Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now. Earlier this week, the Northern Territory government released the
Strategic Regional Environmental and Baseline Assessment. It's known as the
SHRIBA for the Beaterloo sub Basin, which is one of
the key recommendations from the Scientific Inquiry into Fracturing in
the Northern Territory or fracking as we know it now.
The STREBER accounts for thirty five of the inquiri's recommendations
(00:22):
and aims to provide information well so that the appropriate
decisions can be made about the development of natural gas
extraction in the Beaterloo region, including the assessment of water
biodiversity resources to inform land use planning, and the collection
of baseline data to provide a reference for ongoing monitoring now.
(00:42):
The government says that the SHREBER puts more protections in
place for groundwater than ever before, not just in the
Beaterloo region, but right across the entire Northern Territory. So
where are things at when it comes to the be
Toloo Well, joining me in the studio right now is
High Energy CEO Alex Underwood. Good morning to you, Alex.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Good o Katie. Great to meet you and good to
be here in beautiful sunny Darlin.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Yeah, good to have you in the studio. Thank you
so much for your time now, Alex. Obviously the government
made this announcement earlier in the week. Does it provide
more or less certainty when it comes to the Beadlow?
Speaker 2 (01:19):
In our opinion, this is a really key development in
terms of rounding off one hundred and thirty five recommendations
of the Pepper inquiry. You know, there's been a massive
piece of work done by government over the last five
years to implement all of those recommendations, and this gives
effect to thirty five of those recommendations.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
You know.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
The final step to move into production licenses would be
the final sign off of the government, and we understand
from comments by Minister Moss yesterday that that'll be potentially
happening in the next few weeks. In terms of the
impact of the Cerebra on industry, first of all, I
should say we haven't had a chance to read it yet.
It's hundreds of pages of work and it's only just
(01:59):
come through. I suspect there'll be a bit of weekend
reading for us. But what it really does that's quite
important for us is it gives us a very detailed
baseline against which we can now look to build our
facilities and minimize our environmental impacts as we do.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
So there had sort of been some questions asked about
whether you know, whether it was going to become too
difficult to do business in the Northern Territory. How is
Empire feeling at this point.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Well, we're a small company, we're not a multinational, but
I think if you look at our track record over
the last few years, you know, I would say we've
disproven that. So we've been active in the in the
Northern Territory for over a decade now, working very closely
with TOOS throughout that period, but particularly in the early
years to get their full informed prior consent, and that
(02:48):
work continues. And over the last few years since I
joined the company in twenty eighteen, we've been one of
the most active companies in the basin. So we've carried
out seismic surveys, we've drilled four wells now the most
recent one was the longest horizontal well drilled in Australian history.
And also we've carried out three fracture stimulations across of
those four wells so far, and we've done so safely
(03:10):
and with some really encouraging results. So I think, you know,
we and others have proven that we can operate under
this regulatory framework.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Alex sir Asta, I know there'll be people listening this
morning who just really don't want fracking to go ahead
in the Northern Territory. But I guess the situation in
Australia right now or the argument is that while we
may all want to go to clean green energy, we've
actually got a transition to get there.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Absolutely. So first of all, I absolutely respect the views
of people who are concerned about fracking, and we have
a great burden of responsibility as a company and as
an industry to consult with, you know, not only the
directly affected stakeholders of our activities, but the broader community.
And you know we've been doing that for a number
of years and we will continue to going forward. But yeah,
(03:58):
certainly this transition towards net zero is going to be
a massive undertaking. And just yesterday a big report by
a group called net zero Australia, so some world renowned
universities came up with some numbers around what the transition
is going to look like for Australia, and we're talking
between seven and nine trillion dollars of investment between now
(04:19):
and twenty fifty, a trebling of the capacity of the
national electricity market. And even in that scenario, there's going
to be a require a doubling of gas fire generation
to provide peaking support. So gas will continue to play
a very important role in the energy mix going forward.
And also it's not just used for electricity, it's also
(04:39):
an important feedstock for everything we rely on in our
modern lives now.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
Yesterday, Walsh reported that a Senate inquiry into fracking in
the be Toloo Basin is calling for further investigation into
the Middle Arm precinct, now, noting that obviously Empire Energy
isn't part of the Middle Arm development as I understand. However,
it Wash reported that a petrochemical plant would likely source
feedstock from the Beaterloo basin. So will there be any
(05:03):
impact to Empires plans with that potential inquiry or with
that inquiry?
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Yeah, So we have a very close working knowledge of
that inquiry. It's been ongoing for a couple of years now,
and when the inquiry opened in twenty twenty one, we
made the proactive decision to actually actively participate in that inquiry.
We were the first of all of the gas companies
to make submissions to that inquiry and an appear before
the inquiry back in twenty twenty one, yep. And we
(05:29):
thought that was important because we think we have a
good story to tell around the work we've been doing
over the years and the approach we take to working
with communities and to protect the environment. You know, it
was fundamentally a pretty politically motivated inquiry set up by
the Greens Party, and you know, while while it doesn't
have any direct legal effect on government policy and therefore
(05:51):
we're not paying particular notice of it, one thing that
we did focus on during that inquiry was listening to
the submissions of lots of different colder groups and really
understanding what their concerns are. And you know what, you know,
and those who are in support.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
As well, now talk us through you know what or
where are those exploration if it's at so far in
the Beaterloo basin.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
Yeah, sure, So there's been a number of wells drilled
across the basin over the years in terms of our activities,
so we are on both the eastern and western sides
of the basin, so where most of our activity has
been so far is about one hundred k's west of Borolula,
but then also we own properties across the Sturt Plateau
(06:35):
on the other side of the basin. Over the last
few years, as I mentioned, we've drilled for wells and
that expiration activity has really been focused on assessing whether
or not we can economically extract gas from these resources.
The flow testing is ongoing and we've been very encouraged
by those results. And so now as a company, we're
moving into a phase of planning to move into production,
(06:58):
initially in a fairly modest utilizing existing pipelines, and they're
looking to build from there.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
So do you think it's going to be economically viable
for you guys to be able to you know, to
do business in the be Toloo.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
Yeah, so it is relatively early days, and that flow
testing is ongoing, but the results that we're seeing today
are very encouraging. We foresee, based on the results we're
getting that you know, the development costs of these activities
is likely to be two to three dollars a gigagel,
so so well below current prices, and so that gives
us a good degree of optimism that you know, we
(07:31):
can economically develop this asset.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
So from your perspective, you know, depending on on I
guess you know, the different the different measures that the
Northern Territory government has in place, and even on a
federal scale, Empire is still prepared and is still keen
to fracken the be Toloo.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
So you know, we are bound by one of the
strictest regulatory regimes in the world, and you know, we
do really appreciate the significant amount of work that's gone
on across government here in the NT to implement those
Pepper recommendations. We keenly await the final outcome of the
(08:10):
sign off of the Pepper Inquiry in the coming weeks
and that'll really give us the confidence and our investors
the confidence to then move forward into the next phase.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Well, Alex Underwood, the CEO of Empire Energy, appreciate your
time this morning. Thank you very much for coming into
the studio and having a chat with us.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Thank you, Katie, really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
No worries
Now. Earlier this week, the Northern Territory government released the
Strategic Regional Environmental and Baseline Assessment. It's known as the
SHRIBA for the Beaterloo sub Basin, which is one of
the key recommendations from the Scientific Inquiry into Fracturing in
the Northern Territory or fracking as we know it now.
The STREBER accounts for thirty five of the inquiri's recommendations
(00:22):
and aims to provide information well so that the appropriate
decisions can be made about the development of natural gas
extraction in the Beaterloo region, including the assessment of water
biodiversity resources to inform land use planning, and the collection
of baseline data to provide a reference for ongoing monitoring now.
(00:42):
The government says that the SHREBER puts more protections in
place for groundwater than ever before, not just in the
Beaterloo region, but right across the entire Northern Territory. So
where are things at when it comes to the be
Toloo Well, joining me in the studio right now is
High Energy CEO Alex Underwood. Good morning to you, Alex.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Good o Katie. Great to meet you and good to
be here in beautiful sunny Darlin.
Speaker 1 (01:08):
Yeah, good to have you in the studio. Thank you
so much for your time now, Alex. Obviously the government
made this announcement earlier in the week. Does it provide
more or less certainty when it comes to the Beadlow?
Speaker 2 (01:19):
In our opinion, this is a really key development in
terms of rounding off one hundred and thirty five recommendations
of the Pepper inquiry. You know, there's been a massive
piece of work done by government over the last five
years to implement all of those recommendations, and this gives
effect to thirty five of those recommendations.
Speaker 1 (01:39):
You know.
Speaker 2 (01:39):
The final step to move into production licenses would be
the final sign off of the government, and we understand
from comments by Minister Moss yesterday that that'll be potentially
happening in the next few weeks. In terms of the
impact of the Cerebra on industry, first of all, I
should say we haven't had a chance to read it yet.
It's hundreds of pages of work and it's only just
(01:59):
come through. I suspect there'll be a bit of weekend
reading for us. But what it really does that's quite
important for us is it gives us a very detailed
baseline against which we can now look to build our
facilities and minimize our environmental impacts as we do.
Speaker 1 (02:15):
So there had sort of been some questions asked about
whether you know, whether it was going to become too
difficult to do business in the Northern Territory. How is
Empire feeling at this point.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Well, we're a small company, we're not a multinational, but
I think if you look at our track record over
the last few years, you know, I would say we've
disproven that. So we've been active in the in the
Northern Territory for over a decade now, working very closely
with TOOS throughout that period, but particularly in the early
years to get their full informed prior consent, and that
(02:48):
work continues. And over the last few years since I
joined the company in twenty eighteen, we've been one of
the most active companies in the basin. So we've carried
out seismic surveys, we've drilled four wells now the most
recent one was the longest horizontal well drilled in Australian history.
And also we've carried out three fracture stimulations across of
those four wells so far, and we've done so safely
(03:10):
and with some really encouraging results. So I think, you know,
we and others have proven that we can operate under
this regulatory framework.
Speaker 1 (03:17):
Alex sir Asta, I know there'll be people listening this
morning who just really don't want fracking to go ahead
in the Northern Territory. But I guess the situation in
Australia right now or the argument is that while we
may all want to go to clean green energy, we've
actually got a transition to get there.
Speaker 2 (03:35):
Absolutely. So first of all, I absolutely respect the views
of people who are concerned about fracking, and we have
a great burden of responsibility as a company and as
an industry to consult with, you know, not only the
directly affected stakeholders of our activities, but the broader community.
And you know we've been doing that for a number
of years and we will continue to going forward. But yeah,
(03:58):
certainly this transition towards net zero is going to be
a massive undertaking. And just yesterday a big report by
a group called net zero Australia, so some world renowned
universities came up with some numbers around what the transition
is going to look like for Australia, and we're talking
between seven and nine trillion dollars of investment between now
(04:19):
and twenty fifty, a trebling of the capacity of the
national electricity market. And even in that scenario, there's going
to be a require a doubling of gas fire generation
to provide peaking support. So gas will continue to play
a very important role in the energy mix going forward.
And also it's not just used for electricity, it's also
(04:39):
an important feedstock for everything we rely on in our
modern lives now.
Speaker 1 (04:42):
Yesterday, Walsh reported that a Senate inquiry into fracking in
the be Toloo Basin is calling for further investigation into
the Middle Arm precinct, now, noting that obviously Empire Energy
isn't part of the Middle Arm development as I understand. However,
it Wash reported that a petrochemical plant would likely source
feedstock from the Beaterloo basin. So will there be any
(05:03):
impact to Empires plans with that potential inquiry or with
that inquiry?
Speaker 2 (05:08):
Yeah, So we have a very close working knowledge of
that inquiry. It's been ongoing for a couple of years now,
and when the inquiry opened in twenty twenty one, we
made the proactive decision to actually actively participate in that inquiry.
We were the first of all of the gas companies
to make submissions to that inquiry and an appear before
the inquiry back in twenty twenty one, yep. And we
(05:29):
thought that was important because we think we have a
good story to tell around the work we've been doing
over the years and the approach we take to working
with communities and to protect the environment. You know, it
was fundamentally a pretty politically motivated inquiry set up by
the Greens Party, and you know, while while it doesn't
have any direct legal effect on government policy and therefore
(05:51):
we're not paying particular notice of it, one thing that
we did focus on during that inquiry was listening to
the submissions of lots of different colder groups and really
understanding what their concerns are. And you know what, you know,
and those who are in support.
Speaker 1 (06:05):
As well, now talk us through you know what or
where are those exploration if it's at so far in
the Beaterloo basin.
Speaker 2 (06:14):
Yeah, sure, So there's been a number of wells drilled
across the basin over the years in terms of our activities,
so we are on both the eastern and western sides
of the basin, so where most of our activity has
been so far is about one hundred k's west of Borolula,
but then also we own properties across the Sturt Plateau
(06:35):
on the other side of the basin. Over the last
few years, as I mentioned, we've drilled for wells and
that expiration activity has really been focused on assessing whether
or not we can economically extract gas from these resources.
The flow testing is ongoing and we've been very encouraged
by those results. And so now as a company, we're
moving into a phase of planning to move into production,
(06:58):
initially in a fairly modest utilizing existing pipelines, and they're
looking to build from there.
Speaker 1 (07:03):
So do you think it's going to be economically viable
for you guys to be able to you know, to
do business in the be Toloo.
Speaker 2 (07:10):
Yeah, so it is relatively early days, and that flow
testing is ongoing, but the results that we're seeing today
are very encouraging. We foresee, based on the results we're
getting that you know, the development costs of these activities
is likely to be two to three dollars a gigagel,
so so well below current prices, and so that gives
us a good degree of optimism that you know, we
(07:31):
can economically develop this asset.
Speaker 1 (07:33):
So from your perspective, you know, depending on on I
guess you know, the different the different measures that the
Northern Territory government has in place, and even on a
federal scale, Empire is still prepared and is still keen
to fracken the be Toloo.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (07:50):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (07:50):
So you know, we are bound by one of the
strictest regulatory regimes in the world, and you know, we
do really appreciate the significant amount of work that's gone
on across government here in the NT to implement those
Pepper recommendations. We keenly await the final outcome of the
(08:10):
sign off of the Pepper Inquiry in the coming weeks
and that'll really give us the confidence and our investors
the confidence to then move forward into the next phase.
Speaker 1 (08:19):
Well, Alex Underwood, the CEO of Empire Energy, appreciate your
time this morning. Thank you very much for coming into
the studio and having a chat with us.
Speaker 2 (08:27):
Thank you, Katie, really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (08:28):
No worries
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