Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Now the Northern Territory Ombudsman, as I mentioned earlier, has
recommended the government formerly bans spit hoods through legislation as
part of a major one hundred and forty page report
on the use of devices in police custody. Now the
report recommends that the Northern Territory Police extend the ban
on spit hoods to people of all ages, as well
(00:22):
as a recommendation prohibiting spit hoods and emergency restraint chairs
being used all together. So this report was tabled in
Parliament yesterday. It makes a number of recommendations on the
use of the chairs and also the spi hoods, and
it also includes that the police engage with experts to
develop alternative approaches to their therapies. Now this has fired
(00:47):
people up this morning, a lot of you messaging through
and saying well, if you don't spit you're not going
to need a spit hood. Joining me in the studio
is the president of the Northern Territory Police Association, Nathan Finn.
Good morning to you, Finny.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Good morning Katie, and good morning to your listeners.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
Now, Nathan, who can spit hoods currently be used on
by the police.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
So currently they're used on adults obviously in custody facilities only.
That's the obviously policy decision that the police have gone with.
But this report that's obviously was tabled yesterday at Parliament,
we had no pro warning to that that there was
going to be tabled at parliament. Basically we get advice
after a table at Parliament that it's been tabled and
needs the recommendations from that. We had no consultation relation
to that. And firstly, NT Police don't use the spit hoods.
(01:30):
They use the spit guards and obviously are made from
a lightweight, transparent material and reinforce sction around the jaw
line we're spinning and biting. So the photo of the
omasman has used obviously in the front of the report
isn't even the product that the NT Police use.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
So were the police consulted with it all throughout this report?
Speaker 3 (01:45):
The police were consulted early in the days. We did
provide a submission to obviously the investor to the investigation. Again,
our position hasn't changed. The Spitgoucho made a protective option
for our members and make sure they're protecting our members.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Now tell me, I mean, why are they needed and
when are they usually used.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
They're used in the circumstance where the person actually spits
or pretends to spit or goes to spit it our members,
and then they're placed on the person. This is this
policy restriction obviously of us is only to be used
in wat chairs. This occurs in the field as well,
and we want that option availble to our members as
well for the workouth and safety of them.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Anny, how often would you say that police are being
spat on?
Speaker 3 (02:25):
Over my twenty years, I could obviously say I'd be
spat on probably twenty thirty times.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Are you serious?
Speaker 2 (02:30):
I am serious?
Speaker 3 (02:31):
And our members face this every day and then the
consequences of getting spat on and the three month wait
for blood tests and everything else for communicable diseases has
a real effect on our police.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Have you actually had to go through that process yourself.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
I've been through that process a number of occasions, Catie,
and it's frustrating and it's yeah, it's downright wrong because
it affects you and your family.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
You don't what can I ask, and you know, hopefully
I'm not getting too personal here, but what is it like?
What is it like when someone actually spits on you
while trying to.
Speaker 3 (03:00):
Do just disgusting and it's vile. It's interfering with your
personal safety. And when they bite their tongue or bite
the inside of their mouth and spit the blood at you,
and it goes on your uniform and everyone else. How
can we protective equipment? We'd have to walk around and
jumpsuits to protect ourselves from this. It goes out of
our uniform, goes over our hands, over our arms, over
our throats. It's suitable for these people to be wearing
(03:23):
spit guards.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Is frustrating for you. Then when you sort of you know,
when you have like the Ombudsman, for example, saying that
spi hoods should be banned and releasing this report saying
that they should be banned, when when you know you
guys are out there on the front line and actually
dealing with the ramifications of it.
Speaker 3 (03:41):
I invite the amasmen to come out and actually not
to get spot on himself, but to feel that the
consequences of what actually happens when that happens to you,
and the consequences and the procedure you just have to
go through. In the three months waiting for results to
come back, to see whether you've got a communical diseases
because of your workplace and what the issues you're dealing with. Again,
these people are choosing to spit at our members. They
(04:01):
are choosing to do this, and we should have the
option to protect ourselves. They are playing stupid games and
they're going to win stupid prizes every time.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
So tell me. I mean, look, you know again you
just said that it takes like that three month period
for you. When that has happened, you literally you get
spat on. Then you've got to wait for three months
to find out whether you've actually contracted something.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
That's right, Caddie. For the blood testing to be sent
away and to results to come back. It sometimes takes
up even longer than that.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
What kind of invasion is that? Then in your personal life.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
It's an invasion because again you don't want to go home,
you don't want to have a lesusly share these communical
diseases with your family members, with your kids. It places
you at great risk. Again, it's not acceptable, Katie, for
someone to sit in their glass tower up there and go,
let's just ban it, let's just legislate it.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
It's wrong.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
Our members deserve the protection and again we're pandering to
the offenders and not looking after the people are actually
trying to help.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Look, I feel, you know, I feel that plenty of
people in the community are going to agree with you
this morning. I think that the reality here is that
you talking about the use of those spit shields. I
believe that they're called from your perspective. Is that right, Yes, spitguards.
You know you're talking about the use of those when
people are actually, you know, doing the wrong thing. You
don't put them on everybody, do you.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
No, definitely not, Katie.
Speaker 3 (05:15):
There's a procedure in place where our members have to
go through and their strict obviously rigmarole in relation to
how we do that and the review of when we've
used it and when we haven't used it has obviously
gone through a process of management. It's all approved by
superintendent's watch commanders everything else. There's a process to be evolved.
We don't do it for everyone, okay, it's again for
protection of our members when they feel like they already
(05:36):
have been spat on, or they're going to get spat on,
or the person makes advances towards them that they are
going to actually do that.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Nathan I do want to move along because earlier this
week we learned a bit more detail of the government's
new knife crime strategy, but much like the review into
the bail legislation, many are wondering if the changes are
going to go far enough. Now, I want to just
play for you a little bit of the audio from
an interview that we did with the Attorney General Chancey
earlier in the week. Take a listen.
Speaker 4 (06:01):
This is a crime prevention strategy, the knife strategy, and
absolutely enables us to work with our hard working police
and with our community around how we better respond to
situations in the wider community. So I am confident, Katie
that this strategy will absolutely go to addressing and delivering
in the areas of prevention. And this is not saying, Katie,
(06:25):
by any means that this is the be all and
end all. This is a piece of the wider puzzle
in responding to the community around how we can better
deliver community safety.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
So that will see Attorney General Chancey Paike on the
show earlier in the week. Nathan, what was your reaction
to the knife crime strategy.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
It's simply not a strategy, Katie, It's just a cop out.
It's a glossy brochure that the government can refer to.
It actually means nothing to our members. That means nothing
to the people out in the street that actually affected
by knife crime. And again, we weren't consulted about the
strategy at.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
All, so you weren't consulted on it.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
I had to go on to the Chief Minister's website
yesterday and get a copy of it because I haven't
received a copy of it. And so this is just
the consultation they keep claiming to have occurred with all
these lovely stakeholders. I think it's a crock of shit.
Speaker 1 (07:12):
Now, I want to ask you that's and do you
know what? It's obviously very no, it's fine, very blunt.
Don'tmorrow you're okay to say that because I can hear frustration,
and I can hear that you know that the reality
here is that you guys, look it seems as though
you're feeling like you're having to to sort of clean
up after the fact.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Definitely, we feel like we're behind the eight ball. Everything
we do, Codie and getting advice from the senior Police
executive and consoling with the rank and file is totally different.
Aspects of this. They haven't obviously spoken to the members
on the ground that actually are seeing the increases obviously
in knife crime and the community and the fear in
the community from people being faced with this knife crime.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Is huge, Nathan. The government scene to help inform this
strategy and analysis of territory knife crime data was undertaken.
They reckon it showed that knives and edged weapons make
up only five five percent of violent crimes and any
strategy must focus on violent crimes holistically. Do you like,
does that five percent sit right with the Northern Territory,
(08:10):
like with the rank and file of the police, So.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Definitely not, Katie.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
We've had advice obviously since that, since it's come out
and the information they've done, we questioned the statistics. Obviously
five percent of all violent offenses in a twelve month
period involve a NIVA edge weapon. We Actuid Deputy Commistry
yesterday to provide us with the data used for the
review and they told us the Attorney General's Department had
extract the data from the police system. Again, the information
hasn't come directly from police and provide that information. We
(08:34):
want to ensure the government isn't basically cherry picking what
they want to pick out of it, because we're getting
a lot different data from our members out in the
street that this actually is a huge issue for applots.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
So you reckon that five percent troll?
Speaker 2 (08:47):
Yeah? Correct?
Speaker 1 (08:48):
So can you just tell me with the data that
has been extracted? So it's been extracted from the Attorney
General's office, So what do they do like or from
the Attorney General's department? Do they go through? Correct me
if I'm wrong, it may have been upgrater, But do
they go through the promised system will go through the
system and search through the different types of crimes and
whether a knife's been used or not.
Speaker 3 (09:06):
And again, yes, I assume that that would be the case. Again,
I don't know how they're gone and done about how
they got the results of this. But again, the members
that are getting back to us are showing that there's
a significant increase in the number of knives or edge
weapons being used on a daily basis, and it doesn't
represent five percent of their jobs.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Represents far more than that.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
Now tell me. The government also well basically also said
that nearly half of all knife crime incidents and domestic
and family violence related. I've no doubt that there are
actually plenty that are domestic and family violence related. They
also said individuals sleeping rough carry knives for practical purposes
and protection with no intention of offending. What is your
(09:47):
reaction to some of that information.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Again, it's not surprising to us, Katie.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
We were aware of obviously the people that do actually
carry knives and edge weapons, and they do most of
them do to use it for legitimate purposes. But again
it's the people that are actually using to commit violence offenses.
We need stronger punishment and legiacaty reform to make sure
there's a deterrent for people carrying knives and edge weapons.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
So do you think that what the government's announced goes
far enough? I mean, they say that evidence has shot
that the evidence did not show a need for further
legislative amendments at this stage. But the strategy outlines a
range of short to medium term actions, including culturally appropriate
awareness and educational campaigns, including for schools, on the dangers
(10:30):
and consequences of carrying a knife, an alternative strategy to
ensure people sleeping rough feel safe without the need to
carry a knife, working with industry to develop a uniform
practice for the security of knives, to prevent theft as
well as safety and de escalation training for retail and
hospitality workers. And then the development of an anti police
(10:54):
led action plan to enhance the detection and prevention of
knife crime in public places and development of a trauma
and injury informed harm reduction framework.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Let's be honest here, Katie.
Speaker 3 (11:07):
We have trouble educating these types of people in the community,
even education, a standard education of English and maths. How
we're going to educate these people with knives or edge
weapon reforms? Seriously, come on, guys.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Now, what about the development of the nt police led
action plan to enhance the detection and prevention of knife crime?
Speaker 3 (11:26):
Again, they've put it over to police to resolve all
the issues. They've put it to the transfer of the
Anti Social Behavior Unit obviously to the Territory Community Community
Safety Coordination Center, and they're asking them to develop these
plans going forward. Again, we haven't been consoled in relation
to those plans. Again, we asks for our members to
be consulted about what they want to see and how
(11:47):
they think they can change in the community.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Well, Nathan Finn, it certainly sounds as though you guys
are pretty fired up. As I said again, the government
reckons that there's no evidence or the evidence did not
need or did not show a need for further legislative
amendments this stage. Is that in line with your expectations
with the rank and files expectations.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
Definitely not, Katie, definitely not. I spoke to this at
the conference recently. They haven't gone far enough and we've
told them they haven't gone far enough. They haven't come
back to us with any compensation or any movement in
the relation.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
To what they're thinking. We've told them clearly.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
We've told them clearly and from our members point of view,
they have not done enough and they know they haven't
done enough well.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
Nathan Finn, the president of the Northern Territory Police Association,
always appreciate your time. Thanks very much for speaking with
us today.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
Yeah, appreciate if we've got a quick couple of seconds.
We've had some issues obviously in Allie Springs over the
last few days as well, Katie.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
I don't know if you know where about it.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
We've had a number of police cars smashed up and
a number of our members assaulted from rocks being thrown
through windscreens, et cetera. When they're traveling at eighty kloms
an hour. Our members are suffering down there, and members
are actually struggling to deal with the crime that's obviously
going on there. There's been no reports out in the media,
there's been nothing said. We've got members out there who
have been hurt, are struggling to do their job again
(13:01):
through community upprest in Alice Springs, and you hear nothing
about it.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
I had no idea that that had happened.
Speaker 3 (13:07):
No, definitely not. And when fifteen to twenty people surround
two members and assault them with frying pans and throw
rocks at them and throw rocks through the police vehicles,
I'm deeply concerned that.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
When did that happen?
Speaker 3 (13:18):
That happened over the last three days, ago, two days
and over two nights.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
In Alice Spring Are those officers okay?
Speaker 3 (13:24):
Those officer are okay? Had members of our association contact
them again? Some injuries received because of that, and obviously
glass yards that go into their skin and obviously count
them again, rocks run at police cars, smash windows, members
struck in the arm with rocks, et cetera. It's not
acceptable behavior.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
So, Nathan, how many officers have been assaulted in Alice
Springs over the last few days.
Speaker 3 (13:45):
That was four members have been involved in that. Two
one of the indigenous town camps in Elae Springs and
then one obviously near that as well.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
So have the people who who assaulted those offices been apprehended.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
A couple of those people have been out, I'm informed, Katie. Again,
it shows the behavior and obviously the actions of these
people are the public towards our police officers. We know
we're under resource, we haven't got the resource to do it.
So when two members are left there by themselves with
no backup, this is what's going to happen. And this
is what's continue to happen until they actually resource their
police force properly.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
Are you worried about their safety?
Speaker 3 (14:19):
And Alice, I'm worried about their safety every day and
every officer across the Northern Territory, Caddy, and that's why
I'm so passionate.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
About what I do.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
I find it offensive that they continually still argue that
we've got enough, we can do enough. The facts are
out there, Katie. The facts are clear as anything. We
haven't got enough resource to respond to the incidence of
data and the community feels that as well, because they
know we're not getting to their jobs. We know that
when they need the time of need, when they need police,
they're not having us, and that's disappointing for all our members.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
Well, Nathan Finn, I really appreciate your time. Thank you
for making us aware of that. We weren't aware, and
so I appreciate that because I think that the community
needs to know what's going on.
Speaker 3 (14:54):
Definitely, and we do and we will always be there.
We'll always speak honestly on behalf of our members and
we will never shy away from that. But thank you
to all the men and women obviously in air blue
uniforms that keep the territory safe ever you day
Speaker 1 (15:05):
Thank you, thanks so much for your time this morning,
Now the Northern Territory Ombudsman, as I mentioned earlier, has
recommended the government formerly bans spit hoods through legislation as
part of a major one hundred and forty page report
on the use of devices in police custody. Now the
report recommends that the Northern Territory Police extend the ban
on spit hoods to people of all ages, as well
(00:22):
as a recommendation prohibiting spit hoods and emergency restraint chairs
being used all together. So this report was tabled in
Parliament yesterday. It makes a number of recommendations on the
use of the chairs and also the spi hoods, and
it also includes that the police engage with experts to
develop alternative approaches to their therapies. Now this has fired
(00:47):
people up this morning, a lot of you messaging through
and saying well, if you don't spit you're not going
to need a spit hood. Joining me in the studio
is the president of the Northern Territory Police Association, Nathan Finn.
Good morning to you, Finny.
Speaker 2 (00:59):
Good morning Katie, and good morning to your listeners.
Speaker 1 (01:02):
Now, Nathan, who can spit hoods currently be used on
by the police.
Speaker 3 (01:07):
So currently they're used on adults obviously in custody facilities only.
That's the obviously policy decision that the police have gone with.
But this report that's obviously was tabled yesterday at Parliament,
we had no pro warning to that that there was
going to be tabled at parliament. Basically we get advice
after a table at Parliament that it's been tabled and
needs the recommendations from that. We had no consultation relation
to that. And firstly, NT Police don't use the spit hoods.
(01:30):
They use the spit guards and obviously are made from
a lightweight, transparent material and reinforce sction around the jaw
line we're spinning and biting. So the photo of the
omasman has used obviously in the front of the report
isn't even the product that the NT Police use.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
So were the police consulted with it all throughout this report?
Speaker 3 (01:45):
The police were consulted early in the days. We did
provide a submission to obviously the investor to the investigation. Again,
our position hasn't changed. The Spitgoucho made a protective option
for our members and make sure they're protecting our members.
Speaker 1 (01:58):
Now tell me, I mean, why are they needed and
when are they usually used.
Speaker 3 (02:04):
They're used in the circumstance where the person actually spits
or pretends to spit or goes to spit it our members,
and then they're placed on the person. This is this
policy restriction obviously of us is only to be used
in wat chairs. This occurs in the field as well,
and we want that option availble to our members as
well for the workouth and safety of them.
Speaker 1 (02:20):
Anny, how often would you say that police are being
spat on?
Speaker 3 (02:25):
Over my twenty years, I could obviously say I'd be
spat on probably twenty thirty times.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
Are you serious?
Speaker 2 (02:30):
I am serious?
Speaker 3 (02:31):
And our members face this every day and then the
consequences of getting spat on and the three month wait
for blood tests and everything else for communicable diseases has
a real effect on our police.
Speaker 1 (02:40):
Have you actually had to go through that process yourself.
Speaker 3 (02:42):
I've been through that process a number of occasions, Catie,
and it's frustrating and it's yeah, it's downright wrong because
it affects you and your family.
Speaker 1 (02:51):
You don't what can I ask, and you know, hopefully
I'm not getting too personal here, but what is it like?
What is it like when someone actually spits on you
while trying to.
Speaker 3 (03:00):
Do just disgusting and it's vile. It's interfering with your
personal safety. And when they bite their tongue or bite
the inside of their mouth and spit the blood at you,
and it goes on your uniform and everyone else. How
can we protective equipment? We'd have to walk around and
jumpsuits to protect ourselves from this. It goes out of
our uniform, goes over our hands, over our arms, over
our throats. It's suitable for these people to be wearing
(03:23):
spit guards.
Speaker 1 (03:24):
Is frustrating for you. Then when you sort of you know,
when you have like the Ombudsman, for example, saying that
spi hoods should be banned and releasing this report saying
that they should be banned, when when you know you
guys are out there on the front line and actually
dealing with the ramifications of it.
Speaker 3 (03:41):
I invite the amasmen to come out and actually not
to get spot on himself, but to feel that the
consequences of what actually happens when that happens to you,
and the consequences and the procedure you just have to
go through. In the three months waiting for results to
come back, to see whether you've got a communical diseases
because of your workplace and what the issues you're dealing with. Again,
these people are choosing to spit at our members. They
(04:01):
are choosing to do this, and we should have the
option to protect ourselves. They are playing stupid games and
they're going to win stupid prizes every time.
Speaker 1 (04:08):
So tell me. I mean, look, you know again you
just said that it takes like that three month period
for you. When that has happened, you literally you get
spat on. Then you've got to wait for three months
to find out whether you've actually contracted something.
Speaker 3 (04:21):
That's right, Caddie. For the blood testing to be sent
away and to results to come back. It sometimes takes
up even longer than that.
Speaker 1 (04:27):
What kind of invasion is that? Then in your personal life.
Speaker 3 (04:30):
It's an invasion because again you don't want to go home,
you don't want to have a lesusly share these communical
diseases with your family members, with your kids. It places
you at great risk. Again, it's not acceptable, Katie, for
someone to sit in their glass tower up there and go,
let's just ban it, let's just legislate it.
Speaker 2 (04:45):
It's wrong.
Speaker 3 (04:46):
Our members deserve the protection and again we're pandering to
the offenders and not looking after the people are actually
trying to help.
Speaker 1 (04:53):
Look, I feel, you know, I feel that plenty of
people in the community are going to agree with you
this morning. I think that the reality here is that
you talking about the use of those spit shields. I
believe that they're called from your perspective. Is that right, Yes, spitguards.
You know you're talking about the use of those when
people are actually, you know, doing the wrong thing. You
don't put them on everybody, do you.
Speaker 2 (05:14):
No, definitely not, Katie.
Speaker 3 (05:15):
There's a procedure in place where our members have to
go through and their strict obviously rigmarole in relation to
how we do that and the review of when we've
used it and when we haven't used it has obviously
gone through a process of management. It's all approved by
superintendent's watch commanders everything else. There's a process to be evolved.
We don't do it for everyone, okay, it's again for
protection of our members when they feel like they already
(05:36):
have been spat on, or they're going to get spat on,
or the person makes advances towards them that they are
going to actually do that.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
Nathan I do want to move along because earlier this
week we learned a bit more detail of the government's
new knife crime strategy, but much like the review into
the bail legislation, many are wondering if the changes are
going to go far enough. Now, I want to just
play for you a little bit of the audio from
an interview that we did with the Attorney General Chancey
earlier in the week. Take a listen.
Speaker 4 (06:01):
This is a crime prevention strategy, the knife strategy, and
absolutely enables us to work with our hard working police
and with our community around how we better respond to
situations in the wider community. So I am confident, Katie
that this strategy will absolutely go to addressing and delivering
in the areas of prevention. And this is not saying, Katie,
(06:25):
by any means that this is the be all and
end all. This is a piece of the wider puzzle
in responding to the community around how we can better
deliver community safety.
Speaker 1 (06:36):
So that will see Attorney General Chancey Paike on the
show earlier in the week. Nathan, what was your reaction
to the knife crime strategy.
Speaker 3 (06:43):
It's simply not a strategy, Katie, It's just a cop out.
It's a glossy brochure that the government can refer to.
It actually means nothing to our members. That means nothing
to the people out in the street that actually affected
by knife crime. And again, we weren't consulted about the
strategy at.
Speaker 1 (06:58):
All, so you weren't consulted on it.
Speaker 3 (07:00):
I had to go on to the Chief Minister's website
yesterday and get a copy of it because I haven't
received a copy of it. And so this is just
the consultation they keep claiming to have occurred with all
these lovely stakeholders. I think it's a crock of shit.
Speaker 1 (07:12):
Now, I want to ask you that's and do you
know what? It's obviously very no, it's fine, very blunt.
Don'tmorrow you're okay to say that because I can hear frustration,
and I can hear that you know that the reality
here is that you guys, look it seems as though
you're feeling like you're having to to sort of clean
up after the fact.
Speaker 3 (07:29):
Definitely, we feel like we're behind the eight ball. Everything
we do, Codie and getting advice from the senior Police
executive and consoling with the rank and file is totally different.
Aspects of this. They haven't obviously spoken to the members
on the ground that actually are seeing the increases obviously
in knife crime and the community and the fear in
the community from people being faced with this knife crime.
Speaker 1 (07:49):
Is huge, Nathan. The government scene to help inform this
strategy and analysis of territory knife crime data was undertaken.
They reckon it showed that knives and edged weapons make
up only five five percent of violent crimes and any
strategy must focus on violent crimes holistically. Do you like,
does that five percent sit right with the Northern Territory,
(08:10):
like with the rank and file of the police, So.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
Definitely not, Katie.
Speaker 3 (08:12):
We've had advice obviously since that, since it's come out
and the information they've done, we questioned the statistics. Obviously
five percent of all violent offenses in a twelve month
period involve a NIVA edge weapon. We Actuid Deputy Commistry
yesterday to provide us with the data used for the
review and they told us the Attorney General's Department had
extract the data from the police system. Again, the information
hasn't come directly from police and provide that information. We
(08:34):
want to ensure the government isn't basically cherry picking what
they want to pick out of it, because we're getting
a lot different data from our members out in the
street that this actually is a huge issue for applots.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
So you reckon that five percent troll?
Speaker 2 (08:47):
Yeah? Correct?
Speaker 1 (08:48):
So can you just tell me with the data that
has been extracted? So it's been extracted from the Attorney
General's office, So what do they do like or from
the Attorney General's department? Do they go through? Correct me
if I'm wrong, it may have been upgrater, But do
they go through the promised system will go through the
system and search through the different types of crimes and
whether a knife's been used or not.
Speaker 3 (09:06):
And again, yes, I assume that that would be the case. Again,
I don't know how they're gone and done about how
they got the results of this. But again, the members
that are getting back to us are showing that there's
a significant increase in the number of knives or edge
weapons being used on a daily basis, and it doesn't
represent five percent of their jobs.
Speaker 2 (09:23):
Represents far more than that.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
Now tell me. The government also well basically also said
that nearly half of all knife crime incidents and domestic
and family violence related. I've no doubt that there are
actually plenty that are domestic and family violence related. They
also said individuals sleeping rough carry knives for practical purposes
and protection with no intention of offending. What is your
(09:47):
reaction to some of that information.
Speaker 2 (09:50):
Again, it's not surprising to us, Katie.
Speaker 3 (09:51):
We were aware of obviously the people that do actually
carry knives and edge weapons, and they do most of
them do to use it for legitimate purposes. But again
it's the people that are actually using to commit violence offenses.
We need stronger punishment and legiacaty reform to make sure
there's a deterrent for people carrying knives and edge weapons.
Speaker 1 (10:09):
So do you think that what the government's announced goes
far enough? I mean, they say that evidence has shot
that the evidence did not show a need for further
legislative amendments at this stage. But the strategy outlines a
range of short to medium term actions, including culturally appropriate
awareness and educational campaigns, including for schools, on the dangers
(10:30):
and consequences of carrying a knife, an alternative strategy to
ensure people sleeping rough feel safe without the need to
carry a knife, working with industry to develop a uniform
practice for the security of knives, to prevent theft as
well as safety and de escalation training for retail and
hospitality workers. And then the development of an anti police
(10:54):
led action plan to enhance the detection and prevention of
knife crime in public places and development of a trauma
and injury informed harm reduction framework.
Speaker 2 (11:05):
Let's be honest here, Katie.
Speaker 3 (11:07):
We have trouble educating these types of people in the community,
even education, a standard education of English and maths. How
we're going to educate these people with knives or edge
weapon reforms? Seriously, come on, guys.
Speaker 1 (11:18):
Now, what about the development of the nt police led
action plan to enhance the detection and prevention of knife crime?
Speaker 3 (11:26):
Again, they've put it over to police to resolve all
the issues. They've put it to the transfer of the
Anti Social Behavior Unit obviously to the Territory Community Community
Safety Coordination Center, and they're asking them to develop these
plans going forward. Again, we haven't been consoled in relation
to those plans. Again, we asks for our members to
be consulted about what they want to see and how
(11:47):
they think they can change in the community.
Speaker 1 (11:49):
Well, Nathan Finn, it certainly sounds as though you guys
are pretty fired up. As I said again, the government
reckons that there's no evidence or the evidence did not
need or did not show a need for further legislative
amendments this stage. Is that in line with your expectations
with the rank and files expectations.
Speaker 3 (12:05):
Definitely not, Katie, definitely not. I spoke to this at
the conference recently. They haven't gone far enough and we've
told them they haven't gone far enough. They haven't come
back to us with any compensation or any movement in
the relation.
Speaker 2 (12:16):
To what they're thinking. We've told them clearly.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
We've told them clearly and from our members point of view,
they have not done enough and they know they haven't
done enough well.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
Nathan Finn, the president of the Northern Territory Police Association,
always appreciate your time. Thanks very much for speaking with
us today.
Speaker 3 (12:31):
Yeah, appreciate if we've got a quick couple of seconds.
We've had some issues obviously in Allie Springs over the
last few days as well, Katie.
Speaker 2 (12:37):
I don't know if you know where about it.
Speaker 3 (12:38):
We've had a number of police cars smashed up and
a number of our members assaulted from rocks being thrown
through windscreens, et cetera. When they're traveling at eighty kloms
an hour. Our members are suffering down there, and members
are actually struggling to deal with the crime that's obviously
going on there. There's been no reports out in the media,
there's been nothing said. We've got members out there who
have been hurt, are struggling to do their job again
(13:01):
through community upprest in Alice Springs, and you hear nothing
about it.
Speaker 1 (13:05):
I had no idea that that had happened.
Speaker 3 (13:07):
No, definitely not. And when fifteen to twenty people surround
two members and assault them with frying pans and throw
rocks at them and throw rocks through the police vehicles,
I'm deeply concerned that.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
When did that happen?
Speaker 3 (13:18):
That happened over the last three days, ago, two days
and over two nights.
Speaker 1 (13:22):
In Alice Spring Are those officers okay?
Speaker 3 (13:24):
Those officer are okay? Had members of our association contact
them again? Some injuries received because of that, and obviously
glass yards that go into their skin and obviously count
them again, rocks run at police cars, smash windows, members
struck in the arm with rocks, et cetera. It's not
acceptable behavior.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
So, Nathan, how many officers have been assaulted in Alice
Springs over the last few days.
Speaker 3 (13:45):
That was four members have been involved in that. Two
one of the indigenous town camps in Elae Springs and
then one obviously near that as well.
Speaker 1 (13:52):
So have the people who who assaulted those offices been apprehended.
Speaker 3 (13:58):
A couple of those people have been out, I'm informed, Katie. Again,
it shows the behavior and obviously the actions of these
people are the public towards our police officers. We know
we're under resource, we haven't got the resource to do it.
So when two members are left there by themselves with
no backup, this is what's going to happen. And this
is what's continue to happen until they actually resource their
police force properly.
Speaker 1 (14:18):
Are you worried about their safety?
Speaker 3 (14:19):
And Alice, I'm worried about their safety every day and
every officer across the Northern Territory, Caddy, and that's why
I'm so passionate.
Speaker 2 (14:24):
About what I do.
Speaker 3 (14:26):
I find it offensive that they continually still argue that
we've got enough, we can do enough. The facts are
out there, Katie. The facts are clear as anything. We
haven't got enough resource to respond to the incidence of
data and the community feels that as well, because they
know we're not getting to their jobs. We know that
when they need the time of need, when they need police,
they're not having us, and that's disappointing for all our members.
Speaker 1 (14:46):
Well, Nathan Finn, I really appreciate your time. Thank you
for making us aware of that. We weren't aware, and
so I appreciate that because I think that the community
needs to know what's going on.
Speaker 3 (14:54):
Definitely, and we do and we will always be there.
We'll always speak honestly on behalf of our members and
we will never shy away from that. But thank you
to all the men and women obviously in air blue
uniforms that keep the territory safe ever you day
Speaker 1 (15:05):
Thank you, thanks so much for your time this morning,
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