January 17, 2025 • 56 mins
In the early ’70s, films like The Omega Man, Soylent Green, and THX-1138 painted a bleak future of chaos and government control. By 1981, the tone had shifted, with films like Raiders of the Lost Ark and Clash of the Titans offering escapism and classic good vs. evil battles. But then came this 80s flick, set in a dystopian 1997 where Manhattan is a prison island. The hero, a morally gray anti-hero on a mission to rescue the President, must navigate a world full of shady characters and alliances.
Join Tim Williams and guest co-host, Nicholas Pepin from the "Pop Culture Roulette" Podcast, to dive into Escape from New York on this episode of the 80s Flick Flashback Podcast.
Here are some additional behind-the-scenes trivia we were unable to cover in this episode:
- The idea of putting a wig on at one point in the film was improvised by Donald Pleasance.
- The shot of Maggie's corpse under the Duke's car was added after principal photography was done as John Carpenter felt the audience wouldn't get that the impact had killed her. Carpenter and Adrienne Barbeau filmed the shot in their garage with her under their own car.
Sources:
Wikipedia, IMDB
https://www.the-numbers.com/box-office-chart/weekend/1981/07/10
https://www.gq.com/story/escape-from-new-york-40-kurt-russell-john-carpenter-grim-future
Some sections were composed by ChatGPT
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:04):
New York, 1997. The entire city is walled
maximum security prison, the bridges are mine, the rivers are
patrolled, and the United StatesPolice force has everything
(00:24):
under control. I'm going in.
One man must go in where no man has ever gotten out.
His nightmare has just begun. Heard you were dead.
(00:47):
The greatest escape of them all is about to blow the future
apart. Escape from New York.
The early 70s were all about dark, dystopian visions of the
future, inspired by the chaos and crisis dominating the
headlines. Movies like The Omega Man,
(01:08):
Soylent Green, and THX 1138 painted a grim picture of what
could happen if we didn't get our act together.
Where there was biological warfare, overpopulation, or
government control, the message was clear.
Humanity's best days might already be behind us.
Fast forward to the summer of 1981 and the tone had totally
shifted. Films like Clash of the Titans,
(01:30):
Raiders of Lost Ark and Superman2 offered up some much needed
escapism with classic good versus evil battles.
But then there was this 80s flick which took us to the far
off future of 1997. In this world, Manhattan is a
nightmarish, anarchic prison island, and the only thing that
separates the hero from the restof the criminals is his mission
(01:52):
to rescue the president. Full of shadowy characters and
shady alliances, the hero by default is really just a man
looking out for himself. He might do the right thing, but
only if it benefits him in the end.
So prepare the glider plane, check your neck for injections,
and don't forget your eye patch as Nicholas Pepin and I
discussed Escape from New York from 1981 on this episode of the
(02:15):
80s Flip Flashback Contest. John Hughes and all his teen
dreams, montages and simply themes in Fairy's hands.
The city fans living life like it never ends and it's in Bikes
to the Sky. But this club just getting by.
(02:38):
Radical dreams and daring questsback then.
We were all very best in the 80s.
(02:58):
Hi, welcome in 80s flick lovers.I'm Tim Williams Crater and host
of the 80s Flick Flashback podcast.
Thanks so much for joining us today.
Get ready to embark on a nostalgic journey through the
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(03:41):
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Now let's get this party started.
Welcome back to the show. Glad to have him.
He's one of our favorite Co hosts from Pop Culture Roulette.
Mr. Nicholas Pepin, how you doing, Nicholas?
It's all right. The rumors of my demise have
been greatly exaggerated. Good one, good one.
(04:05):
So yeah, we're going to talk about Escape from New York from
1981, John Carpenter, which of all the directors that we've
covered on the podcast, he mightbe one of the most prolific that
we've covered cause of we've done the thing, we've done Big
Trouble in Little China, we've done Christine, now we're doing
Escape from New York. I think the only thing that's
left is the fog. And then maybe what's the kind
(04:30):
of sequel he did? Something about the darkness.
I should have looked it up. He he did a lot of movies.
I was looking through his his catalogue today and I'm like,
I've seen a lot of his movies. Yeah, yeah.
I mean, I covered The Fog over on Horror Through the Decades
over on the Media Pods Match channel.
Right, right. But I, you know, if you ever
(04:51):
want to do it like I've, I've watched that one.
Yeah, just, I just got that one on Blu-ray a couple of months
ago. A couple of months ago, Yeah.
I found like a 2 pack. It was the fog and the howling
together. It was a Scream Scream Queens
edition because it had, you know, 22 pretty decent horror
movies. So.
But yeah, I did, I watched it. I didn't watch it this past
(05:13):
Halloween, but I watched it Halloween of 2023.
So it's still somewhat fresh. Yeah, we'll, we'll get to that
one, but Escape from New York. I will stay up front.
This is not one that I is am as familiar with.
It's not one that I watched a lot, but I'll let you go.
When did you see Escape from NewYork for the very first time?
About a week ago, somehow I've never seen, I went and saw
(05:38):
Escape from LA in the movie theaters.
I remember going to see. I don't, but I have no idea why
I would have gone and seen Escape from LA in the movie
theater when I never saw Escape from New York.
I mean, I'm, I've been aware of escape from New York for a long
time. Like the movie poster is iconic.
I would, I would say the movie, most movie poster might be more
iconic than the movie itself, But I, for, I seem to remember
(06:03):
trying to sit down and watch it like, you know, like 10-15 years
ago, but for whatever reason, like I got distracted or
something happened and I couldn't finish it because there
were parts of it that I was like, I think I, but until about
a week ago, I don't, I had neversat down and watched it in its
entirety. I think I might have seen like
ATV version, maybe like you, I may have not have seen the whole
(06:25):
thing. I might be called like bits and
pieces because there were certain parts of it that I kind
of remembered. Or maybe I'd like seen them in
like clip clip clip montages or something about movies of the
80s. And of course, Snake Pliskin is
a pretty iconic character. So you know, we've seen his
image a lot. Anyway, I did not see Escape
from LA in the theaters. I remember when it came out and
(06:48):
I remember it bombing pretty badat the theater, but I it was
one, it's kind of one that I kind of always wanted to see,
but because 81 I was definitely too young to see it.
But when it came out being an R rated movie, even though it's
not a really, it's not a terrible, you know, it's not a
super adult R rated. I mean, it's got some language
and some violence, but there's really not that much else in it.
I think I had this movie come out in the system that happened
(07:10):
a few years later, it would havebeen PG13.
Yeah, probably. So it has a very 70s aesthetic.
Like it feels much more like a 70s movie than an 80s movie to
me. Like even when I mentioned to my
wife that that's what we're watching, it's like, oh, did
that come out in the 80s and like 81?
Like it, it didn't barely got inthere.
(07:31):
So it still feels very 70s to me.
Yes, I would agree. Yeah.
So, yeah, So I, I watched it forthe first time in the last five
years and I think I watched it kind of online, like on my
phone. So it really wasn't like a great
viewing experience. I mean, not that it's like, you
(07:51):
know, super high tech, a lot of the effects don't really hold up
as well now. But it was better to watch it
when I watched it today, like ona on a bigger screen to kind of
see more of the picture and someof the effects and stuff.
But yeah. So I want to ask you how long
it's been since you rewatched it?
Because you literally just watched it twice, right?
Did you watch it again? Yeah, I rewatched the last time
(08:12):
I rewatched it this afternoon. Right, right, all right well,
let's jump into story origin andpre production.
So John Carpenter, who talked about originally wrote the
screenplay for Escape from New York in 1976, which probably
gives you that 70s vibe in the aftermath of Nixon's Watergate
(08:32):
scandal, Carpenter said the whole feeling of the nation was
one of real cynicism about the president.
He wrote the screenplay, but no studio wanted to make it
because, according to Carpenter,it was too violent, too scary,
and too weird. He had been inspired by the film
Death Wish, which was very popular at the time.
He did not agree with the film'sphilosophy, but he liked how it
(08:52):
conveyed, quote UN quote, the sense of New York as a kind of
jungle. And he wanted to make a science
fiction film along those lines, which he'd already kind of,
well, he'd already done kind of New York as a jungle with
Assault on Precinct 13, which I think came out late 70s.
So that he did that one before this one.
Yeah, I think so. International Film investors
(09:13):
agreed to provide 50% of the budget and Gold Crest Films
signed a Co financing deal with him.
He got $7,000,000 to make this movie, which is which was the
highest budget he had been givento make a movie up to that
point. Yeah, I mean, he knows how to
make a movie on a little budget.Oh yeah, for sure.
Because I mean, even though this, I mean to think if you
(09:35):
were doing that today, that'd belike a $200 million budget, you
know, kind of movie. But you know, to do that movie
on 7,000,000 is impressive. Because it did have some pretty
cool effects and we'll get in, we'll get in a little get into
that a little bit later. But it does still feel kind of
be movie ish in some some sections.
(09:57):
It's a little, yeah, we'll get there.
So the Carpenter had just made Dark Star, but no one wanted to
hire him as a director, so he assumed he would make it in
Hollywood as a screenwriter. The filmmaker went on to do
other successful films with the invention or the intention of
making escape. Later, after the success of
Halloween, Avco Embassy signed producer Deborah Hill and him to
(10:19):
A2 Picture Deal. The first film from this
contract was The Fog, which cameout 1980.
Initially, the second film he was going to make to finish the
contract was The Philadelphia Experiment.
Because of script writing problems, Carpenter rejected it
in favor of this project. However, Carpenter felt
something was missing and recalls this was basically a
straight action film. And at one point I realized it
(10:40):
really doesn't have this kind ofcrazy humor that people from New
York would expect to see. So he brought in Nick Castle, a
friend from his film school daysat University of Southern
California, who also played the Shape in Halloween.
Castle invented the cabbie character and actually came up
with the film's ending. The film's setting proved to be
a potential problem for Carpenter, who needed to create
(11:01):
a decaying, semi destroyed version of New York City on a
shoestring budget. The film's production designer,
Joe Alves, and he rejected shooting on location in New York
because it would be too hard to make it look like a destroyed
city. Carpenter suggested shooting on
a movie back lot, but Alves Nix that idea because the texture of
a real street is not like a backlot.
(11:22):
They sent Barry Bernardi, their location manager and associate
producer, on a sort of all expense paid trip across the
country looking for the worst city in America.
That's what Deborah Hill remembers.
Bernardi suggested East Saint Louis, Illinois, because it was
filled with old buildings that exist in New York now and have
that CD rundown quality that theteam was looking for.
(11:45):
East Saint Louis, sitting acrossthe Mississippi River from the
more prosperous St. Louis, MO, had entire
neighborhoods burned out in 1976during a massive urban fire,
he'll said an interview at blockafter block was burnt out,
rubble. In some places there was
absolutely nothing, so you couldsee three and four blocks away,
(12:05):
so they chose to shoot it, mainly in Saint Louis, Illinois.
Which to my knowledge, East Saint Louis isn't any better now
than it was in. 1981 or 19? 81, Yeah, yeah.
You don't hear that one on the you know, most visited cities in
the in the country list too much.
Because wasn't East Saint Louis the joking vacation?
(12:27):
It might have been, yeah. Isn't that the city they got
robbed? Or I think it might be.
Yeah, I think you're right. Yeah.
You know, how do we get back to Interstate?
What you're going to do is I'm sorry.
Yeah. Good scene.
Carpenter was interested in creating 2 distinct looks for
the movie. He said one was the police
state, high tech, lots of neon, a United States dominated by
underground computers. That was easy to shoot compared
(12:49):
to the Manhattan Island prison sequences which had a few
lights, mainly torch lights likeOld Style England.
Certain matte paintings were rendered by James Cameron, who
was at the time a special effects artist with Roger
Corman's New World Pictures. Cameron was also one of the
directors of photography on the film as Snake pilots the glider
into the city. 3 screens on his control panel display animations
(13:13):
of the landing target on the World Trade Center and
surrounding buildings. Carpenter initially wanted high
tech computer graphics, which were very expensive even for
such a simple animation. The effects crew filmed the
miniature model set of New York City they used for other scenes
under black light reflective tape placed along every edge of
the model buildings. Only the tape is visible and
(13:35):
appears to be in a three-dimensional wireframe
animation. So that's how they did that kind
of look, which I thought was pretty cool.
Yeah, well, I watched the movie and I was like, OK, you know,
whatever. And then I read all of the stuff
and I read that. And when I watched it again
today, I was like, oh, OK, I cantell.
But. Like when I first saw it, like
I, it didn't stick out to me that it wasn't a computer
(13:57):
animation, you know. So I really, you know, good job
on the practical effects and it still hold that part, that part
of the movie still holds up. I mean, there's certain things
like you can, I mean, you can tell just like most 80s movies,
you can tell it's special effects, but it's not terrible.
I mean, we've seen we saw worse special effects in 90s movies.
(14:21):
The 80s Flick Flashback Podcast will return after these
messages. What seems to be the problem,
pal? There's so much pain in the
world, so many issues, I don't think I can bear it.
Hell, friendo, it sounds like you could use a dose of pop
culture roulette. Pop culture roulette?
(14:43):
What's that? Some sort of pop culture theme
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When hope seems far, dive into some PCR.
But I already get my entertainment news from Variety
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PCR gives you news you need, condensed, unfiltered and raw,
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(15:03):
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All right, well, let's jump intocasting.
A studio executive pressure JohnCarpenter to cast a season a
tough guy actor for the role of Steak.
(15:25):
Their preferences included ChuckNorris, Nick Nolte, Tommy Lee
Jones, and Charles Bronson. Carpenter didn't like these
choices because he thought Bronson, who was 60 at the time,
was too old. The others were too typecast or
simply not right for the part. At the time, 29 year old Kurt
Russell was best known for lighthearted Disney roles such as the
(15:46):
Computer wore tennis Shoes from 1969 and had no experience
playing greedy action roles. However, Carpenter had directed
Kurt Russell and Elvis in 1979 and they had a pretty positive
relationship working together. Producer Deborah Hill agreed his
youth, looks, athleticism and freshness to the action genre
made in the ideal choice for thepart.
(16:07):
Can't really see anybody else inthat role at this point.
Not anymore, no. I mean, it's just it's he's kind
of taking that role so much thatit'd be hard to, you know, think
of anybody from that era that could have done it instead.
I did read some some other reports that like Clint Eastwood
was thought of, which is why, you know, Kurt Russell decided
(16:28):
to give him kind of the Eastwoodtalking like the speech patterns
and stuff. So which I didn't notice as much
this time. Like it's clear, which we talked
about in the big trouble in the Little China episode that he was
definitely going for John Wayne and that and it's a little bit
more pronounced. And this one, I think it's just,
it doesn't, I don't feel like he's trying to be Clint
(16:51):
Eastwood. I think he's just talking more
soft like Eastwood does. But I think it works for the
character. Yeah, to say I didn't, I never
once that. Oh, is that Clint Eastwood?
No. Like no but.
There, there's another accent we'll get to, I'm sure.
Yeah. Oh yeah, yeah.
But he also like Another thing Iread was that he also decided to
do the Eastwood accent because of one of his Co stars who we'll
(17:13):
get to in a minute because he had been like several Westerns
with Clint Eastwood. So.
But Russell was the one suggested that his character
should wear an eye patch. He did have to remove the eye
patch between takes as wearing it constantly seriously affected
his depth perception, which I'm sure that's true.
Yeah, I was like, how many days into filming did he go?
(17:34):
Why did I suggest this? Right, right.
And a few things I read said he was like a very last minute
thing, like the first day of shooting.
He put it on and didn't even tell Carpenter and like, we're
going to do this. And so I was like, all right, go
for it. Yeah, as I say, I'm, I'm sure at
some point on like day three or four, he's like bad idea.
But we've gone too far now. We can't.
(17:56):
We can't go back. Right, exactly.
I guess why you don't see him running too much with the eye
patch, like it's, it's more kindof, you know, walking.
Yeah. So we've talked about Kurt
Russell. I've already done several of his
movies already, so won't go too much into his filmography.
But we've already mentioned the thing.
We've mentioned Big Trouble in Little China.
Of course, he did comedies in the 80s as well, like Used Cars,
(18:18):
Overboard, Tango, and Cash. He went to more drama in the 90s
with Backdraft, Tombstone, Stargate, Executive Decision,
and of course, he's still working today.
So one of my favorite actors forsure, one of the most prolific
and can play so many different types of characters.
Like he's great and drama. He's great in action, he's great
(18:39):
in comedy. I've said it before, I'll say it
again. He's one of my favorite actors
just because he can. He can play at all.
Well, he's consistent like. Yeah, he.
He never. I mean, he might be in a bad
movie, but generally speaking he's not the problem.
Right, exactly. He has stated this was his
favorite of all of his films, and Snake Pliskin is his
favorite of his characters. The name Snake Pliskin was
(19:02):
actually taken from a real person.
When writing the screenplay, John Carpenter struggled over
assigning a memorable name to his main character.
A friend of a friend suggested using the name of someone he
knew in high school, who he described as a sort of a tough
guy who bore a large snake tattoo on his abdomen.
The last name was Pliskin and went by the name Snake.
So, Carpenter said. Anybody with a snake tattooed on
(19:25):
them someplace, that's my kind of hero.
Even though I will say the snaketattoo on Kurt Russell is the
most fake looking tattoo I've ever seen on film. 100%.
I don't have any tattoos, but I've seen enough.
I mean, there's guys in the movie with real tattoos.
Then you put them next to Kurt Russell.
(19:45):
It's like it would not be that dark.
It would not be that pronounced as you know.
As as the owner of one tattoo, yeah, that was, it was pretty
glaring. It was pretty glaring how
obvious that was not a real tattoo.
Any thoughts about Kurt Russell as a whole or in the movie?
Like I said, he's consistent. I mean Tombstone, Probably one
(20:06):
of my all time favorites. Absolutely, hands down.
I I was re watching Gilligan's Island recently.
That was because on on lunch I have access to like a Roku at
work. Yeah yeah.
And one episode a jungle boy shows up and I'm like, is that?
No, I can't be. And I looked it up.
It's one of his first roles. Like, I believe it.
(20:26):
He was jungle boy on early episode of Gilligan's Island.
He was one, you know, he was very young.
But yeah, so that's. How long he's?
That's how long he's been around, you know?
Yeah, if you go back and try andtry to find some of those really
old and I think they have a few of them on Disney Plus now.
But some of those old Disney movies that he was in, I mean,
he was really young. And I think I'm trying to
(20:49):
remember the name of the movie that he that him and Goldie Hawn
are in where she's like a dancer.
And I think he has like a reallysmall bit part, but he was only
like 15 or 16 I think at that time.
So I mean, they're and they're both like, I mean look like
teenagers for sure. I would say when you say Goldie
Hawn and Kurt Russell, I immediately think of one of my
dad's favorite movies and go overboard.
(21:10):
Oh, yeah, yeah, I've got to cover that one soon.
That's one that's just, that's a, that's a lot of fun.
That's just a fun movie to watch.
All right, moving down the list with the cast, we got Lee Van
Cleef as Police Commissioner BobHawke.
He appeared in over 170 film andtelevision roles in a career
spanning nearly 40 years, but isbest known as a star spaghetti
(21:30):
westerns, particularly the Sergio Leone directed Dollars
trilogy films for a few Dollars More in 65, The Good, the Bad
and the Ugly in 66. In 1983, he received a Golden
Boot award for his contribution to the Western film and
television genre. So that's of course the actor I
was mentioning that. Why Russell decided to do the
Clint Eastwood acts, you know, homage to Clint Eastwood was
(21:53):
because he knew he was going to Co star with Lee Van Cleef.
So. Lee Van Cleef is one of those
like, yeah, I know about, but his, his movies tend to be on
the older side of things. But like, other than the Good,
the Bad and the Ugly, like, I, I'm sure I'm singing a lot of
his stuff, but that's the one that comes to mind immediately.
That, that, that Primus song. Primus had a song called Lee Van
(22:15):
Cleef. Yeah.
It's such an interesting name. Yeah.
And that's something like I I would definitely recognize the
name. And I think I've seen him and
some other things, like just really small, like bit parts and
like, OK, I think I should know who this guy is.
But then if you've ever seen that one scene from The Good,
the Bad and Ugly where they're all the eyes or, you know,
shifting back and forth, that's clearly him.
(22:35):
And so you like, OK, that's the guy.
So, you know, that's probably his, probably his most famous
role for sure. Probably, yeah.
Yeah, he actually flew in from Los Angeles for a one night
shoot and flew out the next day.When Carpenter watched the
dailies, he discovered that someof Van Cleeb's close-ups were
out of focus. Carpenter was forced to use some
of them since they couldn't afford to get the actor back.
(22:57):
Van Cleef had also suffered a knee injury prior to prior to
filming and wasn't fully recovered when it came time to
film the scenes, which is why hespends the majority of the film
sitting down or leaning on things while standing.
His wife was on set to make surethe actor could get through his
scenes, especially those that required him to walk and talk.
Carpenter recall recalled Van Cleef telling him the tracking
(23:19):
shot of Hawkins Snake walking down a hallway was the most
difficult part of the shoot for him.
Just walking down the hallway that needed it must have been
pretty bad. Moving on Ernest Borg 9 as
Cabbie Borg 9's film career began in 1951, included
supporting roles in From Here toEternity in 53, Bad Day at Black
(23:40):
Rock in 55, and The Wild Bunch in 69.
He also played the unconventional lead in many
films, winning the Academy Awardfor Best Actor for his role in
Marty in 1955. He was also the title character
in the sitcom Mchale's Navy from62 to 66 and Co starred as
Dominic Santini in the action series Airwolf from 84 to 86,
(24:00):
which I remember that show beingon, Oh yeah, on TV.
So he was also known as the original voice of Mermaid Man on
SpongeBob SquarePants from 99 until his death in 2012.
So. Yeah.
I mean, he's another one of those guys that's just been
around forever, so it's hard to.Yeah, Oh yeah, that's Ernest
Borgnine, and he looks the same in almost everything.
(24:20):
So it's yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's like, in really looking
at his filmography, like I felt like I'd seen him in more
things. And maybe he has been in, like,
really small things, maybe more television.
But yeah, yeah, he just one of those guys, you know, like, he's
just, that's Ernest Borgnine. When you see him, you know who
he is. Probably my favorite casting in
(24:41):
the movie. Donald Pleasance as President
John Harker, he began his careeron stage in the West End.
Of course, we talked about him in the Halloween movies, so I'm
going to skip all that. You know, he's most known for
playing Doctor Samuel Lummis in the Halloween movies.
We've covered all of them from the 80's.
The Prince of Darkness is the other John Carpenter mover from
(25:02):
the 80s and 87. So he played a priest in that
one. It's said that Donald Pleasance
drew in his own wartime experience as a prisoner of war
for his performance as the imprisoned president.
What I know you wanted to get towas although appearing as
President of the United States, Donald Pleasant still retains
his unmistakable British accent.According to John Carpenter,
Pleasant's possibly feeling self-conscious suggested the
(25:24):
script include a back story to explain this glaring
constitutional faux pas. He came up with the idea of the
dystopian United States having rejoined the British Empire, in
which case the president no longer needed to be a natural
born citizen. Carpenter thought the idea was
interesting, but would be both distracting and unnecessary.
Unnecessary to the story, instead opting to simply ignore
(25:46):
the accent. Well, and at some point he tried
to adopt an American accent. Yeah, it kind of goes in and
out, yeah. And it but like when he first
shows up on screen and he talks,he like, wait, the president is
British? Right, right.
I. Think, yeah, it was just like,
OK, all right, I mean, it's dystopian, so whatever, like.
(26:08):
Yeah. I mean, it's, yeah, logic.
Who needs logic? Just, you know, go with it.
But yeah, it's 1997, man. Anything can happen, you know.
A lot logic over cool cool wins every time every.
Time. I think that's a conversation
that we've had before. Yes, yes.
Thank you, Jerry D for bringing that one to us.
All right, and then we've got Isaac Hayes as the Duke.
(26:31):
Of course, Isaac Hayes is a wellknown musician.
In the 70s, he was featured in the film Shaft and Truck Turner.
He also had a recurring role in the TV series The Rockford Files
as an old cellmate of Rockford's.
In the 80s and 90s, he appeared in numerous films, this one most
notably. He also was in I'm going to Get
You Sucking 88 Prime Target 91 Robin Hood Men, a tight Robin
(26:52):
Hood Men in Tights in 93, as well as in episodes of The
A-Team and Miami Vice. He joined the founding cast of
Comedy Central's animated TV series South Park.
He provided the voice of the character of Chef, the Armorist
elementary school lunchroom cook, from the show's debut on
August 13th, 1997, one week shy of his 55th birthday, through
(27:12):
the end of its ninth season in 2006.
What are you going to say about him other than, you know, Shaft?
Yeah, and he was decent in this.I liked his little eye twitch,
and I know what that was really supposed to be, but it was at
least it was consistent to the. Movie.
I don't, I don't really know other than Kurt Russell, if
anybody knew what they were doing in this movie.
(27:34):
But. OK, let's get to well, we'll get
to the cast and we'll talk a little bit more about it.
I'll be these will be pretty quick.
We got Harry Dean Stanton as Harold Brain Hellman.
We talked about him in the Christine episode, so I won't
rehash that. Adrian Barbeau as Maggie, which
we talked about her and our Creep Show episode.
Also we talked about her in the Swamp Thing episode with
(27:55):
Laramie. So she's been in, you know, a
couple things. Tom Atkins as Captain Rainey, of
course, I know him best from Halloween Three Season of the
Witch, which we chose not to cover on the podcast because we
just couldn't get through it. He was also in Creepshow, Night
of the Creeps, Maniac Cop, of course, he's Lethal Weapon, but
(28:15):
the eggnog, the bullet through the eggnog as he's holding it.
So yeah, so he's been a couple movies and then we've got
Charles Ciphers as a Secretary of State.
I only mentioned him because he's known for his work with
John Carpenter, especially the role of Sheriff Lee Bracket in
Halloween, as well as Halloween too, and even came back for the
(28:36):
2021 sequel Halloween Kills. So anything to add about any of
those I just covered. Well, when you get to the fog,
you will be talking about Tom Atkins again.
Yes, we will. That's right.
Yeah, which, yeah, I'll wait till we get there because I
have, I have some, I have some thoughts, but we'll, we'll wait
till that episode. Talk about it.
(28:57):
Do you know who the voice was inthe opening narration of the
movie of the computer's voice? Oh, was it Jamie Lee Curtis?
It was Jamie Lee Curtis points to Nicholas.
Good job. I want to say she was the voice
in of the of the recording. He listened to in the thing as
well. So she's, you know, one of
those, you know, I made you famous, so you're going to be in
(29:20):
my movies no matter what. Well, I mean people, people like
to give like Tarantino or James Gunn or Kevin Smith a hard time
for always working with the samepeople.
But clearly, like John, Carpenter works with the same
people a lot. Yeah.
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
And I think one thing he mentioned about one of the
reasons why he wanted Russell instead of someone like Charles
(29:42):
Bronson or Chuck Norris is because he was still kind of a
new director. He didn't want a more seasoned
actor to come in and like try totake over the set or try to
implement too many ideas. So I could see him wanting to
work with people that he knew hecould collaborate with or would
let him do his thing without toomuch, you know, I.
(30:04):
Mean. I get it.
I mean. It's hard to think about, you
know, I've seen the most more recent interviews with John
Carpenter. So think of him as a young guy,
like just I'm up and coming. It's kind of funny thinking
about him that way. So.
But, you know, kids probably saythe same thing about us.
You guys were in high school. Yeah.
This is Austin. The film originally opened with
Snake and an accomplice named Taylor robbing the federal
(30:27):
depository and ultimately getting captured with Taylor
being shot dead by the police. This is the crime hawk note
Snake is being sent to New York for.
Test audiences found the scene over long and confusing, leading
to its removal. It was later included as a
deleted scene on the DVD. Joe Unger, who played Taylor, is
still listed in the end credits,though.
(30:48):
So nothing really about Joe Unger.
He wasn't like a big actor, but I give him his due for at least
being in the movie without beingin the movie.
So anybody else in the cast you want to talk about?
I know there are a few that guys, but they were not listed.
They must have been uncredited so I couldn't.
Find out there wasn't really anybody who jumped out of I did.
(31:13):
The only thing that jumped out of me was in the beginning when
they were running through the credits, it said like
introducing or also like like somebody named was it season
Hundley or season Headley? Yes.
We'll get to her in a second, yes.
OK, yeah, to say she had a special credit and I was like, I
had to look her up to see why, but I was like yeah, OK, yeah,
I'd never heard of her before since so.
We'll just go ahead and say she was married to Kurt Russell at
(31:35):
the time. At the time, she'd only done a
few other movies, but Adrian Barbeau was married to John
Carpenter at the time, so yeah. But she played the the woman in
the abandoned store who asked for a cigarette from snakes, so
that that's who seasoned Huddly was.
There wasn't really anybody thatstood out to me like, hey, it's
that guy, you know, so. Yeah.
And I mean, I could be just thinking it was somebody that it
(31:56):
wasn't, but the one of the like homeless bum guys that he finds
before he gets to the guy who thinks is the president.
He was like sitting down the floor.
I want to say that was like bluefrom old school.
Maybe, but I didn't bother to look that up.
Yeah, I didn't. Like I said I didn't.
He wasn't listed. So and then there was another
(32:18):
guy that was behind him, but I don't remember.
It was the guy that was running down the street like banging on
the the sewer heads. I want to say that was the same
guy that's in Weird Science. That's the like the bald haired,
weird looking guy, but once again, it was hard to really
see. So it's like it looked kind of
like him, but once again, I couldn't find them listed in the
(32:39):
credits so I didn't dig too, toomuch.
But those would have been some of that guys.
I would have been like, oh, there's that guy.
If they had more screen time, baby, normally here we would go
to iconic and favorite scenes. Do we have any iconic or
favorite scenes for this movie? The the closest thing I could
come up with for an iconic scenewas the the fight with the big
(33:01):
guy. Yeah, yeah.
But I think his name is. Yeah, but yeah, there wasn't.
I mean like I said the the the poster is more iconic and that
didn't come from the movie. At all, Right, right.
You know, I mean, I know sometimes you'll you'll see a
trailer and then like come out of the movie like there where
(33:22):
was that scene from the trailer?But this is one of those like
where was the scene from the poster like.
While you're there, I'll I'll read this little bit of trivia.
So first of all, this was the first film to be shot on Liberty
Island beneath the Statue of Liberty.
The Liberty Island scene along with the morning shot of
Manhattan where the helicopter scene were the only scenes in
(33:43):
the film shot in New York City. As you mentioned, the original
lobby poster art for the film shows the head of the Statue of
Liberty laying in the middle of a New York street, even though
this is completely absent from the film and the statue is shown
very much intact multiple times.But the 2008 found footage
monster film Cloverfield, which involves an unseen force
(34:04):
destroying New York City, actually did the poster and pays
homage to Escape from New York by including a shot where the
statue's head is lopped off and does actually wind up in the
street, JJ Abrams said. I love that movie as a kid, but
one of the things that drove me crazy is the poster had this
picture of the head of the Statue of Liberty sitting in the
middle of New York street, but it was never in the movie.
(34:25):
And I always felt that was such a crazy, scary image that it had
to be in our movie. I.
Love Cloverfield? Yeah, but you'll never get to
that because it's from 2008. Yeah, yeah, not even close, but
yeah. But I do think that was cool
that Abrams was like, he remembered that from the the
poster and was like, they didn'tdo it, so I'm going to do it.
So more power to you. Like I enjoyed, like I enjoyed
(34:47):
the scene towards the end where they're driving the taxi cab and
they hit a mine and the car literally like falls.
In half, yeah. But I enjoyed it because it was
so stupid, like it was like you hit a mine and the car like it
was like they took us a saw and literally cut it perfectly in
half, right, right. And then everybody but the but
(35:08):
earnest born 9. Yeah, how is he the only one
that? The three people in the back of
the car get out. No scratches, no cuts.
I just it was of of the many things in that movie that were
ridiculous, that was towards thetop.
But it it just because that scene just made me laugh like it
was. That's one of my favorite, and I
mean almost any scene with Ernest Borgnine because he was.
(35:30):
Just such a he was. He was a good Comic Relief or
good funny part of it. But I mean, overall, like there
wasn't really like a lot of likeclassic one liners or portable
parts or or memorable scenes. Like, yeah.
It's interesting because I so I ask you this question, it it's
kind of listed as a cult classic.
(35:52):
Would you define it as a cult classic?
I think I would because there isa following that it does have,
but it doesn't like it doesn't, it didn't get the awards or the
box office or or or that kind ofstuff that a lot of like movies
that wouldn't be considered likeit doesn't have like great
(36:12):
critical reception. Like it doesn't have a lot of
negative that I can. Yeah, it was.
It was. It wasn't panned by critics, but
it wasn't prey. It was kind of average.
Most people thought it was a glorified B movie which.
Which I think puts it in the level of like a cult classic
because it's one of those that like it probably doesn't get
(36:34):
shown on Saturday. You know, TVA lot.
It doesn't. You know, you, you might you
have you might have to hunt it down a lot more often.
You know, it's one of those things that comes up is like,
hey, that that Kurt Russell filmfrom early in his career or
early in his adult career kind of cool.
Like if you ever seen it, that'swhy you know.
(36:55):
Yeah, for me, it's almost like the movie itself is fine.
I'll just go ahead and say it. It's it's not, it's not my
favorite John Carpenter movie. It's not my favorite Kurt
Russell movie. It's not even in the top five or
ten. It's OK.
It's very slow. It takes a long time to really
kind of figure out kind of what's going on.
It's not as action-packed as I think I thought it was going to
(37:19):
be in my mind before I watched it, but I think it's iconic
because of the character that Kurt Russell gave us and Snake
like, I think that's why it's popular, because of Snake
Pliskin. Like that's the only reason that
it's, it has such staying power to me.
Because he comes off as so. Cool.
Yeah. Oh yeah, for sure.
(37:40):
And so let let me think of the proper way to say this on a on
on a way that I can podcast. You can say it I I can bleep it
up. Funny.
OK. Badass.
Yeah. Yeah, I can say that I can.
Say that. OK, I mean, he's such a badass
in this movie that you're like, oh, like, I mean he's like it
kind of like his charisma kind of makes it where like a movie
(38:02):
that like a lesser actor, this movie would have been forgotten
and we never we wouldn't be talking about this.
I mean, only reason people mighttalk about it or bring it up is
because John Carpenter directed it.
But in the hands of Kurt Russelllike, it made it more enjoyable
or more watchable. Oh yeah, for sure.
(38:22):
Like because really the most of the beginning is this Tim
walking around. Like I mean they said like he
doesn't speak for like the 1st 18 minutes of the movie.
Like he doesn't say a word so. But when he does, like it's so
like his presence really carriesthe movie.
Like just watching him walk around.
Yeah, it's not action-packed, but it still keeps you watching
because you're kind of waiting to see what's going to happen
(38:42):
next. Favorite scenes?
Like I don't really have an icon.
Like, yeah, I think the I think the the poster is the most
iconic scene that's not in the movie.
You know, it's like said that the poster is more iconic than
any seen in the movie. As far as favorite scenes,
nothing really, really stands out except maybe the ending.
It does have an exciting ending,more exciting than I thought I
was going to as we got there, you know, before we got there,
(39:05):
so. Well, and I mean, the Dukes car
is kind of cool in a, in a ridiculous like, why would you
hang crystal chandeliers off thefront of it?
But yeah, you're kind of like, all right.
I mean, in a world where you've managed to take one of the most
valuable properties on the planet and turn it into a
prison, why wouldn't you have a limo with crystal chandeliers
(39:30):
hanging off the front? Sure, why not 1st for me, Yeah.
He almost gives me the vibe of for the Terry Crews as the
President and Idiocracy. Yeah.
Yeah. So all right, well, let's talk
about scenes and trivia. When we think about some other,
I will talk about some deleted scenes and stuff that wasn't in
the movie, which I think, you know, we recently talked about
(39:52):
director's cuts on another podcast.
Some of this I think would have made the movie better, at least
more story love, better story wise.
We'll get into that. As we go, so the model of the
city was repainted and reused for Blade Runner, which also
which came out in 1982. So you can see that.
Makes sense, I mean. Yeah, I love this.
(40:13):
Every character that says I heard you were dead to Snake
dies. Yeah, and I paid attention to
that this time. And I'm like, oh.
Because like somebody said something similar, but they
didn't say I heard you were dead.
It was like the one thing that did strike me is kind of weird
is that somehow in this prison, and I don't know how long these
(40:34):
people have been there, everybody knew who snake was.
Like, everybody's like, hey, you're that guy.
You're a snake. Like even the random woman who
was like, hey, bomb a cigarette.Hey, your snake put like
everybody knew. And then like the one, like you
said, the ones who said, hey, I thought you were dead.
They ended up dying. But, you know, like, yeah, it
was ridiculous. But like, I mean, the cabbie
(40:55):
immediately was like your snake Plisket, you know?
Yeah, and like he talked like they had worked together, like
they were old friends. Like it was like, yes, it was
interesting. Also thought he was a little
off, like I think he was supposed to be a little mentally
off anyway, So so we talked about the the fight scene, which
I thought was like the most was sort of on before the most trope
(41:19):
part of the movie was, you know,you you kidnap or you, you, you
take into custody Snake and he'sobviously got to fight somebody
for no apparent reason just to have them fight in some kind of
death match. Right, But at least it made more
sense than the basketball scene from Escape from LA.
(41:42):
I want to say I've seen Escape from LA, but I couldn't tell you
anything about that movie. Don't.
Don't bother. Yeah, I remember.
I remember being pretty terrible, but Ox Baker is the
guy that he fought in in in thatscene.
But it said he actually struck Kurt Russell very heavily with
(42:02):
some of his blows during the boxing ring fight scene.
Russell had finally had enough and asked Baker to take it easy,
tapping him in the groin to let him know he was serious.
Baker then calm down. Where?
Speaking of that guys like has Ox Baker been in other stuff or
is it just the the beard kind ofmade him look like?
(42:23):
Yeah, I like, I didn't go back and look at it, but I was like,
I think somewhere I read that hewas, he was a wrestler.
Yeah. Which I thought when as soon as
he came out, I was like, he had to have been a wrestler.
He was known professionally as Ox Baker, an American
professional wrestler and actor.He was famous for his
distinctive eyebrows and finishing move, the heart punch,
(42:43):
sometimes called the hurt punch after Baker's famous catch
phrase. I love to hurt people.
And that was in the like, 60s and 70s when he was at his
height. So well before, well before I
was into any any wrestling. So yeah, yeah, absolutely.
But I thought this was interesting because I was like,
(43:04):
this looked pretty real. For the shot where Snake kills
Ox, Kurt Russell had to hit him with a real baseball bat with a
real nail in it. Baker had special padding on the
back of his neck to absorb the impact.
But John Carpenter, Russell bothmentioned in the commentary how
nervous the pro wrestler was. I bet he was because because you
(43:27):
could tell he was hitting him pretty hard.
I was like, I was like, wow, that and that.
And based on what you just said there, there might have been a
little extra behind it. Yeah, yeah, after getting
pummeled for days. Yeah.
All right, so let's talk a little bit about cutscenes,
different scenes. So one part of the screenplay
that surprised everyone who readit was the reveal that Romero
(43:50):
not only didn't kill Cabbie, butthat he traded away the
president's tape because he liked Cabbie's hat.
So that Romero was like the weird like crazy, crazy haired
skinny guy that was the one kindof keeping watch with the
president when when Harry Dean Stanton and Adrian Barbeau get
(44:12):
him. So but he does make that count
about, you know, nice, nice hat.Where did you get it?
So but they but they both assumed the tape was just music,
which is why cabbie had it in his pocket before he handed over
to Snake. Even Frank Doubleday, who played
Romero, had assumed that Romero murdered a lot of Duke's enemies
(44:33):
off screen. So, but we know we we can find
out later that the cabbie dies in the cab.
But yeah, that was interesting. In the original script Snake
Pilskin sorry I didn't say that wrong.
In the original script Snake Pliskin wasn't given a reason
quote UN quote to destroy the tape as he doesn't at the end
and did so because he said earlier he didn't care about the
(44:54):
war or the president. The scene where Snake asked the
president how he feels about thedeaths of everyone in the rescue
and is disgusted by the president's dismissive and empty
words was crafted because it made Snakes action seem
completely understandable. Which helps because I kind of
wondered at the I mean, I, I knew he had switched the tape.
We've seen that troop so many Times Now.
(45:17):
But then for him to destroy the tape, it was like, you know,
what was the whole point? But at the same time, we really
didn't really know what the tapewas or what it was supposed to
expose. It was still kind of mysterious
anyway. And and I would say one of the
the biggest misses of the movie and something that I think maybe
would have made it a little better was when he when Lee Lee
(45:40):
Van Cleef Hawk says thought you were going to kill me.
And he goes, no, I'm too tired and starts walking away.
I think it would have made it like even cooler or not cooler
is not the right word, but even more because he destroys the
tape. Like if he just turned around
and like pulls a gun out of somewhere and shoots him and
then destroys the tape and walks.
Right, right. And then, you know, he hasn't
(46:01):
gotten that far away. You would think, like, once they
hear the music playing on the tape, they would have chased him
down because he reneged somewhaton, you know, why they were
giving. They were pardoning him and
letting him go free. So yeah, that was interesting.
But so in 1981, Bantam Books published a movie tie in
novelization written by Mike Mcquay that adopts a lean,
(46:24):
humorous style reminiscent of the film.
The novel is significant becauseit includes scenes that were cut
out of the movie, such as the Federal Reserve Depository
robbery, the results in Snakes incarceration, which you
mentioned earlier. The novel provides motivation
and back story to Snake and Hawk, both disillusioned war
veterans, deepening the relationship that was only
hinted at in the film. The novel explains how Snake
(46:47):
lost his eye during the battle for Leningrad in World War 3,
how Hawk became Warden of New York, and Hawk's quest to find
his crazy son who lives somewhere in the prison.
The novel fleshes out the world that these characters exist in,
at times presenting a future even bleaker than the one
depicted in the film. The book also explains that the
West Coast is a no man's land and the country's population is
(47:10):
gradually being driven crazy by nerve gas as a result of World
War Three. Which would then make sense of
why they called him the crazies,the people that were, you know,
in the prison or whatever. So which I kind of figured it
had to have been had some some kind of chemical thing going on
there. So, but I think some of those
things that were left out could have added a little bit more
(47:32):
context and made it a little better story.
Yeah, I I'm honestly surprised, given that this film does have a
cult status and and you know, and the remake heavy era that we
live in. We haven't seen Netflix or or
Prime or somebody pick it up andwant to do like an Escape from
(47:55):
New York, like mini series wherelike you can really flesh out
all that stuff. Yeah, I know, I know.
And I don't know if you've got it in your notes because I did
look into some of the stuff likeafter Escape from LA bombed.
But they've tried, they've trieda couple other times to do other
sequels or, or like a snake or reboots.
Yeah, reboots. And they've just all fallen
(48:16):
apart. But then, you know, given how
much money Netflix or Apple TV or Prime just throws that stuff,
like, it wouldn't be outside. And it's not like this movie is
so beloved that, like, if they're like, we're going to
remake it, people would be like,no, how dare you.
I think most people would be like, yeah.
Maybe you there's going to be some.
Yeah, there's going to be some. I mean, there's so much more you
could do with that. You know, I think, I think
(48:38):
Carpenter had a good kernel of an idea.
I just don't think it was a developed enough of a story to
really give you enough to drive drive it story wise.
You know what I'm saying? I, I agree.
I think if we did have more timeto flesh out for the which he
didn't want to make it political, but it is somewhat
political because he doesn't trust the president.
(49:00):
But why doesn't he? And we know what, you know, kind
of some of that back story or whatever.
Well, and yeah, I don't know if it's 7 million in 1981 or it was
1981. Money and technology that has
goes along today would what I think I don't know, I don't, I
mean, I say they couldn't have done it back in 1981.
But I mean, look at what they did with a little more money on
(49:23):
on Star Wars or next year with the same sense in Blade Runner,
you know, so you know. Yeah.
The 80s Flick Flashback Podcast will return after these
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(50:26):
blockbuster. Subscribe today and I'll see you
on the other side of the page. Hey there fellow 80s movie
aficionados, Are you ready to embark on a nostalgia filled
journey to the greatest era of cinema?
Then look no further than the Retro Life for You 80s movie
podcast. Join us every week as we rewind
(50:49):
the VHS tag, dust off those Betamax classics and dive head
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Breakfast Club, Ghostbusters, ETin Indiana Jones and more.
It's like a trip in Doc Brown's Time Machine but without the
(51:13):
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Retro Life for You is your ticket to the ultimate movie
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Facebook at Retrolife for You and we can be found anywhere you
listen to your podcast as well as on our website
(51:37):
www.retrolifethenumber4theletteru.com.All right, well, let's talk
about box office. The Escape from New York was
released on July 10th, 1981, thesame day as The Fox and the
Hound, which also featured Kurt Russell as the voice of copper.
(51:59):
There's a yeah yeah yeah a tale of two movies that are not
alike. The Fox and the Hound ended up
at #3 at the box office just above Escape from New York at #4
Neither new release could be thrown.
Superman 2 from the number one spot in its fourth week of
release, but the film did end upgrossing $26 million off a $7
(52:22):
million budget in in theaters inthe summer of 81 worldwide, it
grossed over $50 million. So it was a successful movie
even though it wasn't, you know,heralded by critics or, you
know, necessarily the audiences.But once again, it made it.
It made good money. And and it does still have that
cult following, which once again, I think is more because
(52:42):
of the characters, Nick Pliskin than the movie itself.
All right, so we're going to move to our newest feature on
the podcast, the rewatch abilitynostalgia meter.
So if you're new to the show or from you haven't listened to a
new episode for this season, instead of talking about the
critical reception, we're going to talk about where this falls
on a scale of one to 10 on rewatch ability and nostalgia.
(53:04):
So to give you a range a a a gauge one would be I saw it once
that was enough. A5 is a good rewatch every
couple of years. 10 is highly rewatchable and full of
nostalgia. You can pick any number between
1:00 and 10:00. So, Nicholas, where does Escape
From New York fall on your rewatch ability and nostalgia
meter? Six.
(53:25):
OK, Yeah. Like, I mean, it's not it's not
bad and I I would rewatch it again, but it's not one like I'm
going to rush or go out on my way to watch again.
Yeah. You know, it's got some
problems. It's not, you know, necessarily
that great. But like if somebody wanted to
watch it, I'd be like, sure, whynot?
Like, you know, but like, you know, it might be a couple years
(53:46):
before I'm like, you know what Ireally want to watch again.
Right Escape from LA. That was good.
Yeah, I'm right there with you. I think 6 is 6 is pretty pretty
on the nose. Like I said, I watched it.
It might be five years ago and even re watching it again today,
like there wasn't a whole lot that I remembered and I think
I'd want it to be that way. It's not something like there's
(54:08):
not a lot of like memorable scenes or not any fun one
liners. I mean, the one running thing is
I heard you were dead. I mean that's like the only
thing that you kind of, you know, pull from from it, But
it's not it's not terrible. I mean, I I mean, I like I like
Carpenter as a director. I like Russell as an actor.
It's got, you know, a pretty good supporting cast.
I mean, you got people that we've we've seen the other
(54:30):
things that we know about. So I think 6 is, is a is a
solid, solid number. All right, well, letting me know
about what's going on. Pop culture roulette.
What are you guys getting into here in the beginning of 2025?
Just, you know, we're, we're going back to some of our normal
shows or just kind of picking a topic and topping about talking
(54:51):
about it or just trying to stay somewhat relevant and topical.
But I mean, basically just just three guys sitting around
talking nonsense. That's what you're known for.
I'm just. Getting well.
Well, I'm sure we haven't done one in a couple weeks, so I'm
sure we'll do a bracket here pretty.
Soon, yeah, yeah. Hey, March will be here before
you know it. It'll be time another.
(55:11):
The season of Brackets is upon us, so I'm sure it'll be coming
coming pretty quick. So yeah, definitely go check out
Pop Culture Roulette. Always a good time on their
show. Look forward to having Nicholas
back again. I know we'll have him on another
show here in the not too distantfuture.
Thanks for being a part of the episode today, alright?
Thanks for having me. Yes, Sir.
All right, everybody, that's a wrap on today's episode.
(55:32):
Thanks again for tuning in. I'm Tim Williams from the 80s
Flip Flashback podcast. Warm up the choppers.
We're moving in the. 80s we willrun where every day is just pure
fun. Coonies.
Never say Friday your mind. In those films we lose our mind.
(56:10):
John Hughes and all his teen dreams, monsages and simply
themes In fairest hands, the city bends living life like it
never ends. You still here?
(56:31):
It's over. Go home.
Go.
New York, 1997. The entire city is walled
maximum security prison, the bridges are mine, the rivers are
patrolled, and the United StatesPolice force has everything
(00:24):
under control. I'm going in.
One man must go in where no man has ever gotten out.
His nightmare has just begun. Heard you were dead.
(00:47):
The greatest escape of them all is about to blow the future
apart. Escape from New York.
The early 70s were all about dark, dystopian visions of the
future, inspired by the chaos and crisis dominating the
headlines. Movies like The Omega Man,
(01:08):
Soylent Green, and THX 1138 painted a grim picture of what
could happen if we didn't get our act together.
Where there was biological warfare, overpopulation, or
government control, the message was clear.
Humanity's best days might already be behind us.
Fast forward to the summer of 1981 and the tone had totally
shifted. Films like Clash of the Titans,
(01:30):
Raiders of Lost Ark and Superman2 offered up some much needed
escapism with classic good versus evil battles.
But then there was this 80s flick which took us to the far
off future of 1997. In this world, Manhattan is a
nightmarish, anarchic prison island, and the only thing that
separates the hero from the restof the criminals is his mission
(01:52):
to rescue the president. Full of shadowy characters and
shady alliances, the hero by default is really just a man
looking out for himself. He might do the right thing, but
only if it benefits him in the end.
So prepare the glider plane, check your neck for injections,
and don't forget your eye patch as Nicholas Pepin and I
discussed Escape from New York from 1981 on this episode of the
(02:15):
80s Flip Flashback Contest. John Hughes and all his teen
dreams, montages and simply themes in Fairy's hands.
The city fans living life like it never ends and it's in Bikes
to the Sky. But this club just getting by.
(02:38):
Radical dreams and daring questsback then.
We were all very best in the 80s.
(02:58):
Hi, welcome in 80s flick lovers.I'm Tim Williams Crater and host
of the 80s Flick Flashback podcast.
Thanks so much for joining us today.
Get ready to embark on a nostalgic journey through the
most iconic films of the decade that brought us unforgettable
adventures, epic music, and classic one liners.
We're thrilled to have you join us, and if you're as excited as
we are, be sure to leave us a stellar 5 star review on Apple
(03:20):
Podcasts. No matter which podcasting
platform you're listening to, goahead and hit that follow or
subscribe button. We want to hear from you.
So dive into the conversation onFacebook, Instagram, Tiktok, or
YouTube. And if you're feeling generous
and want to show your support, check us out on
buymeacoffee.com. Every little bit counts and goes
a long way in keeping our podcast alive.
(03:41):
Plus, make sure to explore 80s flickflashback.com and RT Public
Store for some totally awesome merch and original designs.
Now let's get this party started.
Welcome back to the show. Glad to have him.
He's one of our favorite Co hosts from Pop Culture Roulette.
Mr. Nicholas Pepin, how you doing, Nicholas?
It's all right. The rumors of my demise have
been greatly exaggerated. Good one, good one.
(04:05):
So yeah, we're going to talk about Escape from New York from
1981, John Carpenter, which of all the directors that we've
covered on the podcast, he mightbe one of the most prolific that
we've covered cause of we've done the thing, we've done Big
Trouble in Little China, we've done Christine, now we're doing
Escape from New York. I think the only thing that's
left is the fog. And then maybe what's the kind
(04:30):
of sequel he did? Something about the darkness.
I should have looked it up. He he did a lot of movies.
I was looking through his his catalogue today and I'm like,
I've seen a lot of his movies. Yeah, yeah.
I mean, I covered The Fog over on Horror Through the Decades
over on the Media Pods Match channel.
Right, right. But I, you know, if you ever
(04:51):
want to do it like I've, I've watched that one.
Yeah, just, I just got that one on Blu-ray a couple of months
ago. A couple of months ago, Yeah.
I found like a 2 pack. It was the fog and the howling
together. It was a Scream Scream Queens
edition because it had, you know, 22 pretty decent horror
movies. So.
But yeah, I did, I watched it. I didn't watch it this past
(05:13):
Halloween, but I watched it Halloween of 2023.
So it's still somewhat fresh. Yeah, we'll, we'll get to that
one, but Escape from New York. I will stay up front.
This is not one that I is am as familiar with.
It's not one that I watched a lot, but I'll let you go.
When did you see Escape from NewYork for the very first time?
About a week ago, somehow I've never seen, I went and saw
(05:38):
Escape from LA in the movie theaters.
I remember going to see. I don't, but I have no idea why
I would have gone and seen Escape from LA in the movie
theater when I never saw Escape from New York.
I mean, I'm, I've been aware of escape from New York for a long
time. Like the movie poster is iconic.
I would, I would say the movie, most movie poster might be more
iconic than the movie itself, But I, for, I seem to remember
(06:03):
trying to sit down and watch it like, you know, like 10-15 years
ago, but for whatever reason, like I got distracted or
something happened and I couldn't finish it because there
were parts of it that I was like, I think I, but until about
a week ago, I don't, I had neversat down and watched it in its
entirety. I think I might have seen like
ATV version, maybe like you, I may have not have seen the whole
(06:25):
thing. I might be called like bits and
pieces because there were certain parts of it that I kind
of remembered. Or maybe I'd like seen them in
like clip clip clip montages or something about movies of the
80s. And of course, Snake Pliskin is
a pretty iconic character. So you know, we've seen his
image a lot. Anyway, I did not see Escape
from LA in the theaters. I remember when it came out and
(06:48):
I remember it bombing pretty badat the theater, but I it was
one, it's kind of one that I kind of always wanted to see,
but because 81 I was definitely too young to see it.
But when it came out being an R rated movie, even though it's
not a really, it's not a terrible, you know, it's not a
super adult R rated. I mean, it's got some language
and some violence, but there's really not that much else in it.
I think I had this movie come out in the system that happened
(07:10):
a few years later, it would havebeen PG13.
Yeah, probably. So it has a very 70s aesthetic.
Like it feels much more like a 70s movie than an 80s movie to
me. Like even when I mentioned to my
wife that that's what we're watching, it's like, oh, did
that come out in the 80s and like 81?
Like it, it didn't barely got inthere.
(07:31):
So it still feels very 70s to me.
Yes, I would agree. Yeah.
So, yeah, So I, I watched it forthe first time in the last five
years and I think I watched it kind of online, like on my
phone. So it really wasn't like a great
viewing experience. I mean, not that it's like, you
(07:51):
know, super high tech, a lot of the effects don't really hold up
as well now. But it was better to watch it
when I watched it today, like ona on a bigger screen to kind of
see more of the picture and someof the effects and stuff.
But yeah. So I want to ask you how long
it's been since you rewatched it?
Because you literally just watched it twice, right?
Did you watch it again? Yeah, I rewatched the last time
(08:12):
I rewatched it this afternoon. Right, right, all right well,
let's jump into story origin andpre production.
So John Carpenter, who talked about originally wrote the
screenplay for Escape from New York in 1976, which probably
gives you that 70s vibe in the aftermath of Nixon's Watergate
(08:32):
scandal, Carpenter said the whole feeling of the nation was
one of real cynicism about the president.
He wrote the screenplay, but no studio wanted to make it
because, according to Carpenter,it was too violent, too scary,
and too weird. He had been inspired by the film
Death Wish, which was very popular at the time.
He did not agree with the film'sphilosophy, but he liked how it
(08:52):
conveyed, quote UN quote, the sense of New York as a kind of
jungle. And he wanted to make a science
fiction film along those lines, which he'd already kind of,
well, he'd already done kind of New York as a jungle with
Assault on Precinct 13, which I think came out late 70s.
So that he did that one before this one.
Yeah, I think so. International Film investors
(09:13):
agreed to provide 50% of the budget and Gold Crest Films
signed a Co financing deal with him.
He got $7,000,000 to make this movie, which is which was the
highest budget he had been givento make a movie up to that
point. Yeah, I mean, he knows how to
make a movie on a little budget.Oh yeah, for sure.
Because I mean, even though this, I mean to think if you
(09:35):
were doing that today, that'd belike a $200 million budget, you
know, kind of movie. But you know, to do that movie
on 7,000,000 is impressive. Because it did have some pretty
cool effects and we'll get in, we'll get in a little get into
that a little bit later. But it does still feel kind of
be movie ish in some some sections.
(09:57):
It's a little, yeah, we'll get there.
So the Carpenter had just made Dark Star, but no one wanted to
hire him as a director, so he assumed he would make it in
Hollywood as a screenwriter. The filmmaker went on to do
other successful films with the invention or the intention of
making escape. Later, after the success of
Halloween, Avco Embassy signed producer Deborah Hill and him to
(10:19):
A2 Picture Deal. The first film from this
contract was The Fog, which cameout 1980.
Initially, the second film he was going to make to finish the
contract was The Philadelphia Experiment.
Because of script writing problems, Carpenter rejected it
in favor of this project. However, Carpenter felt
something was missing and recalls this was basically a
straight action film. And at one point I realized it
(10:40):
really doesn't have this kind ofcrazy humor that people from New
York would expect to see. So he brought in Nick Castle, a
friend from his film school daysat University of Southern
California, who also played the Shape in Halloween.
Castle invented the cabbie character and actually came up
with the film's ending. The film's setting proved to be
a potential problem for Carpenter, who needed to create
(11:01):
a decaying, semi destroyed version of New York City on a
shoestring budget. The film's production designer,
Joe Alves, and he rejected shooting on location in New York
because it would be too hard to make it look like a destroyed
city. Carpenter suggested shooting on
a movie back lot, but Alves Nix that idea because the texture of
a real street is not like a backlot.
(11:22):
They sent Barry Bernardi, their location manager and associate
producer, on a sort of all expense paid trip across the
country looking for the worst city in America.
That's what Deborah Hill remembers.
Bernardi suggested East Saint Louis, Illinois, because it was
filled with old buildings that exist in New York now and have
that CD rundown quality that theteam was looking for.
(11:45):
East Saint Louis, sitting acrossthe Mississippi River from the
more prosperous St. Louis, MO, had entire
neighborhoods burned out in 1976during a massive urban fire,
he'll said an interview at blockafter block was burnt out,
rubble. In some places there was
absolutely nothing, so you couldsee three and four blocks away,
(12:05):
so they chose to shoot it, mainly in Saint Louis, Illinois.
Which to my knowledge, East Saint Louis isn't any better now
than it was in. 1981 or 19? 81, Yeah, yeah.
You don't hear that one on the you know, most visited cities in
the in the country list too much.
Because wasn't East Saint Louis the joking vacation?
(12:27):
It might have been, yeah. Isn't that the city they got
robbed? Or I think it might be.
Yeah, I think you're right. Yeah.
You know, how do we get back to Interstate?
What you're going to do is I'm sorry.
Yeah. Good scene.
Carpenter was interested in creating 2 distinct looks for
the movie. He said one was the police
state, high tech, lots of neon, a United States dominated by
underground computers. That was easy to shoot compared
(12:49):
to the Manhattan Island prison sequences which had a few
lights, mainly torch lights likeOld Style England.
Certain matte paintings were rendered by James Cameron, who
was at the time a special effects artist with Roger
Corman's New World Pictures. Cameron was also one of the
directors of photography on the film as Snake pilots the glider
into the city. 3 screens on his control panel display animations
(13:13):
of the landing target on the World Trade Center and
surrounding buildings. Carpenter initially wanted high
tech computer graphics, which were very expensive even for
such a simple animation. The effects crew filmed the
miniature model set of New York City they used for other scenes
under black light reflective tape placed along every edge of
the model buildings. Only the tape is visible and
(13:35):
appears to be in a three-dimensional wireframe
animation. So that's how they did that kind
of look, which I thought was pretty cool.
Yeah, well, I watched the movie and I was like, OK, you know,
whatever. And then I read all of the stuff
and I read that. And when I watched it again
today, I was like, oh, OK, I cantell.
But. Like when I first saw it, like
I, it didn't stick out to me that it wasn't a computer
(13:57):
animation, you know. So I really, you know, good job
on the practical effects and it still hold that part, that part
of the movie still holds up. I mean, there's certain things
like you can, I mean, you can tell just like most 80s movies,
you can tell it's special effects, but it's not terrible.
I mean, we've seen we saw worse special effects in 90s movies.
(14:21):
The 80s Flick Flashback Podcast will return after these
messages. What seems to be the problem,
pal? There's so much pain in the
world, so many issues, I don't think I can bear it.
Hell, friendo, it sounds like you could use a dose of pop
culture roulette. Pop culture roulette?
(14:43):
What's that? Some sort of pop culture theme
podcast or something? That's right, Sonny boy.
When hope seems far, dive into some PCR.
But I already get my entertainment news from Variety
that's pretty good if you're a shucklehead.
PCR gives you news you need, condensed, unfiltered and raw,
from three nerds who know a little something about
(15:03):
something. Wow, OK, sign me up.
That's the spirit. Pop coach roulette New episodes
every Monday, available on all major podcast directories.
All right, well, let's jump intocasting.
A studio executive pressure JohnCarpenter to cast a season a
tough guy actor for the role of Steak.
(15:25):
Their preferences included ChuckNorris, Nick Nolte, Tommy Lee
Jones, and Charles Bronson. Carpenter didn't like these
choices because he thought Bronson, who was 60 at the time,
was too old. The others were too typecast or
simply not right for the part. At the time, 29 year old Kurt
Russell was best known for lighthearted Disney roles such as the
(15:46):
Computer wore tennis Shoes from 1969 and had no experience
playing greedy action roles. However, Carpenter had directed
Kurt Russell and Elvis in 1979 and they had a pretty positive
relationship working together. Producer Deborah Hill agreed his
youth, looks, athleticism and freshness to the action genre
made in the ideal choice for thepart.
(16:07):
Can't really see anybody else inthat role at this point.
Not anymore, no. I mean, it's just it's he's kind
of taking that role so much thatit'd be hard to, you know, think
of anybody from that era that could have done it instead.
I did read some some other reports that like Clint Eastwood
was thought of, which is why, you know, Kurt Russell decided
(16:28):
to give him kind of the Eastwoodtalking like the speech patterns
and stuff. So which I didn't notice as much
this time. Like it's clear, which we talked
about in the big trouble in the Little China episode that he was
definitely going for John Wayne and that and it's a little bit
more pronounced. And this one, I think it's just,
it doesn't, I don't feel like he's trying to be Clint
(16:51):
Eastwood. I think he's just talking more
soft like Eastwood does. But I think it works for the
character. Yeah, to say I didn't, I never
once that. Oh, is that Clint Eastwood?
No. Like no but.
There, there's another accent we'll get to, I'm sure.
Yeah. Oh yeah, yeah.
But he also like Another thing Iread was that he also decided to
do the Eastwood accent because of one of his Co stars who we'll
(17:13):
get to in a minute because he had been like several Westerns
with Clint Eastwood. So.
But Russell was the one suggested that his character
should wear an eye patch. He did have to remove the eye
patch between takes as wearing it constantly seriously affected
his depth perception, which I'm sure that's true.
Yeah, I was like, how many days into filming did he go?
(17:34):
Why did I suggest this? Right, right.
And a few things I read said he was like a very last minute
thing, like the first day of shooting.
He put it on and didn't even tell Carpenter and like, we're
going to do this. And so I was like, all right, go
for it. Yeah, as I say, I'm, I'm sure at
some point on like day three or four, he's like bad idea.
But we've gone too far now. We can't.
(17:56):
We can't go back. Right, exactly.
I guess why you don't see him running too much with the eye
patch, like it's, it's more kindof, you know, walking.
Yeah. So we've talked about Kurt
Russell. I've already done several of his
movies already, so won't go too much into his filmography.
But we've already mentioned the thing.
We've mentioned Big Trouble in Little China.
Of course, he did comedies in the 80s as well, like Used Cars,
(18:18):
Overboard, Tango, and Cash. He went to more drama in the 90s
with Backdraft, Tombstone, Stargate, Executive Decision,
and of course, he's still working today.
So one of my favorite actors forsure, one of the most prolific
and can play so many different types of characters.
Like he's great and drama. He's great in action, he's great
(18:39):
in comedy. I've said it before, I'll say it
again. He's one of my favorite actors
just because he can. He can play at all.
Well, he's consistent like. Yeah, he.
He never. I mean, he might be in a bad
movie, but generally speaking he's not the problem.
Right, exactly. He has stated this was his
favorite of all of his films, and Snake Pliskin is his
favorite of his characters. The name Snake Pliskin was
(19:02):
actually taken from a real person.
When writing the screenplay, John Carpenter struggled over
assigning a memorable name to his main character.
A friend of a friend suggested using the name of someone he
knew in high school, who he described as a sort of a tough
guy who bore a large snake tattoo on his abdomen.
The last name was Pliskin and went by the name Snake.
So, Carpenter said. Anybody with a snake tattooed on
(19:25):
them someplace, that's my kind of hero.
Even though I will say the snaketattoo on Kurt Russell is the
most fake looking tattoo I've ever seen on film. 100%.
I don't have any tattoos, but I've seen enough.
I mean, there's guys in the movie with real tattoos.
Then you put them next to Kurt Russell.
(19:45):
It's like it would not be that dark.
It would not be that pronounced as you know.
As as the owner of one tattoo, yeah, that was, it was pretty
glaring. It was pretty glaring how
obvious that was not a real tattoo.
Any thoughts about Kurt Russell as a whole or in the movie?
Like I said, he's consistent. I mean Tombstone, Probably one
(20:06):
of my all time favorites. Absolutely, hands down.
I I was re watching Gilligan's Island recently.
That was because on on lunch I have access to like a Roku at
work. Yeah yeah.
And one episode a jungle boy shows up and I'm like, is that?
No, I can't be. And I looked it up.
It's one of his first roles. Like, I believe it.
(20:26):
He was jungle boy on early episode of Gilligan's Island.
He was one, you know, he was very young.
But yeah, so that's. How long he's?
That's how long he's been around, you know?
Yeah, if you go back and try andtry to find some of those really
old and I think they have a few of them on Disney Plus now.
But some of those old Disney movies that he was in, I mean,
he was really young. And I think I'm trying to
(20:49):
remember the name of the movie that he that him and Goldie Hawn
are in where she's like a dancer.
And I think he has like a reallysmall bit part, but he was only
like 15 or 16 I think at that time.
So I mean, they're and they're both like, I mean look like
teenagers for sure. I would say when you say Goldie
Hawn and Kurt Russell, I immediately think of one of my
dad's favorite movies and go overboard.
(21:10):
Oh, yeah, yeah, I've got to cover that one soon.
That's one that's just, that's a, that's a lot of fun.
That's just a fun movie to watch.
All right, moving down the list with the cast, we got Lee Van
Cleef as Police Commissioner BobHawke.
He appeared in over 170 film andtelevision roles in a career
spanning nearly 40 years, but isbest known as a star spaghetti
(21:30):
westerns, particularly the Sergio Leone directed Dollars
trilogy films for a few Dollars More in 65, The Good, the Bad
and the Ugly in 66. In 1983, he received a Golden
Boot award for his contribution to the Western film and
television genre. So that's of course the actor I
was mentioning that. Why Russell decided to do the
Clint Eastwood acts, you know, homage to Clint Eastwood was
(21:53):
because he knew he was going to Co star with Lee Van Cleef.
So. Lee Van Cleef is one of those
like, yeah, I know about, but his, his movies tend to be on
the older side of things. But like, other than the Good,
the Bad and the Ugly, like, I, I'm sure I'm singing a lot of
his stuff, but that's the one that comes to mind immediately.
That, that, that Primus song. Primus had a song called Lee Van
(22:15):
Cleef. Yeah.
It's such an interesting name. Yeah.
And that's something like I I would definitely recognize the
name. And I think I've seen him and
some other things, like just really small, like bit parts and
like, OK, I think I should know who this guy is.
But then if you've ever seen that one scene from The Good,
the Bad and Ugly where they're all the eyes or, you know,
shifting back and forth, that's clearly him.
(22:35):
And so you like, OK, that's the guy.
So, you know, that's probably his, probably his most famous
role for sure. Probably, yeah.
Yeah, he actually flew in from Los Angeles for a one night
shoot and flew out the next day.When Carpenter watched the
dailies, he discovered that someof Van Cleeb's close-ups were
out of focus. Carpenter was forced to use some
of them since they couldn't afford to get the actor back.
(22:57):
Van Cleef had also suffered a knee injury prior to prior to
filming and wasn't fully recovered when it came time to
film the scenes, which is why hespends the majority of the film
sitting down or leaning on things while standing.
His wife was on set to make surethe actor could get through his
scenes, especially those that required him to walk and talk.
Carpenter recall recalled Van Cleef telling him the tracking
(23:19):
shot of Hawkins Snake walking down a hallway was the most
difficult part of the shoot for him.
Just walking down the hallway that needed it must have been
pretty bad. Moving on Ernest Borg 9 as
Cabbie Borg 9's film career began in 1951, included
supporting roles in From Here toEternity in 53, Bad Day at Black
(23:40):
Rock in 55, and The Wild Bunch in 69.
He also played the unconventional lead in many
films, winning the Academy Awardfor Best Actor for his role in
Marty in 1955. He was also the title character
in the sitcom Mchale's Navy from62 to 66 and Co starred as
Dominic Santini in the action series Airwolf from 84 to 86,
(24:00):
which I remember that show beingon, Oh yeah, on TV.
So he was also known as the original voice of Mermaid Man on
SpongeBob SquarePants from 99 until his death in 2012.
So. Yeah.
I mean, he's another one of those guys that's just been
around forever, so it's hard to.Yeah, Oh yeah, that's Ernest
Borgnine, and he looks the same in almost everything.
(24:20):
So it's yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's like, in really looking
at his filmography, like I felt like I'd seen him in more
things. And maybe he has been in, like,
really small things, maybe more television.
But yeah, yeah, he just one of those guys, you know, like, he's
just, that's Ernest Borgnine. When you see him, you know who
he is. Probably my favorite casting in
(24:41):
the movie. Donald Pleasance as President
John Harker, he began his careeron stage in the West End.
Of course, we talked about him in the Halloween movies, so I'm
going to skip all that. You know, he's most known for
playing Doctor Samuel Lummis in the Halloween movies.
We've covered all of them from the 80's.
The Prince of Darkness is the other John Carpenter mover from
(25:02):
the 80s and 87. So he played a priest in that
one. It's said that Donald Pleasance
drew in his own wartime experience as a prisoner of war
for his performance as the imprisoned president.
What I know you wanted to get towas although appearing as
President of the United States, Donald Pleasant still retains
his unmistakable British accent.According to John Carpenter,
Pleasant's possibly feeling self-conscious suggested the
(25:24):
script include a back story to explain this glaring
constitutional faux pas. He came up with the idea of the
dystopian United States having rejoined the British Empire, in
which case the president no longer needed to be a natural
born citizen. Carpenter thought the idea was
interesting, but would be both distracting and unnecessary.
Unnecessary to the story, instead opting to simply ignore
(25:46):
the accent. Well, and at some point he tried
to adopt an American accent. Yeah, it kind of goes in and
out, yeah. And it but like when he first
shows up on screen and he talks,he like, wait, the president is
British? Right, right.
I. Think, yeah, it was just like,
OK, all right, I mean, it's dystopian, so whatever, like.
(26:08):
Yeah. I mean, it's, yeah, logic.
Who needs logic? Just, you know, go with it.
But yeah, it's 1997, man. Anything can happen, you know.
A lot logic over cool cool wins every time every.
Time. I think that's a conversation
that we've had before. Yes, yes.
Thank you, Jerry D for bringing that one to us.
All right, and then we've got Isaac Hayes as the Duke.
(26:31):
Of course, Isaac Hayes is a wellknown musician.
In the 70s, he was featured in the film Shaft and Truck Turner.
He also had a recurring role in the TV series The Rockford Files
as an old cellmate of Rockford's.
In the 80s and 90s, he appeared in numerous films, this one most
notably. He also was in I'm going to Get
You Sucking 88 Prime Target 91 Robin Hood Men, a tight Robin
(26:52):
Hood Men in Tights in 93, as well as in episodes of The
A-Team and Miami Vice. He joined the founding cast of
Comedy Central's animated TV series South Park.
He provided the voice of the character of Chef, the Armorist
elementary school lunchroom cook, from the show's debut on
August 13th, 1997, one week shy of his 55th birthday, through
(27:12):
the end of its ninth season in 2006.
What are you going to say about him other than, you know, Shaft?
Yeah, and he was decent in this.I liked his little eye twitch,
and I know what that was really supposed to be, but it was at
least it was consistent to the. Movie.
I don't, I don't really know other than Kurt Russell, if
anybody knew what they were doing in this movie.
(27:34):
But. OK, let's get to well, we'll get
to the cast and we'll talk a little bit more about it.
I'll be these will be pretty quick.
We got Harry Dean Stanton as Harold Brain Hellman.
We talked about him in the Christine episode, so I won't
rehash that. Adrian Barbeau as Maggie, which
we talked about her and our Creep Show episode.
Also we talked about her in the Swamp Thing episode with
(27:55):
Laramie. So she's been in, you know, a
couple things. Tom Atkins as Captain Rainey, of
course, I know him best from Halloween Three Season of the
Witch, which we chose not to cover on the podcast because we
just couldn't get through it. He was also in Creepshow, Night
of the Creeps, Maniac Cop, of course, he's Lethal Weapon, but
(28:15):
the eggnog, the bullet through the eggnog as he's holding it.
So yeah, so he's been a couple movies and then we've got
Charles Ciphers as a Secretary of State.
I only mentioned him because he's known for his work with
John Carpenter, especially the role of Sheriff Lee Bracket in
Halloween, as well as Halloween too, and even came back for the
(28:36):
2021 sequel Halloween Kills. So anything to add about any of
those I just covered. Well, when you get to the fog,
you will be talking about Tom Atkins again.
Yes, we will. That's right.
Yeah, which, yeah, I'll wait till we get there because I
have, I have some, I have some thoughts, but we'll, we'll wait
till that episode. Talk about it.
(28:57):
Do you know who the voice was inthe opening narration of the
movie of the computer's voice? Oh, was it Jamie Lee Curtis?
It was Jamie Lee Curtis points to Nicholas.
Good job. I want to say she was the voice
in of the of the recording. He listened to in the thing as
well. So she's, you know, one of
those, you know, I made you famous, so you're going to be in
(29:20):
my movies no matter what. Well, I mean people, people like
to give like Tarantino or James Gunn or Kevin Smith a hard time
for always working with the samepeople.
But clearly, like John, Carpenter works with the same
people a lot. Yeah.
Oh, yeah. Yeah.
And I think one thing he mentioned about one of the
reasons why he wanted Russell instead of someone like Charles
(29:42):
Bronson or Chuck Norris is because he was still kind of a
new director. He didn't want a more seasoned
actor to come in and like try totake over the set or try to
implement too many ideas. So I could see him wanting to
work with people that he knew hecould collaborate with or would
let him do his thing without toomuch, you know, I.
(30:04):
Mean. I get it.
I mean. It's hard to think about, you
know, I've seen the most more recent interviews with John
Carpenter. So think of him as a young guy,
like just I'm up and coming. It's kind of funny thinking
about him that way. So.
But, you know, kids probably saythe same thing about us.
You guys were in high school. Yeah.
This is Austin. The film originally opened with
Snake and an accomplice named Taylor robbing the federal
(30:27):
depository and ultimately getting captured with Taylor
being shot dead by the police. This is the crime hawk note
Snake is being sent to New York for.
Test audiences found the scene over long and confusing, leading
to its removal. It was later included as a
deleted scene on the DVD. Joe Unger, who played Taylor, is
still listed in the end credits,though.
(30:48):
So nothing really about Joe Unger.
He wasn't like a big actor, but I give him his due for at least
being in the movie without beingin the movie.
So anybody else in the cast you want to talk about?
I know there are a few that guys, but they were not listed.
They must have been uncredited so I couldn't.
Find out there wasn't really anybody who jumped out of I did.
(31:13):
The only thing that jumped out of me was in the beginning when
they were running through the credits, it said like
introducing or also like like somebody named was it season
Hundley or season Headley? Yes.
We'll get to her in a second, yes.
OK, yeah, to say she had a special credit and I was like, I
had to look her up to see why, but I was like yeah, OK, yeah,
I'd never heard of her before since so.
We'll just go ahead and say she was married to Kurt Russell at
(31:35):
the time. At the time, she'd only done a
few other movies, but Adrian Barbeau was married to John
Carpenter at the time, so yeah. But she played the the woman in
the abandoned store who asked for a cigarette from snakes, so
that that's who seasoned Huddly was.
There wasn't really anybody thatstood out to me like, hey, it's
that guy, you know, so. Yeah.
And I mean, I could be just thinking it was somebody that it
(31:56):
wasn't, but the one of the like homeless bum guys that he finds
before he gets to the guy who thinks is the president.
He was like sitting down the floor.
I want to say that was like bluefrom old school.
Maybe, but I didn't bother to look that up.
Yeah, I didn't. Like I said I didn't.
He wasn't listed. So and then there was another
(32:18):
guy that was behind him, but I don't remember.
It was the guy that was running down the street like banging on
the the sewer heads. I want to say that was the same
guy that's in Weird Science. That's the like the bald haired,
weird looking guy, but once again, it was hard to really
see. So it's like it looked kind of
like him, but once again, I couldn't find them listed in the
(32:39):
credits so I didn't dig too, toomuch.
But those would have been some of that guys.
I would have been like, oh, there's that guy.
If they had more screen time, baby, normally here we would go
to iconic and favorite scenes. Do we have any iconic or
favorite scenes for this movie? The the closest thing I could
come up with for an iconic scenewas the the fight with the big
(33:01):
guy. Yeah, yeah.
But I think his name is. Yeah, but yeah, there wasn't.
I mean like I said the the the poster is more iconic and that
didn't come from the movie. At all, Right, right.
You know, I mean, I know sometimes you'll you'll see a
trailer and then like come out of the movie like there where
(33:22):
was that scene from the trailer?But this is one of those like
where was the scene from the poster like.
While you're there, I'll I'll read this little bit of trivia.
So first of all, this was the first film to be shot on Liberty
Island beneath the Statue of Liberty.
The Liberty Island scene along with the morning shot of
Manhattan where the helicopter scene were the only scenes in
(33:43):
the film shot in New York City. As you mentioned, the original
lobby poster art for the film shows the head of the Statue of
Liberty laying in the middle of a New York street, even though
this is completely absent from the film and the statue is shown
very much intact multiple times.But the 2008 found footage
monster film Cloverfield, which involves an unseen force
(34:04):
destroying New York City, actually did the poster and pays
homage to Escape from New York by including a shot where the
statue's head is lopped off and does actually wind up in the
street, JJ Abrams said. I love that movie as a kid, but
one of the things that drove me crazy is the poster had this
picture of the head of the Statue of Liberty sitting in the
middle of New York street, but it was never in the movie.
(34:25):
And I always felt that was such a crazy, scary image that it had
to be in our movie. I.
Love Cloverfield? Yeah, but you'll never get to
that because it's from 2008. Yeah, yeah, not even close, but
yeah. But I do think that was cool
that Abrams was like, he remembered that from the the
poster and was like, they didn'tdo it, so I'm going to do it.
So more power to you. Like I enjoyed, like I enjoyed
(34:47):
the scene towards the end where they're driving the taxi cab and
they hit a mine and the car literally like falls.
In half, yeah. But I enjoyed it because it was
so stupid, like it was like you hit a mine and the car like it
was like they took us a saw and literally cut it perfectly in
half, right, right. And then everybody but the but
(35:08):
earnest born 9. Yeah, how is he the only one
that? The three people in the back of
the car get out. No scratches, no cuts.
I just it was of of the many things in that movie that were
ridiculous, that was towards thetop.
But it it just because that scene just made me laugh like it
was. That's one of my favorite, and I
mean almost any scene with Ernest Borgnine because he was.
(35:30):
Just such a he was. He was a good Comic Relief or
good funny part of it. But I mean, overall, like there
wasn't really like a lot of likeclassic one liners or portable
parts or or memorable scenes. Like, yeah.
It's interesting because I so I ask you this question, it it's
kind of listed as a cult classic.
(35:52):
Would you define it as a cult classic?
I think I would because there isa following that it does have,
but it doesn't like it doesn't, it didn't get the awards or the
box office or or or that kind ofstuff that a lot of like movies
that wouldn't be considered likeit doesn't have like great
(36:12):
critical reception. Like it doesn't have a lot of
negative that I can. Yeah, it was.
It was. It wasn't panned by critics, but
it wasn't prey. It was kind of average.
Most people thought it was a glorified B movie which.
Which I think puts it in the level of like a cult classic
because it's one of those that like it probably doesn't get
(36:34):
shown on Saturday. You know, TVA lot.
It doesn't. You know, you, you might you
have you might have to hunt it down a lot more often.
You know, it's one of those things that comes up is like,
hey, that that Kurt Russell filmfrom early in his career or
early in his adult career kind of cool.
Like if you ever seen it, that'swhy you know.
(36:55):
Yeah, for me, it's almost like the movie itself is fine.
I'll just go ahead and say it. It's it's not, it's not my
favorite John Carpenter movie. It's not my favorite Kurt
Russell movie. It's not even in the top five or
ten. It's OK.
It's very slow. It takes a long time to really
kind of figure out kind of what's going on.
It's not as action-packed as I think I thought it was going to
(37:19):
be in my mind before I watched it, but I think it's iconic
because of the character that Kurt Russell gave us and Snake
like, I think that's why it's popular, because of Snake
Pliskin. Like that's the only reason that
it's, it has such staying power to me.
Because he comes off as so. Cool.
Yeah. Oh yeah, for sure.
(37:40):
And so let let me think of the proper way to say this on a on
on a way that I can podcast. You can say it I I can bleep it
up. Funny.
OK. Badass.
Yeah. Yeah, I can say that I can.
Say that. OK, I mean, he's such a badass
in this movie that you're like, oh, like, I mean he's like it
kind of like his charisma kind of makes it where like a movie
(38:02):
that like a lesser actor, this movie would have been forgotten
and we never we wouldn't be talking about this.
I mean, only reason people mighttalk about it or bring it up is
because John Carpenter directed it.
But in the hands of Kurt Russelllike, it made it more enjoyable
or more watchable. Oh yeah, for sure.
(38:22):
Like because really the most of the beginning is this Tim
walking around. Like I mean they said like he
doesn't speak for like the 1st 18 minutes of the movie.
Like he doesn't say a word so. But when he does, like it's so
like his presence really carriesthe movie.
Like just watching him walk around.
Yeah, it's not action-packed, but it still keeps you watching
because you're kind of waiting to see what's going to happen
(38:42):
next. Favorite scenes?
Like I don't really have an icon.
Like, yeah, I think the I think the the poster is the most
iconic scene that's not in the movie.
You know, it's like said that the poster is more iconic than
any seen in the movie. As far as favorite scenes,
nothing really, really stands out except maybe the ending.
It does have an exciting ending,more exciting than I thought I
was going to as we got there, you know, before we got there,
(39:05):
so. Well, and I mean, the Dukes car
is kind of cool in a, in a ridiculous like, why would you
hang crystal chandeliers off thefront of it?
But yeah, you're kind of like, all right.
I mean, in a world where you've managed to take one of the most
valuable properties on the planet and turn it into a
prison, why wouldn't you have a limo with crystal chandeliers
(39:30):
hanging off the front? Sure, why not 1st for me, Yeah.
He almost gives me the vibe of for the Terry Crews as the
President and Idiocracy. Yeah.
Yeah. So all right, well, let's talk
about scenes and trivia. When we think about some other,
I will talk about some deleted scenes and stuff that wasn't in
the movie, which I think, you know, we recently talked about
(39:52):
director's cuts on another podcast.
Some of this I think would have made the movie better, at least
more story love, better story wise.
We'll get into that. As we go, so the model of the
city was repainted and reused for Blade Runner, which also
which came out in 1982. So you can see that.
Makes sense, I mean. Yeah, I love this.
(40:13):
Every character that says I heard you were dead to Snake
dies. Yeah, and I paid attention to
that this time. And I'm like, oh.
Because like somebody said something similar, but they
didn't say I heard you were dead.
It was like the one thing that did strike me is kind of weird
is that somehow in this prison, and I don't know how long these
(40:34):
people have been there, everybody knew who snake was.
Like, everybody's like, hey, you're that guy.
You're a snake. Like even the random woman who
was like, hey, bomb a cigarette.Hey, your snake put like
everybody knew. And then like the one, like you
said, the ones who said, hey, I thought you were dead.
They ended up dying. But, you know, like, yeah, it
was ridiculous. But like, I mean, the cabbie
(40:55):
immediately was like your snake Plisket, you know?
Yeah, and like he talked like they had worked together, like
they were old friends. Like it was like, yes, it was
interesting. Also thought he was a little
off, like I think he was supposed to be a little mentally
off anyway, So so we talked about the the fight scene, which
I thought was like the most was sort of on before the most trope
(41:19):
part of the movie was, you know,you you kidnap or you, you, you
take into custody Snake and he'sobviously got to fight somebody
for no apparent reason just to have them fight in some kind of
death match. Right, But at least it made more
sense than the basketball scene from Escape from LA.
(41:42):
I want to say I've seen Escape from LA, but I couldn't tell you
anything about that movie. Don't.
Don't bother. Yeah, I remember.
I remember being pretty terrible, but Ox Baker is the
guy that he fought in in in thatscene.
But it said he actually struck Kurt Russell very heavily with
(42:02):
some of his blows during the boxing ring fight scene.
Russell had finally had enough and asked Baker to take it easy,
tapping him in the groin to let him know he was serious.
Baker then calm down. Where?
Speaking of that guys like has Ox Baker been in other stuff or
is it just the the beard kind ofmade him look like?
(42:23):
Yeah, I like, I didn't go back and look at it, but I was like,
I think somewhere I read that hewas, he was a wrestler.
Yeah. Which I thought when as soon as
he came out, I was like, he had to have been a wrestler.
He was known professionally as Ox Baker, an American
professional wrestler and actor.He was famous for his
distinctive eyebrows and finishing move, the heart punch,
(42:43):
sometimes called the hurt punch after Baker's famous catch
phrase. I love to hurt people.
And that was in the like, 60s and 70s when he was at his
height. So well before, well before I
was into any any wrestling. So yeah, yeah, absolutely.
But I thought this was interesting because I was like,
(43:04):
this looked pretty real. For the shot where Snake kills
Ox, Kurt Russell had to hit him with a real baseball bat with a
real nail in it. Baker had special padding on the
back of his neck to absorb the impact.
But John Carpenter, Russell bothmentioned in the commentary how
nervous the pro wrestler was. I bet he was because because you
(43:27):
could tell he was hitting him pretty hard.
I was like, I was like, wow, that and that.
And based on what you just said there, there might have been a
little extra behind it. Yeah, yeah, after getting
pummeled for days. Yeah.
All right, so let's talk a little bit about cutscenes,
different scenes. So one part of the screenplay
that surprised everyone who readit was the reveal that Romero
(43:50):
not only didn't kill Cabbie, butthat he traded away the
president's tape because he liked Cabbie's hat.
So that Romero was like the weird like crazy, crazy haired
skinny guy that was the one kindof keeping watch with the
president when when Harry Dean Stanton and Adrian Barbeau get
(44:12):
him. So but he does make that count
about, you know, nice, nice hat.Where did you get it?
So but they but they both assumed the tape was just music,
which is why cabbie had it in his pocket before he handed over
to Snake. Even Frank Doubleday, who played
Romero, had assumed that Romero murdered a lot of Duke's enemies
(44:33):
off screen. So, but we know we we can find
out later that the cabbie dies in the cab.
But yeah, that was interesting. In the original script Snake
Pilskin sorry I didn't say that wrong.
In the original script Snake Pliskin wasn't given a reason
quote UN quote to destroy the tape as he doesn't at the end
and did so because he said earlier he didn't care about the
(44:54):
war or the president. The scene where Snake asked the
president how he feels about thedeaths of everyone in the rescue
and is disgusted by the president's dismissive and empty
words was crafted because it made Snakes action seem
completely understandable. Which helps because I kind of
wondered at the I mean, I, I knew he had switched the tape.
We've seen that troop so many Times Now.
(45:17):
But then for him to destroy the tape, it was like, you know,
what was the whole point? But at the same time, we really
didn't really know what the tapewas or what it was supposed to
expose. It was still kind of mysterious
anyway. And and I would say one of the
the biggest misses of the movie and something that I think maybe
would have made it a little better was when he when Lee Lee
(45:40):
Van Cleef Hawk says thought you were going to kill me.
And he goes, no, I'm too tired and starts walking away.
I think it would have made it like even cooler or not cooler
is not the right word, but even more because he destroys the
tape. Like if he just turned around
and like pulls a gun out of somewhere and shoots him and
then destroys the tape and walks.
Right, right. And then, you know, he hasn't
(46:01):
gotten that far away. You would think, like, once they
hear the music playing on the tape, they would have chased him
down because he reneged somewhaton, you know, why they were
giving. They were pardoning him and
letting him go free. So yeah, that was interesting.
But so in 1981, Bantam Books published a movie tie in
novelization written by Mike Mcquay that adopts a lean,
(46:24):
humorous style reminiscent of the film.
The novel is significant becauseit includes scenes that were cut
out of the movie, such as the Federal Reserve Depository
robbery, the results in Snakes incarceration, which you
mentioned earlier. The novel provides motivation
and back story to Snake and Hawk, both disillusioned war
veterans, deepening the relationship that was only
hinted at in the film. The novel explains how Snake
(46:47):
lost his eye during the battle for Leningrad in World War 3,
how Hawk became Warden of New York, and Hawk's quest to find
his crazy son who lives somewhere in the prison.
The novel fleshes out the world that these characters exist in,
at times presenting a future even bleaker than the one
depicted in the film. The book also explains that the
West Coast is a no man's land and the country's population is
(47:10):
gradually being driven crazy by nerve gas as a result of World
War Three. Which would then make sense of
why they called him the crazies,the people that were, you know,
in the prison or whatever. So which I kind of figured it
had to have been had some some kind of chemical thing going on
there. So, but I think some of those
things that were left out could have added a little bit more
(47:32):
context and made it a little better story.
Yeah, I I'm honestly surprised, given that this film does have a
cult status and and you know, and the remake heavy era that we
live in. We haven't seen Netflix or or
Prime or somebody pick it up andwant to do like an Escape from
(47:55):
New York, like mini series wherelike you can really flesh out
all that stuff. Yeah, I know, I know.
And I don't know if you've got it in your notes because I did
look into some of the stuff likeafter Escape from LA bombed.
But they've tried, they've trieda couple other times to do other
sequels or, or like a snake or reboots.
Yeah, reboots. And they've just all fallen
(48:16):
apart. But then, you know, given how
much money Netflix or Apple TV or Prime just throws that stuff,
like, it wouldn't be outside. And it's not like this movie is
so beloved that, like, if they're like, we're going to
remake it, people would be like,no, how dare you.
I think most people would be like, yeah.
Maybe you there's going to be some.
Yeah, there's going to be some. I mean, there's so much more you
could do with that. You know, I think, I think
(48:38):
Carpenter had a good kernel of an idea.
I just don't think it was a developed enough of a story to
really give you enough to drive drive it story wise.
You know what I'm saying? I, I agree.
I think if we did have more timeto flesh out for the which he
didn't want to make it political, but it is somewhat
political because he doesn't trust the president.
(49:00):
But why doesn't he? And we know what, you know, kind
of some of that back story or whatever.
Well, and yeah, I don't know if it's 7 million in 1981 or it was
1981. Money and technology that has
goes along today would what I think I don't know, I don't, I
mean, I say they couldn't have done it back in 1981.
But I mean, look at what they did with a little more money on
(49:23):
on Star Wars or next year with the same sense in Blade Runner,
you know, so you know. Yeah.
The 80s Flick Flashback Podcast will return after these
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(50:26):
blockbuster. Subscribe today and I'll see you
on the other side of the page. Hey there fellow 80s movie
aficionados, Are you ready to embark on a nostalgia filled
journey to the greatest era of cinema?
Then look no further than the Retro Life for You 80s movie
podcast. Join us every week as we rewind
(50:49):
the VHS tag, dust off those Betamax classics and dive head
first into the neon soaked, totally tubular world of the
1980s movies. The Brat Pack, the action
heroes, we've got it all covered.
Breakfast Club, Ghostbusters, ETin Indiana Jones and more.
It's like a trip in Doc Brown's Time Machine but without the
(51:13):
DeLorean. So whether you're a die hard 80s
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Retro Life for You is your ticket to the ultimate movie
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Facebook at Retrolife for You and we can be found anywhere you
listen to your podcast as well as on our website
(51:37):
www.retrolifethenumber4theletteru.com.All right, well, let's talk
about box office. The Escape from New York was
released on July 10th, 1981, thesame day as The Fox and the
Hound, which also featured Kurt Russell as the voice of copper.
(51:59):
There's a yeah yeah yeah a tale of two movies that are not
alike. The Fox and the Hound ended up
at #3 at the box office just above Escape from New York at #4
Neither new release could be thrown.
Superman 2 from the number one spot in its fourth week of
release, but the film did end upgrossing $26 million off a $7
(52:22):
million budget in in theaters inthe summer of 81 worldwide, it
grossed over $50 million. So it was a successful movie
even though it wasn't, you know,heralded by critics or, you
know, necessarily the audiences.But once again, it made it.
It made good money. And and it does still have that
cult following, which once again, I think is more because
(52:42):
of the characters, Nick Pliskin than the movie itself.
All right, so we're going to move to our newest feature on
the podcast, the rewatch abilitynostalgia meter.
So if you're new to the show or from you haven't listened to a
new episode for this season, instead of talking about the
critical reception, we're going to talk about where this falls
on a scale of one to 10 on rewatch ability and nostalgia.
(53:04):
So to give you a range a a a gauge one would be I saw it once
that was enough. A5 is a good rewatch every
couple of years. 10 is highly rewatchable and full of
nostalgia. You can pick any number between
1:00 and 10:00. So, Nicholas, where does Escape
From New York fall on your rewatch ability and nostalgia
meter? Six.
(53:25):
OK, Yeah. Like, I mean, it's not it's not
bad and I I would rewatch it again, but it's not one like I'm
going to rush or go out on my way to watch again.
Yeah. You know, it's got some
problems. It's not, you know, necessarily
that great. But like if somebody wanted to
watch it, I'd be like, sure, whynot?
Like, you know, but like, you know, it might be a couple years
(53:46):
before I'm like, you know what Ireally want to watch again.
Right Escape from LA. That was good.
Yeah, I'm right there with you. I think 6 is 6 is pretty pretty
on the nose. Like I said, I watched it.
It might be five years ago and even re watching it again today,
like there wasn't a whole lot that I remembered and I think
I'd want it to be that way. It's not something like there's
(54:08):
not a lot of like memorable scenes or not any fun one
liners. I mean, the one running thing is
I heard you were dead. I mean that's like the only
thing that you kind of, you know, pull from from it, But
it's not it's not terrible. I mean, I I mean, I like I like
Carpenter as a director. I like Russell as an actor.
It's got, you know, a pretty good supporting cast.
I mean, you got people that we've we've seen the other
(54:30):
things that we know about. So I think 6 is, is a is a
solid, solid number. All right, well, letting me know
about what's going on. Pop culture roulette.
What are you guys getting into here in the beginning of 2025?
Just, you know, we're, we're going back to some of our normal
shows or just kind of picking a topic and topping about talking
(54:51):
about it or just trying to stay somewhat relevant and topical.
But I mean, basically just just three guys sitting around
talking nonsense. That's what you're known for.
I'm just. Getting well.
Well, I'm sure we haven't done one in a couple weeks, so I'm
sure we'll do a bracket here pretty.
Soon, yeah, yeah. Hey, March will be here before
you know it. It'll be time another.
(55:11):
The season of Brackets is upon us, so I'm sure it'll be coming
coming pretty quick. So yeah, definitely go check out
Pop Culture Roulette. Always a good time on their
show. Look forward to having Nicholas
back again. I know we'll have him on another
show here in the not too distantfuture.
Thanks for being a part of the episode today, alright?
Thanks for having me. Yes, Sir.
All right, everybody, that's a wrap on today's episode.
(55:32):
Thanks again for tuning in. I'm Tim Williams from the 80s
Flip Flashback podcast. Warm up the choppers.
We're moving in the. 80s we willrun where every day is just pure
fun. Coonies.
Never say Friday your mind. In those films we lose our mind.
(56:10):
John Hughes and all his teen dreams, monsages and simply
themes In fairest hands, the city bends living life like it
never ends. You still here?
(56:31):
It's over. Go home.
Go.
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