. A
friend and I a guy who had a little, uh
like a little fishing boat, and we drove up there
and met him when we were towing the boat behind us,
(07:39):
and we took him up to Bella Coola. Now you
have to go to Williams Lake from where he lives,
which is maybe a four hour drive, and then from
there about two hundred and seventy five miles of road
into Bella Coola. And so we let him drive for
a while. But I was never so happy in my
life to get him up from the driver's seat. He
(08:02):
was a white knuckle driver.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
Well, he said, white knuckle driver. He had white knuckles
that you guys did hanging.
Speaker 4 (08:07):
On well, I mean he drove like a maniac. He
was a fast driver to corners fast and we were
very concerned about getting there alive. He seemed to have
a real man. He was a real man, a mission guy,
and so we drove in and then we took this boat.
We spent quite close to a week. He took us
(08:27):
back to for the white bear, their commody. You've heard
about up there on Prince of I'm going to say
Prince of Wales Island, where he actually saw the white bear.
He put up a trap for a big hunter in
order to catch the bear, and he never caught it.
(08:48):
But while we were up there, on two occasions, I
saw the white bear, their commody, up on the interior
of the island, and we were just fortunate at the
time we were there to have them walking along one
of the beaches, and so I saw the Kramodi there's
so many people had been looking for had never seen.
And we saw them a day later in another area
(09:10):
right up along right up at this island up there
as well. So there's not much known about them, but
they're called their Kramodi, and they're primarily we think of
why white phase of the Black Bear.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and beyond with Cliff and Bobo.
We'll be right back after these messages. Hey, Boba, whatever
happened to your gone squatch and hat used to wear
and finding Bigfoot?
Speaker 4 (09:38):
Now?
Speaker 2 (09:38):
I don't have that hat anymore. I gave it to
Lauren Coleman for his museum, but I might be asking
for it back because I'm getting a little nervous in summertime,
getting too much so on the scalp up there now,
and I'm getting bip up a mosquitoes. There's not a
big lush crop to fend them off. It's as hell, Bobs.
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Speaker 3 (11:15):
I don't know if you knew Bob Tipmas for long enough.
I don't know when these two first cross paths. But
do you have any idea the scope of the evidence
that he lost in the boat fire.
Speaker 4 (11:26):
No, I don't know of that, other than his stories
about being on a boat up in northern Alaska, coming
around a bend and literally seeing a Bigfoot on the shore,
and I think that was the first time he'd seen one,
and from then on, you know, he was hooked. So
I don't know how much he lost from the fire.
(11:47):
I just know from talking to him the knowledge he
has and some of the places he went in his
search for the Bigfoot, including northern California and the Blue
Mountains as you know, down in the south east Washington.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (12:01):
I have a number of photographs from Paul Freeman's photo
album that that were shared with me from both Michael
Freeman and the Freeman family, and also doctor Jeff Meldrim
who was given a photo album by mister Freeman, and
there's lots of pictures in there of Bob Titmas, which
is really great.
Speaker 4 (12:18):
Well, you know, and a little a side note is
that his son just called me recently and I don't
know if you knew i'd made a wax cast of
a little bust of a bigfoot.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
Yes, I'm very aware of that. I was talking to
Michael about it. Actually, great work. By the way, I
want to.
Speaker 2 (12:34):
Hear some stories, like a secret, like something no one's
heard that's a cool. Bob Tennis.
Speaker 4 (12:40):
Well, one of the fascinating ones is you know, being
a geographer, I collected a lot of maps of coastal
British Columbia that they're equivalent of the Department of the
Interior put out, and it was very much like our
USGS maps, And I got tons of those impatient together
and made marks on things that had happened up there.
And one of them dealt with two things dealt with
(13:02):
Bob talking to an Indian band and then going into
the interior not far from where they were. And it
was a hot summer day and he'd hiked up to
this He and his dog had gone up on this
river and there was a big bluff and it was hot,
and so we hitting his dog with behind this bluff,
resting in the shade. Have you heard this one?
Speaker 2 (13:19):
No?
Speaker 4 (13:20):
Just coincidentally, he looks up and there were three bigfoot
a good two cents away from him, and they were
climbing this sheer cliff wall. His description was that the
hair was kind of honey light and sort of golden
and waving in the wind. And he watched them for
fifteen or twenty minutes climb this sheer cliff wall. And
(13:41):
his description is being so much larger than us and
having a reach probably twice that of ours. They were
able to negotiate an area that normally humanly we would
have had trouble doing or couldn't do it all. And
how they would reach up with their hand and find
some small proturbance, a rock or a piece of vegetation,
grab onto it, lift their foot up, and then with
(14:03):
were not not only even all the toes, but they
would find another little ledge, and generally it was a
three toes. If we could tell there'd be some extra toes,
they would support their entire weight on those three toes
and then continue to climb that way, little by little
until they reached the top of the cliff. And that
was three of them that did that. And he and
(14:23):
his dog witnessed that. And I've I've got that mort
on my map.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
I want to see that on map.
Speaker 4 (14:30):
And the only other story I can think that we're
down in northern California where he found with a bigfoot,
you know, had thrown rocks out of the way, you know,
looking for ground squirrels, and we know, you know, you
all know about that sort of thing going on, and
then putting out of stories of knocks, sometimes very intricate,
sometimes long, and having them answer him exactly. And you've
(14:51):
heard of that too, how they're able to instantly play
back what you've done, recorded what you said, or a
rock cadence that they were able to pick up and
repeat exactly just as you have. So evidently for quite
some time he in their bigfoot carried on this little
cross communication with rocks and gosh, there's there's other choice too.
(15:18):
I'll have to think about him, but those are the
ones that stand out that Bob. Bob told me well.
Speaker 3 (15:23):
That that is one of the things that he should
be credited with, is he's the first person to ever
write about Sasquatches doing knocks of any sort. And it
might maybe there's an earlier script somewhere, but the first
inkling that any of us had was written up in
the Bay Area Group newsletter where Bob Timmos wrote in
(15:45):
and said, yeah, but for all the world, I'm tracking
this thing in Bluff Creek and it sounds like it's
hitting a log against another log. And he's the first
person ever record that in writing. Whether other people knew it,
and certainly indigenous people probably knew about that sort of stuff,
but he was the first person to ever write that
down and record it for people, so he gets that
(16:05):
credit that he kind of is the guy that should
be credited with the individual at least, I should be
credited with discovering about wood dogs.
Speaker 4 (16:15):
And as you know, he worked, from what I know,
most exclusively by himself, he and his dog, and so
there wasn't anybody else there to witness what went on
when Bob was out in the field. And as you know,
he spent winter twice down in the Blue Mountains and
you know d Duck Spring, and I've spent time up
there and camped a couple of nights at d Duck
and other areas in the Blue Mountains. And as I
(16:36):
mentioned to you, Jeff Meldrim, John mynsin Skate, Derek Randall
and I spent several days and nights up in the
Blue Mountains here several years ago. I was fortunate to
be with them and we found a bed what had
been a winter bed, probably built on top of the snow,
and then they're sunk down of course because of weight.
(16:57):
And I think I've got movies of that as well.
So I was fortunate at being able to go in
with him and spend some time in the Blue Mountains.
Speaker 3 (17:06):
I was just in the Blue Mountains last weekend. Actually,
so yeah. The aggravating thing is that I got home
and I went back to work because I, you know,
I have that Bigfoot museum. And I took a siding
report yesterday over the phone, and an elderly gentleman up
in Washington somewhere wanted to share his stuff with it.
Before you know, he left with it, basically, and I
(17:27):
opened my our siding report book and there's a blank
sighting report page with a phone number and a name
and whatever else. And I say, call this guy, and
it was from the July thirty first, and it's so
aggravating to me. So July thirty first, right, which is
a few days before I left for the Blue Mountains.
I think I was up there on the fourteenth or
something like that. And I remember and so and I said,
what's this about. He goes, Oh, this guy saw a
(17:48):
Sasquatch over by Tollgate somewhere from like fifteen feet away.
I oh, by Tollgate on the Highway twenty sixties. No, No,
somewhere in eastern Oregon. I thinking, dude, I was there
like three days. I was there like a week ago, Like,
why did you and no one followed up with the sky.
No one did anything. Oh so it's like because we
spend days driving around just looking for water where wildlife
would be, but we of course didn't find any. And
(18:11):
had I known where a sighting had occurred, like two
weeks before, I would have focused my efforts there, but
unfortunately I didn't come to my ears.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
Well, as you know as well, there's hardly any water
in that high country. As you know very well, up
there springs isolated areas like that, And of course d
Duck was unique because you know, it's been amplified, made
into a little pond, and it makes sense that bigfoot
like any other animal would come and visit that site
and leave handprints and things like that. So d Duck
Spring is a pretty a pretty neat area. And do
(18:40):
you know how it got the name d Duck? No
Wes Summerlin, who I spent some time with, and he
took us out in the field, and that's when the
Forest Service alerted me to West and all the things
he had done and his little wife Peeweek. I spent
several nights with him, but the US Forest Service, but
have forest crew was up there of course, and they
(19:01):
would do the work and then at the end of
the week or a month, whenever it was a pay period,
they would all meet at De Duck Spring and at
that point they had to deduct a certain amount from
their paycheck, and Atsfer got the term De Duck Spring.
So there's a little history that I was fortunate to
find out about.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
That's great.
Speaker 3 (19:22):
So it's also about I mean West Summerlin often gets
overshadowed by Paul Freeman, when actually they were just partners
in a lot of ways. There was no competition or
anything between them. They're just partners and they both deserve
so much credit for everything that went on in the
Blue Mountains for that time period and even before eighty
two when Paul saw one and started his Bigfoot journey.
(19:42):
And tell us a little bit about West Summerlin if
you would.
Speaker 4 (19:46):
Well, West is a hard baked little half Indian guy,
you know, spend some time in the rodeo and doing
a lot of guiding in the Blue Mountains. And when
we were up there, we found quite a few camps
that are now abandoned, you know, among others. I'm not
sure if he stayed in some of those, so I
know he spent a lot of time guiding. He also
had a pretty significant UFO experience, and maybe I don't
(20:08):
know if everybody knows about that, but West would go
up and take a string of horses with him, and
he had names for the bigfoot up there. And I'm
trying to remember a lot of this detail, but he
described him physically watching him and seeing them the size
of the by steps on this particular individual. They but
(20:29):
he got to know them as individuals up there. And
on one occasion, his horses were up there and they
were tied up for the night, and something came up
and broke the halters. I mean they just pulled them apart,
pulled the rope apart. So he told me that story.
He also told me, and those sounds pretty far fetched.
During the hunting season, he heard some gunshots going on
(20:52):
and a few moments later a bigfoot came running down
this hill and had been shot in the chest and
it was blood from the chest. It ran down to
a stream and he could hear it down there, and
evidently it was slapping water and mud on its chest
to I guess, you know, overcome the pain in the
chest and get some cold water on it. So That
(21:13):
was an amazing story that you ever heard. The Yeah
that West told me he had some hair samples he
found if you'd been in Wes's house. We spent the
night there. What a character. He didn't have any walls
in the room. He and pe we spent the night
in a bed and it was just opened everybody. He
(21:35):
must have had too many guests there. He said he
felt fenced in because he loved the outdoors, and so
he felt better when he was in a big open space.
And so you look into his room and here you see,
you see the refrigerator, you see the stove, you see
his living room, and then you see the bedroom and
that's where and then you had a big foot there.
And on that big foot that he had made a poster.
(21:57):
He had various things in there, and one of them
was a hair sample which he gave to me. He
found that up on the Tiger Mountain road. You knew
that road, Yeah, yeah, it's a windy road. I've spent
time up there. Of course, you can reach the Duck
Spring by going up Tiger Mountain. And there's a spot
up there, as you're maybe more than halfway for there's
(22:18):
a little pass in there and of course it would
be on the left hand side, and you can walk
into this little pass, climb this little ten foot precipice
and walk into this pass. At the time, I think
Cramps had gone up there and they'd gone in there.
And I found it where they had made casts bigfoot
tracks along this little stream area, and it went on
(22:41):
for a good half a mile, and I could see
tree breaks eight or nine feet up off the office trail,
and then the remnants of the cast.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
What did West teach you about the tree breaks and
tree structures.
Speaker 4 (22:53):
Well, other than the fact they thought they were territorial markers,
the fact the thing to look for, of course, would
be where they twisted. It doesn't mean bigfootoul always twist them.
But one of the characteristics, as you know over the years,
is despite the size, would be the height off the ground.
You know, they can reach up to ten feet or more.
And so if this is at the nine foot level
(23:13):
and you find them consistently, and they're supposed to point
in the direction of travel often and that they'll be
twisted around and around several times. That was what West
told me. And that's where he found these hair samples,
was up in the crotch of one of these twists,
and he gave it to me and I had it
analyzed by the Skeptical Inquirer. They didn't pay me, but
(23:36):
they have a little article on me, you know, happy
showing a footprint, you know, the typical thing. And they
sent it back to me with a lab analysis and
it came back one as unknown, but also came back
as being very human and believe it or not, as
being subject to quite a bit of weathering.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
Well, that's interesting. This must have been in like the
late nineteen eighties, if I had to guess, is that correct?
Speaker 4 (23:58):
Ah, yeah, that sounds right, of course. The telling thing
there was the idea of in being weathered.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
When you were working in the Blues and you were,
you know, hanging out with Wes and those people and
the Blue Mountain Gang. Did you ever spend any time
with Bill Lowry? Because I find him to be like
another Bob Tipmas figure that doesn't really get the credit
he deserves because he was so flying under the radar
at the time. So did you ever have a chance
to meet with mister Lowry?
Speaker 4 (24:23):
Well? I did, and as a back to West or second, yeah,
he did. Fill eclipsed by Paul. I mean we talked
about this that you know, West Reserved for some time
was kind of known locally, you know as a Bigfoot
go to person. Paul comes in and then they started
having a public get togethers in the mall. Maybe you
knew about that. I did.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
Yeah. I know dar Addington very well and she's told
me a lot about those stories.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (24:46):
Yeah, I felt badly for Wes because I think it
was kind of sidelined, you know, even kind of a
different charactery. It was very colorful, but I think he
felt a bit outclassed by, you know, by Paul, and
I think he didn't have as much of a chance
to interact with the public as he would have liked
to if Paul hadn't been there.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Again, of course Paul got those two pieces of footage
of Sasquatches as well, and you know, visual components go
so far with the public nowadays, it seems.
Speaker 4 (25:11):
So Yeah, they're basically basic entertainment. Of course, Paul did
very well with that. As far as Lowry goes, I
never met him. I just and I respected him because,
as I remember, he was a warden or a law
enforcement officer as well.
Speaker 3 (25:26):
He's like some biologists. I guess he's either a warden
or some official in the Wildlife department in Washington there.
Speaker 4 (25:32):
And so the things he's mentioned to me was I
talked to him on the phone, was something about actually
seeing one, and he was flabbergacid at the sheer size
of him. He just said, you would not believe how
big these are, he said, I never would have imagined
that they would have been a huge when I saw them.
He was blown away by their sheer size.
Speaker 3 (25:52):
Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo.
Will be right back after these messages. So we've spoken
a lot about a lot of a lot of the
historical thing or some of them, not even a lot
actually just barely the tip of the iceberg. About the
historical figures and things that you've been involved in, but
(26:14):
you are continuing your research to this day. Tell us
about some of the more interesting things that you've been
able to encounter or hear or see, like have you
ever seen a sasquat, for example, like in the last
thirty years or so, Because my first exposure to you
was at that Bellingham conference back in what was that
two thousand and four or five or something like that,
and I know that you just had gotten those amazing
(26:36):
vocalizations that I still think stand is some of the
best vocalizations out there at the time, and that's what
you spoke about there. But certainly you've seen so much,
So tell us about some of the highlights of the
last few decades if you good.
Speaker 4 (26:49):
Yeah, sure, well, all A said, I've never seen one,
and I don't know if that's what I call the
icing on the cake. It'd be nice to say I did.
That doesn't improve a lot to me any bike. Can
you know, you may see even maybe you don't see
one stop and at night, people have fleeting glimpses of
what they think they see, and then as you know,
they'll fantasize about it. Sometimes they won't talk about it
(27:10):
for months or years because it's out of the comfort zone,
and so by that time maybe they don't remember as much.
There's no doubt there's been tons of sidings. We know that.
But all the stuff I've seen from Bigfoot, Poopy the tracks,
as you know, I mentioned to its twisted vegetation, to
rock structures and stick structures, all the calls the one
(27:33):
coming up to the tent here a couple of weeks ago.
There's absolutely no doubt about their bigfoot existing. And you know,
I hope they never catch it. So if I see one,
I'll be happy. If I don't, I'll probably be just
as happy. I've come within twenty feet of seeing one,
just because I'm at bumping. Paul and I are were
going one direction and a guy came out from Texas
(27:55):
Camp and it was at a place for bigfoot crosses
and maybe you know of that spot bumping up along
the main road just a couple hundred feet what would
that be south of Texas Camp, California camp up there,
and there's actually a little place in the woods you
can look down and see a tunnel and evidently that's
where the bigfoot crosses. And that particular evening, as we
(28:17):
were palling beyond it, this fellow came around the corner
out of the camp and later told us, well, a
bigfoot just crossed behind you, and as you know, what
they'll do, they'll wait until people go beyond them, and
he caught him by surprise when he walked out and
he saw the bigfoot. So yeah, I've been close to it.
(28:38):
I've never seen him, but the tracks i've found some
of the poop that I think was unusual I've found.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
Did you read that, Scott almlas Little Well wait, wait.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
Wait before you do what Scott, I don't know anything
about this. What are you what are you talking about?
Speaker 4 (28:52):
Well, I've found several over the over the years, you know,
up and remoteras where I found one pile. It was
eighteen inches in diameter and probably at least a foot
high up in the middle of nowhere. Bears, you know,
I can have that pattern of eating somewhere, coming back
and pooping and as you know it pickting orchards. I'll
go over and guzzle down stuff, hardly eating it. They'll
(29:16):
come back and all of a sudden they got to
take a crap and it's off and with her pattern,
they'll go back to the same area. I've got one
where there's eight piles of poops around this tree and
it was clearly a bear that did it. Some of
them are huge, but this one is in the middle
of forest, there's nobody around, and it clearly looked like
a single deposit, not multiple deposits, and it was literally
(29:40):
the size of a huge dinner plate and eighteen inches
that I'm guessing and probably a foot high. So we
found that back in the middle of nowhere.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
How much did you pack out if you've had, like,
what'd you put it in?
Speaker 4 (29:52):
I'll be honest, at that point, I didn't pack any
of it out, But the second time I've got it
in my freezer. I'm sure by now it's long from
freezer Burn, but there's very remote lake off of the
Pacific Crest Trail. For Paul and I go, it's about
a seven and a half mile hike in and the
last of east hour and a half was completely off
(30:13):
the trail. One hundred came running out of their years ago.
We said he couldn't take it anymore. And we have
been back in there three times, and I've got two
recording sessions where where they come into camp at least
twelve times in one night. And it just showed up
on my tape recorder and you can hear them coming in,
you can hear them slap my tent, and you can
hear them leave. That goes on for twelve times at
(30:36):
least in one night. I'm sure they're juveniles, probably not
grown ups, for probably are watching them out of the forest.
Probably juveniles just having fun. I didn't listen to that
tape for two years, thinking nothing happened. So there's a
lesson to be learned there. When I listened to it,
I was just blown away. Within twenty minutes, I was
(30:57):
hitting the snack. As you know, as soon as they
hear deep sleeping, they'll come in, not before that time often,
And so you could spend a week up there and
think it was more of a wrong time in the world,
not knowing you had been entertained up there maybe several
nights in a row, and kind of unsatisfying, but very
(31:18):
revealing about bigfoot behavior. Oh about the poopy well up
at this lake. I was up higher coming back to
the lake, and I found this pile of scat. Now
it wasn't huge, but it was probably maybe a foot long.
It was gray, kind of a gelatinous quite gray material,
looked tery like vegetation. I have no idea what it
(31:39):
was composed of. I didn't find any animal matter in it.
It looked like tutsie rolls. They had been broken, and
they were in a perfect line, like it was stacked towardward.
They all were a straight line, none of them overlapped
each other. They were stacked like putty rolls, and they
all were stacked evenly. I've never seen that. I brought
(32:03):
it home, talked to several bear experts. We talked about wolf,
we talked about bear. Oh, we knew it wasn't elk.
They they had no answer for what I'd found. So
I don't know what it is. I found the same
thing up at this particular lake I mentioned Eastern Monroe.
I found these. I get the same kind of a
(32:25):
bunch of poope on the road in two places. So
I got it here by this time. I don't know
who could analyze it, but so I still got that.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
Well, you know about the DNA study with Darby or
cut through the North Carolina University, Right, it's free. All
you have to do is fill out a thing online
and send it to them and they will get back
to you guaranteed. This is the first university sponsored one
ever and they guarantee you will get the results back.
And with whatever it is. They're not looking for bigfoot stuff,
even though they kind of are. We had Darby on
(32:56):
as I yest a few weeks ago. They're looking at
unknown samples in an effort to identify what they are, you.
Speaker 4 (33:03):
Know, and that's even better, that's the perfect setup. You
don't want someone who's got a Bigfoot bias, as you
well know. And some of the most fascinating books I've
read had nothing to do with their interest in Bigfoot,
but just by the way things that happened to them.
So I would trust those people more than somebody with
a preconceived notion of what they're getting. And I'll talk
to Paul because we've got quite a few hair samples.
(33:24):
I've got the scat sample, and I would love to
send it to them.
Speaker 2 (33:29):
It's free.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
It's absolutely free and university sponsored. And I encourage anybody,
especially you, because who have a backlog of samples, who
has a backloag to send stuff to them because they're
rare to go and they're waiting for samples to work on.
Speaker 4 (33:44):
Well you you just send me the information. I'll be
happy to We will do that now. The other sideline
I have one thing lead to another. But speaking of
museums in general, that includes museums in India, museums here
in other places, who are sent remains of primates. In
(34:05):
some cases up in India, as you know, they sent
the remains of what clearly had been a yetty to
a museum there and they never heard anything again. Now
I'm telling people this, you can go up and beat
the woods forever. Go look in the dusty halls of
the museum, go to the basement of they' lechi in.
(34:26):
I think we're going to find a wealth of evidence
on what we're looking for. In these museums. They get
things that they are unclassified. They do know what they are,
they may know what they are, and they simply leave
them down there because they don't have a rational explanation
for them. And if they'll let you in, I think
you could get a wealth of information that would help
(34:47):
us a lot.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo.
Will be right back after these messages. So, John, you've
brought a number of audio recordings to the podcast here
to share with our listeners.
Speaker 2 (35:07):
Yeah, I've been in contact with your partner Paul. Paul
Grace has been a guest on our show before, and
he was telling me he was so excited about these
recordings you got that you just got like a couple
of weeks ago from Wanacchi National Forest. Can you tell
us about that? We'll play that.
Speaker 4 (35:21):
Well, we went to this spot that had a long
history of stuff going on. We camped out within twenty
feet of a road that goes through there. We were
there for a day and a half and only two
cars drove by an entire time, showing you how remote
it is or how unused it is. We got cozy
in our sleeping bags, and the next thing we know,
(35:42):
we hear this big, huge ruckus just outside of our tent.
Paul and I wake up and sleepily say to each other, Oh, man,
did you hear that? Oh yeah, what do you suppose
it was? Oh blah blah blah blah blah. We went
back to bed. We woke up knowing nothing else but that.
I took my tape recorder home and gee whiz I
started playing it and within about half an hour before
(36:04):
all that took place, you can hear this boom boom
boom boom boom boom boom, boom, boom boom right up
to our tent. Right up to our tent. We have
a lot of rocks and pine cones or something being
thrown at our tent during the time we were there.
You can hear them clunk plunk hitting our tent. During
and after the big stomping goes on, and then you
(36:25):
can hear a big moving noise outside of the tent,
and that's when we woke up, and so that would
be the one when they're coming into camp. So that
(37:17):
was the first thing that happened. And then sometime during
the night and now Paul tells me he has two
more of those long calls or they call in a
distance that David Ellis brought up and amplified and it's
been looped three times, and so I guess that's the
next one you'll have.
Speaker 3 (37:33):
Okay, so these are these will be three the same
call loop three different times by Dave Ellis, like he's
the guy who analyzed it and made it loop. But
this was recorded the same night as the previous recording
we just heard.
Speaker 4 (37:45):
Yeah, yeah, right.
Speaker 3 (37:46):
Okay, very good. Let's take a listen. Yeah, no question
(38:16):
about that one.
Speaker 4 (38:17):
Then. Yeah, now I think it's very good and we
might have some more to add to that. David Als
told me it's one of the more interesting recordings he
has because he said there's so much going on. He
thinks there's a language it's being spoken in there. We
have the growls. He thinks at one point it's imitating
my snoring sounds that I heard, and they were much
(38:40):
deeper and lower, So they're imitating me while I'm snoring,
and then when I'm turning back and forth having a
rough night of it, that they're taking advantage of that
and making a lot of noise in the background. So
he's got a ton of things going on during that
particular evening when and Paul and I are concerned, by
the way about going back up there because a lady disappeared.
(39:03):
I guess we talked about that. No, Yeah, this is
a scary part about. There was a lady from the
University of Washington, an older lady. Gosh, she probably my
age makes her ancient, right, So she's up there, and
this has been several years ago when she parked right
across from where we spent the night, and she was
up I think in the fall picking mushrooms, and she
(39:26):
knew there. If she'd been up there, she wasn't a
stranger to the outdoors. She disappeared without a trace and
they never found her, and Paul was involved in the
manhunt for her. The dogs traced her to a certain
area a short distance away and they lost it and
nothing was found there. Was no indications of a struggle,
(39:49):
no blood, no claw marks, nothing. She just simply vanished.
And so when we hear those aggressive sounds come up
to our car, up to our tent, we're just kind
of wondering kind of what we're doing there, you know.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
Yeah, Paul told me. He he says he's there twenty
years by himself, like no words, he said, now he
will not go there alone anymore.
Speaker 4 (40:10):
Yeah, No, we both agreed that we're and I fact,
i'd recommend everybody, of course, never go by yourself. I
used to go a lot by myself when I was ignorant.
Getting older now and I've had a good life. If
it ends, and you know, I had a lot happen,
but I don't want it to end that way. And
we know there's been things are going on in the peninsula.
I've got stories about another one, as you know, about
(40:32):
up at the border of Canada, a horrible thing that happened.
Speaker 3 (40:35):
Up there with the Sasquatch.
Speaker 4 (40:37):
Yeah outliers.
Speaker 3 (40:39):
Well yeah, yeah, why don't we save that for the
members section because I'd like to hear about those stories.
Because I'm advocate. I'm an advocate, and I try to
say this as much as possible, that these are not
your forest friends. These are not you know, necessarily benign
beings that are you know, looking out for the good
of humanity from you know, the overseer in the sky,
(41:01):
you know, as they're often painted by various people in
the Bigfoot community. These are wild animals and perhaps and
I don't think they're out to get us. I'm not
saying that. I'm not saying that they are they're evil
monsters and devils trying to get it. They are potentially
very dangerous. They are wild animals that are very human
like in a lot of ways, which might make them
even more dangerous in some ways. I don't think they're
(41:22):
out to get us, And as evidence, I always say,
look around. If they were out to get us, there'd
be very few of us left. But I do think
there are probably some bad apples out there and they
should be treated with the respect that you would give
something like say a brown bear, something like that.
Speaker 4 (41:39):
And I would certainly agree. And the stories I have,
which are brief, you know me, I don't elaborate a lot,
but the two I know about repeating the public is
hard for me because I don't want people to think
every time they go out, they're going to disappear. And
yet when you hear these stories, if I know the area,
which I do know, I wouldn't go there. Period.
Speaker 3 (42:00):
You always bring a shark cage.
Speaker 4 (42:02):
Yeah right, you're in it.
Speaker 2 (42:04):
Not them.
Speaker 3 (42:04):
You know exactly exactly.
Speaker 4 (42:07):
Who you protected? You well, number one, I guess. Well.
The other thing is we have to recognize we know
nothing about the calls we put out, at least mostly
what are we saying to them. Number two is we
may be very close to their heartland. They're going to
be stressed out if we get too close to them.
We know none of these things, and we can put
ourselves right in harms way migration routes and things like
(42:30):
that and not even know it. And so there's so
much we don't know we could put ourselves in harm's way.
Speaker 3 (42:38):
Well, you know, well, let's let's perhaps maybe end this
session and go on to the member session and we
can hear about those stories and kind of compare notes
with some of the other things that we've heard about
sasquatches being less than friendly. All right, well, John, thank
you so much for coming on and spending the last
hour with us. We're going to continue this conversation in
our members section in just a few minutes, and everybody
can listen to that on Thursday. If you're a member,
(42:59):
if you want to become a member, he can go
to Big, Bigfoot and Beyond podcast dot com and hit
the membership button and I'll tell you all about it.
But in the meantime, thank you very much John for
being on the podcast with us. We really do appreciate
you sharing some of your experiences with us.
Speaker 4 (43:14):
Thank you very much, Bobo, Cliff and Matt.
Speaker 2 (43:17):
It was a long time getting on here, but it
was worth it. I mean, it's been a couple of
years I've been trying to get you going, so yeah,
thanks for showing up.
Speaker 4 (43:23):
John, I know, no, no, thank you so much for
having me, Bobo. This has been nice training for me.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
All right. Well, cool, folks. That's John Andrews from Washington State.
He's got some ongoing stuff. Now we're gonna hear more
from him and Paul. They got some stuff they're working on.
We'll be bringing them back on probably the next couple
of months. But until then, you guys know what to
do out there. Y'all. Keep it squatchy.
Speaker 3 (43:51):
Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Bigfoot and Beyond.
If you liked what you heard, please rate and review
us on iTunes, subscribe to Bigfoot and be Beyond wherever
you get your podcasts, and follow us on Facebook and
Instagram at Bigfoot and Beyond podcast. You can find us
on Twitter at Bigfoot and Beyond that's an N in
the middle, and tweet us your thoughts and questions with
(44:14):
the hashtag Bigfoot and Beyond.
Big Food and Beyond.
Speaker 2 (00:06):
With Cliff and Bubo.
Speaker 3 (00:08):
These guys are your favorites, so like to subscribe and
rade it.
Speaker 1 (00:13):
I'm study and me.
Speaker 3 (00:18):
Righteous on yesterday and listening, oh watching Lin always keep
it squatching and now you're hosts Cliff Berrickman and James
Bubo Fay.
Speaker 2 (00:31):
This guy's a big figure. We respect him a lot.
He's been involved for fifty sixty years. Whatever it's been,
well the information, he's still got stuff going on. He
just sent me some audio through the other day. That's
something out just in the last two weeks. Great guy,
great researcher and a friend of the Squatch and this show.
John Andrews from Washington.
Speaker 3 (00:53):
John, thank you very much for coming on Big Putting
Beyond and welcome. We're so pleased and honored to have you.
Speaker 2 (00:58):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (00:58):
Well, John Andrews, And as I say, I've been at
this long and I'd like to admit since believe it
or not, the late nineteen fifties and into the sixties
in Colorado. So I started there and expanded my research
into several of the Western States and British Columbia as well,
and even at one point was already to go on
(01:19):
an expedition to Mongolia to look for the almas for
the almasty. So you know, in all these years, well,
I've had quite a bit here. I've always wanted to
go to other areas more of a worldwide view of
what's going on. And we can discuss that later.
Speaker 3 (01:34):
Well, John, so you said you got into it in
the late nineteen fifties early nineteen sixties. Was it the
Jerry Crewe incident that got you in it, or perhaps
John Green or what got you going?
Speaker 4 (01:44):
Yeah? Hey, what a guy questioned, Because I've been reviewing
my notes here and I just put down the word
Jerry Crew and so you might have remembered in the
well Boy Scout article back at that time, was talking
about Jerry Crew, and I talked about the Go Road,
which you all know about, and I visited and spent
(02:04):
about a week back in there here several years ago,
starting off with rather a strained incident even before we
went in to that area. So all the things had
happened there, you know, the earth moving wheel being picked
up and rolled, and then culverts, and I've worked with culverts,
(02:25):
you know, twenty foot long culverts being literally picked up
and carriaging them. The thrown into a little ravine or something.
When I read that, it only took me two seconds
to realize something real is going on. It didn't take
me long to figure out Bigfoot Israel.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Now, did you ever have a chance to meet Jerry
Crew back in the day or did there never made
the connection.
Speaker 4 (02:46):
No, it was some time before we even got into
northern California and going up the Go Road, hearing about
the history of it and knowing that it was the
one of the local bands I won't call him, tried
Indian bands that actually stopped the Go Road from going
into their sacred area. And it was like a movie,
driving up this nice uh it looked like freshly black
(03:08):
asphalted road and seeing the four slowly en roach upon
that road, and then parking and then hiking in from
there into a big burn area where we spent four
or five or six days. So I never met him,
but I've certainly had become familiar with that country here
more recently, I see.
Speaker 3 (03:27):
And you were living out in Colorado at that time.
Speaker 4 (03:29):
You said, yeah, I was in Colorado, and then we
moved to Montana after that, and I carried on my
research there.
Speaker 3 (03:36):
Now you've been back then everybody was in contact with
snail mail and phone calls pretty much, because that was
only those are the only games in town. Do you
remember being in contact with some of those early researchers
back of the day, and what were those interactions like?
Speaker 4 (03:49):
Well, you know, obviously I'd probably forgotten more than I remember,
but Bob Tipmas, who really was a big figure. I
think they might have faded a bit now because he's died,
and as you know, he spent a lot of his
life as the next paid up in Harrison. Hodgeprings close
to John Green, and I visited him on several occasions
on my own and spent hours with him, and he
(04:10):
told me some fabulous stories that I'm sure he didn't
tell anybody else. And he also gave me a cast
of his bigfoot that he had in northern California, and
so I've got that to this day.
Speaker 2 (04:22):
You gotta tell us some of those stories.
Speaker 3 (04:24):
Yeah, yeah, So can you tell us something that Bob
told me? Because unfortunately, Bob, to me is this figure
that almost nobody knows about because the new generation of
bigfooters came in with TV and YouTube and whatnot, and Bob,
mister Tipmos is just this figure that we're standing on
his shoulders, whether we realize it or not. You know,
I mean, I'm lucky, Boba and I are lucky enough
(04:45):
to realize it. But so many people have no idea
who he is. And part of that is because mister
Tipmos never really wrote much down. He recorded things on
the back of footprint casts in his beautiful, flowing cursive script,
but he never wrote a book. He didn't do very
many interviews. He didn't really seek attention at all. So
Bob is this kind of elusive, mysterious figure in the
(05:06):
history of Bigfoot which we all need to tip our
hats to. So anything you can share with us and
our audience about Bob Timmas would be very much appreciated.
Speaker 4 (05:14):
No, I think I sure can't give you some insight
into him. I really admired that guy, o end. He
was small and wiry, tougher than hell. Again, an next
American who ended up working for the Canadian government, I think,
on a wildlife officer capacity. And he spent a lot
of times plying the inner the inner passage from here
(05:35):
to Alaska in a sailboat and in other things. And
he got hurt when he was dragging his boat sailboat
onto a beach with an Indian friend, and trying to
get that boat off of the beach, he badly sprained
or injured his back. And from then on until he died,
he was in constant pain. And he tried to be
(05:58):
civil when he was there to overcome him. But he
did his best, and he traveled. He's had some amazing
things happened to him in northern California, and then we
took him on his last trip to British Columbia.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
Tell us about that a little bit.
Speaker 4 (06:14):
Well, you know, he spent a lot of time in
northern California, and I'll start with that one. And his
story there where he got the footcast was he was
by himself with a dog, and we met him there
on one occasion, and that he had by himself traveled
up what was then a dry river bed, and evening
(06:34):
caught up with him, and rather than go back, he
laid down in the river bed and covered himself with
branches and sticks and things like that to keep a
little warm. And upstream from there, up dry river. From there,
he heard these heavy footsteps and they came toward him,
back back and forth away from him, and toward him
(06:55):
on one side of the river, and he could hear
that going on all night long. And anyway, he got
up the next morning and he came out. But that's
the kind of guy that he is. He nothing scared
the guy. He was absolutely amazing. And he spent a
lot of time with John Green, since John Green only
lived about a five or ten minute drive away from him,
(07:18):
and so they became good companions over the years. So
that's how I met him. He told me a lot
of stories again that he hasn't told anybody else, I think.
And then we took him on his last trip. A
friend and I a guy who had a little, uh
like a little fishing boat, and we drove up there
and met him when we were towing the boat behind us,
(07:39):
and we took him up to Bella Coola. Now you
have to go to Williams Lake from where he lives,
which is maybe a four hour drive, and then from
there about two hundred and seventy five miles of road
into Bella Coola. And so we let him drive for
a while. But I was never so happy in my
life to get him up from the driver's seat. He
(08:02):
was a white knuckle driver.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
Well, he said, white knuckle driver. He had white knuckles
that you guys did hanging.
Speaker 4 (08:07):
On well, I mean he drove like a maniac. He
was a fast driver to corners fast and we were
very concerned about getting there alive. He seemed to have
a real man. He was a real man, a mission guy,
and so we drove in and then we took this boat.
We spent quite close to a week. He took us
(08:27):
back to for the white bear, their commody. You've heard
about up there on Prince of I'm going to say
Prince of Wales Island, where he actually saw the white bear.
He put up a trap for a big hunter in
order to catch the bear, and he never caught it.
(08:48):
But while we were up there, on two occasions, I
saw the white bear, their commody, up on the interior
of the island, and we were just fortunate at the
time we were there to have them walking along one
of the beaches, and so I saw the Kramodi there's
so many people had been looking for had never seen.
And we saw them a day later in another area
(09:10):
right up along right up at this island up there
as well. So there's not much known about them, but
they're called their Kramodi, and they're primarily we think of
why white phase of the Black Bear.
Speaker 3 (09:22):
Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and beyond with Cliff and Bobo.
We'll be right back after these messages. Hey, Boba, whatever
happened to your gone squatch and hat used to wear
and finding Bigfoot?
Speaker 4 (09:38):
Now?
Speaker 2 (09:38):
I don't have that hat anymore. I gave it to
Lauren Coleman for his museum, but I might be asking
for it back because I'm getting a little nervous in summertime,
getting too much so on the scalp up there now,
and I'm getting bip up a mosquitoes. There's not a
big lush crop to fend them off. It's as hell, Bobs.
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Speaker 3 (11:15):
I don't know if you knew Bob Tipmas for long enough.
I don't know when these two first cross paths. But
do you have any idea the scope of the evidence
that he lost in the boat fire.
Speaker 4 (11:26):
No, I don't know of that, other than his stories
about being on a boat up in northern Alaska, coming
around a bend and literally seeing a Bigfoot on the shore,
and I think that was the first time he'd seen one,
and from then on, you know, he was hooked. So
I don't know how much he lost from the fire.
(11:47):
I just know from talking to him the knowledge he
has and some of the places he went in his
search for the Bigfoot, including northern California and the Blue
Mountains as you know, down in the south east Washington.
Speaker 2 (12:01):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (12:01):
I have a number of photographs from Paul Freeman's photo
album that that were shared with me from both Michael
Freeman and the Freeman family, and also doctor Jeff Meldrim
who was given a photo album by mister Freeman, and
there's lots of pictures in there of Bob Titmas, which
is really great.
Speaker 4 (12:18):
Well, you know, and a little a side note is
that his son just called me recently and I don't
know if you knew i'd made a wax cast of
a little bust of a bigfoot.
Speaker 3 (12:30):
Yes, I'm very aware of that. I was talking to
Michael about it. Actually, great work. By the way, I
want to.
Speaker 2 (12:34):
Hear some stories, like a secret, like something no one's
heard that's a cool. Bob Tennis.
Speaker 4 (12:40):
Well, one of the fascinating ones is you know, being
a geographer, I collected a lot of maps of coastal
British Columbia that they're equivalent of the Department of the
Interior put out, and it was very much like our
USGS maps, And I got tons of those impatient together
and made marks on things that had happened up there.
And one of them dealt with two things dealt with
(13:02):
Bob talking to an Indian band and then going into
the interior not far from where they were. And it
was a hot summer day and he'd hiked up to
this He and his dog had gone up on this
river and there was a big bluff and it was hot,
and so we hitting his dog with behind this bluff,
resting in the shade. Have you heard this one?
Speaker 2 (13:19):
No?
Speaker 4 (13:20):
Just coincidentally, he looks up and there were three bigfoot
a good two cents away from him, and they were
climbing this sheer cliff wall. His description was that the
hair was kind of honey light and sort of golden
and waving in the wind. And he watched them for
fifteen or twenty minutes climb this sheer cliff wall. And
(13:41):
his description is being so much larger than us and
having a reach probably twice that of ours. They were
able to negotiate an area that normally humanly we would
have had trouble doing or couldn't do it all. And
how they would reach up with their hand and find
some small proturbance, a rock or a piece of vegetation,
grab onto it, lift their foot up, and then with
(14:03):
were not not only even all the toes, but they
would find another little ledge, and generally it was a
three toes. If we could tell there'd be some extra toes,
they would support their entire weight on those three toes
and then continue to climb that way, little by little
until they reached the top of the cliff. And that
was three of them that did that. And he and
(14:23):
his dog witnessed that. And I've I've got that mort
on my map.
Speaker 2 (14:28):
I want to see that on map.
Speaker 4 (14:30):
And the only other story I can think that we're
down in northern California where he found with a bigfoot,
you know, had thrown rocks out of the way, you know,
looking for ground squirrels, and we know, you know, you
all know about that sort of thing going on, and
then putting out of stories of knocks, sometimes very intricate,
sometimes long, and having them answer him exactly. And you've
(14:51):
heard of that too, how they're able to instantly play
back what you've done, recorded what you said, or a
rock cadence that they were able to pick up and
repeat exactly just as you have. So evidently for quite
some time he in their bigfoot carried on this little
cross communication with rocks and gosh, there's there's other choice too.
(15:18):
I'll have to think about him, but those are the
ones that stand out that Bob. Bob told me well.
Speaker 3 (15:23):
That that is one of the things that he should
be credited with, is he's the first person to ever
write about Sasquatches doing knocks of any sort. And it
might maybe there's an earlier script somewhere, but the first
inkling that any of us had was written up in
the Bay Area Group newsletter where Bob Timmos wrote in
(15:45):
and said, yeah, but for all the world, I'm tracking
this thing in Bluff Creek and it sounds like it's
hitting a log against another log. And he's the first
person ever record that in writing. Whether other people knew it,
and certainly indigenous people probably knew about that sort of stuff,
but he was the first person to ever write that
down and record it for people, so he gets that
(16:05):
credit that he kind of is the guy that should
be credited with the individual at least, I should be
credited with discovering about wood dogs.
Speaker 4 (16:15):
And as you know, he worked, from what I know,
most exclusively by himself, he and his dog, and so
there wasn't anybody else there to witness what went on
when Bob was out in the field. And as you know,
he spent winter twice down in the Blue Mountains and
you know d Duck Spring, and I've spent time up
there and camped a couple of nights at d Duck
and other areas in the Blue Mountains. And as I
(16:36):
mentioned to you, Jeff Meldrim, John mynsin Skate, Derek Randall
and I spent several days and nights up in the
Blue Mountains here several years ago. I was fortunate to
be with them and we found a bed what had
been a winter bed, probably built on top of the snow,
and then they're sunk down of course because of weight.
(16:57):
And I think I've got movies of that as well.
So I was fortunate at being able to go in
with him and spend some time in the Blue Mountains.
Speaker 3 (17:06):
I was just in the Blue Mountains last weekend. Actually,
so yeah. The aggravating thing is that I got home
and I went back to work because I, you know,
I have that Bigfoot museum. And I took a siding
report yesterday over the phone, and an elderly gentleman up
in Washington somewhere wanted to share his stuff with it.
Before you know, he left with it, basically, and I
(17:27):
opened my our siding report book and there's a blank
sighting report page with a phone number and a name
and whatever else. And I say, call this guy, and
it was from the July thirty first, and it's so
aggravating to me. So July thirty first, right, which is
a few days before I left for the Blue Mountains.
I think I was up there on the fourteenth or
something like that. And I remember and so and I said,
what's this about. He goes, Oh, this guy saw a
(17:48):
Sasquatch over by Tollgate somewhere from like fifteen feet away.
I oh, by Tollgate on the Highway twenty sixties. No, No,
somewhere in eastern Oregon. I thinking, dude, I was there
like three days. I was there like a week ago, Like,
why did you and no one followed up with the sky.
No one did anything. Oh so it's like because we
spend days driving around just looking for water where wildlife
would be, but we of course didn't find any. And
(18:11):
had I known where a sighting had occurred, like two
weeks before, I would have focused my efforts there, but
unfortunately I didn't come to my ears.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
Well, as you know as well, there's hardly any water
in that high country. As you know very well, up
there springs isolated areas like that, And of course d
Duck was unique because you know, it's been amplified, made
into a little pond, and it makes sense that bigfoot
like any other animal would come and visit that site
and leave handprints and things like that. So d Duck
Spring is a pretty a pretty neat area. And do
(18:40):
you know how it got the name d Duck? No
Wes Summerlin, who I spent some time with, and he
took us out in the field, and that's when the
Forest Service alerted me to West and all the things
he had done and his little wife Peeweek. I spent
several nights with him, but the US Forest Service, but
have forest crew was up there of course, and they
(19:01):
would do the work and then at the end of
the week or a month, whenever it was a pay period,
they would all meet at De Duck Spring and at
that point they had to deduct a certain amount from
their paycheck, and Atsfer got the term De Duck Spring.
So there's a little history that I was fortunate to
find out about.
Speaker 2 (19:21):
That's great.
Speaker 3 (19:22):
So it's also about I mean West Summerlin often gets
overshadowed by Paul Freeman, when actually they were just partners
in a lot of ways. There was no competition or
anything between them. They're just partners and they both deserve
so much credit for everything that went on in the
Blue Mountains for that time period and even before eighty
two when Paul saw one and started his Bigfoot journey.
(19:42):
And tell us a little bit about West Summerlin if
you would.
Speaker 4 (19:46):
Well, West is a hard baked little half Indian guy,
you know, spend some time in the rodeo and doing
a lot of guiding in the Blue Mountains. And when
we were up there, we found quite a few camps
that are now abandoned, you know, among others. I'm not
sure if he stayed in some of those, so I
know he spent a lot of time guiding. He also
had a pretty significant UFO experience, and maybe I don't
(20:08):
know if everybody knows about that, but West would go
up and take a string of horses with him, and
he had names for the bigfoot up there. And I'm
trying to remember a lot of this detail, but he
described him physically watching him and seeing them the size
of the by steps on this particular individual. They but
(20:29):
he got to know them as individuals up there. And
on one occasion, his horses were up there and they
were tied up for the night, and something came up
and broke the halters. I mean they just pulled them apart,
pulled the rope apart. So he told me that story.
He also told me, and those sounds pretty far fetched.
During the hunting season, he heard some gunshots going on
(20:52):
and a few moments later a bigfoot came running down
this hill and had been shot in the chest and
it was blood from the chest. It ran down to
a stream and he could hear it down there, and
evidently it was slapping water and mud on its chest
to I guess, you know, overcome the pain in the
chest and get some cold water on it. So That
(21:13):
was an amazing story that you ever heard. The Yeah
that West told me he had some hair samples he
found if you'd been in Wes's house. We spent the
night there. What a character. He didn't have any walls
in the room. He and pe we spent the night
in a bed and it was just opened everybody. He
(21:35):
must have had too many guests there. He said he
felt fenced in because he loved the outdoors, and so
he felt better when he was in a big open space.
And so you look into his room and here you see,
you see the refrigerator, you see the stove, you see
his living room, and then you see the bedroom and
that's where and then you had a big foot there.
And on that big foot that he had made a poster.
(21:57):
He had various things in there, and one of them
was a hair sample which he gave to me. He
found that up on the Tiger Mountain road. You knew
that road, Yeah, yeah, it's a windy road. I've spent
time up there. Of course, you can reach the Duck
Spring by going up Tiger Mountain. And there's a spot
up there, as you're maybe more than halfway for there's
(22:18):
a little pass in there and of course it would
be on the left hand side, and you can walk
into this little pass, climb this little ten foot precipice
and walk into this pass. At the time, I think
Cramps had gone up there and they'd gone in there.
And I found it where they had made casts bigfoot
tracks along this little stream area, and it went on
(22:41):
for a good half a mile, and I could see
tree breaks eight or nine feet up off the office trail,
and then the remnants of the cast.
Speaker 2 (22:49):
What did West teach you about the tree breaks and
tree structures.
Speaker 4 (22:53):
Well, other than the fact they thought they were territorial markers,
the fact the thing to look for, of course, would
be where they twisted. It doesn't mean bigfootoul always twist them.
But one of the characteristics, as you know over the years,
is despite the size, would be the height off the ground.
You know, they can reach up to ten feet or more.
And so if this is at the nine foot level
(23:13):
and you find them consistently, and they're supposed to point
in the direction of travel often and that they'll be
twisted around and around several times. That was what West
told me. And that's where he found these hair samples,
was up in the crotch of one of these twists,
and he gave it to me and I had it
analyzed by the Skeptical Inquirer. They didn't pay me, but
(23:36):
they have a little article on me, you know, happy
showing a footprint, you know, the typical thing. And they
sent it back to me with a lab analysis and
it came back one as unknown, but also came back
as being very human and believe it or not, as
being subject to quite a bit of weathering.
Speaker 3 (23:53):
Well, that's interesting. This must have been in like the
late nineteen eighties, if I had to guess, is that correct?
Speaker 4 (23:58):
Ah, yeah, that sounds right, of course. The telling thing
there was the idea of in being weathered.
Speaker 3 (24:04):
When you were working in the Blues and you were,
you know, hanging out with Wes and those people and
the Blue Mountain Gang. Did you ever spend any time
with Bill Lowry? Because I find him to be like
another Bob Tipmas figure that doesn't really get the credit
he deserves because he was so flying under the radar
at the time. So did you ever have a chance
to meet with mister Lowry?
Speaker 4 (24:23):
Well? I did, and as a back to West or second, yeah,
he did. Fill eclipsed by Paul. I mean we talked
about this that you know, West Reserved for some time
was kind of known locally, you know as a Bigfoot
go to person. Paul comes in and then they started
having a public get togethers in the mall. Maybe you
knew about that. I did.
Speaker 3 (24:42):
Yeah. I know dar Addington very well and she's told
me a lot about those stories.
Speaker 2 (24:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (24:46):
Yeah, I felt badly for Wes because I think it
was kind of sidelined, you know, even kind of a
different charactery. It was very colorful, but I think he
felt a bit outclassed by, you know, by Paul, and
I think he didn't have as much of a chance
to interact with the public as he would have liked
to if Paul hadn't been there.
Speaker 2 (25:03):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (25:03):
Again, of course Paul got those two pieces of footage
of Sasquatches as well, and you know, visual components go
so far with the public nowadays, it seems.
Speaker 4 (25:11):
So Yeah, they're basically basic entertainment. Of course, Paul did
very well with that. As far as Lowry goes, I
never met him. I just and I respected him because,
as I remember, he was a warden or a law
enforcement officer as well.
Speaker 3 (25:26):
He's like some biologists. I guess he's either a warden
or some official in the Wildlife department in Washington there.
Speaker 4 (25:32):
And so the things he's mentioned to me was I
talked to him on the phone, was something about actually
seeing one, and he was flabbergacid at the sheer size
of him. He just said, you would not believe how
big these are, he said, I never would have imagined
that they would have been a huge when I saw them.
He was blown away by their sheer size.
Speaker 3 (25:52):
Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo.
Will be right back after these messages. So we've spoken
a lot about a lot of a lot of the
historical thing or some of them, not even a lot
actually just barely the tip of the iceberg. About the
historical figures and things that you've been involved in, but
(26:14):
you are continuing your research to this day. Tell us
about some of the more interesting things that you've been
able to encounter or hear or see, like have you
ever seen a sasquat, for example, like in the last
thirty years or so, Because my first exposure to you
was at that Bellingham conference back in what was that
two thousand and four or five or something like that,
and I know that you just had gotten those amazing
(26:36):
vocalizations that I still think stand is some of the
best vocalizations out there at the time, and that's what
you spoke about there. But certainly you've seen so much,
So tell us about some of the highlights of the
last few decades if you good.
Speaker 4 (26:49):
Yeah, sure, well, all A said, I've never seen one,
and I don't know if that's what I call the
icing on the cake. It'd be nice to say I did.
That doesn't improve a lot to me any bike. Can
you know, you may see even maybe you don't see
one stop and at night, people have fleeting glimpses of
what they think they see, and then as you know,
they'll fantasize about it. Sometimes they won't talk about it
(27:10):
for months or years because it's out of the comfort zone,
and so by that time maybe they don't remember as much.
There's no doubt there's been tons of sidings. We know that.
But all the stuff I've seen from Bigfoot, Poopy the tracks,
as you know, I mentioned to its twisted vegetation, to
rock structures and stick structures, all the calls the one
(27:33):
coming up to the tent here a couple of weeks ago.
There's absolutely no doubt about their bigfoot existing. And you know,
I hope they never catch it. So if I see one,
I'll be happy. If I don't, I'll probably be just
as happy. I've come within twenty feet of seeing one,
just because I'm at bumping. Paul and I are were
going one direction and a guy came out from Texas
(27:55):
Camp and it was at a place for bigfoot crosses
and maybe you know of that spot bumping up along
the main road just a couple hundred feet what would
that be south of Texas Camp, California camp up there,
and there's actually a little place in the woods you
can look down and see a tunnel and evidently that's
where the bigfoot crosses. And that particular evening, as we
(28:17):
were palling beyond it, this fellow came around the corner
out of the camp and later told us, well, a
bigfoot just crossed behind you, and as you know, what
they'll do, they'll wait until people go beyond them, and
he caught him by surprise when he walked out and
he saw the bigfoot. So yeah, I've been close to it.
(28:38):
I've never seen him, but the tracks i've found some
of the poop that I think was unusual I've found.
Speaker 2 (28:45):
Did you read that, Scott almlas Little Well wait, wait.
Speaker 3 (28:48):
Wait before you do what Scott, I don't know anything
about this. What are you what are you talking about?
Speaker 4 (28:52):
Well, I've found several over the over the years, you know,
up and remoteras where I found one pile. It was
eighteen inches in diameter and probably at least a foot
high up in the middle of nowhere. Bears, you know,
I can have that pattern of eating somewhere, coming back
and pooping and as you know it pickting orchards. I'll
go over and guzzle down stuff, hardly eating it. They'll
(29:16):
come back and all of a sudden they got to
take a crap and it's off and with her pattern,
they'll go back to the same area. I've got one
where there's eight piles of poops around this tree and
it was clearly a bear that did it. Some of
them are huge, but this one is in the middle
of forest, there's nobody around, and it clearly looked like
a single deposit, not multiple deposits, and it was literally
(29:40):
the size of a huge dinner plate and eighteen inches
that I'm guessing and probably a foot high. So we
found that back in the middle of nowhere.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
How much did you pack out if you've had, like,
what'd you put it in?
Speaker 4 (29:52):
I'll be honest, at that point, I didn't pack any
of it out, But the second time I've got it
in my freezer. I'm sure by now it's long from
freezer Burn, but there's very remote lake off of the
Pacific Crest Trail. For Paul and I go, it's about
a seven and a half mile hike in and the
last of east hour and a half was completely off
(30:13):
the trail. One hundred came running out of their years ago.
We said he couldn't take it anymore. And we have
been back in there three times, and I've got two
recording sessions where where they come into camp at least
twelve times in one night. And it just showed up
on my tape recorder and you can hear them coming in,
you can hear them slap my tent, and you can
hear them leave. That goes on for twelve times at
(30:36):
least in one night. I'm sure they're juveniles, probably not
grown ups, for probably are watching them out of the forest.
Probably juveniles just having fun. I didn't listen to that
tape for two years, thinking nothing happened. So there's a
lesson to be learned there. When I listened to it,
I was just blown away. Within twenty minutes, I was
(30:57):
hitting the snack. As you know, as soon as they
hear deep sleeping, they'll come in, not before that time often,
And so you could spend a week up there and
think it was more of a wrong time in the world,
not knowing you had been entertained up there maybe several
nights in a row, and kind of unsatisfying, but very
(31:18):
revealing about bigfoot behavior. Oh about the poopy well up
at this lake. I was up higher coming back to
the lake, and I found this pile of scat. Now
it wasn't huge, but it was probably maybe a foot long.
It was gray, kind of a gelatinous quite gray material,
looked tery like vegetation. I have no idea what it
(31:39):
was composed of. I didn't find any animal matter in it.
It looked like tutsie rolls. They had been broken, and
they were in a perfect line, like it was stacked towardward.
They all were a straight line, none of them overlapped
each other. They were stacked like putty rolls, and they
all were stacked evenly. I've never seen that. I brought
(32:03):
it home, talked to several bear experts. We talked about wolf,
we talked about bear. Oh, we knew it wasn't elk.
They they had no answer for what I'd found. So
I don't know what it is. I found the same
thing up at this particular lake I mentioned Eastern Monroe.
I found these. I get the same kind of a
(32:25):
bunch of poope on the road in two places. So
I got it here by this time. I don't know
who could analyze it, but so I still got that.
Speaker 3 (32:35):
Well, you know about the DNA study with Darby or
cut through the North Carolina University, Right, it's free. All
you have to do is fill out a thing online
and send it to them and they will get back
to you guaranteed. This is the first university sponsored one
ever and they guarantee you will get the results back.
And with whatever it is. They're not looking for bigfoot stuff,
even though they kind of are. We had Darby on
(32:56):
as I yest a few weeks ago. They're looking at
unknown samples in an effort to identify what they are, you.
Speaker 4 (33:03):
Know, and that's even better, that's the perfect setup. You
don't want someone who's got a Bigfoot bias, as you
well know. And some of the most fascinating books I've
read had nothing to do with their interest in Bigfoot,
but just by the way things that happened to them.
So I would trust those people more than somebody with
a preconceived notion of what they're getting. And I'll talk
to Paul because we've got quite a few hair samples.
(33:24):
I've got the scat sample, and I would love to
send it to them.
Speaker 2 (33:29):
It's free.
Speaker 3 (33:30):
It's absolutely free and university sponsored. And I encourage anybody,
especially you, because who have a backlog of samples, who
has a backloag to send stuff to them because they're
rare to go and they're waiting for samples to work on.
Speaker 4 (33:44):
Well you you just send me the information. I'll be
happy to We will do that now. The other sideline
I have one thing lead to another. But speaking of
museums in general, that includes museums in India, museums here
in other places, who are sent remains of primates. In
(34:05):
some cases up in India, as you know, they sent
the remains of what clearly had been a yetty to
a museum there and they never heard anything again. Now
I'm telling people this, you can go up and beat
the woods forever. Go look in the dusty halls of
the museum, go to the basement of they' lechi in.
(34:26):
I think we're going to find a wealth of evidence
on what we're looking for. In these museums. They get
things that they are unclassified. They do know what they are,
they may know what they are, and they simply leave
them down there because they don't have a rational explanation
for them. And if they'll let you in, I think
you could get a wealth of information that would help
(34:47):
us a lot.
Speaker 3 (34:50):
Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and Bogo.
Will be right back after these messages. So, John, you've
brought a number of audio recordings to the podcast here
to share with our listeners.
Speaker 2 (35:07):
Yeah, I've been in contact with your partner Paul. Paul
Grace has been a guest on our show before, and
he was telling me he was so excited about these
recordings you got that you just got like a couple
of weeks ago from Wanacchi National Forest. Can you tell
us about that? We'll play that.
Speaker 4 (35:21):
Well, we went to this spot that had a long
history of stuff going on. We camped out within twenty
feet of a road that goes through there. We were
there for a day and a half and only two
cars drove by an entire time, showing you how remote
it is or how unused it is. We got cozy
in our sleeping bags, and the next thing we know,
(35:42):
we hear this big, huge ruckus just outside of our tent.
Paul and I wake up and sleepily say to each other, Oh, man,
did you hear that? Oh yeah, what do you suppose
it was? Oh blah blah blah blah blah. We went
back to bed. We woke up knowing nothing else but that.
I took my tape recorder home and gee whiz I
started playing it and within about half an hour before
(36:04):
all that took place, you can hear this boom boom
boom boom boom boom boom, boom, boom boom right up
to our tent. Right up to our tent. We have
a lot of rocks and pine cones or something being
thrown at our tent during the time we were there.
You can hear them clunk plunk hitting our tent. During
and after the big stomping goes on, and then you
(36:25):
can hear a big moving noise outside of the tent,
and that's when we woke up, and so that would
be the one when they're coming into camp. So that
(37:17):
was the first thing that happened. And then sometime during
the night and now Paul tells me he has two
more of those long calls or they call in a
distance that David Ellis brought up and amplified and it's
been looped three times, and so I guess that's the
next one you'll have.
Speaker 3 (37:33):
Okay, so these are these will be three the same
call loop three different times by Dave Ellis, like he's
the guy who analyzed it and made it loop. But
this was recorded the same night as the previous recording
we just heard.
Speaker 4 (37:45):
Yeah, yeah, right.
Speaker 3 (37:46):
Okay, very good. Let's take a listen. Yeah, no question
(38:16):
about that one.
Speaker 4 (38:17):
Then. Yeah, now I think it's very good and we
might have some more to add to that. David Als
told me it's one of the more interesting recordings he
has because he said there's so much going on. He
thinks there's a language it's being spoken in there. We
have the growls. He thinks at one point it's imitating
my snoring sounds that I heard, and they were much
(38:40):
deeper and lower, So they're imitating me while I'm snoring,
and then when I'm turning back and forth having a
rough night of it, that they're taking advantage of that
and making a lot of noise in the background. So
he's got a ton of things going on during that
particular evening when and Paul and I are concerned, by
the way about going back up there because a lady disappeared.
(39:03):
I guess we talked about that. No, Yeah, this is
a scary part about. There was a lady from the
University of Washington, an older lady. Gosh, she probably my
age makes her ancient, right, So she's up there, and
this has been several years ago when she parked right
across from where we spent the night, and she was
up I think in the fall picking mushrooms, and she
(39:26):
knew there. If she'd been up there, she wasn't a
stranger to the outdoors. She disappeared without a trace and
they never found her, and Paul was involved in the
manhunt for her. The dogs traced her to a certain
area a short distance away and they lost it and
nothing was found there. Was no indications of a struggle,
(39:49):
no blood, no claw marks, nothing. She just simply vanished.
And so when we hear those aggressive sounds come up
to our car, up to our tent, we're just kind
of wondering kind of what we're doing there, you know.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
Yeah, Paul told me. He he says he's there twenty
years by himself, like no words, he said, now he
will not go there alone anymore.
Speaker 4 (40:10):
Yeah, No, we both agreed that we're and I fact,
i'd recommend everybody, of course, never go by yourself. I
used to go a lot by myself when I was ignorant.
Getting older now and I've had a good life. If
it ends, and you know, I had a lot happen,
but I don't want it to end that way. And
we know there's been things are going on in the peninsula.
I've got stories about another one, as you know, about
(40:32):
up at the border of Canada, a horrible thing that happened.
Speaker 3 (40:35):
Up there with the Sasquatch.
Speaker 4 (40:37):
Yeah outliers.
Speaker 3 (40:39):
Well yeah, yeah, why don't we save that for the
members section because I'd like to hear about those stories.
Because I'm advocate. I'm an advocate, and I try to
say this as much as possible, that these are not
your forest friends. These are not you know, necessarily benign
beings that are you know, looking out for the good
of humanity from you know, the overseer in the sky,
(41:01):
you know, as they're often painted by various people in
the Bigfoot community. These are wild animals and perhaps and
I don't think they're out to get us. I'm not
saying that. I'm not saying that they are they're evil
monsters and devils trying to get it. They are potentially
very dangerous. They are wild animals that are very human
like in a lot of ways, which might make them
even more dangerous in some ways. I don't think they're
(41:22):
out to get us, And as evidence, I always say,
look around. If they were out to get us, there'd
be very few of us left. But I do think
there are probably some bad apples out there and they
should be treated with the respect that you would give
something like say a brown bear, something like that.
Speaker 4 (41:39):
And I would certainly agree. And the stories I have,
which are brief, you know me, I don't elaborate a lot,
but the two I know about repeating the public is
hard for me because I don't want people to think
every time they go out, they're going to disappear. And
yet when you hear these stories, if I know the area,
which I do know, I wouldn't go there. Period.
Speaker 3 (42:00):
You always bring a shark cage.
Speaker 4 (42:02):
Yeah right, you're in it.
Speaker 2 (42:04):
Not them.
Speaker 3 (42:04):
You know exactly exactly.
Speaker 4 (42:07):
Who you protected? You well, number one, I guess. Well.
The other thing is we have to recognize we know
nothing about the calls we put out, at least mostly
what are we saying to them. Number two is we
may be very close to their heartland. They're going to
be stressed out if we get too close to them.
We know none of these things, and we can put
ourselves right in harms way migration routes and things like
(42:30):
that and not even know it. And so there's so
much we don't know we could put ourselves in harm's way.
Speaker 3 (42:38):
Well, you know, well, let's let's perhaps maybe end this
session and go on to the member session and we
can hear about those stories and kind of compare notes
with some of the other things that we've heard about
sasquatches being less than friendly. All right, well, John, thank
you so much for coming on and spending the last
hour with us. We're going to continue this conversation in
our members section in just a few minutes, and everybody
can listen to that on Thursday. If you're a member,
(42:59):
if you want to become a member, he can go
to Big, Bigfoot and Beyond podcast dot com and hit
the membership button and I'll tell you all about it.
But in the meantime, thank you very much John for
being on the podcast with us. We really do appreciate
you sharing some of your experiences with us.
Speaker 4 (43:14):
Thank you very much, Bobo, Cliff and Matt.
Speaker 2 (43:17):
It was a long time getting on here, but it
was worth it. I mean, it's been a couple of
years I've been trying to get you going, so yeah,
thanks for showing up.
Speaker 4 (43:23):
John, I know, no, no, thank you so much for
having me, Bobo. This has been nice training for me.
Speaker 2 (43:28):
All right. Well, cool, folks. That's John Andrews from Washington State.
He's got some ongoing stuff. Now we're gonna hear more
from him and Paul. They got some stuff they're working on.
We'll be bringing them back on probably the next couple
of months. But until then, you guys know what to
do out there. Y'all. Keep it squatchy.
Speaker 3 (43:51):
Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Bigfoot and Beyond.
If you liked what you heard, please rate and review
us on iTunes, subscribe to Bigfoot and be Beyond wherever
you get your podcasts, and follow us on Facebook and
Instagram at Bigfoot and Beyond podcast. You can find us
on Twitter at Bigfoot and Beyond that's an N in
the middle, and tweet us your thoughts and questions with
(44:14):
the hashtag Bigfoot and Beyond.
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