Ep. 242 - Catching Up on New Discoveries!

Cliff Barackman and "Bigfoot & Beyond" producer Matt Pruitt catch up about new discoveries in Oregon! Cliff describes a set of impressions that he recently documented, as well as other goings-on in the realm of sasquatchery.

Get tickets to SquatchFest here: https://chamber.kelsolongviewchamber.org/events/details/squatch-fest-3753?calendarMonth=2024-01-01&fbclid=IwAR3O49ilVGqJpljelLQgJKCNI4JXn-ZwCil-VmvyskKICqvyu0XeiEtNEQ8

See the Small Town Monsters episode mentioned in the podcast here: https://youtu.be/toBAYRJwCSg?si=jICTeRgNHE7HAJXi

Sign up for our weekly bonus podcast "Beyond Bigfoot & Beyond" here: https://www.patreon.com/bigfootandbeyondpodcast

Get official "Bigfoot & Beyond with Cliff & Bobo" merchandise here: https://sasquatchprints.com/bigfoot-and-beyond-merch/

Episode Transcript

(00:02):
Big Food and Beyond with Cliff andBobo. These guys are fav It's so
like, say subscribe and rade it. I'm stuck and me righteous wish today
and listening, oh watching them alwayskeep it's watching. And now you're hosts

(00:28):
Cliff Berrickman and James Bubo Fay.Hey kids, it's Cliff, and you're
listening to Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliffand usually Bobo. But Bobo is not
here and it is no fault ofhis own. Yeah, so he is
not going to be here today.He had a family emergency. He's taking
care of things and frankly, thereare more important things in this podcast except
for you, the listeners. Bobohas something else more important going on,

(00:50):
so he's dealing with that at themoment. And this time it's absolutely with
my blessing and there's no frustration atall. And I'm pleased to welcome Matt
Pruitt as gonna he's going to beour co host here. Hey Matt,
thanks for having me. I'm alwayshere, but thanks for having me officially.
Yeah yeah, well, well thatthey can hear you now instead of
you're just lurking in the background likesome sort of creep against the back wall.

(01:11):
You know, that's how I viewyou, at least in the podcast
here. Yeah. I like tothink if they listen really really hard on
a quiet day, they can hearmy essence. In most episodes, I
was listening to a Bigfoot and Beyond. It was almost like I was being
watched. All the hair on theback of my neck went up, and
I just thought I was being watched. There was somebody else there. I
think it's that Brillet guy. He'skind of weird. Yeah, I'll put
in a really low, subtle trackof just slow breathing underneath everything. You

(01:37):
should probably do that. Actually,don't need to, because we can probably
just hear Bobo breathing in the backgroundfor most of it, either that or
Karita clapping her hands at him towake him up. Did that make it?
In the last episode, By theway, I did cut it out
because I didn't know at the timewhat was happening. So since we didn't
like intuit it, I didn't knowthat our listeners would. But you know,
if you're not a member of Bigfootand Beyond, we have a Patreon

(01:59):
show that's a bonus show for members, and in the last bonus episode.
You hear Bobo give two really big, hearty yawns during the conversation, and
then he doesn't speak for about twentyminutes. And Cliff and I were talking
and we could hear these sounds inthe background and occasionally they'd be this,
and I just thought there was somethinggoing on in his house. But then

(02:21):
when I went to mix the episodeand was listening to the tracks individually,
I could tell No, those aredefinitely hands clapping, And then I realized,
like, oh, I think that'sBobo's girlfriend trying to wake him up,
because he's sitting in front of hismicrophone with his headphones on, clearly
in the middle of a podcast asleep. I hope that's the case. I
hope that's the case. So ifyou're not a member of Bigfoot and Beyond,

(02:43):
perhaps you want to be so youcan listen to the enticing conversations of
Bobo when he's asleep. Yeah,it's only happened the one time, but
it made for some good content.I think that reminded me of in Kansas.
We were filming the Finding Bigfoot showin Kansas and we were talking to
the witness I don't remember her name. Unfortunate I'm not good at names.
We're talking to her on her frontlawn. Then she found some really interesting

(03:05):
snowprints. And I'm not really bigon bigfoot in Kansas, but these might
have been the real deal. Youknow, there's just not a lot of
habitat in Kansas, and most ofthis stuff in Kansas comes from the southeast
corner, kind of pushed up againstOklahoma, which makes sense. And that
the stuff that is a little bitfurther away, well they're always down in
the river beds and once you getfurther the further away than that, my

(03:25):
belief in it gets a little bitfurther away too. But anyway, we're
talking to her, and that wasthe day it was cold, and you
know how like the cold really messeswith your consciousness in a lot of ways,
Like it kind of makes you sleepy. You know. They always say
like don't fall asleep if you're like, you know, in danger of dying
of hypothermia or whatever. Then allthat other stuff, And of course the
television show is grueling to say thevery least. You know, crazy hours,

(03:49):
eighteen hours a day, very oftenweird sleeping habits, like you might
get like six hours this day,then like eight hours the next and four
the next and you're always waking upat different times and blah blah blah,
Wow wow wow. Filming a TVshows difficult. But anyway, we're all
standing there talking to the witness andI look over and Moneymaker falls asleep on

(04:10):
camera, standing up just for amoment, just for a moment or two.
But he kind of like kind ofcatches himself, and I think,
oh, poor Matt, because Mattis very prone to fall asleep anyway.
He's one of his superpowers. Hecan pretty much fall asleep anywhere. I
think I was on an expedition withhim once years ages years before finding Bigfoot,
and you know, he used todo all the BFRO expeditions, so

(04:30):
he'd travel around a lot. SoI'm sure he wasn't getting a lot of
sleep because those things, you know, you're out at night, and you're
out all night, and it wascold and so we were, you know,
running some of these roads. Itwas one of the earlier nights.
So we're standing in the vehicles andsort of like calling from these high points
and I just need to remember,like he did this epic ohio how and
then within twenty seconds, maybe thirtyseconds, at the most was snoring,

(04:56):
and I'm like, how do youhow do you do that? And then
immediately fall asleep in and however muchtime passed, like fifteen minutes no responses.
As someone got in the radio,it was like Matt call again and
he woke up, howled, andwas back asleep within another twenty seconds.
He's a sleeper, man, I'venever saw He's so lucky he can fall
asleep with that, because you know, even if I'm tired, I'll lay
a week in bed for forty fiveminutes before I go to sleep. Yeah,

(05:19):
it's aggravating, but Matt is,he's very blessed. And you know,
and again I'm not bagging it onMatt at all. I want to
make that very clear. Matt isa good, good friend of mine.
I love the man brother from anothermother sort of thing road family, and
there's nothing. You know, We'rebonded for life and I'm happy to call
him a friend. But man,that guy can sleep. It's astonishing.

(05:40):
Yeah, he's just harnessing the restorativepower of micro naps. I suppose he
is. Yeah, but like hismicro naps are intense and very macro nappy.
Yeah, love me some Matt Moneymaker. Man, love that guy.
I don't even know why we're talkingabout Matt. I kind of forgot why
now, but that gets this doesn'tmatter. But oh yeah, because Bobo
might have fallen the sleeper in thepodcast. Oh bobes. But anyway,

(06:02):
he's off doing some more important thingsin podcasting right now. So we're going
to tackle this podcast with Matt Prudeand I thank you for tuning in everybody.
We do appreciate it. And wehad something else planned. We're gonna
we were gonna do a topical,but that's not gonna shake because Bobo is
not here today. He gets apass today. I just thought it'd be
fun to kind of catch up.I mean, honestly, there's so much
stuff going on. I am outin the woods so much, and new

(06:25):
things are happening. There's a lotof cool things happening right now. I
thought it'd just be a neat opportunityto just kind of shoot the poop basically
for a little while and see what'sgoing on. And our listeners, of
course, can you're in the roomwith us, just enjoy what's happening and
listen to what I have to sharehere. Because there's some cool stuff.
I can't wait to tell you.I was out in the woods again in
one of my favorite spots, andwe got lucky again this time. Dave

(06:47):
Dave Ryan, who's one of theemployees at the shop, and also he
has a YouTube page. I'm gonnaplug his page right now, although he
told me he hasn't updated it ina couple of years. It's called Clackamas
Sasquatch. His name's Dave Ryan,a super good guy, a great employee,
good bigfooter. And we went outon Monday. He's a family man.
He's got a wife and kids andstuff like that, so he gets

(07:10):
out as much as he can,so if I can go with him,
I certainly do. Then a Monday, we had the opportunity to go out
to Mountain Hood National Forest in alocation that we've been kind of eye in
for a little while. We foundsome stuff there a couple other times before,
so we met out at there.We met out at the spot at
maybe ten o'clock in the morning.He drove in one way, I drove
in the other, and he basicallywhen I met him, he said,

(07:33):
hey, well let's go walk thisroad here and see if anything's going on.
And he goes, okay, butafter that, I may have found
something. A couple of roads overa couple of drainages over here, I
said, okay, well cool,let's take care of this first. We
walked that road. We found amaybe footprint, which is cool, but
had nothing to write home about.Not quite sure what it was. Because
I'll say it again, reading allthese John Green books and doctor Krantz books

(07:54):
and all that sort of stuff thatI'm sure most of our readers have read,
it really skews ones per sep andexpectation of what sasquatch footprints look like
in the wild. Okay, Now, there are very relatively few sasquatch footprint
casts out there, and I cansee why is because most people don't put
plaster in things unless it's pretty goodand crisp and clear, and frankly,

(08:16):
most people aren't prepared to pour plasterin anything because they're away from their car
and they didn't bring plaster, andthere's hiking and all that sort of stuff.
But the vast majority of sasquatch footprintsor any sort of print in the
ground is kind of a messy,vague ordeal, to say the least.
Most of the time I see thetoes in real life, and they just

(08:37):
don't show up in the cast likethat sort of stuff, or certainly they
don't show up as well in thecast. You can see them in the
cast, but they don't show upas well. So this particular maybe footprint,
well it's a maybe footprint, youknow, but it's in the right
zone, it's the right size,and maybe it was one. I don't
know. I'll put that out hopefullyin a couple of days from my museum
members, so you can always bea member of there too if you chee.

(09:00):
But so then we went over tothe spot where Dave had found an
impression and we took a look atit, and you know, it might
have been one, but it hadnothing to really hang my hat on,
you know, there were no toesthat if there was a heel, it
was kind of squared off. Isuspect that it was a little if it
was a print, and I'm sayingit was, I don't know. If

(09:20):
it was a print. It seemedto be a little bit older, and
probably it had some weather erosion goingon with it, and probably a slip
of some sort on top of it. Maybe a slip because this was on
the side of a mud puddle,but I was looking at it. He
goes, it's right here, andhe's like pointing straight down that I'm on
the other side of the mud puddlein this road. I go, well,
I mean maybe, I mean,I can see what you're talking about,

(09:41):
but what about that? And Ipoint like eight feet away from where
he's looking, and right there inthe mud there is a pretty good looking
footprint, like right in the middleof the mud, beautiful like nice rounded
heel three maybe four toes are showingwith a really big display and twelve inches
long. Now that's human size,but not a human print because the tosplay

(10:03):
was so wide. And also we'vebeen tracking a twelve inch foot in that
area since at least last February.So it's very very encouraging, and so,
oh my god, this is great. So we go back to the
car, you know, it's likemaybe a quarter and a half mile away
or something. Go back to thecar and get the plaster, and then

(10:24):
we walk back to the mud puddle. So it's a period of time later.
Now we mix up everything. Ipoured the pasture in there and say,
okay, well we got forty fiveminutes, what do you want to
do. So this particular mud puddleis formed by a spring on the side
of the hill and it flows downand crosses the road and goes down again
and flows into a small creek nearby, and that's what makes the mud there.

(10:45):
So we kind of look around inthe spring a little bit and we
walk further up in the road.It dead ends probably another quarter mile up
the road or something like that.And then what we did is from there
we went downhill to the creek,and we're gonna circle back around with the
thought of, okay, when wefind the seap. When we find the
seap going into the creek, that'swhere we'll follow it up. We'll check

(11:07):
out all the muddy areas and thenwe can pull the cast and then get
out of here. Because I hadto get home that day. Tom Powell
was coming over the house for dinnerthat night. I hadn't seen Tom in
six months or something like that,and he's a really good friend of my
wife's and mine, so he hadto be I had to be home by
four basically, So we go downto the river and we're looking through all
the sandy areas and all that stuffalong the creek bed. Were going downstream,

(11:31):
you know, kind of doing theplan, and I don't know,
fifty yards or so down from wherewe drop down to the creek, I
find another footprint and find another twelveinch footprint. This one has pretty decent
toes on it. I go,well, look at this, and Dave's
going, could that be erosion?And I'm thinking, yeah, yes,
it could be erosion, But whydoes it have a rounded heel right here?
And we're kind of going back andforth and that sort of thing.

(11:52):
And then about twelve feet away fromthat one, I find five holes in
the ground that are basely what Iinterpret at the time as tow impressions,
and there's a there's a scraped offarea where it looks like maybe a foot
had slid, and it's like,can holy grab here look at this,
And it seems I think it's thebigger one because we've been tracking a larger

(12:13):
sasquatch in the area as well.We've been getting twelve inch footprints as well
as fourteen inch footprints. At thirteenor fourteen inch footprints, but this one
looked pretty big. But I wassaying that maybe that's the big one.
That's cool, and then I'm lookingat it close and Dave is going,
could that be erosion? I go, well, I don't think so,
because it's at the top of thislittle mound here. Most erosion would happen
at the side are down below.And we're kind of going back and forth,

(12:37):
and I said, well, man, it'd be irresponsible of me to
not put plaster in this and takea look at it. So it's okay,
let's do it. But I'm thinkingit's a print. I'm thinking it's
a footprint at the time, andDave's I think he's I think he's on
the fence about it, honestly.So okay, well let's continue going because
now we got to go and wedidn't have anywhere plaster by the way,
so I had to go back tothe car and come back to get those.

(13:00):
So from that point we continued furtherdown the creek. I found another
twelve inch print, but this onewasn't hadn't have any depth in it.
It was just a mark on thebanks. I interpreted as an area where
the foot went into the sub straightto some depth and then the river level
rose and then filled it in.But there was still discoloration of the same

(13:22):
size and shape as a foot,including toes. By the way, on
this one, I have photographs ofit. And then a little bit further
from that one, I found anotherslight impression with big white tost blaze again
a twelve inch foot. Now,mind you, on the road, and
by the way, the road isburned off, it's overgrown. There's no

(13:43):
traffic on this road. Okay,there's no bikes on this road. There's
nowhere to go on this road.It dead ends right, there's no cars
on this road. There's no motorcycleson this road. I suppose it's possible
people are walking it, after all, we were walking it, but it
doesn't go anywhere, you know,So I will concede that. Okay,

(14:05):
maybe that one up up on theroad could have been a human because it's
a human size and stuff, eventhough the toastplay idem to be too wide.
But down here in the bottom ofthe creek, I don't know,
man, I just don't buy it. I don't see a person walking around
down there. And I found threeof the twelve inch ones and this big
massive one that with the holes andstuff. So I think I'm pretty excited

(14:26):
at this point. I'm pretty confidentwe have the little guy and the big
one. At this point that we'vebeen tracking since at least last February,
I think I have like six footprintsfrom these two individuals, or more.
Actually I have to guess on thatone, maybe six eight footprints from these
guys, because I always cast multipleprints whenever I can. So anyway,
we finally locate the spring, Igo up to the road. By that

(14:48):
time, you know, it's likean hour later or more so that the
cast is good enough to pull.So I pull the first cast out of
the mud buddle, go back tothe car and get drop off that cast,
get like four or five more bagsof plaster, you know, I
keep him in a gallon freezer bags. That's how I you know, divvy
out the plaster to a more orless rite amount and stuff for casting.

(15:11):
And then I bring those things backall the way up you know, like
half mile three quarters of a mileup the up that road until it ends,
and I drop down into the creekand then I backtrack and then I
go and I'm tiking off trail.Dave's somewhere else now, so I'm out
there and I start making these prints, and long story, and already long
story, trying to make that shorter. I pour these things, I get

(15:33):
them out, and actually I broketwo of them trying to get them out,
because again I was under a timecrunch because I Tom Powell's come into
the house at four o'clock and itwas already like two or two thirty.
And yeah, so it's a longdrive out there. But anyway, I
pull these things, I get themout, clean them out, and when
I get home, I hose themdown. I don't brush them off because
they're still you know, green,so to speak. At that point,

(15:56):
I give him a good hose downand bring them into the shop the next
day because I had to work onTuesday, and Dave and I are looking
at what we had done, andso, yeah, we can see the
toes here, and I still needto clean them off more thoroughly. You
know, they're not done yet byany means, but the first initial hose
down was done. So we're lookingat holy you can see this is a
toe and this is the heel.This is pretty obvious. This is cool.

(16:18):
And then we look at that bigone, the real big one,
right, and I go, yeah, I guess that's a foot. It
looks pretty funky. I mean,you can see these these things that I'm
assuming are toes up there, butwhat is this big cleft in the middle
of the planter's surface on the bottomof the foot That doesn't make sense.
R Like these two lobes on eitherside, and there's like a cleft in

(16:40):
the middle of it. And I'mthinking, what in the world is that?
And Dave looks at it and hegoes, could that be a hand?
And I went, holy crap.Stay tuned for more Bigfoot and Beyond
with Cliff and Bogo. We'll beright back after these messages. If you

(17:02):
look at your own hand, like, look at your right palm right now
wherever you are driving, well,you should probably watch the road, don't
listen to me for driving, Butif you're not driving, look at or
flying a plane or a helicopter.Look at your right hand right now,
and then kind of bring your bringyour thumb across and you see the big
like chicken meat thing that the drumstickdeal at the base of your thumb.
That's called the theener eminence. Okay, But and if you bring your thumb

(17:26):
over a little bit, it's gonnalike clench and kind of ball up a
little bit. And you're gonna seeit through the middle of your palm.
There's like a cleft, kind oflike of a butt crack in the middle
of your palm because the thiner eminence, it'll be on your right hand side.
If the thumbs sticking out to theright. There's another sort of pad
on the left hand side. It'scalled the hypo theener eminence, and there's
a there's a like a butt crack, a cleft going down the middle of

(17:49):
those That is what is present inthe cast. That is clear as day.
So I see that in my hand. I look at the cast and
I'm going, holy crap, thatmight be a hand but it's so big.
So you know, I'm at theNABC, so I just, you
know, skip over and I getthe big old nineteen eighty six Freeman hand
cast out. It's the cast.That is. It's the largest handprint I've

(18:14):
seen. It's very large, andyou know, honestly, part of the
reason it looks so big is becausepart of the risk got impressed in it.
It's not quite as large as everybodythinks it is, but it is
very, very big, don't getme wrong. But it extends to beyond
the butt of the palm, sothat's why it appears so large. And
I bring that over and I laydown that cast right over the cast that
we got on Monday, and I'llbe darn, it matches really well.

(18:37):
And then what I thought was noise, you know, just like noise of
substrate in the cast sticking off tothe right. It's exactly where the thumb
is on the Freeman hand And thenI look at some of it. There's
a lot of it's not a neatprint. I'll give Prue a picture of
it and you can post it whereveryou want to post it for our listeners.
There are matt but like, there'sa lot of noise and suggestions of

(19:00):
fingers and stuff like that. Butsure enough, those suggestions and the fingertips
and all this other stuff, theyline up exactly or exactly enough, not
exactly, but exactly enough with theFreeman handprint. Although it's about five or
ten percent smaller than the Freeman one, it's still very very large. It's
very impressive. No pun intended,but yeah, So we're pretty excited at

(19:22):
this point here at the NABC becausewe've got a lot of handprints this year.
We've been very very blessed with handprints. I mean, really, twenty
twenty three was the year the handprint. I think we might have doubled the
handprint data on record just this yearalone. But to have such a large
handprint in our area and I didn'teven recognize it as a handprint at the

(19:44):
time, I was just blown away. Man. I just we're just over
the moon right now. We're superstoked. So yeah, all those casts
from the shop as I speak,downstairs, and so I'm going to take
them home tonight and over this Christmasweekend here, I'm going to try to
clean them up a little bit.They've been sitting around for a few days
drying out. But yeah, itwas a very very eventful Monday for us,

(20:04):
and I'm hoping I have tomorrow off. I'm kind of toying with the
idea of going out there, butthere's I've been neglecting some things at home,
so I have to There's some houseworkI need to take care of,
so I might just stay home anddo that instead. But there's a lot
of talking. I guess it isa podcast. What it's why I'm here?
Does that area stay pretty free ofsnow? Is it at a good
elevation, Like, are you ableto go out there a lot through the

(20:26):
wintertime or not? It depends onthe year. Like last year, the
answer was no. Well I takethat back. Last year I found prints
on in one of the areas,and of course the NABC members know about
this in February, so I wasout there, but then I think in
March at snowed. I think thebig snow's kind of came late. I
remember right last year, like atmidway through February. But I can get

(20:48):
there now. But there's no guarantee, as the thing, because it's pretty
much right at where the snow linelikes to be a big portion of the
year, two or three four months, sometimes more. Can't you can't get
in there. It depends on theyear. Though this year, I mean,
it hasn't snowed it all yet.It hasn't been really cold yet,
although this morning was like thirty sevenor something, which is pretty cold for

(21:12):
me. But I'm sure our listenersin Minnesota are just scoffing at me.
So yeah. So I mean,hopefully when you get out here in January,
I can take you up there andshow you because you're going to be
at squatch Fest. In January,so might as well go to the woods
and look around for stuff. Yeah, I'd love to see it. See.
I try to picture it my mindwhen you describe the landscape and try
to figure out, you know,like when you talk about the creek,
because it's sort of a drainage withwalls or slopes on either side of it,

(21:34):
or is it fairly flat in thatarea? Like it's hard to picture.
So I'd love to see it inperson to get that context, because
it does really sound like you're inan area that constitutes some sort of home
range, and especially you know,the presence of a smaller individual accompanied by
a larger individual. You know,Krantz had written about and I cited this
specifically in my book because I thoughtit was such an important observation that in

(21:59):
plotting what Krantz had access to atthe time, which was just John Green's
database, which is I think hewas dealing with about sixteen or seventeen hundred
reports at that time that he foundthat sidings of females or juveniles, or
female juvenile pairs or what might beconsort pairs like male female pairings, tended
to happen in these sort of smallerareas that were he determined to be like

(22:23):
safe zones. They were a bitfurther away from human development, rural agriculture,
homes, things of that nature.And so it really seemed like a
codex in a way of like,Okay, well, if you were trying
to find a sasquatch's core area fora given individual, Females typically have home
ranges much smaller than males, andso it'd be a more manageable search area.

(22:44):
You would target sidings of females andjuveniles or the track finds of such.
And it really seems like that mightbe what's going on there. Yeah,
it seems to be so, becausewe've been tracking these same individuals for
quite some time now. And Idon't know for sure, but I think
that the stuff we were getting afew years ago might have been the larger
of the individuals. Yeah, soI don't know, I don't know.
We'll see. And of course there'swe've got a couple spots where we've been

(23:08):
getting multiple prints. Two spots inparticular, where we've been getting like a
fourteen ish inch foot and another footin one spot, this spot that I
was just talking about, it's atwelve inch foot and then in the other
spot, it's about a nine inchfoot So it seems to me that the
females are moving with the I'm guessingthat's female, you know. I think

(23:30):
it's a fairly safe assumption on mypart that it's a female moving with its
young. That seems to be appropriate. And again that that handprint, the
the thing that turned out to bea handprint, was like twelve feet away
from where the twelve inch print was. But you know, I got a
wonder, I really wonder that becausethat hand is so big. It's just
so large, and we have otherhandprints. We have two other handprints that

(23:55):
are associated with feet of about fourteeninches thirteen fourteen inches, and both of
those handprints are about the same sizefrom different individuals. And I know that
because one's from Kentucky and one isfrom Washington or actually, yeah, I
know Washington. Technically it's in theBlue Mountains right on the edge there,
but it's in Washington, So Iknow they're different animals, you know,
but they're about the same size.So we have the same more or less

(24:17):
the same size feet, more orless the same size hands. But when
you look at this other hand man, it's a big one. It's a
little bit bigger than the hand fromthe animal that we nicknamed Goliath out there
in Kentucky. But it's also alittle bit smaller than the giant handprint from
nineteen eighty six that we have thecast of in the museum here. But
if you again, I'm assuming thevast majority of our listeners have probably read

(24:41):
doctor Grover Krantz's book, and ifthey have not, you should, I
strongly recommend it. It is agreat book. But there's photographs now,
actually the photographs also in doctor Meldrum'sbook, there's a photograph of a really
big handprint, and I know indoctor Meldrum's book he does or a sketch
of where he is in ferring wherethe bones are inside the hand. It's

(25:03):
that print, but it is quitelarge. You can't really tell how large
it is obviously from photographs, eventhough doctor Krantz puts scale items in his
pictures, and I think Maldren doestoo, But I know Krantz photographs him
against a one inch grid, whichis what I also like to do.
But yeah, it is a verylarge hand. But my assumptions are getting
in the way. I assume thatthe female with thirteen or fourteen inch feet

(25:26):
is not going to have hands thissize. So it makes me wonder,
do we have another individual? Isthis the male? What did he and
if so, does the male travelwith the juvenile because there's very limited data
available, but the only one Ican think of is Glenn Thomas thing where
the male was on one side,then there's a female in the middle and

(25:48):
the juvenile on the other side,and the male was not sharing with the
rest of the family, so tospeak, and the juveniles seem to be
trying to stay away from the male. So I don't know, I've always
kind of theorized or hypothesized, speculatedmight be a far better word, really,
that maybe the females and the juvenilesare tighter perhaps than that the males,
like the males may not have anybond at all with the juveniles for

(26:11):
all. And I don't don't reallyknow, but yeah, I kind of
wonder if that hand is from adifferent individual that I don't have a footprint
from yet. Yeah, but again, I mean, I'm really interested in
goring my own sacred ox if youcan, if you know what I mean.
Like the assumptions, and I thinkI said this on a podcast maybe

(26:33):
a year ago or something. Matt, you listen to our podcast. I
never listened. I just blab Butmaybe I said this is that I'm trying
to question my own assumptions quite oftenand really wonder, like, Okay,
are these truths that we all takein the Bigfoot community as being truths?
Are they true at all? I'mfinding that a lot of them aren't,

(26:56):
or at least there's no reason tothink that. It's just that everybody says
that, and that's why I thinkit's true. But I'm starting to wonder.
I'm starting to wonder about that.But again, so anyway, back
to the handprint thing, I kindof have a there's a lot of doubt
in my mind that that handprint isfrom a female because it is so large.
In which case does that suggest something? Does that tell us anything about

(27:18):
their social structure? Again? Youknow, I think it might, and
especially if more examples can be extractedfrom the woods and shared, if we
can get more examples of juveniles inthe vicinity of big males. Or maybe
it is a female handprint. Idon't know, maybe just has big hands.
I have no idea. There's somany questions, you know, Oh,

(27:40):
certainly. And to your point aboutsacrificing your own sacred cows, so
to speak, I mean you haveto do that. You know, if
you can't take the biggest sledgehammer toyour work, somebody else will, you
know, so you might as wellbe the starting point and do everything you
can do to kick the legs outfrom under it. And if it seems
to hold, then it'll hold forother people too. But you know,

(28:02):
to your point about the things thatpeople hold up is true. I mean,
certainly things emerged from reports, databases, you know, Green could see
certain patterns emerging and developed sort ofmodels or stories to explain those patterns.
You know, you see a pattern, you infer a cause. But even
those, you know, the fourhorsemen so to speak, or as Bobo

(28:25):
said so perfectly the other day,it's really more like two horsemen and two
additional guys on ponies. So speakingof the two horsemen in particular, you
know, I don't think that theyeven intended those models to stand as sort
of like dogmatic truths. In fact, I was reading Carl Jung's It's what
posthumous biography, but it's essentially anautobiography. But there was a great quote

(28:45):
in there. I pulled out todaybecause I was like, yes, that's
exactly it. But he had said, you know, essentially, a scientific
truth is a hypothesis which might beadequate for the moment, but it's not
to be preserved as an article offaith for all time. And I think
that's straight to the point. It'slike, yeah, these things emerge,
and we of course develop models toexplain them, and we should take hammers

(29:10):
to those models and see where wecan find cracks and things of that nature.
They should be living models that evolvean update, or die off if
they don't hold up. You know, Yeah, any true scientist is always
trying to prove him or herself incorrect, doggedly, always incessantly, And if
you cannot prove yourself wrong, wellmaybe you're right, but you don't stop
trying. Certainly, what is thelargest track in that given area that you've

(29:36):
found? Me personally about fourteen inches, But there's another researcher out there work
in that It says he found somethingthat was about twenty inches in length.
Now, I don't think a sasquatchhas feet twenty inches. I think that's
far too large. So there's verylikely a lot of sliding in something of
something of that size. But youknow, maybe I'm wrong about that.

(29:57):
You know, I just don't seeasquatch foot being twenty inches long. The
largest foot that I think I haveseen in a cast is probably about sixteen
inches or so. But now havingsaid that, people are saying, oh,
but this print here is eighteen inchesand this oneever or would you know
that's all find and good. Ididn't say the largest footprint. I said

(30:18):
the largest foot, you know,And of course I haven't seen a sasquatch
foot. But what I interpret andhow I read casts, you know,
and I'm wrong a lot, butI'm very good at it. I mean,
I'm not going to I mean allmodesty aside. I'm good at footprints,
you know, that's kind of mything, even though I'm wide open
to being incorrect, and I makeall sorts of errors and mistakes all the
time. I'm not saying I'm infallible. I'm saying that I know I know

(30:41):
pretty much how to read a castpretty well. I'm better than the average
person. You know. I'm notsaying I'm great, but I'm better than
the average person. I think that'sfair to say. With my experience I
can see tracks and see the slippageand the movement and a lot of times
the interactction with the ground that thefoot did, you know, because a

(31:04):
footprint out, you know, footprintis not the shape of the foot.
It's a shape of the damage underground by the foot as a thing walks
by. I say it all thetime, and I over the years,
many many many years, I've learnedhow to read casts a little bit.
And you can see how the footinteracts with the ground if you look closely,
and you have a lot of experienceat it. So when I say

(31:25):
that the biggest foot that I've seen, I can see the damage of the
foot. It's probably about sixteen inches. But I have an example and I
talk about it all the time inthe museum here where a fourteen inch foot
left an eighteen and a half inchfoot print, you know, because of
slippage and sliding and toe spread andand you know all that kind of stuff,

(31:45):
and you can see it in thecast, and you can see the
reason for it in the cast aswell. It's stepped on a big rock
and then a slid forward deeply impressinginto the ground, and the toes spread
open like it was some sort ofbreak or braking system on the foot.
You know, it was a veryvery interesting cast. So yeah, to
answer your question, in this area, the biggest print, the biggest foot

(32:06):
I think is around thirteen or fourteeninches. But again, my friend pulled
a cast out of the area thathe said the cast is about twenty inches
long. Now I have not seenthe cast, so I'd like to take
a good hard look at that castand see if I can read it,
you know, if I can readwhat happened to that foot as it interacted
with the ground. Stay tuned formore Bigfoot and beyond with Cliff and Bogo

(32:29):
will be right back after these messages. Was it still the case that the
Elkins Creek cast? I know,for at least a while it was considered
like a representative of the largest footin the sort of collection let's say that
included you know, Krantz and Meldrumfor a while, and maybe something larger

(32:51):
has come along, but I knowfor a long time that was referenced as
being the largest on record in castform. Well, it's big, it's
certainly big. I mean, whatis it's like eighteen inches or something.
You know, I'm plugging in myhard drive so I can take a picture
of it or take a look atthe picture of the cast just you know.
Yeah, it seems like it's abit larger, just slightly than let's
say, like the Grace Harbor footOh yeah, well, the greats Harbor

(33:13):
print is fifteen inches, you know, the Hereford cast, you know,
and most and I believe, Ibelieve all of the footprint casts are of
that same individual from the nineteen eightytwo Grays Harbor events, the April and
May stuff that Hereford was involved in, and all sorts of researchers were down
the kranz So's Eric Cliff Crook wasthere, All sorts of people were down

(33:34):
there doing stuff. I believe thatall of those footprints came from one individual
sasquatch, even though everybody says therewe're two, there two distinct prints,
and I think I believe. Ithink I asked Dennis Hereford that when I
sat him down for an interview lastyear. I think he heard also that
there were two individuals but only sawone print or no, no, there
had to be two. There hadto be two. Yeah. I just

(33:55):
always thought it was interesting that thatElkins Creek cast was so large. You
know, one of the of sasquatchryhas always been that, oh, they're
smaller in the south, and youcould say, well, it's interesting that
one of the largest tracks on recordis from essentially central Georgia. It's pretty
far south, you know. Orthe other myth, oh they're more aggressive
in the south, where the majorityof aggressive reports come from the extreme northwest,

(34:19):
like you know, British Columbia onup north, not the southeast US.
And so always found those two besort of interesting observations in the light
of the myths associated with sasquatch.Yeah. Yeah, And you know,
I'm looking at a photograph of theElkins Creek cast right now. It is
obviously a slide in obviously because theheel. And I should have known this

(34:40):
because it's hanging up in the museumand I see it every single day.
It's in the gift shop. Giftshop in the museum, you have to
go in the back. It comeby a shirt and it's right there.
There's a couple of things going onwith the Elkins Creet cast, and one
of the most obvious things is atthe heel the kind of slopes inwards,
you know, like the very veryback part of the heel starts at the

(35:01):
ground level and then slowly gets deeper, which is one of the indications of
some sort of sliding going on.The toes are a little bit splayed,
not super splayed, but they arepretty far apart, and they're also kind
of deep. So yeah, itactually slid into this print. So we
don't know how long the foot is. It's a big one, don't get
me wrong. It's probably a bigmail or something if I had to guess.
But yeah, we don't know howlong the actual print is. But

(35:22):
I think the cast itself is abouteighteen inches I think if I remember right.
I don't know. It seems tome that this is a slide.
And you know, another thing aboutthe Elkins Creek cast, of course,
is that it's widely known to bethe one with dramatic lipics and whatnot.
But the impression was touched before itwas cast, because you can not only

(35:45):
see finger impressions in the cast itself, you can also see a big palm,
a human palm, in the middleof the cast, about halfway down,
with the fingers facing back towards theheel. So even if there are
dramaticallyphics in this particular cast, wehave to throw them out. If those

(36:07):
are sasquatch dramatic elyphics, it's awasted opportunity because there are human finger marks
in the in hand marks in thecast itself. We know a human touch
this the impression before it was cast, and therefore it's polluted. You know,
there's there's a turd in the jacuzzie. You know the water is still

(36:27):
warm, but you don't want togo in there. Yeah anyway, yeah,
yeah, so it's a big oldprint, but there's there is some
sliding going on for sure. Well, it is remark about what you guys
are doing over there, and especiallyfor people to hear that. You know,
it's not just a the museum isnot just a storehouse of artifacts,
so to speak. It's also sortof like a living field research project,
an ongoing field research project, andso those things get updated annually as fines

(36:52):
come in, and it's really remarkableno one else is doing anything like that,
let alone the time and the dedication, because you have this signal coming
in because there's so many people cominginto report sidings or track fines or things
of that nature. And then notonly you know, you have yourself,
but obviously a support of staff whocan go out in the field, competent
field researchers to look at and helpyou document these things. And it's it's

(37:14):
remarkable. No one, no one'sdoing that. So kudos to you and
to Nico and to Dave and toKeith and everyone there. Yeah, and
and of course Tyler as well.Yeah, we all we all have our
roles, you know. I guessI'm just the nerd or whatever, the
head nerd here, but uh,we all love going to the field.
I mean, I bet you dollar. Tyler's probably out right now doing something

(37:34):
and he's fairly new to the game. He kind of he was he was
really drumming everywhere. He's a reallygood drummer, and he was playing music
everywhere. Then he saw a sasquatchout of Mountain National Forest and he'd like
quit all his bands. And nowhe's been out in the woods like three
or four days a week. He'spretty obsessive when it comes to things like
that. And Nico of course iswell trained. He's you know, he's
going going to school form paleontology.He's a kind of a bone expert train

(37:59):
tracker day has you know, beenout there forever. He had some experiences
in the woods and he went likewhat and you know, he made a
YouTube channel and he's he's gung hoand super stoked on learning things and always
wants to go. We've got inof course. Keith, he's our contractor.
I met him through our mutual friendWill Robinson. Keats basically built the

(38:21):
museum, like he built the infant, the bones on the museum and I
hung the meat on it, youknow, because all the content is from
me, but content and artifacts andwhatnot. But he basically built the structures
and whatever for me to hang thingson. And yeah, he didn't think
twice about Bigfoot until he started workingfor us, and now he can't get
enough of it. He's out there, you know, doing the film recreations,
you know, at the Walla Wallasite with us a couple of weeks

(38:43):
ago. He's out in the fieldwith us whenever you can get Yeah,
he just loves it. Very verylucky to have the team we have here,
the location. You know, whenyou mentioned something about like I forget
how you put it, but basicallywe're a big antenna at this point getting
Biger all the time, but abig antenna where people are hearing about it,
and they say, oh, Ibet they would like to know about
this, or oh hey, ohyou found a footprint, tell them about

(39:05):
it, or there was a sightingor you know, that's how we got
the Walla Walla footage. Is thatsomebody said she posted on the Walla Walla
board on the Facebook board, andsomeone said, oh, you should tell
Cliff Berrickman about this, and shedid. You know, so it's kind
of nice to have such a neatline of incoming information. But speaking of
that, just today, just todayin the shop, a family was in
here from I forget Centralia or somethingup that direction. Anyway, they went

(39:29):
through the museum and I said,hey, did you see anything cool back
there? They go, oh,hey, you're Cliff, and I go,
yeah, I am, and well, I said, well depends who's
looking. But it turns out theywere cool. So I said, yeah,
I'm Cliff, and they said Iwant to show you something. We
got a cast in the car.And went like, oh fantastic. And
you know that sort of thing happensevery couple of weeks where it's like,
hey, we've got this in thecar. We'd love to show you.

(39:51):
You know, he usually doesn't showturned out to be too much, too
exciting, but every once in awhile it does, and today was kind
of neat. He went out tothe car and he brought in this cast
and he put it on the tableand I immediately recognized it. It wasn't
a new cast. I was kindof hoping it would be, but I
immediately recognized as a Ray Wallace hoax, which you know when you know,

(40:13):
I'm not a big fan of hoaxes, but I am a big fan of
Bigfoot history, and Ray Wallace hoaxesare part of the history, whether we
like it or not. And Isaid, Oh, where did you get
this? He goes, oh,well, I think his dad or somebody
worked at a fiberglass plant when hewas a kid. In about nineteen eighty
three, he was at his dad'swork and they somebody brought in a semi

(40:34):
translucent resin cast of a bigfoot.It was that one and his friend borrowed
it and made a mold and madea duplicate. So this is actually a
duplicate of a Ray Wallace hoax.And I goes, oh, that's a
Ray And I started telling about thehistory of Ray Wallace and his position in
the history, you know, likehe owned the he owned the log building

(40:58):
or the road building crew ineteen fiftyeight, and then he sub contracted the
job the Jerry Crew, who gotthe footprints of the Sasquatch. You know,
from I understand, Ray Wallace wasn'teven the state at the time,
so he could didn't plant those,But he actually was the recipient of the
government contract to build the first roadin the Bluff Creek, and he subcontracted

(41:19):
that out to Jerry Crew. SoJerry It's often written that Jerry Crew worked
for Ray Wallace, and I guessthat's technically true, but Ray Wallace wasn't
there, he wasn't on site,and Jerry Crew wasn't working for Ray taking
directions from him at the time.That's not the way it happened. He
subcontracted the entire job to Jerry CRU'sroad building operation, and that's how that
happened. But I kind of explainedall that, and I went over and

(41:43):
I pulled off doctor Meldrum's book fromthe shelf and I said, well,
look at this, and I flippedit open and I said, there's your
cast, and there's a picture ofthe same cast in doctor Meldrum's book,
and he goes, oh my god. He immediately recognized there it is,
you know, and we didn't leavethe cast with us, which is fine.
You know, I'm looking for actuallya real Ray Wallace original. I'd
love to have one of those,so if anybody knows where I can find
one, let me know. Butinside that resin mold or the resin cast

(42:07):
that I mentioned, the translucent resincast, was a like a brochure shaped
piece of paper with information about Bigfootin this weird, you know, nineteen
seventies typewriter script, and it was, you know stuff, you know,
it's just like Bigfoot is a blahblah blah and possible relative of Homo sapiens

(42:28):
and all this kind of antiquated sortof stuff. And he said that the
piece of paper was inside the resthe translucent resin cast that this was made
off of, and then someone ofhis friends remade it, like, you
know, somehow scanned it, andhe gave us a bunch of copies of
that, which I thought was kindof neat. So just today somebody brought
in a copy of a piece ofhistory. And you know, history is

(42:51):
part of what the NBC is allabout honestly, So it was really really
neat to kind of see that comein the door. I took some pictures
of it, and I will beposting that in the next couple of days
for our museum members. Yeah,probably not something that we necessarily need to
post for a Bigfoot and beyond andthose people care, but you know,
for the museum members, they'll beseeing that soon. So it's kind of
neat. Oh, that's very coolfor history like that to come in.

(43:12):
Yeah. Things just walk in thedoor all the time, you know.
Yeah. I I remember a coupleof years ago somebody walked in the door
and they're looking around and says,you don't have anything about my family here?
Who who are you? He goes, Oh, my name is Neil
Beck. And I went like,holy crap, Fred, how are you
related to Fred? He goes,oh, that he's my great great uncle
or something like that he said,and I just went like no, yeah,

(43:35):
And then I still I still talkto Neil. With all this Ape
Canyon stuff that's happening right now,there's I don't think it's out yet,
so I'm not going to talk aboutbut kol Ape Canyon stuff is on the
horizon, So I've been I've beencalling Neil and talking to him lately and
stuff. So you just never knowwho's going to come in the door.
You just never know. Stay tunedfor more Bigfoot and Beyond with Cliff and

(43:55):
Bogo. We'll be right back afterthese messages. Yeah, you just never
know who's going to be here.It's a really fun place to work.
Oh, I can't wait to seeit. You know. I visited you
in I guess it was September orOctober of twenty nineteen, and at that
point the gift shop was open,but the museum portion wasn't completed or open

(44:16):
to the public yet. So Ican't wait to see what it looks like
now. I'm really excited about it. Yeah, it kind of sucked then,
but it's great now. It's noteven great now. It's pretty good
now. I'm a pretty harsh criticon myself. It's pretty good now.
But knowing what we have in youknow, what's coming up in the next
couple of months, and the stuffthat you know, I've already paid for

(44:37):
that we haven't received, and there'ssome really really cool things coming. Man.
I cannot I am just tickled.I'm tickled pink about this coming summer,
because you know, we make allof our money in the summer,
because we're kind of a tourism industryat the end of the day, and
so during the fall and winter weimprove things. Like I don't know if
you've been hearing Matt or our audiencefor that matter, but there's been banging

(44:57):
in the background, like bam inthe background. That's because literally right now
as I speak, Keith is downstairs, and you know, Dave was here
for a while. Dave and Keithwere taking everything off one of the walls
and we're repainting one of the wallsdownstairs and putting up shelving where we can
display some really cool items that we'vebeen getting in lately, not for a

(45:19):
museum displays, but for like,you know, merchandise displays. There are
certain things that we keep behind theshelves that people can't put their hands on
because because they're too expensive. Wejust got, like, we have a
thermal imaging camera in the shop that'sgoing to go back in there. We
have we just got a bunch ofautographed John Green stuff in that I put
out for some museum members. Ialways sell the cool stuff to the museum

(45:42):
members first. There's usually nothing leftafter they get they get a hold of
it. But yeah, that kindof thing is going to go behind the
counter on these shelves and stuff.And yeah, so we're improving things all
the time. It's it's it's alot of fun, you know. It's
it's like this really cool living artproject that I get to work on every
day. I show up to workand you know, I cataloged some footprint

(46:05):
casts, I added another cast tothe inventory. I did some proof reading
in the back. Like every dayis Bigfoot Creativity Day for Cliff. It's
a lot of fun to work here. Oh that's hot. I really can't
wait to see it. Like Isaid, I'll be out there in January,
so super excited about it. Maybewe should plug the squatch Fest.

(46:25):
I actually just got an email fromthe organizer today, so it's fresh on
my mind. So I'm really lookingforward to to getting out there. And
I know you've done that event severaltimes and always spoke really highly of it.
Oh, it's one of my favorites. Yeah, it's a great event.
I'd love the fact that it's local, you know, and it's but
it's not just that it's local thatthat makes me tickled about squatch Fest every
year. And it's not just thespeakers either, and they tend to get

(46:47):
really good speakers, but you know, everybody hangs out and it's just a
good time. Like for example,like you know, so you and you're
going to be staying at the housefor a couple of days before squatch Fest.
We're gonna hang out. We're gonnago to the woods and go to
the museum and do all that sortof stuff. Yesterday I got call Michael
Freeman needs a place to stay,So Mike's gonna be stay at the house
too. So Michael will be atthe house and the doctor melderm may or

(47:07):
may not be out. I haven'tspoken to him lately, so yeah,
and it's just gonna be a greattime. It's a lot of fun.
Yeah. It looks like it's Friday, January twenty sixth and Saturday January twenty
seven so a two day event there. And I know they've got a lot
of vendors signed up. And Ijust can't wait to see you and see
doctor Meldrim again. And you know, I've lived in the Northwest for almost

(47:28):
three years. I've got a lotof friends that are to come out,
so it'll be really cool, reallycool trip to catch up with squatching buddies
and some normies, some non squatchingbuddies who are going to come out.
I actually have a friend from Atlantawho now lives in Kelso, and I
kind of forgot that he was livingout there, and then he messaged me
a picture of the flyer and hewas like, dude, you're coming to

(47:49):
town. I'm going to the event. So very exciting. A lot of
people show up, Like three orfour thousand people go through the doors in
those two days. Yeah, it'sa really neat event. And you know,
obviously it's it's good for the museumbecause you know, everything I sell
at my table goes to the museumor whatever. I enjoy speaking to the
local home crowd. I really enjoythat a lot. Actually, still I

(48:09):
think I'm going to be doing abrand new presentation too. I'm still kind
of formulating it. I mentioned recentlyI want it to be about hand prints,
but I think I may have toexpand that a little bit. In
fact, I mentioned earlier I've beenkicking around this idea twenty twenty three year.
The handprints it might be something alongthose lines, because that'll let me
have a chance to not only speakabout hand prints and what they mean to

(48:30):
us the researchers, and what wecan learn about the animals by studying them,
but it also kind of highlights someof the stuff that we're doing at
the NABC, you know, becauseI do kind of like touting our efforts
at the museum to other people,to kind of say, hey, this
is just like an hour south ofyou. You guys are hunters, you're

(48:51):
out in the woods, you know, Like tell me what's going on.
Let me know what's going on here. I'm local. This seems like an
appropriate time or place we can givea plug to our friends over there,
small town monsters. I guess Eli, who was a recent guest on the
on the podcast here, Eli recentlydid a I guess a visit or an
expedition or something with the Olympic Projectfolks, and I guess a couple of

(49:13):
days ago David was telling me aboutit. I really haven't had a chance
to look at it yet. Andyou know, I don't generally watch Bigfoot
TV stuff anyway, but I dolike the small town Monsters guys and gals.
But they did something recently on justthe Nest site. Have you seen
this thing yet? You know,I know it's an episodic series, and
I watched the first episode and itwas excellent. So I haven't seen the

(49:34):
newest one yet, but I didsee the first one, and you know,
I can't say enough nice things aboutEli. He's a great filmmaker.
He's got a good eye for thatstuff. He's a great student of the
Sasquatch subject. And so I'm definitelygonna watch the whole series. Yeah,
Dave was saying that, I guessit's gonna be a two parter of this
one, and the first one ismostly about the nets in general, and
and I guess at the end ofthis one they they just start talking about

(49:58):
the second Nest site. And youknow, I was pretty heavily involved in
this, at least the second oneat the very beginning, and the first
one as well, So I'm kindof anxious to see that. I think
that'd be kind of neat. Sothat's a new thing that's out there that
I think that people probably should gowatch, you know, especially if you
have more questions about the nest site. And I kind of I didn't have
time, because I pulled it openright before I was supposed to come upstairs

(50:20):
and do the podcast here. ButI did have time to kind of scrub
through it, you know, likelike kind of fast forward through it.
It seems like you get a lotof good information straight from Derek and Shane
and to Odd and all those folks, you know, Chris, everybody who's
still working out there in the websin the nest site. Dave gave me
the low down that they start touchingon the vocalization study they've been doing out
there, which is probably second tonone because they have these long term recorders

(50:44):
out there, and I will saythey're doing a far better job than we
are here at the museum doing thatkind of thing. Our focus is really
not on the vocalizations, but wedo have a couple of long term recorders
out there. But they are doingan excellent, excellent job cataloging the soundsifying
the sounds and put them all inthe spreadsheets and trying to squeeze information out

(51:04):
of that stuff. I guess they'restarting to touch on that because I know
what's happening behind the scenes, Likeyou know, I've seen the data.
You know, Chris has been atthe shop with the footprints of the cast,
and like I've seen the data andI know the story, I don't
know the documentary. You know.That's maybe that's part of the reason I
don't watch a lot of big FootTVs because I know what's already going and
I already know what's going on behindthe scenes, you know. But I
guess Dave was talking about that tome, so I guess some of that

(51:28):
might be in the documentary. Butreally the joy of it, I think
for people who have never been tothe nest site, and most people never
will, of course, but thepeople who are interested in the nest site,
you get to see them. Youreally get to see a lot of
video of the nests themselves, andparticularly that second nests seite, because I
find myself describing that second nest sitequite often because in the museum not all.

(51:51):
I mean, they do have aI did catch that the guys Shane
and Derek and those folks were makinga net, and of course they did
that a number of years ago andthen presented the nest at the squatch Fest
event that we were just talking about. So they brought their their their nest
in and they basically made a nestas an experiment to figure out like,

(52:13):
okay, what is what does ittake to make one of these things?
And they learned a lot from doingit. That nest replica, by the
way, is in the NABC.It is here on site, on display
all the time, and with threefull information panels about the nest site,
well the nests in general. Wehave a brand new one that's up maybe

(52:35):
about two months old at the most. About the second nest site discovered one
ridge over from the original nests,and in that see the first the first
nest displays like okay that this happened. There's pictures of the rocks that were
banging together and all that jazz.The second nest site display is a little
bit more. It's information like,hey, they discovered another one. Here's
the circumstances of what what they justwhen they discovered it. Here is a

(53:00):
container full of nesting material from thenest site itself, including and here's a
hair that we found in the nestingmaterial. And also here is a footprint
cast from one of the fourteen inchfootprints that we found and cast at the
site and underneath the material themselves.So that was kind of neat and then

(53:22):
finally the third panel there by,the nest is not about the nests,
but about the pioneering work of LoriJoe Hamilton, a good good friend of
mine, unsung hero and bigfoot.She deserves to be my top bill basically
on a big foot billboard. There. She has been doing excellent quiet work

(53:42):
out there with her dog Marley,walking around and casting footprints since twenty fourteen
or fifteen, unbeknownst to her,within five miles of the nest site,
north, south, east and westof the nest site area and showing the
same individuals that seem to be pressedat the nest site, like literally very
likely the same bigfoots who made thenest. And of course Laurie didn't know

(54:06):
anything about the Olympic project, andthe Olympic Project ever heard of Lori.
I've introduced them, you know.Now they all know each other and communicating
stuff. But so she has herown big display panel with a bunch of
her casts as well. Yeah,so it's neat to see the nest site
documentary kind of make the light ofday and for people who are interested in

(54:28):
what the nests are, what theycould mean, how they were made,
the context of the find and theongoing saga. Well, check out the
new documentary whatever it's called on smallTown Monster stuff. I'm like the worst
guy for plugging things, you know. Check out the new documentary whatever it's
called. The link in the shownotes. It was really cool that first

(54:50):
episode because he also got a lotof video that they had taken over the
years, and so he'd incorporated that. So there's almost like that documentary style
where you can see the progression overthe years of the field research that members
of the Olympic Project are conducting there. And that's really cool that I didn't
know that they were getting into someof the audio stuff, because yeah,

(55:10):
Chris Spencer spearheads that and is,you know, in my opinion, the
best person doing sort of audio workout there. You know, Chris,
you know, I consider a verydear friend, and I could just tell
when I met him because as youknow, you know, doing this for
so long, you travel around thecountry, you meet a lot of people,
and the majority of people that youmeet are sort of enthusiasts or proponents

(55:34):
or you know, but enthusias wouldprobably be the right word, like people
who are fans of the subject whofollow it maybe loosely, you know,
maybe they get out once or twicea year or something like that, or
they engage in the community side ofit. And those people tend to come
and go just because you know,interests change and they wane, you know,
whether you're following this or any othersubject. But there's just always a

(55:55):
tinier handful of people that are thelifers, you know what I mean.
And so I look back at aslong as I've been involved, and some
of the same people have been around, you know, you Darryl call your
Mike Mays. You know, I'vegot a number of these, Derek,
etcetera. As one of them.And I was aware of Chris, but
once I met him and started talkingto him, I was like, oh,
he's one of us, for sure. You know, he's a lifer,

(56:19):
like one of us kind of thing. So goa goba hey, Yeah.
So I think the world of Chris, and he's doing stellar work in
that regard. So I'm glad thatelement of what they're doing is being showcased.
In addition to not just the analysisof these nests and trying to get
to the bottom of that particular phenomenon, let's say, but audio work too.
Because it's Chris is doing this sortof herculean effort there. Well,

(56:43):
all right, Matt, I mean, I mean there's I guess that's a
catching up session. I mean,we didn't have Bubble with us. But
since you're rarely a voice that isheard on the regular episode, you're always
lurking in the shadows, I thoughtthis might be a fun opportunity just to
kind of catch up and talk aboutvarious things have been happening. Get your
point of view, even though itseems like I was mostly doing the talking
in this one. But whatever.You've been a guest on the show a
couple of times, but there yougo. No, I love hearing the

(57:06):
updates. Like I said, kudosto everyone at the NAPC, And what
you're doing is awesome and I can'twait to see it in January. I
can't believe how lucky I am thatI get to do this. I really
really appreciative of this accident that Ican call my life. You know,
absolutely all right, Well, Iguess with that, listen next time if

(57:27):
you can, you know, phonethe neighbors, wake the kids, tell
them to listen to Bigfoot and Beyondwith Cliff and Bobo. And Matt lurking
around here somewhere, and we're goingto go record a members episode here next
And if you want to be amember of Bigfoot and Beyond, just go
to Bigfoot and Beyond podcast dot comand you hit the membership button or Matt
Pru. Of course, we'll putthe link in the show notes, and

(57:47):
then hopefully next week Bobo will bewith us. We expect him to be.
Of course, today was kind ofan anomaly. He had to cancel
the last minute just a couple hoursago, and this case, it is
totally acceptable he did so. Soanyway, tune in next week. So,
Matt Prue, would you like todo your best Bobo imitation and take
us out of here? Yep?Sure, all right, folks, make

(58:08):
sure to like sei you subscribe,give us a five star rating, and
keep it squatchy. Thanks for listeningto this week's episode of Bigfoot and Beyond.
If you liked what you heard,please rate and review us on iTunes,
Subscribe to Bigfoot and Beyond wherever youget your podcasts, and follow us

(58:30):
on Facebook and Instagram at Bigfoot andBeyond podcast. You can find us on
Twitter at Bigfoot and Beyond. That'san n in the middle and tweet us
your thoughts and questions with the hashtagBigfoot and Beyond.