Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
You might recall back in two thousand and eleven, the
Commonwealth was ordered to pay up to a billion dollars
in court ordered compensation for the twenty eleven Indonesian live
export ban. Now, the cattleman and the Commonwealth have been
left at odds over the government's refusal to pay that
compensation and interest over the ban that devastated the territory's
(00:21):
cattle sector and associated industries. Now, according to the Northern
Territory News, the former NT Cattleman's Association chairman David Connolly
was a fierce critic of the Commonwealth's refusal to pay
that compo, using his final address in the role in
Alice Springs last month to deliver well a withering spray
to the Agriculture Minister Murray wash Joining us on the
(00:44):
line to tell us a little bit more about where
things are at right now is the CEO of the
NT Cattleman's Association, Will Evans.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Good morning to you, Will.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Good morning Katie, thanks for having me on.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Yeah, mate, really good to speak to you this morning.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Now, I reckon most people listening today would be thinking
to themselves. I remember when this court, like when this
decision was made. Tracy Hayeser joined me in the studio
to talk about it.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
It was a day that a lot of people.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
Felt like, hey, you know that genuine Territorians are finally
getting the compensation and you know, getting what they deserve
after what had been a horrendous decision by the federal government.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Okatie, Look, I was in the room on that day,
and it was twenty ninth of June twenty twenty, and
we're almost four years after that. Now we are no
further along progressing or finalizing the settlement that we were
on that day. It is extremely, extremely frustrating that we're
dealing with a federal government. Eleven members of this cabinet
(01:46):
were in the cabinet in twenty eleven who made the
decision to ban the trade, and today they're telling us
that this isn't politics, this isn't political, This is an
independent legal process and we're just going to let it
play out. And I think anybody listening to that knows
that that's a very political statement.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
So, Mate, where exactly are things at right now? It
sounds like there's a standstill well.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
Where we're trying to agree on the total sum of damages. Now,
the government gave us an offer of two hundred and
twenty million dollars without interest and without costs. Now, Katie
is anybody would know that is very very standard in
a court case. Is you get costs and you get interests.
(02:31):
And the government said, no, we're not paying that. And
there are more than two hundred claimants, more than two
hundred claimants to this case, and they're offering almost nothing
to those people. So this is where we're at at
the moment. Now we know the damages are far over
a billion dollars. We put forward an offer and we said, look,
this is reasonable, we believe it, this is what we
should do. And the government said absolutely, we're not accepting that.
(02:52):
So where we're out today. We've got a hearing scheduled
for next year. Next year we try to agree next
year to finally try to agree to a total quantum
of damages.
Speaker 1 (03:06):
That'll be nearly five years after the case.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
The government has requested additional time to understand what is
more about the damages that were inflicted and try to
understand how we've reached the number that we've reached. It.
They need more time after thirteen years of advocating on this,
after more than a decade before the courts. They've requested
additional time because they don't quite understand the intricacies of
our claim.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Look, how how are you guys feeling? You know, when
you think about that, when they're saying that you know
that they need more time, How is that? How is
that making everyone feel right now?
Speaker 3 (03:46):
Well, I think there's a lot of issues. There's a
lot of issues because we've got a government, a federal
government at the moment, that is saying we're banning the
sheep trade in Western Australia because we don't like it. However,
we do very much support the Northern cattle industry despite
the fact that we tried to ban it in twenty eleven.
We recognize that it's the backbone of Norman Australian's economy.
(04:06):
We see it as being critically important. We understand all
of that now, but we're going to drag out the
compensation in this case as long as possible because we
don't believe what happened in twenty eleven was actually very bad.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
But it makes them sound like they're full of us.
Speaker 3 (04:20):
They are full of the Katie. And look, I think
we've reached a point now where we have engaged in
good faith. David in his time in the role, met
with representatives and ministers of the federal government and said,
let's get in a room. Give us one day. We
will get to an agreement on this. We will sort
this out. And they said, no, David, this is an
independent legal process and we have to respect that. And
(04:41):
I think we've reasappointed. We put everything that we can
on the table. We are trying to bring this to
a conclusion, and we're being ignored.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Have you spoken to the Agriculture Minister Murray Walham?
Speaker 2 (04:52):
What does he had to say?
Speaker 3 (04:55):
Murray's in a difficul position. I think the reality is
these decisions I don't think of being made made by Murray.
I know they're not being made by Marray. They're being
made by other people. And I don't think he's got
the influence to be able to tell them that they
need to do this. I know Maray is sympathetic to
our situation. I know he agrees that this should be concluded,
but I don't think he's the one making that call.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
So what is your message for the federal government today?
Will where to from here?
Speaker 3 (05:23):
I think there's a really clearly message Katie and they said,
the expectation of everybody, not just a Northern Territory Cattleman's
Association or the members or the claimants to this court case,
expectation of all Australians's government shouldn't hurt the people who
elect them or who they are elected to represent. Government
shouldn't have for calm on those people, and when they do,
they should own up to it and make good. And
(05:46):
the fact that this government walks around the country saying
we see everyone as being equal and we want to
help everybody equally, but refuses to own up to the
mistakes that they made a decade ago, I think tells
everybody exactly what but how strongly they hold those beliefs.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
Mate to anybody that's listening this morning that's thinking, oh,
you know, the amount of money that the cattleman wanted
is too much.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
What would you say to them, Katie.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
This is just the cost so compensation conversation. We have
to calculate compensation based on loss, yep. So it's not
about you know, this is the money that we think
we might have all we would have liked to have
done or we would hope happened. This is what we
lost and it's dragged on so long now that the
interest is enormous. This is going to cost the taxpayer
(06:33):
of fortune. And what's important for the taxpayer to understand
is we're not the ones dragging this case out. The
people who are elected to make these decisions are the
ones who are dragging this case out. And it is
going to cost a lot of money.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Mate, it sounds like the anti Cattleman's Association. You guys
aren't prepared to just go away here. The federal government
should expect to fight.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
Well, I think we have tried everything. We have tried
to be nice. We've tried to be put light. We've
flown the camper, We've spoken to them, we've met with them,
we have tried to put offers on the table that
we considered to be reasonable. We have done everything that
we can to try and mend this bridge, and at
every single turn we've been cut off. And there has
to be a show of good faith and there has
(07:16):
to be something from this government to say, no, look,
we are going to own up to this. But the
reality is Anthony Alberniz he spoke at an event in
rock Campton last or last month, and when he was
attacked or not attacked. When it was raised with him
that he needed to consider compensation in the Brett cattle case,
he was shocked. He was surprised that that was an
issue that the room had and I just you know,
(07:40):
I think that's just speaks of volumes about this current government.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Well it actually like it makes me think it shows
that he's that he's out of touch. Either him or
his staff have no idea, Like I don't understand how
you can rock up to something like that and not
think that it's going to be raised as an issue.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
He was in a room in Northern Australia where there
were people in the room his government owe money to
and he was surprised that it was raised as an issue.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Mate, I find that so unbelievable. And you know, again,
I will.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
Say, it shows that you're quite out of touch, like
that he's quite out of touch with regional Australia, I think,
And that's something that a lot of us feel in
regional Australia as it is. But then when you look
at what's going on and you look at the fact
that that compensation has not been paid, it just beggars belief.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
It does, Guardie, and I think the only other thing
I'd say is this isn't just cattleman who are part
of this case. We have trucking companies, we invest we
have all sorts of people who are part of this case.
This isn't just a cattle issue. This is a Northern
Australian issue. It's a Norman territory issue. And the fact
that the central government thinks that they can drag it
out as long as they like tells US. I think
a lot of territory is exactly what they've always suspected.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Well mate, I really appreciate your time this morning, appreciate
you coming on the show. Please do keep in contact
with US. US know how things progress, and we will
talk to you soon. Thank you, thank you, Thanks so much.
You might recall back in two thousand and eleven, the
Commonwealth was ordered to pay up to a billion dollars
in court ordered compensation for the twenty eleven Indonesian live
export ban. Now, the cattleman and the Commonwealth have been
left at odds over the government's refusal to pay that
compensation and interest over the ban that devastated the territory's
(00:21):
cattle sector and associated industries. Now, according to the Northern
Territory News, the former NT Cattleman's Association chairman David Connolly
was a fierce critic of the Commonwealth's refusal to pay
that compo, using his final address in the role in
Alice Springs last month to deliver well a withering spray
to the Agriculture Minister Murray wash Joining us on the
(00:44):
line to tell us a little bit more about where
things are at right now is the CEO of the
NT Cattleman's Association, Will Evans.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
Good morning to you, Will.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
Good morning Katie, thanks for having me on.
Speaker 2 (00:56):
Yeah, mate, really good to speak to you this morning.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
Now, I reckon most people listening today would be thinking
to themselves. I remember when this court, like when this
decision was made. Tracy Hayeser joined me in the studio
to talk about it.
Speaker 2 (01:09):
It was a day that a lot of people.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
Felt like, hey, you know that genuine Territorians are finally
getting the compensation and you know, getting what they deserve
after what had been a horrendous decision by the federal government.
Speaker 3 (01:26):
Okatie, Look, I was in the room on that day,
and it was twenty ninth of June twenty twenty, and
we're almost four years after that. Now we are no
further along progressing or finalizing the settlement that we were
on that day. It is extremely, extremely frustrating that we're
dealing with a federal government. Eleven members of this cabinet
(01:46):
were in the cabinet in twenty eleven who made the
decision to ban the trade, and today they're telling us
that this isn't politics, this isn't political, This is an
independent legal process and we're just going to let it
play out. And I think anybody listening to that knows
that that's a very political statement.
Speaker 1 (02:04):
So, Mate, where exactly are things at right now? It
sounds like there's a standstill well.
Speaker 3 (02:11):
Where we're trying to agree on the total sum of damages. Now,
the government gave us an offer of two hundred and
twenty million dollars without interest and without costs. Now, Katie
is anybody would know that is very very standard in
a court case. Is you get costs and you get interests.
(02:31):
And the government said, no, we're not paying that. And
there are more than two hundred claimants, more than two
hundred claimants to this case, and they're offering almost nothing
to those people. So this is where we're at at
the moment. Now we know the damages are far over
a billion dollars. We put forward an offer and we said, look,
this is reasonable, we believe it, this is what we
should do. And the government said absolutely, we're not accepting that.
(02:52):
So where we're out today. We've got a hearing scheduled
for next year. Next year we try to agree next
year to finally try to agree to a total quantum
of damages.
Speaker 1 (03:06):
That'll be nearly five years after the case.
Speaker 3 (03:11):
The government has requested additional time to understand what is
more about the damages that were inflicted and try to
understand how we've reached the number that we've reached. It.
They need more time after thirteen years of advocating on this,
after more than a decade before the courts. They've requested
additional time because they don't quite understand the intricacies of
our claim.
Speaker 1 (03:32):
Look, how how are you guys feeling? You know, when
you think about that, when they're saying that you know
that they need more time, How is that? How is
that making everyone feel right now?
Speaker 3 (03:46):
Well, I think there's a lot of issues. There's a
lot of issues because we've got a government, a federal
government at the moment, that is saying we're banning the
sheep trade in Western Australia because we don't like it. However,
we do very much support the Northern cattle industry despite
the fact that we tried to ban it in twenty eleven.
We recognize that it's the backbone of Norman Australian's economy.
(04:06):
We see it as being critically important. We understand all
of that now, but we're going to drag out the
compensation in this case as long as possible because we
don't believe what happened in twenty eleven was actually very bad.
Speaker 2 (04:17):
But it makes them sound like they're full of us.
Speaker 3 (04:20):
They are full of the Katie. And look, I think
we've reached a point now where we have engaged in
good faith. David in his time in the role, met
with representatives and ministers of the federal government and said,
let's get in a room. Give us one day. We
will get to an agreement on this. We will sort
this out. And they said, no, David, this is an
independent legal process and we have to respect that. And
(04:41):
I think we've reasappointed. We put everything that we can
on the table. We are trying to bring this to
a conclusion, and we're being ignored.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Have you spoken to the Agriculture Minister Murray Walham?
Speaker 2 (04:52):
What does he had to say?
Speaker 3 (04:55):
Murray's in a difficul position. I think the reality is
these decisions I don't think of being made made by Murray.
I know they're not being made by Marray. They're being
made by other people. And I don't think he's got
the influence to be able to tell them that they
need to do this. I know Maray is sympathetic to
our situation. I know he agrees that this should be concluded,
but I don't think he's the one making that call.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
So what is your message for the federal government today?
Will where to from here?
Speaker 3 (05:23):
I think there's a really clearly message Katie and they said,
the expectation of everybody, not just a Northern Territory Cattleman's
Association or the members or the claimants to this court case,
expectation of all Australians's government shouldn't hurt the people who
elect them or who they are elected to represent. Government
shouldn't have for calm on those people, and when they do,
they should own up to it and make good. And
(05:46):
the fact that this government walks around the country saying
we see everyone as being equal and we want to
help everybody equally, but refuses to own up to the
mistakes that they made a decade ago, I think tells
everybody exactly what but how strongly they hold those beliefs.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
Mate to anybody that's listening this morning that's thinking, oh,
you know, the amount of money that the cattleman wanted
is too much.
Speaker 2 (06:10):
What would you say to them, Katie.
Speaker 3 (06:13):
This is just the cost so compensation conversation. We have
to calculate compensation based on loss, yep. So it's not
about you know, this is the money that we think
we might have all we would have liked to have
done or we would hope happened. This is what we
lost and it's dragged on so long now that the
interest is enormous. This is going to cost the taxpayer
(06:33):
of fortune. And what's important for the taxpayer to understand
is we're not the ones dragging this case out. The
people who are elected to make these decisions are the
ones who are dragging this case out. And it is
going to cost a lot of money.
Speaker 1 (06:46):
Mate, it sounds like the anti Cattleman's Association. You guys
aren't prepared to just go away here. The federal government
should expect to fight.
Speaker 3 (06:55):
Well, I think we have tried everything. We have tried
to be nice. We've tried to be put light. We've
flown the camper, We've spoken to them, we've met with them,
we have tried to put offers on the table that
we considered to be reasonable. We have done everything that
we can to try and mend this bridge, and at
every single turn we've been cut off. And there has
to be a show of good faith and there has
(07:16):
to be something from this government to say, no, look,
we are going to own up to this. But the
reality is Anthony Alberniz he spoke at an event in
rock Campton last or last month, and when he was
attacked or not attacked. When it was raised with him
that he needed to consider compensation in the Brett cattle case,
he was shocked. He was surprised that that was an
issue that the room had and I just you know,
(07:40):
I think that's just speaks of volumes about this current government.
Speaker 1 (07:43):
Well it actually like it makes me think it shows
that he's that he's out of touch. Either him or
his staff have no idea, Like I don't understand how
you can rock up to something like that and not
think that it's going to be raised as an issue.
Speaker 3 (07:57):
He was in a room in Northern Australia where there
were people in the room his government owe money to
and he was surprised that it was raised as an issue.
Speaker 2 (08:08):
Mate, I find that so unbelievable. And you know, again,
I will.
Speaker 1 (08:13):
Say, it shows that you're quite out of touch, like
that he's quite out of touch with regional Australia, I think,
And that's something that a lot of us feel in
regional Australia as it is. But then when you look
at what's going on and you look at the fact
that that compensation has not been paid, it just beggars belief.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
It does, Guardie, and I think the only other thing
I'd say is this isn't just cattleman who are part
of this case. We have trucking companies, we invest we
have all sorts of people who are part of this case.
This isn't just a cattle issue. This is a Northern
Australian issue. It's a Norman territory issue. And the fact
that the central government thinks that they can drag it
out as long as they like tells US. I think
a lot of territory is exactly what they've always suspected.
Speaker 1 (08:54):
Well mate, I really appreciate your time this morning, appreciate
you coming on the show. Please do keep in contact
with US. US know how things progress, and we will
talk to you soon. Thank you, thank you, Thanks so much.
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